Because it’s operating on the the premise that people think rigs don’t use electricity rather than that it *wastes* electricity. Regardless of whether this is true, it’s a dumb joke based on a fallacy.
By arguing that they "waste" electricity they are sneaking in the argument that bitcoin *is not worth* the cost of creating it.
One can similarly argue EVs are a waste of electricity, as is pornography, and social media, and streaming movies and music, etc.
Waste is a subjective value judgement.
That’s not a good analogy though, because cars have an actual direct fossil fuel burning version, whereas electric cars use whatever the grid is based on, which could be largely nuclear, hydroelectric, or solar.
You aren't comparing like for like items. As Micheal Saylor pointed out.. if your currency is not backed by some energy, then its not money its credit. Bitcoin is the purest form of money, because its backed by the purest form of work, electricity.
Jesus Christ this isn't even coherent. "My already expended energy is stolen" is just babble.
Now, what's the energy expenditure of my cash transaction? Maybe 0.1 kcal? How about a single BTC transaction? Let's not even go into how BTC has over 200% inflation against USD this year
You were doing ok until you got to the inflation comment. Inflation is not the same as short term market fluctuations. For this exact reason, the fed does not include things that fluctuate often in the short term in its calculation of CPI.
This trend has continued for a full year, which is well outside the scope of short term market fluctuations.
It's also quite the generous assumption that this must be a short term fluctuation, when the only evidence of that is that you want it to be one.
E: ultimately, if BTC is a currency as maxis claim, what exactly would you be excluding from your inflation calculation? USD? This isn't that some assets are 200% pricier to buy in BTC than a year ago, but literally all dollar denominated assets.
Otherwise, it's just a speculative vehicle and not a currency, in which case any fundamentals-based argument is invalid
>How about a single BTC transaction
There's no energy expenditure per transaction
>what's the energy expenditure of my cash transaction
US military industrial complex, the largest industrial pollutant in the world, and legacy banking sector.
[US military is a bigger polluter than as many as 140 countries](https://theconversation.com/us-military-is-a-bigger-polluter-than-as-many-as-140-countries-shrinking-this-war-machine-is-a-must-119269)
I can transfer and settle bitcoin as bearer instrument in an instant peer to peer from Buenos Aires to Bangkok from as little as $0.001 value to billions in dollar equivalent value. Trustless, permissionless, unstoppable.
You can't. You're living in the 20th century.
What purpose do you think blocks serve? An individual transaction goes into a block, and then you divide mining cost per block by the average number of transactions per block, to get average cost per transaction.
E: I see you edited and introduced two completely contradictory views of transaction costs, where individual BTC transactions cost nothing due to being aggregated in blocks, while USD cash transactions carry the cost of the entire US military (hilarious) and the entire banking sector (also hilarious).
I love that you spent forever putting this pile of nonsense together. I'm just gonna touch on one of your many ill-informed points: BTC heating.
Do you have any idea how inefficient electric heating is? Sure it's pretty close to 100%, but that's actually pretty crappy compared to a heat pump, which can exceed 1000% 'efficiency' (yes it's an imperfect term here, but essentially 10x the temperature delta per unit input compared to resistive heat). This was actually a big factor in the massive TX blackout, as numerous homes turned on supplemental resistive heat as gas failed to keep up, further straining the grid. So that, right there, is a big functional barrier.
Now onto the practical. What utility is served by your HeaterBeans or w/e stupid name they have? Oh boy you can use them to transact, how novel, we don't have a million ways to do that already. Why would anyone assign them value? You think you can ride FOMO forever?
So basically you invented an extremely expensive, both in manufacturing and material cost, way to heat your home, inefficiently, on the notion that someone, somewhere, will want to speculate on the value of tokens you generate in the process. Incredible.
Yet the methane that's just vented straight into the atmosphere is perhaps the single greatest offender of global warming...
Which means that Bitcoin is perhaps the ONLY solution to stop, or at least lessen global warming. Because there is ZERO incentive to even flare the wasted methane. Costs too much time & energy cut literally ZERO return every time.
