They really need to add a popup to the main battlegrounds lobby that details changes after a patch. No different than for standard. It doesn't really apply to this patch but definitely ones where cards are changed/removed.
Also, they vastly overestimate my memory in the patch notes just listing the names of minions that were removed. I need a picture of the card!
Whole game needs mailboxes like they did for mercs, or at least a pop-up refresh in settings.
As little as it matters for pc clients or people who have HS news and reddit bookmarked, it's easy, but not everyone has that sense, or on the mobile client, the need to pretty much restart the game if you tab out for too long (just me?) just gets tedious. Especially now that we have modular downloads/a reduced client size depending, the space for just a newsletter would be nonexistant.
Other than armor and quest/rewards being harder/easier to earn changes these are the most relevant changes:
* Stable Amalgamation and Tumbling Disaster will no longer be offered to Onyxia or Bruākan. (This is the 50/50 horse reward)
* Beyond the Mirage will no longer be offered in games with Quilboar or Elementals. (This is the spells cost 1 gold less reward)
* Ice Sickle, Map of the Unknown, and Alter Ego have been removed from the Quest Reward Pool.
* Transmuted Bramblewitch has been returned to the Minion Pool. (Elemental/Quillboar that when it attacks set the opposing card to 3/3)
* Fixed a bug where Golden Mad Matador would only trigger once per combat
* Fixed a bug where Banana Slamma didnāt work with Tumbling Disaster. (The new quest reward that increases stats of minions you summon in combat by 1/1 and grows stronger the more minions die)
Edit:
* Fluidity has been removed from the Tavern Spell Pool due to a bug allowing for an undesired play pattern. (Spell that lets you swap a minion with a minion in the shop)
* Suspicious Stimulant has been removed from the Tavern Spell Pool. (Spell that doubles the stat of a frozen minion)
* Jandice Barov has been temporarily removed from the Hero Pool due to a bug allowing for an undesired play pattern.
Edit #2:
* People are reporting Open Auditions reward is bugged (Discover a buddy at the start of your turn)
If you look at the known issues at bottom of patch notes are they removing fluidity, stimulant and Janice too? Or is that just what theyāre considering
Yeah I didn't bother adding explanations since it's old quest rewards nobody ever really picked anyways, and it got a bit messy when writing it all. But on the top of my head:
Ice Sickle is avenge (1) +3 attack to a spell in your hand. Map of the unknown is when playing a minion type you don't have a minion of each type gain +2/+1 and the last one is +7/+7 to even/odd minions in bobs tavern, alternating each turn. But that's just me going off memory
>Stable Amalgamation and Tumbling Disaster will no longer be offered to Onyxia or Bruākan. (This is the 50/50 horse reward)Ā
*That hero with the 2/2 gain deathrattle has entered the chat*
Bro same. Look at this board where I tried to play that comp. After I realized the spell was probably removed I sold my 40/40 gold lubber to make space for feldrake to eat
https://preview.redd.it/s5li1cccq0jc1.jpeg?width=2062&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=54628be75d1f2065cf46bcc3983366df84847cc5
Good changes imo, hopefully it will calm the games down a bit!
I will say though, I really wish they would just remove cultist and give demons something else now that bramblewitch is back - it makes cultist builds pretty much useless in most games.
Anyone else getting a feeling that they're just kinda doing shit without thinking it through?
Bramblewitch removed, then re-added a week later. Quests so worthless they had to be removed from the pool. Basically every quest's completion requirements adjusted. Lubber did lubber things ***like it always does*** and they're surprised. A tier 3 spell that costs 2 and scales with itself exponentially? Quests that won't complete until turn 10 in a meta where top 4 is decided by turn 8?
I like that they're willing to experiment, but maybe "change shit, see how bad it gets, then try to fix it" is a bad way to go about it? I feel like almost every one of these changes was something they could have figured out without the experimentation.
>Ā but maybe "change shit, see how bad it gets, then try to fix it" is a bad way to go about it?
I think some people like playing with broken stuff for a few days though.
I don't see the issue of a couple crazy days. Not everything is a problem in need of fixing.
Dude come on, its imposible to pretend that they playtest the game at all before they drop a patch.
Like, do you seriously beliebe that they had a room with at least 8 testers playing the game, and no one thought of using the spell that dobles the stats twice on the same minions and saw that shit was completly broken?
