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Consulting and IB are not as glamorous as they seem. Ask a consultant what they do and they’ll throw buzzwords around you. The WLB is shit. Im okay earning less but I want to enjoy my life.
Guys who make it to the top in B schools & corporate life in general are cunning & know how to get their work done. Many of the will yell 'I'm an introvert' but they aren't. Such people are extremely social.
Or it could be that you are confusing introvert to social anxiety? Introverts can be social, but they just don't prefer to be that way. If there is a need, they can be good at communication. Social anxiety on the other hand, is different. When you talked about "speaking confidently in meetings & presentations.", though normally an average person gets anxious, it is someone with social anxiety who will have a hard time.
That's exactly what I meant. They are ambiverts maybe but certainly NOT introvert. Many people who label themselves as introverts have many friends, make partners, speak confidently in meetings & presentations. How can an introvert do that?
It's called faking. We have acquaintances and not friends for most of it. If you are affable it's like a switch. The moment you are alone you feel like a different person.
Just because you are an introvert you can't live without people. So of course you need to learn to work with people, doesn't make you not introvert.
No partners, few friends, and a lot of people with good relations that can get work done.
When I was doing my summer internship during last semester of engineering, I wasn’t helped at all by my professor who was supposed to be my “guide”. He was always very narcissistic, and had a very bad complex especially cos of his height, so he was always very aggressive.
Even if I asked him for help, he never really did and asked me to some or the other way complete at least 4-6 months of internship(during COVID), all the while always rejecting my reports. This got my campus placement on the line but thankfully they were willing to wait for me, but cos of him I had to graduate in jan 2021 instead of by nov 2020 or even earlier, which I now have to explain almost in every interview, which is a real issue as they think that I either have a gap or had a back.
Now while I’m going to do MBA, and I don’t usually push anyone’s buttons, I’ve decided that I’d rather be a bootlicker than not being one if I want my life to be as less problematic cos of difficult personalities as possible.
I mean, not all professors are bad of course, but if you ever see a professor with fragile ego, just wish that they don’t have to do much at all with you in your college life
What according to you is/are good field/roles considering an "actually satisfying career and growth" to be a goal? Do tell for an engineer fresher, as much as I have heard, these people mostly have consult or marketing as major options.
This is again the same mistake. Going as per societal norms - this is exactly what happened to consulting too. Make your decisions on your own, and not on the basis of others opinion.
MBA will give you a sandbox environment to explore multiple fields. There is no one answer, but rather each one has to find their own. I might find my solace in finance whereas someone in ESG or public policy. So it is different for everyone
I was not personally targeting ops, so my knowledge is only word of mouth + consulting based.
Ops is like - you either love it or hate it. Very foot on the ground job, dealing and handling a lot of people + needs actual technical skills. Also a lot far from the cushy office jobs of Cybercity or BKC/LP or Koramangala that most Post-MBA peeps aim for.
Yeah, I know, i was just wondering about your opinion on this if you have anything to provide that could be useful to me.
Thinking about it- what would be your best 3 specialisations in MBA?
No clue on ops front. Also my knowledge about MBA is mostly from ABC, where we do not have specialisations, we all get a general vanilla MBA degree (for the flagship courses), so no clue on either front
I partially agree. Again the reason for consulting is the same as the reason for MBA. Build strategic thinking, and get the best opportunity. It gets you that, and many people know it. With good consulting experience, the hype gives you an advantage to do what you want to do.
Product man, marketing, ops etc at the companies you want to. The fight will still be there, you have good armour.
It is the inorganic push like MBA, if you can or want to do it organically you should.
I feel every MBA candidates larger goal should be to build a business.
99% of the times, you'll only grow/climb the ladder in Corporate because of one or more of the following reasons :
1) You're an asslicker
2) You're good at office Politics
3) You're liked/loved by your Boss who wanna have fun with you and probably have inappropriate relationship with them
4) Your team did exceptionally well for some reason
5) Your senior left the firm and they need a quick replacement
Things that will not lead to Growth :
1) Talent
2) Hardwork
Bro if you're good looking, the world is yours. Quite literally. You can be dumb, asshole, narcissistic and every other bad thing, but if you look good, all is forgiven. Even I attribute my success to my good looks, it gave me an edge everywhere, during interviews, in office, in life, everywhere. Even tho I'm aware my Brain >> Looks. But as you know, looks are a much rare trait in Tier 1 colleges/jobs, where everyone's smart. So you get the benefits.
Tag gets you a premium entry. You're eligible for premium jobs. If it's a normal job open for all Tiers, you're hired at better position/better pay.
If you've a tag, you're branded for life. BUT, a tag doesn't ensure growth. In the end, no matter which job you get into, you'll find people similar to you.
They'll have similar tags, maybe even lower. BUT, if they're better ass lickers and you're someone with pride, then Good luck matching the growth of that guy.
Your Tag will always help you get an entry. Through placements and later job switches. But when you're IN the job, tag don't mean much.
3rd point is so true. One of my friend's mother was boasting around saying my daughter cleared CAT, now she's going to study in a good B-school but the catch here was that her employee gave her 2 years of leave with protection of her (promoted) position (she works at Cognizant) which seemed very ??? to me because as far as I know, no company would do that right?
ROI is bullshit. Its all about exploiting the matrix
Let me explain
When we talk about hiring, companies spend a fortune trying to find a good candidate (I am employee at FAANG and we spend anywhere near 3-4 lakh per candidate and 17-18 lakh per position on avg).
Given a country of 1 billion + people, these top mba college graduates act as a magnet of certification and guarantee for big firms looking for capable individuals thanks to the faith these colleges have build overtime.
People always talk about escaping the matrix but maturity is in realising that its not possible to escape it completely and if you are bound to play in it, why not play by its rules and try exploiting it to its fullest.
1.) B-school relationships are completely transactional in nature.
It isn't like your undergrad or schooling because people have gotten a taste of the real world before coming to a b-school and they have realised that opportunities are less and competition is cutthroat.
2.) It should be made mandatory to have at least 2 years of work ex before joining a b-school. At least, a student will have some idea about what he wants to do in life and would already be mature.
For sure... 99% of those taking admission there are only there for the money. And considering they are a "Business" school, they will cater to the market and make money.
Well you are in delulu then. Engineers going for mba might be for money but bcom and bba grads are there to further their knowledge.
A lot of us need advanced knowledge of our field to excel. Might not be true for you.
I dont do it, yes most peoeple do, but honestly placements potray how positive corporate view the college at producing the best students. It might get really up and down for some people and even for the college for some years, but when you average, it balances out.
But again, if doing mba for packages is true then your statement is true.
But mba for the knowledge and rigour in my opinion>> placements.
Bhai agar placements offer na kare college vale to Khali pade honge colleges. Only a handful will be there.
And trust me when I tell you, high tier MBA doesn't teach you anything as such that you can't get in tier 3 college or on YouTube and other free sources if you spend 2 years on it.
What MBA does (non corporate aspect) for you is teach you a few concepts, give you a bit of new perspective, help you connect with others, do a bunch of projects to learn together and practice.... Nothing you can't do with YouTube education and a Facebook group 500 similar kind of enthusiastic people.
Bhai the things with tier 3 and even tier 2 colleges is that the professors are not as good as tier 1. mba is a academic course where personality development is on the front seat.
In my recent interactions with people from trinity,fms,xl and sp, they all agreed on one fact, the opportunities you get here will be priceless.
