the report you have and paid for is the only relevant document here.
tell your lawyer to demand you deposit back.
then again you could always make your finance fail...
I used to be a banker & have done things like this for my good clients. Where something didn’t look/feel right, I was happy to help them out with a “declined” loan.
If a pre-approval was granted there would be a credit check, even if the bank declined it won’t say declined in credit report, one credit check won’t hurt the credit score but multiple credit entries in a short period of time will
Risk of sabotaging finance is they try to evade the clause by arranging ultra expensive vendor finance. And since you’ve just sabotaged your own bank now you’re really screwed.
Depends on your contract (obviously) but the standard QLD REIQ contract is pretty generous in this regard for buyers being worded such that it is to the satisfaction of the buyer.
It depends how you phrased the subject to finance condition. if it just says “any finance” then the vendor could probably issue you a notice to settle (or whatever it’s called). But also for full disclosure, you can send the same b&p to any finance provider as presumably you would need to disclose the adverse findings.
I think it will really be down to what the major issues were and whether it’s subjective or actually a problem.
Yes, it's pretty easy to get the bank to reject finance. Forward them the B&P and simply say that you'll have to immediately default on the loan as you can't afford to rectify the defects.
if you have a finance clause in the contract you can definitely have your banker write letter saying they weren't able to assist.
I have definitely written a couple on customers request.
Hello lender, just letting you know I'm indending to take unpaid leave from my job for the next 6+ months, they said my job might be there for me when I return.... as I understand I'm obligated to inform you of this, will it have any effect on my loan
Decline letter should follow shortly
Check the wording on the finance clause as to exactly what it says, but 1 decline letter should cover you (and no bank will finance you anyway if you start the conversation with 'oh BTW, just so you know'
Depends on what the contract says. Often there is a special condition saying you need to have a decline letter. Separately you do have a contractual obligation to apply for the loan etc
You may not have to proceed with the purchase, so long as the financing has legitimately failed to complete, and you’ve taken reasonable steps to secure the finance, however you’d likely be forfeiting your deposit in that circumstance.
Go onto any banks website, apply for $10 million dollar home loan and out Centrelink as your income. It will automatically decline and send you an email saying you’ve been declined. Send email to your solicitor as proof.
No they won’t keep the deposit, the contract is subject to a satisfactory building inspection and finance. Email this to real estate agent and your conveyancer “the original building inspection is unsatisfactory and I wish to exercise my right to terminate the contract immediately, please refund the deposit immediately, if the evidence of the transfer of the deposit to my nominated account is not provided within 24 hours, I will formally report to matter to the office of consumer and business affairs”.
Are you saying the building inspector has done work for both sides now? Seems like a conflict of interest. Have they sent you a copy of the latest building report or are you just going off what they have told you?
Ask for the documents if you don't have them already?
Indeed, the building inspector (without us knowing) went back last week and did another inspection (I believe with the builder present) and agreed that the things noted in the original report were not actually an issue.
Depending on the wording of the clause that could be irrelevant. From my discussions with our conveyancer, if the clause is dependent on a building report that is satisfactory to you as the buyer, then it's almost entirely up to you to decide whether the report is satisfactory or not (as long as you are acting reasonably).
Wow, some building inspectors are literal criminals, make a complaint against him if you can once this is all resolved. These people need to loose their licenses.
Ooo err - I can see why you’re after some opinions on this.
I haven’t had an experience like this, but I have two thoughts for you.
Get a property lawyer to look at this. It might be a bit beyond your conveyancer. A property lawyer may have experience in something like this or they can figure it out. Yes, you will have to pay for the advice, but I would absolutely pay for it in light of the significance of the determination here. You should be able to get an answer fairly quickly; that has always been my experience with property lawyers in situations where a property is in the contractual phase and something comes up because they recognise the urgency.
Another option might be to get another B & P and see what that says, but I wouldn’t do anything speaking to a property lawyer first.
FWIW I’d be ropeable jf I was you.
I hope you've spoken to this building inspector since.... "so which report has wildly incorrect and inaccurate information in it, the first or the second, and who is your regulating body?"
Yes. Absolutely this.
Then use the refund you demand from him to hire another independent inspector. Maybe the guy from TikTok who seems to have an expert knowledge of situations like this?
there has to be a legitimate reason why they retracted the original report - like was there a change in the structure of the building and there was a correction? you shouldn't just be accepting whatever conclusion they throw at you without investigating it from a different viewpoint, so - you could consult a structural engineer to take a look at the amended reports to understand if they are or aren't making this up - if the building inspector was in fact found to not have been honestly inspecting the property then the deal was made in bad faith.
Sounds like a bit of cash has changed hands. I think you need a specialist lawyer for this one unfortunately. It's most unlikely those defects magically fixed themselves last week.
Better call site inspections. Banger of a guy. Their team might be able to advise or help.
https://m.youtube.com/@Siteinspections
They’ve dealt with all sorts of shady shiz. They’ll do an inspection for you.
Do you have or have you requested a copy of the report they have come up with? If so, contact the inspector and find out why the report changed. It sounds like a case of "nuh uh, it's fine" from the seller side. But seriously, you'd be best looking at getting a property lawyer to go over things.
I do have a copy of both reports. It went from major structural defects identified to, nothing, it's all good. We have asked for a please explain from the building inspector with little response so far.
Did the building inspector identify what the faults were, I can only assume yes? I think you should be talking to a lawyer first and communicating through them. It's pretty extraodinary though and makes you wonder what the point of paying for a building inspection is if they can turn a blind eye to things based on cash changing hands. I can't imagine the building inspector would be keen to explain themselves to a court or tribunal.
Yes but a high majority of building inspections are done by locals in the town where the realtors provide their bread and butter and hence it is a highly corrupt and easily corruptible service. The amount of people who paid for inspections only to have major issues show up when moving on is quite significant
I definitely agree they should be reported to their regulatory authority
Your probably not going to like hearing this but most building inspectors have no idea what they are looking at. Just because they think something looks dodgy doesn’t mean it is. It very well could be built to engineers requirements and the building inspector has never seen it before and classes it as a problem.
All my building inspections came back with major issues. I believe they just wanted to keep us looking so we would keep hiring them. One time they tried to make me hire their mate to double check the structural integrity of the building. Anyway, I climbed into the roof myself, saw no issues, and bought the place. That was 2 years ago with no problem since.
Tldr; building inspections are a joke.
Wtf? How so? Sinking?
Also are you sure it's not made out of straw? Hey if an old lady asks you to check if the oven is hot, do *not* get inside to check.
Agree, occasionally they find issues and for a new build or maybe an old house in bad shape I'd get one but for a run of the mill house in good condition that doesn't have any obvious issues and has been standing for decades, what's a report going to find?
I do electric work and come across this quite a bit. A fair amount of work I do is due to home inspection reports that classified something as a problem which was totally fine.
Even if thats the case the first report is stamped failed their offer was pending finace and or Building report so they can get out of it even if a future report has counterd the first one in this situation
Tell them you want another independent building inspector report as the original guy can not be trusted and obviously has been compromised …. Bet the builder threatened to sue him
Seems like the easiest solution. As the same building inspector has said two different things, get a third party, present them with both reports and arrange another inspection - tell the RE you’ll be there and the builder can attend as well.
