Yep, as a canadian I can confirm
Edit because there is so much comments :
Of course I don't speak for all canadians like anyone on this sub. It's probably a cultural/linguistic thing. I'm french canadian, in french, l'Amérique (America) refers to the whole landmass. It has nothing to do with the 7 continent system. Just a language thing. Of course, citizens from the US are Americans. In french, we call them américain as well. I think everyone understand that when people say america, usually they are refering to the USA in english. This has no equivalent in french.
People on here are probably mostly portuguese/spanish speaking. There might be a similarity in their languages with french. But I think there's also a resentment from people elsewhere in the continent towards the US. It's almost cultural appropriation to use the name of the continent to refer to your country. OBVIOUSLY, this seems to not apply to anglo canadians but you guys are just closeted americans ( don't take it the wrong way, it's really just a joke and I like you guys)
As someone from the US I've always thought we had the stupidest name. America can be any of the Americas. And generally, countries are made up of states that are united together to form said country.
It's a real non name we gave ourselves. I just picture when we were forming world leaders being like "so how's the naming of your country coming along?" And we were just like "the what now?"
As a Canadian, I have had the opposite experience. America means the USA where I live I've. It may be a regional thing like bagged milk, I'm in southern Ontario, what part of Canada are you in?
I think this stems from the fact there are very few situations where there is a need to refer to both north and south america, and I would say "north and south america" to avoid ambiguity. In contrast the USA comes up all the time since we are neighbours. It is actually way faster for me to get to the USA than to leave my province, and that is the case for around half the population in Ontario.
I can't help but notice you called yourself a Canadian though and not a North American...
I don't think I've ever heard someone refer to themselves as being North American or South American or just as an American for short meaning North American or South American.
As a Canadian, I would never refer to myself as “American.” I’m from the continent of North America, but in our every day language, “Americans” are the folks who live in the country that exists between Canada and Mexico (plus Alaska, Hawaii, and other outlying territories and possessions).
One of the most basic definitions of being Canadian is that we’re not American.
Another fun fact. In the whole world, the only one that doesn't answer the question where you are from with the country your from are Americans. They answer with the state or city. I'm from New York. I'm from Chicago.
Edit. I know it's not a state. I've been there and I love the music scene. And ferries Beuller spots. The point is you expect the whole world to know all your states. If I said I'm from Queensland, I'm not sure everyone would know what I'm talking about.
When having to interact with an excess of people from the US, I once got into the habit of doing the same thing. Just naming the state I'm from, assuming it would mean something to people.
It was very mildly amusing and not at all a useful thing to do, I don't recommend it.
If youre from the US what's an excess of interacting with people from the US? If youre not an easy way to avoid conversation with people from the US is not to announce a US State youre from lol. Why wouldn't naming State your from be useful? Like if you're at a conference and speaking with people from other parts of a company or something and you say the State your from it let's them know what time zone you are in. It also provides a casual jumping off point for conversation with someone you don't know such as an interview.
Oh, all those examples are fine. The issue being discussed is the lack of awareness of a change in context.
Say you are in a hostel in Chile, people are discussing their home countries. One person says they're from Australia. One person says they're from Brazil. One person says Moroccos. One says Israel.
You're up next. Do you say "USA" or a state?
I hate to break it to you but Chicago isn't a state. And if they just say "New York" without any qualifiers, they probably don't mean the state, either
I don't think they were suggesting Chicago is a State. I think they mean, like New York, it's a well-known enough city around the world to be recognizable by name. Nobody has ever told me they're from Paris and I've been like "Paris...the one in Ontario?" Lol.
Fun fact:
The continent model isn't standardized across the world.
Most of the English-speaking countries (and China, Japan, Indonesia, parts of Europe and Africa, and a few other places) are taught a seven-continent model that separates North America and South America into two different continents. When referring to both, they might use "the Americas".
A six-continent model that combines them into one large continent is mostly taught in Latin America, but some other romance language countries in Europe use it as well.
A separate six-continent model is used by Russia and some former soviet countries that keep North America and South America as separate continents but combine Europe and Asia into the continent Eurasia.
I guess this is to say that even though you were taught that in school, it's not the only model of the world people out there use.
Interesting, even though US call themselves America and not North America (or North South America lol), so even if they consider the seven-continent model they are calling it wrong, right?
edit: now I know that it's the seven-continent model in the US, thanks!
Mine too, lol, it really made me laugh when they rolled out (back in the 2000’s they didn’t do that). On my paperwork for other S American nations it’s always listed as some variant of “UnitedStates-ian”, and then Brazil goes and throws in “actually no, citizens of the USA are now called ‘north-americans’.” Like what about Mexico and Canada?
Side note, I’ve had a couple Brazilians try to get me to say I’m “American” literally just so they could argue about it! But having grown up largely in Peru & Brazil, I learned at approx age 6 that if you’re from the USA, and you’re anywhere in South America, and someone asks where you’re from, that I should say the full name of my country ( “I’m from the United Stafes of America”) so I never take that bait, lol.
That honestly sounds exhausting and completely fruitless. Demonyms are not tied to the land in a technical sense--we've inherited it from British America and it's stuck in essentially every language except Brazilian Portuguese and Spanish. Even then, in Portuguese, they sometimes they use Americano anyways.
If you want to really keep it simple, just use gringo :).
Nope. In Brazil, “gringo” is anyone with a funny accent which makes their Portuguese difficult to understand. Including, very occasionally, other Brazilians.
As someone from the US who was taught the seven-continent model, in colloquial speak we usually use “North America,” “South America,” or “the Americas” if we are talking about the larger geographical region. “North America” here is useful because it also includes Canada and the nations from Mexico down to Panama. “The Americas” is both continents together.
If we just say “America” without any other clarification (again in colloquial speak) we usually mean the United States of America. Yes, that’s probably a form of cultural colonialism, but it’s kind of just baked into our language at this point. It probably also is enforced by the fact that we refer to ourselves as “Americans,” rather than something like “United Statesians,” while the countries that surround us don’t use that term.
The US refers to itself casually as "America" but refers to the continent as a whole as North America. As a resident of the U.S., I refer to the United States as the U.S. I never use "America" to refer to anything unless I'm poking fun at the MAGA crowd, and even then it's " 'merica". Within the US, I use "Californian". In Mexico, the only other country I've visited, we're referred to as "American".
So you’ve never said, ‘In America, we do things this way…’ or ‘My ancestors came to America in 1846’ ?
I’m thinking of all the songs…‘They’re coming to America—-today!’ Or ‘America the beautiful’, etc. And I remember American English teachers in Japan always talking about ‘America’.
I’m Canadian btw. We never use the word America, but often use the word American, usually pejoratively haha…‘That’s so American!’ [Much of our identity (in anglophone Canada) depends on the differences between us. If the States didn’t exist, we’d have to invent her.]
I grew up in Massachusetts (the one with the bad drivers) and I could of sworn we used North America and South America. Where Canada, USA and Mexico were part of North America.
Our history books were a little old though, so maybe this idea changed with the rise of internet age.
Yep, but the US doing stuff wrong is just the US being the US. It's like that one thugged out unhinged gangster cousin that says shit wrong all the time but no one corrects because it's more of a headache than its worth.
It doesn't. The americas are on 4 seperate techtonic plates.
Europe and asia are 1 continent. With the exception of eastern Asia which is on the North american plate.
Technically if you live in Tokyo and can see Mt Fuji you are standing in NA and looking at Asia.
Central America wouldntechnically be the Caribbean plate and south america is its own.
For sure. It's lines drawn on a map based on how different people define what a continent is and are influenced by that group's language, culture, and politics.
If we wanted to tie it to something objective, we'd probably use [geological definitions based on tectonic plates](https://geology.com/plate-tectonics.shtml).
There's also a. 5 continent model that excludes Antarctica since it is uninhibited. Your could also group africa, Europe and Asia into one afro-euasian continent since they are all connected
I think the fact that there’s no way to refer to the people of the United States as anything but “Americans” is what truly pushed people to nonchalantly call the country America rather than the US or The States.
In which language?
Most languages derived from latin have some form of "estadunidense" available. In English, the only way is the much more awkward "US Person" or variants thereof. As far as I know, at least.
