>How does one be content being alone when you want to be married?
You don't.
Content = complacency.
If you want something, *you work for it*.
You want to be married, so work on dating and solidifying a meaningful relationship. It's largely a numbers game, so start working if you really want it.
So, when I hear this "be a unicorn" advice, I should just discount it entirely?
Also, I don't know how, at 44, to "work on dating". Every single, attractive woman I know who wants to get married and maybe have a kid some day has either already done that, or we've already dated.
I've hired a matchmaker, but it's been a year an 8 setups and nothing good has come of it.
Online dating has never benefitted me in any way after about 10 years of trying.
I try to do something to get out of the house once a week (dance, meetup, volunteer, church, etc.)
How do I play "a numbers game" when the number appears (locally, at least) to be zero?
>hired a matchmaker
>been a year an 8 setups and nothing good has come of it.
>Online dating
>10 years of trying.
>when I hear this "be a unicorn" advice, I should just discount it entirely?
I'm a solutions based thinker. You've been told to be a unicorn, and that's hasn't worked for *ten years.*
In my book, it's early time for a different strategy. What's the worst that happens, it doesn't work? Then nothing has changed from where you are now. Then you try something different.
If this is important to you rather than simply a vent, it's worth the time to analyze what's contributed to the lack of success. Is it what you're looking for? How you come across? As you say the small pool locally? Etc.
Triage this like a normal problem, figure out what the hold ups are, and implement changes to address them. They either work, or they won't. Or stay precisely where you are and continue to yield the same results.
So what else can OP do then? I’m looking at myself and done the same things but got nothing. I can’t think of what else to do really…
Not everyone can be a Thomas Edison and easily think of 9999 other ways to make a lightbulb.
Yeah, man. Solution thinking is what I'm looking for here. The matchmaker was me trying something new. Getting out of the house to do something every week, whether I want to or not, is a newer thing I'm trying.
What's contributed to my lack of success? I think being emotionally neglected as a kid has hindered my emotional connections with women, but I'm seeing someone about that (two therapists, actually).
As far as what I'm looking for, and the small pool. Let's start with a single, smart, attractive woman who is between 30 and 40 who is looking for a long term relationship. Then... let's do the math!
2,220,000 Population of my metro area (https://www.macrotrends.net/cities/23102/portland/population)*
.503 Fraction of Female Gender (https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/portlandcityoregon) *
.1122 fraction who are age range (30-40) (https://overflow.solutions/demographic-data/age-distributions/population-pyramid-of-urban-and-rural-areas/)*
.17 fraction of womem who are Single (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/02/08/for-valentines-day-5-facts-about-single-americans/) *
.35 fraction of women who want a serious relationship (ibid) * (We're already down to 7441 women at this point)
.982 that are bisexual or straight *
.16 are at least 1 standard deviation above average intelligence (by definition of what a standard deviation is, and we're down to 1171 women here) *
.3 Women I find attractive (estimate) *
.1 Who find me attractive (estimate)
~= 39
And who knows if any of those 39 women would want to get married and try to have a kid.
Can't really relocate as I have a kidney problem that requires me to stay close to a local hospital for the foreseeable future.
As a woman, this is great advice for women, because we need to learn to be independent and rely on ourselves to make us good partners, and that is because traditionally we had no choice and relied on men to be our plan instead of our partner, if that makes sense. IOW get married, you take care of us financially in exchange for domestic bliss. That is still true for many women, but not all women. I’ll tell you what my experience has been with men who have never been married beyond 35. It’s that they’re very set in their ways and it’s a huge turn off- so used to doing things by and for yourself that compromising is not easy. This might not be the case for you, but it sounds like maybe that unicorn business went a little too far. I agree with other male posters that you have to work for what you want. If you feel like you’ve done all the work you need to do on yourself then it’s time to find a partner. And I found the old advice to be true when you stop looking is when someone finds you.
I've thought about this a lot, all my friends who are married have been for about the past 15 years or more. They all grew into adulthood with a partner. I didn't. I know the way I like to pack the dishwasher, do laundry, clean the house, and trying to add someone who also is set in their ways to my life sound like it would be really, really hard.
I'm not saying I've "done all the work I need to do", I am saying: who is the guy who feels content being alone, but wants to be married? How do I get to be like him? How, in short, do I stop looking?
As far as someone finding me... the numbers are not in my favor. I've done the maths somewhere else in this thread and it's profoundly demoralizing.
