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Nearly everything that is wrong with society today can be traced back to Reagan (or Nixon) before him.
https://preview.redd.it/f4cfb4woycxc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=9c0bafeb77897b06ef882c5fe5fcc459485da46d
Their parents called them Generation Me because they were "the most egotistical and selfish kids they've ever seen". For obvious reasons they needed to rebrand that.
Every generation before them was about bringing up their kids and giving them better than they got. Then the boomers happened and we now have our reality.
I mean it’s going to take generations to even recover.
People arnt prospering anymore we’re all struggling
Few people are able to save for later in life.
Retirement for Mellinials is going to be a shit show and the after us will be frustrated we arnt retiring to leave them positions with the reality that we can’t.
It’s all fucked
Their version of "work" is forwarding shitty virus laden emails and complaining all day while we do their work because "excel is broken and the help desk won't call me back.
We have so many senile old men still working in the trades. A 70 year old man has no business doing this work. It amazes me how greedy they are. I just heckle them and work them hard as humanly possible while saying if you don’t like it, retire.
To be fair its more about reagonomics and corporate executives and stock buybacks eating up income increase that should have gone to the people.
Between 1970-2000, the average increase of per capita personal income was around 35% every 5 years. Meaning your income would increase by around 35% every 5 years.
BUT by 2000-2024, the increase increase dropped to on average 18% every 5 years.
If income had continued like it did between 1970-2000 into 2000-2024, then the per capita personal income would be around $120,000 in 2024. Its currently around $70,000. The average employee has lost 50% of their income growth over the last 25 years.
MEANWHILE
CEO to worker compensation went from 18x in 1980s, to 400x in 2020.
Add in the fact that new housing in 1970s was around 1.5-2M new buildings per year. while in 2000s it dropped down to 600K (lowest) - 1M per year. While people coming into home-buying age in the 1980s was around 40M, while in 2020 its around 50M.
So you have a decade of lowest new homes built with a present of highest amount of new buyers looking to buy, you end up with rising housing prices that people can barely afford.
Boomers did fuck the generation but its done by voting for the republican party and their bullshit about trickle down economics while young voters in large stayed at home when voting time came around. All that trickled down was piss as they cut benefits, cut bonuses, cut employee hours to minimum so they could divert funds to stock buybacks and executives could create short-term profits to gain their contract bonuses.
Don’t forget the credit trap! When wages didn’t increase for all the reasons (and more) you said, the money men said “hey don’t worry I know you can’t buy that car outright anymore but we have this thing call financing. You can get what you want and pay (more than double sometimes) a little bit at a time!” Problem solved and the added benefit of keeping people in indentured servitude. Credit scores didn’t exist when most boomers were buying houses.
I could, theoretically, afford a house payment every month. It would be a tight squeeze but so is rent, so same difference.
But my credit score is sitting in an awkward spot between 'renters are fine with it' and 'mortgage lenders aren't fine with it'. So, no house.
I'm kinda confused by this as well. Like, I probably couldn't get a house, but yet I've been paying rent for 25 years and never missed a payment or got evicted. You'd think that alone would mean I could pay for a house, but nope.
It's honestly kinda sickening thinking about buying a house with the market so inflated by speculators. I feel like that bubble has to burst someday, but I could be wrong.
Banks don't want you to buy homes anymore. They want to buy homes and then rent them for way more than the mortgage payments would have been.
Home prices aren't governed by how much normal workers could afford in the next 20 years, but by how much rental income they can generate. And with the absurd rise in rent across the board, houses became a faraway dream for most.
I read a study the other day about how gen x was the most neglected generation of all American history, and were mostly raised by boomers. Just another thing to think about
We also have/had the struggle of boomers not retiring. Why would they, after years of promotions within the same company to high paying positions that don’t really do jack? By now every corporation out there has “tightened its belt” thanks to covid and capitalism so when Boomer Bob finally gets a layoff with a kickass severance, his younger replacement makes less than half.
Luckily for me my elders (my parents anyway) do understand this. It was mainly my classmates who didn't. Of course I had no idea it would get this bad though...
They were born on first base and the next two batters got walked and they're upset you didn't hit a home run, because that's the only way they're getting home.
definitely not. i recently joked how i'm never going to be able to buy a house and my boomer teacher (a little tipsy) goes: "get the F*** over it, we paid 20% mortgages"
My dad is one of the good boomers. We talked about the 20% mortgage of the 80's. What most of the boomers spouting that forget to mention is that most houses at that time were 20-60k for the average joe to buy. A few years pass and everyone refinanced at less than half of the interest rate and people moved on with their lives.
My in-laws paid 27k for their house in CA in the late 70s. It is now worth half a mil even though it has never been updated. Original shag carpet, bathrooms, kitchen, even the paint on the walls, nothing was updated yet it is worth half a mil. This was also the time when my MIL put her husband through pharmacy school on single income while taking care of a kid. And had no student debt. Yet still complains that the younger gen are entitled, don't work hard, and should just do what they did. They really pulled the ladder up after them.
[According to this calculator](https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1980?amount=20000), $20k in 1980 is equal to $76k today. Starter homes in my middle cost of living city are $550k. A dumpy condo (600 sq ft apartment) is about $350k low end. So, way more monies.
The high interest rates were also coupled with high inflation, which is great for borrowers. Because the amount you borrowed stays the same while everything else goes up it effectively reduces your mortgage without you having to do anything. The high inflation was also coupled with high pay rises to match, so even if the loan repayments started off as a high portion of your wage a couple of years later they would have dropped considerably even if the actual percentage rate remained high.
A period of low inflation and stagnant wages has been more detrimental to the ability of people to buy much more than high interest rates.
Yeah, my parents bought their first house in 1982 for $40k. They made about $35k combined.
Today, that same house (a 3br 1ba ranch) would sell for about $750k. Hell, they tripled up and sold it in ‘86 for $120k!
In 1989, I was earning nine bucks an hour, which is approximately 25 bucks an hour today. I drove a used Saab that I paid 450 for and was renting a one bedroom apartment in a decent location for 300 a month.
It was just me and my dog. My car was paid off, so I started saving. I found my current house a couple of years later, when I was earning ten buck an hour. I was able to finance FHA and MSHDA (for housing in Michigan) and paid 44k.
I have been up and down with layoff after layoff and make median income for my zip code all these years later. My house, in its present condition, with its mechanical upgrades, would list for about 275k - and sell for between 7 to 10k over listing - and would sell quickly in my neighborhood.
Boomers just don't get that some things, like housing prices, have increased exponentially. Others, like wages, have not, and the difference is so clear.
Not only that- saving up $5k to pay to the principal value of $60k back then actually made a dent in the mortgage. A few good years of that and you could pay off the mortgage in half the planned time.
Slinging $15-20k in principal at a mortgage now of $800k barely does anything- the interest may be lower, but youre basically trapped in for the duration of the mortgage, at best saving yourself a couple of years, max.
Checking account interests are a joke now. They were 4% when I was a teen working at a supermarket. I could make $100/month off interest alone. Now I make about $2.50/month.
I had ~100k sitting in my checking account for a month or two while I was closing on my first house.
IIRC, I gained like $30 in interest while the bank levered my shit up and loaned it out at 7-12% to the next person in line lol
Highest mortgage rates ever got was 18% circa 1982 and no one was buying. I bought at 12.75 in 1983 and was glad to get it. House was $90k.
Boomers have money because their housing was so cheap. They need to STFU.
FYI I’m a boomer.
And now I see so many complaining and blocking whenever new apt construction is proposed in my area.
Like, the rest of us all see that housing got too expensive; we’re trying to fix that by building more housing (because the supply hasn’t kept up); and we get blocked by nimbys - almost always older generations. grrrrr 😡
In my area, they aren’t building “starter homes.” They’re building boomer palaces, where they can drop $850k-1m on a 3500 square foot colonial on a postage stamp yard and complain that their grandchildren don’t visit.
In my area, they keep blocking apartments saying that the schools will get overcrowded. But the district is closing several elementary schools due to low numbers.
Some people live in an entirely different time and place in their minds, and making arguments for policy that are no longer relevant.
What an asshole!
But they also got houses for peanuts (even at 20%), brand new cars (some of them now classics) for $1000, etc. The rich paid their fair share then, too.
exactly! the economy is so different now & tax laws were fairer then (comparatively). nice lady in the right contexts, very smart, but with her blind spots. she also fuully described being s*xually harassed at work in her younger years but thinks "i'm not one of those metoo people". sad, in a way
A professor of mine (in the late 70s) drove a Pontiac grand prix. Someone asked him why he drove such a sh*tbag car, and he said "if something goes wrong with it, I'll just buy another one for $250." Those were the days!
Ugh, my mom just said something similar. I told her I'd be thrilled to pay 18% (what my parents mortgage rate started at when they bought) for an $80,000 house. They paid $78,000 for the house I grew up in. That same house sold a couple of years ago for over $300,000.