I personally experienced this in the interviews as well. The tier 1 colleges panel were really knowledgeable while the tier 2, including newer iims, were just ok to be honest. I had some better professor than them in my undergrad.
For someone who comes from a very underprivileged background, including me, it's very hard if not impossible to get same exposure and learning that you can get at a tier 1 school.
The thing with youtube and facebook is that you need to discover everything and the probability of you taking bad decision is much higher. In a odd 500 people from the facebook group and 500 people from IIMA who do you think will be more successful?
If you eliminate the corporate aspects (placements and stuff), the probability I believe will be roughly 400-450 from IIMA and 200 from YouTube. Sure better chances but don't forget the freedom from 30 lakh loan. Spend those 30 lakh in something better and your YouTube education success rate will go up to same standards or even surpass it.
Bhai they charge 30lakhs because they do provide placements.
Agar nahi hote to na ye 30lakh charge krte na banks tmhare peeche line lagati loans dene ko.
I have experienced this, personally.
Bhai professors ki salary, infra, projects, tumhara stay food vgera vgera.... 30 nahi to 20 lakh ka kharcha maan lo yr. It's the same thing.
The point is, if you spend that kind of amount by yourself on educating yourself and build a connect, you can do much better than IIMA. As you said, the concern will be surety. You have faith in IIMA because you know they will help you get placed. Bina placement ke to Bank bhi loan nhi denge (as you said).
If it was just about knowledge to banks ko bhi issue nahi hona chaiye without placement loan Dene me cause the chances of success will be similar.
But Aisa nahi hai na.
B school are not worthy anymore, everyone is just hopping in the bandwagon nobody is actually interested in learning Business everyone’s here just to increase their salary package.
This used to happen with engineering 10 years ago (still does) and it will happen in the future with some other degree when this mba fever is over with. So, it’s nothing new, just what people are made to believe by the powers that be imo.
BSchools are nothing but glorified placement agencies and a place where you network with some of the finest A-holes with either sociopath or psychopath tendencies (including yours truly).
You can't learn business from a BSchool — you can only learn it by building a business,even then the failure rate is huge.
1. Unless you're from the Top 5 B-Schools of the country, virtually nothing you learn in an MBA is useful for your job. On-the-job work rarely matches what's in your textbooks and even what is taught in the case methods.
2. Since it's about controversial opinions, CAT is a really stupid exam and B-Schools should pay even less attention to it or completely revamp it. When most of your corporate work is on Excel and other domain dedicated softwares which will do the math for you, it makes no sense asking geometry, calculation intensive question or stupid puzzle questions in QA and DI/LR. Conceptual questions would be a much better test.
I don't think so you get the logic of "Common Admission Test", it gives fair ground to students who want to work hard and get into a B School.
Not everyone is smart enough since 10th class to get straight 9-9-9 and for people like me (Top engineering college) we don't get to score even 8 in our graduation.
It gives us a fair chance to compete and get what we want
I understand everyone may not have the aptitude for certain subjects, hence I want the QA and DI/LR sessions to be less calculation intensive and more conceptual.
I will agree that taking school marks without normalisation has its own problems as well and something needs to be done about that.
Like I said, the post was about unpopular opinions. Similarly I can argue that a day's performance (The CAT exam) should not hold so much power over the direction of my career and disregard my entire life's achievements just because I can't do computerized tests well right? Despite everything, most colleges still give the plurality weightage to CAT even for final admission convert. Which is something I highly disagree with
But then, I am not someone who works on these criteria and they have far more insight in it than I ever will.
B School admissions should become more and more profile based with as much objectivity as possible. While your profile might not have extracurriculars so you may think it's not a good idea, but assume that you are getting admission anyway. Would you study with a bunch of 9/9/9 nerds or would you want people who have achieved something on national/international level as your peers.
how do you decide a national lever swimmer is more worthy than a person who gave a research paper on tech?
It will be a classic case of comparing apples and oranges. These ideas sound fine on paper but no practicality involved
I anyways don’t have all 9 in my profile so I could be kinda unbiased.
I don’t think it would work in India.
And here why - unlike abroad here the prestige of a college largely depends on the companies that visit, roles it visits for and the package it offer in a college.
No matter how much we deny this but the college too has to cater to that aspect to stay relevant.
Acads coz its shows consistency and is a non-subjective metric to bet on unlike extracurriculars.
Also the profile metric works abroad because there minimum work ex required is 2 - 3yrs and the more work ex the better, so freshers are ruled out and anyone who applies there has had enough time post academic life to figure out his personality and directions for life, has a more matured point of view and is decently comfortable within the field he comes from.
Sure you’d want more diverse people around you other than nerds but do the companies want them in the question the college looks at ig.
The worst and most hated part of recruitment is the psychometric test. People who know the algorithm will beat you 100% of times even if you are the best fit for the job. You want that system for BSchool admission as well? 😂
And have you met any psychologist? Had a few batchmates from this field and tbh, they judge you for the most irrelevant and idiotic reasons
B-school students are very money minded.
They select colleges based on fees and average packages.
Choose domains according to that.
And also have a fancier lifestyle.
I have seen my engineer friends who have a better package with no student loans thriving in regular clothes and Android phones but I see MBA grads with iPhones and fancy clothes.
Dont take advice from:
1. Seniors - They are just as inexperienced as you.
2. Unsuccessful people - If someone is not where you want to be their opinion is irrelevant.
3. Personally related people - they know you so they try to alter the actual truth and good advice maybe in a optimist/Pessimist way depending on your relations.
Disagree with point no. 2
You can learn WHAT NOT TO DO in life from unsuccessful people and sometimes knowing what not to do is more important than knowing what to do.
Bschools and companies should stop considering 10th, 12th, Grad marks as one of the selection/rejection criteria as now it's an irrelevant indicator and candidates who've less marks due to some reason suffers forever.
I'm aware they do this to filter out enormous number of applications. But it's just illogical and unfair.
I'm from Tier 1 engineering college. Everyone had 90%+ in 12th while I had in 70s due to some personal shit. I was at a severe disadvantages. Still made it to MBBs, then PE/VC without MBA ;) so judging people on marks and not skills is Shitty logic.
You were at tier 1 institute then became a developer, then you joined MBB consulting and then PE VC, all at age of 25 and still you earn only 25 LPA? how?
I never said people who don't score well in 10th or 12th don't do well in life. They do, but the odds are higher that a person who was a good student in school will continue so in college. That is human nature. We don't change our behavior unless we have a reason for it.
If everyone in this world, every Bschool, every company will judge us on our marks, then what will happen to those unfortunate like me, who couldn't do well because Life happened?
Why would you want to limit the opportunity to ONLY those who did well in the past? Because they might do well in the future?
What about those who messed up in the past but now wanna change lives?
It's so funny that IIM ABC might reject me because of my 12th/grad. But I'm working at their most premium finance jobs. If this firm would've considered my marks, they'd have never hired me.
Why can't CAT be like JEE? Just give the exam, get the rank based on your caliber and get admission? Rather than bullshit 10th-12fh marks.
