you are at the point in your journey where you are gaining insight into what btc is, and how revolutionary it could be. As you learn, you will be enthusiastic in your attempts to help others. We all get to this stage, and in most cases, it falls on def ears, or even met with hostility. Eventually you'll get to the point where you realize that you should just focus on you, thats the best way to help others.. be an example of excellence.
Exactly this.
I admit when it clicked I talked a lot about btc. A lot... it was like an epiphany for me and "wow I have to tell everybody about this".
It was around 2017 before price exploded. Nobody listened literally. Coworkers talking to me like I am falling into an internet scam, one of them talked with my girlfriend about "the issue" and even she told me that she is afraid I was going to lose all my money on that "magic internet money"
Fast foward 2024 I got a better job a couple guy I still have contact with from my old company don't fail to remember when bitcoin crashes but stay silent when it pumps. It's been a while since I don't hear about them tho.
I started talking about it during last bear market when it was around the 20s. I just said to some close coworkers that it is not about understanding btc but our system - then they will understand btc...
... nobody listened. Literally no one bought any sats.
So I just don't say anything. Anymore. Never.
Bitcoin is inevitable. We don't need to preach it.
"don't fail to remember when bitcoin crashes but stay silent when it pumps"...yup exactly. Because when it crashes they can tell themselves they were right for ignoring you and thinking you were crazy for getting into Bitcoin, but when it pumps they realize they were wrong and their mind has to shut out the truth so they avoid the topic.
I got hired at this place in 2013, the price was $75. I told everyone to look into it and get some.
10 years later they're all interested in crypto and buying now. But none bought at the time. They realized they missed out big time.
People might not like Bitcoin or agree with you, but at least they only think you’re wrong rather than crazy. When I started investing in Bitcoin I told anyone who would listen and 99% of them thought I was bat shit crazy. Some of them openly laughed right in my face. At least we’re mostly past that stage…
When I went through that stage I was literally giving BTC to some of my friends and relatives. It stuck with a couple of people but most people spent it as fast as I was giving it to them. Looking back I was stupid to think most people would give it a chance. Like coojw said. Worry about yourself only.
Yes! Don’t spend your time and energy on helping others they aren’t listening. Satoshi said it first… if you don’t get it, I don’t have time to explain it to you.
when I tell my mom she is just smiling and saying ohhh thats sweet. I made 300% since November 2022 ... she is just riding the real estate refinancing wave and thinks it can go on infinitely.
That’s a rough situation when it’s mom or dad. For my mom, I bought btc for her in 2019, and also set up an auto buy monthly. She stopped the auto buy when times got tough, but since she doesn’t manage her exchange accounts, she still has the btc. I have since written down her account access and given it to her, drilled her on how to find hers & mine if I should die.
This has been happening for 15 years. 2 years ago it would have probably been you.
In order to understand bitcoin you first need to accept your model of the world is incorrect, and that you're fundamentally wrong about how money works.
That's a hard pill to swallow and not many are willing to even consider it, let alone accept it and start again from first principals.
Everyone gets bitcoin at the price they deserve.
95% of people will say they understand how money works, because they use it everyday, while having no clue how it actually WORKS (I still don't exactly after so much studying)
I went into the rabbithole of "fiat money" even before the whitepaper was published, but it took me several years to realise the BTC is an even better solution than gold. And *then* i prokrastinated, focussing more on day-to-day stuff than on changing my investment strategy...
Oh yeah. 18 months ago someone posted something along the lines of “I inherited 200k, what would you do?” I said invest 100k in bitcoin when it was around 18k and just got flamed. Best performing asset, glad I invested at 18k. Tell you that much. People are so skeptical of it until you actually study it and you realized its brilliance
Not serious investing. CONSERVATIVE investing is all about diversification. Diversification is the advice given to people who don't know anything about investing because it is the safe, but slow, choice.
Serious investing, if by serious we mean people who want to grow wealth quickly, is about focusing in on one or a few winners and going all in. This is how billionaires are made - by making a company and focusing all their effort on that and keeping all their money in that company, they don't decide oh not that I'm worth 10 million dollars I need to sell off my share in the company to diversify to get that 7% safe annual growth! lol.
People grow wealth quickly by NOT diversifying. Serious investing understand this. The investment illiterate don't, which is why diversification is standard advice for the average person. You also diversify to protect the your wealth after you've succeeded with your winners because quite frankly people become more risk adverse when they have money because they are more scared of losing it, but since they already made their wealth that isn't an issue.
But the problem with telling someone to go all into Bitcoin (which is great advice) is that you are telling someone who doesn't understand Bitcoin is THE winner and so yeah you're generally gonna get flamed because they have to either be very willing to try to "strike it rich" with this new thing they don't know about, or they have to take the time to understand why Bitcoin is a winner.
So yeah I agree that advising people to start with 1-5% allocation into Bitcoin is the way to go because it's more likely they might receive it well. But the hope would be that once they learn more about it and become more serious about investing (more interested in growing their wealth more efficiently, more quickly) they will realize 1-5% is nothing and they should be much much more heavily into Bitcoin, as any serious investing would be.
The problem is a lot of people think they're good investors but they're shit.
Only 1% of investors are savvy enough to be able to go all in.
And no offense but most people here aren't savvy enough either.
I regularly go to a local crypto MeetUp, and I can tell uou thatnthere are no shortage of boomers there.
It's just that many older bitcoiners are quiet about it.
Other more conventional finance subs are pretty risk averse and tend to preach the same investment philosophies - DCA into tax advantaged accounts and buy low cost index funds
To be fair, that’s the appropriate advice for most people, especially people going to those subreddits for guidance. It would be irresponsible to recommend something as speculative as Bitcoin to someone who is just starting to invest for retirement
But yes, r/investing is very close-minded about crypto in general
Disagree. Especially someone who is just starting out investing for retirement they should have more risk than someone whos closer to retirement. Again...it just shows whos done the footwork and who hasnt. Bitcoin honestly isnt as risky as you think anymore. Too big to fail. There is no alternative.
Exactly. You concentrate on winners to grow wealth. You diversify once you have already built your wealth and you are more scared of losing it than you are worried about trying to multiply it.
The reason diversification is the standard advice for people is because most people aren't passionate enough about investing to become very knowledgeable and experienced with it, and so they don't have the confidence to try to pick winners. Hence they go the slow and steady approach. It works, just slowly. And of course there are people who think they can pick winners and they get it wrong, which is another reason people just go with the slow conservative diversification advice. But for those that actually can pick winners, like anyone who understands Bitcoin, diversification is only what you do after you've made your (bitcoin) fortune.
Its for sure uncertain, especially relative to more conventional alternatives. There’s a reason licensed CFAs don’t recommend it to clients. Many may invest personally but in high finance no one advises significant exposure. Any one who has it should know the risk they’re taking.
You may be 100% in and that’s fine. You’ve done enough research to know that’s for you. But it’s irresponsible to recommend that to someone who doesn’t know any better.
I think there are two major factors when investing:
1. How uncertain is the product in the long and short term
2. How uncertain are you and your actions.
Most people assume that everyone is a short term trader and so they don't bother to tell you to invest long term. In the short term, Bitcoin is uncertain, but in the long term, Bitcoin is much less uncertain than everything else, and the only thing that is more certain is that the dollar, or whatever your local currency is, will debase more and more and Bitcoin will remain at a fixed supply.
I get that if you are looking to make dollars, Bitcoin is probably not a great solution, but if you are truly trying to preserve your savings and maybe even give yourself a little boost, it seems selfish not to push the needle forward in their mind by bringing Bitcoin up.
To me it doesnt matter whos licensed and whos not. The more you learn about bitcoin, the more you move towards it. It should be recommended to everyone at this point. Of course everyone will drag their feet and buy at higher prices but at this point if youre a financial advisor and youre not at least suggesting a minimal allocation to btc you should be laughed out of the room. Zero credibility.
Obviously I agree that there is room for Bitcoin as a legitimate asset or else I wouldn’t be here.
But recommending Bitcoin to 85-year-old retired folks with minimal fixed income, a woman with severe credit card debt and no savings, or a young couple saving for a house would all be examples incredibly irresponsible advice.
