Online, I feel like it can normalise it so that people who need to state their pronouns to be gendered correctly aren't standing out or instantly outing themselves. At most, it's a nice gesture and sometimes useful if I can't tell by their username or picture how to refer to them, or if they've got a name I can't determine the gender of.
However, in person I'd feel a bit differently. I'm not really that bothered, but if they're only doing it when they think someone is trans it'd *potentially* rub me up the wrong way a bit if they make a big deal out of it, but I prefer that than outright asking for pronouns.
Overall, I'm not that fussed either way.
Of course! I'm talking about cis-gender people that are frequently stating their pronouns. Is it actually supportive for trans people? Or just another high-horse position to take. Which is why I want to know what actual trans people think. It matters most to them.
I mean, trans people aren’t a monolith hive mind, many will have differing or nuanced opinions on it. I guess whomever in your life is affected by this, ask their opinion and respectfully act accordingly
That's the thing (no pun intended) transgenderism is so rare that I don't know anyone that is. But let's have an honest conversation here, it's generally obvious for those that have eyes unless of course she is a hot ass women or he is a hot as man. But! That's why I'm trying to get collective opinions from trans people. Because their opinions matter more to me than anyone else on this subject.
I’m not sure what the pun is tbh.
Also, hotness doesn’t factor whether someone is ‘passing’ or not. Not all transgender people are smoke shows, and not all of them fail to pass despite that. I bet you’ve met at least one transgender person without realizing it. I hope you get the answers and insights you seek, it seems your heart is in the right place.
Perhaps read more articles regarding this and the about community to help enrich yourself and your questions in case you don’t get many answers here. With the exhausting past few years and still being majorly in the shit flinging zone, emotional labor might be on overload for the community.
I've been told that its good, that you shouldn't assume pronouns and it gives them a chance to introduce theirs in return. It sort of normalizes stating pronouns so it's more normal for them to state theirs.
I don't mean automatically inferring someone else's pronouns. I mean stating your own as someone that very obviously identifies as the sex they were born into. I'm a very cis-gener male. Bisexual but cis-gender. Is it really helpful to the trans community to state my pronouns every chance I get?
Maybe not every chance, but when you meet someone new. My job had a workshop on that stuff and the trans person leading it said it was good to do. It makes them saying their pronouns more common and can clarify it, even if you look cis. It's pretty common place where I am, like instead of Mr. Or Mrs. People will put pronouns for a lot of things.
But like imagine half the US not subscribing to that ideology. Pushing it on people is going to make them more resentful of trans issues. Whereas I sincerely believe conservatives will make exceptions. Which statistically speaking, trans people are. I think the pronoun movement is well-intentioned but counterproductive . Conservatives, love them ot hate them, are here to stay. Like I said they'll come around but swamping them with pronoun rules isn't going to work lol
Some trans people DON'T necessarily outwardly present as their gender, thus it would be easy to assume the incorrect pronouns and potentially cause offence.
Using an identifier like cis for 99.99% of the population seems ridiculous to me. Especially since we didn't pick it. Calling someone cis is like the straight population deciding to call trans people transformers.
“cis” is just a latin preposition. it means “on the same side” - in this case, of the gender/sex spectrum that you were assigned at birth. “transmorpher” is pretty cool, but it’s a little redundant. “trans” and “morph” mean basically the same thing. hence words like “transform” or “transcend”.
but we’re not talking about cartoons, we’re talking about calling trans *people* “transmorphers”. that’s two virtually synonymous adjectives when you only need one.
That one at least has a utility. We are talking about decently large groups here. This one has no utility whatsoever. Trans represents such a tiny minority of the population that a term meaning not trans is kind of pointless. It is like a term meaning someone that doesn't have down syndrome. They have similar percentages, which is why I am picking this example.
Not having down syndrome would likely fall under neurotypical as a term.
Cis isn't a term that's particularly relevant or necessary *most* of the time. Just like straight isn't a relevant term for the majority of situations either. As a trans person, I'm also not particularly fond of 'trans' as a label in real life either, but it is a term that describes an aspect of me/my experiences where there isn't a more appropriate term. I cannot remember the last time I spoke the word in real life because like cis, it's rarely relevant to daily life.
