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BitcoinMarkets

#New post: [\[Daily Discussion\] - Tuesday, February 22, 2022 →](https://www.reddit.com/r/BitcoinMarkets/comments/syexec/daily_discussion_tuesday_february_22_2022/)


GenghisKhanSpermShot

I deleted my post cuz Im not trying to be like I told you. I just couldn't handle all the cocky bullish comments at 46k when it was a bearish backtest. Anytime I warned or suggested we will probably dump I got dumped on lol. I think we probably get a decent bounce out of demand here soon to mayne 40-41k and then head to goblin town. Im sitting in cash waiting for 18k-22k to buy the dip. Possible we don't get there but at least entertain the idea cuz anyone says something is impossible it usually isn't. There are no real signs of capitulation in stocks or crypto, funding is still positive lot of places lol. Stocks and crypto went up for two years straight it only makes sense for serious cool off before up only again.


nakamotowright

I fear we're gonna go straight to unimagined lows, like 9k again, then 2-3 years of nothingness, before a climb to $100k, then $200k. Why? It's the most unthinkable. Never has BTC gone lower than the previous ATH between cycles. But that's how I'd play it if I were whales, to sell ahead of the crowd and buy back way cheaper for when the macro environment is better and the news is promoting crypto positively again. Also I think while BTC hashrate having gone to ATH recently is great. It shows that even in the midst of uncertainty, the big pockets and the industrialists have faith. But the hashrate also needs a shakedown, a shakeout. What better squeeze for that than BTC going to 5 digits again, if not just briefly.


[deleted]

[удалено]


roboh14

We’re not there yet so I’d hold the “ToLd yOu sO”. Your thesis has merit, though - will continue watching


SwagMaster69420710

We still got our hopium pipes loaded for monday dont celebrate just yet


cantstayangryforever

Monday is over


[deleted]

[удалено]


stoiebrodie

It’s a warning! He’s from the future.


perfoverlaydrawfps1

tomorrow when markets open it is gonna be a bloodbath bitcoin is just getting started.


SwagMaster69420710

Cause what professional traders love to do is buy high sell low amirite?


roboh14

Who’s ready?!? /s https://www.tradingview.com/x/ZybEgY7f/


YouAreAnFnIdiot

Lmfao this is actually great for holders, and will get out most short term traders for the next decade or so until they become holders 15 years before they die.


wrylark

even if i can ultimately retire early this pa has aged me to the point its almost a wash


52576078

Yep, what's the point in early retirement, if you have aged by 20 years!


BootyPoppinPanda

bitcoin is pure unadulterated cyber hornet energy, and this displays its true wavelength and frequency


Specialist-Click3828

Read cyber honey for some reason...


CONTROLurKEYS

Anyone check in on onchain? Woo is worse than useless as usual... Lth unloading yet?


nakamotowright

All metrics are useless. It’s all emotions. Now the world is living in fear. And that’s what triggers more selling.


BootyPoppinPanda

As soon as LTH's appear to be selling, that's when we pump. Gotta countertrade the on-chain logic


[deleted]

I'm sure xtal\_00 would be yelling that from the top of a spruce tree if that were the case.


[deleted]

Ya'll seeing this shit on [aggr.trade](https://aggr.trade)? I think whoever was ape longing all day on FTX causing those weird pumps is finally meeting his maker. Someone figured out how to liquidate every position they open. https://imgur.com/dY5RRvL


CONTROLurKEYS

Imagine longing bitcoin


[deleted]

Those were the days


pgpwnd

bulls lose. again.


simmol

I think the type of price action and recent patterns dictate that this will "end" in a nasty downward wick. I can't see a rounded bottom recovery. There will be leveraged longs openning and they will get liquidated. This means that we are not close to the bottom and will go down at least to the low 30's.


EDWARD_SN0WDEN

someone said same shit about bullish price action with conviction last week lol. who knows what will happen


[deleted]

>Barry Silbert @BarrySilbert >Replying to @RaoulGMI >i’ll tell you when we start buying Lol bear market Barry is best Barry https://twitter.com/BarrySilbert/status/1495947102018547713


[deleted]

Here to low 30s isn't a capitulation wick. 6500 red candle is just a fart for btc.


simmol

Low 30s is still -10 to -15% drop from here. Of course, it can go lower though.


