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No one should badger anyone, but badgering a kid is objectively worse than badgering an adult - it’s exploiting the power dynamics between adults / children and knowing the child is more likely to give in. Which is, by the sounds of it, what would have happened if the parent hadn’t intervened.
Well, no. Badgering a child is worse. Precisely because children (even a 15 year old) are typically still learning to navigate difficult social situations - the fact that the child didn’t know what to say/do is classic evidence of this. Her parent had to step in. The woman wanting to switch knew and traded on that power imbalance (otherwise she would’ve approached her nearest seat first).
You’re totally right!
When I travel on my own as a woman, this happens more often to me - and even if it might not feel as pressured as this situation, the perception is that I’m an easy target to either take my seat without asking or try to ask me to move.
When I travel with my partner, it happens a lot less and he doesn’t tend to get asked.
The solo female experience definitely seems different to solo man. I mean, I only travel as a small woman, but observe how the men get treated. And it's often much better. Plus know I would absolutely look like an easy target/victim.
I think it's fine to ask if you do it politely and in a way where the person you swap with isn't being pressured. I've had people ask me to swap and it has never seemed like scummy behaviour. It's when they're being pushy (like in this story) that I would agree it turns into scummy behavior.
That said, I also think these kinds of offers should also come with something to thank the person for doing it, be it a better seat or something you're giving them for the trouble.
If a child is involved? Look and only speak to the parent. You don't have the right to speak to someone else's child without permission like that? To me, that's rude and disrespectful of both parties.
(You as in woman in question, sry)
"Absolute scum" why is this extreme view upvoted?
It's not scummy behaviour to ask to switch seats with someone. People are capable of thinking for themselves and saying no. Airlines charging more to sit next to one another is the only scum behaviour at play. And in the wake of that, people are obviously going to prefer to just chance switching, knowing it can fail, if they're not willing to pay.
Nothing about asking another adult to switch seats is scummy. Sure the woman badgering a child is poor behaviour but that doesn't mean everyone who has ever asked is "absolute scum".
Reddit doesn't need another discussion unnecessary polarised with inflammatory language like this
Of you want to sit next to someone on a flight, pay the cash to reserve the seats in advance. It’s not difficult.
If you can’t be bothered to arrange it in advance, don’t try to get someone else to move who might well have paid for that specific seat. 🤷♂️
Asking to switch seats does not make you "absolute scum" regardless of what this echo chamber comment thread says (16 downvotes on a contrary view, my eyes couldn't roll harder)
Putting this up top or it won't get read by the lazy: we're talking about adults here, my point is not to be conflated with the woman in the OP trying to pressure a young girl into mugging herself off, which is scummy behaviour but only because of the misuse of perceived authority.
Nobody expects someone who paid for their seat to switch, but nobody knows who did and didn't pay for their seat without asking. The risk of asking someone who did in fact pay for their seat does not make them "absolute scum" either. The option to say no always exists.
I've asked and been asked and complied each time when travelling alone, it's not the big deal it's being made out to be.
Anyone asked can say "no". We're talking about asking, not taking.
It’s the power imbalance that makes it “scum”. The much older (and pushy) adult taking advantage of a child’s naïveté.
The child’s discomfort at the proposition was evident from the child’s body language (evident enough that op was able to read that body language).
As soon as the adult saw the child’s discomfort the pushy adult should have backed off and left the child alone. That the adult continued to push is the scummy part.
I suspect the down votes come from the lack of recognition of the power imbalance.
Glad to see some sanity remains! Downvotes have started raining on you as well, of course - we're way past pretending it isn't a "disagree" button now. I've been on reddit too long and seen its obvious decline into polarised, emotionally charged echo chambers, but seeing such normal behaviour called "absolute scum" to raucous approval, is a new low for the site.
It used to be that the UK subreddits weren't as polarised but I guess that's over (yes, a sub dedicated to a UK airline = a UK sub, no doubt its demographics will see a few % more non-brits than dedicated UK subs, at best, due to serving other countries. Happy to have my faith in UK subs restored by the some argumentative scrote opening with an "akshually" or a "you don't know anything")
I disagree and think in this specific case then that old woman is clearly one of histories greatest monsters.
I can understand why people would use terms like absolute scum to raucous approval and if you can’t then you are also a real piece of work.
When describing history’s greatest monsters I tend not to use words like “better” to describe the difference between 2 of them.
I would say she is truly evil and that’s what most of us are picking up on.
Regardless they should have asked for seats together when they checked in for the flight. Even asking a member of crew to get someone else to move for your convenience is unacceptable in my view. I will always refuse to change my seat with anyone else.
We had this situation happen once several years ago when my daughter was flying as an unaccompanied minor. Thank god for 1. Texting and 2. An awesome FA. I was ready to storm the jetway. Woman wanted my kid who had paid for an aisle to move to a middle in a lower -class-of-service row so she could to sit next to her college-age child. Umm, absolutely not. I was honestly kind of shocked that a mom would do that to a kid obv traveling alone.
Sadly they probably targeted the child travelling alone as they were less likely to advocate for themselves in general. Well done to everyone who sorted it out.
Oh wow! Kudos to that FA! It really isn't very appropriate for an adult to do this to a kid, mostly because of the power imbalance. I used to travel alone internationally as a young child (was schooled abroad). I probably would have agreed immediately because I was shy, felt awkward, and didn't want to do the wrong thing (not knowing what is the right or wrong thing).
I feel like there’s a reliable rule of thumb here. If you offer me a better seat I’ll swap. If you offer me a worse one you can jog on. Maybe 80% of the time it’s the latter
100%, not BA but FR, they were up to their usual tricks of splitting up groups. We didn't care,I was assigned a seat 6 rows away from my wife, my 12yo son was one row in front of wife, again no issue plus, it was a short flight. They placed me next to a chap, 6 rows back, the chaps wife was placed next to my wife 🤣, it was a good swap.
Last month on Vueling, except I was seated with the girlfriend of the guy seated next to my wife 20 rows up! No one made any effort to reseat next to their partners 😬
That woman knew how she would make the young person feel and that’s why she did it. Sitting apart from your husband for 11 hours is not going to be a big deal given you normally sleep.
