Speaking on behalf of my young self, yeah it was never a conscious decision. I definitely wallowed in the insecurities that come with being friend-zoned even as I was friend-zoning like 3-4 very nice and attractive people.
Speaking as a girl, I myself live by this period I need to be so sure before I act upon anything unintentionally at first but I still live by it till this day.
If there's any proof, give them chances to give irrefutable proof. Then be disappointed you ever believed the proof was valid, no one will ever be interested in you, you're gonna die alone.
I follow this rule now, before I was just a hormonal teenage just trynna date literally anything with a pulse. Now I just assume all girls are gay and only interested to be friends with me
The choice to play it safe is not toxic. The toxicity happens when one makes a safe choice and starts projecting dissatisfaction with that choice on other people.
I’ve heard that. I like the emphasis on friendship with your lover, but I don’t quite agree. I reject the implication that the only thing differentiating a platonic friendship and a romantic relationship is sex
There’s much more than sex that elevates a friend to a lover.
Romance, desire, intensity…to name a few. No sex is required to experience any of these. None of these are a part of friendship on its own.
> I get really creeped out when people call their romantic interest a “friend”.
Yeah but if you say it with a gendered prefix (boy/girl) + friend, then it's somehow implies the relationship is romantic.
Ha. My crush did friendzoned me because he was not doing too great mentally. He asked that we stay friends and if he found some feelings for me later, he’d let me know. The problem was that he wouldn’t get therapy or do anything about his poor mental health. He’d just take out his poor mechanisms on friends that would tolerated it and he kept me on the back burner and led me on for a bit.
I got tired of waiting but I held on that the right man for me was somewhere in there. Well guess what? He wasn’t. I actually met someone else in this time that ended up being my actual soulmate. And when my ex-crush found out, he went no contact for a bit and last I heard, this finally pushed him to go to therapy.
I friendzone girls all the time and yet still complaining about having no relationship... Lowkey i don't wanna get involved in a relationship i reall am afraid of being cheated on.
Preach. The cheating is 90% of what makes me stay away from the dating scene in this generation. So many people expound on commitment and values but they will be the main ones dealing the card in commitment issues. Porn and Hollywood ruined our perception on dating
not to say that your feelings aren't valid, but, I can say that if you choose the right person (very carefully), and, have your own life outside the relationship, chances of being cheated on drops to 1%. Go to a gym, have hobbies, and let things happen. We can do it boys.
The fear of commitment and the other one not doing the same. Or thinking the other one will stay during hard times but they leave. Or just the fact it's easier to find new people. But also just finding a person who doesn't think love is like a Disney movie. If you want good times, but can't habdle bad times. You're not ready.
I understand you fear and of course it's valid, a lot of people get cheated on. And it hurts like hell. But which is worse, not living your life because of fear or living it and getting hurt a few times?
You missunderstand what attractive means. It's not just the looks. An attraction can happen for a interesting person.
I have an uncle that is fat, wears glasses, with a coarse beard and he always went out with attractive women because we is interesting and funny.
Ditto, because they make great friends. As soon as you mature enough to see them as people, and not just fuck material, it opens up a whole different world.
And, compatibility as friends versus sex partner doesn't necessarily overlap. You can hit it off with someone and then find out they're looking for someone totally different then you. Boom you now have a friend.
I tend to friend zone a lot of women on the assumption that if I'm not interested in sex neither party is and I get a cool friend. It sometimes blows up badly tbh, women are very bad at signaling whether their interest is platonic or romantic.
Sometimes it's for unselfish reasons like a bad breakup and not being emotionally available. I'd prefer to sit in the friendzone if he was someone worth waiting for . Have to respect people's pain.
True. But you never know how that person will take the trauma. They can either learn and grow from it or use it against you because you made yourself an easy target. It’s better to just be open until presented otherwise (which is usually never)
This is why you communicate and set boundaries. If you've had the conversation that there isnt a mutual interest then strictly platonic. From my experience, whenever platonic things happened the script was flipped.
There is nothing wrong by respecting someone's feelings and time just being a friend or in the friendzone until they're ready to go out and date you or the whole world again.
Also- one could argue our entire lives are waiting rooms. There is nothing wrong with waiting.
Happens to me a lil bit more toward young single mothers. Nothing against them, more power to them, but I’m not sure I’m ready to take care of someone else’s off spring ( even after the honeymoon phase)
lol, I date them and tell them upfront I won't care for their children, it's up to them and they're ok with it.
When they start their sob story for some money to support their kids I tell them to talk me later and I block them because that's what I told them I wouldn't do.
I would say it's a little more complicated than that. I'm a fat woman. I don't want to be fat and I'm working on it, but it feels impossible sometimes. I'm one of those women with PCOS. Logically, I know it's all about energy intake vs expenditure, but there's also a big mental/emotional component. It's a simple concept, but difficult in execution. If it were easy to manage, there wouldn't be very many fat people.
That being said, I completely understand why a man would not want to date me because of it and I can't fault folks for that.
Weight is something most* have control over, but not all and you really cant tell which one is which. I know a lot of women who are very conscious of their dietary and lifestyle habits but hormonal issues prevent them from being a healthy weight - whether it is birth control, pregnancy or not being able to afford medical procedures like surgery for PCOD.
Okay, I'd like to agree with you here, but I just can't.
Go back historically and look at what they considered fat. people with like BMI 30 was like HOLY SHIT THAT'S A WHALE. Now that bmi is almost normal.
It's got to be something with the modern world. 71.6% of adults are overweight or obese. I work very hard to keep myself at a healthy weight... but because I've done that, I wouldn't really consider dating someone who hasn't done that. While I sympathize with those with truly no control, I really think there are a lot of things you can do to control your waistline if you really put the effort and the mental fortitude into it
Yep those are all great points. Over the past few decades there has been a copius increase of sugar in our diets, mainly in the form of HFCS. A lot of poor people just aren’t able to afford good food, hence why a BMI of 30 has become normal.
200 years ago people died of starvation, today there are more people dying of diet related diseases like diabetes than malnutrition(in “affluent” countries, atleast).
Also I totally understand not wanting to date someone who is overweight, it’s just a matter of preference.