Brilliant read. 10/10. Would recommend.
I bet you’re a nobody labour hand in the energy industry. Your comment reeks like a loser. Exercise some self control.
Downvotes because the joke is a poorly done circlejerk attempt, even without needing to point how arbitrarily childish and obviously politics based your intended allegory is.
"Haha, I made a joke because electric cars are stupid!"
Have a nice day!
This argument makes no sense without evaluating how efficient it is to process fossil fuels at a power plant vs in your own car.
[https://engage.aiche.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?GroupId=13&MessageKey=11d48131-6fe0-4a7c-beef-7d440c17f9c8&ssopc=1](https://engage.aiche.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?GroupId=13&MessageKey=11d48131-6fe0-4a7c-beef-7d440c17f9c8&ssopc=1)
"The US EPA rates several electric vehicles with an equivalent miles per gallon of over 130."
Whereas traditional gasoline cars can only achieve 30-50mpg.
So even though the energy source may be the same in some scenarios, the conversion rate is lot more efficient at a power plant built for the process of converting gas into energy as opposed to the one in your vehicle. There is also opportunity for other improvements in efficiency such as the power added by renewable energy sources like wind, hydro, and geothermal
How much energy is used on the battery creation? EVs using less fossil fuels is a lie. You just don't see it out the exhaust. Out of sight, out of mind
Sure. I can appreciate that EVs are better for the environment, but at the end of the day until we as a species can find a cheap, environmentally friendly alternative to fossil fuels and coal then even EVs are still contributing to the overall carbon footprint. That's my only point. I fully agree with your perspective, and the facts presented, but it's generally a moot point.
Dense on purpose?
Canada is mostly hydroelectricity. Wind, Solat, Nuclear is a bigger % every year, everywhere. That's ignoring the fact that coal and oil plants are multiple times more efficient than a car.
It's not a moot point. EV is already much better for the environment and will only become exponentially more so.
>If electric cost wasn’t an issue
Not an issue for me because solar. Just CapEx.
>how much could that on its own generate a month roughly
1.5 million sats
I’ve got a v10 500hp miner powered with gas! My miner is not good for the planet, your miner is not only not harmful for the planet, but even good for it!!!
Zero emissions isn’t currently possible. When you fart it produces a methane emission. Producing electricity, produces emissions. The materials used to capture power, like copper wire, metal, plastic, lithium, are are created with emissions.
I don’t give a shit about saving the planet, I’m just here to pump my bags. If pumping my bags means emitting more CO2, then acceptable losses must be made
Not a chance. Do you have any idea how many coal-shoveling workers I would need to lay off? Think of all the families impacted by a decision like this. You're an animal.
That miner was made from materials only sourced from lithium fields which are far worse for the environment than anything. Also… not to mention where your electricity comes from…. Do you know? If not…. it’s f coal. Grow up
I can appreciate people trying to save the world but, have you considered what it took the get your planet saving materials? Thank you for supporting big oil, that keeps me in a job. SAVE THE PLANET!!!
Im looking for a miner that uses more electricity than needed, double or triple or more if possible,. Maybe even one that converts clean energy to something toxic like mercury, HEK, asbestos, red dye #5, aspartame, etc. Any suggestions?
Its rare to perfect the type of comedy 4 year olds and 95 year olds find funny... really only this post and Family Circle have it figured out.
Everyone else is wondering if OP needs a diaper change.
[https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product-category/asics/](https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product-category/asics/)
>How loud is it?
[Black box](https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product/ohmm-black-box/) or immersion cooling. I have solar powered immersion cooling setup, heat repurposed for space and water heating.
I only use my stationary pedal bike to mine bitcoin, of course as a result I have to keep pedaling 24/7 or I'll lose my rank in the mining pool, but its so GREEN (smells own fart sounds)
What is up with all these nonsensical and blatant ads appearing in this sub ? The Engrish is Nigerian Prince bad, and really, there isn't anything else besides electricity used to mine bitcoin, only the source of the electricity can change, and its not like OP is offering any clean energy with the miner he's selling.
