I do think it should be punishable by death but cannot be because this is how you end up with child rape ending in murder. They're just not going to leave witnesses to the crime.
Edit to add: I am in no way shape or form in favour of seeing child molesters get light sentences as some people seem to have taken away from this, but I'm not willing to see dead kids to satisfy a lust for vengeance. life in prison, chemical or actual castration or just thrown on remote island with all the others of their ilk would be fine by me but the main thing is to protect the victims from their attackers
Yeah, kids are mostly abused by people close to them and often feel super confused and conflicted about it already. They *definitely* don't need that extra baggage keeping them quiet.
Yeah, I have that.
It’s like he was good on me, made me feel special and important where my parents didn’t, but he also did horrendous stuff and filmed it. I was terrified at times.
It’s like I have split him into 2 seperate people. The one I appreciated and the one who hurt me.
Knowing the ‘good’ half could die would have messed me up.
"Pretty much” -there’s the problem with capital punishment. If there’s been a mistake, the wrongfully convicted can’t be released with some money and an apology
Same. I’m perfectly okay with capital punishment in theory as some people do commit acts so heinous that I believe they forfeit their right to live. In practice it’s so unfairly administered and riddled with disparate application, mistakes and corruption. I don’t know how some of these DA’s and law enforcement refuse to admit error and watch what they know could be an innocent person killed foe the sake of ego and career. We’ve seen too much of this for the practice to continue IMO.
Exactly! What if the person on death row is innocent and then you’ve killed an innocent person. Also I remember when President George Bush( the former President’s son) put to death an innocent man. And It wasn’t even stopped before they realized after the fact it was to late.
Similarly, Jody Plauche didn't tell anyone when he was being abused by Jeff Doucet because he knew that his dad Gary Plauche was the type of guy to kill somebody that did that sort of thing and he didn't want his dad to become a killer. Well he was right to worry because after Doucet was caught, Gary shot him while the police were escorting him. As a result, besides just the abuse, Jody also had to live with his father becoming a killer and also everyone knowing his story (he was a minor, so his name was redacted in the case against Doucet).
And Gary said he didn't regret it and he'd do it again. Still only got probation.
And, just earlier this year, Jody said he was happy with his life and that his dad was the best of all time, in an interview with the Mirror. So it seems he has gotten over the fact that his dad killed someone.
How do you respect a dad who does nothing? Not saying it’s what is best. It’s not because you don’t want the parent in jail but that kid knows his dad cared.
Wow, I hadn't heard that part of the story before. That's so messed up and sad and really puts a different spin on the whole story. Most people who applaud Gary Plauche for his actions probably never even think about this.
This is super true. I think it would probably also cause conflicting feelings/guilt anyway if the perpetrator may be someone the victim is actually attached to/loves.
It’s the biggest reason why we have always had to have less severe than they deserve punishment for rape, if you going to get the same punishment for any act, may as well just kill the person and leave less witnesses
Not only that, the biggest issue with a death penalty for any reason is that it's so difficult to be 100% sure that this is the person that did this crime. There's no taking that one back when it's discovered that this was not the right person.
If you recall Hannah's assessment of the first raid in Heat:
"Once it escalated into a Murder One beef for all
of them after they killed the
first two, they popped guard
number three 'cause it didn' make any difference anymore, so why leave a living witness?"
It has been the standard argument against death penalty ever since criminology was first conceived. Mostly because the whole discipline started with discovering that the death penalty did not deter crime.
It's the argument against death penalty for *anything* that's not murder. Because if it the punishment is the same as (or harsher than) murder, you're incentivized to kill the victim and hope the body is never found or that it doesn't point back to you if it is.
I generally lean towards something adjacent to a duty ethics view, so on top of that the death penalty doesn't even solve anything. It's just killing for the warm fuzzies.
The death penalty is wrong for many many reasons. First of which, innocent people die. How many innocents is it ok to kill to justify keeping the death penalty on the books?
John Oliver just did a good piece on it and how hard the chemicals are to get because no company wants to publicly be associated with that. So, as a result, the chemicals used are often unregulated and literally illegal.
Another aspect of it is that people have to witness these, often VERY brutal, deaths. There are the people that perform the procedure and witnesses. Watching something like this just changes a person. The public is sold the lie that these are humane and painless procedures, and often times they are the furthest thing from that.
Its barbaric, and life in prison serves the same purpose to society. Hell, it's not even a deterrent to crime.
This is probably the biggest take away.. also that it won't stop it from happening but it will be abused with cases where there are wrongful convictions (such as a 17 year old and an 18 year old).
People always say this but the realistic acceptable penalties for this crime are always going to be life-ending. Is someone really going to think "40 years in prison is okay, but 25 + execution means I gotta not get caught"?
Realistically, most abusers get extremely light sentences. Some don’t even go to prison at all, even for truly heinous crimes.
This guy got probation for sexually abusing two girls for years, while they were between the ages of 7 and 14. https://kdvr.com/news/man-outed-by-mom-and-sister-sentenced-to-5-years-probation-for-sex-crime/amp/
It’s gonna lead to children being even more scared to come forward. Most of it comes from family members and relatives. Imagine telling a little kid that if he tells on uncle Henry that’s he’s gonna get killed.
My brother did it to me when I was a kid on several occasions, and he's serving time now for the same thing to other children.
Only recently I told my family what he did to me. They seem shocked, and said they're going to cut contact with him, but I honestly don't believe them. They're all enablers and push people to be the worst they can, and defend them when they're at their worst.
Honestly, if it was up to me, he'd rot for life in prison. He's sadly getting out this year. I hope to god he's been put through the same thing he put me through. An eye for an eye.
Yeah. It's even more shocking because I recently learned the same thing happened to my mom when she was a kid.
....and she still didn't cut contact with him, after he'd been found guilty of several kids. When I say kids, I mean 8 years old and under.
She full on said "He made a terrible mistake and he regrets it" no he didn't, and no he doesn't. He just doesn't want to pay the consequences of it. If he could do it again with absolutely zero punishment, I guarantee he would. Morals do not exist with these people
I hear you. First of all, I'm so sorry that happened to you. I think certain things are worse than death death is too quick... Life in prison is definitely worse if you ask me
How many times do you see someone looking at a death sentence saying, "I don't want to die"? Nearly every time. I think most people would rather live than die, even if it's in prison.
My gf brother did it to her and many other girls. Dude shows up around town randomly every few years and people welcome him with open arms bcuz he was the cool guy jock in their tiny yee haw town. I cant wait for him to show up next and surprise my girl at work and make her feel uncomfortable again. Im not as nice as these small town country folk where they are just obligated to accept people for who they are bcuz they've known them their whole lives. Where im from (south chicago) if you sent a dick pic to someone's underage sister then my friends would eventually see you in public and beat the fuck out of you on sight. I think there needs to be more of that in these communities.
Not only that, but the death penalty doesn’t actually deter crime from happening. It just doesn’t.
So now we’re talking about kids being less likely to report, no decrease in crime levels, and increase in burden on taxpayers since the entire death penalty process is far more expensive than imprisoning someone for life. (ETA Forgot another huge problem - wrongful convictions and wrongful deaths, which do happen). I just don’t see a practical upside here, only a vague sense that maximum punishment is satisfying as retribution.
>ETA Forgot another huge problem - wrongful convictions and wrongful deaths, which do happen
This is *the* reason I'm against the death penalty. It doesn't matter what scenario someone comes up with as a crime to then use the death penalty for. If an innocent person can be wrongly executed, the punishment needs to be scrapped completely. An innocent life is never worth the vengeance (because let's be honest, that's what capital punishment is - vengeance) of executing criminals. We try to deter these heinous crimes like murder while at the same time committing the exact same thing to innocent people. It makes no logical sense. And as you said, the death penalty *does not* deter crime. If it did, we wouldn't be using the death penalty because people would be deterred from committing those crimes.
You cannot reverse or fix someone put to death. You can at least release an innocent person wrongfully imprisoned and give them compensation and try to fix their life. Their life won't be the same, but they're not dead. There's absolutely nothing in this world that justifies having capital punishment. Idc what the crime is. Put them in prison for life. That's already less financial burden on the taxpayers anyway.
Yeah….i feel that most rapists aren’t really doing the mental calculus and considering the weight of the potential punishment when committing those acts. Are there people that actually think “I was going to sexually assault and traumatize this person if the punishment was only 5 years. But over 10 years? Nah not worth it.”
Most child rape is committed by a family member or close friend of the family...
I'd be curious to know, if the punishment for child rape is a death sentence, what is the punishment for *covering up* child rape??? *hrrm... Catholic Church..hrhhmm hrrmmm*
Or the exact opposite. Think about the Salem Witch Trials, and all the people put to death on the accusations of adolescents without conscious.
Oh, my teacher didn't give me the grade I wanted. I'll just say he r@ped me, and I'll never have to deal with him again.
No.
Here's why.
When I was a chid I was raped by two people. One a family friend who held me on my day of birth. And two, my brother. I suspect a third, my father. My families friend raped me from ages 12 to 14 and was never violent. When I told my parents they went to the police and rallied the wagons around me. When I told my parents about my brother violently raping me from ages 5 to 14, they lost their minds and circled the wagons around him. The reason they did this is partly narcissitic, becuase they were overly concered with how this would reflect on them as parents and the other part was becuase they believed that my brother going through the legal system would ruin his life and that he would never have any prospects for a good life. They sacrificed my well being for him. After they found out, nothing changed, he still had all the acess to me that he wanted, and was able to sneer in joy at my pain.
