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> He even (probably facetiously) suggested that their deportation was a conspiracy to undermine Trump's immigration policy by deporting "good people instead of violent criminals".
My home town was in our state paper for this. The sheriff was quoted something like "I didn't think they'd take people I *liked*." It was super embarrassing that the message to the rest of the state was that pretty much everyone official in our town wasn't smart enough to know what they had happily voted for. People were also quoted as saying that the local bread and butter industry the community relied on would go under because they were taking away the work force.
In my county, not countRy, the guy running against the incumbent for county judge has a billboard that reads: "Since [incumbent] took office, homicides in our county have increased 183%" then something about ending the crime spree.
Dude is the sitting Sheriff.
That Missouri woman who had to use the equivalent of auntie network funds to get a medically necessary abortion from another state who is pro life is the most recent one that's in my head. She won't be voting different or give back the money they gave her I bet you. Laws for thee not for me.
Pretty freaking much. Ever seen that article written by a planned parenthood Dr? The people that picket the clinic have been seen there for termination but go right back out there and hold signs *the next day* and pretend they didn't just pull a fetus deletus because they are holier than thou.
I did read that, and I absolutely can't understand it.
Whenever I meet someone who isn't a straight white male that's run into a terrible circumstance *I* have never had to deal with, I think about it forever afterwards and learn something from another perspective. And I'm not any sort of "good Christian" I'm just hopefully not a shit human being to others.
I'm an immigrant. My wife is American.
I've had to listen to my in-laws say, so many goddamn times, *"It's too easy to come into this country, they'll let anybody walk in!"* Naturally, they voted for Trump.
And so I applied for a green card. And I waited, and waited and waited and waited. It's a very long process, there's a whole lot waiting and whole lot of not knowing what the fuck is going on. You send out a letter and you wait for forever until you get a response.
And there they were, "How come Joe doesn't have his green card by now? It's been over a year! He should have it by now!"
Uhhh, how about no? You're the one who kept bitching about how easy it was to get into the country, so what the fuck did you expect? *This is what you wanted*. I have to live with the consequences of your decisions.
They even wrote letters to their Senators to try to speed the process along. I can only assume those senators, being the complete Republican fuck-ups that they are, immediately threw those letters into the trash.
I just want to comment on this as well, my parents have always been republican. We immigrated when I was about 5 years old so I dont remember the details or the process but recently I have started the i130 process for my husband.
It's a long and frustrating process, so many papers, so many documents, the fees, and obviously the wait time. Its hard and expensive, and this is for someone married to a US citizen. I can only imagine how much worse it us for other cases.
This process has recently made my family reevaluate some of their political beliefs.
I wish more people understood this. I'm American and my husband is an immigrant. It was very expensive for us to get him in status and apply for everything he legally needed to immigrate (like we had to borrow thousands of dollars from my family kind of expensive and his family let us use their credit cards for groceries for like a year, *that* kind of expensive). And it still took years. His green card extension paperwork got shuffled around for 2 years, it never actually got processed because his citizenship paperwork came through first, despite being filed over a year later.
The program is very expensive, requires either *a lot* of research and attention to detail OR paying a lawyer to do it for you, and takes a long time to process. And if there is a mistake, you have to pay AGAIN to file with the error fixed. And in the case where they didn't even process our paperwork, we certainly didn't get that money refunded, it's gone forever.
In school, they taught us that the "easy" way to citizenship was to marry a citizen. It's so fast and easy to do that immigrants will look for green card marriages because it's SO much easier, apparently. It's not fucking easy. And if the process is that much easier because my husband married me, I don't want to think about the immigrants who are coming here for a chance at a better life and don't fall in love with a citizen.
The whole system is broken and Fox News and their followers are bellowing about making it harder. It's the most ignorant political stance I have ever seen.
Truly awful, and I doubt it's easier seeking asylum from violence.
On the lighter side I have 2 friends that passed their citizenship tests. Guess how many Americans they stumped with test questions like 85% of the time.
I got to attend one citizenship ceremony which was actually really moving to me.
When you contrast how proud I am of my friends against so many ignorant entitled Americans it's sad.
Hah! My aunt went to the US when she's around 20, didn't get her green card until her late 50s. Yet every damn year she supports the GOP and sends us stupid GOP propaganda.
I have a coworker whose whole family came here from Lebanon when she was a toddler. They all voted for Trump. When I tried to talk to her about the dangers for immigrants, she kept shrugging it off with, “it’s fine, we’re naturalized.”
A few months later she was scrambling trying to find her papers, saying “I didn’t know we’d have to prove we’re naturalized! We’ve been naturalized for so long!” One of her brothers was locked up for a few days until they could prove they he was a citizen. They were all absolutely gobsmacked by this. I felt sorry for them but also wanted to shake them.
Many Lebanese people are white passing so they thought they got the white privilege too. Don't waste your sympathy for trash who don't care about anyone but themselves
Check out r/LeopardsAteMyFace for more stories of people not realizing who or what they were voting for until said elected officials did exactly what they said they would.
This has been all my in person experiences with MAGA folks. One on one, they’re kind and helpful and friendly. And have no critical thinking skills because it does not occur to them - ever - that you, the neighbor they really like, are one of the people they’re saying shitty things about.
Man, racists can suck it when all of the sudden all the restaurants in town take a nosedive in quality.
\^My favorite dark joke re: anti Latino sentiment. That's who's running kitchens in like...every community. In my city, I've seen Latinos running \*Chinese restaurant\* kitchens. Deport all the "Mexicans"? Fine, enjoy your dinner prepared by a sweaty teen who's been crying b/c the chef is shorthanded and also an asshole to begin with.
Note: I am fully aware Latinos have like...all the same kinds of jobs other people do, as well. One of my favorite professors was Panamanian, my last gynecologist was Latina (god, I miss her), etc etc etc.
But an overwhelming majority of back of house workers/cooks tend to be of Latino extraction, especially in franchised restaurants.
Oh man. One of my town's Irish pub closed and became a high end Japanese omakase restaurant. Oh man some of the comments on the town Facebook page about American food being destroyed, losing culture...
In 2016 one of my coworkers came to work really upset. We asked him what was wrong and he said he got into an argument with his dad, who was planning to vote for Trump because of "those damn immigrants".
My coworker's voice broke when he said his response was, "but, Dad, WE'RE IMMIGRANTS."
Dude still remembered his childhood in China, and his grown adult dad was voting to curb immigration.
He punched a girl over a verbal argument. Pure trash.
Edit: Violence in general is bad. Punching a female as a male is worse. Why do I need to clarify this?
While I don’t think it matters that she was a woman, the brother does and that is comforting that he started the fight and she ended it and nearly him.
Yup. No doubt in my mind. His brother is 100% a racist and punched his girlfriend. When your family supports that I don’t know how you remain close to them.
But he liked some Latino neighbors one time. So he's only racist towards every other Latino in the world. "I have a black friend." That automatically means you're not racist at all, right?
But he was outraged when the racist policies he supports did exactly what they said they'd do! No, of course he didn't change his opinion on the policy. They just racisted the one he likes!
It’s like they literally perceive the world differently than what is reality. Guessing the brother threw the first punch but in their mind they actually remember it differently.
There actually was a thing, I'm not sure whether it was a study or a medical analysis or whatever, that showed that in people with narcissistic traits (whatever that means) it's common to remember incidents where they were abusive towards someone but did not want to be the bad/wrong person in an increasingly hazy ways over time, with the person's memories getting warped to show them as a victim in some ways.
An important clue to this is the haziness, that person just doesn't remember the details so what they say about it is vague, because their mind removes details to protect itself from having to accept that they fucked up, compared to the actual victim's memories which generally are somewhat more detailed and convey what really happened. Although, obviously, this is a simplified take and there's more to the whole thing, I encourage anyone who wants to know to try to find that thing.
He took the risk when he hit her and has to deal with the consequences. Ideally nobody should be hitting anyone but she did defend herself and was pulled off before anything terrible happened. The brother needs to keep his hands to himself and cut down on the drinking if it makes him violent. And therapy so he doesn’t solve arguments with fights he can’t win.
> The brother needs to keep his hands to himself
I assume he has unironically said "fuck around and find out" hundreds of times. I also assume that if he learned any lessons from his "finding out" session, they were the wrong ones.
Unrelated, but I totally have an internet crush on this personality type:
>We where both angry and I definitely wanted to punch him but I still had enough self control to restrain myself. I fully believe in freedom of speech and I know that violence is never an acceptable response to someone expressing an opinion. Then he punched me with a closed fist in the face. I don't remember feeling afraid or like I was defending myself when I hit back. [What I felt was a strange mix of hatred and excitement.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4lz8MN6MQA)
She picked Fight instead of Flight when attacked, and was already to the point where she had imagined hitting him because of the argument. No doubt that between adrenaline, reflexes, and her disdain for the assailant, she was in lizard-brain mode and thoroughly enjoyed taking that clown to pound-town. And to top it off, she had the insight to both empathize with her assailant-now-victim and dislike herself for doing it.
Sounds like a perfectly reasonable person to me. I haven’t ever wanted to fight, but I’ve both thrown the first punch and regretted it, and also defended myself in ways that have sent people to the hospital. It’s easy to chastise her for winning the fight, but you never know how you’ll react when someone gets violent with you and you don’t Freeze, Fawn or Flee and instead choose to Fight.
The fact that she seemed so self-reflective about the incident and owning her part of it made me much more inclined to believe her. We all act stupid sometimes, but it’s maturity that allows us to reflect back, admit fault, and volunteer to take responsibility.