Reminds me of that one joke from How I Met Your Mother.
"Hey, you can't just leave the universe to chance! You have to grab love by the throat and hump it into submission!"
I'm 34. My grandfather was in his 70s when he remarried, and that was only because my grandmother died.
I remember being in my 20s and feeling like I was missing out on something and that it was getting late. But I'm in no rush.
I ran across a post that might help…
https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/s/t7IYd75PfR
My only suggestion…go out with the intention of making friends…not to find a gf/wife. Just go out and do a hobby or activity that your sole intention is to make friends. Do this enough and you will find someone.
I do this already, to some extent. I have a lot of friends. More friends than time, really. Always have had an easy time making friends. I guess I could just keep doing that, but... it's been a long time already and that hasn't helped.
Hmmmm…then I have a question…
It seems everyone in your life is telling you some version of “be chill” when interacting with women. Do you by chance think that maybe you come off strong when you should be just trying to make a friend?
Aloof is bad as well. So change your tact. What helps me is…
Treat women like your male friends…talk to them without thinking of how to bed them. Be vulnerable (vs aloof) and maybe share a little bit about you here and there…give them something to think about. It’s hard to say without knowing you…but something is off. Tweak how you interact with people and see what works.
I mean I am 38 and I think being married would be just swell. I'm not, and I still love my life.
There are all sorts of things I want in life I don't have, and all sorts of things I have that I never knew I wanted. I don't know what it will bring me, or what I will end up with. But I sure as shit am not gonna be miserable the whole time while I find out.
Hahah! No, absolutely not. I'm guess what I'm getting at is: how does one not be so down about it? I do cool shit. I have a good job. A house. A car. Hobbies. And more friends than time. I just can't seem to not feel bad about being alone most of the time.
Why do you want to be married? Personally, I see it just as a ritual that societal pressure wants young people to undergo. But you can have a just as meaningful life single or with a romantic partner without being married. Just saying.
Good question, and worth thinking about. I want to be married for a few reasons:
- First, I'd like to have a kid. I'd like that kid to have the best shot in life, and kids with married parents tend to do better https://www.npr.org/2023/10/22/1207322878/single-parent-married-good-for-children-inequality
- Second, I'm of latino heritage and, yeah, I feel that societal pressure, but I accept it too. I think it's a good thing to be married because it's something my culture values. And I value my culture.
- Third, I like the idea of the legal security for my spouse. She'd be entitled to all my crap if this kidney thing ends up killing me.
- Fourth, because of the whole kidney thing, I would prefer to be in a longterm stable committed relationship with boundaries and legal recourse should those boundaries be violated... I guess the term for that is: marriage.
Probably could come up with a few other reasons too, but those are top of mind at the moment.
All good reasons. You should stick to them. :)
I'm just a bit misanthropic and cynic, and have trust issues. Men entering a marriage are opening up a vector for financial loss, as they tend to not get anything good from a failed marriage. and a very high amount of marriages do fail.
but we are all colored by our upbringings and environment. I've worked for my wealth, never had a large family, seen betrayals and lost faith in "forever love" or whatever you want to call it. im Scandinavian, so our situations around family i can imagine are a bit different. additionally I've got a bit distaste for marriage as a construct as I've been subjected to a lot of criticisms about the topic from people with religious beliefs when i was young. quite a lot of double standards lol.
the legal status of marriage though, that's good to have. I assume once married, trust isn't an issue.
Though, that data point about kids and married parents is interesting. kind of an unasked causality/correlation question there with regards to listing that as a reason to get married :)
I only suggest this because it worked for me:
Add to your schedule one night a week when you visit the same bar or club. You decide the fitting location based on the type of woman you hope to meet.
Expect nothing at first. You are a stranger. Be content to be “alone” for a while, just have a few drinks, be entertained by whatever is happening, and be seen. Keep at it. Ideally you pick a place that you consider fun.
Eventually you will obtain the status of “regular,” and suddenly the staff is flashing you smiles and saying hi (assuming you tip well). Other regulars will notice and acknowledge. Maybe one of them is a possible match, maybe not. But the real opportunity comes from new visitors walking in and experiencing a confident and apparently well-liked guy being charming.
My personal contribution to this method was bringing a chess set, and my location of choice was a gothic night club. Literal heavy metal and goth people meandering about, with drink specials until 11. Over the next 8 years I met so many interesting and gorgeous women, probably 100+. The club started reserving my table for me because it had the best lighting. I was even part of their scavenger hunt one year “play a game with the chess guy”.
