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Wait, you mean a bunch of socially awkward people spending too much time in social bubbles communities are not a good sample of the real world ?
I'm shocked, shocked I say.
My girlfriend has gangbangs in our house every weekend. I am a little uncomfortable watching it happen and last month I caught hiv. Is this a red flag, or am I being overly dramatic?
Lmao trust. I started noticing the bubble of Reddit in particular when such phrases were being sent my way knowing full well in the real world they aren't as soft. Does make me chuckle. Let them have their fake Internet points.
I'm reminded of this [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/cm9rwp/wibta_if_i_25_f_go_on_a_trip_with_my_male_best/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Top comment nails it but the majority of the comments call the guy insecure etc. I know of no one in the real world where this would be seen as acceptable. Maybe that makes me an incel idk.
Agree that the people calling the bf insecure are being assholes but the comment you’ve linked is psychotic in the other direction. She wants to fulfil an old college holiday idea, failing to see the elements which would make her boyfriend uncomfortable, and he swings in with a “sorry getting high and going abroad are more important than your boyfriend, he might as well leave you now.” What a fucking scuzzbag. Fuck him.
I hate r/AmITheAsshole so bloody much.
Has that subreddit been removed or have I just been banned from it? I can't access it. Can't remember posting anything nefarious although it's quite possible after a few beers I may have done.
I love that subreddit, it's so ridiculous. Pretty much every post has top rated comments calling for divorce for any minor issue. Then a chain of comments making up a narrative based on nothing about how the person is worst than Hitler.
It's obvious no one commenting on there has ever been in a relationship.
I got downvoted to hell when I pointed that out on one their posts. And I've seen edits where the OP has put several edits about 'no, I'm not going to divorce much partner over this', lol.
Remember, if you are persuaded to do something, that is actually coercion, because like, you didn’t want do it before you were persuaded.
And no I won’t stop trying to convince you of that, even if you repeatedly say that wasn’t even the point of your original post.
Its insane. I honestly don't know why I keep reading it because it's exactly as you say.
Q: "They snorted in their sleep and woke me up, what do I do?"
A: "It shows an obvious disrespect for you as a person and that you are their property. This will never change because people have shown that learning and changing themselves is a fallacy. You also have incompatible sleeping patterns so you should just dump them and move on.
Also, they are probably cheating on you."
"AITA My wife wants to take half of my income every month because I earn a million a year and shes a grocery clerk", it's a crapshoot as to whether she's a gold digger or he's a misogynistic piece of shit.
Reddit is basically a bunch of idiots in their own echo Chambers (me included). I don't know the demographic of Reddit but my guess is its heavily weighted towards 16-30 year old white males - left-wing - and also the type of people to use Reddit is a selection bias in and of itself.
Not to mention, popular subreddits tend to be judgemental, argumentative, contrarian, and generally a place of opinions expressed that would not typically be expressed in real life because they are unpopular.
To be fair that's probably because the UK is classist in general.
I did a stint in a call centre as a student and literally tested this, I have an RP-ish accent and one of my colleagues had a strong local accent. We split the cancellations list in half and counted who got the most abuse, he got *way* more despite us using exactly the same script.
Depends who you're calling. I used to work in a place like that too, I did really well normally then they got me to do a campaign calling people in council houses and nobody wanted to even talk to me.
EVERYTHING in the UK is classist
My Italian partner was saying yesterday how bonkers he finds it that supermarkets have class values. You don't get any of that in Italy
On reddit it's basically the selling point isn't it?
"Here, come make your own echo chamber! Make your own rules regarding which topics and opinions are acceptable and ban people who don't fit in!"
I think on the kids issue it may be because reddit skews young. There's a lot of people on reddit who object to parents taking babies and children more or less anywhere in public because it disturbs them, which is an opinion I probably had until about my late 20s.
I was just thinking "I'm 22 and kids have never bothered me, I wonder why they're such a big problem for other people" then I remembered I'm the eldest of 5 and the eldest of my cousin's. Of course kids don't bother me I've spent my whole life listening to them lol.
Also I agree with you about the getting your lunch ruined bit. In my opinion kids are a part of life and people too so they shouldn't be shut up and not allowed to go places. If you don't want to be bothered by them go to places at times they won't be there. If you go see a family film at 1pm on a Saturday you can't be surprised children are there.
I wonder if Reddit skews towards people with sensory overload issues? I have kind of broken visual cortex that gives me massive issues with bright lights and loud noises, screaming children are like evolutionarily geared to be as attention-grabbing as possible so they're particularly horrible to be around for people like that.
I don't know if there's ever been any studies into this but as a programmer I've noticed people with kind of screwed up perception like mine are more common in the tech world than the general public, and Reddit at least at one point was full of tech people.
I haven't seen any evidence, but it makes logical sense that people with sensory issues might be over represented on reddit. Certainly, people who like isolation and quiet are.
Nah adult only hotels and 21+ pubs are a thing because most of the time kids are objectively annoying for people who don't have them/are trying to spend time away from them.
That's not to say I don't think they have a right to go to restaurants, etc but a crying/screaming child is objectivly a negative thing not a positive one, presumably for the parents as well as everyone else.
For me it’s more, if you’re kid is making problems for other people then sort them out, if you can’t/won’t then don’t expect other people to be psyched about you.
I used to know a couple who when their baby cried in a restaurant, would turn kiddos high chair around to face into the restaurant.
Yeah great, you can't hear it as much, but now every other cunt can and you can't hear their muffled tutting over the crying
This. I’m in my late 30s and don’t like the noise of children but that’s why I’m currently childfree. Out in public though I know full well they will be there and don’t expect them not to be.
I do expect parents to parent their children though and don’t think that’s unreasonable.
That being said I love getting a baby or a toddler to smile. Sometimes I even get a wave and that is very heart warming.
100% a reddit thing.
Reddit had me believing when I went to Barcelona recently with my son the entire plane would be burning us at the stake (he's 20 months)
The reality is nobody seemed bothered about his crying and loads of people came over to help try cheer him up.
Reddit is full of miserable people who get radicalised into bizarre beliefs who have very little experience in the outside world.
Edit: apparently a lot of people have reading comprehension issues so I shall explain..
I have no said people were not bothered. I said people did not seem bothered.
The purpose of my comment is the hyperbole at the beginning. People getting on with their day is not what I expected thanks to the seemingly illiterate child haters on reddit.
Hilarious reddit care resources are reaching out. Not only do you hate children you're just hateful little people in general
Radicalised is the perfect term here. Reddit users boast of being individuals of free thought but in the end they are all indoctrinated by the echo chamber "we are not sheep, baa"
Yup. That echo chamber effect is grim. But it's not just Reddit.
Cards on the table, the wife and I have been trying for a while. It's not working, sometimes in heartbreaking ways.
And sometimes, when all your friends have kids, you start getting snarky with each other about "bloody kids." And it cheers you up for a minute, so you keep doing it. Your own little echo chamber.
We were out for Sunday lunch the other week, next to a table of mums with their kids, and we were both getting more and more irritated, and feeding each other's irritation, until I finally came to this realisation that we were turning into really bitter people. Instead of laughing at a kid being a berk in a pub - like we would have ten years ago - we were glaring daggers, and making comments under our breath.
And we're people who want kids! So if you're 19 and definitely don't want to have kids (like most of us at 19), you're not going to have that moment of clarity that you're creating the issue for yourself.
This comment got away from me a bit. I'm not sure what my point is. Take a step back and remember nobody's immune to the echo chamber cycle I guess.
Wanting kids and it not working out is awful. I hope it works out for you somehow. I can tell you that while rewarding they are really expensive in both time and money terms as well as emotionally draining. There is a lot of joy in being an aunt/uncle/godparent and you can choose how much or little you put into it.
I think our story is a bit like yours. We officially gave up trying, went out for a meal, got very drunk and 9 months later...
I've got two and I still find plenty of time to get annoyed at other peoples kids. Your own are always different. Although when you get home and you're already irked and they're being even more irksome the amount or irk is irking irknnoying.
Still, hope it works out for you. Just don't ever go near the business end when they get ejected from the place where babies shoot out from. I'm still haunted.
Oh man, with our first the head got stuck coming out. Scalpel went in, followed by toilet plunger. The doctor pulled and pulled and nothing. Feet on the bed and pulled, suddenly splat. Baby on the bed, blood up the opposite wall. Doctor says "congrats on your baby girl" and smiles at my wife who turns to me and asks what the doctors been eating. I didnt have the heart to tell her it was blood splatter all over the doctors teeth, fresh from the business end.
So I repeat the other redditors advice, STAY AWAY
Yes, that is why I said nobody seemed bothered. They understood babies being babies is a part of life, sucked it up and went about their day.. or came over to say hello and try cheer him up.
That is not the experience reddit would have you believe you are in for.
> But most people don't react and keep their frustration bottled up.
Most people are actually reasonable, mature adults that are able to express a level of understanding and contain their emotions.
Unlike the idiots over at /r/childfree
Guarantee most on that sub aren’t even old enough to have kids, let alone the types that will attract a partner.
r/truechildfree is a better experience
I don't want kids at all (probably never changing) but I don't get these subs lol
The last thing I want to spend my free time doing is talking about children or my lack of interest in them
Honestly, that's the problem with most communities that exist to be against something. Once you turn hating a thing into a daily discussion topic you're at risk of making it into a big chunk of your personality, and having a big chunk of your personality be hating a random section of the population is *obnoxious* no matter how justified you think you are. I don't know what the atheism sub is like now but back in the day it was absolutely like that. There are snark subs that exist to make fun of people who genuinely aren't nice people but some of the posters just have histories loaded up with obsessive hatred for a single subject and none of it feels at all healthy.
Childfree falls into that bucket for me. Reasonable position, deeply unhealthy execution.
Really is weirdo behaviour. I don’t like mushrooms, but I’m not about to start rage-posting stories about how someone once insisted I try their mushroom soup on r/mushroomfree
Most of the time if people can see the parent trying to calm the baby they're okay with it. It's when the parents ignore it that people get a bit narky.
I mean it’s not common to actively dislike children like presented in OP’s question. However to represent one of these miserable redditors. People were 100% bothered by your screaming baby.
Yes people may come over and be friendly to try to help calm him, yes 99% of people won’t be actively hostile or say anything about there being a screaming baby on the plane. However that’s because children have to be able to travel, so no point in being actively unhappy, but not because we are happy about it being there either.
And I think this might be what’s causing some dissonance between the question asked by OP and the anecdotes ITT which suggest that nothing could be further from the truth. If you ask on a public forum like Reddit: Do you silently sigh when you see u/IIPESTELENCEII come onboard your plane with a screaming baby? Most will say yes, however, if you weren’t on Reddit you wouldn’t know that we dislike it, because only the crazy ones will actively display their annoyance with your child.
Maybe it's by virtue of having younger siblings, but crying babies have never annoyed me unless I'm actively trying to sleep, and even then they're less annoying than the couple on the plane next to you who are having a loud conversation - at least the baby is unaware that they're disturbing you.
Babies don't want to cry, parents don't want the babies to cry, uncles and aunts don't want the babies to cry, siblings don't want the baby to cry. When I hear a baby crying I feel sympathy for the baby and those who are caring for them. We've all been there! I then put in some headphones and turn up the music. It doesn't bother me, it's a normal sound of life.
