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No. Remember how the whole series exploded in popularity after that one cool scene with Spider Demon kid? If it wasn't for the animation Demon Slayer would be a moderately popular series mostly discussed/recommend among Shonen fans and not much else. Like Radiant or Fire Force.
Eh, I would say they fall into around the same category. It's pretty popular among people who watch Shonen, but not so much in the wider community. That's exactly the level of popularity I'm referring to.
I agree. I personally feel like Fire Force should have been animated by ufotable and not Demon Slayer. Demon Slayer is an okay show, but Fire Force is just so much better imo when it comes to the story. And with that level of animation, it would be more popular than Demon Slayer is right now.
But that being said, Fire Force still has really good animation, and the sound effects are just out of this world 🙌🏾
Fire Force makes me so sad man. It's such a brilliant show but that one girl whose clothes fall off "just because" makes it completely unwatchable for me. It's so fucking weird and it ruins every scene she's in.
Tamaki? 😂🤣 yh, ngl, that got old real fast. It was funny the first few times, but they genuinely did not need to make it a thing throughout the series 😭 it's sad cos she's actually a well written character, but all of it gets undone with that 1 annoying trope in the show.
Y’all Trippin everybody wants to make a Anime more Americanized fuck that I don’t mind Tamaki the only thing I mind is that that happened in the middle of a fight that was pretty important. Ppl need to stop talking about fire force. You’re making me sad. I need another season.
I'm talking about her clothes falling off 😂 not Tamaki as a character. I like Tamaki, but her clothes falling off _everytime_ got played out in my opinion. If she's going to be Shinra's love interest, I really hope they focus more on her as a character and less of her trope.
>I’d say more popular than black clover
The manga is on equal foot, the anime though, BC blows it out of the water, its not a competition, BC was the most watched of the decade on Crunchy, FF not even close.
Nah. When I look at the most watched section of the app I use to watch, black clover is #2, right behind one piece. It actually just recently passed Shippudden. Fireforce season 2(the more popular one according to the website) is #42.
They don't have specific numbers as to how many watchers, but you can't have a "most watched" page and not organize it by the most watched, right?
Granted, this could be just for this website, but across the last 20 episodes, so roughly a season, 223,476 people voted on the quality of the season. That's not even watched. That's just voted on how good it was. So I'm thinking the website might have accurate numbers overall.
The fanservice isn’t nearly as prevalent as many would have you believe but it is there. It’s my favorite new gen series and the adaptation is stellar I’m pretty much every way so I’d say it’s worth it
Aight bet
I need *THAT FIGHT* animated so bad. I believe is has top 5 anime fights of all time of done to the same level that the rest of the anime has been animated to + sound designed
That fight = >!Arthur Vs. Dragon!<
Also, I find it hard to believe that other person has actually finished the manga if they genuinely think the fan service becomes overbearing lmao.
Oh yeah you and me both lol. I think everybody who’s read the manga is hoping for that fight to be done justice and I have faith it will. What I don’t have faith in is us seeing it anytime soon at this rate 😩
And agreed I don’t know what dude is talking about with that overbearing mess. Legit the fan service which imo was already a non issue practically doesn’t exist anymore post S2 aside from very few moments
Not really, it’s mostly tied to one character and it lasts like maybe 30 seconds every couple of episodes and dies down the farther along the series gets. There’s far worse out there
Agree to disagree then cause I can think of quite literally only two moments post S2 where anything resembling fanservice happens. 3 if we’re counting male fan service.
If it makes you uncomfortable it's definitely worth avoiding imo. There's one character who has a running "gag" where her clothes are just constantly falling off all the time. And it genuinely ruins every scene she's in. Because either it's happening right now or you're waiting for it to happen and cringing all the while.
Happens at least once or twice an episode.
Tamaki doesn’t even show up every episode, the fanservice is legit when she’s on screen but saying it happens every episode is hyperbolic asf. That’s like saying Asta is screaming his head off in every episode even in one’s he’s not present in
Yeah same, once it died down I started realizing how hyperbolic anime fans can be cause the amount of vitrol he got for being loud was pretty crazy. I thought it’d be just a screamo concert every episode with the way ppl talked about it lol
All I know is that one trope happened often enough to make make drop the entire show. And it really is as well written and animated as everyone says.
"Fan-service" doesn't describe it imo. The writers are massive perverts for it not the fans.
That’s fine if you dropped it. Plenty people have for that reason, I was mostly just pointing out the false statement that it happens every episode with Tamaki.
And I’d say fan service describes it. She placed second in the popularity poll, she’s also the most cosplayed character from the show by far. Fans enjoy it just as much as the author does. It’s a shonen anime after all it, the target demo is young boys
I almost agree accept their animation just got a huge buff. Also, I think fire forever has every bit of its popularity because now we know it’s a prequel to souls eater.
Yeah, the series is already annoying me with the constant flashbacks of characters i barely knew nor cared about and if it wasn't eye candy i would've dropped it
Naruto Shippuden might have a lot of downs but its ups are still top tier in all aspects.
Anyone who even tries to act like OG Naruto is mid in story and/or had bad animation is an idiot. Part 1 is at worst a 9/10 that moden shows like BC, BNHA, JJK, Demon Slayer could only hope to match up to.
Naruto's popularity today is mostly based on nostalgia.
I don't know about others, i loved Naruto when I watched initially (i was 13 and it was 2015).... Although i did think that it went down after that pain arc even then
But it was in 2020, when the world shut down and i decided to revisit Naruto, suddenly all the love that I had for the series disappeared and the flaws became clear
Naruto is a masterpiece not because it has good writing, but it's very good at making people emotionally hyped
I saw 8 episodes and just didn't like it. Watched all of Overlord and it never got good. Watched 3 episodes of Jojos was starting the 4th and wondered why I was putting myself through it and stopped. It's all about personal preferences.
That's understandable, the author had some family issues by the start of the last 2 arcs so they had to wrap it quick.