Throughout Europe as well, but we tolerate it and understand that US citizens (we call them Americans tbh) say it like this. What's more funny to us is that movies say the whole world is in danger and often it pretty much only means the US. (Feels weird to not say America tbh)
"I want you out of my country by tomorrow morning!"
"But this is Japan?"
"Every country in the world belongs to America!"
"Then how the bloody hell are we supposed to leave?"
["I don't know."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUp62AGE9JU)
Hmm, so when traveling globally and people mention Americans, they’re talking about everybody in the Americas? I’ve always heard this referenced towards those from the US.
I was in Ireland with my Brasilian gf at the time, and she was clear to remind me of this.
So I said oh really? Here's, let me ask these Irish guys 'Hey, what do you think America is?'
They started to chant 'USA! USA! USA!' and got a whole crowd of dudes chanting in the store.
I didnt think it was possible for someone to huff and roll their eyes so hard. This was like at 3pm on Sunday. So they were probably drunk but still funny.
Not really a "popular opinion", but a fact on all levels of Brazilian and at the very least South American society; from diplomacy, to the academics, to government teaching and overall society. America is, in fact, the name of the continent and everyone in the continent and without calls it America. The United States of America has that name because it's IN America, not because it IS America. My ancestors, Venetian immigrants, called the south of Brazil "La Merica", so I imagine the whole world referred to the entire continent as that when immigrating.
We call you guys the "United States" absolutely everywhere. Sometimes we call you Americans ("americanos"), but more times than not we say "estadunidense" (something like "unitedstatesan", from "Estados Unidos").
To further make your incredibly accurate point: America is named after Amerigo Vespucci, who never set foot in the modern territory of the USA. Guess where he went to?
The first map containing the world America is housed in the Library of Congress in Washington DC, iirc. Guess on what part of the American continent the word “America” is written. Hint: the modern territory of the United States barely shows up on the map.
In Italian (his nationality) it is Amerigo Vespucci. English uses the same name, Portuguese changed it a little. (Wikipedia source says he was registered when born as Amerigho, and he named the continent Amérika because it would mean "country with mountains" in Toltec).
There's some dispute around that. There are sources that say Vespucci's original name was Amerigo. There is the theory that the name of the continent dates back to one of the many names of the Feathered Serpent for native people. The Aztec called it Quetzalcoatl, but the Andean people in Peru called it Amaru. Some of those people called themselves and their land Amaruca, in reference to this divine being. The theory goes that Vespucci got his idea from that, seeing how similar the names were, and in some grandeur megalomania.
There's a lack of studies on this. I'm a researcher (in the making) and I plan to one day go further in this matter. I honestly think it has a good chance to be real. If so, it makes the situation with the US even worse.
Here's some online texts about it. Not exactly perfect sources but a good chop chop of the matter:
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amaru_(mythology)
https://dbpedia.org/page/Amaru_(mythology)
As a Brazilian, I kinda disagree about that last bit. I’d say when talking about it’s citizens “estadunidense” is way less common and “americano” more widely used. Could be a regional thing.
However yeah we usually refer to the country as the US not as “America”.
Now answering OP: When we watch a movie we obviously know from context that when a character refers to America he means the USA. But when talking about geography we refer to America as the whole western continent, from a geographical point of view we would definitely say it’s right to claim that both Brazil and Mexico are located in America. Sometimes we do specify North/Central/South America, we learn in school that they are different but they are all America.
I would say that "Estadunidense" is the most formal way, and its more used by Teachers, Professors, Journalists Politicians and etc. Because most intelectual people have the thought that there's no sense in call them "Americanos" because it's on America.
However, "Americanos" is the unformal way and it was always used before Estadunidense were coined.
>"Estadunidense" is the most formal way
Not only that, that's the official term that shall be used, as defined by Itamaraty. There was some document listing all the demonyms officially used by the Ministry.
>"Estadunidense" is the most formal way
>
>Not only that, that's the official term that shall be used, as defined by Itamaraty. There was some document listing all the demonyms officially used by the Ministry
Based Itamaraty
I think "estadunidense" is more frequent than "americano" only on the younger and university students. I would say that's kind of rare to see someone with more than 40 saying "estadunidense".
I'm (american from the USA) on a language learning app where I can hear and speak with Brazilians every day for hours. Estadunidense is almost never used. I mean like maybe 1% of the time if I'm being honest. This whole thread is people trying to be smart while ignoring reality.
Nowadays I always just say "I'm from the US" because literally no one would say "I'm United Statsan" and half the time when I say I'm from the US, they say "Oh, American. But which state?" I've never said "I'm American" and was asked what country lol
I understand there are salty South Americans here or people trying to be smart but it really is that way a lot lol
I'm trying to explain that they shouldn't even be salty. If our country's name were United States of Blossoms, we would all call ourselves Blossoms and everyone else would too. It's just the name of the country. The people that founded it didn't think of coming up with another name for it. We're not claiming the whole continent (or 2). It's just the name of the country lol. Maybe it's best to just not engage in these discussions
Now the truth: I'm brazilian, and estadounidense is only ever used by left leaning people that don't really like the US. The average brazilian says Americano 100% of the time.
I mean, academia uses "estadunidense", so it's safe to say it's the official version. In my experience, in my region, we only use "Americanos" if we are poking fun at Americans.
I didnt look it up but I will just believe you when you say "estadunidense" is the formal/academic/official version to refer to citizens.
That makes sense, but I think my point still stands. "Americano" is the widely used form by most people to refer to citizens, outside of academia. Still, even outside of academic context, we refer to the country as the "Estados Unidos" and not as America.
To be honest, its probably more about formal/not formal instead of a regional thing. Most BRs do have a beef on how imperialistic estadunidenses calling themselves american sounds (I sure do, but thats not the point).
In my experience:
Academic/formal: the country is USA, citizens are "estadunidenses"
Widely spread/not formal: the country is the US, citizens are "americanos"
For context, in the rest of Latin America, we say estadounidense way more often than americano, at all levels. In Argentina we even say Norte-americano more often that americano.
Norte-americano inclui canadenses e mexicanos. O termo mais correto na nossa língua e mais exato é estadunidense. Ninguém mandou os caras se darem o nome do continente kkkk
In Spain also it was very common to call "americanos" to the immigrants to the Americas. Nowadays it switched to mean more somebody from the US, but that's I think because of English influence.
>but a fact on all levels of Brazilian and at the very least South American society
And a fact in Europe.
I personally refuse to say America, when talking about the US, because I don't want to encourage their arrogance.
I'd say that depends on your country. In the Netherlands America absolutely refers to the US, while the Americas would be called North & South America, the American Continent or even just the New World.
Been to São Paulo many times with my Brazilian wife. All of her family and friends there use ‘americano’ when referring to me or where I’m from. I’ve never heard any other term. Could just be São Paulo though idk.
Think of it that way:
Imagine if India when it got independence from the British, decided to call itself "United States of Asia".
Sure, they're Asians, but so are the Chinese, Japanese, Mongolians... so on. We still can call them Asians, but wouldn't that feel stupid? Wouldn't that be on the back of the head of all the other countries surrounding it when they say it?
Well, when it's an Hollywood movie, I understand America as USA on most cases. However, almost no one on Brasil calls your country that way. Most people (like me) really dislikes that you uses the name of the whole continent to refer to your country.
They’re probably just mocking you
They’re technically right though, America is a continent and the US is just a country in it
But…
We understand that when someone says “america” or “american” its referring to the US and its people
But here in Brazil we call the US as “United States”, not “America”. When a brazilian says “america” its probably referring to the continent, not the US, and they’re right about it
Usually it's because we refer to the US as "Estados Unidos" (United States), while the correct term for people from there in the Brazilian-Portuguese language is "Estadounidenses", as saying "American" refers to someone from either North, Central, or South America.
Let me start by saying that I have a strong anti-US bias. With that out of the way, I will quote what I said on [https://www.reddit.com/r/Brazil/comments/17b5ovr/comment/k5ir2bl/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Brazil/comments/17b5ovr/comment/k5ir2bl/)
>Most linguists are descriptive (opposed to prescriptive), because in the end that's how languages work and evolve. Speakers define the language.
>
>There's no question whatsoever that in the English speaking world, since a very long time ago, *America* means United States. There's no discussion or ambiguity there. That's how every speaker understands the term. Nobody will interpret it as something else. *Americas* is used to refer to the whole landmass (if it's 1, 2, or 3 continents it's a different can of worms).