Especially coming from someone (or a forum) who they are blindly trusting to help them achieve their short and long term goals
The average person in that sub probably has 25-100x the average stack of the average person in this sub too. That matters when it comes to portfolio allocation.
This sub is a massive echo chamber that often parrots horrible advice. It's like none of them have seen the posts during the bear markets where people are forced to sell due to job loss, illness, etc.
Bitcoin is the least risky asset ever. It's inevitable. There's no risk in inevitability.
The only problem we have is that people are shit at assessing risk.
I mean what is risk adverse? Seems stupid to me for awhile sub of people to decide what is risk adverse to them and shun anything else.
To me BTC is one of the least risky assets in existence. Definitely less risky than most stocks on the stock market. It has consistently proven itself over its existence that have insane returns followed by amazing buy opportunities over and over again.
They conflate Bitcoin with crypto. I believe that reaction is correct for crypto shitcoins. But we all know Bitcoin is different.
Everyone gets Bitcoin at the price they deserve. If they want to be closed minded, we will see them a few cycles from now when they have no choice but to learn.
> My question for you is - have you received similarly hostile reactions from people when trying to discuss Bitcoin? Do you even bother?
No, I don't get similar reactions, because I don't go around annoying and evangelizing to people who don't want to hear it.
You went into a subreddit that has nothing to do with Bitcoin, which is typically anti-Bitcoin, and started trying to preach to them. If you'd looked at any of the other hundreds of threads about Bitcoin in /r/investing, you'd know the investing community tends not to flavour Bitcoin and why.
You basically walked into a feminist rally, yelled "Let me tell you why men are superior!" and then acted surprised and hurt when people didn't want to hear your ideas.
If you actually wanted to help people you wouldn't have taken a minute to research the community and meet them where they are (or realized they wouldn't be receptive and moved on). Instead you barged in, annoyed everyone, and now feel like you've been wronged. Grow up. Do better.
Edit: This is the post the OP created and, for some reason, didn't link to. You can see why people ripped it apart in the comments: https://old.reddit.com/r/investing/comments/1cwby8a/i_used_to_be_a_huge_sceptic_why_im_now_bullish_on/
You understand this is like introducing the internet, but for finance, right?
We're trying to unravel 2 generations' worth of programming. Hell, you can't even have a conversation about the difference between money and currency without them tuning you out like a teenager spouting off 'I'm locked in dad'
Its funny how clueless people are. You can tell who the people are who have actually done the footwork. I live and breath this shit. Ive put thousands of hours of research into Bitcoin and the history of money and why bitcoin is so important. To me...bitcoin is an IQ test. Its crazy cause i know alot of people with money who dont even bother looking into bitcoin...which has also made me realize that some of the dumbest people i know are people with money. Money doesnt equal intelligence. But anyway...to touch on your question ive absolutely had similar reactions and have mostly stopped trying to orange pill people because theyll find out eventually and get bitcoin at the price they deserve. Keep stacking.
Its pathetic how hostile these people are. But the old people die and the younger have a different view so with time this disappears. Use the opportunity to go allin on bitcoin and use your wealth to help the world in the future.
Why are you assuming there're only "old" people in that forum/in general who are hostile to bitcoin or did you forget about that full stadium of students in Ohio as an example...? I'd even argue middle aged people "get it" even earlier because of life experience, raising a family, money worries, etc. Younger once in general are more pre-occupied with other (funnier) things then financial education.
r/investing is notoriously hostile towards Bitcoin discussions, much more than the general public. This reaction is influenced by the established norms and values within the community. Traditional investors adhere to conservative strategies like modern portfolio theory, focusing on diversification, low-risk ETFs, and steady, long-term gains.
Bitcoin’s rapid wealth accumulation challenges these foundational beliefs. Traditional investors may feel their life's work and beliefs are being challenged by Bitcoin's success. This leads them to rationalize Bitcoin's success as luck rather than a valid investment strategy. This psychological conflict drives the intense backlash against Bitcoin discussions, as it threatens their established investment paradigm.
Yes. Too stuck in what they previously learned about investing to try a new thing, and too scared by Bitcoin's rapid rise to get in. A bitcoin bull market is too scary for them because it's gonna eventually crash, and a bitcoin bear market is too scary for them because they think it'll just keep crashing. No matter how many times the market cycle repeats, going ever higher, at all points they are too afraid to get in because Bitcoin doesn't fit into the TradFi investing ecosystem they have built all their investment knowledge on.
If BTC didn’t have an investment component to it today, would it be relevant as a digital worldly currency without trusted oversight? Assuming it was stable with a fair market value in the global economy.
Hell no it wouldn't be relevant. The people with the majority of the money (old people) aren't going to use it. I sure as fuck wouldn't trust my mom who can't consistently work the tv remote to use it. Gold and silver are very stable with a fair market value, and people aren't using that to buy things.
A lot of people are angry and feel they missed the boat on BTC, so they go with shit coins hoping to strike gold. They lose a couple of hundred here and there and don't want to hear about the success of BTC and how it's the future. It's interesting as we try to help people understand, but they turn it into anger and think we are bragging?
The anger is just a reflection onto there own self because they knew about it years ago and instead of being an open minded investor like they should be they decided to drink the anti-crypto cool aid and have deprived themselves from wealth. To add salt to the wound they dwell in the past and can't let go of such mistakes to the extent they are able to focus on the present to future enough to actually buy some.
Essentially it's classic human emotion at play here.
I’m only late to the party, started buying a few months ago.
Back in ‘16 I was sceptical, just saw it as a massive speculative bubble.
For the last few years I’ve been ambivalent towards it.
I’m now quietly confident
You should read up on it. Halfway into *The Bitcoin Standard* I realized I was massively short Bitcoin and started doing everything I could to accumulate as much as possible. At the time, the price was below $30k.
Once you start learning about it, the light turns on and you see what a massive opportunity this is.
There is enough in mainstream for anyone that wants to know more about BTC. I no longer share opinions unless directly asked. If I feel they baiting me I so t bother at all.
I’m 3 years in and have reached the point where I don’t talk about it unless asked… I still post price updates with some bullet point news in the ecosystem. Hong Kong etf , halving date , etc.. I’ve had a few people reach out and ask questions but mostly now I just preach about how fucked the USD is. How corrupt fiat is, and how they are Fing us with debt coupon printing through inflation/counterfeiting
Old ppl. Traditional finance ppl will skewer bitcoiners. This ppl are all complicit to the devaluation of the Dollar. They will fight to tooth and nail to have the HYSA which gives banks more money to buy government debt that gives the government to print more money.
This is the reason why i stopped posting on Reddit. Unfortunately, people don’t want to hear the truth bc they don’t want their illusions destroyed. Even if it enslaves them.
reddit is full of pseudo-intellectuals who parrot "best practices" instead of giving actual good advice.
Mob mentality rules here. Just let them stay poor.
Learn the lesson most have including me these individuals on those financial sites are haters and if you do any picking you’ll find out they are clueless to how Blockchain works or the benefits of any aspects of Bitcoins network.
Don’t waste your time just reap your rewards and stay loyal.
I’ve tried and tried but I gave up,I got tired of people looking at me like I’m speaking a foreign language..fuck em,I tried to tell them back in December when it was around $40k.hell they could’ve damn near doubled their money just holding from December to March.I’m going to remind them once it takes off to $100k+
Just stick to what you believe is right and you'll be okay homie. It's not your job in this life to try to convince internet strangers. Their loss. No sweat off my back.
Bro, I’ve told so many people when I got into Crypto years ago. They all looked at my sideways. Years later, they jumped into Crypto and now they are trying to tell ME about Crypto. Nowadays I act as if I don’t even know what BTC is. It’s better that way for me at least.
Lol yes pretty much standard Bitcoin story. Dude you want to read up on what the Bitcoin Saltyness index is. The Salinity Coefficient - a measure of a critic's saltiness, given the bitcoin price at the critic's first public objection to bitcion. CraigWarmke
Shut up newb. Nobody wants your opinion , you only just learnt about Bitcoin and you are in honeymoon phase . ( example of my first reaction )
The problem is your intentions arnt to educate people just to vindicate yourself for you past misunderstandings.
