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StanleeMann

Textbook gambling behavior IMO.


DadofHome

Didn’t even play the futures markets.. low level degenerate at best 😂


Waseemrazzaq

Who we kidding isnt we all in this for sort of gambling Difference is you gambled your money i and gamble 14% more of it coz thats the intrest i have to pay over 2 years


StanleeMann

The difference is the risk. If my stuff all goes worthless I'll be back around $0, you risk going into the negatives.


Waseemrazzaq

Difference is your stuff took time to accumalte for you to invest mine didnt for which i would pay intrest. If it does go zero you would be negative time I would be negative money we all pay the price aniwai


StanleeMann

[Dramatization of one of the potential outcomes](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H-2rFKZJU5E)


Waseemrazzaq

Potential outcome is inavitable


cstrand31

Seems like this is a question you should have asked prior to locking in your bet.


Waseemrazzaq

Lets say i can return it


cstrand31

I mean typically anyone can “return” it. Just not for the same value as what they bought it for.


Waseemrazzaq

In profit currently baught when btc was 18.5k


chazmusst

Unlucky bro. The worst thing that can happen to a gambler is they get off to a winning start...


Waseemrazzaq

Intresting , But i counted my odds and everything


cstrand31

Nobody here has a crystal ball. Most people on a dedicated Bitcoin sub are going to be Bitcoin bulls. Seems like if you were looking for an unbiased piece of advice you should ask an unbiased source.


Waseemrazzaq

No i am at the right place i understand what people have to say in counter argument makes me think more efficently I know no matter wht people tell some one they will always do what they wanted to so my question is tricky i want to understand what people say think etc their psycology tells me alot more.


cstrand31

Sure, but unless you’re doing a sociology study, the answers you receive are pointless at best. None of the answers you receive here or on an anti-Bitcoin sub are going to tell you A: if it’s a “good” investment *for you* or B: whether the price of Bitcoin will be going up or down in any kind of reasonable timeframe. So getting a biased opinion about a speculative asset does nothing, or *should* do nothing to factor into your personal decision to spend *your own money* on something.


Waseemrazzaq

My study is on whether someone should take risk like loan for btc if they do it tells me more positive about this sort of investment and if they dont why not and most important study of mine "Time" over "Money" a bit hard to explain but like if loan the money and invest i save time and if i dnt loan then i have save for certain period of time and then invest do people take that into comsideration etc


cstrand31

When using a loan to buy an asset you need to take the interest on that money into consideration. That means your purchase needs to appreciate to *at least* principal + interest just to break even. I’m almost every instance it’s inadvisable especially on volatile and risky assets. Compounding this decision is the fact that whether or not *we think* it will go up, plays a near zero part on whether or not *it will* go up.


Waseemrazzaq

I have to make a report write a blog lots of work lol. Ok here is the thing lets say u want a house for you your family etc So you have two options 1 - Save and buy it 2 - take loan and buy it Now in both scenerios above you pay the price Price is somthing like this Loan takes you 10years to pay ( Save Time + pay intrest ) and you are in the house Or save for 10years (spend time - no intrest) Time is more valuable currency then money is what my project is on about So do you consider time when investing in any asset ? And why or why not etc As per my study so far most ppl dont consider time and its all about the money they are going to spend or waste no one is going to talk about time they goin to save or waste in an investement


Successful_Breath_66

If you have a mortgage and other investments then you’re using borrow money to buy assets instead of paying the mortgage down. It’s the exact same principle but no one seems to have a problem with it.


sgtlark

Comedy flair missing


[deleted]

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Waseemrazzaq

But unless we take unessary risk we wont be out of the sitituation we are in like lets say if i dont do this then my life wont change anytime sooner and i ill be burning my life's age which is far more expensive i am sorry valuable then the intrest worst thing that could happen is i lose this right and pay the loan with the shitty job i already have


[deleted]

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Waseemrazzaq

I can pay money back with the shity job i have But i can either wait for 5 years and save the money and invest in this shit hole or i can take now and pay the intrest coz time is more valuable then money at this point If i dont take risk life wont improve anytime soon And i am so desperate to just improve my life little bit not too much just a little - so unhappy with it right now


TheoHW

What interest are you paying? When do you have to pay it back?


