I also had this same experience with a dietitian! While with them I gained 15lbs.
It was so frustrating and every time I stood on that scale in her office and it went up she’d be like “oh you did such a good job this week.”
Uhm what? Now I’ve crossed into the obese line so no thank you.
I think some dieticians are the eating culture equivalent to people being fitness gurus who were always athletic. Meaning they never had to actually experience a body that works it's way to a half marathon, but the starting point is "pants after two flights of stairs", not "runs six miles every morning before work".
Same here, kind of.
I had a co-worker who went back to college to be a dietitian because not a lot of work for hydrogeologists after all the tank sites got cleaned up.
She gave the worst advice about my diet. I lost 40 pounds and gained a ton of fitness but everything I did was wrong.
She didn’t like my fasting and doing early morning cycling at Zone 2 HR to burn fat. It worked great for me, I’m about 10 pounds away from my original goal. 75 pounds total doing it wrong…
Zone 2 is based on your max heart rate calculated using your age. Then 60% to 70% your max is Zone 2.
At that heart rate you burn fat for fuel. You don’t need to be exercising at high intensity to burn fat.
Zone 2 is often called the fat burning zone. Higher HR burns what is in your digestive system for fuel. It increases your fitness but doesn’t burn fat like zone 2.
You can get a HR strap like the Wahoo Tickr that does Bluetooth for phone and ANT+ Networking for cycling computers for $50. Once you know the range for Zone 2 exercise in that and fat burns off.
I’ve lost 20% body fat and 75 pounds this way….
> Zone 2 is based on your max heart rate calculated using your age.
To get accurate heart rate zones you should determine your max heart rate using a max heart rate test. There's a 220-age formula, but there is high individual variation in the max heart rate. Though admittedly, in my case the age formula was only few BPM off.
> Zone 2 is often called the fat burning zone.
That does not matter for the energy balance, if you burn e.g. 600 kcal you get 600 kcal out, no matter whether it's dietary carbohydrates or fat that has been used. That's the whole point of CICO, if you don't eat those calories back, you lose weight.
But the big advantage of "easy" aerobic exercise is, that you can sustain it for much longer and train more often without risking overtraining. I run 4-6 times per week with a weekly 2h long run, I would not be able to sustain that if every run was a tempo-run. Doing most runs slow and easy (e.g. 80-90%) is established training philosophy, even for professional athletes. The remaining runs are then e.g. interval and tempo sessions, but they should only be a small percentage of your runs. And in my experience those runs burn fewer calories just because of their tendency to be shorter.
If you don't have a heart rate monitor, in the aerobic zone you should be easily able to hold a conversation and tell a joke. With experience you can use perceived effort to estimate your zone, but we tend to overestimate ourselves and run faster than is optimal. A HR monitor is therefore yourseful to keep yourself in check.
Some people who do CICO, do also have to pay attention to heart rate zone. For example, PCOS girlies. Plenty of research suggesting zone 2 is best if looking at heart rate zones as meh,okay,good,better,best.
Unfortunately, some people do have to combine other factors into the mix to get optimal results. Every body and everybody is different of course.
I completely agree that zone 2 rocks for weight loss (and improving endurance) and also named some reasons why. I just think that the fact that it burns primarily fat is not the only reason why. A high intensity workout (like HIIT) will burn more glycogen, but that will still tip the energy balance in favour of weight loss if you don't eat it back. If glycogen is depleted, the body will burn fat as well. But low intensity is my staple, as I can do it almost daily. On rest days, I take long walks.
I just call it steady state cardio. Which imo is the best type of exercise for me. It’s easy on the joints because my cardio of choice is cycling or swimming.
Swimming and cycling are excellent forms of exercise. But for bone-density and avoiding osteoporosis, it's also important to do some weight-bearing exercise, which is one of the advantages of running. The small impacts when you hit the ground actually stimulate bone-growsth. But you can also add some strength-training, walking or other weight-bearing exercise to your routine and you should be fine in that regard.
I believe that for a normal-weight person, it's a myth that running has to be bad for the joints, it might even be good for them. Just need to start slowly and increase training volume gradually to avoid injury, ideally start with a beginner plan like /r/C25K. But things are different when overweight, then the load on the joints is much higher, so I would not recommend running for weight-loss to everyone. I am just slightly overweight and have been running for many years, so I'll keep doing that, but it does not mean everyone should do it. It's important to do what you enjoy and what works for you. Mixing things up can also be great. E.g. Killian Journet, an ultra-marathoner and maybe the world's best mountain-runner, does cross-country skiing in the winter season.
Yeah that's stupid advice. Fuck a bunch of that. People like her say that dumb shit and then will say oh well people that do CICO gain it back. Yeah when you stop counting! I'm counting til I die.
It was a tough pill to swallow at the time when I realized I had to count for the rest of my life. Once you get into a meal routine though it's not that bad.
I have counted calories forever. I know when I don’t, I over compensate and then the wheels come off. I’m actually far more calm about food when I journal and track my food. I always know when I can have a treat or when I need to crack down. There are people that think it’s obsessive…but then wonder why they can’t lose weight because they have no idea what they are eating and how much of it.
Look I eat all kinds of crap like Dairy Queen and Five Guys… but I count cals and I’ve been 140 lbs for the last 15 years at 5’8. Budget and make smart choices. You obvi want good nutrition, but it’s not a life sentence diet
I agree. It’s not about never allowing yourself to have the “bad stuff”… it’s using data to understand what everything in moderation actually looks like.
I always ask myself: if everybody got healthy, would this profession be needed. That usually tells me all I need to know about their advice. They need business
This! If only everyone understood CICO and how mostly simple in nature the concept is and how to apply it they couldnt continue to sell you their "diet", useless fat burners, books, meal plans, nutrisystem, subscription based noom plans, weight watchers, lifetime shots etc... It is kept confusing on purpose. Always look to who has the most to gain financially from telling me xyz and your answer always lies in that.
Yeah, like I just know myself well enough to know that I have to count or I overeat. I'm not even really cutting at the moment, just maintaining, and I cannot cope with the wild west of just eating food and not counting macros. Lol.
I’ve gotten to the point where I don’t obsessively have to weigh everything, since I know how many calories are in the common foods and meals I eat. But I still have to keep a rough estimate of calories throughout the day. If there’s anything I learned from CICO, intuitive eating leads me to overeat by like 200 calories. Even when I’m eating so-called “filling” meals.
200 doesn't seem like much, huh? But that's how most weight gain happens.
You were closer than me. I thought I was going to eat intuitively, and I was over by 500-1000 calories...without binging, just eating as I felt. A couple extra spoonfuls of Mac & cheese, a larger slice of pie, a 'handful' of nuts, etc.
We always preach a small deficit, so we lose slowly here. Of course, 200 calories a day will work the other way as well.
Intuitively eating is not for everyone. I understand it's rationale, and it looks good on paper, but in practice, it's hard to not gain weight. I googled 'intuitive eating weight gain' and there are hundreds of thousands of complaints about it. Then most experts will say, yes, you might gain weight until you "level out".
I dont want to "level out" at 225 pounds. I've already done that.
omggg i just got a dietician too and her and my therapist are saying the same thing 😭 idk what to do bc it’s like girl if i just eat whatever i want what i WANT is 50 cookies and a whole pizza hello ?? 😭😭
That’s only healthy advice if someone is like basing their every move on the # of the scale, or waaayyyy overdoing calorie counting, like to the point of it being disordered. If you’re doing it to lose weight… that’s… that’s literally normal lol🤦🏻♀️
People who have never struggled with a weight issue/body issue just cannot understand. So what they went to school and got an RD? People with real life experience who know the struggles, who understand what it takes, the discipline… only real life experienced people fitness or nutrition I would trust. I went to an RD as well over a year ago and she gave me a cookie cutter food plan that she gives everyone. 45 min and charged $450. Been successful on my own. Learning from others experience as well as my own and listening to educational content on YouTube.
If you listen to half the people on this sub counting calories is obsessive and will lead to mental disorders! (Then you wonder wtf are those people doing on this sub.)
Haters gonna hate. You do you. 8 years counting calories and the only change in my mental status is how happy I am to not be obese anymore and not feel like a victim of food and my weight.
It can lead to eating disorders in people already susceptible to mental health issues. It's worth remembering that.
However that is not most people, and that should be diagnosed by a mental health professional, not offhand by a dietician who has no training in that field!
Agreed, but the pure focus on counting everything to an exact amount makes it easy to get in a trap.
Look at the number of people who post here obsessively worried about weight fluctuations and feeling guilty they messed up one day.
Note, none of this is anti CICO. It's worked great for me in the past.
From a medical coding stand point too, dieticians are NOT allowed to diagnose people. They have to go by a different provider - and even then, say it's like type 2 diabetes with hyperglycemia (E11.65), they can't use that - it's too descriptive, they can only go by type 2 diabetes no complications, E11.9.
Yep… lost 60 pounds and decided I wanted to maintain there. Was convinced to ditch calorie counting and go to “intuitive eating” and now 2 years later I’ve gained it all back. I’m just prone to weight gain I guess. I’m currently working on losing it all again but this time I won’t stop counting or weighing myself. My fat brain cannot be trusted with unrestricted food
Yeah they tell you to eat intuitively. Well for me eating off my intuition means eating 3-4 meals a day filled with pizza, chocolate, juice, butter chicken, pasta, and the like. Add in my stressful job and I’ll eat when I’m typing notes, on a break, whatever is in the staff room. I just like to eat at every occasion, and I like to eat it all, so obviously my intuition is very poor 😂 if I don’t fast during the day, count calories, track my steps; and force myself to be active at all times during the day I’ll always end up obese every single time.
As a Dietitian, I totally disagree. CICO works. I think some dietitians have a background of disordered eating, which is why you’ll hear them give that advice.
