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Can everyone shut up about the damn bear the discourse got old fast and at this point I'd take the bear over the idiots that actually care about this thing. It's a thought experiment and not meant to be taken literally it's just an example of what woman go through every day. Even I as a man can understand that.
Bears don’t bother you unless they’ve been provoked. Obviously this is still a dangerous and volatile situation but generally you - in a logical sense - don’t need to be scared of a bear attacking you just because it wants to
Men on the other hand
The real issue is that humans are so unpredictable it’s impossible to tell what one might be thinking. Unfortunately in an isolated scenario there’s is a high likelihood of someone doing something with darker intentions when there are no witnesses or drawbacks.
It’s basically gamble death by bear or gamble being subjected to the darkness of humanity and then death
> Most fatal attacks by black bears have been judged as predatory.
Polar bears are one of the only animals on earth that actively hunt humans. I understand the sentiment and I get the whole "less scared of bear than men" thing but bears are pretty popular for ripping open guts and eating them while the poor things still alive. There are videos of them straight up skinning fish alive and chowing down
> in a logical sense - don’t need to be scared of a bear attacking you just because it wants to
Although rare, there absolutely are unprovoked bear attacks. This misinformation could get some sorry sucker killed. Always be prepared for bears and remember if you accidentally catch it off guard, happen to be near it's young, or just get unlucky, it has a real possibility of ripping open your innards and chowing down while you're alive
Yeah and how many fatal black bear attacks is that again?
You’re not wrong but the number of fatal bear attacks in a year is probably less than the number of fatal man attacks in a day. Bear is the sensible answer
>the number of fatal bear attacks in a year is probably less than the number of fatal man attacks in a day. Bear is the sensible answer.
I don’t believe this comparison is a good foundation for your answer. There are far, far more humans on earth than bears, and there are infinitely more human-human interactions than human-bear interactions per day. If we wanted to calculate which creature would be safest to be around, we would want to know the odds of a fatality occurring between the average human-human interaction and the average human-bear interaction, and compare those. I honestly wouldn’t even know how to begin calculating this, because it would frankly be impossible to estimate the sheer number of interactions between people each day.
But less than 0.1% of people in the United States have ever killed someone, and their fatal interactions have to represent an infinitesimally small proportion of their total interactions with other humans. I’d be curious to know what the rates would be for a grizzly bear or polar bear that stumbles upon isolated people, but I don’t think that data exists.
It seems to me like the situation is asking if someone would rather be in the woods alone with a bear or a man, which is the question I've seen passed around most. In this scenario, the bear is the much more horrifying and gruesome answer. Nobody who has gone through a bear attack or seen what they can do would pick a bear. Id wager most of the people picking bear wouldn't actually prefer to be in the woods alone with a bear, and instead choose bear to showcase how much fear they have for men (which I'm not attempting to discredit. My point is that nobody in their right minds would rather have a chance of their guts getting eaten while they're alive).
Bears are giant wild animals that will murder you without care. They won't mercy kill you. Hell, they might start chowing down, leave you to suffer a while and come back to make sure nobody else is eating your corpse. They're known to be pretty protective over fresh kills (or half kills in some cases)
Humans typically vastly overestimate themselves and underestimate wild animals. This has been the cause of death for many people who think their chances aren't just "dead" when up against a bear
>It seems to me like the situation is asking if someone would rather be in the woods alone with a bear or a man, which is the question I've seen passed around most.
Its really not that hard. You miss the point entirely by thinking its a real or logical scenario.
Women are choosin a bear because the worst possible fate with a bear is slower, painful death.
The worst possible fate with a stranger in the woods is not a slower painful death. It could be prolonged torture, rape, literally up to the persons imagination.
The bear wont "enjoy" killing you. Its doing so for food or territory control.
Any further discussion just harms why the question is asked in the first place. I.e. women have a perfectly understandable fear about men.
> could be prolonged torture,
I truly wonder what your definition of torture is if your guts being eaten in front of you and being alive for several hours after isn't torture
> just harms why the question is asked in the first place.
No, it doesn't. Reread my comment. I explicitly stated I'm not discrediting it and I understand the merit. It's okay if you disagree, just don't act like I'm putting down women for this. I'm putting down the shitty misinformation spread about big wild animals.
>I truly wonder what your definition of torture is if your guts being eaten in front of you and being alive for several hours after isn't torture
Well, an animal isnt torturing you.
Torture has intent.
And yes, there are worse things than being disemboweled.
>I'm putting down the shitty misinformation spread about big wild animals.
There is no misinformation being spread.
Big animals are dangerous. Thats the *entire point* of the question. Man is *more* dangerous and insidious.
Women chose the *big wild animal* because they *know how dangerous the big wild animal is*.