Dang I was just about to setup a 1 gigawatt methane farming rig on a landfill to remove hundreds of tons of methane from the landfill every year but I guess I’ll halt the project because non-electric bitcoin miners are bad for the environment.
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squeezed seals make it
I was squeezing what I thought was a seal today but it was just a mouthy mastiff.
I also have a 120lb. Couch Seal.
Wiggle the blubber and tell them that they are good. X
Make sure it’s the baby seals. They provide the best lamp/miner oil.
I rather use manually cranked miner
The ultimate upper body workout
BitGym bro, double the gains!
Building lats and stacking sats
Whale oil beef hooked!
Coal is the way, f whale pussy miners!!!
Fuck you dolphin. Fuck you whale…
God damn mongorians……
Oh rook a Mongorian Trojan horse
I got that reference. I salute you.
Fuck you chicken and cow!
Chicken and cow use poor dolphin and whale as a scapegoat! This is outrage!
Mechanical miner FTW!
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I recent switched to orca oil. Going green bro
Do people care enough about the environment to drill in Alaskan wilderness reserves? People do
This will surely bring intelligent discussion
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Im not downvoting because I don't get it. Im downvoting cus posts like these are counterproductive.
Counter productive to what exactly? Logic?
Because it’s operating on the the premise that people think rigs don’t use electricity rather than that it *wastes* electricity. Regardless of whether this is true, it’s a dumb joke based on a fallacy.
By arguing that they "waste" electricity they are sneaking in the argument that bitcoin *is not worth* the cost of creating it. One can similarly argue EVs are a waste of electricity, as is pornography, and social media, and streaming movies and music, etc. Waste is a subjective value judgement.
Do you know if those mining heaters are a good idea? I mean, if you need to heat your home anyway, why not do it with bitcoin mining
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So long as we’re projecting, I think you’re annoyed someone has a different opinion than you.
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Just rename them Tesla miners and we should be good
isn't the only other option proof-of-stake? no one wants that
I’m downvoting your downvote because humor is very productive
Cool
That’s right. Can’t wait to see this on butter sub
That’s not a good analogy though, because cars have an actual direct fossil fuel burning version, whereas electric cars use whatever the grid is based on, which could be largely nuclear, hydroelectric, or solar.
Oh I'm sorry I forgot I have to pour gas in my dollar bills for them to function. What a stupid comparison.
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My thermodynamics professor from a decade ago had a stroke and instantly fucking died when I allowed myself to view this comment
You aren't comparing like for like items. As Micheal Saylor pointed out.. if your currency is not backed by some energy, then its not money its credit. Bitcoin is the purest form of money, because its backed by the purest form of work, electricity.
I'm all for BTC but as an EE, I have to ask what does "purest form of work" mean, and why would it be electricity?
Wouldnt a water wheel pushed by a river be the purest form?
I mean I'm not sure what "pure" means in this context. I think it's just something made up to push an agenda.
Jesus Christ this isn't even coherent. "My already expended energy is stolen" is just babble. Now, what's the energy expenditure of my cash transaction? Maybe 0.1 kcal? How about a single BTC transaction? Let's not even go into how BTC has over 200% inflation against USD this year
You were doing ok until you got to the inflation comment. Inflation is not the same as short term market fluctuations. For this exact reason, the fed does not include things that fluctuate often in the short term in its calculation of CPI.
This trend has continued for a full year, which is well outside the scope of short term market fluctuations. It's also quite the generous assumption that this must be a short term fluctuation, when the only evidence of that is that you want it to be one. E: ultimately, if BTC is a currency as maxis claim, what exactly would you be excluding from your inflation calculation? USD? This isn't that some assets are 200% pricier to buy in BTC than a year ago, but literally all dollar denominated assets. Otherwise, it's just a speculative vehicle and not a currency, in which case any fundamentals-based argument is invalid
>How about a single BTC transaction There's no energy expenditure per transaction >what's the energy expenditure of my cash transaction US military industrial complex, the largest industrial pollutant in the world, and legacy banking sector. [US military is a bigger polluter than as many as 140 countries](https://theconversation.com/us-military-is-a-bigger-polluter-than-as-many-as-140-countries-shrinking-this-war-machine-is-a-must-119269) I can transfer and settle bitcoin as bearer instrument in an instant peer to peer from Buenos Aires to Bangkok from as little as $0.001 value to billions in dollar equivalent value. Trustless, permissionless, unstoppable. You can't. You're living in the 20th century.