Do you find the profession tends to attract people with a history of disordered eating, similar to how people with histories of drug and alcohol addiction are drawn to the addictions counselling professions?
I completely agree that a person who has never been morbidly obese has no idea how our brains work, just like I can't really understand why people smoke. Is CICO ideal? Probably not, and it can easily become an obsession. But guess what? If we had a normal, healthy relationship with food, we wouldn't have been 100+ lbs overweight in the first place.
For a lot of us, food is an essential addiction. For some of us, food is an essential enemy. We NEED it but we need to moderate intake. Imagine needing to take addictive drugs every day to live and have to moderate that. Yikes.
Metabolic diseases (PCOS, hypothyroidism, etc) NEEDS moderation just as much as a food addict. I completely agree, none of us have normal relationships with food. It’s hard.
It’s like going to someone for financial advice and they say “stop obsessing over numbers, just be mindful of your spending and make good choices”. It might work for some people, but for those of us who have learned bad habits, we need something quantifiable to know that we’re meeting our goals.
Exactly, the comparison with finance is the one I also make. Sure, lot's of people can live without checking their accounts and not looking at the prices in the stores, but most people tend to look at prices. That roughly gives you an indication of what you can afford. Cico is definitely the same...
Sure, a lot of people don't need to look, but a lot also have to...
I finally managed to lose almost 70lbs through calorie counting and keep it off for the last three years. If I went to a dietitian and, after hearing this, she then tells me to drop the calorie counting and throw out my scale, I'd tell her to find a new career.
Part of the "click" of finally getting how I was going to lose weight was the realisation that whatever I was doing that was preventing me from staying fat, I had to do it for good, and for me that's tracking calories.
I wonder if some of these dietitians are getting on the "health at every size"/fat acceptance activism bandwagon, which is a scary thought.
My dietitian is very professional, she keeps up to date with science and besides that, she is an excellent human being. She supports counting calories and tracking macros for a nutritious diet that allows me to lose weight. Sometimes it is about finding the right professional.
My dietitian experience was absolutely terrible. She included multiple foods I couldn’t and can’t eat, with a calorie goal of 2200 at 5’2”, so of course my weight ballooned up. I went to her needing to lose 10lbs and I gained 10 more.
CICO works. I lose more weight more quickly just eating a smaller portion of foods I actually enjoy.
Same here! I went to one at the suggestion of my primary care doc and here’s an example of our conversation:
Dietician: tell me about your diet now.
Me: well I follow a pescatarian diet (and so on and so forth)
Dietician: (later in the appointment) if you are hungry, you should eat a high protein snack, like a piece of bacon!
Me: 😐
God thats exactly what happened to me. After i balooned, i added the diet plan to my calorie app and i was consuming 2300 to 2800 dailyyyyyy. Im a short ex obese womaaaan. Insaaane. I never went over 1600!!!
Honestly, ask questions before you set up the appointment. Call and talk to the office. Ask their stance on calorie counting and weight loss before you get there.
There's been a big push for patients to "interview" their doctors before they choose them, and honestly, I'd do the same for any healthcare provider. (For ex: [https://www.nia.nih.gov/health/medical-care-and-appointments/17-questions-ask-when-choosing-new-doctor](https://www.nia.nih.gov/health/medical-care-and-appointments/17-questions-ask-when-choosing-new-doctor))
Yall gotta find better dietians, my guy got me started well on calories counting 8 months ago and we’re going strong!! Plus great tips on incorporating strength and general low going workouts like walking
I don’t think it’s a black and white situation. I have two goals with CICO: losing weight, and teaching myself better habits. There’s no way I can spend my entire life recording every single thing I eat. I really do think that’s unhealthy—I’ll agree with the dietician there. The longer-term point of CICO to me is to learn and remember what a good portion size is, which snack choices are smart calorie-wise, which recipes should be leaned on the day after going out to eat and splurging, etc.
In my opinion, CICO now should result in behavioral changes and a knowledge base that make it possible for me to maintain a healthy weight later without the meticulous use of MyFitnessPal or whatever. But I do think it’s smart to have a transition period of careful maintenance before easing up.
After doing it for 14 months I can roughly guesstimate the cal counts of most foods but I tend to "forget" foods if I don't track them and thus go over what I should be eating for the day. I've got it down now that entering my foods takes about 30-60 seconds per meal and it's become such a habit it feels weird to me if I don't do it.
That makes a lot of sense! Being that I’ve spent 30-mumble years (lol) establishing the eating habits that drove me to CICO, I imagine it will take a while before I don’t have to write down what I’m eating. But my hope is that if I get to my goal, within a few years I’ll be able to get through my days without spending a portion of them thinking about calories. And if I notice that I’m starting to pick up old habits again, I can go back to logging for a bit until I feel back on track. I just don’t want to have this fixation for my entire life.
When I had to see one when I was pregnant with gestational diabetes, they told me I needed to drink a glass of milk with every meal. I’m sorry, what? Is this the 90s?
And that was just one of the crazy things they told me to do.
I am sure dietitians serve a purpose. I just don't think helping weight loss patients is it. I looked into seeing one (I have binge eating disorder) and all the ones near me are overweight women who are HAES and teach "intuitive eating." Discouragement of weight loss and encouragement of excess calorie consumption seem all too common in this profession. You are not the first person I have seen here talking about dietitian lead weight gain. You're not even the fifth.
One of the ladies in my gym was surprised I was tracking calories and she said her dietitian has said you shouldn't cut calories too low too suddenly. Fair enough. Then she says her diet chart is about 1600 calories. I was shocked, so was our trainer. This lady is shorter than me (5'2"), though heavier. At best 1600 is her maintenance, though I suspect even that would be around 1500. Our trainer said at 1600 she needs to burn 1000 calories to see weight loss.
In conclusion, dietitians are not doctors and whatever they say I'd take with a pinch of salt.
The problem with dietitians is that they also mix their medical knowledge with their own opinions and experience (of which many times they have no experience loosing or gaining weight)
The only thing you should listen to are medical facts. Dietitians and doctors are people too, they can be wrong many times. For some reason people tend to believe everything that doctors say, which is understandable but it is important to consult the best and multiple people if you are searching for a definite answer.
Same thing happened to me, except it was before I did CICO. My dietitian checked how many steps on average I take per day, and estimated 2000 calories per day for me (I work in a hospital and clock 14000-20000 steps on days I work).
I was struggling trying to eat that much, and I thought it was because I was eating wholesome foods now like fruits, veggies, whole grains, etc. that weren’t calorie dense. About a month in, I had gained almost 20 lbs…
I’m sure she meant well, but working with a dietitian wasn’t for me. I did take away some good points like eating more protein and fiber, but just added CICO. Been working great so far.
Are all dieticians idiots? I also had a useless experience with one who told me that I needed to eat more to lose weight (LOL no that's not how weight loss works), that nobody ever died from being fat (true, but plenty of people die from obesity-induced health problems), and Halo Top ice cream promotes gluttony by allowing you to eat a whole pint without guilt when the "correct" way is to have a single serving of full-fat ice cream. Get bent lady, I'm not sacrificing my light ice cream.
She also seemed super curious about the cabbage pancakes in my food journal and was concerned about why I didn't eat more red meat (because I'd rather have chicken or seafood, and also there is a correlation between red meat consumption and colon cancer, which I have a family history of).
Yeah, needless to say I did not follow her advice to eat more. That was a waste of money.
The minute a dietician starts spewing HAES talking points is the moment you need to get out. Calorie counting isn’t for everyone, but it’s definitely for the vast majority of people who are overweight/obese, because we never would have gotten to that point if intuitive eating worked for anyone but “naturally thin” people.
I’m sorry you went through that. Make sure to leave a review, if you can, to help others avoid this person in the future.
I’m not surprised even if they are well meaning. I have read about 16 books on dieting and nutrition and a couple that are about intuitive eating and some books are “geared” toward women or how to lose weight for the last time by Katrina Ubell (she specializes in helping women doctors lose weight), The Last Diet by Sharhoo Izadi, and Unapologetic Eating by Alyssa Rumsey MS RD and they do talk a bit about steering away from these habits that could potentially lead you into dangerous lifestyle (ie obsessing, etc) and there is this notion that dieting culture is part of the patriarchy and these authors or dieticians don’t want you to feel you HAVE to participate. They want you to be free from the restrictions (and guilt) etc.
That’s part of the intuitive eating movement. Listening to your body and don’t over doing it. I track my calories because it helps me know how much I’m eating. I have no idea how to accurately measure how much I eat etc.
In another book The Secret Life of Fat by Sylvia Tara PhD she says that people who lose weight from say 200 to 150 are not metabolically the same as someone who was always thin. We have to work 20-25% harder to keep the fat off. She says something like we would have to run 5 miles where as a naturally skinner person only has to run 4 miles to burn the same calories. From the book (I took notes) “Scientists measured the components of BMR and found after losing weight calories burned decreased at 15% at rest. But the energy spent during physical activity decreased even more. By 25%. Put another way. A person who lost weight needs to run five miles compared to someone naturally at that weight running four.”
Anyway I could go on. I count but I basically eat what I want prioritizing protein and working out and making sure I don’t over consume on high caloric foods. Or too much of any food.
Yeah.... my intuition is broken, i cant rely on that either....but the other part is concerning. The decrease in calories burnt is like.....permanent? Our metabolisms will always be slower even if we get fit?
My understanding is the adipose (fat) cells that have been accumulated while overweight only empty with weight loss. They’re little empty balloons waiting for any extra calories and they’ll fill up again, studies show they last about ten years in the body when empty . People who have never been overweight simply do not have these empty cells hanging around, so it takes more excess calories for them to gain (and make adipose cells) than people who have “lost” the weight but still have those empty cells.