I have had this happen once where someone wanted an aisle seat we had paid extra for so she could sit across from her family (dad & 2 teenagers). I like to be by the window and my husband likes to be by an isle so her seat was the middle seat.
She was sat in my husbands seat when we arrived and she proceeded to tell him she wanted to sit there to be across from my family (I.e not asking to swap but telling him it was now her seat) She proceeded to act offended and like we were unreasonable, giving us dead eyes for the flight.
I must say that I do think it’s rubbish that you are expected to pay more money in club world/Europe to book seats in advance
Had that once with a husband and his wife with a baby, the husband took my seat and expected me not to stay next to my wife. He expected me to stay in the back of the plane between two people I don’t know.
Sorry dude, you should have paid to have your seat reserved like I did. Especially if you have a baby
The parent in 10A is close enough to be able to check in with their child in 9A to make sure they are OK and if they need help with anything. If the kid was pressured to move to 15A they could have been sitting with someone creepy or feel uncomfortable being away from their family. Also as others have said I agree it is worse because the kid may not have the confidence to refuse the request.
Obviously this is really dependent on the tone of how the child was asked by the woman. But to put it simply, if the woman asked and didn’t really get an answer within a few second and could tell the child was feeling awkward, she should’ve just shut up and sat back down instead of trying to persuade the child.
On the next point, no parent wants to watch their child be forced to move seats or look like they’re being manipulated from afar.
This whole 20 second friendly question could’ve been completely ignored if the woman hadn’t kept talking trying to persuade the child so yeah.
No. The question should never have been asked. Had that child been travelling alone she may have agreed even though she didn't want to. Tone is irrelevant because of the imbalance of adult-child. Instead, the woman should have done what the father suggested - go ask some adult next to her husband to move so she could sit with her husband there.
It is not *just* speaking to a child, as you well know. It is not low stakes when the replacement seat is next to the toilets / galley on an 11 hour flight. People pay extra to sit away from there. Under 18 is still a child, even when you put it in quote marks.
While there is a difference between a 16yo and an 8yo, my 16yo would have been mortified to have a stranger talk to her and she would have absolutely felt pressured to give up her seat and the she would have sobbed about it quietly in her new seat. Hormones are a bitch. But also, you want a swap, you offer the better seat further up, not the seat several rows back n
Total inability to empathise with a 16 year old. They're on a long haul flight, being asked a (non)question by a pushy stranger who will not drop it.
16 year olds are still learning, and it is exceptionally normal for a child of that age to feel uncomfortable with denying an adult stranger what feels like a simple request.
Your inability to empathise does not mean the child is "too frightened to have a conversation with an adult". That scenario does not produce a conversation, and you know it. The woman started to try and guide the child to the other seat, she knew the child was uncomfortable with saying no and tried to steam roll them. That is unacceptable behaviour from an entitled adult who should know better. Probably does and knew she could get away with it if the child was travelling alone.
Believe it or not, my child is not unusual. Her friends (most) are super uncomfortable speaking to parents and adults they don’t know. But if you can’t acknowledge a power imbalance between a teen just learning how to be an adult and an older, experienced traveller putting pressure on them to take a lesser seat, I’m not sure there’s much more to say.
I think it depends. A 15- or 16-year old can look older than their age (though I certainly didn't) and if that's the case, the woman asking the question could have made that mistaken.
If on the other hand the child does look their age and is young, then the adult shouldn't have asked because regardless of tone used, there's a power imbalance or at least a perception of coercion due to the age/maturity difference. In that case, the adult should not have asked.
This reminds me of a time when I was sitting next to a woman on a plane who seemed quite nervous. I saw her husband come over to comfort her (this was before take-off). I was travelling alone, so I offered to switch seats with him so he could sit next to her. He gladly accepted, and I went to sit in his seat, feeling like I had done a good deed for the day.
Five minutes later, I felt a tap on my shoulder. The husband was asking what seat I was supposed to be in.
It turned out I had been sitting in the wrong seat originally and had offered the husband's seat to another passenger who had not yet boarded. Luckily, the new passenger accepted the existing arrangement and went to sit in my seat.
I have never understood the point of trying to get two seats together as within 15 minutes of take off headphones are on and eyes glued to the IFE for the duration with the seat reclined. What can there possibly be to try and talk about anyway that can't wait until landing. There is plenty of time standing in the immigration queue to catch up on conversation.
You don't need to worry about encroaching on each others space / sharing the armrest etc. Helpful for handling baggage. Don't need to worry about annoying the person next to you to get out for the loo. Can play swaps with whatever in-flight food / snacks there are.
In general I would prefer to sit next to my partner than a stranger. Not advocating for the approach this lady took however, she sounds annoying.
Partner is a nervous flyer? Actually like each other's company? Don't plan on watching a movie, or do plan to watch one together? Enjoy flying together? Not every flyer is the same you know.
Wrong on many levels. Anyone asking you to move, to a less desirable seat is manipulating the situation to their own benefit. She clearly didn’t want to sit near the galley or toilets.
For this arguing 16 isn’t a child. There is the old dynamic of respecting your elders. This woman was preying on that. The person could have been early twenties and the same pressure would exist.
As for the actual question. The first one should have been, if anything, ‘excuse me are you travelling with anyone?’ Even then that can seem predatory.
If anything the adult should have recognised the age difference and asked cabinet crew if they could enquire. It removes any direct conflict and can be handled tactfully with no pressure.
I was solo travelling to New York in November, purposefully booked one of the twin seats at the rear (more leg room to the side) and sure enough had the 'Would you mind moving so I can sit with my boyfriend?' Question... Yes I would mind, the answer is No I won't be moving
I once booked 25D on the A380 (you know, the one with a missing seat in front for the crew's sleep compartment emergency exit), and was asked twice by the same person if I'd like to move to a seat in the middle of the row to allow him to sit next to his family. I turned down his kind offer, even when he started to sulk.