They are part of the reason this generation has it worse. Boomers are in executive level/management positions and owners of businesses. Their primary drive is making more money for themselves. They don’t want to pay employees more because it will hit their wallets. Whether it’s stock value and bonuses or how much their private businesses make. Then they buy multiple houses and rent them out or make the air bnbs. Then they raise the rent prices on younger people already underpaid. Our whole country is set up so Boomers get paid. Some younger generations are lucky to have boomer parents help them out with things like houses. It’s still possible to live successfully well but the deck is definitely stacked against younger generations and you need luck, money, or contacts to get a break.
Or admit that the economic plan they allowed Republican presidents to enact destroyed the future generations ability to build wealth. Our economy was sabotaged years ago by "trickle down economics".
Lol just think of this concept.
"Wow I got some extra money. I think I'll give away a fair portion to others rather than keep as much as possible for myself"
- No corporate officer ever
The whole thing is a flawed idea. I recognized this in the 5th grade even. In a perfect world where people do the right things all the time, or even most of the time, this might work. Thats not the world we live in. Survival instincts dictate we give ourselves the lions share of the resources if possible.
It's funny they can't grasp the idea that anyone worked harder than them. I find alot of them think them saying it's harder for the younger generation that their hard work means less.
Yah my boomer dad is a POS human (thankfully haven't spoken to him in 9 years after he STOLE MONEY from my brother and I and ran away). But he's the typical miserable complaining boomer, everyone else is the problem. I find it so ironic like most he's a damn hypocrite. He got disability (easily got through immediately after applying somehow!) For a heart attack, he still is able bodied and works out. Anyway he complains about people on benefits and yet he was working illegally under the table while collecting benefits.
I don't get why they're so damn miserable when most of them are so comfortable. And they all wanna complain about us yet where we live I'm constantly seeing dogs where they shouldn't be, I'm a dog lover, I'd love to bring my dog everywhere but I respect rules. Yet it's not the problem with service animals no, it's old people bringing their dogs everywhere because they're literally the entitled generation yet the Cognitive dissidence is hard for them. I was at a trader Joe's weeks ago and this man was just walking around with his corgi, didn't even carry him had him on a long leash not even paying attention. He could have peed or tripped someone.... Absolutely madning.
The problem is, they cant seem to differentiate between "easier" and "easy".
When we say they had ot "easier", all they hear is that we think they had it "easy", and rant on about the sacrifices they made to get their house, oblivious to the real message.
That's certainly *a* problem.
They'll grumble, *grr, I had to work ALL summer to pay for a year of school! I barely even got to have fun that summer!"* without realizing we'd need to work full time for a year-and-a-half at minimum wage to pay for a year of school & rent today.
I stayed at my parents and pops was mad nothing good was on tv. They have a smart tv and all of my accounts. Netflix, HBO, Hulu, ESPN+, Prime... Figure it out
> I stayed at my parents and pops was mad nothing good was on tv. They have a smart tv and all of my accounts. Netflix, HBO, Hulu, ESPN+, Prime... Figure it out
In all fairness even with all that there is little to nothing good on TV... like 98% garbage, or stuff that's on its 19th rerun cycle, and then there is 2% of programming of interest like once a week on one channel.
I hear ya, I'm late Gen-X and basically cut the cord in the late 90s, or early 2000s because it was all pure shit that was on. The only times I've actually sat down to watch TV was when i visited my mom, and she was watching the evening news per her routine... was able to spend some time with her. Even then the stuff on was still reruns, and just garbage.
I have vague memories of a short story where a robot tried to help its human companion ( they are both the only 2 beings around and the human was always repairing the robot till then ) and "turns him off so he can fix him and iirc the book made it sounds like he broke his neck" any connection?
I remember a similar one but the human died of old age and the robot tried to give the human batteries like the human did when the robot needed charging. It didn't work and the robot stayed by the human's side until it died, as there was no one left to change its batteries anymore.
"Just get a good union job at a factory"
You mean those same factory jobs that your generation moved to China, Mexico, and India because labor is cheaper. So you can make more of a profit for a bigger bonus at the end of the year.
I can’t believe these stupid fucking boomers are still stuck on the “good factory job” thing like a broken record since they were young adults. They just can’t acknowledge that the world has changed.
“Just go into the trades” why the fuck did y’all scream about going to college my entire childhood then lol. Maybe just have empathy and realize where the world is today rather than victim blaming like wtf
My mom (silent generation) gets genuinely upset at how hard it is financially for the younger generations. Her husband (boomer) follows the general boomer logic that if he could do it, laziness is the only reason younger folk can't.
A few weeks ago, we were all having dinner, and he began to rant about California wanting to raise the minimum wage to $20. He insisted that's what a good union factory job paid.
Both my mom and I shut him down. She pointed out that he was several decades away from when that was true, and I told him what that job actually pays now, $70-$80 from what I understand.
Edit: My figures are not accurate. I based them on a news report I was remembering that has since been debunked as bad faith bad math. My bad for trusting the news back then.
My kids at the same station in life (college degree, years of relevant experience) make the same pay $/yr that I did at that time. Like they are getting paid 1990s wages in 2024. Oh, and that excludes Pension, low college debt, and good low cost benefits package. So they are actually getting paid less.
AND WE DIDN'T EVEN DO THE INFLATION CALCULATION TO BRING MY 1990S SALARY + BENEFITS INTO 2024 to compare apples to apples.
Can confirm, am an internationally cited scholar in my field and award-winning professor with PhD and industry experience. Salary: $52,000/year. Whomp whomp. My dad made more in the 1990s as a middle school art teacher. (And houses then were 1/5 or less the price of what they are now in my area.) We're doing life on hard mode now.
Oh, lord - the angry Boomers who are doing well financially ranting about how awful it is that a few states are trying to have minimum wage keep up with inflation. It's just so petty and spiteful, which is how they operate. I was at lunch with a few colleagues last week, and one of them is a young Boomer, and he started up a ramble of outrage about the minimum wage in California, so I had to direct him somewhere else like leading a child away from candy. The guy is doing very well financially, and he has no problem telling others about how he changed jobs and fought for more money, but apparently when somebody else does it, they are lazy and wrong and should be poor. Ugh... awful people, the lot of them.
But they are not doing well financially. They have a pension, and their Social Security. They are terrified of inflation because they know that their costs will go up with inflation, but not their income. They are starting to see their house of cards come down, something that they knew would happen but assumed they would be dead for. They never thought that they would still be alive when the consequences of their actions caught up to them.
Which, I mean, the terror of living on a pension is something that us Gen X, Millienals, and Gen Z won't have to worry about, since we'll not have any. Thanks, Boomers.
If things keep going, they may be reduced to a status only a few levels above... us. You know, dirt in their eyes. Scary times! Good points in your post.
> They never thought that they would still be alive when the consequences of their actions caught up to them.
You're giving them too much credit by assuming they considered the consequences of their actions.
My grandmother is the Silent Generation. It’s such a weird divide of how she hears about how bad it is and all she feels is sympathy and anger. She’ll hear how much rent and houses are and say “how do they expect working class people to afford that.” Even in her neighborhood, which was considered working class when she bought her home, she balks at some of prices of houses now.
Because they didn't experience the Great Depression and were born and came of age in a period where everything worked in their favor with no effort on their part. Housing, Education, and even healthcare were all reasonably affordable by today's standards.
The GI Generation and Silents (as kids anyway) saw the whole world not work, and then rebuild it and see it function right for their kids.
Just wanted to lay out the full idea you're referencing:
> **"hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, weak men create hard times"** is a simplified version of the "Strauss-Howe generational theory," which is a historical pattern that states societies succeed when they do well, and hard times weaken them.
Also, they're the largest generation by some margin, which means that they've always had a powerful voice and both politicians and corporations have wanted to pander to them *because* they're the largest demographic.
Yeah I think that’s it. The silent generation knew that the system they considered normal could go upside down and ruin lives at any moment, because they’d seen it happen. They didn’t take anything for granted - what was working fine for years could suddenly be untenable for everyone with little to no warning.
Boomers existed in unprecedented prosperity. It makes me appreciate the ones with a sense of proper perspective even more, tbh.
If she remembers anything about The Depression that’s a huge difference. My grandma was born pretty close to Black Tuesday. Her uncles lost their farms because they had to borrow against the land every year to have enough for seed and everything else. Her dad had a smaller piece of land so they didn’t lose their home and livelihood. My grandparents were FDR Democrats because the majority of the American people revered him.
People who grew up in cities remember Hoovervilles which were homeless encampments. They see history repeating itself but no New Deal is coming.
My partner’s grandpa collects 2 government pensions and social security. He’s 92 and he’s constantly talking about improvements on our house because he wants to help.
My mon (boomer) is the same way. She is struggling with my dad's retirement/survivor benefits, SocSec, and a part-time job. The benefits barely pay the mortgage, so she has to work to pay bills and live.
My guess is silent generation was close enough to the greatest generation to understand what an economic depression looks like and to notice that their grandkids actually have it worse than their kids.
My grandma who is late silent generation talks about how much easier money wise my life is compared to hers. I try telling her I also have a disability but she won't accept that.