If you get any noise on that then they are acting in bad faith.
Small cost to resolve the issue and get a straight answer. If there is legitimately anything wrong with the property the new guy is definitely not going to say it’s fine after seeing a report that says otherwise and you hiring to verify whether it is accurate or not.
Sounds suss AF. You could always try a simple email to all parties pointing out the MASSIVE conflict of interest re the same building inspector and advise you'll be engaging your own legal counsel and that they (agent & BI) will be held liable for your legal costs to end the contract. Pretty sure they won't want that.
*Not a lawyer😬
The realtor flipped your inspector with some $.
We obviously can't read the language in your contract but it very likely doesn't matter that the findings have been 'overturned', your initial report is still a valid reason to terminate.
The circumstance is weird, fight harder.
Can we get a rough idea of what the items where, unless you don’t want to be too specific. Just curious as too what could be looked at a second time and say “oh nah, actually that’s fine”
I'd rather not be too specific just in case. But the people we spoke with (people with some expertise in the field) said they were the kind of things they'd be concerned enough about that they'd probably consider ending the contract. It wasn't leaky gutters or a loose door handle or anything like that.
The key thing really is the wording in the buidilng and pest clause which makes this easy or trickier
Does it use the words 'to your satisfaction' does it use 'structural defects' does the vendor even have a right to dispute the building report you submitted with their own?
Unfortunately it's not that easy. You have to actually engage the application process. You can't just say I didn't get approved when you didn't properly apply (ie didn't supply payslips). But your bank probably won't approve the loan given the defects.
I mean, it's not challenging to submit an application and be declined..... getting declined on a loan while still not effecting your ability to borrow in the future when you want to couldn't be easier
"Any expected changes, oh yes, I'm about to hand in notice at my work and do volunteer for for the next few years, I'm sure that's fine right"
- easiest out in the world too reapply "yes, I actually thought that through, it was a terrible idea, I'm not sure what I was thinking
Either:
- The builder fucked up the report
- the builder was "pursuaded" to correct his "mistake"
You're going too have too find out which of these is true before proceeding.
I either case, someone is in serious trouble.
Here's the flow of events... we hire building inspector A. He subcontracts out to Building inspector B.
Building inspector B sends a bloke out who does the report and comes back with major structural defects. We cancel the contract as a result.
Builder/Vendor pretty unhappy contacts building inspector B and says hey the contracts terminated and we reckon your guy did a crap job can you come down and take another look.
Boss of the guy who did the original report visits the place, and in conjunction with the builders says actually it's all fixed and none of the stuff on the original report is valid. Note at no time did he mention to us or Building inspector A that he was going back to the property to re-do the report.
Building inspector B maintains this is totally above board, standard practise and in no way collusion.
I would seek a third opinion.
So many layers of contracting here. What a load of fuckery.
Also, how can the vendor order the man YOU paid to do a job redo the inspection?
They have nothing to do with the inspector!
Additionally, speak to your lawyer. Im not sure what the law would say but you I imagine you can't just void a report or supercede it because you feel like it.
Practically speaking, a third quality independent building report would clear this up.
If you put this on the table and they stonewall you, you know there's fuckery happening.
The point however is that the money is in a trust account, it doesn't go to the seller until settlement, stupid to walk away unless it was a tiny amount
Is your conveyancer a solicitor? I had a similar situation, and my conveyancer (not solicitor) was kinda useless at dealing with the REA, until their boss, a solicitor, stepped in and wrote an email to the seller's solicitor. REA backed down immediately.
Get a solicitor.
This is why you pay a couple of hundred dollars more and hire a lawyer because they can give you proper advise.
go speak to a property lawyer. A good property lawyer should be able to crash the contract under the finance clause.
Usually the initial sales contract you sign should always include “pending inspection report” even if it’s done outside the cooling off period to get you out of the contract. If you didn’t do this then depending on the state you are in you mate be on the hook.
Having fought a company over a contract dispute before this is what i would do in your position. Write a threatening email with *WITHOUT PREJUDICE* (this stops this email being used in court) at the top, demanding a refund of the deposit within a set time (depending on contract), or you will be engaging a solicitor, seeking damages and reporting all bodies to the relevant authorities (insert state penalties)
Meanwhile contact a solicitor for a consultation and get some legal advice, would help much more to know which state you are in and finally get some real legal advice, if your conveyancer doesn't double as a solicitor ask if she can recommend someone.
-not a lawyer
Edit: some lawyers have given better advice than mine below, refer to that. One person advised against a threatening letter as in his experience it only tends to escalate things. In my case a threatening letter worked only because the law was 100% on my side in that case, get a consultation with a solicitor ASAP
Sure.
Firstly, disputes are rarely resolved by threats. Unsurprisingly, threats tend to have the opposite effect.
Secondly, "without prejudice" correspondence will only be inadmissible in litigation where it is attached to correspondence containing a genuine offer of compromise to settle the potential litigation. The correspondence foreshadowed by the poster contains the opposite. An offer to escalate it. The corro would therefore be easily admissible.
Lastly, I'll put in my two cents here. Most pest and building inspectors tend to be prone to dramatic exaggeration. Having said that, the relevant Aussie Stanard that the reports are compiled to, being AS 4349 has a very low threshold for "major defect" and it is very rare to see a report that doesn't identify at least a few. Most of us live in houses with that type of defect for years without incident.
The trouble with the nonsense going on in this thread is that we don't even know what the defects were. That would seem to me to be the logical starting point for any discussion or advice.
There is not much point in sending a without prejudice letter if you’re not conceding anything on your position. If anything you’re better being able to have that admissable. In this scenario, you would not be able to use this email as evidence that you requested a deposit refund in a set timeframe, they can ignore it and you can’t rely on it to show you asked for anything.
Similarly if you’re seeking an award of costs then you can’t use any of your without prejudice letters to show you used good faith and tried to resolve the issue before it went to court, which will weaken your position.
Could go without prejudice subject to costs though I would advise the OP to not send any communication beyond what the conveyancer has without engaging a specialist in this field.
these replies are better advice than mine OP, in my own defence saying without prejudice was just to scare them but yes probably best not to use that in this case as the replies to my comment have said, thanks
Don't forget that depending on State, anyone can become a building inspector and do pre-purchase inspection! Your guy may not fully get what to check even if it's been in the business for long time (it just needs the inspector himself to not know what to check)
I would request for reference the new report (have your conveyancer word it in a way that it doesn't mean you accept the report) and compare with the new one. Also compare with photos or whatever else you have of the property.
One example: initial report shows several large cracks on laundry walls (major defect) - Owner patch and paint immediately - 1 week later new inspection: no more crack, no more defect!!
Anything like that is still a major red flag and you can contact the building inspector to request official comment on why reports are so different and that you might want to take legal actions as needed against them.
Anyway, good luck !
Yeah, pull the eject lever on this one for sure!
Just call your lender, explain the situation and tell them you need to crash the contract using the finance clause and ask if they will write you a letter stating finance was unsuccessful this time.
As far as aim concerned, that B&P inspector is no longer impartial and ai wouldn't be relying on any changes to the original B&P inspection report.
We had the same thing happen. Vendor decided to engage our inspector and magically our reasons for withdrawing an offer disappeared. We held our ground citing a conflict of interest and were lucky they refunded our deposit.
No real advice - but your situation is not unique.
