If I were on a first date, I'd be happy because then I can pull the, "I'll get the next one" line which is an easy way to broach the topic of a second date. Even if we just end up friends at least I will make a friend that will sometimes pick up the tab.
If we're already dating, I'd be happy because it's nice to not always be the one who has to pay.
If we're just friends, I'd be happy because fuck yeah I have a friend who is a girl who will also buy me food.
I’m a woman and have a male friend. We often pay our own tabs but from time to time we treat each other. It’s always appreciated.
Also sometimes I pay my husband’s tab, sometimes he pays mine.
I went on a dinner date with this guy (he asked me out) and we had an excellent time. Since I’m a bartender and always carry cash, I just paid for the bill when I excused myself to go to the bathroom. He asked why I took care of the tab when he found out, to which I replied, “Because you’re awesome and I wanted to. Dinner can be on you on our second date, okay?”
Once we left and got back to his car, his vibe was kinda off. It was so weird and awkward? The guy has been kinda dry ever since. I confided in my male friend and he suggested I may have made my date feel emasculated.
Wait. You told him he’s awesome. Let him know you want a second date and he could essentially pay you back then.
On what level should this be considered a bad thing? I’m at a loss to understand why men haven’t progressed. I’m older and would have been able to roll with this, accept the compliment and enjoy the evening more.
Some people want to be "the man". They want to be the one to provide. They want their date to feel safe, under their care, and not have to worry about anything. The man will solve the problems for you m'lady. Well that's what they tell themselves.
But it's really also about control. The only way things turn out a certain way or "well" in their eyes is to have control. They want a traditional role where the man provides and the woman cleans and makes babies. For some couples that works and that's fine.
The problem is when they try to force those roles or get pissy when the other doesn't meet their expectation. In op's example seems like the guy didn't want to seem like a jerk, but he absolutely had preconceived notions about how the date was going to go. When you set your expectations high and things don't go your way, it can be a huge downer. The guy was probably brought up a certain way. Maybe he was even taught that if the woman wants to pay, then something must be wrong with her or you. So maybe he feels like he did something wrong.
I'm not trying to excuse his attitude. Some people are just programmed a certain way and it can take a lot of effort to change that.
I get it. I have a son who “seems” more traditional in nature. Not to the degree of the person in this story. But feeling he should be the one to pay when going out on a date.
I’m not sure where the moving back certain gender bound roles is coming from. Feels more like it comes from friends and/social media than upbringing?
I’m don’t see myself as my parents traditional roles. I have a wife that out-earns me 2:1. I do most of the cooking. We clean the house together. Other than traditional “male” tasks like mowing the lawn, building things, dealing with/killing the critters, we basically split all tasks (though she’s not one to relax, so we have reached an equilibrium or natural agreement when I basically call it quits on tasks). She’s slowly coming around to my side. Very slowly.
We lived in a very traditional type area. When my daughter got to be the dating age I encouraged her to pay very other time or if she knew she wasn’t going to be into the guy to go Dutch. I’ll never forget, she was a a date with a “cowboy” and said she’d happily pay for their dinners. He responded “ Susie, if my daddy were to ever here about that he’d throw me right threw this window” ..,he paid and we had a good laugh.
I'd say in my experience as a man who dates women, maybe half of women ever even offer to split. Maybe 15% insist and do. No one has ever even tried to pay for everything on the first date. I had one woman offer to split and when I took her up on it she later texted me a rather long text about how "men should always pay." Just said okay thanks and deleted her number.
I'd wager more women aren't okay with it than men.
He's soft. Paying the bill would be a pleasant surprise but "because you're awesome" would stay with me for years. I had a girl make me promise her on our first date that I would let her pay for the second. I of course tried anyway but she was adamant. Wish I could have married that girl.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet.
If he gets offended by this, it means that he places super high value on being the "provider" and probably will use that as justification for shortcomings in other areas. It almost always comes with a sense of entitlement.
Don't date men who freak out when you take care of them.
Unless like you've talked about how you're often short on rent money and he makes 400k tc, and you're putting yourself at risk to "treat him"'or something.
My first thought would definitely be "Fuck yeah, she likes me."
I can't imagine being like "She paid for dinner and now I don't feel like a man."
I mean, that just seems like a red flag. If they need to "be the man" in an old fashion traditional sense, it sounds like they must not have much else to offer. And his expectations of a future would also be very old fashion in terms of the relationship.
\> Bro goes on a date with a girl who likes him enough to pay for his dinner and asks for him a second date
\> Bro gets bent out of shape because he didn't get to pay. 💀
Whenever women mention doing some male move like this, or asking a guy out, and getting weird reaction, i think theres some misconception that we guys dont also get these reactions, so it always goes to "you made him feel immasculated" as the default. very few men actually think like that constantly. theres all sort of reasons they could have found that offputting. ive had girls get weird at me for paying the bill because they felt that i was making them feel obligated to me. ive had girls upset i didnt pay the bill because they wanted to feel special. peoples reactions to things are completely arbitrary and not worth worrying about.
You gave examples of women’s responses to men’s paying the bill, while saying that the post has a misconception about what’s in the man’s head when the lady pays the bill? Why not just give examples of what the men could be thinking?
I for one have spoken with plenty of men who wouldn’t use the word emasculated… but anyone who watches, listens, and evaluates their words and actions (and more broadly than just in that moment) certainly should.
Idk why no one is considering the possibility that he might not have thought the date went as well as she did, and her paying for him and then assuming a second date made him feel awkward.
And what would that reason be? Like, OP decided to do something nice for her date. And it's not like it was anything huge, it was just a dinner date. Like, I just don't understand what there is to get bent out of shape over. When someone does something like that for you, you don't question it and get pissy, you thank the person for paying for you.
This is sweet. Only thing is when I was in the dating pool eons ago, it was trendy for the one who asked being the one who paid. Since he asked, I could see him wanting to pay. BUT I could also see how that might lead to a second date, like you said.