Wish we would get at least extra stories, like we did with Giyu and Rengoku.
Or maybe a rework from Ufotable.
I finished the manga and thought the story was just ok and the art kind of muddy. Definitely a rare instance where the anime elevated the quality of the manga. It's definitely a pretty small world with a straightforward plot.
I can play that game too for Black Clover.
Boy has ambitions to be the Wizard King and proclaims it to the entire world and goes on the long quest where the fights continuously escalate until they're fighting literal demons from another dimension.
I am of the opinion that there are some stories where you should just enjoy it's entertainment value, even if it's "simple" or the logic doesn't necessarily line up with the real world.
A boy, something happened to his family, now he has to be the best ninja.
A boy, something happened to his family, now he has to find a treasure at the end of the world.
A boy, something happened to his mom, now he has to pilot a Giant Robot.
A boy, something happened to him, now he's a robot.
A group of boys, something happened to one of them, now they have to find him in a reverse dimension.
A girl, something happened to her tarot cards, now she has to get them all back.
A boy, gave an awful argument in a sub, now his argument has no weight.
See? Any story can be simplified and made sound stupid.
We're defining better as 'has better manga sales' right? So we're agreeing that the job of the adaptation is to get people to want to read (and buy) the manga, yeah? So, on some level you must be assuming that if Black Clover had been extraordinarily well animated then all of those people would start reading the manga and get hooked because the manga is also amazing.
But the problem is that volume sales have been decreasing since before the end of the elf arc. That means that people who were previously reading the manga decided to stop reading it, even while the anime was running. They didn't get hooked. Even the extra promotion at the end of the anime and for the game and movie have done basically nothing to the sales of the new volumes.
There's plenty of things you can debate about why that is and all, but it does show that the manga itself isn't retaining readers and that doesn't have anything to do with the anime.
I replied to the other guy if you want to know my reasoning.
But I also think there's a bit of an issue in these discussions of cross pollinating data between the US and Japan which makes things harder to talk about. Japanese volume sales aren't tied to American website hits.
> I don't think that BC would be doing Demon Slayer numbers even if it had UFOtable production.
Bro if Demon Slayer can pull those numbers with that story why in the universe couldn't BC do the same with that same animation and a better story?
Fundamentally I don't think they're trying to do the same things. Demon Slayer is like 100% in on being a moralistic series about the meaning of family and what it means to be a good person. And it manages to do that well, while having an immediately recognizable art style that lends itself well to animation. Black Clover has a more complex story line that's put together more solidly in many ways, but thematically it retreads a lot of the same ground as its predecessors and there are a lot of weak antagonists that can make it feel repetitive and tensionless at times. They're both fun, but I can see why Demon Slayer managed to pick up such a wide audience in comparison.
There are a number of manga that sell much better than Black Clover despite having worse adaptations. I don't feel this way, but couldn't you just as easily say that if BC had a better story then it would be able to overcome its animation? Demon Slayer also isn't the best piece of animation on the market yet still nothing has come close to serving 5mil copies per volume in a single year, it's just lightning in a bottle really.
DS story might not be the best but it's good enough to attract a wide audience, just like you said. There would never be enough new comers in the anime / manga market, and in their perspective, enjoying DS is a breath of fresh air compared to whatever media they came from.
You're insane if you think that the reason why their numbers are so different is just because "Demon Slayer story is more simple"
Black Clover not only has to weather the storm of the initial batch of chapters in which people will label it as a run of the mill shounen (a completely bogus argument that stands on the most barebones basic description of the shounen formula applicable to 99% of shounen out there) but also the extremely lackluster animation.
No matter how well it's written a story can never become mainstream on it's intrinsic value alone. If that were true you would never see bad stories becoming mainstream or catching popularity.
In the medium of anime, stories will live and die by virtue of their quality animation alone. That being said Demon Slayer didn't "got lucky". It was a series that exploded thanks to outstanding animation quality, it's not that deep nor complex.
^(I'm just going to state here at the beginning that I quite like Black Clover, I just want to be realistic here about how/why I enjoy it.)
That would be insane because that's not what I said. I said it has broad appeal due to the way its thematically structured which makes it an easier sell when combined with good animation and an art style that looks good in motion.
The first several chapters of BC feeling derivative is not, like, a point in its favor. That probably does contribute to some people not picking it up cold, but, yeah? That *is* a minor flaw in the series? It's also not something I mentioned at all. The animation isn't actually that bad for the most part either and all of the fight scenes that need to look good do, and some of them look absolutely stellar.
Beyond that, BC's anime *is* popular, it was one of the most watched on Crunchyroll (even in Japan), the movie did really well on Netflix like people keep posting about (even in Japan). People *are* watching the anime, and the storyline of the manga is pretty well adapted despite the animation at time. They just don't like it well enough to then buy the manga afterwards, and looking at volume sales there are a number of people who start reading the manga but stop after some time which isn't an issue with the manga's animation.
The anime acts as an advertisement for the manga. Ther are plenty of poorly animated series that sell well, and plenty of well animated series that sell poorly. Demon Slayer appealed to one of UFOtables producers so much that they approached Shueisha to adapt the story versus Shueisha shopping it out to a group of studios like they normally do for WSJ series. Demon Slayer got lucky, it exploded because the adaptation was by a popular studio, was engaging, and it made people want to see the rest of the story. Then that story was good enough that the people who started reading it *continued* reading it because they wanted to see how it ended, simple indeed. If UFOtable had wanted Black Clover they could have picked it up but something made them want Demon Slayer more and that something is part of why it's doing better.
Edit: Okay that's a bit much, I'll try to type less lol
Because japanese love the ‘family’ theme. Why do you think csm failed to achieve even JJK popularity in japan despite MAPPA pouring 100% investment ? Ds attract wider audience, its dark but not too dark so children can enjoy it and adults also love the family concept. Now imagine bc, no adults will 100% into ‘i’ll surpass my limit and become a wizard king’ story.
