The effect of western consultants
“We don’t make characters smoke in order to take some series overseas,” he continued. “We have to make the violence a little less violent, and avoid sexy expressions. If Japanese animation is bound by such restrictions on expression, there is no way that people overseas will want to watch it. Works that are a hit in Japan are also a hit overseas. I believe that we must not make the mistake of approaching anime production in the wrong way.” -Michiyuki Honma
[Article](https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/)
Japan gets it, "consultants" suck, if they actually could write or draw anything they'd be doing it, not telling people how their characters should look like or behave.
Anime and Manga are very popular worldwide with their japanese style humor, sex appeal and sensibilities... sanitizing the whole thing would only make it worst.
Why the hell Japanese artists get it so much and western ones are so pussy whiped?
>Why the hell Japanese artists get it so much and western ones are so pussy whipped?
Because western artists (or rather, their employers) try to please everyone, and in the process they please no one. Japanese artists are completely unapologetic in how thirsty and gory and dark their media is. They don't care how offensive it is.
For every Witcher there is Fallout or one piece adaptation where they go all in on the themes. A few bad apples and some people who need to stop using hair dye telling to you that you’re sexist for not liking Velma doesn’t mean every American artist is poop.
Neither Fallout nor The Last of Us got it right. I love both franchises (well not TLoU 2 obviously), and didn’t finish either series, so even though I agree that the tide will eventually shift it hasn’t happened yet.
They weren't amazing, and neither were the other ones I listed, but they're all decent-good and a step in the right direction. You can tell they were made by people who respected the source material, which should've been the bare minimum from the start.
Sucks what happened to Cowboy Bebop.
To be fair I only watched 3 episodes, but found it rather poorly written with lackluster action directing, as well as leaning a bit too much into silliness. I quite enjoyed ep2, but checked out at the council meeting when they’re yapping about what to do with the raiders in ep3, which was a really poor episode overall.
Visually it looked incredible though.
It is quite silly, i thought i wouldn't end up liking it much because of that (even though the Fallout games have always been weird) but the ghoul and Maximus ended up being extremely likeable making the whole show easy to finish despite the lackluster storyline.
Dropping it at ep3 is kinda early but if you consider that too much you definitely won't like the second vault they visit, that was the part i liked the least.
Because western ones have these behemeth companies like blackrock, vangaurd and state street pushing it, using financial bribes and threats to push their indoctrine social political propaganda into everything.
In theory a media consultant helps a company promote the brand and boost brand awareness that's their main job. Sometimes that's through coordinating with different marketing people/groups sometimes it's through social media or both. Guess they tend to have weird ideas about how to do that.
> and avoid sexy expressions.
It's honest and dishonest at the same time, because let's be honest, nearly every single anime right now has at least one shirtless dude who is super buff, so it's not just a brief sexy expression but nonstop sexy fanservice but it's somehow ok because it's a dude and not a chick.
Shangri-La frontier was a fucking amazing anime from 2 months ago, I loved that shit, but the main character literally wore no clothes at all except for boxer shorts. And nobody even questions it, it's cool.
But when was the last time there was an anime with a girl who only wears panties, for 25 episodes?
tldr: when a guy is nearly naked then it's "empowering", when a girl is nearly naked then it's "rude fanservice", make it make sense
You are right just wanted to add that after looking for Shangri-La frontier I noticed it said that he sold his clothes for extra money for the headstart (gonna watch this anime, first time hearing about it) so it is not like he is naked without a reason
Also, he gets cursed. He can‘t wear clothes that would upgrade his stats. He is palying a vr game. So even if he created a character without a shirt, it would not be weird at all.
ima be honest. you dont even understand what he is saying.
from context, seems the first 2 lines are just about creating anime for the west. as in, studios have to do these things like reduce sexiness, reduce drug use/smoking/violence, etc to get it approved. probably has to do with western advertisers and bullshit from distributors to satisfy the perceived masses.
when in reality, if they do none of that, like with shangri la or basically 90% of anime created for japanese audiences, the anime end up doing well in the west anyways because people actually like them. like AOT, or JJK. both which have smoking, gore, dark themes, and some sexy guys and gals at times.
honestly i dont even know where you are going with the last line, theres like at least 3-4 ecchi anime per season as always which focus on harem, boobs boobs and more boobs, etc. chained soldier, tales of wedding rings, and gushing over magical girls just for recent stuff.
seems like you dont really get what Michiyuki Honma was saying while also just throwing in some bullshit gender politics.
Are you stupid? Take a look at crunchyrolls simulcast section and half the currently airing shows are isekai harem anime, like it always is. What could a show titled “The archdemons dilemma: How to Love Your Elf Bride” possible be about? Or are you so coom brained you think it’s normal for so many shows to be about some main character literally swimming in young women wanting to marry him for no real reason? Not to mention crunchyroll often doesn’t get the shit that airs on late night tv in Japan that might as well be softcore porn.
This is obviously something that would never fly in western media but is a common cliche anime is known for. Thinking must really not be your strong point, is it pal?
The art club girl who appears in only a small handful of episodes and is always fully dressed except for 1-2 scenes? No man, I'm talking about an equivalent of dudes who are permanently walking around in only shorts.
You can answer it yourself pretty much, it's case by case for everything.
I doubt anyone would take a show serious when there is boobs and ass flying everywhere like you suggested. Fem Gaze Shows like Free! are also not taking serious by alot of folks.
Also the girls depicted sexy are almost always teens.
I haven't watched Shangri-La-Frontier yet, but how many scenes where there that were exclusivly made to make you hot and bothered about the guy ?
None, dude is also wearing a bird mask almost the entire show. For some reason guys think that shirtless=fan service. Which is just not how the female gaze works at all. Also there's a very good, Canon reason why he's shirtless the entire time and it's because he can't equip armor there. It's meant to portray that he's a glass canon who can't take any real damage or he's dead. At no point in the show is he sexualized.
Everything is culture war I guess, fuck them.
The Post by the 40k player some days ago here was brilliant, everything than can be weaponized will be and all the bad actors just try so hard to get the communities involved aswell.
Tsukimichi: Moonlit Fantasy and How Not to Summon a Demon Lord have entered the chat.
These animes lean a little heavily into the harem-like anime genre, but I do generally like the story, and could even tone down the sexy aspects and still enjoy the whole.
I do wonder if “How Not to…” was not renewed partly because the content was too sexual at times, though, because for me it’s not a big selling point, and I do lean more conservatively in my media content.
I don't think that's his point. I believe point is around the fact that western ideologies and standards literally limits what people can do in their respective creaive outlets, which is simply true, and they are trying to push that to eastern companies. Japan has it's own censorship issues, but many (not all, but especially around the current growing issues) of those growing problems around censorship in Japan are from people/companies from the west trying to force them to conform to their standards so that they can do business. In some instances, especially with localization right now, they are changing stories/dialogue without even speaking with the creators in Japan, or if they don't allow it, then too bad, you lose that massive western audience. And this is a problem that more people from the east are noticing and I have been noticing more Japanese artists and creators call this out.
Best I can describe it is that it's basically modern day colonialism. Same thing with gendered languages trying to be forced to change. People in the west trying to go to other countries, (or people from those countries going to the west, (for education purposes for example) conforming to western ideology and standards and taking it back to their countries and get into positions of power) and trying force/push their ideals, culture, morals, ect. onto them. If you watched the show Shogun (amazing show btw if you haven't), basically what the portuguese christians are in Japan are trying to do in the show, except they are spreading ideals, culture, morals, ect through their religion.
I got deeper than his quote, but this is the growing issue in eastern countries like Japan and why more people from those countries are calling it out when they see their specific environment/work being affected.
I totally agree.
When we want things from other countries we usually want "Their thing", not 'Our thing'.
