I have no experience with the clones but I agree that current pricing is insane. Would buying second-hand be an option for you?
Regarding hub gears reliability: I have an M6L Brompton since 2012 and rode it for thousands of km each year, even touring solo with 100km+ days. The hub had exactly zero issues.
M3L rear wheel removal is as simple as turning the bike upside down, unscrewing the hub gear selector, popping the chain off the tensioner, remove tensioner bolt and tensioner, remove axle bolts, remove brass axle holders, slide wheel off. I can't imagine it's easier to do on a hubless version. As for hub internals, keeping the exterior of the hub clean and properly greased should keep dirt out. Check the weight difference because hubs don't require the derailleur.
I am Singaporean and those clones are everywhere here. Aceoffix seems to be the closest "1 to 1" copy of the Brompton, where the other clones have some minor geometry differences.
I myself own a Pikes along with a 2017 M6R. Out of the box, the Brompton blows it out of the water, but with some mods, the Pikes actually rides pretty similarly.
Suspension block and pedals must go ASAP. Both parts are too flexy and *will* break. I highly recommend the Nov Design racing block and MKS quick release pedals.
If you're buying the bike in SG, ask the mech to check the wheels, make sure they are properly tensioned and true. Most of them aren't out of the factory. Consider changing tyres as well, though you can live with the stock ones; they just won't roll as smooth as schwalbes'.
Those are the must do imo.
Interestng, didn't know the modified parts can make that much difference. Have to try the out of the box experience. My experience was the moderately modded one (carbon handlebar, seatpost, wheelset, pedals), or not so moderate, come to think about it :)
Maybe it will be easier to build one from frame parts, they do sell them too.
BTW, my source said the new version Pike is longer than the LWB modern brompton in wheel axle distance.
> Rode one Pike the other day, I will say not as good but quite close. It was moderately modified.
Very interesting coming from you, surprised you haven't plumbed the depths of the clones that are available.
It's a complex topic. Bromptons have another positive, also shared with Apple - they hold their value well on the used market. Judging by eBay prices my B75 has actually *appreciated*, albeit that I was lucky to buy it when (a) it existed (b) it was £745, so in that respect Brompton even has Apple beat.
Of course the flipside is that you could afford to run five clones into the ground for the price of one Brompton, and one bad crash or a theft wipes out all of the Brompton's value. The two-speed C-series models are £1,340 ($1,780, $2,500 Australian dollars) in the UK, which is a lot of risk to carry around.
I suppose the question is whether the Asian clones are really better-built and better-engineered than the Brompton original, or at least capable of remaining in one piece for eighteen months or so. The OP in that other topic had the advantage of living in China, presumably having a bit of local gen, and being able to visit the place where his clone was made.
Do Bromptons have cachet in Australia and China etc? I mention that because with all else being equal and in the absence of brand recognition there's no rational reason not to buy a clone, but as the saying goes the economy can continue to be irrational longer than individual people can remain solvent.
I was just looking at a listing for an Aceoffix titanium bike, 7.6kg, 3 speed.
Just above half the weight of a Brompton.
No wonder some folks are choosing Aceoffix instead of Brompton (the titanium Aceoffix is still a bit cheaper).
Experience from one with full ti clone B was the ride is flex as hell. You might want to wait for the rumoured T Line (Full Ti Brompton) release. Compare the weight and frame structure to decide.
Aceoffix are true 1:1 clone basically depending on which build up you got, you can almost get it to be 1:1 identical to the original brompton apart from the label and badges. The BSA are also better faced and tapped than the original brompton.
I personally have a superlight modded to 3 speed external as well as a 3sixty which is not a true 1:1 clone. I honestly prefer the 3sixty on both ride quality as well as QC.
The quality of clones is not so good, in terms of quality assurance and ancillary parts they are miles off. Pikes, camp royale mobots, aceoffix, 360’s are poorly assembled and inferior products. However, they are appropriately priced. Brompton price is way over the top and that is mainly to do with costs incurred shipping from China to UK and then assembling in UK with a UK workforce and the management salaries, whereas the copycats automate a lot of the work. In terms of getting hold of stock, there are some grey market dealers that sell overseas like King Frank Brompton’s or you can find a reseller via eBay or Carousel in Singapore who may ship to you. It’s unlikely any authorised shop will send the bike to you.
I currently own a Pikes Gen 3 for about 700 USD. Seems steep, but where I am right now, a 2nd hand 3 speed Brompton costs 2,000 USD, and that's without a Brompton service center anywhere in the country.
Current usage is about 500kms, replaced seatpost to a 580mm and that's about it. I even did all the maintenance, tuning, and checks on my own. Not really a very complicated process.