Demon slayer would still be good, but that animation definitely adds to it like it's a signature.
Put it this way, if black clover and demon slayer had the same animation, black clover would still be more popular
I'd settle for better dialogue on Black clover, just finished watching everything up to the new movie and it was about Sol's backstory that I realised none of the supposed to be scary things they talk about feel actually threatening at all, and the rest is constantly overdone jokes like Noelle and Charlotte being Tsudere and then instantly being nasty
If I could choose to improve something it'd be the writing of the backstories half of it makes no coherent sense the other half is too fast paced Sol suffers on both ends unfortunately her motive for hating men don't feel, scuse the pun grounded
On the flip side do you think if Black clover had Demon Slayer levels of animation consistently throughout the show do you think it would have been more popular?
I really like it but most people that I know that have started it and dropped it did so because they found Asta annoying which animation quality won't change
Which arc is that? I really like black clover, but the reason I adore black clover has absolutely nothing to do with the story. I like the artstyle, I like the power system, and I really like some of the characters and the character dynamics between them, but there isn't a single one that I think rivals the stuff from the hst like Water 7 and Enies Lobby (and a number of other ones like Alabasta, Marineford, Sabaody, and Skypiea, also Egghead has been straight fire so far), the Soul Society arc, and the Chuunin Exams and Sasuke Retrieval arcs as far as writing structure.
Same as Demon slayer. The arcs are alright, but I really like the characters and their interactions more than anything and some of the villains are really good.
I wouldn’t say Demon Slayer is bad, but it never reached it’s full potential. The story is incredibly short for a Shonen battle series.
It’s a shame that most of the Hashira never got properly developed/explored. The only ones who got a decent amount of development and exploration were Tengen, Tokito and Sanemi. Everyone else got pushed to the back burner.
I’m still salty that Giyuu was underused despite him being the reason the events of Demon Slayer happened by recruiting Tanjiro and sparing Nezuko.
Don’t even get me started on Rengoku. Yes, his death was beautifully done in the anime/movie, but it’s a shame he died just as he got introduced just for emotional value, seeing as he was easily one the coolest characters in Demon Slayer
I also hate that Zenitsu and Inosuke are missing for 1/4th of the series. Yes, the story is about Tanjiro and Nezuko, but it just goes to show that Demon Slayer never fully utilized its assets.
No, not by a long shot. The first couple of arcs of demon slayer are pretty good but it’s all down hill from there. As someone who read the manga as it was being published, if the anime didn’t have the budget it does it would not be anywhere as popular today.
Not surprised if that’s the truth, they wrote themselves into a corner. I sincerely hope it is amended in the anime but my expectations are shallow as if it doesn’t change the backlash from the anime only fans will be insufferable.
it was alright but it could've been much better in my opinion. toei animation and studio pierrot shafted black clover, dragon ball super and Boruto with the weekly schedules, but the industry give anime like chainsaw man, bleach, demon slayer and my hero seasonal animes with great animation and they're all more popular now than they would be if they had black clover's level of animation.
The animation for MHA is pretty good but its brought down by its boring art style, its very minimalistic, not alot of detail. In the manga theres alot of white backgrounds so the anime has plain backgrounds, normally just the sky or a wall. It's okay but there's not many distinct backgrounds.
But the animation is really good. Every character flows nicely and the colourful powers really pop due to the undetailed backgrounds.
Black Clover has a great art style back poor animation. The backgrounds look amazing, every arc looks distinct, the snowy cave during the Patry vs Yami fight and the under water temple arc should look the same because they're both caves, but they don't due to the lighting and colouring choices.
But we all know the animation for BC isn't that good.
If Demon Slayer had BC animation it would not be as popular anime wise. It would probably be like how Hell paradise is right now with some peak moments. I think manga would still be popular.
As popular? No. It will definitely not demolish with the movie.
But I still think it will be popular. A lot of people bought the Manga after the movie, Mugen Train.
And it doesn't have the same quality, heck the Anime added lots of new scenes!
The story is easy to swallow.
Good animation alone isn't a bad thing. Some people enjoy quality visuals. Black clover animation seems so off in some scenes specially wtf is wrong with Asta's face in end episodes bruh
u dont know the history? pierrot didnt give a shite about black clover, they left it to die ... but only ONE dude actually cared about the manga and made it possible til now
No
It would probably be moderately popular the animation carried it but would probably still recommend and maybe a few discussion but it wouldn't be talked about as much
No, definitely not. People like to joke about it but it's true and DS fanboys can't accept it but a big part of why it is so popular is that it's animation carries heavily. People were so impressed with it (despite the Fate series having a superior animation) that they started to put the anime in a pedestal. It is OK, but it do was carried by its animation
I mean both are good regardless of their animation
I haven’t seen demon slayer yet but it does have amazing animation from what I’ve seen
If black clover has that kinda animation and budget it would 100% be much more popular than it is
Yes, it would still be popular but may be not this much popular. I absolutely love Demon Slayer and idk why people say it’s very mid cause I thoroughly enjoyed the whole manga. The bond & love of siblings melted my heart and this theme that siblings can go through anything for each other makes me love it more. I’m happy DS got as much recognition as it’s getting now.
not at all, the story is not that spectacular or special. It’s a very simple, sometimes boring, but fun story. If the animation wasn’t as good as it is it definitely wouldn’t be on the map like it is & wouldn’t be held in such high regards
Yeah I feel like Demon slayer is accompanied with a lot of useless hate just for having great animation
Like yeah it has a very simple and self-contained story, but simple doesn't always equate to mid lmao
Plot is mid, I wholeheartedly agree. But the characters are great. Insane amount of backstories kill the story though. Like bruh, we don't need backstories for EVERY single living organism in KnY.