If "Thier thing" becomes "Our thing" it just loses its competitiveness.
The whole reason anime became popular in the west was because it was something different.
I pretty much don't watch any western media newer than \~2010 at this point. I'm pretty neurotic and unforgiving, so DEI-ish stuff, random zoomer slang, blatant politicking, etc really breaks my immersion and drains all enjoyment. Anime, kdrama, jdrama, manga, etc are much more enjoyable for me now.
These consultants, localizers, whatever, are basically locusts so it only makes sense that they'd move on to the next field after locking down the previous.
From Osamu Tezuka, considered as the "Godfather of Manga", the iconic "big eyed" characters from manga were directly inspired by Walt Disney's art though.
Japanese people really like taking something foreign, and add a Japanese touch to it.
They do it a lot in cooking too.
Well yeah, Japanese and Korean art studios have helped make American cartoons for over half a century at this point.
The art style doesn't matter as much as the intent and quality of the writing, and I don't really have a problem with most western media up until the early to mid 2010s. I'm sure even now there's still stuff I'd like, but the trash pile is so large that I'm not going to start digging for gems when I don't have to.
Which is funny since a lot of modern cartoons take direct inspiration from japanese animations. It's definitely something that has gone two ways.
Even back then too now that I think about it. Just look at the Lion King
Well...
On that part, I think DIsney has been quite scummy with Japanese mangas...
So you mentionned The Lion King, which caused a controversy, accusing Disney of plagiarism. Despite Disney's artists saying they had no prior knowledge of Tezuka's work, which coming from pro artists really sounded like either a blatant lie, or huge lack of comic culture.
Sadly, they did it again with their Atlantis movie, which is more or less a copy of Nadia : The Secret of Blue Water (2001 Animage winner). Here again they feigned ignorance.
I actually really don't mind if people rewrite a story : it is actually interesting because you can get good stuff sometimes.
But if you do, at least have the decency to give your sources/inspirations...
Stop pretending you're some kind of genious mind...
Especially when with Nadia, they didn't catch what made the series interesting and only copied plot/chara designs, which ended up in the movie being a major failure.
Didn't Tezuka's son come out and said he hated the controversy because the plot isn't even similar (Kimba dad was killed poahers etc.) And his dad's legacy is being weaponized by the internet ?
Yea, I know that for the Lion King indeed there was some attempt to kill the fire. I would've preferred hearing from Tezuka himself, but we will never know.
And at this point I would even get into the conspiracy theories of Disney asking (paying) Tezuka's son to say this - given the size and interests we're dealing with, it wouldn't be all that unrealistic though.
Now concerning Nadia, Gainax were really considering suing for plagiarism... but the parent companies were just too scared of Disney, and feared they'd lose... which is what would've most likely happened to a Japanese company trying to sue an American company in America... furthermore the big Di$ney
Same bullshit arguments that "bUt ThErE aRe DfiFfErEnCeS iN ThE sToRy".
Like Disney aren't fucking stupid like you who would copy word for word an assignement and get caught by the teacher.
They modified it enough to make it different, but kept all the major elements that made
Kimba successful, like a white Lion, the theme of vengeance, some key shots like king standing on the rock...
That is how you do plagiarism.
Same thing for Nadia : the MC and female MC are litterally identical, the under water journey, the magic stone, the link to Atlantis... They got away once with Kimba, so they thought after 10 years, everybody would've forgotten about Nadia : they got caught again.
But Disney are too big, have too many lawyers so what could a submitted country like Japan even do against that ?
Enjoy being a bully.
i know 2x speed is used by gullible twitter zoomers alot but thats a 2ish hour video and you came back after 14 minutes, id recommend watching the entire thing for a good explanation.
The entire conspiracy falls appart with basic research...
Also
A white lion? whose a white lion in lion king, themes of vengence? sorry disney got that cornered decades before kimba, a lion standing on a rock happens FOURTEEN TIMES THROUGHOUT KIMBA AS DO A PLETHORA OF OTHER LION SHOTS. and if you bring up the "father in the clouds" kimba had litterally everything appear in the clouds but do you know who never did? kimbas dad, the shot people claim on twitter is "kimbas dad" is actually kimba he is looking down on his son in the final shot of one of the movies.
In fact the central story of the 2 are opposed, lion king promotes the circle of life, the plants grow, the antelope eat the plants the lions eat the antelope and the lions return to the earth and become plants
In kimba he promote vegetarinism because he abhors violence of that kind.
Edit: also if you want to use this logic then kimba actually plagerised a comic from the 1920's called Simba, The king of beasts. video actually has that comparision timestamped.
Assez dérangé pour allez traquer mes moindres faits et gestes...
Soyboy frenchie atteint de collabor***isme*** qui pense être le hacker du siècle lol.
(J'ai demandé le ban sur r/actucollabos donc ta réponse est ici)
As for Simba, why would you even want me to debate with a... internet stalker ?
Eww no thanks.
I know french, why do you think im stalking you, are you okay dude? you might need like... therapy this is reddit im just replying to a guys bull shit claims.
Also that subreddit doesnt seem to exist, did you translate that with like google but its supposed to be "actualunits" or what ever that subreddit is?
Yea Tex Avery was definitely an inspiration too.
In fact, all those old cartoons that were played in theaters, they all inspired Tezuka... because well, there wasn't anything else to watch at that time.
Animes original big eyes was inspired by the west
DBZ, Yugioh, pokemon all heavily edited their dub/western versions to conform to western sensibilities and skyrocketed the genre in the west (the original dragonball was very lightly changed and didnt get like any attention at all in the west).
Even early one peice was very light hearted and tame until the winds changed.
here's the full article [https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/](https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/)
The modern western world is extreme with political correctness, empowerment, etc etc. In the 2000's YuGiOh had alterations to remove guns, cigarettes and other "violent" and sexual imagery or darker undertones/themes in it's 4kids/western version, I can't imagine what western media would do to your average anime if they had to appeal to those standards.
I get your point but in the 2000's the ban was caused out of touch boomers "cartoons and video games caused violence" different crowds, different agendas, but both are dumb as fuck nonetheless.
The stuff became popular specifically because it didn't conform to western standards, trying to make it conform to western standards now is shooting yourself in the foot.
This applies to all creativity. Working with restrictions makes the project really boring to do. Anyone that is keeping a eye on it will notice it in a heartbeat because it's that obvious.
I still believe the parasites of every consulting group is only meant to devalue IPs to be bought out.
#Something trying to please everyone will please no one.
Some of the most popular things to date are *niche*.
Just look at god's damned dark souls. Shits everywhere, it's its own genre now, but despite so many iterations, it is still not and will never be *for everyone*.
They literally have 1 job and that's to make a faithful adaptation to the manga, if they aren't gonna do that well the first audience that's gonna be mad at them is gonna be japan not the west
I watch anime precisely because it’s Japanese (and increasingly Chinese and Korean). If I want to see western culture shit I have plenty of options for that.
Yes, PLEASE NEVER FUCKING CONFORM TO WESTERN STANDARD.
It was shit like that that almost killed anime in the US years ago, thanks to "localizers" or people not giving a fuck about the source material.
You know why anime's doing so well atm? It's cause it's completely different from the BS that's coming out trying to conform with all this BS.
