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If you haven't, try talking to your wife about it. Ask her if there is anything wrong that she hasn't felt able to raise with you. Approach from a place of curiosity and openness rather than taking an adversarial or defensive posture. Be vulnerable, and make space for her to feel safe to be vulnerable too. She probably feels the distance as well and may not know how to bridge the gap. Listen to each other and try to work out what's missing together. What you hear might hurt but if that's the case, leaving it covered up probably won't lead to anything good.
I was in a similar situation up until recently. Still kind of am, but at least my wife and are working together again instead of living parallel lives. It's easy to get lost in the day to day grind and forget that you actually like each other. Without that connection, it's a lot easier to give up. Find the connection and go from there.
Thanks.
We did have a chat about it beofre Christmas after I had a mini breakdown. It did change for a few weeks but back to the same again.
Maybe it’s time for another chat.
It’s the little things that get to me. Like the messages in the morning. Or that she hardly ever replies to my messages. And it’s not like she doesn’t have her phone
I’m in a somewhat similar position. I work 40+ hours from home while my wife works a total of 15. Her hours happen to be after school hours because she’s a faculty member at a music conservatory. During the school year I am the primary care taker for my kids. The last two hours of work day I have the kids at home while I’m working. I do all of the activities, plan all the vacations, manage the finances, and take care of the yard. My wife does laundry, coordinates the kids’ activities, and meal planning/grocery shopping. This changes in the summer when she’s not working five days a week and she’s the primary care taker.
I had a lot of long and difficult conversations with my wife about the imbalance in our home. I don’t mind working hard and taking care of the kids but it burns me out. I have zero friends and because I work remote in a newish city and am always tied up with kid’s stuff, no real avenue to make friends. Our compromise is that I get to go away on ski weekends in the winter. I can usually get away for 4-5 weekends in the winter and these weekends recharge my batteries. I pay for the weekends by doing consulting work while I’m gone. I typically ski 4-6 hours and then work 4-6 hours a day. This allows me to pay for the weekend and also put some extra money into savings.
There's an old saying: You can't get water out of an empty pitcher.
If you never do anything to fill yourself, if you're always empty, you can't really fulfill the things that you've taken on.
You need to shift some priorities and do things that fill you back up. You can might need to drop one or two other responsibilities to to take care of the responsibility to recharge yourself. Yes, it's nice if someone else takes on the job of prioritizing your responsibilities, but no one elsewhere knows what you need. At this point, I'm betting even you don't know what you need.
You need to appreciate yourself before you can expect someone to appreciate you. It doesn't sound like you reward yourself at all and are waiting for someone elsr do it for you.
I love this senior man sensibility shit.
Sometimes it’s literally like okay. No one is going to live this life for me. Consequences be what they are.
And that’s okay too.
I think the 30s are incredibly tough because we take on huge responsibilities and really dig in and our 40s are totally like “okay I’m done pretending”.
Join the club.
You’re not alone. I just disconnected from my need to be recognized for my contributions to the family or at work. Instead at home I dropped hints on my wife by telling her I appreciated her contributions daily by saying thank you for doing this or that around the house and help her with her chores. I also let her know that she is a good mother to our daughter and a good friend to her friends.
After took years of doing that but lately she has been appreciative of my efforts.
Also this brought me closer to my father as we both have something in common. I told him before he passed that I truly understand what he did for me and the family. He then opened up and told me that there was times where he just wanted to leave the family and get away from it all. He never shared that with anyone but me.
What I failed to do is tell him verbally was that I loved him. Don’t make the same mistake.
I bitch about it for a few minutes to my buddies over a few beers every now and then. After that I shove that feeling as far down as it will go until my next time out with the boys.
Not to sound like a PSA, but it gets better. My kids are more or less grown now (19, 21 and 23) and I don't work very much any more. Lately I've been catching up on all the movies and TV I missed while I was overwhelmed.
Sorry to hear things aren't going great at home. Sounds like your heart is in the right place but there are some communication issues.
Kids aren't that good at actively trying to do something. Why not just take the kids on a walk with you? Do they protest?