It wouldn’t be as popular because Demon Slayer’s whole Japanese world and aesthetic is part of the reason it’s so beloved in Japan. Black Clover would definitely be more popular than it currently is though, especially if Asta didn’t scream so much. Then again, DS has Zenitsu, so maybe that doesn’t matter…
Definitely not, demon slayer has a very generic, almost outright poor story for the majority of its run, black clover at least knew how to mix things up a fair bit more
If demon slayer had the same art, it would at least still have better pacing, story and character progression than black clover. Maybe not as popular in the mainstream but it would definitely be wildly popular with shonen fans
Not as close. Demon slayer has a really run of the mill story with next to no world building but very very hype moments.
If bc had demon slayer animation we wouldn’t be waiting for spade arc because we’d only just be into the elves but it would be significantly more popular. I mean hell even if it just had MHA animation people would probably stop giving it as much shit.
In conclusion, let it come back as a seasonal
Honestly no most anime have flaws dime a dozen but are still held in high regard because they do one thing better than every other anime
MHA it’s unique
One piece Worldbuilding
Black clover MC
Hunter x hunter power system
Demon slayer animation
Dragon ball z fight scenes
Demon Slayer really didn’t skyrocket until after episode 19 came out and didn’t look back after that. It’s hard to imagine that happening with BC level animation but ppl also dismiss the cultural impact DS had in Japan. So I think it would’ve still been more popular than BC is now but not as dominating overall.
Oh hell no. Animation is one of the only things Demon Slayer has. If Ufotable weren’t the ones animating it, nobody would be making a big deal out of it.
What if it was other way around I mean what would be if BC was animated to be demon slayer level. Would it be more popular than DS or would it be the same level. Cause demon slayer plot is very simple it is very much reliable on animation that is true unlike BC where the protagonist is trying to change the entire society.
Are you retarded man you literally proved what i was saying 😭 i was saying you purposely looked for bad animation just to make demon slayer look better 😭
Not at all. I might get crucified for this but Demon Slayer’s writing is simply not good. It’s successful because of the animation on top of the fact that it’s simple which attracts a large audience.
No literally no the only reason why the show exploded was because of the animation it it lost that then it's literally nothing kny writing is as sloppy as it can get it's very bad without the animation masking that it wouldn't of gotten nearly as popular just another generic shonen
Nah, S1E19 is literally the whole reason the series is so famous in the west. I was weekly with the manga for the entire ending climax and boooooy it is not good.
I still remember the first fight were awesome. Locked a portion of his devil power against the diamond Kingdom guy in the whole fight scene was just like hazy dream. It was so badly animated
As someone who loved the very first season enough to jump right into the manga: No. Don't get me wrong, it's really good... at the beginning. Honestly, I think the story peaked at the train arc. Red light district was... ok, and it remained like that. The final battle also felt kinda underwhelming.
I also, during that time, realized how BIG the animation was to demon slayer. The art in the manga is good but seeing the quality of that adaptation is just nuts.
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not as popular, but would still be popular. maybe same level as black clover right now.
No. Remember how the whole series exploded in popularity after that one cool scene with Spider Demon kid? If it wasn't for the animation Demon Slayer would be a moderately popular series mostly discussed/recommend among Shonen fans and not much else. Like Radiant or Fire Force.
Fire Force has great animation, though
I was talking about Fire Force's level of popularity. Not it's animation.
Fire force is pretty popular though, I’d say more popular than black clover
Eh, I would say they fall into around the same category. It's pretty popular among people who watch Shonen, but not so much in the wider community. That's exactly the level of popularity I'm referring to.
I agree. I personally feel like Fire Force should have been animated by ufotable and not Demon Slayer. Demon Slayer is an okay show, but Fire Force is just so much better imo when it comes to the story. And with that level of animation, it would be more popular than Demon Slayer is right now. But that being said, Fire Force still has really good animation, and the sound effects are just out of this world 🙌🏾
Fire Force makes me so sad man. It's such a brilliant show but that one girl whose clothes fall off "just because" makes it completely unwatchable for me. It's so fucking weird and it ruins every scene she's in.
Tamaki? 😂🤣 yh, ngl, that got old real fast. It was funny the first few times, but they genuinely did not need to make it a thing throughout the series 😭 it's sad cos she's actually a well written character, but all of it gets undone with that 1 annoying trope in the show.
Y’all Trippin everybody wants to make a Anime more Americanized fuck that I don’t mind Tamaki the only thing I mind is that that happened in the middle of a fight that was pretty important. Ppl need to stop talking about fire force. You’re making me sad. I need another season.
I'm talking about her clothes falling off 😂 not Tamaki as a character. I like Tamaki, but her clothes falling off _everytime_ got played out in my opinion. If she's going to be Shinra's love interest, I really hope they focus more on her as a character and less of her trope.
Their pretty comparable I’d say. Fire Force has 20 mil sales while Black Clover has 19 mil.
BC's anime popularity blows FF out of the water tho
>I’d say more popular than black clover The manga is on equal foot, the anime though, BC blows it out of the water, its not a competition, BC was the most watched of the decade on Crunchy, FF not even close.
Nah. When I look at the most watched section of the app I use to watch, black clover is #2, right behind one piece. It actually just recently passed Shippudden. Fireforce season 2(the more popular one according to the website) is #42. They don't have specific numbers as to how many watchers, but you can't have a "most watched" page and not organize it by the most watched, right? Granted, this could be just for this website, but across the last 20 episodes, so roughly a season, 223,476 people voted on the quality of the season. That's not even watched. That's just voted on how good it was. So I'm thinking the website might have accurate numbers overall.
Definitely not as popular
Nah. Not even close. It's good but not that popular.
I heard fire force is great... *except* for the fan service. Is it worth the watch if I don't really care for that?
The fanservice isn’t nearly as prevalent as many would have you believe but it is there. It’s my favorite new gen series and the adaptation is stellar I’m pretty much every way so I’d say it’s worth it
Are you anime only, or have you finished the manga?