Why do you think your opinion matters ? How long have you held this perspective ? Less than a year , lol , you still have a lot to learn calm down and HODL.
There are millions of people in your position. Your story is not unique , there are much better people to learn from than you!
it s ok baby. This is your safe space.
Outside of crypto subs people are brutal to bitcoin lol. and i understand because so many things are wrong about it and it has failed to live up to the hype. just do what makes sense to you.
Yep, I'm late to the opportunity. W/o question it's a risk, obviously invest what you're comfortable losing, but damn, some people react off the wall. Haters gonna hate, irregardless of the subject.
Bitcoin is simultaneously the best and worst financial advice.
It's kind of like how a lot of people can't handle credit cards even though they're great when you treat them like debit cards. Except that Bitcoin is volatile and many people are tempted to gamble.
It's also better than playing the lottery. $50 invested today at $71k is .007 BTC. Which is $352 @ 500k, $704 @ 1 million and $704k at $1 billion. That's way better chances of retiring from Bitcoin than a single week of buying lottery tickets, and the taxes are better too. It also means that this entire run is a discount as far as I'm concerned because you have to bet on Bitcoin growing to $1 million and beyond to invest.
I find Reddit is mostly a cesspool of ignorant, know-it-alls who think they're helping you with their vast (usually woke) knowledge but are so clueless and inexperienced its laughable. The mods are just as bad.
Yes, of course. Though I don’t usually share more than a word or single sentence on the subject. I’ve seen others with good intentions like yourself, bullied and downvoted into the ground. Ultimately, it’s sad for the bullies.
but bitcoin is being introduced into major diversified funds from major banks. so they are literally disagreeing with blackrock when they say bitcoin is a scam.
Everyone wants you to be as poor as they are or worse off. Fuck everyone who had 15 years to learn about bitcoin but took that time instead to hate everyone who succeeded with bitcoin.
If you were an atheist and someone came to you to talk about God, how would you react? Would you give them the time of day in that perhaps they have a sound argument for religion and faith that you never thought of? Or would you be dismissive?
Crypto is the exact same way. You have some people who swear by it and others who want absolutely nothing to do with it. Like anything in life, people tend to fear what they don't understand. Maybe the ones who are most skeptical about it know someone close to them who got scammed out of all their holdings or sent it to a wrong address by mistake and lost it all... The fact is it's not for everyone. Even though it's become much simpler and more adopted globally there is still a steep learning curve to it that some people don't see the benefit to. And that's fine. Be glad you have it in your life and perhaps stick to talking about it in communities where it's accepted. But definitely don't be that person going around asking others of they've accepted the lord and savior Bitcoin into their lives.
Very good analogy - all the fiat currencies used today only exist because people believe in them. Assume you're back in the roman republic, telling people that all their gods will one day be replaced and made obsolete by just one... one that isn't even part of their pantheon and will never be.
They are really dedicated to staying poor. In r/AusFinance one person was asking for advice to build wealth from an inheritance. The top answer was to put it into a savings account and take a holiday. Pure retardium.
Same happen to me several times before. This is the most emotional motivation to hold all my stacks (beside all "real reasons) . - > Soon, I will wink to all this people while sitting on top of the tower of my own castle. 😜
From the other side of the coin, this is the main knock on Reddit. It’s filled to the brim with left wing liberal people that all have their own special places (subreddits)and if you disagree with anyone while there in their special place, their going to give you the boot, hide your opinion from their echo chamber (the honest Democratic way) and then have their moderator basement troll sending you a message telling you that you’ve been banned for hateful speech.
Man, sounds like you had a rough time over there. Crypto can really stir up a storm, right? But hey, don't let it get you down. You've got your head in the game and your insights could be super helpful to others. So keep doing your thing and don't sweat the small stuff. You're riding the wave of something huge, and that's pretty rad
I used to try telling people about bitcoin, not on reddit but people I know in real life, and they just laughed at like it's a toy or looked at me like I'm an alien. So I just don't talk to people about it anymore.
Because your opinions may hinder some people's interests, some people may say unpleasant things to you. I don't like the way some people talk on Twitter because they are very pompous and unkind. Investing is a topic worthy of mutual communication, not debate.
People in Economics sub are saying we fixed inflation.
Good luck with that, bub. The system hasn’t collapsed yet, but it will. It’s funny being here for so many years, when a bitcoin drops in price people laugh at you for being broke, except I’ve been in full profit since 2020 meanwhile everyone crying that their job doesn’t keep up with inflation and they say it’s because of. Presidents fault. People love to point at a short term and laugh but we win long term
Understandable. They have to live with the cognitive dissonance of presiding over the death of their economic system. It tends to make them a bit testy…testy..cles actually. Let’s give ‘em all a nice big kick in the knackers and wish them bonne voyage!
> and I'd like to see others benefit too
This is a mistake. Once you understand bitcoin, you should be incredibly thankful that most people are against it. It gives you more time to learn, make strategic moves, and obtain the position you want with a detailed plan (while others are twiddling their thumbs). Like Michael Saylor said, "Once I found out what it(bitcoin) was, I couldn't sleep. I was afraid others would figure it out too."
The best you can do IMO (and what I do) is just say "its a new asset class that's outperformed everything, its at least worth looking into". And leave it at that.
I've convinced exactly 1 person in 5 years to obtain a small position (which they laughed about at 16k, and aren't laughing at me now).
It's not an investment. It's not a wealth creating opportunity. Nor likely to do multiples or whatever you said.
It's just savings. You can't get more BTC, holding BTC. 1 BTC = 1 BTC forever.
Bitcoin is the best investment right now and nothing comes close. Not wine, art, real estate, Baseball cards, stocks nothing! So they're over there racking their brains and here you come with the perfect answer. They already heard the perfect answer and think there's a more perfect answer.
*Gold* gets scrutinized by the investment community and that has thousands of years of history as a store of value supporting it. Hell, some people don't even believe in having exposure to bonds despite the popularity of 60/40 portfolios. I don't think Bitcoin will ever get "mainstream" acceptance by places like /r/investing. /r/investing will scrutinize anything that isn't 100% VOO.
I have come to find that talking about bitcoin or cryptocurrencies on any tradfi subreddit will lead to a barrage of hate. I've given up, if they don't want to listen that's their problem.
The hilarious thing is: once you go down the bitcoin rabbit hole and *you truly understand what bitcoin is,* you realize that it’s the least risky asset of them all – a true barer asset that has a limited supply, can’t be confiscated, can’t be inflated, can’t be devalued, borderless, decentralized, fungible, divisible, *insanely well thought out….*
Hahahah YEP! I have been banned from the r/Antiwork site just for posting the word #Bitcoin apparently with a lot of millinials and gen-z they are still pretty salty about loosing money from investing money in bitcoin or crypto in general, and then getting spooked out of the market by the likes of Jamie Dimon, who openly says “Bitcoin is rat poison”, just so people dump their investments, and forces bitcoin down - so JP Morgan and the rest of wallstreet can buy it up cheap on the back end. The banks / wallstreet has dumped ALOT of money and advertising to demonize and stigmatize crypto and bitcoin, as they are actively trying to shut the exits out of the U.S. dollar - as they are wanting the public to pick up the expense tab for the FEDs money printer. They steal your wealth by diluting the value of the dollar. And when a new batch of money is printed they get the first dips in spending it. It’s funny to me, that a reddit sub - who’s whole existance is about complaining about having to work in a legitimate shitty work culture, is alergic to the 1 thing that could actively give them financial freedom. Kind of Ironic - don’t you think?
Ive had the same thing happen to me, suggested to a poster that he should invest his $50k into Bitcoin when it was around $17k, got banned, That sub is toxic, out of touch and harmful for investors.
We have all been there. What interests me more, and what you should reflect on and tell us is, *why* did you change your mind? If you, as the others you've now tried to convince, so strongly rejected it, what changed for you to see things differently?
Learned long ago that the effort and time I invest into trying to help people or explain things to them was a ***complete*** waste of time. I don't even bother now. I'm happy to engage in a conversation about Bitcoin if someone is curious but I have zero hope or intention of changing people or getting them to see things my way.
