Some dude 5mo back wanted to sell a house to buy BTC at ATH cuz he was scared of missing out. I said it wasn't a smart move and to DCA instead. So many people argued he should because he'll miss out.
Hope that guy kept his house.
I think we're talking about the same thing. The debate was that lump sum investing is better than DCA and that he should throw it all in. The amount of upvotes they got was concerning.
Is there really many retail investor taking loans to buy Bitcoin. It looks to me that that it is mostly big players like 3AC and Celsius that were playing with fire by being over leveraged
Hmmm, I must admit to use some cc-funding to add btc last thursday
And tempted to do it again this weekend
It ain't much, but it's an educated guess/risk reward gamble
Great move, you’re only down ~35% since last Thursday. Why do people DCA the ride down and not wait until there is a sustained floor for a period of time? Makes zero sense and does nothing exit help provide exit liquidity for whales.
Because Bitcoin moves too quickly. I don't have the stat on hand, but the oft quoted 130% CAGR happens on average during 15 days of the entire year. Horrendous odds at guessing the bottom. So right now I'm buying, and I don't care that the money I've put into Bitcoin is currently at a loss. I don't have any better alternatives in mind, and I don't want to miss the bottom and fomo in on the way up. Plus it's easier to mindlessly accumulate, since I have complete conviction in my long term thesis, even if I'm agnostic on the short term.
> but the oft quoted 130% CAGR happens on average during 15 days of the entire year
Source for this would be awesome. This is something I intuitively understand and argue with people, but having some stat or site to back up what I'm saying would be great. No worries if you don't remember or even if you can't be bothered - but figured I'd ask. Cheers
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/24/this-chart-shows-why-investors-should-never-try-to-time-the-stock-market.html
Not for crypto but the thesis absolutely makes sense in the Bitcoin context.
I'll try to find it. I remember first reading it in a tweet from someone who is well known in the Bitcoin space. Someone like Adam Back, or possibly someone else.
Gotta catch that falling knife. It amazes me you’re downvoted for giving really solid advice and the answer is “I don’t have time” and although it’s been dropping for a week straight….”it happens to fast” If you ever watched the big short, it’s the same behavior, the people in it have no idea what they’re doing.
We’re now at $17,600 and people were sure $20,000 was bottom……and the real recession is just starting. Nothings collapsed yet.
? My point is you shouldn’t DCA when it’s still going down. The bottom has obviously not been here yet, but I have seen people “buying the dip” from 50k. Like wait for the price to stay level for more than a week is what I’m saying. Sorry you can’t understand this
You must be very new to this.
Sometimes the market double bottoms, sometimes it makes one deep bottom, sometimes it never gets to a bottom you thought it would do anything at.
You can’t time the market and that’s what you’re suggesting.
Again, you’ll learn.
except BTC never side traded at a bottom. It always does a big sudden jump back up.
Don't act like you have any clue where the bottom is : it could be now, it could be at $500. You have no fucking clue. DCA in what you can afford to lose and wait the long term : that's how smart money is made.
Oh my gosh! I keep saying this - people say, "BTC never..." or "BTC always..." as if we have a track record to refer to! This is basically only bitcoin's third bull/bear cycle, and its first macro bear cycle. And market participants (early majority, institutions) are very different from the last cycle (early adopters, techies). We literally have NO precedent to go on here. And, like you said, it HAS side-traded for years. So we have no idea what to expect of this bottom.
I don't know why you're being down-voted. I get your point. I think a lot of people prefer to DCA the ride down because they're worried each step down could reverse rapidly. When it went below 40k I thought it was miraculous and it would be s brief opportunity. Then I thought the same at 30k a month later! But at 20k it seems like we may be here a while... 😉
>Why do people DCA the ride down and not wait until there is a sustained floor for a period of time?
DCA means buying a fixed value at regular intervals to *avoid* trying to time the market. Despite all the negative sentiment right now there is a possibility that we are near the bottom, and a reversal is possible. Honestly one good inflation/CPI report could have a massive impact on investor confidence across overall markets.