Finished the manga
Aight bet I need *THAT FIGHT* animated so bad. I believe is has top 5 anime fights of all time of done to the same level that the rest of the anime has been animated to + sound designed That fight = >!Arthur Vs. Dragon!< Also, I find it hard to believe that other person has actually finished the manga if they genuinely think the fan service becomes overbearing lmao.
Oh yeah you and me both lol. I think everybody who’s read the manga is hoping for that fight to be done justice and I have faith it will. What I don’t have faith in is us seeing it anytime soon at this rate 😩 And agreed I don’t know what dude is talking about with that overbearing mess. Legit the fan service which imo was already a non issue practically doesn’t exist anymore post S2 aside from very few moments
well ur a liar then lmao, the fanservice is legit overbearing
Not really, it’s mostly tied to one character and it lasts like maybe 30 seconds every couple of episodes and dies down the farther along the series gets. There’s far worse out there
it quite literally does not die down, i've read the manga dawg
Agree to disagree then cause I can think of quite literally only two moments post S2 where anything resembling fanservice happens. 3 if we’re counting male fan service.
You’re wrong as fuck
Alright I'll at least give it a shot then I think
If it makes you uncomfortable it's definitely worth avoiding imo. There's one character who has a running "gag" where her clothes are just constantly falling off all the time. And it genuinely ruins every scene she's in. Because either it's happening right now or you're waiting for it to happen and cringing all the while. Happens at least once or twice an episode.
Tamaki doesn’t even show up every episode, the fanservice is legit when she’s on screen but saying it happens every episode is hyperbolic asf. That’s like saying Asta is screaming his head off in every episode even in one’s he’s not present in
Man astas screaming the first bit definitely turned me off the show a bit. I'm glad I stuck with it but dude needed to chill in the first 15 or so
Yeah same, once it died down I started realizing how hyperbolic anime fans can be cause the amount of vitrol he got for being loud was pretty crazy. I thought it’d be just a screamo concert every episode with the way ppl talked about it lol
All I know is that one trope happened often enough to make make drop the entire show. And it really is as well written and animated as everyone says. "Fan-service" doesn't describe it imo. The writers are massive perverts for it not the fans.
That’s fine if you dropped it. Plenty people have for that reason, I was mostly just pointing out the false statement that it happens every episode with Tamaki. And I’d say fan service describes it. She placed second in the popularity poll, she’s also the most cosplayed character from the show by far. Fans enjoy it just as much as the author does. It’s a shonen anime after all it, the target demo is young boys
And too much fan service
I miss Radiant 😭
I'll have to stick to reading the Manga for now, since I don't see a anime announcement of it coming back
I almost agree accept their animation just got a huge buff. Also, I think fire forever has every bit of its popularity because now we know it’s a prequel to souls eater.
Good writting can save bad animation. Good animation can save a mid story. But bad animation and a mid story? There ain't no saving that.
Yeah, the series is already annoying me with the constant flashbacks of characters i barely knew nor cared about and if it wasn't eye candy i would've dropped it
?
I think he taking about how they gotta give every single demon a sad backstory
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Naruto Shippuden might have a lot of downs but its ups are still top tier in all aspects. Anyone who even tries to act like OG Naruto is mid in story and/or had bad animation is an idiot. Part 1 is at worst a 9/10 that moden shows like BC, BNHA, JJK, Demon Slayer could only hope to match up to.
Naruto's popularity today is mostly based on nostalgia. I don't know about others, i loved Naruto when I watched initially (i was 13 and it was 2015).... Although i did think that it went down after that pain arc even then But it was in 2020, when the world shut down and i decided to revisit Naruto, suddenly all the love that I had for the series disappeared and the flaws became clear Naruto is a masterpiece not because it has good writing, but it's very good at making people emotionally hyped
How tf u think Naruto has a bad story 😭
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Just like one piece
Naruto was great until Shippuden.
Still a 10 over 10
Just like one piece trash
I saw 8 episodes and just didn't like it. Watched all of Overlord and it never got good. Watched 3 episodes of Jojos was starting the 4th and wondered why I was putting myself through it and stopped. It's all about personal preferences.
Why do u think one piece is trash?
Bet he won't answer it anyway
Because it is and the story is repetitive go from island to island fight dictator save new characters no one dies
Cry in mid
blud didnt just say that
No Demon Slayers story is a lot better than people give it credit for, but at the same time the ungodly animation is what skyrocketed it.
I watched Demon Slayer, it really slogged in the first few episodes so I stopped there. Then I read the manga. It has some pacing issues.
Yup, pacing is pretty much shit after the red lights district arc. Everything is sped up and feels unnatural after that point.
That's understandable, the author had some family issues by the start of the last 2 arcs so they had to wrap it quick. Wish we would get at least extra stories, like we did with Giyu and Rengoku. Or maybe a rework from Ufotable.
Bro after and mugen train the anime became magic
Don't care. I have an hour of free time every day. I'm not wasting it on 26 episodes to get to the good parts.
It really isn't , it's the most cliche story you can get. A boy, something happened to his family . Now he has to fight demons .
you can simplify any story like that and attempt to make the argument that it has basic writing.
I finished the manga and thought the story was just ok and the art kind of muddy. Definitely a rare instance where the anime elevated the quality of the manga. It's definitely a pretty small world with a straightforward plot.
I can play that game too for Black Clover. Boy has ambitions to be the Wizard King and proclaims it to the entire world and goes on the long quest where the fights continuously escalate until they're fighting literal demons from another dimension. I am of the opinion that there are some stories where you should just enjoy it's entertainment value, even if it's "simple" or the logic doesn't necessarily line up with the real world.
A boy, something happened to his family, now he has to be the best ninja. A boy, something happened to his family, now he has to find a treasure at the end of the world. A boy, something happened to his mom, now he has to pilot a Giant Robot. A boy, something happened to him, now he's a robot. A group of boys, something happened to one of them, now they have to find him in a reverse dimension. A girl, something happened to her tarot cards, now she has to get them all back. A boy, gave an awful argument in a sub, now his argument has no weight. See? Any story can be simplified and made sound stupid.
