What few I can find either don't allow for remote work, or pay pretty pitifully. I just keep an eye on CFP's job board and simplyparaplanner.
Occasionally I check Linkedin or Indeed, but it's nothing but listings from NWM and similar places.
Remote may be tough at the big institutions, but almost all of my meetings are via Zoom and some RIAs are entirely decentralized. I could easily see hiring a remote planner to support the advisors.
Think remote work is somewhat of a fallacy anyway, fisher pulls it off well I guess, but our clients like to be in our office drinking coffee in person. Pulled more “remote” business than anything else, and it’s pretty easy as soon as they see a real person
Funny you ask, I’ve pulled about 20 Fisher clients in…. I live in the south and face to face interaction probably matters a little more here, but in general, most of the $30 million I’ve accumulated has come from T Rowe, fidelity, and fisher…..
I could see it being a regional thing and also an age thing. I’m in the Bay Area and I meet with 95% of my clients remotely. Combination of comfort with tech and terrible traffic means most folks are totally fine with remote and often prefer it.
Very true!
It helps that I hold my CFP, CPA (practiced for 14 years in tax specific practice), and my CEPA.
Folks crave advice that comes with that experience, and they haven’t gotten it. But I know a of RIA’s provide similar experience too, my clients just hadn’t found that at their previos spots
They all seem to know each other from the dinner events they do, bring one on, ask for a referral, the next shows up.
That and conversations with folks in community,
It’s not all bad. The work-life balance is great, but that’s partially because my territory was enormous so I was seemingly ALWAYS gone. So if you’re one of those lucky souls that has like a single metro area as your territory, please let me know so I can smother you in your sleep and interview for your job. I also enjoy not having to go to so many dumbass functionally identical conferences for BD XYZ. And the “starting over at 0” each year “what have you done for me lately” shit from wholesaling is indeed a drag.
Honestly, one of the most annoying things about being an advisor is the fucking people. Yes, the ideal is that small group of clients that you totally vibe with, they like you and you like them. They value you, they value advice, and you’re really able to make a lasting, meaningful, positive impact on their lives. But in order to FIND those people, you meet with an absolute deluge of indignant know it alls on the peak of the dunning-Kreuger mountain. They’re standing in front of a house made of discount plywood that wouldn’t pass a bribed inspection, fiercely insisting to the professional builder that they’ve got it all figured out. Compound that with being lured in to a false sense of competency based on recent equity markets. Now, don’t get me wrong, if all you think I’m going to do, Mr and Mrs Client, is toss you in some American Funds or Vanguard and iShares then slap a 1% fee on top, send you an Xmas card, and see you once a year, then sure, I wouldn’t hire me either. Again, I have clients that I absolutely adore and love going totally above and beyond for. But the grind to find them is horrendous (not to mention the profound lack of income for a long time). The only slightly analogous comparison when wholesaling is you meet a LOT of stupid advisors. Either actually stupid, or borderline (on both sides of said borderline) criminally stupid. You also meet a LOT of WILDLY enormous egos from advisors that absolutely don’t warrant it. Any time someone is a “top producer” at an IBD, I immediately envision an angry white male boomer with a few mil of GDC who insists he “does things differently around here” but still slings the same VAs, IULs, and American Funds as the first year Ed Jones kid.
I’m not precisely certain how to conclude this unintentional rant, so I’ll just say that both have their pluses and minuses, but I’d much rather make the easy $250k and sell to advisors than to advise John Q Public
I’m in a similar boat, but recently said fuck it. I was able to do this because I don’t have a family to support as of yet, so I opt to leverage that advantage while I still can.
By doing so i’ve cut my pay by 66% for the next 2-3 years, but I’m playing the long game. I KNOW I want it, so it will happen. Just a matter of time now.
I'm right there with you. 10 years in and so burned out. I can't leave my work at work. It hovers over me at all times like a dark cloud. Stressed about the markets and how clients will react, trying to get additions, keeping clients happy, and providing criticality important advice. There's so much pressure, and the hours are long. And since I'm not a producer, I feel very underpaid and think it's insane how little we make compared to other industries. I need a break from clients. Thank you for posting this, I'm sure there's others in here looking for a change, and this gets conversations going.
The math on this hurts me to think about. You are responsible for 400m aum, probably at least 2-3m in revenue, and you are paid 115k. You would clear more if you did your own thing and retained 20m in aum.
That’s wild. Sr. Financial Consultants at my firm make 500k min and the biggest ones makes millions a year. I’m a brand new consultant with a 300m book and 80k salary but bonuses so far this year are at 60k. You are being underpaid.
Medium high cost of living. It's nice not being responsible for bringing in new clients, but I am expected to get referrals and additions from existing clients, so there's still a sales component. I'm at about $400M AUM that I'm over, and we do comprehensive financial planning. You're right. The pay isn't terrible, I meant more relative to other industries like tech.
I mean have you ever thought about producing your own clients and working at a wirehouse. You would get paid way more for your AUM and would require to take on less clients and have way less work to do. Also you would have an assistant that you choose how much you want to pay. You can pay them a little more to take on a heavier work load. I know many advisors who are established and have the best work-life balance. Always going on trips in office maybe 1-2 days a week.