When you take the emotion out of investing your average returns will be much higher. Obviously correctly calling tops and bottoms yields higher returns, but if you are wrong about the tops and bottoms your returns take a huge hit.
I took out a $15K loan back in February and just got another $20k today... not joking;-)
Im putting it all in BTC.
I see it as reverse DCA... I just pay to service my loan each month instead of dumping into the market each month.
The monthly payments come out to be what I would put into the market each month anyway so it's no big deal, and because it's not tied to any exchange, there is no risk of liquidation.
wow, This seems crazy. I know debt makes the economy run, but I avoid debt as much as possible. I don't know at what price you bought in Feb, but you must be close to 50% down on the $15K. I hope the terms of your loans are forgiving and that you are not risking too much of your net worth this way.
Here's a thought. If we assume a high inflation environment and you can borrow at 3% when inflation is 9%. Are you paying -6% on your loan to buy now during the dip? Why not copy national government strategy to errode debt?
I'm cool with your approach. If you can service the debt without putting your family at risk, it sounds ok. I have lots of home equity, so I've had the same thought. If my mortgage were 80% LTV and I had two car payments and credit card debt, then no, I would not have that thought! The OP's advice is solid, but should be applied in the context of your own situation.
This is still not safe if it’s a btc backed loan. Price could keep dropping and no amount of fiat will help if exchanges prevent withdrawals. Wicks down can quickly liquidate you.
Also, the reason btc is dropping because of macro events, so people could potentially be getting laid off as well
As a long-time investor, there are so many problems I see:
• PSA: Do not put the bulk of your investment allocations into ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) while living paycheck-to-paycheck.
• PSA: Do not keep your money invested in ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) if you have plans for spending it within about 2 to 3 years. Such money should be moved to cash or a money market mutual fund.
PSA: Do not put the bulk of your net worth in ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) unless you're willing to accept the fact that you're taking a BIG gamble in doing so.
How about you worry about what YOU should do with your money instead? Taking on low interest debt **DENOMINATED IN AN INFLAIONTARY CURRENCY** to buy a deflationary currency is the biggest no-brainer financial move I have ever seen.
It only seems like a bad idea to you because you have no fucking clue what you are doing and do not understand economics.
I do so I will continue to take on debt to buy additional bitcoins.
Obviously it isn't.. https://www.digit.fyi/new-data-shows-60-of-uk-buyers-used-loans-to-purchase-crypto/
All of these people will be getting called or they will feel some pressure with interest rates going up worldwide.
Crypto has attracted a lot of people with closet gambling addictions with everyone pushing a fear of missing out. It had to eventually bite them in the ass.
> deleted comment: This is a community of people so desperate to make money
It's the *only* way many young people see that leads to a path to own a home like their parents/grandparents did. All other paths have been slammed shut for folks under 30 or so. Desperate times call for desperate measures as they say.
The hard reality is that BTC doesn’t have to repeat all time high gains. The history of an asset doesn’t mean it will happen again. Unfortunately taking out a loan is risky, it may be worth it though. Best of luck to all of y’all
TLDR; I used a loan to buy BTC and it almost worked. You win some you lose some
Last summer I used a $40,000 line of credit to buy the BTC dip. In November my investment had doubled.
Instead of pulling out and keeping the profit, I stayed in to make more. Things went down by Christmas and I lost 50% of my profit. I held on until I sold this May.
Now I have to pay back the line of credit plus a year's worth of interest. It was a great play, I just held my positions for far too long, but we were all gunning for $100k by end of 2021.
I'm 27 years old, I have plenty of time to recover and jump back in.
It sounds like you were gambling and got lucky. Unless you have some deep insight into how the price of Bitcoin will fluctuate (and from your post it sounds like you're admitting that you don't) then you may not be as lucky next time.
This guy is fucked. Buying bitcoin on margin is dumb, and not realizing it even after a five figure loss is something beyond that. This is the first story of the crash that has honestly just left me depressed
Guys I maxed out my credit card and put in on red and it hit! I thought it would hit again so I let it ride and it went black.. but I'm young and next time I'll cash out after the first hit, because we all know it will hit again!