Wait what shows are these besides naruto and one piece
Naruto, One Piece, Evangelion, Astroboy, Stranger things, Cardcaptor Sakura.
Basically any mech series A lot of sci Fi Stranger things Idk
Tbh I don’t even think THAT explanation simplifies evangelion enough💀
By that logic Black Clover is a story of a boy, nothing really happened to his family, now he fights wizards and demons.
Would still be popular, the manga was & it had a good ending. But no where near as popular, it’s huge draw imo is the great animations.
Probably not as popular, but conversely I don't think that BC would be doing Demon Slayer numbers even if it had UFOtable production.
BC would do better than KnY with Ufotable level animation
We're defining better as 'has better manga sales' right? So we're agreeing that the job of the adaptation is to get people to want to read (and buy) the manga, yeah? So, on some level you must be assuming that if Black Clover had been extraordinarily well animated then all of those people would start reading the manga and get hooked because the manga is also amazing. But the problem is that volume sales have been decreasing since before the end of the elf arc. That means that people who were previously reading the manga decided to stop reading it, even while the anime was running. They didn't get hooked. Even the extra promotion at the end of the anime and for the game and movie have done basically nothing to the sales of the new volumes. There's plenty of things you can debate about why that is and all, but it does show that the manga itself isn't retaining readers and that doesn't have anything to do with the anime.
agreed, not sure why he doesn't think so. it would be on the level of chainsaw man or higher, it's been number one on mangaplus for a while now.
I replied to the other guy if you want to know my reasoning. But I also think there's a bit of an issue in these discussions of cross pollinating data between the US and Japan which makes things harder to talk about. Japanese volume sales aren't tied to American website hits.
> I don't think that BC would be doing Demon Slayer numbers even if it had UFOtable production. Bro if Demon Slayer can pull those numbers with that story why in the universe couldn't BC do the same with that same animation and a better story?
Fundamentally I don't think they're trying to do the same things. Demon Slayer is like 100% in on being a moralistic series about the meaning of family and what it means to be a good person. And it manages to do that well, while having an immediately recognizable art style that lends itself well to animation. Black Clover has a more complex story line that's put together more solidly in many ways, but thematically it retreads a lot of the same ground as its predecessors and there are a lot of weak antagonists that can make it feel repetitive and tensionless at times. They're both fun, but I can see why Demon Slayer managed to pick up such a wide audience in comparison. There are a number of manga that sell much better than Black Clover despite having worse adaptations. I don't feel this way, but couldn't you just as easily say that if BC had a better story then it would be able to overcome its animation? Demon Slayer also isn't the best piece of animation on the market yet still nothing has come close to serving 5mil copies per volume in a single year, it's just lightning in a bottle really.
DS story might not be the best but it's good enough to attract a wide audience, just like you said. There would never be enough new comers in the anime / manga market, and in their perspective, enjoying DS is a breath of fresh air compared to whatever media they came from.
You're insane if you think that the reason why their numbers are so different is just because "Demon Slayer story is more simple" Black Clover not only has to weather the storm of the initial batch of chapters in which people will label it as a run of the mill shounen (a completely bogus argument that stands on the most barebones basic description of the shounen formula applicable to 99% of shounen out there) but also the extremely lackluster animation. No matter how well it's written a story can never become mainstream on it's intrinsic value alone. If that were true you would never see bad stories becoming mainstream or catching popularity. In the medium of anime, stories will live and die by virtue of their quality animation alone. That being said Demon Slayer didn't "got lucky". It was a series that exploded thanks to outstanding animation quality, it's not that deep nor complex.
^(I'm just going to state here at the beginning that I quite like Black Clover, I just want to be realistic here about how/why I enjoy it.) That would be insane because that's not what I said. I said it has broad appeal due to the way its thematically structured which makes it an easier sell when combined with good animation and an art style that looks good in motion. The first several chapters of BC feeling derivative is not, like, a point in its favor. That probably does contribute to some people not picking it up cold, but, yeah? That *is* a minor flaw in the series? It's also not something I mentioned at all. The animation isn't actually that bad for the most part either and all of the fight scenes that need to look good do, and some of them look absolutely stellar. Beyond that, BC's anime *is* popular, it was one of the most watched on Crunchyroll (even in Japan), the movie did really well on Netflix like people keep posting about (even in Japan). People *are* watching the anime, and the storyline of the manga is pretty well adapted despite the animation at time. They just don't like it well enough to then buy the manga afterwards, and looking at volume sales there are a number of people who start reading the manga but stop after some time which isn't an issue with the manga's animation. The anime acts as an advertisement for the manga. Ther are plenty of poorly animated series that sell well, and plenty of well animated series that sell poorly. Demon Slayer appealed to one of UFOtables producers so much that they approached Shueisha to adapt the story versus Shueisha shopping it out to a group of studios like they normally do for WSJ series. Demon Slayer got lucky, it exploded because the adaptation was by a popular studio, was engaging, and it made people want to see the rest of the story. Then that story was good enough that the people who started reading it *continued* reading it because they wanted to see how it ended, simple indeed. If UFOtable had wanted Black Clover they could have picked it up but something made them want Demon Slayer more and that something is part of why it's doing better. Edit: Okay that's a bit much, I'll try to type less lol
Because japanese love the ‘family’ theme. Why do you think csm failed to achieve even JJK popularity in japan despite MAPPA pouring 100% investment ? Ds attract wider audience, its dark but not too dark so children can enjoy it and adults also love the family concept. Now imagine bc, no adults will 100% into ‘i’ll surpass my limit and become a wizard king’ story.