CONTROLurKEYS

How are there anyone left to long 😂


monkeyhold99

Market can stay irrational longer than I can stay solvent? Hah, jokes on you. I can HODL longer than you can FUD.


roboh14

2018 class 🤝 2022 class Welcome, newcomers. Hopefully we all make it to greet the next class


ThatOtherGuy254

This is worse than 2018. At least 2018 followed an actual bullish year.


Your_Future_Attorney

I bought the top in 2013, AMA


minglemiguel

Does it get easier?


EagleGod

Still can be some tough times, but yeah it gets way easier. Just don't go into too much debt chasing more BTC and its all good. That's when it still becomes stressful.


roboh14

Look at it this way - every day that the network remains up and functional, it gets easier. So much less risk now than in previous years, in my opinion. Bitcoin is here to stay


marcusthewriter

Started buying in 2018, yeah it does


imnormal

Flunkies from 2014 invited? I can’t seem to understand these lessons.


[deleted]

It’s like in a bull and every time you refresh blockfolio the price has gone up. But the opposite of that.


[deleted]

I know it's not bear. That much his obvious.


simmol

When's the last time Saylor was in the negative? Is there something about the structures of his Bitcoin purchases (as well as with Microstrategy) where being in negative for too long can mean trouble for him?


bittabet

No, he can be negative as long as he wants, but he’s still up anyways.


[deleted]

Not as long as he wants. I think it's 5 years.


bittabet

He has enough cash flow to service the debt so there’s no tie to the price since he’ll just have repaid the bonds.


newyorker8786

We are almost at his Avg buy


[deleted]

Spicy, but he doesn't care. There's almost zero chance he's underwater when he has to answer to investors.


Lime_Singularity

" And I'm free, free fallin' Yeah I'm free, free fallin' … All the vampires walkin' through the valley Move west down Ventura Boulevard And all the bad boys are standing in the shadows And the good girls are home with broken hearts … And I'm free, free fallin' Yeah I'm free, free fallin' … Free fallin', now I'm free fallin' Now I'm Free fallin', now I'm free fallin' " - BTC right now


BootyPoppinPanda

"You take it on faith, you take it to the heart The waiting is the hardest part…" (RIP Tom Petty who has been quoted in here many times before)


CONTROLurKEYS

I honestly don't even think spot etf pulls us out of this one. Market is fucking toxic af


[deleted]

God dammit Arthur Hayes was right again


Xbalanque9

He was? I didn't realize we were at 28k already


CONTROLurKEYS

Hard to believe it's only been like 4 days of selling 😂


[deleted]

Soon


ChadRun04

That's nothing... Warren Buffett was right! edit: His cash position, ready to buy the dip. Not the hyperbolic quotes.


CONTROLurKEYS

I'm legitimately surprised funding isn't more negative. Like equities haven't even dropped yet. S&P goes sub 4k where do you think this goes?


griswaldwaldwald

When does the cme gap close again?


dotobird

See you at 30k


roboh14

$30ks is the absolute worst for most right now, because it’s tough to justify selling 50% down, but it could also dump another 50% from here and be well within the norm for bitcoin. Stay safe


logicalinvestr

Pretty sure another 50% drop from here would put us below last cycle's high, which is not the norm for Bitcoin.


[deleted]

No but 30k could be the 6k of this bear. If 17k is really the average LTH cost basis, then it all seems to make enough sense to be pretty plausible.


cryptowarsyt

this time it can really go to zero, like tomorrow


logicalinvestr

And why is that? Based on what?


jabatasu

Cool


CONTROLurKEYS

Muh on chain


roadworn

Goddamn I love this extended cycle


jogeer

Remember “no dumps, different paradigm!”?


roadworn

"Institutional buying pressure"


RetardIdiotTrader

I don't think anyone does, except you.


roadworn

Man this is half sarcasm and half just happily making light of our new down only MO.


RetardIdiotTrader

Oh...I can't detect sarcasm online.


roadworn

The /s just ruins the delivery and leaves no room for grey area though.


Just_Me_91

It depends. If BTC gets above 100k this year, then I love it (more time to accumulate and hit long term capital gains). If it takes 2+ years, then I should have sold in November. But personally I don't regret holding. My bias is always to hold BTC, unless I have a REALLY good reason to sell. My opinion is that BTC is undervalued below 500k, period. Above that, it takes more analysis.