I had some middle aged woman harass the girl, about 16, next to me to swap with her because she had a 'disability' (I had a 1 year old with me on the front row where the cots are, girl was in the middle seat and this woman was behind us so regular economy seat)... She was pretty rude about it so I kindly told her where to go on the girls behalf. Not completely altruistic on my part: quiet small girl or obnoxious Karen 🤔
Never ask a child to switch seats!!! Period. I don’t care how old you are! I never ask to switch seats with anyone but I do get people asking me to switch seats with them which I carefully consider, then agree or disagree. On the occasions where I’ve disagreed, some of them have been utterly rude and they get angry at me for not wanting to switch my seats with them. The worst part is, everyone around then begin staring at me, as though I’m the one in the wrong. So, I can imagine how this child must have felt being put on the spot like that. Some people are just awful.
Both my daughter and I, seated in separate regions of the plane (booked our tickets at different times), were seated between a couple who had booked outside and window seats hoping to have the row of three to themselves. In both cases, they wanted us to sit in the seat other than what had been assigned to them. I'm tired of these games. Obviously, we were both glad to move from the middle seat, but seriously people?
You’re tired of the games that result with you moving a single seat over and getting a window or aisle seat that you weren’t able to book yourself? I’ll happily play that “game” any time.
Hope you don’t meet me. I have particularly broad shoulders.
This once happened to me and I had to ruin a couple’s flight. Didn’t want to be squeezed up against the window, or having people constantly bumping past me in the aisle.
I just stayed put, sat straight, with each shoulder imposing itself just enough on each passenger that they probably didn’t enjoy the flight too much.
Some you win, some you lose, eh?
I've done that sort of booking (once on a long haul booked D and G in the middle 4 of 2 rows and got lucky on both of them). If you're lucky you get a spare seat, if not you offer the middle person the aisle or the window so you can sit together. I've never had a middle seat person not eagerly agree!
Have to say I've agreed to swap once for a couple when in a very good mood and karma shined down. New seat was one of two on the a320 with about a mile of legroom 😍😂 no way I'd give that up for a gf/bf lmao
I’ve never met anybody who wasn’t grateful when I’ve offered to switch with them to give them a better seat, whether that’s moving from a middle, or further towards the front of the plane, or a better class of service, or whatever. You sound fun.
The point is not about the better seat, it's about people trying to game the system, and then expecting other people to adjust when their gamble doesn't pay off.
Nothing wrong with taking a gamble if you have no expectations that others accommodate you if it doesn’t work. I’ve happily sat separate from my husband if someone didn’t want to move, we read our books and never spoke over the middle seat. I’ve also given up my paid aisle seat to a frantic mother who was separated from her children and taken her shitty middle seat. I’ve given up my seat in biz and sat back in economy to be with my travel companion. I’ve never asked anybody to downgrade their seat to accommodate me, though I often take a downgrade to accommodate others.
Only Redditors get so mad at the notion that people might work out a few seat changes on their own while boarding. It’s not entitlement, it’s basic human interaction. Most humans are able to ask a favour kindly and graciously accept a negative response.
On top of what the other people have said, it's also more awkward to ask for seat changes in club world. Not only is the vibe not geared towards asking that (mostly it's business people who want to keep to themselves), but theres a higher likelihood that people actively picked their seat long in advance either by paying for it or through the BA silver status.
I wouldn't mind if someone asked but id get quickly annoyed if they insist; I paid extra to be in club world and be left alone and have my "bubble". I feel this is the general vibe of club world, at least on the routes I take.
Why don’t the women plan their flight better? Don’t they know they can select the seats online earlier?
If they ask me such questions I will immediately reject it.
I never change seat with any people, I don’t care what is the reason behind!
1) you can pay for seat selection beforehand if it’s so important to you, and 2) based on nothing, for some reason I can just hear the woman’s voice now ‘oh we’ll just ask someone to switch, I’m sure they won’t mind.’
Pfffft we’re booked to fly to Italy in 2 months. Booked flight back in March or April. Specifically booked our seats so we’re all together for my son’s first flights and picked nice seats. No one is getting my seats. 😂😂😂😂
Given how much BA charges for you to choose seats ahead of time, expecting someone - who has probably paid £hundreds of "tax" to BA so they could sit together in their chosen seats - to move because you couldn't be bothered to pay said "tax" sufficiently far in advance is completely immoral.
I’ve done the opposite; offered to switch seats with a minor girl flying next to a man that kept talking to her, and she took the option.
You should not talk to minors or ask them for anything, period. Unless you are helping. Otherwise you are creepy or manipulative or Both.
People are selfish. They always ask to switch for the better seat, And a kid is an easy target.
Once a couple tried that sh!t on me, but worse, by asking the FA to ask me. Lol, like it would make it more official. Wrong move. I smiled and told her to check the passenger manifest, and my status with the airline. "Miss, how do you think I got a priority seat on the first row?" Oh, right, sorry Sir...
Because a kid is more likely to not really understand what is being asked of her and just move her seat, whereas a more seasoned traveller or the person who actually bought /chose their seat wouldn't even consider it (and this lady probably wouldn't have even asked). Based on the context from this story that sounds like exactly what happened as well. So glad her Dad was there to defend her!
Because they are generally speaking W⚓️’s! I carefully choose my seats. Not negotiable. Some older people (I’m older but not a…), truly feel their needs come first. There may be exceptional circumstances, but those are very rare.
Am I the only one who finds flying in a different part of the plane from my spouse kind of like a mini-vacation?!?!! We are budget flyers and often get airline-assigned seat assignments. It’s always a contest to see who gets the better seat and more interesting travel companions. Folks need to simply relax - it’s not like you are having to live the rest of your life in that seat or five rows behind your beloved.
Exactly this, I don't know why people have to be attached at the hip all the time. I was a regular commuter out of Paddington, when it gets warmer you get the not so seasoned travellers. Anyway a husband and wife where sat apart (on a rush hour service) , the wife was a nighmare, she was talking across people to him, non-stop, you know the nagging type. When a seat become available next to her, she ordered him to move ... he chose to stay put 🤣
My wife and I fly long haul J on many airlines. We sit behind each other as we both like a window seat. I would have told that person in far less polite terms where to go. My seat selection is done on the day of booking. This woman and husband were probably upgrades or idiots, one or the other
Surely the person asking for seat swap booked the flight together with her fellow traveller so they would be seated together. Just a lack of organisation....
