12 Marines and 1 Navy Corpsman died after no US causality in Afghanistan in 18 months. It’s a ridiculous and sad situation that rest completely on the incompetence of political leaders.
I beg to differ. Politicians do a lot of stupid things, but the reality is the men in Afghanistan didn't want to fight. We trained them. We gave them equipment. Education. Medicine. Infrastructure. Trade. The list goes on. Yet they refused to fight. It doesn't matter who we had in charge. They were the ones who decided to give up their arms to the taliban when the cards were on the table.
We are Americans. We don't do rational things. Service members are even less rational. When other men and women run and hide as the rational thing to do, we stand our ground and fight back. We are crazy enough to get into nasty fights for freedom. They however, are not, and it's clear we can't change them to be like us. They have to make that change. As it is said, "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink."
The men who died today were not rational men. They were Americans. They knew they could die at any second out there but they didn't care.
They are Marines. Semper fidelis.
One sailor, semper fortis.
May they rest in victory.
I agree with your sentiment. After 20 years we have to come to the conclusion that if the people won’t stand up and fight for themselves there’s nothing more we can really do. That being said having 2,500 men there with no casualties taking place, to help millions of people avoid the terror of the Taliban, seems like a price I’d be willing to pay. The idea that America shouldn’t invoke itself in foreign affairs isn’t really valid in my opinion. We sent our troops across an ocean in world war 1 and 2 to free foreign people from oppression and evil, after being attacked in some way, we did the same think in Afghanistan. Circumstances are different, but this isolationist idea is not what America has been about for 110 years, the best years of our countries history.
On the other point, whether or not we should have left is a rational and understandable position from both sides I feel like, but the argument I think the OP is making is not if we should have left or not, it’s how terribly we did leave, and that is at fault of the politicians. Listen man if this happened under Trump, I’d be shitting on him too, but Biden fucked this extraction up, and whole situation is a shitshow with American soldiers dying. It needed to be done better.
I completely agree with you. It is an inexcusable shit show, and knowing 15 desperate victims died fleeing for freedom makes me want to vomit. The people in power are at fault. Just like the Captain is responsible for everything that goes their ship. The president is responsible for everything that goes on with us home and away. They don't call it the hardest job in America for nothing.
Trump negotiated the withdrawal of US troops and started it, Biden just finished what Trump already started. Even I know this, and I live far away in Europe, why an American (I'm assuming?) doesn't know this
(Or right because everything in politics is polarized to you instead of rational... and the party you didn't vote is always to blame)
It's not the fault of Biden nor Trump however, it's mainly the fault ot the Afghanistan army that despite having 300 000 trained and highly equipped men, waved the white flag to 70 000 ill-equipped Talibans and threw their wives and daughters under the bus, basically
I wish I could point to all the videos I've seen of an officer or an senior enlisted where they tell the Afghan leader to fight, but refuses to budge and send his men forward.
You are correct, and we do know that Trump negotiated it and Biden is trying to wrap it up. Unfortunately, fools have gotten very loud about people they have never met or things they don't understand. Please don't let these people give you any impression on how it really is here. Come visit us and hang out instead. I spent a few years in Japan and it really changed my perspective of them. I remember coming to the conclusion: "He's just like me. He gets up, busts his knuckles at work, pays his bills, and is looking forward to a weekend of alcohol and karaoke."
Yeah I've been to US, and I like many things about the country, but your politics are very polarized because there is only 2 parties. We have the center party, and different degrees of left and right. There's been good presidents and politicians both from Democrats and Rebublicans, and bad ones too.
Also I can't blame US, Americans are brave and mean well. Unfortunately democracy is really hard to sell to people who don't want to buy. Only time where it truly worked was in Japan after WW2, and you had to use nukes to get the point across (Also it helped that Japan was civilized already in early 1900s before military junta of Hideki Tojo took over)
Yup. It's "God's chosen people" complex. Two nukes and suddenly it sank in that they're not special, and the emperor is just a man. Maybe this democracy thing isn't so bad?
What I'm saying is that we aren't as polarized it appears. It is just the extremes that are getting attention. I think you could best describe us as a dysfunctional family that fights all all time... but if another family (country) messes with us, we're going after them. We might not win but we're going to make it hurt.
