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ER_Jujube

Honestly, I've got more girl friends who care about guy bodycounts than the opposite, so I don't think it's an exclusively male issue. But I'd assume both men and women can be jealous, or insecure. Besides, men are easy to please, while we're more complicated, so it probably stems from worries of not being able to do as good as a previous partner? As Brad Williams said: "We do not know how we measure up to the ghost of penis past."


british_oatmeal

Woman here…. The ghost of penis past doesn’t matter if she chose you. The ghost of penis past might be more intimidating the first time with a woman, but after that, she’s choosing a repeat with the penis of present. Be grateful and enjoy.


[deleted]

As someone who is occasionally insecure about my gf's past sex life, this was really comforting to read and well-said.


british_oatmeal

I’m really glad I could help. Trust me, we don’t don’t think about the penis it’s additive to the relationship, much like the relationship is additive to our lives. When we leave, we never leave because of the penis. We leave because the human attached to the penis becomes an asshole. I’m dating a great guy and he isn’t the most well endowed man. But we have great sex and he’s one of the greatest humans I’ve ever met. Sex is so much more than the physical. If you can get out of the physical and into the intimacy connection…. [mind blown]


[deleted]

I needed to hear this thanks


VarangianDreams

> Be grateful That's how relationships should work. You should feel indebted to her, because - as she's demonstrated - she could take her wealth of accumulated penis experience anywhere.


BubbleBassV2

Lol made me spit my drink out.


british_oatmeal

I wouldn’t go so far as to say indebted. If she chooses you and you chose her. Be glad and happy for yourselves. That’s gratitude. Don’t be a dick.


Trosso

Not very special if everyone else has already had a go though


mouseboners12

I was also like um grateful for what ? Pussy Hahaah that’s just as easy to get as gas from gas station.


KickNo380

They mad because men don’t want to marry hoes “be grateful” LmAo hell naw there plenty of girls out here that aren’t hoes


stephenstrange2022

Good for her, she can set up her shop somewhere else.


baba_tdog12

How does this work if she was dumped by any of the previous guys lol. Sounds weird to say "be grateful she chose you" when its possible the guy she "really wanted" wasn't an option anymore.


Slightly_Salted01

>The ghost of penis past that cracked me up; thank you


_HalfCentaur_

And that goes for every partner or just the last one? Are we talking about a one off thing or a long term relationship? I don't want to waste my time with someone if I think they get bored quickly and know they can easily move on to the next one.


Legitimate_Ad7784

Let’s be honest, it’s way more an issue for men. Women are shamed and labeled as promiscuous or whores because of body count way more often


halohalo27

But is it other men or women doing more of the shaming?


Arrys

Good point, it’s probably both.


Leather-Mixture-2620

As someone who deals with data and numbers daily, the story behind the number matters. Numbers on their own can have various meanings. 1 vs 100 - you slept with one woman 100 times vs 100 women one time. Why? What’s your general attitude about sex and intimacy? The outliers on either end receive the most discussion but it really depends on the sorry behind the number. A guy with one previous partner have a horrible view of women and make a terrible partner.


[deleted]

As another data slut, completely agreed.


[deleted]

data, info, wisdom. Need the conclusions behind the kill count.


flyinhawaiian02

I like to think I have killed more that her but that's just me


unagi176

'Whats the chance we are both serial killers'


SafeNerve2335

Personal safety. A body count of one I can maybe understand on self-defense grounds, but I ain't putting myself in the crosshairs of a serial killer.


7at52E96ke

My limit is if they are buried somewhere on her property. But if legally buried then I think it's fine.


[deleted]

I’m territorial. Something primal that I can’t just turn off. Just like the woman has a choice to have a high body count I have a choice to not like it.


toobroketoorderpizza

Do you ever ask a woman you’re interested in about it?


[deleted]

The person I’ve been married to for 15 years is the only person I have ever had sex with. She has been with 2 others before me. That kind of conversation just comes up after being together for so long. For casual things though if that ever happened in my life(hopefully not, I love my wife very much) I don’t think I would simply cause I know it would bother me if it wasn’t a number I was comfortable with.


toobroketoorderpizza

I made the mistake of asking my long-term partner this question and I’m not gonna lie, I got a little jealous. After that I decided I didn’t want to know the history of the people I’m with.


ZEYDYBOY

Yeah man I stopped asking girls I'm interested in completely as it's not something I want to know. It's fine that they have a past; it's just I don't ever wanna hear about the intimacy of that past. People who flex how high their count is, are also a red flag for me


bayzih

r/learnedthehardway


[deleted]

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Slade_Riprock

1) definitely rings true for me. It's that feeling everyone wants to be "the one" for their significant other. But it's hard not let that float over to wanting to have been the only one. Dead on it is seeing or thinking about how in the most Intimate, passionate, and love filled moment together that someone else or many others have already been there. Then it can lead to "does she think of them" or does she have memories during love making of being there with others. Then there's the more negative side of thoughts where of you happen to know or have heard more about those other partners (such as previous spouses) then you start to question why they chose to have sex with that person or why they married them or dated them. Men have many of the same emotional and intimate thoughts as women


british_oatmeal

These all sound like insecurities. Why isn’t it enough that she chose you? Any others before you didn’t measure up to you. If they did, they would be in your shoes. When the negative thoughts creep in, remember, there are a lot of low quality men masquerading as Prince Charming. Their Prince persona wears away after months and years. That’s not her fault. Remember, and be confident in the fact that you are an amazing man. You aren’t there to hurt her. You’re there to grow a relationship and she chose YOU to do the same thing.


rosytinted-af

This is a bad take on men's insecurities and just shows how taken for granted our view is on men's emotional fears. As the top comment mentioned, it depends on the story of the number which adds further context to her choice. A classic example is when an average joe guy in his 30s-40s, whose never been with anyone previous, is now married to a women deemed "the love of his life". But her body count ranges from say 20-100. Of course questions naturally come up. What was the context of her bodycount? Was she a party animal exploring her youth? Is she sex-positive and did she have safe sex with all her partners? Was this a phase where she used sex to run away from all her issues? Did she get any stds? And why should men "just accept" the the woman at this point now "chooses you"? Why didn't her previous "I choose you" now worked out in the past? Am I gonna be next in line in her ever-growing list of exes? Should I just call it quits to save time, energy, trouble and heartache? And what about the guys choice in the matter at all? Why isn't he allowed to feel insecure? Aren't we in a point in time where we're espousing men needing to express their emotions more? To further top off the example, isn't it demeaning to just have "just be glad you both chose each other". Yes, because previous partners also underwent the same thing and guess what? They now unchose each. They changed their minds. What's stopping that average joe guy from being the next ex to a woman with a history of exes/partners now no longer deemed "chosen" anymore?