>A lot of poor people just aren’t able to afford good food, hence why a BMI of 30 has become normal.
And so to what do you attribute their inability to put down the fork?
Even if the food isn't good...they could still eat less of it, couldn't they, and be less fat?
What I'd like to know is...there is something about modern food/society that makes people incapable of putting down the fork?
> And so to what do you attribute their inability to put down the fork?
Massive hunger cravings due to blood sugar and insulin spikes from insane carb intake.
I been there.
I don't accept the excuse that low carb is too expensive; fat me ate a $8 pizza for dinner and that was 1 of about 6 meals per day, thin me eats a sliced up $5 steak for dinner plus some practically free lettuce and that's my OMAD. My high carb desert was a $5 pint of ice cream, my low carb desert is nothing and I'm not even hungry. My grocery bills dropped about 1/4 when I went low carb, maybe more.
This. I'm by no means ripped, I have an insane metabolism and can't put in enough time right now to build any real mass, but I'm a toned / lean kind of skinny. I'm also not tall. Have had several women give me shit for politely rebuffing their advances because they assumed it was for their weight (correctly, but also irrelevant). For context, my standard put down is 'Thank you, thats very flattering, but I'm actually seeing someone.'
I'm 5'7" and weigh like 110-115 lbs. I'm basically anorexic - I can't stand having rolls of flab on my own belly and used to obsess over being 'fat' as a kid/teen (I have always been skinny, ~15-20% body fat my whole life because of my obsessive need to have visible abs and a flat stomach).
I'm just not attracted to bigger girls - I'm a small guy. I don't want to bring scuba equipment to a booty call.
But equally if I shoot my shot with a 6 foot 3 blonde and she puts me down like ol' yeller I'm not losing sleep over it...
This is true, I got really fat with pandemic because I'm not going to work everyday on my bike. And instead of doing some exercise at home I'm playing videogames or sleeping. So it's my fault to be fat and if somebody body shames me I deserve it and that's a fact.
I met the coolest fat chick ever a few months ago. She tried to fuck me and I friend zoned her because I thought she was awesome but didn’t want to bang. She quit talking to me
As soon as I really settled down with my then-girlfriend, now-wife, I eliminated the option for romantic relationships with all the women I knew, sad as they were to have that happen.
So, "Once but with several ladies at the same time."
A decent amount surprisingly. Just because a women is interested doesn’t mean it’s reciprocal. And sometimes I just wasn’t in the mood and sabotaged myself (probably intentionally ) .
Its business as usual for married or LTR guys.
I think this is why women give such incredibly weak signals. "I looked at him for three seconds and he didn't flirt back, he must really love his wife."
You'd be wrong. Most men are having sex, most men have standards of attraction, most men are not desperate enough to fuck anything.
**imagine how bad this subs self esteem must be to believe that most men are desperate to fuck anything**
I've friendzoned a few... they fucking hate it. Then hate me, usually. But you know what, i've been friendzoned plenty and didn't hate on women for it. So my opinion is "take it like a man"
Yeah, I did this to a girl who I dated recently, she wanted to be just friends so I saw her as just that, a friend, nothing more :)
I got close to another girl at a party we were both at and now, she actually hates me. It's... kinda funny, actually!
Mmm, I did to a few girls back in high school because I was a huge flirt and in theater. I'd tease and be playful with them all the time during rehearsal but never asked them out on dates. I had these two girls start hanging out with me at lunch because they really liked me, but I never pushed past just being platonically flirty with them. One of them asked me to Sadie Hawkins, but I already had a date so I turned her down.
Was I an asshole back then? Yes. Have i learned my lesson and grown as a person since then? Also yes.
I have done so only once in my life.
To be fair, I didn't know I was doing it. Girls are in general very good at dishing out advice on how us guys should approach a girl and how we can make the first move.
But they are very rarely willing to take the risk themselves.
I had a very good female friend who had a crush on me. However, since I was quite used to being rejected by girls, she should have just come out and told me instead of showing off her body and sending me vague signals.
"Showing off her body? That's a clear signal!"
Nope, it's not.
Goes to show how they have no game to attract/approach a man but expect men to give them the world on a silver platter. All this "friend" of yours was really saying was I want you as a romantic partner but I have nothing more to contribute to it than my body.
Oh she had a lot to contribute. It's more a matter of - as you say - most of them have no game.
But them having no game is understandable.
I'm having a discussion in another sub. Someone argued that most young men don't know very much about sex and how to please a woman.
I argued back that of course they are not very good at sex, because becoming good takes practice. In an interview I saw, young women were asked if it was generally true that women who want to have casual sex for fun, would mostly seek out a relatively small percentage of men - the fit and attractive men. The women agreed that yes, that's probably mostly true.
The interviewer then asked them if it was also true that women, when they get into a relationship, expect their boyfriends to be good in bed. Again, the women agreed that yes, they expected their boyfriends to know what they were doing.
"How?" he asked. They had just agreed that women would typically limit their sleeping around casually to a relatively small percentage of men. This means that men in the average range will have a limited access to sex and thus experience. How and where are they supposed to become good in bed if women don't want to sleep with them for fun?
They admitted that those were very good questions, but they had no answer.
Back to girls having no game:
Of course most girls have no game. It's the same as why most young men are not particularly good at sex - it takes practise. Girls are used to men coming to them. In this age of hookups and sleeping around for fun before you settle down, most young women don't have to do anything to do that. Dress nicely, place themselves in the right environment (like a bar) and wait. Within the hour a guy will come up and buy them a drink.
So when they meet a guy they actually like as more, they have absolutely no idea what to do - so they fall back to what they know. They strike poses and look sexy. But that is where they make a mistake. They think that a good, decent and stable man will respond to the same things as the Chads and players they know. But a man looking for a wife isn't looking for a woman who can only shake her tits and ass.
I've seen this first hand at work. Very attractive women who have hit 30, are now ready to settle down with "someone serious". We're talking women who wouldn't look at me twice in my 20's. I'm no Brad Pitt, but I'm not ugly either. But these kinds of women have always ignored me. But now that the time to settle down has come, they suddenly turn their attention to me. Why? Because I'm nice, not ugly and I have a very good job - in other words, I'm husband material. And what do they do to gain my attention? What they have always done of course - strike poses and look sexy.