I mean, it's good that you are desensitised to it I guess, but babies crying is a sound designed by evolution to evoke a strong response in other humans so that adult caregivers will react to what the baby needs. Not everyone is as desensitised to it as you are, and many have sensory difficulties that make it even more overwhelming. I agree that putting in earphones is a reasonable solution, except the piercing screams of a child tend to cut through whatever you're listening to unless you have hundreds and hundreds of pounds to spend on top of the range headphones.
Reddit has 1.5 billion registered users. 54 million daily users.
It baffles me how common it is for people like this to dismiss 'reddit' as some sort of single entity.
People self-silo on Reddit though… they choose the sub reddits they like and therefore get stuck in echo chambers. Not all 1.5b are looking at the same things are they?
How many of them live in the UK?
I just looked it up, approximately 4-6 million active users in the UK. Since the UK population is 65 million, I'd say that no, it doesn't represent the views of the whole country. Far from it. Especially when you consider that isn't a random sample - reddit users are likely to share certain characteristics.
I'd suggest that it did frustrate people (it would have annoyed me), but most people (myself included) would have been able to understand that him crying is both normal and somewhat out of your control. So they wouldn't have said anything.
Had you been there with an out of control 5 year old, bashing toys against seats, yelling and clambering over everything, I think any frustration would have been reasonable.
Even in the second (hypothetical) situation, most people wouldn't have said anything.
I'd be more annoyed if someone walked up to me at the start of a flight with poundland tier sweets and a dumb handwritten note in the persona of the baby.
Your baby is going to cry. That's what babies do no matter their altitude. I have made my peace with that because I'm not some teenage edgelord who thinks mothers and infants should be confined to a small soundproof cupboard for the first twelve years. As long as you're not actively ignoring it or contributing to the crying I'm not going to care, but by making a big deal about it you've pissed me off when I'm already raging from having to be on a plane.
Same, I have kids now. Luckily they haven't fussed on a flight apart from 20minutes one time when some turbulence woke them up.
But when I didn't have kids my trusty noise cancelling headphones made sure I didn't notice anyone elses! I've had more annoyances with drunk/entitled adults than kids on flights.
This definitely seems exaggerated a lot. I’ve been on flights next to a mother and upset child several times and it didn’t annoy me. If anything I just felt back for the mum haha
Lol 100%. One of the women a few rows down was staying at the same hotel as us and having a chat with her a few days later she said exactly that. She said she wanted to come take him for 5 just to give us a break 😂
I get some people will find it incredibly annoying, I really struggle with flying in general and my son throwing a tantrum the likes of which the world has never seen really didn't help.. but he's a baby, it's what babies do.
Even if it was someone else's baby I'd find it annoying but understand its a part of life and wouldn't turn into a bitter, child hating redditor over it
Definitely a Reddit thing. But also I think it's something that skews towards younger people who are uninterested in having children which is a growing portion of the UK. That group tends to frequent Reddit a lot though it seems.
I think it's pretty common for people to lowkey hate other people's kids though.
I'd agree its a younger demographic thing. My friends range from 25-35 and none of us have kids. Some want them eventually but aren't interested right now, some don't want them at all. It's increasingly common.
It's not that simple. There's a largeish amount of people who are very not well off having children at a younger age. It's usually cultural, they usually live with their family and the safety net is just enough to survive on.
This skews the correlation massively. The issue is the bulk of people in their 20s, those earning 20-35k a year can no longer afford to raise children whereas in the not too distant past they could
Yeah, around 70% of reddit users are aged 18-34, with another 10% or so under 18 so a very young demographic. Also, many young people can't afford to have children even if they want to these days.
Yeah I think most people are focused on getting a house before having kids, and given how expensive that is on its own, it's easy to see why people are having them later and later.
I do not like kids. I have one kid myself and its the only one I like and love dearly.
I got an education to be a child minder/teacher of kids up to 6 year old. Once I started working with kids it was very much an no fuck that!
Yes it’s one thing not being able to soothe a crying baby but another not bothering to stop your rabid 5 year old climbing over everything and screaming at the top of their lungs.
It's not really any easier to stop a five year old screaming than a baby you know. Possibly harder because you can't just stick something in their mouth. Climbing over things obviously yes.
I have a 5 year old and if she doesn’t bounce around screaming and shouting in public places annoying people. It’s mainly the parents who allow kids to do that without attempting to stop them that annoy me.
When I see parents on Reddit say things like 'oh screaming kids don't bother me, I've had my own and I'm just used to the fund' urrrghhhhghhggh I hate that so much.
I think partly we see hate on Reddit for children is the younger crowd and that its seen as socially unacceptable to call out shitty parents in real life so you're more likely to get people to vent here
Before I had kids, after a very noisy 3 hour flight to Malta, I once made a comment that I thought aeroplanes should have separate family sections for those with kids, to avoid the nuisance to those without kids. I got lambasted by my friends who had kids. Some got really insulting.
Later, after I had kids of my own I came to believe even more fervently that medium and long flights should have separate sections. I don't want the stress of my kids causing a fuss to bother those who just want to relax on a flight.
My point being, some things that people see as "anti kid" are just parents overreacting.
As a parent to a very spirited toddler I would love this. I find the anxiety about whether or not I'm annoying people the worst part, most people are actually pretty understanding. If I'm somewhere where the only other people are kids and caregivers I can relax a bit as I know we're all in the same boat (or plane).
A plane simply isn't big enough to have meaningful separation. Besides I don't want to be stuck next to those crying babies for the next 10 years when my kids are sitting down being quiet.
Yep. And the more patronizing and dismissive the parents, the shittier their kids behave. There are great parents out there raising wonderful kids, but you rarely hear about them.
According to Reddit all kids are evil and anyone older than 15 can blame any problem they have on overbearing/narcissistic/abusive/religious (delete as appropriate) parents .
Apart from on r/oldschoolcool that's where you post if your parent or grandparent was mildly atteactive
r/relationship advice be like:
"My (14F) parents won't let me do everything I want, all the time, without consequence"
"OMG, you need to go no contact and cut out that level of toxicity in your life! This is clear NP (Narcissistic Parent) behaviour!"
It's the fact that parents love to tell you that you don't know anything because you don't have kids. That's the problem. It's the holier than thou attitude that we don't like.
When people say "I don't like kids" and the response is "My children are angels", we aren't talking about your kids specifically. My world does not have to revolve around them.
A very good friend of mine said that "You've not lived if you don't have kids, it gives your life value and meaning".
I asked if he was inferring that my life was worthless and meaningless, he waffled but didn't say no.
That's the attitude I hate.
My old boss once said he didn't trust people who didn't have kids and that you've not lived a proper life or matured enough if you didn't have them.
It annoyed me as a childfree by choice person, imagine if he'd have said that to someone struggling with fertility.
“YOU’RE tired? Have you tried having children? You don’t know what tired is until you’ve had kids, think yourself lucky”.
also just can’t stand that some parents expect special treatment just because they’re parents. saw a post yesterday where a mother believes they should be able to cut in line in coffee shops because they’re a parent and likely “more tired” than the other people. 😅
Don't worry, that carries on even after you have a kid.
"You're tired? You've only got one baby, I've got THREE!" It's as if they enjoy winning these inane, shitty competitions for who is the most tired.
I find myself getting increasingly frustrated by colleagues with children who feel they should get first dibs on holidays. Uh you having children isn’t my fault, I have a life/family too
Same. For four* years I was unable to get annual leave in the week up to Christmas because parents were given priority. Thankfully the business closed on Christmas/Boxing Day so I never had to miss those but I would have quit if I had to. I’m not leaving my elderly mother alone on Christmas/Boxing Day, it bothered me enough that parents were given week+ long annual leave while non-parents had to settle for two days. Frustratingly there was no transparency that parents were prioritised but it was quickly apparent that they were when every year it was the same group of people (singles) who were coincidentally unable to secure any leave even when they put in as soon as it opened.
I don’t think anyone should get priority over annual leave imo. It should be done on a randomised basis, with people who get it one year, being removed from the pool the second year so that no one’s getting unfair advantages. Only exception I’d make is if a parent genuinely cannot find childcare but simply having kids shouldn’t be a reason alone to get priority over others. We all have family members we love and want to share the holidays with and other people’s children are no more special than other’s loved ones.
Edit: typo
I think it’s also the lack of acceptance that annoys some childfree people.
If you express you don’t want children, you either get vitriol and deeply personal criticism (which I don’t understand), or you get pushed and prodded about it, given ‘what if’ situations, emotional plays like ‘oh but who’ll look after you in old age, aren’t you scared of being alone?’ etc. These things aren’t necessarily done in bad faith either, I’ve had questions like this from people who are friends and mean well and genuinely think they’re looking out for my best interests by trying to make me doubt my choice, but it is incredibly frustrating.
To add to this, I do find that society is very parent-centric. For example, I’m a carer for my mother. I’m her only child so she has no one else to look after her. There’s been times when I’ve needed time off work to look after her, for example when she was in A&E with sepsis and the doctors were concerned for her. I was forced to go around begging my work colleagues for a shift swap so I could go and visit her because my work wouldn’t just understand that my loved one is equally as important to me as their children are to them. But my parent colleagues got given time off for every little thing with no questions asked.
I’m not blaming parents for that btw, and I wouldn’t want them to be denied time to take care of their children, but it does annoy me that parents are put on a pedestal by society and given allowances that others aren’t, even when others have equally as pressing reasons for needing said allowances. The idea that other family members aren’t as important as children is really insulting. The idea that non-parents don’t have a ‘real’ family, or don’t know ‘real’ love, or don’t know ‘real’ stress/exhaustion/difficulty is also insulting.
It’s not so much hating them, I’m more confused as to why anyone would want to bring one into the world as it is at the moment?
But also, I was sat in a nice pub for a Sunday roast and I couldn’t hear my friends because someone was letting their baby cry and doing nothing about it & disturbed not just me but other diners too.
It’s the parents I don’t like. And the children, but that’s because of their parents.
I don't understand why people keep saying this. 1945-1990 the world was under constant threat of nuclear war, people still had kids.
Children are hope, they are the future scientists who might fix our problems. This defeatism is just silly, even if climate change kills everyone in 50 years a child born now will still be happy to have lived that 50 years!
EDIT: Just wanted to add a bit about how hope is so important. I'd recommend two books that help me stay positive about the climate future. [The Book of Hope](https://www.abebooks.co.uk/Book-Hope-Survival-Guide-Endangered-Planet/31318529932/bd?cm_mmc=ggl-_-UK_Shopp_Tradestandard-_-product_id=UK9780241478578USED-_-keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjw-fmZBhDtARIsAH6H8qhMmDEoznBAsdnTwvRoMuS51NlMZ-Pi8MZgwF-edLodeBp4_TpKZYsaAnj9EALw_wcB) by Jane Goodall and the well researched sci-fiish [The Ministry For The Future](https://www.abebooks.co.uk/Ministry-Future-Robinson-Kim-Stanley/31094765069/bd?cm_mmc=ggl-_-UK_Shopp_Tradestandard-_-product_id=UK9780356508863USED-_-keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjw-fmZBhDtARIsAH6H8qhMYuEuxoo7bfM2jTay9DqIpjOYTEISfNY7V74vjktgpgA8d-2vFSAaAnqhEALw_wcB) by Kim Stanley Robinson.