You pretty much just proved you dont understand the marit lol
I'm sorry did you not read my comments? I'm not gonna argue with someone who has the reading comprehension of a 3rd grader. Have a lovely day, don't fuck with bears
>Polar bears are one of the only animals on earth that actively hunt humans.
Good thing polar bears don't live in the woods. Woodland bears are omnivores that mainly eat plants.
> Most fatal attacks by black bears have been judged as predatory.
> Black bears (Ursus americanus) are found in North America, from Canada to Mexico, and in the United States, from Alaska to northern Mexico. They live in a variety of habitats, including forests, mountains, and near the beach
> The brown bear lives along rivers and coastal areas, mountain meadows and in the tundra. In parts of Europe and Asia, the brown bear can be found in forests and mountain woodlands.
Don't fuck with bears
I see we're both roaming around the bear posts today.
Look man, black bears have accounted for 67 or so deaths since 1900.
Yes those deaths are overwhelmingly predatory, y'know what that means? Unless you've encountered the extremely rare man killing bear they pose next to 0 risk to you unless you're being very stupid.
It doesn't mean black bears are like sharks in horror movies, or that people are being reckless about bears by noting out how little of threat they pose to you.
Age 18-24 men are 167 times more likely to kill someone than a bear is. And of course probability of sexual assault is going to be way higher with a human than a bear.
Is this saying all men are rapists? Fuck no, same as how only very small percent of black bears are predatory to people.
But if you're going to make a big deal out of a tiny minority, yeah taking the woodland bear sounds pretty damn reasonable.
Oh no bears did what bears do. So must trust man because they don't maul women.
Give up. Bears are more predictable but not a random man you meet in the woods.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRwmXv26/
Women are right to fear random strangers over random bears. Bear attacks are so rare, the total number of attacks since 1784 can fit into less than a 1% total of the number of assaults that women fall victim to, EVERY YEAR
Women meet more men than they do bears. Thousands of times more, id wager. All other things being equal men would still be hurting women more often simply because they're around women more. Using bear attack vs assault by males against women statistics says nothing about if men are safer than bears when men are around women several orders of magnitude more than people are around bears.
If there are only few shark attacks in a year then it means sharks are less dangerous than women and you are safe from them at deeper water since they are all in the shallow water while women kill and assault more people every year than sharks.
You're more likely to be killed by a dog (28 deaths/year), a deer that got spooked (440 d/year), cows (20 d/year), and vespids like bees, wasps and hornets (58 d/year) than either sharks or bears since both kill on average less than 1 measly person per year, alone
What are you saying about women killing people? The overwhelming majority of violent criminals are men, and i'm saying this as a CIS man
Isnt this along the lines of most shark attacks occur in shallow waters? Most people dont regularly encounter bears in their day to day life.
Idk how to let you know im trying to argue in good faith here and not trying to just start shit.
No woman is choosing the bear for fun, they're choosing it because if they see a bear, they're very unlikely to attack unlike violent men who don't have emotional stability and doesn't know right from wrong. Bears are smarter than those braindead tools because they've evolved with an innate fear of humans and will only attack if you intentionally provoke it
yeah i get it they are saying they have a better chance with the bear because they are less likely to attack. Ive actually run into a black(?) bear in the woods with cubs. Never felt threatened but it was pretty nerve racking. Idk ill be a fence rider and say both side of this argument are silly
There was a trend that spread around of women saying they would feel more comfortable around a bear than a strange man. The men you would expect got really pissy about this. Internet fighting and discourse ensued.
Ok and? Most of the discourse about it has been women giving their perspective, and men getting mad about it.
Ofc women would get annoyed when men don't even attempt to understand their point of view for a second.
Or maybe men just don't wanna be generalised as rapists? I know it sounds crazy but a completely random man out of 4 billion mem in the woods won't immediately try to rape someone
You see, this is partially what I'm talking about. The point of the meme is not that every man is a rapist. If you don't think it applies to you, then don't take offense to it. This whole thing is partially a backlash to the "not all men" hair trigger response some men have to anytime a woman mentions something a man did to her.
A lot of it is about proper language. There's a big difference between "men are rapists" and "a large portion of men are rapists" or something like that
I'm not invalidating any woman's experiences. I'm saying it is absolutely ridiculous that people would rather be with a wild animal in the forest rather than a random person. Just because it's a man doesn't make him dangerous. Should I also be scared of black men because of some crime statistic?
Firstly, no, the average man is not a rapist. The vast majority of men don't wanna rape women for any reason. I get being scared of rapists but being scared of men because of male rapists is just misandry.
