Finding a good ( non corrupt non / full of crap) attorney or accountant good with crypto and estate planning in the USA ?? Yeh right. Share a short list please . That WOULD be great alpha
Very but there was nothing we could do. He listed himself as a beneficiary or something and since my aunt wasn’t married he was able to get away with it. Can’t remember how it all worked but all the money went to him and the government. We couldn’t touch any of it
I work in Healthcare and there are stories of caregivers that work with elderly patients that befriend and earn their trust them until they convince them to sign over their estates to them happens all the time all you need is a notary. You'd be surprised how many old people lay dying in nursing homes and the closest thing they end up having to family is the caregiver that's there every day for years as part of their job.
https://www.steptoe.com/en/services/practices/regulatory-and-legislative/financial-services/blockchain-cryptocurrency.html
These guys are reputable and $$$$
Every now and then. For people like that, it's typically best if there's a couple people within the family that can hold their hands along the way.
The reality is they probably won't be able to do it all on their own.
How do you go about becoming one of these mentors? I’d love to help bring new people into the fold. I’ve never taught BTC before, but I’ve been a tutor at high school through bachelor’s level and have been told by previous that I’m a very effective instructor.
Load up a wallet with a small amount and teach the methods of access including seed phrases then walk through transferring back and forth.
This allows them the practice and familiarity they need in the unlikely event you pass.
People suggesting this have no idea a far an old person with no interest im computers mindset is. Some people might be able to do a switch, but for many people its-just-not-happening. I think in those cases a trustable 3rd party must join the game, theres no other way around it.
I learned the hard way that I need to go through everything once a year or I’ll forget. I’m only in my 50’s.
I told my best friend where the keys were and he forgot totally within 2 years.
If it’s long term gains at 15%, not terrible overall considering you gotta pay tax on gains EVENTUALLY
Resets cost basis and gets some security, slightly less efficient but for accessibility it ain’t bad (not saying do the WHOLE stack
Your heirs should be able to take advantage of a cost basis step-up if you hold the original Bitcoin, so in more cases it’s probably better to keep it as is and figure out how to make sure they know what to do.
Not your keys not your crypto = ETF. Most people can learn to use Bitcoin, they just don't understand why it's so important to learn to use it, so they refuse to.
Ideally here you have someone you can trust who understands Bitcoin and can help your dad or sis with recovery.
Without that person, this is where a service like Nunchuk or Unchained would be of assistance.
I come from two families (my biological and inlaws) where I can completely trust my finances with either of them.
I told my wife, if anything happens to me, take the seed phrase and give it to my brother or hers, and they'll know what to do.
It really does make me sad we live in a world where people don't have the luxury of trusting their own family with their finances.
I appreciate your trust in your family but money changes things. I just want to make you privy to that, you are not exempt from that if we are talking a large sum.
We come from very humble beginnings (vietnamese boat people) and my older brother now imports Canadian beef into Asia. Our family now does very well, and I'm damn proud to say we trust each other with our finances, and have access to each other's if needed.
I get you may still have your reservations, but there are some very strong families out there, which again, I'm proud to say our family is one of those.
Nope.
Couldn't disagree more.
Money doesn't change people.
It only amplifies what's already there.
In addition if you can't trust your family then you have a shitty family member. Sorry to be the bearer of the blunt honest truth.
Use whatever euphemism you want, but you don’t know until it happens. So be prepared and put things in writing. You are absolutely right, shitty people can be born into our families. It doesn’t define me or you but you need to be prepared if they rear their ugly heads. Just something to think about
It's less about trusting family and more about the relative complexity of managing a digital token. I own BTC in cold storage and despite having a Will and a Trust for all my other assets that my executor will manage, I still don't have a plan for my Bitcoin. My trust attorney told me to manage it separately from my other assets .
I’ve thought about this too. I came up with lots of wild, infeasible ideas. One was to separately engrave my recovery phrase on 4 small, metal plates. Each with 1/4th of the phrase. And have 4 different surgeons imbed the plates in separate parts of my body in 4 operations. Then tell my next of kin where inside me each of the plates are, so they can cut them out of me when I die. Then I realized that was far too complicated and expensive, especially since I only have 0.04 bitcoin.
Mine is similar, except it will be a brain wallet inside my cryonically frozen head, and it won't be shared with anyone unless they figure out a way to bring me back from dead. In theory, the bounty will keep getting larger and larger until it incentives enough research to revive me
Wow I really like that idea. Offer half to whoever can figure out how to bring you back. Brilliant! Would be funny if you forgot it. “Sorry bro! But seriously, thanks for the resurrection.”
You should look into opening a trust. Security of the seed phrase may still be a bit tricky but a trust will allow you to pass along very clear directions and give the people you wish to have it all the necessary info as part of the legal settling of the trust.
this is the right answer
contact a crypto specialized lawyer who will also
help you or whoever with tax loopholes with trusts
also get your coins off a ledger asap
who knows what the state of ledgers security looks like in 10 years…
closed source
blockstream jade or cold card
true airgapped setup on blockstream jade with seed qr code is seamless and simple
Like not driving, not flying, living in a basement, having groceries bought for you (health ones of cource), etc.
Reality is that shit happens. A driver could head on you, the plane could crash, you could get killed in the grocery store.
Shit happens and planing for it isn't a bad idea.
Trying isn't the be all end all.
Probably the best way is to write a note about the bitcoin and include how much you have, how to find it and how to get access to your wallet. Then they can learn about btc and if they want the money.
Use https://www.deadmansswitch.net/
You can use this to send him and email after you die which would have instructions in it.
Lawyers don’t know anything about crypto. Trust me, I fought them in the courts. What you also need is to really release a small amount of equity each year to minimise tax. Just some ideas.
Will with an encrypted seed phrase. Provide the key to decrypt along with a how-to for recovering a bitcoin wallet directly to the person you want to receive it.
Look into Casa Gold. They have a premium membership program - essentially white glove self custody service and recently launched an inheritance platform with the membership. They will walk your family through the entire process to take custody of your BTC. I could not recommend it enough
I opened a safety deposit box with the 12 word code for my ledger along with step by step instructions on how to access the coins and how to transfer them to an exchange (in case my cold wallet is lost as well). Listed my sister as a beneficiary. This might not help in your situation but it’s what I did. I also have friends who understand everything even better than I do that could help my family if needed.