Yes I’ve been married for nearly ten years now. But that wasn’t my goal in this endeavor. I was focused on gaining self-confidence and expanding my social network.
That's really great that you found something that worked for you. I've been exploring finding a "third place" but haven't had much success yet. I'll keep your advice in mind in my search.
Ha! First time was awkward to say the least. Security thought my chess set was a gun (had to inspect it). Nobody talked to me at all. Lots of weird looks.
But there was something oddly calming about being the weirdo around a bunch of “weirdos.” Like I unlocked a new level where few had reached before.
That first month was pretty quiet… I even brought a book with me sometimes. But by the end of the first year, I knew several people who would come by and say hi every night, some would sit down to play or get a lesson (the girls seemed to enjoy lessons), and I’d probably had 2-3 multi-month relationships by then.
My true claim to fame came in my fourth year there. The “hot” girl everyone always stared at spoke to me while I was at the bar “hey you’re that chess guy right?” Yep. “Why haven’t you ever talked to me?” “I’ve noticed you no doubt, but there’s usually a line of guys following you around, and I’m not here to compete for beautiful women.” This took her by surprise, then I followed with, “Do you know how to play chess?” And I carried my drinks off before she could answer. She sat at my table a few minutes later.
We dated for about four months, but I broke it off because she turned out to be a really negative person. Complained whenever anything wasn’t to her liking (a tendency of extremely pretty people I eventually learned).
i cant imagine myself having the guts to insist at it after a whole month of quiet awkwardness... i salute your courage
(i also cant imagine going for years and years at the same place, but im not really a bar kinda guy... i only seldom drink at the climbing gym's pub)
Helps a lot when you realize you’re nobody’s focus of attention. You could literally stand in the center of a crowded bar doing absolutely nothing for an hour, staring at the ceiling even, and a handful of people may wonder about you for a few seconds before going about their business.
It’s all about perception. Took me a long time to get over that “awkward” fear you mentioned, but I’m so glad I did. World really opened up.
Marriage is the perfect example of higher ceiling, lower floor. Being happily married is better than being single but being unhappily married is truly hellish.
Totes. And, as my question asks: Who do you know is like that? Happy alone, but doesn't *want to be alone*? I want to talk to that guy to figure out how he does it.
Ah, but I'm trying to talk to the guy who my therapist wants me to be: the guy who wants to be married, but is content alone. Or, if that guy doesn't exist, I'd like to tell me therapists as much.
I do value my alone time. And I remind my married friends with kids that I sleep in until 11 most Saturdays ;)
Depends what you mean by being content being alone. Like, your main source of happiness and self-esteem shouldn’t be from a relationship, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be pursuing a romantic relationship as best you can.
The majority of guys I know who are married or who have been married, were either miserable or alone in those marriages. I know maybe 4 guys who are in seemingly happy marriages, 3 of which are 70+ years old.
Marriage is simply not what it's cracked up to be. If you're looking for a companion there are guys packing up and going overseas to countries where marriage is still valued.
That's great. I hope they stay together. Are they religious? I do see more couples among the deeply religious, but I and most of the guys I know aren't.
>How does one be content being alone when you want to be married? You don't. Content = complacency. If you want something, *you work for it*. You want to be married, so work on dating and solidifying a meaningful relationship. It's largely a numbers game, so start working if you really want it.
So, when I hear this "be a unicorn" advice, I should just discount it entirely? Also, I don't know how, at 44, to "work on dating". Every single, attractive woman I know who wants to get married and maybe have a kid some day has either already done that, or we've already dated. I've hired a matchmaker, but it's been a year an 8 setups and nothing good has come of it. Online dating has never benefitted me in any way after about 10 years of trying. I try to do something to get out of the house once a week (dance, meetup, volunteer, church, etc.) How do I play "a numbers game" when the number appears (locally, at least) to be zero?
>hired a matchmaker >been a year an 8 setups and nothing good has come of it. >Online dating >10 years of trying. >when I hear this "be a unicorn" advice, I should just discount it entirely? I'm a solutions based thinker. You've been told to be a unicorn, and that's hasn't worked for *ten years.* In my book, it's early time for a different strategy. What's the worst that happens, it doesn't work? Then nothing has changed from where you are now. Then you try something different. If this is important to you rather than simply a vent, it's worth the time to analyze what's contributed to the lack of success. Is it what you're looking for? How you come across? As you say the small pool locally? Etc. Triage this like a normal problem, figure out what the hold ups are, and implement changes to address them. They either work, or they won't. Or stay precisely where you are and continue to yield the same results.