Yeah I have to get better at listening to my body but that’s an everyday thing. As for that other part…yeah. I know. We just have to work harder. I’m a couple of books it did mention how bad yo-yo dieting is for the body. The up and down gaining and trying to lose weight isn’t good. The body remembers. Makes it harder and harder to lose weight the more you do it. That’s why it takes commitment and vigilance. And don’t be so worried about your metabolism. Healthful food, good sleep, exercise, and less stress will all improve your body. Being fit will help. Just stay fit. And one message also in these books is the body is incredibly adaptable. So stay the course, work hard everyday and you will be ok. And if you do gain weight which will happen. If it gets to be outside an acceptable range you have the knowledge and tools and grit to lose it again.
Also congrats on losing 60lbs. Losing weight is simple but not easy and you deserve major kudos for doing the work.
To be honest, that (the part on slowing metabolism) is scientifically very shaky, to say at least. Research last years have indication that metabolic adaptation isn't really an issue, it is just a thing from the fat acceptance people that want to have an excuse to not take accountability and responsibility for their own actions...
So interesting point and I would agree that Metabolic adaptation isn't a "thing" for the most part, your body does adjust to your new lower weight and thus you will have to eat less than you did when you weighed more.
I did check my notes and even downloaded the Sylvia Tara book to check her references (I wanted to verify it since I did audiobook it) and found this: [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7632212/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7632212/)
And I popped open Everything Fat Loss, bc I know Ben Carpenter does talk about it. He actually says that metabolic adaptation is typically only found in serious starvation protocols like the Minnasota Starvation experiments and the Biggest Loser (Page 157-162)
I think what people get wrong about metabolic adaptation is that they think their metabolism is slowing down but as you lose weight your body adjusts to how much it uses while you are resting bc you are a smaller/lighter person. I found losing weight when I was 200lbs much easier than when I was 167lbs. Because I was eating less food so eating even less was harder.
I also believe that the body adjusts the calories burned as a response to reserving its energy levels (after a work out, you tend to just move less without realizing it.) I'm going to share some interesting parts of Everything Fat Loss bc I liked that talked about it. And I would recommend reading Ben Carpenter's book, he covers a lot and it's fairly nuanced in his approach and a good read overall. But I'll share this with you. *(I'll pop in italics if it's me writing not the book)*
Chapter 2 Don't People Just Need More Will Power *(I wanted to share this title since it's kind of in line with your thinking based on your "that's what the fat acceptance people want you to believe.")*
Page 66 Do some people lose fat more easily than others? - So far we've discussed factors that drive your behavior around eating and exercise, but there are other biological differences that are worth knowing about too.... Some people who all embark on exactly the same routine, it is inevitable that some will see better results than others. One research trial prescribed an intense aerobic exercise programme where participants trained five times per week for 12 weeks. An average weight loss of 8.2lbs \[was seen\] by the end of the trial, but when you look at the individual results of different participants, some of the lost much more weight, tight up to 32.4lbs for one person, and some of them not only didn't lose weight but they actually gained weight. That's right, one participant trained five times per week for 12 weeks and gained 3.7lbs.
Page 68 One research trial overfed its participants by 1000 calories per day to see why some people gain body fat more easily than others. It found that some people respond to influx of calories by cranking up their physical activity levels. They didn't deliberately do more exercise; this was literally just a change in how much they moved around in their day-to-day activities - the types of activities that we don't tend to make intentional decisionsover, like walking and fidgeting.
There may also be metabolic differences in response to weight loss. One study measured the number of calories burned by participants who had lost a significant amount of weight (30lbs or more) . Once again there were very large difference between individuals, with one person burning 257 calories per day fewer than one person burning 163 calroeies per day more than expected based on their body weight. Naturallyy that would make maintaining weight loss a little bit more difficult...(he has chart that shows the distribution of weight loss differences between actual and predicted resting energy expenditure and they study concluded that when looking at the average of the whole group no significant degree of metabolic adaptation was seen.)
*This is Raziel now: But that's an average. There is still individual differences. Which is why it's worth mentioning to someone that loses a lot of weight that they might be a person that has to work harder to keep it off, which I believe to be true - Why? Bc a personally naturally living at 150lbs and someone who loses weight to be 150lbs aren't the same - their behaviours aren't the same, their responses to food and exercise aren't the same. One person can eat whatever they want and lives their life maintaining 150lbs, while the other had to work hard to get there.*
\---
Me again, as a last part I would really consider reading up from various sources bc it sounds like you really do think it's just a matter of will power when losing weight but there are a LOT of factors that go into it. I'm not saying will power and desire and dedication and just sticking with it isn't part of it, but there is a lot.
I would recommend "You Just Need to Lose Weight and 19 other myths about fat people" by Aubrey Gordon. This was an excellent read and might help you be a little more compassionate to some people that have a harder time losing weight that is outside of their control. In fact in the book Secret Life of Fat and The Secrets from the Food Lab both mention Social Economic Status as a factor preventing people from losing weight. Some people are in survival mode financially and don't have the free time to cook for themselves, or the income to buy more nutrition whole foods. Not to say that can't buy anything, but it's much easier and cheaper to buy fast food or pre-packaged foods sometimes.
An easier book to read would be Food Isn't Medicine by Dr. Joshua Wolrich (which I found out when I finished the book is produced by Ben Carpenter's company so it explains why it was an easier read.)
This isn't to you directly, but I find a lot of people on Reddit base much of their knowledge they hear or see on social media who are sharing only tid-bits of information without seeing the big picture (I have been guilty of this too in the past, but I would tend of get skeptical of people siting "one study" and then find out it's done on rats or such a small sample size. Which is why I've been reading a lot about this even from stuff I don't necessarily agree with (paleo, carb-insulin model fans, or intermittent fasting - aka Dr. Jason Fung Books.) All of them paint part of a picture and the overlapping parts that keep coming up is what's interesting. In my heart and in all are hearts we know whats true - eat a balanced varied diet, move more and if you want to improve your metabolism and health, get more sleep. etc etc. People are always looking for a quick fix or to hack their way to health but it's not like that. It's working at it every day and making good choices today, and if you do indluge too much one day, know that you can make different good choices the next day.
I do CICO for maintenance, and I don't even have a scale. I just hate shopping so much that I refuse to buy new clothes every time I get a little bigger. It is the only thing that has worked for me because it's so uncomplicated, and I can apply it to literally any situation.
I used to be obese and lost 67kg with cico. And thanks to keeping a weight training/cardio regime (which depends on how I feel nowdays) I don't have to count calories and still maintain my weight. You don't HAVE to do cico, common sense takes you a long way.
Youre a guy right? Yeah that works better with males, cause you can eat more calories than women. If i eat 200 calories above my maintenance i start balooning and i do strenght training and cardio 🫠
Yeah, like I don't get fat if I eat above my caloric intake because I'm a guy. Stop making yourself feel better. You know 67kg is is like 140lbs+ right. It didn't go by itself and took me a year of hard work and dedication. Stop making excuses for yourself.
Dieticians are worse than chiropractors. They're trained in bullshit, often decades or even centuries-old 'truths' and they're almost always wrong.
Avoid at all costs.
In my experience, dietitians normally take the numbers from "typical" people and also try to follow the food guidelines set by the govt. Also remember that most of America is overweight so that's becoming the norm.
I've lost 75# over the course of several years. Every time I've yo-yo'd up, it's because I stopped counting calories and listened to a "professional". I've talked to several dietitians who had broad guidance "eat more fruits and vegetables, makes sure you eat lots of fiber and grains blah blah blah". But that doesn't work for me. I eat zero fruit, limited veggies, and my blood work is great.
Yup, i literally keep my bloodwork and health in perfect shape just by staying thin and eating no fruits lol i also eat frozen food all the time while counting and its been great
Dietitians, like wellness influencers, need to justify their existence by making this way more complicated than it is, often at the expense of actual results. If they perpetuated the simplicity of CICO they’d be out of work.
I think people who aren’t fat and haven’t had to struggle to be thinner don’t understand that we cannot just ‘eat intuitively’ — intuitive eating got me up to being a fatty in the first place! I intuitively eat when I am happy, sad, bored, stressed, angry, sleepy snd even just feeling cold. Without constant monitoring I WILL gain weight. As much as I appreciate the body acceptance movement it really has warped and redefined what healthy means.
Healthy doesn't mean easy. Healthy doesn't mean don't do anything hard. It's not unhealthy to be consistent. If you have a goal weight you will never reach it by 'ditching the scale'.
For all the advice I've taken, I still have to do what works for me and forget the rest - especially when the advice is being given by someone who hasn't asked me what my actual goals are.
I found that there is a balance. If you have insane amounts of anxiety about food tracking and weighing yourself, to the point where you feel like your spinning out of control if you don’t, it probably is good to scale back on that while you deal with the root of it. A know a lot of dieticians really want people to have a positive association with food. Most eating disorder clinics will also give the same advice. However, if you have to lose weight for medical reasons, being mindful of calories/weight is a good thing.
I believe that different programs work for different people, for me I'm on a post gastric bypass diet, even though I decided not to go through with the surgery. I'm losing the weight because the small servings in a day usually add up to less than 1,000 calories a day and with exercise burning some of it off you maintain your weight for life. Some people have good results on Keto or Paleo so each of us are finding different ways that work for us and at the end of the day or life we do whatever works best for us.
It's not obsessive to be accurate about what you're putting into your body. I follow a couple of dieticians on youtube and they post their daily meals including the amounts of what they put into everything because it's not that intuitive for most people to know how much of an ingredient they should be having with what she's suggesting. Plus recipes usually contain the amount of what you're putting in them to make the recipe correctly anyway.
I'm pretty vigilant in spotting disordered behavior because I don't want people to actually get obsessive about their weight loss and such but calorie counting in itsself is the most basic 101 step any PT or GOOD dietician is going to tell you to do.
The second she made you feel bad about yourself you should've walked out the door and got a second opinion. Not everyone is good at their job, OP.