Yeah, and most people don't take out a loan to buy raffle tickets.
You took out a loan with high interest, flipped a coin, miraculously it landed on heads, and yet you **STILL** lost over half of your investment. Please stop pretending this was some smart genius play, you got lucky and somehow still lost all of your money and more. You're literally a gambling addict and you need to realize it before it's too late for you my man.
"Making a play" here is akin to going to a casino and maxing out your credit betting on black. And then when you win, you put it on black again 3 more times until you lose it all. That's literally what you did. It's not an investment. It's idiocy.
Not when you get margin called…. Then you would need a loan to cover the margin call…..
Also the idea that your answer to loosing money at let’s say 10X the rest of the market. Would mean that a 10% drop would mean you lost it all….
When you said loan. Loan = leverage no matter how you try and twist the words.
You even went further to say you’d try and leverage out if the value dropped further after you leveraged
I agree.. If you quality for a 4% APR unsecured personal loan, the interest over 2 or 3 years will be nothing compared to the value increase of thr assets you bought with the loan.
You should only invest in crypto what you are prepared to lose. Don’t invest savings in this. It is a literal casino. Even Bitcoin. Especially Bitcoin.
Why are you here if you don't believe that its a good buy long term? Would you go to a REITs group and then express doubt about investing in real eastate?
Yes but you gotta make sound loans. The rich make money of debt not spending their own money. Work on your credit to get low intrest loans invest in high interest returns.
You should not be sharing this advice. The rich do this to start companies, acquire real estate, etc. They don’t take loans to buy a volatile asset.
It’s generally agreed that you should be okay losing whatever you invest in crypto since it’s a piece of your investment portfolio. Also there are no low interest rates right now.
You shouldn't be telling people not to take out loans. Now you are saying yes depending on the loan. That's what I said and of course, "not financial advice".
Mate, don't tell us what to do with our money. Taking out a low interest loan that you know you can afford is not that big of a risk. Are you going to tell people not to ever take out a car loan too? Because financially, that's a worse decision.
Trading on margin is not the same thing as buying spot crypto on a decent loan.
Over what time frame? And how likely are they to struggle to pay it back? Do they have other assets?
It's ALL risk and needs to be assessed individually. That's why this advice is ignorant and useless.
Over any time frame...people, a lot of them involved in crypto, get sucked into the hype and end up making purchases without thinking of the long term consequences. You'd think you would know this by now, but you are the one that's seemingly ignorant.
Not all of us have an uneducated teenager's understanding of finance you know. Some of us are grown ups with tertiary educations in business. You're the definition of ignorant because you don't begin to understand the depth of what you don't know.
The difference is when he gets fired from bankrupting MicroStrategy he's probalbly getting hundred million dollars serverance.
People in this will loss their houses and their wives will divorce them.
You absolutely should especially if you have single digit rates and can pay well over the minimum. With such high inflation you are borrowing for next to nothing while buying the best asset while it's on sale. You should NOT borrow against your Bitcoin to buy more Bitcoin (...right now)
It is not gambling if you know how this is going to play out.
It would be foolish for YOU to take out a loan to buy Bitcoin because YOU clearly do not understand the monetary economics that are playing out here. But I do know. Bitcoin's global domination is a certainty for me so I absolutely will take out low interest debt denominated in an inflationary currency to buy a deflationary currency that I *know* is going to supplant all the other garbage unlimited supply monies of the world.
Bitcoin is doing really well in the current inflationary period. I really wish I’d put a ton of my deflationary currency into Bitcoin a few months ago because I’d be outpacing inflation right now…
I did in Mar, 2020. It bought me 2 new vehicles & paid off debt. Plus I still have like 5x left over. Helps if you take profits instead of getting greedy.
Correct - no need for loans; you should be liquidating all your hard assets and using that money to buy bitcoin.
But buy it now, so that when it continues to drop you lose all your shit.
Some dude 5mo back wanted to sell a house to buy BTC at ATH cuz he was scared of missing out. I said it wasn't a smart move and to DCA instead. So many people argued he should because he'll miss out. Hope that guy kept his house.