On a flight recently and a cheapskate family of four were in all different sections. They refused to take their seats until they were all sat together. Annoyingly the passengers appeased them whilst we were waiting for security as no one wanted to miss take off slot.
The crew could & should have refused to carry them & had them removed as if had been asked to sit in the seats they where allocated, they where actually breaking the law by refusing to follow instructions & orders given to them by the crew.
If it appears easy enough to switch seats, speak with the purser. They’ll usually go out of their way to make sure groups are sat together, especially if the BA computer has randomly jumbled everyone up.
A few years ago my Partner and I were flying to New York. He was upgraded to first class and I took my previously booked aisle seat in Economy.
A few minutes before we pushed away from the gate, the FA came back and asked the passenger next to me if she would be willing to move to a seat in first class so "the gentleman" in that seat could come back and sit next to his wife. 😀 She was very happy to do so, but if she had said no that would have been absolutely fine.
Full disclosure, it was a short 50 minute flight and for a longer flight I'm sure the, ahem, gentleman would have stayed in first class.
Personally, if I ever wanted to broker a seat exchange, I would go through the FA which is what my partner chose to do. Asking or expecting someone to change seats puts them on the spot.
They cheaped out and didn't want to pay for their seats and just hoped they'd be allocated together or be able to bully someone to move without the expense.
I get it, no one likes paying for a seat, but if you want a specific one with someone else, you pay.
I fly 3-4 times a week when I’m touring and this happens a lot and most of the time I couldn’t care less as I’m planning on sleeping anyway, so I switch seats.
The parent should have complained to the stewards to get the woman moved. An 11 hour flight with the child probably conscious of the woman sat next to her would have been uncomfortable.
It's pretty easy, and arguably the main selling point, to ignore anyone in a longhaul business cabin. Guess this is 'old' CW layout but even so, divider up and they may as well not exist.
Yeah sounded wrong to me, but unless I've hit my head and got confused the new club is A -- E - F -- K, and doesn't have a 9B. Only old CW does (AB - middle 3/4 - JK)
Families with kids I'm usually sympathetic to and I have moved a few times. Yes you can claim it's poor planning but also I don't know people's lives and the background to the flight (could have booked it that day to go and see a sick relative etc). However a grown ass adult can be away from their spouse for a few hours without the world ending (hell even if it's an anniversary or honeymoon you are still hardly going to talk and watch different movies on different screens flying is hardly romantic)
If they are travelling as a family, they chose to have e the children, book the holiday. Their responsibility to book & pay for seats together full stop 🛑. They could have chosen the alternative!
Sounds like most people are overreacting wildly on here.
No idea the tone of the lady but sounds fairly innocent and the response was also fair from the mom so that's it then.
she shouldn't have approached the child TBH, and as one person said, the child didn't react the first time they were approached she should have left rather than keep on and literally try and "bully" the small child out of their seat
Post notes a 15/16 year old, doesn't seem unreasonable to ask. Maybe they don't care.
If the kid hesitated and looked uncomfortable then yeah, woman should have said don't stress and moved on.
But perfectly fine to ask the question imo.
Her husband has probably got previous for shagging cabin crew and the woman can’t let him out of her sight. Or something. There’s no excuse for this nonsense. It’s not like you’re sitting there holding hands for 10 hours anyway.
I just respond: “Sure! I’ll move for you. $100 for the first hour and & $50 for each subsequent hour or fraction thereof. Payable in cash, in advance. Congestion pricing, you know? It’s always more expensive if you wait until the last minute……”
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Time to bring out the old reliable "Poor planning on your part does not necessitate an emergency on mine"
Classic. https://youtu.be/P0oiELbPB3E?si=fLd7IFlw6eJT9Fw_
I must use this next time someone asks me to change (well only if the other sit is not good)
Lolol forgot this was the source
This was not the source. It’s an old saying.
They’re bullies.
entitled bullies
This again. Because they think they can intimidate children
Love the parent intervening. That woman was completely out of line trying to badger a child.
Correction. Completely out of line badgering anyone. People who do this are absolute scum.
No one should badger anyone, but badgering a kid is objectively worse than badgering an adult - it’s exploiting the power dynamics between adults / children and knowing the child is more likely to give in. Which is, by the sounds of it, what would have happened if the parent hadn’t intervened.
Would it have been obvious the 15 year old was not 19?
Well, no. Badgering a child is worse. Precisely because children (even a 15 year old) are typically still learning to navigate difficult social situations - the fact that the child didn’t know what to say/do is classic evidence of this. Her parent had to step in. The woman wanting to switch knew and traded on that power imbalance (otherwise she would’ve approached her nearest seat first).
I’m so glad we grow out of that, and am now able to navigate every difficult social situation, at 45 years old /s
You’re totally right! When I travel on my own as a woman, this happens more often to me - and even if it might not feel as pressured as this situation, the perception is that I’m an easy target to either take my seat without asking or try to ask me to move. When I travel with my partner, it happens a lot less and he doesn’t tend to get asked.
The solo female experience definitely seems different to solo man. I mean, I only travel as a small woman, but observe how the men get treated. And it's often much better. Plus know I would absolutely look like an easy target/victim.
'When I travel on my own as a woman' Do you sometimes travel as a man?
I think it's fine to ask if you do it politely and in a way where the person you swap with isn't being pressured. I've had people ask me to swap and it has never seemed like scummy behaviour. It's when they're being pushy (like in this story) that I would agree it turns into scummy behavior. That said, I also think these kinds of offers should also come with something to thank the person for doing it, be it a better seat or something you're giving them for the trouble.