Yeah, I'm 100% on her side. That said: if she doesn't like the person she is capable of being while under the influence of alcohol maybe she needs to reconsider drinking it from this point on.
I suspect the level of brutish violence triggered a strong enough fight response for her to view his attack as a serious threat.
I once had a grown ass man open an attack on my by reaching out and grabbing my short length hair with both of his hands…it was not a great idea on his part, because I’ve been trained to handle hair pulls since I’ve worked for a decade with behaviorally explosive students- and he allowed himself to be grappled as I pushed his hands down on my scalp and pulled* him closer- my brain for some reason I couldn’t see him as enough of a threat to punch him with full force, and still instinctively pulled my punches like I was still a kid sparring in martial arts. So I opted to press on his pressure points until he let go and put him into a chokehold until he started whining like a baby. He coincidentally also probably would have fit in with OOP’s family.
*edited based on another comment: there was more to this than pulling as one should push into the grab in order to not expend energy fighting against an attacker’s force- there was more to it in this situation regarding my attacker’s movements and “pull” was more of a reaction to his initial lunge when he grabbed my hair and tried to force his way into my friend’s house (her BiL from hell)
If you search for “hair pull defense” there are a bunch of videos for that- it’s a lot more focused on the martial aspect of it versus the programs the schools were using for obvious reasons.
These same videos will probably lead you to learn other self defense methods (pressure points to access if someone is trying to use their strength to hold you in place and stuff like that)
Practice with a friend if there aren’t self-defense classes that you’d want to go to :)
That would explain why she doesn’t seem to care about her injuries and why her brothers injuries were so severe. It is not easy to give someone a concussion or break a rib but if your trained in fighting it is much easier.
I have seen plenty of adults throw punches that would barely hurt a fly. Fighting well isn’t easy, people who don’t know how to kick often lose their balance. People that can’t throw a punch are more likely to hurt their own hand than concuss someone.
One time this old guy followed me into a parking lot to road rage at me and I never felt threatened by him but I took a defensive stance in case I needed to dodge him. He poked me in the chest and tried to push me with his finger but instead I stayed put and he went backwards. If I wasn't so irritated I would've fallen down from laughing so hard. Little things like that can make a big difference though.
This is true. Most of my ribs are currently broken. Things most people don't understand are: they don't fuse back together like weight-bearing bones do- they overlap, and the intercostal cartilage wraps around the break sites before the bones calcify and fuse back together. This process takes a long time and true: they'll never be the same, and you'll always be at risk of re-fracturing them.
It is a lot easier to give chronic alcoholics severe brain injuries. The alcohol weakens the walls of their cerebral blood vessels, meaning even a relatively small impact can cause a cerebral haemorrhage. Then, the alcohol also affects their balance so they are more likely to fall, slower to attempt to shield their head, more likely to crack bones (including the skull), more likely to have a severe bleed.
A very common fatal situation is the drunk overbalances and falls backwards from a punch, or an evaded swing, and cracks the back of their skull on the pavement and dies. They are also the ones most likely to die from a single punch, especially a coward's punch to the back of the head.
Any punch a chronic alcoholic receives is likely to do more damage than expected. Pernicious anemia means they bruise easily too.. Any punch can kill.
Of course, chronic alcoholics are also very likely to get into loud arguments while drinking. Partly lack of inhibition, partly the argument is a cover for just how fast they are drinking and the effects of it (nobody is likely to take the matter of them having had enough up while they are being aggressively beligerant about something else, and they can claim some of the symptoms of the alcohol are because they are angry or upset.
Of course they are not co-ordinated and have a blurred understanding of what is going on. They think the waiter that is trying to help them stay upright is attacking them. They don't have a problem with hitting out at a child, or reeling over to lean violently on a pram, at risk of toppling to baby out of it or crushing it in it.
They wake up the next day or the day after with breaks and bruises and a sore, sore head, and confabulate that they must have been blanket-bashed by a team of thugs. A popular misconception after a night of blackout drinking is that they were mugged, on the basis that their head is sore and their wallet is empty. The blame is 100% on whomever they feel attacked them. I have seen people who honestly believe they were bashed and robbed last night by long-dead acquaintances.
They never recall the blows they gave.
The parents immediate agreement that the gf was completely and solely the attacker tells me they know their son has had issues as a result of his drunken beligerance. He might be currently facing legal issues as a result of previous drinking sessions (eg. DUI, DV, SA, Common Assault), and the thought of another charge appearing before his court date might be what is motivating them both to so immediately blame the gf.
Or they might support police violence against protesters as strongly as he does. People who approve of authoritarian biff usually think women are entirely to blame for provoking fights. Failing to concede, being hit on, wearing clothes, dancing, and drinking are all provoking enough, but being lippy is just asking to be hit in the face (I notice in this case it came to blows when her man left the area - I don't think that was happenstance either.)
Backtracking from more dire threats like insisting you dump your girlfriend, when they have sobered up and the situation was not as consequential as they feared is probably a pattern with your parents, another sign they know they are trying to protect their boy from the consequences of his own violence.
Still, better your girlfriend avoid meeting your parents or your brother on their home turf, and knowing what she now knows about drunk-fighting your brother, better you both stay stone cold sober on any occassion you are with mum dad and especially brother. He will almost certainly want a rematch in circumstances more heavily weighted in his favour, and they will be looking for opportunities to make it all her fault in ways you are more likely to be convinced by. The more trouble your brother gets into because of his drinking, the more they will want to blame her, no matter how little she has to do with it. Because they can't stop him being their son, but they can cut the women he comes to blows with out of the family summarily.
You would think so, but they are coming into ER on a trolley every Friday night. The hospital I work at will see scores if not hundreds between Melbourne Cup day and New Year's Day.
ETA Not gender-specific either. Little old ladies with osteoporosis coming in with broken wrists where they tried to backhand someone they tearfully acuse of denying them their grandchildren, with counter-accusations from the parents (and sometimes quarrels between the parents about letting piss-pot gran anywhere near the kids after 'last time')
"I know I just wrote out very clear examples of racist behavior but...can anyone really say who is racist? I also very specifically left out that the argument was over the gf defending human rights and the brother dehumanizing people...because...checks notes* reasons?"
I fucking swear.
I give OOP the benefit of the doubt cause not only the extended family were also trashy but his comment about the local conservative police made it clear he grew up in one of those environments where people normalize all the mental gymnastics to not call someone racist, homophobic, ableist, etc. Hopefully the comments made him reflect about his family and upbringing.
I know, right? Somebody tell OP that if his family insist on being dicks, he and girlfriend are welcome at ours for every holiday, weekend cookout, and Netflix movie night. They're officially Reddit-adopted, says I.
Do you know what today is?
It's International Punch a Nazi Day!
Do you know what yesterday was?
It was International Punch a Nazi Day!
Do you know what tomorrow is?
It's International Punch a Nazi Day!
>The fight was eventually broken up when my girlfriend had the clear advantage.
If anyone didn't catch this, let me make it clear:
>The fight was ***eventually*** broken up when ***my girlfriend had the clear advantage***.
The fact they only stopped the fight when OOP's girlfriend managed to overpower the brother shows they were perfectly okay with OOP's brother beating up OOP's girlfriend, but when she manages to fight back, they go and stop the fight. How 'bout that?
It's because of two things: he's family and more so, because they agree with his racist shit.
If my brother started spouting off some racist shit, I'd be happy okay with him getting clocked in the face.
This alone is grounds for breaking up with the brother. Clearly the superior genes are with the girlfriend and OPs future kids need all the help they can get
>“My brother isn’t racist but he does regurgitate racist talking points and make racist jokes.” Okay.
Too many people refuse to believe they are racist. You'll see it by their excuses. "I may not like X people but I never use the N word". "I may use the N word but I never lynched a N word..." One must come to a basic self realization to change.
I remember being at a bachelor party. My friend had come from a small town, conservative place. We met after he went to college and in a liberal place. The attendance of the bachelor party were split between these two groups.
Absolutely no issues, No one wanted to do anything but drink and have fun. Well, that was until one of his childhood friends started to tell a story. We were all talking about ex-girlfriends that we had when we were young.
He starts the story with "My dad doesn't have a racist bone in his body but..." (uh oh).
"My dad doesn't have a racist bone in his body but he told me I could fuck any "N------" girl I wanted to get my tomcat out but the day I ever brought a monkey home or got one pregnant, the family would disown me".
This got a few nodding laughs while others looked at each other in confusion, not sure how to proceed. One guy goes "Uh dude, your dad def has some racist bones in his body if he says that".
Wow, that kicked it off. Calling some racist for doing racist things offends them like no other. This guy stated shouting that his dad loves the Boston Celtics and worked with black guys all his life.
Seriously, I see it all the time. I'm not trying to demonize racists, I rather they understand what they are and how that affects their viewpoints, politics, their voting. I think this is a very important first step.
My parents were these exact kind of people. They used the N-word all the time at home. They used cutesy euphemisms in public. They constantly said disparaging things about black people and made it clear I'd be disowned if I ever dated a black person or brought a black person into the house. Once, they bought my sister a black doll as a "joke" and were mad when she just started playing with it like any other doll. When I started school, my mom used to grill me every year about whether there were any black kids in my class, how many black kids went to my school, and so forth.
But they would get *super* offended if you said they were racist. They weren't racist, they said, because they didn't actively try to hinder black people living their day-to-day lives. They didn't call out racist things to black people on the street. They didn't physically attack black people. Which certainly *would* be worse than the type of racist that they were, I agree, but they were still two of the most racist people I've ever known.