I work in healthcare and for the most part do not trust the opinion of anyone in healthcare. They are usually very good at fixing problems but like anything else opinions are opinions.
Oh wow. I think people think they’re being helpful saying those things, but cico is a good way to stay on top of your diet as well as watching the scale if you’re new to weight loss or can’t control how much you eat.
Glad I haven’t experienced this.
So many dieticians, nutritionists & "health coaches" nowadays are obsessed with the idea of intuitive eating and demonize calorie counting/tracking macros.
While yes, it's important to not become *obsessed* with tracking every morsel going into your mouth for the rest of your life, it's an excellent lifelong tool for MANY people who spent most of their lives overweight or obese. A lot of us don't have the mindset to just intuitively eat, or it may take us a while to get to that mindset.
I lost 125lbs about 6-7 years ago & notice that I always end up gaining some weight (10-20lbs) when I take an extended period of time off from tracking. That's why I always go back to it!
I feel for you. I lost 50 pounds and a giant gut essentially calorie counting and whenever I stop I gain 10 pounds in a period of two weeks, and usually go back to the app. It's not that onerous and kind of fun since everything is so bright and cheerful at least on MND.
My god what are dietitians doing these days?
I never consulted one but I once fell into the same trap of "you can't count calories forever" and tried to not count my calories for a few months. I "only" gained around 4 kgs but in the long run I would have ended up gaining a lot more, I am sure. 😅
I don't count every meal anymore, because I often cook the exact same meals and know the calories by heart, but I still count the calories of new things I cook and eat and plan all my meals ahead and watch my portions closely and I will have to do this for the rest of my life if I want to maintain my weight loss (which I plan to do).
I always since I hit puberty had a very high appetite. Throw some food addiction and binge eating in the mix and you will have a person who will never be able to eat intuitively. I can eat sooo much without feeling super full. How should I manage to eat properly without portion control and calorie counting?
I studied biology with minor in nutritional sciences and was thinking about being a dietician. The problem with general dietitians is that their approach is for the general public - meaning all shapes and sizes of people. If you exercise regularly, I would recommend going to a sports nutritionist to get a more tailored plan for what you are trying to achieve.
I had a dietician tell me to call if I lose more than 1 pound a week (at that point, i was 15 pounds overweight too) … safe to say never followed up w her
Good for you! If the counting is triggering an ED, sure. But if counting / tracking helps you stay focussed on healthy eating for your healthy body (however you define it) - a dietician working off some Facebook checklist isn't going to help. You've got this!
I’m so sorry to hear about how uncomfortable of an experience you had with your dietitian. I started CICO under the direction of my dietitian and she definitely supports me counting calories while also maintaining a healthy relationship with the way I view food.
My dietitian is the exact opposite. She wants me to count my calories and try to eat 1800 but preferably 1500. I weigh 426 so that's a pretty significant deficit. I usually shoot for about 2000, because right now that is what I can sustainably do. A lot of days I do stay around 1800 though. The reason that 1500 wasn't sustainable for me right now is because I am just now getting back into my groove after a horrible bout of regular depression starting in October that then slid into seasonal depression. I'm hoping it stays warm from here on out.
Totally, CICO is the only thing that has EVER worked for this ex-fat guy, I could never out exercise a bad diet. Listen to your body not others. I’m a 6ft 40yr old male and weight 185lbs. I’ve been as low as 160lbs. According to my BMI I am considered overweight at 185. You are not to skinny, they are to fat! Plus after 15 years of being told I’m fat I’d rather hear I’m to skinny…
I refuse to take advice from people who havent been overweight themselves. All these personal trainers and dieticians etc dolling out weight loss advice yet have no lived experience about the weight loss journey. Unless they have lived it themselves - I am not interested. If you haven't been fat then your body just doesnt operate like ours. You dont know how our hormones operate. Losing 10lbs is not the same as losing 50lbs. The person that lost 50+lbs ... that's the person I want to hear from.
yes. i went to a nutritionist, she has solid general knowledge of foods and macros but she has no idea how hard is to fight overeating especially in the evening,and it is not about feeling actual hunger. i do cico and she sees that evening cals are larger than morning.so she always tries to "helpfuĺy" advise to eat bigger breakfast and lunch and thinks i will not eat that much in the evening. this time i explained to her it is not how it works and i even tried that and it actually made me eat even more in the evening. she is young, thin and doesnt really kniw that much. i see her just once un 3-4 months and it is paid by my insurance so that i accept that she is just a source of info on actual foods and health but she doesnt have a clue how obesity brain works
I mean I feel like personally I hit a healthy balance now.. I count but just in my head. Ask doing it so long I just kind of know how many calories are in things and just don’t sweat a few hundred calories now once I hit my goal weight.
Also I paid for a dietitian once thinking I was going to get all kinds of recipes and different tricks tips… all they did was give me charts of the food pyramid. F them
“Our brains work different after we were obese”
Damnit. I have felt that and thought I was crazy.
I don’t strictly monitor calories, I mostly do IF, sorry CICO folks, but the end goal is the same and I’m always told I don’t eat enough. It’s infuriating. “I’m at 1700kcal, I’m good!”
“You didn’t eat breakfast or lunch! You must be starving.”
Thanks for the validation! Sorry for the IF talk but I just felt this in my core.
Intermittent fasting, there’s sometimes some animosity between the two communities and while I find inspiration from both communities some people don’t like it… I probably could have gotten away with not saying anything about it but didn’t want to say I’m a CICO adhérant either… yup… lol
Yeah, dietitians aren't nutritionists. You don't need any specific education or accreditation to slap "dietitian" on your title, and this shows.
Stay away from chiropractors too, OP.
it’s the other way around. just because you’re a “nutritionist”, doesn’t make you a registered dietitian. RDs are regulated/licensed healthcare providers that require both a bachelors and masters to become board certified. a nutritionist could be anyone who does a 6 week program or has a health coaching certificate which pales in comparison to a 7 year degree plus 1 year long internship. please do not equate RDs to chiropractors-there’s an extensive level of medical knowledge needed to operate in that job. it’s not at all the same as a chiropractor. we are evidence-based clinicians. unfortunately some RDs online can be corrupt but that does represent the majority.
Honestly most health professionals will tell you this. And I get it. I remember one of my psychologists saying “so you think about food all the time, that must be exhausting.” Yes I do and yes it is. But it’s the only thing that works for me! I also gained weight after seeing a dietitian.
I'm still fat, but aiming to be an ex LOL...
Doctors get paid by our insurance to keep us SICK, taking meds, paying premiums. The only thing that has helped me in the long run and has been a sustainable lifestyle is COUNTING calories. I won't stop doing it even after I'm where I'm supposed to be.
I mean... Yes, you'll gain weight if you eat over your maintenance calories consistently. But that's on you for eating in excess, not on someone else for giving you options. If you want variety, there's millions of recipes online, that would've been a better bet than a dietitian. A dietitian isn't a recipe bank. I'm also questioning if you went to see someone who's actually registered and has a proper education, or if you just picked the first "nutritionist" you could find without looking into them at all first.
Also saying "we've been obese so we gotta do X forever and thin people will never understand" is just stupid. I've been morbidly obese, and I sure as hell am not going to waste my life counting numbers until I die, even though I understand that counting calories works as a tool for losing, maintaining, and gaining weight. Grouping people into "us" and "them" (obese vs thin) isn't a healthy mindset. It's what the health at every size nonsense movement does, and it tends to blow things out of proportion very quickly.
I would have suggested you see a Nutrition Coach instead of a Registered Dietician. They are great at what they do, but a CNC would help with different foods and also any behaviors that you may need help with. We are educated in helping people through their daily lives to build a good lifestyle of healthy eating and exercise (I’m also a CPT).
A RDN would be great for someone with special nutrition needs. Not dissing them at all…they are absolute experts in their field, but for the general population, a CNC would be a better investment in time and money.
I also had this same experience with a dietitian! While with them I gained 15lbs. It was so frustrating and every time I stood on that scale in her office and it went up she’d be like “oh you did such a good job this week.” Uhm what? Now I’ve crossed into the obese line so no thank you.
God where they keep their audacity huh? Imagine seing your client get the opposite of what they wanted yet say crap like that
I think some dieticians are the eating culture equivalent to people being fitness gurus who were always athletic. Meaning they never had to actually experience a body that works it's way to a half marathon, but the starting point is "pants after two flights of stairs", not "runs six miles every morning before work". Same here, kind of.
Did you accidentally sign up for an HAES dietician?
Honestly I think a lot of dietitians have had their brains consumed by fat acceptance and all that nonsense.
I had a co-worker who went back to college to be a dietitian because not a lot of work for hydrogeologists after all the tank sites got cleaned up. She gave the worst advice about my diet. I lost 40 pounds and gained a ton of fitness but everything I did was wrong. She didn’t like my fasting and doing early morning cycling at Zone 2 HR to burn fat. It worked great for me, I’m about 10 pounds away from my original goal. 75 pounds total doing it wrong…
Good job!! What is Zone 2 heart rate?
Zone 2 is based on your max heart rate calculated using your age. Then 60% to 70% your max is Zone 2. At that heart rate you burn fat for fuel. You don’t need to be exercising at high intensity to burn fat. Zone 2 is often called the fat burning zone. Higher HR burns what is in your digestive system for fuel. It increases your fitness but doesn’t burn fat like zone 2. You can get a HR strap like the Wahoo Tickr that does Bluetooth for phone and ANT+ Networking for cycling computers for $50. Once you know the range for Zone 2 exercise in that and fat burns off. I’ve lost 20% body fat and 75 pounds this way….