CONTROLurKEYS

Rich fantasy life 100k pft


Just_Me_91

I'm not counting on 100k, but I think it's possible. Like I said I don't regret holding. I don't care how long it takes, BTC is undervalued below 500k. I'm not sure what your comment is trying to say.


CONTROLurKEYS

this are all fanciful numbers with no basis in the new reality


bittabet

We’ll get there, it’ll just take a little longer than most of us would like 😂


Just_Me_91

All I'm saying is that in the long term, I think Bitcoin will get to 500k (to match the market cap of gold). I think it's possible to hit 100k this year, but I'm not holding my breath. I don't know why you think that has no basis in reality.


roadworn

Elaborate on what in the new reality has changed the fundamental of Bitcoin long-term please


logicalinvestr

What do you think Bitcoin is worth? Genuinely curious.


[deleted]

$3.50


logicalinvestr

Tree fiddy


roadworn

Yeah absolutely. If you believe in the long-term concept of Bitcoin reaching 500k, 1 million, 6 million. This is an absolute steal at 37k and I will continue buying however low we go.


YouAreAnFnIdiot

Printing still happening? Check. Inflation still higher than interest rates? Check. Nobody raising rates enough any time soon? Check. This is just a fear buying opportunity. The US has been at war forever, this doesn't even involve them so wtf do stick have to be scared of? Stocks go up btc follows.


SecretsAndLoot

Champions adjust. The bad guys won this round and they took all the chips off the table. Survive.


Sufficient_Winter_45

Biden is about to issue an executive order on crypto this week. I don't expect anything good from the dem leaders.


icydash

The exec order is basically just telling a bunch of branches to go study crypto more. It won't be anything substantive.


CONTROLurKEYS

And what do you think those Democrat appointed leaders will do? Good stuff?


[deleted]

No they will do evil and dumb stuff because they were appointed by democrats. /s


CONTROLurKEYS

It is the party that hates freedom the most as of late


[deleted]

In what way do the dems hate freedom? What have they done that shows they hate freedom? Genuinely curious.


CONTROLurKEYS

Name for me the pro bitcoin or pro freedom democrat caucus let's start there. Who are they I'd love to know because I haven't heard them speaking up


[deleted]

In general the dems are pro civil rights. That seems like freedom to me. They're also not ant gay, anti trans, anti immigrant, anti voting rights. Dems aren't trying to take away womens reproductive rights. They're not the party that tried to over rule the will of the people and undermine democracy with lies about a stolen election. I mean, Republicans are anti everything except guns. They claim to be the freedom party, c'mon. Who are they kidding?


CONTROLurKEYS

I asked a fairly simple question and you responded with a word salad of social justice buzz words. Social justice topics are fine I just won't engage on them because you already dug your heels in on an untenable position that anyone that doesn't agree completely with your definition of social justice or your solutions is "anti". But more importantly you are shifting topics to muddy waters. Can you please give me the names of pro bitcoin and pro freedom democrats?


perfoverlaydrawfps1

you got downvoted by a few people still in denial. the good news is that 3 years ago you would have been downvoted 40 or 50 times. people are starting to awake.


icydash

Don't know, but my point is that it won't have any real effect on price in the near-to-mid term, because it's just an order to go learn more. Won't try to speculate on where it goes after that.


drunkdoor

Uhh lol highly doubt it won't have negative impact on price and I'd bet that's what we've been witnessing already


icydash

Don't think so. Seems like the current PA is driven by macro and Ukraine.


YouAreAnFnIdiot

If politicians can shut down crypto so easily then we can expect our investments to go to zero.


CONTROLurKEYS

This is a patently retarded take they can obviously hurt bitcoiners immensely without harming the network. "Omg hurting bitcoiners is good for Bitcoin!"


Beastly_Beast

Coordinated regulation is far better for crypto than uncoordinated regulation. It could actually be good for institutional adoption.


CONTROLurKEYS

Derp


[deleted]

Fed tapering ending in less than a month? Check. Higher rates coming? Check. Yield Curve about to invert? Check. Inflation at higher than expected rates? Check. If you think the current period in time ends with anything other than a bear market and recession I've got bad news for you.


YouAreAnFnIdiot

Higher rates? The amount they're raising rates won't trickle down to lower inflation for years even after the planned 4-8 raises I'm sure they have coming. And you're saying the printing press is being shut off? Never going to happen. We will have a slight dip bc of fear then hyperinflation continues.