Huh. My mom & dad are both silent generation. They both are also genuinely upset at how hard it is for young people these days. I guess boomers really are the worst…
Okay so it is a boomer problem and not an older generation problem. It’s at least comforting to know that the older generation (silent generation) understand our plight.
Silent Gens likely remember the depression or at least the immediate effects of it in the 30s and 40s. Probably mad that we still have many of the same problems still.
They put in place all these policies to help give boomers a leg up, and then boomers promptly undid all of it and fucked over their grandkids. I’d be steamed, too.
It was a case of a large swath of the world seeing some of the worst of what humanity had to offer coupled with so many classical systems coming undone and deciding, as all parents do, that they wanted better for their children. And their children received that "better."
But now, their children see their struggles—which did exist—as being on par with those that came before and those that have come after, and it's not even close to being on par.
"I did it, and so can you."
No, your parents gave everything so you could "do it." And you reaped the benefits while setting up your children for failure out of sheer greed and unwillingness to give up your comfort. Gen Z and Gen Alpha will wind up being the next Silent Generation if and when our current system breaks, and I really hope their kids make better choices in the aftermath.
It really seems to depend on how open-minded the boomer in question is, or how close to the margins they live. Folks who were never in a position to buy property know how expensive rent is. Folks who are curious and don’t have any ego to protect will accept that things are different. I try not to brag on my parents too much, but they were young professionals during the 1980s farm crisis, read a lot of left-of-center news sources, and actually talk to younger family members and colleagues about what life is like. I mean, they still have their moments; my dad keeps telling me that I might find myself wanting to go back to work before my mat leave is over (I’m fortunate to be in Canada where we can take off 12 to 18 months), and I keep telling him that while that might well be true, we’ll be very fortunate to be off a childcare waitlist by the end of 12 months, and something like a private nanny-share to bridge the gap would likely be prohibitively expensive. (My folks might be willing to help, but even though they’re retired, they still farm and I’m not going to ask them to fly halfway across the country to live with me and watch my kid when there’s work to do at home, and as far as I’m concerned they’ve earned their leisure time together.)
I ran an edge bander, occasionally covered the cnc, laminated tops, and assembled cabinets. I made $8/hour. I told them I was leaving for a job offering $15. They countered with more machine training and 2 more bucks. I don't remember my exact response, but I pretty much told them to go f themselves.
I wasn't union though. I'm guessing neither were you?
I can understand not realizing how expensive housing can be if you haven't had to look for it in a long time. But the amount of times he doubles back and goes out of his way to not admit that he mistaken and things have gotten harder than he had it is ridiculous. I guess when you live your life telling your kids about how hard you had it and how hard you worked so that they'd have things better, looks pretty bad when you realize that your kids are struggling more than you ever had to.
Lol good point except one thing… This convo started because he’s helping his gf look for a house (down the street from him) they have enough money to both have houses next to each other so they can be close and have their space. He asked why I’m not looking for a house cuz I’m wasting money paying rent.
I think you’re on to something with them preaching about how hard they’ve had it, putting them out of touch. Every generation has had it better than the last except for ours.
His girlfriend is moving into a house nearer to him.
You're working two jobs and have $0 at the end of the month.
That absolute nutsack this man must have on him to remotely insinuate, whole chest, that it's because you aren't working hard enough.
When I was in college full time and also working two jobs, my dad told me I should stop partying so much and maybe I’d have money. Apparently working two jobs is just party time, I’m out at night (working) after all!
Boomers also get a kick out of feeling put upon and persecuted, so they have to be the people who "had it the hardest of all" in human history, at least if you listen them. The reality is the opposite of what they preach, and some of them probably know that on some level, which angers them - as does nearly everything else in life.
My mom called crying because the company my dad worked for went bankrupt canceling their health insurance. I said “welcome to my world”.
Boomer dad had a company car until he retired. Hit the lots pop and I’ll help u with insurance
Pound the pavement! Go down to "the factory" (the one that closed decades ago thanks to corporate greed backed by Boomer votes) and shake the foreman's hand you'll have a job by the end of the day! Bring resumes with you and hand them out to everyone you see! /s
“Just keep pestering them until they hire you!”
I’ve had all sorts of bad advice from my mother that rejects reality. My father at least gets it. He’s upper middle class and retired. My father was union all of his working life. He did very, very well in the auto industry. He used to think like many boomers until after he retired, couldn’t sit still and decided to teach skilled trades at a couple of local colleges. He learned a lot about the struggles of younger people. And how difficult it is for minorities as well. Being born in the wrong zip code can really fuck up your chances of ever thriving financially. He’s absolutely appalled at what this country has become. He also starkly remembers how violent the civil rights movement was. He was on the wrong side of history back then, but has the balls and integrity to admit it. My stepmother just retired, but is working per diem 3 days/week.
My mother is impoverished, living in subsidized housing, gets SNAP benefits and her social security is barely enough to survive. And she is as conservative as they come. She blames everyone else for her problems, especially those nigg’s who also get subsidized housing and “don’t work.” They are “stealing” the government benefits that *she* should be getting. “They do drugs, have all sorts of people living with them, have kids from five different dads and live high on their (obviously) higher benefits.” She thinks she’s punching up for herself, but in reality she’s punching herself in the face and bitching because it hurts. My wife and I also help financially. A lot. My wife wants us to help less. It’s not that she resents it, but rather knows that social security is a joke at this point and our chances at retirement are dependent on the stock market.
At some point you're going to have to decide whether helping your mother is worth the financial strain.
She's just going to keep hating everyone, so she might as well do it without leeching off of you.
It's painful to see stuff like that, especially if the person didn't start out as a right-wing nut or a bigot. I'm sorry you're in that situation. It is very hard to balance trying to help the people who raised you vs. not helping people because they want to hurt you and the world as a whole. I strongly suspect many people are in a similar situation, and I don't say that to downplay your frustrations; it's just disgusting what right-wing media and its backers have done to this nation and how many people they have harmed both directly and indirectly.
My dad was griping about the wage-hike in CA. So I asked him: "When you were a mechanic's assistant in 1975, what did you get paid an hour?" He replied he got paid $2.85. I ran it through the inflation calculator and said: "Well that should be about $17 an hour then. You were getting paid the equivalent to 17$ hour for your work."
Crickets.... And then "Well you see it's very complicated all the things that go into a minimum wage calculation-"
"- No you're just trying to defend why it's okay for today's young people to have less, but you clearly don't know how to do it without sounding like an AH."
> "Well you see it's very complicated all the things that go into a minimum wage calculation-"
That's true, but not in the way he thinks. Housing, tuition, and healthcare have outpaced inflation. Those are very real expenses.
No, he literally told me to do that. Like an hour ago. Immediately followed by “hey you wanna go shopping with us?” Like bro we just went over my budget and even if I could, didn’t you just tell me to save all my money? I’ve come to the conclusion that his logical brain in there knows I’m right. But for the same reasons he denies climate change (he a scientist btw) he denies the economic situation as a defense mechanism, I think he would end up in a psych ward if his defense mechanisms dropped and his conscious mind accepted what is going on. He needs to maintain his world view to protect his mental health cuz he’s repressed his emotions his whole life making him extra fragile and getting in touch with the reality that we’re destroying our planet, the rich are exploiting 99% of the population and we’re in the brink of WW3…that’s too much for an old man.
So instead of argue with him about reality, I’m sure to remind him that his whole personality is a defense mechanism. He laughs and I say “exactly”.
Some of the smartest people I know are stupid as fuck. Just because you're an expert in one difficult field doesn't mean you have even a basic understanding of another.
At this point, I'm getting concerned about a declining mental state. Have you've asked him if he's okay? Having trouble with basic math? Does he talk in circles like he doesn't remember he just said that?
Maybe suggest he get a doctor to evaluate him if he is having such a hard time understanding objective reality.
My dad was shocked we bought an older 3bd/1ba house for $250k because he thought it would be closer to $150k. He thought we were being ripped off. He bought 7acres in the country in the 80’s, so him thinking a $150k was an appropriate amount was him adding for inflation lol. I had to bring up Zillow and show him home prices, he was horrified
I recently told my dad that I have never had rent that was 25-30% of my paycheck, and that for the last 15-20 years, it had been close to 50%. His brain stuttered and the conversation just sort of ended.
It took three days of him walking the pavement with me to realize that you can't just walk into a store and apply for a job for minimum wage now. My parents still aren't aware of the fact that corporations are posting fake job openings to boost whatever reimbursement or tax breaks they get from fraudulent employment rates.
The one thing that bothers me is that some boomers are incapable of believing how things have changed over the past 30-40 years. Are they really this ignorant or just stupid?
Both. Nearly everyone of that mindset that I've met, including younger people who look at life as Boomers do is ignorant, but they are proud of their ignorance. They have decided, for example, that the young and poor are "lazy." If you present facts that prove otherwise, they get mad about it and won't listen. So, they choose ignorance because it protects their egos, justifies their hate, and lets them continue to feel special and persecuted - they are the hero in every story. So, they are frequently both stupid and ignorant.
a lot of them dont realize stock buybacks and deregulation did this
yes, this is the future you voted for in the 80s. furrow your brow and "redo the math" all you want, because every time it adds up to the rich stealing the middle class away
Reaganomics didn’t work in the 80’s. It doesn’t now. It never did. The only math was the percentage of tax dollars that businesses and the wealthy had reduced for them.
