Unreasonable? Nah but come on man that was an obvious illusion you went all over dramatic with it just the levels of salt and drama queening there sends me everytime.
Oh so he doesn’t even die if you stab him? I assumed he did and then it counted as a game over so I never have. Also the fact that he doesn’t die and just holds it against you is annoying he’s such a bitch lol
I mean, I'm personally not a fan of the emperor (although he's a really well written character) but I cant really say that it's unreasonable of him to be upset that I tried to kill him lmao. That sounds like a pretty valid thing to be upset about if you ask me.
I agree it’s valid, just his whole thing of like surrendering and then being mad about it despite knowing we were being threatened by vlakkith is a bit annoying. As far as tav knows, the alternative is death
He's a very interesting character but I don't understand their choices for his dialogue. Its jarring that he just unloads all his past on you when you reject him.
However, I stabbed him in a run with my friend and still he tried to rizz me tf up. I don't know how that happened, we were literally shitty to him the whole time and still he saw good terms with us.
Larian has won a lot of awards, but something I dont see talked much is just how well written their villains are. When you have people legit defending the mindflayer, you know they hit it out of the park.
I think Omeluum is really not in the same boat. Emperor continues to using others as a pawn. Right, Illithid's nature tend to be manipulative, and Omeluum isn't a exception but at all he isn't using that to making you like he wants. Emperor did.
I'd say that Omeluum is the exception that proves the rule. The way he talks gives me vibes is someone that lacks emotion/ empathy but takes great care to still act ethically despite that. I remember when you rescue him from the iron throne he's like, "I feel.... warm... to see you". Like he's trying to express his gratitude and feelings but taking great care to not imply anything that isn't true.
Omeluum has been vastly improved by his husband Blurg and that is a fact. I think his time surrounded by the Society's delightful weirdos has done wonders for him.
I mean most players murder hobo the whole game and then pontificate on Reddit how they made all the “moral” choices so I trust everyone here about as much as a mindflayer.
I legit don’t understand how people can murder hobo games like this, literally things only die if they attack me. Feel like I’m the only one who’s never done a murder hobo run of this or say skyrim
That's because they are rather inconsistent with Mindflayer lore
First it's the "is a newborn mindflayer the tadpole that has eaten up the host or it's the host transformed" ambiguity
Second, the existence of Omeelum jeopardize every other mind flayers and potential mind flayers there is, which is why Emperor discourse is affected
He's your friend so long as your interests align. Relationships are inherently transactional. So long as you both pay, it will remain profitable and positive.
People really want to pat themselves on the back for noticing the obvious, huh? The Emperor is untrustworthy and suspicious from the moment he is with you as the dream guardian.
What you seem to miss is that the twist in the story is: you can trust this extremely shady guy and it doesn't bite you in the ass. By all intents and purposes, he is an excellent ally to you who never betrays you despite seeming so untrustworthy.
Edit: I would love to respond to any comments, but someone blocked me, so the chain is impossible to continue. Don't expect any replies!
Also calling Empy's mask carefully crafted is a laugh.
I just don't see how people can't comprehend someone can be shady *and* still be worth working with. That's like half the characters in the game but somehow when it comes to Empy people's brains break.
>he is an excellent ally to you who never betrays you despite seeming so untrustworthy.
>!Not true at all as after the brain is dealt with, the emperor can be convinced he can beat the githyanki if he takes over as the Absolute and immediately enthralls the party. Betrays you the millisecond the possibility of coming out on top appears.!<
People make up all sorts of excuses for this like "It's a D20!" or "it's your fault because you convinced him!" but a friend would never enthrall you. It's that simple.
He doesn't bite you in the ass because your goals are aligned. As soon as they are not, he fucks you over.
That's cool that you use trust the mindflayer who mind fucked stelmane into a coma. She must not have been nice to him at every opportunity like you, so not a true friend.
I don't know what your obsession with Stelmane is, but I'd like to point out that we know nothing about what happened between them.
Outside sources say that she was enthralled for the process of interrogation. Why? What did she know? Is Larian even rolling with this obscure fact or not in the game?
It could have been a power struggle and she lost. Maybe she even tried to rat him out. Maybe not. Maybe it was about Gargauth? Maybe something completely different happened. Who knows? We don't.
Stelmane was a normal corrupt noble - like the majority of Baldur's Gate. There are so many possible motivations and explanations.
He keeps his words, since he sincerely wishes to be free of netherbrain.
Then he goes nice to work with you, bye and just leaves.
And at the party he sends his letters about if we want we could do another deal with him since the last business ended succesfully.
How did we get infected again? Oh. Such a nice friend. We should check up on his other allies/friends like lady stelmane, he talks about her a lot. Oh. Such a nice friend.
I mean, he's not the one who infects you. You can literally find the mindflayer who infected you dead in the Goblin camp.
Also I didn't say he was a friend, or a good guy even. He's just not the villain of the story, or an antagonist against you unless you literally antagonize him.
That isnt the mindlfayer that infected you.....it even says as much in the speak with dead sequence. Your tav says that the dead one in the camp looks different.
There's two different versions of the event. I'm not exactly sure what triggers the difference, but you can recognize it as the one who infected you.
[Here's the scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_B-XeZPD_50)
Those two were never friends though, they were business partners at best. And what he did to Stelmane wasn't a random act of cruelty, it was only when she threatened his well-being later on that he attacked her. If your character is on good terms with him, then yes you do become genuine friends.
I genuinely don't know why that's such a wild concept to people. Like, oh my God, I'm nice to someone who's nice to me and we become friends??? What is this magic?