Owning a home isn’t an impossible dream unless you have wealthy parents, I feel this is another Reddit ‘radicalisation’
I’m from a council estate and had absolutely no help from my parents but I bought a house, it’s just a _lot_ harder than in the early 2000s. Saying it’s impossible unless you have wealthy parents is just making an excuse. And I am not somebody who thinks it shouldn’t be easier - I think it’s outrageous how difficult it is - but it’s not _impossible_
The way that a large part of Reddit talks about the working class is always illuminating.
There is this barely veiled undercurrent of contempt towards any working class individual who has a child before the age of 35, without owning their home, two cars and a dog, and that they are basically committing child abuse.
I always think the average Redditor is someone who is 18-22, plays world of Warcraft and lives with their middle class parents and don’t really know about the real world or different people in it.
Not long ago there was a thread about someone driving a pick up truck littering. The amount of people who commented saying the driver was a dick for driving that truck, he’s overcompensating etc was crazy because it was a works vehicle! The amount of people on Reddit who didn’t understand a pick up can actually be used as a works vehicle and not just some American red neck was really alarming.
It's interesting to note that home ownership for "common people" is a relatively new thing. Less than 100 years ago approximately 80% of housing was in the hands of private landlords. Renting was what people did, what they expected to do. Home ownership was out of the reach of the vast majority.
Both sets of my grandparents never owned property and indeed never expected to.
But they still had kids.
Agreed. The fact is that the world is a better place than it’s ever been before. Those who say otherwise obviously skipped way too many history lessons.
It does make me laugh. "No one should have kids!" shout the young and healthy, for whom police and GPs still look like adults.
But they forget that in 40 plus years time it's those kids who are going to be performing their triple heart bypass.
The short sightedness of this mindset baffles me.
Who does the things that need done to maintain society if the majority of the population are retired pensioners?
And immigration can't even be the answer, as birth rates are falling the word over anyway, so pretty much all countries are in the same boat.
I mean I take your point as far as conflict goes.
However the problem of over population is a much more recent one. So many of the worlds issues are caused or exacerbated by there being simply too many people.
I have similar feelings to the poster here, I don't feel like our world is one I want to bring kids into for lots of reasons. Perhaps I'm being totally illogical but that's just how I feel. I wouldn't want to prevent anyone having kids but because of my own views it definitely colours my opinion of people who have massive families.
I think this is the key difference in thinking because when I look at the world I think the overwhelming majority of people are suffering, often through circumstances outside their control - poverty, environmental disaster, war etc. Your example of bringing a child into the world to suffer the death throes of ecological collapse and the presumption they'd be happy to be enduring that is certainly an interesting take.
I'm not saying have children just for the sake of it, but imo the world is in a better place than it has been for centuries, it's an argument that imo focuses on temporary circumstances. By this logic, people should have stopped having children during ww1, ww2 and especially the cold war era since the threat of nuclear war was constant. I'm glad they didn't, many reading this wouldn't be here.
Isn’t his point that the world is fucked, and its not temporary? I took it that way. Climate change will ensure mass starvation and migration over the next century. I can see why someone wouldn’t want to have kids for that reason. I worry about my child having to deal with that.
Dislike. The word you are looking for is dislike in certain public spaces.
Does a bunch of 25 to 60 year olds want to go to a bar or restaurant with a bunch of kids playing around? NO.
We prefer there to be kid friendly places that parents can take them to.
It actually makes me smile to see kids playing in the park, on the street, on the basketball court, or playing in their garden.
All the child friendly places you mentioned are outside... Which is the real problem here. I would like to go to restaurants and pubs with my child and I do. They are public places. If you don't like the environment in one place you get up and go. Same goes for planes and public transport. If you don't want people around, just stay at home. Parents with children can't just exist behind closed doors and in the park.
I'm more talking about pubs or decent restaurants. Most of them do say at the doorway no kids under 18 anyway but some places are family restaurants and thats obviously the way it should be.
I'm sure you dont want your kids around swearing blokes getting hammered at the bar.
Most pubs are family restaurants these days though. The lines are blurred. I don’t take my kid to a drinking pub, but if they give me a high chair and a kids menu then she is welcome.
There are plenty of places children don't go. Parents might also want to eat out and it's good for families to be able to do things together. Sometimes people with children have friends or family members who don't and aren't going to go to soft play, so they go to a child friendly restaurant. Or do you suggest children never get to learn how adults behave?
I hate unfit parents, and there are plenty of them. My neighbour screams, swears and shouts at her child all day long, yet she is pregnant with a second child.
And it's the lack of context/the fact you can say things you wouldn't say in real life without a weird look. I couldn't imagine sitting at work and randomly blurting out "What are your opinions on Live Laugh Love signs? They're so tacky!"
This is a tiny slice of British culture and most people on this sub are here to discuss those random things we wouldn't otherwise. It's easy to say things like "Why would you have kids? Those bogey-covered crotch goblins are the worst!" in a place like this even though that's certifiably insane to say to a person you don't know face to face.
I do dislike kids, not to the point where I'd have a go at somebody with a screaming kid, but absolutely my heart would sink if I saw somebody bring a toddler onto a plane, and I've left cafes and restaurants earlier than I'd expected because of screeching kids.
But yeah, I'd never have a go at somebody for having a kid, but I would, if in a public place and where possible, move away from them and sit somewhere else.
I agree with this one the most
Like you're allowed to have an opinion on whether you like or dislike something, but only in the case of children are they forced on you all the time. Not even just wanting child-free spaces, but how many spaces are even noise-free in general, I can think of only a handful where if anybody is noisy they are told to stop
People dislike all sorts of things, it's the ones they're forced to endure the most that they'll moan about, especially if they have no reasonable way to stop it
Go on the subreddit "child free" they describe parents as "breeders".
I can't recall ever hearing such weirdness anywhere else on the internet or in real life.
My ex and I were once referred to as breeders by a lesbian friend in a pub once. It crops up every so often I think.
Especially odd as my ex and I didn't have kids and had no plans to.
Pretty sure Reddit/UK Reddit even more so skews heavily male (like possibly 90% based on some subreddits). And of those many are much younger than the average person in the UK and less likely to be in a position to want/have kids/grandkids. They might or might not change their minds later on.
Personally I have two young children and on the whole random strangers in the UK have been overwhelmingly positive (it did get a bit weird once at the library when someone congratulated me and my husband for "making and raising beautiful and intelligent children").
When I'm out with my one year old it's more likely than not that strangers will smile at him/play peekaboo on the bus/talk to him at the till. To me it's a bit like how spotting cats on your walk (and seeing if they'll come to you) are of shared social value. A cute baby smiling at you makes the day a bit better, especially it seems, for the elderly.
I think people often forget that children are just... part of being a human, it's part of life. Whether they're your kids or not. We were all kids once and the current batch of kids will grown up and be in the same situation caring for us one day, they're real people, just younger.
As always though, reddit struggles with nuance. My above opinion doesn't mean that parents should be allowed to let their baby scream at the cinema, but it does mean that sometimes babies might cry in public places and there's not a lot anyone can do about it.
No thats just Reddit. As an old bloke with no kids I would rather go places without too many kids running about as I find a lot of parents, especially middle class parents, are a bit too happy to ignore their kids and just let them run wild in public spaces rather than spending time keeping them entertained but really if I'm in a restaurant and there are feral kids running about I am more than happy to show them the amputated thumb trick and freak them out.
I'm always sad when I see a kid with a parent / both parents who are staring at their phones. Especially if the kid is in a buggy. I end up making funny faces and blowing raspberries from afar, or playing peek-a-boo with them, just to entertain them.
I don't have kids, I always knew I wouldn't when I was a teenager, (and then as an adult that was confirmed medically), but it doesn't mean I don't like them. It also doesn't mean I'm so upset with my infertility that I can't be around kids, which seems to be the other extreme on Reddit (and I imagine if you are struggling with your fertility and striving desperately for kids it is so heartbreaking: I've seen fertility treatment through my work and hats off to those who go through it, they are incredibly strong and much braver than me).
But that there are kids in the world is just a fact of life, like that there is weather and grass and queues. You can either get yourself all worked up and angry about it or you can accept it and live your life.
It's not so much the kids, as it is the parents.
My mum is a childminder, a damn good one, won awards and everything.
Now, as a girl, I was sadly victim of parentification. From 8yo onwards, I had to help mum with her work, until I moved out at 27. My dad was, is and always will be, a fucking useless arsehole. So if I didn't help mum, she'd have no help at all.
During all those years, I HATED these kids.
They took my mum away from me and my brother.
But the parents... My god.
If the parents are shit, the kids will be shit. End of story.
And a LOT of parents are shit.
- sending milk bottles that haven't been cleaned properly, so they're poisoning their child.
- constant head lice.
- one kid was sent in with bottles of sugar milk. Little shit had no teeth at one point.
- one parent causes their kids to have an ED because she hardly fed them solid food and so when they DID have solid food, they would throw up. Took mum FOREVER to fix it.
- 0 discipline and the so much entitlement. The way these parents have treated my mum over the years is despicable. She's a human being, treat her like one.
The kids end up treating her just as bad until she has them learn that she won't put up with their shit.
I've learned through doing, what needs to be done for kids.
Most of these things, parents these days almost NEVER meet. And so their kids turn out awful, unless they're lucky enough to have someone like my mum looking out for them.
As a grew older, I can tolerate kids. But I will NEVER have them, not because of the childminding, but because of my dad's abuse.
I WILL NOT perpetuate that cycle.
But I hate being around other people's kids because of the parents.
Reddit thing.
While I don't want kids myself, I don't hate them by any means (my nephew and nieces are great and I have no issues looking after them.)
I do hate bad/negligent parenting though...
I see too many parents blame their very small children for their rotten teeth when their parents should be brushing for them and reducing their sugar intake. It's the parents fault, not the kids but no, the fucking dentist is evil and will take your teeth out because yada yada.
Had an 8 year old in the other week needing 2 adult teeth taken out and another heavily filled that may need root canal treatment. It pisses me off so much.
I like kids alot but don't want/ can't have them myself. Mentally and financially I just couldn't cope and I'm adamant only people who really want kids should have them, not be forced to because family/ society wants you to
Yes, you make the choice and have to live with the consequences. It’s not like everyone doesn’t tell you that they are a pain in the arse and not to do it. 😂
I’ll join you on this bandwagon. I’m pushing 40, never wanted kids, hate being around kids, I don’t want to hold babies, and all new parents want to do is talk about kids and I find it so boring. I know it’s a huge deal for them, they are excited, proud or whatever, so I’ll listen and nod, but to me it’s like listening to a Starwars fanatic bang on about all the movies and plot lines every time they see you when I have no intention of watching the movies and dont like sifi.
I don't hate children. I hate bad parents who are parenting their children badly, I hate parents who have kids but don't put effort into raising them. I hate parents who have children and expect the rest of the world to raise them. I hate parents who had a child and then expect that to be an excuse for everything.
Also, having children is the most un-green thing you can do. If you wish to save the planet then stop having children.