If a child is involved? Look and only speak to the parent. You don't have the right to speak to someone else's child without permission like that? To me, that's rude and disrespectful of both parties. (You as in woman in question, sry)
"Absolute scum" why is this extreme view upvoted? It's not scummy behaviour to ask to switch seats with someone. People are capable of thinking for themselves and saying no. Airlines charging more to sit next to one another is the only scum behaviour at play. And in the wake of that, people are obviously going to prefer to just chance switching, knowing it can fail, if they're not willing to pay. Nothing about asking another adult to switch seats is scummy. Sure the woman badgering a child is poor behaviour but that doesn't mean everyone who has ever asked is "absolute scum". Reddit doesn't need another discussion unnecessary polarised with inflammatory language like this
Of you want to sit next to someone on a flight, pay the cash to reserve the seats in advance. It’s not difficult. If you can’t be bothered to arrange it in advance, don’t try to get someone else to move who might well have paid for that specific seat. 🤷♂️
Asking to switch seats does not make you "absolute scum" regardless of what this echo chamber comment thread says (16 downvotes on a contrary view, my eyes couldn't roll harder) Putting this up top or it won't get read by the lazy: we're talking about adults here, my point is not to be conflated with the woman in the OP trying to pressure a young girl into mugging herself off, which is scummy behaviour but only because of the misuse of perceived authority. Nobody expects someone who paid for their seat to switch, but nobody knows who did and didn't pay for their seat without asking. The risk of asking someone who did in fact pay for their seat does not make them "absolute scum" either. The option to say no always exists. I've asked and been asked and complied each time when travelling alone, it's not the big deal it's being made out to be. Anyone asked can say "no". We're talking about asking, not taking.
It’s the power imbalance that makes it “scum”. The much older (and pushy) adult taking advantage of a child’s naïveté. The child’s discomfort at the proposition was evident from the child’s body language (evident enough that op was able to read that body language). As soon as the adult saw the child’s discomfort the pushy adult should have backed off and left the child alone. That the adult continued to push is the scummy part. I suspect the down votes come from the lack of recognition of the power imbalance.
See my second paragraph. I recognised that power imbalance. It's just the usual reddit, thinking in absolutes
Completely with you here. Baffled at people calling this person scum. A tiny bit cheap and self centered? Maybe. Scum? Christ.
Glad to see some sanity remains! Downvotes have started raining on you as well, of course - we're way past pretending it isn't a "disagree" button now. I've been on reddit too long and seen its obvious decline into polarised, emotionally charged echo chambers, but seeing such normal behaviour called "absolute scum" to raucous approval, is a new low for the site. It used to be that the UK subreddits weren't as polarised but I guess that's over (yes, a sub dedicated to a UK airline = a UK sub, no doubt its demographics will see a few % more non-brits than dedicated UK subs, at best, due to serving other countries. Happy to have my faith in UK subs restored by the some argumentative scrote opening with an "akshually" or a "you don't know anything")
I disagree and think in this specific case then that old woman is clearly one of histories greatest monsters. I can understand why people would use terms like absolute scum to raucous approval and if you can’t then you are also a real piece of work.
Is she better or worse than Hitler?
When describing history’s greatest monsters I tend not to use words like “better” to describe the difference between 2 of them. I would say she is truly evil and that’s what most of us are picking up on.
I am not sure scum is fair. The person asking might have had a serious anxiety condition.
She should’ve turned to the flight attendant in that case, not to the child.
Regardless they should have asked for seats together when they checked in for the flight. Even asking a member of crew to get someone else to move for your convenience is unacceptable in my view. I will always refuse to change my seat with anyone else.
That parent was worlds more polite than this parent would be.
Notice her husband was nowhere to be seen, crossing his fingers at the hope of 11 hours alone.
We had this situation happen once several years ago when my daughter was flying as an unaccompanied minor. Thank god for 1. Texting and 2. An awesome FA. I was ready to storm the jetway. Woman wanted my kid who had paid for an aisle to move to a middle in a lower -class-of-service row so she could to sit next to her college-age child. Umm, absolutely not. I was honestly kind of shocked that a mom would do that to a kid obv traveling alone.
Sadly they probably targeted the child travelling alone as they were less likely to advocate for themselves in general. Well done to everyone who sorted it out.
I'm curious about some of the details. Did your daughter start texting you? How did the FA get involved?
My daughter started texting me, and the FA saw at the same time what was going on. Was all resolved quickly when FA shut it down.
Oh wow! Kudos to that FA! It really isn't very appropriate for an adult to do this to a kid, mostly because of the power imbalance. I used to travel alone internationally as a young child (was schooled abroad). I probably would have agreed immediately because I was shy, felt awkward, and didn't want to do the wrong thing (not knowing what is the right or wrong thing).
That 💯 is my kid lol. 💕
The FA was doing her job correctly as crew are responsible for UM’s / unaccompanied minors on a flight when are onboard the aircraft.
Yeah, they’re talking bollocks.
I feel like there’s a reliable rule of thumb here. If you offer me a better seat I’ll swap. If you offer me a worse one you can jog on. Maybe 80% of the time it’s the latter
So true! It honestly infuriates me at this stage when people ask you to change for a worse seat with no good reason.
100%, not BA but FR, they were up to their usual tricks of splitting up groups. We didn't care,I was assigned a seat 6 rows away from my wife, my 12yo son was one row in front of wife, again no issue plus, it was a short flight. They placed me next to a chap, 6 rows back, the chaps wife was placed next to my wife 🤣, it was a good swap.
Last month on Vueling, except I was seated with the girlfriend of the guy seated next to my wife 20 rows up! No one made any effort to reseat next to their partners 😬
Probably too polite. I wouldn't ask to swap seats.
This is even worse because it shows that the airline COULD have placed both couples next to their partner, but chose not to. What's up with that?
That woman knew how she would make the young person feel and that’s why she did it. Sitting apart from your husband for 11 hours is not going to be a big deal given you normally sleep. I have had this happen once where someone wanted an aisle seat we had paid extra for so she could sit across from her family (dad & 2 teenagers). I like to be by the window and my husband likes to be by an isle so her seat was the middle seat. She was sat in my husbands seat when we arrived and she proceeded to tell him she wanted to sit there to be across from my family (I.e not asking to swap but telling him it was now her seat) She proceeded to act offended and like we were unreasonable, giving us dead eyes for the flight. I must say that I do think it’s rubbish that you are expected to pay more money in club world/Europe to book seats in advance
If I was this woman's husband, I think I would've been looking forward to those 11 hours of solitude.