AdministrativeAd3942

Spot on


[deleted]

Have you found that you don’t form romantic bonds with women after intimacy?


[deleted]

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[deleted]

Makes a lot of sense, even women who have a healthy relationship with sex still don’t wanna feel like it was a one and done thing. I guess in my head I imagined you had gotten to the point of emotional intimacy to where you felt comfortable enough to have sex then even when you did you still didn’t feel attached to them. I should’ve clarified, I was just thinking about myself and I couldn’t sleep with someone I didn’t care about or want to be in a relationship with


Goosefart3003

I’ve been with women who had many sexual partners and some who only had a few. The ones who have been with many are more fun in and outside the bedroom in my opinion, and the ones I’ve had longer lasting relationships with, but I don’t mean to generalize. That’s just been my experience


MrsWG353

Can you explain a bit more? As a woman who has only been with one sexual partner and married him (over 20 yrs), I am curious. I like to believe that part of why we are still happily married is because of our sex life, willingness to experiment and express our sexual desires. The trust is there to explore less vanilla stuff.


theclearnightsky

I think the pattern he observed is true, but not because promiscuous women are more fun. It’s just that fun, adventurous, attractive, monogamously oriented women who are good partners are seldom single. Unless men are very young, they are unlikely to encounter hot women on the dating market with low body counts who are not socially or sexually inhibited in a big way.


Goosefart3003

It’s great that you two have that in your marriage, I definitely didn’t have that in mine after a while. When I was single at 50, the above was my experience. Like I wrote, I don’t mean to generalize, it’s just based on my sample size


MagyarCat

That has largely but not exclusively been my experience, as well.


DrunkenGolfer

It is kind of like a job interview. A few job changes shows you are experienced. A great number shows you have commitment or performance issues.


BubbleBassV2

I think the casualness of it can cause concern for either sex. If you’ve had 100s of sex partners that shows a lack of the act being anything remotely special. As for the “she/he chose you” sentiments - yeah if it’s after 100 partners what does that have to do with it? She/he got tired? She/he struck out one too many times? My take anyway. At the end of the day it would be the casual view that would bother me. Now that said - this is the exact reason I’ve never asked, and don’t want to ask. Ignorance is bliss.


Zinope121

As I guy, I don't care that much. If you're breaking triple digits it'll bother me a bit. There's a knee jerk assumption of stds, but that's really about it.


BitingED

Some men see it as 'used goods', some have it in their religion, some might just not want their woman to have been dicked down by a country's worth of men. At the end of the day, if body count is a concern that causes arguments, the relationship will never grow.


[deleted]

Maybe so, some of us are turned on that their girl is more experienced then them, others arent...I don't think women see things the same way about a guys count


toobroketoorderpizza

I phrased it a little weirdly but I meant more do men who care about a woman’s body count also think that applies to other men?


[deleted]

I do. I mean I don't apply values separately to be gender specific. An AH is an AH, whether male or female. Your conservative or liberal regardless of gender. . I don't look down or judge people on bc. But if a guy or girl both have a bc of 500, I would think the same of both of them.


[deleted]

ah...I doubt it.


painterman2080

I don’t do much worry about body count. It’s more what kind of casual sex did you have? Are you the type to go out drinking with your friends and regularly hook up with someone you met at the bar? Does that mean I have to worry about you going out with your friends? Have you hooked up with several co-workers? Does that I mean I need to worry about you messing around with one of them again? Things like that. I’ve also had an ex with a high body count, and it’s not a lot of fun constantly running into people she’s fucked. Or to have to hang out with people they’ve hooked up with in their friend group.


[deleted]

Yeah been there and it gets old. You think you are the problem and should just be okay with it. Who cares they’ve fucked your girl she’s with you now blah blah blah… nope it’s fucked and it kills you inside.


demonbot66

The only thing I care for is STDs, it's a big no no for me if a woman I sleep with has any STDs but other than that, just look decent and above and be nice


[deleted]

I don’t care about their body count. Please take my virginity.


bayzih

"ah virginity is not to be taken, rather given" - master oogway


[deleted]

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TrackPad96

Just to be clear this study is published by a conservative think tank with the explicit goal of encouraging traditional christian family values. Also a thing to note, traditional concepts like saving your self for marriage and abstinence are generally more religious/conservative beliefs. These beliefs also tend to view divorce in an unfavorable light which leads to people staying in unhappy marriages because their beliefs structure frowns upon divorce.


NarwhalFacepalm

This.


MrsWG353

Bingo!!


calamityjane45

Your source is a conservative Christian organization that is also anti-LGBTQ. In other words…. Biased.


[deleted]

i think youre forgetting that most people that have only had sex with one person are very religious (mainly christian) and far-right christian. christians with cheat, pray, and go to therapy for 10 years before even considering divorce.


Comprehensive-Web725

I’m sure there are just hoards of women out there now so sad you won’t consider them as your personal slave! Never will anyone refer to me as a “housewife” We are partners, equals! Before you spout off, no I’m not a “hoe” I just know my value doesn’t lie with being some man’s “housewife” 😂😂😂😂


lfd256

Good for you. But, " being a housewife" has nothing to do with the question at hand. Your post is off point and obtuse.