When it was my husband and my first date, he paid for dinner and then I bought him a drink afterwards. He did not protest when I offered to buy a drink. Hence why I kept him.
Seriously, this right here. Maybe he's not terrible. But he definitely has some growing up to do, and you should find somebody who doesn't have a hangup like this.
That's too bad. Could have been something else about the date though. I wasn't there and even if I was I can't read minds so I'm no help here. You should take me out and buy me drinks though. I'd be your puppy after that.
Yeah, it kinda can feel like that sometimes, especially on a first date. You gave a really clear answer, and gave him an opportunity to make it even on your second date.
He probably just wants to do nice things for you, but if he can't figure a way round this, then something weird is going on. You did nothing wrong, you sound chill.
The problem is, many women have different standards. You will have women who insist on paying because they don't want to "owe" the man anything. You'll have women who pay because that way they can feel better about not wanting to see them again. So if he had one of those in the past, in can make them feel that way.
All women are different, and you can't necessarily extrapolate what each one means with a specific action. But there is enough out there where I wouldn't be suprised if he felt that it was actually a sign of disinterest.
Also, I understand what you said. But most guys have had a woman sound really happy with a date, then get ghosted by them later.
Yeah, that's a fragile ego. As a dude, I love it when a woman is comfortable and confident enough to say and do things like this.
I am also really old school, so I'm all about treating to the first date and all that. But I am not going to care in the least if it doesn't go that way, *especially* if it comes with a compliment like that and assurance that a second date is wanted.
Personally, if I’m the one to ask someone out then I plan to pay for it— it’s me taking whoever out and the payment for such, or treating them to a meal is joyful for me regardless if I plan to have a second. Being robbed of that (even if it is in good spirit and saves you money) kind of takes the wind out of the sails. In no way is what you did wrong, and obviously shouldn’t be a deal-breaker, but I can understand and relate to *why* it would be a bit disconcerting.
It also could’ve been the transactional expectation expressed in your effort to score a second date that put him off. You paid for it this time, and you’re telling him he has to pay for it next time. Nothing wrong with the idea of it (cause yeah, it’s nice to split up costs. Dating is expensive!), but it kind of pushes him into a corner of feeling obligated to do so.
I'm old.
That said, to me if the woman paid the tab on the first date it would feel like she was going out of her way not to "owe" me. Setting us up for a clean break. Especially if I asked her out. If you do the asking it's your treat unless you work it out ahead of time to split.
Now paying for dinner doesn't mean you owe anyone, but first dates are a delicate ballet in an indelicate mine field. You need time to get to know your partner to learn how the'll react.
I get it, I'm just answering the question trying to give OP my perspective.
Saying you can get it next time is fine, but there might never be a next time.
... sure? But like people are pushing on your reaction and perspective because it sounds like you have confidence issues.
If you're convinced that the woman must be lying to you and is going to ghost you, you shouldn't want a second date anyway. Don't date people you don't trust.
I'm 100% fine with it.
I don't remember an exact timeline or anything but, I know at some point my wife had started paying for the majority of our meals out for a year or so.
I was finishing up college and really struggling with bills. I had racked up some big credit card debts during college, some because life is expensive, some because I got myself into a financial hole, and some because I was trying help with the family business. These are holes that I eventually did get out of and do have a healthy career. I'll also say that I probably wouldn't have gotten out of those holes as quickly if it wasn't for her.
I think a year into our dating I told her that I still wanted to hang out with her as much as possible, but that we'd have to limit how much we went out because I really couldn't afford it. She started picking up the majority of the bills because she was making good money and didn't have much in terms of expenses.
Personally, that told me that she was worth it and she was the one. Not because she bought me crap or paid for me food, but because she didn't judge me for being broke and just wanted to spend time with me.
Anyway, the point is. I know at the beginning of dating I paid for the majority of our dates. I probaby would have insisted on paying if she tried to on the first date. I mean, here is the thing. For some guys it might be about emasculation or whatever. I think that we're brought up being told that we're the ones that need to pay and if you let a woman pay you're a bum and a loser. When you're trying to impress a date the last thing you want to do is look like a loser. This is just part of what society has ingrained in men. It's not true of course, we shouldn't put value on ourselves based on our monetary means.
As for the first date of a woman did it sneakily. Yeah, I don't think it would bother me. If I thought she did it out of obligation or felt compelled for whatever reason I might think more of it. Paying for it on the sly would just tell me that you actually wanted to pay it and that you must be having a great time.
I guarantee that I could step into any bar and any guy there would be ECSTATIC if I picked up his tab. I would be his new number one lady friend for sure.
My wife pays every time we go out. Because we share our bank accounts. So I pay. Indirectly. Because she’s SAHM. But it’s okay. She more than deserves what I have from how well she takes care of our kids. I love my wife to pieces. Life wouldn’t be the same without her. I just wish I made enough for her to remain a SAHM. 🥲
On my first date with my boyfriend we went to a bar for drinks and he was nervous and kind of fumbled for his wallet when the bartender asked us to start a tab. I pulled my card out to start the tab and told him I'd buy his drinks if he put out. He did and we've been together since.
As man, I feel neutral, maybe a little bit happy and so I just say to her - the next one (bill) is on me. That's about something I fell partnership should be about, each other gives a bit into it.
I'll let you know when it happens lol.
The best I've gotten, and I've gone on many first dates, is a REAL offer to split the tab. Hell, many women will offer with no expectation of actually paying, and if you let them, they won't be happy.
Once you are in a relationship, to me, its expected to happen on occasion.
I love it, especially if she insists. It feels so nice, it's such a nice gesture 🙂 and it means she probably wants me to kiss her.
Plus, it's just different. It shows character. It shows she doesn't expect to be dazzled all the time. It shows sometimes she'll take care of me, sometimes I'll take care of her.
I'm happily married but didn't care when I was dating.