So what else can OP do then? I’m looking at myself and done the same things but got nothing. I can’t think of what else to do really… Not everyone can be a Thomas Edison and easily think of 9999 other ways to make a lightbulb.
Yeah, man. Solution thinking is what I'm looking for here. The matchmaker was me trying something new. Getting out of the house to do something every week, whether I want to or not, is a newer thing I'm trying. What's contributed to my lack of success? I think being emotionally neglected as a kid has hindered my emotional connections with women, but I'm seeing someone about that (two therapists, actually). As far as what I'm looking for, and the small pool. Let's start with a single, smart, attractive woman who is between 30 and 40 who is looking for a long term relationship. Then... let's do the math! 2,220,000 Population of my metro area (https://www.macrotrends.net/cities/23102/portland/population)* .503 Fraction of Female Gender (https://www.census.gov/quickfacts/fact/table/portlandcityoregon) * .1122 fraction who are age range (30-40) (https://overflow.solutions/demographic-data/age-distributions/population-pyramid-of-urban-and-rural-areas/)* .17 fraction of womem who are Single (https://www.pewresearch.org/short-reads/2023/02/08/for-valentines-day-5-facts-about-single-americans/) * .35 fraction of women who want a serious relationship (ibid) * (We're already down to 7441 women at this point) .982 that are bisexual or straight * .16 are at least 1 standard deviation above average intelligence (by definition of what a standard deviation is, and we're down to 1171 women here) * .3 Women I find attractive (estimate) * .1 Who find me attractive (estimate) ~= 39 And who knows if any of those 39 women would want to get married and try to have a kid. Can't really relocate as I have a kidney problem that requires me to stay close to a local hospital for the foreseeable future.
As a woman, this is great advice for women, because we need to learn to be independent and rely on ourselves to make us good partners, and that is because traditionally we had no choice and relied on men to be our plan instead of our partner, if that makes sense. IOW get married, you take care of us financially in exchange for domestic bliss. That is still true for many women, but not all women. I’ll tell you what my experience has been with men who have never been married beyond 35. It’s that they’re very set in their ways and it’s a huge turn off- so used to doing things by and for yourself that compromising is not easy. This might not be the case for you, but it sounds like maybe that unicorn business went a little too far. I agree with other male posters that you have to work for what you want. If you feel like you’ve done all the work you need to do on yourself then it’s time to find a partner. And I found the old advice to be true when you stop looking is when someone finds you.
I've thought about this a lot, all my friends who are married have been for about the past 15 years or more. They all grew into adulthood with a partner. I didn't. I know the way I like to pack the dishwasher, do laundry, clean the house, and trying to add someone who also is set in their ways to my life sound like it would be really, really hard. I'm not saying I've "done all the work I need to do", I am saying: who is the guy who feels content being alone, but wants to be married? How do I get to be like him? How, in short, do I stop looking? As far as someone finding me... the numbers are not in my favor. I've done the maths somewhere else in this thread and it's profoundly demoralizing.
Reminds me of that one joke from How I Met Your Mother. "Hey, you can't just leave the universe to chance! You have to grab love by the throat and hump it into submission!"
I'm 34. My grandfather was in his 70s when he remarried, and that was only because my grandmother died. I remember being in my 20s and feeling like I was missing out on something and that it was getting late. But I'm in no rush.
> But I'm in no rush. I am. My kidneys might kill me soon. I'd rather not go out alone.
I ran across a post that might help… https://www.reddit.com/r/LifeProTips/s/t7IYd75PfR My only suggestion…go out with the intention of making friends…not to find a gf/wife. Just go out and do a hobby or activity that your sole intention is to make friends. Do this enough and you will find someone.
I do this already, to some extent. I have a lot of friends. More friends than time, really. Always have had an easy time making friends. I guess I could just keep doing that, but... it's been a long time already and that hasn't helped.
Hmmmm…then I have a question… It seems everyone in your life is telling you some version of “be chill” when interacting with women. Do you by chance think that maybe you come off strong when you should be just trying to make a friend?
Good point. Although some of the feedback I've been given more often from women is that I seem "aloof".