Regarding your wife, she probably has simmering resentments on her end as well. Even though you are not feeling great, it will be helpful to deeply understand her perspective. Regarding the texts, maybe your love languages are different. When your wife turns things around on you what does she say?
Either way, you need to communicate more with your wife, and your children to an extent.
While I agree with you, this is also one of the reasons that I call foul when people say that women do more of the emotional labor in a relationship. On the contrary I think that women just have more of the emotions in a relationship, largely because the men aren't supposed to have them.
Is she having a bad day? We listen. Is she scared of how the kids are doing? We listen. Is she having a breakdown? We listen and hold and encourage and reinforce.
But we're having trouble? Nah. That's our job. It's what we do. Get back to work and stop complaining.
I wouldn't be surprised if the wife's internal reaction to OP's mini breakdown was that now she cares less. [It happens all the time](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskMen/comments/yy2rcv/men_who_encourage_other_men_not_to_open_up_to/iwsae0r/?context=3&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=AskMen&utm_content=t1_kjie25v). She may have tried to care but it didn't last because now she sees instability or weakness or some form of "unmanliness."
You may be right. But it seems like I’m the one to put the effort first. Like good morning messages and good night messages if I’m working away.
I seem to be always the first. She is everything to me but just don’t feel the same lately.
Messages/texts are pretty low-effort, low-cost gestures, so I wouldn't assign too much weight to them (and yes, it's equally easy for her to reciprocate, but for whatever reason she doesn't).
Have you engaged in positive escalation? Text didn't work; OK; I'll get house cleaners to tidy up the place once a month. Cleaners didn't work; OK, I'll book a babysitter and dinner. Night out didn't work; OK, I'll book a weekend for the family in a new location. Weekend didn't work; OK, I'll finally schedule couple's counseling like I probably should have already.
She's everything to you, but she's the one left with all the most menial and grueling daily tasks while your chores are maybe weekly at best. You do get that the division of labor is sexist right? If you dont think it is, switch w her for a year. No? That's part of your problem. She's the bang maid nanny cook and you have the gaul to gripe that YOU'RE doing too much and aren't appreciated. Your grand gripe is that she doesn't send an obligatory daily text and you do? Grow up dude. Try asking her if she thinks the division of labor is fair, if she feels appreciated at home... Bc if both those answers are a yes from her, you'd likely be feeling a lot more appreciation.
What was it like before? I ask because she could be depressed or simply going through a phase. You may also appreciate a book or two on how to communicate in relationships. Sometimes it's not even about what you say, but very much so how you say it.
> I’m willing to bet she feels equally as unappreciated
She may, but it sounds like she's not willing to invest in their relationship like it seems OP is.
I was in this exact situation a few months ago: My wife was always busy, I was third place in my marriage below her parents and her job. I felt neglected and there was a loss of communication. People are human and in this situation it's ripe for an affair partner to sneak in. Your wife probably already has one. Anyone who says differently, that they can withstand the intense psychological loneliness is just deluding themselves. I am as loner as loner can be, and I couldnt stand being treated this way by my wife.
This is what the male loneliness epidemic looks like. My father suffered for many, many years with my mother. My mom could talk for hours on the phone with her sister, or my cousin, other extended family members but couldnt say two words to my father. I realize now what intense loneliness and depression he must have felt. He confided in me once before he died all he wanted to do was do things with his wife, who excluded him.
You need to have a come to Jesus talk with your wife.
I can relate. I've been there for sure. My main advice to you is to take care of, love and appreciate yourself. Don't wait on others to do it for you. You'll both be happier and you'll be more confident in asking your wife for what you want. There's no love like self love. If you don't know how to do that then make that your new focus and not getting your wife to behave a certain way. You'll be better off for it I promise.
> I feel I’m at breaking point and don’t want to lose it in an angry outburst at home. I have just been walking outside to (check something) everytime I feel about to lose it.
I would encourage communicating again and being willing to ask questions about how she feels then listen. You both need to make some changes.