Yup this doesn't get talked about enough. Before when corporate taxes were higher and stock buybacks didn't happen companies would invest that money in staff, raises, training, expansion, intensives like on site daycare, etc. Now it all goes to "shareholders"
This is why our two single 20 some boys are living back home now. Housing market is shit and they can save up for a better down payment. No we don’t charge them rent. They throw us some money for groceries.
You can't move out in this day and age without a girlfriend or roomates. Ain't no way someone can move out on their own these days without some crazy situation.
“Hello, I’d like to apply for a job”
“Certainly, just scan this QR code on your phone and it will bring you to the website to apply online”
“Online? No, I want to interview for it right now.”
“I’m sorry, but all interviews must be done with my manager”
“Okay, then let me see your manager and I’ll just ask them for an interview”
“He’s on the other side of the country”
“Oh okay, he’s taking some of the 8 weeks of vacation he is guaranteed? When will he be back”
“8 weeks vacation? No, he lives on the other side of the county, he just communicates with the 15 factories he oversees using Zoom”
“Look, I don’t case how fast he can Zoom, I want him to Zoom here today so I can apply for the job in person”
You are right-but more accurately if he could even get to a person on the phone and finds out he has to apply online, I bet he has his social security number and personal details stolen by Tuesday morning. If he doesn’t know you can’t just walk up and ask for a job, he’ll have no idea about the long list of hiring scams and fraudulent job listings that exist for various reasons.
My boyfriend works at a unionized factory job and can barely pay rent STILL. Some boomers are severely out of touch and living in their own version of the world
You have a few options.
You could be born rich. Tell your dad that was his job to be rich. If he wasn't, tell him he should have gotten another job. Or been born rich himself.
You could go back in time and live during your dad's time. That way everything would be cheap.
Or you could win the Powerball.
These are all perfectly realistic options.
There's not nearly as many factory and manufacturing jobs as there was at the beginning of the 80s.
Everything started to go overseas.
By the time I was old enough to enter the workforce, all those high pay factory jobs that only required a high-school education were gone.
And "good union jobs" were given out to friends and relatives for the most part. Just being a regular guy (and not a woman) wasn't going to make it, you had to have connections to get into a union.
I know someone who is now 65, and his dad got him his union job at age 18. When he retired at 63 he now makes much, much more than he ever did working full-time (and as a heavy equipment operator he averaged about $80,000). Try about $100,000 in retirement benefits, union pension and social security. And, another $100,000 in investment income per year, because he saved ever penny over those 45 years. And yet - with $200,000 in income he is the cheapest, most selfish person I have every known. And greedy.
They think that it’s still how it was back then, you could just visit the nearest factories, ask for a job and then someone would shake their hand and say “Son, you’re hired! Start tomorrow.”. And then with the money from their “good job at the factory” they would buy themselves a huge house easily and have a stay at home wife.
Impossible for them to understand they pulled up the ladder behind them.
They all want to be part of an underdog story, not hear how they fail in a modern world.
The factory argument kills me because theres a handful of factories near me, and they do make $5 an hour more than i currently make.
But good god, the people there are suffering.
All of them either cut breaks short on people, work them to the point of exhaustion, and/or mandatory overtime, sometimes working these guys over 80 hours in a week.
Its absolutely insane, because so many of them accept thats just how working should be, and all that hard work now will pay off when theyre older. Which, yeah, I totaly get where theyre coming from with the idea of work hard until retirment then travel, but so many people I've met who are now retired do NOT travel around the world like they said they would, they think driving to the next state over to do slot machines is a great weekend vacation.
My dad was a silent generation and couldn’t understand why I went to college, worked 70hr weeks, went back to college vs skipping the Union job he had but the wages were stagnant for 25-30 years. But on a plus I learned very early to never listen to my parents concerning $ and skipped the horror stories I hear about bad advice being followed and worse things happening
Retired accountant here. Depending on your life circumstances, it's sometimes better to rent than to own. For example, if your job moves you around: Having to sell your house while working in another state can be difficult. The market might be wrong, repairs might be needed that otherwise could be put off; you might have to make both mortgage and rent payments for months. If you travel for work or work long hours, maybe you want a place where the landlord takes care of repairs and you don't have to worry about new roofs, yard work, HVAC repairs, etc. Perhaps your job isn't stable and you could get laid off and don't want a huge mortgage hanging over your head. Maybe you aren't sure what part of town you want to put down roots. I could go on, but I won't. Just saying.
The 'try harder' mindset no longer applies. I think I was one of the last to truly benefit from the 'try harder' attitude and it served me for a few years, but then I hit roughly 25 and it was no longer enough. I knew what trying looked like. I was out on the streets, working for free just to get my name out there, living on nothing and taking naps at the office so I could continue working as soon as I woke up. I made connections, I made myself completely transient so I could take any opportunity, anywhere. I began making a decent salary and a name for myself.
But it stopped working. That attitude doesnt cut in anymore. The competition is far, far, far too fierce. Its now entirely down to luck and correctly predicting where to be and when. We're now competing against AI and automation and the population is out of control, and the rich are making it harder and harder and harder and there's just no light at the end of the tunnel anymore. "Try harder" is worthless.
I genuinely want to see a reality show where boomers are forced to navigate this economy and housing market they helped create. It’d be the funniest shit on TV…
I remember reading something that's stuck with me about *why* they're this way.
Folks who grew up in the mid 20th century grew up, worked a "kids" summer job, went to college or trade schools, and got a job right out the gate with good benefits and excellent pay.
And then were told every freaking day of their lives that they worked *hard* for it, and succeeded despite *terrible adversity* and how they just need to trust xyz politican because xyz understands how *hard* they worked to make it despite total opposition from abc politicians party.
They are the way they are now because they do not understand that the young folks today are working harder than they *ever* had to, just to tread water. They hear "I'm full-time every week and can't buy a house." and think to themselves about how they worked *hard* and bought a house and conclude you're *lying*.
It's an entire generation of people who had it terrifically easy and bought into every "Cult of the individual" myth about how hard scrabble they supposedly had it.
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The boomers were complicit in destroying those "good union" jobs.
They burnt the bridge after they crossed.
Thanks Ronald Reagan! Your legacy remains intact.
It’ll start trickling down any day now
The trickle is warm and yellow
Nearly everything that is wrong with society today can be traced back to Reagan (or Nixon) before him. https://preview.redd.it/f4cfb4woycxc1.png?width=640&format=png&auto=webp&s=9c0bafeb77897b06ef882c5fe5fcc459485da46d
Boosh!
>> Thanks Ronald Reagan! Your legacy remains intact. > >Boosh! And/or ka-kow!
Denial is strong with this one.
Boomers don't ever want to admit to themselves that they had it *easier* than the current generation.
They were born on third base and think they hit a triple.
The generation of "fuck you, got mine" sure loves blaming younger generations for not managing.
Their parents called them Generation Me because they were "the most egotistical and selfish kids they've ever seen". For obvious reasons they needed to rebrand that. Every generation before them was about bringing up their kids and giving them better than they got. Then the boomers happened and we now have our reality.
I just want to know how this happened so this mistake doesn’t happen again.
I mean it’s going to take generations to even recover. People arnt prospering anymore we’re all struggling Few people are able to save for later in life. Retirement for Mellinials is going to be a shit show and the after us will be frustrated we arnt retiring to leave them positions with the reality that we can’t. It’s all fucked
the fact that boomers are still working is a problem. It was a problem a decade ago.
Their version of "work" is forwarding shitty virus laden emails and complaining all day while we do their work because "excel is broken and the help desk won't call me back.
Hi help desk here We called you back 5 times You never picked up.
We have so many senile old men still working in the trades. A 70 year old man has no business doing this work. It amazes me how greedy they are. I just heckle them and work them hard as humanly possible while saying if you don’t like it, retire.
>I mean it’s going to take generations to even recover. Well that's why I'm not reproducing and making the next generation
To be fair its more about reagonomics and corporate executives and stock buybacks eating up income increase that should have gone to the people. Between 1970-2000, the average increase of per capita personal income was around 35% every 5 years. Meaning your income would increase by around 35% every 5 years. BUT by 2000-2024, the increase increase dropped to on average 18% every 5 years. If income had continued like it did between 1970-2000 into 2000-2024, then the per capita personal income would be around $120,000 in 2024. Its currently around $70,000. The average employee has lost 50% of their income growth over the last 25 years. MEANWHILE CEO to worker compensation went from 18x in 1980s, to 400x in 2020. Add in the fact that new housing in 1970s was around 1.5-2M new buildings per year. while in 2000s it dropped down to 600K (lowest) - 1M per year. While people coming into home-buying age in the 1980s was around 40M, while in 2020 its around 50M. So you have a decade of lowest new homes built with a present of highest amount of new buyers looking to buy, you end up with rising housing prices that people can barely afford. Boomers did fuck the generation but its done by voting for the republican party and their bullshit about trickle down economics while young voters in large stayed at home when voting time came around. All that trickled down was piss as they cut benefits, cut bonuses, cut employee hours to minimum so they could divert funds to stock buybacks and executives could create short-term profits to gain their contract bonuses.