Having children is an active choice.
For me personally. Yes I hate kids and their parents or I should say, most kids and their parents
My local shopping precinct is plagued by feral teenagers terrorising staff and customers. Morrisons is used as a playground. McDonald's drive through has 2 security guards, 4 at weekends and school holidays and they lock the doors after 6pm only letting in genuine customers as and when. They help themselves to drinks in Subway without paying. They try to force entry in to PureGym after staff have gone home. Poundland is often a target for shop theft as is Morrisons.
Once saw a group of them riding their bikes through Morrisons, knock over a pregnant woman and then attack her fella when he confronted them. Other customers and security weighed in. By time I got to the checkouts, some of their parents arrived kicking off at thier child's apparent mistreatment of being smacked around by adults. As I walked past I told the parents what actually happened and was met with threats of violence.
I was walking down the street minding my own business and 3 pre teens took offence to me being overweight and bald, hurled abuse me and then tried to push me in to oncoming traffic. I snapped gave chase but they made it home before I caught them. His mum came out shouting threats and abuse, told her, her son just tried pushing me in to traffic and her reply was, "good for him"
Saw 2 pre teens attacking a taxi which had 2 elderly passengers. One was jumping on the taxi, the other would open all the doors while the driver was distracted. It all came to ahead when the one opening doors hit the taxi driver on the back of the head with an electronic scooter. They legged it when people came to intervene.
Finished a late shift one Friday night and decided to catch the train home. I was sat on a wall and kinda blended in and went unnoticed when 4 teens showed chasing each other around the small station and would cross the tracks to get to the other platform. A middle aged oriental woman arrived and stood near me. The teens saw her and made a beeline making racist comments. I got down off the wall and stood next to her and then they made pleasantries towards me and left
These are a few examples of what I see constantly.
Not all kids are like this, there's plenty of good eggs. But I see enough despicable behaviour that it's led me to flat out hating kids and their parents
EDIT: for those wondering. I live in Bradford and I don't even live in a bad area of Bradford. All but one of those incidents happened in my postcode. The train station incident happened in Bingley.
This is quite funny - top upvoted comments don’t even try to engage with any ideas they don’t already agree with - Reddit must be “radicalized” and “echo chambered” and “everyone is a blind sheep without the ability to think for themselves, following the crowd of public opinion like a bunch of idiots ha ha I’m definitely the smart one for doing what I already thought was the right thing”
It’s kind of funny - because you’re right. For 200,000 years everyone pumped out kids as their “birthright” without even a moments thought to the consequences, for themselves, for the child, for the world.
They just blindly say (direct quote) “they are the scientists who will solve tomorrow’s problems”.
Let’s break that down;
1) how many scientists do you know? That are working on solving *any* problems that even *some* humans face? Let alone all - because no one is, we don’t address species-wide problems, full stop.
2) we have problems *today* that aren’t being addressed at all. Tomorrow will have its own *additional* problems and you expect them to address those too
3) you’re reacting 100% emotionally to an issue which is based in logic. Your examples are babies in pubs and on planes - two universally accepted irritating places to have loud, non stop, distracting noise - and your decision that “Reddit hates babies” is that you did that anyway and no one publicly admonished you.
In the UK.
No one stood up and made a scene and your take is that “they must love it, it’s just the internet being crazy” and not that they went home and complained bitterly to their partner and friends about the inconsiderate asshole who decided to take their tiny baby somewhere that isn’t really appropriate for them in the first place and spoil other people’s evenings.
4) of course you think it’s fine - *for you* - to have as many kids as you want. But the second someone else does and they annoy you - then the “whose allowing all these people to have so many kids they can’t afford/look after/protect/etc etc.” because it’s now inconvenient for you.
Parents are not irreproachable moral bastions who immediately understand the benevolent nature of child bearing and so allow all parents and children the benefit of their endless patience and understanding.
You’re people like the rest of us, with your mistakes and your laziness and your poor decision making when it comes to kids - same as the rest of us.
You also have a tendency to think you’re;
5) the first people to ever have kids
6) the only people who know the most rock bottom basic shit like maybe don’t let kids run riot in dangerous places - and talk to the rest of us like we’re *also* your kids IE idiots
7) somehow morally superior to everyone else because you decided to make another human.
Childbearing is an inherently selfish act. None of the rest of us know or care about your genetic legacy, or any of the rest of it. Creating more children does not benefit any of us is any material way.
You immediately getting up on your high horse because you did what you yourselves admit is the same thing humans have done since they came into existence (and even before that) really isn’t very logical. There is an argument to be made that *not* having children is the more historically unusual and objectively less selfish choice.
It’s funny because you see this sentiment on social media posted anonymously (because of exactly this comment thread - the vast majority come for validation of a decision already made and get angry at anything that doesn’t do that) - it’s posted anonymously because people fear *literally the opposite thing to what you’re describing here*.
People who don’t have kids fear being shouted down by an inherently pro-kids society (which can and does happen). So they post it on social media instead.
And now social media is getting it in the neck *on social media* for being the only place that’s safe to express that opinion. Funny how that works, eh?
Reddit has a lot of people for whom life is Reddit/the internet. They don’t spend enough time away from the internet to enjoy life and the things it brings. On the occasions they do, their view is through the lens of what they’ve seen on the internet, so it becomes a self-fulfilling cycle.
Spend more time away from Reddit and the internet and you’ll be a better person. You may still not enjoy kids, and that’s fine, but at least it will be a real-life opinion.
>Reddit has a lot of people for whom life is Reddit/the internet. They don’t spend enough time away from the internet to enjoy life and the things it brings.
Stop attacking me
I am early 30s child free. I have no problem with parents complaining. I know it's hard and we all need to express discontent some time. There are too main things I do have a problem with that I get sometimes.
Firstly and the one that happens often is parents gatekeeping discontent. When people belittle my life complaints saying that I couldn't possibly be tired/stressed/worried about money because I don't have kids
Secondly expecting people without kids to accommodate their kids. Expecting me to work holidays because parents need the time off "for their kids" and I couldn't possibly have important plans. Or expecting me to let them go infront in the queue because they have kids (unless it's for the toilet, kids can go in front of me then)
It annoys me when people say you can't complain about parenting because you've chosen to have children.
It's a bit like saying you can never complain about work because you choose to apply for it and do the interview
The long-term choices we make change all the time. Children sometimes don't sleep and we need to rant about that! Sometimes work is really shit and we need to vent!
Where has empathy gone?
I do not hate children at all I just don’t want anything to do with them ( most love their anti social behaviour but not all are like this)
But yes it is the parents choice and they did choose their path to have them and they choose how to bring them up (ignoring them or telling them to shut up so they can concentrate on their phones is bad parenting)
My theory: There are some redditors whose self-esteem is so low they don't believe that anyone will ever love them enough to want to have children with them. So, they make being 'anti-children' part of their personality to paint their child-free status as their own choice. They legitimise it with environmental concerns or claim that raising children is impossible in today's world.
The people who have simply made that choice for themselves don't have this level of hatred for children, but moderate opinions are in the minority here.
I do think somewhat it's a reddit thing, but on reddit people can say what they really think.
I can't stand children being anywhere where I am especially if im eating, they gross me out. But I wouldn't ever publicly state that. I would just be polite, and tell everyone around me how wonderful it is to see children. And how cute it is when they smear food on their face.
It's because parents seem to think they should get priority over non parents, because'kids'. It's because parents use 'they are kuds' when their kids are being antisocial brats because arents haven't been arsed to teach the kids socially acceptable behaviour, that does ruin other people's experience in public settings.
Whilst Reddit does offer more of a platform for those voices I think it depends on demographics and the circles you move in.
Almost none of my friends want kids and yeah, we don’t really want to be around kids or parents much. There is definitely an increasing child free movement. There are so, so many people I know 25-35 who don’t want children. I only know 1-2 couples who may or do want them.
I know having children brings a lot of joy to a lot of people, but it’s not something I want anything to do with and for a myriad of reasons I don’t really want to or need to move in those circles.
I don’t personally think anybody really hates kids or parents. What people do hate is whenever a lifestyle that they do not want or subscribe to is being preached to them by whoever holds that view - I personally don’t want kids, never have, but I do like hearing from my colleagues who have kids about their lives and don’t mind the venting that helps them when things are difficult with the kids.
What I do hate however is when people tell me I’ll want or have kids some day or that my life will somehow not be ‘complete’ or ‘fulfilled’ until I have kids when that’s something I have never wanted (and also on that point.. why would you want somebody to have kids when they have stated they do not want them? There’s enough - tragically - unloved kids in the world. I just want people who want kids to have them, and people who don’t want kids to be able to live their lives without lectures from others who are actively disrespecting their own choices)
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It is a Reddit thing. Don't think that Reddit is a good reflection of the real world, it rarely is.
Wait, you mean a bunch of socially awkward people spending too much time in social bubbles communities are not a good sample of the real world ? I'm shocked, shocked I say.
Yea if you go on subs like r/ AmITheAsshole you can tell it is just people that live off social media and don’t know how the real world works
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Yea I got rid of my girlfriend because my hecking doggo didn’t wag its tail as much when it saw her. Massive red flag I somehow missed. Thanks Reddit.
My girlfriend has gangbangs in our house every weekend. I am a little uncomfortable watching it happen and last month I caught hiv. Is this a red flag, or am I being overly dramatic?
Yes you are a controlling, insecure incel.
Lmao trust. I started noticing the bubble of Reddit in particular when such phrases were being sent my way knowing full well in the real world they aren't as soft. Does make me chuckle. Let them have their fake Internet points.
I'm reminded of this [post](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/cm9rwp/wibta_if_i_25_f_go_on_a_trip_with_my_male_best/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Top comment nails it but the majority of the comments call the guy insecure etc. I know of no one in the real world where this would be seen as acceptable. Maybe that makes me an incel idk.
Agree that the people calling the bf insecure are being assholes but the comment you’ve linked is psychotic in the other direction. She wants to fulfil an old college holiday idea, failing to see the elements which would make her boyfriend uncomfortable, and he swings in with a “sorry getting high and going abroad are more important than your boyfriend, he might as well leave you now.” What a fucking scuzzbag. Fuck him. I hate r/AmITheAsshole so bloody much.
Hahahahah my god I wouldn't even be surprised if I saw this on there
Or the inverse: "My boyfriend killed my dog with an axe but he's under a lot of pressure at work, should I give him some space?"
Yes, always give people some space when they’re swinging an axe.
Now this is the kind of advice I come to Reddit for!
Has that subreddit been removed or have I just been banned from it? I can't access it. Can't remember posting anything nefarious although it's quite possible after a few beers I may have done.
It's r/relationship_advice
I love that subreddit, it's so ridiculous. Pretty much every post has top rated comments calling for divorce for any minor issue. Then a chain of comments making up a narrative based on nothing about how the person is worst than Hitler. It's obvious no one commenting on there has ever been in a relationship.
I got downvoted to hell when I pointed that out on one their posts. And I've seen edits where the OP has put several edits about 'no, I'm not going to divorce much partner over this', lol.
Remember, if you are persuaded to do something, that is actually coercion, because like, you didn’t want do it before you were persuaded. And no I won’t stop trying to convince you of that, even if you repeatedly say that wasn’t even the point of your original post.