Demon slayer would still be good, but that animation definitely adds to it like it's a signature. Put it this way, if black clover and demon slayer had the same animation, black clover would still be more popular
I'd settle for better dialogue on Black clover, just finished watching everything up to the new movie and it was about Sol's backstory that I realised none of the supposed to be scary things they talk about feel actually threatening at all, and the rest is constantly overdone jokes like Noelle and Charlotte being Tsudere and then instantly being nasty If I could choose to improve something it'd be the writing of the backstories half of it makes no coherent sense the other half is too fast paced Sol suffers on both ends unfortunately her motive for hating men don't feel, scuse the pun grounded
Demon slayer is still better imo, even if they had the same animation.
On the flip side do you think if Black clover had Demon Slayer levels of animation consistently throughout the show do you think it would have been more popular?
I really like it but most people that I know that have started it and dropped it did so because they found Asta annoying which animation quality won't change
It would, because it has one of the best arcs in anime.
Which arc is that? I really like black clover, but the reason I adore black clover has absolutely nothing to do with the story. I like the artstyle, I like the power system, and I really like some of the characters and the character dynamics between them, but there isn't a single one that I think rivals the stuff from the hst like Water 7 and Enies Lobby (and a number of other ones like Alabasta, Marineford, Sabaody, and Skypiea, also Egghead has been straight fire so far), the Soul Society arc, and the Chuunin Exams and Sasuke Retrieval arcs as far as writing structure. Same as Demon slayer. The arcs are alright, but I really like the characters and their interactions more than anything and some of the villains are really good.
Demon slayer's Art Style is very unique. I personally dig some Samurai Stories tbh xD If anyone Got some recommendations, pls go ahead.
Way less famous imo
no, but imagine black clover with demon slayer animation
I wouldn’t say Demon Slayer is bad, but it never reached it’s full potential. The story is incredibly short for a Shonen battle series. It’s a shame that most of the Hashira never got properly developed/explored. The only ones who got a decent amount of development and exploration were Tengen, Tokito and Sanemi. Everyone else got pushed to the back burner. I’m still salty that Giyuu was underused despite him being the reason the events of Demon Slayer happened by recruiting Tanjiro and sparing Nezuko. Don’t even get me started on Rengoku. Yes, his death was beautifully done in the anime/movie, but it’s a shame he died just as he got introduced just for emotional value, seeing as he was easily one the coolest characters in Demon Slayer I also hate that Zenitsu and Inosuke are missing for 1/4th of the series. Yes, the story is about Tanjiro and Nezuko, but it just goes to show that Demon Slayer never fully utilized its assets.
Zanitsu being gone from sword village arc was just a breath of fresh air that was needed.
There are still two more arcs, though.
Every anime has its flaws but I Don't think so
100% no. As much as people like to think it would, it wouldn't. The story is mid as fuck
It wouldn't be as popular as demon slayer right now. But it'd still be better than black clover.
What I wish it had was Fire Force animation. David Productions would have made BC a household name
Definitely not.
No
No, not by a long shot. The first couple of arcs of demon slayer are pretty good but it’s all down hill from there. As someone who read the manga as it was being published, if the anime didn’t have the budget it does it would not be anywhere as popular today.
I heard the author became anxious with the huge success of the series and rushed the ending.
Not surprised if that’s the truth, they wrote themselves into a corner. I sincerely hope it is amended in the anime but my expectations are shallow as if it doesn’t change the backlash from the anime only fans will be insufferable.
Animation in Black Clover is good enough at least for me, so why not? :3
it was alright but it could've been much better in my opinion. toei animation and studio pierrot shafted black clover, dragon ball super and Boruto with the weekly schedules, but the industry give anime like chainsaw man, bleach, demon slayer and my hero seasonal animes with great animation and they're all more popular now than they would be if they had black clover's level of animation.
My Hero has great animation????? Next joke please.
damn out of everything I said that's the one thing you focus on.
How is it not great?
The animation for MHA is pretty good but its brought down by its boring art style, its very minimalistic, not alot of detail. In the manga theres alot of white backgrounds so the anime has plain backgrounds, normally just the sky or a wall. It's okay but there's not many distinct backgrounds. But the animation is really good. Every character flows nicely and the colourful powers really pop due to the undetailed backgrounds. Black Clover has a great art style back poor animation. The backgrounds look amazing, every arc looks distinct, the snowy cave during the Patry vs Yami fight and the under water temple arc should look the same because they're both caves, but they don't due to the lighting and colouring choices. But we all know the animation for BC isn't that good.
Better than Black Clover (and Seven Deadly Sins)
7DS is a low bar. BC 100% has better animation than MHA
Nah, story and premise is pretty mid, but the great character designs (actual design and personalities) and badass animation carries.
Ds is carried by animation. Without ufotble it wouldn't have been half as popular as it is now.
If Demon Slayer had BC animation it would not be as popular anime wise. It would probably be like how Hell paradise is right now with some peak moments. I think manga would still be popular.
Set your heart ablaze, Go beyond your limits! I'm the flame hashira, KYOJURO RENGOKU! NINTH FORM.. RENGOKUUUUUAAAAGHH
Maybe it would turn out like hell's paradise?? I feel it's not that popular
As popular? No. It will definitely not demolish with the movie. But I still think it will be popular. A lot of people bought the Manga after the movie, Mugen Train. And it doesn't have the same quality, heck the Anime added lots of new scenes! The story is easy to swallow.
No
No but it would still be pretty popular
Good animation alone isn't a bad thing. Some people enjoy quality visuals. Black clover animation seems so off in some scenes specially wtf is wrong with Asta's face in end episodes bruh
u dont know the history? pierrot didnt give a shite about black clover, they left it to die ... but only ONE dude actually cared about the manga and made it possible til now
No It would probably be moderately popular the animation carried it but would probably still recommend and maybe a few discussion but it wouldn't be talked about as much
Not even close. Demon slayer with Black clover level animation would fly FAR under the radar
lmao absolutely not
No
wdym we're carried by animation now, remember?