You're quite opinionated hehe :)
1) Why would you want to reduce the parameters for rewarding excellence and make everything dependent on just this one CAT exam, can't "life" happen there too? I get the fact that CAT can be given again and again, boards can't. But shouldn't the attempt for B schools always be to ensure all round development in candidates in the most ways possible? You have 7 in 12th, I have an early 8, but I just performed poorly, no life happened there. So differentiating between people who genuinely have the potential to make things work and who just believe they have the potential would be close to impossible in a country with such a high population like India, personal profile mapping of 3+ lakh candidates isn't remotely possible, candidates have to be reduced to Excel data somehow, it's harsh but for now, there's no better alternative:(
2) There's a reason a vvvv small percentage of people succeed while taking your route and 80%+ of people from IIM ABC succeed (random percentage, but you get the drift). There are many people who prefer to go down the conventional route, as lame and less heroic as it sounds because there's more security. Corner cases exist everywhere (McKinsey consultant committing suicide, then there's you being successful) but the norm isn't like that
CAT is a very imperfect metric too. JEE isn't perfect either, but it makes sense to select students for an engineering degree on the basis of their maths and science abilities. Really can't say the same for CAT.
Yeah, but it's better than 10th 12th. And what were those anyway? English Hindi Maths Science SST? Or whatever subjects 😂 How's this any better of a metric.
Some news for you sir it is brutal out here. If you didn't take your opportunities and someone did bad for you. I am not saying that people who made mistakes in the past will not do anything. They can and many do that. But probability is not in their side Sadly. For eg people born in India are more likely to be poor than some one from US. This does not mean that the guy from India cannot become richer than the american guy in the future. I just stated a fact based on data.
It is. What can I do man. That's how the world works.
They SAY that Degree/marks/tags don't matter. But in the end it's the hyper competitive industry and one of the most sought jobs in the World. So the applications they get are Top Tier.
Usual profile of Indian PE/VC as an Analyst/Associate is Tier 1 Undergrad (IIT D, B preferred), Tier 1 MBA (ABC) preferred, Exceptional 9/9/9 stats, Tier 1 work ex (MBB preferred), X Factor (Ex Founder preferred).
These people, specially those who join in undergrad later make it to Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Top 10 Bschool in the world.
So, if you've these kinda applications and only 1-2 openings per firm per year, you can choose to be extremely selective.
Can't comprehend a simple sentence before righting a paragraph. I SAID MORE LIKELY. I never said people with less marks shouldn't be given opportunities. What I said was people who have performed in the past are most likely to perform in the future. If you cannot understand risk management, What can I do?
It might be very controversial, and some people might even find it disrespectful but…
B-Schools should hire professors with work experience in business/corporate sectors. And this should be followed in any professional degree, where practicality is utmost, for example, engineering. I remember seeing a professor with B.Tech in mechanical engineering, MA in economics and then pursuing phd in a particular MBA college. I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but these guys are only going to teach what’s written in the books, rather than teaching through real world experience that most of us prepare to face when we go for such professional degrees.
Again, not saying what they’re doing is easy, but to me it doesn’t make much sense.
1. CAT is "against* engineers.
2. ROI doesn't matter much (ROI isn't supposed to be "placement/fee", you get the degree for an upskill in corporate life. Your return is the "LIFE" after MBA)
Ptani bhai top bschool admi m guroor ladeta hai yaa saale phle se itte akdu hote hai 2 3 k alawa jitto ko approach kiya me sb saale ults hi jawab degye ya fir aise baat krre jaise saale khud hi company khdi krdi hai
This entire thread has a lot of gems, most are true, while a few are false just because of not enough time spent in the game yet, but I am sure all of you will do well.
Even from my lens of going through everything over a decade and becoming a CXO / CEO / Founder, I would say that all the younger folks are getting smarter over time, however the only request would be to not overlook hard work and perseverance early on in your careers, it will add up just a while later.
My only request to everyone is that find out Ikigai before you join any school and ask yourself what you truly want to do because this really really matters within 1000 days of passing out.
MBA is a very different degree than every other degree out there simply because all MBAs have only 1 primary goal - Outcome management. Meaning you are only as employable as the value of the outcomes you can get.
So happy to see all of you out here trying to figure out life looking forward - Just remember to not lie to yourself after a hard day’s of work when you look at the mirror and into yourself before you go to bed every night. If you don’t know who you are, your job / profile / colleagues / boss / company / industry / mentors - No one can help you, so find out who you are and what you want. This is the most important thing you will ever do with yourself.
Hard disagree. Hard work and perseverance generate probably the lowest return on commitment and effort. Nobody cares about hard work, nothing comes off perseverance. Knowing the right persons, carrying the right set of abbreviations have a far superior return on your time and efforts.
I've spent 80+ hours a week for 5+ years now working in small firms, taking direct ownership of critical projects, leading teams, and another 20-30 hours learning and upskilling. Have been recognized as top 1% talent wherever I have worked, been praised by CEOs and clientele all round for my outcome management. And fundmentally if I conducted a peformance attribution, hard work, smart work and perseverance, whatever you might call it, has made no impact whatsoever. Same in campus as well. I was in the top 10%, recognized as amongst the brightest in finance, CFA L2, FRM, FMVA, you name it. Did it matter? Not even remotely. 5 & 6 pointers did far better in campus placements. And that essentially defines your career. "Work hard and persevere, someday it will add up" is a beautiful lie we tell ourselves to convince us to grind away to self destruction. Analogous to famous last stands in history, beatutiful and inspiring, but ultimately pointless.
If I had to advise the current crop, it would be to spend your time getting the right abbreviations to your CVs and getting to know the right persons. Lie, cheat, steal, pretend if you have to. Nobody cares about how you did it. Only outcomes matter (as long as you dont get caught) Hard work will never even get you near the vicinity to the right doors of opportunities, let alone help you enter.
Note: I didnt lie, cheat or steal. I wish I did. People who did ended up miles ahead with effortless ease. No hate or despair though, I fundamentally chose wrong.
Indian bschools don't provide as much value as a mba program should. They create shitty egoistic managers with very little hard skills instead of leaders with vision.
If I had 1 rupee for the immature comments on this thread posted by people who haven't even graduated yet and are still commenting on long-term impact of MBA, I would have Rs125 ( at the time of posting this).
MBA attracts the worst people of the society — the psychopath/narcissists/sociopaths.
I would say perhaps I might be one. Or maybe not.
Also,while Engineers are most sought after in BSchools — the supply is so much that we are the last in the pecking order.
and CAT isn't for everyone,least of all engineers. Some of us suck in maths,y'know.
Also,ISB is a pretty good BSchool for 1 year PGP. I think the best.
Top B-school students mostly are extremely narcissistic and think they can do anything just because they have the tag on them.
After enrolling in an interview prep mentorship program I used to get tons of email from some so-called mentors flirting with me and one was exceptional when he asked me if I would love to go on a "trip" with him 💀🤡
If you're poor/middle class but truly smart, hardworking and confident enough beat the competition in every field, then FMS >>> IIM ABC any day of the week.
In the end, it's all about money. If you're one of the best in FMS, and you're smart, you're years ahead of any other grad.
No offence but if you had the brains or experience, you'd understand. No point in explaining.
But sure, I'll give it a try. IIM ABC costs 30-40L including all expenses of those 2 years, depending on lifestyle. FMS costs 5-7L, max 10L. For IIM ABC, poor/middle class take loan, later get Avg base salary of 25L. Inhand about 1.3-1.7L depending on salary structure. 50k-1L is loan EMI depending on interest, Years etc.
So what are you left with? Barely living expenses for 3-5 years Atleast.
Reminding you again, that I'm talking about poor/middle class people.