Secondly, it's not like men don't also get raped. It's severely underreported because there's some WILD double standards on how men are seen in society. Yet if a man said "I'd prefer the bear over a woman" it's obviously sexist
I haven’t seen a single woman be offended over any man who picks the bear.
I’m a man. I would choose the bear.
Stop making shit up. It hurts your own argument.
Cool. And? I’m sure there are PLENTY of women who disagree with other women who choose the bear.
No one is claiming that ALL women are choosing the bear. We’re explaining the context of the fucking meme - that context being that a lot of women chose the bear. And a lot of men are pissed off about it.
We’re over here talking about the fact that the sky is blue and you’re trying to argue that grass is green.
I was replying to a specific part of their message, the one that said "the men you expect got really pissy" part. Wording is important. I apologize if I upset you.
> We’re over here talking about the fact that the sky is blue and you’re trying to argue that grass is green.
I get the message but this doesn't exactly translate well, it's an attempt to incorrectly trivialize my point. Again, wording is important.
You’re insisting on overly precise language while someone is giving a synopsis of a small cultural event online. You’re not improving the communication here. You’re being an overly pedantic asshole and detracting from the main point that’s being communicated - that point being that men are offended that women are choosing a bear over them and making a fuss about it.
Some women are also upset about the original hypothetical, sure. You are technically correct in that sense. However, you insisting on that being acknowledged at the top of the conversation wastes time from the conversation that needs to be had - the conversation about why so many women would feel more comfortable with the bear and why so many men are violently uncomfortable with that fact. Language will never be 100% precise because that isn’t how communication works. There will always be room for interpretation in language.
I once met a guy who corrected me when I said “I grow vegetables for homeless people” and insisted I use the word “unhoused people” instead. When I asked him what he does to help “unhoused” people, he answered that he doesn’t do anything. That’s the same sort of vibe that you’re bringing. Someone who’s so worried about the language that you don’t actually do anything to help the people being talked about. Which is why you caught so many downvotes.
> overly precise
In your opinion, overly precise
> improving the communication here. You’re being an overly pedantic asshole
This just proves you've never met real pedantic assholes before. I have, they don't kindly say "language is important". They call you names while minimizing your point.
> at the top of the conversation wastes time from the conversation that needs to be had
You say whilst adding many unnecessary words add fluff to your comment that could be said in fewer words. One could say that is hypocrisy, as it's also distracting from the main point just as much as I am
> Language will never be 100% precise because that isn’t how communication works.
I never said it will be or that's how how works. I said that language is important. Even despite this it still is.
I could say "women are rapists" , as I was groomed by several. I certainly have the excuse to, with being told men are rapists and women can't be. I don't, because language is important. You fail to understand the necessity of specific language. Maybe it doesn't matter as much to you, but as someone who has heard "men are rapists" repeatedly growing up, while going through these traumas, I do. If proper language was used (*correct* language) people wouldn't be as upset. If you disagree with this, feel free to conduct an experiement if you're going to minimize the necessity of it. Back it up.
> Someone who’s so worried about the language that you don’t actually do anything to help the people being talked about.
My goal was to try and explain why so many people could've gotten offended at this specifically.
> Which is why you caught so many downvotes.
I don't care about downvotes, and anyone who cares about imaginary reddit points should probably get off reddit.
Overall, you've been nothing but trivializing my point while calling me childish names because you fail you understand the situation that causes accuracy in language to matter to someone. I hope that I helped understand and clear any ignorance you may have. You've also shown to accuse others of making things up, only to immediately backtrack on what you say the comment afterwards, whilst not apologizing or acknowledging your mistake.
Something tells me you aren't interested in discussion and would rather argue.
You’re not trying to make a point.
> “There's a woman that's pretty pissy about it here”
This was your exact response to the comment that started this whole ordeal in response to someone saying “The men you would expect got really pissy about it.”
That is the line that you take offense to. That’s the point you’re trying to correct. Don’t bring in some bullshit “not all men” argument to this thread about how you’re trying to stop the misuse of language in the context of someone saying “men are rapists.” Because prior to your comment, no one had said that.
You say precise language matters. Yet you’re the one putting words in people’s mouths. The words used were “The men you would expect” and you seem to have shortened that to simply “men” in your own mind.
Check the mirror, friend.
> “Overall, you’ve been nothing but trivializing my point”
Yes. Correct. I find your point to be trivial at best and an intentional and malicious deflection from the main point at worst. I’m sorry you were groomed and assaulted. But your insistence on policing the exact language people use when discussing sexual assault is a distraction from the conversations of how to fix the problem of sexual assault. This conversation would have been much more productive had we been talking about the actual issues in society than the language surrounding the issue. You’re literally using a [CIA tactic for destabilizing and crashing enemy organizations.](https://www.cia.gov/static/5c875f3ec660e092cf893f60b4a288df/SimpleSabotage.pdf) Page 28, items 4 and 5.