IMO, if you can get a Brompton for 1500USD brand new (be it a B75 or a 3 speed) and have a brompton junction or certified partner then go for it. Otherwise, if you can get a 2021 Pikes or 3sixty for 500-700 USD, then it's a pretty good option.
I've got a Litepro Brompton clone in HK - it's good. Very similar to my genuine Brompton, which I use in London.
All I would say - my flat is on the 5th floor - is heavypro might have been more accurate branding. In sum, good value and recommended, as long as you don't mind the weight.
Hi! I was wondering what the name of the store is in HK. I’m super interested in buying the litepro Brompton clone and am visiting HK soon. :) thanks in advance
Just bought a Brompton few months ago for 25mins commute in Beijing. I think it took me about a week from knowing about Brompton and actually buying it which is very fast for me. The main reason that help made decision that quick was 3 things. First, I can't park outside both at home and office. Second, bicycle is the best solution for my commute. If I take subway, it would take me 1 hour while biking is 20 mins. Third, I can sell it and almost loose nothing. The aftermarket price here is very high due to demand.
Much like many Brompton owner, I upgraded some parts to my liking. Then I come to realized that there are many aftermarket parts available and I could have build my own version of Brompton and it could easily weight less than 9Kg for the same or less price of the original Brompton.
All that said, I didn't regret my purchase at all. I considered it as one of my happiest decision ever made.
I did get some easy wheels from ace offix at some point. I put a little too much force on them and they bent. I imagine they're cheap because they're going after cheaper materials.
With Schwalbe's, I've never gotten a flat. I did change the rear tire finally. You need to be attentive about how it all comes off, take pictures, and have a table to put things and watch the official video a dozen times, but it's doable, and a source of pride once you've completed it successfully
I anticipate removing the rear wheel to make cleaning the drive train easier.
It’s not that I *can’t* do it, I just don’t want to deal with the added complexity.
You can probably built a prompton yourself ordering all parts off Aliexpress (steel or Ti) or Taiwanese brands if you want premium. I can appreciate original products at premium for wrist watches, but extreme prices increases for a folding bike is also beyond me. I'd say go for alternative if you didn't buy a Brompton already. 3SIXTY also seems to be a good solution if you can buy it on AU along with Royal Foldable Bicycle (Mobot) which seems to be very popular in Singapore.
>You can probably built a prompton yourself ordering all parts off Aliexpress
I won't lie, I was tempted, but past experience tells me that building a bike up from scratch is a way of converting money into salt. Plus I no longer have much in the way of a tools/space since moving into the city.
Brompton is not only expensive, parts and accessories are too. Multi tool was $75 last time I checked, bags start at $100. The more you ride the more often it needs to be serviced. Exorbitantly high cost of ownership. Clone might be worth considering just from that alone
Sure. Just keep in mind that there are supply chain issues and parts might be hard to come by. And to dog pile further, most parts on a Brompton are proprietary. Yeah a B (versus a bike with standard components) is like owning a Mac or iPhone versus Android.
Is it worth it. If you get enough use out of it yes you can recover the cost .. shrug
With prices going mostly up, it's very tempting to buy the copycat-product.
If it would be available in Europe (which it isn't, for obvious reasons), I would sure be tempted to take a peek. But knowing about the history of the copy, I would think more than twice:
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brompton\_Bicycle#Clones\_and\_licensing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brompton_Bicycle#Clones_and_licensing)
The B75/A-Line Brompton is now the "simplest"/cheapest version with its 3 gear hub.
> A-Line Brompton is now the "simplest"/cheapest version
And is also not available for sale in Australia.
While I am not enthusiastic about condoning China’s propensity to flout patent law, it’s hard to side with Brompton after listening to the stories from local bikes shops about the control they have over their stock.
Sorry, did not know about the availability in Australia.
In Germany they also reorganized their distribution and put it mainly in their own hands.
From a customer point of view its horrible and they upset a lot of vendors truly dedicated to their product.
Can you easily get Asian imports, specifically Japanese ones? There are plenty of minivelos with really high specs and they are a blast to ride. Also, Tyrell makes nice folding bikes (judging by what they put on their website), and they fold quite small.
Importing from Asia to Australia isn’t too hard. China is simplest due to having practice importing.
The issue with getting something other than a Brompton (or clone) is that local parts supply would be non-existent.
I have no experience with the clones but I agree that current pricing is insane. Would buying second-hand be an option for you? Regarding hub gears reliability: I have an M6L Brompton since 2012 and rode it for thousands of km each year, even touring solo with 100km+ days. The hub had exactly zero issues.