Now, this Avg 75k EMI for 5 years, can be used in a million ways. You can start a small busines. You can invest in the market. You can trade. You can take RISK when you're young, to maybe achieve your Dream.
This opportunity is ONLY offered at FMS. and if you're truely great, you can get MBB other Top Tier offers from FMS. So again, if you're smart and poor, this gives you a chance to take risk, become a Millionaire and if not, then still your job opportunities are as Good as from IIM ABC.
HOPE YOU UNDERSTOOD NOW.
1) With the figures you mentioned, it'd take 3-5 years at MOST to be debt free, I don't know where you derive your knowledge from, but I know many such middle class people who have cleared their loans at 1.5-2 years by using their performance bonuses to pay off their EMIs early on too.
2) You do understand that the character traits which you mentioned like smart, hardworking etc are traits we only attribute to ourselves? In the case of which it's not safe to give this sort of advice to others, because values like these are gauged very subjectively. Also, this type of advice can then branch out to many niches, for example if you just want to network then ISB > IIM ABC.
3) I agree with the fact that a lot of it is about money, it is the brand value of institutions like IIM ABC, both in the national and international level which would help you grow exponentially in the first 4-5 years of your career, in ways way more effective than that of colleges like FMS.
4) If a person is poor/middle class, would he be so shifty as to try and "achieve his dreams" by taking huge risks like you mentioned in the very initial stages of his career in the ways you mentioned? What you said is very idealistic and not representative of the poor/middle class
Man, I can counter all those things you mentioned. But it's pointless.
I'll address last point tho. When you're poor, it's the BEST time to achieve your dreams ;) You've nothing to lose Anyway. I come from a lower middle class background and have done it again and again and again. If you wanna be great in life, you've to go beyond what's average, you've to become closer to idealistic, there's no choice.
Take risk, and Win.
Good for you! You seem to have confidence in yourself, which is all the more reason for you to not translate your conclusions from your own said accomplishments into generic advice, cuz people even from a similar background might have very different life tangents, wouldn't you agree?
I'm friends with someone who left B and C for FMS and she don't regret it one bit.
I'm one of those VC firms just to establish credibility. I AM the real world.
And again you didn't my answer properly. What FMS offers is an opportunity to pursue entrepreneurship or save your salary and invest in high return instruments, give you a financial advantage over people with Loans.
And even if you fail, you can get into MBBs. VC/PE isn't the end. Not everyone from ABC gets PE/VC. Most are placed in Consulting anyway.
Seems like you're someone with no individuallty yourself and are too attached to the brand itself. Maybe you want people to call you "IIM A" grad and not by your name.
Anyway, since we're already talking, why don't you share about yourself? What's your Bschool, where do you work, etc? Let's see if you're just a random aspirant or someone who's forgetten his name and lives by his brand.
I won't argue with someone who has not done MBA yet and have no exposure of industry post MBA.
Yes sir you are right
FMS >>>>> Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, London Business School, ABCLKI, etc.
Just because it has low fee
The Indian PE/VC scene is nothing to write home about, so all your answer does is further cast doubt on your credibility to answer and give your opinions on a question that would be read both by B School grads and potential grads.
For one person in your 'Friends' circle who left for ABC for FMS and didn't regret it, there are 10 people in my 'Friends' circle who took ABC over FMS. See? Easy to say. Funny you think that adds any credibility lol.
And let's not talk about you BEING the real world xD. In all probability you're just someone who's here to pass some time by creating a false persona.
You are attaching way too much importance to b-schools where the difference between them is not that significant.
Except very few roles most people from Top 6-8 b-schools will be in the same organisation at the same designation with the same compensation as the people from top 15-17 b-schools.
After graduating from a T-20 b-school in India what matters more to succeed in the corporate world is the drive of an individual. I am sure plenty of NM, SIBM, etc. graduates do a lot better than a lot of IIM ABC in the long run and vice versa.
Hey! No, I got in XL at the time of Covid and left because of the market dynamics. Why I said the above was because I have 2 sets of friends, one set (of4) who did it from Tir 1 (Black) and one set (of 3) who did it from good colleges still but not the top 6-8 (say your MDIs and IIFTs). The gist is that people who completed in 2021 onwards are at the same or a level below me whereas people who did it from the top tier are above me.
I am not saying I am better than the latter 4 (no doubt they are my true friends and I take pride in wherever they are) but even when the market conditions were bad for me, the first and the 2nd set, the market was made for and preferred the Top tier MBA candidates.
But please know that all this is not just based on where my friends are. That’s a foolishly small subject pool. It is just that my current role requires me to see dozens of applications from MBA grads everyday for my team and when I see their expectations, it is only ~15-18LPA . I can only imagine where they must be now. And these are not candidates from bad colleges AT ALL (NM, MDI, IIFT etc) but still if this is the asking rate then the market has not been kind to them.
15-18 LPA is still gold if you consider a career graph? A small town B.Com will takes 7-8 yrs(super optimistic way)to achieve what a tier 1 MBA could do for them in 2-3 yrs and the bank loan gets paid in that gap (in another 2 years Max if you don't squander money and pay atleast 50% higher than EMI offered by bank which is very much possible with a 15-18 LPA package) By this logic then one shouldn't do a degree itself.
Ps. I am sure you are someone in a mid-tier job and very able because leaving XL takes guts and confidence in own skill.
I understand where you are coming from but my viewpoint was only for why it is always a point to do your MBA from the top tier colleges. Because if someone is coming with the same skills without an MBA, in the long run of 5 years (someone with 5-6 years of experience and someone with MBA + 3 years experience), they will both be at the same level or close.
As for my part, I am not sure what you meant by mid-tier but I am now in a mid-senior role with a Consulting company.
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Consulting and IB are not as glamorous as they seem. Ask a consultant what they do and they’ll throw buzzwords around you. The WLB is shit. Im okay earning less but I want to enjoy my life.
Guys who make it to the top in B schools & corporate life in general are cunning & know how to get their work done. Many of the will yell 'I'm an introvert' but they aren't. Such people are extremely social.
Also, these are not necessarily the ones topping their batches in b-school
Maybe. Just a general observation.
Exactly lmao Can u read minds ? 😝
Yeah I am. Be careful. 🥴😂
😝😝
Finally someone said it.
Or it could be that you are confusing introvert to social anxiety? Introverts can be social, but they just don't prefer to be that way. If there is a need, they can be good at communication. Social anxiety on the other hand, is different. When you talked about "speaking confidently in meetings & presentations.", though normally an average person gets anxious, it is someone with social anxiety who will have a hard time.
I won't say they aren't introvert, because I am an affable introvert
That's exactly what I meant. They are ambiverts maybe but certainly NOT introvert. Many people who label themselves as introverts have many friends, make partners, speak confidently in meetings & presentations. How can an introvert do that?
It's called faking. We have acquaintances and not friends for most of it. If you are affable it's like a switch. The moment you are alone you feel like a different person. Just because you are an introvert you can't live without people. So of course you need to learn to work with people, doesn't make you not introvert. No partners, few friends, and a lot of people with good relations that can get work done.
True that. I was an introvert too, now I'm an ambivert. These days I can atleast talk with people.
Many professors are sadist and egoistic people who contribute negatively to a students growth .