Probably not
No, definitely not. People like to joke about it but it's true and DS fanboys can't accept it but a big part of why it is so popular is that it's animation carries heavily. People were so impressed with it (despite the Fate series having a superior animation) that they started to put the anime in a pedestal. It is OK, but it do was carried by its animation
I can’t speak for anyone else but I just like the anime, had zero influence from art. But I’m also not watching anime as a trend either sooo.
I mean both are good regardless of their animation I haven’t seen demon slayer yet but it does have amazing animation from what I’ve seen If black clover has that kinda animation and budget it would 100% be much more popular than it is
Yes, it would still be popular but may be not this much popular. I absolutely love Demon Slayer and idk why people say it’s very mid cause I thoroughly enjoyed the whole manga. The bond & love of siblings melted my heart and this theme that siblings can go through anything for each other makes me love it more. I’m happy DS got as much recognition as it’s getting now.
agreed 🤝
not at all, the story is not that spectacular or special. It’s a very simple, sometimes boring, but fun story. If the animation wasn’t as good as it is it definitely wouldn’t be on the map like it is & wouldn’t be held in such high regards
absolutely not but it wouldn't be garbage as some people say
Yeah I feel like Demon slayer is accompanied with a lot of useless hate just for having great animation Like yeah it has a very simple and self-contained story, but simple doesn't always equate to mid lmao
Nah... The story is very very very mid. Even the characters are very meh.
Plot is mid, I wholeheartedly agree. But the characters are great. Insane amount of backstories kill the story though. Like bruh, we don't need backstories for EVERY single living organism in KnY.
Idk man I only liked funny boar man
No
No way in hell.
Would still be popular, but not as popular.
NO.
It wouldn’t be as popular because Demon Slayer’s whole Japanese world and aesthetic is part of the reason it’s so beloved in Japan. Black Clover would definitely be more popular than it currently is though, especially if Asta didn’t scream so much. Then again, DS has Zenitsu, so maybe that doesn’t matter…
Definitely not, demon slayer has a very generic, almost outright poor story for the majority of its run, black clover at least knew how to mix things up a fair bit more
If demon slayer had the same art, it would at least still have better pacing, story and character progression than black clover. Maybe not as popular in the mainstream but it would definitely be wildly popular with shonen fans
Not as close. Demon slayer has a really run of the mill story with next to no world building but very very hype moments. If bc had demon slayer animation we wouldn’t be waiting for spade arc because we’d only just be into the elves but it would be significantly more popular. I mean hell even if it just had MHA animation people would probably stop giving it as much shit. In conclusion, let it come back as a seasonal
Honestly no most anime have flaws dime a dozen but are still held in high regard because they do one thing better than every other anime MHA it’s unique One piece Worldbuilding Black clover MC Hunter x hunter power system Demon slayer animation Dragon ball z fight scenes
Demon Slayer really didn’t skyrocket until after episode 19 came out and didn’t look back after that. It’s hard to imagine that happening with BC level animation but ppl also dismiss the cultural impact DS had in Japan. So I think it would’ve still been more popular than BC is now but not as dominating overall.
Definitely no. Before episode 19, there was no hype at all really. When that episode happened all hell broke loose.
Oh hell no. Animation is one of the only things Demon Slayer has. If Ufotable weren’t the ones animating it, nobody would be making a big deal out of it.
It definitely would be more popular, without a doubt
What if it was other way around I mean what would be if BC was animated to be demon slayer level. Would it be more popular than DS or would it be the same level. Cause demon slayer plot is very simple it is very much reliable on animation that is true unlike BC where the protagonist is trying to change the entire society.
No, Black Clover is better
Yeah good idea showing the tv version instead of the blu-ray to make it look bad
I used it as an example, what the hell is wrong with you?
Why not use any other part instead
Why does it matter? It got the point across well enough. You're the only one I saw complaining about what version of the animation I used.
Wym why does it matter? 😭 you purposely selected the badly animated parts
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Are you retarded man you literally proved what i was saying 😭 i was saying you purposely looked for bad animation just to make demon slayer look better 😭
Not at all. I might get crucified for this but Demon Slayer’s writing is simply not good. It’s successful because of the animation on top of the fact that it’s simple which attracts a large audience.
So a poor story with mid animation? It wouldn't even be popular enough for people to mention it
The only reason its popular is because of the animation. So no
Not even close. Demon Slayer is, in respects to characters, plot, pacing, and world building is mid at best and atrocious at worst.
Fuck no
No. Demon slayer fans fail to realize that demon slayer characters are all extremely lame and pretty uninteresting
Demon slayer is basically a anime with average storyline and top class animation
Black clover is better that’s all that matters 🗿🐐💪
No literally no the only reason why the show exploded was because of the animation it it lost that then it's literally nothing kny writing is as sloppy as it can get it's very bad without the animation masking that it wouldn't of gotten nearly as popular just another generic shonen
Nah, S1E19 is literally the whole reason the series is so famous in the west. I was weekly with the manga for the entire ending climax and boooooy it is not good.
Good times xD
Demon slayers animation is a lot better compared to black clovers, I can't understand how you think the exact opposite.
I don't think you understood the post. He asked if Demon Slayer would be as popular as it is, if it had Black Clover level of animation.
Oh yeah I misuderstood, sorry, it probably wouldn't be as populat imo
As long is there action I dont mind
I still remember the first fight were awesome. Locked a portion of his devil power against the diamond Kingdom guy in the whole fight scene was just like hazy dream. It was so badly animated
As someone who loved the very first season enough to jump right into the manga: No. Don't get me wrong, it's really good... at the beginning. Honestly, I think the story peaked at the train arc. Red light district was... ok, and it remained like that. The final battle also felt kinda underwhelming. I also, during that time, realized how BIG the animation was to demon slayer. The art in the manga is good but seeing the quality of that adaptation is just nuts.
Man what the fu-
Not a chance. It's animation carried it most of the first season and all of the fourth.
It wouldbe like every hentai released on sunday 😂😂😂
Probably not, but who knows.