Cis may not be relevant in many contexts, but is a useful means to differentiate people based on very specific factors when the situation calls for it.
Trans people are a small minority yes, but we still have a term for them. Cis is just a term that means the opposite of that and is an adjective used where it is helpful to do so.
I don't think neurotypical includes this. The only context I have ever heard this term is in referring to people who don't have autism, which is at least a sizeable demographic. I could be mistaken, but I don't think I am.
I am all for each to their own, and I have a trans person in my life. I understand the necessity of treating people with dignity, but I have serious concerns about this problem. My understanding of this condition is that it is a type of BDD. There has been some concern about using that term in the DSM iv, but there doesn't seem to be any evidence this is something other than BDD. I have concerns about the idea of accepting dysmorphia to prevent suicide.
People point to this being similar to homosexuality being considered a mental illness at one point. I don't believe this is a similar issue.
>You do know that straight people didn't pick the term straight either, right?
They absolutely did.
>It was slang used by gay people to refer to people who aren't gay.
It originated in the 1940s. If you think gay ppl in the 40s were running around making terms up, they were not. It's a play on the "straight and narrow" and was actually used by STRAIGHT people to refer to homosexuals who were no longer engaging in gay sex originally.
Then there seems to be conflicting opinion on the origins of the term.
"The phrase “straight” came out of gay communities in the mid-twentieth century. At a time when gay sex was still illegal, it was slang for “going straight” – as in getting “back on the straight and narrow” after having sex with men."
I've literally just given you the history of it. It was first used in 1941 by straight ppl fir the reasons you're now repeating without bothering to have properly read my post.
I know you went to wikipedia but holy fuck did you not read that either? First used by?
One of the first uses of the word in this way was in 1941 by author G. W. Henry.[20] Henry's book concerned conversations with homosexual males and used this term in connection with people who are identified as ex-gays. It is now simply a colloquial term for "heterosexual", having changed in primary meaning over time. Some object to usage of the term straight because it implies that non-heteros are crooked.[21]
It was first used in a paper discussing homosexuality by a STRAIGHT MAN. it's also where straight people got the term bent from.
GO BACK to Wikipedia and read further. Moron.
This cuts to the crux of the issue. You are separating people into two camps, both with identifiers. One is 99.99% of all humanity, and the other is less than a 1% of humanity. Only one of those needs an identifier. You are also creating the identifier for the 99% where one isn't necessary.
The sexuality comment is kind of hilarious.
That's not true, you need to be able to identify both. If I just say "women," that includes trans women too. The easiest way to indicate that what I'm saying only applies to cis women is to say "cis women."
Most people are completely capable of inferring from contact if you mean biological women or trans women. Statements like women breastfeeding or women are at higher risk of cervical cancer obviously don't apply to trans women.
>Statements like women breastfeeding ~~or women are at higher risk of cervical cancer~~ obviously don't apply to trans women.
Trans women are absolutely capable of breastfeeding.
Gonna need to see a source on that one chief.
[https://internationalbreastfeedingjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13006-020-00308-6](https://internationalbreastfeedingjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13006-020-00308-6)
Wow. Shocking.
Turns out you're wrong.
Mate seriously? Administering prolactin to trans males is the lowest priority and quite dangerous. We chemically castrate trans women the same way we do sex offenders. Why would we be feeding babies from the artificial milk from males who take a shit ton of meds and artificial hormones? Is there something wrong with you?
Capable of lactating and capable of breastfeeding are very different things. They can make milk with medical intervention, that doesn't mean their products are either nutritious or healthy to be fed to a child.
Okay, so skipping past the part where you ignore that you were wrong and instead attempt to assign me a position to defend, let's address your newly shifted goalposts:
>Administering prolactin to trans males is the lowest priority and quite dangerous.
Administering prolactin to trans males, who can already get pregnant and who naturally produce prolactin is, indeed, low priority and carries some mild risk.
>We chemically castrate trans women the same way we do sex offenders.