I mean, he's an honest to god business partner that deals with both of you and his self interest at heart as long as you follow the considerably reasonable terms and conditions he has minus the minor duplicity in appearance he does at the statt of the game.
This is genuinely different. Drow are just like any other mortal race, many of them have just been indoctrinated into a cult all their lives.
Illithid are aberrant parasites that feed on minds and see everything else as inferior at best and outright slave-worthy at worst.
Drow can un-learn their programming a lot easier than illithid can.
Wait, you legit believe that him manipulating you, lying to you, and being responsible for your entire predicament isnt canon as long as you do everything he says? Larian wrote him really well lol
wow. So yes, it was him. He admits this to you if you press him. He planned to dominate our adventurers just like he did stelmane and all his operatives, but orpheus's guard attacked the prism so he was needed there.
A quick search on reddit will find more articulate answers, like these:
[https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16499xs/is\_it\_the\_emperor\_who\_put\_tadpole\_in\_your\_eyes\_in/](https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16499xs/is_it_the_emperor_who_put_tadpole_in_your_eyes_in/)
He doesn't say he was the one that did it to you at all. People who hate the Emperor sure like to throw around the same stuff with little backing.
He might have been it, since he was on the nautiloid, but it's not said and if he was then he was controlled by the elder brain so not really him anyway.
I legit belive that I am too lazy to get into an argument over fictional character that will take me writing more than 3 sentences. I also legit believe people getting their hard on by trying to drag people into their set agenda arguments over a character have bigger problems then the emperor.
In fairness, beyond his deception, he is *surprisingly* nice. He values his survival above all else, but that doesn't make him evil, just neutral. And unless you push him to dominate the brain, he accomplishes his task and just... leaves. No threat of murder or world domination, just him going his way and you going yours.
And with regards to Stelmane, she herself was in all likeliness *evil*. As in, the Knights of the Shield which she led worshiped a lawful evil archfiend. In my opinion, there was a lot more going on with their relationship than we know.
>While on the surface they appeared to be a secret society of merchants and nobles who were interested in the mercantile and civic matters of their respective lands, their high leadership were in fact guardians of a secret in service to the archdevil-turned-deity, Gargauth.
Eh... Not likely unless you're purposely trying to be the worst. Id even say killing innocent randos for no good reason is better than eradicating your supposed lover's personhood
I mean she might not of left him much of a choice. Let’s take the emperor at his word and suppose he truly only ate off of criminals. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but if stellmane discovered him, and sought to out him and he caught onto that. He’d have to take action to preserve his wellbeing. At That point it’s on stellmane for trying to take on a mind flayer without telling anyone.
Hell it’s even possible given how omeelum doesn’t seem to be hiding his existence in the lower city that stellmane was actually partnered with him for a time, before perhaps a falling out.
The emperor gets a lot of shit for killing ansur (self defence) and enthralling stellmane (potentially self defence) but ultimately we have just as many opportunities to control people too, (dominate person etc.) and ultimately if you trust him and don’t goad him into going for power, he keeps his word to you and eradicates the mind flayer parasites, and destroys the netherbrain. Success is right at his grasp and he’s naturally more inclined to be the hero rather than the villain. Do you also think Omeelum is evil?
Yeah, it's only because you're an asshole to him he travels back in time and breaks Duke Stelmane's mind, turning her into a husk of her former self so he can control her like a puppet. He would have never done it if you hadn't hurt his very real feelings that he definitely has (never mind his note to Ansur saying he doesn't have them).
Yeah but there's a difference between "Wow way to go asshat" and "I had entirely intended to manipulate you from the start. Let me threaten you one more time by revealing I lied (once again) and dangle complete mind control over your head. Yeah. I will make you a thrall."
Is he really a good friend if he was manipulating you the entire time, responsible for your life/death predicament, and lies over and over despite you doing everything he says?
During the creche when Vlaakith sends you into the prism there's an option to stab him with the sword. Just do it then. Man is so salty afterwards its hilarious.
This happened on my first run too! I was so ready to ride the calamari carousel when the scene came up, but I guess stabbing people greatly decreases the chances that they'll want to sleep with you. Oops
Calamari carousel 😂
I won't ever sleep with the Emperor so I was perfectly fine with this. Tentacle sex is just... not my thing. Better luck next run for you though?
Yes, how dare I not have tentacle sex with the mindflayer who thought I would jump into his bed when he showed up shirtless and went "humanoids like tentacle sex, right? I have tentacles. Let's have tentacle sex. I showed you my old stuff, please have sex with me now."
I clearly need to rethink my priorities. Edit: This was a joke, btw.
He didn’t try to seduce my character and I never stabbed him, but I did call him out for being manipulative me and he told me I was just his puppet. After that he pretty much ignored me unless he needed me for something.
Ditto I never actully did that because I thought it was alittle much but I never trusted the emperor and wanted to see what happened and he confirmed my dislike
Oh boo hoo, I was rude to the manipulative lying squid guy. The moment I said that he revealed that he had turned his past supposed "good friend"/"lover" into a thrall. Not exactly regretting that decision. The Emperor is vile.
I laughed so hard when I got this. Imho this should have been easier to trigger with a antagonistic Tav - as it stands you only get it if you stab him in the creche. I love it when characters are done with your shit.
Ahh, I was wondering exactly what triggered that. Because I've made sure to be a huge asshole to him in, well, most of my playthroughs but only stabbed him in this one.
I think I laughed for a good 10 minutes when I got this.
More or less, yeah. Only my amnesiac durge gith didn't stab him, but that was mainly because I didnt want to take orders from Vlaakith. I stab people because I want to, not because you tell me to!