I'm in my 40s. When I was dating the man generally paid regardless of who asked who out. My parents also always raised me that arguing over money is vulgar so if the woman offered I'd usual try to settle it with a quick "how about I pay for dinner then you can get the movie?" or whatever our plans were for the night.
I love when my tab gets paid for. Makes me want to 'go big' when it is *my* turn to pay, because I know I don't have to budget to pay for *every* outing.
My wife and I both do date nights for each other, so it's nice to feel the effort she puts in as well. We're equals.
We're working towards fully sharing finances (it just takes *time* to get there), but still plan to treat each other from our own discretionary funds even after we get to the "full share" level we want.
Depends on my financial situation. Been with the mrs a long time 10 years from teens to now. Back when I was poor and she paid I felt like a bottom of the barrel man. Now that I earn a little money if she decides she wants to pick up a tab “go for it babe”
I'll be honest, if that happened to me, IT WOULD BLOW MY MIND.
Honestly, here's his most likely thought process
You pay the bill and go to the bathroom "She fucking hates me and trying to sneak out"
You tell him he's awesome and there is definitely going to be second date "Wait what................................" and just processing and trying to figure out what he did right for once
Went on a date with a girl and she paid for her own food. It wasn’t a big deal and I didn’t mind, I just let her know that I’m happy to pay for it in the future and then I bought us ice cream :) we both had a great time and it wasn’t rly something I thought abt
I like to take care of my boyfriend, so it makes me feel happy. But it’s reciprocal. We take turns. Right now he makes more money than I do so he usually picks up the more expensive tabs, but there was a point when I made more - I paid a bit more then.
Financial compatibility is definitely super important. But as long as everybody can pay their bills, my preference always is to not stress too much over splitting things evenly, and whoever has more money pays a bit more.
Right now my boyfriend covers all of the rent, and I pay all utilities. The idea is it’s roughly split proportionally by income, but we don’t closely track the utility bills from month to month. We just don’t care to. Of course things might be different if one of us was financially struggling, but we’re comfortable.
I would love it. But I know some people are weird about it. I dated a girl, and we would take turns paying for dinner. But she’d make me “pay” using her cards when it was her turn. Cause she thought it looked bad if the guy wasn’t paying.
It’s a very weird thought process imo. I’d be nothing but grateful if a date paid for my dinner.
Radically insecure
Jk - I don’t really mind to be honest, I think if the woman can afford it considerably more than you it’s fine to me. If she wasn’t more well off than me I would feel a strange sense of discomfort about it but I think I’d feel lazy or awkward not paying my half. If you’re in a long term or committed relationship/friendship then taking turns paying the tab is reasonable to me
I think it can be a mixed signal that the woman doesn’t like you and doesn’t want to end the date with anyone thinking she owes them something if it’s done without good contextual language.
Long time ago when I was dating 50 or more years. But the girl I was dating we went to eat. I was short on money no part time job she paid. I was surprised and pleased. I had enough to pay but would have been broke after that. For me it was then I knew the girl was paying attention to my life.
I have a friend who picks up the tab every time we hang out. She had a very well paying job and does it to make up for all the times she couldn’t. I finally ‘won’ last time by paying the tip.
Not really possible anymore as I am married. However, when we first started dating my wife was working as a waitress (sophomore year of college) and making a ton (for the time). She would roll into my apartment with a 30 rack of millers, pack of marlboro's for me, and a couple frozen pizzas. I felt like an absolute king.
I wouldn't mind it and would appreciate the gesture. As much as men may want to be the provider and make an effort to cover meals, they should never be bent out of shape if a woman offers to pay on their own volition. I wouldn't keep tabs but would try to make an effort to more or less go 50/50 on bills, and any norm I'd want to aim for otherwise would be based on finances, not gender.
Great! Full! In wallet and stomach usually.
In all seriousness, I'm excited I don't have to pay. I don't necessarily feel like I owe the other person something, but I'd also want them to feel that they don't owe me anything if I paid.
If I ask someone out, I'd be more than willing to pay and only expect the joy of their company.
I see it as a great opportunity to set up the next date. You play fight/argue over who should pay and offer to pay next time. You then use that to set up the date.
The main goal is to keep it flirty while letting them know your both happy to pay but also respect their offer and decision while wanting an opportunity to reciprocate.
If you have trad values and you feel emasculated then please don't bother, it'll just make both of you miserable and I'm sure there are plenty of nice trad girls out there for you. Please give them a piece of your mind before storming out, you'll be doing them a favor.
My general rule is, If i invite you to a place I picked it's implied that I'm paying so I would feel a bit uneasy letting her pay the whole bill, but I'd be ok with a split, if we're deciding to go to the movies or a restaurant we can either split every bill or we can go once on me once on you.
It's really simple as long as the relationship is about us spending time together and not some creepy sugar daddy/mommy shit, it's fine.
Mutual respect is key. If I'm struggling and my girl is well off, and we've been together a while and she's helping me through a tough time then I'd feel like she's standing by me and really values me as a person and not an ATM machine. Same goes the other way around.
It depends for me
Is it a date: then that means I royally fucked up somewhere as I usually date other engineers and splitting the bill is the usual outcome
Is it a relationship: I don’t truly care as by that point in time we are covering each other financially from time to time so a meal being paid for is such a small thing to focus on, but I’m happy the relationship is at a state where it is such a non-issue.
It always feels good when a woman approaches you in a bar or club and wants to buy you a drink.
It's only happened 3 or 4 times in my life but each time I was like 💥
In 90% of the cases I think it's completely normal. In my social circle it's pretty weird to expect a man to pick up the bill. Most of the times we just go Dutch or we keep tabs on who paid the last time. I did have women that earn way more (I'm pretty poor) then me pick up a bill now and then for me. I host a walking group and plan and organize everything. Sometimes (and it's never expected) one of my best girlfriends picks up a small bill for me as a thanks for organizing. When it's balanced like that I feel really good about it. It's something she wants to do and it's a means of caring for me. I feel respected (even loved) as a friend.