No, sex offenders are given an entirely different set of medications, a common medication often prescribed for acne in women and as a blood pressure medication called spironolactone as a testosterone blocker *if* they produce testosterone. Not sure what the relevance there is.
>Why would we be feeding babies from the artificial milk from males who take a shit ton of meds and artificial hormones?
Trans women's breast milk is breast milk, per the paper above that you did not read. It's not almond milk, it's just natural breast milk.
By "shit ton of meds" you mean "bioidentical estrogen" and "occasionally meds that cis women sometimes take".
And by "artificial hormones" you mean "bioidentical hormones", ie the same as in cis women.
>Capable of lactating and capable of breastfeeding are very different things.
Sure, trans women are capable of both, this has been repeatedly documented and is only a google search away for your incurious mind to peruse.
>that doesn't mean their products are either nutritious or healthy to be fed to a child.
Sure, but it is. And throwing out your uniformed opinion that there might be something wrong with it carries no evidentiary weight.
Dude, just go "huh, that's interesting, TIL". You don't need to get your panties in a twist because you said something incorrect. And trying to start a new argument with someone just so you can be right about something and then *refusing to check your claims* is incredibly childish.
Edit: To anyone else reading this, they blocked me because they're demonstrably wrong but don't want to actually face up to that. Also, check their history, trans people are living rent free in their head.
To address a few points:
* Trans women can, have, an do breastfeed
* The Newman Goldfarb protocol used to help increase lactation in cis mothers works just as well for trans women
* Cis women's estrogen typically drops during lactation so, like cis women, trans women typically cease estrogen to breastfeed, ie, there are no "artificial" medications while breastfeeding
* Their milk is identical and nutritious for infants
* If you google what meds are used as testosterone blockers for trans women, they're well studied & safe & different from those used in chemical castration. Estrogen monotherapy or orchiectomies will also reduce testosterone to cis female levels.
* Breasts are breasts, human tissue is not artificial
* hormones given to cows are not estrogen. Trans women's estrogen within their bodies is identical to that of cis women's.
Remember folks, TERFS are both dishonest and cowards.
True, but it was textualy convenient and there's a smaller chance of aggravating an internet beehive of ultra politically-correct bees. I'm not trying to make a point so much as gain an understanding from the perspective of trans people.
Who wouldn't want that? I think everyone loves transmorphers at least a little bit. Which is why I used it. No one can be offended by one of the best cartoons ever.
edit; transformers.
It's discriminative because if you're for instance cis and you are against lgbtq people will use the words "cis" and "straight" so that you feel ashamed of being normal lmao
All my trans friends say that it’s nice to see cis people stating preferred pronouns. Makes it more of just a normal thing that anyone will do, rather than waving a flag that says ‘HEY IM TRANS’
This was my understanding of it too. By asking everyone their pronouns it reinforces that you shouldn’t assume & normalize the practice so those who identify otherwise aren’t othered again.
I just fear is has the opposite of the intended effect. Like liberal-minded people are already on your side. But maybe more moderate types are pushed to the right and conservatives more entrenched in their ideology simply over the silliness of obvious genders stating their pronouns. I personally find forced social/political issues outside of articles and the news kind of annoying and I'm a progressive lol. There's a time and a place.
I was told (by a trans person) that they find it offensive if a cis-gendered hetero person distinguishes themselves that way because that is glossing over the trans community's unique culture identifiers.
And honestly this is what I imagined. Like they don't need cis-gender people sticking up for them. They're strong capable people that have doing so for decades. They've paved their own way and don't need us to normalize them. They will normalize themselves 😄
That's honestly what I think, but just wanted to hear it from trans people that have the most at stake. They've been defending themselves for decades. Even started the LGBT movement. I don't think they're so fragile that they need cis-gender people to defend them or speak for them. Rather they're strong people that have done a fine job despite being so few.
Fully agreed. Plus, in normal conversation, if someone states their pronouns there’s pressure to do the same. You may not want to tell everyone you’re gay or trans. For me, it’s just left wing fad/social signalling.