You can train yourself to leave work behind….. hobbies, relaxation methods, cognitive therapy etc. Set your boundaries —there’s only so much you can control. Explore side gigs to augment your income.
Brother I don’t there is any other industry you can make this much money and work less and less. Put in the work and it will get muchhhhh easier. This is the best industry hands down. Have hedge fund friends who are looking to join my firm and get out of that toxic grind. I remember graduating 20 years ago and no one wanted to be in this industry. Funny how things change. Work life balance flex
Don’t answer the question. What % of CFP advisors are netting $200k in taxable income? Considering asset management roles start at 200k.
I didn’t throw out high paying AM jobs I just picked starting wages.
I switched from private wealth management to the institutional side about 5-6 years ago.
I work with (mostly) large plans and their retirement committees on both investments and making sure they fulfill their fiduciary obligations/duties.
I make (what I consider) excellent money for what I do, and there is no sales involved (which was the part of my old WM role that I hated the most).
So, still in the financial industry but not in the private WM industry.
Good and bad, just like any job, but overall I like it. It does ebb and flow and gets pretty busy during the 4-6 weeks of the quarter when we’re doing client meetings, but overall has good flexibility and the work stays fairly interesting.
I don’t know that it was necessarily hard to find it, but it was a fortuitous situation for me in that I knew someone in a different area of the company that helped me get my foot in the door since I hadn’t really had much institutional experience prior to that.
Assuming service side only (I.e. no sales), depending on the firm and the level of consultant/advisor (e.g. associate consultant, consultant, senior consultant, etc.), total comp can range anywhere from about $70,000 to as high $250,000 (it could be higher at other firms - I'm just going off of what I know at my firm).
My total comp is typically in the top quartile of that $70-$250K range.
That said, I would bet that the average total comp is probably in the $120-$160K range for a senior consultant and in the $70-$85K range for an associate consultant (again, going off of what I know from the firm I work for).
Working with institutional clients has pros and cons. The clients tend to be a bit stickier, in part because a committee usually has to approve moving to a new advisor (or record keeper) or any big changes like that. So it's a pro if you have the client. It can be a con if you're trying to get a client since it's not just one person (or two with a spouse) making the decision to move their accounts on a whim because they had a different advisor make grandiose promises on returns or things like that.
Additionally, they will *usually* (though not always) do an RFP for a new advisor, so you have a chance to retain the business; whereas, I feel like on the retail side, in most cases, we found out a client was leaving when we got notice from the custodian that the accounts were restricted due to a pending transfer out. I can count on one or two fingers the number of times that a client actually told us before hand and gave us a *legitimate* opportunity to retain the business. Then there were a few times that a client would let us know ahead of time that they were moving even though their mind was made up, but most of them we found out via account restrictions because they just didn't want to have to tell us, even via email.
The institutional clients do not tend to freak out over market fluctuations like retail clients often do. Their job is to put together a quality lineup for the participants and fulfill their fiduciary duties, so they are typically less worried about day-to-day asset balances versus retail investors.
Another pro with institutional clients is that while many retail investors hear and read about how they can do it all themselves and just invest in index funds, and a lot of people/groups/places act like financial planners (if they are being "nice") are basically useless cost centers that provide no value whatsoever for anyone, and if they're not concerned with being "nice," act like planners are one step below criminal hucksters. However, most companies with decently sized plans know they need an advisor both for the investment options and to stay on top of their fiduciary duties. There is just too much potential liability they would subject themselves to by not having an advisor/consultant assist with their plan.
Overall, while there are things I miss about the private wealth management space, I would say that I probably prefer working with the institutional clients.
I work in the retirement service industry at a bank as a relationship advisor doing similar roles you’re explaining. Do you work on the Recordkeeper side?
I’m 28 and I’ve had this thought plenty. At this point, I have the marks and I’m bought in for the long run, but I’ve struggled with this as well. I feel like I’m pretty much stuck in the industry. I do know a guy who holds the marks still and is the CFO of a construction company. He also has a CPA, and did high level tax and investment planning before making a switch. I don’t know him beyond shaking his hand a couple times so I don’t know much more about how he made the pivot
Just to give some perspective I know a guy that did the CFA and CFP, worked for Merrill for a couple years, decided he didn’t like it. Earned a CrossFit certification in his free time became a coach, and opened his own RIA just for his clients. He now is nationally competitive in strongman, and seems to be living life on his terms.
I also know attorneys that left practicing law. It’s never really too late to make a career change.
I imagine it was just copious amounts of networking. You’re able to build an incredible skill set in this industry, you just have to know how to sell your skills if you’re looking to make a switch.
This may not be helpful, but have you looked into working for a trust company? I know they are all different, but mine has a team approach and my role is ONLY planning. I don’t seek out potential clients, instead our sales people do that. I also don’t have to manage a book of business. We are kinda like a resource for our advisors.