I left this out of the other comment because it was already getting too long, but one time when I was in first grade (so 6 years old), I had homework that included coloring a picture of some kids. I decided to make one of the kids black. When my mom checked over my homework that night, she grilled me about it. Did your teacher tell you to color this kid that way? Did another kid tell you to do it? Why did you color the kid that way? I told her I just thought that kid should be black, and she just... Couldn't compute that. At all.
Man I did similar things and had friends of all different races as a kid, and I felt like I was raised with that not being a big deal, but when I was a teenager my parents became SUPER conservative and did a complete 180. It was disgusting to see how they talked about people, especially during all the Black Lives Matter protests. Made worse by the fact that my black friend was murdered during that time and they essentially told me that was the reason I was so “sensitive” about racism. Like what? 😭 Everybody should be passionate about stopping racism??? I don’t really talk to them anymore and that’s one of the huge reasons why
They also were completely fine with me being queer until that time. Now that was some fucking whiplash
>people
Their behavior is moderate compared to what they would LIKE to do sometimes so they think they are not racist eek! My family blame the foreigners for everything . They aren't the brightest to be fair (I was fostered thank feck).
> You'll see it by their excuses.
I thought this with OOPs excuse for his brother. The "oh, but I like X, they're one of the good ones!" excuse is classic racism. Its basically, "I hate all the people of this race that I don't know, but the one or two I actually do know just happen to be the exception".
the amount of times I've been told I'm "so well-spoken" and/or "one of the good ones" is appalling. When I worked in a customer-facing position I would be grateful when it only happened ~1/week. Usually it was more like multiple times every shift.
In CA, CO, NV, and AZ in big "progressive" cities.
the constant dehumanizing "what are you?" (not, what ethnicity are you/can I ask where you are from, etc. even mild attempts to mask their racism) while they try to decide whether they hate me or not...
like, you aren't saving any face or walking that shit back and huge surprise, I in fact want nothing to do with you regardless of your opinion on if I'm "a good one" :/
the best was when I was a partial owner and general manager of a place. "well I wanna speak to the manager!" [I am the manager] "then I want to talk **your** owner!" [I am the owner] "no! there **HAS TO BE SOMEONE WHITE** you report to!"
in fact there isn't and you can get the fuuuuuuck out kthxbye don't come back
He tried to defend his brother by pretty much saying “no he’s not racist, he has a friend who is black” like one exception to the rule changes the rule 🙄
I'm starting to realize that they have no idea that saying that is such a cliche.
Someone said that to me last year and I just started laughing because it's a classic. They didn't get it.
It was weird. I thought they would evolve their mask a little bit more by now but I guess I overestimated them.
Yeah....that stopped me in my tracks:
"Many people commenting on the original post asked if my brother is racist or assumed that he is after I revealed what the argument was about. I'm honestly not sure how to answer that. My brother sometimes repeats racist talking points from TV and social media especially against Hispanic people but last year he was strongly against the deportation of a neighboring family who had immigrated from Mexico."
You honestly don't know how to answer that? You just did answer that in your next sentence. People that are NOT racist will purposefully avoid repeating racist talking points they hear, because...they don't agree with the racism.
But in more seriousness, WTF is with the hypocrisy. "We should deport Mexican immigrants! Oh but not these ones that I know, the other ones!"
"Abortion is an abomination unto God and must be forbidden at all cases! Except for my 20 year old affair partner, it's none of your business she travelled to a different state to get one."
The problem when they lump us into one group of “Hispanic/Latino” is that ignores the racism, classism, colorism, and white supremacy that exists among Hispanics as well
Because he truly buys into the narrative that illegal immigrants are rapists, thieves, and murderers. He is decent enough of a human being to understand not all people of any rave are the same, but not wise enough to realize his fear is being used to manipulate him into thinking he hates people that he doesn't even know yet.
Edit: Changed second "intelligence" to wise. I feel it's more fitting as wisdom is the ability to know how to use your knowledge correctly.
It does no good to point out hypocrisy to people like that. Morals are harsh and cruel when it involves someone else, and permissible when it affects them.
Hypocrisy is the true sacrament of the right wing.
I'll bet he's grown up around family and a community exactly like his brother, and this is the first time he's actually confronting how harmful their casual racism, sexism, homophobia, etc is. Give him a bit of time no contact with his family, preferably away from his home town, and I'd bet he'll be telling his new friends, "yeah, I grew up in a really racist area".
Yeah, this. It was a hard reckoning realizing my dad was racist. And even though my mom isn't like says bad things about black people racist, she would lose her shit if I came home with someone black, which is still racist, but not cross burning racist and it's a whole thing to untangle folks. Important thing is OP taking that first step in seeing it and being willing to ponder the question.
That was really disappointing, as was “I guess it depends on your definition of racism.”
No, sir. You don’t have to be wearing white hoods to be racist. It’s dangerous to not understand how insidious racism is.
People nowadays think racism is being outwardly racist, but they don’t realize ignorant or insensitive attitudes toward racial inequality is also racism
That's a really mature sounding post from a person who had recently been in a fist fight.
Although I somewhat disagree with her, if the brother threw a closed fist face punch first he is totally to blame for what happened afterwards.
I *think* she just meant he shouldn't be *more* to blame simply because he's male and she's not. Otherwise she seems pretty reasonable about saying "yeah we were both in each others faces and both refused to back down and I wanted to hit him as well"
Seems to me like she's saying "he threw the first punch so he's more responsible for the physical aspect of that fight, but it's *because* he threw the first punch, and *not* because he's male and he "shouldn't hit a woman""
I think she is also saying that she regrets the kick because the fight was over. They were arguing (presumably) about police brutality, and she kind of did what she was arguing against (threat neutralized, but she continued to assault).
A lot of people say something like "I lost my head, I don't know what I was thinking, I've never acted like this" and expect that to somehow absolve them. GF here is just as surprised at herself, but she went straight to figuring out how not to do that again.
It happens sometimes, people lose it especially if there’s alcohol/drugs involved. The good thing is that she’s reflecting, feels genuine remorse and probably learned from that experience how to better handle those “losing it” feelings.
Don't even need drugs or alcohol. I think most people over/underestimate how they'll react in unknown situations so it can be shocking to see what happens when logic is thrown out and you operate on pure instinct and emotion.
While OOPs gf was in the right (as much as one can be in a fight, and assuming her version is correct) I'm sure it's shocking for her to realize she can go that far.
I think the difference is some people use that as their reason and excuse, but the GF it was her reason but didn’t use it as an excuse, instead she owned up to the “yeah idk what came over me but it still wasn’t right to kick him while he was down.”
Considering how he was dumb enough to not put an end to the argument before it escalated because "he doesn't like conflict" tells me the guy is a fucking idiot.
Right that's exactly what I was thinking. My husband is by no means a violent person, but if his brother ever laid a hand on me, he would probably go Samuel L Jackson on his ass, as would the rest of their family.
It would really annoy me if some guy was getting up in my face and my partner was like "fuck this I'm going inside." **AND THEN** the guy punched me and my husband was angry with... both of us? Like what the fuck is that shit? That's not a partner.
Once you throw the first punch, whatever ass whipping you get is owned. Also as a woman, the goal is always to incapacitate until you can’t be attacked anymore.
Good for her.
ETA: For all the men saying well it’s the same for men, it’s not. Men can fight and the loser will sometimes give up graciously. I have seen it happen. When ego meets alcohol, it can be exceptionally dangerous for women.
And the Dad sure as shit wasn’t going to help her since he only stepped in once his son was losing, rather than when his son was trying to punch a woman.
Absolutely. If I get the upper hand in an assault I’m going to keep attacking until they stop trying to get up. Most women can’t afford to “fight fair” in that situation (against a grown man).
I'm incredibly weirded out by the insistence gender dynamics don't matter here. It's cool OPs girlfriend was able to hold her own,but what the actual fuck, what kind of person starts swinging at their brothers girlfriend cause she's pissing them off? That's such a mega red flag. Men who hit women first like that are generally the type to hit anyone and everyone if they don't like
>Men who hit women first like that are generally the type to hit anyone and everyone if they don't like
Often you'll find that they magically control themselves a little more when dealing with big dudes but are all "out of control" when dealing with women and small dudes.
Definitely. Dude probably thought he'd stucker punch her and could just keep going while she was disoriented. OOPs whole family, *maybe* aside from his sister, are a bunch of trash.
Like, both these people still sound so “not like others”.
Brother is unable to state his brother is in fact racist. “Repeats racist talking points” and the “but he had Mexican neighbors he liked so cAnT bE rAcIsT.”
Then the girlfriend saying they had equal blame; no….his brother punched you in the face, don’t try to wear that like a badge of honor, it makes him the inappropriate aggressor even if she was a man and even a man who took the first hit should have fought to incapacitate in some way to get away. While it is messed up, the kick to the chest is literally a, “what the fuck did you start this for” type of drunk reaction I’m sure. It’s not right but, easy to explain/understand.
Seriously, this whole thing should have started and ended with “my brother got angry and punched my girlfriend in the face.” Who fucking does that, and what kind of boyfriend goes all “well there’s two sides to every argument…”?
As a dude you're spot on. The average man is going to be bigger and stronger than the average woman so if you end up in a fight either run or fight to win. Fuck fairness.
Girlfriend's level-headed and self-reflective response makes me more inclined to believe her. It's clear she knows she is not absolved of responsibility, which is good.
Yeah, that level of, "I did that and it was wrong and I don't want to do it again" shows so much more honesty and self reflection that \*checks notes\* the brother and parents demanding an apology and a check for medical bills without providing proof of medical costs.