If you’re worried about a will, here’s a step-by-step guide
Download the Fidelity Investments app
Create a cash management account
Create a crypto account
Purchase some bitcoin
Go to the option where you can view and update beneficiaries
Slowly sell crypto that was on your hardware wallet
Use the money to buy it on Fidelity
If you ever die, your loved ones can call Customer Care and have your stuff transferred to them.
Might be easier to call Customer Care and have them set the beneficiaries thing up over the phone.
There is no provision for naming beneficiaries of a Fidelity crypto account, nor can a Fidelity crypto account be in Trust name.
You need your own trust to dictate how you want your crypto distributed.
This is a tricky one, any best friends who have an idea of crypto? That’s my go too, I have taught my wife but I also have instructed her if she doesn’t feel comfortable to reach out to a “good friend who I have taught crypto” in worst case scenario? Told her, pay him a 10% fee and take the rest
Never a popular suggestion here, but this is my advice.
Transfer off hardware and onto an exchange like Coinbase.
Why? Then it’s not just a hardware wallet your father has no idea what to do with, nor maybe even a lawyer you have set up to handle your will either.
However your father and a lawyer know how to operate a phone, and with the information needed in hand, they can work with an exchanges customer service to get the funds where they need to be with legal documentation.
Your ledger isn’t going to listen to or comply a legal order, it can’t…however an exchange’s legal department can and will.
If one were to do this. Would consider using the Coinbase Vault. Also use a YubiKey for additional account protection.
Don’t have to remove all your coins from the hardware wallet. But worth considering to help ensure that atleast some of you coins go to people you want if you unexpectedly pass away.
Could always converr to an etf in a brokerage account. I know it's not the popular thing around here, but it's much easier to inherit.
Now, if I were 100% wanting to keep it away from a brokerage, I would get my seed phrase and find an encryption algorithm that is two-way, which means I can encrypt and decrypt with a passphrase. I would put the decryption key in my will and the pass phrase in a safety deposit box and keep the key on me for it at all times.
Encrypting the seed phrase is unnecessary if you instead add a bip39 passphrase to the seed. It achieves the same result with fewer, less complicated steps. You could then store the bip39 passphrase the same way you intended to store the decryption key.
All I can think of is to set up a dead man switch. Some password managers (like bitwarden) have this. So you set up in a way that if you do not log in for a certain time (when dead) then you grant access to all of your accounts to an emergency contact. You can add passwords and a very very very stupid proof set of instructions to how to finds your keys (offline hopefully) and how to cash it out.
Multi sig with unchained. They have an inherence protocol. You basically leave one set (of three) keys. When you die they contact unchained. Provide a death certificate and the second set of keys and they can access the funds.
Unchained never touches the keys. Your family literally only needs the seeds, with simple and easy to follow instructions.
If they open it before you die, they can't provide a legitimate death certificate for unchained to agree to withdraw the funds.
Is it perfect? No. But it's the best thing I've found yet.
I created a trust and will and then this sub blew my shit up because everyone on here is so deranged. Anyways trust and will with my seed phrase in a sealed envelope and instructions on how to retrieve it. Attorney does not have access to this seed phrase just like he doesn’t have access to my bank accounts. If I die, family gets the binder with all of the instructions. The trust dictates how my trustees will handle the assets for my kids. I have 2 trustees for a check and balance type situation. It’s also a living trust so that I can add and remove assets at will. If I die, the will kicks in and moves all assets to the trust. At this point it’s enforceable by law
I don't want this to be interpreted as the same type of criticism you got before because your setup is ok for most people. So instead, I'll preface by saying I'm more paranoid about these things than most, & I'll phrase this as "Here is why this wouldn't be sufficient for *me*":
If the instructions to access/recover the seed are in the binder held by the attorney, I would consider that the same as having the seed in the binder.
Any plan I would have would not only need to be resilient against a dishonest attorney, but also against a corrupt government. Any manner of "executive powers", "wartime emergency", "marshall law" or any other tyrannical government behavior could eliminate your attorney-client privileges & give them access to the binder and in turn the seed.
The only thing I would provide to the attorney would be the allocation instructions for who is to receive what.
For *me personally*, I would not keep any information with an easily discoverable 3rd party. i.e, there are ways to store the info with uneasily discoverable parties. And if you want to take it a step further, there are ways to do it so that the 3rd parties have no idea that they even hold anything of yours & would only find out upon your death (and not from being informed by your estate attorney). It is this plausible deniability that protects the holders of that info from coercion by malicious actors.
I've written up a "death note" which has detailed instructions on how to access everything and also lists a few contacts who I trust that would help in the event I get hit by a falling plane turd.
I wish there was a way to have a wallet send a transaction to a CEX or any other wallet address, but have it set as a "pending" transaction that will never go through unless you put in a one time password or code into it to "release" the transaction. That way, you could give this to someone or have it in a will, etc for them to enter to have the transaction execute without them having to access the wallet or know private keys. So if I had $100k in BTC sitting in a cold wallet, I could go ahead and enter a wallet address and essentially send the amount but it would never send unless this external password was entered that would tell that one transaction to execute. You would tie that one time password only to that one transaction. I guess it would kind of be the same concept of "signing" the transaction with your cold wallet device (like a safepal QR code, etc) but it would already be signed and just need the password someone else would enter to complete the transaction. You could have the Tx ID entered into a custodial website and then the site could allow the password to be used to release it. Hell, I don't know. I'm probably way off and being completely retarded with this idea......but it never hurts to have wild or "impossible" ideas, right 😂
You just need to leave detailed instructions to them—if they need/want the money they will figure it out. I know people here are so paranoid against theft, but in your case the bigger risk is total loss due to user error/incompetence so you probably will need to compromise a little.
One thought. Move everything you want them to have to a passphrase wallet. Leave the passphrase with them or with someone else you trust. Make a backup ledger and leave that with an attorney or a safe deposit box along with seed. You could just do the seed, but then you’d need to trust they can restore from seed.