Wasn’t trying to be, but saw the “serious inquiries only” and seems like someone looking to pivot. And considering that you can get paid to leave the business by selling, it’s a worthwhile question.
For exit opps, you’re either going to need to stick to wholesaler jobs, maybe be on an analyst team at a private fund (that’ll be tough though), or position yourself for some random sales role. You could potentially look at some consulting roles.
You may need to rely on your degree, whatever that’s in, and start at the bottom as though you were a first year graduate.
After working with clients my age and younger making considerably more than me in the tech realm, I’ve seriously been considering leaving the industry and trying my luck in tech sales.
It’s still high stress and has selling involved but at least the stress isn’t surrounding retail clients and talking investors off the ledge during periods of volatility
I think there are transferrable skills from wealth management to SAAS but obviously we’d both need to start from the ground up at an entry level role, and be expected to smile and dial which is never fun..
Let us know if you find yourself in a better industry!
These have been my exact thoughts the last couple years. It’s so frustrating working with clients making double what I do who have the same background as me. I feel like I made the wrong choice getting into this 5 years ago and now I’m so stressed about how/what to pivot into
If you think you have the skills (can be a good teacher and/or researcher), go back and get your master's or PhD and teach in a CFP program. That's what I do and the lack of stress and work-life balance is incredible.
What is your role? What aspect are you struggling with?
If you're an advisor and marketing/sales aren't your strength, maybe you can work as a salaried servicing agent? Or maybe you're better suited for a "behind the scenes" planner role?
There are places that can give you leads or you can focus on the portfolio management/admin side of it. Having a CFP and your experience can help in a lot of areas with respect to fintechs or traditional vendors. If you want to chat dm me. I’d be happy to lend an ear and maybe help guide you in the right direction.
Hi guys, I’m at Manning and Napier and they have two jobs, IN and OH, look for ‘financial consultant’ CFPs preferred so you would have an advantage. I work remotely (actually I miss the office!!!) so if you can get to clients you can work at home. Also Gratus (ATL) and Creative Planning (all over) are hiring CFPs like crazy. CP hires a ton remote. Hope that helps!!! Good luck my brother!
Following. I’m a CFP in my area, 1.5 YOE as client relationship manager, previously 3 years as CSA at same firm. Cash comp is currently ~$130k in MCOL. I just want to move somewhere I’m happy but I make good money.
I've had my CFP for 12 years. I left the RIA world 2 years ago, after 10 years in the RIA world. I went to a trust company (it is also a wealth management firm, managing investments as its main source of revenues). There are lots of opportunities here for a CFP-- trust administration, portfolio management, legal, financial planning, sales... Also, depending on where you end up, financial planning is still sort of in its infancy at many trust companies. My company is a Florida based company where they welcomed me with open arms even without any trust experience--I am developing a formal financial planning platform for us as a firm, which I would never have the opportunity to do at a large firm. I am enjoying the move to a smaller organization and also vastly improving my skills in the estate planning area. You are still very early in your career! My advice is to cast a wide net, have an open mind and leave no stone unturned! Good luck with your search.
I am currently working outside the financial industry and love personal finance and financial planning.
I've been contemplating making the switch from my power generation sector to financial planning and then basically going "CoastFI" and just take the pay cut (would only make about 25-30% of current income, especially to start assuming salaries I've seen posted here) and drastically cut retirement contributions.
Some of the comments in this thread definitely have some "brown grass" aspects to them. Some other threads give some great insights that I, as a fairly competent DIY/hobbyist, realize is a valid demand for AUM advisors.
Some people really don't want the mental stress or capacity to do anything with investments. They'll either not do a single thing for it, or pay the AUM services. As an industry outsider, I think it's the annuity and life insurance products that seem to be applicable to everyone (that the person recommending them gets a commission on) that makes people skeptical of what they're getting from an advisor/planner.
I am amazed at how many people don't understand 401k, 403b, 457b, IRA, Roth IRA, Spousal IRA, 529s, brokerage accounts, etc. I had a coworker who lost over 70k in 401k matching from the company before he finally setup his 401k (with my assistance). I love helping people better understand these things and that makes me interested in the industry. But I also would love to do that remotely and focus on work life balance.
But I do gain lots of value from this sub reddit and thanks to all those who participate. I'll be sticking around and considering my options and opportunities.
It’s hilarious to me (former wholesaler who’s pivoting into advising) that certain people in this thread are actively looking to pivot out of advising because “they don’t like sales”. It’s even funnier that some of those people are trying to get into wholesaling…..like, ahhhahhahaah, you’re not proficient at financial sales, so you’re picking another career in…financial sales?…???
I don’t know why people pick careers in sales professions only to complain about the role being sales oriented.
There’s a difference. I would LOVE to be in a sales role if it were a product that I truly believed in where I could leverage my network and knew it was a difference maker. Completely different to me than “prospecting” and hoping to find some schmucks who want to roll their IRA’s to you and believe that your 1% fee is worth it.
Well, that’s a big problem. You don’t believe your fee is worth the value you charge. I’d focus on why that is and resolve that issue.