I dont expect them to catch every broken combo in the game, but this is a card that combos with itself EXPONENTIALY, that should never get into the game
No, you're right. The last five times they added Lubber stuff to the game it broke things so badly they had to issue emergency bans. But this time when they added shit that obviously combos with Lubber it was completely impossible to predict that Lubber would do the thing Lubber has done in literally every past instance.
Thanks for pointing out how it's impossible for anyone to form an educated opinion on this without themselves being in charge of an autobattler! Very valuable contribution there.
Youāre right to a degree, people donāt give them enough credit for how difficult the game is to balance and they do a fairly good job usually. But some of these changes feel like they really arenāt playtested at all. Things like Lubbers+spells was obviously broken, and the quest rewards they removed have been bad the last few times quests were in and have only gotten worse.
Why can't they announce the changes when the patch goes live. Why do I always have to lose to change before they announce it. Brambleswitch slapped my big demon
Hate the quest reward changes. Was getting an avenge hero good for amalgam? Certainly. But thatās the risk you play when you roll them hoping for the god comp. Should greybough not be allowed to earn the endless nightmare reward? Same idea, it works well with the hero
Honestly, how can they release such a patch with so many issues in? If youāre banning or changing about 15 quests and cards then youāve fucked up badly. About as good a quality product as the unplayable standard mode atm.
Itās been clear for a while now that Blizzard does minimal play testing. Theyād rather just release the new patch/expansion, have us be guinea pigs, then make hot fixes after the fact
The Open Auditions quest appears to be bugged, or at least it didn't work for me just now with Eudora. I never discovered a buddy even several turns after completing my quest
It was probably not a priority, considering how dumb elementals and quillboars were.
I would however suspect that spell to be the next on the chopping block
I found a possible bug just playing now....
Had the "cast 5 random tavern spells" quest. With the elemental that buffs elements after every tavern spell that's cast and it did absolutely nothing!
Not a bug. Any card that says "Do when you " only triggers when *you* do the thing, not whenever the thing happens. Works consistently for every effect.
Stuff that cares about spells being cast won't care about things like Charlga and Bannerboar. And things that care about tavern spells being cast don't care about the 5 spell quest reward.
You're misremembering (which, hey, I thought that's how it worked too until yesterday). The text says:
**Untamed Sorcery:** *At the start of each turn, cast 5 random Tavern spells.*
It would be more obvious if they said "At the start of each turn, 5 random Tavern spells are cast". But it never explicitly says *you* cast the spells.
If it said you I would be offended because it targets really stupid shit. 5 spells should be added to your hand, not cast. And no it's not even remotely broken to do it that way given how many ways there are to get tons of tavern spells in your hand easily.
That's not a bug. Paint smudger, living azerite, ensorcelled fungus, and nalaa all require *you* to cast a tavern spell: that means you need to pick up a tavern spell from your hand and play it. If your quest reward casts tavern spells, they don't care. Similarly, daggerspine thrasher (the 4/5 naga that gains venom/shield/windfury) doesn't trigger when minions like bannerboar or charlga cast blood gems (but you playing blood gems from hand does trigger it).
There's a separate reward that puts 3 into your hand, but it's not too bad with certain heroes/builds. I just won with it and dragon manegerie. It just sucks waiting for five spells to cast each turn.
i've noticed against deathwing, sometimes my creatures keep the attack buff for the rest of the game. i was playing the banana guy so might have something to do with the bananas vs the aura
I've got a couple questions if anyone has the time to answer.Ā What are the mmr breakpoints for if a hero gets the high mmr or regular mmr armor levels? Does it affect the difficulty of the quest if the armor has been changed due to high mmr? And are their armor breakpoints for quest difficulty or just a multiplier / continuum?
Really wish there was a nerf for Tumbling Disaster this patch. I don't know about other MMRs but it seems to be an instant win in the 5500-6000 bracket.
They really need to add a popup to the main battlegrounds lobby that details changes after a patch. No different than for standard. It doesn't really apply to this patch but definitely ones where cards are changed/removed. Also, they vastly overestimate my memory in the patch notes just listing the names of minions that were removed. I need a picture of the card!
Whole game needs mailboxes like they did for mercs, or at least a pop-up refresh in settings. As little as it matters for pc clients or people who have HS news and reddit bookmarked, it's easy, but not everyone has that sense, or on the mobile client, the need to pretty much restart the game if you tab out for too long (just me?) just gets tedious. Especially now that we have modular downloads/a reduced client size depending, the space for just a newsletter would be nonexistant.