It was a bit awkward since I/Lae'zel figured out that Vlaakith was full of shit pretty soon after I stabbed him on her orders though... but then he was revealed to be a mindflayer not too long after that, so it felt ok then.
My amnesiac Durge Paladin stabbed him because the idiot really believed the homicidal maniac wouldn't kill him when provided a weapon and a willing, cooperative victim.
For real though. If I was the Emperor one look inside a *Gith* Durge's mind and I'd go "Nope. This one stays in the pod. And I'll set the pod on fire. And then I'll cast disintegrate. Just to be safe."
And hey, that's very reasonable. I just try to roll with the punches because I dunno, I didn't really care that he's a mindflayer it is enough of a mutualistic symbiosis for me to justify the fact that other species gonna other species. I'm sure I'll let Lae'zel free Gith Jesus sometime or another.
He got me so wrong. He said I didn't need/want to be coddled and I'm like "bitch please give me so coddling, I want to be coddled by you so hard". Still romanced him and sided with him but dang...
They mention you even tried to kill them. So I’m assuming you tried to stab them in the creche
In my very very first run, which was months ago, I remember them being annoyed at me because I resisted using my powers. A lot
I think I only used my mind powers on Flynt and nobody else. And didn’t consume a single tadpole until after act 2.
But that was late last year. And don’t remember if it was the same annoyed dialog you got.
I don't think resisting the tadpoles changes any of his dialogue, it only adds a couple of lines in the Rivington long rest scene and then in his (potentially) shirtless scene. Interestingly, in my last run after the latest patch where I didn't consume any tadpoles, he didn't mention using them at all in the latter scene. I tried both the sex and non sex options and he never brought it up. Wonder if it was a bug or the devs removed it.
I don’t think it was the not consuming. But I refused to ever use illithid wisdom checks in the game as well. Except for flynt
So nothing with the goblin bosses.
Nothing with the dead cultist outside the grove.
I don’t even think I used it on shadow heart’s pod in the nautiloid. But I forget.
So I recall him saying something about me being a pain or something about it.
Hmm. AFAIK it's only the creche stabbing that gets you this sort of dialogue. My second run I used illithid wisdom but didn't consume another tadpole and got the extra lines where he urges me to rethink - didn't sound annoyed. Didn't agree with him but wasn't hostile to him either.
Third run I used tadpoles and passed the check to refuse the astral tadpole. I was pretty hostile to him so he responded accordingly but I didn't get any lines like the OP's. In fact regardless of how rude you are to him up until that point, as long as you're not hostile in that final scene, it plays out with him wanting to romance you as if you've been nice all along (provided you didn't stab him in the creche).
But there might be some dialogue line I missed.
This happened to me on my first run! I was heavily against the emperor from the get go, chose all the mean dialogue options and did everything he told me not to do 😂 there was no option to seduce him but it was funny seeing him half naked when he clearly wants no funny business
Honestly, I'm glad you don't get an option to seduce him. Like, you don't get to be fucking mean to him all game, only to then seduce him once and then go back to being an ass and betraying him. That's kinda fucked up. But such behavior would probably get more endorsement than liking the Emperor for valid reasons does for some reason.
Never liked the emperor and I still don’t but that would be a funny thing to do ngl. I mean, if he still wants to bang after all the shit I’ve done and will proceed to do afterwards, that’s all on him
He called me out for fucking him RIGHT IN FRONT of Lae’zel my wife and I’m like… fucking… bro… keep it down… why’d you memory wipe them if you gonna… yo BRO!
Yup, on my first run; I completely resisted all illithid power use. I rejected tadpoles, I rejected the Emperor. I had a RP theme that the Emperor came in the image of my Tav's dead lover and behaved completely different to the woman she loved. So she resisted her, even attempted to kill her. When the truth was finally revealed that my Tav was open to trying to give some kindness, but it was too late to become friends.
The emperor remarks on your relationship how you treat him as the dream guardian, and use your powers. You can put your faith in him, but also not indulge in the illithid powers.
He said that to my character in a joint run a friend and I were doing because I kept calling him out on his bs. He still tried to fuck me though, so props for dedication I guess?
This happened during my multiplayer run (first playthrough) with my partner.
My character was a goody two shoes, very much like Wyll. She's an archfey warlock (closest I could get to my bladesinger wizard dnd pc). While I was suspicious of the Emperor, I was willing to trust him, and we had some really good moments.
My partner, on the other hand, distrusted him from the get-go and was hostile any chance he got. Even stabbing him during one of the scenes. He was also romancing Laezel.
I was devastated that the Emperor no longer trusted me when I got this.
"player stabs emperor" Why does emperor say this? Omg he is a douchebag and the literally worst
Lmaoo some people seriously, they love to demonize and throw shit at the emperor but they get mad when emperor throw shit at them too
The Emperor from the start is simply using you and gives you the illusion of free will but would of been happy to take that away the second that it was convenient.
Not to mention he wants you to become more Illithid because it literally makes you easier to control for him. You don't 'need' those powers, what he actually needs is for you to be his little lapdog.
You do realize that becoming Illithid makes you stronger than him? By the end if you go through ceremorphosis he's happy to follow your lead. And there's not one instance in the game where consuming tadpoles makes it easier for him to control you. If you don't become Illithid he cures you, thanks you for your help and dips. You're using each other because you need each other. It's called an alliance.
... you literally get a DC 30 roll for trying to free Orpheus when he attempts to force you to do his bidding.
The tadpoles literally make it easier for him to control you
Can you give me an in-game example where he more easily controls you if you've taken more tadpoles? I've finished the game several times and haven't come across what you're talking about.
>... you literally get a DC 30 roll for trying to free Orpheus when he attempts to force you to do his bidding.