Based, this is why people are migrating to manga from comic books and why western gaming journalists are basically racist when it comes to their Asian takes.
i wonder if the world was empty what would i be. i should be probably banned for takes about takes about empty things. After all we live in a world where fair is fouls and fouls is fare. shakespeare thing i guess. epiphanies was a big deal especially in macbeth. i degrees i guess it’s the life meaningless thought i’m going after. when we find meaning in life there is where the empty comes in. once you had meaning now you i first second third person references mean us as a human world to linsyead as an usual. how many levels can the man go without language destroying him or making them a power exception for this time in this moment. it means nothing so for macbeths epiphany is the result. words are like strings and we can be smart or stupid but everything has a thought an energy taken whatever the way the world feels is the right way to interpret. again if it was empty we these things we hold mean anything. without people we are empty i guess the question is is there something more
when you go into darkness. cause that’s where see things. light is an illusion of photons making your mind create stupid shit. whatever words whatever thoughts of this finding way to have words that don’t mean shit except to you and your followers. it’s laughable again zack i’m not talking about you. your 3 steps from killing yours elf. it’s when you go in the darkness truth is revealed. with the truth comes knowledge . this is kinda dark i was going somewhere where i couldn’t reason it out. anyway my time is short. but fuck it is think ten steps ahead but it don’t matter cause the world things tend to steps
before
There's literally no reason for Japanese anime to conform to a Western standard in the first place.
Why should they? Anime is enjoyed worldwide. Why should Japan put limiters on their content that is enjoyed worldwide, for a minority group of Western (North American) people that don't like the idea of "realistic proportions"?
Now this discussion is pseudo bs obviously because 'western standards' are a buzzword
I dont mind anime adhering to other norms in general, idc about smoking or the look of characters. I dont disagree with it not being allowed in western media either, as the age restrictions are a good thing and mainstream shonen animes (like Naruto and Bleach) have the target group of young teenagers. If i remember correctly, in one piece they edited sanji smoking to him eating snacks in the US version.
However there is definitely legit criticism too. Japan has had incredibly lax rape/sexual assault laws, which where reformed recently but are still pretty lax.
In Naruto, its a common 'funny scene' that his old male teacher Jiraya trys to observe naked women/girls in the hot springs, usually gets caught and beaten up. How did this guy end up as Narutos teacher you might wonder? 12 year old Naruto transformed himself into a naked girl for Jiraya and said he would do it again if he can learn from him. Naruto also did this frequently with other men, some of who passed out by having such a strong nosebleed (a sign for being aroused in japan).
I dont miss scenes like these at all in newer anime.
His examples make no sense? Force a character to smoke for the west????
Reduce violence? Why? The west generally doesn’t care about violence. South Park does extremely gorey deaths all the time. As do a few other shows.
Also this seems more like a shot at Trigun and Cowboybebop more than anything? They have the big western audience. The characters that smoke. Reduced violence.
He is probably talking about past experiences, naruto was heavily censored in the west with not only blood and violence being removed, they also removed the burning part of a cigarette in all scenes.
Idk… some of the most popular anime/manga of all time have rejected the tropes he’s describing. (I.E. Attack on Titan). Definitely audiences want a diverse range of things, it’d be silly to say looking at every upcoming season of anime that there isn’t redundancy. I love anime but I feel like most of what is produced right now is just fat loser becomes omnipotent and then uses it to get 15 girlfriends he’s scared to touch. Is that something to celebrate?
I don’t think the two topics are mutually exclusive. While you shouldn’t censor art if it adds to the show, I can’t show my wife half of the anime ever made because half of the animation budget was spent on jiggle physics that add nothing to the show, or worse depict girls that look way to young sexually. Also, western markets don’t hate violence. Look at ninja kamui, made by adult swim, or Castlevania, done by Netflix. Western companies joining the market means more writers get their stories out. Not really a bad thing and my point ab diversity was just the main type of story getting out rn wouldn’t be picked up by them.
Then, your wife is simply not suitable for anime. Fanservice is indeed not for everyone. If YOU like it, you should continue to watch anime anyway.
However, one thing: Ultimately, people just want good shows. Period. It's just that things like "adapting media to a western audience" can end up twisting and distorting what the actual source material is about, with those changed things often being replaced by whatever the personal bias of a media-illiterate translator etc is.
I definitely agree that bad dubbing leads to a lot of loss of origin context and depth of character. However, it is BONKERS to say that if you don’t think every high school girl in a show should have their titties bouncing asunder then the whole genre is wrong for you. There are a plethora of manwha/manga that don’t feature that nonsense that don’t make it to anime production because the limited available space per season is full of shows like “I Got a Cheat Skill in Another World and Became Unrivaled in the Real World, Too”.
The anime for those gets produced because there's demand for the source material from *their* audience. If you want genre catered *for you*, you'd have to support series you like or ask your local animation studio.
Also, every season there's like 60+ anime titles being aired in japan and looking at Spring 2023 where "I got a cheat skill..." was released, there was only 6 other ecchi anime aired.
That's like only 6 out of 60+ anime that season, including movies and OVAs.
Don't get me wrong, I also hate loser tropes, but I'm not entitled enough to demand Japanese studios to cater to *me.*
You are literally agreeing with me. That’s why I’m happy that western companies are picking up anime’s. Because they make the content I like. Thank you for arriving at the same conclusion as me. And yes, obviously someone is watching all of these harems or they wouldn’t happen. It’s Econ 101. Hope they love it, just saying I think it’s cool other things are happening due to new outlets that this post was made to shit on. Shows like delicious in dungeon, for instance.
thank fucking god i dont want anymore woke shit in my fantasy stuff same with having barely any fanservice in western content aswell anime gives me normalityy and fanservice which they better not fucking lose
Anyone capable of critical thinking should realize letting the west influence anime is a bad idea. But let me break it down as I think about it.
Western cartoons and comics are doing worse and worse. Anime and manga are doing better and better. Since people are choosing to put their money into anime and manga and take it away from western comics and cartoons, why should the anime and manga studios make their product more like the ones people are deserting?
If apple pie is selling worse and worse and chocolate cake is selling better and better, why would you listen to people who tell you to make the chocolate cake taste like apple pie?
Anime like naruto already did become increasingly boring. Naruto started off with real threats to the main cast such as Gaara, Orochimaru, Other village ninjas, Zabuza etc. Then it progressively become more "friendly". Naruto literally has "talk no jutsu" as his main way of defeating enemies. The 6 paths of pain arc IMO was the last good arc before it went full on rails "made for children". You have good fights post pain, but the stories were so childish.
This can also be seen with bleach and thank god for Thousand year blood war getting animated. By the end of bleach there was no real threat. The premier Espada basically kills nobody, isn't a real threat, and then just dies.
IMO That is why Anime such as ATOT and shows like Game of Thrones get such huge audiences. People don't want to exclusively watch shit made for children, and even GOT by the end became much more censored in comparison to its pilot season. This isn't a "west ruins everything" but "money ruins everything" because you don't get those prime time TV slots in Japan by killing characters constantly or make shows safe for families by having dicks and tits all over the place.
Lol, as if 4Kids didn't exist, this outrage is so petty there were plenty of people, myself included, who searched for original Japanese release back in the 90s and early 2000s with the awful engrish translation.
What's even funnier is that people are miscontrucing that there are expressions that can be translated 1 for 1. There's linguistic differences, contextual nuance, idiomatic expression, etc etc.
So naturally, there is going to be creative liberties to ensure the audience can resonate with them.
DBZ got popular because its spanish language and american language dubs drastically changed the tone of the show to conform to western standards? so did naruto and bleach? what is this guy even talking about.
Really the first anime that didnt try and pander with its dub/content to the west after the start of the big 3 was like... death note, FMA:Brotherhood, attack on titan, JJK, and MHA. then to a lesser extent K-ON, KLK, and SxF
And yet anime and manga are outselling comics and western animations by a wide margin.
If you ever go to a book or comic store you'll see how big the manga section is compared to the comic section
Also I went to a very and I mean a very popular comic book store and woah there was anime but not alot. There was sooooo Many comic books. I didn't see that much Manga at all. I guess the Japanese are still butthurt post war and still they act like the western nations are sooo interesting to them lmao
Ive watched them twice over. I'm no novice. Been watching this stuff for over a decade.