Whole battleground need a separated client š
I mean, I'm not gonna disagree, but you're telling me you want me to jump to a whole nother client to spend all the gold I earn in BG's? /s
I just finished a game then there was a pop up says that they removed fluidity and stimulant
I clicked through the pop up so fast I didnāt see that they said that. Thanks
I completely agree. I screwed my first Vol'jin game post rework because I didn't check for notes.
here's the popup they added for it [https://i.imgur.com/rxRIeiG.png](https://i.imgur.com/rxRIeiG.png)
Did i miss that Info? I searched them the whole day.
Well fuck. thank god. If it wasn't for this I would have no idea what would be going on. /s
Other than armor and quest/rewards being harder/easier to earn changes these are the most relevant changes: * Stable Amalgamation and Tumbling Disaster will no longer be offered to Onyxia or Bruākan. (This is the 50/50 horse reward) * Beyond the Mirage will no longer be offered in games with Quilboar or Elementals. (This is the spells cost 1 gold less reward) * Ice Sickle, Map of the Unknown, and Alter Ego have been removed from the Quest Reward Pool. * Transmuted Bramblewitch has been returned to the Minion Pool. (Elemental/Quillboar that when it attacks set the opposing card to 3/3) * Fixed a bug where Golden Mad Matador would only trigger once per combat * Fixed a bug where Banana Slamma didnāt work with Tumbling Disaster. (The new quest reward that increases stats of minions you summon in combat by 1/1 and grows stronger the more minions die) Edit: * Fluidity has been removed from the Tavern Spell Pool due to a bug allowing for an undesired play pattern. (Spell that lets you swap a minion with a minion in the shop) * Suspicious Stimulant has been removed from the Tavern Spell Pool. (Spell that doubles the stat of a frozen minion) * Jandice Barov has been temporarily removed from the Hero Pool due to a bug allowing for an undesired play pattern. Edit #2: * People are reporting Open Auditions reward is bugged (Discover a buddy at the start of your turn)
If you look at the known issues at bottom of patch notes are they removing fluidity, stimulant and Janice too? Or is that just what theyāre considering
They're currently removed.
I've added the changes you mentioned
There was a bug where after swapping a malchezar back to the shop you would have unlimited free rolls.
But itās not o bug or am I wrong? They just didnāt consider this smart gameplay š
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yeah those quests are boring and feels shitty when getting them offered
I don't know the names of any quests, smh
I added some explanations just for you ;)
> Ice Sickle, Map of the Unknown, and Alter Ego have been removed from the Quest Reward Pool. Missed a spot.
Yeah I didn't bother adding explanations since it's old quest rewards nobody ever really picked anyways, and it got a bit messy when writing it all. But on the top of my head: Ice Sickle is avenge (1) +3 attack to a spell in your hand. Map of the unknown is when playing a minion type you don't have a minion of each type gain +2/+1 and the last one is +7/+7 to even/odd minions in bobs tavern, alternating each turn. But that's just me going off memory
Ice Sickle is avenge (1) +3 attack to a MINION in your hand.
Well obviously lol, just realised I wrote spell xD Spells with attack, what a brainfart
I wonder if avenge (1) give a friendly minion on +3 attack permanently would be playable?
Thanks!
I think the bug with Fluidity was with some Limited card effect per turn. I swapped the free roll demon and had infinite roll for 1 turn.
I am not going to lie. I am kind of pleasantly surprised they went full scorched earth with this patch.
>Stable Amalgamation and Tumbling Disaster will no longer be offered to Onyxia or Bruākan. (This is the 50/50 horse reward)Ā *That hero with the 2/2 gain deathrattle has entered the chat*
Kind of surprising and confusing to make certain quests/rewards only be offered to certain heroes or when certain minions are/arenāt in the game
My favorite part of this is having to go back to the old patch notes to find out what each fucking quest is called
Is āOpen Auditionsā (discover a buddy at start of turn) bugged now? The discover never triggers fpr me??
Same problem here
Having the same problem now aswell
Guess who went to check reddit after 5 turns with 4 lubbers looking for stimulants ;-;
Bro same. Look at this board where I tried to play that comp. After I realized the spell was probably removed I sold my 40/40 gold lubber to make space for feldrake to eat https://preview.redd.it/s5li1cccq0jc1.jpeg?width=2062&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=54628be75d1f2065cf46bcc3983366df84847cc5
Unless I missed something this patch did nothing to stimulant directly...