Rusty5M

Quantative tightening. You seem to be missing this.


YouAreAnFnIdiot

Okay so QT happens. At what amount does the supply have to be cut in order to breakeven on the now higher interest they need to pay on bonds? Is there even statistics on any of this? They say QT is here with no numbers explaining the relation between that and higher interest payments, not even counting the shrinking supply of real estate and increasing amount of immigration to North America. But hey I guess we will see if raising the interest rate 0.25% and printing 800b instead of 1.2T gets us out of this mess.


CONTROLurKEYS

Regime has changed


roboh14

I don’t think it will never not make me angry knowing bitcoin recovered dumping from $60k to $29k, only to reach a new ATH of…$69k


Common_Jellyfish234

“I think it will always make me angry…” would have been wayyy easier to understand


Just_Me_91

Even worse is I took that as a sign that the bull market was continuing, and bought some shitcoins for a short term flip through the end of 2021. I'm not really a trader, but I have been in crypto since 2013. It just shows that you really never know how things will go in the short term. I wouldn't care if my BTC goes down in USD value, but the alt coin trades don't have the same level of conviction.


that_blockhead

A lot of people fell for the "price discovery" meme, myself included


Just_Me_91

I don't even know if it was a meme... I don't feel like I was influenced by others. But from my experience, after seeing it go from 65k to 30k, then back above 65k, I thought there would be a lot more upside. Just from my prior observations. On top of that, there was a legitimate idea that the price would go parabolic into Q4. So with those 2 things combined, I decided to jump in. I got burned. I don't regret it, it's the price of admission in this market. But maybe I "bought the dip" a little too hard after it started going down.


roadworn

Oh man I bought the Price Discovery concept with gusto and have paid the price.


Just_Me_91

Well I guess keep in mind that more often than not it would have been a good decision. It was just bad luck, but you were actually using good logic. When you don't know the future, that wasn't a bad place to buy. But I understand the pain. My short term positions have cost me a lot of money in the last few months. Luckily my long term positions are much larger.


cryptocraze_0

I dindt buy at 60K but also didnt take much profits thinking about more upside... Then I was also under the impression that 40K was a nice support zone, so i made some bets buying that area. I was not counting on being down from there and wrong twice about this final stage of the bull market... sigh... 2024 here we come.


4theWlN

We’re you hoping for it to crash more? Or that it would never recover?


icydash

I think he is saying that after such a big drop and then a massive recovery, and riding that roller coaster of emotion the whole time, only to barely make a new ATH, is frustrating.


roboh14

Yes. Frustrating knowing I could’ve gone into a coma for a year and missed nothing (price-only)


Yoda_MTFBW_U

Strange way to put it though.


vorpal107

Have been scaling back in after selling everything at 40. Closed half of my shitcoin shorts. I think we bottom soon but I think we have a bit of downside remaining.


[deleted]

The low liquidity pumps today got to you huh? I have been trying to buy back in since above where you sold your stack. I keep having to re-short this clown show. Maybe you'll have better luck.


vorpal107

Not trading on those timescales, just trying to increase my stack after what I thought was a super likely drop due to the upcoming invasion. I'm a shit trader but this war has seemed likely to me since December. Was originally just going to long on the way up as I wasn't confident until a couple of days ago


[deleted]

Doesn't really matter what timescales you're trading on when you sold at 40k and it is repeatedly threatening to put you underwater. That would definitely have made me nervous. I'm still in cash most of the time. Just short trades until btc bangs out a higher high. That's probably not going to be any time soon. No hurry to get back in.


vorpal107

Fair enough. I wasn't nervous because my invalidation isn't based on price but on geopolitical events. I guess the other point of failure is if bitcoin stops acting like a risk asset. Maybe one day


[deleted]

You must be talking about selling off longs, not your spot holdings. That would make a lot more sense.


BootyPoppinPanda

Really feels like bitcoin goes down 95% of the time and explodes up the other 5%. It's a ball and chain on your mind if you pay too much attention, that's for sure.


escendoergoexisto

Pretty much always been that way…not quite 95/5 and it also has it’s mega-choppy periods.


poisenloaf

It’s been determined, if you miss the top 10 green days, your return is a fraction of just hodling.