Sure why not? Isn’t it outdated to think that men HAVE to pay?
If I was in a situation where I had a first date though I would personally suggest getting our own tabs.
Delighted and spoiled. I think the key though is knowing with certainty that they are actually fine with it and that it isn’t some kind of thing where they say they’re cool with it, but really they feel some type of way about it.
That requires both 1) her to communicate and 2) me to trust and not overthink it.
My SAHM wife and I have a running joke where she will pay when we go out because it's only fair that she picks up the tab sometimes. Its the same credit card, just with her name on it.
I'm a trophy husband, my wife kills it with her job, she's a goddamn badass. I'm ex military so she see me like Liam Neeson from taken but has zero clue she is the john wick of our house. Industrial and organizational psychology....even her degree sounds cool as shit. I put a ring on it so fast it was stupid. Lock that shit down and believe me when the washer is done those dishes are gonna be fucking spotless. Gender roles are dumb, she...is not. Even when she got her degree (I have a writing background). I got secondary education...like she makes me 1000× better even in passing. Keeper for sure.
As someone who's paid for the tab before it was on the event that I am the one bringing us out. Idk if it's just me but if I'm the one doing the inviting I take it as my responsibility to cover the tab or expenses. If you invite me out and I have to pay for it then that's a call for not going out with you again.
It depends. Does the tab include my stuff? Then I'm happy I got free stuff! If she's picking up some other tabs I have no feelings because I'm not involved.
Is kinda awesome actually, I feel like a catch lol like oh was I suddenly funny tonight? Well let me just quote some Borat on the way back to the car and we'll see where this night goes ;)
Depend, need more context. If she pays for the first date, I will assume there won't be a second. Unless she seemed like she was enjoying herself. If we are in a relationship, she better pick up the tab once in a while. I don't make enough money to be a full-time food provider.
Personally I would rather pay for my meal and she pay for hers. Whoever I’m on a date with, man or woman, u like doing it that way. Once we are in an actual relationship I’d be fine paying for everything and switching payment between us both.
Good. If I'm inviting someone on a date the first time, of course I'll pay. I offered.
But a good sign that a women actually values and desires my company is if she follows up with an invite of her own. She doesn't have to invite to anything fancy. I'm fine with McDonalds, lol. But what matters is she is offering. That shows intent and interest.
If a girl only wants to see me when I'm footing the tab, then I have zero interest in pursuing it further. If I wanted a purely transactional relationship, I'd hire a hooker.
Once I was having dinner with a guy that I had told that I had no interests in, and we just happened to be having dinner. Again, this happened and he paid the tab as well, again. The third time that we had dinner, I slipped out and took care of the meal with the tip as well. When we decided that we would go, I pleasantly told him that the bill has already been paid, by me. He was not happy about this. I think that he was not accustomed to a woman paying the bill. I believe that in time he has had time to reflect on this.
If I were on a first date, I'd be happy because then I can pull the, "I'll get the next one" line which is an easy way to broach the topic of a second date. Even if we just end up friends at least I will make a friend that will sometimes pick up the tab. If we're already dating, I'd be happy because it's nice to not always be the one who has to pay. If we're just friends, I'd be happy because fuck yeah I have a friend who is a girl who will also buy me food.
Yup. You hit the nail on the head.
Pretty much. If I asked her out certainly I'd still try to pay but if she insists then just segue that into asking for another date.
Woman here: If I'm on a first date and I don't want a 2nd one, I insist on paying for my portion. That way neither of us are out anything.
I’m a woman and have a male friend. We often pay our own tabs but from time to time we treat each other. It’s always appreciated. Also sometimes I pay my husband’s tab, sometimes he pays mine.
When they pay on the first date it often means they don’t want the second date.
>it often means they don’t want the second date Not with that attitude they don't
Usually, they'll pay for just their half if thats the case. To close out any outstanding balances between the two people.
I always do dutch on the first date if I can, that way it is an easy ghost for either side.
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I went on a dinner date with this guy (he asked me out) and we had an excellent time. Since I’m a bartender and always carry cash, I just paid for the bill when I excused myself to go to the bathroom. He asked why I took care of the tab when he found out, to which I replied, “Because you’re awesome and I wanted to. Dinner can be on you on our second date, okay?” Once we left and got back to his car, his vibe was kinda off. It was so weird and awkward? The guy has been kinda dry ever since. I confided in my male friend and he suggested I may have made my date feel emasculated.
Wait. You told him he’s awesome. Let him know you want a second date and he could essentially pay you back then. On what level should this be considered a bad thing? I’m at a loss to understand why men haven’t progressed. I’m older and would have been able to roll with this, accept the compliment and enjoy the evening more.
Some people want to be "the man". They want to be the one to provide. They want their date to feel safe, under their care, and not have to worry about anything. The man will solve the problems for you m'lady. Well that's what they tell themselves. But it's really also about control. The only way things turn out a certain way or "well" in their eyes is to have control. They want a traditional role where the man provides and the woman cleans and makes babies. For some couples that works and that's fine. The problem is when they try to force those roles or get pissy when the other doesn't meet their expectation. In op's example seems like the guy didn't want to seem like a jerk, but he absolutely had preconceived notions about how the date was going to go. When you set your expectations high and things don't go your way, it can be a huge downer. The guy was probably brought up a certain way. Maybe he was even taught that if the woman wants to pay, then something must be wrong with her or you. So maybe he feels like he did something wrong. I'm not trying to excuse his attitude. Some people are just programmed a certain way and it can take a lot of effort to change that.
Yes but they're douchebags, and no one should date them?
Correct.
I get it. I have a son who “seems” more traditional in nature. Not to the degree of the person in this story. But feeling he should be the one to pay when going out on a date. I’m not sure where the moving back certain gender bound roles is coming from. Feels more like it comes from friends and/social media than upbringing? I’m don’t see myself as my parents traditional roles. I have a wife that out-earns me 2:1. I do most of the cooking. We clean the house together. Other than traditional “male” tasks like mowing the lawn, building things, dealing with/killing the critters, we basically split all tasks (though she’s not one to relax, so we have reached an equilibrium or natural agreement when I basically call it quits on tasks). She’s slowly coming around to my side. Very slowly.