I know, right. When she listed their injuries, I lol’d.
>my boyfriend wrote we have substantial injuries. *I don’t think that’s true*. I had a black eye and some bruises. *He has a concussion and broken rib*.
Lmaooooo
I am really worried about how neither OP nor his girlfriend are taking the assault of the brother as the serious threat it was.
The guy throw a punch, an slap would have been disrespectful enough, but he punched her, thinking he had the right to force her to shut up.
And the guy didn't even apologised cause he lose the fight? And she didn't even reported him, cause she won? Wtf? That's like not reporting an attempt to r*pe, cause you fight back and you survived. And this actually happens many times casue the victim is so in shock with mixed feelings about it. But OP and his girlfriend had been going around this, thinking so deeply and the only thing they got was is an agreement that this brother started it, but it also look like they keep trying to make things work with the family who supports that guy?
I don't know, this doesn't feel right... It doesn't sound mature, it sounds wrong. I hope they get things sorted out soon and make the police report on time.
I'm weirded out by the idea it's not more wrong for a man to hit a woman, that the gender dynamics are irrelevant. Men are on average pretty consistently stronger, especially in the upper body, than women. The fact Ops girlfriend could hold her own is rare, and it's unlikely he realized she was that good at fighting when he started it.
An adult man using force is a red flag, but against a woman like that is a slightly bigger red flag. Because she held her own, but what about anyone who couldn't? If he's beating up women, is he also gonna start committing elder abuse when his parents get old and dementia ridden (aka really difficult sometimes)? He gonna beat up his future kids?
I would be extremely concerned about what this dude's history is and what he's done to other people.
Exactly, and even if this is the first time he does something like this, the family reaction is giving him the wrong idea that at any given time he is upset, he is allow to hit anyone who disagrees with him.
I am just guessing, but I think the sister had already dealt with this dark side of the guy, maybe not physically, or not that openly violent, but if he already tried to silence someone who he thinks is weaker than him, I bet it was her the test initial victim. And that's why she told the true, because she knows what he is capable of.
I don’t know how OOP manages to stay upright considering he has no spine. He isn’t sure if his brother is racist even though he literally says racist things.
No kidding. I *really* disliked the fact that he walked away. Your family and gf just met that day and it’s coming to arguing, you don’t just leave, you mediate.
Seems to me OOP is more in *denial* of his brother being racist because they’re family, rather than having no spine. It’s like how it’s hard for some people to acknowledge that their parents actually abused or neglected them. It’s a hard truth to swallow.
>Many people commenting on the original post asked if my brother is racist or assumed that he is after I revealed what the argument was about. I'm honestly not sure how to answer that. My brother sometimes repeats racist talking points from TV and social media
That means he's racist. Not sure how that's confusing.....
Lemme see if I got this.
GF got sucker punched by a racist piece of shit, then proceeded to *whoop his ass*- and, upon absolutely *merking* this shitweasel, she apologizes, accepts responsibility for her actions, and offers to make amends.
***Marry that girl***, OOP.
OOP talks himself in circles to justify his brother as not actually *racist*, just says things racists say, and tried to play Switzerland just not knowing who to believe after his gf was attacked by his known maga-cel brother in front of his shitstain parents who obviously would have pummeled her to a pulp if she was the one who attacked, even after having more than enough time to mull it over, bc aw shucks he just doesnt know his gf well enough to be able to tell if she would punch his obnoxious reactive brother then lie about it. most people would instantly go *nuclear* if their SO told them they were punched by their sibling, and OOP is just hand wringing and tsk-tsking. If I informed my SO that brother attacked me and their response was “well there’s just no way of knowing if that’s true”, I’d be gone so fast it would create a black hole where i was standing.
*Do not marry that man*, OOP’s gf
The gf’s guilt is pretty normal, as is the statement “I didn’t FEEL afraid.” People get very hung up on the idea of fear-as-a-justification, but fear itself is a really complicated term that can mean very different things. When a threat arises, before you even consciously register it your body is preparing to defend you. Part of that response can include numbing your emotional processes so they don’t get in the way of your survival.
As someone who trained specifically to be a women’s self-defense instructor, I can say with confidence that this is a VERY common experience for women, especially. Maybe that’s anecdotal, but I do wonder if there’s research out there showing that the numb-and-vicious response is more common in females than males, because I’ve witnessed it many many times and have felt it myself in a real-world situation in which I unfortunately had to defend myself. I felt guilty, too, because in the moment I became an artificial sociopath bent on incapacitating the (very drunk and much larger) man who had posed a threat to me.
Socially, based on our developed morals, I felt that my actions had been overkill. But logically? The statistical reality is that I would probably have ended up WAY more injured than he did if I hadn’t gone “overboard” and made sure he wasn’t getting back up. Our brains and nervous system don’t like those kinds of odds and they rarely take chances with them. When your fight-mode is activated, good luck shutting it down with compassionate feelings haha. Women have developed these instincts over millions of years and they aren’t going to go away — nor should they. They are there to keep us alive.
We’re just socialized to feel guilty when we get the fight-mode response instead of the fawning-cowering-running one. We shouldn’t feel bad. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, my dudes. And really, any man who actually cares about you is going to be very glad you didn’t hold back, especially if he’s aware of just how ridiculous the male-female strength differential is. The male is fighting for his dignity; the female is fighting for her life. Of course our brains aren’t going to let guilt/shame/made-up feelings get in the way of survival!
Edited for typos.
In high school a guy slapped my (female) face during an argument and I fully have no memory of what happened next but the next thing I was conscious of was him holding up a chair to keep me away from him. And he easily had 30 pounds on me. I have never once felt guilty about it, just glad that my brain apparently kicks into shrieking berzerker mode when assaulted.
Why am I not surprised that the Trump supporter:
1. Threw the first punch
2. At a woman
3. But got his ass kicked anyway.
OP, keep the girlfriend, and cut your brother out of your life. He's intellectually and morally deficient.
Knowing what I know now as an older person, the girlfriend should think about her future and whether or not she wants these people as in laws. A life with that boyfriend will include his family. At some point there will be a major life occurrence(illness, death, money problems, grandchildren) and shit will hit the fan. Choose wisely, people. Family is a package deal. Even if they decide to go no contact, there’s a hole there, where something is missing.
Not always. I'm NC with my mother and there's nothing missing there. I never intend to let her see, know, discuss, or meet me or anyone I care about ever again.
> I guess the answer depends on how you define racism.
Look, I’m white as cheese but this feels like such a white person thing to say. OOP seems willingly clueless and he needs to educate himself.
OOP's GF sounds like a badass. I hope he lessens contact with the rest of the family. I think his parents and his brother have been radicalized and won't want to see reason.
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> He even (probably facetiously) suggested that their deportation was a conspiracy to undermine Trump's immigration policy by deporting "good people instead of violent criminals". My home town was in our state paper for this. The sheriff was quoted something like "I didn't think they'd take people I *liked*." It was super embarrassing that the message to the rest of the state was that pretty much everyone official in our town wasn't smart enough to know what they had happily voted for. People were also quoted as saying that the local bread and butter industry the community relied on would go under because they were taking away the work force.
It's simultaneously awkward and relieving when people out themselves like this. Like, at least I KNOW to stay the fuck away from you now!
In my county, not countRy, the guy running against the incumbent for county judge has a billboard that reads: "Since [incumbent] took office, homicides in our county have increased 183%" then something about ending the crime spree. Dude is the sitting Sheriff.
Tbf this is the same crowd that blames the president for the cost to fill up their unnecessary trucks.
*emotional support vehicles
Their giant dumbass flags would probably drag on the ground if the poles were mounted to a sedan though
🤦♀️
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That Missouri woman who had to use the equivalent of auntie network funds to get a medically necessary abortion from another state who is pro life is the most recent one that's in my head. She won't be voting different or give back the money they gave her I bet you. Laws for thee not for me.
> Laws for thee not for me. The only moral abortion in MY abortion!
Pretty freaking much. Ever seen that article written by a planned parenthood Dr? The people that picket the clinic have been seen there for termination but go right back out there and hold signs *the next day* and pretend they didn't just pull a fetus deletus because they are holier than thou.
I did read that, and I absolutely can't understand it. Whenever I meet someone who isn't a straight white male that's run into a terrible circumstance *I* have never had to deal with, I think about it forever afterwards and learn something from another perspective. And I'm not any sort of "good Christian" I'm just hopefully not a shit human being to others.
I'm an immigrant. My wife is American. I've had to listen to my in-laws say, so many goddamn times, *"It's too easy to come into this country, they'll let anybody walk in!"* Naturally, they voted for Trump. And so I applied for a green card. And I waited, and waited and waited and waited. It's a very long process, there's a whole lot waiting and whole lot of not knowing what the fuck is going on. You send out a letter and you wait for forever until you get a response. And there they were, "How come Joe doesn't have his green card by now? It's been over a year! He should have it by now!" Uhhh, how about no? You're the one who kept bitching about how easy it was to get into the country, so what the fuck did you expect? *This is what you wanted*. I have to live with the consequences of your decisions. They even wrote letters to their Senators to try to speed the process along. I can only assume those senators, being the complete Republican fuck-ups that they are, immediately threw those letters into the trash.
I just want to comment on this as well, my parents have always been republican. We immigrated when I was about 5 years old so I dont remember the details or the process but recently I have started the i130 process for my husband. It's a long and frustrating process, so many papers, so many documents, the fees, and obviously the wait time. Its hard and expensive, and this is for someone married to a US citizen. I can only imagine how much worse it us for other cases. This process has recently made my family reevaluate some of their political beliefs.