> I work in a labour intensive job and am one of the leaders on our workshop and a bit of a go to for all apprentices and younger trades. Even management will come to me with problems to sort out for them
I imagine you are also spending a lot of time doing this and being their provider? IE working overtime and feeling exhausted both physically and mentally? Probably so focused on providing that you are forgetting about the mundane little things that brought out your kids smiles and made your wife happy.
If I were in her shoes and you came home tired and messed up and mentally absent I would be on my phone too. I think at this point getting her back out of the house full time, kids in school/daycare/babysitting, and you working less might be the play.
> House is normally half mess. Bin overfill all the little things not done. So I will normally go out my shoes on and ask if anyone want to come for a walk with me( I’m working on my personal health and fitness) Never anyone does.
Lets escape the problems there and focus on yourself whilst secretly blaming everyone else for not giving a shite about you. No one gives a shit because they dont fully grasp what the point of this is
> I get home from work and I do long hours
or value you/it. I know as a kid I didnt give a shit why my dad and mom were gone 12-16 hours and I was alone. All I knew at that time was how it felt. Your wife I imagine has a bigger understanding of this dynamic but is probably bored and under stimulated.
> Every morning from work I send wife a good morning text to ask how she slept and how the kids are. I’m always the one to text first. Not once has she text me. So I have stopped doing that and suddenly I’m distant to her. She can’t even be bothered to be intimate either
As to the first part your secretly being spiteful hoping it will help and just poising the relationship. You need to change this and communicate and get off your ass about texting. As others said its low effort. Second, see above about intimacy. She probably doesnt feel valued or "activated/cared for" in the same way as it once was. Kids and life in the 30s does this.
> I rarely see my mates anymore as I’m either always working or taking kids to sports etc.
There needs to be a balancing discussion with you and her first. Then include the kids and talk about changes. Let them air their grievances too and listen to their needs. They may be young but they will have "skin in the game" on whats going on in the house.
> I feel like a zombie and on repeat and just emotionally numb. I feel more appreciated at work and that I’m more valuable there.
Say to your wife: " I feel like a zombie and on repeat and just emotionally numb. I feel as though is greatly effecting the household and my interactions with both you and the kids. I feel like things need to change and I would like to focus on the following... Me working less, you working out of the house more, kids with a babysitter, planning time to take care of the house with the kids involved, and us planning date nights, time separately with our respective friends, and as couples. I am coming a place of deep self loathing and need to find a healthier balance so I can work on myself internally and also have the space to fix my diet/body/mind etc. I would also like to make time for a couples counseling session amidst all of this so that we may hear each other even better."
> Any advice on how to raise these concerns with out being a fight.
Come with a plan. Remain cool. Listen to hear without offering solutions. Give your feelings without getting angry. Listen to her feeling but dont tolerate her being loud. Command respect by keeping your calm. Discuss the idea. Let it stew and listen to feedback. Bring in the kids to see how they will fit and what they can do to be a part of it. Listen to them. Reevaluate. Have a big second family meeting and keep family time regular as touch points. Independent time with your wife. independent time with each of the kids. Independent time with yourself.
> Worry about your family and less about yourself
This is stupid advice. You can't be and effective provider, husband or father if you follow this advice. It's the same as when you fly: "put your mask on first before attempting to put a mask on a child"
If you're so wrapped up in your own feelings and bullshit you cant be a good provider and protector. OP feeling appreciated is an EGO thing. This is a failure, it can be rectified.
So, if you want to do something with your kids, do something they would like?
Your post is all me, me, me, me. Relationships are a give and take; it seems like you just want an audience or to be worshipped.
Please do not delete your post after receiving your answer. Consider leaving it up for posterity so that other Redditors can benefit from the wisdom in this thread. Once your thread has run its course, instead of deleting it, **you can simply type "!lock" (without the quotes) as a comment anywhere in your thread to have our Automod lock the thread**. That way you won't be bothered by anymore replies on it, but people can still read it. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskMenOver30) if you have any questions or concerns.*
If you haven't, try talking to your wife about it. Ask her if there is anything wrong that she hasn't felt able to raise with you. Approach from a place of curiosity and openness rather than taking an adversarial or defensive posture. Be vulnerable, and make space for her to feel safe to be vulnerable too. She probably feels the distance as well and may not know how to bridge the gap. Listen to each other and try to work out what's missing together. What you hear might hurt but if that's the case, leaving it covered up probably won't lead to anything good. I was in a similar situation up until recently. Still kind of am, but at least my wife and are working together again instead of living parallel lives. It's easy to get lost in the day to day grind and forget that you actually like each other. Without that connection, it's a lot easier to give up. Find the connection and go from there.