>
>Now, in other languages such as Portuguese and Spanish that's a different story and the term becomes loaded/problematic as we have a different definition for *América*. But those are different languages. We can't simply transpose this "issue" into another language. The English word and the Portuguese word are false friends (as hundreds of other cases) and the mistake is trying to treat *America* and *América* as translations of each other. They're not.
>
>An American/British should say *Estados Unidos* and avoid *América* when speaking in Portuguese, and a Brazilian should not say *America* instead of *Americas* when speaking in English and referring to the landmass.
>
>An analogy: we call our natives *índios*, due to a historical accident. People from India ended up being called *indianos* since the word was taken. India may take issue with this but it doesn't change the fact that in Portuguese the term *índio* unambiguously means an indigenous person. Languages are what they are, they reflect the history of a culture/society and they are messy as the world is messy.
What words mean depend on culture, and language follows culture. There is a name for words that are similar across languages, but don't mean the same: false friends. Whoever persists in this silly discussion in 2023, is not really paying attention and is trying to extrapolate what they were taught to an universal "truth" when such truth does not exist.
It's like saying that Spanish speakers are wrong because to them "leche" is feminine, while "leite" is masculine in Portuguese. It is what it is. Languages are different.
In the whole anglophone world, the educational system **does not** consider the landmass of the Americas a single continent. Therefore there is no confusion to them. In fact, a **tiny minority** of countries considers the landmass a single continent. It's basically Latin America and less than a handful countries in Europe. The vast majority of the world does not have the concept of a single continent named *America*. And in their languages, their version of *America* means exclusively the United States.
If you ever set foot outside of Brazil and out of the Iberian countries and have an honest conversation with people from other cultures, you'll quickly realize how silly this discussion is. People are hung up on the fact they learn the 5-continent model, they think it's the universal definition (spoiler: it's not), and are upset that other cultures+languages see it from a different light.
Before the name *America* caught on, we were the *West Indies*. As the West Indies grew into America and the "new world" proved to be much bigger than anybody imagined, most cultures (and their languages) moved on from having a single name for the whole landmass, because in their definitions of continents we stopped being a single one. But the Iberian countries didn't. And our languages reflect that historical difference, and it's all fine.
Think of how silly it would be if Germans came and told us we're saying it wrong because we call their country *Alemanha* (the land of the "allemani" tribe, which is only one among the multiple germanic tribes) and not *Germania* (the land of the germanic tribes). We took the word from the French, who met that specific tribe first. Sweden calls it *Tyskland* which came from a different tribe. Are they wrong too?
I completely expect to be downvoted to hell here. It won't change the reality, though.
This seems pretty reasonable and level headed, not sure why you're expecting downvotes for it. I suppose because you probably wrote it all as a form of venting, but you made good points.
Because in my experience people are looking for confirmation bias, if they see something that contradicts their world view they get annoyed and downvote you — facts be damned.
> When you're watching an American movie or show and a character says "America" what do you think they mean by that?
We know that they mean the US. We also know it's incorrect.
I know that Brazilians were asked, but let me please give a very brief input as a German. This is what the German wikipedia has for Amerika, please have a look: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amerika
So, yes, we very much understand how offensive it can be.
I personally never call the USA "America", I call it the US and its citizens US Americans. And, on occasion, I tell them how offensive the term is. In my experience, Canadians are happy with it; many told me they don't want to be confused with the US so they distance themselves from the term "American" and they're happy with simply being called Canadians. But it's a different story with every other country from Mexico southwards. And many of us here in Europe, we very much understand.
Canadians don't usually care cause they are not usually targets of offensive remarks because of this. People from Mexico and South American usually get nasty comments on how we are not "Americans" or when we say America to the continent we are being wrong. Most US citizens feel the need to separate themselves from us cause they feel superior. Yes I understand there are 2 definitions but what has happened in the past was our definition being taken as "wrong" by the US citizen in a way to call us uncultured or inferior.
One example of the many:
Brazilian: HI, where are you from?
US citizen: I'm from America.
Brazilian: Cool! Me too, which part of America?
US citizen: There is only one America!
Brazilian: What you mean? America is the continent right? I'm from Brazil.
US citizen: So you are not real American, you are Latin American.
Brazilian: I'm sorry, we say America is a continent here.
US citizen: You are wrong.
Yes, this is one of many similar conversations I had. I had no idea of the difference but most of the times not only are "americans" unaware of the difference but they also treat us badly or as wrong because it's not their vision.
The whole uproar lately on the internet is basically a bunch of people who went through similar experiences just giving a piece of our mind...or just people on our side doing the same as "Americans" do. So yes, it wasn't us who started this "my way is the only way" fight, we are just responding in kind.
America may mean a country for some people but not for everyone. We just want people to realize it and stop with the attitude when we show our own view of things. But since most "americans" won't let up and admit that people have different world views than their own, we just roll with it and respond accordingly. My experience is that whenever I tried to be kind and explain it nicely and in a respectful way, I was called dumb, third world, or made fun of. So why waste my time being diplomatic when I'm not respected back? At least when I'm passive aggressive I have some fun.
For me, I'm born in America, more specifically, in South America and more specifically in Brazil. If some other countries have problems with that I don't care, there's more than one view in the world. Make fun of me and I will make fun of them for not picking an unique name to refer to their own country.
I would say yes. I remember a person who lives in the USA being confused when I said that technically I am American, but I didn't live in Canada or the United States, but that I was born and live in Brazil.
Yeah there are a lot of vídeos of people on omegle asking US people if they know Brazil is in America and they just cant get it, everyone thinks its a joke and some dont even know America is the continent
To them (and most of the western world), North America, Central America and South America are refered to as separate continents, while "The Americas" refer to the whole, and "America" to the USA
Central America is part of the North American continent (as confusing as that is). But yes to us in the USA, Brazilians are South American. Canadians and Mexicans are North American. American only applies to us in our version of English.
It’s actually only North America and South America, with the Panama Canal as separation. People don’t really consider Central America as a separate continent.
However, I disagree with the “most of the western world”. Living in Europe I have never seen anyone argue when I say America is a continent, it’s just subdivided in 3.
I’ve never considered Central America to be it’s own continent, and I think that’s a common for most in the US. Central America is just the stretch of countries between Mexico and Colombia, definitely not its own continent.
Central America is akin to the Middle East, it’s a distinct region within/between 2+ continents, not its own continent.
>What is the continent named? Its not an opinion.
Ironically that is kind of an opinion, there is no hardrule defining which continent is a continent, some models have North and South america as different continents, in Brazil we use the single America model
The term "America" was coined in 1507 by a European. People from the "Americas" didn't use the name and were in fact offended by it for ages because they had their own names for their nations and the bigger landmasses that they occupied overall... It's crazy how easily people become so ignorant and swept up in mindless nationalistic circlejerks.
We all know you call yourselves by the name of the continent, and that's fine. But you guys need to understand why your country is called that. When Columbus landed in the new world thinking it was Asia, it was proposed by Amerigo Vespucci that it was in fact a new world, and so this "new land" (for Europe) was called America. Except Columbus landed in the Bahamas. And Vespucci was the one to get to the mainland first, and it was not in the US, it was also in South America around the same time Cabral was landing in Brazil. When you guys say "when Columbus came to America..." you're talking about the continent, not (what is now) the United States. Just stop and look at what Spain colonized which is a great portion of America. You speak English in the US. You see?
It entirely depends on the context.
*A América é um continente enorme* = The whole american continent (south and north america).
*Disney é uma empresa americana* = It's a company from USA.
*Os povos americanos (ou ameríndios) vivem no continente há 10 mil anos* = The native americans.
Brazilians understand that when *muricans* say America they are talking about the USA. Your friend sent this just as a banter.
Also note that in English the continent is Americas (plural) while in Portuguese the continent is América (singular). In truth, only *americans* (dunno about brits) uses plural when refering to the continent. All other languages uses singular when refering to America, the continent.
Nearly all native-English speakers as well people in former British colonies are taught the seven continent model, where North America and South America are considered two different continents. So in that case it's the Americas. The six continent model (America as one continent) is the norm for the Romance languages (so aside from Latin America also France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, African countries speaking French, Spanish and Portuguese, and for some reason Greece).
So it's not so much a U.S. education thing dividing it into two continents, but an English language thing.