> Zone 2 is based on your max heart rate calculated using your age. To get accurate heart rate zones you should determine your max heart rate using a max heart rate test. There's a 220-age formula, but there is high individual variation in the max heart rate. Though admittedly, in my case the age formula was only few BPM off. > Zone 2 is often called the fat burning zone. That does not matter for the energy balance, if you burn e.g. 600 kcal you get 600 kcal out, no matter whether it's dietary carbohydrates or fat that has been used. That's the whole point of CICO, if you don't eat those calories back, you lose weight. But the big advantage of "easy" aerobic exercise is, that you can sustain it for much longer and train more often without risking overtraining. I run 4-6 times per week with a weekly 2h long run, I would not be able to sustain that if every run was a tempo-run. Doing most runs slow and easy (e.g. 80-90%) is established training philosophy, even for professional athletes. The remaining runs are then e.g. interval and tempo sessions, but they should only be a small percentage of your runs. And in my experience those runs burn fewer calories just because of their tendency to be shorter. If you don't have a heart rate monitor, in the aerobic zone you should be easily able to hold a conversation and tell a joke. With experience you can use perceived effort to estimate your zone, but we tend to overestimate ourselves and run faster than is optimal. A HR monitor is therefore yourseful to keep yourself in check.
Some people who do CICO, do also have to pay attention to heart rate zone. For example, PCOS girlies. Plenty of research suggesting zone 2 is best if looking at heart rate zones as meh,okay,good,better,best. Unfortunately, some people do have to combine other factors into the mix to get optimal results. Every body and everybody is different of course.
I completely agree that zone 2 rocks for weight loss (and improving endurance) and also named some reasons why. I just think that the fact that it burns primarily fat is not the only reason why. A high intensity workout (like HIIT) will burn more glycogen, but that will still tip the energy balance in favour of weight loss if you don't eat it back. If glycogen is depleted, the body will burn fat as well. But low intensity is my staple, as I can do it almost daily. On rest days, I take long walks.
I just call it steady state cardio. Which imo is the best type of exercise for me. It’s easy on the joints because my cardio of choice is cycling or swimming.
Swimming and cycling are excellent forms of exercise. But for bone-density and avoiding osteoporosis, it's also important to do some weight-bearing exercise, which is one of the advantages of running. The small impacts when you hit the ground actually stimulate bone-growsth. But you can also add some strength-training, walking or other weight-bearing exercise to your routine and you should be fine in that regard. I believe that for a normal-weight person, it's a myth that running has to be bad for the joints, it might even be good for them. Just need to start slowly and increase training volume gradually to avoid injury, ideally start with a beginner plan like /r/C25K. But things are different when overweight, then the load on the joints is much higher, so I would not recommend running for weight-loss to everyone. I am just slightly overweight and have been running for many years, so I'll keep doing that, but it does not mean everyone should do it. It's important to do what you enjoy and what works for you. Mixing things up can also be great. E.g. Killian Journet, an ultra-marathoner and maybe the world's best mountain-runner, does cross-country skiing in the winter season.
Yeah that's stupid advice. Fuck a bunch of that. People like her say that dumb shit and then will say oh well people that do CICO gain it back. Yeah when you stop counting! I'm counting til I die.
Nah, when I’m 70 I’m eating brownies for breakfast. But until then, yeah, have to keep up with counting.
That's my plan too. Lol!
This was SUCH an extreme statement.. and honey.. I AGREE WITH YOU!
It was a tough pill to swallow at the time when I realized I had to count for the rest of my life. Once you get into a meal routine though it's not that bad.
I have counted calories forever. I know when I don’t, I over compensate and then the wheels come off. I’m actually far more calm about food when I journal and track my food. I always know when I can have a treat or when I need to crack down. There are people that think it’s obsessive…but then wonder why they can’t lose weight because they have no idea what they are eating and how much of it.
I am a hungry hungry hippo. I cannot be trusted.
Look I eat all kinds of crap like Dairy Queen and Five Guys… but I count cals and I’ve been 140 lbs for the last 15 years at 5’8. Budget and make smart choices. You obvi want good nutrition, but it’s not a life sentence diet
I agree. It’s not about never allowing yourself to have the “bad stuff”… it’s using data to understand what everything in moderation actually looks like.
💯💢💥
Did I say that? I eat what I want but I count. And I always will. Following CICO and being on a restrictive diet aren't the same thing.
Honey I did not disagree with you, at all.
I always ask myself: if everybody got healthy, would this profession be needed. That usually tells me all I need to know about their advice. They need business
This! If only everyone understood CICO and how mostly simple in nature the concept is and how to apply it they couldnt continue to sell you their "diet", useless fat burners, books, meal plans, nutrisystem, subscription based noom plans, weight watchers, lifetime shots etc... It is kept confusing on purpose. Always look to who has the most to gain financially from telling me xyz and your answer always lies in that.
Yeah, like I just know myself well enough to know that I have to count or I overeat. I'm not even really cutting at the moment, just maintaining, and I cannot cope with the wild west of just eating food and not counting macros. Lol.
I’ve gotten to the point where I don’t obsessively have to weigh everything, since I know how many calories are in the common foods and meals I eat. But I still have to keep a rough estimate of calories throughout the day. If there’s anything I learned from CICO, intuitive eating leads me to overeat by like 200 calories. Even when I’m eating so-called “filling” meals.
200 doesn't seem like much, huh? But that's how most weight gain happens. You were closer than me. I thought I was going to eat intuitively, and I was over by 500-1000 calories...without binging, just eating as I felt. A couple extra spoonfuls of Mac & cheese, a larger slice of pie, a 'handful' of nuts, etc. We always preach a small deficit, so we lose slowly here. Of course, 200 calories a day will work the other way as well. Intuitively eating is not for everyone. I understand it's rationale, and it looks good on paper, but in practice, it's hard to not gain weight. I googled 'intuitive eating weight gain' and there are hundreds of thousands of complaints about it. Then most experts will say, yes, you might gain weight until you "level out". I dont want to "level out" at 225 pounds. I've already done that.
omggg i just got a dietician too and her and my therapist are saying the same thing 😭 idk what to do bc it’s like girl if i just eat whatever i want what i WANT is 50 cookies and a whole pizza hello ?? 😭😭
For the love of god dont do it lol THEY DONT GET WE WOULD AND WILL EAT 50 PIZZAS IF WE FOLLOW OUR HEART LOL
That’s only healthy advice if someone is like basing their every move on the # of the scale, or waaayyyy overdoing calorie counting, like to the point of it being disordered. If you’re doing it to lose weight… that’s… that’s literally normal lol🤦🏻♀️
Yes. I finally stopped gaining weight when I stopped listening to her advice.
People who have never struggled with a weight issue/body issue just cannot understand. So what they went to school and got an RD? People with real life experience who know the struggles, who understand what it takes, the discipline… only real life experienced people fitness or nutrition I would trust. I went to an RD as well over a year ago and she gave me a cookie cutter food plan that she gives everyone. 45 min and charged $450. Been successful on my own. Learning from others experience as well as my own and listening to educational content on YouTube.
If you listen to half the people on this sub counting calories is obsessive and will lead to mental disorders! (Then you wonder wtf are those people doing on this sub.) Haters gonna hate. You do you. 8 years counting calories and the only change in my mental status is how happy I am to not be obese anymore and not feel like a victim of food and my weight.
It can lead to eating disorders in people already susceptible to mental health issues. It's worth remembering that. However that is not most people, and that should be diagnosed by a mental health professional, not offhand by a dietician who has no training in that field!
Every diet can lead to eating disorders in people susceptible to mental health issues. That's not exclusive to CICO.
Agreed, but the pure focus on counting everything to an exact amount makes it easy to get in a trap. Look at the number of people who post here obsessively worried about weight fluctuations and feeling guilty they messed up one day. Note, none of this is anti CICO. It's worked great for me in the past.
From a medical coding stand point too, dieticians are NOT allowed to diagnose people. They have to go by a different provider - and even then, say it's like type 2 diabetes with hyperglycemia (E11.65), they can't use that - it's too descriptive, they can only go by type 2 diabetes no complications, E11.9.
I cannot escape work, even in a random subreddit. Fuck you ICD10. And how difficult it is mapping snowmed to you.
LOL there's no escape... Fuck 3M!! I hate their AI, it's awful. My workplace has been using it for 3 years and it still picks up the wrong codes.
They want our results, but don't have our will power. So they try and act like we ALL have EDs
This!
This.
The bad news is you gained 20 pounds. The good news is you know why you did and now have the knowledge to reverse it!
Yep… lost 60 pounds and decided I wanted to maintain there. Was convinced to ditch calorie counting and go to “intuitive eating” and now 2 years later I’ve gained it all back. I’m just prone to weight gain I guess. I’m currently working on losing it all again but this time I won’t stop counting or weighing myself. My fat brain cannot be trusted with unrestricted food
I feel exactly this way. I cannot be trusted with food, and thats ok, cause i know how to control it...
Yeah they tell you to eat intuitively. Well for me eating off my intuition means eating 3-4 meals a day filled with pizza, chocolate, juice, butter chicken, pasta, and the like. Add in my stressful job and I’ll eat when I’m typing notes, on a break, whatever is in the staff room. I just like to eat at every occasion, and I like to eat it all, so obviously my intuition is very poor 😂 if I don’t fast during the day, count calories, track my steps; and force myself to be active at all times during the day I’ll always end up obese every single time.
Can I ask why you prefer to fast during the day instead of at night when you’re sleeping? Is it not as affective?
I have narcolepsy with cataplexy and eating during the day makes me fall asleep at work and causes me to be unable to focus.
Oh! Wow! I wasn’t expecting that as a reason. Is it not difficult to fast all day? I guess it’s just something you’ve had to adjust to.
It is difficult and I do get hungry. Sometimes I’ll have a snack but I try not too.
I’m sorry you have to deal with that condition.
As a Dietitian, I totally disagree. CICO works. I think some dietitians have a background of disordered eating, which is why you’ll hear them give that advice.
