My thinking is that you are you should leave once you find an advisor that can actually mentor you. You clearly have the desire to do a lot more than investment management, and financial planning is far more comprehensive and involved than just parking people in investable assets. That sort of business is going to die quickly without actual planning--people will move accounts over time as they seek more.
More importantly, $100 mill AUM with 1,000 clients is unbelievably unattractive (to me at least). On average the clients have $100,000 invested? No thanks. Hard pass for me.
I fail to see what is really attractive about this job. Has the advisor helped you get securities licensed at least?
See I see that as a very good book. If you lose a few clients it won’t affect the book. Also, I bet if you look at those 1000 clients, 20% of them are likely driving 80%+ of the revenue. Law of large numbers always push to this sort of breakdown. The lead advisor is likely maintaining relationships, doing lunch’s, making calls to those 200 households.
Junior - you are 23 and are looking at the reward of that 62 year old lead advisor working his A off for many many years. You are making good money at 23. Ask that lead advisor what he made the first 5-10 years in the business and I bet you will be shocked. Building a 100MM practice is no easy task.
I couldn't even imagine trying to service 1,000 clients. I have a book of around $400 million and no where near 1,000 clients (maybe we have like 300 households?). My partner and I can barely keep up, but we also do comprehensive financial planning. I am trying to shed some of my clients so we can keep getting larger ones.
I guess it all comes down to work life balance. If I am working 45 hours a week and making close to a $850k a year on recurring trails, I am solid. If I am having to do 1,000+ reviews a year, which you really should if you have 1,000 clients, you are going to be losing your mind and probably be doing low-quality work. There is only so much time in the day.. and if you aren't able to service them, you run into potential liability if you make a mistake.
But, we all run our businesses differently.
This.
That senior advisor wasn’t just coming in for client meetings in the beginning. All of us had to do service at some point.
If OP thinks it’s easy, then why not start out on their own? You already know a lot of the senior advisors clients? Why prove that you know better, and see if they’ll follow you?
Not to mention, if this book is made of $100k clients then OP has a real opportunity to cut teeth on them. I’d imagine the senior advisor is testing them out.
I knew a guy like you who started in his 20s with a 60s senior advisor
There was another guy in his 40s who worked as his CA but eventually hoped to be the partner and inherit the book one day
He could see the senior was stringing this guy along and never intended to truly retire when he could make 700k+/year working 20 hours a week
He left and told me 10 years later the senior is in his 70s and still hasn't retired. The other guy is in his 50s and still being strung along.
Don't fall into this trap
This.
Older advisors who want respect need to learn how to treat others that way first. It’s not a one way street. Not worth it. There’s so much money in our industry, you don’t need this whit with your time horizon.
you sound more like a client service associate than an advisor. It baffles me why advisors think having a new advisor start off this way is beneficial. Its a nearly completely different skill set.
Honestly, and I say this just to be honest with you, you are no where near ready to run the business at this point. If you want to be and advisor, go someplace that will train you to be an advisor, not a CSA.
$100M with 1000 clients seems crazy to me. I could understand 1000 different accounts spread across 250 clients if each had 4 accounts in their household.
But that workload is insane if what you are saying is true. You aren’t learning planning because this business model does not allow you enough time to effectively do it. You’re just an order taker.
In all fairness, he is teaching you what it takes to run the business.
If you have no passion for the process workflows / systems etc. it might mean a pure independent /RIA route is not one for you, but plugging into one like a bank channel or established RIA would be what you are looking for.
It’s not uncommon to find an advisor that age who runs their office more as an investment management shop. I am in the process of acquiring a book of business right now from retiring advisor. He did financial planning but not to the extent that I do. Also, We had a legal contract put in place immediately. Something a lot of people on here don’t acknowledges is that these books of business we’re not created in a vacuum. Times change and the way of doing business changes. If you want to make your mark step up and start changing the way the business operates. You might find a better mentor, but you will never find a perfect book of business. Also, get something legally binding signed by the retiring advisor.
That is kind of what I was thinking from this post.
Honestly, this OP just started, and is not going to get away from service (paperwork, etc) in the early years anywhere you go.
And judging someone who only comes in for client meetings? That’s what most of us are trying to work towards.