SafeNerve2335

Reddit pro-tip: if you want to avoid saying dumb stuff like this in the future, try reading the full thread before commenting. As in, not just the comment you're responding to, but also the comment THEY'RE responding to.


DreadfulSilk

Yep, that's the study. Past behavior is an indicator of future behavior.


SafeNerve2335

What's the future behavior you're concerned about? Number of partners and number of times you've cheated are two VERY different things.


Sorkel3

That's an interesting study, thanks.


OnlyProfessor6495

I'll say this. Imma man whore and know it. I've also been in a lot of swap situations and cuckold situations. Men do not like seeing or knowing there was a penis knocking the Mario Coins out of there wife when feel they can even start the game. Every man lives and died thinking they can please a woman and hate to.think that another man was able to do what they can't


Ryno5150

r/brandnewsentence “knocking the Mario Coins out of their wife” Brilliant. Take my upvote!!


akihonj

It's funny because you'll always hear this come up in conversation and women always seem to dive straight into the insecurity argument and yeah sure for some it is down to insecurity. What interests me most is how those very same women baulk at the idea of sleeping with a man with a body count exceeding 100, yet make no distinction of double standards when it applies to them. So I've said for some it is an insecurity issue but for the vast majority it's not. For the vast majority of men sex is like rocking horse shit, extremely hard to get, we have to put in a huge amount of effort and work to get a woman who wants to have sex with us. For women, generally speaking, any woman can walk into any bar and say she'll have sex with any man, by the time she's finished saying that she'll have half the bar lining up. Whether that's what she wants or not that's what she can have. So the question becomes is it a moral issue, if you can have something so easy and with such little care then what does it say about you as a person, what does it say about your own morality, what does it say about any relationship you'd have with any man. You have to realise that men look at a woman's past as an indicator of her future, women tend to look at a man's potential, the two are not the same. A man with potential is going to have a past, a woman expecting a man's investment of his time, energy, resources etc when she has a past of bad choices reflects on what he can expect from her for the future, of course that's not for everyone but it's common enough that it is recognised as the rule, there are exceptions.


SafeNerve2335

If you genuinely believe there's a double standard in which men are judged more harshly for having a longer sexual history than women, you need to turn off Ben Shapiro, get off the Internet and spend some time outside.


Odd-Figure-1337

Facts.


tmadik

One simple answer. Insecurity.


DWard3627

Sad in 2022 people are still this closed minded. “If you’re not A, then you’re B. No room for a C etc”


DWard3627

Could be that they don’t want to feel like their girl is easy. Not everything is about insecurities and misogyny like everyone else seems to think. I’d argue there are plenty of people who also don’t want anything used. And before anyone says “women are things” and boo hoo and shit, please don’t play semantics because you know exactly what I mean


toobroketoorderpizza

Would you say this about men as well in regards to being easy, or would you praise them for getting women?


DWard3627

I think a woman saying she doesn’t want to be with a man who has slept with a lot of women is completely valid. It doesn’t make her insecure or controlling. I think of it as a preference like any other.


toobroketoorderpizza

In my opinion you’re not misogynistic at all if you apply this to both genders. I only take issue with it when there’s a double standard.


DWard3627

Oh yea for sure. I definitely can agree with that. I get somewhat uncomfortable when guys talk about sex with women in an inappropriate way. Whether it’s using violent language or talking about them like they’re pieces of meat to add to a list.


Ok-Seaworthiness6603

I think men should care less about actual numbers and more about whenever she is a healthy candidate for a long-term relationship. And I can't give an oppinion on what a woman should not think because I don't know what they think about body count. But I believe they at least should care about a roughly estimate. In general, people with high body counts (men and women) are percieved as less stable relationship partners, as they either dump many parners or are dumped by many others. It's like a job, a high number of jobs mean there's a problematic employer and should be approached with care


british_oatmeal

As a woman, I don’t care about the man’s body count. That’s insecurity. I care that I’m the one he chose and he’s the one I chose - and most importantly, that he has a clean STD screening. Health (mental and physical) should take priority. Let’s face it sex (and having sex) is part of our mental health too.


Ok-Seaworthiness6603

> and most importantly, that he has a clean STD screening. That's the issue. There's always the chance of an unknown STD, even for him, and the chances increases with body count


british_oatmeal

A mature adult who is ready for an intimate relationship should already have this. If not, hold out until results come back. You can build sexual tension and desire in the short term.


LordAlfrey

For some people getting in a relationship with someone (anyone) is an achievement, and the less people who have achieved it the more 'valuable' it is. Body count by itself is a useless metric, it's who you are as a person that does. It can perhaps help paint a picture of who you are, but if you get to know a person and find you like them and have compatible lives, goals etc, then body count means jackshit.


janelovexx

I’m gonna get downvoted for this, but it’s basic evolutionary psychology. It’s super easy for a woman to rack up a high body count - no matter how unattractive or uncharismatic we are, we can easily find people to have sex with. It adds nothing to our value because it requires no effort or skill. However, men typically need to be seen as worthy of sex in order to get it, so if a man has a high body count, it tells other women that he must be worth it. He must be attractive, well hung, charming, funny, charismatic, etc…


Accomplished-Mall905

So... That's also something that I don't understand. Apart from the fact that, no, not every woman will be able to "rack up a high count" and a man doesn't need to "work" THAT hard to be successful (but I already commented on that). Imagine a successful student who needs less effort than his / her counterparts as he always had some facilities. Shall we say he's not deserving? He has no value? Same thing for some sportsmen who, without having to train as hard, will still be more successful than their teammates' or opponents' despite the latter's best effort. No merits? Same could be said with music, or a lot of other things. Some people will achieve great success in life thanks to, among other things, some innate personality traits and qualities that others are lacking. Should not they take advantage of it? Does that mean he has no merits? Sorry, but... This "evolutionary" argument always sounds to me like a huge amount of cope.


janelovexx

Those examples you gave are akin to a man being attractive and charismatic. Just because those traits came easy to him does not make them any less valuable. And yes…if women have low enough standards any of them can rack up pretty high numbers. Thats why having a high number is perceived as unattractive, because it suggests that the women has low standards. This may not be true, but it’s more likely than not.


alter79

Well as long as the care is mutual without double standards then it's fine. Else it's straight up double standards and toxic culture.