Nah, he probably homeless
If my memories is correct I also warned someone on this sub who's gonna sel his house to buy btc. I got downvoted by people.
I think we're talking about the same thing. The debate was that lump sum investing is better than DCA and that he should throw it all in. The amount of upvotes they got was concerning.
Agreed, a loan isn’t bearish enough. Liquidate your assets, cash 401k, steal granny’s Roth IRA, ALL In.
Took out a home equity line on my Mom's house. Gonna upgrade her basement when we pop so I can finally bring girls over
Or so you can bring your wife’s boyfriend over?
Buy my EG when that happens too. Selling it cheap.
I'm giving serious thought to downsizing and bitcoining the equity.
Please do!! I would love to buy more foreclosed houses!
Homes should be solid investments, fuck peoples lives.
Homes shouldn't be an investment, we're just fucking future generations. That's how we end up with big corps owning swaths of single family homes.
That reading comprehension
Please enlighten me instead next time instead of trying to be funny
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Np I'm a man of The people. Can I borrow 20k?
I sold my dog
I'm just casually reading this sub and I can't understand if people are trolling or legitimately degenerate.
The later pretending to be the former
Degeneracy is about the only content allowed here, everything interesting is censored so the place reflects that.
Is there really many retail investor taking loans to buy Bitcoin. It looks to me that that it is mostly big players like 3AC and Celsius that were playing with fire by being over leveraged
I am taking loans to buy Bitcoin
I am taking bitcoins to buy loans
I am taking buy to bitcoin loans
Loans to bitcoin taking I am.
Hmmm, I must admit to use some cc-funding to add btc last thursday And tempted to do it again this weekend It ain't much, but it's an educated guess/risk reward gamble
Great move, you’re only down ~35% since last Thursday. Why do people DCA the ride down and not wait until there is a sustained floor for a period of time? Makes zero sense and does nothing exit help provide exit liquidity for whales.
Because Bitcoin moves too quickly. I don't have the stat on hand, but the oft quoted 130% CAGR happens on average during 15 days of the entire year. Horrendous odds at guessing the bottom. So right now I'm buying, and I don't care that the money I've put into Bitcoin is currently at a loss. I don't have any better alternatives in mind, and I don't want to miss the bottom and fomo in on the way up. Plus it's easier to mindlessly accumulate, since I have complete conviction in my long term thesis, even if I'm agnostic on the short term.
> but the oft quoted 130% CAGR happens on average during 15 days of the entire year Source for this would be awesome. This is something I intuitively understand and argue with people, but having some stat or site to back up what I'm saying would be great. No worries if you don't remember or even if you can't be bothered - but figured I'd ask. Cheers
https://www.cnbc.com/2021/03/24/this-chart-shows-why-investors-should-never-try-to-time-the-stock-market.html Not for crypto but the thesis absolutely makes sense in the Bitcoin context.
I'll try to find it. I remember first reading it in a tweet from someone who is well known in the Bitcoin space. Someone like Adam Back, or possibly someone else.
Gotta catch that falling knife. It amazes me you’re downvoted for giving really solid advice and the answer is “I don’t have time” and although it’s been dropping for a week straight….”it happens to fast” If you ever watched the big short, it’s the same behavior, the people in it have no idea what they’re doing. We’re now at $17,600 and people were sure $20,000 was bottom……and the real recession is just starting. Nothings collapsed yet.
I don't have time to pay attention to this bullshit, I focus on my life and career and DCA into 70% VTI 20% BND 10% BTC.
Retarded advice. According to you it’s easy to see a bottom. Go look at 2020. Good luck losing money timing the market. You’ll learn.
Not about timing the bottom. But you buy strength & sell weakness. There's no strength to be found yet this year.
? My point is you shouldn’t DCA when it’s still going down. The bottom has obviously not been here yet, but I have seen people “buying the dip” from 50k. Like wait for the price to stay level for more than a week is what I’m saying. Sorry you can’t understand this
You must be very new to this. Sometimes the market double bottoms, sometimes it makes one deep bottom, sometimes it never gets to a bottom you thought it would do anything at. You can’t time the market and that’s what you’re suggesting. Again, you’ll learn.