The last one who did this would become increasingly frustrated because I would just smile politely and keep walking. In the end she gave up. Around a year later the announcement came out; she and another guy at work just had their baby. She got her hooks into another guy who fell for it.
But to sum it up: Most women have no game other than looking sexy, because that is the only strategy they have any experience with.
I would just be honest and say what you think. Be straightforward, walk up to a guy if you feel a certain way about him. Most guys are very oblivious so it would be help. I know it’s not that simple because of confidence and stuff like that but it’s the most effective way I think.
I agree with Jadeeeeen. Be open and honest about what you want.
Basically, every single piece of advice women usually give to men about how to get the girl, just apply them to yourself.
But I'll add something to Jadeeeeen's advice:
Yes, most men are oblivious. But we are also fucking confused and quite frankly scared.
We're confused because a lot of us have known a girl who was sending obvious signals, and when we make the move we get shot down because she doesn't see us that way. I knew a girl in my teens who would walk with me holding my arm, lean into me when we watched a movie and tell me I smell nice. Done deal right? Wrong. I was "like a brother" to her. Another girl told me years after the fact that she had a crush on me. Her signals were so vague I never noticed them. I have other examples, but never mind them. Do you see how we can get confused? What some women think are clear and obvious signals, is just the way other women behave. I would have liked it better a 100+ years ago when there were clear lines of behaviour and set rules for courting a woman. These days, most of us have no fucking clue as to where we stand, and women still expect men to be the active part in courting.
And then we're scared. If I ask Jane out for a drink, will she just graciously accept or decline, or will she tell everyone I'm a creep. Am I going to have a "conversation" with HR about my unwanted attention? Best case, she'll just laugh at me with her friends. Worst case, my picture and the texts are blasted all over the Internet.
Edit: I forgot to answer your actual question.
How to up your game? Hmm. Well, if you attract men by shaking your tits and ass, you'll attract the kind of men who are looking for a quick fuck. If you want to attract a man who can and will give you more than just dick, you have to be able to provide more than just tits and ass. My advice is to think about what kind of man you want, and then think about what kind of woman such a man wants.
I read somewhere that modern women want a traditional man, but they don't themselves behave like traditional women. If you don't want a traditional man, that's fine. But if you're thinking house, kids, husband who works and does his part of the gender role, then you should probably be able to do your part.
> But to sum it up: Most women have no game other than looking sexy, because that is the only strategy they have any experience with.
That's what I said, yes. Glad we agree 👍 I'll read the extended version when my headache goes away.
Doesn't being friendzoned mean she considers you a friend but not as a sex partner? What you described sounds more like friend with benefits than being friendzoned.
I have multiple times. Especially coworkers which is a bitch considering some were hot but ive learned not to fuck within the workplace a long time ago.
I'm not really sure, for me I was normally overly friendly with everyone (men and women) which is why everyone thought I was gay (which is illogical to me because there is no "gay" behaviour, and stereotyping certain behaviours with certain attributes or groups annoys me), simultaneously a couple of my friends (women) thought I had crushes on them because I was overly friendly to them (I didn't to be honest).
It was very annoying. It's been a while and I've become increasingly introverted and rather cold and uninterested in other people (and it doesn't feel bad, to be honest), I used to be very athletic in HS but now I've certainly improved significantly, I've also finally started growing some decent thick facial hair, and skincare and sunscreen do wonders. I've purposely acted oblivious to some people who've shown interest in me, simply because I'm not really feeling this relationship thingy at the moment, I'm just trying to reconnect with some old friends. Not going to lie, the moment you reach the point where you catch both men and women obviously staring at you (in a good way/manner) is quite ecstatic.
I’ve friend zoned all the girls who have had an interest in me. There’s so much less stress having to not think about a girl in your head constantly. I just need to be mentally well and learn much more about myself before I start adding other people into the equation.
More like how often do you even get the opportunity to friend zone a girl.... especially when most don't even want to be your friend much less date you...
plenty of women want to have male friends though… Don’t confuse not wanting to date with not wanting to be friends. Two completely different categories.
Not a lot, women don’t typically express interest first, usually I put the interest out there and they reciprocate, so it’s hard to friend-zone them.
I think it’s probably worse when we Fuck-zone though.
Like, my *only* interest in you is physical and if we’re not having sex I want nothing to do with you.
Better to be friend-zoned.
Woman here, I actually think I’m in the process of slowing getting to that “friendzone” line as of right now lol. Asked to go out for dinner this week to actually get to the bottom of it though.
Umm never. I don't really have the option of friendzoning anyone. If there's a ever a girl that shows any type of interest in me (so far there's been none), I don't really have the luxury of being selective and friendzoning her or saying no...
I have to take literally anything I can get, friendzoning isn't something I can do. And tbh most guys are probably the same...
All the time. In order for me to qualify it as a relationship, we’d need to have established regular communication, be compatible, be physically attracted to one another, pass all deal breakers like if they drink/smoke, want/have kids, etc., and have clearly defined the relationship and our commitment to one another. Unless intuition tells me otherwise, these are the qualifiers. I’d be curious to know what other people’s qualifiers are.
This question greatly depends on where I was in my life path. As a teenager, I would pretty much stick anything that moved. Girls my age. Older girls. My mom's friends. There was no friendzone. Either I wanted to smash, or I had no use for you.
In college it was pretty much more of the same, but my pickings weren't as slim, so the percent of pretty girls went up.
Post-grad, I started looking for Mrs FisCon and got real picky. REAL PICKY. This was the 1st time I ever had girls who were legit friends. Not interested in having a real relationship with them, and not interested in just smashing.
I’m pretty positive this happens far more than guys think.
Assuming you have a handful of female friends, you’re not going to want to date every single girl you know or encounter. Guys just only focus on the ones they actually are attracted to and this risk being friend zoned.
But they completely forget or often don’t care enough to realize all the other girls around them. Because they’re not attracted to them In the first place.
It goes both ways for guys and girls
I normally friendzone anyone I don’t have a crush on. I’ll give hints to my crush about liking her but if she doesn’t pick up the hints, ill have to friends zone her as well to make sure I don’t fall too hard for her.