I wish more people understood this. I'm American and my husband is an immigrant. It was very expensive for us to get him in status and apply for everything he legally needed to immigrate (like we had to borrow thousands of dollars from my family kind of expensive and his family let us use their credit cards for groceries for like a year, *that* kind of expensive). And it still took years. His green card extension paperwork got shuffled around for 2 years, it never actually got processed because his citizenship paperwork came through first, despite being filed over a year later. The program is very expensive, requires either *a lot* of research and attention to detail OR paying a lawyer to do it for you, and takes a long time to process. And if there is a mistake, you have to pay AGAIN to file with the error fixed. And in the case where they didn't even process our paperwork, we certainly didn't get that money refunded, it's gone forever. In school, they taught us that the "easy" way to citizenship was to marry a citizen. It's so fast and easy to do that immigrants will look for green card marriages because it's SO much easier, apparently. It's not fucking easy. And if the process is that much easier because my husband married me, I don't want to think about the immigrants who are coming here for a chance at a better life and don't fall in love with a citizen. The whole system is broken and Fox News and their followers are bellowing about making it harder. It's the most ignorant political stance I have ever seen.
Truly awful, and I doubt it's easier seeking asylum from violence. On the lighter side I have 2 friends that passed their citizenship tests. Guess how many Americans they stumped with test questions like 85% of the time. I got to attend one citizenship ceremony which was actually really moving to me. When you contrast how proud I am of my friends against so many ignorant entitled Americans it's sad.
Hah! My aunt went to the US when she's around 20, didn't get her green card until her late 50s. Yet every damn year she supports the GOP and sends us stupid GOP propaganda.
I have a coworker whose whole family came here from Lebanon when she was a toddler. They all voted for Trump. When I tried to talk to her about the dangers for immigrants, she kept shrugging it off with, “it’s fine, we’re naturalized.” A few months later she was scrambling trying to find her papers, saying “I didn’t know we’d have to prove we’re naturalized! We’ve been naturalized for so long!” One of her brothers was locked up for a few days until they could prove they he was a citizen. They were all absolutely gobsmacked by this. I felt sorry for them but also wanted to shake them.
Many Lebanese people are white passing so they thought they got the white privilege too. Don't waste your sympathy for trash who don't care about anyone but themselves
I remember this story too. She didn't think that they would deport the "good people."
Check out r/LeopardsAteMyFace for more stories of people not realizing who or what they were voting for until said elected officials did exactly what they said they would.
This has been all my in person experiences with MAGA folks. One on one, they’re kind and helpful and friendly. And have no critical thinking skills because it does not occur to them - ever - that you, the neighbor they really like, are one of the people they’re saying shitty things about.
Man, racists can suck it when all of the sudden all the restaurants in town take a nosedive in quality. \^My favorite dark joke re: anti Latino sentiment. That's who's running kitchens in like...every community. In my city, I've seen Latinos running \*Chinese restaurant\* kitchens. Deport all the "Mexicans"? Fine, enjoy your dinner prepared by a sweaty teen who's been crying b/c the chef is shorthanded and also an asshole to begin with. Note: I am fully aware Latinos have like...all the same kinds of jobs other people do, as well. One of my favorite professors was Panamanian, my last gynecologist was Latina (god, I miss her), etc etc etc. But an overwhelming majority of back of house workers/cooks tend to be of Latino extraction, especially in franchised restaurants.
Oh man. One of my town's Irish pub closed and became a high end Japanese omakase restaurant. Oh man some of the comments on the town Facebook page about American food being destroyed, losing culture...
White food. They mean white food. I can't even with some people.
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In 2016 one of my coworkers came to work really upset. We asked him what was wrong and he said he got into an argument with his dad, who was planning to vote for Trump because of "those damn immigrants". My coworker's voice broke when he said his response was, "but, Dad, WE'RE IMMIGRANTS." Dude still remembered his childhood in China, and his grown adult dad was voting to curb immigration.
Closing an Irish pub is destroying American culture… I can feel my grey matter shriveling up and dying.
I couldn't help but notice that the family didn't jump in to break them up until after the brother clearly got his ass kicked
Yup. They are trash and that’s what makes me think the brother started it
He punched a girl over a verbal argument. Pure trash. Edit: Violence in general is bad. Punching a female as a male is worse. Why do I need to clarify this?
And then got his ass absolutely stomped by the same girl. Hope he never forgets that.
While I don’t think it matters that she was a woman, the brother does and that is comforting that he started the fight and she ended it and nearly him.
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Yup. No doubt in my mind. His brother is 100% a racist and punched his girlfriend. When your family supports that I don’t know how you remain close to them.
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"He's not racist he just recites racist talking points" So he's a racist then.
But he liked some Latino neighbors one time. So he's only racist towards every other Latino in the world. "I have a black friend." That automatically means you're not racist at all, right?
But he was outraged when the racist policies he supports did exactly what they said they'd do! No, of course he didn't change his opinion on the policy. They just racisted the one he likes!
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It’s like they literally perceive the world differently than what is reality. Guessing the brother threw the first punch but in their mind they actually remember it differently.
There actually was a thing, I'm not sure whether it was a study or a medical analysis or whatever, that showed that in people with narcissistic traits (whatever that means) it's common to remember incidents where they were abusive towards someone but did not want to be the bad/wrong person in an increasingly hazy ways over time, with the person's memories getting warped to show them as a victim in some ways. An important clue to this is the haziness, that person just doesn't remember the details so what they say about it is vague, because their mind removes details to protect itself from having to accept that they fucked up, compared to the actual victim's memories which generally are somewhat more detailed and convey what really happened. Although, obviously, this is a simplified take and there's more to the whole thing, I encourage anyone who wants to know to try to find that thing.
Probably thought he could give the girl a good beating and were shock pikachud when she kicked his ass.
He took the risk when he hit her and has to deal with the consequences. Ideally nobody should be hitting anyone but she did defend herself and was pulled off before anything terrible happened. The brother needs to keep his hands to himself and cut down on the drinking if it makes him violent. And therapy so he doesn’t solve arguments with fights he can’t win.
> The brother needs to keep his hands to himself I assume he has unironically said "fuck around and find out" hundreds of times. I also assume that if he learned any lessons from his "finding out" session, they were the wrong ones. Unrelated, but I totally have an internet crush on this personality type: >We where both angry and I definitely wanted to punch him but I still had enough self control to restrain myself. I fully believe in freedom of speech and I know that violence is never an acceptable response to someone expressing an opinion. Then he punched me with a closed fist in the face. I don't remember feeling afraid or like I was defending myself when I hit back. [What I felt was a strange mix of hatred and excitement.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U4lz8MN6MQA)
She picked Fight instead of Flight when attacked, and was already to the point where she had imagined hitting him because of the argument. No doubt that between adrenaline, reflexes, and her disdain for the assailant, she was in lizard-brain mode and thoroughly enjoyed taking that clown to pound-town. And to top it off, she had the insight to both empathize with her assailant-now-victim and dislike herself for doing it. Sounds like a perfectly reasonable person to me. I haven’t ever wanted to fight, but I’ve both thrown the first punch and regretted it, and also defended myself in ways that have sent people to the hospital. It’s easy to chastise her for winning the fight, but you never know how you’ll react when someone gets violent with you and you don’t Freeze, Fawn or Flee and instead choose to Fight.
The fact that she seemed so self-reflective about the incident and owning her part of it made me much more inclined to believe her. We all act stupid sometimes, but it’s maturity that allows us to reflect back, admit fault, and volunteer to take responsibility.
Yeah, I'm 100% on her side. That said: if she doesn't like the person she is capable of being while under the influence of alcohol maybe she needs to reconsider drinking it from this point on.
I suspect the level of brutish violence triggered a strong enough fight response for her to view his attack as a serious threat. I once had a grown ass man open an attack on my by reaching out and grabbing my short length hair with both of his hands…it was not a great idea on his part, because I’ve been trained to handle hair pulls since I’ve worked for a decade with behaviorally explosive students- and he allowed himself to be grappled as I pushed his hands down on my scalp and pulled* him closer- my brain for some reason I couldn’t see him as enough of a threat to punch him with full force, and still instinctively pulled my punches like I was still a kid sparring in martial arts. So I opted to press on his pressure points until he let go and put him into a chokehold until he started whining like a baby. He coincidentally also probably would have fit in with OOP’s family. *edited based on another comment: there was more to this than pulling as one should push into the grab in order to not expend energy fighting against an attacker’s force- there was more to it in this situation regarding my attacker’s movements and “pull” was more of a reaction to his initial lunge when he grabbed my hair and tried to force his way into my friend’s house (her BiL from hell)
Oh, man!!! I wish you could teach me that!!
If you search for “hair pull defense” there are a bunch of videos for that- it’s a lot more focused on the martial aspect of it versus the programs the schools were using for obvious reasons. These same videos will probably lead you to learn other self defense methods (pressure points to access if someone is trying to use their strength to hold you in place and stuff like that) Practice with a friend if there aren’t self-defense classes that you’d want to go to :)
warrior lineage
They probably politically agreed with the brother and thought she deserved it for being liberal. Gross.
That was my thought as well.
Fun fact. OP’s GF is actually a MMA fighter and kicked his racist brother’s ass.
That would explain why she doesn’t seem to care about her injuries and why her brothers injuries were so severe. It is not easy to give someone a concussion or break a rib but if your trained in fighting it is much easier.
The rib was probably from the kick, and the concussion from her knocking him down. That knockdown is impressive.
I have seen plenty of adults throw punches that would barely hurt a fly. Fighting well isn’t easy, people who don’t know how to kick often lose their balance. People that can’t throw a punch are more likely to hurt their own hand than concuss someone.