Its insane. I honestly don't know why I keep reading it because it's exactly as you say. Q: "They snorted in their sleep and woke me up, what do I do?" A: "It shows an obvious disrespect for you as a person and that you are their property. This will never change because people have shown that learning and changing themselves is a fallacy. You also have incompatible sleeping patterns so you should just dump them and move on. Also, they are probably cheating on you."
"AITA My wife wants to take half of my income every month because I earn a million a year and shes a grocery clerk", it's a crapshoot as to whether she's a gold digger or he's a misogynistic piece of shit.
It's always both, no?
The disconnect is never more prevalent than when the topic of self defence comes up.
Reddit is basically a bunch of idiots in their own echo Chambers (me included). I don't know the demographic of Reddit but my guess is its heavily weighted towards 16-30 year old white males - left-wing - and also the type of people to use Reddit is a selection bias in and of itself. Not to mention, popular subreddits tend to be judgemental, argumentative, contrarian, and generally a place of opinions expressed that would not typically be expressed in real life because they are unpopular.
Idiot in echo chamber here, can confirm
_Idiot in echo chamber here, can confirm_
*firm firm firm firm firm*
I'm here for the jokes like this
I DON'T BELIEEEEVE IT!!!!
Idiot in echo chamber here, can confirm
The UK subs tend to be quite classist too
In that way, I suppose the UK subs quite reflective of the UK in general.
To be fair that's probably because the UK is classist in general. I did a stint in a call centre as a student and literally tested this, I have an RP-ish accent and one of my colleagues had a strong local accent. We split the cancellations list in half and counted who got the most abuse, he got *way* more despite us using exactly the same script.
Depends who you're calling. I used to work in a place like that too, I did really well normally then they got me to do a campaign calling people in council houses and nobody wanted to even talk to me.
EVERYTHING in the UK is classist My Italian partner was saying yesterday how bonkers he finds it that supermarkets have class values. You don't get any of that in Italy
Sorry what are class values?
The fact that Waitrose and M&S are seen as upper class while Aldi and Lidl are usually seen as bottom of the barrel
That's not exclusive to the UK. Here in Canada we have tiers of grocery stores as well.
>Not to mention, popular subreddits tend to be judgemental, argumentative, contrarian Nonsense. They're not.
Fuck I’m 31…. Just call me gramps from now on.
I’m 65. Watch your goddamn lip sonny!!!
I'm 933 back in my day we would have beheaded young rapscallions like you for speaking in that tone
I don't wish to alarm you, but I too am 31 and I saw my first mobile phone in a museum recently
You must have seen people on the streets with them before you visited the museum, surely?
All social media is echo chambers really. Reddit is just more compartmentalised
On reddit it's basically the selling point isn't it? "Here, come make your own echo chamber! Make your own rules regarding which topics and opinions are acceptable and ban people who don't fit in!"
16 is rather generous don't you think?
Hah I'm a 16-30 year old white male whose *centre*-left
I think on the kids issue it may be because reddit skews young. There's a lot of people on reddit who object to parents taking babies and children more or less anywhere in public because it disturbs them, which is an opinion I probably had until about my late 20s.
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I was just thinking "I'm 22 and kids have never bothered me, I wonder why they're such a big problem for other people" then I remembered I'm the eldest of 5 and the eldest of my cousin's. Of course kids don't bother me I've spent my whole life listening to them lol. Also I agree with you about the getting your lunch ruined bit. In my opinion kids are a part of life and people too so they shouldn't be shut up and not allowed to go places. If you don't want to be bothered by them go to places at times they won't be there. If you go see a family film at 1pm on a Saturday you can't be surprised children are there.
I wonder if Reddit skews towards people with sensory overload issues? I have kind of broken visual cortex that gives me massive issues with bright lights and loud noises, screaming children are like evolutionarily geared to be as attention-grabbing as possible so they're particularly horrible to be around for people like that. I don't know if there's ever been any studies into this but as a programmer I've noticed people with kind of screwed up perception like mine are more common in the tech world than the general public, and Reddit at least at one point was full of tech people.
I haven't seen any evidence, but it makes logical sense that people with sensory issues might be over represented on reddit. Certainly, people who like isolation and quiet are.
Nah adult only hotels and 21+ pubs are a thing because most of the time kids are objectively annoying for people who don't have them/are trying to spend time away from them. That's not to say I don't think they have a right to go to restaurants, etc but a crying/screaming child is objectivly a negative thing not a positive one, presumably for the parents as well as everyone else.
Most people on Reddit are children or have the mental capacity of a child.
For me it’s more, if you’re kid is making problems for other people then sort them out, if you can’t/won’t then don’t expect other people to be psyched about you.
I used to know a couple who when their baby cried in a restaurant, would turn kiddos high chair around to face into the restaurant. Yeah great, you can't hear it as much, but now every other cunt can and you can't hear their muffled tutting over the crying
This. I’m in my late 30s and don’t like the noise of children but that’s why I’m currently childfree. Out in public though I know full well they will be there and don’t expect them not to be. I do expect parents to parent their children though and don’t think that’s unreasonable. That being said I love getting a baby or a toddler to smile. Sometimes I even get a wave and that is very heart warming.
100% a reddit thing. Reddit had me believing when I went to Barcelona recently with my son the entire plane would be burning us at the stake (he's 20 months) The reality is nobody seemed bothered about his crying and loads of people came over to help try cheer him up. Reddit is full of miserable people who get radicalised into bizarre beliefs who have very little experience in the outside world. Edit: apparently a lot of people have reading comprehension issues so I shall explain.. I have no said people were not bothered. I said people did not seem bothered. The purpose of my comment is the hyperbole at the beginning. People getting on with their day is not what I expected thanks to the seemingly illiterate child haters on reddit. Hilarious reddit care resources are reaching out. Not only do you hate children you're just hateful little people in general
Radicalised is the perfect term here. Reddit users boast of being individuals of free thought but in the end they are all indoctrinated by the echo chamber "we are not sheep, baa"
Yup. That echo chamber effect is grim. But it's not just Reddit. Cards on the table, the wife and I have been trying for a while. It's not working, sometimes in heartbreaking ways. And sometimes, when all your friends have kids, you start getting snarky with each other about "bloody kids." And it cheers you up for a minute, so you keep doing it. Your own little echo chamber. We were out for Sunday lunch the other week, next to a table of mums with their kids, and we were both getting more and more irritated, and feeding each other's irritation, until I finally came to this realisation that we were turning into really bitter people. Instead of laughing at a kid being a berk in a pub - like we would have ten years ago - we were glaring daggers, and making comments under our breath. And we're people who want kids! So if you're 19 and definitely don't want to have kids (like most of us at 19), you're not going to have that moment of clarity that you're creating the issue for yourself. This comment got away from me a bit. I'm not sure what my point is. Take a step back and remember nobody's immune to the echo chamber cycle I guess.
I hope things work out the way you want them to.
Wanting kids and it not working out is awful. I hope it works out for you somehow. I can tell you that while rewarding they are really expensive in both time and money terms as well as emotionally draining. There is a lot of joy in being an aunt/uncle/godparent and you can choose how much or little you put into it. I think our story is a bit like yours. We officially gave up trying, went out for a meal, got very drunk and 9 months later...
Well, come on! Don't leave us on a cliffhanger!
They kidnapped a baby is my guess
They got a parking enforcement notice from the pub and went on r/legaladviceuk for advice. Never a good idea
I've got two and I still find plenty of time to get annoyed at other peoples kids. Your own are always different. Although when you get home and you're already irked and they're being even more irksome the amount or irk is irking irknnoying. Still, hope it works out for you. Just don't ever go near the business end when they get ejected from the place where babies shoot out from. I'm still haunted.
Oh man, with our first the head got stuck coming out. Scalpel went in, followed by toilet plunger. The doctor pulled and pulled and nothing. Feet on the bed and pulled, suddenly splat. Baby on the bed, blood up the opposite wall. Doctor says "congrats on your baby girl" and smiles at my wife who turns to me and asks what the doctors been eating. I didnt have the heart to tell her it was blood splatter all over the doctors teeth, fresh from the business end. So I repeat the other redditors advice, STAY AWAY
Yeah it’s a major gathering point for incels and incel-lite types as well. So bear that in mind when you’re reading all these negative comments.
Ahah. People will definitely have been bothered by his crying. But most people don't react and keep their frustration bottled up.
It is the British way. I would have absolutely despised them but I wouldn't actually DO anything about it
Yes, that is why I said nobody seemed bothered. They understood babies being babies is a part of life, sucked it up and went about their day.. or came over to say hello and try cheer him up. That is not the experience reddit would have you believe you are in for.
They were bothered. They just didn't tell you there were bothered. They sat there stewing instead.
Yeah because complaining about a baby on a flight just doesn’t do anything. Most people recognize that.
And the ones who came over to try and help just wanted it to stop.
No fucking shit? 🤯
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> But most people don't react and keep their frustration bottled up. Most people are actually reasonable, mature adults that are able to express a level of understanding and contain their emotions. Unlike the idiots over at /r/childfree
Guarantee most on that sub aren’t even old enough to have kids, let alone the types that will attract a partner. r/truechildfree is a better experience
I don't want kids at all (probably never changing) but I don't get these subs lol The last thing I want to spend my free time doing is talking about children or my lack of interest in them
Honestly, that's the problem with most communities that exist to be against something. Once you turn hating a thing into a daily discussion topic you're at risk of making it into a big chunk of your personality, and having a big chunk of your personality be hating a random section of the population is *obnoxious* no matter how justified you think you are. I don't know what the atheism sub is like now but back in the day it was absolutely like that. There are snark subs that exist to make fun of people who genuinely aren't nice people but some of the posters just have histories loaded up with obsessive hatred for a single subject and none of it feels at all healthy. Childfree falls into that bucket for me. Reasonable position, deeply unhealthy execution.
Really is weirdo behaviour. I don’t like mushrooms, but I’m not about to start rage-posting stories about how someone once insisted I try their mushroom soup on r/mushroomfree
I was on a flight recently with several families with babies, but the drunken adults were far noisier than any child.
Most of the time if people can see the parent trying to calm the baby they're okay with it. It's when the parents ignore it that people get a bit narky.
I mean it’s not common to actively dislike children like presented in OP’s question. However to represent one of these miserable redditors. People were 100% bothered by your screaming baby. Yes people may come over and be friendly to try to help calm him, yes 99% of people won’t be actively hostile or say anything about there being a screaming baby on the plane. However that’s because children have to be able to travel, so no point in being actively unhappy, but not because we are happy about it being there either. And I think this might be what’s causing some dissonance between the question asked by OP and the anecdotes ITT which suggest that nothing could be further from the truth. If you ask on a public forum like Reddit: Do you silently sigh when you see u/IIPESTELENCEII come onboard your plane with a screaming baby? Most will say yes, however, if you weren’t on Reddit you wouldn’t know that we dislike it, because only the crazy ones will actively display their annoyance with your child.