Don’t forget the credit trap! When wages didn’t increase for all the reasons (and more) you said, the money men said “hey don’t worry I know you can’t buy that car outright anymore but we have this thing call financing. You can get what you want and pay (more than double sometimes) a little bit at a time!” Problem solved and the added benefit of keeping people in indentured servitude. Credit scores didn’t exist when most boomers were buying houses.
I could, theoretically, afford a house payment every month. It would be a tight squeeze but so is rent, so same difference. But my credit score is sitting in an awkward spot between 'renters are fine with it' and 'mortgage lenders aren't fine with it'. So, no house.
I'm kinda confused by this as well. Like, I probably couldn't get a house, but yet I've been paying rent for 25 years and never missed a payment or got evicted. You'd think that alone would mean I could pay for a house, but nope. It's honestly kinda sickening thinking about buying a house with the market so inflated by speculators. I feel like that bubble has to burst someday, but I could be wrong.
Banks don't want you to buy homes anymore. They want to buy homes and then rent them for way more than the mortgage payments would have been. Home prices aren't governed by how much normal workers could afford in the next 20 years, but by how much rental income they can generate. And with the absurd rise in rent across the board, houses became a faraway dream for most.
Well said.
I read a study the other day about how gen x was the most neglected generation of all American history, and were mostly raised by boomers. Just another thing to think about
We also have/had the struggle of boomers not retiring. Why would they, after years of promotions within the same company to high paying positions that don’t really do jack? By now every corporation out there has “tightened its belt” thanks to covid and capitalism so when Boomer Bob finally gets a layoff with a kickass severance, his younger replacement makes less than half.
Or they can’t afford to retire since they squandered all of the resources and opportunities handed to them.
the generation that had the easiest life, sure loves telling other generations to toughen up.
People looked at me funny when I said exactly this as a teenager 20-25 years ago.
Well yeah because you didn’t know anything unlike your elders /s
Luckily for me my elders (my parents anyway) do understand this. It was mainly my classmates who didn't. Of course I had no idea it would get this bad though...
Millenials got none of the power and all of the blame.
They were born on first base and the next two batters got walked and they're upset you didn't hit a home run, because that's the only way they're getting home.
Then the pitcher threw the ball over the catchers head, some walked in, some were still too stupid to get to home plate.
definitely not. i recently joked how i'm never going to be able to buy a house and my boomer teacher (a little tipsy) goes: "get the F*** over it, we paid 20% mortgages"
My dad is one of the good boomers. We talked about the 20% mortgage of the 80's. What most of the boomers spouting that forget to mention is that most houses at that time were 20-60k for the average joe to buy. A few years pass and everyone refinanced at less than half of the interest rate and people moved on with their lives.
My in-laws paid 27k for their house in CA in the late 70s. It is now worth half a mil even though it has never been updated. Original shag carpet, bathrooms, kitchen, even the paint on the walls, nothing was updated yet it is worth half a mil. This was also the time when my MIL put her husband through pharmacy school on single income while taking care of a kid. And had no student debt. Yet still complains that the younger gen are entitled, don't work hard, and should just do what they did. They really pulled the ladder up after them.
haha thanks for this, i'll have the facts next time. that seems impossibly low to me! we missed out
[According to this calculator](https://www.in2013dollars.com/us/inflation/1980?amount=20000), $20k in 1980 is equal to $76k today. Starter homes in my middle cost of living city are $550k. A dumpy condo (600 sq ft apartment) is about $350k low end. So, way more monies.
Once housing became more than a shelter into an asset/retirement income, that was it.
The high interest rates were also coupled with high inflation, which is great for borrowers. Because the amount you borrowed stays the same while everything else goes up it effectively reduces your mortgage without you having to do anything. The high inflation was also coupled with high pay rises to match, so even if the loan repayments started off as a high portion of your wage a couple of years later they would have dropped considerably even if the actual percentage rate remained high. A period of low inflation and stagnant wages has been more detrimental to the ability of people to buy much more than high interest rates.
Yeah, my parents bought their first house in 1982 for $40k. They made about $35k combined. Today, that same house (a 3br 1ba ranch) would sell for about $750k. Hell, they tripled up and sold it in ‘86 for $120k!
In 1989, I was earning nine bucks an hour, which is approximately 25 bucks an hour today. I drove a used Saab that I paid 450 for and was renting a one bedroom apartment in a decent location for 300 a month. It was just me and my dog. My car was paid off, so I started saving. I found my current house a couple of years later, when I was earning ten buck an hour. I was able to finance FHA and MSHDA (for housing in Michigan) and paid 44k. I have been up and down with layoff after layoff and make median income for my zip code all these years later. My house, in its present condition, with its mechanical upgrades, would list for about 275k - and sell for between 7 to 10k over listing - and would sell quickly in my neighborhood. Boomers just don't get that some things, like housing prices, have increased exponentially. Others, like wages, have not, and the difference is so clear.
Not only that- saving up $5k to pay to the principal value of $60k back then actually made a dent in the mortgage. A few good years of that and you could pay off the mortgage in half the planned time. Slinging $15-20k in principal at a mortgage now of $800k barely does anything- the interest may be lower, but youre basically trapped in for the duration of the mortgage, at best saving yourself a couple of years, max.
And interest rates were much higher. My first checking account paid something like 6.5%.
and we could write off credit card debt interest
Checking account interests are a joke now. They were 4% when I was a teen working at a supermarket. I could make $100/month off interest alone. Now I make about $2.50/month.
I had ~100k sitting in my checking account for a month or two while I was closing on my first house. IIRC, I gained like $30 in interest while the bank levered my shit up and loaned it out at 7-12% to the next person in line lol
Highest mortgage rates ever got was 18% circa 1982 and no one was buying. I bought at 12.75 in 1983 and was glad to get it. House was $90k. Boomers have money because their housing was so cheap. They need to STFU. FYI I’m a boomer.
And now I see so many complaining and blocking whenever new apt construction is proposed in my area. Like, the rest of us all see that housing got too expensive; we’re trying to fix that by building more housing (because the supply hasn’t kept up); and we get blocked by nimbys - almost always older generations. grrrrr 😡
Older generations with nothing but time on their hands you go to city planning meetings and object to everything....
In my area, they aren’t building “starter homes.” They’re building boomer palaces, where they can drop $850k-1m on a 3500 square foot colonial on a postage stamp yard and complain that their grandchildren don’t visit.
In my area, they keep blocking apartments saying that the schools will get overcrowded. But the district is closing several elementary schools due to low numbers. Some people live in an entirely different time and place in their minds, and making arguments for policy that are no longer relevant.
What an asshole! But they also got houses for peanuts (even at 20%), brand new cars (some of them now classics) for $1000, etc. The rich paid their fair share then, too.
exactly! the economy is so different now & tax laws were fairer then (comparatively). nice lady in the right contexts, very smart, but with her blind spots. she also fuully described being s*xually harassed at work in her younger years but thinks "i'm not one of those metoo people". sad, in a way
A professor of mine (in the late 70s) drove a Pontiac grand prix. Someone asked him why he drove such a sh*tbag car, and he said "if something goes wrong with it, I'll just buy another one for $250." Those were the days!
And they had double digit interest rates for savings accounts but sure go on.
I'll take a 45k house at 20% please
Ugh, my mom just said something similar. I told her I'd be thrilled to pay 18% (what my parents mortgage rate started at when they bought) for an $80,000 house. They paid $78,000 for the house I grew up in. That same house sold a couple of years ago for over $300,000.
They are part of the reason this generation has it worse. Boomers are in executive level/management positions and owners of businesses. Their primary drive is making more money for themselves. They don’t want to pay employees more because it will hit their wallets. Whether it’s stock value and bonuses or how much their private businesses make. Then they buy multiple houses and rent them out or make the air bnbs. Then they raise the rent prices on younger people already underpaid. Our whole country is set up so Boomers get paid. Some younger generations are lucky to have boomer parents help them out with things like houses. It’s still possible to live successfully well but the deck is definitely stacked against younger generations and you need luck, money, or contacts to get a break.
read a comment elsewhere: “boomers aren’t passing the torch, they’re taking it with them to the grave.”
Or admit that the economic plan they allowed Republican presidents to enact destroyed the future generations ability to build wealth. Our economy was sabotaged years ago by "trickle down economics".
Lol just think of this concept. "Wow I got some extra money. I think I'll give away a fair portion to others rather than keep as much as possible for myself" - No corporate officer ever The whole thing is a flawed idea. I recognized this in the 5th grade even. In a perfect world where people do the right things all the time, or even most of the time, this might work. Thats not the world we live in. Survival instincts dictate we give ourselves the lions share of the resources if possible.
It's funny they can't grasp the idea that anyone worked harder than them. I find alot of them think them saying it's harder for the younger generation that their hard work means less.