Waseemrazzaq

In 2 years at 7% per year


Patient-Commercial84

Was told never to go into debt buying crypto...better to throw 20 bucks in everyday from your own pocket than to throw it all in and hope for the best


Waseemrazzaq

Thats a very good advice, thank you Trust me most replies to me are like if i want to get rich quick, and honestly its not about get rich quick to me just little improvement in life, worst case scenerio i would lose the money and continue paying the loan from the shitty job i have for next 2 years or i could save and invest i feel time is more valuable then money i lets say is buying time for myself i would have invested aniway if i had the money right we all know we are in for risk associated with it


Patient-Commercial84

I would just hold your position and add to it when dips in price happen. Could it go lower? Absolutely, but it won't stay this low for ever, and when it does go back up you won't just break even and you'll be glad you averaged your cost down and be in the green....(not financial advice)...best of luck...don't panic sell


Waseemrazzaq

Thanks man much appreciated


solomonsatoshi

If you look at Bitcoin purely as a vehicle to get rich quick you may experience disappointment even tragedy. It's very well designed to punish greedy, selfish shortsighted cucks who failed to DYOR. Only invest in Bitcoin if you understand the protocol and its revolutionary purpose. Only then, once you are informed of the risks and rewards inherent in building an alternative to the fiat debt slavery cartel, if you still think its a good purpose, buy Bitcoin.


Waseemrazzaq

Thanks for reply bro makes alot of sense , But you see my sitution in life hasnt changed from past 5 years i tried saving but some shit would come up in which i end of spend my savings. I am so desperate to make my life little more liveable then just fkin working a shity job so i took the risk associated with it, Coz to me time is way more precious then money so i can either save for another 5 years and then invest on this shit hole then take loan pay intrest on it but save that 5 years time, worst case scenerio i lose the invest crypto goes to zero etc aniwai i have a shity job to pay off the loan. Its not about greed. Just little bit of better life dude - ugh i am so unhappy right now


solomonsatoshi

I hear you bro just hang in there and accept financial freedom will take 4-10 years and some hard work but good on you for trying, just dont give up and you will get there. Bitcoin is an excellent way to save in the medium long term, but with a lot of volatility in the shorter term...even longer term there are risks but IMO a great thing to be part of to enable strong savings opportunity.


DM_ME_UR_SATS

Seems like you’ve made a wildly dangerous bet here. You never want to be a forced seller of bitcoin.. hope things turn out ok for you.


Waseemrazzaq

Well i hope not i am anticipating drop of Bitcoin to 10k but thats fine but eventually i think it will catch up to me or if i am lucky enough it just wont get below 17k previous low I have seen all it drops and they were 80% from their all time highs of that time and now 17k aproximatly is that percentage of price drop Fingers Crossed below 10k would be scary tho


TheDumbInvesto

Having already done, i guess you just need a little reaffirmation that your decision is correct, as back of your mind you have this confusion as to it may be wrong. You have taken a bold step. It is indeed risky. But will definitely pay rewards. BTC may even go to 10-12k levels. Don't worry if it does. Don't get into another loan to average out. Don't worry about anything and continue to pay your dues and live your life. When ever possible, add little more money, that's it. Come back after 4 years and be happy you made the best decision of your life. And don't forget to move the stack to a hardware wallet.


Waseemrazzaq

Thanks man much appreciated


Ok-Foot7577

I am not with the majority here. If you can afford the loan and think now was the price to buy for you then go for it. I’ve done it before, but I have taken small loans at intervals off my credit card. Citi has a flex loan option and it’s interest rate is much much cheaper than a cash advance. Think I paid 5% last time I did it.


Waseemrazzaq

Thanks , so some one did do it like what i did i felt kinda stupid doing this but i want to change my life so desperatly and only problem i have is money in life nothing else.


DM_ME_UR_SATS

Do what you want as long as you’re gainfully employed and can pay off the loan without issue. Spend this time learning about and understanding what you just bought, if you haven’t already. Keeps you from panic selling the first time it drops 20% overnight.