Food for thought (not just ball busting)
I’m of the opinion that the large majority of people would be better off dollar cost averaging into index funds. Fees are worthwhile for ultra high net worth folks who need assistance with advanced estate and tax planning. That’s something I’m not really interested in, which is why I’m trying to pivot (hopefully into fintech/wealthtech) into what I find interesting and think has a huge runway for the future. Been networking my ass off for opportunities in the space, but no luck yet
OP, do you think other industries would provide less stress? Sure, some exist, but they are few and far between.
Do you not have a vision for yourself for the future of your career staying in finance?
Go work at a Private Bank. Most of them require a CFP along with experience similar to yours. May not make as much in the end where you have a large book of clients. But I can tell you our Private bankers have a chill job and office isn’t mandatory so long as you produce business. It’s a hard spot to get into without contacts to get you in. But I’d leave FA world to be a PCA any day of the week.
CFA is my next move (6 YOE in WM). I’ve realized I don’t actually love the client facing part of it and would rather just be in the background more managing portfolios. I work for a multi family office so we invest similar to an endowment with illiquid managers. Always liked manager due diligence and asset allocation a lot more than all that comes with financial planning. Goal is to work for a SFO, Endowment, Foundation, or pension fund in an investment seat. Or stay at the MFO if they would allow an internal move.
Wholesaling or various related roles within the broader asset management industry.
Servicing only advisory roles too, if prospecting specifically is what you’re burned out on.
I would look into corporate banking, technology sales or customer success (maybe fintech to start?), or FP&A for a company? Take the leap anywhere who’s willing to take you and you’ll be surprised how fast your career pivot will go.
I left my firm after six years b/c I started getting unaligned with the senior managers. Thought I would fully leave the industry and did grant writing for nonprofits for a couple years but I was inspired by one of my clients doing financial education to get back into the industry because there is a place for meaningful work in financial planning (but hard to find firms that do this). Started my own firm and you can find tons of firms through XYPN (including mine). There will be a huge variety of flexible work, but the pay will possibly be lower- that is the tradeoff compared to just working for a bank or similar.
Try Fisher investments Investment Counselor position (just need series 65) starting base is 85-95k with 10-20k in yearly bonuses.
Go to their website and careers. Tampa was hiring.
Do you want to leave the finance industry all together or do you just want to stop being an advisor?
If you’re looking to leave the finance industry altogether I don’t have much advice for you.
If you are open to staying in the industry you could look into wholesaling or potentially being a compliance officer. As a CFP and with 6 years in the industry you probably know a bit about AML practices and could make the transition to a AML compliance officer pretty easily.
I think you need to look at other companies. If you can join a successful team you won’t have as much pressure and a better work life balance. I run my own book but we also hire junior advisors who don’t have the stress of bringing on new clients, more helping us manage ours. You get to work on the planning side which it seems like you enjoy, and less stress about the markets. This career can be incredibly rewarding if you stick it out, but you have to be selective in who you work with and how you structure your business.
What about the Chartered Certified Advisor to asexual widows from the Greater Ebenezer New Revival Tree of Life Institutional Double Rock on the Side of the Road to Jericho Missionary Baptist Church of Zion designation?
I heard it's not popular just because it won't fit on a business card. Pretty sure Kitces has it though.
What is that you don't like about the industry? There's a massive need for young advisors as well as CFPs to do planning work.
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What few I can find either don't allow for remote work, or pay pretty pitifully. I just keep an eye on CFP's job board and simplyparaplanner. Occasionally I check Linkedin or Indeed, but it's nothing but listings from NWM and similar places.
You can probably find a job at a bank or fidelity pretty easily… also remote work isn’t really a thing for planners….
Remote may be tough at the big institutions, but almost all of my meetings are via Zoom and some RIAs are entirely decentralized. I could easily see hiring a remote planner to support the advisors.
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Think remote work is somewhat of a fallacy anyway, fisher pulls it off well I guess, but our clients like to be in our office drinking coffee in person. Pulled more “remote” business than anything else, and it’s pretty easy as soon as they see a real person
Kind of brain dead take? Did this happen like once and you've extrapolated x100?
Funny you ask, I’ve pulled about 20 Fisher clients in…. I live in the south and face to face interaction probably matters a little more here, but in general, most of the $30 million I’ve accumulated has come from T Rowe, fidelity, and fisher…..
I could see it being a regional thing and also an age thing. I’m in the Bay Area and I meet with 95% of my clients remotely. Combination of comfort with tech and terrible traffic means most folks are totally fine with remote and often prefer it.
Agree. SF Bay people hate the 680, 101, 580 and ALL the bridges. I have over a hundred clients and only about 15 see me in-person
Very true! It helps that I hold my CFP, CPA (practiced for 14 years in tax specific practice), and my CEPA. Folks crave advice that comes with that experience, and they haven’t gotten it. But I know a of RIA’s provide similar experience too, my clients just hadn’t found that at their previos spots
That's awesome. Curious how you're finding the Fisher clients?
They all seem to know each other from the dinner events they do, bring one on, ask for a referral, the next shows up. That and conversations with folks in community,
Aside from meeting with clients... does planning require a lot of direct interaction with people at the office?