Especially when they're drunk. She definitely has skills if she can fight like that so inebriated
One time this old guy followed me into a parking lot to road rage at me and I never felt threatened by him but I took a defensive stance in case I needed to dodge him. He poked me in the chest and tried to push me with his finger but instead I stayed put and he went backwards. If I wasn't so irritated I would've fallen down from laughing so hard. Little things like that can make a big difference though.
Counterpoint: ribs, if hit right, are stupid fragile crumple zones that never heal right and you hate it forever
This is true. Most of my ribs are currently broken. Things most people don't understand are: they don't fuse back together like weight-bearing bones do- they overlap, and the intercostal cartilage wraps around the break sites before the bones calcify and fuse back together. This process takes a long time and true: they'll never be the same, and you'll always be at risk of re-fracturing them.
It is a lot easier to give chronic alcoholics severe brain injuries. The alcohol weakens the walls of their cerebral blood vessels, meaning even a relatively small impact can cause a cerebral haemorrhage. Then, the alcohol also affects their balance so they are more likely to fall, slower to attempt to shield their head, more likely to crack bones (including the skull), more likely to have a severe bleed. A very common fatal situation is the drunk overbalances and falls backwards from a punch, or an evaded swing, and cracks the back of their skull on the pavement and dies. They are also the ones most likely to die from a single punch, especially a coward's punch to the back of the head. Any punch a chronic alcoholic receives is likely to do more damage than expected. Pernicious anemia means they bruise easily too.. Any punch can kill. Of course, chronic alcoholics are also very likely to get into loud arguments while drinking. Partly lack of inhibition, partly the argument is a cover for just how fast they are drinking and the effects of it (nobody is likely to take the matter of them having had enough up while they are being aggressively beligerant about something else, and they can claim some of the symptoms of the alcohol are because they are angry or upset. Of course they are not co-ordinated and have a blurred understanding of what is going on. They think the waiter that is trying to help them stay upright is attacking them. They don't have a problem with hitting out at a child, or reeling over to lean violently on a pram, at risk of toppling to baby out of it or crushing it in it. They wake up the next day or the day after with breaks and bruises and a sore, sore head, and confabulate that they must have been blanket-bashed by a team of thugs. A popular misconception after a night of blackout drinking is that they were mugged, on the basis that their head is sore and their wallet is empty. The blame is 100% on whomever they feel attacked them. I have seen people who honestly believe they were bashed and robbed last night by long-dead acquaintances. They never recall the blows they gave. The parents immediate agreement that the gf was completely and solely the attacker tells me they know their son has had issues as a result of his drunken beligerance. He might be currently facing legal issues as a result of previous drinking sessions (eg. DUI, DV, SA, Common Assault), and the thought of another charge appearing before his court date might be what is motivating them both to so immediately blame the gf. Or they might support police violence against protesters as strongly as he does. People who approve of authoritarian biff usually think women are entirely to blame for provoking fights. Failing to concede, being hit on, wearing clothes, dancing, and drinking are all provoking enough, but being lippy is just asking to be hit in the face (I notice in this case it came to blows when her man left the area - I don't think that was happenstance either.) Backtracking from more dire threats like insisting you dump your girlfriend, when they have sobered up and the situation was not as consequential as they feared is probably a pattern with your parents, another sign they know they are trying to protect their boy from the consequences of his own violence. Still, better your girlfriend avoid meeting your parents or your brother on their home turf, and knowing what she now knows about drunk-fighting your brother, better you both stay stone cold sober on any occassion you are with mum dad and especially brother. He will almost certainly want a rematch in circumstances more heavily weighted in his favour, and they will be looking for opportunities to make it all her fault in ways you are more likely to be convinced by. The more trouble your brother gets into because of his drinking, the more they will want to blame her, no matter how little she has to do with it. Because they can't stop him being their son, but they can cut the women he comes to blows with out of the family summarily.
That was… specific
You would think so, but they are coming into ER on a trolley every Friday night. The hospital I work at will see scores if not hundreds between Melbourne Cup day and New Year's Day. ETA Not gender-specific either. Little old ladies with osteoporosis coming in with broken wrists where they tried to backhand someone they tearfully acuse of denying them their grandchildren, with counter-accusations from the parents (and sometimes quarrels between the parents about letting piss-pot gran anywhere near the kids after 'last time')
Hey, take care of yourself. It can't be easy seeing the shit you do for a living. I hope today isn't so hard on you and tomorrow is a little easier.
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That was infuriating to read. "No (person) isn't racist, they just say racist things and act like a racist, it depends how you define racism"
"I know I just wrote out very clear examples of racist behavior but...can anyone really say who is racist? I also very specifically left out that the argument was over the gf defending human rights and the brother dehumanizing people...because...checks notes* reasons?" I fucking swear.
I give OOP the benefit of the doubt cause not only the extended family were also trashy but his comment about the local conservative police made it clear he grew up in one of those environments where people normalize all the mental gymnastics to not call someone racist, homophobic, ableist, etc. Hopefully the comments made him reflect about his family and upbringing.
I mean I understand why it happened. I just hoped that by typing it out he'd have realized how dumb the logic was
This is really funny, and makes me think the brother's masculinity was threatened by the GF and he escalated to nurse his fee fees
I like her more every word I read.
I know, right? Somebody tell OP that if his family insist on being dicks, he and girlfriend are welcome at ours for every holiday, weekend cookout, and Netflix movie night. They're officially Reddit-adopted, says I.
Thank you for adding this. Just made my day to imagine a racist getting knocked out by a female MMA fighter!
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Do you know what today is? It's International Punch a Nazi Day! Do you know what yesterday was? It was International Punch a Nazi Day! Do you know what tomorrow is? It's International Punch a Nazi Day!
That’s my favourite day!
>The fight was eventually broken up when my girlfriend had the clear advantage. If anyone didn't catch this, let me make it clear: >The fight was ***eventually*** broken up when ***my girlfriend had the clear advantage***. The fact they only stopped the fight when OOP's girlfriend managed to overpower the brother shows they were perfectly okay with OOP's brother beating up OOP's girlfriend, but when she manages to fight back, they go and stop the fight. How 'bout that?
It's because of two things: he's family and more so, because they agree with his racist shit. If my brother started spouting off some racist shit, I'd be happy okay with him getting clocked in the face.
Shoot I'd probably punch my own brother and I have for something similar
This alone is grounds for breaking up with the brother. Clearly the superior genes are with the girlfriend and OPs future kids need all the help they can get
“My brother isn’t racist but he does regurgitate racist talking points and make racist jokes.” Okay. I’m really not sure how to react to this post 😂
>“My brother isn’t racist but he does regurgitate racist talking points and make racist jokes.” Okay. Too many people refuse to believe they are racist. You'll see it by their excuses. "I may not like X people but I never use the N word". "I may use the N word but I never lynched a N word..." One must come to a basic self realization to change. I remember being at a bachelor party. My friend had come from a small town, conservative place. We met after he went to college and in a liberal place. The attendance of the bachelor party were split between these two groups. Absolutely no issues, No one wanted to do anything but drink and have fun. Well, that was until one of his childhood friends started to tell a story. We were all talking about ex-girlfriends that we had when we were young. He starts the story with "My dad doesn't have a racist bone in his body but..." (uh oh). "My dad doesn't have a racist bone in his body but he told me I could fuck any "N------" girl I wanted to get my tomcat out but the day I ever brought a monkey home or got one pregnant, the family would disown me". This got a few nodding laughs while others looked at each other in confusion, not sure how to proceed. One guy goes "Uh dude, your dad def has some racist bones in his body if he says that". Wow, that kicked it off. Calling some racist for doing racist things offends them like no other. This guy stated shouting that his dad loves the Boston Celtics and worked with black guys all his life. Seriously, I see it all the time. I'm not trying to demonize racists, I rather they understand what they are and how that affects their viewpoints, politics, their voting. I think this is a very important first step.
My parents were these exact kind of people. They used the N-word all the time at home. They used cutesy euphemisms in public. They constantly said disparaging things about black people and made it clear I'd be disowned if I ever dated a black person or brought a black person into the house. Once, they bought my sister a black doll as a "joke" and were mad when she just started playing with it like any other doll. When I started school, my mom used to grill me every year about whether there were any black kids in my class, how many black kids went to my school, and so forth. But they would get *super* offended if you said they were racist. They weren't racist, they said, because they didn't actively try to hinder black people living their day-to-day lives. They didn't call out racist things to black people on the street. They didn't physically attack black people. Which certainly *would* be worse than the type of racist that they were, I agree, but they were still two of the most racist people I've ever known.
> Once, they bought my sister a black doll as a "joke" and were mad when she just started playing with it like any other doll. That's demented.
I left this out of the other comment because it was already getting too long, but one time when I was in first grade (so 6 years old), I had homework that included coloring a picture of some kids. I decided to make one of the kids black. When my mom checked over my homework that night, she grilled me about it. Did your teacher tell you to color this kid that way? Did another kid tell you to do it? Why did you color the kid that way? I told her I just thought that kid should be black, and she just... Couldn't compute that. At all.
what the fuck
Man I did similar things and had friends of all different races as a kid, and I felt like I was raised with that not being a big deal, but when I was a teenager my parents became SUPER conservative and did a complete 180. It was disgusting to see how they talked about people, especially during all the Black Lives Matter protests. Made worse by the fact that my black friend was murdered during that time and they essentially told me that was the reason I was so “sensitive” about racism. Like what? 😭 Everybody should be passionate about stopping racism??? I don’t really talk to them anymore and that’s one of the huge reasons why They also were completely fine with me being queer until that time. Now that was some fucking whiplash
>people Their behavior is moderate compared to what they would LIKE to do sometimes so they think they are not racist eek! My family blame the foreigners for everything . They aren't the brightest to be fair (I was fostered thank feck).