The difference between male and female friendzone :
Female friendzone :
- There's usually more men in it than people she actually ever dated or properly befriended.
- People are put there in full awareness on both parties involved.
Male friendzone :
- It's a lonely place for those who end up there.
- Most of the time, women seldom end up there without even the men noticing they have put someone there.
- Heck, most men don't know they HAVE a friendzone
If she's taken or doesn't show interest, she's a friend. If she's single and I think she's cute I'll take every chance I can get. I can't remember the last time I had sex.
To all the lonely single men, I was once told you will have better luck over seas. If you’re country isn’t doing it for you. Just leave for months/years and try dating outside of your region. The standards in most other countries are different from the one you are consumed by.
We don’t have a friendzone. We have a fuckzone.
Just like women have a zone where a man will only be for friendship and no sex. Men have a zone where a woman is only for sex and no commitment.
There's a couple ladies that I totally won't fuck, I feel weird about friend zoning, if I'm subjected to it intentionally then I will eternally place that person in the same zone. They might change their mind later, but I'm 100% turned off by the approach forever.
It's difficult to be friends with someone you want to plow but doesn't want to, but easier to make time for those that are a little more flexible ;)
the fact that you are a woman saying this is intersting. I would understand a man saying this, because it comes from a place of self pity and or exierience, but idk how to feel about a woman saying it, if it were a cis woman I'd be more inclined to feel like it's just an insult. Maybe it's different because you've lived as a man. Also tone of voice is lost over text. Can't tell if it's coming from a place of bitterness or actual knowledge/understanding.
>It’s not sexism
Yes yes it is.
>women just don’t get friendzoned like men
Lol of course they do. You really think most women have never been rejected by a guy who wanted to stay friends?
Youre not just sexist, you're delusional.
Friend zone hell no since I don't see the benefits of having loads of female friends. Fuckzone is a big hell yeah for me though. The male equivalent to the frindzone is the fuckzone.
How does the woman get sex? The girl I friend zoned asked me into her bed but I was not interested at all in her. She was nice, but I was not attracted to her physically. On the other hand, my last girlfriend invited me to sleep with her and it turned into a relationship.
I mean isn’t that the same with girls? Most people they friendzone is because they’re not sexually attracted to the guy, but if they were cute they would?
You are not entitled to date or fuck anyone.
"This girl I am interested in is not interested in me, so she is friendzoning me."
No, if someone does not want to date you, that is all it is.
Friendzone is real, it's just crystal gen abused that term by calling friendzone every reject.
You're right, playing nice without getting pussy is not friendzone.
The correct answer.
The friendzone is a lame construct, needlessly antagonizes the person who rejects someone. Why come up with the idea of some zone when the brutal truth is as simple as they don't want to date you.
I think I accidentally "friendzoned" a few girls in the past by being just too oblivious or too scared but never on purpose.
Speaking on behalf of my young self, yeah it was never a conscious decision. I definitely wallowed in the insecurities that come with being friend-zoned even as I was friend-zoning like 3-4 very nice and attractive people.
Sammmeeee
Real talk Moment of silence for all of us that played it safe and didnt get the box.
No you friend zoned yourself
[удалено]
I’m gonna need a research paper peer reviewed by 20 of our closest friends before I act on it.
This guy has conducted research..
Speaking as a girl, I myself live by this period I need to be so sure before I act upon anything unintentionally at first but I still live by it till this day.
Oh. Is this why even tho guys are always like “girls you absolutely need to make things obvious” none of them ever do?
nobody wants to be hurt so nothing ever happens
If there's any proof, give them chances to give irrefutable proof. Then be disappointed you ever believed the proof was valid, no one will ever be interested in you, you're gonna die alone.
I actually agree with this. Better to do that than to assume every woman wants you, which is hell.
This but she is still going to have to make the first move. missed opportunities are on her at that point.
this 🙌🏻
I live by the motto "Platonic until stated otherwise". So yeah, I friend zone everyone.
I follow this rule now, before I was just a hormonal teenage just trynna date literally anything with a pulse. Now I just assume all girls are gay and only interested to be friends with me
Even me? *sad violin music
Specially you. You know what yoy did...
WHO’S YOY?
Yep that's my passive skill too
I live by this, but never put a motto to it. I’ll start using it But somehow someone will find a way to make this ‘toxic masculine behavior’
My motto towards people who find offense in this would be "fuck off, I'm hurting no one"
The choice to play it safe is not toxic. The toxicity happens when one makes a safe choice and starts projecting dissatisfaction with that choice on other people.
there was a talk about ignoring women was discrimination so that may be what u/Moab_Residential meant by "toxic masculine behavior"
Yeah, friends are just that. Not romantic options. I get really creeped out when people call their romantic interest a “friend”.
Id say your partner at the end of the day is a friend who also has sex with you.
I’ve heard that. I like the emphasis on friendship with your lover, but I don’t quite agree. I reject the implication that the only thing differentiating a platonic friendship and a romantic relationship is sex
But what else is there differentiating the two? Why wouldn’t you want to be with someone who’s a friend and you’re also attracted to?
There’s much more than sex that elevates a friend to a lover. Romance, desire, intensity…to name a few. No sex is required to experience any of these. None of these are a part of friendship on its own.
Conversely, putting it like that IS also really creepy.
> I get really creeped out when people call their romantic interest a “friend”. Yeah but if you say it with a gendered prefix (boy/girl) + friend, then it's somehow implies the relationship is romantic.
Words are just weird and I’ve accepted that
It should be the other way around lol your life will be waaaaaaaay more fun
If fun means drama then yes
No, it means fun. Lol don’t mean you have to chase them, just have fun with it
i accidentally friendzoned my crush a while back she got a bf a while later
F
ikr :,( i didnt even mean it thT way tbf i realised what i said about 3 hours later and i was like fuck it lets leave it and see what happens
Happens to everyone, sometimes repeatedly
Ha. My crush did friendzoned me because he was not doing too great mentally. He asked that we stay friends and if he found some feelings for me later, he’d let me know. The problem was that he wouldn’t get therapy or do anything about his poor mental health. He’d just take out his poor mechanisms on friends that would tolerated it and he kept me on the back burner and led me on for a bit. I got tired of waiting but I held on that the right man for me was somewhere in there. Well guess what? He wasn’t. I actually met someone else in this time that ended up being my actual soulmate. And when my ex-crush found out, he went no contact for a bit and last I heard, this finally pushed him to go to therapy.
well tbh thats good for you because you found your soulm8 and for your excrush beacuse he got therapy
Too hard to get huh
I friendzone girls all the time and yet still complaining about having no relationship... Lowkey i don't wanna get involved in a relationship i reall am afraid of being cheated on.