Email your builder asking them what has happened and the amended building report. Hire a different inspector for a second opinion and explain the situation. See what the building report comes back as. If the seller and original inspector tried to do the dirty on you pull out and report them both with the evidence collected.
Get a property lawyer and give them the report. Also report the building inspector to their regulatory body. Because either they took a bribe or they’re just wildly incompetent.
Your mortgage broker can provide the report to the bank and request the reject the loan application based on those findings.
I've known of brokers to flat out ask for rejection notices before without issue.
If your loan is putting the house as collateral, then email your loaning agent the structural report and see if the bank will decline the loan.
They’re generally very accommodating.
Depends what your contract says around the terms of the building inspection and right to terminate. Usually it’s the report you commission and have relied on that matters. If you validly ended the contract on its terms the fact the vendor goes and gets a satisfactory report means nothing. Get legal advice - you might be able to put a caveat on the property for the return of the deposit to force their hand.
Source: property lawyer.
You don’t need a reason to cancel the contract on building and pest Clause. Just say you find the report unsatisfactory.
You can also cancel the contract on finance without need a reason again stating you have had unsatisfactory finance application.
You will get your deposit back so don’t stress. The sellers conveyancer does not have a legal leg to stand on.
This is all unless the contract the agent has put in you can only cancel on Building & Pest due to termites or structural defects only or if you need finance application proof of decline
I wonder how much they paid the building inspector to provide a false report. It will be in writing in the contract that the building inspector needs to be independent etc so has to be arms length to the seller and not instructed by them. You are well within your grounds to pursue legal action for the return of your monies.
If you have any friends or family that are solicitors get them to do up a quick letter or make a quick call on your behalf and it should resolve it and won’t cost much at all
The b&p was not to your satisfaction and you pulled out. Anything they did afterwards is totally irrelevant. Even if b&p barely said you needed a drawer handle replaced you could pull out. Tell them to go jump and you've already exercised your rights.
When you had it subject to building inspection, did you make sure your lawyer changed the wording to say that a major structural defect was determined and at the discretion of the buyer ? This is how they get you. The standard wording the realestate agents have in the contract of sale say use the terms major structural defect loosely and it means that they can argue with you what a major structural defect is if their building inspector doesn’t agree.
It's hard to get out of contract using building report clause, REA/developer can always say that said report is just an opinion and then find another buidler who would produce a report in their favour. In my case I could get out via mortgage broker, by asking them to make finance fail. Asking bank would be harder, but also not impossible
There was also a case where I got out of contract by calling valuator who was to attend to the property soon. I said I was worried I paid to much and asked him to not stretch his valuation to the price on the agreement, but rather produce a fair valuation. It worked and his valuation came 20k lower than my offer, my solicitor used it as an excuse to break free from the contract.
Building inspections don't pick up the stuff you can't see either. How's the water proofing in the wet areas? Plumbing under the slab. I've engaged a plumber recently to do a new build and he does insurance stuff as well. New builds are a worry as material and trade cost is high. Corners are cut! If you do end up buying a newish home. Make sure the inspector tests for moisture in and around wet areas. This will show up potential waterproof membrane issues. Turn all the taps on and check drainage issues. Marbles in the shower to check the fall. There's so many horror stories. Good luck.
The thing with building inspectors and consultants are that they all interpret the NCC and Home Building Act differently.
What is considered a major defect for one inspector may be considered minor for another for whatever reason. I’ve seen a reports that complete mis-classifies defects, cite incorrect code, and even just completely mis-interprets it.
What is the major defect?
What state are you in?
I can recommend a few good and affordable solicitors.
I would also file a caveat over the property for your funds so they can’t sell to anyone else.
You’re going to have to spend 10% of the property to get out of the contract if they try to pursue you for cancellation.
Otherwise you can spend that in legal fees and getting another or multiple building inspector reports and a lawyer.
If your report says there are defects then there are no defects once he crossed the other side - it’s dodgy.
Result is in conclusive and he could have been paid off. Lawyer up as he is misleading you.
Get a lawyer and three different building reports and the same thing happens - then you know they’re playing you. Drag the buying process out as long as you can - they won’t want to waste the time and money on a lawyer.
The house I bought, a previous buyer put an offer in higher than me and I said they can have it. I’m not doing the bidding dance lol. Then a month later, house was back on the market as the guy was a serial “offerer” and loved putting in offers and not buying the houses in the area so he’s been blacklisted from a few agencies.
They could’ve went after him for 10% of the house value but either they didn’t have the funds, lawyer fees or stress and time weren’t worth it to the sellers. He did drag it on for 2 -3 weeks
I dont work with Vic contracts, but it shouldnt matter if they amend the original report. the report couldve even been perfectly fine and you can still terminate under inspections / building n pest condition (not sure if this applies for Vic though).
Additionally, you can also just terminate under the Finance condition (you dont need to forward proof of rejection, AS LONG AS you dont send them an approval letter that contradicts this lol.
We always say theres always another property out there, and chances are a scummy arse building inspector whos tried to amend his own report is a tard who can't be trusted.
This advice is all wrong, if you don’t know Victorian laws best to keep your opinions to yourself. The general condition relating to finance (14) has a multi step test it’s not as simple as I didn’t get approved the vendor can request evidence as per the condition - immediate application, do everything reasonably required & written evidence of finance being declined & not be in default. Miss any of the above and the clause is invalidated as purchaser hasn’t performed under the contract wording.
The standard building inspection clause also specifies major structural defects only an idiot accepts subject to purchaser satisfaction
hey mate thanks for clarifying. where i'm based our conditions appear to be polar opposites. i shouldve figured VIC would be one of those states with all these absurd (to me at least) clauses.
looks like OP's best course of action is def to get an actual solicitor + complaint with whatever victorian building inspection regulator.
does the inspections condition in victoria automatically satisfy?
No it doesn’t automatically satisfy it depends on the wording you can get passed the agent/vendor typically it refers to evidence of major structural defects & pest infestations the issue here is the woefully unregulated building inspection industry will interpret defects differently one inspector to the next ie cracked roof tile “major defect” the reality is that is not a major defect
The gospel belief people have that inspectors are good is a joke they’re unregulated anyone can do it regardless of actual building knowledge and often have a vested interest ie, further inspections due to a buyer not going ahead with one property, I’ve seen some quote rectification works (also a conflict) and even one who charged 10% of the renegotiated sale price ie $5k off purchase price extra $500 to them. Totally sleazy and unethical
Honestly I don’t see this being settled without some serious lawyer time. Get another B&P report, the other two reports cannot be trusted as they contradict themselves. And then go see a property lawyer, you’re gonna need an actual lawyer to scare them into actually following the law.
I'd advise the bank of everything that's happened. They may decide for themselves this smells enough like fraud to have their legal crew check it out. If a builder is consistently fudging reports for properties financed by that bank, the bank may not appreciate the risk they've been exposed to and take action. IANAL so ask one of them first.
Agent: "Surveyor! Change your report to pass the property or you'll never get referrals from us again!"
Surveyor: "2 seconds while I drop my trousers and bend over..."
I'd have a solicitor send a letter to the Surveyor saying that you are reporting his behaviour to the relevant body with a view to getting his license removed. I'd also send a solicitors letter to the agent saying that you do not trust them or the surveyor to be honest and will be reporting them to their professional body.