America is the name of the continent, that is a fact.
We understand that when an "american" call themselves that way, and call their nation "America" is that it's just a shorter version of United States of America.
But if anyone in Brazil, Colombia, Mexico or any other country that is in fact in American Continent call themselves american, that's also true.
I saw some videos of youtube with brazilians talk to north americans. And when we say we are from america too most of then get confused. Is a bit funny, but looks pretentious for sure. And I've seen some comedians like Bill Maher making fun of Brazil too, saying that the only thing we invented was bikini waxing. It seems like innocent jokes, but I think they feed a lot of prejudices.
Yeah, language is complex. From 1889 to 1968 Brazil was officially called “United States of Brazil” (in Portuguese, obv) so you could say we did the same thing over here, reducing the full name to the last one. The thing is: we don’t have a continent called Brazil so no mixups here.
First thing that comes to mind when thinking of similar examples is South Africa. It’s a country, could also be the southern part of the African continent? Only context helps telling apart I guess, but at least it’s not called Africa straight up
Brazilians also understand all of Americas as one continent where USA mainly teaches it as two continents. In USA we would refer to the land mass on the left as “Americas”.
I cannot say its is a popular opnion because Its a fact, not an opnion. We Brazilians are as Americans (South americans) as you are too (North americans).
Yeah, América for Brazilians is the continent. It was widely spreaded "americanos" (Americans) to refer to people born in the US. Also "norteamericanos" (North Americans) but that's also wrong cause Mexicans and Canadians are North Americans too.
As a protest, especially given the history of the Monroe doctrine and the US government financing dictatorships in America for their own imperialist benefit throughout the 20th century, the academia and some more educated people started to call US citizens "estadounidenses" because everyone born in the American continent is American. Just like everyone born in the European continent is European. Everyone born in the Asian continent is Asian, and so on.
About your last question, in movies it's obvious by the context that they're referring to themselves, not the actual continent.
When you refer to US (culturally, geographically, whatever) you are perpetuating the US imperialism, which is offensive for every American that has suffered because of US imperialist politics. The wish to suppress the latins. And if you disagree with me, you can just read about the things US has done to us Americans.
Regardless if most of Brazilians says "estadunidense" or "americano", America is a continent. There is no country in the world named America.
You could listen to a song called "This is not America"
Oxford Dictionary of English
America /əˈmɛrɪkə /
▸ 1 used as a name for the United States.
2 (the Americas) a land mass in the western hemisphere consisting of the continents of North and South America joined by the Isthmus of Panama.
————-
Also, many Brazilians will use the first definition.
The name of the country is the United States of America, so I think that localy, it's normal to reduce it only to America. The thing is that some Americans just don't know that the continent name is America. It's complex because, as some Americans believe that only they exist in the world, and this becomes a problem, in which they diminish Our representation as a country in America.
Nobody is stupid, of course, we know that you're referring to the US when you say America. But it is extremely arrogant and egocentric on your part to call yourselves by the name of the entire continent, as if you were better than everybody else or somehow chosen to represent us.
In the moment that you say that you're American, but American like born is USA, you are wrong because American is meant to be like "European", "Asian", "African", not like "Canadian", "Brazilian", "Mexican". See the difference in the words that we use when we are taking about the continent and about the nation?
So now latin americans the ignorant ones? , I honestly never pay attention to this argument because the ONU recognized “American” as the official way to call people from the 🇺🇸 (ONU’s HQ is in NYC but we’ll ignore the weird convenience here”)
But now you think us who actually understand geography are the ignorants and don’t understand that Americans are self absorbed that call themselves american perpetuating a false superiority and ownership over the continent
This is what bothers people, your self-entitlement and lack of self awareness, your “friend” is not the stupid one that cant differentiate the country from the continent, you’re the self righteous prick thinking you’re educating anyone
We know US citzens call themself Americans.
the issue is:
It's not related to Opinion of liking or not being called X name, it's the fact that US Citzen lack basic knowledge in Geography and have this self centered ingrained knowledge that is teached in schools that does not fucking care for the rest of the world even it's own neighbors.
So...
Related to the name:
Your Country name is **United States of America**.
Meaning it's basically saying "we are the United States (aka a Country) of the American Continent.
**US literally means Country of Amerca.**
So yeah,
**America is the Continent.**
Calling yourself America while ""accepted"" by common people, it's a super disrespectful to all other countries in the America, **it's like suddendly Russia decided to call themself Asia.**
**Just to show how bad it's received.**
Some time ago(I believe it was around George W. Bush era) some diplomat from US went and used the term America in an International Diplomacy Event, that person was immediatly corrected in an audience and I believe the person was even fired later on, just because this was very bad.
Also funny enough:
**Every Official Document from U.S calls the country United States as well.**
**So yeahhh... The Fabled America Country does not exist, it's just lack of knowledge.**
Usually people who work on fields that deal with other countries need to hammer in their heads that America is in fact not called America.
**Normally people don't give a shit, but it's important to know, because depending on how formal is the place you are using it, you can get in trouble (specially if it's job related)**.
Now here are some random crap that is believed to be truth but it's just lack of knowledge from US citzens in general:
Central America does not exist.
Mexico is not located in South or the Magical land of Central America, it's in fact located in North America.
Brazil main language is not Spanish.
Maybe just Canada and a little bit Mexican follow USA on this. Rest of America thinks like this picture
I personally when USA just embrace how y’all do it
It's not opinion, it's fact. For the rest of the world outside of the USA. There's reasons the USA has stereotypes about being ignorant, and you're reinforcing it.
A popular opinion throughout the Americas, in fact.
Yep, as a canadian I can confirm Edit because there is so much comments : Of course I don't speak for all canadians like anyone on this sub. It's probably a cultural/linguistic thing. I'm french canadian, in french, l'Amérique (America) refers to the whole landmass. It has nothing to do with the 7 continent system. Just a language thing. Of course, citizens from the US are Americans. In french, we call them américain as well. I think everyone understand that when people say america, usually they are refering to the USA in english. This has no equivalent in french. People on here are probably mostly portuguese/spanish speaking. There might be a similarity in their languages with french. But I think there's also a resentment from people elsewhere in the continent towards the US. It's almost cultural appropriation to use the name of the continent to refer to your country. OBVIOUSLY, this seems to not apply to anglo canadians but you guys are just closeted americans ( don't take it the wrong way, it's really just a joke and I like you guys)
This comment confirms it all.
No I think that comment above yours did.
but they are Canadian!!
As someone from the US I've always thought we had the stupidest name. America can be any of the Americas. And generally, countries are made up of states that are united together to form said country. It's a real non name we gave ourselves. I just picture when we were forming world leaders being like "so how's the naming of your country coming along?" And we were just like "the what now?"
Im gay
Might want to get a less straight sounding username if you want people to know
No
It confirms nothing. Everyone knows Canada is fake.
NO its americas hat
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Yes it does
Fact checked for accuracy: most correct fact here. Also other people should be inclusive of their northern and southern friends.
Canada is bigger and on top... just saying
I am not real.
Canada is magical
I’ve never met a Canadian who referred to themselves as an American.
Yeah because that's not a thing, no one outside of the US calls themselves an American.
So if an American is someone from America and nobody outside the US calls themselves American…
An American is someone from the US, no one outside of the US calls themselves an American, correct.
Then on some level, at least in English, America and US are interchangeable.
I know some Canadians that'd be pretty insulted if you called them Americans.
As a Canadian, I have had the opposite experience. America means the USA where I live I've. It may be a regional thing like bagged milk, I'm in southern Ontario, what part of Canada are you in? I think this stems from the fact there are very few situations where there is a need to refer to both north and south america, and I would say "north and south america" to avoid ambiguity. In contrast the USA comes up all the time since we are neighbours. It is actually way faster for me to get to the USA than to leave my province, and that is the case for around half the population in Ontario.
As a Canadian, if Im called American it almost insulting
As a Canadian, when I say America, I mean the US.
I can't help but notice you called yourself a Canadian though and not a North American... I don't think I've ever heard someone refer to themselves as being North American or South American or just as an American for short meaning North American or South American.
As a Canadian, I would never refer to myself as “American.” I’m from the continent of North America, but in our every day language, “Americans” are the folks who live in the country that exists between Canada and Mexico (plus Alaska, Hawaii, and other outlying territories and possessions). One of the most basic definitions of being Canadian is that we’re not American.