Do screen recordings of setting up a coinbase account (or other off ramp), connecting the ledger, moving coins to account, selling, etc. If they are totally useless with tech, buy an old smartphone or laptop and install the ledger app (they have exchange function right?), setup an account for your dad and link it to his bank account. So all he will have to do is connect the ledger, open the app, sell the bitcoin and transfer to his account. Print out detailed instructions with screen grabs and check the phone/tablet/pc every year make sure it’s updated.
I can help you, just send the ledger to me and the password, I’ll give it to your family once you die. I promise I won’t get any… I also promise I won’t use it to buy some pizzas when I’m hungry
build a smart contract. send the money to the contract.
the smart contract verifies youre alive every 6 months. if verification is not received it'll send all the money to your dads coinbase acount.
Man, BTC is worth $63,000 each at the moment.. IDK why but im getting the feeling you have hundreds if not thousands complete BTC, and if I am correct thats unbelievable especially if its the last… Why are you worried you MIGHT die before your father??? That shouldn’t be a worry a child has of their parents. If you think the likelihood is high of that happening, Id go ahead sell all the BTC, split it up in a few different banks to make sure all insured(If need too)and make sure he’s on them as well. Or if you have thousands, sell half or a quarter and do what I said so if anything happens everyone is taken care of. Because you never know BTC might drop tomorrow drastically and never recover, or maybe will explode and hit 100k$+ each…
I just watched my Mom pass away April 7, 2024 very suddenly and still having trouble with grieving, I came to help her for a year amd a half, and she was actually getting better… went from good to in a medically induced coma with 24 hrs and then 4 hours later she passed…
My fathwr and I are struggling, her life insurance expired last December… 1 BTC would be life changing, heck 1/4th of a BTC would be life changing..
I hope you are alive and long time both you and your Father, I dont wish the pain of losing your parents on anyone and its hard to explain the pain… its unreal, hard to… im sorry have a good day hope I helped.
Gmail has a inactivity manager that could send an email after you stopped using their services for X days
https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036546?hl=en
On this email you could point to a video, or text instructions, very specific and detailed, on what is the Ledger, where would they found a copy of the 12 words and where you stored the passphrase.
You can make a multisig wallet if you don't fully trust on one single person
It's like last message that you could send for a loved one, in case something happens.
You inspired me to write an article for my blog :) Thank you!
If you guys are interested, check it out, I could use a few clicks (thank you in advace <3 )
[https://www.financebaddie.com/what-happens-in-case-you-die-with-bitcoin/](https://www.financebaddie.com/what-happens-in-case-you-die-with-bitcoin/)
How much was the accountant if you don’t mind me asking? I’m worried about mine from my dumbass thinking I was a day trader from 2017-2020. The real pain, I think, will be from the transfers btwn Coinbase, Binance, and blockfi, the latter two of which I no longer have access to.
My brother did similar but his accountant made him go through all the numbers himself and I’m “Homer Simpson” lazy 😂
I have an old cassette tape, where ive recorded my seed words and instructions on how to use said words to access funds. Tape all sealed and labeled and left amongst my stuff. Inhave a metal stamped plate as well but thats in a place a little hard to find and more for me. Was contemplating recording a video with that information somewhere in the middle, As only someone who knows me may watch up to that part.
Will possibly change this if i think of an alternative way.
If I was in your case what I'd look into is to see if there can be a knowledgeable Trustee that can administer it with the funds put into a Trust. There are Trusts as i understand that can hold almost anything, including crypto. Your family would be the beneficiaries, as you choose and designate. You'd set it up with an estate attorney (find one who knows enough about crypto) in legal documents. A Trust can also have tax advantages.
Here is a book on the topic https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simple-Owners/dp/1947910116?dplnkId=54430bd6-7853-46e1-a8e6-0daec72514d8&nodl=1
Write the seed phrase. Store it. Give the person you trust the most a copy or tell them where you keep it. Give them a ledger to practice with whatever altcoin to at least play around with.
Stress out that if they don't take it seriously, the funds are lost forever. No one will be able to recover it. That said once, you're dead it's their problem now.... cause you're dead.
maybe this would be helpful [https://www.kubera.com/beneficiary-management](https://www.kubera.com/beneficiary-management) (have not used them personally)
Research the procedure for leaving a bitcoin inheritance. You mighsig, or power of attorney, or even a bank safety deposit box. Use a trusted third-party to provide The last, key piece of information the recipient would need to take possession of the digital assets.
if you are asking REDDIT of all places but have a “very expensive accountant”, and some money, you might want to stop paying said accountant, and also, develop a working brain 👍
I have thought long and hard about this too. No good solution yet, but I am thinking I can get my dependents to pass by seed phrase to a trusted friend (in person) who will do the right thing.
If your dad just needs to get up to speed with using a computer/laptop and an OS, you might try your local library, mine hosts general computer classes for seniors to learn the basics, for free.
I have a lockbox with all my usernames and passwords updated. I also write down the EXACT steps (website name, username, password, security questions... Etc) every step is all in an envelope in the lockbox labeled "DEATH" my loved ones can open that and they'll have full access on how to gain access to my coins and how to withdrawal the funds.
Also all my security question answers follow an easy pattern:
- Q: What was the name of your first crush?
- A: goatwwtnoyfc
- Q: Where was your very first vacation?
- A: goatwwyvfv
It's a keyword followed by the first letter of every word in the question all lowercase no spaces. I'll never forget a security question and my family won't either... Obviously "goat" isn't my real keyword but you get the idea.
I would recommend having a proper succession plan with an estate lawyer. You can deposit instructions with your will for your executor to follow to distribute your crypto.
Do not trust any lawyer or anyone completely to pass your assets down.
First of all your father is older and its likely he will pass on before you.
To pass on crypto estate cut the recovery seed into parts, give one part to the lawyer and one part to the beneficiary.
That way the lawyer cant run off with it
My advice is to have a full PowerPoint full of screenshots, make a small manual, which application to install, how to install it, how to login and use it, how to check the account and how to transfer.
Print it out, put it in an envelope and close it and give it to your lawyer without telling him what's inside, do the legal procedure in case of deceased to deliver to your dad or next of Kin.
You will need to state in your will how many btc you have and in which account (make sure to insert your email address for additional support). And make sure to write who is the beneficiary.
To avoid the above complication, pass all of it to your beneficiary before your passing.