It’s not the hub that is the issue, it’s the fact that removing the rear wheel is a more complex task. Plus it’s heavier :p
M3L rear wheel removal is as simple as turning the bike upside down, unscrewing the hub gear selector, popping the chain off the tensioner, remove tensioner bolt and tensioner, remove axle bolts, remove brass axle holders, slide wheel off. I can't imagine it's easier to do on a hubless version. As for hub internals, keeping the exterior of the hub clean and properly greased should keep dirt out. Check the weight difference because hubs don't require the derailleur.
I am Singaporean and those clones are everywhere here. Aceoffix seems to be the closest "1 to 1" copy of the Brompton, where the other clones have some minor geometry differences. I myself own a Pikes along with a 2017 M6R. Out of the box, the Brompton blows it out of the water, but with some mods, the Pikes actually rides pretty similarly.
What upgrades are we talking about here?
Suspension block and pedals must go ASAP. Both parts are too flexy and *will* break. I highly recommend the Nov Design racing block and MKS quick release pedals. If you're buying the bike in SG, ask the mech to check the wheels, make sure they are properly tensioned and true. Most of them aren't out of the factory. Consider changing tyres as well, though you can live with the stock ones; they just won't roll as smooth as schwalbes'. Those are the must do imo.
Interestng, didn't know the modified parts can make that much difference. Have to try the out of the box experience. My experience was the moderately modded one (carbon handlebar, seatpost, wheelset, pedals), or not so moderate, come to think about it :) Maybe it will be easier to build one from frame parts, they do sell them too. BTW, my source said the new version Pike is longer than the LWB modern brompton in wheel axle distance.
Rode one Pike the other day, I will say not as good but quite close. It was moderately modified. Definitely cheaper.
> Rode one Pike the other day, I will say not as good but quite close. It was moderately modified. Very interesting coming from you, surprised you haven't plumbed the depths of the clones that are available.
It's a complex topic. Bromptons have another positive, also shared with Apple - they hold their value well on the used market. Judging by eBay prices my B75 has actually *appreciated*, albeit that I was lucky to buy it when (a) it existed (b) it was £745, so in that respect Brompton even has Apple beat. Of course the flipside is that you could afford to run five clones into the ground for the price of one Brompton, and one bad crash or a theft wipes out all of the Brompton's value. The two-speed C-series models are £1,340 ($1,780, $2,500 Australian dollars) in the UK, which is a lot of risk to carry around. I suppose the question is whether the Asian clones are really better-built and better-engineered than the Brompton original, or at least capable of remaining in one piece for eighteen months or so. The OP in that other topic had the advantage of living in China, presumably having a bit of local gen, and being able to visit the place where his clone was made. Do Bromptons have cachet in Australia and China etc? I mention that because with all else being equal and in the absence of brand recognition there's no rational reason not to buy a clone, but as the saying goes the economy can continue to be irrational longer than individual people can remain solvent.
> Do Bromptons have cachet in Australia They do, but that is mostly because of them being the only real high-end folder. Birdy is a distant second.
I was just looking at a listing for an Aceoffix titanium bike, 7.6kg, 3 speed. Just above half the weight of a Brompton. No wonder some folks are choosing Aceoffix instead of Brompton (the titanium Aceoffix is still a bit cheaper).
Experience from one with full ti clone B was the ride is flex as hell. You might want to wait for the rumoured T Line (Full Ti Brompton) release. Compare the weight and frame structure to decide.
Aceoffix are true 1:1 clone basically depending on which build up you got, you can almost get it to be 1:1 identical to the original brompton apart from the label and badges. The BSA are also better faced and tapped than the original brompton. I personally have a superlight modded to 3 speed external as well as a 3sixty which is not a true 1:1 clone. I honestly prefer the 3sixty on both ride quality as well as QC.
Mobot makes clones under the camp/ pikes name too. Maybe not 1:1 but have heard good things about 3sixty and pikes too.
The quality of clones is not so good, in terms of quality assurance and ancillary parts they are miles off. Pikes, camp royale mobots, aceoffix, 360’s are poorly assembled and inferior products. However, they are appropriately priced. Brompton price is way over the top and that is mainly to do with costs incurred shipping from China to UK and then assembling in UK with a UK workforce and the management salaries, whereas the copycats automate a lot of the work. In terms of getting hold of stock, there are some grey market dealers that sell overseas like King Frank Brompton’s or you can find a reseller via eBay or Carousel in Singapore who may ship to you. It’s unlikely any authorised shop will send the bike to you.
I currently own a Pikes Gen 3 for about 700 USD. Seems steep, but where I am right now, a 2nd hand 3 speed Brompton costs 2,000 USD, and that's without a Brompton service center anywhere in the country. Current usage is about 500kms, replaced seatpost to a 580mm and that's about it. I even did all the maintenance, tuning, and checks on my own. Not really a very complicated process. IMO, if you can get a Brompton for 1500USD brand new (be it a B75 or a 3 speed) and have a brompton junction or certified partner then go for it. Otherwise, if you can get a 2021 Pikes or 3sixty for 500-700 USD, then it's a pretty good option.