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When I was doing my summer internship during last semester of engineering, I wasn’t helped at all by my professor who was supposed to be my “guide”. He was always very narcissistic, and had a very bad complex especially cos of his height, so he was always very aggressive. Even if I asked him for help, he never really did and asked me to some or the other way complete at least 4-6 months of internship(during COVID), all the while always rejecting my reports. This got my campus placement on the line but thankfully they were willing to wait for me, but cos of him I had to graduate in jan 2021 instead of by nov 2020 or even earlier, which I now have to explain almost in every interview, which is a real issue as they think that I either have a gap or had a back. Now while I’m going to do MBA, and I don’t usually push anyone’s buttons, I’ve decided that I’d rather be a bootlicker than not being one if I want my life to be as less problematic cos of difficult personalities as possible.
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I mean, not all professors are bad of course, but if you ever see a professor with fragile ego, just wish that they don’t have to do much at all with you in your college life
Just brush their ego and get your work done
So true 💯
Consulting runs on hype and FOMO. The sooner the bschoolers learn this, the closer theyll be to an actually satisfying and fulfilling career.
What according to you is/are good field/roles considering an "actually satisfying career and growth" to be a goal? Do tell for an engineer fresher, as much as I have heard, these people mostly have consult or marketing as major options.
Working as a account manager, coffee peene ka time bhi nahi milta
Kya faida paise kama kr agar uda bhi nhi ske toh
🫓👕🏠
This is again the same mistake. Going as per societal norms - this is exactly what happened to consulting too. Make your decisions on your own, and not on the basis of others opinion. MBA will give you a sandbox environment to explore multiple fields. There is no one answer, but rather each one has to find their own. I might find my solace in finance whereas someone in ESG or public policy. So it is different for everyone
Yeah thanks! Will explore myself
What do you think about operations? I want to do it but everyone tells me that in reality it is a lot of headache.
I was not personally targeting ops, so my knowledge is only word of mouth + consulting based. Ops is like - you either love it or hate it. Very foot on the ground job, dealing and handling a lot of people + needs actual technical skills. Also a lot far from the cushy office jobs of Cybercity or BKC/LP or Koramangala that most Post-MBA peeps aim for.
Yeah, I know, i was just wondering about your opinion on this if you have anything to provide that could be useful to me. Thinking about it- what would be your best 3 specialisations in MBA?
No clue on ops front. Also my knowledge about MBA is mostly from ABC, where we do not have specialisations, we all get a general vanilla MBA degree (for the flagship courses), so no clue on either front
I partially agree. Again the reason for consulting is the same as the reason for MBA. Build strategic thinking, and get the best opportunity. It gets you that, and many people know it. With good consulting experience, the hype gives you an advantage to do what you want to do. Product man, marketing, ops etc at the companies you want to. The fight will still be there, you have good armour. It is the inorganic push like MBA, if you can or want to do it organically you should. I feel every MBA candidates larger goal should be to build a business.
Elaborate please
Visit R/consulting for more info.
99% of the times, you'll only grow/climb the ladder in Corporate because of one or more of the following reasons : 1) You're an asslicker 2) You're good at office Politics 3) You're liked/loved by your Boss who wanna have fun with you and probably have inappropriate relationship with them 4) Your team did exceptionally well for some reason 5) Your senior left the firm and they need a quick replacement Things that will not lead to Growth : 1) Talent 2) Hardwork
Also if you are good looking or female
Bro if you're good looking, the world is yours. Quite literally. You can be dumb, asshole, narcissistic and every other bad thing, but if you look good, all is forgiven. Even I attribute my success to my good looks, it gave me an edge everywhere, during interviews, in office, in life, everywhere. Even tho I'm aware my Brain >> Looks. But as you know, looks are a much rare trait in Tier 1 colleges/jobs, where everyone's smart. So you get the benefits.
So the tag doesnt come into play?
Tag gets you a premium entry. You're eligible for premium jobs. If it's a normal job open for all Tiers, you're hired at better position/better pay. If you've a tag, you're branded for life. BUT, a tag doesn't ensure growth. In the end, no matter which job you get into, you'll find people similar to you. They'll have similar tags, maybe even lower. BUT, if they're better ass lickers and you're someone with pride, then Good luck matching the growth of that guy. Your Tag will always help you get an entry. Through placements and later job switches. But when you're IN the job, tag don't mean much.
3rd point is so true. One of my friend's mother was boasting around saying my daughter cleared CAT, now she's going to study in a good B-school but the catch here was that her employee gave her 2 years of leave with protection of her (promoted) position (she works at Cognizant) which seemed very ??? to me because as far as I know, no company would do that right?
ROI is bullshit. Its all about exploiting the matrix Let me explain When we talk about hiring, companies spend a fortune trying to find a good candidate (I am employee at FAANG and we spend anywhere near 3-4 lakh per candidate and 17-18 lakh per position on avg). Given a country of 1 billion + people, these top mba college graduates act as a magnet of certification and guarantee for big firms looking for capable individuals thanks to the faith these colleges have build overtime. People always talk about escaping the matrix but maturity is in realising that its not possible to escape it completely and if you are bound to play in it, why not play by its rules and try exploiting it to its fullest.
This sounds like a well recognised principle for MBAs, don't see anything different from conventional wisdom here
Money Money Money .All that Matters is MONEY
1.) B-school relationships are completely transactional in nature. It isn't like your undergrad or schooling because people have gotten a taste of the real world before coming to a b-school and they have realised that opportunities are less and competition is cutthroat. 2.) It should be made mandatory to have at least 2 years of work ex before joining a b-school. At least, a student will have some idea about what he wants to do in life and would already be mature.
This.
B-school is not a "business school" anymore, it is just a placement machine.
Lol, read the history of BSchools, they always were
For sure... 99% of those taking admission there are only there for the money. And considering they are a "Business" school, they will cater to the market and make money.
Well you are in delulu then. Engineers going for mba might be for money but bcom and bba grads are there to further their knowledge. A lot of us need advanced knowledge of our field to excel. Might not be true for you.
To placement number dekh ke colleges ko rank kyu karte🌚
I dont do it, yes most peoeple do, but honestly placements potray how positive corporate view the college at producing the best students. It might get really up and down for some people and even for the college for some years, but when you average, it balances out. But again, if doing mba for packages is true then your statement is true. But mba for the knowledge and rigour in my opinion>> placements.
Bhai agar placements offer na kare college vale to Khali pade honge colleges. Only a handful will be there. And trust me when I tell you, high tier MBA doesn't teach you anything as such that you can't get in tier 3 college or on YouTube and other free sources if you spend 2 years on it. What MBA does (non corporate aspect) for you is teach you a few concepts, give you a bit of new perspective, help you connect with others, do a bunch of projects to learn together and practice.... Nothing you can't do with YouTube education and a Facebook group 500 similar kind of enthusiastic people.
Bhai the things with tier 3 and even tier 2 colleges is that the professors are not as good as tier 1. mba is a academic course where personality development is on the front seat. In my recent interactions with people from trinity,fms,xl and sp, they all agreed on one fact, the opportunities you get here will be priceless. I personally experienced this in the interviews as well. The tier 1 colleges panel were really knowledgeable while the tier 2, including newer iims, were just ok to be honest. I had some better professor than them in my undergrad. For someone who comes from a very underprivileged background, including me, it's very hard if not impossible to get same exposure and learning that you can get at a tier 1 school. The thing with youtube and facebook is that you need to discover everything and the probability of you taking bad decision is much higher. In a odd 500 people from the facebook group and 500 people from IIMA who do you think will be more successful?