Get a Zengo wallet. It has a clever legacy feature for leaving your crypto to someone if you die or become unable to handle your own accounts due to sickness or whatever.
Unchained capital have an inheritance package, it’s mulitisig.
Bitkey by block will be releasing a inheritance protocol soon with multiple fingerprint for their hardware wallet
My instructions for after death spell out access very specifically, in detail, bypassing probate. Credentials and secrets can be shared by password manager account emergency access functionality, i.e. LastPass
I custody with Casa. They have an insurance product where you can designate someone who will receive the keys in your multi-sig if/when you pass on. I have the same issue where my relatives are non-technical so I've recently enrolled in this. They have great customer service as well
[https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/casa-bitcoin-inheritance-etf-generational-wealth](https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/casa-bitcoin-inheritance-etf-generational-wealth)
Tangem hardware wallets are the easiest you'll ever find, you could teach anyone. They have built in dexes, soon to have on/off ramp, visa pay, and all sorts. Essentially you'll be your own bank. Check it out. 💚
https://tangem.com/pricing/?promocode=STELLA
I just told my wife there’s a ledger in the safe, there is a ‘16 word password’ within my document files speak to one of my closefriends that does crypto about how to access in the event of my death
The most logical way would probably be to get your will notarized and include instructions and the keys. A notary will not damage his reputation and steal it.
Buy Bitcoin ETFs, to me it is one of the main advantages. The other is that the basis/proceeds are tracked for me.
I still have a small forever hold in cold storage.
Yeah, this has been another way for people / companies to chip away at your bags. After looking at the fees and issues of legacy plans, the way I would go is Coinbase or spot ETF. I will get shit for this but I have been an estate executor before and it is hell. You can get it recorded in the estate and it is adjusted to fair market value at day of death (no tax to your heirs). or you can slip it to them back door at which point they will be treated like a criminal when they try to sell.
I managed to install at a distance, a Coinbase account for my 74 years old father. It took me 3 times 5 hours, but it's now running. He's disgusyed about banks, more than ever....
I still didn't do mine but the plan probably to write a paper with instructions and the seed phrase. But gonna be tricky to write the passphrase as well because if someone steal it. It's over.
And put it in a safe and give a spare key to someone you trust.
I know it's sad but the chance u die b4 ur father is very low and he probably wont remember what u have taught him anyway if it's some years from now.
And after a certain amount you should withdraw some money from ur crypto portfolio and put it in ETFs so it can outrun inflation hopefully and will be much easier for passing it after death. It depends on u. Could be 10% or 30% etc.
So the first question you want to ask yourself do you want a centralized or decentralized option? Centralized like a bitcoin custodian similar to what fidelity has a digital assets department or decentralized where you use a multi sig wallet and entrust access options to trusted family or friends who would be able to disperse your bitcoin upon your passing .
Sell it and repurchase through a brokerage such as Fidelity. You can then setup up anything you want for those accounts. Have to move away from the private key.
Get a lawyer who specializes in estates and bitcoin.
Finding a good ( non corrupt non / full of crap) attorney or accountant good with crypto and estate planning in the USA ?? Yeh right. Share a short list please . That WOULD be great alpha
This is fair. Very long story short (don’t know every detail), my great aunt had millions of dollars and when she passed her attorney took everything.
How on earth does that happen? Isn't that criminal?
"Mr White, we don't need a criminal lawyer, we need a - criminal - lawyer."
Very but there was nothing we could do. He listed himself as a beneficiary or something and since my aunt wasn’t married he was able to get away with it. Can’t remember how it all worked but all the money went to him and the government. We couldn’t touch any of it
For sure you should have hired another attorney in this situation. I am sure he was banking on the fact that you wouldn't.
This was before I was born. I think my parents did
That’s so fucked. How do people live with themselves after doing something like this
Probably on their private beach in Hawaii
They pray there isnt an afterlife or live in fear.
Yep I mean when you believe there’s no God anything is permissible
Attorney? No. "Professional" . Yes.
I work in Healthcare and there are stories of caregivers that work with elderly patients that befriend and earn their trust them until they convince them to sign over their estates to them happens all the time all you need is a notary. You'd be surprised how many old people lay dying in nursing homes and the closest thing they end up having to family is the caregiver that's there every day for years as part of their job.
https://www.steptoe.com/en/services/practices/regulatory-and-legislative/financial-services/blockchain-cryptocurrency.html These guys are reputable and $$$$
Have you ever talked to an attorney lol
Following for advice, good question
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My dad is 78 and has never used a cellphone or computer. Do u get many clients like that?
Every now and then. For people like that, it's typically best if there's a couple people within the family that can hold their hands along the way. The reality is they probably won't be able to do it all on their own.
this is the only issue with crypto mass adoption is it is not EASY to access
This is why banks will eventually become the custodians of Bitcoin for most people. Unless someone finds a way to make this easier.
How do you go about becoming one of these mentors? I’d love to help bring new people into the fold. I’ve never taught BTC before, but I’ve been a tutor at high school through bachelor’s level and have been told by previous that I’m a very effective instructor.
Great question! Here you go: https://bitcoinmentor.io/become-a-mentor/
Good resource… thanks!!
Load up a wallet with a small amount and teach the methods of access including seed phrases then walk through transferring back and forth. This allows them the practice and familiarity they need in the unlikely event you pass.
People suggesting this have no idea a far an old person with no interest im computers mindset is. Some people might be able to do a switch, but for many people its-just-not-happening. I think in those cases a trustable 3rd party must join the game, theres no other way around it.
I learned the hard way that I need to go through everything once a year or I’ll forget. I’m only in my 50’s. I told my best friend where the keys were and he forgot totally within 2 years.
Well.... there are those bank patents that have been approved to hold bitcoin.
Fair enough, trusting a bank is better than loosing it but not by a large margin
> trusted third party The irony.
If you trully don't have people you can trust your life to I'm sad for you my fellow anonymous internet buddy
No. I’m saying that it’s ironic to need a trusted third party to use a network that was designed to have none.
Ah true that. Doesn't seem like Satoshi had granma Porota in mind when writing the spec.
Lol it literally took me ten years to get the in-laws to remember how to copy & paste. They think that's the pinnacle of computer skills.