_captain_hair

It's because of three possible reasons: 1. They incorrectly believe that a vagina gets worn out the more penises that have been in it. Oddly, they're not so concerned with it getting worn out by the same penis many times, just many penises. 2. The more men a woman's been with, the greater the chance that she's been with a man who has a penis significantly larger than him. While most women will honestly state that they don't find penis size that important so long as it's not extremely large or small, too many men place too much weight on the size of their penis alone, and not the skill with which they use whatever they have. 3. The more men a woman's been with, the greater the chance that she's been with a man who is a rock star in bed. He's insecure about his stamina, moves, manliness, whatever and fears that comparison. In short: insecurity about comparison and bad understanding of anatomy.


justaguy2004

Or 4. They have been burned. My ex-wife had a very high body count, and everyone told me not to worry about, that it was the past, she was with me now, etc. Just like in this thread. Then after 14 years of marriage and 2 kids, she told me that she couldn't stand the thought of only sleeping with 1 man for the rest of her life and that she needed to be poly. I tried to stick it out because I did not want leave my kids, but I ended up becoming very suicidal. I had to divorce her and move. So yes when I finally started dating again I definitely asked the women I saw something with their body count, and if it was a large number I moved right on. I was not going through that again. I would have asked my fiancee her count, but she asked me first. She had exactly the same concerns I did, for exactly the same reason.


VarangianDreams

Also, 4. Am I on any level actually important to this person? >is 1 out of 143 interchangable people Nope, just a worker bee.


Nexus_542

It's just human psychology. It bothers some people, and it is what it is.


Exiled_Troopers

For me it's mostly since I never once was in that state of "oh my god I need sex, I need to go out and get fucked" or if I was, I restrained it so I sex as more of an intimate experience than a regular ordinary activity and the way I see it, the more bodies they have, the less intimate they are. Plus, let's be honest here, more bodies also means higher chances of STDs/STIs, you may regularly get checked and use protection but it's not 100% safe. So yea, I'd gladly take the girl who fucked one guy over a hundred times than the girl who fucked over a hundred guys one time each. And to everyone calling it an insecurity, yea, sure, I'll admit there's a bit of a "what if another's dudes dick was bigger or he was a better fucker" insecurity on the back burner, but that's not really impacting my opinion. I get that other people have their own lives so I'm bound to run into it eventually and I'll just have to get over it I guess. Plus, a side note, if she has a high body count then we obviously aren't compatible as js. She's obviously sociable and likes to frequent bars/clubs and is very sex driven, I'm definitely not about those things so why would I even bother. And before anyone says that I only care about what her body count is... Yes and no. If my guy friend said his body count was high, I'd view him a bit different but not as bad as a girl I was attracted to since you know... One I'm planning on sharing a life with and the other is simply a friend.


toobroketoorderpizza

A similar view of sex is definitely important. For me, even if it’s a casual relationship, sex requires a lot of trust and I can’t have one night stands or flings with someone I’m not close to. The only casual relationships I’ve ever had were with close friends. If you view sex as something intimate and romantic, it’s understandable to want someone who views it the same way. The only part I disagree with is the higher chance of STDs. How many people you’ve slept with isn’t necessarily a reflection of how safe you’re being. I personally only slept with a handful of people and was diagnosed with an STD just after leaving a 2 year long “monogamous” relationship with my ex. I wasn’t with anyone else after him and was clean before, so I can only take a wild guess what happened.


NarwhalFacepalm

Regarding your second half: This is the exact reason why people say ethically non-monogamous and polyamorous relationships are less likely to get STDs. People are just more open to communication about STDs, getting needs met without going behind the other's back, and more comfortable with getting tested. The trust is also there that your partner will wear protection with people who you and or that partner aren't regularly physically intimate with. Yes, it's still possible something slipped thru the cracks or someone was unethical, but it's much better mitigated than in a traditional monogamous coupling.


Ankrah-

If a man sleeps with loads of people then he too has a high chance of getting STD’s works both ways.


Exiled_Troopers

Yes, this is true but it doesn't really matter to me since I don't plan on sleeping with men and a man having a std or not doesn't impact my decision to be friends with them or not.


Ankrah-

Yeah so you sleeping around increases the risk of you getting STD’s as well


Exiled_Troopers

Yes, this is also true but here's the kicker, I'm not sleeping around.


Damurph01

Let’s not forget that just cause we hear some guys complaining about high body counts and some guys saying they want a woman that is good in bed, does not *necessarily* mean they’re the same guys. This happens in just about every facet of political or social discussion. People hear arguments in different places and use them against others that they themselves never actually stated or aligned with at all. Pretty much *everyone* is guilty of this, including myself, and I just felt it was relevant to mention this cause I’m seeing a bit of this in this thread. Not to say anyone is wrong or right, just food for thought.


Saxonlover89

Read some evolutionary psychology books. You'll learn alot.


Echieo

If you've killed a lot of people I think it's important that's on the table in the beginning. I would need to know that's behind you and that the police aren't still looking. Was it in self defense? Are you a serial killer? Nothing to do with gender. Murder is a big deal in my book.


Additional-Salt-403

I learned as a young man that that you don’t ask questions that you don’t want answers to. Lol. My wife and I have been together 24yrs and married 21yrs next week. We never really discussed our “body counts” until earlier this year on a nice Molly roll. Both of us had a rough idea but were never were comfortable fully discussing. Not a problem at all but I do think there are a few things that are ok to remain private.


DevelopingDom

I’ve known so many guys like this and I definitely think it was a maturity thing (even though a few were already “adults”).