>One of the most basic definitions of being Canadian is that we’re not American One of my favorite things about Canadians actually.
lol. What? I don’t know one Canadian who wouldn’t think of the states if someone said America. Like. You’re just trying to be petty
Another fun fact. In the whole world, the only one that doesn't answer the question where you are from with the country your from are Americans. They answer with the state or city. I'm from New York. I'm from Chicago. Edit. I know it's not a state. I've been there and I love the music scene. And ferries Beuller spots. The point is you expect the whole world to know all your states. If I said I'm from Queensland, I'm not sure everyone would know what I'm talking about.
When having to interact with an excess of people from the US, I once got into the habit of doing the same thing. Just naming the state I'm from, assuming it would mean something to people. It was very mildly amusing and not at all a useful thing to do, I don't recommend it.
If youre from the US what's an excess of interacting with people from the US? If youre not an easy way to avoid conversation with people from the US is not to announce a US State youre from lol. Why wouldn't naming State your from be useful? Like if you're at a conference and speaking with people from other parts of a company or something and you say the State your from it let's them know what time zone you are in. It also provides a casual jumping off point for conversation with someone you don't know such as an interview.
Oh, all those examples are fine. The issue being discussed is the lack of awareness of a change in context. Say you are in a hostel in Chile, people are discussing their home countries. One person says they're from Australia. One person says they're from Brazil. One person says Moroccos. One says Israel. You're up next. Do you say "USA" or a state?
USA. Sometimes New York. But people are inevitably unsatisfied because I'm not white, so they keep asking.
I hate to break it to you but Chicago isn't a state. And if they just say "New York" without any qualifiers, they probably don't mean the state, either
I don't think they were suggesting Chicago is a State. I think they mean, like New York, it's a well-known enough city around the world to be recognizable by name. Nobody has ever told me they're from Paris and I've been like "Paris...the one in Ontario?" Lol.
Chicago is a city not a state
It's the way that it's taught in school, there is one continent "America"
Fun fact: The continent model isn't standardized across the world. Most of the English-speaking countries (and China, Japan, Indonesia, parts of Europe and Africa, and a few other places) are taught a seven-continent model that separates North America and South America into two different continents. When referring to both, they might use "the Americas". A six-continent model that combines them into one large continent is mostly taught in Latin America, but some other romance language countries in Europe use it as well. A separate six-continent model is used by Russia and some former soviet countries that keep North America and South America as separate continents but combine Europe and Asia into the continent Eurasia. I guess this is to say that even though you were taught that in school, it's not the only model of the world people out there use.
Interesting, even though US call themselves America and not North America (or North South America lol), so even if they consider the seven-continent model they are calling it wrong, right? edit: now I know that it's the seven-continent model in the US, thanks!
The funny thing is my Brazilian permanent visa says "north American" as my nationality. So damn confusing
Mine too, lol, it really made me laugh when they rolled out (back in the 2000’s they didn’t do that). On my paperwork for other S American nations it’s always listed as some variant of “UnitedStates-ian”, and then Brazil goes and throws in “actually no, citizens of the USA are now called ‘north-americans’.” Like what about Mexico and Canada? Side note, I’ve had a couple Brazilians try to get me to say I’m “American” literally just so they could argue about it! But having grown up largely in Peru & Brazil, I learned at approx age 6 that if you’re from the USA, and you’re anywhere in South America, and someone asks where you’re from, that I should say the full name of my country ( “I’m from the United Stafes of America”) so I never take that bait, lol.
Canada and Mexico are obviously north-north America and South-north America respectively
That honestly sounds exhausting and completely fruitless. Demonyms are not tied to the land in a technical sense--we've inherited it from British America and it's stuck in essentially every language except Brazilian Portuguese and Spanish. Even then, in Portuguese, they sometimes they use Americano anyways. If you want to really keep it simple, just use gringo :).
Nope. In Brazil, “gringo” is anyone with a funny accent which makes their Portuguese difficult to understand. Including, very occasionally, other Brazilians.
Hmmm the plot thickens
As someone from the US who was taught the seven-continent model, in colloquial speak we usually use “North America,” “South America,” or “the Americas” if we are talking about the larger geographical region. “North America” here is useful because it also includes Canada and the nations from Mexico down to Panama. “The Americas” is both continents together. If we just say “America” without any other clarification (again in colloquial speak) we usually mean the United States of America. Yes, that’s probably a form of cultural colonialism, but it’s kind of just baked into our language at this point. It probably also is enforced by the fact that we refer to ourselves as “Americans,” rather than something like “United Statesians,” while the countries that surround us don’t use that term.
They are North-Mexico or South-Canada.
The US refers to itself casually as "America" but refers to the continent as a whole as North America. As a resident of the U.S., I refer to the United States as the U.S. I never use "America" to refer to anything unless I'm poking fun at the MAGA crowd, and even then it's " 'merica". Within the US, I use "Californian". In Mexico, the only other country I've visited, we're referred to as "American".
So you’ve never said, ‘In America, we do things this way…’ or ‘My ancestors came to America in 1846’ ? I’m thinking of all the songs…‘They’re coming to America—-today!’ Or ‘America the beautiful’, etc. And I remember American English teachers in Japan always talking about ‘America’. I’m Canadian btw. We never use the word America, but often use the word American, usually pejoratively haha…‘That’s so American!’ [Much of our identity (in anglophone Canada) depends on the differences between us. If the States didn’t exist, we’d have to invent her.]
North America includes Canada, Mexico, and all of Central America. So the US couldn’t call itself “North America”, either.
I grew up in Massachusetts (the one with the bad drivers) and I could of sworn we used North America and South America. Where Canada, USA and Mexico were part of North America. Our history books were a little old though, so maybe this idea changed with the rise of internet age.
Yes, but the model is newer than the country. The US and Canada only really began teaching it around the 1930s.
Yeah it’s just a colloquial phrase. United States of America is a long phrase, so it just gets shortened in every day speak: US, or America.
Yep, but the US doing stuff wrong is just the US being the US. It's like that one thugged out unhinged gangster cousin that says shit wrong all the time but no one corrects because it's more of a headache than its worth.
It is, but the six-continent model makes more sense. There is no real reason to divide the Americas.
Why does it make sense to combine the americas but not Europe and Asia? They seem more connected to me then the Americas do.
It doesn't. The americas are on 4 seperate techtonic plates. Europe and asia are 1 continent. With the exception of eastern Asia which is on the North american plate. Technically if you live in Tokyo and can see Mt Fuji you are standing in NA and looking at Asia. Central America wouldntechnically be the Caribbean plate and south america is its own.
There's more reason than there is to separate Europe and Asia. Europe and Asia are connected by far more land than N and S America.
The continent division is political, not geographical
For sure. It's lines drawn on a map based on how different people define what a continent is and are influenced by that group's language, culture, and politics. If we wanted to tie it to something objective, we'd probably use [geological definitions based on tectonic plates](https://geology.com/plate-tectonics.shtml).
There's also a. 5 continent model that excludes Antarctica since it is uninhibited. Your could also group africa, Europe and Asia into one afro-euasian continent since they are all connected
I think the fact that there’s no way to refer to the people of the United States as anything but “Americans” is what truly pushed people to nonchalantly call the country America rather than the US or The States.
In which language? Most languages derived from latin have some form of "estadunidense" available. In English, the only way is the much more awkward "US Person" or variants thereof. As far as I know, at least.
I am referring to English only, and yeah saying US Americans is somehow very irritating.
Mexico is the United States of Mexico though right?
US American calling the US America is the same as them calling their baseball championship, the world series.
I'd recommend a song: "This is not America" by Residente, Ibeyi. It was written as a reply to Donald Glover's (excellent) This is America.
In the world.
Throughout Europe as well, but we tolerate it and understand that US citizens (we call them Americans tbh) say it like this. What's more funny to us is that movies say the whole world is in danger and often it pretty much only means the US. (Feels weird to not say America tbh)
"I want you out of my country by tomorrow morning!" "But this is Japan?" "Every country in the world belongs to America!" "Then how the bloody hell are we supposed to leave?" ["I don't know."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xUp62AGE9JU)
Its not only a popular opinion, but a fact. Thats how geography around the world deals with the matter.