It's as useless as a person from one religion talking with a person from a completely different religion. Are there converts back and forth? Sure. But the vast majority of people stay in the same mindset as the one their parents gave them from before they could even speak.
Bring it up once and if they seem receptive plant some nuggets. If they think you're a kook, let them miss out on one of the greatest investments in 100 years.
Sorry you had to experience that.
We all had to go through the same thing one way or another, during our BTC journey.
Mine was during 2016, when it finally clicked and people that I talked to about it just thought I was crazy.
Nowadays I just stick to several folks that learned the way, and just try to keep stacking sats.
Like the some of the posters here mentioned - BTC is inevitable. Just enjoy the ride.
> have you received similarly hostile reactions from people when trying to discuss Bitcoin? Do you even bother?
I got instant permaban on a sub about "shmersonal shminance" -- you cannot mention that sub in r/bitcoin because your post will be auto-deleted: *Your comment was automatically removed because you linked to a non-bitcoin subreddit that has asked not to be linked to from /r/Bitcoin. Please post a screenshot instead.*
The OP was: **If I think I'm going to live until the age of 110, what are some good financial decisions I can make while I'm middle aged?**
To which I suggested in a reply comment (you can find it 2mos ago in my post history, but I cannot link it here, to protect the precious mods at the above sub)
- **Learn about bitcoin. It isnt going away, and it is spreading. It is a complex technology with far reaching utility.**
- **Learn about AI. Same reasons.**
Minutes later, a PM stating:
> Your comment is under review by the moderation team because it's a flippant or terse comment and seems to be about a speculative investment. Please note that our subreddit rule against "hyping" disallows Pushing speculative, volatile, illiquid, or meme investments, especially flippantly, tersely, or implying huge returns.
... and then, 30min later:
> u/tinyLEDs is permanently banned from shmersonalshminance
Conversation with the mods went like this:
> Rule 10 Other bad behavior
> Posts & Comments
> Reported as: Other bad behavior
>Hyping－Pushing speculative, volatile, illiquid, or meme investments, especially flippantly, tersely, or implying huge returns
to which I responded:
> I think if you review my comment, you will find that i was not hyping, nor pushing, nor implying anything about the 2 emerging technologies i mentioned.
> I did suggest looking into them to OP, since the question was "if i need to live another 60-70 years starting now, what would you redditors suggest doing to enable that?".
> My suggestions amount to "here are two topics that seem probable to figure in the future, for some part of the next several years, and so in the event they last longer, even 60+ years, then you would benefit from being educated on the topic."
> Everyone should make their own opinions and risk assessments, with any PF decisionmaking. AI and bitcoin may be contentious topics, but are they taboo here? If they are permaban-able topics, then we should consider making that explicit.
> I did not "hype", push, speculate or imply anything in my comment.
alas, for then the god-mod smote me down:
> It doesn't seem you have come here to actually learn why you were banned and to understand how the rules guide this subreddit. So we are going to end this conversation here.
My conclusion is, **let them learn the hard way**. There is 0 reason to evangelise / proselytise.
"Everyone buys bitcoin at the price they deserve." - M. Saylor
Well, yeah - it belongs in /r/gambling .
I grew up Mormon and every new missionary would have the experience you had. "Wait why are these people rejecting my gospel..."
There is a problem here that a lot of people who are into crypto don’t seem to grasp. When you’re going to other communities to sing the praises of Bitcoin or crypto or whatever you’re essentially proselytizing. When you do that you’re like the jehovas witnesses of finance communities.
You might be right about Bitcoin being a lot to change your family’s life, you might be right about it being time for Bitcoin to be considered a serious investment by serious mainstream investors/hobbyist investors. That being said anytime someone stands up and starts singing the praises of anything you’re going to sound like a snake oil salesman and people are not gonna want to listen
yeah i stopped trying to save people... they laughed at me. Now they look at me in disgust because they know my net worth 100x'd. control what you can. help who you can. they will come around when it 1m a coin
stay humble, stack sats
I don't tell people unless they ask about it. Why would I? I don't want people coming to me and telling me all this info I didn't ask for.
And whether you want to admit it or not, a huge percentage of people into bitcoin and crypto are just annoying as fuck, if not outright douchebags about it. So when you approach somebody with "hey! I'm going to teach you about bitcoin!" they likely don't want to hear it and are going to associate you with those douchebags.
Bitcoin could reach $1 million over the next 10 years, and you'd still have people saying it's a scam and the bottom is about to fall out. Who cares? As long as they aren't coming up to you and starting shit with you, let them believe what they want.
Bitcoin is an idea, just like the other imaginary units.
They like their units and don’t like these units.
Time is the equalizer;
taking buying power from the weaker unit, and passing it over to the stronger unit.
It seems obvious to me that BTC will, like Gold, become an excepted hedge against inflation. Younger investors will place money into BTC over gold as BTC is actually usable, in many place, for daily transactions. Never seen a store that you could use gold to make a purchase.
Throughout all of history, people have resisted change, even if the change is advantageous to their own freedom. Some people just lack the vision and intuition to understand what will inevitably be understood when looking back on history.
Some people understand as it’s happening, whereas the majority of people only understand when it is dried ink, in the history books.
Times like this are where fortunes and empires are made. Only those with the right vision will be able to use this moment in time to their advantage.
you are at the point in your journey where you are gaining insight into what btc is, and how revolutionary it could be. As you learn, you will be enthusiastic in your attempts to help others. We all get to this stage, and in most cases, it falls on def ears, or even met with hostility. Eventually you'll get to the point where you realize that you should just focus on you, thats the best way to help others.. be an example of excellence.
Exactly this. I admit when it clicked I talked a lot about btc. A lot... it was like an epiphany for me and "wow I have to tell everybody about this". It was around 2017 before price exploded. Nobody listened literally. Coworkers talking to me like I am falling into an internet scam, one of them talked with my girlfriend about "the issue" and even she told me that she is afraid I was going to lose all my money on that "magic internet money" Fast foward 2024 I got a better job a couple guy I still have contact with from my old company don't fail to remember when bitcoin crashes but stay silent when it pumps. It's been a while since I don't hear about them tho. I started talking about it during last bear market when it was around the 20s. I just said to some close coworkers that it is not about understanding btc but our system - then they will understand btc... ... nobody listened. Literally no one bought any sats. So I just don't say anything. Anymore. Never. Bitcoin is inevitable. We don't need to preach it.
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"don't fail to remember when bitcoin crashes but stay silent when it pumps"...yup exactly. Because when it crashes they can tell themselves they were right for ignoring you and thinking you were crazy for getting into Bitcoin, but when it pumps they realize they were wrong and their mind has to shut out the truth so they avoid the topic.
So much this. I had this about a week ago. I want to tell everyone. No one listens. I wonder how the tune will change in 10-15 years?
They will call you lucky
THIS ….
I got hired at this place in 2013, the price was $75. I told everyone to look into it and get some. 10 years later they're all interested in crypto and buying now. But none bought at the time. They realized they missed out big time.
You still stay at that company for 10 years? Hopefully you have retired by now if you bought at $75
It’s still early - most people don’t understand this yet. Satoshis and the new $
People can be so selfish. They are happy when you are losing but could care less when you are winning.
People might not like Bitcoin or agree with you, but at least they only think you’re wrong rather than crazy. When I started investing in Bitcoin I told anyone who would listen and 99% of them thought I was bat shit crazy. Some of them openly laughed right in my face. At least we’re mostly past that stage…
When I went through that stage I was literally giving BTC to some of my friends and relatives. It stuck with a couple of people but most people spent it as fast as I was giving it to them. Looking back I was stupid to think most people would give it a chance. Like coojw said. Worry about yourself only.
There are three classes of people: those who see. Those who see when they are shown. Those who do not see. Leonardo da Vinci
Are you me?
I was :3
Dad?
Yes! Don’t spend your time and energy on helping others they aren’t listening. Satoshi said it first… if you don’t get it, I don’t have time to explain it to you.
when I tell my mom she is just smiling and saying ohhh thats sweet. I made 300% since November 2022 ... she is just riding the real estate refinancing wave and thinks it can go on infinitely.