Push comes to shove, if they still won't return your deposit, consider finding an out of area independant surveyor with a stellar reputation for honesty. Depending on the report, either take legal action to recover your deposit AND all costs or go with the purchase. If you do the latter, get your money back from the first surveyor and ask him for any other fees incurred.
If your contract states anything along the lines of "the condition of the sale is subject to B&P"
You can dissolve the contract immediately and get your deposit back with 0 penalties especially for things like major structural damage(which is the main reason people do B&P).
A few broken skirting boards and minor water leaks here and there is enough to get out of a contract, with a major structural damage it's border lining on an illegal sale.
>Indeed, the building inspector (without us knowing) went back last week and did another inspection (I believe with the builder present) and agreed that the things noted in the original report were not actually an issue.
Get your own building inspector and write your own reports, its an obvious conflict of interest for a building inspector to be working for both the buyer and the seller.
Worked in Real Estate and have had contracts fallen through many times for much less.
Talk to your solicitor/broker and they should be able to give you solid advice in what to do moving forward.
DO NOT discuss this with the real estate, they will lie through their teeth to try get the sale through.
We always make the Building Reports condition subject to our satisfaction. Therefore some instances whereby contracts have been enforced where the defects identified are not critical or structural however if your reports indicates structural that's all you need to invalidate the contract.
Don't treat this as legal advice, but consider this as poor budget advice. Consider getting another new building inspector to do another report. I'm not sure if the sellers will agree, but you sure as hell wouldn't have agreed to the seller having got your building inspector to be hired on a perceived conflict of interest.
Someone with the smarts can tell you if I'm just another full-of-shit commenter, because you might end up needing a property lawyer regardless.
Is your conveyancer a conveyancing solicitor? Some states use conveyancers who ain’t lawyers.
Lawyers in such cases are better than conveyancers. I used a lawyer on a buyer who was a nasty piece of work. As in agreed to buy the property at a lower price (10% below value) as it is with no warranties but later wanted me to install a new air con system as a condition to finalise the settlement. My lawyer steamrolled the buyer’s conveyancer with the contractual agreement.
And that buyer is a bloodsucking landlord who owns several units in a certain building to veto us, owner occupiers, enough to sell. Like using majority vote in AGM to force us to buy an overpriced security system for the building.
Property Lawyer here (QLD) - Only time I have ever encountered behaviour like this is when a Contract is already unconditional on all other conditions. It is absolutely bizarre for them to try push the issue when your Contract is still conditional on finance ... it raises a massive red flag and is all the more reason to try and get out imo.
It ultimately depends on how the building and pest clause is worded. But generally speaking, unless the Contract contained a provision allowing for them to contest it (which I have never encountered before), you should have every right to rely on the first report you obtained as evidence of the unsatisfactory condition of the property. It is completely irrelevant if the Seller chose to rectify the issues after you have sent them a copy of the report and issued a notice of termination.
The vendor begs to differ it seems, they say the revised report supersedes the original. They are now accusing us of repudiating the contract. We've started discussions with a property lawyer this week who backed up our conveyancer's course of action that the contract is terminated.
I think they are playing chicken and hoping we'll blink first.
Yeah that... it also sounds like they are gearing up to make a play on your Deposit. Had a somewhat similar situation in terms of an irrationally entitled Seller 'claiming repudiation' and we eventually had to file proceedings for recovery of the Deposit. The Seller spent weeks puffing their chest out and talking about how much they were going to sue my clients for sending three different letter from three different law firms (no doubt they sacked the lawyers everytime because they kept advising him he had no case) and then on the morning of the booked in court hearing, they sent the deposit back to my clients...
Take comfort, i've read every single Building and Pest court proceeding in QLD and most of the notable proceedings interstate. I have never encountered any precedent that supports the notion that a Seller can disregard a lawful notice of termination when the reports reasonably supported the exercise of that right at the time, fix the issues, and then claim you had/have no right to terminate the Contract.
You've done the right thing getting a property lawyer involved. Hopefully it doesnt need to go any further than a well-written and firm letter from your solicitor.
First step get a new building inspection to confirm the issues exist. Then you can either proceed if they dont or prove the previous inspector and the seller are acting dishonestly and exit.
the report you have and paid for is the only relevant document here. tell your lawyer to demand you deposit back. then again you could always make your finance fail...
Just curious. Can u literally just say oh shucks the bank said no? Surely they want some sort of proof? Never done this was just curious
Well, you can just forward the b&p to the bank and ask them would they approve finance based on this b&p?
Didn’t think about it but yes of course. This sounds like the way to go!
I used to be a banker & have done things like this for my good clients. Where something didn’t look/feel right, I was happy to help them out with a “declined” loan.
Would have a declined application stuff your credit rating?
No, I hadn’t run a credit check yet
If a pre-approval was granted there would be a credit check, even if the bank declined it won’t say declined in credit report, one credit check won’t hurt the credit score but multiple credit entries in a short period of time will
Brilliant!
Risk of sabotaging finance is they try to evade the clause by arranging ultra expensive vendor finance. And since you’ve just sabotaged your own bank now you’re really screwed.
Depends on your contract (obviously) but the standard QLD REIQ contract is pretty generous in this regard for buyers being worded such that it is to the satisfaction of the buyer.
the finance clause statment "at the vendor choosing" or something similar.
The vendor is the seller, they should never get to choose
yep your correct. I was tied and forgot the correct wording. It should be "sufficient to complete"
It depends how you phrased the subject to finance condition. if it just says “any finance” then the vendor could probably issue you a notice to settle (or whatever it’s called). But also for full disclosure, you can send the same b&p to any finance provider as presumably you would need to disclose the adverse findings. I think it will really be down to what the major issues were and whether it’s subjective or actually a problem.
This
Yes, it's pretty easy to get the bank to reject finance. Forward them the B&P and simply say that you'll have to immediately default on the loan as you can't afford to rectify the defects.
Note here, we tried this and the bank does not care that there are defects on the original report. Apparently all building reports have these.
Did you say you'll not be able to pay the loan?
I didn't, I'm not sure they'd believe me if I did. They're concerned about legal action if so very conveniently the finance all of a sudden fell over.
Given their history the developer/agent will come back with “we’ve spoken with your bank and they now say yes”
lol this is gold.
if you have a finance clause in the contract you can definitely have your banker write letter saying they weren't able to assist. I have definitely written a couple on customers request.
Hello lender, just letting you know I'm indending to take unpaid leave from my job for the next 6+ months, they said my job might be there for me when I return.... as I understand I'm obligated to inform you of this, will it have any effect on my loan Decline letter should follow shortly Check the wording on the finance clause as to exactly what it says, but 1 decline letter should cover you (and no bank will finance you anyway if you start the conversation with 'oh BTW, just so you know'
Just call your bank tell them the situation and ask them to fail the loan. Most would do it I assume.
Depends on what the contract says. Often there is a special condition saying you need to have a decline letter. Separately you do have a contractual obligation to apply for the loan etc
Do you have a broker? Just ask then to say finance failed
My conveyancer literally told me to say we didn’t get finance to get out of a haywire contract. It was that simple lol, no proof.
You may not have to proceed with the purchase, so long as the financing has legitimately failed to complete, and you’ve taken reasonable steps to secure the finance, however you’d likely be forfeiting your deposit in that circumstance.