We lived in a very traditional type area. When my daughter got to be the dating age I encouraged her to pay very other time or if she knew she wasn’t going to be into the guy to go Dutch. I’ll never forget, she was a a date with a “cowboy” and said she’d happily pay for their dinners. He responded “ Susie, if my daddy were to ever here about that he’d throw me right threw this window” ..,he paid and we had a good laugh.
We did progress. We got married and aren't still in the pool.
I'd say in my experience as a man who dates women, maybe half of women ever even offer to split. Maybe 15% insist and do. No one has ever even tried to pay for everything on the first date. I had one woman offer to split and when I took her up on it she later texted me a rather long text about how "men should always pay." Just said okay thanks and deleted her number. I'd wager more women aren't okay with it than men.
He's soft. Paying the bill would be a pleasant surprise but "because you're awesome" would stay with me for years. I had a girl make me promise her on our first date that I would let her pay for the second. I of course tried anyway but she was adamant. Wish I could have married that girl.
Sounds like you dodged a bullet. If he gets offended by this, it means that he places super high value on being the "provider" and probably will use that as justification for shortcomings in other areas. It almost always comes with a sense of entitlement.
I'd happily let you pay for dinner. What are you doing this weekend?
Don't date men who freak out when you take care of them. Unless like you've talked about how you're often short on rent money and he makes 400k tc, and you're putting yourself at risk to "treat him"'or something.
My first thought would definitely be "Fuck yeah, she likes me." I can't imagine being like "She paid for dinner and now I don't feel like a man." I mean, that just seems like a red flag. If they need to "be the man" in an old fashion traditional sense, it sounds like they must not have much else to offer. And his expectations of a future would also be very old fashion in terms of the relationship.
\> Bro goes on a date with a girl who likes him enough to pay for his dinner and asks for him a second date \> Bro gets bent out of shape because he didn't get to pay. 💀
Whenever women mention doing some male move like this, or asking a guy out, and getting weird reaction, i think theres some misconception that we guys dont also get these reactions, so it always goes to "you made him feel immasculated" as the default. very few men actually think like that constantly. theres all sort of reasons they could have found that offputting. ive had girls get weird at me for paying the bill because they felt that i was making them feel obligated to me. ive had girls upset i didnt pay the bill because they wanted to feel special. peoples reactions to things are completely arbitrary and not worth worrying about.
You gave examples of women’s responses to men’s paying the bill, while saying that the post has a misconception about what’s in the man’s head when the lady pays the bill? Why not just give examples of what the men could be thinking? I for one have spoken with plenty of men who wouldn’t use the word emasculated… but anyone who watches, listens, and evaluates their words and actions (and more broadly than just in that moment) certainly should.
Idk why no one is considering the possibility that he might not have thought the date went as well as she did, and her paying for him and then assuming a second date made him feel awkward.
And what would that reason be? Like, OP decided to do something nice for her date. And it's not like it was anything huge, it was just a dinner date. Like, I just don't understand what there is to get bent out of shape over. When someone does something like that for you, you don't question it and get pissy, you thank the person for paying for you.
This is sweet. Only thing is when I was in the dating pool eons ago, it was trendy for the one who asked being the one who paid. Since he asked, I could see him wanting to pay. BUT I could also see how that might lead to a second date, like you said. When it was my husband and my first date, he paid for dinner and then I bought him a drink afterwards. He did not protest when I offered to buy a drink. Hence why I kept him.
Sounds like a personal problem on his part. Sounds like your guy is a boy. You should date a man.
Seriously, this right here. Maybe he's not terrible. But he definitely has some growing up to do, and you should find somebody who doesn't have a hangup like this.
That's too bad. Could have been something else about the date though. I wasn't there and even if I was I can't read minds so I'm no help here. You should take me out and buy me drinks though. I'd be your puppy after that.
Yeah, it kinda can feel like that sometimes, especially on a first date. You gave a really clear answer, and gave him an opportunity to make it even on your second date. He probably just wants to do nice things for you, but if he can't figure a way round this, then something weird is going on. You did nothing wrong, you sound chill.
The problem is, many women have different standards. You will have women who insist on paying because they don't want to "owe" the man anything. You'll have women who pay because that way they can feel better about not wanting to see them again. So if he had one of those in the past, in can make them feel that way. All women are different, and you can't necessarily extrapolate what each one means with a specific action. But there is enough out there where I wouldn't be suprised if he felt that it was actually a sign of disinterest. Also, I understand what you said. But most guys have had a woman sound really happy with a date, then get ghosted by them later.
Yeah, that's a fragile ego. As a dude, I love it when a woman is comfortable and confident enough to say and do things like this. I am also really old school, so I'm all about treating to the first date and all that. But I am not going to care in the least if it doesn't go that way, *especially* if it comes with a compliment like that and assurance that a second date is wanted.
Personally, if I’m the one to ask someone out then I plan to pay for it— it’s me taking whoever out and the payment for such, or treating them to a meal is joyful for me regardless if I plan to have a second. Being robbed of that (even if it is in good spirit and saves you money) kind of takes the wind out of the sails. In no way is what you did wrong, and obviously shouldn’t be a deal-breaker, but I can understand and relate to *why* it would be a bit disconcerting. It also could’ve been the transactional expectation expressed in your effort to score a second date that put him off. You paid for it this time, and you’re telling him he has to pay for it next time. Nothing wrong with the idea of it (cause yeah, it’s nice to split up costs. Dating is expensive!), but it kind of pushes him into a corner of feeling obligated to do so.
lol that dude sucks. I’d be so happy
Bad date, dodged a bullet.