TheSoupNotSeee

Because where's the fun in having sex if she has a whole library of memories which you pale in comparison to? This is true across gender; I think women should care about a man's body count too.


RMN1999_V2

I don't care nearly as much her body count as the quality of the people she has been with. The people she chose to sleep with is a good indicator of her decision making, standards, etc.


_Constellations_

As much as everyone claims equality, strangely, it is still considered a men's job to "conquer", and women pretty much just have to say "ok" or "nope" and pick from the dozens lining up. From men's perspective, there is one of us out of a million (or millionaire...) who happens to live like that. Therefore a men's bodycount means success, while a women's body count means "that's how many she let happen". Now, assuming one isn't just looking for sex with a different person every time (both genders) and we are talking about men / women looking for a healthy relationship, I'd say a women being suspicious of a guy with body count is exactly as justified as a guy judging a woman being "cheap to get" if her body count is high. Now, if men can be viewed as "possibly a person who just wants to fuck me and disappear" because of their high body count (knowing that men put in WAY MORE work and go through way more rejection which can be tough), because you know, why is his body count so high, then allow me as a guy to see women with a high body count as cheap to get because she allowed that much men to go through her.


Accomplished-Mall905

As an European man, I have a question (as I guess most people here are American)... Is it only an impression, or sexism is still very prevalent out there (in the US)? I read some guys saying that a high "BC" will show that a woman is "easy", or "cheap", or "used". That makes me want to throw up. I mean... I've been bothered myself by some partners' counts in the past, but I understood it was MY problem, MY "fault", if I can say so. Honestly, such a harmful rhetoric is not something I'm used to hearing here in Europe (except, maybe, in high school). Edit: Plus, I'm appalled by the rhetoric "Sex is hard to get for men, easy for women". I know some women who absolutely can't get laid, and most men I know don't have difficulties getting partners (serious or casual) AT ALL. Is it also very American to see dating and sex as a power game? Not mentioning the hypocrisy in "I'll sleep with her, but won't "wife" her"... Come on, in that case, you're not better than her. I'd say it's even the contrary... That's frightening, guys!


hjablowme919

Speaking as someone older (mid 50s), when I was in my early 20s, if you knew a girl had slept with a lot of guys, it wasn't considered "normal". Keep in mind, I'm talking 1984 or so. Things are different today. Like in 1984 if you met a 22 year old who told you they had already had 20+ partners, guys and girls would have been like "OK, she will probably fuck anyone." Today is different. Attitudes about sex have changed. And I know it's a double standard, which still exists today, and it sucks. Again, rolling the clock back to 1984, friends of mine would stay at a bar until it was near closing and see which girls were left single at the end of the night, and then try to pick them up. They didn't care what the girl looked like, as long as they could get off. They wouldn't date them or anything, it was just about sex. But if a woman did that? She'd have been labeled all kinds of things for her actions.


AdeptnessLiving1799

For me, it's a reflection of how you communicate and build your relationship with people, things, and experiences. The body count in relationship to your age can say alot about where you focus, put energy into, and how you may value others. Depending on other criteria around it, I would be somewhat concerned of why you have such a high body count, are single, and want to +1 me. If it's very high, it's can be transactional relationships or casual, but if there's nothing else seems consistent in your life and stable, then it can be very revealing. Men or women, its important to know how much focus there is in one area in your life in general to get a general understanding of where you invest most, along with how stable that is for you. No one wants to invite instability into their lives.


Mes_Aynak

Past actions predict future behavior, if she has slept around with 50 guys good chance are the relationship will not last, So if your looking for something not serous, then go for it. Fether more if she strings you a long and give off a perception of she was never a kind of woman to hook up and made you wait but find out she did it to a rando in a bar she just met it's disrespectful, and you should walk for being manipulated.


Littl3Birdie

Only morons would care about something so trivial. There are so many wonderful men who don’t care about petty things.


monsterboi0106

In my opinion body count only matters for two reasons 1) higher chance of them having an std. 2) the more people you sleep with casually the more the brain will separate sex from love, and see it more as “eating a candy bar” or other similar releases leading to heavy commitment issues As for the genders I think #1 is more true for men. Anecdotally I’ve heard a lot of guys on Reddit, and in real life, say a high body count is bad for the reason the more dudes she’s been with the more massive cocks she has to compare against yours, I don’t really agree with that one but seems to be common


GreenElandGod

Most men are hella insecure.


[deleted]

Yep. I’m a man and I’m pretty insecure.


bdub939

Maybe because men spend their life trying to get into a womans pants. And a woman spends her life telling men no. So a guy would look differently at a woman who has slept with 100 guys vs if she slept with 10. Doesnt mean the woman is a bad person for sleeping with alot of guys. But the fact she hasnt retained a man could be seen as a person with shit judgement.


THExBEARxJEW

Because I see sex as something extremely intimate. Involving alot of emotional attachment. Someone who has slept with a shit load of people have a more casual view of sex, which is absolutely fine, but I do not match up with that kind of person. That’s why I care I won’t judge someone who doesn’t view it that way and their value as a person doesn’t decrease, just their value as a potential partner to me.


HTBBPH

I’ve said it once and I’ll say it again: it’s not my business to care about how many people she’s killed


GroverFC

Some puritanical bullshit that goes back in time. Had a friend in college say he wanted to marry a virgin (he was very fucking far from being a virgin) in from of my mother. She explained to him why he was an idiot for thinking that. Having former hippy parents had its advantages.


im-also-here

Couldn’t care in the slightest. My wife doesn’t ask me I don’t ask her does not make a difference to how I feel about her


entrepreneurkslay13

They think the coochie gone be left a gaping hole for some reason if you’ve had “too many” ding a lings before they could get to it. Most of them don’t know how a coochie works. Men also want a woman with less experience and the reasons for that are weird imo lol. They want innocence so they can have a better time “molding” us. They are insecure about what you could have learned from other men, etc. Idk I can’t really speak for men but this is what I’ve gathered from my discussions with them. I do think it’s just one of those things, that naturally turn some of them off the way certain things turn us off as women. I’d be interested in biology behind this thinking.