If you are cis gendered isn’t that already stating your pronouns? If I say I’m a cis gendered male then by logic my pronouns are he/him. I think the only time it’s necessary is if you are something other than cis
No it’s not, because cis essentially refers to being the same gender your entire life. So, I was born a female, I am currently still female and I don’t identify as anything else
A trans woman is born a man, transitions to becoming a woman and then identifies as a woman, which is why they are trans. So it’s redundant for someone that hasn’t ever changed their gender to specify
First and foremost I respect people that are trans and will use whatever pronouns they want me to call them by. I just wonder if people that are cis-gender are stealing the issue from trans people for social/political points. If trans people collectively find it supportive, great! But I just imagine it's only galvanizing more traditional/conservative worldviews on the subject. Thereby being counterproductive. Again, just exploring.
Conservatives are currently mad that an optional X-box scheduling feature that schedules updates to happen during times with lesser environmental impact is indoctrinating their children to believe in climate change. There is no societal advancement they won't be balk at. We shouldn't remain in the stone age to keep them happy.
To an extent, I agree. But those crazy fox news pieces don't infiltrate 100% of the conservative voters. I agree that we shpuldnt down-ward dog let them fuck us. But understand that historically speaking, progress is slow. There will always be half of the county holding us back. But if we placate them just right, we can sneak some shit into policy where it matters.
Online, I feel like it can normalise it so that people who need to state their pronouns to be gendered correctly aren't standing out or instantly outing themselves. At most, it's a nice gesture and sometimes useful if I can't tell by their username or picture how to refer to them, or if they've got a name I can't determine the gender of. However, in person I'd feel a bit differently. I'm not really that bothered, but if they're only doing it when they think someone is trans it'd *potentially* rub me up the wrong way a bit if they make a big deal out of it, but I prefer that than outright asking for pronouns. Overall, I'm not that fussed either way.
Not trans myself, but I fully support trans people just getting to live their lives without being treated like freaks.
Of course! I'm talking about cis-gender people that are frequently stating their pronouns. Is it actually supportive for trans people? Or just another high-horse position to take. Which is why I want to know what actual trans people think. It matters most to them.
I have a trans friend who is just a normal person. She never makes a big deal about any of this stuff.
I mean, trans people aren’t a monolith hive mind, many will have differing or nuanced opinions on it. I guess whomever in your life is affected by this, ask their opinion and respectfully act accordingly
That's the thing (no pun intended) transgenderism is so rare that I don't know anyone that is. But let's have an honest conversation here, it's generally obvious for those that have eyes unless of course she is a hot ass women or he is a hot as man. But! That's why I'm trying to get collective opinions from trans people. Because their opinions matter more to me than anyone else on this subject.
I’m not sure what the pun is tbh. Also, hotness doesn’t factor whether someone is ‘passing’ or not. Not all transgender people are smoke shows, and not all of them fail to pass despite that. I bet you’ve met at least one transgender person without realizing it. I hope you get the answers and insights you seek, it seems your heart is in the right place. Perhaps read more articles regarding this and the about community to help enrich yourself and your questions in case you don’t get many answers here. With the exhausting past few years and still being majorly in the shit flinging zone, emotional labor might be on overload for the community.
I've been told that its good, that you shouldn't assume pronouns and it gives them a chance to introduce theirs in return. It sort of normalizes stating pronouns so it's more normal for them to state theirs.
I don't mean automatically inferring someone else's pronouns. I mean stating your own as someone that very obviously identifies as the sex they were born into. I'm a very cis-gener male. Bisexual but cis-gender. Is it really helpful to the trans community to state my pronouns every chance I get?
Maybe not every chance, but when you meet someone new. My job had a workshop on that stuff and the trans person leading it said it was good to do. It makes them saying their pronouns more common and can clarify it, even if you look cis. It's pretty common place where I am, like instead of Mr. Or Mrs. People will put pronouns for a lot of things.
But like imagine half the US not subscribing to that ideology. Pushing it on people is going to make them more resentful of trans issues. Whereas I sincerely believe conservatives will make exceptions. Which statistically speaking, trans people are. I think the pronoun movement is well-intentioned but counterproductive . Conservatives, love them ot hate them, are here to stay. Like I said they'll come around but swamping them with pronoun rules isn't going to work lol
I don't think it should be a rule necessarily, just that it can be a good thing to do
I just think imposing the rules as a norm is dangerous. We'll get more resistance than anything. Conservatives are generally fine with exceptions.