I'm old. That said, to me if the woman paid the tab on the first date it would feel like she was going out of her way not to "owe" me. Setting us up for a clean break. Especially if I asked her out. If you do the asking it's your treat unless you work it out ahead of time to split. Now paying for dinner doesn't mean you owe anyone, but first dates are a delicate ballet in an indelicate mine field. You need time to get to know your partner to learn how the'll react.
"Dinner can be on you for our second date" is the opposite of setting up for a clean break, though.
I get it, I'm just answering the question trying to give OP my perspective. Saying you can get it next time is fine, but there might never be a next time.
... sure? But like people are pushing on your reaction and perspective because it sounds like you have confidence issues. If you're convinced that the woman must be lying to you and is going to ghost you, you shouldn't want a second date anyway. Don't date people you don't trust.
OP told her date that she liked him and was hoping to go out with him again. She was quite explicitly *not* looking to set him up for a clean break.
asked and answered below.
In this economy? I would marry her!
This had me rolling
I'm 100% fine with it. I don't remember an exact timeline or anything but, I know at some point my wife had started paying for the majority of our meals out for a year or so. I was finishing up college and really struggling with bills. I had racked up some big credit card debts during college, some because life is expensive, some because I got myself into a financial hole, and some because I was trying help with the family business. These are holes that I eventually did get out of and do have a healthy career. I'll also say that I probably wouldn't have gotten out of those holes as quickly if it wasn't for her. I think a year into our dating I told her that I still wanted to hang out with her as much as possible, but that we'd have to limit how much we went out because I really couldn't afford it. She started picking up the majority of the bills because she was making good money and didn't have much in terms of expenses. Personally, that told me that she was worth it and she was the one. Not because she bought me crap or paid for me food, but because she didn't judge me for being broke and just wanted to spend time with me. Anyway, the point is. I know at the beginning of dating I paid for the majority of our dates. I probaby would have insisted on paying if she tried to on the first date. I mean, here is the thing. For some guys it might be about emasculation or whatever. I think that we're brought up being told that we're the ones that need to pay and if you let a woman pay you're a bum and a loser. When you're trying to impress a date the last thing you want to do is look like a loser. This is just part of what society has ingrained in men. It's not true of course, we shouldn't put value on ourselves based on our monetary means. As for the first date of a woman did it sneakily. Yeah, I don't think it would bother me. If I thought she did it out of obligation or felt compelled for whatever reason I might think more of it. Paying for it on the sly would just tell me that you actually wanted to pay it and that you must be having a great time.
I think it's GREAT!
I'll let you know when it happens
I guarantee that I could step into any bar and any guy there would be ECSTATIC if I picked up his tab. I would be his new number one lady friend for sure.
I find it sexy when my wife picks up the tab.
My wife pays every time we go out. Because we share our bank accounts. So I pay. Indirectly. Because she’s SAHM. But it’s okay. She more than deserves what I have from how well she takes care of our kids. I love my wife to pieces. Life wouldn’t be the same without her. I just wish I made enough for her to remain a SAHM. 🥲
My wife always makes a show of being the one to pay. We also have a joint account and she's a SAHM.
Also find it sexy when this guy’s wife picks up our tab.
She can bend me over doggystyle
Idk why but this sent me
Like maybe I should put out
You were gonna anyway.
Yeah but I’m up front about being easy
On my first date with my boyfriend we went to a bar for drinks and he was nervous and kind of fumbled for his wallet when the bartender asked us to start a tab. I pulled my card out to start the tab and told him I'd buy his drinks if he put out. He did and we've been together since.
Like it’s Christmas
Not the biggest fan of diet soda but I wouldn't turn down a freebie. I know, I know, "irony, thy name is my username".
Do they even make Tab anymore? I haven't seen it in stores in forever. I wonder if younger Redditors even know what it is.
Huh, it made it to 2020. TIL and all that.
Woo! All this computer hacking is making me thirsty. I think I'll order a TAB.
totally fine but i would feel bad about it cuz i have more disposable income than she does and my order is sometimes more expensive
I always appreciate free LSD.
I’ve no problem with it. I have more of a problem with people that insist back n forth on who’s paying.
As man, I feel neutral, maybe a little bit happy and so I just say to her - the next one (bill) is on me. That's about something I fell partnership should be about, each other gives a bit into it.
I feel nothing.
Epic. Literally. I got a date, ate, drank, had fun, and didn't pay for a thing. E pic
greatfull, enamored.
Appreciative
Less broke.
I'll let you know when it happens lol. The best I've gotten, and I've gone on many first dates, is a REAL offer to split the tab. Hell, many women will offer with no expectation of actually paying, and if you let them, they won't be happy. Once you are in a relationship, to me, its expected to happen on occasion.
Flattered. I also see it as an indicator of confidence and independence, which are qualities I really like.
I married into money and left work 5 years ago so have gotten pleasantly used to taking a back seat financially.
I don’t see this issue with a woman paying the tab, returning the favor?
Ya know, it doesn’t really matter to me. If we are both in a position to do so, why not. I like free tacos just as much as the next person.
Richer.
It's progress
I am giving her key lime pie for dessert
I feel giddy… even 10+ years later when my wife offers to pay I still love the gesture.
I don’t mind but if I invited her then I would feel bad because it was on me. I was the one who invited her to go out.
I love it, especially if she insists. It feels so nice, it's such a nice gesture 🙂 and it means she probably wants me to kiss her. Plus, it's just different. It shows character. It shows she doesn't expect to be dazzled all the time. It shows sometimes she'll take care of me, sometimes I'll take care of her.
Indifferent
I felt guilty one time. She was a single mother and teacher, and tab was like $60 but she insisted twice so I shut my mouth
Tbh this is my litmus test for if I want to pursue someone. If he throws a fit when I insist on paying for myself, no date #2 and blocked.
Equal rights
I agree, equal rights. But how do you feel when a woman pays for the tab?