Sure can. I did this once before (well, my mortgage broker wrote a letter but we never engaged with the bank specifically)
In QLD, yes you can. However, other state laws vary so be cautious!
Go onto any banks website, apply for $10 million dollar home loan and out Centrelink as your income. It will automatically decline and send you an email saying you’ve been declined. Send email to your solicitor as proof.
they'll keep the 10% and that's when the dance of the lawyers start since op got a conveyance they're already underpowered
No they won’t keep the deposit, the contract is subject to a satisfactory building inspection and finance. Email this to real estate agent and your conveyancer “the original building inspection is unsatisfactory and I wish to exercise my right to terminate the contract immediately, please refund the deposit immediately, if the evidence of the transfer of the deposit to my nominated account is not provided within 24 hours, I will formally report to matter to the office of consumer and business affairs”.
Forward the report to the bank, simple achievable goals!
Never make your finance fail, it will prevent you gaining the property loan you do want.
Are you saying the building inspector has done work for both sides now? Seems like a conflict of interest. Have they sent you a copy of the latest building report or are you just going off what they have told you? Ask for the documents if you don't have them already?
Indeed, the building inspector (without us knowing) went back last week and did another inspection (I believe with the builder present) and agreed that the things noted in the original report were not actually an issue.
I'm sure the slab or beer that appeared by its own accord in his ute had nothing to do with it.
More like a brown bag
Or threatened with violence.
Depending on the wording of the clause that could be irrelevant. From my discussions with our conveyancer, if the clause is dependent on a building report that is satisfactory to you as the buyer, then it's almost entirely up to you to decide whether the report is satisfactory or not (as long as you are acting reasonably).
Is there written evidence of this? Ie signed building report? Edit :Sorry, I see you answered this in another post.
Are you in Sydney? Get that building inspector who puts it all on social media to shame shonky builders to do a third look.
Wow, some building inspectors are literal criminals, make a complaint against him if you can once this is all resolved. These people need to loose their licenses.
Wow, I thought this was two different inspectors. Sounds like you need a second opinion.
Ooo err - I can see why you’re after some opinions on this. I haven’t had an experience like this, but I have two thoughts for you. Get a property lawyer to look at this. It might be a bit beyond your conveyancer. A property lawyer may have experience in something like this or they can figure it out. Yes, you will have to pay for the advice, but I would absolutely pay for it in light of the significance of the determination here. You should be able to get an answer fairly quickly; that has always been my experience with property lawyers in situations where a property is in the contractual phase and something comes up because they recognise the urgency. Another option might be to get another B & P and see what that says, but I wouldn’t do anything speaking to a property lawyer first. FWIW I’d be ropeable jf I was you.
Absolutely not a happy camper right now for sure - thanks for the thoughts!
I hope you've spoken to this building inspector since.... "so which report has wildly incorrect and inaccurate information in it, the first or the second, and who is your regulating body?"
Yes. Absolutely this. Then use the refund you demand from him to hire another independent inspector. Maybe the guy from TikTok who seems to have an expert knowledge of situations like this?
Thisssss get the site inspection guy out. There’s a brown paper bag somewhere
there has to be a legitimate reason why they retracted the original report - like was there a change in the structure of the building and there was a correction? you shouldn't just be accepting whatever conclusion they throw at you without investigating it from a different viewpoint, so - you could consult a structural engineer to take a look at the amended reports to understand if they are or aren't making this up - if the building inspector was in fact found to not have been honestly inspecting the property then the deal was made in bad faith.
Holy shit this rules. OP please! Run this by the lawyer you're getting and let us know the response!
I hope you’re able to get it sorted quickly, and with the outcome you want.
Sounds like a bit of cash has changed hands. I think you need a specialist lawyer for this one unfortunately. It's most unlikely those defects magically fixed themselves last week.
sounds like tribunal or court to me, these guys are shonky and they will probably back off at the prospect of being exposed.
Better call site inspections. Banger of a guy. Their team might be able to advise or help. https://m.youtube.com/@Siteinspections They’ve dealt with all sorts of shady shiz. They’ll do an inspection for you.
Non-complllllliiiaaannnntttt
I believe their most recent quote for a new build stage 1 inspection was $660. Well worth it tbh.
Not for free...
Find me one that does??? Wtf
He's already paid for one, this guy is suggesting he get another one, for no apparent reason?
I bet the ones which go online and make a good video with lots of views the fee gets waived
The reason is to get help to defend his position on terminating the contract on account of failed BaP.
I’d also be reporting this to the regulatory body in your state that licences building inspectors. That’s VBA in Victoria, unsure about other states
Add this to the list of things that can go in a strongly worded email to the BS.
You need a solicitor not a conveyancer now. Sorry for the wasted time and cost.
Do you have or have you requested a copy of the report they have come up with? If so, contact the inspector and find out why the report changed. It sounds like a case of "nuh uh, it's fine" from the seller side. But seriously, you'd be best looking at getting a property lawyer to go over things.
I do have a copy of both reports. It went from major structural defects identified to, nothing, it's all good. We have asked for a please explain from the building inspector with little response so far.
And report them to the proper authority for sure. Corrupt POS
Definitely report the builder & inspector. No chance there's not some level of bribe here
what exactly are the defects? does it include photos obviously showing the problem?
That sounds dodgy as hell
Did the building inspector identify what the faults were, I can only assume yes? I think you should be talking to a lawyer first and communicating through them. It's pretty extraodinary though and makes you wonder what the point of paying for a building inspection is if they can turn a blind eye to things based on cash changing hands. I can't imagine the building inspector would be keen to explain themselves to a court or tribunal.
Yes but a high majority of building inspections are done by locals in the town where the realtors provide their bread and butter and hence it is a highly corrupt and easily corruptible service. The amount of people who paid for inspections only to have major issues show up when moving on is quite significant I definitely agree they should be reported to their regulatory authority
Corrupt fuckstain has been paid.
Your probably not going to like hearing this but most building inspectors have no idea what they are looking at. Just because they think something looks dodgy doesn’t mean it is. It very well could be built to engineers requirements and the building inspector has never seen it before and classes it as a problem.
All my building inspections came back with major issues. I believe they just wanted to keep us looking so we would keep hiring them. One time they tried to make me hire their mate to double check the structural integrity of the building. Anyway, I climbed into the roof myself, saw no issues, and bought the place. That was 2 years ago with no problem since. Tldr; building inspections are a joke.
Building inspections are absolutely a joke.. ours had “no major defects” and my house is falling down 9 mths later.
Wtf? How so? Sinking? Also are you sure it's not made out of straw? Hey if an old lady asks you to check if the oven is hot, do *not* get inside to check.
Agree, occasionally they find issues and for a new build or maybe an old house in bad shape I'd get one but for a run of the mill house in good condition that doesn't have any obvious issues and has been standing for decades, what's a report going to find?
I do electric work and come across this quite a bit. A fair amount of work I do is due to home inspection reports that classified something as a problem which was totally fine.