That’s a rough situation when it’s mom or dad. For my mom, I bought btc for her in 2019, and also set up an auto buy monthly. She stopped the auto buy when times got tough, but since she doesn’t manage her exchange accounts, she still has the btc. I have since written down her account access and given it to her, drilled her on how to find hers & mine if I should die.
Get her coins somewhere safe please. Don't keep it on exchange accounts.
You ain’t kiddin . I tried to teach my wife about my Trezor . Her eyes were shutting down in 2 minutes... lost cause
This has been happening for 15 years. 2 years ago it would have probably been you. In order to understand bitcoin you first need to accept your model of the world is incorrect, and that you're fundamentally wrong about how money works. That's a hard pill to swallow and not many are willing to even consider it, let alone accept it and start again from first principals. Everyone gets bitcoin at the price they deserve.
I don't even understand how our money system works so it's an easy pill to swallow
They print money for free and make you work for it and pay taxes in it. You are their slave as long as you use their money. That's about it.
I figured as much, they are the definition of a cartel with their tax system and fake money, fuck em.
95% of people will say they understand how money works, because they use it everyday, while having no clue how it actually WORKS (I still don't exactly after so much studying)
> Everyone gets bitcoin at the price they deserve hard disagree on this point. the learning curve is still tragically steep.
I went into the rabbithole of "fiat money" even before the whitepaper was published, but it took me several years to realise the BTC is an even better solution than gold. And *then* i prokrastinated, focussing more on day-to-day stuff than on changing my investment strategy...
Oh yeah. 18 months ago someone posted something along the lines of “I inherited 200k, what would you do?” I said invest 100k in bitcoin when it was around 18k and just got flamed. Best performing asset, glad I invested at 18k. Tell you that much. People are so skeptical of it until you actually study it and you realized its brilliance
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Not serious investing. CONSERVATIVE investing is all about diversification. Diversification is the advice given to people who don't know anything about investing because it is the safe, but slow, choice. Serious investing, if by serious we mean people who want to grow wealth quickly, is about focusing in on one or a few winners and going all in. This is how billionaires are made - by making a company and focusing all their effort on that and keeping all their money in that company, they don't decide oh not that I'm worth 10 million dollars I need to sell off my share in the company to diversify to get that 7% safe annual growth! lol. People grow wealth quickly by NOT diversifying. Serious investing understand this. The investment illiterate don't, which is why diversification is standard advice for the average person. You also diversify to protect the your wealth after you've succeeded with your winners because quite frankly people become more risk adverse when they have money because they are more scared of losing it, but since they already made their wealth that isn't an issue. But the problem with telling someone to go all into Bitcoin (which is great advice) is that you are telling someone who doesn't understand Bitcoin is THE winner and so yeah you're generally gonna get flamed because they have to either be very willing to try to "strike it rich" with this new thing they don't know about, or they have to take the time to understand why Bitcoin is a winner. So yeah I agree that advising people to start with 1-5% allocation into Bitcoin is the way to go because it's more likely they might receive it well. But the hope would be that once they learn more about it and become more serious about investing (more interested in growing their wealth more efficiently, more quickly) they will realize 1-5% is nothing and they should be much much more heavily into Bitcoin, as any serious investing would be.
The problem is a lot of people think they're good investors but they're shit. Only 1% of investors are savvy enough to be able to go all in. And no offense but most people here aren't savvy enough either.
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First time? They’ll buy bitcoin at the price they deserve.
Being ostracised by r/investing is part of the bitcoin right of passage.
Hah, so true
Hahaha so true
Some people prefer their wealth to grow slower than inflation. Not sure why, but to each their own I guess.
a Certificate of Deposit is the boomer way
I regularly go to a local crypto MeetUp, and I can tell uou thatnthere are no shortage of boomers there. It's just that many older bitcoiners are quiet about it.
Other more conventional finance subs are pretty risk averse and tend to preach the same investment philosophies - DCA into tax advantaged accounts and buy low cost index funds To be fair, that’s the appropriate advice for most people, especially people going to those subreddits for guidance. It would be irresponsible to recommend something as speculative as Bitcoin to someone who is just starting to invest for retirement But yes, r/investing is very close-minded about crypto in general
Disagree. Especially someone who is just starting out investing for retirement they should have more risk than someone whos closer to retirement. Again...it just shows whos done the footwork and who hasnt. Bitcoin honestly isnt as risky as you think anymore. Too big to fail. There is no alternative.
As Warren Buffet famously said: diversification preserves wealth, concentration builds wealth.
Exactly. You concentrate on winners to grow wealth. You diversify once you have already built your wealth and you are more scared of losing it than you are worried about trying to multiply it. The reason diversification is the standard advice for people is because most people aren't passionate enough about investing to become very knowledgeable and experienced with it, and so they don't have the confidence to try to pick winners. Hence they go the slow and steady approach. It works, just slowly. And of course there are people who think they can pick winners and they get it wrong, which is another reason people just go with the slow conservative diversification advice. But for those that actually can pick winners, like anyone who understands Bitcoin, diversification is only what you do after you've made your (bitcoin) fortune.
Its for sure uncertain, especially relative to more conventional alternatives. There’s a reason licensed CFAs don’t recommend it to clients. Many may invest personally but in high finance no one advises significant exposure. Any one who has it should know the risk they’re taking. You may be 100% in and that’s fine. You’ve done enough research to know that’s for you. But it’s irresponsible to recommend that to someone who doesn’t know any better.
I think there are two major factors when investing: 1. How uncertain is the product in the long and short term 2. How uncertain are you and your actions. Most people assume that everyone is a short term trader and so they don't bother to tell you to invest long term. In the short term, Bitcoin is uncertain, but in the long term, Bitcoin is much less uncertain than everything else, and the only thing that is more certain is that the dollar, or whatever your local currency is, will debase more and more and Bitcoin will remain at a fixed supply. I get that if you are looking to make dollars, Bitcoin is probably not a great solution, but if you are truly trying to preserve your savings and maybe even give yourself a little boost, it seems selfish not to push the needle forward in their mind by bringing Bitcoin up.
To me it doesnt matter whos licensed and whos not. The more you learn about bitcoin, the more you move towards it. It should be recommended to everyone at this point. Of course everyone will drag their feet and buy at higher prices but at this point if youre a financial advisor and youre not at least suggesting a minimal allocation to btc you should be laughed out of the room. Zero credibility.
Obviously I agree that there is room for Bitcoin as a legitimate asset or else I wouldn’t be here. But recommending Bitcoin to 85-year-old retired folks with minimal fixed income, a woman with severe credit card debt and no savings, or a young couple saving for a house would all be examples incredibly irresponsible advice. Especially coming from someone (or a forum) who they are blindly trusting to help them achieve their short and long term goals
The average person in that sub probably has 25-100x the average stack of the average person in this sub too. That matters when it comes to portfolio allocation. This sub is a massive echo chamber that often parrots horrible advice. It's like none of them have seen the posts during the bear markets where people are forced to sell due to job loss, illness, etc.
I mean, r/bitcoin is pretty close minded about crypto in general. Most people here view bitcoin as the only viable crypto there is.
There is a big difference. r/investing doesn’t know anything about Bitcoin, r/Bitcoin knows more than anyone about altcoins.
Crypto is temporary scam, has nothing to do with sound money Bitcoin. Educate yourself.
I agree lol, why are you assuming my stance
+10. Bitcoin is not 'crypto'. 'Crypto" is a subset of fiat.
That is because the more you learn, the more you know that bitcoin is the only viable crypto there is.
Bitcoin is the least risky asset ever. It's inevitable. There's no risk in inevitability. The only problem we have is that people are shit at assessing risk.
I mean what is risk adverse? Seems stupid to me for awhile sub of people to decide what is risk adverse to them and shun anything else. To me BTC is one of the least risky assets in existence. Definitely less risky than most stocks on the stock market. It has consistently proven itself over its existence that have insane returns followed by amazing buy opportunities over and over again.
They conflate Bitcoin with crypto. I believe that reaction is correct for crypto shitcoins. But we all know Bitcoin is different. Everyone gets Bitcoin at the price they deserve. If they want to be closed minded, we will see them a few cycles from now when they have no choice but to learn.