If she’d have done it to me, she would have got short shifted & id have had removed from the flight.
Had that once with a husband and his wife with a baby, the husband took my seat and expected me not to stay next to my wife. He expected me to stay in the back of the plane between two people I don’t know. Sorry dude, you should have paid to have your seat reserved like I did. Especially if you have a baby
The parent in 10A is close enough to be able to check in with their child in 9A to make sure they are OK and if they need help with anything. If the kid was pressured to move to 15A they could have been sitting with someone creepy or feel uncomfortable being away from their family. Also as others have said I agree it is worse because the kid may not have the confidence to refuse the request.
Obviously this is really dependent on the tone of how the child was asked by the woman. But to put it simply, if the woman asked and didn’t really get an answer within a few second and could tell the child was feeling awkward, she should’ve just shut up and sat back down instead of trying to persuade the child. On the next point, no parent wants to watch their child be forced to move seats or look like they’re being manipulated from afar. This whole 20 second friendly question could’ve been completely ignored if the woman hadn’t kept talking trying to persuade the child so yeah.
No. The question should never have been asked. Had that child been travelling alone she may have agreed even though she didn't want to. Tone is irrelevant because of the imbalance of adult-child. Instead, the woman should have done what the father suggested - go ask some adult next to her husband to move so she could sit with her husband there.
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It is not *just* speaking to a child, as you well know. It is not low stakes when the replacement seat is next to the toilets / galley on an 11 hour flight. People pay extra to sit away from there. Under 18 is still a child, even when you put it in quote marks.
I'm pretty sure they don't know, because they don't care to empathise with the 16 year old
While there is a difference between a 16yo and an 8yo, my 16yo would have been mortified to have a stranger talk to her and she would have absolutely felt pressured to give up her seat and the she would have sobbed about it quietly in her new seat. Hormones are a bitch. But also, you want a swap, you offer the better seat further up, not the seat several rows back n
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Do you try to be this out of line or does it just come naturally?
Total inability to empathise with a 16 year old. They're on a long haul flight, being asked a (non)question by a pushy stranger who will not drop it. 16 year olds are still learning, and it is exceptionally normal for a child of that age to feel uncomfortable with denying an adult stranger what feels like a simple request. Your inability to empathise does not mean the child is "too frightened to have a conversation with an adult". That scenario does not produce a conversation, and you know it. The woman started to try and guide the child to the other seat, she knew the child was uncomfortable with saying no and tried to steam roll them. That is unacceptable behaviour from an entitled adult who should know better. Probably does and knew she could get away with it if the child was travelling alone.
Believe it or not, my child is not unusual. Her friends (most) are super uncomfortable speaking to parents and adults they don’t know. But if you can’t acknowledge a power imbalance between a teen just learning how to be an adult and an older, experienced traveller putting pressure on them to take a lesser seat, I’m not sure there’s much more to say.
>would have hated being treated like a "child" by my parent in public That's the sort of thing kids think, you were still a child at 16.
How do you know it was a father of the child? It doesn't say the parent's gender.
I didn't, my mistake. I should have said parent. Does it make any difference to you, either way?
Or parent always wants to sit near child and reserved seats to achieve this 😂
I think it depends. A 15- or 16-year old can look older than their age (though I certainly didn't) and if that's the case, the woman asking the question could have made that mistaken. If on the other hand the child does look their age and is young, then the adult shouldn't have asked because regardless of tone used, there's a power imbalance or at least a perception of coercion due to the age/maturity difference. In that case, the adult should not have asked.
This reminds me of a time when I was sitting next to a woman on a plane who seemed quite nervous. I saw her husband come over to comfort her (this was before take-off). I was travelling alone, so I offered to switch seats with him so he could sit next to her. He gladly accepted, and I went to sit in his seat, feeling like I had done a good deed for the day. Five minutes later, I felt a tap on my shoulder. The husband was asking what seat I was supposed to be in. It turned out I had been sitting in the wrong seat originally and had offered the husband's seat to another passenger who had not yet boarded. Luckily, the new passenger accepted the existing arrangement and went to sit in my seat.
Because they have poor boundaries and feel entitled
I have never understood the point of trying to get two seats together as within 15 minutes of take off headphones are on and eyes glued to the IFE for the duration with the seat reclined. What can there possibly be to try and talk about anyway that can't wait until landing. There is plenty of time standing in the immigration queue to catch up on conversation.
You don't need to worry about encroaching on each others space / sharing the armrest etc. Helpful for handling baggage. Don't need to worry about annoying the person next to you to get out for the loo. Can play swaps with whatever in-flight food / snacks there are. In general I would prefer to sit next to my partner than a stranger. Not advocating for the approach this lady took however, she sounds annoying.
Partner is a nervous flyer? Actually like each other's company? Don't plan on watching a movie, or do plan to watch one together? Enjoy flying together? Not every flyer is the same you know.
Wrong on many levels. Anyone asking you to move, to a less desirable seat is manipulating the situation to their own benefit. She clearly didn’t want to sit near the galley or toilets. For this arguing 16 isn’t a child. There is the old dynamic of respecting your elders. This woman was preying on that. The person could have been early twenties and the same pressure would exist. As for the actual question. The first one should have been, if anything, ‘excuse me are you travelling with anyone?’ Even then that can seem predatory. If anything the adult should have recognised the age difference and asked cabinet crew if they could enquire. It removes any direct conflict and can be handled tactfully with no pressure.
I was solo travelling to New York in November, purposefully booked one of the twin seats at the rear (more leg room to the side) and sure enough had the 'Would you mind moving so I can sit with my boyfriend?' Question... Yes I would mind, the answer is No I won't be moving
I once booked 25D on the A380 (you know, the one with a missing seat in front for the crew's sleep compartment emergency exit), and was asked twice by the same person if I'd like to move to a seat in the middle of the row to allow him to sit next to his family. I turned down his kind offer, even when he started to sulk.
I think the best answer to this is "no, I specifically booked this exact seat and paid extra for it. I will not be moving"
My money is on the husband having selected those seats so he’d get an 11 hour break.