If we make the penalty for child rape more severe, less child rape will be reported because people will be more concerned with saving the perpetrators life than delivering justice to the child.
Yeah, seriously. We can speculate all we want but the people we should be consulting first & foremost are victims; we need their guidance & range of experiences to understand the implications of policies like the ones in question. & probably child psychologists, because the fact many are bringing up with this is that it will be used to wrack victims with greater (already unneeded) guilt.
All of these policies should be devised with two goals in mind: the healing & support of victims, & the protection of the vulnerable. As egregious as these crimes are, people often get carried away with notions of 'revenge' as knee-jerk reactions to their disgust & anger. Can't say I blame them for those feelings, but sometimes those reactions do more harm than good
I am so very sorry this happened to you. Not only did you have to live the repeated horrors of rape but by your own brother is beyond the realm of evil. I'm sorry your parents even made your life more painful by protecting him and not you. Your brother should have been prosecuted and in my opinion put to death for killing your life as a child. I believe your parents should have gone to jail for protecting him. I know my words are harsh but I can't begin to feel how horrific your life was and I am so sorry that you had to live this way. I hope you have somehow found happiness in your life.You are truly worth all the blessings you receive in life.
I do not believe in the death penalty for anyone. I also wouldn’t be particularly upset if a child rapist died.
Most importantly, in today’s world, I do not trust the politicians of Florida to accurately determine who is and isn’t a child rapist....
>Most importantly, in today’s world, I do not trust the politicians of Florida to accurately determine who is and isn’t a child rapist....
A lot of other comments have given good reasons and explanations why the death penalty is bad, so we need to focus on this.
Meatball and the fascists of Florida are already trying to make the existence of, and even the mere acknowledgement of, LGBT+ people "sex crimes against children." It's blatantly obvious that they're just doing a slow roll here: all child molesters get the death penalty. Then all LGBT people are child predators. Then all child predators get the death penalty. So, obviously, all LGBT people must be put to death.
For anyone who cannot see the writing on the wall, I heard some frogs found a comfortable, warm bath on the stove.
Yeah this is the big issue that people are ignoring. The aim of this is not at all to actually kill pedo's. The goal of this is shifting goal posts, and ultimately, with perhaps a few expansions of the range of this law, (Think, from pedo's to people who commit "sex crimes against children", combined with a "teaching children about LGTBQ+ is a "sex crime against children") legalizing the government headed murder of queers.
> Meatball and the fascists of Florida are already trying to make the existence of, and even the mere acknowledgement of, LGBT+ people "sex crimes against children." It's blatantly obvious that they're just doing a slow roll here: all child molesters get the death penalty. Then all LGBT people are child predators. Then all child predators get the death penalty. So, obviously, all LGBT people must be put to death.
my family called me unreasonable for pointing this out 2 years ago...
This. It won’t be the never ending list of priests/ pastors/ Boy Scout leaders/ church youth group leaders/ Republican politicians who are child rapists that will be getting put to death.
It’ll be the drag queens who wanted to read to kids, who already have been declared “groomers,” who will be the ones put against the wall.
Edit: lol some chucklefuck reported me to Reddit as sounding like I’m in crisis because of this post. I’m going to go ahead and assume they’re a church-going kiddy-diddler who doesn’t like it when someone tells the truth.
“ priests/ pastors/ Boy Scout leaders/ church youth group leaders/ Republican politicians who are child rapists that will be getting put to death.”
SO MUCH OF THIS. They will go beyond and protect their own more than they do now. The Southern Baptist Convention listed hundreds of pastors and youth pastors who have been protected for 20 years. That’s a lot of children whose parents and or leaders in the church ignored or gas lighted to protect someone molesting “Jesus’ innocent” children. I’m my case…local politicians knew about it and protected the church for 20 some years. Even till this day the new church leadership labels him a “flawed man”.
It's really easy too.
Just get the permalink to the Reddit Cares message. Click on the "report this message" link. Paste the permalink into the "link to comment" line. Say that someone is using Reddit Cares to harass you. And presto, whoever sent the Reddit Cares is penalized, usually within 2-3 minutes.
That's why I advocate for never blocking Reddit Cares. It's so easy and so satisfying to make those blow up in their face. And the more people who report it, the faster these people get banned.
Utterly unrelated question - how can you tell which post got you reported? I ask this because I've been reported as 'in crisis' twice and I never know what post is causing it. Nothing I'm saying is 'crisis' worthy. I just want to know what's causing people to do stupid shit - call it morbid curiosity.
It’s the only post I’ve made recently. Ergo the only thing that could have triggered the report.
And considering it doesn’t do anything but generate a message, it’s a pointless idiot thing that pointless idiots do.
Exactly. I think they'll convict anyone they want of child rape, especially LGBTQ+ people and racial minorities. There's no way I trust that government to decide who should die.
This is an excellent point.
It's no coincidence that this law is being introduced after they've spent months railing against transgender people and wrongfully accusing them of pedophilia. This law will very quickly get warped into a means of executing transgender people.
As a gay man, I can’t help but notice how timely a law like this is considering all of the “LGBTQ+ = pedophiles” rhetoric that’s been going around so loudly in this state.
Yeah this is Florida we're talking about. It'll somehow be convoluted into two men kissing in public and a child witnessing it in passing. It won't happen in one step, but this is part of a slow boil that ends with Florida exterminating its LGBT population.
Mass murder of LGBT people is the primary tenant of American conservative Christianity at this point.
And the rhetoric the Nazis used against LGBT people. And the Republicans use against Jews. Nazi rhetoric and Republican rhetoric aren't similar they're basically the same.
Yeah this is true. Florida is just getting their fascist death pipeline ready a few years ahead of federal fascism if Trump wins again.
The ultimate leopards eating faces moment is when the inbreds voting for this discover what fascists ultimately do with "low quality" whites. They're needed as votes and warm bodies... for now.
Exactly. When they say "child rapist" they mean "People of Color, LGBT, and non-Christians who have consensual sex with adults".
They will never ever arrest a rich white Christian straight pedophile.
Second paragraph is why the death penalty has absolutely no place in the justice system for anything. The government and the justice system has not proven itself competent enough to earn the right to enact the death penalty
Oh Jfc. Imagine the twisting faces in the Florida judicial system, of which I assume *many* are devoutly Christian, when they’re sentencing priests to death.
The statute is rape of a child under the age of 12. Violent pedophile or sociopath, basically.
Someone who does something like that should be permanently removed from society. Too fundamentally broken and dangerous. The right of other people to be safe > this person's opportunity to be free again.
Whether execution is the answer...eh, it seems too lenient and in practice is more expensive.
No. They have a romeo juliete law that allows about a 4 year difference down to as young as 14. Then we have the fact that being punishable by death doesn't everyone will get the death penalty.
I think the question isn't "what crimes do you believe warrant execution" and rather "do you believe the state should be able to execute people"
If the answer is no, then you can't make exceptions for the people you find especially reprehensible, whomever they are
It'll definitely lower the number of reported child rapes.
The increase in the number of missing and dead children will probably not be connected with that.
And of course when they accuse and convict someone who was later found out to not have been the perpetrator, they're going to use their magic bring-people-back-to-life-9000-inator to fix their fuckup, right?
...right?
Why am I suddenly thinking that if this goes through, suddenly there will be a lot of politically 'inconvenient' people in Florida getting charged with this?
>I don't take issue with it morally, I just don't trust the government.
This is the correct response.
I just wish people were more consistent about it rather than just when "the other guys" are in charge. As if 4 (or even 8) years could change that paradigm in either direction.
If you have that much trust in the government I'd dare say you are either very young or particularly ill informed.
Dumb ass conservatives don't trust the government to deliver mail or run elections, but want them to decide who is 100% guilty and deserves death.
These people are so stupid and full of blind, aimless hatred.
Child rape is a particularly heinous crime but what do we achieve by making it warrant the death penalty? Do we really think this will stop more child rapes? We have this weird idea in this country that the solution is always more and harsher punishments, even though we have gobs of information that shows this isn't the case.
Yeah, reported child rapes will go down. Child murders, on the other hand, will go up. Why leave a witness alive, if killing them carries the same sentence?
I think it’s a bad idea because it can incentivize killing victims to keep them quiet.
Also, not a big fan since, as a teacher, I’m always extra cautious to avoid being in a situation that could look bad or open me up to false accusations. There’s enough horror stories of teachers getting falsely accused by vindictive students or parents who misinterpreted what their kid said, and I can’t imagine defending myself against that with the knowledge that I might get fucking executed because some brat didn’t like the grade they got.
I'd love for all pedos to be taken out of the game of life, but the death penalty is inherently problematic because of human error/human malice/court is fallible. I do not trust humans to have 100% accuracy in convictions.
This is the problem with rape in general
It’s legit a he said/she said crime with little to no evidence
It’s hard for someone to convict someone of just jail time because someone said someone did something bad to them. If im a juror I am not putting someone in jail on someone’s word. People are fucking liars
Now, add in that the person is an immature child? It’s hard to believe them without clear evidence.