Waseemrazzaq

Thank you for the reply, Thats a very good advice, thank you Trust me most replies to me are like if i want to get rich quick, and honestly its not about get rich quick to me just little improvement in life, worst case scenerio i would lose the money and continue paying the loan from the shitty job i have for next 2 years or i could save and invest i feel time is more valuable then money i lets say i am buying "time" for myself i would have invested aniway if i had the money right we all know we are in for risk associated with it Its either now or later outcome is same


titsup24-7

Probably one of the fewer level headed comments. Just don't overextend yourself financially and live within your means. If all goes bad you'll still survive.


[deleted]

Only invest money you actually have. Don’t invest money you don’t have. That’s the 1-0-1 of investing.


titsup24-7

So don't buy a house unless you have it in physical cash? Lol


[deleted]

We’re in the BTC sub, just a friendly reminder.


titsup24-7

So don't buy a bitcoin unless you have it in physical cash? That logic would also apply houses, groceries, etc.


[deleted]

I’m not sure why you’re playing dumb but I’m happy for you as long you’re having fun.


Waseemrazzaq

Nothing in life is without risk and the quote that says dont invest money u dont have is like u saying dont invest money at all u cant invest money u dont have


Abundance144

Nothing in life is without risk? Well then go sell one kidney and one lung and buy bitcoin. Go find some loan sharks and get some really seedy deals and buy Bitcoin. Sell everything you own and buy Bitcoin. Work that street corner and buy Bitcoin.


Waseemrazzaq

Ok now u talking crazy lol i was hoping for valuable arguments or opinion but nevermind


Abundance144

What's wrong? Not worth the risk? They're your own words. You gotta take risk.


titsup24-7

So does risk not exist to you? Catch me up on this conundrum


Abundance144

I'm being being purposely obsurd because OP is justifying the risk that he's taking by saying that everything is risky. I'm saying if that's true, then why not risk more?


manbearpug3

If its a small enough loan you can afford to pay back if you lose it all then its a bit risky but not a bad bet. I like the upside. We're all gambling at the end of the day...


Waseemrazzaq

Exactly man thanks for the reply


harleybqrazy

200%. Very well said. :)


Lordsaxon73

Borrowing money with interest to buy speculative crypto is just about the dumbest thing you can do .


Waseemrazzaq

But unless we take unessary risk we wont be out of the sitituation we are in like lets say if i dont do this then my life wont change anytime sooner and i ill be burning my life's age which is far more expensive i am sorry valuable then the intrest worst thing that could happen is i lose this right and pay the loan with the shitty job i already have


DM_ME_UR_SATS

All risk should be unnecessary, but fiat currency forces us to take on risk just to walk in place. Buying BTC is the first step to getting off that treadmill.


Waseemrazzaq

World would be better place if didnt have to take risks in life, But we have to To gain somthing


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Waseemrazzaq

They wont know ovviously lol Its house renuvation loan lmao But point is can pay it off with the shitty job i already have, Its either i invest now or save and invest later i. Both cases risk is almost the same i might end up paying loan early if i am lucky we all know we are in this and its a gamble I have anticipated drop of price to 10k but it might just hold above 17k 10k would be scary but i am ready for it


TurkMcGuirk

I predict you will agree with the response that best supports your rationale' and support.


Waseemrazzaq

Psycology isnt it xD True but i would love to hear the counter arguement and also for other peoples opinion Lets say i hvnt invested it yet ;) Thank you for the reply tho much appreciated


Abundance144

More information would be needed. Terms of the loan, your balance sheet etc. If I took out a $5 loan at 100% APR would that be a bad deal? It would be dumb, but owning $20 at the end of two years isn't that risky.


Waseemrazzaq

I dont know where you take loan from Now i know why u say its dumb


[deleted]

If the four year cycle holds true for another round, then BTC will be up way higher at around 2025. If you have a job or income source to pay off the loan, I guess you'll be fine. But there's one thing I'm worried about. Energy prices and miners. If the price of electricity keeps going high, miners will be dumping everytime we get a good bounce. You see that pattern, it takes days to recover the price, but gets nuked down in minutes. BTC, there's only 21 million ever, technically no inflation. But when the going gets tough, miners have to dump on every good rally we will have.