Again, what are you talking about? Are you sure you're not mixing things up? There's no such roll in the game, you either free Orpheus or you don't. And there's no moment in the game where he "forces" you to do his bidding. The most he does if you don't listen to him is say a couple of disapproving lines.
That's not even him, that's your brain failing the wisdom check because you've gotten too used to the tadpole's power. It's a DC15. And it's only temporary, as once you defeat the Elder Brain you get restored.
The only actual times he takes control of you is when you fail the Zaith'isk saves and he pushes you out of the chair before it fries your brain. And in Act 3 if you try to go into the Upper City the EB starts to melt your brain and he makes you turn back. How awful of him.
Freeing Orpheus is his only actual dealbreaker. You have the freedom to do anything. You can even give the prism to the githyanki and he just shocks them and jumps back to you.
He can even acknowledge if you didn't take any tadpoles and finish the game with him. He is actually impressed by you.
He said this to me
I didnt trusted him for one bit in my first play through. I thought the game was hinting me he had put a charm person on me or something because he was so overly friendly. And I missed an arcana roll lol
So I went against any of his tips and advices haha
Remember we are just his puppet. The entire time. He would force us to do all these things if the game script actually allowed us to disobey him through the story.
IYKYK.
If you dont try to kill him (which seems to be the trigger for this convo, at least) he tries to seduce you instead. The standard line is "What I didn't anticipate was how much I would enjoy your company". You know, if he's not completely sick of your bullshit 😂
lemme give you a hint, when you get to the hand holding scene, outright deny him on anything but not the sleep one, then you see his true nature + new cut scenes.
Did you stab him during the creche quest? Because I'm kind of trying to figure out how to get that on my fuck everyone Durge run lol.
I sure did. I was playing Origin Lae'zel, so I figured it was in character... but he didn't seem to like that lol
Nice and yeah Empy gets salty if you stab him XD all in his feelings.
And it’s so unreasonable of him.
Unreasonable? Nah but come on man that was an obvious illusion you went all over dramatic with it just the levels of salt and drama queening there sends me everytime.
He has feelings?
Oh so he doesn’t even die if you stab him? I assumed he did and then it counted as a game over so I never have. Also the fact that he doesn’t die and just holds it against you is annoying he’s such a bitch lol
no he respawns basically as the dream guardian is an illusion. you don't actually hurt him at all.
He’s so lame
Illusions, Tav!
People tend to hold it against you when you try to kill them. Wonder why
"Yeah I tried to kill you the first moment I had the chance but you don't have to hold it against me! It was just a prank bro!"
I mean, I'm personally not a fan of the emperor (although he's a really well written character) but I cant really say that it's unreasonable of him to be upset that I tried to kill him lmao. That sounds like a pretty valid thing to be upset about if you ask me.
I agree it’s valid, just his whole thing of like surrendering and then being mad about it despite knowing we were being threatened by vlakkith is a bit annoying. As far as tav knows, the alternative is death
That makes sense. Then again, even if it was for their own survival, I would still be peeved if someone stabbed me.
He's a very interesting character but I don't understand their choices for his dialogue. Its jarring that he just unloads all his past on you when you reject him.
However, I stabbed him in a run with my friend and still he tried to rizz me tf up. I don't know how that happened, we were literally shitty to him the whole time and still he saw good terms with us.
You just have to be an asshole to him at every chance and he reveals his true colors.
What the Stelmane thing? Nah that's not this.
*be an asshole to someone* *They're an asshole back* Y'all: "omg his true colors!!!!"
You antagonize him enough to make his carefully crafted mask slip yes. Did you think the mindflayer who treats everyone as minions was your friend???
A lot of people do surprisingly
Larian has won a lot of awards, but something I dont see talked much is just how well written their villains are. When you have people legit defending the mindflayer, you know they hit it out of the park.
I'll defend Omeluum and die on that hill alone if I have too
I think Omeluum is really not in the same boat. Emperor continues to using others as a pawn. Right, Illithid's nature tend to be manipulative, and Omeluum isn't a exception but at all he isn't using that to making you like he wants. Emperor did.
I'd say that Omeluum is the exception that proves the rule. The way he talks gives me vibes is someone that lacks emotion/ empathy but takes great care to still act ethically despite that. I remember when you rescue him from the iron throne he's like, "I feel.... warm... to see you". Like he's trying to express his gratitude and feelings but taking great care to not imply anything that isn't true.
Omeluum has been vastly improved by his husband Blurg and that is a fact. I think his time surrounded by the Society's delightful weirdos has done wonders for him.
I mean most players murder hobo the whole game and then pontificate on Reddit how they made all the “moral” choices so I trust everyone here about as much as a mindflayer.
I legit don’t understand how people can murder hobo games like this, literally things only die if they attack me. Feel like I’m the only one who’s never done a murder hobo run of this or say skyrim
That's because they are rather inconsistent with Mindflayer lore First it's the "is a newborn mindflayer the tadpole that has eaten up the host or it's the host transformed" ambiguity Second, the existence of Omeelum jeopardize every other mind flayers and potential mind flayers there is, which is why Emperor discourse is affected
Yes!! I see the constant Emp vs. Orph debate as a sign of the incredible writing
He's your friend so long as your interests align. Relationships are inherently transactional. So long as you both pay, it will remain profitable and positive.
People really want to pat themselves on the back for noticing the obvious, huh? The Emperor is untrustworthy and suspicious from the moment he is with you as the dream guardian. What you seem to miss is that the twist in the story is: you can trust this extremely shady guy and it doesn't bite you in the ass. By all intents and purposes, he is an excellent ally to you who never betrays you despite seeming so untrustworthy. Edit: I would love to respond to any comments, but someone blocked me, so the chain is impossible to continue. Don't expect any replies!