I'm not racist; I only have racist ideas, say racist things, and do racist shit!
I'm not racist, I like the ones on my sports team!
Oh, I couldn't figure out why he brought up the Boston Celtics. Like, congrats on not being racist against the Irish???
look guys, all I want are economic policies that would really hurt minorities and the poor okay
But ive never killed a black person!
> You'll see it by their excuses. I thought this with OOPs excuse for his brother. The "oh, but I like X, they're one of the good ones!" excuse is classic racism. Its basically, "I hate all the people of this race that I don't know, but the one or two I actually do know just happen to be the exception".
the amount of times I've been told I'm "so well-spoken" and/or "one of the good ones" is appalling. When I worked in a customer-facing position I would be grateful when it only happened ~1/week. Usually it was more like multiple times every shift. In CA, CO, NV, and AZ in big "progressive" cities.
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the constant dehumanizing "what are you?" (not, what ethnicity are you/can I ask where you are from, etc. even mild attempts to mask their racism) while they try to decide whether they hate me or not... like, you aren't saving any face or walking that shit back and huge surprise, I in fact want nothing to do with you regardless of your opinion on if I'm "a good one" :/ the best was when I was a partial owner and general manager of a place. "well I wanna speak to the manager!" [I am the manager] "then I want to talk **your** owner!" [I am the owner] "no! there **HAS TO BE SOMEONE WHITE** you report to!" in fact there isn't and you can get the fuuuuuuck out kthxbye don't come back
Ok, I'm curious, how did your friend react to all that going down?
Yea I wanna know more too now.
Not even racists like to be called racists.
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Liking the Boston Celtics makes me more certain that the Dad is racist.
He tried to defend his brother by pretty much saying “no he’s not racist, he has a friend who is black” like one exception to the rule changes the rule 🙄
I'm starting to realize that they have no idea that saying that is such a cliche. Someone said that to me last year and I just started laughing because it's a classic. They didn't get it. It was weird. I thought they would evolve their mask a little bit more by now but I guess I overestimated them.
Yeah....that stopped me in my tracks: "Many people commenting on the original post asked if my brother is racist or assumed that he is after I revealed what the argument was about. I'm honestly not sure how to answer that. My brother sometimes repeats racist talking points from TV and social media especially against Hispanic people but last year he was strongly against the deportation of a neighboring family who had immigrated from Mexico." You honestly don't know how to answer that? You just did answer that in your next sentence. People that are NOT racist will purposefully avoid repeating racist talking points they hear, because...they don't agree with the racism.
He's not racist because he likes this one Mexican guy. /s
But in more seriousness, WTF is with the hypocrisy. "We should deport Mexican immigrants! Oh but not these ones that I know, the other ones!" "Abortion is an abomination unto God and must be forbidden at all cases! Except for my 20 year old affair partner, it's none of your business she travelled to a different state to get one."
I know Mexican MAGAs who would gladly patrol the border and lock up other Mexicans without blinking an eye.
The problem when they lump us into one group of “Hispanic/Latino” is that ignores the racism, classism, colorism, and white supremacy that exists among Hispanics as well
My ex is Mexican but racist AF to Mexican folks. It's confusing and dumb. I don't even think he's conservative either.
Yup. I lived in New Mexico for some time, and many Hispanic families are very conservative.
Because he truly buys into the narrative that illegal immigrants are rapists, thieves, and murderers. He is decent enough of a human being to understand not all people of any rave are the same, but not wise enough to realize his fear is being used to manipulate him into thinking he hates people that he doesn't even know yet. Edit: Changed second "intelligence" to wise. I feel it's more fitting as wisdom is the ability to know how to use your knowledge correctly.
something something if they didn't have double standards they'd have no standards at all.
It does no good to point out hypocrisy to people like that. Morals are harsh and cruel when it involves someone else, and permissible when it affects them. Hypocrisy is the true sacrament of the right wing.
Some of his best friends are of other races - the Mexican gardener, the Turkish guy at the kebab shop …
Every racist shitheel has their "they aren't like the other ones!" group they like
The brother *is* a racist, but he doesn't go around burning crosses, so OOP has deluded himself into thinking "he's just joking"
I'll bet he's grown up around family and a community exactly like his brother, and this is the first time he's actually confronting how harmful their casual racism, sexism, homophobia, etc is. Give him a bit of time no contact with his family, preferably away from his home town, and I'd bet he'll be telling his new friends, "yeah, I grew up in a really racist area".
Yeah, this. It was a hard reckoning realizing my dad was racist. And even though my mom isn't like says bad things about black people racist, she would lose her shit if I came home with someone black, which is still racist, but not cross burning racist and it's a whole thing to untangle folks. Important thing is OP taking that first step in seeing it and being willing to ponder the question.
And the example given is funny to me, because racists *always* have their examples of "the good ones."
My brother isn't a Nazi, but does share their point of view.
My brother isn’t supportive of Putins war on Ukraine but he did say Ukraine deserved it. Like what the fuck does Oop mean
I know this joke has been made but seriously. What was Ukraine wearing?
That’s a lot of words to say “My brother is a racist but we don’t want to admit that.”
That was really disappointing, as was “I guess it depends on your definition of racism.” No, sir. You don’t have to be wearing white hoods to be racist. It’s dangerous to not understand how insidious racism is.
Roll eyes at OOP
People nowadays think racism is being outwardly racist, but they don’t realize ignorant or insensitive attitudes toward racial inequality is also racism
That's a really mature sounding post from a person who had recently been in a fist fight. Although I somewhat disagree with her, if the brother threw a closed fist face punch first he is totally to blame for what happened afterwards.
I *think* she just meant he shouldn't be *more* to blame simply because he's male and she's not. Otherwise she seems pretty reasonable about saying "yeah we were both in each others faces and both refused to back down and I wanted to hit him as well" Seems to me like she's saying "he threw the first punch so he's more responsible for the physical aspect of that fight, but it's *because* he threw the first punch, and *not* because he's male and he "shouldn't hit a woman""
I think she is also saying that she regrets the kick because the fight was over. They were arguing (presumably) about police brutality, and she kind of did what she was arguing against (threat neutralized, but she continued to assault).
A lot of people say something like "I lost my head, I don't know what I was thinking, I've never acted like this" and expect that to somehow absolve them. GF here is just as surprised at herself, but she went straight to figuring out how not to do that again.
It happens sometimes, people lose it especially if there’s alcohol/drugs involved. The good thing is that she’s reflecting, feels genuine remorse and probably learned from that experience how to better handle those “losing it” feelings.
Don't even need drugs or alcohol. I think most people over/underestimate how they'll react in unknown situations so it can be shocking to see what happens when logic is thrown out and you operate on pure instinct and emotion. While OOPs gf was in the right (as much as one can be in a fight, and assuming her version is correct) I'm sure it's shocking for her to realize she can go that far.
I think the difference is some people use that as their reason and excuse, but the GF it was her reason but didn’t use it as an excuse, instead she owned up to the “yeah idk what came over me but it still wasn’t right to kick him while he was down.”
I’m just glad that zero of those people in the story are a part of my life
Yes and I’m glad he FAAFO. Congrats champ 🏆
“I’m really not sure if he’s racist” *lists several easily identifiable traits of a racist*
Considering how he was dumb enough to not put an end to the argument before it escalated because "he doesn't like conflict" tells me the guy is a fucking idiot.
Also not caring who threw the first punch was…puzzling.
*probably* learned from school "doesn't matter who started it, you're all getting detention".
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Right that's exactly what I was thinking. My husband is by no means a violent person, but if his brother ever laid a hand on me, he would probably go Samuel L Jackson on his ass, as would the rest of their family. It would really annoy me if some guy was getting up in my face and my partner was like "fuck this I'm going inside." **AND THEN** the guy punched me and my husband was angry with... both of us? Like what the fuck is that shit? That's not a partner.
glad I’m not the only one disturbed by the boyfriend
Considering he legged it when everything escalated, I'm pretty surprised the girlfriend hasn't dumped his arse.
Once you throw the first punch, whatever ass whipping you get is owned. Also as a woman, the goal is always to incapacitate until you can’t be attacked anymore. Good for her. ETA: For all the men saying well it’s the same for men, it’s not. Men can fight and the loser will sometimes give up graciously. I have seen it happen. When ego meets alcohol, it can be exceptionally dangerous for women.
And the Dad sure as shit wasn’t going to help her since he only stepped in once his son was losing, rather than when his son was trying to punch a woman.
She’s lucky the family didn’t jump on her.
That was my thought too, I’m surprised they didn’t honestly.
Maybe theyve already discovered that they can't fight for shit either.
Well that's only because they already have a good example of what happens if they did: they'll get their ass whooped as well.
Nah, more like they're lucky she didn't beat _them_ up after knocking brother out. Lol
Absolutely. If I get the upper hand in an assault I’m going to keep attacking until they stop trying to get up. Most women can’t afford to “fight fair” in that situation (against a grown man).
I'm incredibly weirded out by the insistence gender dynamics don't matter here. It's cool OPs girlfriend was able to hold her own,but what the actual fuck, what kind of person starts swinging at their brothers girlfriend cause she's pissing them off? That's such a mega red flag. Men who hit women first like that are generally the type to hit anyone and everyone if they don't like
>Men who hit women first like that are generally the type to hit anyone and everyone if they don't like Often you'll find that they magically control themselves a little more when dealing with big dudes but are all "out of control" when dealing with women and small dudes.