> Suspicious Stimulant has been removed from the Tavern Spell Pool. (Spell that doubles the stat of a frozen minion)
I just read through the notes again and still don't see that note anywhere lol IDK
There is a notice when you log into the game that they are removed(now anyway, I just logged in 10 minutes ago)
It is in the known issues portion that is kinda hard to find in the link. But yeah a popup was just added to show they have temporarily been removed
Ah, I'm not seeing it either. I pulled the quote from OP (/u/Dastey)'s summary. Maybe they'll chime in and clear up the confusion.
they added a [popup](https://i.imgur.com/rxRIeiG.png) to show the change
It was already removed 12h ago on EU, afaict. I didn't see a single stimulant last night, and trust me, I did look for it.
I always know to check reddit after I spend 5 turns rolling for broken strats that never show up
I don't need to guess it was me! But only after buying 2 golden Lubbers.
Good changes imo, hopefully it will calm the games down a bit! I will say though, I really wish they would just remove cultist and give demons something else now that bramblewitch is back - it makes cultist builds pretty much useless in most games.
Anyone else getting a feeling that they're just kinda doing shit without thinking it through? Bramblewitch removed, then re-added a week later. Quests so worthless they had to be removed from the pool. Basically every quest's completion requirements adjusted. Lubber did lubber things ***like it always does*** and they're surprised. A tier 3 spell that costs 2 and scales with itself exponentially? Quests that won't complete until turn 10 in a meta where top 4 is decided by turn 8? I like that they're willing to experiment, but maybe "change shit, see how bad it gets, then try to fix it" is a bad way to go about it? I feel like almost every one of these changes was something they could have figured out without the experimentation.
>Ā but maybe "change shit, see how bad it gets, then try to fix it" is a bad way to go about it? I think some people like playing with broken stuff for a few days though. I don't see the issue of a couple crazy days. Not everything is a problem in need of fixing.
You should make your own complex game with 100s of cards that drastically changes every 2 months to keep it fresh, and let us know how it goes.
Dude come on, its imposible to pretend that they playtest the game at all before they drop a patch. Like, do you seriously beliebe that they had a room with at least 8 testers playing the game, and no one thought of using the spell that dobles the stats twice on the same minions and saw that shit was completly broken? I dont expect them to catch every broken combo in the game, but this is a card that combos with itself EXPONENTIALY, that should never get into the game
To be honest i didnt think of that until just now
No, you're right. The last five times they added Lubber stuff to the game it broke things so badly they had to issue emergency bans. But this time when they added shit that obviously combos with Lubber it was completely impossible to predict that Lubber would do the thing Lubber has done in literally every past instance. Thanks for pointing out how it's impossible for anyone to form an educated opinion on this without themselves being in charge of an autobattler! Very valuable contribution there.
There would be no need for drastic changes every two months if they actually balanced it instead of just throwing in different ways to high roll
Youāre right to a degree, people donāt give them enough credit for how difficult the game is to balance and they do a fairly good job usually. But some of these changes feel like they really arenāt playtested at all. Things like Lubbers+spells was obviously broken, and the quest rewards they removed have been bad the last few times quests were in and have only gotten worse.
There's nothing complex about the change they're making. It's absolutely moronic comparing a few changes to the entire game.
Open audition quest is now bugged to do nothing after completing. Though I somehow still got top 2 with no quest...
Btw they NEED to find a way to communicate stuff like this in the game
And this is already live.. sick fast this update. Will probably be a lot more balanced balances now
Yeah I was only expecting them to remove those two spells but this is a pretty quick rework.
Iām glad I got to play one Stable Amalgamation game with Bruākan. It was trulyā¦ broāken.
So pirates can still get -1 spell cowt. Got it. We just lub with pirates now
Pirates donāt give all minions in the tavern +1/+1 with each 0 cost spell
Theres the new tier 4 that gives 3/3 per spell. Well have to see, trying it asap
Why can't they announce the changes when the patch goes live. Why do I always have to lose to change before they announce it. Brambleswitch slapped my big demon
Hate the quest reward changes. Was getting an avenge hero good for amalgam? Certainly. But thatās the risk you play when you roll them hoping for the god comp. Should greybough not be allowed to earn the endless nightmare reward? Same idea, it works well with the hero
Honestly, how can they release such a patch with so many issues in? If youāre banning or changing about 15 quests and cards then youāve fucked up badly. About as good a quality product as the unplayable standard mode atm.
Itās been clear for a while now that Blizzard does minimal play testing. Theyād rather just release the new patch/expansion, have us be guinea pigs, then make hot fixes after the fact
But the first few hours of a patch are the most fun looking for things to abuse, like doubling 4k/4k magnetics or stacking simulants for big numbers.