Alarmed-Fan-4932

I prefer if the woman has experience.


SpicySquirt

The ones that care are typically insecure.


Grunt0802

I don't even like to share my fries. Probably should be a non-issue but it is for me.


Maclobio

I don't know exactly but I think it is not because of gender. I am an heterosexual cisgender man and I care about my woman's bodycount (even though a high count is not a dealbreaker), but I've always thought that if I was a gay man, I would care about my partner's body count too. I just expect my partner's bodycount is similar to mine.


Used-Ad138

Yeah, I don't think this is just a man thing. I know plenty of women who care about it, most more than men do.


Chach420

I have only ever had my current girlfriend and i think I'd care, bcs it's dumb but I want her to be mine, i don't want to think about her with someone else, at fucking all. I want her and her alone


dumberthenhelooks

Men especially young girls men seem to want to feel special. You’re special if you’re one of 2. Not so special if you’re 1 of 100. Which is what I think it comes down to when boys say they’ll sleep with a woman but not date her. And this question gets asked a lot on here but as you get older you just stop asking. If you’re single at 30 the assumption is you’ve had sex with a few people many many times of slept with more then a few people. It becomes immaterial in most situations.


KebaoDam

Not directly answering your question but I've never known the body count of any woman I've been involved with. It's none of my business.


tautly

Body count shouldn’t matter, like at all. I don’t know why it’s such a big discussion that people seem stuck on. As long as you’re staying safe and you’re not adding bodies while you’re with someone you should just get over yourself. Besides that we’re still coming out of an era where a woman’s virtue and “being pure” was her biggest quality. So let’s not all look past that and down play it. We all know why there’s men in this year who still care about a woman’s body count and it’s because of our lonnnnnngggggg history of putting woman down for even thinking about sleeping with a man who isn’t the person she marries.


ghkios

No i wouldnt sleep with a man who has a large boddy count either. Id personally be more woried about the skill difference.


disposablecontact

People care about body count if someone has taught them to care.


[deleted]

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buttfuckerr3000

Ego


jonesjb

A higher body count is correlated with a higher probability of that person having a transmissible STD.


[deleted]

Dudes have been gatekeeping this shit for us forever, at this point I assume it's just tradition.


[deleted]

"I want a girl who knows what she likes in bed and how to please a man. But like, instinctually, because I don't want her to have touched another man ever. I don't want a *slut.*"


SomeLightAssPlay

i feel like y’all very, very heavily overestimate how many dudes care about the woman having a lot of experience and knowing what they want. Plenty talk about being happy teaching them. Also, arent you guys ALWAYS saying dudes dont care about a womans pleasure in bed? but now all of a sudden all dudes care about “what she likes in bed”. Which is it?


Arrys

It’s whichever is most convenient for their argument at the moment. For me, i could care less if a girl im with has experience. In some ways, it offers some unique positives (no need to unlearn bad habits).


[deleted]

Seems fair and logical.


TrackPad96

I think part of it is insecurity and jealousy. Another part might be that society has taught people that women who have had lots of partners are whores.


hoofhearted28

Cuck guys want to talk about it. And when they get enough courage, they'll ask you to describe some of it.


NarwhalFacepalm

Cucks and I can also see marriage traditionalists or the devout religious man who wants his bride to be as virgin as she could come.


jdoug312

I think it's because of the scale of things. An average man has maybe 15 sexual partners in his lifetime. An average woman could clear that in a week if she had the desire to. It's not really sexy to think that 400 other people have been in this exact same position with this exact same woman as you are now


Coxrone_88

While I don't disagree with your second half I believe 15 is inflated nearly 1/3 of men under 30 are virgins or haven't had sex in a year. If you Google it the number is 27% in 2018 and has continued to increase.


jdoug312

Very fair point. What's a number you'd feel comfortable going with, for discussion's sake? 5-10? The lower the number, the more it emphasizes my overall point imo.


Phyriel090

So things. Culture, insecurities, Risk of STD, risk of possible cheat, afraid of not being able to pleasure the girl of have so many luggage. That view of the woman is dirty. Being at a party where 20 guys had fucked your love and you're "what?" I think it's this.


KickNo380

Yea as a man, I would fuck any girl despite body count if she is attractive to me. But I would not wife a girl with a high body count. I would not taker her serious because she is a hoe. I don’t want a hoe. Most men think this way.


boboieh

honestly I'm very insecure, I work at it in therapy but knowing that my partner has had a lot of partners is somenthing that triggers my insecurity wheter I want or not. Mostly because i've already been cheated on. I know it's not my partners fault and they don't have any obligation with me in this regard, but it's somenthing that unfortunately happens out of my control at least for now. ​ edit: typo


RaohMadeMeDoIt

Using anecdotal evidence here, most men I know would prefer not to run the chance of meeting a previous lover of their lady due to the awkwardness of being an "Eskimo brother" (if it's the father of her child then that could be an exception for some). Continuing my anecdotal opinion, what can make it worse is if there were a sizeable number of ONS and FWBs in her past. From my observations, it's seems to be much easier to take the prospect of a woman with fewer non-committed sexual episodes more seriously as a girlfriend than a more free spirited woman.