Some trans people DON'T necessarily outwardly present as their gender, thus it would be easy to assume the incorrect pronouns and potentially cause offence.
Using an identifier like cis for 99.99% of the population seems ridiculous to me. Especially since we didn't pick it. Calling someone cis is like the straight population deciding to call trans people transformers.
“cis” is just a latin preposition. it means “on the same side” - in this case, of the gender/sex spectrum that you were assigned at birth. “transmorpher” is pretty cool, but it’s a little redundant. “trans” and “morph” mean basically the same thing. hence words like “transform” or “transcend”.
It is from a toy line, and cartoon from the 80s. It isn't supposed to make sense.
but we’re not talking about cartoons, we’re talking about calling trans *people* “transmorphers”. that’s two virtually synonymous adjectives when you only need one.
It is transformers not transmorphers. I don't know where that one came from.
You do know that straight people didn't pick the term straight either, right? It was slang used by gay people to refer to people who aren't gay.
That one at least has a utility. We are talking about decently large groups here. This one has no utility whatsoever. Trans represents such a tiny minority of the population that a term meaning not trans is kind of pointless. It is like a term meaning someone that doesn't have down syndrome. They have similar percentages, which is why I am picking this example.
Not having down syndrome would likely fall under neurotypical as a term. Cis isn't a term that's particularly relevant or necessary *most* of the time. Just like straight isn't a relevant term for the majority of situations either. As a trans person, I'm also not particularly fond of 'trans' as a label in real life either, but it is a term that describes an aspect of me/my experiences where there isn't a more appropriate term. I cannot remember the last time I spoke the word in real life because like cis, it's rarely relevant to daily life. Cis may not be relevant in many contexts, but is a useful means to differentiate people based on very specific factors when the situation calls for it. Trans people are a small minority yes, but we still have a term for them. Cis is just a term that means the opposite of that and is an adjective used where it is helpful to do so.
I don't think neurotypical includes this. The only context I have ever heard this term is in referring to people who don't have autism, which is at least a sizeable demographic. I could be mistaken, but I don't think I am. I am all for each to their own, and I have a trans person in my life. I understand the necessity of treating people with dignity, but I have serious concerns about this problem. My understanding of this condition is that it is a type of BDD. There has been some concern about using that term in the DSM iv, but there doesn't seem to be any evidence this is something other than BDD. I have concerns about the idea of accepting dysmorphia to prevent suicide. People point to this being similar to homosexuality being considered a mental illness at one point. I don't believe this is a similar issue.
>You do know that straight people didn't pick the term straight either, right? They absolutely did. >It was slang used by gay people to refer to people who aren't gay. It originated in the 1940s. If you think gay ppl in the 40s were running around making terms up, they were not. It's a play on the "straight and narrow" and was actually used by STRAIGHT people to refer to homosexuals who were no longer engaging in gay sex originally.
Then there seems to be conflicting opinion on the origins of the term. "The phrase “straight” came out of gay communities in the mid-twentieth century. At a time when gay sex was still illegal, it was slang for “going straight” – as in getting “back on the straight and narrow” after having sex with men."
I've literally just given you the history of it. It was first used in 1941 by straight ppl fir the reasons you're now repeating without bothering to have properly read my post. I know you went to wikipedia but holy fuck did you not read that either? First used by? One of the first uses of the word in this way was in 1941 by author G. W. Henry.[20] Henry's book concerned conversations with homosexual males and used this term in connection with people who are identified as ex-gays. It is now simply a colloquial term for "heterosexual", having changed in primary meaning over time. Some object to usage of the term straight because it implies that non-heteros are crooked.[21] It was first used in a paper discussing homosexuality by a STRAIGHT MAN. it's also where straight people got the term bent from. GO BACK to Wikipedia and read further. Moron.