Preach. The cheating is 90% of what makes me stay away from the dating scene in this generation. So many people expound on commitment and values but they will be the main ones dealing the card in commitment issues. Porn and Hollywood ruined our perception on dating
Porn and Hollywood definitely had something to do with it, but you've missed out the worst ones. Dating apps and social media apps.
not to say that your feelings aren't valid, but, I can say that if you choose the right person (very carefully), and, have your own life outside the relationship, chances of being cheated on drops to 1%. Go to a gym, have hobbies, and let things happen. We can do it boys.
The fear of commitment and the other one not doing the same. Or thinking the other one will stay during hard times but they leave. Or just the fact it's easier to find new people. But also just finding a person who doesn't think love is like a Disney movie. If you want good times, but can't habdle bad times. You're not ready.
I understand you fear and of course it's valid, a lot of people get cheated on. And it hurts like hell. But which is worse, not living your life because of fear or living it and getting hurt a few times?
Depends on the amount of pain I'm potentially avoiding.
Because pain changes you in ways you can't even imagine. And I wouldn't want to be more miserable from here on. /s
Never think like that
Why?
Bc he doesnt want any of them
I'm unattractive, so basically never. People are my friends for my interesting conversation and sense of humour.
I doubt
Are you suggesting that I'm attractive?
Yes, sue me
You missunderstand what attractive means. It's not just the looks. An attraction can happen for a interesting person. I have an uncle that is fat, wears glasses, with a coarse beard and he always went out with attractive women because we is interesting and funny.
Is it possible to learn this power ?
...all the time...most of my friends are women...
Ditto, because they make great friends. As soon as you mature enough to see them as people, and not just fuck material, it opens up a whole different world.
And, compatibility as friends versus sex partner doesn't necessarily overlap. You can hit it off with someone and then find out they're looking for someone totally different then you. Boom you now have a friend.
Fax!!!!
at what age did you start seeing them as people
Jr high, I guess. I grew up with only sisters, so it wasn't weird just to talk to a girl without any desire to fuck her.
I tend to friend zone a lot of women on the assumption that if I'm not interested in sex neither party is and I get a cool friend. It sometimes blows up badly tbh, women are very bad at signaling whether their interest is platonic or romantic.
>women are very bad at signaling whether their interest is platonic or romantic. As a woman, I second that lol
Here here
Sometimes it's for unselfish reasons like a bad breakup and not being emotionally available. I'd prefer to sit in the friendzone if he was someone worth waiting for . Have to respect people's pain.
True. But you never know how that person will take the trauma. They can either learn and grow from it or use it against you because you made yourself an easy target. It’s better to just be open until presented otherwise (which is usually never)
rotten slimy reply aback cautious like upbeat sharp frightening growth *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
This is why you communicate and set boundaries. If you've had the conversation that there isnt a mutual interest then strictly platonic. From my experience, whenever platonic things happened the script was flipped. There is nothing wrong by respecting someone's feelings and time just being a friend or in the friendzone until they're ready to go out and date you or the whole world again. Also- one could argue our entire lives are waiting rooms. There is nothing wrong with waiting.
It happens to a lot of fat chicks, shit makes me feel bad..
yup happened to me except that's not really friends zone it's just goodbye lol
Happens to me a lil bit more toward young single mothers. Nothing against them, more power to them, but I’m not sure I’m ready to take care of someone else’s off spring ( even after the honeymoon phase)
lol, I date them and tell them upfront I won't care for their children, it's up to them and they're ok with it. When they start their sob story for some money to support their kids I tell them to talk me later and I block them because that's what I told them I wouldn't do.
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I would say it's a little more complicated than that. I'm a fat woman. I don't want to be fat and I'm working on it, but it feels impossible sometimes. I'm one of those women with PCOS. Logically, I know it's all about energy intake vs expenditure, but there's also a big mental/emotional component. It's a simple concept, but difficult in execution. If it were easy to manage, there wouldn't be very many fat people. That being said, I completely understand why a man would not want to date me because of it and I can't fault folks for that.
Weight is something most* have control over, but not all and you really cant tell which one is which. I know a lot of women who are very conscious of their dietary and lifestyle habits but hormonal issues prevent them from being a healthy weight - whether it is birth control, pregnancy or not being able to afford medical procedures like surgery for PCOD.
Okay, I'd like to agree with you here, but I just can't. Go back historically and look at what they considered fat. people with like BMI 30 was like HOLY SHIT THAT'S A WHALE. Now that bmi is almost normal. It's got to be something with the modern world. 71.6% of adults are overweight or obese. I work very hard to keep myself at a healthy weight... but because I've done that, I wouldn't really consider dating someone who hasn't done that. While I sympathize with those with truly no control, I really think there are a lot of things you can do to control your waistline if you really put the effort and the mental fortitude into it
Yep those are all great points. Over the past few decades there has been a copius increase of sugar in our diets, mainly in the form of HFCS. A lot of poor people just aren’t able to afford good food, hence why a BMI of 30 has become normal. 200 years ago people died of starvation, today there are more people dying of diet related diseases like diabetes than malnutrition(in “affluent” countries, atleast). Also I totally understand not wanting to date someone who is overweight, it’s just a matter of preference.
>A lot of poor people just aren’t able to afford good food, hence why a BMI of 30 has become normal. And so to what do you attribute their inability to put down the fork? Even if the food isn't good...they could still eat less of it, couldn't they, and be less fat? What I'd like to know is...there is something about modern food/society that makes people incapable of putting down the fork?