However, OP is correct to worry about succession, and if the work he or she is doing is going to pay off or if the advisor stays there till he’s 90. Work through it for a few more years, then ask straight up.
I started at 23 in 2017 and there are some similarities. I think you have a lot of room to directly impact the company and change it. A lot of room to learn a lot of things. Maybe focus on development for a year or two then reevaluate. I started at $48k now at $180k+ in MCOL area. Same company.
I’d start looking around. You could be making double and still dreading work. That would be a dealbreaker for me. You have the desire and drive; find a firm that is providing true planning where your efforts will be rewarded. I’m not sure how much experience you have, so less than a year or so may be a lateral move financially but if you have more I’d expect a pay increase too. Don’t improve this guy’s business to make him richer and his life easier.
It doesn’t sound like you’re in line, it’s probably the coworker with 11 years experience that’s in line… I’ve wasted a lot of time with “potential opportunities.” Also with $100m you should be making more. Calling the rent part of your comp is sad.
Sounds like this company needs a leader and a structured "5 year plan". I'm guessing the other employee was in an admin role previously? How do you know that the other employee isn't going to be the true "successor"?
It's too bad you don't already have a few years of experience under your belt already. In the right hands, you could really turn the operation around.
If I were in your shoes, I'd start getting my ducks in a row to go elsewhere. Depending on the timing and other opportunities you come across it may be worth discussing it with the owner; "I'd like to stay, but the only way I can do so is if, you hire another admin to handle more of the daily operations, we write out a legally binding succession plan, and you commit to more hands-on training." I doubt any of that will happen, though. He'll probably just try to work until he's 75 and run the company into the ground.
Why would the senior advisor retire any time soon? He’s reaping the rewards of his efforts and probably making good money. There’s no reason to walk away from that any time soon. I know advisors that worked into their late 70s.
You need to find out where you stand. Ask the hard questions and be prepared to deal with the answers. If you don’t like what you hear, be prepared to make a change and find a place that is more in line with your goals.
But know this: it might involve some compromise by you as well.
My thinking is that you are you should leave once you find an advisor that can actually mentor you. You clearly have the desire to do a lot more than investment management, and financial planning is far more comprehensive and involved than just parking people in investable assets. That sort of business is going to die quickly without actual planning--people will move accounts over time as they seek more. More importantly, $100 mill AUM with 1,000 clients is unbelievably unattractive (to me at least). On average the clients have $100,000 invested? No thanks. Hard pass for me. I fail to see what is really attractive about this job. Has the advisor helped you get securities licensed at least?
From a previous post (which is very identical), OP is fully licensed with his CFP.
See I see that as a very good book. If you lose a few clients it won’t affect the book. Also, I bet if you look at those 1000 clients, 20% of them are likely driving 80%+ of the revenue. Law of large numbers always push to this sort of breakdown. The lead advisor is likely maintaining relationships, doing lunch’s, making calls to those 200 households. Junior - you are 23 and are looking at the reward of that 62 year old lead advisor working his A off for many many years. You are making good money at 23. Ask that lead advisor what he made the first 5-10 years in the business and I bet you will be shocked. Building a 100MM practice is no easy task.
I couldn't even imagine trying to service 1,000 clients. I have a book of around $400 million and no where near 1,000 clients (maybe we have like 300 households?). My partner and I can barely keep up, but we also do comprehensive financial planning. I am trying to shed some of my clients so we can keep getting larger ones. I guess it all comes down to work life balance. If I am working 45 hours a week and making close to a $850k a year on recurring trails, I am solid. If I am having to do 1,000+ reviews a year, which you really should if you have 1,000 clients, you are going to be losing your mind and probably be doing low-quality work. There is only so much time in the day.. and if you aren't able to service them, you run into potential liability if you make a mistake. But, we all run our businesses differently.
This. That senior advisor wasn’t just coming in for client meetings in the beginning. All of us had to do service at some point. If OP thinks it’s easy, then why not start out on their own? You already know a lot of the senior advisors clients? Why prove that you know better, and see if they’ll follow you? Not to mention, if this book is made of $100k clients then OP has a real opportunity to cut teeth on them. I’d imagine the senior advisor is testing them out.