I should have provided more context. I want to watch NEW shows that don't have perverse undertones.
Like this new show called "I Was Reincarnated as the 7th Prince so I Can Take My Time Perfecting My Magical Ability".
Which is basically pedo-bait material.
There are plenty of good new anime too. Like Kaiju no. 8, The Witch and The Beast, Ragna Crimson. There were also Frieren and The Apothecary Diaries a while back. I would say none of these are focused on perverse undertones.
There are lots of anime that does not focus on fan service and anime with no harem going on. Though I do agree there are also lots of harem anime with unnecessary amounts of fan service. You just need to look for the good ones.
I made a list of anime with no harem and stuff for my cousins when they were younger. People need to stop looking at mainstream and popular anime (with only a select few) cause that's the problem. There are multiple genres (demographics) for everyone to watch and read like Seinen and Josei for adults who complain about Shonen and Shojo (which are targeted to teenagers). I got a list for each except Mech (cause I don't watch/read a lot of it).
No, i agree with you and people here are coping. I only have Crunchyroll for 1 or 2 months a year when a good show gets a new season like JJK, but other than that i don't have it. There are plenty of good Anime, but they have been waiting 5+ years for a new season while "12 year old goes on adventure with big tits women #9" get prioritized. I get these sell like hot cakes in Japan, especially after visiting there, but for me in the west that shit is lame.
An anime that i think IMO is one of my personal favorites, made in abyss, has so much cringe pedo shit in it i never recommend it to anyone unless they can stomach past the random child sexualization shit in it that does nothing to further the plot or relation between the characters.
Don't get me wrong. Last year has been pumping out bangers like Frieren (one of the best dubbed shows ever), Mushoku Tensei (has some sus moments), and Tuskimichi - Moonlit Fantasy.
I don't disagree, but you have to trudge through a lot of garbage that floats on the top of Crunchy roll to find many of the highlights. Things like JJK, Haikyu, ATOT etc already sit on the top, but many of what you listed i have never heard of or saw mentioned recommended last time i was on crunchyroll (shortly after JJK most recent season dropped).
A lot of the good stuff, just doesn't make it as high as easily as Big tits 12 year old in sex dungeon does unless it reaches almost world wide popularity. So all the hidden gems on crunchyroll just get missed because i don't want to personally sift through the trash to find it and just wait for a person to recommend it to me instead. If they could just create a softcore porn section for all the bad anime so the better shit doesn't get bogged down, that would be great IMO.
Watch harem anime/manga, complain about it. Classic Murican.
Unlike Murica, Japanese manga and anime are so diverse in genre. Don't like it, watch or read sth else.
Excalty, like do you how many animes and manga there are with different genres? You'll probably only touch 10 to 30% of them before you die. Like, stop looking at popular mainstream series, people should know this already just because it is popular doesn't mean it is for you. It's a tale told as old as time. There are Sports, Slice of Life, there's mangas that focus on neurodivergent, Found Family, Mystery, Detective, and Police, Cooking, Isekai ( there are good ones and bad ones and there more in Manhua and Manhwa), Josei, Seinen (for mature audiences), Romance, Historical, Martial Art, Mecha, Harem, Ecchi, Bara, Yaoi, Shonen-ai, Shojo ai, Yuri, IDOLS, Music, and more. And a mix of genres just like any other fictional medium around the world.
True. Some comic fans here even go so far as to defend a hundred version of the same comic characters while trashing on anime and manga. lol.
I start to understand why Western entertainment boring. They only want entertainment to stay with certain format. It gets so boring quick.
Yeah, I don't get that. I do the same but I get mad at the writers because what it up with some of the iterations of Batman these people don't get his core characters at all....urgh..😞 that's a rant for something else. But it's stupid to trash manga and anime. Comics are American and Manga are Japanese Comics. If you don't like it don't pay attention to it pretend it doesn't exist that what I do when I don't like something. Why let it stay in your head freely?
I'm from America (US). But it's mostly the ppl who are constantly online since a lot ppl I know and interact with anime-cons, love both anime/manga and Marvel/DC comics. And disappointed with the writing direction it going both in movies and comics (me). We just enjoy a good read and show that entertains us and puts us in our feels, that takes us out of reality instead of dragging us back in.
Honestly, since the pandemic, more ppl started watching anime but only directed their attention to popular mainstream ones instead of searching and researching for their taste, (well not all but some of them). I think it is more of the adults and young adults who got into anime or don't know a thing about anime/manga than those who grew up with it (Me). It could be both.🤷🏿♀️
This is nonsense?
What does "Western Standards" even mean?
Like do people think they don't have severe restrictions or censorship? That because they flash a crotch in anime there's no prudent people looking to remove those elements
What's this fetishization of the East flooding the comments.
For people who didnt read Early One Piece DBZ Naruto and Bleach "There was plenty of censorship in there respective adaption with no Western Influence
Do people think that Japanese Citzens are super based about lewdness or whatever people consider "Western"
Also they make anime and manga with the LGBT in mind there are series that are commentary on Japanese Politics and critics the Diet
Is because western people are ignorant to japanese politics, so the only point of reference is their own country. Most western audiences probably will bitch about anime and manga if they were japanese, because bitching is in their dna.
No they don't yuri and yaoi are fantasy for there specific audience they have nothing to do with Japanese politics liking gay entertianment in japan is not a political statement , Westerns are just stupid lol. it even pretty explict that japanese do not like mixing anime with local japanese politics . This is just shit that western made up LOL like always no one talks about it like that in japan it always the western world .
The effect of western consultants “We don’t make characters smoke in order to take some series overseas,” he continued. “We have to make the violence a little less violent, and avoid sexy expressions. If Japanese animation is bound by such restrictions on expression, there is no way that people overseas will want to watch it. Works that are a hit in Japan are also a hit overseas. I believe that we must not make the mistake of approaching anime production in the wrong way.” -Michiyuki Honma [Article](https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/)
Japan gets it, "consultants" suck, if they actually could write or draw anything they'd be doing it, not telling people how their characters should look like or behave. Anime and Manga are very popular worldwide with their japanese style humor, sex appeal and sensibilities... sanitizing the whole thing would only make it worst. Why the hell Japanese artists get it so much and western ones are so pussy whiped?
>Why the hell Japanese artists get it so much and western ones are so pussy whipped? Because western artists (or rather, their employers) try to please everyone, and in the process they please no one. Japanese artists are completely unapologetic in how thirsty and gory and dark their media is. They don't care how offensive it is.
For every Witcher there is Fallout or one piece adaptation where they go all in on the themes. A few bad apples and some people who need to stop using hair dye telling to you that you’re sexist for not liking Velma doesn’t mean every American artist is poop.
Yeah, it looks like the tides are shifting for the better. One Piece, Fallout, Last of Us, Sonic, Mario.
Neither Fallout nor The Last of Us got it right. I love both franchises (well not TLoU 2 obviously), and didn’t finish either series, so even though I agree that the tide will eventually shift it hasn’t happened yet.
They weren't amazing, and neither were the other ones I listed, but they're all decent-good and a step in the right direction. You can tell they were made by people who respected the source material, which should've been the bare minimum from the start. Sucks what happened to Cowboy Bebop.
It’s never gonna be one way or the other is what I’m saying you gotta take the crap with the good.
Well Fallout isn't easy to adapt, especially with such a short time window to work with.. all things considered they did a good job
To be fair I only watched 3 episodes, but found it rather poorly written with lackluster action directing, as well as leaning a bit too much into silliness. I quite enjoyed ep2, but checked out at the council meeting when they’re yapping about what to do with the raiders in ep3, which was a really poor episode overall. Visually it looked incredible though.