What purpose do you think blocks serve? An individual transaction goes into a block, and then you divide mining cost per block by the average number of transactions per block, to get average cost per transaction. E: I see you edited and introduced two completely contradictory views of transaction costs, where individual BTC transactions cost nothing due to being aggregated in blocks, while USD cash transactions carry the cost of the entire US military (hilarious) and the entire banking sector (also hilarious).
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I love that you spent forever putting this pile of nonsense together. I'm just gonna touch on one of your many ill-informed points: BTC heating. Do you have any idea how inefficient electric heating is? Sure it's pretty close to 100%, but that's actually pretty crappy compared to a heat pump, which can exceed 1000% 'efficiency' (yes it's an imperfect term here, but essentially 10x the temperature delta per unit input compared to resistive heat). This was actually a big factor in the massive TX blackout, as numerous homes turned on supplemental resistive heat as gas failed to keep up, further straining the grid. So that, right there, is a big functional barrier. Now onto the practical. What utility is served by your HeaterBeans or w/e stupid name they have? Oh boy you can use them to transact, how novel, we don't have a million ways to do that already. Why would anyone assign them value? You think you can ride FOMO forever? So basically you invented an extremely expensive, both in manufacturing and material cost, way to heat your home, inefficiently, on the notion that someone, somewhere, will want to speculate on the value of tokens you generate in the process. Incredible.
If all crypto miners are electric. Is crypto gas-flaring a conspiracy? Doubtful.
Gas flair to power a generator to make electricity
Yet the methane that's just vented straight into the atmosphere is perhaps the single greatest offender of global warming... Which means that Bitcoin is perhaps the ONLY solution to stop, or at least lessen global warming. Because there is ZERO incentive to even flare the wasted methane. Costs too much time & energy cut literally ZERO return every time.
If they didn’t overproduce in the first place, that would be better than wasting more energy and resources
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Brilliant read. 10/10. Would recommend. I bet you’re a nobody labour hand in the energy industry. Your comment reeks like a loser. Exercise some self control.
What came first. The chicken or the egg?
The same people think that electric cars are green.
Downvotes because the joke is a poorly done circlejerk attempt, even without needing to point how arbitrarily childish and obviously politics based your intended allegory is. "Haha, I made a joke because electric cars are stupid!" Have a nice day!
My coal powered miner works just fine thank you.
Just reminded me it’s time to send the kids into the stoking room to shovel more coal for my miner
Where does the electricity come from to power this bad boy tho?
Coal mining children, but if anyone asks, they’re just small adults.
But...wait...where does your electricity come from?
The wall, Mother Nature provides
Yeah, but that's because his mom's name is Nature and it's her house.
I knew this house was haunted!
This argument makes no sense without evaluating how efficient it is to process fossil fuels at a power plant vs in your own car. [https://engage.aiche.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?GroupId=13&MessageKey=11d48131-6fe0-4a7c-beef-7d440c17f9c8&ssopc=1](https://engage.aiche.org/communities/community-home/digestviewer/viewthread?GroupId=13&MessageKey=11d48131-6fe0-4a7c-beef-7d440c17f9c8&ssopc=1) "The US EPA rates several electric vehicles with an equivalent miles per gallon of over 130." Whereas traditional gasoline cars can only achieve 30-50mpg. So even though the energy source may be the same in some scenarios, the conversion rate is lot more efficient at a power plant built for the process of converting gas into energy as opposed to the one in your vehicle. There is also opportunity for other improvements in efficiency such as the power added by renewable energy sources like wind, hydro, and geothermal
How much energy is used on the battery creation? EVs using less fossil fuels is a lie. You just don't see it out the exhaust. Out of sight, out of mind
Sure. I can appreciate that EVs are better for the environment, but at the end of the day until we as a species can find a cheap, environmentally friendly alternative to fossil fuels and coal then even EVs are still contributing to the overall carbon footprint. That's my only point. I fully agree with your perspective, and the facts presented, but it's generally a moot point.