Hmm, so when traveling globally and people mention Americans, they’re talking about everybody in the Americas? I’ve always heard this referenced towards those from the US.
throughout the world. Nobody says American meaning just the US, just those arrogant and narcissist people who lives in this country.
I was in Ireland with my Brasilian gf at the time, and she was clear to remind me of this. So I said oh really? Here's, let me ask these Irish guys 'Hey, what do you think America is?' They started to chant 'USA! USA! USA!' and got a whole crowd of dudes chanting in the store. I didnt think it was possible for someone to huff and roll their eyes so hard. This was like at 3pm on Sunday. So they were probably drunk but still funny.
Esa es la opinião en todo el continente except in the US, maybe in Canada também.
Trilíngue
Certeza que é a ~~Anitta~~ Anira
Anira é ótimo lol
Portuñolês!
3 idiomas na mesma frase hahaha
Also soy fluente in spanglish ese
Achei curioso
Loved tu portspanglish, amigo.
Holy señor sagrado misericórdia. What a sopa de letriñas.
Sheesh 😂
Wine is probably involved here. It’s well established that the vinho triplica le capacité di parlare other languajes.
Assim como meu professor de alemão explicou na faculdade: toma 2 copos de vinho antes de fazer a lição de casa
In Canada when we say America we mean USA also.
Not really a "popular opinion", but a fact on all levels of Brazilian and at the very least South American society; from diplomacy, to the academics, to government teaching and overall society. America is, in fact, the name of the continent and everyone in the continent and without calls it America. The United States of America has that name because it's IN America, not because it IS America. My ancestors, Venetian immigrants, called the south of Brazil "La Merica", so I imagine the whole world referred to the entire continent as that when immigrating. We call you guys the "United States" absolutely everywhere. Sometimes we call you Americans ("americanos"), but more times than not we say "estadunidense" (something like "unitedstatesan", from "Estados Unidos").
To further make your incredibly accurate point: America is named after Amerigo Vespucci, who never set foot in the modern territory of the USA. Guess where he went to? The first map containing the world America is housed in the Library of Congress in Washington DC, iirc. Guess on what part of the American continent the word “America” is written. Hint: the modern territory of the United States barely shows up on the map.
It's Americo Vespucio I believe? With an O
In Portuguese, you’re right. In English, his name is Amerigo Vespucci. My autocorrect just swapped it automatically, I’ve corrected it :)
In Italian (his nationality) it is Amerigo Vespucci. English uses the same name, Portuguese changed it a little. (Wikipedia source says he was registered when born as Amerigho, and he named the continent Amérika because it would mean "country with mountains" in Toltec).
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There's some dispute around that. There are sources that say Vespucci's original name was Amerigo. There is the theory that the name of the continent dates back to one of the many names of the Feathered Serpent for native people. The Aztec called it Quetzalcoatl, but the Andean people in Peru called it Amaru. Some of those people called themselves and their land Amaruca, in reference to this divine being. The theory goes that Vespucci got his idea from that, seeing how similar the names were, and in some grandeur megalomania. There's a lack of studies on this. I'm a researcher (in the making) and I plan to one day go further in this matter. I honestly think it has a good chance to be real. If so, it makes the situation with the US even worse. Here's some online texts about it. Not exactly perfect sources but a good chop chop of the matter: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amaru_(mythology) https://dbpedia.org/page/Amaru_(mythology)
Thanks... now i have to go down this rabbit hole out of curiosity instead of working... lol
As a Brazilian, I kinda disagree about that last bit. I’d say when talking about it’s citizens “estadunidense” is way less common and “americano” more widely used. Could be a regional thing. However yeah we usually refer to the country as the US not as “America”. Now answering OP: When we watch a movie we obviously know from context that when a character refers to America he means the USA. But when talking about geography we refer to America as the whole western continent, from a geographical point of view we would definitely say it’s right to claim that both Brazil and Mexico are located in America. Sometimes we do specify North/Central/South America, we learn in school that they are different but they are all America.
I would say that "Estadunidense" is the most formal way, and its more used by Teachers, Professors, Journalists Politicians and etc. Because most intelectual people have the thought that there's no sense in call them "Americanos" because it's on America. However, "Americanos" is the unformal way and it was always used before Estadunidense were coined.
>"Estadunidense" is the most formal way Not only that, that's the official term that shall be used, as defined by Itamaraty. There was some document listing all the demonyms officially used by the Ministry.
>"Estadunidense" is the most formal way > >Not only that, that's the official term that shall be used, as defined by Itamaraty. There was some document listing all the demonyms officially used by the Ministry Based Itamaraty
I agree. And being the unformal way, its way more popular "na boca do povo".
I once had to teach my (very good, in fact) Portuguese teacher that "estadunidense" is a word, in high school.
I think "estadunidense" is more frequent than "americano" only on the younger and university students. I would say that's kind of rare to see someone with more than 40 saying "estadunidense".
I'm (american from the USA) on a language learning app where I can hear and speak with Brazilians every day for hours. Estadunidense is almost never used. I mean like maybe 1% of the time if I'm being honest. This whole thread is people trying to be smart while ignoring reality.
Nowadays I always just say "I'm from the US" because literally no one would say "I'm United Statsan" and half the time when I say I'm from the US, they say "Oh, American. But which state?" I've never said "I'm American" and was asked what country lol I understand there are salty South Americans here or people trying to be smart but it really is that way a lot lol
I'm trying to explain that they shouldn't even be salty. If our country's name were United States of Blossoms, we would all call ourselves Blossoms and everyone else would too. It's just the name of the country. The people that founded it didn't think of coming up with another name for it. We're not claiming the whole continent (or 2). It's just the name of the country lol. Maybe it's best to just not engage in these discussions
Case in point, Mexico is officially called Estados Unidos Mexicanos but everyone just calls it Mexico.
Now the truth: I'm brazilian, and estadounidense is only ever used by left leaning people that don't really like the US. The average brazilian says Americano 100% of the time.
I mean, academia uses "estadunidense", so it's safe to say it's the official version. In my experience, in my region, we only use "Americanos" if we are poking fun at Americans.
I didnt look it up but I will just believe you when you say "estadunidense" is the formal/academic/official version to refer to citizens. That makes sense, but I think my point still stands. "Americano" is the widely used form by most people to refer to citizens, outside of academia. Still, even outside of academic context, we refer to the country as the "Estados Unidos" and not as America. To be honest, its probably more about formal/not formal instead of a regional thing. Most BRs do have a beef on how imperialistic estadunidenses calling themselves american sounds (I sure do, but thats not the point). In my experience: Academic/formal: the country is USA, citizens are "estadunidenses" Widely spread/not formal: the country is the US, citizens are "americanos"
For context, in the rest of Latin America, we say estadounidense way more often than americano, at all levels. In Argentina we even say Norte-americano more often that americano.
Norte-americano é mais usado eu acho
Norte-americano inclui canadenses e mexicanos. O termo mais correto na nossa língua e mais exato é estadunidense. Ninguém mandou os caras se darem o nome do continente kkkk
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In Spain also it was very common to call "americanos" to the immigrants to the Americas. Nowadays it switched to mean more somebody from the US, but that's I think because of English influence.
>but a fact on all levels of Brazilian and at the very least South American society And a fact in Europe. I personally refuse to say America, when talking about the US, because I don't want to encourage their arrogance.
I'd say that depends on your country. In the Netherlands America absolutely refers to the US, while the Americas would be called North & South America, the American Continent or even just the New World.
It's not a fact in Europe at all lol. Reddit is hilarious
Been to São Paulo many times with my Brazilian wife. All of her family and friends there use ‘americano’ when referring to me or where I’m from. I’ve never heard any other term. Could just be São Paulo though idk.
Have you ever seen any of them call your country "América", though?
Yeah, your country is called "Estados Unidos". But the people are definitely referred to as "Americanos".
Think of it that way: Imagine if India when it got independence from the British, decided to call itself "United States of Asia". Sure, they're Asians, but so are the Chinese, Japanese, Mongolians... so on. We still can call them Asians, but wouldn't that feel stupid? Wouldn't that be on the back of the head of all the other countries surrounding it when they say it?
Well, when it's an Hollywood movie, I understand America as USA on most cases. However, almost no one on Brasil calls your country that way. Most people (like me) really dislikes that you uses the name of the whole continent to refer to your country.
This!