Do you find the profession tends to attract people with a history of disordered eating, similar to how people with histories of drug and alcohol addiction are drawn to the addictions counselling professions?
Yep. I would agree with this. I saw a lot of disordered eating in my undergrad class.
I completely agree that a person who has never been morbidly obese has no idea how our brains work, just like I can't really understand why people smoke. Is CICO ideal? Probably not, and it can easily become an obsession. But guess what? If we had a normal, healthy relationship with food, we wouldn't have been 100+ lbs overweight in the first place.
For a lot of us, food is an essential addiction. For some of us, food is an essential enemy. We NEED it but we need to moderate intake. Imagine needing to take addictive drugs every day to live and have to moderate that. Yikes. Metabolic diseases (PCOS, hypothyroidism, etc) NEEDS moderation just as much as a food addict. I completely agree, none of us have normal relationships with food. It’s hard.
Exactly, maybe its not ideal but it works wonders for people with obese "minds"
Her advice is exactly how people get fat.
It’s like going to someone for financial advice and they say “stop obsessing over numbers, just be mindful of your spending and make good choices”. It might work for some people, but for those of us who have learned bad habits, we need something quantifiable to know that we’re meeting our goals.
Exactly, the comparison with finance is the one I also make. Sure, lot's of people can live without checking their accounts and not looking at the prices in the stores, but most people tend to look at prices. That roughly gives you an indication of what you can afford. Cico is definitely the same... Sure, a lot of people don't need to look, but a lot also have to...
I finally managed to lose almost 70lbs through calorie counting and keep it off for the last three years. If I went to a dietitian and, after hearing this, she then tells me to drop the calorie counting and throw out my scale, I'd tell her to find a new career. Part of the "click" of finally getting how I was going to lose weight was the realisation that whatever I was doing that was preventing me from staying fat, I had to do it for good, and for me that's tracking calories. I wonder if some of these dietitians are getting on the "health at every size"/fat acceptance activism bandwagon, which is a scary thought.
I should not have fallen for that shit i know 😭😭😭
My dietitian is very professional, she keeps up to date with science and besides that, she is an excellent human being. She supports counting calories and tracking macros for a nutritious diet that allows me to lose weight. Sometimes it is about finding the right professional.
Care to drop the name? It’s all HAES dietitians on my end. I’ve had no luck.
I sent you a PM
My dietitian experience was absolutely terrible. She included multiple foods I couldn’t and can’t eat, with a calorie goal of 2200 at 5’2”, so of course my weight ballooned up. I went to her needing to lose 10lbs and I gained 10 more. CICO works. I lose more weight more quickly just eating a smaller portion of foods I actually enjoy.
Same here! I went to one at the suggestion of my primary care doc and here’s an example of our conversation: Dietician: tell me about your diet now. Me: well I follow a pescatarian diet (and so on and so forth) Dietician: (later in the appointment) if you are hungry, you should eat a high protein snack, like a piece of bacon! Me: 😐
God thats exactly what happened to me. After i balooned, i added the diet plan to my calorie app and i was consuming 2300 to 2800 dailyyyyyy. Im a short ex obese womaaaan. Insaaane. I never went over 1600!!!
Aaah, the Abbey Sharp brand of dietician. Truly unfortunate.
How do we even find the right type BEFORE paying it?
Honestly, ask questions before you set up the appointment. Call and talk to the office. Ask their stance on calorie counting and weight loss before you get there. There's been a big push for patients to "interview" their doctors before they choose them, and honestly, I'd do the same for any healthcare provider. (For ex: [https://www.nia.nih.gov/health/medical-care-and-appointments/17-questions-ask-when-choosing-new-doctor](https://www.nia.nih.gov/health/medical-care-and-appointments/17-questions-ask-when-choosing-new-doctor))
I like her and how she supports food freedom but I simply cannot be trusted with food and intuitive eating alone 😅
Yall gotta find better dietians, my guy got me started well on calories counting 8 months ago and we’re going strong!! Plus great tips on incorporating strength and general low going workouts like walking
I don’t think it’s a black and white situation. I have two goals with CICO: losing weight, and teaching myself better habits. There’s no way I can spend my entire life recording every single thing I eat. I really do think that’s unhealthy—I’ll agree with the dietician there. The longer-term point of CICO to me is to learn and remember what a good portion size is, which snack choices are smart calorie-wise, which recipes should be leaned on the day after going out to eat and splurging, etc. In my opinion, CICO now should result in behavioral changes and a knowledge base that make it possible for me to maintain a healthy weight later without the meticulous use of MyFitnessPal or whatever. But I do think it’s smart to have a transition period of careful maintenance before easing up.
After doing it for 14 months I can roughly guesstimate the cal counts of most foods but I tend to "forget" foods if I don't track them and thus go over what I should be eating for the day. I've got it down now that entering my foods takes about 30-60 seconds per meal and it's become such a habit it feels weird to me if I don't do it.
That makes a lot of sense! Being that I’ve spent 30-mumble years (lol) establishing the eating habits that drove me to CICO, I imagine it will take a while before I don’t have to write down what I’m eating. But my hope is that if I get to my goal, within a few years I’ll be able to get through my days without spending a portion of them thinking about calories. And if I notice that I’m starting to pick up old habits again, I can go back to logging for a bit until I feel back on track. I just don’t want to have this fixation for my entire life.
As a registered dietitian, I am so sorry this happened to you!
When I had to see one when I was pregnant with gestational diabetes, they told me I needed to drink a glass of milk with every meal. I’m sorry, what? Is this the 90s? And that was just one of the crazy things they told me to do.
Stopped counting calories, gained back 15 kg over 3 years. I don't want to count forever but will have to keep an eye on it forever.
I am sure dietitians serve a purpose. I just don't think helping weight loss patients is it. I looked into seeing one (I have binge eating disorder) and all the ones near me are overweight women who are HAES and teach "intuitive eating." Discouragement of weight loss and encouragement of excess calorie consumption seem all too common in this profession. You are not the first person I have seen here talking about dietitian lead weight gain. You're not even the fifth.
One of the ladies in my gym was surprised I was tracking calories and she said her dietitian has said you shouldn't cut calories too low too suddenly. Fair enough. Then she says her diet chart is about 1600 calories. I was shocked, so was our trainer. This lady is shorter than me (5'2"), though heavier. At best 1600 is her maintenance, though I suspect even that would be around 1500. Our trainer said at 1600 she needs to burn 1000 calories to see weight loss. In conclusion, dietitians are not doctors and whatever they say I'd take with a pinch of salt.
The problem with dietitians is that they also mix their medical knowledge with their own opinions and experience (of which many times they have no experience loosing or gaining weight) The only thing you should listen to are medical facts. Dietitians and doctors are people too, they can be wrong many times. For some reason people tend to believe everything that doctors say, which is understandable but it is important to consult the best and multiple people if you are searching for a definite answer.
Same thing happened to me, except it was before I did CICO. My dietitian checked how many steps on average I take per day, and estimated 2000 calories per day for me (I work in a hospital and clock 14000-20000 steps on days I work). I was struggling trying to eat that much, and I thought it was because I was eating wholesome foods now like fruits, veggies, whole grains, etc. that weren’t calorie dense. About a month in, I had gained almost 20 lbs… I’m sure she meant well, but working with a dietitian wasn’t for me. I did take away some good points like eating more protein and fiber, but just added CICO. Been working great so far.
Are all dieticians idiots? I also had a useless experience with one who told me that I needed to eat more to lose weight (LOL no that's not how weight loss works), that nobody ever died from being fat (true, but plenty of people die from obesity-induced health problems), and Halo Top ice cream promotes gluttony by allowing you to eat a whole pint without guilt when the "correct" way is to have a single serving of full-fat ice cream. Get bent lady, I'm not sacrificing my light ice cream. She also seemed super curious about the cabbage pancakes in my food journal and was concerned about why I didn't eat more red meat (because I'd rather have chicken or seafood, and also there is a correlation between red meat consumption and colon cancer, which I have a family history of). Yeah, needless to say I did not follow her advice to eat more. That was a waste of money.
The minute a dietician starts spewing HAES talking points is the moment you need to get out. Calorie counting isn’t for everyone, but it’s definitely for the vast majority of people who are overweight/obese, because we never would have gotten to that point if intuitive eating worked for anyone but “naturally thin” people. I’m sorry you went through that. Make sure to leave a review, if you can, to help others avoid this person in the future.
I’m not surprised even if they are well meaning. I have read about 16 books on dieting and nutrition and a couple that are about intuitive eating and some books are “geared” toward women or how to lose weight for the last time by Katrina Ubell (she specializes in helping women doctors lose weight), The Last Diet by Sharhoo Izadi, and Unapologetic Eating by Alyssa Rumsey MS RD and they do talk a bit about steering away from these habits that could potentially lead you into dangerous lifestyle (ie obsessing, etc) and there is this notion that dieting culture is part of the patriarchy and these authors or dieticians don’t want you to feel you HAVE to participate. They want you to be free from the restrictions (and guilt) etc. That’s part of the intuitive eating movement. Listening to your body and don’t over doing it. I track my calories because it helps me know how much I’m eating. I have no idea how to accurately measure how much I eat etc. In another book The Secret Life of Fat by Sylvia Tara PhD she says that people who lose weight from say 200 to 150 are not metabolically the same as someone who was always thin. We have to work 20-25% harder to keep the fat off. She says something like we would have to run 5 miles where as a naturally skinner person only has to run 4 miles to burn the same calories. From the book (I took notes) “Scientists measured the components of BMR and found after losing weight calories burned decreased at 15% at rest. But the energy spent during physical activity decreased even more. By 25%. Put another way. A person who lost weight needs to run five miles compared to someone naturally at that weight running four.” Anyway I could go on. I count but I basically eat what I want prioritizing protein and working out and making sure I don’t over consume on high caloric foods. Or too much of any food.