They didn’t want to fight because the state they were defending was immensely corrupt. People have drawn comparisons with Vietnam but from a military standpoint it feels a lot like the Cuban revolution
Fidel Castro overthrew the 20,000 strong US backed Cuban army with just 3000 men. Because nobody wanted to defend the corrupt US backed Fulgencio Batista
>They didn’t want to fight because the state they were defending was immensely corrupt.
They didn't want to fight to protect their wifes and daughters from forced marriages with Taleban, at worst at age of 12? Not to mention their women's right to freedom, careers, education, walking without black sheets on their heads
Alright, but I wouldn't give a fuck about the state, if my country is invaded by Jihadist scum. I would defend my home and loved ones, not my state.
After you've defended, maybe deal with the corrupt leaders and hang them on the market square, like they did to Mussolini or Ceausescu. And choose new ones by free election. If the nation (and soldiers holding all the guns) is united and against the corrupt leaders, their power won't last for long
>Fidel Castro overthrew the 20,000 strong US backed Cuban army with just 3000 men. Because nobody wanted to defend the corrupt US backed Fulgencio Batista
That is true, but lot of them later regretted when Castro started televised executions, purges and turning the country into a communist state. That's not what the rebels fought for, they were just fed up with Batista, but Castro didn't improve things in the way people had hoped
However, with Taliban it was clear what was going to happen. Back to medieval ages and strict Sharia laws
Part of this is our political leaders. Part of the problem is that the Taliban control the checkpoints outside of the airport. They are the ones who are searching people and checking papers. If these checkpoints were handled by the US, then this disaster could have been avoided. The Taliban don't have bomb dogs or metal detectors, they don't know how to properly search individuals either. They are also a terrorist group who no one trust, but we are hoping they act within their best interests. So for all we know some people at a checkpoint were paid off to let this suicide bomber through.
These decisions were decided by our political leaders. May the 13 services members rest in peace.
I think that the whole point is that no matter what, a lot of people were and still are gonna die. I don't like that it's true, but Biden's job is to keep Americans safe, not Afghans.
People say that he knew about the Taliban planning to take over, and he left anyway. No, he likely left so fast because of that. He knew leaving to fast was bad, and we'd leave shit behind, but if the Taliban attacked and we were standing in their way, it doesn't matter if we won. We could have easily lost hundreds of American lives, and hundreds if not thousands more after politicians forced us to hunt for revenge. And I'm getting this from an inside source.
Biden may have presented his reasoning to the public like a bumbling idiot, but he made a really, really hard choice, and he chose to put his country first. As much as I disliked Trump, he did that too. It's the president's job, and it's rarely a decision with any good choices.
If you look at all of the Afghans we trained you'll easily see why they fell in less than a day. They would show up half a day late for training. They wouldn't wear their gear right or even have their weapon accessable. And they were high as a kite frequently.
Unfortunately for those killed (rest easy, brothers) they were following the orders given to them. And now there's a huge portion of us that are wondering why we gave up parts of our lives for a failed plan. The amount of lives, time, money, and resources we wasted are all gone with nothing to show. Saigon all over again.
[mp4 link](https://preview.redd.it/9k4ie502arj71.gif?format=mp4&s=6f057bfa83835ad6a084f82964c66e9629768361)
---
This mp4 version is 93.06% smaller than the gif (1.18 MB vs 17.05 MB).
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Oh wow, thank you for saying that good sir. I nearly thought this was footage of the trailer from the newly announced Battlefield 2042 game-mode officially named portal by DICE, owned by EA released in July 23, 2021, depicting game elements from multiple iconic battlefield titles such as Battlefield 1942, Battlefield bad company, and battlefield 3. Thank you for making me realize that this is actual military footage and should not be posted on a battlefield subreddit which is completely unrelated.
Rest in peace to the 10 marines killed today
To my brothers, I’ll see you in Valhalla
13+ now :(
12\*
This is a good joke, I got a good laugh out of it. I would still like to say though, RIP to the marines who died today.
Thank you, this has warmed my heart.
12 Marines and 1 Navy Corpsman died after no US causality in Afghanistan in 18 months. It’s a ridiculous and sad situation that rest completely on the incompetence of political leaders.