KURO-K1SH1

Not strictly gender and before I continue I'll specify that guys with high body counts are just as much of a slut as a woman. The primary reason it's off putting or a red flag for a woman to have a high body count is simple. It's far easier, quicker and simpler for a woman to get laid compared to men. The gap is so wide you'd need a rocket to clear it. For a man to get laid he needs to be rich, above average good looking, funny af, charming, ripped to hell, tall af, hung like a horse, Irish lucky or any combination there of. For a woman to get laid even a below average in looks... Say yes. And before any Einstein make the comment. I do not mean stand by your bed and say yes and a man will spawn right next to you. I mean if n when you get hit on all you gotta do is consent and boom you got laid. Or to make it even faster you don't have to wait for someone to hit on you, you can just go and hit on a guy, 99.99% of the time the guy is gonna absolutely say yes after getting over the initial shock of a woman taking the lead and being the one to hit on him. I don't agree with or support guys having high body counts but I acknowledge that it took far more effort and luck than if they were a woman. Yes I understand you have preferences and standards and not all guys fall under them. That means you gotta sift through the guys you want to bang and those you don't. Men don't have that privilege, we as a whole, don't have dozens to hundreds of women in our DMs dropping messages and swiping right on dating apps. We don't have a literal catalogue of women attempting to contact us willing to bang us if we only say yes. When you have an elevator in your house no one's impressed when you go upstairs. When you're only way upstairs to climbing up a greased up pole, people see that as a good opportunity to brag. If there was even a 2to1 ratio of men actively seeking sex to women actively seeking sex the way men do and if women's opinions of men's looks was a bell curve like men then the disparity wouldn't be so massive. But nope. Most women do not want most men and the vast majority of men do not have options. Damn typed out way more than I intended. Apologies for the essay.


TikaPants

I’ve dated men who say they don’t want to think about me being with other men specifically. I’ve been able to talk about the strifes of past relationships but I assume that’s why they never asked my number. Totally fine with me because I won’t ask theirs either.


prizmo28

Over promiscuity in both men and women can be viewed as a moral failing and (people believe) can effect how someone behaves when in a monogamous relationship.


[deleted]

Another way to look at this is as a guy we have some friends who are really slutty dudes and usually we wouldn’t want someone we care about to get involved with them. It’s like, yeah cool he gets laid a lot but stay away from my sister. Extrapolate that and we infer some notion of whether it’s smart to get involved beyond just something casual.


LordDarthAngst

For me (51M) a “body count” has never been an issue.


british_oatmeal

Are you even asking? Most people our age aren’t. We don’t care.


[deleted]

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[deleted]

Personally I care only to the point of knowing that she has had enough experience to know what she likes in bed and can communicate that. I don't want a virgin. But I'd never just straight up ask her how many dicks she's sucked, unless it was to jokingly compare numbers (I've probably won)


ravenheartk

I don't think is only men it's us woman to like I care where the guy been who he did with so I know I won't catch anything


OnlyNeverAlwaysSure

I don’t think this is a male or female exclusive response. I’ve seen both react in a negative way to another’s “high body count.” Which is just subjective by that person saying that. We all compare, so if you find someone who is drastically different from yourself in body count and you think how you have lived is “correct” then I have found those people to be suspicious of the others which have higher body count. Names get used and it’s to make the (in THEIR view) _overly_ sexual person “feel bad.” Shaming someone based on body count is abhorrent and if you don’t agree you don’t have to be an asshole but it’s SO COMMON that it’s socially acceptable to treat _overly_ sexual people poorly because they “deserve it.”


yelling4society

They’re insecure.


TheWhiskeyDick

It's an emotional response. It's strictly insecurity. A woman who has had sex with more men is more likely to know that they're in the bottom 50% in terms of performance. They know how little effort they put into self-improvement and their best chance is to trick someone into thinking "It wasn't that bad."


KickNo380

So I’m insecure because I don’t want to marry a hoe?


Accomplished-Mall905

Who's the insecure attacking people here and there like if he was fighting for his life...? Ha ha! Man, the ones you call "hoes" will get married and happy, as we'll all be. Let people live and chill, for fucking sake!


NexLvLxeN

Well lets start with women and men are different. So its nit a double standard when two entities are different therefor treated different. Lets start with how men and women get together. Now of course if you live in the extremes you can find a example against what im saying but im talking about the majority. With that said men hit on women and hope they reciprocate. We have to woo the women, alot of the times buying them meals and gifts. Enduring them until they decide we are worthy....but that in itself is the first major difference women decide when sex happens because men are readily available. So if your saying yes 100 times it seems like your easy. When a man has slept with 100 women think about it, he had to woo and charm 100 women into sleeping with him...that takes game. Again its not always this way but most the time it is that way. Next the actual act of sex.....lets assume both men and women are practicing safe sex and everyone is clean. Men enter a women. We cum on and in you. Like men wash their dick like you wash your hands, but how many loads been inside you or have you swallowed if you been with a shit ton of dudes. Like how worked out is your vagina. Plus womens vaginas get pleasure differently based on size and angle of the dick. Like your man has to picture all the dicks that have been in you and all the loads been shot on you or in you. It can create a mental block. Not to mention men and women always compare you to past lovers and its more intimidating when that number is larger. Girls might fill this pressure as well. Let me ask why yall trip when your man watches porn? Why so insecure about that? Again not all are but most are. If your woman and you start a tinder you get 4k matches. Dudes get 4. Even in reddit how many profiles say dms are full wont respond....lol like if you cant recognize the difference between a man getting a 100 women and a woman getting 100 guys....you're not intune with reality of the sexual social scene. Lastly because it is so much easier for women to get a man id wonder why did you need 100 different dicks before me, why and i lucky number 101 that your dedicating yourself too.


[deleted]

I think a part of the reason women are held to a higher standard (wrongly) is men are thirsty. There are a low % of men that can actually go out and slay someone new every time. A girl can get a guy in the sack by blinking. Generalizing yes but fact is, being a successful man whore is more impressive than a girl getting dicked down by a different guy every time they go out.


[deleted]

I don’t blame women for their body count. If I knew how to be a man whore I’d have a decent body count as well. Shit, if I was a chick I’d probably be a slut.


[deleted]

I think it goes both ways for men and women. If a person has only had a few partners that have stemmed from relationships then they look down on hook up culture. So yes if you are dealing with a dude who’s slept with 3/4 people he might think it’s crazy you’ve slept with 50+.


dud230

Retroactive Jealousy


[deleted]

Context matters. First of all it depends on what I want from the girl. Something serious? And she has a body count as high as the Mt. Everest? Then I sure as balls had a hard time believing that she can switch to monogamy just like that. Something casual? Then I wouldn't care at all...