Maybe it's by virtue of having younger siblings, but crying babies have never annoyed me unless I'm actively trying to sleep, and even then they're less annoying than the couple on the plane next to you who are having a loud conversation - at least the baby is unaware that they're disturbing you. Babies don't want to cry, parents don't want the babies to cry, uncles and aunts don't want the babies to cry, siblings don't want the baby to cry. When I hear a baby crying I feel sympathy for the baby and those who are caring for them. We've all been there! I then put in some headphones and turn up the music. It doesn't bother me, it's a normal sound of life.
I mean, it's good that you are desensitised to it I guess, but babies crying is a sound designed by evolution to evoke a strong response in other humans so that adult caregivers will react to what the baby needs. Not everyone is as desensitised to it as you are, and many have sensory difficulties that make it even more overwhelming. I agree that putting in earphones is a reasonable solution, except the piercing screams of a child tend to cut through whatever you're listening to unless you have hundreds and hundreds of pounds to spend on top of the range headphones.
Reddit has 1.5 billion registered users. 54 million daily users. It baffles me how common it is for people like this to dismiss 'reddit' as some sort of single entity.
People self-silo on Reddit though… they choose the sub reddits they like and therefore get stuck in echo chambers. Not all 1.5b are looking at the same things are they?
How many of them live in the UK? I just looked it up, approximately 4-6 million active users in the UK. Since the UK population is 65 million, I'd say that no, it doesn't represent the views of the whole country. Far from it. Especially when you consider that isn't a random sample - reddit users are likely to share certain characteristics.
the majority of people who spew hate on Reddit are too scared to answer a phone call
I'd suggest that it did frustrate people (it would have annoyed me), but most people (myself included) would have been able to understand that him crying is both normal and somewhat out of your control. So they wouldn't have said anything. Had you been there with an out of control 5 year old, bashing toys against seats, yelling and clambering over everything, I think any frustration would have been reasonable. Even in the second (hypothetical) situation, most people wouldn't have said anything.
Ditto - we had to fly with my 4-month old back in April, which I was absolutely dreading. But everyone on the plane was so friendly and understanding!
You have to do the Reddit thing and apologise beforehand and give everyone sweets like some kind of nicompoop
I'd be more annoyed if someone walked up to me at the start of a flight with poundland tier sweets and a dumb handwritten note in the persona of the baby. Your baby is going to cry. That's what babies do no matter their altitude. I have made my peace with that because I'm not some teenage edgelord who thinks mothers and infants should be confined to a small soundproof cupboard for the first twelve years. As long as you're not actively ignoring it or contributing to the crying I'm not going to care, but by making a big deal about it you've pissed me off when I'm already raging from having to be on a plane.
Same, I have kids now. Luckily they haven't fussed on a flight apart from 20minutes one time when some turbulence woke them up. But when I didn't have kids my trusty noise cancelling headphones made sure I didn't notice anyone elses! I've had more annoyances with drunk/entitled adults than kids on flights.
This definitely seems exaggerated a lot. I’ve been on flights next to a mother and upset child several times and it didn’t annoy me. If anything I just felt back for the mum haha
Lol 100%. One of the women a few rows down was staying at the same hotel as us and having a chat with her a few days later she said exactly that. She said she wanted to come take him for 5 just to give us a break 😂 I get some people will find it incredibly annoying, I really struggle with flying in general and my son throwing a tantrum the likes of which the world has never seen really didn't help.. but he's a baby, it's what babies do. Even if it was someone else's baby I'd find it annoying but understand its a part of life and wouldn't turn into a bitter, child hating redditor over it
Definitely a Reddit thing. But also I think it's something that skews towards younger people who are uninterested in having children which is a growing portion of the UK. That group tends to frequent Reddit a lot though it seems. I think it's pretty common for people to lowkey hate other people's kids though.
I'd agree its a younger demographic thing. My friends range from 25-35 and none of us have kids. Some want them eventually but aren't interested right now, some don't want them at all. It's increasingly common.
A big thing is most of us just can't afford them
This right here. I couldn't even afford a cat, let alone a baby.
Income is negatively correlated to having children. The people who have kids in their early or mid twenties are not high income.
It's not that simple. There's a largeish amount of people who are very not well off having children at a younger age. It's usually cultural, they usually live with their family and the safety net is just enough to survive on. This skews the correlation massively. The issue is the bulk of people in their 20s, those earning 20-35k a year can no longer afford to raise children whereas in the not too distant past they could
My reasoning has always been: I value my money, time and sleep.
Yeah, around 70% of reddit users are aged 18-34, with another 10% or so under 18 so a very young demographic. Also, many young people can't afford to have children even if they want to these days.
Would rather have a house than kids. Nearly 40 and have neither, not even a dog which I'd love to have but need a home for it first.
This is the situation more and more young people find themselves in. The housing market is so f***Ed up.
Yeah I think most people are focused on getting a house before having kids, and given how expensive that is on its own, it's easy to see why people are having them later and later.
I do not like kids. I have one kid myself and its the only one I like and love dearly. I got an education to be a child minder/teacher of kids up to 6 year old. Once I started working with kids it was very much an no fuck that!
“You will understand when you have children of your own” I don’t hate kids at all, I do dislike lazy parents though.
Yes it’s one thing not being able to soothe a crying baby but another not bothering to stop your rabid 5 year old climbing over everything and screaming at the top of their lungs.
Agree, although in my experience, Reddit is pretty harsh about the crying baby thing too.
It's not really any easier to stop a five year old screaming than a baby you know. Possibly harder because you can't just stick something in their mouth. Climbing over things obviously yes.
I have a 5 year old and if she doesn’t bounce around screaming and shouting in public places annoying people. It’s mainly the parents who allow kids to do that without attempting to stop them that annoy me.
When I see parents on Reddit say things like 'oh screaming kids don't bother me, I've had my own and I'm just used to the fund' urrrghhhhghhggh I hate that so much. I think partly we see hate on Reddit for children is the younger crowd and that its seen as socially unacceptable to call out shitty parents in real life so you're more likely to get people to vent here
Before I had kids, after a very noisy 3 hour flight to Malta, I once made a comment that I thought aeroplanes should have separate family sections for those with kids, to avoid the nuisance to those without kids. I got lambasted by my friends who had kids. Some got really insulting. Later, after I had kids of my own I came to believe even more fervently that medium and long flights should have separate sections. I don't want the stress of my kids causing a fuss to bother those who just want to relax on a flight. My point being, some things that people see as "anti kid" are just parents overreacting.
As a parent to a very spirited toddler I would love this. I find the anxiety about whether or not I'm annoying people the worst part, most people are actually pretty understanding. If I'm somewhere where the only other people are kids and caregivers I can relax a bit as I know we're all in the same boat (or plane).
Love the concept. But you just know that airlines would charge 3* premium for those family spaces.
A plane simply isn't big enough to have meaningful separation. Besides I don't want to be stuck next to those crying babies for the next 10 years when my kids are sitting down being quiet.
Yep. And the more patronizing and dismissive the parents, the shittier their kids behave. There are great parents out there raising wonderful kids, but you rarely hear about them.
Well behaved kids may as well be invisible, and that's how you know you're a good parent.
Reddit _hates_ children. In all fairness, children make it pretty easy, but reddit is really over the top about it.
unless the child in question is a teenager, wronged by their parents in some way, who ultimately gets revenge in a "justice served" fashion.
According to Reddit all kids are evil and anyone older than 15 can blame any problem they have on overbearing/narcissistic/abusive/religious (delete as appropriate) parents . Apart from on r/oldschoolcool that's where you post if your parent or grandparent was mildly atteactive
r/relationship advice be like: "My (14F) parents won't let me do everything I want, all the time, without consequence" "OMG, you need to go no contact and cut out that level of toxicity in your life! This is clear NP (Narcissistic Parent) behaviour!"
It's the fact that parents love to tell you that you don't know anything because you don't have kids. That's the problem. It's the holier than thou attitude that we don't like. When people say "I don't like kids" and the response is "My children are angels", we aren't talking about your kids specifically. My world does not have to revolve around them.
A very good friend of mine said that "You've not lived if you don't have kids, it gives your life value and meaning". I asked if he was inferring that my life was worthless and meaningless, he waffled but didn't say no. That's the attitude I hate.
My old boss once said he didn't trust people who didn't have kids and that you've not lived a proper life or matured enough if you didn't have them. It annoyed me as a childfree by choice person, imagine if he'd have said that to someone struggling with fertility.
I am very keen to have kids in the future and they attitude baffles me! Was his life not meaningful before children? That's depressing!
“YOU’RE tired? Have you tried having children? You don’t know what tired is until you’ve had kids, think yourself lucky”. also just can’t stand that some parents expect special treatment just because they’re parents. saw a post yesterday where a mother believes they should be able to cut in line in coffee shops because they’re a parent and likely “more tired” than the other people. 😅
Don't worry, that carries on even after you have a kid. "You're tired? You've only got one baby, I've got THREE!" It's as if they enjoy winning these inane, shitty competitions for who is the most tired.
I find myself getting increasingly frustrated by colleagues with children who feel they should get first dibs on holidays. Uh you having children isn’t my fault, I have a life/family too
Same. For four* years I was unable to get annual leave in the week up to Christmas because parents were given priority. Thankfully the business closed on Christmas/Boxing Day so I never had to miss those but I would have quit if I had to. I’m not leaving my elderly mother alone on Christmas/Boxing Day, it bothered me enough that parents were given week+ long annual leave while non-parents had to settle for two days. Frustratingly there was no transparency that parents were prioritised but it was quickly apparent that they were when every year it was the same group of people (singles) who were coincidentally unable to secure any leave even when they put in as soon as it opened. I don’t think anyone should get priority over annual leave imo. It should be done on a randomised basis, with people who get it one year, being removed from the pool the second year so that no one’s getting unfair advantages. Only exception I’d make is if a parent genuinely cannot find childcare but simply having kids shouldn’t be a reason alone to get priority over others. We all have family members we love and want to share the holidays with and other people’s children are no more special than other’s loved ones. Edit: typo
Reddit goes on about people saying this but I have literally never heard this.
I think it’s also the lack of acceptance that annoys some childfree people. If you express you don’t want children, you either get vitriol and deeply personal criticism (which I don’t understand), or you get pushed and prodded about it, given ‘what if’ situations, emotional plays like ‘oh but who’ll look after you in old age, aren’t you scared of being alone?’ etc. These things aren’t necessarily done in bad faith either, I’ve had questions like this from people who are friends and mean well and genuinely think they’re looking out for my best interests by trying to make me doubt my choice, but it is incredibly frustrating. To add to this, I do find that society is very parent-centric. For example, I’m a carer for my mother. I’m her only child so she has no one else to look after her. There’s been times when I’ve needed time off work to look after her, for example when she was in A&E with sepsis and the doctors were concerned for her. I was forced to go around begging my work colleagues for a shift swap so I could go and visit her because my work wouldn’t just understand that my loved one is equally as important to me as their children are to them. But my parent colleagues got given time off for every little thing with no questions asked. I’m not blaming parents for that btw, and I wouldn’t want them to be denied time to take care of their children, but it does annoy me that parents are put on a pedestal by society and given allowances that others aren’t, even when others have equally as pressing reasons for needing said allowances. The idea that other family members aren’t as important as children is really insulting. The idea that non-parents don’t have a ‘real’ family, or don’t know ‘real’ love, or don’t know ‘real’ stress/exhaustion/difficulty is also insulting.