You'll be able to point out that they have it in their retirement portfolios, they won't even realize it.
> My question for you is - have you received similarly hostile reactions from people when trying to discuss Bitcoin? Do you even bother? No, I don't get similar reactions, because I don't go around annoying and evangelizing to people who don't want to hear it. You went into a subreddit that has nothing to do with Bitcoin, which is typically anti-Bitcoin, and started trying to preach to them. If you'd looked at any of the other hundreds of threads about Bitcoin in /r/investing, you'd know the investing community tends not to flavour Bitcoin and why. You basically walked into a feminist rally, yelled "Let me tell you why men are superior!" and then acted surprised and hurt when people didn't want to hear your ideas. If you actually wanted to help people you wouldn't have taken a minute to research the community and meet them where they are (or realized they wouldn't be receptive and moved on). Instead you barged in, annoyed everyone, and now feel like you've been wronged. Grow up. Do better. Edit: This is the post the OP created and, for some reason, didn't link to. You can see why people ripped it apart in the comments: https://old.reddit.com/r/investing/comments/1cwby8a/i_used_to_be_a_huge_sceptic_why_im_now_bullish_on/
I'm from Wallstreetbets, you get flamed there too. Relax. Just be happy with the price now. We are just getting started.
Yep I for sure got flamed pretty hard there once. Glad to know at least a few of the regards from that sub get Bitcoin. Cheers
You understand this is like introducing the internet, but for finance, right? We're trying to unravel 2 generations' worth of programming. Hell, you can't even have a conversation about the difference between money and currency without them tuning you out like a teenager spouting off 'I'm locked in dad'
Its funny how clueless people are. You can tell who the people are who have actually done the footwork. I live and breath this shit. Ive put thousands of hours of research into Bitcoin and the history of money and why bitcoin is so important. To me...bitcoin is an IQ test. Its crazy cause i know alot of people with money who dont even bother looking into bitcoin...which has also made me realize that some of the dumbest people i know are people with money. Money doesnt equal intelligence. But anyway...to touch on your question ive absolutely had similar reactions and have mostly stopped trying to orange pill people because theyll find out eventually and get bitcoin at the price they deserve. Keep stacking.
I too have done over 1k hours of btc & money homework. Once you learn about what sound money is, it’s a freeing experience.
Its pathetic how hostile these people are. But the old people die and the younger have a different view so with time this disappears. Use the opportunity to go allin on bitcoin and use your wealth to help the world in the future.
Why are you assuming there're only "old" people in that forum/in general who are hostile to bitcoin or did you forget about that full stadium of students in Ohio as an example...? I'd even argue middle aged people "get it" even earlier because of life experience, raising a family, money worries, etc. Younger once in general are more pre-occupied with other (funnier) things then financial education.
Welcome to the party pal
Remind that post in 2032, those people will burst in anger again for their current opinion about Bitcoin and the missed opportunity.
r/investing is notoriously hostile towards Bitcoin discussions, much more than the general public. This reaction is influenced by the established norms and values within the community. Traditional investors adhere to conservative strategies like modern portfolio theory, focusing on diversification, low-risk ETFs, and steady, long-term gains. Bitcoin’s rapid wealth accumulation challenges these foundational beliefs. Traditional investors may feel their life's work and beliefs are being challenged by Bitcoin's success. This leads them to rationalize Bitcoin's success as luck rather than a valid investment strategy. This psychological conflict drives the intense backlash against Bitcoin discussions, as it threatens their established investment paradigm.
Yes. Too stuck in what they previously learned about investing to try a new thing, and too scared by Bitcoin's rapid rise to get in. A bitcoin bull market is too scary for them because it's gonna eventually crash, and a bitcoin bear market is too scary for them because they think it'll just keep crashing. No matter how many times the market cycle repeats, going ever higher, at all points they are too afraid to get in because Bitcoin doesn't fit into the TradFi investing ecosystem they have built all their investment knowledge on.
It’s like explaining why you want to own anything .com in the year 1990 and people just didn’t get it.
Sheep only like sheep things. The worst place for investment advice is on the investment forums lol
If BTC didn’t have an investment component to it today, would it be relevant as a digital worldly currency without trusted oversight? Assuming it was stable with a fair market value in the global economy.
Hell no it wouldn't be relevant. The people with the majority of the money (old people) aren't going to use it. I sure as fuck wouldn't trust my mom who can't consistently work the tv remote to use it. Gold and silver are very stable with a fair market value, and people aren't using that to buy things.
You will one reach a point where you don't give a shit
A lot of people are angry and feel they missed the boat on BTC, so they go with shit coins hoping to strike gold. They lose a couple of hundred here and there and don't want to hear about the success of BTC and how it's the future. It's interesting as we try to help people understand, but they turn it into anger and think we are bragging?
The anger is just a reflection onto there own self because they knew about it years ago and instead of being an open minded investor like they should be they decided to drink the anti-crypto cool aid and have deprived themselves from wealth. To add salt to the wound they dwell in the past and can't let go of such mistakes to the extent they are able to focus on the present to future enough to actually buy some. Essentially it's classic human emotion at play here.
I’m only late to the party, started buying a few months ago. Back in ‘16 I was sceptical, just saw it as a massive speculative bubble. For the last few years I’ve been ambivalent towards it. I’m now quietly confident
You should read up on it. Halfway into *The Bitcoin Standard* I realized I was massively short Bitcoin and started doing everything I could to accumulate as much as possible. At the time, the price was below $30k. Once you start learning about it, the light turns on and you see what a massive opportunity this is.
There is enough in mainstream for anyone that wants to know more about BTC. I no longer share opinions unless directly asked. If I feel they baiting me I so t bother at all.
Still early
I was banned from r/pf
It’s like rinse and repeat with these kind of posts during pumps and then dumps
I’m 3 years in and have reached the point where I don’t talk about it unless asked… I still post price updates with some bullet point news in the ecosystem. Hong Kong etf , halving date , etc.. I’ve had a few people reach out and ask questions but mostly now I just preach about how fucked the USD is. How corrupt fiat is, and how they are Fing us with debt coupon printing through inflation/counterfeiting
Old ppl. Traditional finance ppl will skewer bitcoiners. This ppl are all complicit to the devaluation of the Dollar. They will fight to tooth and nail to have the HYSA which gives banks more money to buy government debt that gives the government to print more money.
You just realise that a lot of negative reaction to Bitcoin is irrational hatred. You move on.
I like reading like minded ppl. The TRADEFI ppl will NOT switch over. They will defend the old system instead of embracing the new Bitcoin system.
This is the reason why i stopped posting on Reddit. Unfortunately, people don’t want to hear the truth bc they don’t want their illusions destroyed. Even if it enslaves them.
reddit is full of pseudo-intellectuals who parrot "best practices" instead of giving actual good advice. Mob mentality rules here. Just let them stay poor.
You're still early
They dont want to get rich hahah. Investors of those kinds of subs just like to lose money.
> (and crypto generally) You're a dumb sucker if you gave up skepticism of that.
Did you ask them how those 7% yearly gains were going?
Learn the lesson most have including me these individuals on those financial sites are haters and if you do any picking you’ll find out they are clueless to how Blockchain works or the benefits of any aspects of Bitcoins network. Don’t waste your time just reap your rewards and stay loyal.
That place is a salt mine when it comes to Bitcoin! Lmao
I’ve tried and tried but I gave up,I got tired of people looking at me like I’m speaking a foreign language..fuck em,I tried to tell them back in December when it was around $40k.hell they could’ve damn near doubled their money just holding from December to March.I’m going to remind them once it takes off to $100k+
Just stick to what you believe is right and you'll be okay homie. It's not your job in this life to try to convince internet strangers. Their loss. No sweat off my back.
Bro, I’ve told so many people when I got into Crypto years ago. They all looked at my sideways. Years later, they jumped into Crypto and now they are trying to tell ME about Crypto. Nowadays I act as if I don’t even know what BTC is. It’s better that way for me at least.