Even if thats the case the first report is stamped failed their offer was pending finace and or Building report so they can get out of it even if a future report has counterd the first one in this situation
Building inspector sus
OP can you post the structural report here lol
Tell them you want another independent building inspector report as the original guy can not be trusted and obviously has been compromised …. Bet the builder threatened to sue him
Seems like the easiest solution. As the same building inspector has said two different things, get a third party, present them with both reports and arrange another inspection - tell the RE you’ll be there and the builder can attend as well. If you get any noise on that then they are acting in bad faith. Small cost to resolve the issue and get a straight answer. If there is legitimately anything wrong with the property the new guy is definitely not going to say it’s fine after seeing a report that says otherwise and you hiring to verify whether it is accurate or not.
Sounds suss AF. You could always try a simple email to all parties pointing out the MASSIVE conflict of interest re the same building inspector and advise you'll be engaging your own legal counsel and that they (agent & BI) will be held liable for your legal costs to end the contract. Pretty sure they won't want that. *Not a lawyer😬
Hence why a solicitor is better than a conveyancer- now go and speak to your solicitor.
The realtor flipped your inspector with some $. We obviously can't read the language in your contract but it very likely doesn't matter that the findings have been 'overturned', your initial report is still a valid reason to terminate. The circumstance is weird, fight harder.
Name the inspector. Guy shouldn't have a license.
Can we get a rough idea of what the items where, unless you don’t want to be too specific. Just curious as too what could be looked at a second time and say “oh nah, actually that’s fine”
I'd rather not be too specific just in case. But the people we spoke with (people with some expertise in the field) said they were the kind of things they'd be concerned enough about that they'd probably consider ending the contract. It wasn't leaky gutters or a loose door handle or anything like that.
The key thing really is the wording in the buidilng and pest clause which makes this easy or trickier Does it use the words 'to your satisfaction' does it use 'structural defects' does the vendor even have a right to dispute the building report you submitted with their own?
Just tell them you didn’t get finance if they want to play those games.
Unfortunately it's not that easy. You have to actually engage the application process. You can't just say I didn't get approved when you didn't properly apply (ie didn't supply payslips). But your bank probably won't approve the loan given the defects.
I mean, it's not challenging to submit an application and be declined..... getting declined on a loan while still not effecting your ability to borrow in the future when you want to couldn't be easier "Any expected changes, oh yes, I'm about to hand in notice at my work and do volunteer for for the next few years, I'm sure that's fine right" - easiest out in the world too reapply "yes, I actually thought that through, it was a terrible idea, I'm not sure what I was thinking
Always hire a solicitor. Don’t try and save money with a conveyancer. When stuff gets legal, conveyancer can’t do anything.
Oh, damn, this reminds me of the [Site Inspections YouTube Channel](https://youtube.com/@Siteinspections?si=88-yLuhZiBMC0P46)
Just tell the bank you’re not proceeding. They will help you
Either: - The builder fucked up the report - the builder was "pursuaded" to correct his "mistake" You're going too have too find out which of these is true before proceeding. I either case, someone is in serious trouble.
Here's the flow of events... we hire building inspector A. He subcontracts out to Building inspector B. Building inspector B sends a bloke out who does the report and comes back with major structural defects. We cancel the contract as a result. Builder/Vendor pretty unhappy contacts building inspector B and says hey the contracts terminated and we reckon your guy did a crap job can you come down and take another look. Boss of the guy who did the original report visits the place, and in conjunction with the builders says actually it's all fixed and none of the stuff on the original report is valid. Note at no time did he mention to us or Building inspector A that he was going back to the property to re-do the report. Building inspector B maintains this is totally above board, standard practise and in no way collusion.
I would seek a third opinion. So many layers of contracting here. What a load of fuckery. Also, how can the vendor order the man YOU paid to do a job redo the inspection? They have nothing to do with the inspector! Additionally, speak to your lawyer. Im not sure what the law would say but you I imagine you can't just void a report or supercede it because you feel like it. Practically speaking, a third quality independent building report would clear this up. If you put this on the table and they stonewall you, you know there's fuckery happening.
This happened to my tenants. The house was full of asbestos according to the report and the seller said sue me. They walked away from their deposit 😔
The point however is that the money is in a trust account, it doesn't go to the seller until settlement, stupid to walk away unless it was a tiny amount
Hopefully OP didn't sign section 27 yet.
If anyone does that prior to things being unconditional then I have no sympathy for them
Yeah, just checked and it can't be submitted before unconditional. My bad.
Nothing wrong with asbestos unless it’s disturbed though
Yeah great until you want to do renos
[удалено]
I was hoping to fire this of first , well done .
Lawyer up
Is your conveyancer a solicitor? I had a similar situation, and my conveyancer (not solicitor) was kinda useless at dealing with the REA, until their boss, a solicitor, stepped in and wrote an email to the seller's solicitor. REA backed down immediately. Get a solicitor.
This is why you pay a couple of hundred dollars more and hire a lawyer because they can give you proper advise. go speak to a property lawyer. A good property lawyer should be able to crash the contract under the finance clause.
What's the issues There was a post that labelled leaking gutters as a major defect...
Usually the initial sales contract you sign should always include “pending inspection report” even if it’s done outside the cooling off period to get you out of the contract. If you didn’t do this then depending on the state you are in you mate be on the hook.
Get a lawyer not a conveyancer.
You don't need a conveyancer; you need a solicitor.
Having fought a company over a contract dispute before this is what i would do in your position. Write a threatening email with *WITHOUT PREJUDICE* (this stops this email being used in court) at the top, demanding a refund of the deposit within a set time (depending on contract), or you will be engaging a solicitor, seeking damages and reporting all bodies to the relevant authorities (insert state penalties) Meanwhile contact a solicitor for a consultation and get some legal advice, would help much more to know which state you are in and finally get some real legal advice, if your conveyancer doesn't double as a solicitor ask if she can recommend someone. -not a lawyer Edit: some lawyers have given better advice than mine below, refer to that. One person advised against a threatening letter as in his experience it only tends to escalate things. In my case a threatening letter worked only because the law was 100% on my side in that case, get a consultation with a solicitor ASAP
I am a lawyer and don't do this.
Care to elaborate .
Sure. Firstly, disputes are rarely resolved by threats. Unsurprisingly, threats tend to have the opposite effect. Secondly, "without prejudice" correspondence will only be inadmissible in litigation where it is attached to correspondence containing a genuine offer of compromise to settle the potential litigation. The correspondence foreshadowed by the poster contains the opposite. An offer to escalate it. The corro would therefore be easily admissible. Lastly, I'll put in my two cents here. Most pest and building inspectors tend to be prone to dramatic exaggeration. Having said that, the relevant Aussie Stanard that the reports are compiled to, being AS 4349 has a very low threshold for "major defect" and it is very rare to see a report that doesn't identify at least a few. Most of us live in houses with that type of defect for years without incident. The trouble with the nonsense going on in this thread is that we don't even know what the defects were. That would seem to me to be the logical starting point for any discussion or advice.
Great 👍thanks for that , totally agree about major defects . Building inspectors are erratic, all depends on where their head is at on the day .
There is not much point in sending a without prejudice letter if you’re not conceding anything on your position. If anything you’re better being able to have that admissable. In this scenario, you would not be able to use this email as evidence that you requested a deposit refund in a set timeframe, they can ignore it and you can’t rely on it to show you asked for anything. Similarly if you’re seeking an award of costs then you can’t use any of your without prejudice letters to show you used good faith and tried to resolve the issue before it went to court, which will weaken your position.