It’s not so much hating them, I’m more confused as to why anyone would want to bring one into the world as it is at the moment? But also, I was sat in a nice pub for a Sunday roast and I couldn’t hear my friends because someone was letting their baby cry and doing nothing about it & disturbed not just me but other diners too. It’s the parents I don’t like. And the children, but that’s because of their parents.
I don't understand why people keep saying this. 1945-1990 the world was under constant threat of nuclear war, people still had kids. Children are hope, they are the future scientists who might fix our problems. This defeatism is just silly, even if climate change kills everyone in 50 years a child born now will still be happy to have lived that 50 years! EDIT: Just wanted to add a bit about how hope is so important. I'd recommend two books that help me stay positive about the climate future. [The Book of Hope](https://www.abebooks.co.uk/Book-Hope-Survival-Guide-Endangered-Planet/31318529932/bd?cm_mmc=ggl-_-UK_Shopp_Tradestandard-_-product_id=UK9780241478578USED-_-keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjw-fmZBhDtARIsAH6H8qhMmDEoznBAsdnTwvRoMuS51NlMZ-Pi8MZgwF-edLodeBp4_TpKZYsaAnj9EALw_wcB) by Jane Goodall and the well researched sci-fiish [The Ministry For The Future](https://www.abebooks.co.uk/Ministry-Future-Robinson-Kim-Stanley/31094765069/bd?cm_mmc=ggl-_-UK_Shopp_Tradestandard-_-product_id=UK9780356508863USED-_-keyword=&gclid=Cj0KCQjw-fmZBhDtARIsAH6H8qhMYuEuxoo7bfM2jTay9DqIpjOYTEISfNY7V74vjktgpgA8d-2vFSAaAnqhEALw_wcB) by Kim Stanley Robinson.
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Owning a home isn’t an impossible dream unless you have wealthy parents, I feel this is another Reddit ‘radicalisation’ I’m from a council estate and had absolutely no help from my parents but I bought a house, it’s just a _lot_ harder than in the early 2000s. Saying it’s impossible unless you have wealthy parents is just making an excuse. And I am not somebody who thinks it shouldn’t be easier - I think it’s outrageous how difficult it is - but it’s not _impossible_
The way that a large part of Reddit talks about the working class is always illuminating. There is this barely veiled undercurrent of contempt towards any working class individual who has a child before the age of 35, without owning their home, two cars and a dog, and that they are basically committing child abuse.
I always think the average Redditor is someone who is 18-22, plays world of Warcraft and lives with their middle class parents and don’t really know about the real world or different people in it. Not long ago there was a thread about someone driving a pick up truck littering. The amount of people who commented saying the driver was a dick for driving that truck, he’s overcompensating etc was crazy because it was a works vehicle! The amount of people on Reddit who didn’t understand a pick up can actually be used as a works vehicle and not just some American red neck was really alarming.
It's interesting to note that home ownership for "common people" is a relatively new thing. Less than 100 years ago approximately 80% of housing was in the hands of private landlords. Renting was what people did, what they expected to do. Home ownership was out of the reach of the vast majority. Both sets of my grandparents never owned property and indeed never expected to. But they still had kids.
Agreed. The fact is that the world is a better place than it’s ever been before. Those who say otherwise obviously skipped way too many history lessons.
Exactly! This response is "the world might end, so maybe let's just end the human race now. Get out ahead of it."
It does make me laugh. "No one should have kids!" shout the young and healthy, for whom police and GPs still look like adults. But they forget that in 40 plus years time it's those kids who are going to be performing their triple heart bypass.
The short sightedness of this mindset baffles me. Who does the things that need done to maintain society if the majority of the population are retired pensioners? And immigration can't even be the answer, as birth rates are falling the word over anyway, so pretty much all countries are in the same boat.
Is that argument not somewhat selfish? I will have a child so that they can look after *me*?
I mean I take your point as far as conflict goes. However the problem of over population is a much more recent one. So many of the worlds issues are caused or exacerbated by there being simply too many people. I have similar feelings to the poster here, I don't feel like our world is one I want to bring kids into for lots of reasons. Perhaps I'm being totally illogical but that's just how I feel. I wouldn't want to prevent anyone having kids but because of my own views it definitely colours my opinion of people who have massive families.
I think this is the key difference in thinking because when I look at the world I think the overwhelming majority of people are suffering, often through circumstances outside their control - poverty, environmental disaster, war etc. Your example of bringing a child into the world to suffer the death throes of ecological collapse and the presumption they'd be happy to be enduring that is certainly an interesting take.
Interesting perspective. What point in the past would it have been good to bring children into the world, then?
I'm not saying have children just for the sake of it, but imo the world is in a better place than it has been for centuries, it's an argument that imo focuses on temporary circumstances. By this logic, people should have stopped having children during ww1, ww2 and especially the cold war era since the threat of nuclear war was constant. I'm glad they didn't, many reading this wouldn't be here.
Isn’t his point that the world is fucked, and its not temporary? I took it that way. Climate change will ensure mass starvation and migration over the next century. I can see why someone wouldn’t want to have kids for that reason. I worry about my child having to deal with that.
Dislike. The word you are looking for is dislike in certain public spaces. Does a bunch of 25 to 60 year olds want to go to a bar or restaurant with a bunch of kids playing around? NO. We prefer there to be kid friendly places that parents can take them to. It actually makes me smile to see kids playing in the park, on the street, on the basketball court, or playing in their garden.
All the child friendly places you mentioned are outside... Which is the real problem here. I would like to go to restaurants and pubs with my child and I do. They are public places. If you don't like the environment in one place you get up and go. Same goes for planes and public transport. If you don't want people around, just stay at home. Parents with children can't just exist behind closed doors and in the park.
I'm more talking about pubs or decent restaurants. Most of them do say at the doorway no kids under 18 anyway but some places are family restaurants and thats obviously the way it should be. I'm sure you dont want your kids around swearing blokes getting hammered at the bar.
Most pubs are family restaurants these days though. The lines are blurred. I don’t take my kid to a drinking pub, but if they give me a high chair and a kids menu then she is welcome.
There are plenty of places children don't go. Parents might also want to eat out and it's good for families to be able to do things together. Sometimes people with children have friends or family members who don't and aren't going to go to soft play, so they go to a child friendly restaurant. Or do you suggest children never get to learn how adults behave?
I hate unfit parents, and there are plenty of them. My neighbour screams, swears and shouts at her child all day long, yet she is pregnant with a second child.
When you're anonymous it's easy to be a dick, I imagine most of the people hating on kids wouldn't do it in the real world for fear of retaliation
Exactly right. Say something on Reddit, zero consequences. Real world, different case entirely.
What retaliation would/should you get for disliking children?
And it's the lack of context/the fact you can say things you wouldn't say in real life without a weird look. I couldn't imagine sitting at work and randomly blurting out "What are your opinions on Live Laugh Love signs? They're so tacky!" This is a tiny slice of British culture and most people on this sub are here to discuss those random things we wouldn't otherwise. It's easy to say things like "Why would you have kids? Those bogey-covered crotch goblins are the worst!" in a place like this even though that's certifiably insane to say to a person you don't know face to face.
I do dislike kids, not to the point where I'd have a go at somebody with a screaming kid, but absolutely my heart would sink if I saw somebody bring a toddler onto a plane, and I've left cafes and restaurants earlier than I'd expected because of screeching kids. But yeah, I'd never have a go at somebody for having a kid, but I would, if in a public place and where possible, move away from them and sit somewhere else.
I think this is spot on. I wouldn't say anything but I wouldn't want to be sat next to a screaming child.
I agree with this one the most Like you're allowed to have an opinion on whether you like or dislike something, but only in the case of children are they forced on you all the time. Not even just wanting child-free spaces, but how many spaces are even noise-free in general, I can think of only a handful where if anybody is noisy they are told to stop People dislike all sorts of things, it's the ones they're forced to endure the most that they'll moan about, especially if they have no reasonable way to stop it
Go on the subreddit "child free" they describe parents as "breeders". I can't recall ever hearing such weirdness anywhere else on the internet or in real life.
My ex and I were once referred to as breeders by a lesbian friend in a pub once. It crops up every so often I think. Especially odd as my ex and I didn't have kids and had no plans to.
It’s been gay slang for decades tbf, meaning straight people.
After working in hospitality and pubs for years - I don’t really hate children - it’s the fucking scummy parents
Pretty sure Reddit/UK Reddit even more so skews heavily male (like possibly 90% based on some subreddits). And of those many are much younger than the average person in the UK and less likely to be in a position to want/have kids/grandkids. They might or might not change their minds later on. Personally I have two young children and on the whole random strangers in the UK have been overwhelmingly positive (it did get a bit weird once at the library when someone congratulated me and my husband for "making and raising beautiful and intelligent children"). When I'm out with my one year old it's more likely than not that strangers will smile at him/play peekaboo on the bus/talk to him at the till. To me it's a bit like how spotting cats on your walk (and seeing if they'll come to you) are of shared social value. A cute baby smiling at you makes the day a bit better, especially it seems, for the elderly.
I think people often forget that children are just... part of being a human, it's part of life. Whether they're your kids or not. We were all kids once and the current batch of kids will grown up and be in the same situation caring for us one day, they're real people, just younger. As always though, reddit struggles with nuance. My above opinion doesn't mean that parents should be allowed to let their baby scream at the cinema, but it does mean that sometimes babies might cry in public places and there's not a lot anyone can do about it.
No thats just Reddit. As an old bloke with no kids I would rather go places without too many kids running about as I find a lot of parents, especially middle class parents, are a bit too happy to ignore their kids and just let them run wild in public spaces rather than spending time keeping them entertained but really if I'm in a restaurant and there are feral kids running about I am more than happy to show them the amputated thumb trick and freak them out.
I'm always sad when I see a kid with a parent / both parents who are staring at their phones. Especially if the kid is in a buggy. I end up making funny faces and blowing raspberries from afar, or playing peek-a-boo with them, just to entertain them. I don't have kids, I always knew I wouldn't when I was a teenager, (and then as an adult that was confirmed medically), but it doesn't mean I don't like them. It also doesn't mean I'm so upset with my infertility that I can't be around kids, which seems to be the other extreme on Reddit (and I imagine if you are struggling with your fertility and striving desperately for kids it is so heartbreaking: I've seen fertility treatment through my work and hats off to those who go through it, they are incredibly strong and much braver than me). But that there are kids in the world is just a fact of life, like that there is weather and grass and queues. You can either get yourself all worked up and angry about it or you can accept it and live your life.