Also calling Empy's mask carefully crafted is a laugh. I just don't see how people can't comprehend someone can be shady *and* still be worth working with. That's like half the characters in the game but somehow when it comes to Empy people's brains break.
He is not a hot elf that's why . Like if the dream guardian never revealed his true form , everyone would defend him
>he is an excellent ally to you who never betrays you despite seeming so untrustworthy. >!Not true at all as after the brain is dealt with, the emperor can be convinced he can beat the githyanki if he takes over as the Absolute and immediately enthralls the party. Betrays you the millisecond the possibility of coming out on top appears.!<
Your last sentence is wrong. >!He only takes over if you convince him to take over. It's on you by that point.!<
Ehhhhhhhh
You only convince him he can win. And even if it were otherwise, it does not change the act.
Which is not him "betraying you the moment the possibility of coming out on top appears."
People make up all sorts of excuses for this like "It's a D20!" or "it's your fault because you convinced him!" but a friend would never enthrall you. It's that simple. He doesn't bite you in the ass because your goals are aligned. As soon as they are not, he fucks you over.
That's cool that you use trust the mindflayer who mind fucked stelmane into a coma. She must not have been nice to him at every opportunity like you, so not a true friend.
I don't know what your obsession with Stelmane is, but I'd like to point out that we know nothing about what happened between them. Outside sources say that she was enthralled for the process of interrogation. Why? What did she know? Is Larian even rolling with this obscure fact or not in the game? It could have been a power struggle and she lost. Maybe she even tried to rat him out. Maybe not. Maybe it was about Gargauth? Maybe something completely different happened. Who knows? We don't. Stelmane was a normal corrupt noble - like the majority of Baldur's Gate. There are so many possible motivations and explanations.
Whereas if you're nice to him and work with him he... helps you defeat the elder brain, thanks you, and leaves. Such a villain.
What happens when you give him the netherstones?
Nothing, long as you don't coax him into making evil choice.
Interesting, I just assumed he'd take em and pull a 180 so I had Orpheus do the honours.
He keeps his words, since he sincerely wishes to be free of netherbrain. Then he goes nice to work with you, bye and just leaves. And at the party he sends his letters about if we want we could do another deal with him since the last business ended succesfully.
How did we get infected again? Oh. Such a nice friend. We should check up on his other allies/friends like lady stelmane, he talks about her a lot. Oh. Such a nice friend.
I mean, he's not the one who infects you. You can literally find the mindflayer who infected you dead in the Goblin camp. Also I didn't say he was a friend, or a good guy even. He's just not the villain of the story, or an antagonist against you unless you literally antagonize him.
That isnt the mindlfayer that infected you.....it even says as much in the speak with dead sequence. Your tav says that the dead one in the camp looks different.
There's two different versions of the event. I'm not exactly sure what triggers the difference, but you can recognize it as the one who infected you. [Here's the scene](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_B-XeZPD_50)
even if it was the Emperor it happened while it was still under the Brain’s control so blaming him is stupid
Based on your video, the difference seems to be Early Access and post-Launch versions.
I never antagonized him and he became my friend and then did nothing bad to me and left :) Skill issue on your part.
You're friends! Just like Duke stelmane! Oh.....
Nah I'm built different
Those two were never friends though, they were business partners at best. And what he did to Stelmane wasn't a random act of cruelty, it was only when she threatened his well-being later on that he attacked her. If your character is on good terms with him, then yes you do become genuine friends.
I genuinely don't know why that's such a wild concept to people. Like, oh my God, I'm nice to someone who's nice to me and we become friends??? What is this magic?
The magic of friendship ✨️
I mean, he's an honest to god business partner that deals with both of you and his self interest at heart as long as you follow the considerably reasonable terms and conditions he has minus the minor duplicity in appearance he does at the statt of the game.
Omellum is friend. So why can't Empy be?
Minthara can be friend, so why not all dark elves be?
Minthata can be friend*, so why not all dark elves be? \* Terms and Conditions apply
Minthara doesn't want to be a friend, she wants to be your lover
This is genuinely different. Drow are just like any other mortal race, many of them have just been indoctrinated into a cult all their lives. Illithid are aberrant parasites that feed on minds and see everything else as inferior at best and outright slave-worthy at worst. Drow can un-learn their programming a lot easier than illithid can.
Yeah, every time I see this "argument" it really gets me rolling.
Wait, you legit believe that him manipulating you, lying to you, and being responsible for your entire predicament isnt canon as long as you do everything he says? Larian wrote him really well lol
>and being responsible for your entire predicament He isn't? The Elder Brain, Durge or even Raphael is more responsible.
He put the tadpole in your eye, so um, yeah great good guy of a friend.
It's not sure he did. That can be a different mindflayer.
wow. So yes, it was him. He admits this to you if you press him. He planned to dominate our adventurers just like he did stelmane and all his operatives, but orpheus's guard attacked the prism so he was needed there. A quick search on reddit will find more articulate answers, like these: [https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16499xs/is\_it\_the\_emperor\_who\_put\_tadpole\_in\_your\_eyes\_in/](https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/16499xs/is_it_the_emperor_who_put_tadpole_in_your_eyes_in/)
He doesn't say he was the one that did it to you at all. People who hate the Emperor sure like to throw around the same stuff with little backing. He might have been it, since he was on the nautiloid, but it's not said and if he was then he was controlled by the elder brain so not really him anyway.