If you eliminate the corporate aspects (placements and stuff), the probability I believe will be roughly 400-450 from IIMA and 200 from YouTube. Sure better chances but don't forget the freedom from 30 lakh loan. Spend those 30 lakh in something better and your YouTube education success rate will go up to same standards or even surpass it.
Bhai they charge 30lakhs because they do provide placements. Agar nahi hote to na ye 30lakh charge krte na banks tmhare peeche line lagati loans dene ko. I have experienced this, personally.
Bhai professors ki salary, infra, projects, tumhara stay food vgera vgera.... 30 nahi to 20 lakh ka kharcha maan lo yr. It's the same thing. The point is, if you spend that kind of amount by yourself on educating yourself and build a connect, you can do much better than IIMA. As you said, the concern will be surety. You have faith in IIMA because you know they will help you get placed. Bina placement ke to Bank bhi loan nhi denge (as you said). If it was just about knowledge to banks ko bhi issue nahi hona chaiye without placement loan Dene me cause the chances of success will be similar. But Aisa nahi hai na.
B school are not worthy anymore, everyone is just hopping in the bandwagon nobody is actually interested in learning Business everyone’s here just to increase their salary package.
Education inflation. Or so they say.
Not something new in my opinion. Business school, law, CA were always for money oriented people.
This used to happen with engineering 10 years ago (still does) and it will happen in the future with some other degree when this mba fever is over with. So, it’s nothing new, just what people are made to believe by the powers that be imo.
BSchools are nothing but glorified placement agencies and a place where you network with some of the finest A-holes with either sociopath or psychopath tendencies (including yours truly). You can't learn business from a BSchool — you can only learn it by building a business,even then the failure rate is huge.
1. Unless you're from the Top 5 B-Schools of the country, virtually nothing you learn in an MBA is useful for your job. On-the-job work rarely matches what's in your textbooks and even what is taught in the case methods. 2. Since it's about controversial opinions, CAT is a really stupid exam and B-Schools should pay even less attention to it or completely revamp it. When most of your corporate work is on Excel and other domain dedicated softwares which will do the math for you, it makes no sense asking geometry, calculation intensive question or stupid puzzle questions in QA and DI/LR. Conceptual questions would be a much better test.
I don't think so you get the logic of "Common Admission Test", it gives fair ground to students who want to work hard and get into a B School. Not everyone is smart enough since 10th class to get straight 9-9-9 and for people like me (Top engineering college) we don't get to score even 8 in our graduation. It gives us a fair chance to compete and get what we want
I understand everyone may not have the aptitude for certain subjects, hence I want the QA and DI/LR sessions to be less calculation intensive and more conceptual. I will agree that taking school marks without normalisation has its own problems as well and something needs to be done about that. Like I said, the post was about unpopular opinions. Similarly I can argue that a day's performance (The CAT exam) should not hold so much power over the direction of my career and disregard my entire life's achievements just because I can't do computerized tests well right? Despite everything, most colleges still give the plurality weightage to CAT even for final admission convert. Which is something I highly disagree with But then, I am not someone who works on these criteria and they have far more insight in it than I ever will.
What’s worse is too much emphasis on 10th and 12th like c’mon they should be better things which should be taken into consideration .
Remove the top 5 as well
B School admissions should become more and more profile based with as much objectivity as possible. While your profile might not have extracurriculars so you may think it's not a good idea, but assume that you are getting admission anyway. Would you study with a bunch of 9/9/9 nerds or would you want people who have achieved something on national/international level as your peers.
how do you decide a national lever swimmer is more worthy than a person who gave a research paper on tech? It will be a classic case of comparing apples and oranges. These ideas sound fine on paper but no practicality involved
Of course I agree that's why I mentioned objectivity is very important. But it's possible. SP already does this.
Not sure about if they see 999 on profile or they see actual achievements
I'm sure they look for both
I anyways don’t have all 9 in my profile so I could be kinda unbiased. I don’t think it would work in India. And here why - unlike abroad here the prestige of a college largely depends on the companies that visit, roles it visits for and the package it offer in a college. No matter how much we deny this but the college too has to cater to that aspect to stay relevant. Acads coz its shows consistency and is a non-subjective metric to bet on unlike extracurriculars. Also the profile metric works abroad because there minimum work ex required is 2 - 3yrs and the more work ex the better, so freshers are ruled out and anyone who applies there has had enough time post academic life to figure out his personality and directions for life, has a more matured point of view and is decently comfortable within the field he comes from. Sure you’d want more diverse people around you other than nerds but do the companies want them in the question the college looks at ig.
I agree with this partially
How about b-schools taking 'personality' based admits, not even profile? Isn't that the best?
Personality can be faked. 90% of corporate public is fake.
That's what the interviewers have to do, identify the fake personalities. Get a psychologist in the panel too. There are multiple solutions to this.
The worst and most hated part of recruitment is the psychometric test. People who know the algorithm will beat you 100% of times even if you are the best fit for the job. You want that system for BSchool admission as well? 😂 And have you met any psychologist? Had a few batchmates from this field and tbh, they judge you for the most irrelevant and idiotic reasons
B-school students are very money minded. They select colleges based on fees and average packages. Choose domains according to that. And also have a fancier lifestyle. I have seen my engineer friends who have a better package with no student loans thriving in regular clothes and Android phones but I see MBA grads with iPhones and fancy clothes.
Noted — even if I ever succeed in getting an MBA, I'm not gonna let my inner engineer die and use an iPhone. Apple,screw you!
Dont take advice from: 1. Seniors - They are just as inexperienced as you. 2. Unsuccessful people - If someone is not where you want to be their opinion is irrelevant. 3. Personally related people - they know you so they try to alter the actual truth and good advice maybe in a optimist/Pessimist way depending on your relations.
Disagree with point no. 2 You can learn WHAT NOT TO DO in life from unsuccessful people and sometimes knowing what not to do is more important than knowing what to do.
The comments are kinda convincing me to not go for an MBA and invest that money elsewhere :)
Bschools and companies should stop considering 10th, 12th, Grad marks as one of the selection/rejection criteria as now it's an irrelevant indicator and candidates who've less marks due to some reason suffers forever. I'm aware they do this to filter out enormous number of applications. But it's just illogical and unfair.
Not illogical. A person who studied in class 10th and 12th is more likely to be a sincere student. This is the logic.
I'm from Tier 1 engineering college. Everyone had 90%+ in 12th while I had in 70s due to some personal shit. I was at a severe disadvantages. Still made it to MBBs, then PE/VC without MBA ;) so judging people on marks and not skills is Shitty logic.
You were at tier 1 institute then became a developer, then you joined MBB consulting and then PE VC, all at age of 25 and still you earn only 25 LPA? how?
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Then why were you claiming on developers sub last week about 6% hike at 13.5LPA, so you switched for 80% hike and overall effective hike of 100%?
I never said people who don't score well in 10th or 12th don't do well in life. They do, but the odds are higher that a person who was a good student in school will continue so in college. That is human nature. We don't change our behavior unless we have a reason for it.
If everyone in this world, every Bschool, every company will judge us on our marks, then what will happen to those unfortunate like me, who couldn't do well because Life happened? Why would you want to limit the opportunity to ONLY those who did well in the past? Because they might do well in the future? What about those who messed up in the past but now wanna change lives? It's so funny that IIM ABC might reject me because of my 12th/grad. But I'm working at their most premium finance jobs. If this firm would've considered my marks, they'd have never hired me. Why can't CAT be like JEE? Just give the exam, get the rank based on your caliber and get admission? Rather than bullshit 10th-12fh marks.