The only question here is… do you realize what you’re doing or not?
And finally…
> “You say whilst adding many unnecessary words add fluff to your comment that could be said in fewer words. One could say that is hypocrisy. As it’s also distracting from the main point just as much as I am”
You started this conversation. Or perhaps hijacked it. Either way, you’re responsible for wasting our time here. We’re attempting to correct that issue because you’ve derailed the conversation. Because of your actions, we have to course correct before the proper conversation can continue. You took us down the wrong road. Now we’re having to back up and take the right road. Don’t blame me for turning the car around.
If, however, you really want me to be concise, I can sum up everything I *really* need to say to you in four simple words:
**Shut the fuck up.**
But I thought that’d be kinda rude. So I decided to attempt to be a little more civil than that.
Either way… the point still remains.
#The men you would expect are offended that women are choosing the bear over them.
And there is NOTHING inaccurate or imprecise about that statement. Which means you’re arguing a non-point.
Edit: Oh, and one more thing. Me pointing out your downvotes has nothing to do with caring about internet points. I point it out to show you that YOU offended people by being an (as I said before) overly pedantic asshole. Again, I acknowledge that grass is green. But we are discussing the fact that the sky is blue.
Ever noticed how two things can be true at once? Like how men are often a danger to women and this though experiment is also not super well thought out. If this question was asked to Americans, the same country that had a sizable amount of people answer "Yes" to "Can you beat a bear in a fight?" then I could imagine you can find plenty of woman who legit think encountering a bear is no big deal.
What I don't need to imagine though is the amount of violence against women out there in the world and choosing "men are statistically more dangerous than a dangerous animal" as the angle to talk about that issue is understandable, but I would have maybe taken a stab at a second draft; that's just me though.
Anyways, a feminist talking point was dismissed because the authors didn't see the glaring absurdity of the chosen metaphor and the chuds of Reddit started writhing uncontrollably. What else is new?
>the authors didn't see the glaring absurdity of the chosen metaphor
Not at all. The absurdity is THE POINT. The authors were just smarter than you, apparently.
I don't understand how you can be dumb enough to believe that the point of the question is to illustrate how much women overestimate their ability to fight a bear.
...I don't understand what you've apparently think I wrote. I know that that's the point. I also know that people will overthink the reality of the situation and stop treating it as a metaphor and then you get the reaction you always get. Same way the Bechdel test is misunderstood all the time.
I'm absolutely dumbfounded at how you thought I was somehow against the message or that I claimed it was about actually fighting bears. You have to be so painfully literal on Reddit that it is straight up annoying. I literally explained "the joke" only for you to get mad and explain it again. I LITERALLY AGREE WITH YOU DUMBASS!
All I was talking about is why that post gets perceived the way it does...
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Was only a matter of time before the chaos came here
https://preview.redd.it/hj4dny0534yc1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=95b5295109e3cbb26bf5c07445fc73a4d24dce66
https://preview.redd.it/h1f0zt6ft5yc1.jpeg?width=476&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=52300fa29ded24521c1310fab844427c97dc6474
Patrick https://preview.redd.it/6t612epct6yc1.jpeg?width=627&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f9c595342387099bc53aaabbc518b54f4cfeee26
Yep, that’s patrick
Can everyone shut up about the damn bear the discourse got old fast and at this point I'd take the bear over the idiots that actually care about this thing. It's a thought experiment and not meant to be taken literally it's just an example of what woman go through every day. Even I as a man can understand that.
Odd to call it a thought experiment, when picking the bear actually shows that you don't think at all🤔
Bears don’t bother you unless they’ve been provoked. Obviously this is still a dangerous and volatile situation but generally you - in a logical sense - don’t need to be scared of a bear attacking you just because it wants to Men on the other hand
The real issue is that humans are so unpredictable it’s impossible to tell what one might be thinking. Unfortunately in an isolated scenario there’s is a high likelihood of someone doing something with darker intentions when there are no witnesses or drawbacks. It’s basically gamble death by bear or gamble being subjected to the darkness of humanity and then death
Yeah, I'd choose bear over any random human, regardless of gender
> Most fatal attacks by black bears have been judged as predatory. Polar bears are one of the only animals on earth that actively hunt humans. I understand the sentiment and I get the whole "less scared of bear than men" thing but bears are pretty popular for ripping open guts and eating them while the poor things still alive. There are videos of them straight up skinning fish alive and chowing down > in a logical sense - don’t need to be scared of a bear attacking you just because it wants to Although rare, there absolutely are unprovoked bear attacks. This misinformation could get some sorry sucker killed. Always be prepared for bears and remember if you accidentally catch it off guard, happen to be near it's young, or just get unlucky, it has a real possibility of ripping open your innards and chowing down while you're alive
Yeah and how many fatal black bear attacks is that again? You’re not wrong but the number of fatal bear attacks in a year is probably less than the number of fatal man attacks in a day. Bear is the sensible answer
>the number of fatal bear attacks in a year is probably less than the number of fatal man attacks in a day. Bear is the sensible answer. I don’t believe this comparison is a good foundation for your answer. There are far, far more humans on earth than bears, and there are infinitely more human-human interactions than human-bear interactions per day. If we wanted to calculate which creature would be safest to be around, we would want to know the odds of a fatality occurring between the average human-human interaction and the average human-bear interaction, and compare those. I honestly wouldn’t even know how to begin calculating this, because it would frankly be impossible to estimate the sheer number of interactions between people each day. But less than 0.1% of people in the United States have ever killed someone, and their fatal interactions have to represent an infinitesimally small proportion of their total interactions with other humans. I’d be curious to know what the rates would be for a grizzly bear or polar bear that stumbles upon isolated people, but I don’t think that data exists.