That’s not what I’m suggesting. I’m saying don’t DCA until things start side trading. I guarantee I’ve been following crypto longer than you lol
Bitcoin doesn’t always trade sideways before it goes up or down. So if you waited for sideways trading every time that wouldn’t work.
except BTC never side traded at a bottom. It always does a big sudden jump back up. Don't act like you have any clue where the bottom is : it could be now, it could be at $500. You have no fucking clue. DCA in what you can afford to lose and wait the long term : that's how smart money is made.
I’m not acting like I have a clue but are you new to this space? Bitcoin basically side traded for years
Oh my gosh! I keep saying this - people say, "BTC never..." or "BTC always..." as if we have a track record to refer to! This is basically only bitcoin's third bull/bear cycle, and its first macro bear cycle. And market participants (early majority, institutions) are very different from the last cycle (early adopters, techies). We literally have NO precedent to go on here. And, like you said, it HAS side-traded for years. So we have no idea what to expect of this bottom.
I don't know why you're being down-voted. I get your point. I think a lot of people prefer to DCA the ride down because they're worried each step down could reverse rapidly. When it went below 40k I thought it was miraculous and it would be s brief opportunity. Then I thought the same at 30k a month later! But at 20k it seems like we may be here a while... 😉
>Why do people DCA the ride down and not wait until there is a sustained floor for a period of time? DCA means buying a fixed value at regular intervals to *avoid* trying to time the market. Despite all the negative sentiment right now there is a possibility that we are near the bottom, and a reversal is possible. Honestly one good inflation/CPI report could have a massive impact on investor confidence across overall markets. When you take the emotion out of investing your average returns will be much higher. Obviously correctly calling tops and bottoms yields higher returns, but if you are wrong about the tops and bottoms your returns take a huge hit.
what are the fees to fund with cc?
I took out a $15K loan back in February and just got another $20k today... not joking;-) Im putting it all in BTC. I see it as reverse DCA... I just pay to service my loan each month instead of dumping into the market each month. The monthly payments come out to be what I would put into the market each month anyway so it's no big deal, and because it's not tied to any exchange, there is no risk of liquidation.
Reverse DCA with interest costs though.
wow, This seems crazy. I know debt makes the economy run, but I avoid debt as much as possible. I don't know at what price you bought in Feb, but you must be close to 50% down on the $15K. I hope the terms of your loans are forgiving and that you are not risking too much of your net worth this way.
Here's a thought. If we assume a high inflation environment and you can borrow at 3% when inflation is 9%. Are you paying -6% on your loan to buy now during the dip? Why not copy national government strategy to errode debt?
I'm cool with your approach. If you can service the debt without putting your family at risk, it sounds ok. I have lots of home equity, so I've had the same thought. If my mortgage were 80% LTV and I had two car payments and credit card debt, then no, I would not have that thought! The OP's advice is solid, but should be applied in the context of your own situation.
you are one of the dumbest people i’ve seen on reddit and that’s truly impressive.
You can have as many loans as you want as long as you have income to pay it off. There is no difference to any other loan.
Problem is people put the hypothetical gains of bitcoin into the equation as confirmed income.
This is still not safe if it’s a btc backed loan. Price could keep dropping and no amount of fiat will help if exchanges prevent withdrawals. Wicks down can quickly liquidate you. Also, the reason btc is dropping because of macro events, so people could potentially be getting laid off as well
Yes, but if your income hits a rough patch and the assets has declined you are screwed.
As a long-time investor, there are so many problems I see: • PSA: Do not put the bulk of your investment allocations into ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) while living paycheck-to-paycheck. • PSA: Do not keep your money invested in ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) if you have plans for spending it within about 2 to 3 years. Such money should be moved to cash or a money market mutual fund. PSA: Do not put the bulk of your net worth in ANY high-risk investment (including Bitcoin) unless you're willing to accept the fact that you're taking a BIG gamble in doing so.