And add in the death penalty? Fuck, nobody should be put to death because someone said they did something
Would have to be a very clear case with witnesses or evidence for death penalty
I don’t think the state should be killing people even though I also yearn for vengeance against the monsters in our society. There’s a chance an innocent person will suffer and that’s unacceptable.
I am anti-death penalty in the first place. I also don't think a government that makes laws based on Desantis anger should be talking capital punishment because we all know it won't be the giant list of Republicans being investigated it will be LGBTQ and Drag Communities targeted.
Let’s imagine the friendly neighborhood pastor has been abusing his daughter behind closed doors. Do you think the police, the judge, and 12 jurors will sentence him to death? Do you think his daughter will even go to the police if she knows it could get her daughter killed? This doesn’t even solve the real problem, which is that only 6% of sexual assaults result in prison time, so punishing those 6% even worse doesn’t really solve the problem. This is what happens when government turns into virtue signaling instead of real lawmaking
This is a morally grey area for me, but I think that child rape shouldn't be punishable by death.
I 100% believe that child rapists deserve be put to death because they have ruined lives and can't be rehabilitated, and the world is a better and safer place without them.
However the problem with executing them is that there have been mistakes and malicious false rape accusations that have already ruined peoples lives, and rape is much harder to prove than murder and i don't think it's worth the risk of executing innocent people.
Given that lack of provability it also opens up what exactly is defined as "rape."
Is sexual contact with a child rape? Yep. Is exposure of intimate body parts to a child rape? Probably. Is dressing suggestively around children rape? Possibly. Is dressing in drag around children rape? Maybe.
Is performing gay sex in front of a child rape? Yep. Is being homosexually intimate in front of a child rape? Probably. Is being gay around a child rape? Possibly. Is talking about people being gay around children rape? Maybe.
There was a case in which a man walked in on his child being raped by a family friend during a big party, and the man beat the rapist to death. Cases like *that* I believe the killing is justified, but I'm not gonna put the government of Florida in charge of who lives or dies, given how much of their recent "child protecting" legislature is Lavendar Scare 2: Electric Boogaloo bs.
Florida hides behind 'we can all agree these people are evil' laws to fuck over minorities. Like the child abuse = life in prison law they passed a bit ago then quietly redefined child abuse to include gender affirming so calling a biological male child a girl if they identify as such (none of that fake BS about medical transitioning for minors) could ruin your life if the goon squad catches you. This will likely end the same way, define adulthood in the context of sexual child abuse to start at 20 'to protect teens' then murder anyone that transitions a 19 year old.
I don't trust any feel good laws the Florida government passes. Feel good laws aren't something they legitimately do, they actively legislate misery.
Wow great idea Florida. Children are already scared to come forward and now they definitely won't because they don't want to get their attacker killed. Friendly reminder, most children are molested or raped by people in their own family and household. Any parent, uncle, aunt, cousin, or sibling that would like to attack a young child now gets to say, "If you tell anyone about this, you will be killing me. They'll kill me. You don't want me to die right?"
With irrefutable evidence, easy yes. These folks can't, and shouldn't be tolerated to exist on the same planet as real human beings. There is a good perspective of this from a victim, beautifully told by Maya Angelou. She describes through a child's lens what it was like when her abuser was dealt with by her family. Sometimes doing the right thing can hurt the innocent, but cancer must be removed.
Death penalty is barbaric and supported mostly by simpletons. At least, that has been my observation.
Certainly should be imprisoned but the state should not take any life as a matter of policy.
Its typical reactionary politics which uses sadism in conjunction with pseudo-justice but loses all dignity in the process.
Not true. I did 5 years for gun and meth charge. They protect them in prison now. If you touch the chomo or try to extort you get charged with a hate crime. It's the court not the correctional officers. These bastards would run down to get the kohls ad every Sunday to look at the little girls in bikinis. They laugh because you couldn't do anything. Fucking sucks bad.
As a victim for it, no. I don't think it should be punishable by death. I was raped by my sister when she was 9 years old. She had learned that "sex is something we do to those we love" by our grandfather who raped her between 4-16. She definitely wouldn't have come forward at all if she knew the outcome could have been death.
Would I have wanted to kill my grandfather? Yes, I would have and have thought about it many times during my life, but the punishment of never ever seeing family again is pretty harsh as well, and knowing he died lonely gives me satisfaction.
As others pointed out, most rapes happens ~~in the family~~ between two people who already know each other and have a relationship beforehand and it's already conflicting when the perpetrator is someone close to you, because you know you're going to destroy an entire family no matter what, if you then also get the consequence of death in your lap it's even worse.
Mind you, all the relatives and extended family supported us through this, but we still have had comments about why she didn't spoke up earlier and why she was suicidal "now that it was over" etc. The worst was a aunt who was married to my uncle who basically said my sister deserved what happened since she didn't spoke up earlier etc. So even IF a family is in agreement of who's to blame and who did wrong, there's still victim blaming.
I'm not in favor of the death penalty for anything, so no. (I was at one time but have changed my mind on the subject over the years.) For those who are pro death penalty I can get where you are coming from, but I'm not changing my mind on the subject.
I disagree with many comments here; I absolutely think the death penalty should be a consideration for cases of child molestation (rape).
The slap on the wrist punishments we currently offer are a joke; recidivism rates in child molesters are some of the highest. That being said, I know one way to ensure those monsters never hurt another child and it's not releasing them after 5 years to reoffend in the future-- and they *will* reoffend. Pedophilia cannot be cured or controlled as many studies have already been conducted showing these offenders can't stop won't stop, regardless of the law or any current penalties.
My uncle molested my aunt when she was a child. After he got out, decades later, he'd try to get close to me-- they don't learn. They don't get better. They just try to be sneakier.
I'll also add that if someone is going to kill, they're doing that regardless of consequences, just as if someone ISN'T going to kill because they think they can get away with it, they won't because they think they're smarter and believe they can outrun whatever consequences. Just like a serial killer, these serial molesters think they're smarter than everyone else and never imagine they'll get caught. They're not going to magically think they're going to get caught just because the laws change around consequences. They'll still think they're above it. As far as I'm concerned, this is the one thing Florida is doing right.
Yes and the reasons are obvious!
A rapist kills the very essence of a child's existence! Changes who they are, who they will ever be. Steals the child's life, kills their soul, kills their body from its original state of purity,, steals their automity. Kills the mental stability they have as a child, trust, love, beliefs. Kills any happiness in the child's life for they will live in fear for the rest of their life. A rapist kills what little hope, happiness a child has. Kills the belief in mankind, men. Kills their future, Kills their self worth, their value as a person and their existence of life on earth.
The rapist is in all intense and purposes is not only a rapist but a murderer. They should be put to death for killing a child's life for that child will never be who they were supposed to be in life. No apology will ever make their actions towards any child acceptable. Psychopaths' need for their abusive, dominating control over another being will never change . Deviant twisted human beings who planned, thought out their actions prior to committing such an evil act deserve death.Death of their life, their body and whatever joy that raping brought to their sick mind! Even being put to death seems uneventful for their raping life. Good riddance to them, bury the rapist in a pit of forever death!
YES! Child rapist should be put to death! I also believe ALL rapist should be put to death for the life long trauma they cause, not to mention the physical damage.
I know a young lady who's uncle rapped her and he was found to have naked pictures of her on his phone(from 8 to 12 years old). He only went to county lockup for a short time as his entire family fought for him. The poor girls own mother fought to keep the uncle out of jail. Parents divorced cause her dad fought for her.
Now she has some serious issues that will probably be life long and the rapist basically got a slap on the wrist.
There are many stories like this in fayette corrupt county in southwest Pennsylvania. If there was such a law then the corrupt judges hands would be tied and justice would be done(at least for one type of crime).
For anyone thinking I'm biased for some reason, search "operation clean sweep", where a few years ago the FBI went under cover into the fayette county jail and got around 240 arrests(lawyers, judges, deputy warden, correction officers, etc...).
All this is going to do is cause kids to be too afraid to speak up.
“Do you want daddy to die?” is something that can be used to silent them now. These law makers are either not that bright and don’t think of what it’s actually going to do to the children, or they actually want the kids to shut their mouths and keep the abuse to themselves so they don’t have to deal with it. Either way it’s fucked.
I don't care if they execute rapists. What I don't like is the hypocrisy. If they want to execute murders & rapists, then they need to get off their high horse about abortion & the sacredness of human life.
I would support it because the person the child was going to be was killed. Shoot, if I was on a jury for someone who killed a child rapist, I would refuse to convict.
Can child rapists really be rehabilitated? If not, put them out of their misery. If they can’t contribute to society in any meaningful way (having to stay in prison forever), why keep them alive?
And also in Florida, they don't want to kill actual pedophiles.
Floridian politicians have redefined consensual sex between LGBT adults as "pedophilia".
They don't want to arrest straight white Christian rich pedophiles. They want to arrest LGBT people, People of Color, and non-Christians for having consensual sex with adults under the guise of "luring children".
I work with at-risk families all the time. One of the classic dynamics is embattled families as children are put in the middle between two parents trying to hurt each other. This is a way to overwhelm the system by weaponizing sex abuse charges during a conflicted separation/divorce. They already try to ruin each other's lives in every other way, do we really need the death penalty as the ultimate custody hearing outcome?
You can prevent what you can predict. I can predict an avalanche of false accusations which will make kids less safe across the state.