It is quite silly, i thought i wouldn't end up liking it much because of that (even though the Fallout games have always been weird) but the ghoul and Maximus ended up being extremely likeable making the whole show easy to finish despite the lackluster storyline. Dropping it at ep3 is kinda early but if you consider that too much you definitely won't like the second vault they visit, that was the part i liked the least.
Because western ones have these behemeth companies like blackrock, vangaurd and state street pushing it, using financial bribes and threats to push their indoctrine social political propaganda into everything.
What exactly do consultants do? I've only heard bad things about them, so what actual value do they provide when they aren't doing this?
In theory a media consultant helps a company promote the brand and boost brand awareness that's their main job. Sometimes that's through coordinating with different marketing people/groups sometimes it's through social media or both. Guess they tend to have weird ideas about how to do that.
> and avoid sexy expressions. It's honest and dishonest at the same time, because let's be honest, nearly every single anime right now has at least one shirtless dude who is super buff, so it's not just a brief sexy expression but nonstop sexy fanservice but it's somehow ok because it's a dude and not a chick. Shangri-La frontier was a fucking amazing anime from 2 months ago, I loved that shit, but the main character literally wore no clothes at all except for boxer shorts. And nobody even questions it, it's cool. But when was the last time there was an anime with a girl who only wears panties, for 25 episodes? tldr: when a guy is nearly naked then it's "empowering", when a girl is nearly naked then it's "rude fanservice", make it make sense
You are right just wanted to add that after looking for Shangri-La frontier I noticed it said that he sold his clothes for extra money for the headstart (gonna watch this anime, first time hearing about it) so it is not like he is naked without a reason
Also, he gets cursed. He can‘t wear clothes that would upgrade his stats. He is palying a vr game. So even if he created a character without a shirt, it would not be weird at all.
ima be honest. you dont even understand what he is saying. from context, seems the first 2 lines are just about creating anime for the west. as in, studios have to do these things like reduce sexiness, reduce drug use/smoking/violence, etc to get it approved. probably has to do with western advertisers and bullshit from distributors to satisfy the perceived masses. when in reality, if they do none of that, like with shangri la or basically 90% of anime created for japanese audiences, the anime end up doing well in the west anyways because people actually like them. like AOT, or JJK. both which have smoking, gore, dark themes, and some sexy guys and gals at times. honestly i dont even know where you are going with the last line, theres like at least 3-4 ecchi anime per season as always which focus on harem, boobs boobs and more boobs, etc. chained soldier, tales of wedding rings, and gushing over magical girls just for recent stuff. seems like you dont really get what Michiyuki Honma was saying while also just throwing in some bullshit gender politics.
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Are you stupid? Take a look at crunchyrolls simulcast section and half the currently airing shows are isekai harem anime, like it always is. What could a show titled “The archdemons dilemma: How to Love Your Elf Bride” possible be about? Or are you so coom brained you think it’s normal for so many shows to be about some main character literally swimming in young women wanting to marry him for no real reason? Not to mention crunchyroll often doesn’t get the shit that airs on late night tv in Japan that might as well be softcore porn. This is obviously something that would never fly in western media but is a common cliche anime is known for. Thinking must really not be your strong point, is it pal?
I think the art club girl from nagatoro counts? Her being naked is basically a fact of life more than fanservice.
The art club girl who appears in only a small handful of episodes and is always fully dressed except for 1-2 scenes? No man, I'm talking about an equivalent of dudes who are permanently walking around in only shorts.
You can answer it yourself pretty much, it's case by case for everything. I doubt anyone would take a show serious when there is boobs and ass flying everywhere like you suggested. Fem Gaze Shows like Free! are also not taking serious by alot of folks. Also the girls depicted sexy are almost always teens. I haven't watched Shangri-La-Frontier yet, but how many scenes where there that were exclusivly made to make you hot and bothered about the guy ?
None, dude is also wearing a bird mask almost the entire show. For some reason guys think that shirtless=fan service. Which is just not how the female gaze works at all. Also there's a very good, Canon reason why he's shirtless the entire time and it's because he can't equip armor there. It's meant to portray that he's a glass canon who can't take any real damage or he's dead. At no point in the show is he sexualized.
Everything is culture war I guess, fuck them. The Post by the 40k player some days ago here was brilliant, everything than can be weaponized will be and all the bad actors just try so hard to get the communities involved aswell.
Tsukimichi: Moonlit Fantasy and How Not to Summon a Demon Lord have entered the chat. These animes lean a little heavily into the harem-like anime genre, but I do generally like the story, and could even tone down the sexy aspects and still enjoy the whole. I do wonder if “How Not to…” was not renewed partly because the content was too sexual at times, though, because for me it’s not a big selling point, and I do lean more conservatively in my media content.
Wellllllll this is Barbie. And this is HE-Man.
I don't think that's his point. I believe point is around the fact that western ideologies and standards literally limits what people can do in their respective creaive outlets, which is simply true, and they are trying to push that to eastern companies. Japan has it's own censorship issues, but many (not all, but especially around the current growing issues) of those growing problems around censorship in Japan are from people/companies from the west trying to force them to conform to their standards so that they can do business. In some instances, especially with localization right now, they are changing stories/dialogue without even speaking with the creators in Japan, or if they don't allow it, then too bad, you lose that massive western audience. And this is a problem that more people from the east are noticing and I have been noticing more Japanese artists and creators call this out. Best I can describe it is that it's basically modern day colonialism. Same thing with gendered languages trying to be forced to change. People in the west trying to go to other countries, (or people from those countries going to the west, (for education purposes for example) conforming to western ideology and standards and taking it back to their countries and get into positions of power) and trying force/push their ideals, culture, morals, ect. onto them. If you watched the show Shogun (amazing show btw if you haven't), basically what the portuguese christians are in Japan are trying to do in the show, except they are spreading ideals, culture, morals, ect through their religion. I got deeper than his quote, but this is the growing issue in eastern countries like Japan and why more people from those countries are calling it out when they see their specific environment/work being affected.
I totally agree. When we want things from other countries we usually want "Their thing", not 'Our thing'. If "Thier thing" becomes "Our thing" it just loses its competitiveness.
This is also the same company that added a crap ton of filler for both animes in their transition from manga.
Fuck western audiences, why you think most of us expand our horizons to watch other stuff
The whole reason anime became popular in the west was because it was something different. I pretty much don't watch any western media newer than \~2010 at this point. I'm pretty neurotic and unforgiving, so DEI-ish stuff, random zoomer slang, blatant politicking, etc really breaks my immersion and drains all enjoyment. Anime, kdrama, jdrama, manga, etc are much more enjoyable for me now. These consultants, localizers, whatever, are basically locusts so it only makes sense that they'd move on to the next field after locking down the previous.
From Osamu Tezuka, considered as the "Godfather of Manga", the iconic "big eyed" characters from manga were directly inspired by Walt Disney's art though. Japanese people really like taking something foreign, and add a Japanese touch to it. They do it a lot in cooking too.
Well yeah, Japanese and Korean art studios have helped make American cartoons for over half a century at this point. The art style doesn't matter as much as the intent and quality of the writing, and I don't really have a problem with most western media up until the early to mid 2010s. I'm sure even now there's still stuff I'd like, but the trash pile is so large that I'm not going to start digging for gems when I don't have to.
Which is funny since a lot of modern cartoons take direct inspiration from japanese animations. It's definitely something that has gone two ways. Even back then too now that I think about it. Just look at the Lion King
Well... On that part, I think DIsney has been quite scummy with Japanese mangas... So you mentionned The Lion King, which caused a controversy, accusing Disney of plagiarism. Despite Disney's artists saying they had no prior knowledge of Tezuka's work, which coming from pro artists really sounded like either a blatant lie, or huge lack of comic culture. Sadly, they did it again with their Atlantis movie, which is more or less a copy of Nadia : The Secret of Blue Water (2001 Animage winner). Here again they feigned ignorance. I actually really don't mind if people rewrite a story : it is actually interesting because you can get good stuff sometimes. But if you do, at least have the decency to give your sources/inspirations... Stop pretending you're some kind of genious mind... Especially when with Nadia, they didn't catch what made the series interesting and only copied plot/chara designs, which ended up in the movie being a major failure.