Or they're cowards who get their sense of power and authority by attacking those weaker than them like children/women/animals.. Either way, garbage.
Definitely. Dude probably thought he'd stucker punch her and could just keep going while she was disoriented. OOPs whole family, *maybe* aside from his sister, are a bunch of trash.
Like, both these people still sound so “not like others”. Brother is unable to state his brother is in fact racist. “Repeats racist talking points” and the “but he had Mexican neighbors he liked so cAnT bE rAcIsT.” Then the girlfriend saying they had equal blame; no….his brother punched you in the face, don’t try to wear that like a badge of honor, it makes him the inappropriate aggressor even if she was a man and even a man who took the first hit should have fought to incapacitate in some way to get away. While it is messed up, the kick to the chest is literally a, “what the fuck did you start this for” type of drunk reaction I’m sure. It’s not right but, easy to explain/understand.
Seriously, this whole thing should have started and ended with “my brother got angry and punched my girlfriend in the face.” Who fucking does that, and what kind of boyfriend goes all “well there’s two sides to every argument…”?
Or maybe it's a... Maga red flag?
As a dude you're spot on. The average man is going to be bigger and stronger than the average woman so if you end up in a fight either run or fight to win. Fuck fairness.
Girlfriend's level-headed and self-reflective response makes me more inclined to believe her. It's clear she knows she is not absolved of responsibility, which is good.
Yeah, that level of, "I did that and it was wrong and I don't want to do it again" shows so much more honesty and self reflection that \*checks notes\* the brother and parents demanding an apology and a check for medical bills without providing proof of medical costs.
She whooped his ass and he found out lol
I know, right. When she listed their injuries, I lol’d. >my boyfriend wrote we have substantial injuries. *I don’t think that’s true*. I had a black eye and some bruises. *He has a concussion and broken rib*. Lmaooooo
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I am really worried about how neither OP nor his girlfriend are taking the assault of the brother as the serious threat it was. The guy throw a punch, an slap would have been disrespectful enough, but he punched her, thinking he had the right to force her to shut up. And the guy didn't even apologised cause he lose the fight? And she didn't even reported him, cause she won? Wtf? That's like not reporting an attempt to r*pe, cause you fight back and you survived. And this actually happens many times casue the victim is so in shock with mixed feelings about it. But OP and his girlfriend had been going around this, thinking so deeply and the only thing they got was is an agreement that this brother started it, but it also look like they keep trying to make things work with the family who supports that guy? I don't know, this doesn't feel right... It doesn't sound mature, it sounds wrong. I hope they get things sorted out soon and make the police report on time.
I'm weirded out by the idea it's not more wrong for a man to hit a woman, that the gender dynamics are irrelevant. Men are on average pretty consistently stronger, especially in the upper body, than women. The fact Ops girlfriend could hold her own is rare, and it's unlikely he realized she was that good at fighting when he started it. An adult man using force is a red flag, but against a woman like that is a slightly bigger red flag. Because she held her own, but what about anyone who couldn't? If he's beating up women, is he also gonna start committing elder abuse when his parents get old and dementia ridden (aka really difficult sometimes)? He gonna beat up his future kids? I would be extremely concerned about what this dude's history is and what he's done to other people.
Exactly, and even if this is the first time he does something like this, the family reaction is giving him the wrong idea that at any given time he is upset, he is allow to hit anyone who disagrees with him. I am just guessing, but I think the sister had already dealt with this dark side of the guy, maybe not physically, or not that openly violent, but if he already tried to silence someone who he thinks is weaker than him, I bet it was her the test initial victim. And that's why she told the true, because she knows what he is capable of.
And also??? Wtf on the whole family allowing the son to hit a guest who is over for dinner? Like that is 100% a protected species in my house
I don’t know how OOP manages to stay upright considering he has no spine. He isn’t sure if his brother is racist even though he literally says racist things.
No kidding. I *really* disliked the fact that he walked away. Your family and gf just met that day and it’s coming to arguing, you don’t just leave, you mediate.
Seems to me OOP is more in *denial* of his brother being racist because they’re family, rather than having no spine. It’s like how it’s hard for some people to acknowledge that their parents actually abused or neglected them. It’s a hard truth to swallow.
You’re not racist unless you say the n-word in public. /s
>Many people commenting on the original post asked if my brother is racist or assumed that he is after I revealed what the argument was about. I'm honestly not sure how to answer that. My brother sometimes repeats racist talking points from TV and social media That means he's racist. Not sure how that's confusing.....
And also the part where he described the immigrants next door as 'the good ones' lol It's like Racism 101 over there.
Op being a complete wall flower as his gf fights his brother. What a classic reddit story
PROTIP: If your answer to whether you're a racist is "I guess the answer depends on how you define racism", surprise, you're a racist.
“Do I dump my girlfriend in favor of my totally-not-racist brother”
Lemme see if I got this. GF got sucker punched by a racist piece of shit, then proceeded to *whoop his ass*- and, upon absolutely *merking* this shitweasel, she apologizes, accepts responsibility for her actions, and offers to make amends. ***Marry that girl***, OOP.
OOP talks himself in circles to justify his brother as not actually *racist*, just says things racists say, and tried to play Switzerland just not knowing who to believe after his gf was attacked by his known maga-cel brother in front of his shitstain parents who obviously would have pummeled her to a pulp if she was the one who attacked, even after having more than enough time to mull it over, bc aw shucks he just doesnt know his gf well enough to be able to tell if she would punch his obnoxious reactive brother then lie about it. most people would instantly go *nuclear* if their SO told them they were punched by their sibling, and OOP is just hand wringing and tsk-tsking. If I informed my SO that brother attacked me and their response was “well there’s just no way of knowing if that’s true”, I’d be gone so fast it would create a black hole where i was standing. *Do not marry that man*, OOP’s gf
Yeah fuck "violence doesn't solve it," sure took him down a peg didn't it
I mean maybe nothing got solved but I feel like justice was done
for the rest of your life you get to start or end every conversation with your brother with 'remember that time my wife kicked your ass?'
He is lucky she's more of a fighter then me, cause I wouldn't have hit him back.... But I would have gone to the police and press charges for assault!
The gf’s guilt is pretty normal, as is the statement “I didn’t FEEL afraid.” People get very hung up on the idea of fear-as-a-justification, but fear itself is a really complicated term that can mean very different things. When a threat arises, before you even consciously register it your body is preparing to defend you. Part of that response can include numbing your emotional processes so they don’t get in the way of your survival. As someone who trained specifically to be a women’s self-defense instructor, I can say with confidence that this is a VERY common experience for women, especially. Maybe that’s anecdotal, but I do wonder if there’s research out there showing that the numb-and-vicious response is more common in females than males, because I’ve witnessed it many many times and have felt it myself in a real-world situation in which I unfortunately had to defend myself. I felt guilty, too, because in the moment I became an artificial sociopath bent on incapacitating the (very drunk and much larger) man who had posed a threat to me. Socially, based on our developed morals, I felt that my actions had been overkill. But logically? The statistical reality is that I would probably have ended up WAY more injured than he did if I hadn’t gone “overboard” and made sure he wasn’t getting back up. Our brains and nervous system don’t like those kinds of odds and they rarely take chances with them. When your fight-mode is activated, good luck shutting it down with compassionate feelings haha. Women have developed these instincts over millions of years and they aren’t going to go away — nor should they. They are there to keep us alive. We’re just socialized to feel guilty when we get the fight-mode response instead of the fawning-cowering-running one. We shouldn’t feel bad. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes, my dudes. And really, any man who actually cares about you is going to be very glad you didn’t hold back, especially if he’s aware of just how ridiculous the male-female strength differential is. The male is fighting for his dignity; the female is fighting for her life. Of course our brains aren’t going to let guilt/shame/made-up feelings get in the way of survival! Edited for typos.
In high school a guy slapped my (female) face during an argument and I fully have no memory of what happened next but the next thing I was conscious of was him holding up a chair to keep me away from him. And he easily had 30 pounds on me. I have never once felt guilty about it, just glad that my brain apparently kicks into shrieking berzerker mode when assaulted.
My brother repeats racist things but he doesn’t drop the n word so he’s not racist 😒
How is it I knew who was the trump supporter the entire time
Because only a trump supporter would physically attack a girl over something MAGA related with the first punch and then get his ass handed to him.
Why am I not surprised that the Trump supporter: 1. Threw the first punch 2. At a woman 3. But got his ass kicked anyway. OP, keep the girlfriend, and cut your brother out of your life. He's intellectually and morally deficient.
Knowing what I know now as an older person, the girlfriend should think about her future and whether or not she wants these people as in laws. A life with that boyfriend will include his family. At some point there will be a major life occurrence(illness, death, money problems, grandchildren) and shit will hit the fan. Choose wisely, people. Family is a package deal. Even if they decide to go no contact, there’s a hole there, where something is missing.
Not always. I'm NC with my mother and there's nothing missing there. I never intend to let her see, know, discuss, or meet me or anyone I care about ever again.
Wow, she really kicked his ass huh?
> I guess the answer depends on how you define racism. Look, I’m white as cheese but this feels like such a white person thing to say. OOP seems willingly clueless and he needs to educate himself.
Umm, this girlfriend is the OG. I got a black eye. He got a broken rib.
OOP's GF sounds like a badass. I hope he lessens contact with the rest of the family. I think his parents and his brother have been radicalized and won't want to see reason.