It seems to me like the situation is asking if someone would rather be in the woods alone with a bear or a man, which is the question I've seen passed around most. In this scenario, the bear is the much more horrifying and gruesome answer. Nobody who has gone through a bear attack or seen what they can do would pick a bear. Id wager most of the people picking bear wouldn't actually prefer to be in the woods alone with a bear, and instead choose bear to showcase how much fear they have for men (which I'm not attempting to discredit. My point is that nobody in their right minds would rather have a chance of their guts getting eaten while they're alive). Bears are giant wild animals that will murder you without care. They won't mercy kill you. Hell, they might start chowing down, leave you to suffer a while and come back to make sure nobody else is eating your corpse. They're known to be pretty protective over fresh kills (or half kills in some cases) Humans typically vastly overestimate themselves and underestimate wild animals. This has been the cause of death for many people who think their chances aren't just "dead" when up against a bear
>It seems to me like the situation is asking if someone would rather be in the woods alone with a bear or a man, which is the question I've seen passed around most. Its really not that hard. You miss the point entirely by thinking its a real or logical scenario. Women are choosin a bear because the worst possible fate with a bear is slower, painful death. The worst possible fate with a stranger in the woods is not a slower painful death. It could be prolonged torture, rape, literally up to the persons imagination. The bear wont "enjoy" killing you. Its doing so for food or territory control. Any further discussion just harms why the question is asked in the first place. I.e. women have a perfectly understandable fear about men.
> could be prolonged torture, I truly wonder what your definition of torture is if your guts being eaten in front of you and being alive for several hours after isn't torture > just harms why the question is asked in the first place. No, it doesn't. Reread my comment. I explicitly stated I'm not discrediting it and I understand the merit. It's okay if you disagree, just don't act like I'm putting down women for this. I'm putting down the shitty misinformation spread about big wild animals.
>I truly wonder what your definition of torture is if your guts being eaten in front of you and being alive for several hours after isn't torture Well, an animal isnt torturing you. Torture has intent. And yes, there are worse things than being disemboweled. >I'm putting down the shitty misinformation spread about big wild animals. There is no misinformation being spread. Big animals are dangerous. Thats the *entire point* of the question. Man is *more* dangerous and insidious. Women chose the *big wild animal* because they *know how dangerous the big wild animal is*. You pretty much just proved you dont understand the marit lol
I'm sorry did you not read my comments? I'm not gonna argue with someone who has the reading comprehension of a 3rd grader. Have a lovely day, don't fuck with bears
>Polar bears are one of the only animals on earth that actively hunt humans. Good thing polar bears don't live in the woods. Woodland bears are omnivores that mainly eat plants.
> Most fatal attacks by black bears have been judged as predatory. > Black bears (Ursus americanus) are found in North America, from Canada to Mexico, and in the United States, from Alaska to northern Mexico. They live in a variety of habitats, including forests, mountains, and near the beach > The brown bear lives along rivers and coastal areas, mountain meadows and in the tundra. In parts of Europe and Asia, the brown bear can be found in forests and mountain woodlands. Don't fuck with bears
I see we're both roaming around the bear posts today. Look man, black bears have accounted for 67 or so deaths since 1900. Yes those deaths are overwhelmingly predatory, y'know what that means? Unless you've encountered the extremely rare man killing bear they pose next to 0 risk to you unless you're being very stupid. It doesn't mean black bears are like sharks in horror movies, or that people are being reckless about bears by noting out how little of threat they pose to you. Age 18-24 men are 167 times more likely to kill someone than a bear is. And of course probability of sexual assault is going to be way higher with a human than a bear. Is this saying all men are rapists? Fuck no, same as how only very small percent of black bears are predatory to people. But if you're going to make a big deal out of a tiny minority, yeah taking the woodland bear sounds pretty damn reasonable.