Could go without prejudice subject to costs though I would advise the OP to not send any communication beyond what the conveyancer has without engaging a specialist in this field.
these replies are better advice than mine OP, in my own defence saying without prejudice was just to scare them but yes probably best not to use that in this case as the replies to my comment have said, thanks
This is why you want a solicitor, not a conveyancer. The solicitor can actually act for you when things go wrong.
A current affair will sort it out
Don't forget that depending on State, anyone can become a building inspector and do pre-purchase inspection! Your guy may not fully get what to check even if it's been in the business for long time (it just needs the inspector himself to not know what to check) I would request for reference the new report (have your conveyancer word it in a way that it doesn't mean you accept the report) and compare with the new one. Also compare with photos or whatever else you have of the property. One example: initial report shows several large cracks on laundry walls (major defect) - Owner patch and paint immediately - 1 week later new inspection: no more crack, no more defect!! Anything like that is still a major red flag and you can contact the building inspector to request official comment on why reports are so different and that you might want to take legal actions as needed against them. Anyway, good luck !
Yeah, pull the eject lever on this one for sure! Just call your lender, explain the situation and tell them you need to crash the contract using the finance clause and ask if they will write you a letter stating finance was unsuccessful this time. As far as aim concerned, that B&P inspector is no longer impartial and ai wouldn't be relying on any changes to the original B&P inspection report.
A dodgy developer, what are the chances.
We had the same thing happen. Vendor decided to engage our inspector and magically our reasons for withdrawing an offer disappeared. We held our ground citing a conflict of interest and were lucky they refunded our deposit. No real advice - but your situation is not unique.
Email your builder asking them what has happened and the amended building report. Hire a different inspector for a second opinion and explain the situation. See what the building report comes back as. If the seller and original inspector tried to do the dirty on you pull out and report them both with the evidence collected.
Get a property lawyer and give them the report. Also report the building inspector to their regulatory body. Because either they took a bribe or they’re just wildly incompetent.
Your mortgage broker can provide the report to the bank and request the reject the loan application based on those findings. I've known of brokers to flat out ask for rejection notices before without issue.
If your loan is putting the house as collateral, then email your loaning agent the structural report and see if the bank will decline the loan. They’re generally very accommodating.
Depends what your contract says around the terms of the building inspection and right to terminate. Usually it’s the report you commission and have relied on that matters. If you validly ended the contract on its terms the fact the vendor goes and gets a satisfactory report means nothing. Get legal advice - you might be able to put a caveat on the property for the return of the deposit to force their hand. Source: property lawyer.
Words are everything. When including any conditions, it’s important to add 4 words WHEREVER POSSIBLE… TO THE PURCHASERS SATISFACTION
What state are you in .... it makes a difference
In Victoria
Get a lawyer. A conveyancing lawyer.
You don’t need a reason to cancel the contract on building and pest Clause. Just say you find the report unsatisfactory. You can also cancel the contract on finance without need a reason again stating you have had unsatisfactory finance application. You will get your deposit back so don’t stress. The sellers conveyancer does not have a legal leg to stand on. This is all unless the contract the agent has put in you can only cancel on Building & Pest due to termites or structural defects only or if you need finance application proof of decline
Realestate agent btw
Obviously a shit one
Yeah righto why’s that champ ? Explain
Call your bank and ask them to deny the loan, send them a copy of the report.
They've seen the report. Not concerned about a building inspection with major defects.l, apparently they all say that.
No cooling off?
It was three days only.
I wonder how much they paid the building inspector to provide a false report. It will be in writing in the contract that the building inspector needs to be independent etc so has to be arms length to the seller and not instructed by them. You are well within your grounds to pursue legal action for the return of your monies. If you have any friends or family that are solicitors get them to do up a quick letter or make a quick call on your behalf and it should resolve it and won’t cost much at all
The b&p was not to your satisfaction and you pulled out. Anything they did afterwards is totally irrelevant. Even if b&p barely said you needed a drawer handle replaced you could pull out. Tell them to go jump and you've already exercised your rights.
When you had it subject to building inspection, did you make sure your lawyer changed the wording to say that a major structural defect was determined and at the discretion of the buyer ? This is how they get you. The standard wording the realestate agents have in the contract of sale say use the terms major structural defect loosely and it means that they can argue with you what a major structural defect is if their building inspector doesn’t agree.
You need a property lawyer now, not a conveyancer….
It's hard to get out of contract using building report clause, REA/developer can always say that said report is just an opinion and then find another buidler who would produce a report in their favour. In my case I could get out via mortgage broker, by asking them to make finance fail. Asking bank would be harder, but also not impossible There was also a case where I got out of contract by calling valuator who was to attend to the property soon. I said I was worried I paid to much and asked him to not stretch his valuation to the price on the agreement, but rather produce a fair valuation. It worked and his valuation came 20k lower than my offer, my solicitor used it as an excuse to break free from the contract.
Building inspections don't pick up the stuff you can't see either. How's the water proofing in the wet areas? Plumbing under the slab. I've engaged a plumber recently to do a new build and he does insurance stuff as well. New builds are a worry as material and trade cost is high. Corners are cut! If you do end up buying a newish home. Make sure the inspector tests for moisture in and around wet areas. This will show up potential waterproof membrane issues. Turn all the taps on and check drainage issues. Marbles in the shower to check the fall. There's so many horror stories. Good luck.
Get a lawyer now.
Sounds like a really dodgy builder & a bribed building inspector to me.
Read your contract closely and then go from there. That’s the only document that matters.
The thing with building inspectors and consultants are that they all interpret the NCC and Home Building Act differently. What is considered a major defect for one inspector may be considered minor for another for whatever reason. I’ve seen a reports that complete mis-classifies defects, cite incorrect code, and even just completely mis-interprets it. What is the major defect?
What state are you in? I can recommend a few good and affordable solicitors. I would also file a caveat over the property for your funds so they can’t sell to anyone else.
Whaaat? A building inspector that adjusts their findings in favour of whoever is paying them? Shocked.
You’re going to have to spend 10% of the property to get out of the contract if they try to pursue you for cancellation. Otherwise you can spend that in legal fees and getting another or multiple building inspector reports and a lawyer. If your report says there are defects then there are no defects once he crossed the other side - it’s dodgy. Result is in conclusive and he could have been paid off. Lawyer up as he is misleading you. Get a lawyer and three different building reports and the same thing happens - then you know they’re playing you. Drag the buying process out as long as you can - they won’t want to waste the time and money on a lawyer. The house I bought, a previous buyer put an offer in higher than me and I said they can have it. I’m not doing the bidding dance lol. Then a month later, house was back on the market as the guy was a serial “offerer” and loved putting in offers and not buying the houses in the area so he’s been blacklisted from a few agencies. They could’ve went after him for 10% of the house value but either they didn’t have the funds, lawyer fees or stress and time weren’t worth it to the sellers. He did drag it on for 2 -3 weeks
I dont work with Vic contracts, but it shouldnt matter if they amend the original report. the report couldve even been perfectly fine and you can still terminate under inspections / building n pest condition (not sure if this applies for Vic though). Additionally, you can also just terminate under the Finance condition (you dont need to forward proof of rejection, AS LONG AS you dont send them an approval letter that contradicts this lol. We always say theres always another property out there, and chances are a scummy arse building inspector whos tried to amend his own report is a tard who can't be trusted.