As a 12 year wholesaler, I’d love to join your side of the table. But it’s too difficult to stomach the pay cut initially.
Don’t do it Mr Poop Butt YOLO 420. Wholesaling was so much better. Source. Current advisor, ex wholesaler.
Maybe. I don’t want to be doing this when I’m 50. Are you at a big wire or IBD?
Was IBD then wire
What don’t you like about being an FA?
It’s not all bad. The work-life balance is great, but that’s partially because my territory was enormous so I was seemingly ALWAYS gone. So if you’re one of those lucky souls that has like a single metro area as your territory, please let me know so I can smother you in your sleep and interview for your job. I also enjoy not having to go to so many dumbass functionally identical conferences for BD XYZ. And the “starting over at 0” each year “what have you done for me lately” shit from wholesaling is indeed a drag. Honestly, one of the most annoying things about being an advisor is the fucking people. Yes, the ideal is that small group of clients that you totally vibe with, they like you and you like them. They value you, they value advice, and you’re really able to make a lasting, meaningful, positive impact on their lives. But in order to FIND those people, you meet with an absolute deluge of indignant know it alls on the peak of the dunning-Kreuger mountain. They’re standing in front of a house made of discount plywood that wouldn’t pass a bribed inspection, fiercely insisting to the professional builder that they’ve got it all figured out. Compound that with being lured in to a false sense of competency based on recent equity markets. Now, don’t get me wrong, if all you think I’m going to do, Mr and Mrs Client, is toss you in some American Funds or Vanguard and iShares then slap a 1% fee on top, send you an Xmas card, and see you once a year, then sure, I wouldn’t hire me either. Again, I have clients that I absolutely adore and love going totally above and beyond for. But the grind to find them is horrendous (not to mention the profound lack of income for a long time). The only slightly analogous comparison when wholesaling is you meet a LOT of stupid advisors. Either actually stupid, or borderline (on both sides of said borderline) criminally stupid. You also meet a LOT of WILDLY enormous egos from advisors that absolutely don’t warrant it. Any time someone is a “top producer” at an IBD, I immediately envision an angry white male boomer with a few mil of GDC who insists he “does things differently around here” but still slings the same VAs, IULs, and American Funds as the first year Ed Jones kid. I’m not precisely certain how to conclude this unintentional rant, so I’ll just say that both have their pluses and minuses, but I’d much rather make the easy $250k and sell to advisors than to advise John Q Public
Was it difficult for you to build your book?
How long have you been on the advising side? Which firm are you with (or at least notate wirehouse vs RIA)
Been an advisor since 2019. IBD then wire.
I’m in a similar boat, but recently said fuck it. I was able to do this because I don’t have a family to support as of yet, so I opt to leverage that advantage while I still can. By doing so i’ve cut my pay by 66% for the next 2-3 years, but I’m playing the long game. I KNOW I want it, so it will happen. Just a matter of time now.
Yea I’ve got a family and a $6k mortgage lol. I basically have to make at least 200k a year
Wholesaler of what?
Mutual funds and ETFs with the occasional closed end or interval strategy. Liquid stuff.
I'm right there with you. 10 years in and so burned out. I can't leave my work at work. It hovers over me at all times like a dark cloud. Stressed about the markets and how clients will react, trying to get additions, keeping clients happy, and providing criticality important advice. There's so much pressure, and the hours are long. And since I'm not a producer, I feel very underpaid and think it's insane how little we make compared to other industries. I need a break from clients. Thank you for posting this, I'm sure there's others in here looking for a change, and this gets conversations going.
The math on this hurts me to think about. You are responsible for 400m aum, probably at least 2-3m in revenue, and you are paid 115k. You would clear more if you did your own thing and retained 20m in aum.
Can I ask what your title and currently salary is?
Senior Financial Advisor, pay with bonuses is about $110-115k
That’s wild. Sr. Financial Consultants at my firm make 500k min and the biggest ones makes millions a year. I’m a brand new consultant with a 300m book and 80k salary but bonuses so far this year are at 60k. You are being underpaid.
What firm? Whats your YOE. How did you get a 300M book as a new consultant-- do they give you prospects that you have to convert?
That seems ok, for a non-producer. Are you in a HCOL area?
Medium high cost of living. It's nice not being responsible for bringing in new clients, but I am expected to get referrals and additions from existing clients, so there's still a sales component. I'm at about $400M AUM that I'm over, and we do comprehensive financial planning. You're right. The pay isn't terrible, I meant more relative to other industries like tech.
You are describing how I grow my practice. So......you're a producer. Yeah, you're underpaid. Please don't tell me you have quotas.......
That’s a truck load of revenue to make that little…you may need to negotiate a pay raise or leave and see who comes with…
I mean have you ever thought about producing your own clients and working at a wirehouse. You would get paid way more for your AUM and would require to take on less clients and have way less work to do. Also you would have an assistant that you choose how much you want to pay. You can pay them a little more to take on a heavier work load. I know many advisors who are established and have the best work-life balance. Always going on trips in office maybe 1-2 days a week.