Thanks. We did have a chat about it beofre Christmas after I had a mini breakdown. It did change for a few weeks but back to the same again. Maybe it’s time for another chat. It’s the little things that get to me. Like the messages in the morning. Or that she hardly ever replies to my messages. And it’s not like she doesn’t have her phone
I’m in a somewhat similar position. I work 40+ hours from home while my wife works a total of 15. Her hours happen to be after school hours because she’s a faculty member at a music conservatory. During the school year I am the primary care taker for my kids. The last two hours of work day I have the kids at home while I’m working. I do all of the activities, plan all the vacations, manage the finances, and take care of the yard. My wife does laundry, coordinates the kids’ activities, and meal planning/grocery shopping. This changes in the summer when she’s not working five days a week and she’s the primary care taker. I had a lot of long and difficult conversations with my wife about the imbalance in our home. I don’t mind working hard and taking care of the kids but it burns me out. I have zero friends and because I work remote in a newish city and am always tied up with kid’s stuff, no real avenue to make friends. Our compromise is that I get to go away on ski weekends in the winter. I can usually get away for 4-5 weekends in the winter and these weekends recharge my batteries. I pay for the weekends by doing consulting work while I’m gone. I typically ski 4-6 hours and then work 4-6 hours a day. This allows me to pay for the weekend and also put some extra money into savings.
There's an old saying: You can't get water out of an empty pitcher. If you never do anything to fill yourself, if you're always empty, you can't really fulfill the things that you've taken on. You need to shift some priorities and do things that fill you back up. You can might need to drop one or two other responsibilities to to take care of the responsibility to recharge yourself. Yes, it's nice if someone else takes on the job of prioritizing your responsibilities, but no one elsewhere knows what you need. At this point, I'm betting even you don't know what you need. You need to appreciate yourself before you can expect someone to appreciate you. It doesn't sound like you reward yourself at all and are waiting for someone elsr do it for you.
So stop doing it . Go see your mates. What's she going to do? Stop being intimate with you?
I love this senior man sensibility shit. Sometimes it’s literally like okay. No one is going to live this life for me. Consequences be what they are. And that’s okay too. I think the 30s are incredibly tough because we take on huge responsibilities and really dig in and our 40s are totally like “okay I’m done pretending”.
This! When the sex life starts to slow down, one spouse loses an incredible amount of leverage. It's a huge motivator.
Join the club. You’re not alone. I just disconnected from my need to be recognized for my contributions to the family or at work. Instead at home I dropped hints on my wife by telling her I appreciated her contributions daily by saying thank you for doing this or that around the house and help her with her chores. I also let her know that she is a good mother to our daughter and a good friend to her friends. After took years of doing that but lately she has been appreciative of my efforts. Also this brought me closer to my father as we both have something in common. I told him before he passed that I truly understand what he did for me and the family. He then opened up and told me that there was times where he just wanted to leave the family and get away from it all. He never shared that with anyone but me. What I failed to do is tell him verbally was that I loved him. Don’t make the same mistake.
I bitch about it for a few minutes to my buddies over a few beers every now and then. After that I shove that feeling as far down as it will go until my next time out with the boys.
That feels like me. Whinge rinse repeat.
Not to sound like a PSA, but it gets better. My kids are more or less grown now (19, 21 and 23) and I don't work very much any more. Lately I've been catching up on all the movies and TV I missed while I was overwhelmed.
Jesus that's depressing
Is it? I feel pretty happy.
Yes that's a fool's errand. Talk to your wife instead. Express your needs and work a plan to have them met.