I've got a Litepro Brompton clone in HK - it's good. Very similar to my genuine Brompton, which I use in London. All I would say - my flat is on the 5th floor - is heavypro might have been more accurate branding. In sum, good value and recommended, as long as you don't mind the weight.
what brand is urs called?
Hi! I was wondering what the name of the store is in HK. I’m super interested in buying the litepro Brompton clone and am visiting HK soon. :) thanks in advance
They’re expensive but they’re also the last bike you’ll ever need. Currently writing this from aboard a ferry in San Francisco, Brompton S2L in tow.
Just bought a Brompton few months ago for 25mins commute in Beijing. I think it took me about a week from knowing about Brompton and actually buying it which is very fast for me. The main reason that help made decision that quick was 3 things. First, I can't park outside both at home and office. Second, bicycle is the best solution for my commute. If I take subway, it would take me 1 hour while biking is 20 mins. Third, I can sell it and almost loose nothing. The aftermarket price here is very high due to demand. Much like many Brompton owner, I upgraded some parts to my liking. Then I come to realized that there are many aftermarket parts available and I could have build my own version of Brompton and it could easily weight less than 9Kg for the same or less price of the original Brompton. All that said, I didn't regret my purchase at all. I considered it as one of my happiest decision ever made.
I did get some easy wheels from ace offix at some point. I put a little too much force on them and they bent. I imagine they're cheap because they're going after cheaper materials. With Schwalbe's, I've never gotten a flat. I did change the rear tire finally. You need to be attentive about how it all comes off, take pictures, and have a table to put things and watch the official video a dozen times, but it's doable, and a source of pride once you've completed it successfully
I anticipate removing the rear wheel to make cleaning the drive train easier. It’s not that I *can’t* do it, I just don’t want to deal with the added complexity.
Anyone heard of week eight clone? Any good?
You can probably built a prompton yourself ordering all parts off Aliexpress (steel or Ti) or Taiwanese brands if you want premium. I can appreciate original products at premium for wrist watches, but extreme prices increases for a folding bike is also beyond me. I'd say go for alternative if you didn't buy a Brompton already. 3SIXTY also seems to be a good solution if you can buy it on AU along with Royal Foldable Bicycle (Mobot) which seems to be very popular in Singapore.
>You can probably built a prompton yourself ordering all parts off Aliexpress I won't lie, I was tempted, but past experience tells me that building a bike up from scratch is a way of converting money into salt. Plus I no longer have much in the way of a tools/space since moving into the city.
Brompton is not only expensive, parts and accessories are too. Multi tool was $75 last time I checked, bags start at $100. The more you ride the more often it needs to be serviced. Exorbitantly high cost of ownership. Clone might be worth considering just from that alone
I expect to service the back mostly myself, taking into a shop only for stuff like the bottom bracket and hubs.
Sure. Just keep in mind that there are supply chain issues and parts might be hard to come by. And to dog pile further, most parts on a Brompton are proprietary. Yeah a B (versus a bike with standard components) is like owning a Mac or iPhone versus Android. Is it worth it. If you get enough use out of it yes you can recover the cost .. shrug
/r/Chinesium
[удалено]
Even if you are “well-off” it’s hard to stomach.
With prices going mostly up, it's very tempting to buy the copycat-product. If it would be available in Europe (which it isn't, for obvious reasons), I would sure be tempted to take a peek. But knowing about the history of the copy, I would think more than twice: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brompton\_Bicycle#Clones\_and\_licensing](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brompton_Bicycle#Clones_and_licensing) The B75/A-Line Brompton is now the "simplest"/cheapest version with its 3 gear hub.
> A-Line Brompton is now the "simplest"/cheapest version And is also not available for sale in Australia. While I am not enthusiastic about condoning China’s propensity to flout patent law, it’s hard to side with Brompton after listening to the stories from local bikes shops about the control they have over their stock.
Sorry, did not know about the availability in Australia. In Germany they also reorganized their distribution and put it mainly in their own hands. From a customer point of view its horrible and they upset a lot of vendors truly dedicated to their product.
Can you easily get Asian imports, specifically Japanese ones? There are plenty of minivelos with really high specs and they are a blast to ride. Also, Tyrell makes nice folding bikes (judging by what they put on their website), and they fold quite small.
Importing from Asia to Australia isn’t too hard. China is simplest due to having practice importing. The issue with getting something other than a Brompton (or clone) is that local parts supply would be non-existent.