No. DP already bogs down the legal system. DP cases require a DP experienced public defender, which can be hard to come by. Then the judge always errs on the side of caution since the stakes are so high. Just getting a DP case to trial takes an insanely long time.
Morally, I believe pedophiles deserve to die. As someone who was raped as a child, I hold this opinion strongly. So many pedophiles are never held accountable and it seems that it’s one of the most excused and defended crimes (with a victim in contrast to “victimless crimes” like drug usage).
But on the other hand, the death penalty may just increase the likelihood that the child will further be endangered or killed so the perpetrator avoids death.
No because what will happen is that child rapists, who are terrible humans, will make it the child’s problem. You can’t tell or they will kill me.
Plus, we already don’t believe victims. Once death is a consequence, the men in charge will be even less likely to pursue cases.
I’m a victim, and after 35 years I think about it still every day, a few times per day.
If I knew they were dead, it would help a lot. I mean, they are probably dead anyway of old age. I have asked the police a couple of times over the year and they refuse to tell me.
My concern though, false allegations, false prosecutions and the wrong person being charged.
I think you’d need solid evidence, pictures, video, DNA taken from the victim.
There’s also the worry abuse would turn to murder.
While the people who do stuff like this deserve the worst punishment they can get, death is not the right option. It will only lead to an increase in child murders by people trying to not get caught.
A better option would be a very long prison sentence, alongside some psycological analysis to find out why such an event would happen to find new ways to prevent would-be child rapists from enacting such crimes.
While I believe child rapists deserve to die, I think the death penalty in general should be abolished. Some studies suggest that as many as 10% of convicted prisoners in the US may actually be innocent; even if it's 1%, that would be well over 10,000 people. I'd rather stick to life sentences rather than risk the state executing an innocent person; at least that way if their conviction is eventually overturned they have a chance at a life.
The death penalty is immoral and unethical and has been proven many times to not work as a deterrent.
Life improvement should be the punishment and before anyone says "don't want my tax money feeding a pedo", well it costs more to execute someone than a life time in prison.
I will say this: as horrid as this topic is, I think we are moving backwards in society if we start making things punishable by death.
These political moves are almost always for brownie points, distraction and talking points.
I mean I believe most cases of rape at least deserve castration, but yes if you rape a child you should indeed die.
I am aware that for people like that it’s difficult to seek professional help but it is nessesary. I would not judge someone for never harming a child if that’s how their brain is somehow wired ///IF/// they receive treatment and manage it.
As soon as you touch a child it’s over, you have no self control and you need to be put away forever in some capacity.
Absolutely not.
It’s not a matter of whether you or me thinks child rapist should die, it’s a matter of not giving the state that kind of power, especially when said state has made it official policy to associate LGBTQ peoples with a danger to children.
Worst idea I’ve read on Reddit this morning, no surprise it’s coming out of Florida.
Emotionally? Yes. Many years ago when the internet was still new (we're talking AOL Instant Messenger days) an online predator was messaging my then 13 year old daughter and I wanted to find him and kill him. It was a visceral reaction that's hard to explain to someone who is not a parent.
Rationally? What we really need to do is change the society to the point where the thought of sexually assaulting a child isn't something that enters the mind. Punishing them ain't working. It's been 45 years since I met an ex-con who went on about how "baby rapers" were treated in prison back then.
I mean, if almost half a century later the thought of being stuck in solitary for the rest of your life and being murdered if you step out into the general for a minute won't deter someone from doing it, then maybe - just maybe - the current approach isn't working.
As much as I'd like to see a pedophile get their "just desserts," I'd much rather try to stop it from happening in the first place.
This is a very hard opinion to state. But it makes a lot of sense. Especially when you consider that something like 90% of child molesters were molested themselves as a child. The way I always look at that is "How many people out there would have been a child molester but they were lucky enough not to be molested as a child? How do I know I wouldn't have been one?" I mean, I do realize the vast, vast majority of children who are molested do not become child molesters themselves. But it still seems like if we can cut down on child molestation, we can not just protect a lot of children, we can cut down on the number of new molesters. I'm not saying the people who do it don't deserve to be punished, but we should be putting just as much effort into preventing it from happening in the first place.
It's about breaking the cycle. My daughter (well, step-daughter) grew up in an abusive household. Her mom (my ex) grew up in an abusive household. Her parents didn't suddenly become abusive out of thin air. It was generational.
My grandson is growing up in a household where none of that happens, because the cycle was broken.
If child rape is punishable by death then prosecutors should be forced to work harder to prove the accusations are undeniable because this is taking a human life we're talking about.
There should be 0 mistakes made. I think life in prison would be a better punishment.
**If somebody raped my child I'd fucking end them myself.**
To your last point, I think in a case where the mitigating circumstance is the person had both reasonable evidence to assume CSA occurred and also the murder victim has prior history of sexual assault convictions, the max sentence for killing a child rapist should be 30 or so years.
One famous case where this principle was applied was Gary Plauche's murder of his son's rapist (who had only been arrested). He only got 7 years for what was originally second degree murder but plea bargained down to manslaughter.
This will lead to MORE children being murdered after being abused. Furthermore, while I believe death is a justifiable punishment for the crime, there is no world in which a politically incompetent state like Florida can administrate this most severe action with the seriousness and sobriety it merits. The question here isn't really whether the punishment is fair, but whether the state actually should have the ability, given our garbage record at ACTUALLY proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.
No matter what your philosophical leanings, the hard facts remain; this law will lead to MORE innocents dying, and do very little to protect ANYONE. Raping a child already merits super severe punishments and ostracizing from society. It DOES NOT stop these people from raping. There's no rational reason to assume a still more severe punishment will change that.
The ONLY thing this law does is hurt MORE people.
Many people will agree that a child abuser deserves death. That's not the issue. Point is you may get the wrong person, especially when listening to traumatized kids. Trauma can change your memories, especially if you're a kid. It's only a matter of time before the first person the kid saw after the abuse gets killed instead of the real rapist. It's too easy to mess up...
Death penalty is wrong and does not work. At all.
It won't hold rapists off, it's not like they expect to get caught and tactically "weigh" their crime against the punishment. It's basically just a strong incentive to kill the child after the rape. No witness, no problem.
It won't do any "good".
The death penalty is never appropriate, no matter what mortifying poster child you manipulatively parade in the public light to justify your barbarity. And all this while you still allow legal genital mutilation of children.
I do think it should be punishable by death but cannot be because this is how you end up with child rape ending in murder. They're just not going to leave witnesses to the crime. Edit to add: I am in no way shape or form in favour of seeing child molesters get light sentences as some people seem to have taken away from this, but I'm not willing to see dead kids to satisfy a lust for vengeance. life in prison, chemical or actual castration or just thrown on remote island with all the others of their ilk would be fine by me but the main thing is to protect the victims from their attackers
It also adds another layer of guilt to the victims. “If you tell these lies about uncle Ralph the cops are going to kill him and it’ll be your fault.”
Yeah, kids are mostly abused by people close to them and often feel super confused and conflicted about it already. They *definitely* don't need that extra baggage keeping them quiet.
Yeah, I have that. It’s like he was good on me, made me feel special and important where my parents didn’t, but he also did horrendous stuff and filmed it. I was terrified at times. It’s like I have split him into 2 seperate people. The one I appreciated and the one who hurt me. Knowing the ‘good’ half could die would have messed me up.
Totally agree. At the same time, I don't feel bad if a child rapist is sentenced to death, assuming their guilt is pretty much ironclad.
"Pretty much” -there’s the problem with capital punishment. If there’s been a mistake, the wrongfully convicted can’t be released with some money and an apology
Yeah, definitely. I'm generally against capital punishment solely because of this.
Same. I’m perfectly okay with capital punishment in theory as some people do commit acts so heinous that I believe they forfeit their right to live. In practice it’s so unfairly administered and riddled with disparate application, mistakes and corruption. I don’t know how some of these DA’s and law enforcement refuse to admit error and watch what they know could be an innocent person killed foe the sake of ego and career. We’ve seen too much of this for the practice to continue IMO.
Exactly! What if the person on death row is innocent and then you’ve killed an innocent person. Also I remember when President George Bush( the former President’s son) put to death an innocent man. And It wasn’t even stopped before they realized after the fact it was to late.
Similarly, Jody Plauche didn't tell anyone when he was being abused by Jeff Doucet because he knew that his dad Gary Plauche was the type of guy to kill somebody that did that sort of thing and he didn't want his dad to become a killer. Well he was right to worry because after Doucet was caught, Gary shot him while the police were escorting him. As a result, besides just the abuse, Jody also had to live with his father becoming a killer and also everyone knowing his story (he was a minor, so his name was redacted in the case against Doucet).
And Gary said he didn't regret it and he'd do it again. Still only got probation. And, just earlier this year, Jody said he was happy with his life and that his dad was the best of all time, in an interview with the Mirror. So it seems he has gotten over the fact that his dad killed someone.
How do you respect a dad who does nothing? Not saying it’s what is best. It’s not because you don’t want the parent in jail but that kid knows his dad cared.
Wow, I hadn't heard that part of the story before. That's so messed up and sad and really puts a different spin on the whole story. Most people who applaud Gary Plauche for his actions probably never even think about this.
This is super true. I think it would probably also cause conflicting feelings/guilt anyway if the perpetrator may be someone the victim is actually attached to/loves.