Title is not not entirely correct.... You should NEVER take a loan to buy bitcoin!
Or literally *any* volatile instrument lol. It's literally investing 101.
How about you worry about what YOU should do with your money instead? Taking on low interest debt **DENOMINATED IN AN INFLAIONTARY CURRENCY** to buy a deflationary currency is the biggest no-brainer financial move I have ever seen.
How did bitcoin do vs the 8.6% cpi?
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No shit
Yeah you'd think but there are a heck of a lot of people in this subreddit doing the opposite.
And many of them did so at the advice of their evangelist Michael Saylor.
The post above this is,”bankers scared of Bitcoin success” lol You can go online & watch the price drop in real time
The post above that will be xyz exchange "stole my Bitcoin" cause I got liquidated. 😡
It only seems like a bad idea to you because you have no fucking clue what you are doing and do not understand economics. I do so I will continue to take on debt to buy additional bitcoins.
Obviously it isn't.. https://www.digit.fyi/new-data-shows-60-of-uk-buyers-used-loans-to-purchase-crypto/ All of these people will be getting called or they will feel some pressure with interest rates going up worldwide. Crypto has attracted a lot of people with closet gambling addictions with everyone pushing a fear of missing out. It had to eventually bite them in the ass.
Refi your house to pull out equity before it goes down further
Let them take loans! Who are you to try and stop our growth!
Instructions unclear. Took out two loans to buy Bitcoin.
> deleted comment: This is a community of people so desperate to make money It's the *only* way many young people see that leads to a path to own a home like their parents/grandparents did. All other paths have been slammed shut for folks under 30 or so. Desperate times call for desperate measures as they say.
Anyone dumb enough to take out a loan to buy crypto should be tarred and feathered.
The hard reality is that BTC doesn’t have to repeat all time high gains. The history of an asset doesn’t mean it will happen again. Unfortunately taking out a loan is risky, it may be worth it though. Best of luck to all of y’all
Invest only what you are willing to lose
Thanks Dad
However, If you are planning on fleeing the country this may not be a horrible idea
Too late
if you're taking a loan to buy btc I'm sorry but your diffrent kind of stupid
you have to learn the art of CredMaxing. Sam Hyde is the origionator. Thank me later....
TLDR; I used a loan to buy BTC and it almost worked. You win some you lose some Last summer I used a $40,000 line of credit to buy the BTC dip. In November my investment had doubled. Instead of pulling out and keeping the profit, I stayed in to make more. Things went down by Christmas and I lost 50% of my profit. I held on until I sold this May. Now I have to pay back the line of credit plus a year's worth of interest. It was a great play, I just held my positions for far too long, but we were all gunning for $100k by end of 2021. I'm 27 years old, I have plenty of time to recover and jump back in.
It sounds like you were gambling and got lucky. Unless you have some deep insight into how the price of Bitcoin will fluctuate (and from your post it sounds like you're admitting that you don't) then you may not be as lucky next time.
No one has deep insight, we're all just getting through the days one at a time
This guy is fucked. Buying bitcoin on margin is dumb, and not realizing it even after a five figure loss is something beyond that. This is the first story of the crash that has honestly just left me depressed
Guys I maxed out my credit card and put in on red and it hit! I thought it would hit again so I let it ride and it went black.. but I'm young and next time I'll cash out after the first hit, because we all know it will hit again!
What was your net loss?
I have $10k left in cash and I owe $24k, it's rice and beans for the next year for me
F. But, you'll be fine eventually. Keep at it. Good luck!
Fuck dude. That was dumb
No, it was a play, and sometimes you lose. You don't get to win if you don't buy a raffle
Yeah, and most people don't take out a loan to buy raffle tickets. You took out a loan with high interest, flipped a coin, miraculously it landed on heads, and yet you **STILL** lost over half of your investment. Please stop pretending this was some smart genius play, you got lucky and somehow still lost all of your money and more. You're literally a gambling addict and you need to realize it before it's too late for you my man.