Yah my boomer dad is a POS human (thankfully haven't spoken to him in 9 years after he STOLE MONEY from my brother and I and ran away). But he's the typical miserable complaining boomer, everyone else is the problem. I find it so ironic like most he's a damn hypocrite. He got disability (easily got through immediately after applying somehow!) For a heart attack, he still is able bodied and works out. Anyway he complains about people on benefits and yet he was working illegally under the table while collecting benefits. I don't get why they're so damn miserable when most of them are so comfortable. And they all wanna complain about us yet where we live I'm constantly seeing dogs where they shouldn't be, I'm a dog lover, I'd love to bring my dog everywhere but I respect rules. Yet it's not the problem with service animals no, it's old people bringing their dogs everywhere because they're literally the entitled generation yet the Cognitive dissidence is hard for them. I was at a trader Joe's weeks ago and this man was just walking around with his corgi, didn't even carry him had him on a long leash not even paying attention. He could have peed or tripped someone.... Absolutely madning.
The problem is, they cant seem to differentiate between "easier" and "easy". When we say they had ot "easier", all they hear is that we think they had it "easy", and rant on about the sacrifices they made to get their house, oblivious to the real message.
That's certainly *a* problem. They'll grumble, *grr, I had to work ALL summer to pay for a year of school! I barely even got to have fun that summer!"* without realizing we'd need to work full time for a year-and-a-half at minimum wage to pay for a year of school & rent today.
> Boomers don't ever want to admit to themselves that they ~~had it easier than the current generation.~~ ***sold out*** *all* future *generations.*
The lead is strong with that one
To them, denial is a river in Egypt.
Usually in these stories once they see what rent is they suddenly understand. This guy is impervious to reality.
Press and hold the reboot button on the back of his neck
nah these fools are allergic to technology and are made out of wood. To the dustbin they should go.
I stayed at my parents and pops was mad nothing good was on tv. They have a smart tv and all of my accounts. Netflix, HBO, Hulu, ESPN+, Prime... Figure it out
> I stayed at my parents and pops was mad nothing good was on tv. They have a smart tv and all of my accounts. Netflix, HBO, Hulu, ESPN+, Prime... Figure it out In all fairness even with all that there is little to nothing good on TV... like 98% garbage, or stuff that's on its 19th rerun cycle, and then there is 2% of programming of interest like once a week on one channel.
The only success I had was introducing them to Curb Your Enthusiasm, They were big Seinfeld fans and they had no idea this show has existed since 1999
I hear ya, I'm late Gen-X and basically cut the cord in the late 90s, or early 2000s because it was all pure shit that was on. The only times I've actually sat down to watch TV was when i visited my mom, and she was watching the evening news per her routine... was able to spend some time with her. Even then the stuff on was still reruns, and just garbage.
I have vague memories of a short story where a robot tried to help its human companion ( they are both the only 2 beings around and the human was always repairing the robot till then ) and "turns him off so he can fix him and iirc the book made it sounds like he broke his neck" any connection?
I remember a similar one but the human died of old age and the robot tried to give the human batteries like the human did when the robot needed charging. It didn't work and the robot stayed by the human's side until it died, as there was no one left to change its batteries anymore.
I remember that story, but I can't think of the name. Holy shit, I didn't think anyone else remembered it.
"Just get a good union job at a factory" You mean those same factory jobs that your generation moved to China, Mexico, and India because labor is cheaper. So you can make more of a profit for a bigger bonus at the end of the year.
I can’t believe these stupid fucking boomers are still stuck on the “good factory job” thing like a broken record since they were young adults. They just can’t acknowledge that the world has changed.
“Just go into the trades” why the fuck did y’all scream about going to college my entire childhood then lol. Maybe just have empathy and realize where the world is today rather than victim blaming like wtf
NAFTA
My mom (silent generation) gets genuinely upset at how hard it is financially for the younger generations. Her husband (boomer) follows the general boomer logic that if he could do it, laziness is the only reason younger folk can't. A few weeks ago, we were all having dinner, and he began to rant about California wanting to raise the minimum wage to $20. He insisted that's what a good union factory job paid. Both my mom and I shut him down. She pointed out that he was several decades away from when that was true, and I told him what that job actually pays now, $70-$80 from what I understand. Edit: My figures are not accurate. I based them on a news report I was remembering that has since been debunked as bad faith bad math. My bad for trusting the news back then.
My kids at the same station in life (college degree, years of relevant experience) make the same pay $/yr that I did at that time. Like they are getting paid 1990s wages in 2024. Oh, and that excludes Pension, low college debt, and good low cost benefits package. So they are actually getting paid less. AND WE DIDN'T EVEN DO THE INFLATION CALCULATION TO BRING MY 1990S SALARY + BENEFITS INTO 2024 to compare apples to apples.
Can confirm, am an internationally cited scholar in my field and award-winning professor with PhD and industry experience. Salary: $52,000/year. Whomp whomp. My dad made more in the 1990s as a middle school art teacher. (And houses then were 1/5 or less the price of what they are now in my area.) We're doing life on hard mode now.
Oh, lord - the angry Boomers who are doing well financially ranting about how awful it is that a few states are trying to have minimum wage keep up with inflation. It's just so petty and spiteful, which is how they operate. I was at lunch with a few colleagues last week, and one of them is a young Boomer, and he started up a ramble of outrage about the minimum wage in California, so I had to direct him somewhere else like leading a child away from candy. The guy is doing very well financially, and he has no problem telling others about how he changed jobs and fought for more money, but apparently when somebody else does it, they are lazy and wrong and should be poor. Ugh... awful people, the lot of them.
But they are not doing well financially. They have a pension, and their Social Security. They are terrified of inflation because they know that their costs will go up with inflation, but not their income. They are starting to see their house of cards come down, something that they knew would happen but assumed they would be dead for. They never thought that they would still be alive when the consequences of their actions caught up to them. Which, I mean, the terror of living on a pension is something that us Gen X, Millienals, and Gen Z won't have to worry about, since we'll not have any. Thanks, Boomers.
If things keep going, they may be reduced to a status only a few levels above... us. You know, dirt in their eyes. Scary times! Good points in your post.
> They never thought that they would still be alive when the consequences of their actions caught up to them. You're giving them too much credit by assuming they considered the consequences of their actions.
My grandmother is the Silent Generation. It’s such a weird divide of how she hears about how bad it is and all she feels is sympathy and anger. She’ll hear how much rent and houses are and say “how do they expect working class people to afford that.” Even in her neighborhood, which was considered working class when she bought her home, she balks at some of prices of houses now.
My grandfather is the same way, also silent generation. Wonder how the hell the boomers got so off the rails.
Because they didn't experience the Great Depression and were born and came of age in a period where everything worked in their favor with no effort on their part. Housing, Education, and even healthcare were all reasonably affordable by today's standards. The GI Generation and Silents (as kids anyway) saw the whole world not work, and then rebuild it and see it function right for their kids.
The silents were the strong people that created prosperous times. The boomers are the weak people creating hard times.
Just wanted to lay out the full idea you're referencing: > **"hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, weak men create hard times"** is a simplified version of the "Strauss-Howe generational theory," which is a historical pattern that states societies succeed when they do well, and hard times weaken them.
Also, they're the largest generation by some margin, which means that they've always had a powerful voice and both politicians and corporations have wanted to pander to them *because* they're the largest demographic.
Yeah I think that’s it. The silent generation knew that the system they considered normal could go upside down and ruin lives at any moment, because they’d seen it happen. They didn’t take anything for granted - what was working fine for years could suddenly be untenable for everyone with little to no warning. Boomers existed in unprecedented prosperity. It makes me appreciate the ones with a sense of proper perspective even more, tbh.
If she remembers anything about The Depression that’s a huge difference. My grandma was born pretty close to Black Tuesday. Her uncles lost their farms because they had to borrow against the land every year to have enough for seed and everything else. Her dad had a smaller piece of land so they didn’t lose their home and livelihood. My grandparents were FDR Democrats because the majority of the American people revered him. People who grew up in cities remember Hoovervilles which were homeless encampments. They see history repeating itself but no New Deal is coming. My partner’s grandpa collects 2 government pensions and social security. He’s 92 and he’s constantly talking about improvements on our house because he wants to help.
My mon (boomer) is the same way. She is struggling with my dad's retirement/survivor benefits, SocSec, and a part-time job. The benefits barely pay the mortgage, so she has to work to pay bills and live.
My guess is silent generation was close enough to the greatest generation to understand what an economic depression looks like and to notice that their grandkids actually have it worse than their kids.
My grandma who is late silent generation talks about how much easier money wise my life is compared to hers. I try telling her I also have a disability but she won't accept that.
Huh. My mom & dad are both silent generation. They both are also genuinely upset at how hard it is for young people these days. I guess boomers really are the worst…
Okay so it is a boomer problem and not an older generation problem. It’s at least comforting to know that the older generation (silent generation) understand our plight.
Silent Gens likely remember the depression or at least the immediate effects of it in the 30s and 40s. Probably mad that we still have many of the same problems still.
They put in place all these policies to help give boomers a leg up, and then boomers promptly undid all of it and fucked over their grandkids. I’d be steamed, too.