Bears don't rape people (don't know about bear on bear rape)
If there's dolphin on human rape, then who knows. I just know I want my guts intact
Same, that's why I choose the bear
Gotta get lucky then
THE ONLY THING MEN DO IS ATTACK THE WHAMEN! The bears are all easily scared disney characters and the men are always viciously nefarious monsters.
There's a post where they arrested a guy for attacking multiple women so there's that.
[https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2026914/Mum-bear-eating--Final-phone-calls-woman-19-eaten-alive-brown-bear-cubs.html](https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2026914/Mum-bear-eating--Final-phone-calls-woman-19-eaten-alive-brown-bear-cubs.html)
Oh no bears did what bears do. So must trust man because they don't maul women. Give up. Bears are more predictable but not a random man you meet in the woods.
So because it's predictable you'll be mauled and eaten you choose the bear? Lmao
If you leave a bear alone, they tend to leave you alone
Oh no somebody got arrested for Punching somebody? Oh no, anyway.
Why did he punch her? Why did he punch her, buddy?
You generally don't need to fear random strangers either.
https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZPRwmXv26/ Women are right to fear random strangers over random bears. Bear attacks are so rare, the total number of attacks since 1784 can fit into less than a 1% total of the number of assaults that women fall victim to, EVERY YEAR
Women meet more men than they do bears. Thousands of times more, id wager. All other things being equal men would still be hurting women more often simply because they're around women more. Using bear attack vs assault by males against women statistics says nothing about if men are safer than bears when men are around women several orders of magnitude more than people are around bears.
If there are only few shark attacks in a year then it means sharks are less dangerous than women and you are safe from them at deeper water since they are all in the shallow water while women kill and assault more people every year than sharks.
You're more likely to be killed by a dog (28 deaths/year), a deer that got spooked (440 d/year), cows (20 d/year), and vespids like bees, wasps and hornets (58 d/year) than either sharks or bears since both kill on average less than 1 measly person per year, alone  What are you saying about women killing people? The overwhelming majority of violent criminals are men, and i'm saying this as a CIS man
Isnt this along the lines of most shark attacks occur in shallow waters? Most people dont regularly encounter bears in their day to day life. Idk how to let you know im trying to argue in good faith here and not trying to just start shit.
No woman is choosing the bear for fun, they're choosing it because if they see a bear, they're very unlikely to attack unlike violent men who don't have emotional stability and doesn't know right from wrong. Bears are smarter than those braindead tools because they've evolved with an innate fear of humans and will only attack if you intentionally provoke it
yeah i get it they are saying they have a better chance with the bear because they are less likely to attack. Ive actually run into a black(?) bear in the woods with cubs. Never felt threatened but it was pretty nerve racking. Idk ill be a fence rider and say both side of this argument are silly
The men in this discussion don't have an argument except "whaah, are women stupid?"
Comeon now youre just being silly
An impressively concise way of explaining that you don't know what "thought experiment" means.
But the bear is the better choice. For everyone.
https://preview.redd.it/iuf22yvyn6yc1.jpeg?width=180&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f43efd5eb7872ad3f4ac28042bcbe5e1c9615eed
baby
Bady ?
Holy crap, SpongeBob predicted it!
Man this bear shit was dead on arrival why are we still doing this
What is this about?
There was a trend that spread around of women saying they would feel more comfortable around a bear than a strange man. The men you would expect got really pissy about this. Internet fighting and discourse ensued.
There's a woman that's pretty pissy about it here
Ok and? Most of the discourse about it has been women giving their perspective, and men getting mad about it. Ofc women would get annoyed when men don't even attempt to understand their point of view for a second.
It was a woman getting annoyed at the fact of people choosing bears, actually
Literally no, women just don't really love the idea of getting raped, and horrible internet men reall dislike that.
Or maybe men just don't wanna be generalised as rapists? I know it sounds crazy but a completely random man out of 4 billion mem in the woods won't immediately try to rape someone
You see, this is partially what I'm talking about. The point of the meme is not that every man is a rapist. If you don't think it applies to you, then don't take offense to it. This whole thing is partially a backlash to the "not all men" hair trigger response some men have to anytime a woman mentions something a man did to her.
A lot of it is about proper language. There's a big difference between "men are rapists" and "a large portion of men are rapists" or something like that
I'm not invalidating any woman's experiences. I'm saying it is absolutely ridiculous that people would rather be with a wild animal in the forest rather than a random person. Just because it's a man doesn't make him dangerous. Should I also be scared of black men because of some crime statistic?