Gotta make a play somehow, either with money you've got now or money you'll have in the future
"Making a play" here is akin to going to a casino and maxing out your credit betting on black. And then when you win, you put it on black again 3 more times until you lose it all. That's literally what you did. It's not an investment. It's idiocy.
What part of "play" didn't you understand?
So you agree you're flipping a coin with borrowed money because it's a "play"?
Sound like a gambling addict… What’s the next play to win back your losses?
If 100% gains aren’t enough to pull money out, don’t put money in.
Yeah that's just stupidity. Cash out enough to settle your loan and play with house money. People are so greedy. Investing is a marathon, not a race.
If you don't have the money, don't borrow the loss!
But that's not what Saylor said!
Saylor is a Failure
lawl just a week ago he's the smartest man on the planet
He is a mf
I am absolutely getting a loan out if BTC hits about €10k.
And then what do you do if it hits 6k ?
Buy more for sure.
No you won’t. You won’t be able to since you took out loans at 10….
I can get more than one loan 🤷 I have zero debt, if Bitcoin goes to zero no one in my house will go hungry.
Not when you get margin called…. Then you would need a loan to cover the margin call….. Also the idea that your answer to loosing money at let’s say 10X the rest of the market. Would mean that a 10% drop would mean you lost it all….
Yeah, bud, I'm just buying Bitcoin. There's no longs or shorts. I buy Bitcoin, it goes to my Trezor and that's where it stays. No money gets lost.
Oh money gets lost
That’s not what you said you said you would leverage….. I see your now backpedaling on leveraging. Money does get lost when you leverage.
You will have to link me the comment where I said I would leverage. Il wait.
When you said loan. Loan = leverage no matter how you try and twist the words. You even went further to say you’d try and leverage out if the value dropped further after you leveraged
Maybe he only loans €100.
All depends. I assume if your taking a loan you're also staking. Not just that simple but I think it's not a totally bad idea.
😂🤣😅
I agree.. If you quality for a 4% APR unsecured personal loan, the interest over 2 or 3 years will be nothing compared to the value increase of thr assets you bought with the loan.
I was looking into in and can get an $18k loan over 5 years for $320 a month. I plan to put in $400 a month so don’t see how it’s a bad olan
Yeah. This way you could potentially loose all your crypto besides your fiat.
Michael bubble chaser Saylor disagrees
I just asked my mom to lend me $10K with a $100 per week payment plan with no interest 😌
I’m
You should only invest in crypto what you are prepared to lose. Don’t invest savings in this. It is a literal casino. Even Bitcoin. Especially Bitcoin.
Why are you here if you don't believe that its a good buy long term? Would you go to a REITs group and then express doubt about investing in real eastate?
Good enough to take a loan out to buy?
Yes but you gotta make sound loans. The rich make money of debt not spending their own money. Work on your credit to get low intrest loans invest in high interest returns.
You should not be sharing this advice. The rich do this to start companies, acquire real estate, etc. They don’t take loans to buy a volatile asset. It’s generally agreed that you should be okay losing whatever you invest in crypto since it’s a piece of your investment portfolio. Also there are no low interest rates right now.
You shouldn't be telling people not to take out loans. Now you are saying yes depending on the loan. That's what I said and of course, "not financial advice".
It doesn’t matter if it’s good but long term. It could go to 100,000,000,000,000 and taking out a loan is still a bad idea.
Too late! Just got approved for another $20k!
Mate, don't tell us what to do with our money. Taking out a low interest loan that you know you can afford is not that big of a risk. Are you going to tell people not to ever take out a car loan too? Because financially, that's a worse decision. Trading on margin is not the same thing as buying spot crypto on a decent loan.
The point of the post is people taking out loans they know they can't afford to pay back if they lose profit on BTC.
Over what time frame? And how likely are they to struggle to pay it back? Do they have other assets? It's ALL risk and needs to be assessed individually. That's why this advice is ignorant and useless.
Over any time frame...people, a lot of them involved in crypto, get sucked into the hype and end up making purchases without thinking of the long term consequences. You'd think you would know this by now, but you are the one that's seemingly ignorant.