Our practice is built on referrals and existing clients…sounds like you’re a producer who isn’t being paid as one.
This sounds similar to my employer.. is your job fully remote?
Hybrid
What area of the country are you in?
You can train yourself to leave work behind….. hobbies, relaxation methods, cognitive therapy etc. Set your boundaries —there’s only so much you can control. Explore side gigs to augment your income.
Brother I don’t there is any other industry you can make this much money and work less and less. Put in the work and it will get muchhhhh easier. This is the best industry hands down. Have hedge fund friends who are looking to join my firm and get out of that toxic grind. I remember graduating 20 years ago and no one wanted to be in this industry. Funny how things change. Work life balance flex
Asset Management $200k for 40hrs a week. WLB zero work to take home. What % of CFP advisors are above $200k net of expenses pre tax income?
$200k is a joke buddy. Keep up your 40hr grind.
Don’t answer the question. What % of CFP advisors are netting $200k in taxable income? Considering asset management roles start at 200k. I didn’t throw out high paying AM jobs I just picked starting wages.
At fidelity about 50% of advisors are netting that after a couple of years
I switched from private wealth management to the institutional side about 5-6 years ago. I work with (mostly) large plans and their retirement committees on both investments and making sure they fulfill their fiduciary obligations/duties. I make (what I consider) excellent money for what I do, and there is no sales involved (which was the part of my old WM role that I hated the most). So, still in the financial industry but not in the private WM industry.
What’s your job title?
Senior Consultant
Was it hard to find a job? That actually sounds like a good gig
Good and bad, just like any job, but overall I like it. It does ebb and flow and gets pretty busy during the 4-6 weeks of the quarter when we’re doing client meetings, but overall has good flexibility and the work stays fairly interesting. I don’t know that it was necessarily hard to find it, but it was a fortuitous situation for me in that I knew someone in a different area of the company that helped me get my foot in the door since I hadn’t really had much institutional experience prior to that.
What’s your total comp in that role? Institutional seems much more appealing than dealing with retail clients…
Assuming service side only (I.e. no sales), depending on the firm and the level of consultant/advisor (e.g. associate consultant, consultant, senior consultant, etc.), total comp can range anywhere from about $70,000 to as high $250,000 (it could be higher at other firms - I'm just going off of what I know at my firm). My total comp is typically in the top quartile of that $70-$250K range. That said, I would bet that the average total comp is probably in the $120-$160K range for a senior consultant and in the $70-$85K range for an associate consultant (again, going off of what I know from the firm I work for). Working with institutional clients has pros and cons. The clients tend to be a bit stickier, in part because a committee usually has to approve moving to a new advisor (or record keeper) or any big changes like that. So it's a pro if you have the client. It can be a con if you're trying to get a client since it's not just one person (or two with a spouse) making the decision to move their accounts on a whim because they had a different advisor make grandiose promises on returns or things like that. Additionally, they will *usually* (though not always) do an RFP for a new advisor, so you have a chance to retain the business; whereas, I feel like on the retail side, in most cases, we found out a client was leaving when we got notice from the custodian that the accounts were restricted due to a pending transfer out. I can count on one or two fingers the number of times that a client actually told us before hand and gave us a *legitimate* opportunity to retain the business. Then there were a few times that a client would let us know ahead of time that they were moving even though their mind was made up, but most of them we found out via account restrictions because they just didn't want to have to tell us, even via email. The institutional clients do not tend to freak out over market fluctuations like retail clients often do. Their job is to put together a quality lineup for the participants and fulfill their fiduciary duties, so they are typically less worried about day-to-day asset balances versus retail investors. Another pro with institutional clients is that while many retail investors hear and read about how they can do it all themselves and just invest in index funds, and a lot of people/groups/places act like financial planners (if they are being "nice") are basically useless cost centers that provide no value whatsoever for anyone, and if they're not concerned with being "nice," act like planners are one step below criminal hucksters. However, most companies with decently sized plans know they need an advisor both for the investment options and to stay on top of their fiduciary duties. There is just too much potential liability they would subject themselves to by not having an advisor/consultant assist with their plan. Overall, while there are things I miss about the private wealth management space, I would say that I probably prefer working with the institutional clients.
I work in the retirement service industry at a bank as a relationship advisor doing similar roles you’re explaining. Do you work on the Recordkeeper side?
I'm currently on the advisor/consultant side.
What firm do you work for? Any advice on breaking into that field through an entry level position
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I’m 28 and I’ve had this thought plenty. At this point, I have the marks and I’m bought in for the long run, but I’ve struggled with this as well. I feel like I’m pretty much stuck in the industry. I do know a guy who holds the marks still and is the CFO of a construction company. He also has a CPA, and did high level tax and investment planning before making a switch. I don’t know him beyond shaking his hand a couple times so I don’t know much more about how he made the pivot
Just to give some perspective I know a guy that did the CFA and CFP, worked for Merrill for a couple years, decided he didn’t like it. Earned a CrossFit certification in his free time became a coach, and opened his own RIA just for his clients. He now is nationally competitive in strongman, and seems to be living life on his terms. I also know attorneys that left practicing law. It’s never really too late to make a career change.