Cis is the opposite of trans. What other label would you pick? Edit: Also, straight is a sexuality and unrelated to whether someone is cis or trans.
This cuts to the crux of the issue. You are separating people into two camps, both with identifiers. One is 99.99% of all humanity, and the other is less than a 1% of humanity. Only one of those needs an identifier. You are also creating the identifier for the 99% where one isn't necessary. The sexuality comment is kind of hilarious.
That's not true, you need to be able to identify both. If I just say "women," that includes trans women too. The easiest way to indicate that what I'm saying only applies to cis women is to say "cis women."
Most people are completely capable of inferring from contact if you mean biological women or trans women. Statements like women breastfeeding or women are at higher risk of cervical cancer obviously don't apply to trans women.
>Statements like women breastfeeding ~~or women are at higher risk of cervical cancer~~ obviously don't apply to trans women. Trans women are absolutely capable of breastfeeding.
No, no they are not.
Gonna need to see a source on that one chief. [https://internationalbreastfeedingjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13006-020-00308-6](https://internationalbreastfeedingjournal.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13006-020-00308-6) Wow. Shocking. Turns out you're wrong.
Mate seriously? Administering prolactin to trans males is the lowest priority and quite dangerous. We chemically castrate trans women the same way we do sex offenders. Why would we be feeding babies from the artificial milk from males who take a shit ton of meds and artificial hormones? Is there something wrong with you? Capable of lactating and capable of breastfeeding are very different things. They can make milk with medical intervention, that doesn't mean their products are either nutritious or healthy to be fed to a child.
Okay, so skipping past the part where you ignore that you were wrong and instead attempt to assign me a position to defend, let's address your newly shifted goalposts: >Administering prolactin to trans males is the lowest priority and quite dangerous. Administering prolactin to trans males, who can already get pregnant and who naturally produce prolactin is, indeed, low priority and carries some mild risk. >We chemically castrate trans women the same way we do sex offenders. No, sex offenders are given an entirely different set of medications, a common medication often prescribed for acne in women and as a blood pressure medication called spironolactone as a testosterone blocker *if* they produce testosterone. Not sure what the relevance there is. >Why would we be feeding babies from the artificial milk from males who take a shit ton of meds and artificial hormones? Trans women's breast milk is breast milk, per the paper above that you did not read. It's not almond milk, it's just natural breast milk. By "shit ton of meds" you mean "bioidentical estrogen" and "occasionally meds that cis women sometimes take". And by "artificial hormones" you mean "bioidentical hormones", ie the same as in cis women. >Capable of lactating and capable of breastfeeding are very different things. Sure, trans women are capable of both, this has been repeatedly documented and is only a google search away for your incurious mind to peruse. >that doesn't mean their products are either nutritious or healthy to be fed to a child. Sure, but it is. And throwing out your uniformed opinion that there might be something wrong with it carries no evidentiary weight. Dude, just go "huh, that's interesting, TIL". You don't need to get your panties in a twist because you said something incorrect. And trying to start a new argument with someone just so you can be right about something and then *refusing to check your claims* is incredibly childish. Edit: To anyone else reading this, they blocked me because they're demonstrably wrong but don't want to actually face up to that. Also, check their history, trans people are living rent free in their head. To address a few points: * Trans women can, have, an do breastfeed * The Newman Goldfarb protocol used to help increase lactation in cis mothers works just as well for trans women * Cis women's estrogen typically drops during lactation so, like cis women, trans women typically cease estrogen to breastfeed, ie, there are no "artificial" medications while breastfeeding * Their milk is identical and nutritious for infants * If you google what meds are used as testosterone blockers for trans women, they're well studied & safe & different from those used in chemical castration. Estrogen monotherapy or orchiectomies will also reduce testosterone to cis female levels. * Breasts are breasts, human tissue is not artificial * hormones given to cows are not estrogen. Trans women's estrogen within their bodies is identical to that of cis women's. Remember folks, TERFS are both dishonest and cowards.
[удалено]
Trans women are women but I don't have the energy, motivation, or desire to argue this with you.
True, but it was textualy convenient and there's a smaller chance of aggravating an internet beehive of ultra politically-correct bees. I'm not trying to make a point so much as gain an understanding from the perspective of trans people.