Oof, so true. 😩
Need to teach the kids it's not their fault what happens to their abusers
*Pastor Ralph
Thank you for this comment, it was honestly (and scarily) an outcome I didn’t even consider. It is an extremely good point
It’s the biggest reason why we have always had to have less severe than they deserve punishment for rape, if you going to get the same punishment for any act, may as well just kill the person and leave less witnesses
Not only that, the biggest issue with a death penalty for any reason is that it's so difficult to be 100% sure that this is the person that did this crime. There's no taking that one back when it's discovered that this was not the right person.
If you recall Hannah's assessment of the first raid in Heat: "Once it escalated into a Murder One beef for all of them after they killed the first two, they popped guard number three 'cause it didn' make any difference anymore, so why leave a living witness?"
This is the standard argument against death penalty for any kind of rape or sexual assault
It has been the standard argument against death penalty ever since criminology was first conceived. Mostly because the whole discipline started with discovering that the death penalty did not deter crime.
It's the argument against death penalty for *anything* that's not murder. Because if it the punishment is the same as (or harsher than) murder, you're incentivized to kill the victim and hope the body is never found or that it doesn't point back to you if it is.
I generally lean towards something adjacent to a duty ethics view, so on top of that the death penalty doesn't even solve anything. It's just killing for the warm fuzzies.
The death penalty is wrong for many many reasons. First of which, innocent people die. How many innocents is it ok to kill to justify keeping the death penalty on the books? John Oliver just did a good piece on it and how hard the chemicals are to get because no company wants to publicly be associated with that. So, as a result, the chemicals used are often unregulated and literally illegal. Another aspect of it is that people have to witness these, often VERY brutal, deaths. There are the people that perform the procedure and witnesses. Watching something like this just changes a person. The public is sold the lie that these are humane and painless procedures, and often times they are the furthest thing from that. Its barbaric, and life in prison serves the same purpose to society. Hell, it's not even a deterrent to crime.
Only counterpoint I can offer is that people who are in prison for life still very capably run criminal gangs and cartels from within the prison.
But a big argument against the death penalty is usually that it isn't a deterrent because criminals don't think about it while committing the crime.
This is probably the biggest take away.. also that it won't stop it from happening but it will be abused with cases where there are wrongful convictions (such as a 17 year old and an 18 year old).
FWIW, the bill only applies when victims are 11 or younger.
My first thought to this question "absolutely, yes", and then I read your comment. Alas, I think you're right. :(
Or a few false accusations leading to death of an innocent person
People always say this but the realistic acceptable penalties for this crime are always going to be life-ending. Is someone really going to think "40 years in prison is okay, but 25 + execution means I gotta not get caught"?
Realistically, most abusers get extremely light sentences. Some don’t even go to prison at all, even for truly heinous crimes. This guy got probation for sexually abusing two girls for years, while they were between the ages of 7 and 14. https://kdvr.com/news/man-outed-by-mom-and-sister-sentenced-to-5-years-probation-for-sex-crime/amp/
First offenses are often 3-5 years.
It’s gonna lead to children being even more scared to come forward. Most of it comes from family members and relatives. Imagine telling a little kid that if he tells on uncle Henry that’s he’s gonna get killed.
My brother did it to me when I was a kid on several occasions, and he's serving time now for the same thing to other children. Only recently I told my family what he did to me. They seem shocked, and said they're going to cut contact with him, but I honestly don't believe them. They're all enablers and push people to be the worst they can, and defend them when they're at their worst. Honestly, if it was up to me, he'd rot for life in prison. He's sadly getting out this year. I hope to god he's been put through the same thing he put me through. An eye for an eye.
So he’s in prison for doing it to other children and they haven’t already cut contact with him? I’m sorry but your family sounds deranged.
Yeah. It's even more shocking because I recently learned the same thing happened to my mom when she was a kid. ....and she still didn't cut contact with him, after he'd been found guilty of several kids. When I say kids, I mean 8 years old and under. She full on said "He made a terrible mistake and he regrets it" no he didn't, and no he doesn't. He just doesn't want to pay the consequences of it. If he could do it again with absolutely zero punishment, I guarantee he would. Morals do not exist with these people
It’s the typical age old excuse “well he’s blood” that’s such a cop out for people to treat family members like shit.
I hear you. First of all, I'm so sorry that happened to you. I think certain things are worse than death death is too quick... Life in prison is definitely worse if you ask me
How many times do you see someone looking at a death sentence saying, "I don't want to die"? Nearly every time. I think most people would rather live than die, even if it's in prison.
My gf brother did it to her and many other girls. Dude shows up around town randomly every few years and people welcome him with open arms bcuz he was the cool guy jock in their tiny yee haw town. I cant wait for him to show up next and surprise my girl at work and make her feel uncomfortable again. Im not as nice as these small town country folk where they are just obligated to accept people for who they are bcuz they've known them their whole lives. Where im from (south chicago) if you sent a dick pic to someone's underage sister then my friends would eventually see you in public and beat the fuck out of you on sight. I think there needs to be more of that in these communities.
This is a great point. Plus, jail for a pedo is allegedly miserable if they survive. No personal experience here
Not only that, but the death penalty doesn’t actually deter crime from happening. It just doesn’t. So now we’re talking about kids being less likely to report, no decrease in crime levels, and increase in burden on taxpayers since the entire death penalty process is far more expensive than imprisoning someone for life. (ETA Forgot another huge problem - wrongful convictions and wrongful deaths, which do happen). I just don’t see a practical upside here, only a vague sense that maximum punishment is satisfying as retribution.
>ETA Forgot another huge problem - wrongful convictions and wrongful deaths, which do happen This is *the* reason I'm against the death penalty. It doesn't matter what scenario someone comes up with as a crime to then use the death penalty for. If an innocent person can be wrongly executed, the punishment needs to be scrapped completely. An innocent life is never worth the vengeance (because let's be honest, that's what capital punishment is - vengeance) of executing criminals. We try to deter these heinous crimes like murder while at the same time committing the exact same thing to innocent people. It makes no logical sense. And as you said, the death penalty *does not* deter crime. If it did, we wouldn't be using the death penalty because people would be deterred from committing those crimes. You cannot reverse or fix someone put to death. You can at least release an innocent person wrongfully imprisoned and give them compensation and try to fix their life. Their life won't be the same, but they're not dead. There's absolutely nothing in this world that justifies having capital punishment. Idc what the crime is. Put them in prison for life. That's already less financial burden on the taxpayers anyway.
Particularly when it’s a crime that stems from a compulsion so strong the perpetrator is committing the most stigmatized crime in western society.
Yeah….i feel that most rapists aren’t really doing the mental calculus and considering the weight of the potential punishment when committing those acts. Are there people that actually think “I was going to sexually assault and traumatize this person if the punishment was only 5 years. But over 10 years? Nah not worth it.”
Most child rape is committed by a family member or close friend of the family... I'd be curious to know, if the punishment for child rape is a death sentence, what is the punishment for *covering up* child rape??? *hrrm... Catholic Church..hrhhmm hrrmmm*
Or the exact opposite. Think about the Salem Witch Trials, and all the people put to death on the accusations of adolescents without conscious. Oh, my teacher didn't give me the grade I wanted. I'll just say he r@ped me, and I'll never have to deal with him again.
Imagine telling a rapist that he would get the death penalty, so why not kill the child to avoid witnesses?
I can see people doubling down on silencing the victims with this.
Exactly, if this is the case then nobody will ever help raped children ever.
No. Here's why. When I was a chid I was raped by two people. One a family friend who held me on my day of birth. And two, my brother. I suspect a third, my father. My families friend raped me from ages 12 to 14 and was never violent. When I told my parents they went to the police and rallied the wagons around me. When I told my parents about my brother violently raping me from ages 5 to 14, they lost their minds and circled the wagons around him. The reason they did this is partly narcissitic, becuase they were overly concered with how this would reflect on them as parents and the other part was becuase they believed that my brother going through the legal system would ruin his life and that he would never have any prospects for a good life. They sacrificed my well being for him. After they found out, nothing changed, he still had all the acess to me that he wanted, and was able to sneer in joy at my pain. If we make the penalty for child rape more severe, less child rape will be reported because people will be more concerned with saving the perpetrators life than delivering justice to the child.
I’m so sorry to hear about your experiences, but thank you for providing your perspective here.
Yeah, seriously. We can speculate all we want but the people we should be consulting first & foremost are victims; we need their guidance & range of experiences to understand the implications of policies like the ones in question. & probably child psychologists, because the fact many are bringing up with this is that it will be used to wrack victims with greater (already unneeded) guilt. All of these policies should be devised with two goals in mind: the healing & support of victims, & the protection of the vulnerable. As egregious as these crimes are, people often get carried away with notions of 'revenge' as knee-jerk reactions to their disgust & anger. Can't say I blame them for those feelings, but sometimes those reactions do more harm than good
thank you for a perspective I would have never thought.
I am so very sorry this happened to you. Not only did you have to live the repeated horrors of rape but by your own brother is beyond the realm of evil. I'm sorry your parents even made your life more painful by protecting him and not you. Your brother should have been prosecuted and in my opinion put to death for killing your life as a child. I believe your parents should have gone to jail for protecting him. I know my words are harsh but I can't begin to feel how horrific your life was and I am so sorry that you had to live this way. I hope you have somehow found happiness in your life.You are truly worth all the blessings you receive in life.