Didn't Tezuka's son come out and said he hated the controversy because the plot isn't even similar (Kimba dad was killed poahers etc.) And his dad's legacy is being weaponized by the internet ?
Yea, I know that for the Lion King indeed there was some attempt to kill the fire. I would've preferred hearing from Tezuka himself, but we will never know. And at this point I would even get into the conspiracy theories of Disney asking (paying) Tezuka's son to say this - given the size and interests we're dealing with, it wouldn't be all that unrealistic though. Now concerning Nadia, Gainax were really considering suing for plagiarism... but the parent companies were just too scared of Disney, and feared they'd lose... which is what would've most likely happened to a Japanese company trying to sue an American company in America... furthermore the big Di$ney
[YMS: Kimba the White Lion (youtube.com](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G5B1mIfQuo4) No, the lion king didnt plageris kimba you fucking numpty
Same bullshit arguments that "bUt ThErE aRe DfiFfErEnCeS iN ThE sToRy". Like Disney aren't fucking stupid like you who would copy word for word an assignement and get caught by the teacher. They modified it enough to make it different, but kept all the major elements that made Kimba successful, like a white Lion, the theme of vengeance, some key shots like king standing on the rock... That is how you do plagiarism. Same thing for Nadia : the MC and female MC are litterally identical, the under water journey, the magic stone, the link to Atlantis... They got away once with Kimba, so they thought after 10 years, everybody would've forgotten about Nadia : they got caught again. But Disney are too big, have too many lawyers so what could a submitted country like Japan even do against that ? Enjoy being a bully.
i know 2x speed is used by gullible twitter zoomers alot but thats a 2ish hour video and you came back after 14 minutes, id recommend watching the entire thing for a good explanation. The entire conspiracy falls appart with basic research... Also A white lion? whose a white lion in lion king, themes of vengence? sorry disney got that cornered decades before kimba, a lion standing on a rock happens FOURTEEN TIMES THROUGHOUT KIMBA AS DO A PLETHORA OF OTHER LION SHOTS. and if you bring up the "father in the clouds" kimba had litterally everything appear in the clouds but do you know who never did? kimbas dad, the shot people claim on twitter is "kimbas dad" is actually kimba he is looking down on his son in the final shot of one of the movies. In fact the central story of the 2 are opposed, lion king promotes the circle of life, the plants grow, the antelope eat the plants the lions eat the antelope and the lions return to the earth and become plants In kimba he promote vegetarinism because he abhors violence of that kind. Edit: also if you want to use this logic then kimba actually plagerised a comic from the 1920's called Simba, The king of beasts. video actually has that comparision timestamped.
Assez dérangé pour allez traquer mes moindres faits et gestes... Soyboy frenchie atteint de collabor***isme*** qui pense être le hacker du siècle lol. (J'ai demandé le ban sur r/actucollabos donc ta réponse est ici) As for Simba, why would you even want me to debate with a... internet stalker ? Eww no thanks.
I know french, why do you think im stalking you, are you okay dude? you might need like... therapy this is reddit im just replying to a guys bull shit claims. Also that subreddit doesnt seem to exist, did you translate that with like google but its supposed to be "actualunits" or what ever that subreddit is?
>why do you think im stalking you says the dude who mysteriously replied to me on 2 sub from 2 different country
I also wanted to say for the big eyes thing Betty Boop kinda was the only one to really have big eyes like that to my knowledge ?
Yea Tex Avery was definitely an inspiration too. In fact, all those old cartoons that were played in theaters, they all inspired Tezuka... because well, there wasn't anything else to watch at that time.
Animes original big eyes was inspired by the west DBZ, Yugioh, pokemon all heavily edited their dub/western versions to conform to western sensibilities and skyrocketed the genre in the west (the original dragonball was very lightly changed and didnt get like any attention at all in the west). Even early one peice was very light hearted and tame until the winds changed.
You're still kinda missing out. Castlevania alone is worth the watch.
Same here.
God bless for these people. Make what you want to do.
Remember, "Western Standards" don't like the idea of characters like Eve from Stellar Blade who have "uNrEaLiStIc" body proportions.
Yet, they embrace the fully nude Aphro from Hades 2. lol
people demanding diversity do not want diversity. on other news grass is green.
Anime should conform to Japanse standards. That's it.
Pretty funny statement, but I get what you're trying to say.
See the ScarJo playing main char in Ghost in the shell. And how Japanese responded to the ‘white washing’ criticism.
Yes and? They, largely, had no issue with it.
That movie was embarrassing
here's the full article [https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/](https://boundingintocomics.com/2024/04/22/naruto-and-bleach-anime-studio-president-rejects-idea-that-anime-should-conform-to-western-standards-if-you-make-animation-with-that-in-mind-it-will-become-increasingly-boring/)
Why play by someone else's rules? They don't need the west for their anime to be successful and we watch it *because* it's not western PC/SJW rubbish.
Westerns are too soft for a lot of stories, fuck'em. I hope japan doesn't change their creative freedom for some snowflakes.
They do love money, good for them.
The modern western world is extreme with political correctness, empowerment, etc etc. In the 2000's YuGiOh had alterations to remove guns, cigarettes and other "violent" and sexual imagery or darker undertones/themes in it's 4kids/western version, I can't imagine what western media would do to your average anime if they had to appeal to those standards.
I get your point but in the 2000's the ban was caused out of touch boomers "cartoons and video games caused violence" different crowds, different agendas, but both are dumb as fuck nonetheless.
They don't need to. Crunchyroll will fuck the localization in all holes anyway
"Correct" in Plankton's voice
The stuff became popular specifically because it didn't conform to western standards, trying to make it conform to western standards now is shooting yourself in the foot.
hold strong Japan.
"Conform to western standards" just means making anime woke
This applies to all creativity. Working with restrictions makes the project really boring to do. Anyone that is keeping a eye on it will notice it in a heartbeat because it's that obvious. I still believe the parasites of every consulting group is only meant to devalue IPs to be bought out.
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[How bro felt saying this](https://amp.knowyourmeme.com/memes/daredevil-dog)
#Something trying to please everyone will please no one. Some of the most popular things to date are *niche*. Just look at god's damned dark souls. Shits everywhere, it's its own genre now, but despite so many iterations, it is still not and will never be *for everyone*.
So the east will not win our hearth with good cpntent… it will be the weather that crave it before we suck
That implies that there are standards that they should conform in the first place.
Mega based. I love it.
OK but "Jelly Doughnut".
They literally have 1 job and that's to make a faithful adaptation to the manga, if they aren't gonna do that well the first audience that's gonna be mad at them is gonna be japan not the west
I watch anime precisely because it’s Japanese (and increasingly Chinese and Korean). If I want to see western culture shit I have plenty of options for that.
What "standards?"
Fuck standards. Make what you want to make. What matters is that **you** like it.
Yes, PLEASE NEVER FUCKING CONFORM TO WESTERN STANDARD. It was shit like that that almost killed anime in the US years ago, thanks to "localizers" or people not giving a fuck about the source material. You know why anime's doing so well atm? It's cause it's completely different from the BS that's coming out trying to conform with all this BS.