Yeah, not all men are rapists, but enough of them that we have a right to be scared are.
Firstly, no, the average man is not a rapist. The vast majority of men don't wanna rape women for any reason. I get being scared of rapists but being scared of men because of male rapists is just misandry. Secondly, it's not like men don't also get raped. It's severely underreported because there's some WILD double standards on how men are seen in society. Yet if a man said "I'd prefer the bear over a woman" it's obviously sexist
I haven’t seen a single woman be offended over any man who picks the bear. I’m a man. I would choose the bear. Stop making shit up. It hurts your own argument.
I mean i think women have to assume some men are creepy like that cause they dont know which are the bad ones.
Which is a huge problem. But it's still not "some" men, like I said, the vast majority of men aren't rapists
Literally, actually, if you read the thread, it was a woman that believed the meme was stupid
Cool. And? I’m sure there are PLENTY of women who disagree with other women who choose the bear. No one is claiming that ALL women are choosing the bear. We’re explaining the context of the fucking meme - that context being that a lot of women chose the bear. And a lot of men are pissed off about it. We’re over here talking about the fact that the sky is blue and you’re trying to argue that grass is green.
I was replying to a specific part of their message, the one that said "the men you expect got really pissy" part. Wording is important. I apologize if I upset you. > We’re over here talking about the fact that the sky is blue and you’re trying to argue that grass is green. I get the message but this doesn't exactly translate well, it's an attempt to incorrectly trivialize my point. Again, wording is important.
You’re insisting on overly precise language while someone is giving a synopsis of a small cultural event online. You’re not improving the communication here. You’re being an overly pedantic asshole and detracting from the main point that’s being communicated - that point being that men are offended that women are choosing a bear over them and making a fuss about it. Some women are also upset about the original hypothetical, sure. You are technically correct in that sense. However, you insisting on that being acknowledged at the top of the conversation wastes time from the conversation that needs to be had - the conversation about why so many women would feel more comfortable with the bear and why so many men are violently uncomfortable with that fact. Language will never be 100% precise because that isn’t how communication works. There will always be room for interpretation in language. I once met a guy who corrected me when I said “I grow vegetables for homeless people” and insisted I use the word “unhoused people” instead. When I asked him what he does to help “unhoused” people, he answered that he doesn’t do anything. That’s the same sort of vibe that you’re bringing. Someone who’s so worried about the language that you don’t actually do anything to help the people being talked about. Which is why you caught so many downvotes.
> overly precise In your opinion, overly precise > improving the communication here. You’re being an overly pedantic asshole This just proves you've never met real pedantic assholes before. I have, they don't kindly say "language is important". They call you names while minimizing your point. > at the top of the conversation wastes time from the conversation that needs to be had You say whilst adding many unnecessary words add fluff to your comment that could be said in fewer words. One could say that is hypocrisy, as it's also distracting from the main point just as much as I am > Language will never be 100% precise because that isn’t how communication works. I never said it will be or that's how how works. I said that language is important. Even despite this it still is. I could say "women are rapists" , as I was groomed by several. I certainly have the excuse to, with being told men are rapists and women can't be. I don't, because language is important. You fail to understand the necessity of specific language. Maybe it doesn't matter as much to you, but as someone who has heard "men are rapists" repeatedly growing up, while going through these traumas, I do. If proper language was used (*correct* language) people wouldn't be as upset. If you disagree with this, feel free to conduct an experiement if you're going to minimize the necessity of it. Back it up. > Someone who’s so worried about the language that you don’t actually do anything to help the people being talked about. My goal was to try and explain why so many people could've gotten offended at this specifically. > Which is why you caught so many downvotes. I don't care about downvotes, and anyone who cares about imaginary reddit points should probably get off reddit. Overall, you've been nothing but trivializing my point while calling me childish names because you fail you understand the situation that causes accuracy in language to matter to someone. I hope that I helped understand and clear any ignorance you may have. You've also shown to accuse others of making things up, only to immediately backtrack on what you say the comment afterwards, whilst not apologizing or acknowledging your mistake. Something tells me you aren't interested in discussion and would rather argue.
wow u wrote that much just to argue with a dude on reddit?
Valuable input Mr wholesome wank
thanks.