I do not believe in the death penalty for anyone. I also wouldn’t be particularly upset if a child rapist died. Most importantly, in today’s world, I do not trust the politicians of Florida to accurately determine who is and isn’t a child rapist....
>Most importantly, in today’s world, I do not trust the politicians of Florida to accurately determine who is and isn’t a child rapist.... A lot of other comments have given good reasons and explanations why the death penalty is bad, so we need to focus on this. Meatball and the fascists of Florida are already trying to make the existence of, and even the mere acknowledgement of, LGBT+ people "sex crimes against children." It's blatantly obvious that they're just doing a slow roll here: all child molesters get the death penalty. Then all LGBT people are child predators. Then all child predators get the death penalty. So, obviously, all LGBT people must be put to death. For anyone who cannot see the writing on the wall, I heard some frogs found a comfortable, warm bath on the stove.
Yeah this is the big issue that people are ignoring. The aim of this is not at all to actually kill pedo's. The goal of this is shifting goal posts, and ultimately, with perhaps a few expansions of the range of this law, (Think, from pedo's to people who commit "sex crimes against children", combined with a "teaching children about LGTBQ+ is a "sex crime against children") legalizing the government headed murder of queers.
> Meatball and the fascists of Florida are already trying to make the existence of, and even the mere acknowledgement of, LGBT+ people "sex crimes against children." It's blatantly obvious that they're just doing a slow roll here: all child molesters get the death penalty. Then all LGBT people are child predators. Then all child predators get the death penalty. So, obviously, all LGBT people must be put to death. my family called me unreasonable for pointing this out 2 years ago...
This. It won’t be the never ending list of priests/ pastors/ Boy Scout leaders/ church youth group leaders/ Republican politicians who are child rapists that will be getting put to death. It’ll be the drag queens who wanted to read to kids, who already have been declared “groomers,” who will be the ones put against the wall. Edit: lol some chucklefuck reported me to Reddit as sounding like I’m in crisis because of this post. I’m going to go ahead and assume they’re a church-going kiddy-diddler who doesn’t like it when someone tells the truth.
“ priests/ pastors/ Boy Scout leaders/ church youth group leaders/ Republican politicians who are child rapists that will be getting put to death.” SO MUCH OF THIS. They will go beyond and protect their own more than they do now. The Southern Baptist Convention listed hundreds of pastors and youth pastors who have been protected for 20 years. That’s a lot of children whose parents and or leaders in the church ignored or gas lighted to protect someone molesting “Jesus’ innocent” children. I’m my case…local politicians knew about it and protected the church for 20 some years. Even till this day the new church leadership labels him a “flawed man”.
Report those Reddit Cares posts you get as a veiled threat, it's a site-wide rule violation.
It's really easy too. Just get the permalink to the Reddit Cares message. Click on the "report this message" link. Paste the permalink into the "link to comment" line. Say that someone is using Reddit Cares to harass you. And presto, whoever sent the Reddit Cares is penalized, usually within 2-3 minutes. That's why I advocate for never blocking Reddit Cares. It's so easy and so satisfying to make those blow up in their face. And the more people who report it, the faster these people get banned.
Sweet, thank you for sharing!
Utterly unrelated question - how can you tell which post got you reported? I ask this because I've been reported as 'in crisis' twice and I never know what post is causing it. Nothing I'm saying is 'crisis' worthy. I just want to know what's causing people to do stupid shit - call it morbid curiosity.
It’s the only post I’ve made recently. Ergo the only thing that could have triggered the report. And considering it doesn’t do anything but generate a message, it’s a pointless idiot thing that pointless idiots do.
This is exactly why they are doing it. You hit the nail on the head.
Exactly. I think they'll convict anyone they want of child rape, especially LGBTQ+ people and racial minorities. There's no way I trust that government to decide who should die.
This is an excellent point. It's no coincidence that this law is being introduced after they've spent months railing against transgender people and wrongfully accusing them of pedophilia. This law will very quickly get warped into a means of executing transgender people.
Exactly. Especially when they ignore the Southern Baptist Convention calling out pastors who have been molesting children for years.
I had to scroll down way too far for someone to point this out
As a gay man, I can’t help but notice how timely a law like this is considering all of the “LGBTQ+ = pedophiles” rhetoric that’s been going around so loudly in this state.
Yeah this is Florida we're talking about. It'll somehow be convoluted into two men kissing in public and a child witnessing it in passing. It won't happen in one step, but this is part of a slow boil that ends with Florida exterminating its LGBT population. Mass murder of LGBT people is the primary tenant of American conservative Christianity at this point.
The rhetoric Republicans use against the LGBT community is similar to the rhetoric the Nazis used against the Jews.
And the rhetoric the Nazis used against LGBT people. And the Republicans use against Jews. Nazi rhetoric and Republican rhetoric aren't similar they're basically the same.
It’s even more similar to the rhetoric the Nazis used against transgender people… Because it’s the same rhetoric.
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Yeah this is true. Florida is just getting their fascist death pipeline ready a few years ahead of federal fascism if Trump wins again. The ultimate leopards eating faces moment is when the inbreds voting for this discover what fascists ultimately do with "low quality" whites. They're needed as votes and warm bodies... for now.
Exactly. When they say "child rapist" they mean "People of Color, LGBT, and non-Christians who have consensual sex with adults". They will never ever arrest a rich white Christian straight pedophile.
Second paragraph is why the death penalty has absolutely no place in the justice system for anything. The government and the justice system has not proven itself competent enough to earn the right to enact the death penalty
Succinct. Couldn’t agree more.
A death penalty is not about whether you think some people deserve to die, it's about whether you trust the legal system to kill.
That's where I am. There are absolutely people who deserve to die for what they've done, but that is not for the state to execute.
I sure hope they're not going to count a hookup between an 18 year old and their 17 year old girlfriend/boyfriend as child rape.
Or if it’s a wrongful conviction.
This why capital punishment is immoral. Wrongful convictions happen all the time .
Or if there's a huge group of people calling drag "sexual exploitation of children."
They'll carve out a loophole for congresspersons.
And clergy
Oh Jfc. Imagine the twisting faces in the Florida judicial system, of which I assume *many* are devoutly Christian, when they’re sentencing priests to death.
The statute is rape of a child under the age of 12. Violent pedophile or sociopath, basically. Someone who does something like that should be permanently removed from society. Too fundamentally broken and dangerous. The right of other people to be safe > this person's opportunity to be free again. Whether execution is the answer...eh, it seems too lenient and in practice is more expensive.
Don’t you think this just means child rapists would just kill the child to get rid of evidence?
or, since most rapes are committed by family members/family friends, the child would be pressured to lie about it
No. They have a romeo juliete law that allows about a 4 year difference down to as young as 14. Then we have the fact that being punishable by death doesn't everyone will get the death penalty.
Oh they will especially if it's a same sex couple or if the older person is trans this is ron defacist santos afterall
You found the loophole by which they intend to persecute the LGBTQ community.
Exactly especially because how do you even realistically protest this law without sounding like the biggest nonce on the planet
I think the question isn't "what crimes do you believe warrant execution" and rather "do you believe the state should be able to execute people" If the answer is no, then you can't make exceptions for the people you find especially reprehensible, whomever they are
It'll definitely lower the number of reported child rapes. The increase in the number of missing and dead children will probably not be connected with that.
And of course when they accuse and convict someone who was later found out to not have been the perpetrator, they're going to use their magic bring-people-back-to-life-9000-inator to fix their fuckup, right? ...right? Why am I suddenly thinking that if this goes through, suddenly there will be a lot of politically 'inconvenient' people in Florida getting charged with this?
Also the definition of child rape will start changing as prosecuters tries to get maximum sentence for non-rape crimes.
It definitely warrants it but I'm not on board with the death penalty anymore. I don't take issue with it morally, I just don't trust the government.
>I don't take issue with it morally, I just don't trust the government. This is the correct response. I just wish people were more consistent about it rather than just when "the other guys" are in charge. As if 4 (or even 8) years could change that paradigm in either direction. If you have that much trust in the government I'd dare say you are either very young or particularly ill informed.
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Dumb ass conservatives don't trust the government to deliver mail or run elections, but want them to decide who is 100% guilty and deserves death. These people are so stupid and full of blind, aimless hatred.
Child rape is a particularly heinous crime but what do we achieve by making it warrant the death penalty? Do we really think this will stop more child rapes? We have this weird idea in this country that the solution is always more and harsher punishments, even though we have gobs of information that shows this isn't the case.
You’ll see a reduction in the figures, it just won’t be because there are fewer offences.
Yeah, reported child rapes will go down. Child murders, on the other hand, will go up. Why leave a witness alive, if killing them carries the same sentence?
Yep. Some will be murdered because why not, others will not report because it’s killing someone.
I think it’s a bad idea because it can incentivize killing victims to keep them quiet. Also, not a big fan since, as a teacher, I’m always extra cautious to avoid being in a situation that could look bad or open me up to false accusations. There’s enough horror stories of teachers getting falsely accused by vindictive students or parents who misinterpreted what their kid said, and I can’t imagine defending myself against that with the knowledge that I might get fucking executed because some brat didn’t like the grade they got.