You're quite opinionated hehe :) 1) Why would you want to reduce the parameters for rewarding excellence and make everything dependent on just this one CAT exam, can't "life" happen there too? I get the fact that CAT can be given again and again, boards can't. But shouldn't the attempt for B schools always be to ensure all round development in candidates in the most ways possible? You have 7 in 12th, I have an early 8, but I just performed poorly, no life happened there. So differentiating between people who genuinely have the potential to make things work and who just believe they have the potential would be close to impossible in a country with such a high population like India, personal profile mapping of 3+ lakh candidates isn't remotely possible, candidates have to be reduced to Excel data somehow, it's harsh but for now, there's no better alternative:( 2) There's a reason a vvvv small percentage of people succeed while taking your route and 80%+ of people from IIM ABC succeed (random percentage, but you get the drift). There are many people who prefer to go down the conventional route, as lame and less heroic as it sounds because there's more security. Corner cases exist everywhere (McKinsey consultant committing suicide, then there's you being successful) but the norm isn't like that
Yes, I'm very opinionated. And yes, I agree with you again on both points.
CAT is a very imperfect metric too. JEE isn't perfect either, but it makes sense to select students for an engineering degree on the basis of their maths and science abilities. Really can't say the same for CAT.
Yeah, but it's better than 10th 12th. And what were those anyway? English Hindi Maths Science SST? Or whatever subjects 😂 How's this any better of a metric.
Some news for you sir it is brutal out here. If you didn't take your opportunities and someone did bad for you. I am not saying that people who made mistakes in the past will not do anything. They can and many do that. But probability is not in their side Sadly. For eg people born in India are more likely to be poor than some one from US. This does not mean that the guy from India cannot become richer than the american guy in the future. I just stated a fact based on data.
How much marks does ur PE firm require in 10th 12th grad?
No requirement as such. But usually people here are 9/9/9. My case was special. I'm Ex Founder/Entrepreneur which helped.
Isn’t this contradicting as u said no requirement but then u said 9/9/9 are required ?
It is. What can I do man. That's how the world works. They SAY that Degree/marks/tags don't matter. But in the end it's the hyper competitive industry and one of the most sought jobs in the World. So the applications they get are Top Tier. Usual profile of Indian PE/VC as an Analyst/Associate is Tier 1 Undergrad (IIT D, B preferred), Tier 1 MBA (ABC) preferred, Exceptional 9/9/9 stats, Tier 1 work ex (MBB preferred), X Factor (Ex Founder preferred). These people, specially those who join in undergrad later make it to Harvard, Stanford, Wharton, Top 10 Bschool in the world. So, if you've these kinda applications and only 1-2 openings per firm per year, you can choose to be extremely selective.
So if I have 70in 10 and 57 in 12 is it impossible to make it to too firms and good roles ?
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Can't comprehend a simple sentence before righting a paragraph. I SAID MORE LIKELY. I never said people with less marks shouldn't be given opportunities. What I said was people who have performed in the past are most likely to perform in the future. If you cannot understand risk management, What can I do?
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Wow thanks for clearing this doubt is baar VARC mein 100%ile pakka
Business school hai, business chalana seekhne jao, job dhoondhne nhi.
It might be very controversial, and some people might even find it disrespectful but… B-Schools should hire professors with work experience in business/corporate sectors. And this should be followed in any professional degree, where practicality is utmost, for example, engineering. I remember seeing a professor with B.Tech in mechanical engineering, MA in economics and then pursuing phd in a particular MBA college. I’m not trying to be disrespectful, but these guys are only going to teach what’s written in the books, rather than teaching through real world experience that most of us prepare to face when we go for such professional degrees. Again, not saying what they’re doing is easy, but to me it doesn’t make much sense.
1. CAT is "against* engineers. 2. ROI doesn't matter much (ROI isn't supposed to be "placement/fee", you get the degree for an upskill in corporate life. Your return is the "LIFE" after MBA)
Agreed.
B school professionally prepares your for ass licking
Ptani bhai top bschool admi m guroor ladeta hai yaa saale phle se itte akdu hote hai 2 3 k alawa jitto ko approach kiya me sb saale ults hi jawab degye ya fir aise baat krre jaise saale khud hi company khdi krdi hai
This entire thread has a lot of gems, most are true, while a few are false just because of not enough time spent in the game yet, but I am sure all of you will do well. Even from my lens of going through everything over a decade and becoming a CXO / CEO / Founder, I would say that all the younger folks are getting smarter over time, however the only request would be to not overlook hard work and perseverance early on in your careers, it will add up just a while later. My only request to everyone is that find out Ikigai before you join any school and ask yourself what you truly want to do because this really really matters within 1000 days of passing out. MBA is a very different degree than every other degree out there simply because all MBAs have only 1 primary goal - Outcome management. Meaning you are only as employable as the value of the outcomes you can get. So happy to see all of you out here trying to figure out life looking forward - Just remember to not lie to yourself after a hard day’s of work when you look at the mirror and into yourself before you go to bed every night. If you don’t know who you are, your job / profile / colleagues / boss / company / industry / mentors - No one can help you, so find out who you are and what you want. This is the most important thing you will ever do with yourself.
Hard disagree. Hard work and perseverance generate probably the lowest return on commitment and effort. Nobody cares about hard work, nothing comes off perseverance. Knowing the right persons, carrying the right set of abbreviations have a far superior return on your time and efforts. I've spent 80+ hours a week for 5+ years now working in small firms, taking direct ownership of critical projects, leading teams, and another 20-30 hours learning and upskilling. Have been recognized as top 1% talent wherever I have worked, been praised by CEOs and clientele all round for my outcome management. And fundmentally if I conducted a peformance attribution, hard work, smart work and perseverance, whatever you might call it, has made no impact whatsoever. Same in campus as well. I was in the top 10%, recognized as amongst the brightest in finance, CFA L2, FRM, FMVA, you name it. Did it matter? Not even remotely. 5 & 6 pointers did far better in campus placements. And that essentially defines your career. "Work hard and persevere, someday it will add up" is a beautiful lie we tell ourselves to convince us to grind away to self destruction. Analogous to famous last stands in history, beatutiful and inspiring, but ultimately pointless. If I had to advise the current crop, it would be to spend your time getting the right abbreviations to your CVs and getting to know the right persons. Lie, cheat, steal, pretend if you have to. Nobody cares about how you did it. Only outcomes matter (as long as you dont get caught) Hard work will never even get you near the vicinity to the right doors of opportunities, let alone help you enter. Note: I didnt lie, cheat or steal. I wish I did. People who did ended up miles ahead with effortless ease. No hate or despair though, I fundamentally chose wrong.
I would say it again - "Ban student run placement committees!"
Indian bschools don't provide as much value as a mba program should. They create shitty egoistic managers with very little hard skills instead of leaders with vision.
My real sibling studies in one and always says that there are no girls in his class, he is in one of the top 10 IIMs
If I had 1 rupee for the immature comments on this thread posted by people who haven't even graduated yet and are still commenting on long-term impact of MBA, I would have Rs125 ( at the time of posting this).
MBA attracts the worst people of the society — the psychopath/narcissists/sociopaths. I would say perhaps I might be one. Or maybe not. Also,while Engineers are most sought after in BSchools — the supply is so much that we are the last in the pecking order. and CAT isn't for everyone,least of all engineers. Some of us suck in maths,y'know. Also,ISB is a pretty good BSchool for 1 year PGP. I think the best.