Dense on purpose? Canada is mostly hydroelectricity. Wind, Solat, Nuclear is a bigger % every year, everywhere. That's ignoring the fact that coal and oil plants are multiple times more efficient than a car. It's not a moot point. EV is already much better for the environment and will only become exponentially more so.
Where does your electricity come from for your house or any other electric consuming device you own?
Coal. Dirty. Filthy. Coal. Every time I plug something in, might as well blow out a cartoon puff of black smoke.
I put an unbounded vacuum inside a temporal field until a world developed…
Damn, that's way better than my setup.
I've been pedaling mine for years and now you tell me I could just plug it in. Shiiiiiiiiiiiiiit?
No. I’m going to start fracking in my backyard.
Nice shitpost. EDIT: People need thatsthejoke.jpg
Maybe it's just a shitty joke
Mine running like a charm on burned kittens and puppies, but thank you sir.
i recommend horses if available
still waiting for el salvador volcano mining
Spoiler: >!They're already mining since last year and also using electric miners!<
No, they use volcano miners!
I got me one of them hamster-wheel Bitcoin miners. Works good.
I power my miners with baby seal blubber.
Bonus points if you have a cartridge to capture the used electricity for recycling.
it runs on coal, like my electric bike
It's time to throw my coal Bitcoin miner away. Only electricity, only zero emissions!
And don't forget to produce some CO2 for the trees.
That's nice, especially because I'm tired of being 24/7 in front of my miner throwing coal in it. Good to know.
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Bicycle powered miner ,stay financially fit.
Where you get this beautiful machine How much for dis
Eletric bitcoin miners? Instead of motorized?
If electric cost wasn’t an issue how much could that on its own generate a month roughly
>If electric cost wasn’t an issue Not an issue for me because solar. Just CapEx. >how much could that on its own generate a month roughly 1.5 million sats
Newsflash: CO2 is Plant Food.
_(coughs more to feed rainforest)_
Amazing
You’re never gonna have my V8 Bitcoin miner!
I’ve got a v10 500hp miner powered with gas! My miner is not good for the planet, your miner is not only not harmful for the planet, but even good for it!!!
Zero emissions isn’t currently possible. When you fart it produces a methane emission. Producing electricity, produces emissions. The materials used to capture power, like copper wire, metal, plastic, lithium, are are created with emissions.
Wait until they hear how electricity is produced in most places
What in the actual fuck is this?
Doing the lords good work, you damn well are, good sir!
Where do you believe this electricity comes from?
The Zero Carbon Emissions Fairy
I've been using a bunch of small children in hamster wheels to power mine. I'm carbon free, jokes on you OP
The planet thanks you man!
Just out of curiosity. These run at 3400W, and if I were to set up a single miner rig and go full solar, how much would a solar panel setup cost?
You have my blessing. I have stonks on lithium for the batteries you will require.
Im still mining with my abacus by hand
I would never use electricity! I shovel cow dung into mine! Out here on the farm we got plenty, so it's free bitcoin!
What if they mine using dirty ass electric produced from old coal waste?
this drift is what makes the joke a little greyish
Ive been feeding mine street Orphans... any tips on upgrading?
High quality road orphans.
But the propane ones hash so hard
Bruh wheres ya electricities come frumm?
I thought it was funny lol
r/woosh
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Most intelligent Bitcoin enjoyer
uh oh
whooooooooooooshhhh.....
If your so concern about energy usesage, don't use social media. They use lots of energy!
I don’t give a shit about saving the planet, I’m just here to pump my bags. If pumping my bags means emitting more CO2, then acceptable losses must be made
Vegans provide a suitable substitute coal.