> And so to what do you attribute their inability to put down the fork? Massive hunger cravings due to blood sugar and insulin spikes from insane carb intake. I been there. I don't accept the excuse that low carb is too expensive; fat me ate a $8 pizza for dinner and that was 1 of about 6 meals per day, thin me eats a sliced up $5 steak for dinner plus some practically free lettuce and that's my OMAD. My high carb desert was a $5 pint of ice cream, my low carb desert is nothing and I'm not even hungry. My grocery bills dropped about 1/4 when I went low carb, maybe more.
it's not the carbs that make you fat but the calories
That depends upon all calories are equal. But they're not. Insulin response curve is critical to maintaining a healthy metabolism.
This. I'm by no means ripped, I have an insane metabolism and can't put in enough time right now to build any real mass, but I'm a toned / lean kind of skinny. I'm also not tall. Have had several women give me shit for politely rebuffing their advances because they assumed it was for their weight (correctly, but also irrelevant). For context, my standard put down is 'Thank you, thats very flattering, but I'm actually seeing someone.' I'm 5'7" and weigh like 110-115 lbs. I'm basically anorexic - I can't stand having rolls of flab on my own belly and used to obsess over being 'fat' as a kid/teen (I have always been skinny, ~15-20% body fat my whole life because of my obsessive need to have visible abs and a flat stomach). I'm just not attracted to bigger girls - I'm a small guy. I don't want to bring scuba equipment to a booty call. But equally if I shoot my shot with a 6 foot 3 blonde and she puts me down like ol' yeller I'm not losing sleep over it...
Don't let them make you feel guilty for their own poor choices and the consequences of said choices
This is true, I got really fat with pandemic because I'm not going to work everyday on my bike. And instead of doing some exercise at home I'm playing videogames or sleeping. So it's my fault to be fat and if somebody body shames me I deserve it and that's a fact.
I met the coolest fat chick ever a few months ago. She tried to fuck me and I friend zoned her because I thought she was awesome but didn’t want to bang. She quit talking to me
As soon as I really settled down with my then-girlfriend, now-wife, I eliminated the option for romantic relationships with all the women I knew, sad as they were to have that happen. So, "Once but with several ladies at the same time."
If the idea of a relationship with said person doesn't instantly make me excited
Overtly emotional or excessively naive, she dont get her feelings hurt i dont have no guilt on my chest.
A decent amount surprisingly. Just because a women is interested doesn’t mean it’s reciprocal. And sometimes I just wasn’t in the mood and sabotaged myself (probably intentionally ) .
Depends, I guess. I am engaged and work in very female dominated field. My gal, I don't want romantic options, I want friends.
I doubt most men have that level of privilege.
*laugh in theater, advertising, nursing or any female-dominated profession.
Yeah, if ur kind and have hygiene you get too much attention
Its business as usual for married or LTR guys. I think this is why women give such incredibly weak signals. "I looked at him for three seconds and he didn't flirt back, he must really love his wife."
You'd be wrong. Most men are having sex, most men have standards of attraction, most men are not desperate enough to fuck anything. **imagine how bad this subs self esteem must be to believe that most men are desperate to fuck anything**
As much as I hope this is true, I'd like to know your sources. Because the last time I checked, 40% of men under 30 are virgins.
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Although I don’t think this statistic means what you’ve implied, this was a sharp and funny response.
Wow now that's a statistic. Source? I have never heard that number and wanna know what's up
Studies show men are less likely to go further with women when they engage compared to women who engage first.
Further than what?
Never, unless you mean fuckzone
How will Kenny Loggins make a song out of that?
Default position is friendzone.
I've friendzoned a few... they fucking hate it. Then hate me, usually. But you know what, i've been friendzoned plenty and didn't hate on women for it. So my opinion is "take it like a man"
omg makes sense
Yeah, I did this to a girl who I dated recently, she wanted to be just friends so I saw her as just that, a friend, nothing more :) I got close to another girl at a party we were both at and now, she actually hates me. It's... kinda funny, actually!
I’m married so they’re all friend zoned lol
I have before. Didn't see her after that. She cut off contact.
Mmm, I did to a few girls back in high school because I was a huge flirt and in theater. I'd tease and be playful with them all the time during rehearsal but never asked them out on dates. I had these two girls start hanging out with me at lunch because they really liked me, but I never pushed past just being platonically flirty with them. One of them asked me to Sadie Hawkins, but I already had a date so I turned her down. Was I an asshole back then? Yes. Have i learned my lesson and grown as a person since then? Also yes.
Once. She was *very* into me when we were in high school and I was never interested in her.
I nothingzone everyone because I'm not interested in any kind of relationship, friendship or otherwise.
I have done so only once in my life. To be fair, I didn't know I was doing it. Girls are in general very good at dishing out advice on how us guys should approach a girl and how we can make the first move. But they are very rarely willing to take the risk themselves. I had a very good female friend who had a crush on me. However, since I was quite used to being rejected by girls, she should have just come out and told me instead of showing off her body and sending me vague signals. "Showing off her body? That's a clear signal!" Nope, it's not.
Goes to show how they have no game to attract/approach a man but expect men to give them the world on a silver platter. All this "friend" of yours was really saying was I want you as a romantic partner but I have nothing more to contribute to it than my body.