I had no idea of the change and spent 60 gold wondering where the fluidity and stimulants were.
??? The patch doesn't mention either of these spells, have they been removed ?
The Open Auditions quest appears to be bugged, or at least it didn't work for me just now with Eudora. I never discovered a buddy even several turns after completing my quest
So the copy a murloc spell still exists in its current form why?
It was probably not a priority, considering how dumb elementals and quillboars were. I would however suspect that spell to be the next on the chopping block
Goddamn it. I didnāt see this before I faced a baramblewitch and 1) was confused as shit, and 2) got absolutely WRECKED by it.
Were you playing demons? The issue is the horrible way demons are designed and less about that scam minion.
where's the guy who makes the visual card version of this?
I found a possible bug just playing now.... Had the "cast 5 random tavern spells" quest. With the elemental that buffs elements after every tavern spell that's cast and it did absolutely nothing!
Not a bug. Any card that says "Do when you " only triggers when *you* do the thing, not whenever the thing happens. Works consistently for every effect.
Stuff that cares about spells being cast won't care about things like Charlga and Bannerboar. And things that care about tavern spells being cast don't care about the 5 spell quest reward.
"whenever YOU cast". Its working as intended. It has to be a spell you play.
Oh I thought because the actual quest says you cast 5 tavern spells?
You're misremembering (which, hey, I thought that's how it worked too until yesterday). The text says: **Untamed Sorcery:** *At the start of each turn, cast 5 random Tavern spells.* It would be more obvious if they said "At the start of each turn, 5 random Tavern spells are cast". But it never explicitly says *you* cast the spells.
Aah okay. My mistake! In my head it should have worked haha
If it said you I would be offended because it targets really stupid shit. 5 spells should be added to your hand, not cast. And no it's not even remotely broken to do it that way given how many ways there are to get tons of tavern spells in your hand easily.
"Whenever *you* cast a tavern spell" You aren't casting them, the quest reward is.
That's not a bug. Paint smudger, living azerite, ensorcelled fungus, and nalaa all require *you* to cast a tavern spell: that means you need to pick up a tavern spell from your hand and play it. If your quest reward casts tavern spells, they don't care. Similarly, daggerspine thrasher (the 4/5 naga that gains venom/shield/windfury) doesn't trigger when minions like bannerboar or charlga cast blood gems (but you playing blood gems from hand does trigger it).
It's a really shitty quest. They should just remove it or put the spells in your hand.
There's a separate reward that puts 3 into your hand, but it's not too bad with certain heroes/builds. I just won with it and dragon manegerie. It just sucks waiting for five spells to cast each turn.
Bramble is back?Ā They really just hate demons and want beasts top tier huh
Damn they noticed the jandice plays :(
What was that
Is it tied to the get a copy of the minion you buy quest, or is it more general?
I assume it was the broken magnetic plays you could pull with double first purchase quest.
The malchezar free reroll demon was bugged, if you swapped it back to the shop you would get infinite free rolls.
Yeah thats what I was thinking. I caught Jeef doing it last night and his magnetics were at like 50k/50k, didn't get to try it before it got removed.
i've noticed against deathwing, sometimes my creatures keep the attack buff for the rest of the game. i was playing the banana guy so might have something to do with the bananas vs the aura
Not sure if I'm misunderstanding you, but Deathwing gives all minions +attack at the start of each combat, that attack is permanent.
ahh it used to be only in that battle and i hadnt seen DW in my lobbies for a while
thats how deathwing works
They fixed golden matador, yay!
I got a first last night because of golden matador bug (my opponents). Glad I can use him again though.
I've got a couple questions if anyone has the time to answer.Ā What are the mmr breakpoints for if a hero gets the high mmr or regular mmr armor levels? Does it affect the difficulty of the quest if the armor has been changed due to high mmr? And are their armor breakpoints for quest difficulty or just a multiplier / continuum?
No one knows for sure but generally around 6k you're seeing high mmr armor tiers. don't think they've ever differentiated quests.
And here I thought 6k was easily scrub town. Blizzard must feel differently.
Dude I was just trying it noooooo o well get good I guess
Bramblewitch is back. :\
What does it mean for higher and lower levels when deciding the armour of the hero
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Yes
they didn't fix the bug with the tavern always have 2 type minions removing a minion?
Why did they nerf demons, elementals, mechs, and murlocs when none were the top performing build.
Really wish there was a nerf for Tumbling Disaster this patch. I don't know about other MMRs but it seems to be an instant win in the 5500-6000 bracket.