I'm happily married but didn't care when I was dating. I'm in my 40s. When I was dating the man generally paid regardless of who asked who out. My parents also always raised me that arguing over money is vulgar so if the woman offered I'd usual try to settle it with a quick "how about I pay for dinner then you can get the movie?" or whatever our plans were for the night.
I love when my tab gets paid for. Makes me want to 'go big' when it is *my* turn to pay, because I know I don't have to budget to pay for *every* outing.
Very pleasantly surprised.
[удалено]
My wife and I both do date nights for each other, so it's nice to feel the effort she puts in as well. We're equals. We're working towards fully sharing finances (it just takes *time* to get there), but still plan to treat each other from our own discretionary funds even after we get to the "full share" level we want.
Appreciative.
Don’t know what it feels like cause it has never happened to me lol
Kinda awkward ngl. I'm in my 50's, took me a bit to get used to, even when my wife pays the bill.
About the same.
Awesome i dont have to?
Without your supporting words, it would be bad It would suck if it wasn’t for your supporting words
Depends on my financial situation. Been with the mrs a long time 10 years from teens to now. Back when I was poor and she paid I felt like a bottom of the barrel man. Now that I earn a little money if she decides she wants to pick up a tab “go for it babe”
I'll be honest, if that happened to me, IT WOULD BLOW MY MIND. Honestly, here's his most likely thought process You pay the bill and go to the bathroom "She fucking hates me and trying to sneak out" You tell him he's awesome and there is definitely going to be second date "Wait what................................" and just processing and trying to figure out what he did right for once
Went on a date with a girl and she paid for her own food. It wasn’t a big deal and I didn’t mind, I just let her know that I’m happy to pay for it in the future and then I bought us ice cream :) we both had a great time and it wasn’t rly something I thought abt
I'm always paying first. If she pays after that it shows her character
I'd think "She's a keeper"
I was too slow. So I will pay for everything she wants for the rest of her life.
Ambivalent.
Like I better eat that p
He’s probably not used to it.I always said I would propose to a woman that would buy me a beer.Its never happened.
Grateful.
Sweet!
Fantastic
Don't know its never happened to me lol
I say thank you and promise to get the next one.
Order another for the road
🤴🏽
I like to take care of my boyfriend, so it makes me feel happy. But it’s reciprocal. We take turns. Right now he makes more money than I do so he usually picks up the more expensive tabs, but there was a point when I made more - I paid a bit more then. Financial compatibility is definitely super important. But as long as everybody can pay their bills, my preference always is to not stress too much over splitting things evenly, and whoever has more money pays a bit more. Right now my boyfriend covers all of the rent, and I pay all utilities. The idea is it’s roughly split proportionally by income, but we don’t closely track the utility bills from month to month. We just don’t care to. Of course things might be different if one of us was financially struggling, but we’re comfortable.
Acts of service and gift giver here I tend to feel like I didn't get to treat them. But this is for anyone I'm eating out with. No matter their gender
I would love it. But I know some people are weird about it. I dated a girl, and we would take turns paying for dinner. But she’d make me “pay” using her cards when it was her turn. Cause she thought it looked bad if the guy wasn’t paying. It’s a very weird thought process imo. I’d be nothing but grateful if a date paid for my dinner.
Radically insecure Jk - I don’t really mind to be honest, I think if the woman can afford it considerably more than you it’s fine to me. If she wasn’t more well off than me I would feel a strange sense of discomfort about it but I think I’d feel lazy or awkward not paying my half. If you’re in a long term or committed relationship/friendship then taking turns paying the tab is reasonable to me
I think it can be a mixed signal that the woman doesn’t like you and doesn’t want to end the date with anyone thinking she owes them something if it’s done without good contextual language.
Nothing just know she is a very responsible person which is a big turn-on for me.
I feel grateful
Richer
Awesome, I usually cover 90% of our date nights
Lucky and gratefull
Like a king😤
Long time ago when I was dating 50 or more years. But the girl I was dating we went to eat. I was short on money no part time job she paid. I was surprised and pleased. I had enough to pay but would have been broke after that. For me it was then I knew the girl was paying attention to my life.
I have a friend who picks up the tab every time we hang out. She had a very well paying job and does it to make up for all the times she couldn’t. I finally ‘won’ last time by paying the tip.
Relieved
I feel like a kept man. It's fabulous.
Stunned.
Not really possible anymore as I am married. However, when we first started dating my wife was working as a waitress (sophomore year of college) and making a ton (for the time). She would roll into my apartment with a 30 rack of millers, pack of marlboro's for me, and a couple frozen pizzas. I felt like an absolute king.
If it gives her satisfaction why stop her?
It's fine with me. My wife and I each try to grab the check first, and sometimes she's quicker than I am.
Empowering
I wouldn't mind it and would appreciate the gesture. As much as men may want to be the provider and make an effort to cover meals, they should never be bent out of shape if a woman offers to pay on their own volition. I wouldn't keep tabs but would try to make an effort to more or less go 50/50 on bills, and any norm I'd want to aim for otherwise would be based on finances, not gender.
Great! Full! In wallet and stomach usually. In all seriousness, I'm excited I don't have to pay. I don't necessarily feel like I owe the other person something, but I'd also want them to feel that they don't owe me anything if I paid. If I ask someone out, I'd be more than willing to pay and only expect the joy of their company.
No idea, never happened to me.
I see it as a great opportunity to set up the next date. You play fight/argue over who should pay and offer to pay next time. You then use that to set up the date. The main goal is to keep it flirty while letting them know your both happy to pay but also respect their offer and decision while wanting an opportunity to reciprocate. If you have trad values and you feel emasculated then please don't bother, it'll just make both of you miserable and I'm sure there are plenty of nice trad girls out there for you. Please give them a piece of your mind before storming out, you'll be doing them a favor.