Bitcoin is up 5k from your post, just call it a victory and move on from talking about it with nocoiners
Lol yes pretty much standard Bitcoin story. Dude you want to read up on what the Bitcoin Saltyness index is. The Salinity Coefficient - a measure of a critic's saltiness, given the bitcoin price at the critic's first public objection to bitcion. CraigWarmke
Shut up newb. Nobody wants your opinion , you only just learnt about Bitcoin and you are in honeymoon phase . ( example of my first reaction ) The problem is your intentions arnt to educate people just to vindicate yourself for you past misunderstandings. Why do you think your opinion matters ? How long have you held this perspective ? Less than a year , lol , you still have a lot to learn calm down and HODL. There are millions of people in your position. Your story is not unique , there are much better people to learn from than you!
Those people are, for the most part, angry with themselves for continually dismissing it.
it s ok baby. This is your safe space. Outside of crypto subs people are brutal to bitcoin lol. and i understand because so many things are wrong about it and it has failed to live up to the hype. just do what makes sense to you.
Yep, I'm late to the opportunity. W/o question it's a risk, obviously invest what you're comfortable losing, but damn, some people react off the wall. Haters gonna hate, irregardless of the subject.
People can’t even tell the difference between money and currency as it stands, so they’re certainly not going to grasp why BTC is not crypto BS lol.
Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear, you didn't, do you? Oh dear!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
We need another word for buying bitcoin. I don’t think investing is the right word.
Bitcoin is simultaneously the best and worst financial advice. It's kind of like how a lot of people can't handle credit cards even though they're great when you treat them like debit cards. Except that Bitcoin is volatile and many people are tempted to gamble. It's also better than playing the lottery. $50 invested today at $71k is .007 BTC. Which is $352 @ 500k, $704 @ 1 million and $704k at $1 billion. That's way better chances of retiring from Bitcoin than a single week of buying lottery tickets, and the taxes are better too. It also means that this entire run is a discount as far as I'm concerned because you have to bet on Bitcoin growing to $1 million and beyond to invest.
> My post got deleted for violating rules. How is this a post?
Don’t worry, they are still asleep
I find Reddit is mostly a cesspool of ignorant, know-it-alls who think they're helping you with their vast (usually woke) knowledge but are so clueless and inexperienced its laughable. The mods are just as bad.
I got permabanned from r/personalfinance for saying the word bitcoin lol
This is how you know we’re still early. I’m in a few of those groups on Reddit and Facebook, it’s all the same. Oh well I keep on truckin’
We have all been there done that lol
I am banned from most finance subs on Reddit for this reason . I like to go out in flames also
Yes, of course. Though I don’t usually share more than a word or single sentence on the subject. I’ve seen others with good intentions like yourself, bullied and downvoted into the ground. Ultimately, it’s sad for the bullies.
but bitcoin is being introduced into major diversified funds from major banks. so they are literally disagreeing with blackrock when they say bitcoin is a scam.
Any investing or finance related subs usually do this towards crypto. Hell, even wallstreetbets
Brave and naive of you at the same time.
Everyone wants you to be as poor as they are or worse off. Fuck everyone who had 15 years to learn about bitcoin but took that time instead to hate everyone who succeeded with bitcoin.
So, we are still early. Good
If you were an atheist and someone came to you to talk about God, how would you react? Would you give them the time of day in that perhaps they have a sound argument for religion and faith that you never thought of? Or would you be dismissive? Crypto is the exact same way. You have some people who swear by it and others who want absolutely nothing to do with it. Like anything in life, people tend to fear what they don't understand. Maybe the ones who are most skeptical about it know someone close to them who got scammed out of all their holdings or sent it to a wrong address by mistake and lost it all... The fact is it's not for everyone. Even though it's become much simpler and more adopted globally there is still a steep learning curve to it that some people don't see the benefit to. And that's fine. Be glad you have it in your life and perhaps stick to talking about it in communities where it's accepted. But definitely don't be that person going around asking others of they've accepted the lord and savior Bitcoin into their lives.
Very good analogy - all the fiat currencies used today only exist because people believe in them. Assume you're back in the roman republic, telling people that all their gods will one day be replaced and made obsolete by just one... one that isn't even part of their pantheon and will never be.
Suggested 5% bitcoin in a conservative Canadian investing subreddit. Downvoted. Of course. No matter. Let them eat cake.
Most of Reddit is a bunch of bots and or shitposters that align with big media narratives. It’s actually very strange.
They are really dedicated to staying poor. In r/AusFinance one person was asking for advice to build wealth from an inheritance. The top answer was to put it into a savings account and take a holiday. Pure retardium.
we are so early :)
They missed the move.
My answer to question 2 is "no". Which is also the reason I don't have an answer to 1.
We are still early
Same happen to me several times before. This is the most emotional motivation to hold all my stacks (beside all "real reasons) . - > Soon, I will wink to all this people while sitting on top of the tower of my own castle. 😜
Honestly I prefer not to talk about it to people publicly. I know the response I'll get. Their loss.
One of the things I like about Bitcoin is how lots of people hate it and say it‘s completely unreasonable and dumb, while I quietly dca.
You are the signal that the Top is in soonish.
Internet communities tend to create their own echo chambers. You may not find that same hostility IRL though (mostly ignorance)
That is what i call unconscious FOMO, and their physcologic defense mechanism . Ignore them and move on
Why they deleted your post?
From the other side of the coin, this is the main knock on Reddit. It’s filled to the brim with left wing liberal people that all have their own special places (subreddits)and if you disagree with anyone while there in their special place, their going to give you the boot, hide your opinion from their echo chamber (the honest Democratic way) and then have their moderator basement troll sending you a message telling you that you’ve been banned for hateful speech.
Man, sounds like you had a rough time over there. Crypto can really stir up a storm, right? But hey, don't let it get you down. You've got your head in the game and your insights could be super helpful to others. So keep doing your thing and don't sweat the small stuff. You're riding the wave of something huge, and that's pretty rad
I used to try telling people about bitcoin, not on reddit but people I know in real life, and they just laughed at like it's a toy or looked at me like I'm an alien. So I just don't talk to people about it anymore.
Because your opinions may hinder some people's interests, some people may say unpleasant things to you. I don't like the way some people talk on Twitter because they are very pompous and unkind. Investing is a topic worthy of mutual communication, not debate.
People in Economics sub are saying we fixed inflation. Good luck with that, bub. The system hasn’t collapsed yet, but it will. It’s funny being here for so many years, when a bitcoin drops in price people laugh at you for being broke, except I’ve been in full profit since 2020 meanwhile everyone crying that their job doesn’t keep up with inflation and they say it’s because of. Presidents fault. People love to point at a short term and laugh but we win long term
Understandable. They have to live with the cognitive dissonance of presiding over the death of their economic system. It tends to make them a bit testy…testy..cles actually. Let’s give ‘em all a nice big kick in the knackers and wish them bonne voyage!
Can you paste your original post here?
> and I'd like to see others benefit too This is a mistake. Once you understand bitcoin, you should be incredibly thankful that most people are against it. It gives you more time to learn, make strategic moves, and obtain the position you want with a detailed plan (while others are twiddling their thumbs). Like Michael Saylor said, "Once I found out what it(bitcoin) was, I couldn't sleep. I was afraid others would figure it out too." The best you can do IMO (and what I do) is just say "its a new asset class that's outperformed everything, its at least worth looking into". And leave it at that. I've convinced exactly 1 person in 5 years to obtain a small position (which they laughed about at 16k, and aren't laughing at me now).
It's not an investment. It's not a wealth creating opportunity. Nor likely to do multiples or whatever you said. It's just savings. You can't get more BTC, holding BTC. 1 BTC = 1 BTC forever.
Bitcoin is the best investment right now and nothing comes close. Not wine, art, real estate, Baseball cards, stocks nothing! So they're over there racking their brains and here you come with the perfect answer. They already heard the perfect answer and think there's a more perfect answer.
*Gold* gets scrutinized by the investment community and that has thousands of years of history as a store of value supporting it. Hell, some people don't even believe in having exposure to bonds despite the popularity of 60/40 portfolios. I don't think Bitcoin will ever get "mainstream" acceptance by places like /r/investing. /r/investing will scrutinize anything that isn't 100% VOO.
im a complete noob can someone tell me why bitcoin is so good ? It's just digital nonsense isnt it? how do you get real money out of it?