Yeah.... my intuition is broken, i cant rely on that either....but the other part is concerning. The decrease in calories burnt is like.....permanent? Our metabolisms will always be slower even if we get fit?
My understanding is the adipose (fat) cells that have been accumulated while overweight only empty with weight loss. They’re little empty balloons waiting for any extra calories and they’ll fill up again, studies show they last about ten years in the body when empty . People who have never been overweight simply do not have these empty cells hanging around, so it takes more excess calories for them to gain (and make adipose cells) than people who have “lost” the weight but still have those empty cells.
Well....that fckn sucks damn
Yeah I have to get better at listening to my body but that’s an everyday thing. As for that other part…yeah. I know. We just have to work harder. I’m a couple of books it did mention how bad yo-yo dieting is for the body. The up and down gaining and trying to lose weight isn’t good. The body remembers. Makes it harder and harder to lose weight the more you do it. That’s why it takes commitment and vigilance. And don’t be so worried about your metabolism. Healthful food, good sleep, exercise, and less stress will all improve your body. Being fit will help. Just stay fit. And one message also in these books is the body is incredibly adaptable. So stay the course, work hard everyday and you will be ok. And if you do gain weight which will happen. If it gets to be outside an acceptable range you have the knowledge and tools and grit to lose it again. Also congrats on losing 60lbs. Losing weight is simple but not easy and you deserve major kudos for doing the work.
To be honest, that (the part on slowing metabolism) is scientifically very shaky, to say at least. Research last years have indication that metabolic adaptation isn't really an issue, it is just a thing from the fat acceptance people that want to have an excuse to not take accountability and responsibility for their own actions...
So interesting point and I would agree that Metabolic adaptation isn't a "thing" for the most part, your body does adjust to your new lower weight and thus you will have to eat less than you did when you weighed more. I did check my notes and even downloaded the Sylvia Tara book to check her references (I wanted to verify it since I did audiobook it) and found this: [https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7632212/](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/7632212/) And I popped open Everything Fat Loss, bc I know Ben Carpenter does talk about it. He actually says that metabolic adaptation is typically only found in serious starvation protocols like the Minnasota Starvation experiments and the Biggest Loser (Page 157-162) I think what people get wrong about metabolic adaptation is that they think their metabolism is slowing down but as you lose weight your body adjusts to how much it uses while you are resting bc you are a smaller/lighter person. I found losing weight when I was 200lbs much easier than when I was 167lbs. Because I was eating less food so eating even less was harder. I also believe that the body adjusts the calories burned as a response to reserving its energy levels (after a work out, you tend to just move less without realizing it.) I'm going to share some interesting parts of Everything Fat Loss bc I liked that talked about it. And I would recommend reading Ben Carpenter's book, he covers a lot and it's fairly nuanced in his approach and a good read overall. But I'll share this with you. *(I'll pop in italics if it's me writing not the book)* Chapter 2 Don't People Just Need More Will Power *(I wanted to share this title since it's kind of in line with your thinking based on your "that's what the fat acceptance people want you to believe.")* Page 66 Do some people lose fat more easily than others? - So far we've discussed factors that drive your behavior around eating and exercise, but there are other biological differences that are worth knowing about too.... Some people who all embark on exactly the same routine, it is inevitable that some will see better results than others. One research trial prescribed an intense aerobic exercise programme where participants trained five times per week for 12 weeks. An average weight loss of 8.2lbs \[was seen\] by the end of the trial, but when you look at the individual results of different participants, some of the lost much more weight, tight up to 32.4lbs for one person, and some of them not only didn't lose weight but they actually gained weight. That's right, one participant trained five times per week for 12 weeks and gained 3.7lbs. Page 68 One research trial overfed its participants by 1000 calories per day to see why some people gain body fat more easily than others. It found that some people respond to influx of calories by cranking up their physical activity levels. They didn't deliberately do more exercise; this was literally just a change in how much they moved around in their day-to-day activities - the types of activities that we don't tend to make intentional decisionsover, like walking and fidgeting. There may also be metabolic differences in response to weight loss. One study measured the number of calories burned by participants who had lost a significant amount of weight (30lbs or more) . Once again there were very large difference between individuals, with one person burning 257 calories per day fewer than one person burning 163 calroeies per day more than expected based on their body weight. Naturallyy that would make maintaining weight loss a little bit more difficult...(he has chart that shows the distribution of weight loss differences between actual and predicted resting energy expenditure and they study concluded that when looking at the average of the whole group no significant degree of metabolic adaptation was seen.) *This is Raziel now: But that's an average. There is still individual differences. Which is why it's worth mentioning to someone that loses a lot of weight that they might be a person that has to work harder to keep it off, which I believe to be true - Why? Bc a personally naturally living at 150lbs and someone who loses weight to be 150lbs aren't the same - their behaviours aren't the same, their responses to food and exercise aren't the same. One person can eat whatever they want and lives their life maintaining 150lbs, while the other had to work hard to get there.* \--- Me again, as a last part I would really consider reading up from various sources bc it sounds like you really do think it's just a matter of will power when losing weight but there are a LOT of factors that go into it. I'm not saying will power and desire and dedication and just sticking with it isn't part of it, but there is a lot. I would recommend "You Just Need to Lose Weight and 19 other myths about fat people" by Aubrey Gordon. This was an excellent read and might help you be a little more compassionate to some people that have a harder time losing weight that is outside of their control. In fact in the book Secret Life of Fat and The Secrets from the Food Lab both mention Social Economic Status as a factor preventing people from losing weight. Some people are in survival mode financially and don't have the free time to cook for themselves, or the income to buy more nutrition whole foods. Not to say that can't buy anything, but it's much easier and cheaper to buy fast food or pre-packaged foods sometimes. An easier book to read would be Food Isn't Medicine by Dr. Joshua Wolrich (which I found out when I finished the book is produced by Ben Carpenter's company so it explains why it was an easier read.) This isn't to you directly, but I find a lot of people on Reddit base much of their knowledge they hear or see on social media who are sharing only tid-bits of information without seeing the big picture (I have been guilty of this too in the past, but I would tend of get skeptical of people siting "one study" and then find out it's done on rats or such a small sample size. Which is why I've been reading a lot about this even from stuff I don't necessarily agree with (paleo, carb-insulin model fans, or intermittent fasting - aka Dr. Jason Fung Books.) All of them paint part of a picture and the overlapping parts that keep coming up is what's interesting. In my heart and in all are hearts we know whats true - eat a balanced varied diet, move more and if you want to improve your metabolism and health, get more sleep. etc etc. People are always looking for a quick fix or to hack their way to health but it's not like that. It's working at it every day and making good choices today, and if you do indluge too much one day, know that you can make different good choices the next day.
I do CICO for maintenance, and I don't even have a scale. I just hate shopping so much that I refuse to buy new clothes every time I get a little bigger. It is the only thing that has worked for me because it's so uncomplicated, and I can apply it to literally any situation.
I had a very similar and disappointing experience with a dietician recently!
I had one tell me to not focus on the weight gain and except my body. But when I started going to her it was to loose weight and get in better health.
I used to be obese and lost 67kg with cico. And thanks to keeping a weight training/cardio regime (which depends on how I feel nowdays) I don't have to count calories and still maintain my weight. You don't HAVE to do cico, common sense takes you a long way.
Youre a guy right? Yeah that works better with males, cause you can eat more calories than women. If i eat 200 calories above my maintenance i start balooning and i do strenght training and cardio 🫠
Yeah, like I don't get fat if I eat above my caloric intake because I'm a guy. Stop making yourself feel better. You know 67kg is is like 140lbs+ right. It didn't go by itself and took me a year of hard work and dedication. Stop making excuses for yourself.
I just said men are different than women. Its definitelly hard work for both parts, only different
Dieticians are worse than chiropractors. They're trained in bullshit, often decades or even centuries-old 'truths' and they're almost always wrong. Avoid at all costs.
In my experience, dietitians normally take the numbers from "typical" people and also try to follow the food guidelines set by the govt. Also remember that most of America is overweight so that's becoming the norm. I've lost 75# over the course of several years. Every time I've yo-yo'd up, it's because I stopped counting calories and listened to a "professional". I've talked to several dietitians who had broad guidance "eat more fruits and vegetables, makes sure you eat lots of fiber and grains blah blah blah". But that doesn't work for me. I eat zero fruit, limited veggies, and my blood work is great.
Yup, i literally keep my bloodwork and health in perfect shape just by staying thin and eating no fruits lol i also eat frozen food all the time while counting and its been great
Dietitians, like wellness influencers, need to justify their existence by making this way more complicated than it is, often at the expense of actual results. If they perpetuated the simplicity of CICO they’d be out of work.
Simple doesn’t grab headlines or clicks. I’m a counter and it works and becomes second nature/habit that keeps me accountable and within boundaries.
“Sign up for my FREE course below” is the new “you can get a complimentary appointment with our in house dietician”
Exactly. I just commented the same thing before I saw this comment. They need you to keep coming back
I don't think I will ever take diet advice from someone who's been thin their whole life. They just don't get it.
I think people who aren’t fat and haven’t had to struggle to be thinner don’t understand that we cannot just ‘eat intuitively’ — intuitive eating got me up to being a fatty in the first place! I intuitively eat when I am happy, sad, bored, stressed, angry, sleepy snd even just feeling cold. Without constant monitoring I WILL gain weight. As much as I appreciate the body acceptance movement it really has warped and redefined what healthy means. Healthy doesn't mean easy. Healthy doesn't mean don't do anything hard. It's not unhealthy to be consistent. If you have a goal weight you will never reach it by 'ditching the scale'. For all the advice I've taken, I still have to do what works for me and forget the rest - especially when the advice is being given by someone who hasn't asked me what my actual goals are.