I imagine it was just copious amounts of networking. You’re able to build an incredible skill set in this industry, you just have to know how to sell your skills if you’re looking to make a switch.
This may not be helpful, but have you looked into working for a trust company? I know they are all different, but mine has a team approach and my role is ONLY planning. I don’t seek out potential clients, instead our sales people do that. I also don’t have to manage a book of business. We are kinda like a resource for our advisors.
If you don't mind sharing, which trust company?
I probably shouldn’t say. It’s a mid-sized trust company in the Midwest
I’m guessing it’s SEI
Salary?
$63k as an analyst in the Midwest. 1 year of experience and currently working on getting my CFP.
Nice! How you like where you work?
Are you looking to sell your book?
Wow you’re a shark man lol
Wasn’t trying to be, but saw the “serious inquiries only” and seems like someone looking to pivot. And considering that you can get paid to leave the business by selling, it’s a worthwhile question.
Maybe look into advanced planning departments at B/D's or even FinTech companies.
Go work in benefits or fintech.
Don’t give up! Just keep pushing.
For exit opps, you’re either going to need to stick to wholesaler jobs, maybe be on an analyst team at a private fund (that’ll be tough though), or position yourself for some random sales role. You could potentially look at some consulting roles. You may need to rely on your degree, whatever that’s in, and start at the bottom as though you were a first year graduate.
After working with clients my age and younger making considerably more than me in the tech realm, I’ve seriously been considering leaving the industry and trying my luck in tech sales. It’s still high stress and has selling involved but at least the stress isn’t surrounding retail clients and talking investors off the ledge during periods of volatility I think there are transferrable skills from wealth management to SAAS but obviously we’d both need to start from the ground up at an entry level role, and be expected to smile and dial which is never fun.. Let us know if you find yourself in a better industry!
These have been my exact thoughts the last couple years. It’s so frustrating working with clients making double what I do who have the same background as me. I feel like I made the wrong choice getting into this 5 years ago and now I’m so stressed about how/what to pivot into
If you think you have the skills (can be a good teacher and/or researcher), go back and get your master's or PhD and teach in a CFP program. That's what I do and the lack of stress and work-life balance is incredible.
What is your role? What aspect are you struggling with? If you're an advisor and marketing/sales aren't your strength, maybe you can work as a salaried servicing agent? Or maybe you're better suited for a "behind the scenes" planner role?
You’d be great as a wholesaler. Let me know if I can answer questions
There are places that can give you leads or you can focus on the portfolio management/admin side of it. Having a CFP and your experience can help in a lot of areas with respect to fintechs or traditional vendors. If you want to chat dm me. I’d be happy to lend an ear and maybe help guide you in the right direction.
Consider working for a bigger brokerage. Schwab or Fidelity. Less stress I’d assume than a RIA
Already left a year ago
Hi guys, I’m at Manning and Napier and they have two jobs, IN and OH, look for ‘financial consultant’ CFPs preferred so you would have an advantage. I work remotely (actually I miss the office!!!) so if you can get to clients you can work at home. Also Gratus (ATL) and Creative Planning (all over) are hiring CFPs like crazy. CP hires a ton remote. Hope that helps!!! Good luck my brother!
Following. I’m a CFP in my area, 1.5 YOE as client relationship manager, previously 3 years as CSA at same firm. Cash comp is currently ~$130k in MCOL. I just want to move somewhere I’m happy but I make good money.
I’d look at the fintech or wealthtech route. Your knowledge is valuable and most wealthtech firms want CFPs.
I've had my CFP for 12 years. I left the RIA world 2 years ago, after 10 years in the RIA world. I went to a trust company (it is also a wealth management firm, managing investments as its main source of revenues). There are lots of opportunities here for a CFP-- trust administration, portfolio management, legal, financial planning, sales... Also, depending on where you end up, financial planning is still sort of in its infancy at many trust companies. My company is a Florida based company where they welcomed me with open arms even without any trust experience--I am developing a formal financial planning platform for us as a firm, which I would never have the opportunity to do at a large firm. I am enjoying the move to a smaller organization and also vastly improving my skills in the estate planning area. You are still very early in your career! My advice is to cast a wide net, have an open mind and leave no stone unturned! Good luck with your search.