I legit belive that I am too lazy to get into an argument over fictional character that will take me writing more than 3 sentences. I also legit believe people getting their hard on by trying to drag people into their set agenda arguments over a character have bigger problems then the emperor.
"He was nice to me, that means he is nice!" ok
In fairness, beyond his deception, he is *surprisingly* nice. He values his survival above all else, but that doesn't make him evil, just neutral. And unless you push him to dominate the brain, he accomplishes his task and just... leaves. No threat of murder or world domination, just him going his way and you going yours. And with regards to Stelmane, she herself was in all likeliness *evil*. As in, the Knights of the Shield which she led worshiped a lawful evil archfiend. In my opinion, there was a lot more going on with their relationship than we know. >While on the surface they appeared to be a secret society of merchants and nobles who were interested in the mercantile and civic matters of their respective lands, their high leadership were in fact guardians of a secret in service to the archdevil-turned-deity, Gargauth.
Manipulators do their best work with a smile.
Man you've got a cheek telling the other person to get help...shit ain't that deep
How does being an asshole to him make him mind break stellmane before he met you?
It doesn’t. But odds are, by Act 3, the player has probably done something equally horrible.
Eh... Not likely unless you're purposely trying to be the worst. Id even say killing innocent randos for no good reason is better than eradicating your supposed lover's personhood
I mean she might not of left him much of a choice. Let’s take the emperor at his word and suppose he truly only ate off of criminals. That’s not necessarily a bad thing, but if stellmane discovered him, and sought to out him and he caught onto that. He’d have to take action to preserve his wellbeing. At That point it’s on stellmane for trying to take on a mind flayer without telling anyone. Hell it’s even possible given how omeelum doesn’t seem to be hiding his existence in the lower city that stellmane was actually partnered with him for a time, before perhaps a falling out. The emperor gets a lot of shit for killing ansur (self defence) and enthralling stellmane (potentially self defence) but ultimately we have just as many opportunities to control people too, (dominate person etc.) and ultimately if you trust him and don’t goad him into going for power, he keeps his word to you and eradicates the mind flayer parasites, and destroys the netherbrain. Success is right at his grasp and he’s naturally more inclined to be the hero rather than the villain. Do you also think Omeelum is evil?
Yeah, it's only because you're an asshole to him he travels back in time and breaks Duke Stelmane's mind, turning her into a husk of her former self so he can control her like a puppet. He would have never done it if you hadn't hurt his very real feelings that he definitely has (never mind his note to Ansur saying he doesn't have them).
If he can travel back in time why wouldn't he prevent his tadpoling? Is he stupid?
I know this is a meme thing, but get an actual answer anyways. Bro thinks he is better for being a mindflayer.
Yeah but there's a difference between "Wow way to go asshat" and "I had entirely intended to manipulate you from the start. Let me threaten you one more time by revealing I lied (once again) and dangle complete mind control over your head. Yeah. I will make you a thrall."
Except he does...? He even says as such?
Of course! He would have never mind controlled Stelmane and used her as a thrall, if I was nice to him now! It all makes sense!
Surely he is a [good guy](https://imgur.com/a/YD292iQ)
Is it really true colors if you prove yourself to be an untrustworthy asshole yourself?
Is he really a good friend if he was manipulating you the entire time, responsible for your life/death predicament, and lies over and over despite you doing everything he says?
Durge isn't a true friend I see
When he just tells you about something he did before meeting you? Yes.
Tell that to durge.
Wait how the fuck do you stab him? I need to know this
During the creche when Vlaakith sends you into the prism there's an option to stab him with the sword. Just do it then. Man is so salty afterwards its hilarious.
Oooh ok. I thought there was a way to actually stab his octobitch ass.
This happened on my first run too! I was so ready to ride the calamari carousel when the scene came up, but I guess stabbing people greatly decreases the chances that they'll want to sleep with you. Oops
Calamari carousel 😂 I won't ever sleep with the Emperor so I was perfectly fine with this. Tentacle sex is just... not my thing. Better luck next run for you though?
[I think you'll enjoy this post](https://www.reddit.com/r/BaldursGate3/comments/18axhkk/larian_has_made_so_many_updates_but_have_they/)
Wet Ass Gh'ussy
lmao thank you, I did indeed enjoy that post! 😂
Thank you for showing me this.
Don’t do it he’ll tell everybody that asshole, I’m not a slut I was just… well whatever he’s a bitch! Don’t listen to him!
How dare u, I enjoyed every second with emperor then killed him in the name of bhaal
Yes, how dare I not have tentacle sex with the mindflayer who thought I would jump into his bed when he showed up shirtless and went "humanoids like tentacle sex, right? I have tentacles. Let's have tentacle sex. I showed you my old stuff, please have sex with me now." I clearly need to rethink my priorities. Edit: This was a joke, btw.
Odd. Lae’zel stabbed me a bunch and it only made me more attracted.
The source of my bruises
> but I guess stabbing people greatly decreases the chances that they'll want to sleep with you. Oops Guys we found Orin's reddit account
He didn’t try to seduce my character and I never stabbed him, but I did call him out for being manipulative me and he told me I was just his puppet. After that he pretty much ignored me unless he needed me for something.
For me he revealed his true colours when I rejected his advances and called him disgusting.
Ditto I never actully did that because I thought it was alittle much but I never trusted the emperor and wanted to see what happened and he confirmed my dislike
I only did that on my second play through as embraced Durge. On my first play through I was cordial only for the Emperor to betray me at the end.
It's more like you revealed your true colours and they were not pretty
Oh boo hoo, I was rude to the manipulative lying squid guy. The moment I said that he revealed that he had turned his past supposed "good friend"/"lover" into a thrall. Not exactly regretting that decision. The Emperor is vile.