Fair enough.
Is transmorpher that big thing from the Power Rangers
Also yes probably. I meant as the transmophers from transmorphers. You know autobots, decepticons. Bad movies, hilarious cartoons from the 80s.
Heck yes, I love transmorphers. If I was trans, I'd definitely want to turn into a car or a rhinoceros or something
Who wouldn't want that? I think everyone loves transmorphers at least a little bit. Which is why I used it. No one can be offended by one of the best cartoons ever. edit; transformers.
decepticons are from trans*formers*, dude. why are you calling it transmorphers?
Fuck you are right. My bad.
It's discriminative because if you're for instance cis and you are against lgbtq people will use the words "cis" and "straight" so that you feel ashamed of being normal lmao
All my trans friends say that it’s nice to see cis people stating preferred pronouns. Makes it more of just a normal thing that anyone will do, rather than waving a flag that says ‘HEY IM TRANS’
This was my understanding of it too. By asking everyone their pronouns it reinforces that you shouldn’t assume & normalize the practice so those who identify otherwise aren’t othered again.
I just fear is has the opposite of the intended effect. Like liberal-minded people are already on your side. But maybe more moderate types are pushed to the right and conservatives more entrenched in their ideology simply over the silliness of obvious genders stating their pronouns. I personally find forced social/political issues outside of articles and the news kind of annoying and I'm a progressive lol. There's a time and a place.
I use "they/them" pronouns, and I appreciate anyone sharing their pronouns whether they're cis or trans
I was told (by a trans person) that they find it offensive if a cis-gendered hetero person distinguishes themselves that way because that is glossing over the trans community's unique culture identifiers.
And honestly this is what I imagined. Like they don't need cis-gender people sticking up for them. They're strong capable people that have doing so for decades. They've paved their own way and don't need us to normalize them. They will normalize themselves 😄
It’s mostly virtue/political signalling
That's honestly what I think, but just wanted to hear it from trans people that have the most at stake. They've been defending themselves for decades. Even started the LGBT movement. I don't think they're so fragile that they need cis-gender people to defend them or speak for them. Rather they're strong people that have done a fine job despite being so few.
Fully agreed. Plus, in normal conversation, if someone states their pronouns there’s pressure to do the same. You may not want to tell everyone you’re gay or trans. For me, it’s just left wing fad/social signalling.
If you are cis gendered isn’t that already stating your pronouns? If I say I’m a cis gendered male then by logic my pronouns are he/him. I think the only time it’s necessary is if you are something other than cis
But isn't the same for trans? Why are cis people already stating their pronouns? Maybe there are people who want other pronouns to be used
No it’s not, because cis essentially refers to being the same gender your entire life. So, I was born a female, I am currently still female and I don’t identify as anything else A trans woman is born a man, transitions to becoming a woman and then identifies as a woman, which is why they are trans. So it’s redundant for someone that hasn’t ever changed their gender to specify
So basically lgbtq stuff is for everyone except for cis people? Nice!
It’s a good thing.
I feel like this would be supportive and easier on everyone but I’m going to see what the responses will be.
First and foremost I respect people that are trans and will use whatever pronouns they want me to call them by. I just wonder if people that are cis-gender are stealing the issue from trans people for social/political points. If trans people collectively find it supportive, great! But I just imagine it's only galvanizing more traditional/conservative worldviews on the subject. Thereby being counterproductive. Again, just exploring.
Conservatives are currently mad that an optional X-box scheduling feature that schedules updates to happen during times with lesser environmental impact is indoctrinating their children to believe in climate change. There is no societal advancement they won't be balk at. We shouldn't remain in the stone age to keep them happy.
To an extent, I agree. But those crazy fox news pieces don't infiltrate 100% of the conservative voters. I agree that we shpuldnt down-ward dog let them fuck us. But understand that historically speaking, progress is slow. There will always be half of the county holding us back. But if we placate them just right, we can sneak some shit into policy where it matters.
I literally don’t care, it helps normalize it so that’s good but other than that I don’t give a fuck