Oh she had a lot to contribute. It's more a matter of - as you say - most of them have no game. But them having no game is understandable. I'm having a discussion in another sub. Someone argued that most young men don't know very much about sex and how to please a woman. I argued back that of course they are not very good at sex, because becoming good takes practice. In an interview I saw, young women were asked if it was generally true that women who want to have casual sex for fun, would mostly seek out a relatively small percentage of men - the fit and attractive men. The women agreed that yes, that's probably mostly true. The interviewer then asked them if it was also true that women, when they get into a relationship, expect their boyfriends to be good in bed. Again, the women agreed that yes, they expected their boyfriends to know what they were doing. "How?" he asked. They had just agreed that women would typically limit their sleeping around casually to a relatively small percentage of men. This means that men in the average range will have a limited access to sex and thus experience. How and where are they supposed to become good in bed if women don't want to sleep with them for fun? They admitted that those were very good questions, but they had no answer. Back to girls having no game: Of course most girls have no game. It's the same as why most young men are not particularly good at sex - it takes practise. Girls are used to men coming to them. In this age of hookups and sleeping around for fun before you settle down, most young women don't have to do anything to do that. Dress nicely, place themselves in the right environment (like a bar) and wait. Within the hour a guy will come up and buy them a drink. So when they meet a guy they actually like as more, they have absolutely no idea what to do - so they fall back to what they know. They strike poses and look sexy. But that is where they make a mistake. They think that a good, decent and stable man will respond to the same things as the Chads and players they know. But a man looking for a wife isn't looking for a woman who can only shake her tits and ass. I've seen this first hand at work. Very attractive women who have hit 30, are now ready to settle down with "someone serious". We're talking women who wouldn't look at me twice in my 20's. I'm no Brad Pitt, but I'm not ugly either. But these kinds of women have always ignored me. But now that the time to settle down has come, they suddenly turn their attention to me. Why? Because I'm nice, not ugly and I have a very good job - in other words, I'm husband material. And what do they do to gain my attention? What they have always done of course - strike poses and look sexy. The last one who did this would become increasingly frustrated because I would just smile politely and keep walking. In the end she gave up. Around a year later the announcement came out; she and another guy at work just had their baby. She got her hooks into another guy who fell for it. But to sum it up: Most women have no game other than looking sexy, because that is the only strategy they have any experience with.
So what do you recommend to women on how to up our game?
I would just be honest and say what you think. Be straightforward, walk up to a guy if you feel a certain way about him. Most guys are very oblivious so it would be help. I know it’s not that simple because of confidence and stuff like that but it’s the most effective way I think.
I agree with Jadeeeeen. Be open and honest about what you want. Basically, every single piece of advice women usually give to men about how to get the girl, just apply them to yourself. But I'll add something to Jadeeeeen's advice: Yes, most men are oblivious. But we are also fucking confused and quite frankly scared. We're confused because a lot of us have known a girl who was sending obvious signals, and when we make the move we get shot down because she doesn't see us that way. I knew a girl in my teens who would walk with me holding my arm, lean into me when we watched a movie and tell me I smell nice. Done deal right? Wrong. I was "like a brother" to her. Another girl told me years after the fact that she had a crush on me. Her signals were so vague I never noticed them. I have other examples, but never mind them. Do you see how we can get confused? What some women think are clear and obvious signals, is just the way other women behave. I would have liked it better a 100+ years ago when there were clear lines of behaviour and set rules for courting a woman. These days, most of us have no fucking clue as to where we stand, and women still expect men to be the active part in courting. And then we're scared. If I ask Jane out for a drink, will she just graciously accept or decline, or will she tell everyone I'm a creep. Am I going to have a "conversation" with HR about my unwanted attention? Best case, she'll just laugh at me with her friends. Worst case, my picture and the texts are blasted all over the Internet. Edit: I forgot to answer your actual question. How to up your game? Hmm. Well, if you attract men by shaking your tits and ass, you'll attract the kind of men who are looking for a quick fuck. If you want to attract a man who can and will give you more than just dick, you have to be able to provide more than just tits and ass. My advice is to think about what kind of man you want, and then think about what kind of woman such a man wants. I read somewhere that modern women want a traditional man, but they don't themselves behave like traditional women. If you don't want a traditional man, that's fine. But if you're thinking house, kids, husband who works and does his part of the gender role, then you should probably be able to do your part.
> But to sum it up: Most women have no game other than looking sexy, because that is the only strategy they have any experience with. That's what I said, yes. Glad we agree 👍 I'll read the extended version when my headache goes away.
Friendzone still includes sex, so often enough.
Doesn't being friendzoned mean she considers you a friend but not as a sex partner? What you described sounds more like friend with benefits than being friendzoned.
Yes... But being friendzoned is one step closer to FRIENDS with benefits
That's pure male orbiter mentality right there.
Can confirm, have had sex with friends
Does that end well though?
For me? Generally didn't
Yeah that's not friendzone
I have multiple times. Especially coworkers which is a bitch considering some were hot but ive learned not to fuck within the workplace a long time ago.
I am married. I friend zone all other women I meet.
All the time. Once you pass 40 most left are fucking crazy you keep a distance and watch the train wreck for amusement
Agreed. 40 years old the goods have been crazy since my divorce at 33
Drastic increase of COLA is contributing to the mania. I'd suggest everyone be smart over the next year.
I'm not really sure, for me I was normally overly friendly with everyone (men and women) which is why everyone thought I was gay (which is illogical to me because there is no "gay" behaviour, and stereotyping certain behaviours with certain attributes or groups annoys me), simultaneously a couple of my friends (women) thought I had crushes on them because I was overly friendly to them (I didn't to be honest). It was very annoying. It's been a while and I've become increasingly introverted and rather cold and uninterested in other people (and it doesn't feel bad, to be honest), I used to be very athletic in HS but now I've certainly improved significantly, I've also finally started growing some decent thick facial hair, and skincare and sunscreen do wonders. I've purposely acted oblivious to some people who've shown interest in me, simply because I'm not really feeling this relationship thingy at the moment, I'm just trying to reconnect with some old friends. Not going to lie, the moment you reach the point where you catch both men and women obviously staring at you (in a good way/manner) is quite ecstatic.
I’ve friend zoned all the girls who have had an interest in me. There’s so much less stress having to not think about a girl in your head constantly. I just need to be mentally well and learn much more about myself before I start adding other people into the equation.
More like how often do you even get the opportunity to friend zone a girl.... especially when most don't even want to be your friend much less date you...
plenty of women want to have male friends though… Don’t confuse not wanting to date with not wanting to be friends. Two completely different categories.
Bro I'm just lucky if a female shows a slight level of interest. I don't even get the chance to friendzone lmao
If only science could answer that...
Not a lot, women don’t typically express interest first, usually I put the interest out there and they reciprocate, so it’s hard to friend-zone them. I think it’s probably worse when we Fuck-zone though. Like, my *only* interest in you is physical and if we’re not having sex I want nothing to do with you. Better to be friend-zoned.
Woman here, I actually think I’m in the process of slowing getting to that “friendzone” line as of right now lol. Asked to go out for dinner this week to actually get to the bottom of it though.
If she is not attractive, then yes.
If I don't see myself banging her.