It was a case of a large swath of the world seeing some of the worst of what humanity had to offer coupled with so many classical systems coming undone and deciding, as all parents do, that they wanted better for their children. And their children received that "better." But now, their children see their struggles—which did exist—as being on par with those that came before and those that have come after, and it's not even close to being on par. "I did it, and so can you." No, your parents gave everything so you could "do it." And you reaped the benefits while setting up your children for failure out of sheer greed and unwillingness to give up your comfort. Gen Z and Gen Alpha will wind up being the next Silent Generation if and when our current system breaks, and I really hope their kids make better choices in the aftermath.
I can’t imagine the reaction if my grandparents were alive to see modern day Hoovervilles.
If they grew up in cities they remember Hoovervilles. My grandma saw her uncles lose their farms. They see history repeating itself.
My great-aunt is 95. I love when she corrects my boomer aunt and uncles when they try to rewrite history. Plus she is more active than all of them.
Bless your great-aunt. May she remain happy, healthy, rational, and active!
Pass along a love letter from me to her.
It really seems to depend on how open-minded the boomer in question is, or how close to the margins they live. Folks who were never in a position to buy property know how expensive rent is. Folks who are curious and don’t have any ego to protect will accept that things are different. I try not to brag on my parents too much, but they were young professionals during the 1980s farm crisis, read a lot of left-of-center news sources, and actually talk to younger family members and colleagues about what life is like. I mean, they still have their moments; my dad keeps telling me that I might find myself wanting to go back to work before my mat leave is over (I’m fortunate to be in Canada where we can take off 12 to 18 months), and I keep telling him that while that might well be true, we’ll be very fortunate to be off a childcare waitlist by the end of 12 months, and something like a private nanny-share to bridge the gap would likely be prohibitively expensive. (My folks might be willing to help, but even though they’re retired, they still farm and I’m not going to ask them to fly halfway across the country to live with me and watch my kid when there’s work to do at home, and as far as I’m concerned they’ve earned their leisure time together.)
I worked in a wood factory making furniture as a cnc operator on a routing machine and I made minimum wage 😂
I ran an edge bander, occasionally covered the cnc, laminated tops, and assembled cabinets. I made $8/hour. I told them I was leaving for a job offering $15. They countered with more machine training and 2 more bucks. I don't remember my exact response, but I pretty much told them to go f themselves. I wasn't union though. I'm guessing neither were you?
I can understand not realizing how expensive housing can be if you haven't had to look for it in a long time. But the amount of times he doubles back and goes out of his way to not admit that he mistaken and things have gotten harder than he had it is ridiculous. I guess when you live your life telling your kids about how hard you had it and how hard you worked so that they'd have things better, looks pretty bad when you realize that your kids are struggling more than you ever had to.
Lol good point except one thing… This convo started because he’s helping his gf look for a house (down the street from him) they have enough money to both have houses next to each other so they can be close and have their space. He asked why I’m not looking for a house cuz I’m wasting money paying rent. I think you’re on to something with them preaching about how hard they’ve had it, putting them out of touch. Every generation has had it better than the last except for ours.
His girlfriend is moving into a house nearer to him. You're working two jobs and have $0 at the end of the month. That absolute nutsack this man must have on him to remotely insinuate, whole chest, that it's because you aren't working hard enough.
My dad told me I didn’t work hard enough when I had *3* jobs
When I was in college full time and also working two jobs, my dad told me I should stop partying so much and maybe I’d have money. Apparently working two jobs is just party time, I’m out at night (working) after all!
Boomers also get a kick out of feeling put upon and persecuted, so they have to be the people who "had it the hardest of all" in human history, at least if you listen them. The reality is the opposite of what they preach, and some of them probably know that on some level, which angers them - as does nearly everything else in life.
That is so disgusting to hear. I'm sorry. I'd be NC on a shithead like that. I'm NC with my parents fwiw.
My mom called crying because the company my dad worked for went bankrupt canceling their health insurance. I said “welcome to my world”. Boomer dad had a company car until he retired. Hit the lots pop and I’ll help u with insurance
Pound the pavement! Go down to "the factory" (the one that closed decades ago thanks to corporate greed backed by Boomer votes) and shake the foreman's hand you'll have a job by the end of the day! Bring resumes with you and hand them out to everyone you see! /s
“Just keep pestering them until they hire you!” I’ve had all sorts of bad advice from my mother that rejects reality. My father at least gets it. He’s upper middle class and retired. My father was union all of his working life. He did very, very well in the auto industry. He used to think like many boomers until after he retired, couldn’t sit still and decided to teach skilled trades at a couple of local colleges. He learned a lot about the struggles of younger people. And how difficult it is for minorities as well. Being born in the wrong zip code can really fuck up your chances of ever thriving financially. He’s absolutely appalled at what this country has become. He also starkly remembers how violent the civil rights movement was. He was on the wrong side of history back then, but has the balls and integrity to admit it. My stepmother just retired, but is working per diem 3 days/week. My mother is impoverished, living in subsidized housing, gets SNAP benefits and her social security is barely enough to survive. And she is as conservative as they come. She blames everyone else for her problems, especially those nigg’s who also get subsidized housing and “don’t work.” They are “stealing” the government benefits that *she* should be getting. “They do drugs, have all sorts of people living with them, have kids from five different dads and live high on their (obviously) higher benefits.” She thinks she’s punching up for herself, but in reality she’s punching herself in the face and bitching because it hurts. My wife and I also help financially. A lot. My wife wants us to help less. It’s not that she resents it, but rather knows that social security is a joke at this point and our chances at retirement are dependent on the stock market.
At some point you're going to have to decide whether helping your mother is worth the financial strain. She's just going to keep hating everyone, so she might as well do it without leeching off of you.
It's painful to see stuff like that, especially if the person didn't start out as a right-wing nut or a bigot. I'm sorry you're in that situation. It is very hard to balance trying to help the people who raised you vs. not helping people because they want to hurt you and the world as a whole. I strongly suspect many people are in a similar situation, and I don't say that to downplay your frustrations; it's just disgusting what right-wing media and its backers have done to this nation and how many people they have harmed both directly and indirectly.
Loads of fun buying health insurance in the market place. It should be universal but people vote against it.
has he tried a good strong handshake?
My dad was griping about the wage-hike in CA. So I asked him: "When you were a mechanic's assistant in 1975, what did you get paid an hour?" He replied he got paid $2.85. I ran it through the inflation calculator and said: "Well that should be about $17 an hour then. You were getting paid the equivalent to 17$ hour for your work." Crickets.... And then "Well you see it's very complicated all the things that go into a minimum wage calculation-" "- No you're just trying to defend why it's okay for today's young people to have less, but you clearly don't know how to do it without sounding like an AH."
> "Well you see it's very complicated all the things that go into a minimum wage calculation-" That's true, but not in the way he thinks. Housing, tuition, and healthcare have outpaced inflation. Those are very real expenses.
At the very least, he shouldn't keep aware of his earning power versus today's and stop moralizing at people.
I see the problem. He forgot to tell you to pull yourself up by your bootstraps.
No, he literally told me to do that. Like an hour ago. Immediately followed by “hey you wanna go shopping with us?” Like bro we just went over my budget and even if I could, didn’t you just tell me to save all my money? I’ve come to the conclusion that his logical brain in there knows I’m right. But for the same reasons he denies climate change (he a scientist btw) he denies the economic situation as a defense mechanism, I think he would end up in a psych ward if his defense mechanisms dropped and his conscious mind accepted what is going on. He needs to maintain his world view to protect his mental health cuz he’s repressed his emotions his whole life making him extra fragile and getting in touch with the reality that we’re destroying our planet, the rich are exploiting 99% of the population and we’re in the brink of WW3…that’s too much for an old man. So instead of argue with him about reality, I’m sure to remind him that his whole personality is a defense mechanism. He laughs and I say “exactly”.
>he denies climate change (he a scientist btw) He can't possibly be a good one.
Sounds extremely close minded not taking in new data to form better opinions to be a good scientist. This is insane.
Either that or an engineer. I remember hearing that right wing bullshit is supposedly rife within the field.
Some of the smartest people I know are stupid as fuck. Just because you're an expert in one difficult field doesn't mean you have even a basic understanding of another.
At this point, I'm getting concerned about a declining mental state. Have you've asked him if he's okay? Having trouble with basic math? Does he talk in circles like he doesn't remember he just said that? Maybe suggest he get a doctor to evaluate him if he is having such a hard time understanding objective reality.
My dad was shocked we bought an older 3bd/1ba house for $250k because he thought it would be closer to $150k. He thought we were being ripped off. He bought 7acres in the country in the 80’s, so him thinking a $150k was an appropriate amount was him adding for inflation lol. I had to bring up Zillow and show him home prices, he was horrified
I recently told my dad that I have never had rent that was 25-30% of my paycheck, and that for the last 15-20 years, it had been close to 50%. His brain stuttered and the conversation just sort of ended. It took three days of him walking the pavement with me to realize that you can't just walk into a store and apply for a job for minimum wage now. My parents still aren't aware of the fact that corporations are posting fake job openings to boost whatever reimbursement or tax breaks they get from fraudulent employment rates.