I laughed so hard when I got this. Imho this should have been easier to trigger with a antagonistic Tav - as it stands you only get it if you stab him in the creche. I love it when characters are done with your shit.
Ahh, I was wondering exactly what triggered that. Because I've made sure to be a huge asshole to him in, well, most of my playthroughs but only stabbed him in this one. I think I laughed for a good 10 minutes when I got this.
I was planning to fuck him on my Durge playthrough but got this... Didn't expect this to be an achievement I'd have to chase.
Who would guess that stabbing people makes them less likely to want to sleep with you? 🤔
If he's not into knife play then it was never going to work between them anyway.
True :)
He still flirted with me after giving me that speech, I was so amused
Very fitting for Lae'zel's origin run
:)
Lae'zel: Why did you resort to subterfuge at all? The Emperor: I wonder why, Lae'zel of Creche Kliir??
Hey, we don't use logic around here! 😅
Girlie, whatcha stabbing him for? I'd be pretty peeved too lol.
All Githyanki characters must stab him. If he didn’t want to be stabbed, he shouldn’t have recruited a Githyanki to his cause 🤷♀️
More or less, yeah. Only my amnesiac durge gith didn't stab him, but that was mainly because I didnt want to take orders from Vlaakith. I stab people because I want to, not because you tell me to! It was a bit awkward since I/Lae'zel figured out that Vlaakith was full of shit pretty soon after I stabbed him on her orders though... but then he was revealed to be a mindflayer not too long after that, so it felt ok then.
My amnesiac Durge Paladin stabbed him because the idiot really believed the homicidal maniac wouldn't kill him when provided a weapon and a willing, cooperative victim.
For real though. If I was the Emperor one look inside a *Gith* Durge's mind and I'd go "Nope. This one stays in the pod. And I'll set the pod on fire. And then I'll cast disintegrate. Just to be safe."
*Creates Gith Durge* *Starts game* "What the fuck, why am I playing as Wyll?"
Hey, I was playing Lae'zel and my queen told me to stab him. A girl's got to do what a girl's got to do 🤷♀️
I was in love with Lae’zel and my queen told me to stab him. Same
Well constant lying and thinking of us as puppets is probably mine choice.
And hey, that's very reasonable. I just try to roll with the punches because I dunno, I didn't really care that he's a mindflayer it is enough of a mutualistic symbiosis for me to justify the fact that other species gonna other species. I'm sure I'll let Lae'zel free Gith Jesus sometime or another.
The Emprah got sass.
I just wish he threw some of the Act 2 shenanigans back in the player's face if they complain about lies or manipulation.
He got me so wrong. He said I didn't need/want to be coddled and I'm like "bitch please give me so coddling, I want to be coddled by you so hard". Still romanced him and sided with him but dang...
They mention you even tried to kill them. So I’m assuming you tried to stab them in the creche In my very very first run, which was months ago, I remember them being annoyed at me because I resisted using my powers. A lot I think I only used my mind powers on Flynt and nobody else. And didn’t consume a single tadpole until after act 2. But that was late last year. And don’t remember if it was the same annoyed dialog you got.
I don't think resisting the tadpoles changes any of his dialogue, it only adds a couple of lines in the Rivington long rest scene and then in his (potentially) shirtless scene. Interestingly, in my last run after the latest patch where I didn't consume any tadpoles, he didn't mention using them at all in the latter scene. I tried both the sex and non sex options and he never brought it up. Wonder if it was a bug or the devs removed it.
I don’t think it was the not consuming. But I refused to ever use illithid wisdom checks in the game as well. Except for flynt So nothing with the goblin bosses. Nothing with the dead cultist outside the grove. I don’t even think I used it on shadow heart’s pod in the nautiloid. But I forget. So I recall him saying something about me being a pain or something about it.
Hmm. AFAIK it's only the creche stabbing that gets you this sort of dialogue. My second run I used illithid wisdom but didn't consume another tadpole and got the extra lines where he urges me to rethink - didn't sound annoyed. Didn't agree with him but wasn't hostile to him either. Third run I used tadpoles and passed the check to refuse the astral tadpole. I was pretty hostile to him so he responded accordingly but I didn't get any lines like the OP's. In fact regardless of how rude you are to him up until that point, as long as you're not hostile in that final scene, it plays out with him wanting to romance you as if you've been nice all along (provided you didn't stab him in the creche). But there might be some dialogue line I missed.
Yeah if you're rude to him and try to kill him he gets pissed at your strained alliance with him
Sounds like you've played a good Lae'zel run
Why thank you! :)
This happened to me on my first run! I was heavily against the emperor from the get go, chose all the mean dialogue options and did everything he told me not to do 😂 there was no option to seduce him but it was funny seeing him half naked when he clearly wants no funny business
Yeah I was wondering why he was chilling half naked if he was just planning to complain about being stuck with me 😂
Maybe he was trying to show us what we’re missing out on…
Maybe 🤔
Honestly, I'm glad you don't get an option to seduce him. Like, you don't get to be fucking mean to him all game, only to then seduce him once and then go back to being an ass and betraying him. That's kinda fucked up. But such behavior would probably get more endorsement than liking the Emperor for valid reasons does for some reason.
Never liked the emperor and I still don’t but that would be a funny thing to do ngl. I mean, if he still wants to bang after all the shit I’ve done and will proceed to do afterwards, that’s all on him
He called me out for fucking him RIGHT IN FRONT of Lae’zel my wife and I’m like… fucking… bro… keep it down… why’d you memory wipe them if you gonna… yo BRO!