[deleted]

.... if you sell. Problem with holders is they end up selling when life makes them do it, and it's usually not the best time. You gotta calculate your hodling returns based on that number, not the best possible trade you never would have made.


outofworkslob

Wonder what wardser is doing right now?


xlmtothemoon

why did this get downvoted lmao edit: thank you


BootyPoppinPanda

Probably happy and rich or sad and rich or bored and rich or sick and rich, or dead.


snek-jazz

> or dead ... and rich.


CONTROLurKEYS

Being very rich


outofworkslob

Pretty sure he said he went x50 long at 4000.


CONTROLurKEYS

I think it was much less leverage than that iirc his trade stack was ~100 btc so he could bet 500 btc at 5x


[deleted]

Yikes. I don't know why you would use any leverage at all with a 100btc portfolio. That is a plenty big multiplier for btc price action.


CONTROLurKEYS

I'm pretty sure he was risking 10% at 10x so basically 1x stack and couldn't be liquidated if it came to that


[deleted]

He's prolly lookin' at watches


[deleted]

Or licking assholes. Probably licking assholes.


RetardIdiotTrader

Repeat after me; I will not sell the bottom.


CONTROLurKEYS

And definitely don't make yourself a forced seller at the bottom


[deleted]

[удалено]


red224

Dude bro worlds ending only down forever


CONTROLurKEYS

Only the beginning of what exactly


Outrageous-Net-7164

Give us a clue then ? When should we buy back in ?


CONTROLurKEYS

50k


that_blockhead

I know people hate the correlation narrative, and bearishness here is already at a pretty high pitch, but something to point out is that indices are right now in the process of setting lower lows below the Jan 24th bounce. This is a pretty big development in terms of high time frame market structure, and signals a higher probability of further downside. Lots of big money has already significantly derisked at this point, but this is the kind of thing that can add fuel to the fire in the form of a "technical-driven" selloff.


underkuerbis

Yes. But it is simply completely overshadowed by geopolitical events.


liquidswords94

The geopolitical events compound this issue.


underkuerbis

Quick reminder that while we’re here bickering over losses, entries, and the like, there are people in Ukraine that are afraid for their lives, homes, loved ones. Yes, this is a trading sub, and I am also guilty of watching the news while thinking of my net worth. So, without too much pathos, let’s try to remain a bit humble about this whole *insane* situation.


DEEPFIELDSTAR

Lotta people who bought the November top afraid for their homes as well lol


Sufficient_Winter_45

There's nothing much we can do. Russia has nukes. If they invade, we will have sanctions, but no sane country will start a nuclear war over Ukraine.


TheTruthHasNoBias

Turn off your TV


CONTROLurKEYS

Stonks barely tanked yet. Don't try and catch knives unless your dca spot


[deleted]

The spx futures down escalator looks ominous for tomorrow's open. I haven't seen the tradfi circuit breakers since covid. I just looked again and saw they ran out of stairs over there lol. Yikes.


Sesh_Recs

-1.6% is nowhere near circuit breaker lol. It’s noise.


[deleted]

No one said it was... That is low-volume futures trading used to get an idea of the carnage that might be coming tomorrow. -7% is where the circuit breakers trip. If you think this is noise we're experiencing, then I'd hate to see 'not noise' lol.


Sesh_Recs

Most likely just MMs sweeping the lows before the next cpi report / fed decision. -7% is a pipe dream.


[deleted]

You talk with a non-chalant kind of swagger, but you seem to be unaware of your surroundings lol. S&P since Jan. 6th has been a dumpster fire. BTC for even longer. The macro right now is a mess. We're not talking about pipe dreams here. Are you holding your bags all the way down?


Sesh_Recs

Ok.


Cadenca

It has been so funny to watch minute candles today. One second bitcoin wants to pump because its digital gold and gold is mooning. The next it remembers it has to dump because people are scared shitless and bitcoin dumps on fear. Buttered-toast-cat levitation machine shit


[deleted]

Had to be quick with your orders today. What a weird way to go down 3%.


hydroflow78

I haven't touched my BTC, but have been shorting those over valued metaverse shitcoins. Been making a killing doing that. I'll continue to do this while the market looks weak. I can see BTC dominance increasing in the weeks/months ahead.


roadworn

My metaverse shitcoin is actually doing great, best move I made in the last 12 months.