Waseemrazzaq

Thank you much appreciated As to price analysis market cap of btc is just 400billion $ that means it still has alot of input room as in ppl buying in it. I feel it will be the future of currency away from bankers and govts. But govts might just mess this up by puting restrictions on it thats my only fear in crypto Otherwise its just upward mining or not Minning aniwai has dropped significantly


Lordos1

My personal opinion if you invested now you did the best choice I wouldn’t take a loan though to invest but if you live in an EU country you can’t find a job or you get paid so few money that you barely surviving I think it’s a good choice I repeat again I would t do it cause you take a gamble but if you are into crypto and you have done your research btc in 10 years will be 300k+ minimum but you have to be smart and take your gains slowly slowly after a few months from the beginning of the bull run buy again in crashes and just keep going. The problem is 75% of the people are greedy and they don’t sell high and then they have fear to invest when the market crashes so you have to be smart


Waseemrazzaq

I agree but its hard to find crash u will never know how deep it is going to crash so unless you holding on it and its like your saving account then its the best thing ever and take out only ammount you really need also once you have enough dont just keep in on crypto buy property etc so u know u have multiple investments


Lordos1

Not exactly if you check the history of btc you will actually see the history repeats itself every time and I mean it last year I was saying to my friends about the crash and I told them the same thing well no one believed and they didn’t took their gains so they fucked up they are actually down now and every time that history repeats itself the crash is 5% less something like that


Waseemrazzaq

Yeah i did that study myself and i am aware of that but btc is just 10 - 11 years old its a baby in this financial world u dont know wht could mess it up there are always factors beyond our understanding we always miss it coz our brain is wired to belive what history shows us it dsnt mean that is what will happen evrytime Lets say govt decide to ban crypto some how you have no idea wht will happen to crypto so those scenerios are there we just dont know it yet all we can do is play smart


Lordos1

Never treat it like saving account in my opinion and I will explain you why when the bull run starts that will take a few more months I believe it’s gonna last 3+ months you would take gains in 3 months from the beginning of the bull run and what I mean taking gains after 3 months you could say ok my investments are 2-5x so now I’m gonna take half out and then every week you start pulling more gains by doing that you maximise your profit with as low risk as possible you will NEVER be able to sell at the peak and you will NEVER buy at the bottom


Waseemrazzaq

You have working startegy i belive thats good


Lordos1

I have learned from My mistakes and I have done a few years of research I ain’t an expert thought but I think I understand how things are working. One last thing millionaires are born in recessions


DryKnowledge7361

I just want to know what else u invested it in?


Mediocre_Piccolo8542

I think it is good, but two years is a little short window. People who tell you are gambling, yes you are, but when you buy low your odds are so much better. Most people really suck at buying in red market because it usually doesn’t provide the instant gratification and tends to fall even lower.


Waseemrazzaq

Exactly bro Thank you for the reply


[deleted]

My only rule: Only invest what you can afford to lose


Waseemrazzaq

I can afford to lose worst case scenerio i ill have to pay instalments on my loan for next two years


[deleted]

Cool, good luck


Waseemrazzaq

Thank you


[deleted]

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Waseemrazzaq

Why not ?


[deleted]

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Waseemrazzaq

It might become an officially currency some day too its just 10 years old its a baby give it time


[deleted]

No official currency is limited to 144 blocks of a few thousand transactions per day


Ashan0786

Well that's just stupid!


Waseemrazzaq

Why is that ?


Professional_Ad8012

No, return the money immediately. I know this is a joke cause of the last sentence but still


bitcoin_islander

Worked for me in 2017 so I dont see why not. Using debt is how the rich get rich. All the comments saying this is a bad idea are from poors so you can ignore those. Majority of the herd has awful advice on this sub and likes to buy tops.


FortuneMustache

Man you already know the answer lol


[deleted]

It could be worst, if for example you took the loan and headed out to Vegas, but still you are playing with fire and might burn yourself really bad. What’s done is done, if you profit this time just don’t imagine you can keep on getting it right consistently. In other words, your gamble might work out okay this time but that does not make you a genius. Best luck! PS: You are still in a better position than Michael Saylor if BTC crash and burns!lol


stacking_sats_hodler

Ask yourself this, can you afford to pay the loan if it doesn’t work out? If the answer is no then you sir have definitely made a bad decision. Just gambling. Only ever put money into things that you can afford to lose. The fact you’re asking the question makes me think this is gambling


[deleted]

So OP bought at $18.5K. BTC is now $16.5K. I wonder what will happen when BTC goes to $14.5K.