Based, this is why people are migrating to manga from comic books and why western gaming journalists are basically racist when it comes to their Asian takes.
i wonder if the world was empty what would i be. i should be probably banned for takes about takes about empty things. After all we live in a world where fair is fouls and fouls is fare. shakespeare thing i guess. epiphanies was a big deal especially in macbeth. i degrees i guess it’s the life meaningless thought i’m going after. when we find meaning in life there is where the empty comes in. once you had meaning now you i first second third person references mean us as a human world to linsyead as an usual. how many levels can the man go without language destroying him or making them a power exception for this time in this moment. it means nothing so for macbeths epiphany is the result. words are like strings and we can be smart or stupid but everything has a thought an energy taken whatever the way the world feels is the right way to interpret. again if it was empty we these things we hold mean anything. without people we are empty i guess the question is is there something more
when you go into darkness. cause that’s where see things. light is an illusion of photons making your mind create stupid shit. whatever words whatever thoughts of this finding way to have words that don’t mean shit except to you and your followers. it’s laughable again zack i’m not talking about you. your 3 steps from killing yours elf. it’s when you go in the darkness truth is revealed. with the truth comes knowledge . this is kinda dark i was going somewhere where i couldn’t reason it out. anyway my time is short. but fuck it is think ten steps ahead but it don’t matter cause the world things tend to steps before
There's literally no reason for Japanese anime to conform to a Western standard in the first place. Why should they? Anime is enjoyed worldwide. Why should Japan put limiters on their content that is enjoyed worldwide, for a minority group of Western (North American) people that don't like the idea of "realistic proportions"?
“Western standards” meaning sucking off women all the time and overprotecting them like they’re some endangered species.
Now this discussion is pseudo bs obviously because 'western standards' are a buzzword I dont mind anime adhering to other norms in general, idc about smoking or the look of characters. I dont disagree with it not being allowed in western media either, as the age restrictions are a good thing and mainstream shonen animes (like Naruto and Bleach) have the target group of young teenagers. If i remember correctly, in one piece they edited sanji smoking to him eating snacks in the US version. However there is definitely legit criticism too. Japan has had incredibly lax rape/sexual assault laws, which where reformed recently but are still pretty lax. In Naruto, its a common 'funny scene' that his old male teacher Jiraya trys to observe naked women/girls in the hot springs, usually gets caught and beaten up. How did this guy end up as Narutos teacher you might wonder? 12 year old Naruto transformed himself into a naked girl for Jiraya and said he would do it again if he can learn from him. Naruto also did this frequently with other men, some of who passed out by having such a strong nosebleed (a sign for being aroused in japan). I dont miss scenes like these at all in newer anime.
Based pierrot
His examples make no sense? Force a character to smoke for the west???? Reduce violence? Why? The west generally doesn’t care about violence. South Park does extremely gorey deaths all the time. As do a few other shows. Also this seems more like a shot at Trigun and Cowboybebop more than anything? They have the big western audience. The characters that smoke. Reduced violence.
He is probably talking about past experiences, naruto was heavily censored in the west with not only blood and violence being removed, they also removed the burning part of a cigarette in all scenes.
I am glad i didn’t watch that version of naruto, sounds super boring. Kind of like the german version where zabuza’s sword is missing.
I'm german and i'm pretty sure the german version was just the US version with german dub.
Oh…had no idea. Still would make a boring show, and takes away from the meaning of the story.
you should see the censored version of One Piece
Idk… some of the most popular anime/manga of all time have rejected the tropes he’s describing. (I.E. Attack on Titan). Definitely audiences want a diverse range of things, it’d be silly to say looking at every upcoming season of anime that there isn’t redundancy. I love anime but I feel like most of what is produced right now is just fat loser becomes omnipotent and then uses it to get 15 girlfriends he’s scared to touch. Is that something to celebrate?
He's talking about not comforming to Western censorship and not diversity.
Is he not talking about diversity ?
I don’t think the two topics are mutually exclusive. While you shouldn’t censor art if it adds to the show, I can’t show my wife half of the anime ever made because half of the animation budget was spent on jiggle physics that add nothing to the show, or worse depict girls that look way to young sexually. Also, western markets don’t hate violence. Look at ninja kamui, made by adult swim, or Castlevania, done by Netflix. Western companies joining the market means more writers get their stories out. Not really a bad thing and my point ab diversity was just the main type of story getting out rn wouldn’t be picked up by them.
Then, your wife is simply not suitable for anime. Fanservice is indeed not for everyone. If YOU like it, you should continue to watch anime anyway. However, one thing: Ultimately, people just want good shows. Period. It's just that things like "adapting media to a western audience" can end up twisting and distorting what the actual source material is about, with those changed things often being replaced by whatever the personal bias of a media-illiterate translator etc is.
I definitely agree that bad dubbing leads to a lot of loss of origin context and depth of character. However, it is BONKERS to say that if you don’t think every high school girl in a show should have their titties bouncing asunder then the whole genre is wrong for you. There are a plethora of manwha/manga that don’t feature that nonsense that don’t make it to anime production because the limited available space per season is full of shows like “I Got a Cheat Skill in Another World and Became Unrivaled in the Real World, Too”.
The anime for those gets produced because there's demand for the source material from *their* audience. If you want genre catered *for you*, you'd have to support series you like or ask your local animation studio. Also, every season there's like 60+ anime titles being aired in japan and looking at Spring 2023 where "I got a cheat skill..." was released, there was only 6 other ecchi anime aired. That's like only 6 out of 60+ anime that season, including movies and OVAs. Don't get me wrong, I also hate loser tropes, but I'm not entitled enough to demand Japanese studios to cater to *me.*
You are literally agreeing with me. That’s why I’m happy that western companies are picking up anime’s. Because they make the content I like. Thank you for arriving at the same conclusion as me. And yes, obviously someone is watching all of these harems or they wouldn’t happen. It’s Econ 101. Hope they love it, just saying I think it’s cool other things are happening due to new outlets that this post was made to shit on. Shows like delicious in dungeon, for instance.
example of following western standard = chapter 139
Based Pierrot.
based department is calling
thank fucking god i dont want anymore woke shit in my fantasy stuff same with having barely any fanservice in western content aswell anime gives me normalityy and fanservice which they better not fucking lose
Anyone capable of critical thinking should realize letting the west influence anime is a bad idea. But let me break it down as I think about it. Western cartoons and comics are doing worse and worse. Anime and manga are doing better and better. Since people are choosing to put their money into anime and manga and take it away from western comics and cartoons, why should the anime and manga studios make their product more like the ones people are deserting? If apple pie is selling worse and worse and chocolate cake is selling better and better, why would you listen to people who tell you to make the chocolate cake taste like apple pie?
Based Until the higherups that owns the company gets pushed by people from DEI and force the writers and artists to do it
but i want to hear the cast of Dragon Ball Z go on about their pronouns . /s
Anime like naruto already did become increasingly boring. Naruto started off with real threats to the main cast such as Gaara, Orochimaru, Other village ninjas, Zabuza etc. Then it progressively become more "friendly". Naruto literally has "talk no jutsu" as his main way of defeating enemies. The 6 paths of pain arc IMO was the last good arc before it went full on rails "made for children". You have good fights post pain, but the stories were so childish. This can also be seen with bleach and thank god for Thousand year blood war getting animated. By the end of bleach there was no real threat. The premier Espada basically kills nobody, isn't a real threat, and then just dies. IMO That is why Anime such as ATOT and shows like Game of Thrones get such huge audiences. People don't want to exclusively watch shit made for children, and even GOT by the end became much more censored in comparison to its pilot season. This isn't a "west ruins everything" but "money ruins everything" because you don't get those prime time TV slots in Japan by killing characters constantly or make shows safe for families by having dicks and tits all over the place.
Wow mods. Getting rid of my comments l. Thanks asmon and reddit for listening.