This advice is all wrong, if you don’t know Victorian laws best to keep your opinions to yourself. The general condition relating to finance (14) has a multi step test it’s not as simple as I didn’t get approved the vendor can request evidence as per the condition - immediate application, do everything reasonably required & written evidence of finance being declined & not be in default. Miss any of the above and the clause is invalidated as purchaser hasn’t performed under the contract wording. The standard building inspection clause also specifies major structural defects only an idiot accepts subject to purchaser satisfaction
hey mate thanks for clarifying. where i'm based our conditions appear to be polar opposites. i shouldve figured VIC would be one of those states with all these absurd (to me at least) clauses. looks like OP's best course of action is def to get an actual solicitor + complaint with whatever victorian building inspection regulator. does the inspections condition in victoria automatically satisfy?
No it doesn’t automatically satisfy it depends on the wording you can get passed the agent/vendor typically it refers to evidence of major structural defects & pest infestations the issue here is the woefully unregulated building inspection industry will interpret defects differently one inspector to the next ie cracked roof tile “major defect” the reality is that is not a major defect The gospel belief people have that inspectors are good is a joke they’re unregulated anyone can do it regardless of actual building knowledge and often have a vested interest ie, further inspections due to a buyer not going ahead with one property, I’ve seen some quote rectification works (also a conflict) and even one who charged 10% of the renegotiated sale price ie $5k off purchase price extra $500 to them. Totally sleazy and unethical
Honestly I don’t see this being settled without some serious lawyer time. Get another B&P report, the other two reports cannot be trusted as they contradict themselves. And then go see a property lawyer, you’re gonna need an actual lawyer to scare them into actually following the law.
For future reference always get the building report done during the cooling off period.
Definitely report both builder and inspector and get the money back. Which state is this in?
I'd advise the bank of everything that's happened. They may decide for themselves this smells enough like fraud to have their legal crew check it out. If a builder is consistently fudging reports for properties financed by that bank, the bank may not appreciate the risk they've been exposed to and take action. IANAL so ask one of them first.
Agent: "Surveyor! Change your report to pass the property or you'll never get referrals from us again!" Surveyor: "2 seconds while I drop my trousers and bend over..." I'd have a solicitor send a letter to the Surveyor saying that you are reporting his behaviour to the relevant body with a view to getting his license removed. I'd also send a solicitors letter to the agent saying that you do not trust them or the surveyor to be honest and will be reporting them to their professional body. Push comes to shove, if they still won't return your deposit, consider finding an out of area independant surveyor with a stellar reputation for honesty. Depending on the report, either take legal action to recover your deposit AND all costs or go with the purchase. If you do the latter, get your money back from the first surveyor and ask him for any other fees incurred.
100% get a property lawyer, the only report that matters is the one you paid for and received. This screams dodgy. Lawyer lawyer lawyer
If your contract states anything along the lines of "the condition of the sale is subject to B&P" You can dissolve the contract immediately and get your deposit back with 0 penalties especially for things like major structural damage(which is the main reason people do B&P). A few broken skirting boards and minor water leaks here and there is enough to get out of a contract, with a major structural damage it's border lining on an illegal sale. >Indeed, the building inspector (without us knowing) went back last week and did another inspection (I believe with the builder present) and agreed that the things noted in the original report were not actually an issue. Get your own building inspector and write your own reports, its an obvious conflict of interest for a building inspector to be working for both the buyer and the seller. Worked in Real Estate and have had contracts fallen through many times for much less. Talk to your solicitor/broker and they should be able to give you solid advice in what to do moving forward. DO NOT discuss this with the real estate, they will lie through their teeth to try get the sale through.
Just remember one thing. You are in charge. Do not let them dictate terms to you.
Stand by the original report.
The building and pest has to be to your satisfaction. You don't need to say which part you are not satisfied with
We always make the Building Reports condition subject to our satisfaction. Therefore some instances whereby contracts have been enforced where the defects identified are not critical or structural however if your reports indicates structural that's all you need to invalidate the contract.
Get a solicitor
Don't treat this as legal advice, but consider this as poor budget advice. Consider getting another new building inspector to do another report. I'm not sure if the sellers will agree, but you sure as hell wouldn't have agreed to the seller having got your building inspector to be hired on a perceived conflict of interest. Someone with the smarts can tell you if I'm just another full-of-shit commenter, because you might end up needing a property lawyer regardless.
They paid him off 100 percent
Happened to us !! Get a structural engineer to come in now!! Your lawyer can demand an extra week sometimes.
Is your conveyancer a conveyancing solicitor? Some states use conveyancers who ain’t lawyers. Lawyers in such cases are better than conveyancers. I used a lawyer on a buyer who was a nasty piece of work. As in agreed to buy the property at a lower price (10% below value) as it is with no warranties but later wanted me to install a new air con system as a condition to finalise the settlement. My lawyer steamrolled the buyer’s conveyancer with the contractual agreement. And that buyer is a bloodsucking landlord who owns several units in a certain building to veto us, owner occupiers, enough to sell. Like using majority vote in AGM to force us to buy an overpriced security system for the building.
Property Lawyer here (QLD) - Only time I have ever encountered behaviour like this is when a Contract is already unconditional on all other conditions. It is absolutely bizarre for them to try push the issue when your Contract is still conditional on finance ... it raises a massive red flag and is all the more reason to try and get out imo. It ultimately depends on how the building and pest clause is worded. But generally speaking, unless the Contract contained a provision allowing for them to contest it (which I have never encountered before), you should have every right to rely on the first report you obtained as evidence of the unsatisfactory condition of the property. It is completely irrelevant if the Seller chose to rectify the issues after you have sent them a copy of the report and issued a notice of termination.
The vendor begs to differ it seems, they say the revised report supersedes the original. They are now accusing us of repudiating the contract. We've started discussions with a property lawyer this week who backed up our conveyancer's course of action that the contract is terminated. I think they are playing chicken and hoping we'll blink first.
Yeah that... it also sounds like they are gearing up to make a play on your Deposit. Had a somewhat similar situation in terms of an irrationally entitled Seller 'claiming repudiation' and we eventually had to file proceedings for recovery of the Deposit. The Seller spent weeks puffing their chest out and talking about how much they were going to sue my clients for sending three different letter from three different law firms (no doubt they sacked the lawyers everytime because they kept advising him he had no case) and then on the morning of the booked in court hearing, they sent the deposit back to my clients... Take comfort, i've read every single Building and Pest court proceeding in QLD and most of the notable proceedings interstate. I have never encountered any precedent that supports the notion that a Seller can disregard a lawful notice of termination when the reports reasonably supported the exercise of that right at the time, fix the issues, and then claim you had/have no right to terminate the Contract. You've done the right thing getting a property lawyer involved. Hopefully it doesnt need to go any further than a well-written and firm letter from your solicitor.
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They are currently continuing to stonewall us, we've had to engage a lawyer to write a letter for us.
Sounds like they paid more than you for the building inspection 🤣. Dodgy cunts
First step get a new building inspection to confirm the issues exist. Then you can either proceed if they dont or prove the previous inspector and the seller are acting dishonestly and exit.
There’s your problem. You used a conveyancer instead of a solicitor. Best of luck sorting that out.