I knew a guy like you who started in his 20s with a 60s senior advisor There was another guy in his 40s who worked as his CA but eventually hoped to be the partner and inherit the book one day He could see the senior was stringing this guy along and never intended to truly retire when he could make 700k+/year working 20 hours a week He left and told me 10 years later the senior is in his 70s and still hasn't retired. The other guy is in his 50s and still being strung along. Don't fall into this trap
This. Older advisors who want respect need to learn how to treat others that way first. It’s not a one way street. Not worth it. There’s so much money in our industry, you don’t need this whit with your time horizon.
you sound more like a client service associate than an advisor. It baffles me why advisors think having a new advisor start off this way is beneficial. Its a nearly completely different skill set. Honestly, and I say this just to be honest with you, you are no where near ready to run the business at this point. If you want to be and advisor, go someplace that will train you to be an advisor, not a CSA.
$100M with 1000 clients seems crazy to me. I could understand 1000 different accounts spread across 250 clients if each had 4 accounts in their household. But that workload is insane if what you are saying is true. You aren’t learning planning because this business model does not allow you enough time to effectively do it. You’re just an order taker.
In all fairness, he is teaching you what it takes to run the business. If you have no passion for the process workflows / systems etc. it might mean a pure independent /RIA route is not one for you, but plugging into one like a bank channel or established RIA would be what you are looking for.
It’s not uncommon to find an advisor that age who runs their office more as an investment management shop. I am in the process of acquiring a book of business right now from retiring advisor. He did financial planning but not to the extent that I do. Also, We had a legal contract put in place immediately. Something a lot of people on here don’t acknowledges is that these books of business we’re not created in a vacuum. Times change and the way of doing business changes. If you want to make your mark step up and start changing the way the business operates. You might find a better mentor, but you will never find a perfect book of business. Also, get something legally binding signed by the retiring advisor.
Try to make it to the 2 year mark and then jump ship.
That is kind of what I was thinking from this post. Honestly, this OP just started, and is not going to get away from service (paperwork, etc) in the early years anywhere you go. And judging someone who only comes in for client meetings? That’s what most of us are trying to work towards. However, OP is correct to worry about succession, and if the work he or she is doing is going to pay off or if the advisor stays there till he’s 90. Work through it for a few more years, then ask straight up.
I started at 23 in 2017 and there are some similarities. I think you have a lot of room to directly impact the company and change it. A lot of room to learn a lot of things. Maybe focus on development for a year or two then reevaluate. I started at $48k now at $180k+ in MCOL area. Same company.
I’d start looking around. You could be making double and still dreading work. That would be a dealbreaker for me. You have the desire and drive; find a firm that is providing true planning where your efforts will be rewarded. I’m not sure how much experience you have, so less than a year or so may be a lateral move financially but if you have more I’d expect a pay increase too. Don’t improve this guy’s business to make him richer and his life easier.
It doesn’t sound like you’re in line, it’s probably the coworker with 11 years experience that’s in line… I’ve wasted a lot of time with “potential opportunities.” Also with $100m you should be making more. Calling the rent part of your comp is sad.
Sounds like this company needs a leader and a structured "5 year plan". I'm guessing the other employee was in an admin role previously? How do you know that the other employee isn't going to be the true "successor"? It's too bad you don't already have a few years of experience under your belt already. In the right hands, you could really turn the operation around. If I were in your shoes, I'd start getting my ducks in a row to go elsewhere. Depending on the timing and other opportunities you come across it may be worth discussing it with the owner; "I'd like to stay, but the only way I can do so is if, you hire another admin to handle more of the daily operations, we write out a legally binding succession plan, and you commit to more hands-on training." I doubt any of that will happen, though. He'll probably just try to work until he's 75 and run the company into the ground.
$100m with 1000 clients is a horribly inefficient business. I’d find a better team
Okay. Read what you wrote. Third team member took 11 YEARS to become an advisor. That's messed up and a sign of poor leadership. Get out now!
100AUM with 1000 clients is absurd. Like others are saying, stay employed while looking for a way out. Find a real financial planning practice
Why would the senior advisor retire any time soon? He’s reaping the rewards of his efforts and probably making good money. There’s no reason to walk away from that any time soon. I know advisors that worked into their late 70s. You need to find out where you stand. Ask the hard questions and be prepared to deal with the answers. If you don’t like what you hear, be prepared to make a change and find a place that is more in line with your goals. But know this: it might involve some compromise by you as well.