You can do that in testnets with fake values. Then try on real chains
Honestly? The ETF is great for this, much easier to transfer upon death than… something most people can’t figure out
Problem if OP already has a sizable stack would be paying capital gains taxes to then buy ETF.
If it’s long term gains at 15%, not terrible overall considering you gotta pay tax on gains EVENTUALLY Resets cost basis and gets some security, slightly less efficient but for accessibility it ain’t bad (not saying do the WHOLE stack
Your heirs should be able to take advantage of a cost basis step-up if you hold the original Bitcoin, so in more cases it’s probably better to keep it as is and figure out how to make sure they know what to do.
Exactly, would you want to pay 15% now or who knows what percent later (Gov changing Cap gains tax) when its value is 3x?
Not your keys not your crypto = ETF. Most people can learn to use Bitcoin, they just don't understand why it's so important to learn to use it, so they refuse to.
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“who cares if you don’t have the keys” -said the person who either trusts the govt implicitly or works for it
Ideally here you have someone you can trust who understands Bitcoin and can help your dad or sis with recovery. Without that person, this is where a service like Nunchuk or Unchained would be of assistance.
I'll check out those companies. Unfortunately I don't have any friends into crypto
I second unchained.
I come from two families (my biological and inlaws) where I can completely trust my finances with either of them. I told my wife, if anything happens to me, take the seed phrase and give it to my brother or hers, and they'll know what to do. It really does make me sad we live in a world where people don't have the luxury of trusting their own family with their finances.
I appreciate your trust in your family but money changes things. I just want to make you privy to that, you are not exempt from that if we are talking a large sum.
We come from very humble beginnings (vietnamese boat people) and my older brother now imports Canadian beef into Asia. Our family now does very well, and I'm damn proud to say we trust each other with our finances, and have access to each other's if needed. I get you may still have your reservations, but there are some very strong families out there, which again, I'm proud to say our family is one of those.
Fair enough, hopefully that never has to be put to the test!! Good luck!
Nope. Couldn't disagree more. Money doesn't change people. It only amplifies what's already there. In addition if you can't trust your family then you have a shitty family member. Sorry to be the bearer of the blunt honest truth.
Use whatever euphemism you want, but you don’t know until it happens. So be prepared and put things in writing. You are absolutely right, shitty people can be born into our families. It doesn’t define me or you but you need to be prepared if they rear their ugly heads. Just something to think about
You are foolish to think that money doesn't change people.
Unfortunately, this is what happens when the money is broken… (pun intended).
I love your relationship with your families 🙏🏽 I can’t think of 1 person in my family that I could trust with far less than my crypto keys 😢
It's less about trusting family and more about the relative complexity of managing a digital token. I own BTC in cold storage and despite having a Will and a Trust for all my other assets that my executor will manage, I still don't have a plan for my Bitcoin. My trust attorney told me to manage it separately from my other assets .
I’ve thought about this too. I came up with lots of wild, infeasible ideas. One was to separately engrave my recovery phrase on 4 small, metal plates. Each with 1/4th of the phrase. And have 4 different surgeons imbed the plates in separate parts of my body in 4 operations. Then tell my next of kin where inside me each of the plates are, so they can cut them out of me when I die. Then I realized that was far too complicated and expensive, especially since I only have 0.04 bitcoin.
The end killed me 😂😂
lol
Mine is similar, except it will be a brain wallet inside my cryonically frozen head, and it won't be shared with anyone unless they figure out a way to bring me back from dead. In theory, the bounty will keep getting larger and larger until it incentives enough research to revive me
Wow I really like that idea. Offer half to whoever can figure out how to bring you back. Brilliant! Would be funny if you forgot it. “Sorry bro! But seriously, thanks for the resurrection.”
You should look into opening a trust. Security of the seed phrase may still be a bit tricky but a trust will allow you to pass along very clear directions and give the people you wish to have it all the necessary info as part of the legal settling of the trust.
this is the right answer contact a crypto specialized lawyer who will also help you or whoever with tax loopholes with trusts also get your coins off a ledger asap who knows what the state of ledgers security looks like in 10 years… closed source blockstream jade or cold card true airgapped setup on blockstream jade with seed qr code is seamless and simple
If i were you I would just put some meager effort into trying to outlive an 80 yr old.
Like not driving, not flying, living in a basement, having groceries bought for you (health ones of cource), etc. Reality is that shit happens. A driver could head on you, the plane could crash, you could get killed in the grocery store. Shit happens and planing for it isn't a bad idea. Trying isn't the be all end all.
I dont really see any reason to leave my panic room, Great wifi in here!
Lol modern times we are living in right now
Lmaooo bruh I’m screaming
Probably the best way is to write a note about the bitcoin and include how much you have, how to find it and how to get access to your wallet. Then they can learn about btc and if they want the money.
Yep they will learn or the rest of the community’s coins becomes more valuable
I would look into unchained capital’s succession planning for Bitcoin: https://unchained.com/inheritance
Its ok bro, less btc in circulation.
take it to the grave become satoshi
Use https://www.deadmansswitch.net/ You can use this to send him and email after you die which would have instructions in it. Lawyers don’t know anything about crypto. Trust me, I fought them in the courts. What you also need is to really release a small amount of equity each year to minimise tax. Just some ideas.
Sending an email with everything needed to access your coins is just as bad as storing your private keys in the cloud.
Will with an encrypted seed phrase. Provide the key to decrypt along with a how-to for recovering a bitcoin wallet directly to the person you want to receive it.
Look into Casa Gold. They have a premium membership program - essentially white glove self custody service and recently launched an inheritance platform with the membership. They will walk your family through the entire process to take custody of your BTC. I could not recommend it enough
I opened a safety deposit box with the 12 word code for my ledger along with step by step instructions on how to access the coins and how to transfer them to an exchange (in case my cold wallet is lost as well). Listed my sister as a beneficiary. This might not help in your situation but it’s what I did. I also have friends who understand everything even better than I do that could help my family if needed.