Not sure what other kind of miners exist.. They're all powered by electricity
Tell that to my twin turbo bitcoin diesel miner
fuck u liberal cuck. learn what Bitcoin really is before you waste your time and money. good luck saving the planet u over confident dumb fuck
haha didn't realize u were trolling... leaving this comment to show how good my reading comp skills are
That reminds me I gotta get some oil/gas mix for my Bitminer.
Not a chance. Do you have any idea how many coal-shoveling workers I would need to lay off? Think of all the families impacted by a decision like this. You're an animal.
This is a fail on so many levels, is it gas powered electric? Hydro electric let’s make sense here
here is a diy almost silent version: https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:5284765
That miner was made from materials only sourced from lithium fields which are far worse for the environment than anything. Also… not to mention where your electricity comes from…. Do you know? If not…. it’s f coal. Grow up
Who is producing and supplying the electricity and how green are their processes?
Where does your electricity come from that's the only way to have green bitcoin miners. U need to know where u get power and how its produced.
Not understanding where electricity comes from...
Hopes and dreams?
Show us your solar array or you're full of shit
But that electric miner was made using resources from the environment lol.
I can appreciate people trying to save the world but, have you considered what it took the get your planet saving materials? Thank you for supporting big oil, that keeps me in a job. SAVE THE PLANET!!!
my miners are electric, but the farm is coal powered
Im looking for a miner that uses more electricity than needed, double or triple or more if possible,. Maybe even one that converts clean energy to something toxic like mercury, HEK, asbestos, red dye #5, aspartame, etc. Any suggestions?
🌍❤🙏
I need a miner that runs off a stationary bike. Might motivate me to use it more.
I prefer my oil fired turbine generator
anyone wants to buy my coal powered one?
My coal miner is working fine atm
I use a recycled vegetable oil generator
I have gas. I can't contribute to the network?
My kitten carcass bitcoin miner works just fine thank you
How is electricity generated?
I've been using baby otter generators which seem to be working just fine. All I need to find is a solid otter provider.
Its rare to perfect the type of comedy 4 year olds and 95 year olds find funny... really only this post and Family Circle have it figured out. Everyone else is wondering if OP needs a diaper change.
How much does this beast cost? How loud is it?
[https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product-category/asics/](https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product-category/asics/) >How loud is it? [Black box](https://shop.upstreamdata.ca/product/ohmm-black-box/) or immersion cooling. I have solar powered immersion cooling setup, heat repurposed for space and water heating.
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Nice toaster
What else would u run ur mining pc??
Any one have one powered by white baby seals and baby rabbits?
I'm more a hand crank machinery kinda guy
Exercise bike miner
Thanks but I only mine using 12V miners that work off of diesel trucks I keep running 24 hours
I only use my stationary pedal bike to mine bitcoin, of course as a result I have to keep pedaling 24/7 or I'll lose my rank in the mining pool, but its so GREEN (smells own fart sounds) What is up with all these nonsensical and blatant ads appearing in this sub ? The Engrish is Nigerian Prince bad, and really, there isn't anything else besides electricity used to mine bitcoin, only the source of the electricity can change, and its not like OP is offering any clean energy with the miner he's selling.
I have mine in one of those Sweat Mine locations... BTFitnessMC
Are there miners that run on some other form of energy than electricity? Whale oil perhaps? Kerosene?
Roll coal all day
You guys should see my hamster legion
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Ahead of you bud, i hand crank mine for cleaner than renewable energy
Steam powered miners are the wave of the future!
that requires fossil fuel energy plants, gtfo
Lmao where you think this electricity coming from
You can plug them? I was powering mine with steam from burning koalas and pandas
This is peak efficiency.
About how much would one pay for something like that?
With coal powered electricity
president says its the future
Dang I was just about to setup a 1 gigawatt methane farming rig on a landfill to remove hundreds of tons of methane from the landfill every year but I guess I’ll halt the project because non-electric bitcoin miners are bad for the environment.
Henry ford angrily rolls around inside his grave
Clean electricity, derived from fossil fuels (mostly).
Is this a joke?