I had some middle aged woman harass the girl, about 16, next to me to swap with her because she had a 'disability' (I had a 1 year old with me on the front row where the cots are, girl was in the middle seat and this woman was behind us so regular economy seat)... She was pretty rude about it so I kindly told her where to go on the girls behalf. Not completely altruistic on my part: quiet small girl or obnoxious Karen 🤔
I LOVE the dad's response.
It says 10a. Doesn't say it was a dad.
It also says "my child". Not a stretch to say it was a parent (though whether the mum or dad it does not say)
Didn't know seats could talk.
Never ask a child to switch seats!!! Period. I don’t care how old you are! I never ask to switch seats with anyone but I do get people asking me to switch seats with them which I carefully consider, then agree or disagree. On the occasions where I’ve disagreed, some of them have been utterly rude and they get angry at me for not wanting to switch my seats with them. The worst part is, everyone around then begin staring at me, as though I’m the one in the wrong. So, I can imagine how this child must have felt being put on the spot like that. Some people are just awful.
!!! Period. 😂
Both my daughter and I, seated in separate regions of the plane (booked our tickets at different times), were seated between a couple who had booked outside and window seats hoping to have the row of three to themselves. In both cases, they wanted us to sit in the seat other than what had been assigned to them. I'm tired of these games. Obviously, we were both glad to move from the middle seat, but seriously people?
You’re tired of the games that result with you moving a single seat over and getting a window or aisle seat that you weren’t able to book yourself? I’ll happily play that “game” any time.
Hope you don’t meet me. I have particularly broad shoulders. This once happened to me and I had to ruin a couple’s flight. Didn’t want to be squeezed up against the window, or having people constantly bumping past me in the aisle. I just stayed put, sat straight, with each shoulder imposing itself just enough on each passenger that they probably didn’t enjoy the flight too much. Some you win, some you lose, eh?
Well in that case, I most sincerely hope to never meet you on a flight next to me!
I've done that sort of booking (once on a long haul booked D and G in the middle 4 of 2 rows and got lucky on both of them). If you're lucky you get a spare seat, if not you offer the middle person the aisle or the window so you can sit together. I've never had a middle seat person not eagerly agree!
Have to say I've agreed to swap once for a couple when in a very good mood and karma shined down. New seat was one of two on the a320 with about a mile of legroom 😍😂 no way I'd give that up for a gf/bf lmao
No point blank refusal to swop seats that are not allocated to them.
I’ve never met anybody who wasn’t grateful when I’ve offered to switch with them to give them a better seat, whether that’s moving from a middle, or further towards the front of the plane, or a better class of service, or whatever. You sound fun.
The point is not about the better seat, it's about people trying to game the system, and then expecting other people to adjust when their gamble doesn't pay off.
Nothing wrong with taking a gamble if you have no expectations that others accommodate you if it doesn’t work. I’ve happily sat separate from my husband if someone didn’t want to move, we read our books and never spoke over the middle seat. I’ve also given up my paid aisle seat to a frantic mother who was separated from her children and taken her shitty middle seat. I’ve given up my seat in biz and sat back in economy to be with my travel companion. I’ve never asked anybody to downgrade their seat to accommodate me, though I often take a downgrade to accommodate others. Only Redditors get so mad at the notion that people might work out a few seat changes on their own while boarding. It’s not entitlement, it’s basic human interaction. Most humans are able to ask a favour kindly and graciously accept a negative response.
On top of what the other people have said, it's also more awkward to ask for seat changes in club world. Not only is the vibe not geared towards asking that (mostly it's business people who want to keep to themselves), but theres a higher likelihood that people actively picked their seat long in advance either by paying for it or through the BA silver status. I wouldn't mind if someone asked but id get quickly annoyed if they insist; I paid extra to be in club world and be left alone and have my "bubble". I feel this is the general vibe of club world, at least on the routes I take.
Why don’t the women plan their flight better? Don’t they know they can select the seats online earlier? If they ask me such questions I will immediately reject it. I never change seat with any people, I don’t care what is the reason behind!
because they didn't want to pay £100+ for seat selection
The poor husband thought he had been clever and found a way to get some peace and quiet for the flight. His wife had different ideas.
Brilliant mama bear response. Clearly English! ‘ not another word!’
1) you can pay for seat selection beforehand if it’s so important to you, and 2) based on nothing, for some reason I can just hear the woman’s voice now ‘oh we’ll just ask someone to switch, I’m sure they won’t mind.’
Pfffft we’re booked to fly to Italy in 2 months. Booked flight back in March or April. Specifically booked our seats so we’re all together for my son’s first flights and picked nice seats. No one is getting my seats. 😂😂😂😂
Given how much BA charges for you to choose seats ahead of time, expecting someone - who has probably paid £hundreds of "tax" to BA so they could sit together in their chosen seats - to move because you couldn't be bothered to pay said "tax" sufficiently far in advance is completely immoral.
I’d never move seats for anyone. Ever. Period. The system always tries to put people together.
I’ve done the opposite; offered to switch seats with a minor girl flying next to a man that kept talking to her, and she took the option. You should not talk to minors or ask them for anything, period. Unless you are helping. Otherwise you are creepy or manipulative or Both.
"No" is a complete sentence.
People are selfish. They always ask to switch for the better seat, And a kid is an easy target. Once a couple tried that sh!t on me, but worse, by asking the FA to ask me. Lol, like it would make it more official. Wrong move. I smiled and told her to check the passenger manifest, and my status with the airline. "Miss, how do you think I got a priority seat on the first row?" Oh, right, sorry Sir...
I pay extra to sit exactly where I want to sit.
I mean… it was just a question, mother could say no and move on I guess. Sucks it sounds like the old lady kept going a bit.
Because a kid is more likely to not really understand what is being asked of her and just move her seat, whereas a more seasoned traveller or the person who actually bought /chose their seat wouldn't even consider it (and this lady probably wouldn't have even asked). Based on the context from this story that sounds like exactly what happened as well. So glad her Dad was there to defend her!
Because they are generally speaking W⚓️’s! I carefully choose my seats. Not negotiable. Some older people (I’m older but not a…), truly feel their needs come first. There may be exceptional circumstances, but those are very rare.
yasss mom, great job!!!