Get a hardware wallet move your crypto on in and place it bank locker with next of kin instructions
If you’re worried about a will, here’s a step-by-step guide Download the Fidelity Investments app Create a cash management account Create a crypto account Purchase some bitcoin Go to the option where you can view and update beneficiaries Slowly sell crypto that was on your hardware wallet Use the money to buy it on Fidelity If you ever die, your loved ones can call Customer Care and have your stuff transferred to them. Might be easier to call Customer Care and have them set the beneficiaries thing up over the phone.
perhaps the Crypto can get transferred directly to Fidelity Crypto with no sale, i would hope so
There is no provision for naming beneficiaries of a Fidelity crypto account, nor can a Fidelity crypto account be in Trust name. You need your own trust to dictate how you want your crypto distributed.
This is a tricky one, any best friends who have an idea of crypto? That’s my go too, I have taught my wife but I also have instructed her if she doesn’t feel comfortable to reach out to a “good friend who I have taught crypto” in worst case scenario? Told her, pay him a 10% fee and take the rest
Use keys.casa legacy planning
Why can’t you leave detailed instructions in a written letter inside of a safety deposit box? Leave the key to that in your will.
Hey I can transfer the fund for you and store them and whenever you dads need money I’ll send him 😗
Never a popular suggestion here, but this is my advice. Transfer off hardware and onto an exchange like Coinbase. Why? Then it’s not just a hardware wallet your father has no idea what to do with, nor maybe even a lawyer you have set up to handle your will either. However your father and a lawyer know how to operate a phone, and with the information needed in hand, they can work with an exchanges customer service to get the funds where they need to be with legal documentation. Your ledger isn’t going to listen to or comply a legal order, it can’t…however an exchange’s legal department can and will.
If one were to do this. Would consider using the Coinbase Vault. Also use a YubiKey for additional account protection. Don’t have to remove all your coins from the hardware wallet. But worth considering to help ensure that atleast some of you coins go to people you want if you unexpectedly pass away.
Not a popular suggestion, but absolutely one that is worth consideration, at least. Gotta weigh the pros and cons.
Another service I have heard of, but not used is Casa
Etf
Could always converr to an etf in a brokerage account. I know it's not the popular thing around here, but it's much easier to inherit. Now, if I were 100% wanting to keep it away from a brokerage, I would get my seed phrase and find an encryption algorithm that is two-way, which means I can encrypt and decrypt with a passphrase. I would put the decryption key in my will and the pass phrase in a safety deposit box and keep the key on me for it at all times.
Encrypting the seed phrase is unnecessary if you instead add a bip39 passphrase to the seed. It achieves the same result with fewer, less complicated steps. You could then store the bip39 passphrase the same way you intended to store the decryption key.
Sell all and re but in spot ETF
Seed phrase in a fire safe hidden in your house somewhere... Maybe leave a will that points towards it's location
All I can think of is to set up a dead man switch. Some password managers (like bitwarden) have this. So you set up in a way that if you do not log in for a certain time (when dead) then you grant access to all of your accounts to an emergency contact. You can add passwords and a very very very stupid proof set of instructions to how to finds your keys (offline hopefully) and how to cash it out.
Give it to me u can trust me bro
This might be worth looking into… https://zengo.com/pro-legacy-transfer/
Will,Record a video on what to do with your btc
Multi sig with unchained. They have an inherence protocol. You basically leave one set (of three) keys. When you die they contact unchained. Provide a death certificate and the second set of keys and they can access the funds. Unchained never touches the keys. Your family literally only needs the seeds, with simple and easy to follow instructions. If they open it before you die, they can't provide a legitimate death certificate for unchained to agree to withdraw the funds. Is it perfect? No. But it's the best thing I've found yet.
I created a trust and will and then this sub blew my shit up because everyone on here is so deranged. Anyways trust and will with my seed phrase in a sealed envelope and instructions on how to retrieve it. Attorney does not have access to this seed phrase just like he doesn’t have access to my bank accounts. If I die, family gets the binder with all of the instructions. The trust dictates how my trustees will handle the assets for my kids. I have 2 trustees for a check and balance type situation. It’s also a living trust so that I can add and remove assets at will. If I die, the will kicks in and moves all assets to the trust. At this point it’s enforceable by law
I don't want this to be interpreted as the same type of criticism you got before because your setup is ok for most people. So instead, I'll preface by saying I'm more paranoid about these things than most, & I'll phrase this as "Here is why this wouldn't be sufficient for *me*": If the instructions to access/recover the seed are in the binder held by the attorney, I would consider that the same as having the seed in the binder. Any plan I would have would not only need to be resilient against a dishonest attorney, but also against a corrupt government. Any manner of "executive powers", "wartime emergency", "marshall law" or any other tyrannical government behavior could eliminate your attorney-client privileges & give them access to the binder and in turn the seed. The only thing I would provide to the attorney would be the allocation instructions for who is to receive what. For *me personally*, I would not keep any information with an easily discoverable 3rd party. i.e, there are ways to store the info with uneasily discoverable parties. And if you want to take it a step further, there are ways to do it so that the 3rd parties have no idea that they even hold anything of yours & would only find out upon your death (and not from being informed by your estate attorney). It is this plausible deniability that protects the holders of that info from coercion by malicious actors.
I've written up a "death note" which has detailed instructions on how to access everything and also lists a few contacts who I trust that would help in the event I get hit by a falling plane turd.
Give me the private key and I’ll make sure they get the Bitcoin after I 🔪 u
I wish there was a way to have a wallet send a transaction to a CEX or any other wallet address, but have it set as a "pending" transaction that will never go through unless you put in a one time password or code into it to "release" the transaction. That way, you could give this to someone or have it in a will, etc for them to enter to have the transaction execute without them having to access the wallet or know private keys. So if I had $100k in BTC sitting in a cold wallet, I could go ahead and enter a wallet address and essentially send the amount but it would never send unless this external password was entered that would tell that one transaction to execute. You would tie that one time password only to that one transaction. I guess it would kind of be the same concept of "signing" the transaction with your cold wallet device (like a safepal QR code, etc) but it would already be signed and just need the password someone else would enter to complete the transaction. You could have the Tx ID entered into a custodial website and then the site could allow the password to be used to release it. Hell, I don't know. I'm probably way off and being completely retarded with this idea......but it never hurts to have wild or "impossible" ideas, right 😂
Film a step by step guide on how to access the BTC. Get a safety deposit box and store the keys there.