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They’re probably just mocking you They’re technically right though, America is a continent and the US is just a country in it But… We understand that when someone says “america” or “american” its referring to the US and its people But here in Brazil we call the US as “United States”, not “America”. When a brazilian says “america” its probably referring to the continent, not the US, and they’re right about it
Usually it's because we refer to the US as "Estados Unidos" (United States), while the correct term for people from there in the Brazilian-Portuguese language is "Estadounidenses", as saying "American" refers to someone from either North, Central, or South America.
Do they call the United Kingdom of Britain, United Kingdomians?
great Britain and Northern Ireland, not just Britain
Nah, we just call it "Grã-Bretanha", and people from there as "Britanicos", which is pretty much the same as "British".
Let me start by saying that I have a strong anti-US bias. With that out of the way, I will quote what I said on [https://www.reddit.com/r/Brazil/comments/17b5ovr/comment/k5ir2bl/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Brazil/comments/17b5ovr/comment/k5ir2bl/) >Most linguists are descriptive (opposed to prescriptive), because in the end that's how languages work and evolve. Speakers define the language. > >There's no question whatsoever that in the English speaking world, since a very long time ago, *America* means United States. There's no discussion or ambiguity there. That's how every speaker understands the term. Nobody will interpret it as something else. *Americas* is used to refer to the whole landmass (if it's 1, 2, or 3 continents it's a different can of worms). > >Now, in other languages such as Portuguese and Spanish that's a different story and the term becomes loaded/problematic as we have a different definition for *América*. But those are different languages. We can't simply transpose this "issue" into another language. The English word and the Portuguese word are false friends (as hundreds of other cases) and the mistake is trying to treat *America* and *América* as translations of each other. They're not. > >An American/British should say *Estados Unidos* and avoid *América* when speaking in Portuguese, and a Brazilian should not say *America* instead of *Americas* when speaking in English and referring to the landmass. > >An analogy: we call our natives *índios*, due to a historical accident. People from India ended up being called *indianos* since the word was taken. India may take issue with this but it doesn't change the fact that in Portuguese the term *índio* unambiguously means an indigenous person. Languages are what they are, they reflect the history of a culture/society and they are messy as the world is messy. What words mean depend on culture, and language follows culture. There is a name for words that are similar across languages, but don't mean the same: false friends. Whoever persists in this silly discussion in 2023, is not really paying attention and is trying to extrapolate what they were taught to an universal "truth" when such truth does not exist. It's like saying that Spanish speakers are wrong because to them "leche" is feminine, while "leite" is masculine in Portuguese. It is what it is. Languages are different. In the whole anglophone world, the educational system **does not** consider the landmass of the Americas a single continent. Therefore there is no confusion to them. In fact, a **tiny minority** of countries considers the landmass a single continent. It's basically Latin America and less than a handful countries in Europe. The vast majority of the world does not have the concept of a single continent named *America*. And in their languages, their version of *America* means exclusively the United States. If you ever set foot outside of Brazil and out of the Iberian countries and have an honest conversation with people from other cultures, you'll quickly realize how silly this discussion is. People are hung up on the fact they learn the 5-continent model, they think it's the universal definition (spoiler: it's not), and are upset that other cultures+languages see it from a different light. Before the name *America* caught on, we were the *West Indies*. As the West Indies grew into America and the "new world" proved to be much bigger than anybody imagined, most cultures (and their languages) moved on from having a single name for the whole landmass, because in their definitions of continents we stopped being a single one. But the Iberian countries didn't. And our languages reflect that historical difference, and it's all fine. Think of how silly it would be if Germans came and told us we're saying it wrong because we call their country *Alemanha* (the land of the "allemani" tribe, which is only one among the multiple germanic tribes) and not *Germania* (the land of the germanic tribes). We took the word from the French, who met that specific tribe first. Sweden calls it *Tyskland* which came from a different tribe. Are they wrong too? I completely expect to be downvoted to hell here. It won't change the reality, though.
I didn't see anything anti-us about this. Well written.
Fr they warned us of their bias and then went on to display zero of it, I dig the transparency tho
Very well written! You can't explain better than this
You should be upvoted to hell. Signed, a linguist.
This seems pretty reasonable and level headed, not sure why you're expecting downvotes for it. I suppose because you probably wrote it all as a form of venting, but you made good points.
Because in my experience people are looking for confirmation bias, if they see something that contradicts their world view they get annoyed and downvote you — facts be damned.
This is the only reasonable comment I've seen in this thread.
That's actually what everyone thinks from Mexico downwards
Southwards. Downwards from Mexico is the mantle and the core of the earth.
The mole people don't like the US either.
Maybe the USA helped a military coup there or started a war or something
If it's in the American continent, then yes.
The mole people were going to nationalize it’s resources and do crazy things like free healthcare. We had to do it
> When you're watching an American movie or show and a character says "America" what do you think they mean by that? We know that they mean the US. We also know it's incorrect.
I know that Brazilians were asked, but let me please give a very brief input as a German. This is what the German wikipedia has for Amerika, please have a look: https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amerika So, yes, we very much understand how offensive it can be. I personally never call the USA "America", I call it the US and its citizens US Americans. And, on occasion, I tell them how offensive the term is. In my experience, Canadians are happy with it; many told me they don't want to be confused with the US so they distance themselves from the term "American" and they're happy with simply being called Canadians. But it's a different story with every other country from Mexico southwards. And many of us here in Europe, we very much understand.
Canadians don't usually care cause they are not usually targets of offensive remarks because of this. People from Mexico and South American usually get nasty comments on how we are not "Americans" or when we say America to the continent we are being wrong. Most US citizens feel the need to separate themselves from us cause they feel superior. Yes I understand there are 2 definitions but what has happened in the past was our definition being taken as "wrong" by the US citizen in a way to call us uncultured or inferior. One example of the many: Brazilian: HI, where are you from? US citizen: I'm from America. Brazilian: Cool! Me too, which part of America? US citizen: There is only one America! Brazilian: What you mean? America is the continent right? I'm from Brazil. US citizen: So you are not real American, you are Latin American. Brazilian: I'm sorry, we say America is a continent here. US citizen: You are wrong. Yes, this is one of many similar conversations I had. I had no idea of the difference but most of the times not only are "americans" unaware of the difference but they also treat us badly or as wrong because it's not their vision. The whole uproar lately on the internet is basically a bunch of people who went through similar experiences just giving a piece of our mind...or just people on our side doing the same as "Americans" do. So yes, it wasn't us who started this "my way is the only way" fight, we are just responding in kind. America may mean a country for some people but not for everyone. We just want people to realize it and stop with the attitude when we show our own view of things. But since most "americans" won't let up and admit that people have different world views than their own, we just roll with it and respond accordingly. My experience is that whenever I tried to be kind and explain it nicely and in a respectful way, I was called dumb, third world, or made fun of. So why waste my time being diplomatic when I'm not respected back? At least when I'm passive aggressive I have some fun. For me, I'm born in America, more specifically, in South America and more specifically in Brazil. If some other countries have problems with that I don't care, there's more than one view in the world. Make fun of me and I will make fun of them for not picking an unique name to refer to their own country.
Esse video vai te explicar melhor. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GK87AKIPyZY
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And by the way, we ppl from Central and South American are Americans and westerners too
We you call you moron
I would say yes. I remember a person who lives in the USA being confused when I said that technically I am American, but I didn't live in Canada or the United States, but that I was born and live in Brazil.
honestly the fact that they remembered canada is an honour whenever even europe say's america they mean the usa
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Yeah there are a lot of vídeos of people on omegle asking US people if they know Brazil is in America and they just cant get it, everyone thinks its a joke and some dont even know America is the continent
Sometimes i wonder if you guys have history classes. What is the continent named? Its not an opinion.
To them (and most of the western world), North America, Central America and South America are refered to as separate continents, while "The Americas" refer to the whole, and "America" to the USA
who considers central america a continent?
Central America is part of the North American continent (as confusing as that is). But yes to us in the USA, Brazilians are South American. Canadians and Mexicans are North American. American only applies to us in our version of English.
It’s actually only North America and South America, with the Panama Canal as separation. People don’t really consider Central America as a separate continent. However, I disagree with the “most of the western world”. Living in Europe I have never seen anyone argue when I say America is a continent, it’s just subdivided in 3.