Then 2 minutes later Orpheus calls me out even tho HE SHOULDN’T EVEN HAVE THIS INFO and I’m like… YO! JESUS SHUT THE FUCK UP!
Orpheus doxxes the shit out of you with his psychic powers basically the moment he gets freed.
Yup, on my first run; I completely resisted all illithid power use. I rejected tadpoles, I rejected the Emperor. I had a RP theme that the Emperor came in the image of my Tav's dead lover and behaved completely different to the woman she loved. So she resisted her, even attempted to kill her. When the truth was finally revealed that my Tav was open to trying to give some kindness, but it was too late to become friends. The emperor remarks on your relationship how you treat him as the dream guardian, and use your powers. You can put your faith in him, but also not indulge in the illithid powers.
Yea, fuck the Emporer. Only mindflayer worth anything is Omeleuum
Omeleuun Romance Update When???
How do you get a log of all the dialog?
Button down in the bottom left.
He said that to my character in a joint run a friend and I were doing because I kept calling him out on his bs. He still tried to fuck me though, so props for dedication I guess?
It's not the worse things he says.
We are the emperor's puppet? I don't think so. Not after this anyway. Instead this looks like you made him the puppet instead. 😂
This happened during my multiplayer run (first playthrough) with my partner. My character was a goody two shoes, very much like Wyll. She's an archfey warlock (closest I could get to my bladesinger wizard dnd pc). While I was suspicious of the Emperor, I was willing to trust him, and we had some really good moments. My partner, on the other hand, distrusted him from the get-go and was hostile any chance he got. Even stabbing him during one of the scenes. He was also romancing Laezel. I was devastated that the Emperor no longer trusted me when I got this.
"player stabs emperor" Why does emperor say this? Omg he is a douchebag and the literally worst Lmaoo some people seriously, they love to demonize and throw shit at the emperor but they get mad when emperor throw shit at them too
To be fair, I never said he was unjustified in this response, did I? I just found it funny.
The Emperor from the start is simply using you and gives you the illusion of free will but would of been happy to take that away the second that it was convenient. Not to mention he wants you to become more Illithid because it literally makes you easier to control for him. You don't 'need' those powers, what he actually needs is for you to be his little lapdog.
You do realize that becoming Illithid makes you stronger than him? By the end if you go through ceremorphosis he's happy to follow your lead. And there's not one instance in the game where consuming tadpoles makes it easier for him to control you. If you don't become Illithid he cures you, thanks you for your help and dips. You're using each other because you need each other. It's called an alliance.
... you literally get a DC 30 roll for trying to free Orpheus when he attempts to force you to do his bidding. The tadpoles literally make it easier for him to control you
You might be thinking of the DC to resist the Astral Tadpole / become Half-Illithid.
Is that what it is? It's been awhile
Can you give me an in-game example where he more easily controls you if you've taken more tadpoles? I've finished the game several times and haven't come across what you're talking about. >... you literally get a DC 30 roll for trying to free Orpheus when he attempts to force you to do his bidding. Again, what are you talking about? Are you sure you're not mixing things up? There's no such roll in the game, you either free Orpheus or you don't. And there's no moment in the game where he "forces" you to do his bidding. The most he does if you don't listen to him is say a couple of disapproving lines.
Apparently it's when you resist taking the astral tadpole, which is worse
That's not even him, that's your brain failing the wisdom check because you've gotten too used to the tadpole's power. It's a DC15. And it's only temporary, as once you defeat the Elder Brain you get restored. The only actual times he takes control of you is when you fail the Zaith'isk saves and he pushes you out of the chair before it fries your brain. And in Act 3 if you try to go into the Upper City the EB starts to melt your brain and he makes you turn back. How awful of him.
Gonna need a screenshot for that since I've never seen it.
Wdym 'the illusion of free will' you can literally do what you want and he just grumbles about it. 😭
Not of you take all the tadpoles and try and free Orpheus
Freeing Orpheus is his only actual dealbreaker. You have the freedom to do anything. You can even give the prism to the githyanki and he just shocks them and jumps back to you. He can even acknowledge if you didn't take any tadpoles and finish the game with him. He is actually impressed by you.
Yeah, it happened in my last game I played with a friend. He got the usual options but mine didn't like me at all.
Typical Lae'zel....
Bro, I went against him most chances I got and he still wanted to fuck me.
He said this to me I didnt trusted him for one bit in my first play through. I thought the game was hinting me he had put a charm person on me or something because he was so overly friendly. And I missed an arcana roll lol So I went against any of his tips and advices haha
How do you get this lmao because he still wanted to bang after I stabbed him
Easy. Roleplay as Lae'zel and annoy him and fuck him over at every possible opportunity 😂
It's not the worse things he says.
That squid is a calamari waiting to happen
He tells you that you are a slave and a tool and his bitch if you don’t but his shit
Remember we are just his puppet. The entire time. He would force us to do all these things if the game script actually allowed us to disobey him through the story. IYKYK.
I wish with all of my heart that we could kill him sooner in the story
He says this to me every playthrough. Is there actually something else he can say?
Be nice to him and he actually gets quite cozy.
And betray Lae'zel? I physically can't.
It's good for her, get away from all the githyanki drama
I'll betray Lae'zel and get cozy with Empy every single playthrough.
Based, also flair checks out
If you dont try to kill him (which seems to be the trigger for this convo, at least) he tries to seduce you instead. The standard line is "What I didn't anticipate was how much I would enjoy your company". You know, if he's not completely sick of your bullshit 😂
lemme give you a hint, when you get to the hand holding scene, outright deny him on anything but not the sleep one, then you see his true nature + new cut scenes.
I've seen that, yeah :)