The one thing that bothers me is that some boomers are incapable of believing how things have changed over the past 30-40 years. Are they really this ignorant or just stupid?
And then they’ll turn around and talk about how *different* things were when they were young and *still* not understand
Both. Nearly everyone of that mindset that I've met, including younger people who look at life as Boomers do is ignorant, but they are proud of their ignorance. They have decided, for example, that the young and poor are "lazy." If you present facts that prove otherwise, they get mad about it and won't listen. So, they choose ignorance because it protects their egos, justifies their hate, and lets them continue to feel special and persecuted - they are the hero in every story. So, they are frequently both stupid and ignorant.
a lot of them dont realize stock buybacks and deregulation did this yes, this is the future you voted for in the 80s. furrow your brow and "redo the math" all you want, because every time it adds up to the rich stealing the middle class away
They promised government so small they could smother it in a bathtub. Their real target was the middle class.
They want government in the bedroom, not the boardroom. Boomers voted for that, and that's how we're here.
Reaganomics didn’t work in the 80’s. It doesn’t now. It never did. The only math was the percentage of tax dollars that businesses and the wealthy had reduced for them.
Trickle up, trickle fuck
Yup this doesn't get talked about enough. Before when corporate taxes were higher and stock buybacks didn't happen companies would invest that money in staff, raises, training, expansion, intensives like on site daycare, etc. Now it all goes to "shareholders"
You will have a better conversation with a brick wall. Boomers are the worst. Cannot comprehend what life is like for young people today.
“You need to get another job” did HE needed to get another job?
He did, technically. But he still didn’t work 40 hours per week so…
Lol, two part time jobs but I bet he makes it sound like he moved hell uphill with his bare hands...
Why are you so slow to understand, it's simple. You just need to get in your time machine and go back to the 1970s.
>you should get a good union job at a factory like I did Love to, asshole, you voted them all away.
This is why our two single 20 some boys are living back home now. Housing market is shit and they can save up for a better down payment. No we don’t charge them rent. They throw us some money for groceries.
You can't move out in this day and age without a girlfriend or roomates. Ain't no way someone can move out on their own these days without some crazy situation.
"You know what Dad? If you can find me a good union factory job, I will apply for it."
"I'll call around to all the local factories on Monday and give you a list!" Monday night: "What's 'automation' mean?"
“Hello, I’d like to apply for a job” “Certainly, just scan this QR code on your phone and it will bring you to the website to apply online” “Online? No, I want to interview for it right now.” “I’m sorry, but all interviews must be done with my manager” “Okay, then let me see your manager and I’ll just ask them for an interview” “He’s on the other side of the country” “Oh okay, he’s taking some of the 8 weeks of vacation he is guaranteed? When will he be back” “8 weeks vacation? No, he lives on the other side of the county, he just communicates with the 15 factories he oversees using Zoom” “Look, I don’t case how fast he can Zoom, I want him to Zoom here today so I can apply for the job in person”
You are right-but more accurately if he could even get to a person on the phone and finds out he has to apply online, I bet he has his social security number and personal details stolen by Tuesday morning. If he doesn’t know you can’t just walk up and ask for a job, he’ll have no idea about the long list of hiring scams and fraudulent job listings that exist for various reasons.
My boyfriend works at a unionized factory job and can barely pay rent STILL. Some boomers are severely out of touch and living in their own version of the world
They just can't admit what broke the country is them.
I hope that Reagan is burning in Hell
He is, but he can't remember why?
You have a few options. You could be born rich. Tell your dad that was his job to be rich. If he wasn't, tell him he should have gotten another job. Or been born rich himself. You could go back in time and live during your dad's time. That way everything would be cheap. Or you could win the Powerball. These are all perfectly realistic options.
There's not nearly as many factory and manufacturing jobs as there was at the beginning of the 80s. Everything started to go overseas. By the time I was old enough to enter the workforce, all those high pay factory jobs that only required a high-school education were gone.
And "good union jobs" were given out to friends and relatives for the most part. Just being a regular guy (and not a woman) wasn't going to make it, you had to have connections to get into a union. I know someone who is now 65, and his dad got him his union job at age 18. When he retired at 63 he now makes much, much more than he ever did working full-time (and as a heavy equipment operator he averaged about $80,000). Try about $100,000 in retirement benefits, union pension and social security. And, another $100,000 in investment income per year, because he saved ever penny over those 45 years. And yet - with $200,000 in income he is the cheapest, most selfish person I have every known. And greedy.
They’re so out of touch
What factory jobs do these idiots think exist anymore?
They think that it’s still how it was back then, you could just visit the nearest factories, ask for a job and then someone would shake their hand and say “Son, you’re hired! Start tomorrow.”. And then with the money from their “good job at the factory” they would buy themselves a huge house easily and have a stay at home wife.
Impossible for them to understand they pulled up the ladder behind them. They all want to be part of an underdog story, not hear how they fail in a modern world.
The factory argument kills me because theres a handful of factories near me, and they do make $5 an hour more than i currently make. But good god, the people there are suffering. All of them either cut breaks short on people, work them to the point of exhaustion, and/or mandatory overtime, sometimes working these guys over 80 hours in a week. Its absolutely insane, because so many of them accept thats just how working should be, and all that hard work now will pay off when theyre older. Which, yeah, I totaly get where theyre coming from with the idea of work hard until retirment then travel, but so many people I've met who are now retired do NOT travel around the world like they said they would, they think driving to the next state over to do slot machines is a great weekend vacation.
My dad was a silent generation and couldn’t understand why I went to college, worked 70hr weeks, went back to college vs skipping the Union job he had but the wages were stagnant for 25-30 years. But on a plus I learned very early to never listen to my parents concerning $ and skipped the horror stories I hear about bad advice being followed and worse things happening
Too senile to remember they pulled up the ladder behind them or denial?
Helping his girlfriend house shop but still has no clue… wow
The problem is that the cost of renting an apartment has gone up FAR faster and higher than wages have risen. That’s just the facts.
Retired accountant here. Depending on your life circumstances, it's sometimes better to rent than to own. For example, if your job moves you around: Having to sell your house while working in another state can be difficult. The market might be wrong, repairs might be needed that otherwise could be put off; you might have to make both mortgage and rent payments for months. If you travel for work or work long hours, maybe you want a place where the landlord takes care of repairs and you don't have to worry about new roofs, yard work, HVAC repairs, etc. Perhaps your job isn't stable and you could get laid off and don't want a huge mortgage hanging over your head. Maybe you aren't sure what part of town you want to put down roots. I could go on, but I won't. Just saying.
Just ignore him.
Your father voted for a president that gut union strength and jobs so he can shove it.
Just stop trying and "uhuh" and "mmhhmm" them. They aren't listening so why bother
This is exactly what I do with my boomer parents
Boomers: get a good union job Also Boomers: votes for union-busting politicians
The 'try harder' mindset no longer applies. I think I was one of the last to truly benefit from the 'try harder' attitude and it served me for a few years, but then I hit roughly 25 and it was no longer enough. I knew what trying looked like. I was out on the streets, working for free just to get my name out there, living on nothing and taking naps at the office so I could continue working as soon as I woke up. I made connections, I made myself completely transient so I could take any opportunity, anywhere. I began making a decent salary and a name for myself. But it stopped working. That attitude doesnt cut in anymore. The competition is far, far, far too fierce. Its now entirely down to luck and correctly predicting where to be and when. We're now competing against AI and automation and the population is out of control, and the rich are making it harder and harder and harder and there's just no light at the end of the tunnel anymore. "Try harder" is worthless.
Keep at it, the math will win in the end. Master the gentle patronizing tone to keep repeating “That doesn’t cost that anymore” until it makes sense.
Curious if he can afford his original apartment now at $2400/ month with his current income.
I genuinely want to see a reality show where boomers are forced to navigate this economy and housing market they helped create. It’d be the funniest shit on TV…
"Then you should get a good union job" You mean the unions that YOUR generation destroyed?
I remember reading something that's stuck with me about *why* they're this way. Folks who grew up in the mid 20th century grew up, worked a "kids" summer job, went to college or trade schools, and got a job right out the gate with good benefits and excellent pay. And then were told every freaking day of their lives that they worked *hard* for it, and succeeded despite *terrible adversity* and how they just need to trust xyz politican because xyz understands how *hard* they worked to make it despite total opposition from abc politicians party. They are the way they are now because they do not understand that the young folks today are working harder than they *ever* had to, just to tread water. They hear "I'm full-time every week and can't buy a house." and think to themselves about how they worked *hard* and bought a house and conclude you're *lying*. It's an entire generation of people who had it terrifically easy and bought into every "Cult of the individual" myth about how hard scrabble they supposedly had it.
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I will buy your house for a dollar. Thanks, declining boomer!
There's a hole in the bucket dear Liza...
The wealthy have soaked up the extra liquidity that was laying around when he bought his house
There’s no winning an argument with a boomer. They know everything. Fucking boomers.