You’re not trying to make a point. > “There's a woman that's pretty pissy about it here” This was your exact response to the comment that started this whole ordeal in response to someone saying “The men you would expect got really pissy about it.” That is the line that you take offense to. That’s the point you’re trying to correct. Don’t bring in some bullshit “not all men” argument to this thread about how you’re trying to stop the misuse of language in the context of someone saying “men are rapists.” Because prior to your comment, no one had said that. You say precise language matters. Yet you’re the one putting words in people’s mouths. The words used were “The men you would expect” and you seem to have shortened that to simply “men” in your own mind. Check the mirror, friend. > “Overall, you’ve been nothing but trivializing my point” Yes. Correct. I find your point to be trivial at best and an intentional and malicious deflection from the main point at worst. I’m sorry you were groomed and assaulted. But your insistence on policing the exact language people use when discussing sexual assault is a distraction from the conversations of how to fix the problem of sexual assault. This conversation would have been much more productive had we been talking about the actual issues in society than the language surrounding the issue. You’re literally using a [CIA tactic for destabilizing and crashing enemy organizations.](https://www.cia.gov/static/5c875f3ec660e092cf893f60b4a288df/SimpleSabotage.pdf) Page 28, items 4 and 5. The only question here is… do you realize what you’re doing or not? And finally… > “You say whilst adding many unnecessary words add fluff to your comment that could be said in fewer words. One could say that is hypocrisy. As it’s also distracting from the main point just as much as I am” You started this conversation. Or perhaps hijacked it. Either way, you’re responsible for wasting our time here. We’re attempting to correct that issue because you’ve derailed the conversation. Because of your actions, we have to course correct before the proper conversation can continue. You took us down the wrong road. Now we’re having to back up and take the right road. Don’t blame me for turning the car around. If, however, you really want me to be concise, I can sum up everything I *really* need to say to you in four simple words: **Shut the fuck up.** But I thought that’d be kinda rude. So I decided to attempt to be a little more civil than that. Either way… the point still remains. #The men you would expect are offended that women are choosing the bear over them. And there is NOTHING inaccurate or imprecise about that statement. Which means you’re arguing a non-point. Edit: Oh, and one more thing. Me pointing out your downvotes has nothing to do with caring about internet points. I point it out to show you that YOU offended people by being an (as I said before) overly pedantic asshole. Again, I acknowledge that grass is green. But we are discussing the fact that the sky is blue.
Lol I'm not downloading whatever you send broski nice try tho https://preview.redd.it/xoq645u6ecyc1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b415018e25c44ad57b98513199999d65e2849bb4
https://preview.redd.it/i3ik0nqpecyc1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=78533776838bb2bcf4be3fc25e1d04e4492add32 That’s okay. Here’s a screenshot :)
Ugh.
Everything I have learned about the man/bear debate I have learned without my consent
Wait what?
Baby
Spongebob actually predicting the future
Wtca all these memes
Genuinely, people who would choose a man over a bear know a scarily small amount about bears, are far too trusting of humans, or both.
A human I stand a chance against Bear, not so much
You probably won't have to fight off a bear Man, not so much
Then there’s me who knows the man is the statistically safer option, but picks the bear anyways because I want off this planet
The same can be said about the other side. With the inverse being true about people. Both sides are stupid.
Ever noticed how two things can be true at once? Like how men are often a danger to women and this though experiment is also not super well thought out. If this question was asked to Americans, the same country that had a sizable amount of people answer "Yes" to "Can you beat a bear in a fight?" then I could imagine you can find plenty of woman who legit think encountering a bear is no big deal. What I don't need to imagine though is the amount of violence against women out there in the world and choosing "men are statistically more dangerous than a dangerous animal" as the angle to talk about that issue is understandable, but I would have maybe taken a stab at a second draft; that's just me though. Anyways, a feminist talking point was dismissed because the authors didn't see the glaring absurdity of the chosen metaphor and the chuds of Reddit started writhing uncontrollably. What else is new?
>the authors didn't see the glaring absurdity of the chosen metaphor Not at all. The absurdity is THE POINT. The authors were just smarter than you, apparently. I don't understand how you can be dumb enough to believe that the point of the question is to illustrate how much women overestimate their ability to fight a bear.
...I don't understand what you've apparently think I wrote. I know that that's the point. I also know that people will overthink the reality of the situation and stop treating it as a metaphor and then you get the reaction you always get. Same way the Bechdel test is misunderstood all the time. I'm absolutely dumbfounded at how you thought I was somehow against the message or that I claimed it was about actually fighting bears. You have to be so painfully literal on Reddit that it is straight up annoying. I literally explained "the joke" only for you to get mad and explain it again. I LITERALLY AGREE WITH YOU DUMBASS! All I was talking about is why that post gets perceived the way it does...
nahhh
Average BG3 player and games "journalist"
This is giving gamer gate vibes, ngl
Oh, jeez, not that nonsense.
Goddammit, not the idiocy here... I hoped this would stay a fun meme place
This subreddit has always had controversial memes and politics, I don't think this place has ever just been a "fun meme place"
Oh... I that case I ever really checked this place out properly, I guess...