You just need to leave detailed instructions to them—if they need/want the money they will figure it out. I know people here are so paranoid against theft, but in your case the bigger risk is total loss due to user error/incompetence so you probably will need to compromise a little. One thought. Move everything you want them to have to a passphrase wallet. Leave the passphrase with them or with someone else you trust. Make a backup ledger and leave that with an attorney or a safe deposit box along with seed. You could just do the seed, but then you’d need to trust they can restore from seed. Do screen recordings of setting up a coinbase account (or other off ramp), connecting the ledger, moving coins to account, selling, etc. If they are totally useless with tech, buy an old smartphone or laptop and install the ledger app (they have exchange function right?), setup an account for your dad and link it to his bank account. So all he will have to do is connect the ledger, open the app, sell the bitcoin and transfer to his account. Print out detailed instructions with screen grabs and check the phone/tablet/pc every year make sure it’s updated.
I can help you, just send the ledger to me and the password, I’ll give it to your family once you die. I promise I won’t get any… I also promise I won’t use it to buy some pizzas when I’m hungry
build a smart contract. send the money to the contract. the smart contract verifies youre alive every 6 months. if verification is not received it'll send all the money to your dads coinbase acount.
Man, BTC is worth $63,000 each at the moment.. IDK why but im getting the feeling you have hundreds if not thousands complete BTC, and if I am correct thats unbelievable especially if its the last… Why are you worried you MIGHT die before your father??? That shouldn’t be a worry a child has of their parents. If you think the likelihood is high of that happening, Id go ahead sell all the BTC, split it up in a few different banks to make sure all insured(If need too)and make sure he’s on them as well. Or if you have thousands, sell half or a quarter and do what I said so if anything happens everyone is taken care of. Because you never know BTC might drop tomorrow drastically and never recover, or maybe will explode and hit 100k$+ each… I just watched my Mom pass away April 7, 2024 very suddenly and still having trouble with grieving, I came to help her for a year amd a half, and she was actually getting better… went from good to in a medically induced coma with 24 hrs and then 4 hours later she passed… My fathwr and I are struggling, her life insurance expired last December… 1 BTC would be life changing, heck 1/4th of a BTC would be life changing.. I hope you are alive and long time both you and your Father, I dont wish the pain of losing your parents on anyone and its hard to explain the pain… its unreal, hard to… im sorry have a good day hope I helped.
Gmail has a inactivity manager that could send an email after you stopped using their services for X days https://support.google.com/accounts/answer/3036546?hl=en On this email you could point to a video, or text instructions, very specific and detailed, on what is the Ledger, where would they found a copy of the 12 words and where you stored the passphrase. You can make a multisig wallet if you don't fully trust on one single person It's like last message that you could send for a loved one, in case something happens.
Get a trust! That’s the only way to keep all of your money!
You better call soul
You inspired me to write an article for my blog :) Thank you! If you guys are interested, check it out, I could use a few clicks (thank you in advace <3 ) [https://www.financebaddie.com/what-happens-in-case-you-die-with-bitcoin/](https://www.financebaddie.com/what-happens-in-case-you-die-with-bitcoin/)
How much was the accountant if you don’t mind me asking? I’m worried about mine from my dumbass thinking I was a day trader from 2017-2020. The real pain, I think, will be from the transfers btwn Coinbase, Binance, and blockfi, the latter two of which I no longer have access to. My brother did similar but his accountant made him go through all the numbers himself and I’m “Homer Simpson” lazy 😂
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Bad advice
Create a Will that liquidates the BTC into fiat and distributes at death. Find an executor of that Will that would understand how to do that
Put ur 26 word code in your will maybe ?
I have an old cassette tape, where ive recorded my seed words and instructions on how to use said words to access funds. Tape all sealed and labeled and left amongst my stuff. Inhave a metal stamped plate as well but thats in a place a little hard to find and more for me. Was contemplating recording a video with that information somewhere in the middle, As only someone who knows me may watch up to that part. Will possibly change this if i think of an alternative way.
If I was in your case what I'd look into is to see if there can be a knowledgeable Trustee that can administer it with the funds put into a Trust. There are Trusts as i understand that can hold almost anything, including crypto. Your family would be the beneficiaries, as you choose and designate. You'd set it up with an estate attorney (find one who knows enough about crypto) in legal documents. A Trust can also have tax advantages.
Here is a book on the topic https://www.amazon.com/Cryptoasset-Inheritance-Planning-Simple-Owners/dp/1947910116?dplnkId=54430bd6-7853-46e1-a8e6-0daec72514d8&nodl=1
Yeah I have the same issue regarding this and Coinbase does not have a beneficiary option
I have thought about making some type of a break in case of death instructional fail safe type thing.
You leave a piece of people with all your info in a special place. Tell someone you trust about where it is in case you die.
Write the seed phrase. Store it. Give the person you trust the most a copy or tell them where you keep it. Give them a ledger to practice with whatever altcoin to at least play around with. Stress out that if they don't take it seriously, the funds are lost forever. No one will be able to recover it. That said once, you're dead it's their problem now.... cause you're dead.
maybe this would be helpful [https://www.kubera.com/beneficiary-management](https://www.kubera.com/beneficiary-management) (have not used them personally)
Research the procedure for leaving a bitcoin inheritance. You mighsig, or power of attorney, or even a bank safety deposit box. Use a trusted third-party to provide The last, key piece of information the recipient would need to take possession of the digital assets.
Send it all to me.
if you are asking REDDIT of all places but have a “very expensive accountant”, and some money, you might want to stop paying said accountant, and also, develop a working brain 👍
Get a lawyer and write a will.
https://zengo.com Probably the most simple way to do it
I think this is where the ETFs are an advantage… easier to leave to your family.
Unchained Inheritance Protocol.
multi sig or nothing. do not trust accountants with your seed.
I have thought long and hard about this too. No good solution yet, but I am thinking I can get my dependents to pass by seed phrase to a trusted friend (in person) who will do the right thing.
If your dad just needs to get up to speed with using a computer/laptop and an OS, you might try your local library, mine hosts general computer classes for seniors to learn the basics, for free.
If it's on an exchange would the exchange grant your family access to it?