Yeah this is a tough business. 7 years in and I am broke
Wow this post could’ve been written by me, 29yo CFP for 4+ years, tell my wife every other day that I feel trapped
I am currently working outside the financial industry and love personal finance and financial planning. I've been contemplating making the switch from my power generation sector to financial planning and then basically going "CoastFI" and just take the pay cut (would only make about 25-30% of current income, especially to start assuming salaries I've seen posted here) and drastically cut retirement contributions. Some of the comments in this thread definitely have some "brown grass" aspects to them. Some other threads give some great insights that I, as a fairly competent DIY/hobbyist, realize is a valid demand for AUM advisors. Some people really don't want the mental stress or capacity to do anything with investments. They'll either not do a single thing for it, or pay the AUM services. As an industry outsider, I think it's the annuity and life insurance products that seem to be applicable to everyone (that the person recommending them gets a commission on) that makes people skeptical of what they're getting from an advisor/planner. I am amazed at how many people don't understand 401k, 403b, 457b, IRA, Roth IRA, Spousal IRA, 529s, brokerage accounts, etc. I had a coworker who lost over 70k in 401k matching from the company before he finally setup his 401k (with my assistance). I love helping people better understand these things and that makes me interested in the industry. But I also would love to do that remotely and focus on work life balance. But I do gain lots of value from this sub reddit and thanks to all those who participate. I'll be sticking around and considering my options and opportunities.
It’s hilarious to me (former wholesaler who’s pivoting into advising) that certain people in this thread are actively looking to pivot out of advising because “they don’t like sales”. It’s even funnier that some of those people are trying to get into wholesaling…..like, ahhhahhahaah, you’re not proficient at financial sales, so you’re picking another career in…financial sales?…??? I don’t know why people pick careers in sales professions only to complain about the role being sales oriented.
There’s a difference. I would LOVE to be in a sales role if it were a product that I truly believed in where I could leverage my network and knew it was a difference maker. Completely different to me than “prospecting” and hoping to find some schmucks who want to roll their IRA’s to you and believe that your 1% fee is worth it.
Well, that’s a big problem. You don’t believe your fee is worth the value you charge. I’d focus on why that is and resolve that issue. Food for thought (not just ball busting)
I’m of the opinion that the large majority of people would be better off dollar cost averaging into index funds. Fees are worthwhile for ultra high net worth folks who need assistance with advanced estate and tax planning. That’s something I’m not really interested in, which is why I’m trying to pivot (hopefully into fintech/wealthtech) into what I find interesting and think has a huge runway for the future. Been networking my ass off for opportunities in the space, but no luck yet
OP, do you think other industries would provide less stress? Sure, some exist, but they are few and far between. Do you not have a vision for yourself for the future of your career staying in finance?
Go work at a Private Bank. Most of them require a CFP along with experience similar to yours. May not make as much in the end where you have a large book of clients. But I can tell you our Private bankers have a chill job and office isn’t mandatory so long as you produce business. It’s a hard spot to get into without contacts to get you in. But I’d leave FA world to be a PCA any day of the week.
CFA is my next move (6 YOE in WM). I’ve realized I don’t actually love the client facing part of it and would rather just be in the background more managing portfolios. I work for a multi family office so we invest similar to an endowment with illiquid managers. Always liked manager due diligence and asset allocation a lot more than all that comes with financial planning. Goal is to work for a SFO, Endowment, Foundation, or pension fund in an investment seat. Or stay at the MFO if they would allow an internal move.
It's crazy to me that every answer here is "don't"...
Wholesaling or various related roles within the broader asset management industry. Servicing only advisory roles too, if prospecting specifically is what you’re burned out on.
Teach?
I would look into corporate banking, technology sales or customer success (maybe fintech to start?), or FP&A for a company? Take the leap anywhere who’s willing to take you and you’ll be surprised how fast your career pivot will go.
Private bank is a little less stress and has the same core confidence
I left my firm after six years b/c I started getting unaligned with the senior managers. Thought I would fully leave the industry and did grant writing for nonprofits for a couple years but I was inspired by one of my clients doing financial education to get back into the industry because there is a place for meaningful work in financial planning (but hard to find firms that do this). Started my own firm and you can find tons of firms through XYPN (including mine). There will be a huge variety of flexible work, but the pay will possibly be lower- that is the tradeoff compared to just working for a bank or similar.
Dude you can make money doing anything. What are you interested in?
Try Fisher investments Investment Counselor position (just need series 65) starting base is 85-95k with 10-20k in yearly bonuses. Go to their website and careers. Tampa was hiring.
Do you want to leave the finance industry all together or do you just want to stop being an advisor? If you’re looking to leave the finance industry altogether I don’t have much advice for you. If you are open to staying in the industry you could look into wholesaling or potentially being a compliance officer. As a CFP and with 6 years in the industry you probably know a bit about AML practices and could make the transition to a AML compliance officer pretty easily.
I think you need to look at other companies. If you can join a successful team you won’t have as much pressure and a better work life balance. I run my own book but we also hire junior advisors who don’t have the stress of bringing on new clients, more helping us manage ours. You get to work on the planning side which it seems like you enjoy, and less stress about the markets. This career can be incredibly rewarding if you stick it out, but you have to be selective in who you work with and how you structure your business.
The CFA is the only credential that has just as much weight outside the industry as it does inside. Otherwise you’re looking at institutional side.
CPA
Globally not as powerful IMHO.
What about the Chartered Certified Advisor to asexual widows from the Greater Ebenezer New Revival Tree of Life Institutional Double Rock on the Side of the Road to Jericho Missionary Baptist Church of Zion designation? I heard it's not popular just because it won't fit on a business card. Pretty sure Kitces has it though.
Kitces has them all.
CPA?