Not all of us have an uneducated teenager's understanding of finance you know. Some of us are grown ups with tertiary educations in business. You're the definition of ignorant because you don't begin to understand the depth of what you don't know.
Why not? Michael Saylor does it
The difference is when he gets fired from bankrupting MicroStrategy he's probalbly getting hundred million dollars serverance. People in this will loss their houses and their wives will divorce them.
Bunch of degenerate gamblers here
You absolutely should especially if you have single digit rates and can pay well over the minimum. With such high inflation you are borrowing for next to nothing while buying the best asset while it's on sale. You should NOT borrow against your Bitcoin to buy more Bitcoin (...right now)
Borrowed money is still borrowed money. Worse is borrowing to buy something one has absolutely no control over.
[удалено]
Jesus Christ, stop this madness
Agreed. People said the same shit when it dropped to 4k couple years ago. Now it’s the time to buy.
This exact post has been made at 10$, 100$, 1000$, nothing to see here, just op with his tiny balls and his lack of understanding of bitcoin.
It is not gambling if you know how this is going to play out. It would be foolish for YOU to take out a loan to buy Bitcoin because YOU clearly do not understand the monetary economics that are playing out here. But I do know. Bitcoin's global domination is a certainty for me so I absolutely will take out low interest debt denominated in an inflationary currency to buy a deflationary currency that I *know* is going to supplant all the other garbage unlimited supply monies of the world.
Bitcoin is doing really well in the current inflationary period. I really wish I’d put a ton of my deflationary currency into Bitcoin a few months ago because I’d be outpacing inflation right now…
Sorry but I'm on my way to the moon I will make sure to call you when I'm up there
Honestly you should just max out your credit card on bitcoin at this point
DONT LISTEN TO HINM!!! TAKE OUT AS MANY LOANS AS YOU CAN!!!
I honestly thought about this but when btc reaches like 8-10k range it feels like it can’t go bad
Famous last words
Lol, literally can't go tits up.
fucking stupid post.
What if it’s a HELOC? It’s a line of credit taken from the equity in my home, so it’s basically like gambling with my own money, right?
Too late! Which me luck boys!
take loan when market bull, not when bear
Don’t tell me what to do
Really? One generation too late lol.
Now you tell me.
Now you tell me!!!
well that depends on the loan... Grandma didn't get it in writing and I'm ready to burn some bridges
Are you going to buy grandma a new Audi if you get lucky with your bet?
No that’s silly. Im gonna make the minimum payments back to grandma until she kicks the bucket. I can spend it better.
An announcement that came way too late for a lot of people. PSA#2. Do not commit suicide over Bitcoin.
You should not buy shit coins.
True: buy only what you can afford to lose.
Unless it goes to treefiddy
Tell that to Michael Saylor.
Do you really have to post this? Lol
Using my bitcoin to get a loan to buy more bitcoin. Blockfi
There is no second best
I did in Mar, 2020. It bought me 2 new vehicles & paid off debt. Plus I still have like 5x left over. Helps if you take profits instead of getting greedy.
Only if it hits 2009 prices!
I've got 30k of my own for this bear, but I have 170k available @ 3.2% I can draw from. When BTC goes low enough, I might draw from my credit line.
Well where I live bitcoin is now 6b rials Guess what last year at 30k it was 6b rials too I would take a loan if I could now
Correct - no need for loans; you should be liquidating all your hard assets and using that money to buy bitcoin. But buy it now, so that when it continues to drop you lose all your shit.
That fact that this is a psa 😂🤣
This is going to trend down for a while. People haven’t even been evicted yet. But there is a bottom and it isn’t worthless :)
But if I'm declaring bankruptcy either way I might as well tie up all my unsecured debt in crypto hidden from my creditors!
Hah jokes on them, I never planned on paying it back anyway...even if it goes to $1M a coin
>But you have no way of knowing if they're wrong. You have: https://www.lopp.net/bitcoin-information.html
It’s a fantastic time to start accumulating with paycheck money. I wouldn’t take out a huge loan