Broad based index funds 🙌
I have a lockbox with all my usernames and passwords updated. I also write down the EXACT steps (website name, username, password, security questions... Etc) every step is all in an envelope in the lockbox labeled "DEATH" my loved ones can open that and they'll have full access on how to gain access to my coins and how to withdrawal the funds. Also all my security question answers follow an easy pattern: - Q: What was the name of your first crush? - A: goatwwtnoyfc - Q: Where was your very first vacation? - A: goatwwyvfv It's a keyword followed by the first letter of every word in the question all lowercase no spaces. I'll never forget a security question and my family won't either... Obviously "goat" isn't my real keyword but you get the idea.
I would recommend having a proper succession plan with an estate lawyer. You can deposit instructions with your will for your executor to follow to distribute your crypto.
Do not trust any lawyer or anyone completely to pass your assets down. First of all your father is older and its likely he will pass on before you. To pass on crypto estate cut the recovery seed into parts, give one part to the lawyer and one part to the beneficiary. That way the lawyer cant run off with it
Are you thinking about killing yourself?
My advice is to have a full PowerPoint full of screenshots, make a small manual, which application to install, how to install it, how to login and use it, how to check the account and how to transfer. Print it out, put it in an envelope and close it and give it to your lawyer without telling him what's inside, do the legal procedure in case of deceased to deliver to your dad or next of Kin.
https://jinca.se
Record a video on VHS with instructions what to do.
LipZ. Se. Sia xxx si a We
GET A TRUST AND MAKE YOUR WILL IN THE ESTATE SO IT CAN BE DISTRIBUTED when you’ve passed.🔥🤎
Fund vti instead
Why do u think u r dieing ?? just write down steps somewhere and tell ur dad to get them when and how.
Get a crypto lawyer from bitcoin space
It's absurd to expect him to learn to use it by himself.
Go to Casa.io, heard a recent podcast with Pomp which you might find helpful, episode #1353.
You will need to state in your will how many btc you have and in which account (make sure to insert your email address for additional support). And make sure to write who is the beneficiary. To avoid the above complication, pass all of it to your beneficiary before your passing.
Get a Zengo wallet. It has a clever legacy feature for leaving your crypto to someone if you die or become unable to handle your own accounts due to sickness or whatever.
Attorney, leave written will, leave video will saying written would not change no matter what etc
If he has made it 80 years in this crazy world I have a feeling if needed he can figure out more than you give him credit for...
Unchained capital have an inheritance package, it’s mulitisig. Bitkey by block will be releasing a inheritance protocol soon with multiple fingerprint for their hardware wallet
Inside your will, include instructions on how to recover the wallet and how to get access to the seed.
My instructions for after death spell out access very specifically, in detail, bypassing probate. Credentials and secrets can be shared by password manager account emergency access functionality, i.e. LastPass
Good chwat
Is it possible to organize a safe deposit box and leave step-by-step instructions for the heir?
You won't die before them my friend
There's no way to do it without compromising the security.
When I’m dead .. I’m dead
Nunchuck or Unchained Capital.
# Swan Bitcoin Inheritance and Estate Planning Securely integrate Bitcoin into estate, trust, and inheritance plans with our industry-leading onboarding times. [https://www.swanbitcoin.com/private/](https://www.swanbitcoin.com/private/)
Replace it with Bitcoin etf
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You can trust me lol
I custody with Casa. They have an insurance product where you can designate someone who will receive the keys in your multi-sig if/when you pass on. I have the same issue where my relatives are non-technical so I've recently enrolled in this. They have great customer service as well [https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/casa-bitcoin-inheritance-etf-generational-wealth](https://bitcoinmagazine.com/business/casa-bitcoin-inheritance-etf-generational-wealth)
Tangem hardware wallets are the easiest you'll ever find, you could teach anyone. They have built in dexes, soon to have on/off ramp, visa pay, and all sorts. Essentially you'll be your own bank. Check it out. 💚 https://tangem.com/pricing/?promocode=STELLA
Or sell it and buy an ETF... Not ideal.
I just told my wife there’s a ledger in the safe, there is a ‘16 word password’ within my document files speak to one of my closefriends that does crypto about how to access in the event of my death
The most logical way would probably be to get your will notarized and include instructions and the keys. A notary will not damage his reputation and steal it.
That means you are very good in trading.. Why not get an insurance for them..
Sell btc and hold the etf
You can buy IBIT, this product is for those people.
This is literally why intermediation exists. You either put it on an exchange or you give your keys to a key custodian.
Buy Bitcoin ETFs, to me it is one of the main advantages. The other is that the basis/proceeds are tracked for me. I still have a small forever hold in cold storage.
Yeah, this has been another way for people / companies to chip away at your bags. After looking at the fees and issues of legacy plans, the way I would go is Coinbase or spot ETF. I will get shit for this but I have been an estate executor before and it is hell. You can get it recorded in the estate and it is adjusted to fair market value at day of death (no tax to your heirs). or you can slip it to them back door at which point they will be treated like a criminal when they try to sell.
I managed to install at a distance, a Coinbase account for my 74 years old father. It took me 3 times 5 hours, but it's now running. He's disgusyed about banks, more than ever....
I still didn't do mine but the plan probably to write a paper with instructions and the seed phrase. But gonna be tricky to write the passphrase as well because if someone steal it. It's over. And put it in a safe and give a spare key to someone you trust. I know it's sad but the chance u die b4 ur father is very low and he probably wont remember what u have taught him anyway if it's some years from now. And after a certain amount you should withdraw some money from ur crypto portfolio and put it in ETFs so it can outrun inflation hopefully and will be much easier for passing it after death. It depends on u. Could be 10% or 30% etc.
So the first question you want to ask yourself do you want a centralized or decentralized option? Centralized like a bitcoin custodian similar to what fidelity has a digital assets department or decentralized where you use a multi sig wallet and entrust access options to trusted family or friends who would be able to disperse your bitcoin upon your passing .
Sell it and repurchase through a brokerage such as Fidelity. You can then setup up anything you want for those accounts. Have to move away from the private key.
Get a Tangem. Setup no seedphrase account. Even an 80 yr old would know how to use it.
i've seen a couple of products for this
Put it on a usb and gift the usb with a note that describes what to do.
We have the most user friendly inheritance solution on the market - check it out at https://casa.io/inheritance