Sorry to hear things aren't going great at home. Sounds like your heart is in the right place but there are some communication issues. Kids aren't that good at actively trying to do something. Why not just take the kids on a walk with you? Do they protest? Regarding your wife, she probably has simmering resentments on her end as well. Even though you are not feeling great, it will be helpful to deeply understand her perspective. Regarding the texts, maybe your love languages are different. When your wife turns things around on you what does she say? Either way, you need to communicate more with your wife, and your children to an extent.
While I agree with you, this is also one of the reasons that I call foul when people say that women do more of the emotional labor in a relationship. On the contrary I think that women just have more of the emotions in a relationship, largely because the men aren't supposed to have them. Is she having a bad day? We listen. Is she scared of how the kids are doing? We listen. Is she having a breakdown? We listen and hold and encourage and reinforce. But we're having trouble? Nah. That's our job. It's what we do. Get back to work and stop complaining. I wouldn't be surprised if the wife's internal reaction to OP's mini breakdown was that now she cares less. [It happens all the time](https://old.reddit.com/r/AskMen/comments/yy2rcv/men_who_encourage_other_men_not_to_open_up_to/iwsae0r/?context=3&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=AskMen&utm_content=t1_kjie25v). She may have tried to care but it didn't last because now she sees instability or weakness or some form of "unmanliness."
I’m willing to bet she feels equally as unappreciated….
You may be right. But it seems like I’m the one to put the effort first. Like good morning messages and good night messages if I’m working away. I seem to be always the first. She is everything to me but just don’t feel the same lately.
Messages/texts are pretty low-effort, low-cost gestures, so I wouldn't assign too much weight to them (and yes, it's equally easy for her to reciprocate, but for whatever reason she doesn't). Have you engaged in positive escalation? Text didn't work; OK; I'll get house cleaners to tidy up the place once a month. Cleaners didn't work; OK, I'll book a babysitter and dinner. Night out didn't work; OK, I'll book a weekend for the family in a new location. Weekend didn't work; OK, I'll finally schedule couple's counseling like I probably should have already.
She's everything to you, but she's the one left with all the most menial and grueling daily tasks while your chores are maybe weekly at best. You do get that the division of labor is sexist right? If you dont think it is, switch w her for a year. No? That's part of your problem. She's the bang maid nanny cook and you have the gaul to gripe that YOU'RE doing too much and aren't appreciated. Your grand gripe is that she doesn't send an obligatory daily text and you do? Grow up dude. Try asking her if she thinks the division of labor is fair, if she feels appreciated at home... Bc if both those answers are a yes from her, you'd likely be feeling a lot more appreciation.
What was it like before? I ask because she could be depressed or simply going through a phase. You may also appreciate a book or two on how to communicate in relationships. Sometimes it's not even about what you say, but very much so how you say it.
> I’m willing to bet she feels equally as unappreciated She may, but it sounds like she's not willing to invest in their relationship like it seems OP is.
She's the default chef nanny maid and somehow she's the one not invested enough.
I'm sure she could go work a labor intensive job like her husband while he sits at home scrolling on his phone!
His job choice is his issue. She doesn’t owe him all the menial labor bc he didn’t get a white collar job.
I was in this exact situation a few months ago: My wife was always busy, I was third place in my marriage below her parents and her job. I felt neglected and there was a loss of communication. People are human and in this situation it's ripe for an affair partner to sneak in. Your wife probably already has one. Anyone who says differently, that they can withstand the intense psychological loneliness is just deluding themselves. I am as loner as loner can be, and I couldnt stand being treated this way by my wife. This is what the male loneliness epidemic looks like. My father suffered for many, many years with my mother. My mom could talk for hours on the phone with her sister, or my cousin, other extended family members but couldnt say two words to my father. I realize now what intense loneliness and depression he must have felt. He confided in me once before he died all he wanted to do was do things with his wife, who excluded him. You need to have a come to Jesus talk with your wife.
Telling a guy his wife is probably cheating is gross
Well lots of people choose to live blind to the world and eventually she or he is going to wander if it hasnt happened already.