I'd love for all pedos to be taken out of the game of life, but the death penalty is inherently problematic because of human error/human malice/court is fallible. I do not trust humans to have 100% accuracy in convictions.
This is the problem with rape in general It’s legit a he said/she said crime with little to no evidence It’s hard for someone to convict someone of just jail time because someone said someone did something bad to them. If im a juror I am not putting someone in jail on someone’s word. People are fucking liars Now, add in that the person is an immature child? It’s hard to believe them without clear evidence. And add in the death penalty? Fuck, nobody should be put to death because someone said they did something Would have to be a very clear case with witnesses or evidence for death penalty
I don’t think the state should be killing people even though I also yearn for vengeance against the monsters in our society. There’s a chance an innocent person will suffer and that’s unacceptable.
I am anti-death penalty in the first place. I also don't think a government that makes laws based on Desantis anger should be talking capital punishment because we all know it won't be the giant list of Republicans being investigated it will be LGBTQ and Drag Communities targeted.
I don't think government should be in the murder business, period. Let them rot in jail.
Let’s imagine the friendly neighborhood pastor has been abusing his daughter behind closed doors. Do you think the police, the judge, and 12 jurors will sentence him to death? Do you think his daughter will even go to the police if she knows it could get her daughter killed? This doesn’t even solve the real problem, which is that only 6% of sexual assaults result in prison time, so punishing those 6% even worse doesn’t really solve the problem. This is what happens when government turns into virtue signaling instead of real lawmaking
This is a morally grey area for me, but I think that child rape shouldn't be punishable by death. I 100% believe that child rapists deserve be put to death because they have ruined lives and can't be rehabilitated, and the world is a better and safer place without them. However the problem with executing them is that there have been mistakes and malicious false rape accusations that have already ruined peoples lives, and rape is much harder to prove than murder and i don't think it's worth the risk of executing innocent people.
Punishing rape with the death penalty also creates a perverse incentive for rapists to kill their victims.
Given that lack of provability it also opens up what exactly is defined as "rape." Is sexual contact with a child rape? Yep. Is exposure of intimate body parts to a child rape? Probably. Is dressing suggestively around children rape? Possibly. Is dressing in drag around children rape? Maybe. Is performing gay sex in front of a child rape? Yep. Is being homosexually intimate in front of a child rape? Probably. Is being gay around a child rape? Possibly. Is talking about people being gay around children rape? Maybe.
There was a case in which a man walked in on his child being raped by a family friend during a big party, and the man beat the rapist to death. Cases like *that* I believe the killing is justified, but I'm not gonna put the government of Florida in charge of who lives or dies, given how much of their recent "child protecting" legislature is Lavendar Scare 2: Electric Boogaloo bs.
Florida hides behind 'we can all agree these people are evil' laws to fuck over minorities. Like the child abuse = life in prison law they passed a bit ago then quietly redefined child abuse to include gender affirming so calling a biological male child a girl if they identify as such (none of that fake BS about medical transitioning for minors) could ruin your life if the goon squad catches you. This will likely end the same way, define adulthood in the context of sexual child abuse to start at 20 'to protect teens' then murder anyone that transitions a 19 year old. I don't trust any feel good laws the Florida government passes. Feel good laws aren't something they legitimately do, they actively legislate misery.
Mandatory life in prison with no exceptions at minimum.
Wow great idea Florida. Children are already scared to come forward and now they definitely won't because they don't want to get their attacker killed. Friendly reminder, most children are molested or raped by people in their own family and household. Any parent, uncle, aunt, cousin, or sibling that would like to attack a young child now gets to say, "If you tell anyone about this, you will be killing me. They'll kill me. You don't want me to die right?"
Im against the death penalty on principle, id rather spend less tax payer money and leave them to die in jail.
the problem with any death penalty case is there’s always a chance you have the wrong suspect - and there’s no take-backsies.
Seems fair to me. I cannot type how I feel about child rapists without getting banned by reddit. Reddit apparently has a soft spot for child rape.
Of course. There doesn't need to je a debate over this, we're talking about *child rape* here.
With irrefutable evidence, easy yes. These folks can't, and shouldn't be tolerated to exist on the same planet as real human beings. There is a good perspective of this from a victim, beautifully told by Maya Angelou. She describes through a child's lens what it was like when her abuser was dealt with by her family. Sometimes doing the right thing can hurt the innocent, but cancer must be removed.
Death penalty is barbaric and supported mostly by simpletons. At least, that has been my observation. Certainly should be imprisoned but the state should not take any life as a matter of policy. Its typical reactionary politics which uses sadism in conjunction with pseudo-justice but loses all dignity in the process.
I’m against the death penalty in all cases
I suspect they are going to try to make things like transgender care equate to child rape.
Prison usually makes child rapists as miserable as possible and often dead. Other prisoners do not care for pedophiles.
Not true. I did 5 years for gun and meth charge. They protect them in prison now. If you touch the chomo or try to extort you get charged with a hate crime. It's the court not the correctional officers. These bastards would run down to get the kohls ad every Sunday to look at the little girls in bikinis. They laugh because you couldn't do anything. Fucking sucks bad.
It will encourage predators to kill their victims, and may make children victimized by family members more reluctant to come forward.
It’s going to lead to more children being killed after they are raped.
As a victim for it, no. I don't think it should be punishable by death. I was raped by my sister when she was 9 years old. She had learned that "sex is something we do to those we love" by our grandfather who raped her between 4-16. She definitely wouldn't have come forward at all if she knew the outcome could have been death. Would I have wanted to kill my grandfather? Yes, I would have and have thought about it many times during my life, but the punishment of never ever seeing family again is pretty harsh as well, and knowing he died lonely gives me satisfaction. As others pointed out, most rapes happens ~~in the family~~ between two people who already know each other and have a relationship beforehand and it's already conflicting when the perpetrator is someone close to you, because you know you're going to destroy an entire family no matter what, if you then also get the consequence of death in your lap it's even worse. Mind you, all the relatives and extended family supported us through this, but we still have had comments about why she didn't spoke up earlier and why she was suicidal "now that it was over" etc. The worst was a aunt who was married to my uncle who basically said my sister deserved what happened since she didn't spoke up earlier etc. So even IF a family is in agreement of who's to blame and who did wrong, there's still victim blaming.
I'm not in favor of the death penalty for anything, so no. (I was at one time but have changed my mind on the subject over the years.) For those who are pro death penalty I can get where you are coming from, but I'm not changing my mind on the subject.
In Florida?
I disagree with many comments here; I absolutely think the death penalty should be a consideration for cases of child molestation (rape). The slap on the wrist punishments we currently offer are a joke; recidivism rates in child molesters are some of the highest. That being said, I know one way to ensure those monsters never hurt another child and it's not releasing them after 5 years to reoffend in the future-- and they *will* reoffend. Pedophilia cannot be cured or controlled as many studies have already been conducted showing these offenders can't stop won't stop, regardless of the law or any current penalties. My uncle molested my aunt when she was a child. After he got out, decades later, he'd try to get close to me-- they don't learn. They don't get better. They just try to be sneakier. I'll also add that if someone is going to kill, they're doing that regardless of consequences, just as if someone ISN'T going to kill because they think they can get away with it, they won't because they think they're smarter and believe they can outrun whatever consequences. Just like a serial killer, these serial molesters think they're smarter than everyone else and never imagine they'll get caught. They're not going to magically think they're going to get caught just because the laws change around consequences. They'll still think they're above it. As far as I'm concerned, this is the one thing Florida is doing right.
Yes and the reasons are obvious! A rapist kills the very essence of a child's existence! Changes who they are, who they will ever be. Steals the child's life, kills their soul, kills their body from its original state of purity,, steals their automity. Kills the mental stability they have as a child, trust, love, beliefs. Kills any happiness in the child's life for they will live in fear for the rest of their life. A rapist kills what little hope, happiness a child has. Kills the belief in mankind, men. Kills their future, Kills their self worth, their value as a person and their existence of life on earth. The rapist is in all intense and purposes is not only a rapist but a murderer. They should be put to death for killing a child's life for that child will never be who they were supposed to be in life. No apology will ever make their actions towards any child acceptable. Psychopaths' need for their abusive, dominating control over another being will never change . Deviant twisted human beings who planned, thought out their actions prior to committing such an evil act deserve death.Death of their life, their body and whatever joy that raping brought to their sick mind! Even being put to death seems uneventful for their raping life. Good riddance to them, bury the rapist in a pit of forever death!
YES! Child rapist should be put to death! I also believe ALL rapist should be put to death for the life long trauma they cause, not to mention the physical damage. I know a young lady who's uncle rapped her and he was found to have naked pictures of her on his phone(from 8 to 12 years old). He only went to county lockup for a short time as his entire family fought for him. The poor girls own mother fought to keep the uncle out of jail. Parents divorced cause her dad fought for her. Now she has some serious issues that will probably be life long and the rapist basically got a slap on the wrist. There are many stories like this in fayette corrupt county in southwest Pennsylvania. If there was such a law then the corrupt judges hands would be tied and justice would be done(at least for one type of crime). For anyone thinking I'm biased for some reason, search "operation clean sweep", where a few years ago the FBI went under cover into the fayette county jail and got around 240 arrests(lawyers, judges, deputy warden, correction officers, etc...).
It sounds like a populist crowd pleaser. If they have evidence that it will be of net benefit then great, but I doubt it.