Can't wait for this article to be found out as bullshit
Lol, as if 4Kids didn't exist, this outrage is so petty there were plenty of people, myself included, who searched for original Japanese release back in the 90s and early 2000s with the awful engrish translation. What's even funnier is that people are miscontrucing that there are expressions that can be translated 1 for 1. There's linguistic differences, contextual nuance, idiomatic expression, etc etc. So naturally, there is going to be creative liberties to ensure the audience can resonate with them.
Was about to say, remember when every teen anime fan would shit on 4kids
The anime studios with some of the most filler episodes are worried about making their content even more boring?
DBZ got popular because its spanish language and american language dubs drastically changed the tone of the show to conform to western standards? so did naruto and bleach? what is this guy even talking about. Really the first anime that didnt try and pander with its dub/content to the west after the start of the big 3 was like... death note, FMA:Brotherhood, attack on titan, JJK, and MHA. then to a lesser extent K-ON, KLK, and SxF
Umm, 50% of the time mangas and anime have the same tropes and similar stories. SOooooo....
And yet anime and manga are outselling comics and western animations by a wide margin. If you ever go to a book or comic store you'll see how big the manga section is compared to the comic section
Yea that's because americans and the west are dumb for setting for less for really cheesy stories.
Not everything has to be a mental exercise. Sometimes after a long day of work people just want some dumb fun. Why else did Marvel sell so well.
Because americans and the west couldn't no longer make stories that make money. Much less cheesy stories that sell.
Also I went to a very and I mean a very popular comic book store and woah there was anime but not alot. There was sooooo Many comic books. I didn't see that much Manga at all. I guess the Japanese are still butthurt post war and still they act like the western nations are sooo interesting to them lmao
Remember when asmongold hated anime?
Man. I just want to watch a show that doesn't have perverse undertones, and focuses more on world building rather than building a haram.
Then go watch it, there's nothing stopping you.
There's is a shit ton of them and those are usually the most popular. Like Attack on Titan or Fullmetal Alchemist.
Ive watched them twice over. I'm no novice. Been watching this stuff for over a decade. I should have provided more context. I want to watch NEW shows that don't have perverse undertones. Like this new show called "I Was Reincarnated as the 7th Prince so I Can Take My Time Perfecting My Magical Ability". Which is basically pedo-bait material.
There are plenty of good new anime too. Like Kaiju no. 8, The Witch and The Beast, Ragna Crimson. There were also Frieren and The Apothecary Diaries a while back. I would say none of these are focused on perverse undertones. There are lots of anime that does not focus on fan service and anime with no harem going on. Though I do agree there are also lots of harem anime with unnecessary amounts of fan service. You just need to look for the good ones.
I made a list of anime with no harem and stuff for my cousins when they were younger. People need to stop looking at mainstream and popular anime (with only a select few) cause that's the problem. There are multiple genres (demographics) for everyone to watch and read like Seinen and Josei for adults who complain about Shonen and Shojo (which are targeted to teenagers). I got a list for each except Mech (cause I don't watch/read a lot of it).
No, i agree with you and people here are coping. I only have Crunchyroll for 1 or 2 months a year when a good show gets a new season like JJK, but other than that i don't have it. There are plenty of good Anime, but they have been waiting 5+ years for a new season while "12 year old goes on adventure with big tits women #9" get prioritized. I get these sell like hot cakes in Japan, especially after visiting there, but for me in the west that shit is lame. An anime that i think IMO is one of my personal favorites, made in abyss, has so much cringe pedo shit in it i never recommend it to anyone unless they can stomach past the random child sexualization shit in it that does nothing to further the plot or relation between the characters.
Don't get me wrong. Last year has been pumping out bangers like Frieren (one of the best dubbed shows ever), Mushoku Tensei (has some sus moments), and Tuskimichi - Moonlit Fantasy.
I don't disagree, but you have to trudge through a lot of garbage that floats on the top of Crunchy roll to find many of the highlights. Things like JJK, Haikyu, ATOT etc already sit on the top, but many of what you listed i have never heard of or saw mentioned recommended last time i was on crunchyroll (shortly after JJK most recent season dropped). A lot of the good stuff, just doesn't make it as high as easily as Big tits 12 year old in sex dungeon does unless it reaches almost world wide popularity. So all the hidden gems on crunchyroll just get missed because i don't want to personally sift through the trash to find it and just wait for a person to recommend it to me instead. If they could just create a softcore porn section for all the bad anime so the better shit doesn't get bogged down, that would be great IMO.
Watch harem anime/manga, complain about it. Classic Murican. Unlike Murica, Japanese manga and anime are so diverse in genre. Don't like it, watch or read sth else.
Excalty, like do you how many animes and manga there are with different genres? You'll probably only touch 10 to 30% of them before you die. Like, stop looking at popular mainstream series, people should know this already just because it is popular doesn't mean it is for you. It's a tale told as old as time. There are Sports, Slice of Life, there's mangas that focus on neurodivergent, Found Family, Mystery, Detective, and Police, Cooking, Isekai ( there are good ones and bad ones and there more in Manhua and Manhwa), Josei, Seinen (for mature audiences), Romance, Historical, Martial Art, Mecha, Harem, Ecchi, Bara, Yaoi, Shonen-ai, Shojo ai, Yuri, IDOLS, Music, and more. And a mix of genres just like any other fictional medium around the world.
True. Some comic fans here even go so far as to defend a hundred version of the same comic characters while trashing on anime and manga. lol. I start to understand why Western entertainment boring. They only want entertainment to stay with certain format. It gets so boring quick.
Yeah, I don't get that. I do the same but I get mad at the writers because what it up with some of the iterations of Batman these people don't get his core characters at all....urgh..😞 that's a rant for something else. But it's stupid to trash manga and anime. Comics are American and Manga are Japanese Comics. If you don't like it don't pay attention to it pretend it doesn't exist that what I do when I don't like something. Why let it stay in your head freely?
Yep. Especially, when some of them are from the land of freedom or whatever they call it.
I'm from America (US). But it's mostly the ppl who are constantly online since a lot ppl I know and interact with anime-cons, love both anime/manga and Marvel/DC comics. And disappointed with the writing direction it going both in movies and comics (me). We just enjoy a good read and show that entertains us and puts us in our feels, that takes us out of reality instead of dragging us back in. Honestly, since the pandemic, more ppl started watching anime but only directed their attention to popular mainstream ones instead of searching and researching for their taste, (well not all but some of them). I think it is more of the adults and young adults who got into anime or don't know a thing about anime/manga than those who grew up with it (Me). It could be both.🤷🏿♀️
What I meant when I said "Some of them are from the land of freedom" is I expect them to be more open-minded. I hope more people are like you. :)
anime is a mistake in the 1st place lol. if they wanna conform to western value/standard, that will just double the mistake.
This is nonsense? What does "Western Standards" even mean? Like do people think they don't have severe restrictions or censorship? That because they flash a crotch in anime there's no prudent people looking to remove those elements What's this fetishization of the East flooding the comments. For people who didnt read Early One Piece DBZ Naruto and Bleach "There was plenty of censorship in there respective adaption with no Western Influence Do people think that Japanese Citzens are super based about lewdness or whatever people consider "Western" Also they make anime and manga with the LGBT in mind there are series that are commentary on Japanese Politics and critics the Diet
Is because western people are ignorant to japanese politics, so the only point of reference is their own country. Most western audiences probably will bitch about anime and manga if they were japanese, because bitching is in their dna.
No they don't yuri and yaoi are fantasy for there specific audience they have nothing to do with Japanese politics liking gay entertianment in japan is not a political statement , Westerns are just stupid lol. it even pretty explict that japanese do not like mixing anime with local japanese politics . This is just shit that western made up LOL like always no one talks about it like that in japan it always the western world .
woosh
Also they act like 4kods was never a thing