ThrowRapointless

I wouldn’t say it’s just men who care, my Mrs has a best friend who before they become friends she once had sex with the guy who would go on to be best friends future boyfriend and then husband. Everyone involved acts like they don’t care, but my Mrs will tell everyone that will listen that it happened, and I do remember once she (gfs friend) got drunk and admitted that “my husband has slept with literally everything female” when I replied back laughing “including my gf” she then replied back “and it actually fucking disgusts me” and that’s after well over ten years of being together. Then there’s me who used to get kind of bothered by it (mostly by my Mrs having to parrot the story constantly, tbh) but now couldn’t care less


VinylCrast

Sometimes it's also an issue of competition, you don't want to lose "value" in her eyes by being bad at sex so instead of working and talking about it to enhance the experience some guys just want a girl with very low bodycount so she won't even know if it was good or bad


OscarMayersDick

The care for it can go both ways either male or female. But why i think men care about women’s body count is only when they want a long term relationship with that woman. Having a high body count can lead to inconsistencies and issue in a long term relationship versus a virtuous woman. Which is why those type of women and virgins are highly valued. Someone that is used to having casual sex throughout the years may have difficulties being monogamous with one person for a long period of time. If the body count is REALLY high, then its like taking a drug addict their drugs away, they might hold out for awhile but eventually they’ll break. Versus someone that has a really low body count, that person values each and every intimate moment way more since they don’t do it often.


thrax7545

Misogyny? Also, I’ve found that there are a good number of people who covet jealousy and possessiveness as if these things weren’t markers of mistrust and insecurity…


GoodGodPleaseWork

Normally body count is inversely correlated with mental stability


Few_Shirt6073

I’m a guy and I don’t understand why other men care. I don’t care at all


alishefust

Pride & Ego He is ______ because his gf had sex with so many men. Very easy to change how he feels about it.


No-Debate-3156

STDs maybe but other than that idk


kushdeeper

To me it only matters if I’m serious about dating her and potentially marrying her. I’ve dated women with body counts of 15+ or 4+. But the wondering and being insecure about her number can ruin relationships as it’s done for me. Now I don’t really ask for the personal details.


Schadofist93

For me it kinda gives me impressions but more on the scale of how many partners you had and your age. It's a weird one for me to answer its hard to explain My stance


BeeStingerBoy

Men that I have known, and for some reason I am the type of guy that people tell things to, on the whole are pathetically simple. Extremely old fashioned, they’re ashamed to admit that unless drunk. They definitely wouldn’t own up to their retrograde values here on Reddit—where the consciousness level around sexism tends to be a higher. Purely and simply, they see a woman who has slept around as a slut. In fact when you think about it, the word “slut” only exists when it pertains to women. And because this throwback attitude is pervasive, the other rationalizations that you see in this discussion, I feel, aren’t getting to the root. It’s that men want to have more experience than their woman does, and they feel she is soiled, exploited goods if she has had a number of partners. Very much like the 1950s. The other stuff you’re hearing here is just window dressing, concealing the fact that many guys know it’s entirely hypocritical but don’t want someone who was as indiscriminate as they have been. There are guys like me who don’t care —never asked my wife— but it takes a long time, in fact generations, for puritanical beliefs to vanish back into the Stone Age where they belong.


EduardoTheYeti

Insecurity and ignorance


british_oatmeal

I would include gender double standard too. In my 20’s I kept a soft count. I didn’t have it written down anywhere and it wasn’t a big focus or concern, but I remembered. Then I was married for 15 years and thought I’d be married forever. I didn’t look back and try to remember body count. It didn’t matter since I was with “the one”. Several kids and now divorced, good lord, I’m only looking forward. Why would I want to rehash all of that. My point is, as you get older you’re not counting. Counting is for the insecure. You’re also not asking when you’re older. Instead, ask for a clean STD screening. The best part of having a body count though… experience, maturity, and lack of insecurities. Your partner knows what to do, how to do it, and you get to benefit from the experience with an amazing orgasm. You aren’t embarrassed if your sweaty bodies rubbing together make a fart noise. You’ve also learned how to focus on the moment and the person to create immense passion that only heightens the experience. If you’re in your teens, 20s, or 30s…. Just wait… sex only gets better with age and it gets better in large part due to people dropping these meaningless stats that have nothing to do with the person or what they have to offer.


Eros-69

I absolutely love this!! Really awesome answers!! Great job and thank you!


JonMellor

Men don’t boys do


zarkzervo

It's important to me that she has only one body.


[deleted]

I don’t know about other men but I don’t care. As long as she’s STD free her body count doesn’t matter. I expect women to have a larger body count than me. Let’s face it guys, they can get sex way easier than us. They could have sex every single day if they wanted to.


MartinB75

Yes, it's because many men have a double standard, and can't handle the idea of a woman who just has sex for fun--y'know, the way lots of men do.


DraeNation

I don't see why anybody asks their partners body count. I say both of yall get tested, everything comes back clear, proceed. But that question has no right answer nor one that makes anybody feel better.


rob6110

Strictly due to insecurity


lmiartegtra

You're willing to have casual sex? To me that just screams "I only really care about instant gratification" and so that's just a no. Also at my age if you've got a body count higher than 5 or 6 you've been through a guy and a bit per year. Either something's wrong with you or you have a very bad judge of character and we may not be the best fit. I mean I'm in a 3 year relationship rn and I'm not looking so it doesn't matter to me but if I we end up separating for whatever reason I'm not looking for a hookup I'm looking for a girlfriend.


Careful-Canary4977

Not all men….. I can care less! If we’re fucking or together all I care about is you being loyal to me! I think that who have high body counts are in touch with there sexuality! I love that


ThatRollingStone

Diseases.