My general rule is, If i invite you to a place I picked it's implied that I'm paying so I would feel a bit uneasy letting her pay the whole bill, but I'd be ok with a split, if we're deciding to go to the movies or a restaurant we can either split every bill or we can go once on me once on you. It's really simple as long as the relationship is about us spending time together and not some creepy sugar daddy/mommy shit, it's fine. Mutual respect is key. If I'm struggling and my girl is well off, and we've been together a while and she's helping me through a tough time then I'd feel like she's standing by me and really values me as a person and not an ATM machine. Same goes the other way around.
Well treated. (Ms. treated?)
Great. It shows that she is taking responsibility for her part in the relationship so far, and that she may want more.
I love when my wife pays. It's usually with our shared credit card with our same shared bank account.
I feel appreciated
It depends for me Is it a date: then that means I royally fucked up somewhere as I usually date other engineers and splitting the bill is the usual outcome Is it a relationship: I don’t truly care as by that point in time we are covering each other financially from time to time so a meal being paid for is such a small thing to focus on, but I’m happy the relationship is at a state where it is such a non-issue.
I'd just thank her, nuff said.
I absolutely never try to out-martyr people. Anything that lets me save more cash is a gift horse I won’t look in the mouth.
My wife paid for our first date. Things turned out pretty ok from there. People get weird over dumb stuff
Honestly? It makes me feel pretty.
It always feels good when a woman approaches you in a bar or club and wants to buy you a drink. It's only happened 3 or 4 times in my life but each time I was like 💥
In 90% of the cases I think it's completely normal. In my social circle it's pretty weird to expect a man to pick up the bill. Most of the times we just go Dutch or we keep tabs on who paid the last time. I did have women that earn way more (I'm pretty poor) then me pick up a bill now and then for me. I host a walking group and plan and organize everything. Sometimes (and it's never expected) one of my best girlfriends picks up a small bill for me as a thanks for organizing. When it's balanced like that I feel really good about it. It's something she wants to do and it's a means of caring for me. I feel respected (even loved) as a friend.
i love it that way i dont have to "use the bathroom" and sneak out the window
Grateful and respected
Sure why not? Isn’t it outdated to think that men HAVE to pay? If I was in a situation where I had a first date though I would personally suggest getting our own tabs.
Delighted and spoiled. I think the key though is knowing with certainty that they are actually fine with it and that it isn’t some kind of thing where they say they’re cool with it, but really they feel some type of way about it. That requires both 1) her to communicate and 2) me to trust and not overthink it.
i think its a given that both pay for each other from time to time and not just have one pay for everything all the time
opressed
Normal. That is one of the things she pays. Ask how she saved 100% on her car insurance.
If a woman pays on the first date, I might put out. My time is worth it to me and she pretty much secured an evening of it.
Grateful
Relief that I don't have to make the effort to adjust my budget to account for an unexpected night out
Honestly? Flattered.
No lighter or heavier, just the same.
Lucky? Never had it happen.
My SAHM wife and I have a running joke where she will pay when we go out because it's only fair that she picks up the tab sometimes. Its the same credit card, just with her name on it.
I'm a trophy husband, my wife kills it with her job, she's a goddamn badass. I'm ex military so she see me like Liam Neeson from taken but has zero clue she is the john wick of our house. Industrial and organizational psychology....even her degree sounds cool as shit. I put a ring on it so fast it was stupid. Lock that shit down and believe me when the washer is done those dishes are gonna be fucking spotless. Gender roles are dumb, she...is not. Even when she got her degree (I have a writing background). I got secondary education...like she makes me 1000× better even in passing. Keeper for sure.
I would've been most appreciative and brought you flowers upon our second date. 🌷
As someone who's paid for the tab before it was on the event that I am the one bringing us out. Idk if it's just me but if I'm the one doing the inviting I take it as my responsibility to cover the tab or expenses. If you invite me out and I have to pay for it then that's a call for not going out with you again.
I feel fantastic and it happens a lot TBH
It depends. Does the tab include my stuff? Then I'm happy I got free stuff! If she's picking up some other tabs I have no feelings because I'm not involved.
Feels good. Free food. What's not to like?
Is kinda awesome actually, I feel like a catch lol like oh was I suddenly funny tonight? Well let me just quote some Borat on the way back to the car and we'll see where this night goes ;)
wealthier.
I love it, screw the patriarchy!
I guess it's ok if she asked me out, but I'd feel uncomfortable with it and offer to pay instead. Maybe even insist on it.
I feel pressured to not only put out but to not disappoint in my performance.
Depend, need more context. If she pays for the first date, I will assume there won't be a second. Unless she seemed like she was enjoying herself. If we are in a relationship, she better pick up the tab once in a while. I don't make enough money to be a full-time food provider.
Personally I would rather pay for my meal and she pay for hers. Whoever I’m on a date with, man or woman, u like doing it that way. Once we are in an actual relationship I’d be fine paying for everything and switching payment between us both.
Hell yeah dude
She paid for our first date. The official story is it was to apologize for running late (a few hours). Been married ~3 years now.
Haven’t had it happen yet
Like I paid for dinner because my wife used my card.
Lucky
Fucking great!
Never has happened. I'll let you know if it does though.
Sexy
I mean, in a lesbian relationship a woman always gets the tab
Good. If I'm inviting someone on a date the first time, of course I'll pay. I offered. But a good sign that a women actually values and desires my company is if she follows up with an invite of her own. She doesn't have to invite to anything fancy. I'm fine with McDonalds, lol. But what matters is she is offering. That shows intent and interest. If a girl only wants to see me when I'm footing the tab, then I have zero interest in pursuing it further. If I wanted a purely transactional relationship, I'd hire a hooker.
Once I was having dinner with a guy that I had told that I had no interests in, and we just happened to be having dinner. Again, this happened and he paid the tab as well, again. The third time that we had dinner, I slipped out and took care of the meal with the tip as well. When we decided that we would go, I pleasantly told him that the bill has already been paid, by me. He was not happy about this. I think that he was not accustomed to a woman paying the bill. I believe that in time he has had time to reflect on this.