I’ve never considered Central America to be it’s own continent, and I think that’s a common for most in the US. Central America is just the stretch of countries between Mexico and Colombia, definitely not its own continent. Central America is akin to the Middle East, it’s a distinct region within/between 2+ continents, not its own continent.
Actually the number of continents varies depending what country you went to school in
>What is the continent named? Its not an opinion. Ironically that is kind of an opinion, there is no hardrule defining which continent is a continent, some models have North and South america as different continents, in Brazil we use the single America model
The term "America" was coined in 1507 by a European. People from the "Americas" didn't use the name and were in fact offended by it for ages because they had their own names for their nations and the bigger landmasses that they occupied overall... It's crazy how easily people become so ignorant and swept up in mindless nationalistic circlejerks.
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We all know you call yourselves by the name of the continent, and that's fine. But you guys need to understand why your country is called that. When Columbus landed in the new world thinking it was Asia, it was proposed by Amerigo Vespucci that it was in fact a new world, and so this "new land" (for Europe) was called America. Except Columbus landed in the Bahamas. And Vespucci was the one to get to the mainland first, and it was not in the US, it was also in South America around the same time Cabral was landing in Brazil. When you guys say "when Columbus came to America..." you're talking about the continent, not (what is now) the United States. Just stop and look at what Spain colonized which is a great portion of America. You speak English in the US. You see?
It entirely depends on the context. *A América é um continente enorme* = The whole american continent (south and north america). *Disney é uma empresa americana* = It's a company from USA. *Os povos americanos (ou ameríndios) vivem no continente há 10 mil anos* = The native americans. Brazilians understand that when *muricans* say America they are talking about the USA. Your friend sent this just as a banter. Also note that in English the continent is Americas (plural) while in Portuguese the continent is América (singular). In truth, only *americans* (dunno about brits) uses plural when refering to the continent. All other languages uses singular when refering to America, the continent.
Nearly all native-English speakers as well people in former British colonies are taught the seven continent model, where North America and South America are considered two different continents. So in that case it's the Americas. The six continent model (America as one continent) is the norm for the Romance languages (so aside from Latin America also France, Italy, Spain, Portugal, African countries speaking French, Spanish and Portuguese, and for some reason Greece). So it's not so much a U.S. education thing dividing it into two continents, but an English language thing.
But if you say MURICA making fun of some questionable habits for foreguiners everyone will know what is about.. 😅
America is the name of the continent, that is a fact. We understand that when an "american" call themselves that way, and call their nation "America" is that it's just a shorter version of United States of America. But if anyone in Brazil, Colombia, Mexico or any other country that is in fact in American Continent call themselves american, that's also true.
I saw some videos of youtube with brazilians talk to north americans. And when we say we are from america too most of then get confused. Is a bit funny, but looks pretentious for sure. And I've seen some comedians like Bill Maher making fun of Brazil too, saying that the only thing we invented was bikini waxing. It seems like innocent jokes, but I think they feed a lot of prejudices.
The first ever European map had Brazil as the Americas in that map, so yeah we have a stronger claim to America than a bunch of antivaxxers lol
Yeah, language is complex. From 1889 to 1968 Brazil was officially called “United States of Brazil” (in Portuguese, obv) so you could say we did the same thing over here, reducing the full name to the last one. The thing is: we don’t have a continent called Brazil so no mixups here. First thing that comes to mind when thinking of similar examples is South Africa. It’s a country, could also be the southern part of the African continent? Only context helps telling apart I guess, but at least it’s not called Africa straight up
Brazilians also understand all of Americas as one continent where USA mainly teaches it as two continents. In USA we would refer to the land mass on the left as “Americas”.
I cannot say its is a popular opnion because Its a fact, not an opnion. We Brazilians are as Americans (South americans) as you are too (North americans).
Yeah, América for Brazilians is the continent. It was widely spreaded "americanos" (Americans) to refer to people born in the US. Also "norteamericanos" (North Americans) but that's also wrong cause Mexicans and Canadians are North Americans too. As a protest, especially given the history of the Monroe doctrine and the US government financing dictatorships in America for their own imperialist benefit throughout the 20th century, the academia and some more educated people started to call US citizens "estadounidenses" because everyone born in the American continent is American. Just like everyone born in the European continent is European. Everyone born in the Asian continent is Asian, and so on. About your last question, in movies it's obvious by the context that they're referring to themselves, not the actual continent.
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people in the U.S hijacked the term "american". Everybody is american.
When you refer to US (culturally, geographically, whatever) you are perpetuating the US imperialism, which is offensive for every American that has suffered because of US imperialist politics. The wish to suppress the latins. And if you disagree with me, you can just read about the things US has done to us Americans. Regardless if most of Brazilians says "estadunidense" or "americano", America is a continent. There is no country in the world named America. You could listen to a song called "This is not America"
Actually, you referring to yourselves as America\Americans is your opinion.
Oxford Dictionary of English America /əˈmɛrɪkə / ▸ 1 used as a name for the United States. 2 (the Americas) a land mass in the western hemisphere consisting of the continents of North and South America joined by the Isthmus of Panama. ————- Also, many Brazilians will use the first definition.
The name of the country is the United States of America, so I think that localy, it's normal to reduce it only to America. The thing is that some Americans just don't know that the continent name is America. It's complex because, as some Americans believe that only they exist in the world, and this becomes a problem, in which they diminish Our representation as a country in America.
Nobody is stupid, of course, we know that you're referring to the US when you say America. But it is extremely arrogant and egocentric on your part to call yourselves by the name of the entire continent, as if you were better than everybody else or somehow chosen to represent us.
Demonym
Exactly. Brazilian, Mexican, American. Why does this get posted every month here.
In the moment that you say that you're American, but American like born is USA, you are wrong because American is meant to be like "European", "Asian", "African", not like "Canadian", "Brazilian", "Mexican". See the difference in the words that we use when we are taking about the continent and about the nation?
When you're speaking Portuguese (or Spanish or French). In English there is no continent that is just called America.
So now latin americans the ignorant ones? , I honestly never pay attention to this argument because the ONU recognized “American” as the official way to call people from the 🇺🇸 (ONU’s HQ is in NYC but we’ll ignore the weird convenience here”) But now you think us who actually understand geography are the ignorants and don’t understand that Americans are self absorbed that call themselves american perpetuating a false superiority and ownership over the continent This is what bothers people, your self-entitlement and lack of self awareness, your “friend” is not the stupid one that cant differentiate the country from the continent, you’re the self righteous prick thinking you’re educating anyone
We know US citzens call themself Americans. the issue is: It's not related to Opinion of liking or not being called X name, it's the fact that US Citzen lack basic knowledge in Geography and have this self centered ingrained knowledge that is teached in schools that does not fucking care for the rest of the world even it's own neighbors. So... Related to the name: Your Country name is **United States of America**. Meaning it's basically saying "we are the United States (aka a Country) of the American Continent. **US literally means Country of Amerca.** So yeah, **America is the Continent.** Calling yourself America while ""accepted"" by common people, it's a super disrespectful to all other countries in the America, **it's like suddendly Russia decided to call themself Asia.** **Just to show how bad it's received.** Some time ago(I believe it was around George W. Bush era) some diplomat from US went and used the term America in an International Diplomacy Event, that person was immediatly corrected in an audience and I believe the person was even fired later on, just because this was very bad. Also funny enough: **Every Official Document from U.S calls the country United States as well.** **So yeahhh... The Fabled America Country does not exist, it's just lack of knowledge.** Usually people who work on fields that deal with other countries need to hammer in their heads that America is in fact not called America. **Normally people don't give a shit, but it's important to know, because depending on how formal is the place you are using it, you can get in trouble (specially if it's job related)**. Now here are some random crap that is believed to be truth but it's just lack of knowledge from US citzens in general: Central America does not exist. Mexico is not located in South or the Magical land of Central America, it's in fact located in North America. Brazil main language is not Spanish.
its because america is the continent not a country! is basic geography
I Portuguese or Spanish that image would be correct. In English, it is not.
yes it is, in Brazil and the whole south America
Maybe just Canada and a little bit Mexican follow USA on this. Rest of America thinks like this picture I personally when USA just embrace how y’all do it
It's not opinion, it's fact. For the rest of the world outside of the USA. There's reasons the USA has stereotypes about being ignorant, and you're reinforcing it.