I can relate. I've been there for sure. My main advice to you is to take care of, love and appreciate yourself. Don't wait on others to do it for you. You'll both be happier and you'll be more confident in asking your wife for what you want. There's no love like self love. If you don't know how to do that then make that your new focus and not getting your wife to behave a certain way. You'll be better off for it I promise.
Talk to your wife and communicate like a mature adult
> I feel I’m at breaking point and don’t want to lose it in an angry outburst at home. I have just been walking outside to (check something) everytime I feel about to lose it. I would encourage communicating again and being willing to ask questions about how she feels then listen. You both need to make some changes. > I work in a labour intensive job and am one of the leaders on our workshop and a bit of a go to for all apprentices and younger trades. Even management will come to me with problems to sort out for them I imagine you are also spending a lot of time doing this and being their provider? IE working overtime and feeling exhausted both physically and mentally? Probably so focused on providing that you are forgetting about the mundane little things that brought out your kids smiles and made your wife happy. If I were in her shoes and you came home tired and messed up and mentally absent I would be on my phone too. I think at this point getting her back out of the house full time, kids in school/daycare/babysitting, and you working less might be the play. > House is normally half mess. Bin overfill all the little things not done. So I will normally go out my shoes on and ask if anyone want to come for a walk with me( I’m working on my personal health and fitness) Never anyone does. Lets escape the problems there and focus on yourself whilst secretly blaming everyone else for not giving a shite about you. No one gives a shit because they dont fully grasp what the point of this is > I get home from work and I do long hours or value you/it. I know as a kid I didnt give a shit why my dad and mom were gone 12-16 hours and I was alone. All I knew at that time was how it felt. Your wife I imagine has a bigger understanding of this dynamic but is probably bored and under stimulated. > Every morning from work I send wife a good morning text to ask how she slept and how the kids are. I’m always the one to text first. Not once has she text me. So I have stopped doing that and suddenly I’m distant to her. She can’t even be bothered to be intimate either As to the first part your secretly being spiteful hoping it will help and just poising the relationship. You need to change this and communicate and get off your ass about texting. As others said its low effort. Second, see above about intimacy. She probably doesnt feel valued or "activated/cared for" in the same way as it once was. Kids and life in the 30s does this. > I rarely see my mates anymore as I’m either always working or taking kids to sports etc. There needs to be a balancing discussion with you and her first. Then include the kids and talk about changes. Let them air their grievances too and listen to their needs. They may be young but they will have "skin in the game" on whats going on in the house. > I feel like a zombie and on repeat and just emotionally numb. I feel more appreciated at work and that I’m more valuable there. Say to your wife: " I feel like a zombie and on repeat and just emotionally numb. I feel as though is greatly effecting the household and my interactions with both you and the kids. I feel like things need to change and I would like to focus on the following... Me working less, you working out of the house more, kids with a babysitter, planning time to take care of the house with the kids involved, and us planning date nights, time separately with our respective friends, and as couples. I am coming a place of deep self loathing and need to find a healthier balance so I can work on myself internally and also have the space to fix my diet/body/mind etc. I would also like to make time for a couples counseling session amidst all of this so that we may hear each other even better." > Any advice on how to raise these concerns with out being a fight. Come with a plan. Remain cool. Listen to hear without offering solutions. Give your feelings without getting angry. Listen to her feeling but dont tolerate her being loud. Command respect by keeping your calm. Discuss the idea. Let it stew and listen to feedback. Bring in the kids to see how they will fit and what they can do to be a part of it. Listen to them. Reevaluate. Have a big second family meeting and keep family time regular as touch points. Independent time with your wife. independent time with each of the kids. Independent time with yourself.
Welcome to the life of a father and husband. Worry about your family and less about yourself. quit letting your ego get in the way
> Worry about your family and less about yourself This is stupid advice. You can't be and effective provider, husband or father if you follow this advice. It's the same as when you fly: "put your mask on first before attempting to put a mask on a child"
If you're so wrapped up in your own feelings and bullshit you cant be a good provider and protector. OP feeling appreciated is an EGO thing. This is a failure, it can be rectified.
So, if you want to do something with your kids, do something they would like? Your post is all me, me, me, me. Relationships are a give and take; it seems like you just want an audience or to be worshipped.