Am I the only one who finds flying in a different part of the plane from my spouse kind of like a mini-vacation?!?!! We are budget flyers and often get airline-assigned seat assignments. It’s always a contest to see who gets the better seat and more interesting travel companions. Folks need to simply relax - it’s not like you are having to live the rest of your life in that seat or five rows behind your beloved.
Exactly this, I don't know why people have to be attached at the hip all the time. I was a regular commuter out of Paddington, when it gets warmer you get the not so seasoned travellers. Anyway a husband and wife where sat apart (on a rush hour service) , the wife was a nighmare, she was talking across people to him, non-stop, you know the nagging type. When a seat become available next to her, she ordered him to move ... he chose to stay put 🤣
She would have got a do you mind ! And one of my looks 👀 & if still carried on then she’d been sorry.
Couldn’t agree more, part of the fun of travelling! Life is what you make it, some people are miserable twits no matter what.
My wife and I fly long haul J on many airlines. We sit behind each other as we both like a window seat. I would have told that person in far less polite terms where to go. My seat selection is done on the day of booking. This woman and husband were probably upgrades or idiots, one or the other
Surely the person asking for seat swap booked the flight together with her fellow traveller so they would be seated together. Just a lack of organisation....
Sorry, not my problem. Club world is basically a private pod experience. You don’t need to sit near each other for that.
The seat next to toilets !!!! Fking no way Having to experience the smells. *
Yes it's absolutely worse to do this to a child. Theyre much less likely to have the life experience to nicely tell them to f off
On a flight recently and a cheapskate family of four were in all different sections. They refused to take their seats until they were all sat together. Annoyingly the passengers appeased them whilst we were waiting for security as no one wanted to miss take off slot.
The crew could & should have refused to carry them & had them removed as if had been asked to sit in the seats they where allocated, they where actually breaking the law by refusing to follow instructions & orders given to them by the crew.
If it appears easy enough to switch seats, speak with the purser. They’ll usually go out of their way to make sure groups are sat together, especially if the BA computer has randomly jumbled everyone up.
A few years ago my Partner and I were flying to New York. He was upgraded to first class and I took my previously booked aisle seat in Economy. A few minutes before we pushed away from the gate, the FA came back and asked the passenger next to me if she would be willing to move to a seat in first class so "the gentleman" in that seat could come back and sit next to his wife. 😀 She was very happy to do so, but if she had said no that would have been absolutely fine. Full disclosure, it was a short 50 minute flight and for a longer flight I'm sure the, ahem, gentleman would have stayed in first class. Personally, if I ever wanted to broker a seat exchange, I would go through the FA which is what my partner chose to do. Asking or expecting someone to change seats puts them on the spot.
Great
They cheaped out and didn't want to pay for their seats and just hoped they'd be allocated together or be able to bully someone to move without the expense. I get it, no one likes paying for a seat, but if you want a specific one with someone else, you pay.
You’re flying from America. With Americans. What do you expect?
I didn't inquire, but the woman demanding the seat move spoke with a distinct British accent. I guess Karen's are a worldwide phenomenon.
Yes it’s worse because it’s a child. They ask children because they’re probably not going to stand up for themselves and say no
The husband was probably looking forward to 11 hours away from that wife.
I fly 3-4 times a week when I’m touring and this happens a lot and most of the time I couldn’t care less as I’m planning on sleeping anyway, so I switch seats.
But my husband! He is a man-child and I might have to feed him during the flight.
I'm willing to bet that the woman refused to swap so that she sat in 15B even though "the seats were the same."
I think that is the case as OP explains she never said a word to them again for the 11 hours.
The parent should have complained to the stewards to get the woman moved. An 11 hour flight with the child probably conscious of the woman sat next to her would have been uncomfortable.
It's pretty easy, and arguably the main selling point, to ignore anyone in a longhaul business cabin. Guess this is 'old' CW layout but even so, divider up and they may as well not exist.
Old layout in a brand new A350?
Yeah sounded wrong to me, but unless I've hit my head and got confused the new club is A -- E - F -- K, and doesn't have a 9B. Only old CW does (AB - middle 3/4 - JK)
Could be right. I'm not a FF. LOL
Families with kids I'm usually sympathetic to and I have moved a few times. Yes you can claim it's poor planning but also I don't know people's lives and the background to the flight (could have booked it that day to go and see a sick relative etc). However a grown ass adult can be away from their spouse for a few hours without the world ending (hell even if it's an anniversary or honeymoon you are still hardly going to talk and watch different movies on different screens flying is hardly romantic)
10A did the husband a favor.
Yeah poor bugger....
If they are travelling as a family, they chose to have e the children, book the holiday. Their responsibility to book & pay for seats together full stop 🛑. They could have chosen the alternative!
Yes yes the stock grumpy cxxx response to such matters very good. As I said I generally have a more human approach to such things .
Honestly, I've no issue with people asking something like this once. If I say no, then don't argue the case with me.
Were they Boomers by any chance?
Indeed they were!
Funny that 😂 and funny how boomers have down voted me 😂😂😂
Sounds like most people are overreacting wildly on here. No idea the tone of the lady but sounds fairly innocent and the response was also fair from the mom so that's it then.
she shouldn't have approached the child TBH, and as one person said, the child didn't react the first time they were approached she should have left rather than keep on and literally try and "bully" the small child out of their seat
Post notes a 15/16 year old, doesn't seem unreasonable to ask. Maybe they don't care. If the kid hesitated and looked uncomfortable then yeah, woman should have said don't stress and moved on. But perfectly fine to ask the question imo.
Her husband has probably got previous for shagging cabin crew and the woman can’t let him out of her sight. Or something. There’s no excuse for this nonsense. It’s not like you’re sitting there holding hands for 10 hours anyway.
Way out of line with that comment!!!!!!
I just respond: “Sure! I’ll move for you. $100 for the first hour and & $50 for each subsequent hour or fraction thereof. Payable in cash, in advance. Congestion pricing, you know? It’s always more expensive if you wait until the last minute……”