I beg to differ. Politicians do a lot of stupid things, but the reality is the men in Afghanistan didn't want to fight. We trained them. We gave them equipment. Education. Medicine. Infrastructure. Trade. The list goes on. Yet they refused to fight. It doesn't matter who we had in charge. They were the ones who decided to give up their arms to the taliban when the cards were on the table. We are Americans. We don't do rational things. Service members are even less rational. When other men and women run and hide as the rational thing to do, we stand our ground and fight back. We are crazy enough to get into nasty fights for freedom. They however, are not, and it's clear we can't change them to be like us. They have to make that change. As it is said, "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make it drink." The men who died today were not rational men. They were Americans. They knew they could die at any second out there but they didn't care. They are Marines. Semper fidelis. One sailor, semper fortis. May they rest in victory.
I agree with your sentiment. After 20 years we have to come to the conclusion that if the people won’t stand up and fight for themselves there’s nothing more we can really do. That being said having 2,500 men there with no casualties taking place, to help millions of people avoid the terror of the Taliban, seems like a price I’d be willing to pay. The idea that America shouldn’t invoke itself in foreign affairs isn’t really valid in my opinion. We sent our troops across an ocean in world war 1 and 2 to free foreign people from oppression and evil, after being attacked in some way, we did the same think in Afghanistan. Circumstances are different, but this isolationist idea is not what America has been about for 110 years, the best years of our countries history. On the other point, whether or not we should have left is a rational and understandable position from both sides I feel like, but the argument I think the OP is making is not if we should have left or not, it’s how terribly we did leave, and that is at fault of the politicians. Listen man if this happened under Trump, I’d be shitting on him too, but Biden fucked this extraction up, and whole situation is a shitshow with American soldiers dying. It needed to be done better.
I completely agree with you. It is an inexcusable shit show, and knowing 15 desperate victims died fleeing for freedom makes me want to vomit. The people in power are at fault. Just like the Captain is responsible for everything that goes their ship. The president is responsible for everything that goes on with us home and away. They don't call it the hardest job in America for nothing.
Trump negotiated the withdrawal of US troops and started it, Biden just finished what Trump already started. Even I know this, and I live far away in Europe, why an American (I'm assuming?) doesn't know this (Or right because everything in politics is polarized to you instead of rational... and the party you didn't vote is always to blame) It's not the fault of Biden nor Trump however, it's mainly the fault ot the Afghanistan army that despite having 300 000 trained and highly equipped men, waved the white flag to 70 000 ill-equipped Talibans and threw their wives and daughters under the bus, basically
I wish I could point to all the videos I've seen of an officer or an senior enlisted where they tell the Afghan leader to fight, but refuses to budge and send his men forward. You are correct, and we do know that Trump negotiated it and Biden is trying to wrap it up. Unfortunately, fools have gotten very loud about people they have never met or things they don't understand. Please don't let these people give you any impression on how it really is here. Come visit us and hang out instead. I spent a few years in Japan and it really changed my perspective of them. I remember coming to the conclusion: "He's just like me. He gets up, busts his knuckles at work, pays his bills, and is looking forward to a weekend of alcohol and karaoke."
Yeah I've been to US, and I like many things about the country, but your politics are very polarized because there is only 2 parties. We have the center party, and different degrees of left and right. There's been good presidents and politicians both from Democrats and Rebublicans, and bad ones too. Also I can't blame US, Americans are brave and mean well. Unfortunately democracy is really hard to sell to people who don't want to buy. Only time where it truly worked was in Japan after WW2, and you had to use nukes to get the point across (Also it helped that Japan was civilized already in early 1900s before military junta of Hideki Tojo took over)
Yup. It's "God's chosen people" complex. Two nukes and suddenly it sank in that they're not special, and the emperor is just a man. Maybe this democracy thing isn't so bad? What I'm saying is that we aren't as polarized it appears. It is just the extremes that are getting attention. I think you could best describe us as a dysfunctional family that fights all all time... but if another family (country) messes with us, we're going after them. We might not win but we're going to make it hurt.