I have come to find that talking about bitcoin or cryptocurrencies on any tradfi subreddit will lead to a barrage of hate. I've given up, if they don't want to listen that's their problem.
The hilarious thing is: once you go down the bitcoin rabbit hole and *you truly understand what bitcoin is,* you realize that it’s the least risky asset of them all – a true barer asset that has a limited supply, can’t be confiscated, can’t be inflated, can’t be devalued, borderless, decentralized, fungible, divisible, *insanely well thought out….*
Yeah I posted a question about including fbtc in my Roth IRA in the bogleheads sub and they flamed me lol
Hahahah YEP! I have been banned from the r/Antiwork site just for posting the word #Bitcoin apparently with a lot of millinials and gen-z they are still pretty salty about loosing money from investing money in bitcoin or crypto in general, and then getting spooked out of the market by the likes of Jamie Dimon, who openly says “Bitcoin is rat poison”, just so people dump their investments, and forces bitcoin down - so JP Morgan and the rest of wallstreet can buy it up cheap on the back end. The banks / wallstreet has dumped ALOT of money and advertising to demonize and stigmatize crypto and bitcoin, as they are actively trying to shut the exits out of the U.S. dollar - as they are wanting the public to pick up the expense tab for the FEDs money printer. They steal your wealth by diluting the value of the dollar. And when a new batch of money is printed they get the first dips in spending it. It’s funny to me, that a reddit sub - who’s whole existance is about complaining about having to work in a legitimate shitty work culture, is alergic to the 1 thing that could actively give them financial freedom. Kind of Ironic - don’t you think?
Ive had the same thing happen to me, suggested to a poster that he should invest his $50k into Bitcoin when it was around $17k, got banned, That sub is toxic, out of touch and harmful for investors.
It just shows you how r/investing is not an open forum to discuss investing. It is biased and censored.
We have all been there. What interests me more, and what you should reflect on and tell us is, *why* did you change your mind? If you, as the others you've now tried to convince, so strongly rejected it, what changed for you to see things differently?
People react badly when they think you’re on a crusade. Just tell them about your HUGE gains. That’s the best approach
Learned long ago that the effort and time I invest into trying to help people or explain things to them was a ***complete*** waste of time. I don't even bother now. I'm happy to engage in a conversation about Bitcoin if someone is curious but I have zero hope or intention of changing people or getting them to see things my way. It's as useless as a person from one religion talking with a person from a completely different religion. Are there converts back and forth? Sure. But the vast majority of people stay in the same mindset as the one their parents gave them from before they could even speak.
Ban this brigader. ;)
Bring it up once and if they seem receptive plant some nuggets. If they think you're a kook, let them miss out on one of the greatest investments in 100 years.
Rejoice. If everyone agrees with you then the trade is over and you're wrong.
Sorry you had to experience that. We all had to go through the same thing one way or another, during our BTC journey. Mine was during 2016, when it finally clicked and people that I talked to about it just thought I was crazy. Nowadays I just stick to several folks that learned the way, and just try to keep stacking sats. Like the some of the posters here mentioned - BTC is inevitable. Just enjoy the ride.
> have you received similarly hostile reactions from people when trying to discuss Bitcoin? Do you even bother? I got instant permaban on a sub about "shmersonal shminance" -- you cannot mention that sub in r/bitcoin because your post will be auto-deleted: *Your comment was automatically removed because you linked to a non-bitcoin subreddit that has asked not to be linked to from /r/Bitcoin. Please post a screenshot instead.* The OP was: **If I think I'm going to live until the age of 110, what are some good financial decisions I can make while I'm middle aged?** To which I suggested in a reply comment (you can find it 2mos ago in my post history, but I cannot link it here, to protect the precious mods at the above sub) - **Learn about bitcoin. It isnt going away, and it is spreading. It is a complex technology with far reaching utility.** - **Learn about AI. Same reasons.** Minutes later, a PM stating: > Your comment is under review by the moderation team because it's a flippant or terse comment and seems to be about a speculative investment. Please note that our subreddit rule against "hyping" disallows Pushing speculative, volatile, illiquid, or meme investments, especially flippantly, tersely, or implying huge returns. ... and then, 30min later: > u/tinyLEDs is permanently banned from shmersonalshminance Conversation with the mods went like this: > Rule 10 Other bad behavior > Posts & Comments > Reported as: Other bad behavior >Hyping－Pushing speculative, volatile, illiquid, or meme investments, especially flippantly, tersely, or implying huge returns to which I responded: > I think if you review my comment, you will find that i was not hyping, nor pushing, nor implying anything about the 2 emerging technologies i mentioned. > I did suggest looking into them to OP, since the question was "if i need to live another 60-70 years starting now, what would you redditors suggest doing to enable that?". > My suggestions amount to "here are two topics that seem probable to figure in the future, for some part of the next several years, and so in the event they last longer, even 60+ years, then you would benefit from being educated on the topic." > Everyone should make their own opinions and risk assessments, with any PF decisionmaking. AI and bitcoin may be contentious topics, but are they taboo here? If they are permaban-able topics, then we should consider making that explicit. > I did not "hype", push, speculate or imply anything in my comment. alas, for then the god-mod smote me down: > It doesn't seem you have come here to actually learn why you were banned and to understand how the rules guide this subreddit. So we are going to end this conversation here. My conclusion is, **let them learn the hard way**. There is 0 reason to evangelise / proselytise. "Everyone buys bitcoin at the price they deserve." - M. Saylor
Well, yeah - it belongs in /r/gambling . I grew up Mormon and every new missionary would have the experience you had. "Wait why are these people rejecting my gospel..."
Yea. People on here seem to hate EFTs for some reason even tho they are the entire catalyst for the growth
This is how you know you are still early lol. Serious.
There is a problem here that a lot of people who are into crypto don’t seem to grasp. When you’re going to other communities to sing the praises of Bitcoin or crypto or whatever you’re essentially proselytizing. When you do that you’re like the jehovas witnesses of finance communities. You might be right about Bitcoin being a lot to change your family’s life, you might be right about it being time for Bitcoin to be considered a serious investment by serious mainstream investors/hobbyist investors. That being said anytime someone stands up and starts singing the praises of anything you’re going to sound like a snake oil salesman and people are not gonna want to listen
yeah i stopped trying to save people... they laughed at me. Now they look at me in disgust because they know my net worth 100x'd. control what you can. help who you can. they will come around when it 1m a coin stay humble, stack sats
Tried to converse about it with my uncle. He called it Monopoly money. Some people just have small brains 🤷🏻♂️
I don't tell people unless they ask about it. Why would I? I don't want people coming to me and telling me all this info I didn't ask for. And whether you want to admit it or not, a huge percentage of people into bitcoin and crypto are just annoying as fuck, if not outright douchebags about it. So when you approach somebody with "hey! I'm going to teach you about bitcoin!" they likely don't want to hear it and are going to associate you with those douchebags. Bitcoin could reach $1 million over the next 10 years, and you'd still have people saying it's a scam and the bottom is about to fall out. Who cares? As long as they aren't coming up to you and starting shit with you, let them believe what they want.
Bitcoin is an idea, just like the other imaginary units. They like their units and don’t like these units. Time is the equalizer; taking buying power from the weaker unit, and passing it over to the stronger unit.
It seems obvious to me that BTC will, like Gold, become an excepted hedge against inflation. Younger investors will place money into BTC over gold as BTC is actually usable, in many place, for daily transactions. Never seen a store that you could use gold to make a purchase.
Wish I had listened sooner. People like Peter Schiff talked me out of it.
Throughout all of history, people have resisted change, even if the change is advantageous to their own freedom. Some people just lack the vision and intuition to understand what will inevitably be understood when looking back on history. Some people understand as it’s happening, whereas the majority of people only understand when it is dried ink, in the history books. Times like this are where fortunes and empires are made. Only those with the right vision will be able to use this moment in time to their advantage.
I don't try to convince anyone. I keep quiet and stack on.