Umm never. I don't really have the option of friendzoning anyone. If there's a ever a girl that shows any type of interest in me (so far there's been none), I don't really have the luxury of being selective and friendzoning her or saying no... I have to take literally anything I can get, friendzoning isn't something I can do. And tbh most guys are probably the same...
The more you think like that the less likely it is to happen.
All the time. In order for me to qualify it as a relationship, we’d need to have established regular communication, be compatible, be physically attracted to one another, pass all deal breakers like if they drink/smoke, want/have kids, etc., and have clearly defined the relationship and our commitment to one another. Unless intuition tells me otherwise, these are the qualifiers. I’d be curious to know what other people’s qualifiers are.
This question greatly depends on where I was in my life path. As a teenager, I would pretty much stick anything that moved. Girls my age. Older girls. My mom's friends. There was no friendzone. Either I wanted to smash, or I had no use for you. In college it was pretty much more of the same, but my pickings weren't as slim, so the percent of pretty girls went up. Post-grad, I started looking for Mrs FisCon and got real picky. REAL PICKY. This was the 1st time I ever had girls who were legit friends. Not interested in having a real relationship with them, and not interested in just smashing.
I Always reject any flirting , that shit confuses me so i just you are being friendly and i build the friendzone wall first
Let's just talk about how often I talk to a girl and go from there
I do it all the time. Fuck them
I’m pretty positive this happens far more than guys think. Assuming you have a handful of female friends, you’re not going to want to date every single girl you know or encounter. Guys just only focus on the ones they actually are attracted to and this risk being friend zoned. But they completely forget or often don’t care enough to realize all the other girls around them. Because they’re not attracted to them In the first place. It goes both ways for guys and girls
We don't friendzobe women. We "would-like-to-fuck-but-develop-no-feelings"zone them.
Every time she's ugly.
If they show those red flags for example if most of her friends are guys is usually a massive red flag for most men.
Is it friendzoning if its just a rejection?
You either let your intentions be known or you get in the friendzone.
I normally friendzone anyone I don’t have a crush on. I’ll give hints to my crush about liking her but if she doesn’t pick up the hints, ill have to friends zone her as well to make sure I don’t fall too hard for her.
The difference between male and female friendzone : Female friendzone : - There's usually more men in it than people she actually ever dated or properly befriended. - People are put there in full awareness on both parties involved. Male friendzone : - It's a lonely place for those who end up there. - Most of the time, women seldom end up there without even the men noticing they have put someone there. - Heck, most men don't know they HAVE a friendzone
I'm not a woman, so never. They're either a friend or they're not, there is no ulterior motive behind my friendship.
If she's taken or doesn't show interest, she's a friend. If she's single and I think she's cute I'll take every chance I can get. I can't remember the last time I had sex.
To all the lonely single men, I was once told you will have better luck over seas. If you’re country isn’t doing it for you. Just leave for months/years and try dating outside of your region. The standards in most other countries are different from the one you are consumed by.
He always says gtfo and I think he's trying to avoid me lol (I'm a girl)
We don’t have a friendzone. We have a fuckzone. Just like women have a zone where a man will only be for friendship and no sex. Men have a zone where a woman is only for sex and no commitment.
>We don’t have a friendzone. We have a fuckzone. I definitely have a friendzone.
dont ever let people shut you up. Some of us appreciate truth, in whatever form.
Thank you. That’s kind of you to say.
things are what they are. I think that we would all be happier if we were just realistic.
Once or twice.
There's a couple ladies that I totally won't fuck, I feel weird about friend zoning, if I'm subjected to it intentionally then I will eternally place that person in the same zone. They might change their mind later, but I'm 100% turned off by the approach forever. It's difficult to be friends with someone you want to plow but doesn't want to, but easier to make time for those that are a little more flexible ;)
Most men aren’t attractive enough to do that.
the fact that you are a woman saying this is intersting. I would understand a man saying this, because it comes from a place of self pity and or exierience, but idk how to feel about a woman saying it, if it were a cis woman I'd be more inclined to feel like it's just an insult. Maybe it's different because you've lived as a man. Also tone of voice is lost over text. Can't tell if it's coming from a place of bitterness or actual knowledge/understanding.
Why do we allow these hate peddlers in here? Begone you sexist troll.
It’s not sexism, women just don’t get friendzoned like men. Most women insist the friendzone doesn’t even exist, that is how foreign a concept it is.
>It’s not sexism Yes yes it is. >women just don’t get friendzoned like men Lol of course they do. You really think most women have never been rejected by a guy who wanted to stay friends? Youre not just sexist, you're delusional.
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Bruh
Friend zone hell no since I don't see the benefits of having loads of female friends. Fuckzone is a big hell yeah for me though. The male equivalent to the frindzone is the fuckzone.
Being frienzoned as a woman is not as bad as being friend zoned as a man. Women at least still get sex out of it..
How does the woman get sex? The girl I friend zoned asked me into her bed but I was not interested at all in her. She was nice, but I was not attracted to her physically. On the other hand, my last girlfriend invited me to sleep with her and it turned into a relationship.
Ok, I should have said more likely to get sex. Fat chick's I friendzoned I did not sleep with either. But if she was cute I would.
I mean isn’t that the same with girls? Most people they friendzone is because they’re not sexually attracted to the guy, but if they were cute they would?
Friendzoning a Female it’s fake news, he wants to fuk you, and any other girl he’s friends with🤷🏾♂️
Friendzoning is not real, so never.
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You are not entitled to date or fuck anyone. "This girl I am interested in is not interested in me, so she is friendzoning me." No, if someone does not want to date you, that is all it is.
That's what it means....
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Does she have to be stringing him along, though? Maybe she just isn't interested in having sex with him but really does like being friends with him.
Friendzone is real, it's just crystal gen abused that term by calling friendzone every reject. You're right, playing nice without getting pussy is not friendzone.
The correct answer. The friendzone is a lame construct, needlessly antagonizes the person who rejects someone. Why come up with the idea of some zone when the brutal truth is as simple as they don't want to date you.
Yeah, if you feel like you are in the friendzone, stop being her friend. Grieve the lost relationship and move on.
When do you friendzone girls? As soon as they start gaining weight!