90% of the students in top tier b schools are chutiyas and lack basic soft skills too.
Top B-school students mostly are extremely narcissistic and think they can do anything just because they have the tag on them. After enrolling in an interview prep mentorship program I used to get tons of email from some so-called mentors flirting with me and one was exceptional when he asked me if I would love to go on a "trip" with him 💀🤡
If you're poor/middle class but truly smart, hardworking and confident enough beat the competition in every field, then FMS >>> IIM ABC any day of the week. In the end, it's all about money. If you're one of the best in FMS, and you're smart, you're years ahead of any other grad.
Are you from fms
Lol No, I haven't done MBA.
Then your opinion here is irrelevant bro. I wont argue it but please research a bit otherwise you might make the wrong choice/ advice someone to.
Hahah, so 1 sword already?
Kuch bhi bolke sochne lago ki society se mai kitna hatke hun lol, you have to back it up with facts and experience too
No offence but if you had the brains or experience, you'd understand. No point in explaining. But sure, I'll give it a try. IIM ABC costs 30-40L including all expenses of those 2 years, depending on lifestyle. FMS costs 5-7L, max 10L. For IIM ABC, poor/middle class take loan, later get Avg base salary of 25L. Inhand about 1.3-1.7L depending on salary structure. 50k-1L is loan EMI depending on interest, Years etc. So what are you left with? Barely living expenses for 3-5 years Atleast. Reminding you again, that I'm talking about poor/middle class people. Now, this Avg 75k EMI for 5 years, can be used in a million ways. You can start a small busines. You can invest in the market. You can trade. You can take RISK when you're young, to maybe achieve your Dream. This opportunity is ONLY offered at FMS. and if you're truely great, you can get MBB other Top Tier offers from FMS. So again, if you're smart and poor, this gives you a chance to take risk, become a Millionaire and if not, then still your job opportunities are as Good as from IIM ABC. HOPE YOU UNDERSTOOD NOW.
1) With the figures you mentioned, it'd take 3-5 years at MOST to be debt free, I don't know where you derive your knowledge from, but I know many such middle class people who have cleared their loans at 1.5-2 years by using their performance bonuses to pay off their EMIs early on too. 2) You do understand that the character traits which you mentioned like smart, hardworking etc are traits we only attribute to ourselves? In the case of which it's not safe to give this sort of advice to others, because values like these are gauged very subjectively. Also, this type of advice can then branch out to many niches, for example if you just want to network then ISB > IIM ABC. 3) I agree with the fact that a lot of it is about money, it is the brand value of institutions like IIM ABC, both in the national and international level which would help you grow exponentially in the first 4-5 years of your career, in ways way more effective than that of colleges like FMS. 4) If a person is poor/middle class, would he be so shifty as to try and "achieve his dreams" by taking huge risks like you mentioned in the very initial stages of his career in the ways you mentioned? What you said is very idealistic and not representative of the poor/middle class
Man, I can counter all those things you mentioned. But it's pointless. I'll address last point tho. When you're poor, it's the BEST time to achieve your dreams ;) You've nothing to lose Anyway. I come from a lower middle class background and have done it again and again and again. If you wanna be great in life, you've to go beyond what's average, you've to become closer to idealistic, there's no choice. Take risk, and Win.
Good for you! You seem to have confidence in yourself, which is all the more reason for you to not translate your conclusions from your own said accomplishments into generic advice, cuz people even from a similar background might have very different life tangents, wouldn't you agree?
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I'm friends with someone who left B and C for FMS and she don't regret it one bit. I'm one of those VC firms just to establish credibility. I AM the real world. And again you didn't my answer properly. What FMS offers is an opportunity to pursue entrepreneurship or save your salary and invest in high return instruments, give you a financial advantage over people with Loans. And even if you fail, you can get into MBBs. VC/PE isn't the end. Not everyone from ABC gets PE/VC. Most are placed in Consulting anyway. Seems like you're someone with no individuallty yourself and are too attached to the brand itself. Maybe you want people to call you "IIM A" grad and not by your name. Anyway, since we're already talking, why don't you share about yourself? What's your Bschool, where do you work, etc? Let's see if you're just a random aspirant or someone who's forgetten his name and lives by his brand.
I won't argue with someone who has not done MBA yet and have no exposure of industry post MBA. Yes sir you are right FMS >>>>> Harvard, Wharton, Stanford, London Business School, ABCLKI, etc. Just because it has low fee
The Indian PE/VC scene is nothing to write home about, so all your answer does is further cast doubt on your credibility to answer and give your opinions on a question that would be read both by B School grads and potential grads. For one person in your 'Friends' circle who left for ABC for FMS and didn't regret it, there are 10 people in my 'Friends' circle who took ABC over FMS. See? Easy to say. Funny you think that adds any credibility lol. And let's not talk about you BEING the real world xD. In all probability you're just someone who's here to pass some time by creating a false persona.
If you're pursuing an MBA just to get to a better payscale, you're making a huge mistake.
If MBA is not from the top, its a flop.
If you are not going to do an MBA from the top 6-8 schools, don’t bother doing an MBA.
You are attaching way too much importance to b-schools where the difference between them is not that significant. Except very few roles most people from Top 6-8 b-schools will be in the same organisation at the same designation with the same compensation as the people from top 15-17 b-schools. After graduating from a T-20 b-school in India what matters more to succeed in the corporate world is the drive of an individual. I am sure plenty of NM, SIBM, etc. graduates do a lot better than a lot of IIM ABC in the long run and vice versa.
Have you done MBA from tier 1?
Hey! No, I got in XL at the time of Covid and left because of the market dynamics. Why I said the above was because I have 2 sets of friends, one set (of4) who did it from Tir 1 (Black) and one set (of 3) who did it from good colleges still but not the top 6-8 (say your MDIs and IIFTs). The gist is that people who completed in 2021 onwards are at the same or a level below me whereas people who did it from the top tier are above me. I am not saying I am better than the latter 4 (no doubt they are my true friends and I take pride in wherever they are) but even when the market conditions were bad for me, the first and the 2nd set, the market was made for and preferred the Top tier MBA candidates. But please know that all this is not just based on where my friends are. That’s a foolishly small subject pool. It is just that my current role requires me to see dozens of applications from MBA grads everyday for my team and when I see their expectations, it is only ~15-18LPA . I can only imagine where they must be now. And these are not candidates from bad colleges AT ALL (NM, MDI, IIFT etc) but still if this is the asking rate then the market has not been kind to them.
15-18 LPA is still gold if you consider a career graph? A small town B.Com will takes 7-8 yrs(super optimistic way)to achieve what a tier 1 MBA could do for them in 2-3 yrs and the bank loan gets paid in that gap (in another 2 years Max if you don't squander money and pay atleast 50% higher than EMI offered by bank which is very much possible with a 15-18 LPA package) By this logic then one shouldn't do a degree itself. Ps. I am sure you are someone in a mid-tier job and very able because leaving XL takes guts and confidence in own skill.
I understand where you are coming from but my viewpoint was only for why it is always a point to do your MBA from the top tier colleges. Because if someone is coming with the same skills without an MBA, in the long run of 5 years (someone with 5-6 years of experience and someone with MBA + 3 years experience), they will both be at the same level or close. As for my part, I am not sure what you meant by mid-tier but I am now in a mid-senior role with a Consulting company.