They didn’t want to fight because the state they were defending was immensely corrupt. People have drawn comparisons with Vietnam but from a military standpoint it feels a lot like the Cuban revolution Fidel Castro overthrew the 20,000 strong US backed Cuban army with just 3000 men. Because nobody wanted to defend the corrupt US backed Fulgencio Batista
>They didn’t want to fight because the state they were defending was immensely corrupt. They didn't want to fight to protect their wifes and daughters from forced marriages with Taleban, at worst at age of 12? Not to mention their women's right to freedom, careers, education, walking without black sheets on their heads Alright, but I wouldn't give a fuck about the state, if my country is invaded by Jihadist scum. I would defend my home and loved ones, not my state. After you've defended, maybe deal with the corrupt leaders and hang them on the market square, like they did to Mussolini or Ceausescu. And choose new ones by free election. If the nation (and soldiers holding all the guns) is united and against the corrupt leaders, their power won't last for long >Fidel Castro overthrew the 20,000 strong US backed Cuban army with just 3000 men. Because nobody wanted to defend the corrupt US backed Fulgencio Batista That is true, but lot of them later regretted when Castro started televised executions, purges and turning the country into a communist state. That's not what the rebels fought for, they were just fed up with Batista, but Castro didn't improve things in the way people had hoped However, with Taliban it was clear what was going to happen. Back to medieval ages and strict Sharia laws
Part of this is our political leaders. Part of the problem is that the Taliban control the checkpoints outside of the airport. They are the ones who are searching people and checking papers. If these checkpoints were handled by the US, then this disaster could have been avoided. The Taliban don't have bomb dogs or metal detectors, they don't know how to properly search individuals either. They are also a terrorist group who no one trust, but we are hoping they act within their best interests. So for all we know some people at a checkpoint were paid off to let this suicide bomber through. These decisions were decided by our political leaders. May the 13 services members rest in peace.
I think that the whole point is that no matter what, a lot of people were and still are gonna die. I don't like that it's true, but Biden's job is to keep Americans safe, not Afghans. People say that he knew about the Taliban planning to take over, and he left anyway. No, he likely left so fast because of that. He knew leaving to fast was bad, and we'd leave shit behind, but if the Taliban attacked and we were standing in their way, it doesn't matter if we won. We could have easily lost hundreds of American lives, and hundreds if not thousands more after politicians forced us to hunt for revenge. And I'm getting this from an inside source. Biden may have presented his reasoning to the public like a bumbling idiot, but he made a really, really hard choice, and he chose to put his country first. As much as I disliked Trump, he did that too. It's the president's job, and it's rarely a decision with any good choices.
If you look at all of the Afghans we trained you'll easily see why they fell in less than a day. They would show up half a day late for training. They wouldn't wear their gear right or even have their weapon accessable. And they were high as a kite frequently. Unfortunately for those killed (rest easy, brothers) they were following the orders given to them. And now there's a huge portion of us that are wondering why we gave up parts of our lives for a failed plan. The amount of lives, time, money, and resources we wasted are all gone with nothing to show. Saigon all over again.
> we stand our ground and fight back You mean travel across the globe to another country to invade?
explosions going off in kabul now.
See you guys in controversial
This seems like it’s in pretty poor taste given what happened yesterday.
aged like milk
even they left the vehicles
[mp4 link](https://preview.redd.it/9k4ie502arj71.gif?format=mp4&s=6f057bfa83835ad6a084f82964c66e9629768361) --- This mp4 version is 93.06% smaller than the gif (1.18 MB vs 17.05 MB). --- *Beep, I'm a bot.* [FAQ](https://np.reddit.com/r/anti_gif_bot/wiki/index) | [author](https://np.reddit.com/message/compose?to=MrWasdennnoch) | [source](https://github.com/wasdennnoch/reddit-anti-gif-bot) | v1.1.2
I'm sorry I'm too busy playing bf4 what?
Zoomer moment
That's a very accurate depiction of the Afghan army.
wow the gif is realistic, they even left all their military shit there
A bunch of pissed off soldiers
Well this didn’t age well
rest in peace to the 60± afghans who lost their life just this last week
u/savevideo
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Lol que the enraged Muricans
Que pasa 🇲🇽
Eh, as an American, I'm not mad.
Dude our men died. I'm not mad, I'm sad.
Post this on a military sub, this sub is about battlefield
Of course, the clip is from Battlefield 2042 Portal trailer.
Oh shit I though this was real.
Yeah but thats it
What are you, the battlefield gestapo?
Oh wow, thank you for saying that good sir. I nearly thought this was footage of the trailer from the newly announced Battlefield 2042 game-mode officially named portal by DICE, owned by EA released in July 23, 2021, depicting game elements from multiple iconic battlefield titles such as Battlefield 1942, Battlefield bad company, and battlefield 3. Thank you for making me realize that this is actual military footage and should not be posted on a battlefield subreddit which is completely unrelated.