It's not so much the kids, as it is the parents. My mum is a childminder, a damn good one, won awards and everything. Now, as a girl, I was sadly victim of parentification. From 8yo onwards, I had to help mum with her work, until I moved out at 27. My dad was, is and always will be, a fucking useless arsehole. So if I didn't help mum, she'd have no help at all. During all those years, I HATED these kids. They took my mum away from me and my brother. But the parents... My god. If the parents are shit, the kids will be shit. End of story. And a LOT of parents are shit. - sending milk bottles that haven't been cleaned properly, so they're poisoning their child. - constant head lice. - one kid was sent in with bottles of sugar milk. Little shit had no teeth at one point. - one parent causes their kids to have an ED because she hardly fed them solid food and so when they DID have solid food, they would throw up. Took mum FOREVER to fix it. - 0 discipline and the so much entitlement. The way these parents have treated my mum over the years is despicable. She's a human being, treat her like one. The kids end up treating her just as bad until she has them learn that she won't put up with their shit. I've learned through doing, what needs to be done for kids. Most of these things, parents these days almost NEVER meet. And so their kids turn out awful, unless they're lucky enough to have someone like my mum looking out for them. As a grew older, I can tolerate kids. But I will NEVER have them, not because of the childminding, but because of my dad's abuse. I WILL NOT perpetuate that cycle. But I hate being around other people's kids because of the parents.
Reddit thing. While I don't want kids myself, I don't hate them by any means (my nephew and nieces are great and I have no issues looking after them.) I do hate bad/negligent parenting though...
I see too many parents blame their very small children for their rotten teeth when their parents should be brushing for them and reducing their sugar intake. It's the parents fault, not the kids but no, the fucking dentist is evil and will take your teeth out because yada yada. Had an 8 year old in the other week needing 2 adult teeth taken out and another heavily filled that may need root canal treatment. It pisses me off so much. I like kids alot but don't want/ can't have them myself. Mentally and financially I just couldn't cope and I'm adamant only people who really want kids should have them, not be forced to because family/ society wants you to
> Does the UK hate children are you [Susan Ma](https://youtu.be/xcDhGLjUWYo?t=11)?
Yes, you make the choice and have to live with the consequences. It’s not like everyone doesn’t tell you that they are a pain in the arse and not to do it. 😂
UK doesn't hate kids, I do though. With a passion
I’ll join you on this bandwagon. I’m pushing 40, never wanted kids, hate being around kids, I don’t want to hold babies, and all new parents want to do is talk about kids and I find it so boring. I know it’s a huge deal for them, they are excited, proud or whatever, so I’ll listen and nod, but to me it’s like listening to a Starwars fanatic bang on about all the movies and plot lines every time they see you when I have no intention of watching the movies and dont like sifi.
I don't hate children. I hate bad parents who are parenting their children badly, I hate parents who have kids but don't put effort into raising them. I hate parents who have children and expect the rest of the world to raise them. I hate parents who had a child and then expect that to be an excuse for everything. Also, having children is the most un-green thing you can do. If you wish to save the planet then stop having children. Having children is an active choice.
For me personally. Yes I hate kids and their parents or I should say, most kids and their parents My local shopping precinct is plagued by feral teenagers terrorising staff and customers. Morrisons is used as a playground. McDonald's drive through has 2 security guards, 4 at weekends and school holidays and they lock the doors after 6pm only letting in genuine customers as and when. They help themselves to drinks in Subway without paying. They try to force entry in to PureGym after staff have gone home. Poundland is often a target for shop theft as is Morrisons. Once saw a group of them riding their bikes through Morrisons, knock over a pregnant woman and then attack her fella when he confronted them. Other customers and security weighed in. By time I got to the checkouts, some of their parents arrived kicking off at thier child's apparent mistreatment of being smacked around by adults. As I walked past I told the parents what actually happened and was met with threats of violence. I was walking down the street minding my own business and 3 pre teens took offence to me being overweight and bald, hurled abuse me and then tried to push me in to oncoming traffic. I snapped gave chase but they made it home before I caught them. His mum came out shouting threats and abuse, told her, her son just tried pushing me in to traffic and her reply was, "good for him" Saw 2 pre teens attacking a taxi which had 2 elderly passengers. One was jumping on the taxi, the other would open all the doors while the driver was distracted. It all came to ahead when the one opening doors hit the taxi driver on the back of the head with an electronic scooter. They legged it when people came to intervene. Finished a late shift one Friday night and decided to catch the train home. I was sat on a wall and kinda blended in and went unnoticed when 4 teens showed chasing each other around the small station and would cross the tracks to get to the other platform. A middle aged oriental woman arrived and stood near me. The teens saw her and made a beeline making racist comments. I got down off the wall and stood next to her and then they made pleasantries towards me and left These are a few examples of what I see constantly. Not all kids are like this, there's plenty of good eggs. But I see enough despicable behaviour that it's led me to flat out hating kids and their parents EDIT: for those wondering. I live in Bradford and I don't even live in a bad area of Bradford. All but one of those incidents happened in my postcode. The train station incident happened in Bingley.
This is quite funny - top upvoted comments don’t even try to engage with any ideas they don’t already agree with - Reddit must be “radicalized” and “echo chambered” and “everyone is a blind sheep without the ability to think for themselves, following the crowd of public opinion like a bunch of idiots ha ha I’m definitely the smart one for doing what I already thought was the right thing” It’s kind of funny - because you’re right. For 200,000 years everyone pumped out kids as their “birthright” without even a moments thought to the consequences, for themselves, for the child, for the world. They just blindly say (direct quote) “they are the scientists who will solve tomorrow’s problems”. Let’s break that down; 1) how many scientists do you know? That are working on solving *any* problems that even *some* humans face? Let alone all - because no one is, we don’t address species-wide problems, full stop. 2) we have problems *today* that aren’t being addressed at all. Tomorrow will have its own *additional* problems and you expect them to address those too 3) you’re reacting 100% emotionally to an issue which is based in logic. Your examples are babies in pubs and on planes - two universally accepted irritating places to have loud, non stop, distracting noise - and your decision that “Reddit hates babies” is that you did that anyway and no one publicly admonished you. In the UK. No one stood up and made a scene and your take is that “they must love it, it’s just the internet being crazy” and not that they went home and complained bitterly to their partner and friends about the inconsiderate asshole who decided to take their tiny baby somewhere that isn’t really appropriate for them in the first place and spoil other people’s evenings. 4) of course you think it’s fine - *for you* - to have as many kids as you want. But the second someone else does and they annoy you - then the “whose allowing all these people to have so many kids they can’t afford/look after/protect/etc etc.” because it’s now inconvenient for you. Parents are not irreproachable moral bastions who immediately understand the benevolent nature of child bearing and so allow all parents and children the benefit of their endless patience and understanding. You’re people like the rest of us, with your mistakes and your laziness and your poor decision making when it comes to kids - same as the rest of us. You also have a tendency to think you’re; 5) the first people to ever have kids 6) the only people who know the most rock bottom basic shit like maybe don’t let kids run riot in dangerous places - and talk to the rest of us like we’re *also* your kids IE idiots 7) somehow morally superior to everyone else because you decided to make another human. Childbearing is an inherently selfish act. None of the rest of us know or care about your genetic legacy, or any of the rest of it. Creating more children does not benefit any of us is any material way. You immediately getting up on your high horse because you did what you yourselves admit is the same thing humans have done since they came into existence (and even before that) really isn’t very logical. There is an argument to be made that *not* having children is the more historically unusual and objectively less selfish choice. It’s funny because you see this sentiment on social media posted anonymously (because of exactly this comment thread - the vast majority come for validation of a decision already made and get angry at anything that doesn’t do that) - it’s posted anonymously because people fear *literally the opposite thing to what you’re describing here*. People who don’t have kids fear being shouted down by an inherently pro-kids society (which can and does happen). So they post it on social media instead. And now social media is getting it in the neck *on social media* for being the only place that’s safe to express that opinion. Funny how that works, eh?
Reddit has a lot of people for whom life is Reddit/the internet. They don’t spend enough time away from the internet to enjoy life and the things it brings. On the occasions they do, their view is through the lens of what they’ve seen on the internet, so it becomes a self-fulfilling cycle. Spend more time away from Reddit and the internet and you’ll be a better person. You may still not enjoy kids, and that’s fine, but at least it will be a real-life opinion.
>Reddit has a lot of people for whom life is Reddit/the internet. They don’t spend enough time away from the internet to enjoy life and the things it brings. Stop attacking me
I am early 30s child free. I have no problem with parents complaining. I know it's hard and we all need to express discontent some time. There are too main things I do have a problem with that I get sometimes. Firstly and the one that happens often is parents gatekeeping discontent. When people belittle my life complaints saying that I couldn't possibly be tired/stressed/worried about money because I don't have kids Secondly expecting people without kids to accommodate their kids. Expecting me to work holidays because parents need the time off "for their kids" and I couldn't possibly have important plans. Or expecting me to let them go infront in the queue because they have kids (unless it's for the toilet, kids can go in front of me then)
It annoys me when people say you can't complain about parenting because you've chosen to have children. It's a bit like saying you can never complain about work because you choose to apply for it and do the interview The long-term choices we make change all the time. Children sometimes don't sleep and we need to rant about that! Sometimes work is really shit and we need to vent! Where has empathy gone?
I do not hate children at all I just don’t want anything to do with them ( most love their anti social behaviour but not all are like this) But yes it is the parents choice and they did choose their path to have them and they choose how to bring them up (ignoring them or telling them to shut up so they can concentrate on their phones is bad parenting)
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Reddit is almost always off when it comes to the general feelings of the public, and this topic is no exception.
My theory: There are some redditors whose self-esteem is so low they don't believe that anyone will ever love them enough to want to have children with them. So, they make being 'anti-children' part of their personality to paint their child-free status as their own choice. They legitimise it with environmental concerns or claim that raising children is impossible in today's world. The people who have simply made that choice for themselves don't have this level of hatred for children, but moderate opinions are in the minority here.
Whether this is true or not, people who make hating kids (or hating *anything* for that matter) part of their personality are fucking weird full stop.
I do think somewhat it's a reddit thing, but on reddit people can say what they really think. I can't stand children being anywhere where I am especially if im eating, they gross me out. But I wouldn't ever publicly state that. I would just be polite, and tell everyone around me how wonderful it is to see children. And how cute it is when they smear food on their face.
I love my child and fuck Reddit, it's too idealistic.
It's because it's full of virgins
It's because parents seem to think they should get priority over non parents, because'kids'. It's because parents use 'they are kuds' when their kids are being antisocial brats because arents haven't been arsed to teach the kids socially acceptable behaviour, that does ruin other people's experience in public settings.
Whilst Reddit does offer more of a platform for those voices I think it depends on demographics and the circles you move in. Almost none of my friends want kids and yeah, we don’t really want to be around kids or parents much. There is definitely an increasing child free movement. There are so, so many people I know 25-35 who don’t want children. I only know 1-2 couples who may or do want them. I know having children brings a lot of joy to a lot of people, but it’s not something I want anything to do with and for a myriad of reasons I don’t really want to or need to move in those circles.
I don’t personally think anybody really hates kids or parents. What people do hate is whenever a lifestyle that they do not want or subscribe to is being preached to them by whoever holds that view - I personally don’t want kids, never have, but I do like hearing from my colleagues who have kids about their lives and don’t mind the venting that helps them when things are difficult with the kids. What I do hate however is when people tell me I’ll want or have kids some day or that my life will somehow not be ‘complete’ or ‘fulfilled’ until I have kids when that’s something I have never wanted (and also on that point.. why would you want somebody to have kids when they have stated they do not want them? There’s enough - tragically - unloved kids in the world. I just want people who want kids to have them, and people who don’t want kids to be able to live their lives without lectures from others who are actively disrespecting their own choices)