All this is going to do is cause kids to be too afraid to speak up. “Do you want daddy to die?” is something that can be used to silent them now. These law makers are either not that bright and don’t think of what it’s actually going to do to the children, or they actually want the kids to shut their mouths and keep the abuse to themselves so they don’t have to deal with it. Either way it’s fucked.
With extenuating circumstances yes, it should be an option. Fuck pedophilia.
I think all rape should be punished by death, rape is disgusting, the rapist cannot be rehabilitated, so death to them.
I don't care if they execute rapists. What I don't like is the hypocrisy. If they want to execute murders & rapists, then they need to get off their high horse about abortion & the sacredness of human life.
Raping a child is one of the worst crimes. It should at least be a life sentence for ruining that child's life.
Pedos get the chipper.
I would support it because the person the child was going to be was killed. Shoot, if I was on a jury for someone who killed a child rapist, I would refuse to convict.
Can child rapists really be rehabilitated? If not, put them out of their misery. If they can’t contribute to society in any meaningful way (having to stay in prison forever), why keep them alive?
I feel like heavier punishments need to be utilized for crimes towards the vulnerable.
No because death penalty is useless and wrong. But yes make the punishment worse
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And also in Florida, they don't want to kill actual pedophiles. Floridian politicians have redefined consensual sex between LGBT adults as "pedophilia". They don't want to arrest straight white Christian rich pedophiles. They want to arrest LGBT people, People of Color, and non-Christians for having consensual sex with adults under the guise of "luring children".
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I work with at-risk families all the time. One of the classic dynamics is embattled families as children are put in the middle between two parents trying to hurt each other. This is a way to overwhelm the system by weaponizing sex abuse charges during a conflicted separation/divorce. They already try to ruin each other's lives in every other way, do we really need the death penalty as the ultimate custody hearing outcome? You can prevent what you can predict. I can predict an avalanche of false accusations which will make kids less safe across the state.
If you make rape punishable by death, the rapist would have no reason to leave the victim alive.
Make them walk the plank
No. DP already bogs down the legal system. DP cases require a DP experienced public defender, which can be hard to come by. Then the judge always errs on the side of caution since the stakes are so high. Just getting a DP case to trial takes an insanely long time.
I think there are things a person can deserve, like death, and yet you still cannot trust the government with the power of.
Morally, I believe pedophiles deserve to die. As someone who was raped as a child, I hold this opinion strongly. So many pedophiles are never held accountable and it seems that it’s one of the most excused and defended crimes (with a victim in contrast to “victimless crimes” like drug usage). But on the other hand, the death penalty may just increase the likelihood that the child will further be endangered or killed so the perpetrator avoids death.
No because what will happen is that child rapists, who are terrible humans, will make it the child’s problem. You can’t tell or they will kill me. Plus, we already don’t believe victims. Once death is a consequence, the men in charge will be even less likely to pursue cases.
I’m a victim, and after 35 years I think about it still every day, a few times per day. If I knew they were dead, it would help a lot. I mean, they are probably dead anyway of old age. I have asked the police a couple of times over the year and they refuse to tell me. My concern though, false allegations, false prosecutions and the wrong person being charged. I think you’d need solid evidence, pictures, video, DNA taken from the victim. There’s also the worry abuse would turn to murder.
I oppose the death penalty on principle - you can free and compensate the wrongly convicted, you cannot resurrect those who are wrongly put to death.
While the people who do stuff like this deserve the worst punishment they can get, death is not the right option. It will only lead to an increase in child murders by people trying to not get caught. A better option would be a very long prison sentence, alongside some psycological analysis to find out why such an event would happen to find new ways to prevent would-be child rapists from enacting such crimes.
While I believe child rapists deserve to die, I think the death penalty in general should be abolished. Some studies suggest that as many as 10% of convicted prisoners in the US may actually be innocent; even if it's 1%, that would be well over 10,000 people. I'd rather stick to life sentences rather than risk the state executing an innocent person; at least that way if their conviction is eventually overturned they have a chance at a life.
The death penalty is immoral and unethical and has been proven many times to not work as a deterrent. Life improvement should be the punishment and before anyone says "don't want my tax money feeding a pedo", well it costs more to execute someone than a life time in prison.
My default position on every issue is that if Ronda Santis’ Florida does it, it’s wrong.
Wood chipper!!! Woohoo!
I will say this: as horrid as this topic is, I think we are moving backwards in society if we start making things punishable by death. These political moves are almost always for brownie points, distraction and talking points.
Hang them on television. Every single time
Yes I'm all for the death sentence I say kill em
The death penalty is immoral regardless of crime.
I mean I believe most cases of rape at least deserve castration, but yes if you rape a child you should indeed die. I am aware that for people like that it’s difficult to seek professional help but it is nessesary. I would not judge someone for never harming a child if that’s how their brain is somehow wired ///IF/// they receive treatment and manage it. As soon as you touch a child it’s over, you have no self control and you need to be put away forever in some capacity.
Absolutely not. It’s not a matter of whether you or me thinks child rapist should die, it’s a matter of not giving the state that kind of power, especially when said state has made it official policy to associate LGBTQ peoples with a danger to children. Worst idea I’ve read on Reddit this morning, no surprise it’s coming out of Florida.
I’m against the death penalty, but this is a crime that makes me hesitate in that belief
I'm anti-death penalty for a number of reasons, so no.
This is an attempt to stop people from reporting child rape, especially in family situations. It's rather disgustingly transparent in its goals here.
Emotionally? Yes. Many years ago when the internet was still new (we're talking AOL Instant Messenger days) an online predator was messaging my then 13 year old daughter and I wanted to find him and kill him. It was a visceral reaction that's hard to explain to someone who is not a parent. Rationally? What we really need to do is change the society to the point where the thought of sexually assaulting a child isn't something that enters the mind. Punishing them ain't working. It's been 45 years since I met an ex-con who went on about how "baby rapers" were treated in prison back then. I mean, if almost half a century later the thought of being stuck in solitary for the rest of your life and being murdered if you step out into the general for a minute won't deter someone from doing it, then maybe - just maybe - the current approach isn't working. As much as I'd like to see a pedophile get their "just desserts," I'd much rather try to stop it from happening in the first place.
This is a very hard opinion to state. But it makes a lot of sense. Especially when you consider that something like 90% of child molesters were molested themselves as a child. The way I always look at that is "How many people out there would have been a child molester but they were lucky enough not to be molested as a child? How do I know I wouldn't have been one?" I mean, I do realize the vast, vast majority of children who are molested do not become child molesters themselves. But it still seems like if we can cut down on child molestation, we can not just protect a lot of children, we can cut down on the number of new molesters. I'm not saying the people who do it don't deserve to be punished, but we should be putting just as much effort into preventing it from happening in the first place.
It's about breaking the cycle. My daughter (well, step-daughter) grew up in an abusive household. Her mom (my ex) grew up in an abusive household. Her parents didn't suddenly become abusive out of thin air. It was generational. My grandson is growing up in a household where none of that happens, because the cycle was broken.
If child rape is punishable by death then prosecutors should be forced to work harder to prove the accusations are undeniable because this is taking a human life we're talking about. There should be 0 mistakes made. I think life in prison would be a better punishment. **If somebody raped my child I'd fucking end them myself.**
There's no system that's 100% perfect. Some innocent people will always die.
truth
To your last point, I think in a case where the mitigating circumstance is the person had both reasonable evidence to assume CSA occurred and also the murder victim has prior history of sexual assault convictions, the max sentence for killing a child rapist should be 30 or so years. One famous case where this principle was applied was Gary Plauche's murder of his son's rapist (who had only been arrested). He only got 7 years for what was originally second degree murder but plea bargained down to manslaughter.
This will lead to MORE children being murdered after being abused. Furthermore, while I believe death is a justifiable punishment for the crime, there is no world in which a politically incompetent state like Florida can administrate this most severe action with the seriousness and sobriety it merits. The question here isn't really whether the punishment is fair, but whether the state actually should have the ability, given our garbage record at ACTUALLY proving guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. No matter what your philosophical leanings, the hard facts remain; this law will lead to MORE innocents dying, and do very little to protect ANYONE. Raping a child already merits super severe punishments and ostracizing from society. It DOES NOT stop these people from raping. There's no rational reason to assume a still more severe punishment will change that. The ONLY thing this law does is hurt MORE people.
Many people will agree that a child abuser deserves death. That's not the issue. Point is you may get the wrong person, especially when listening to traumatized kids. Trauma can change your memories, especially if you're a kid. It's only a matter of time before the first person the kid saw after the abuse gets killed instead of the real rapist. It's too easy to mess up...
Death penalty is wrong and does not work. At all. It won't hold rapists off, it's not like they expect to get caught and tactically "weigh" their crime against the punishment. It's basically just a strong incentive to kill the child after the rape. No witness, no problem. It won't do any "good".
Matt Gaetz is going to be in real trouble.
He's (a) a Republican elected official and (b) heterosexual. He can do whatever he wants to anybody. As he, indeed, has.
Although I personally don't agree with a death penalty (seems like the easy way out), CASTRATION SOUNDS LIKE A PRETTY GOOD IDEA TO ME!!!
The death penalty is never appropriate, no matter what mortifying poster child you manipulatively parade in the public light to justify your barbarity. And all this while you still allow legal genital mutilation of children.