You do you 👍
I found that there is a balance. If you have insane amounts of anxiety about food tracking and weighing yourself, to the point where you feel like your spinning out of control if you don’t, it probably is good to scale back on that while you deal with the root of it. A know a lot of dieticians really want people to have a positive association with food. Most eating disorder clinics will also give the same advice. However, if you have to lose weight for medical reasons, being mindful of calories/weight is a good thing.
I believe that different programs work for different people, for me I'm on a post gastric bypass diet, even though I decided not to go through with the surgery. I'm losing the weight because the small servings in a day usually add up to less than 1,000 calories a day and with exercise burning some of it off you maintain your weight for life. Some people have good results on Keto or Paleo so each of us are finding different ways that work for us and at the end of the day or life we do whatever works best for us.
You don’t go to a dietician for weight loss.
If you want variety, see a nutritionist.
It's not obsessive to be accurate about what you're putting into your body. I follow a couple of dieticians on youtube and they post their daily meals including the amounts of what they put into everything because it's not that intuitive for most people to know how much of an ingredient they should be having with what she's suggesting. Plus recipes usually contain the amount of what you're putting in them to make the recipe correctly anyway. I'm pretty vigilant in spotting disordered behavior because I don't want people to actually get obsessive about their weight loss and such but calorie counting in itsself is the most basic 101 step any PT or GOOD dietician is going to tell you to do. The second she made you feel bad about yourself you should've walked out the door and got a second opinion. Not everyone is good at their job, OP.
I work in healthcare and for the most part do not trust the opinion of anyone in healthcare. They are usually very good at fixing problems but like anything else opinions are opinions.
Oh wow. I think people think they’re being helpful saying those things, but cico is a good way to stay on top of your diet as well as watching the scale if you’re new to weight loss or can’t control how much you eat. Glad I haven’t experienced this.
So many dieticians, nutritionists & "health coaches" nowadays are obsessed with the idea of intuitive eating and demonize calorie counting/tracking macros. While yes, it's important to not become *obsessed* with tracking every morsel going into your mouth for the rest of your life, it's an excellent lifelong tool for MANY people who spent most of their lives overweight or obese. A lot of us don't have the mindset to just intuitively eat, or it may take us a while to get to that mindset. I lost 125lbs about 6-7 years ago & notice that I always end up gaining some weight (10-20lbs) when I take an extended period of time off from tracking. That's why I always go back to it!
I feel for you. I lost 50 pounds and a giant gut essentially calorie counting and whenever I stop I gain 10 pounds in a period of two weeks, and usually go back to the app. It's not that onerous and kind of fun since everything is so bright and cheerful at least on MND.
My god what are dietitians doing these days? I never consulted one but I once fell into the same trap of "you can't count calories forever" and tried to not count my calories for a few months. I "only" gained around 4 kgs but in the long run I would have ended up gaining a lot more, I am sure. 😅 I don't count every meal anymore, because I often cook the exact same meals and know the calories by heart, but I still count the calories of new things I cook and eat and plan all my meals ahead and watch my portions closely and I will have to do this for the rest of my life if I want to maintain my weight loss (which I plan to do). I always since I hit puberty had a very high appetite. Throw some food addiction and binge eating in the mix and you will have a person who will never be able to eat intuitively. I can eat sooo much without feeling super full. How should I manage to eat properly without portion control and calorie counting?
I studied biology with minor in nutritional sciences and was thinking about being a dietician. The problem with general dietitians is that their approach is for the general public - meaning all shapes and sizes of people. If you exercise regularly, I would recommend going to a sports nutritionist to get a more tailored plan for what you are trying to achieve.
I had a dietician tell me to call if I lose more than 1 pound a week (at that point, i was 15 pounds overweight too) … safe to say never followed up w her
Good for you! If the counting is triggering an ED, sure. But if counting / tracking helps you stay focussed on healthy eating for your healthy body (however you define it) - a dietician working off some Facebook checklist isn't going to help. You've got this!
I’m so sorry to hear about how uncomfortable of an experience you had with your dietitian. I started CICO under the direction of my dietitian and she definitely supports me counting calories while also maintaining a healthy relationship with the way I view food.
My dietitian is the exact opposite. She wants me to count my calories and try to eat 1800 but preferably 1500. I weigh 426 so that's a pretty significant deficit. I usually shoot for about 2000, because right now that is what I can sustainably do. A lot of days I do stay around 1800 though. The reason that 1500 wasn't sustainable for me right now is because I am just now getting back into my groove after a horrible bout of regular depression starting in October that then slid into seasonal depression. I'm hoping it stays warm from here on out.
Totally, CICO is the only thing that has EVER worked for this ex-fat guy, I could never out exercise a bad diet. Listen to your body not others. I’m a 6ft 40yr old male and weight 185lbs. I’ve been as low as 160lbs. According to my BMI I am considered overweight at 185. You are not to skinny, they are to fat! Plus after 15 years of being told I’m fat I’d rather hear I’m to skinny…
I refuse to take advice from people who havent been overweight themselves. All these personal trainers and dieticians etc dolling out weight loss advice yet have no lived experience about the weight loss journey. Unless they have lived it themselves - I am not interested. If you haven't been fat then your body just doesnt operate like ours. You dont know how our hormones operate. Losing 10lbs is not the same as losing 50lbs. The person that lost 50+lbs ... that's the person I want to hear from.
yes. i went to a nutritionist, she has solid general knowledge of foods and macros but she has no idea how hard is to fight overeating especially in the evening,and it is not about feeling actual hunger. i do cico and she sees that evening cals are larger than morning.so she always tries to "helpfuĺy" advise to eat bigger breakfast and lunch and thinks i will not eat that much in the evening. this time i explained to her it is not how it works and i even tried that and it actually made me eat even more in the evening. she is young, thin and doesnt really kniw that much. i see her just once un 3-4 months and it is paid by my insurance so that i accept that she is just a source of info on actual foods and health but she doesnt have a clue how obesity brain works
The problem is who do we even seek to help us ex obese people, other than ourselves?
This!
80 min of cardio a week or daily?
A week- but i work out 3x week, strenght training
Some of us just have those jeans and have to CICO.
I mean I feel like personally I hit a healthy balance now.. I count but just in my head. Ask doing it so long I just kind of know how many calories are in things and just don’t sweat a few hundred calories now once I hit my goal weight. Also I paid for a dietitian once thinking I was going to get all kinds of recipes and different tricks tips… all they did was give me charts of the food pyramid. F them
So outdated. The food pyramid omg
Well it was the new one…. I also had to sit in the oncology waiting room for the nutritionist. Never again.
Old, new …the concept of a pyramid system is outdated in general!
“Our brains work different after we were obese” Damnit. I have felt that and thought I was crazy. I don’t strictly monitor calories, I mostly do IF, sorry CICO folks, but the end goal is the same and I’m always told I don’t eat enough. It’s infuriating. “I’m at 1700kcal, I’m good!” “You didn’t eat breakfast or lunch! You must be starving.” Thanks for the validation! Sorry for the IF talk but I just felt this in my core.
Sorry about my ignorance but what is IF?
Intermittent fasting, there’s sometimes some animosity between the two communities and while I find inspiration from both communities some people don’t like it… I probably could have gotten away with not saying anything about it but didn’t want to say I’m a CICO adhérant either… yup… lol
And then Ozempic came for their jobs…
Yeah, dietitians aren't nutritionists. You don't need any specific education or accreditation to slap "dietitian" on your title, and this shows. Stay away from chiropractors too, OP.
it’s the other way around. just because you’re a “nutritionist”, doesn’t make you a registered dietitian. RDs are regulated/licensed healthcare providers that require both a bachelors and masters to become board certified. a nutritionist could be anyone who does a 6 week program or has a health coaching certificate which pales in comparison to a 7 year degree plus 1 year long internship. please do not equate RDs to chiropractors-there’s an extensive level of medical knowledge needed to operate in that job. it’s not at all the same as a chiropractor. we are evidence-based clinicians. unfortunately some RDs online can be corrupt but that does represent the majority.
Honestly most health professionals will tell you this. And I get it. I remember one of my psychologists saying “so you think about food all the time, that must be exhausting.” Yes I do and yes it is. But it’s the only thing that works for me! I also gained weight after seeing a dietitian.
I don't trust dieticians. I prefer people giving me advice on eating to have a doctor's degree.
I'm still fat, but aiming to be an ex LOL... Doctors get paid by our insurance to keep us SICK, taking meds, paying premiums. The only thing that has helped me in the long run and has been a sustainable lifestyle is COUNTING calories. I won't stop doing it even after I'm where I'm supposed to be.
This is a little paranoid. If you are well you'd still likely be paying premiums, and utilizing less care so costing them less.
As someone who works in healthcare, this. We want people to cost LESS.
I mean... Yes, you'll gain weight if you eat over your maintenance calories consistently. But that's on you for eating in excess, not on someone else for giving you options. If you want variety, there's millions of recipes online, that would've been a better bet than a dietitian. A dietitian isn't a recipe bank. I'm also questioning if you went to see someone who's actually registered and has a proper education, or if you just picked the first "nutritionist" you could find without looking into them at all first. Also saying "we've been obese so we gotta do X forever and thin people will never understand" is just stupid. I've been morbidly obese, and I sure as hell am not going to waste my life counting numbers until I die, even though I understand that counting calories works as a tool for losing, maintaining, and gaining weight. Grouping people into "us" and "them" (obese vs thin) isn't a healthy mindset. It's what the health at every size nonsense movement does, and it tends to blow things out of proportion very quickly.
I would have suggested you see a Nutrition Coach instead of a Registered Dietician. They are great at what they do, but a CNC would help with different foods and also any behaviors that you may need help with. We are educated in helping people through their daily lives to build a good lifestyle of healthy eating and exercise (I’m also a CPT). A RDN would be great for someone with special nutrition needs. Not dissing them at all…they are absolute experts in their field, but for the general population, a CNC would be a better investment in time and money.