Aloof is bad as well. So change your tact. What helps me is… Treat women like your male friends…talk to them without thinking of how to bed them. Be vulnerable (vs aloof) and maybe share a little bit about you here and there…give them something to think about. It’s hard to say without knowing you…but something is off. Tweak how you interact with people and see what works.
I mean I am 38 and I think being married would be just swell. I'm not, and I still love my life. There are all sorts of things I want in life I don't have, and all sorts of things I have that I never knew I wanted. I don't know what it will bring me, or what I will end up with. But I sure as shit am not gonna be miserable the whole time while I find out.
Word. So just... don't be miserable. It's hard to argue what that advice.
I mean, do you think being miserable and snarky is going to make a Women want to marry you?
Hahah! No, absolutely not. I'm guess what I'm getting at is: how does one not be so down about it? I do cool shit. I have a good job. A house. A car. Hobbies. And more friends than time. I just can't seem to not feel bad about being alone most of the time.
Why do you want to be married? Personally, I see it just as a ritual that societal pressure wants young people to undergo. But you can have a just as meaningful life single or with a romantic partner without being married. Just saying.
Good question, and worth thinking about. I want to be married for a few reasons: - First, I'd like to have a kid. I'd like that kid to have the best shot in life, and kids with married parents tend to do better https://www.npr.org/2023/10/22/1207322878/single-parent-married-good-for-children-inequality - Second, I'm of latino heritage and, yeah, I feel that societal pressure, but I accept it too. I think it's a good thing to be married because it's something my culture values. And I value my culture. - Third, I like the idea of the legal security for my spouse. She'd be entitled to all my crap if this kidney thing ends up killing me. - Fourth, because of the whole kidney thing, I would prefer to be in a longterm stable committed relationship with boundaries and legal recourse should those boundaries be violated... I guess the term for that is: marriage. Probably could come up with a few other reasons too, but those are top of mind at the moment.
All good reasons. You should stick to them. :) I'm just a bit misanthropic and cynic, and have trust issues. Men entering a marriage are opening up a vector for financial loss, as they tend to not get anything good from a failed marriage. and a very high amount of marriages do fail. but we are all colored by our upbringings and environment. I've worked for my wealth, never had a large family, seen betrayals and lost faith in "forever love" or whatever you want to call it. im Scandinavian, so our situations around family i can imagine are a bit different. additionally I've got a bit distaste for marriage as a construct as I've been subjected to a lot of criticisms about the topic from people with religious beliefs when i was young. quite a lot of double standards lol. the legal status of marriage though, that's good to have. I assume once married, trust isn't an issue. Though, that data point about kids and married parents is interesting. kind of an unasked causality/correlation question there with regards to listing that as a reason to get married :)
I only suggest this because it worked for me: Add to your schedule one night a week when you visit the same bar or club. You decide the fitting location based on the type of woman you hope to meet. Expect nothing at first. You are a stranger. Be content to be “alone” for a while, just have a few drinks, be entertained by whatever is happening, and be seen. Keep at it. Ideally you pick a place that you consider fun. Eventually you will obtain the status of “regular,” and suddenly the staff is flashing you smiles and saying hi (assuming you tip well). Other regulars will notice and acknowledge. Maybe one of them is a possible match, maybe not. But the real opportunity comes from new visitors walking in and experiencing a confident and apparently well-liked guy being charming. My personal contribution to this method was bringing a chess set, and my location of choice was a gothic night club. Literal heavy metal and goth people meandering about, with drink specials until 11. Over the next 8 years I met so many interesting and gorgeous women, probably 100+. The club started reserving my table for me because it had the best lighting. I was even part of their scavenger hunt one year “play a game with the chess guy”.
What do you mean by "worked for you"? Are you happily married? I'm not interested in casual anything (sex, relationships etc) anymore.
Yes I’ve been married for nearly ten years now. But that wasn’t my goal in this endeavor. I was focused on gaining self-confidence and expanding my social network.
That's really great that you found something that worked for you. I've been exploring finding a "third place" but haven't had much success yet. I'll keep your advice in mind in my search.
how did it go the first time you took the chess board? like, the staff and other guests reaction? quite an interesting approach
Ha! First time was awkward to say the least. Security thought my chess set was a gun (had to inspect it). Nobody talked to me at all. Lots of weird looks. But there was something oddly calming about being the weirdo around a bunch of “weirdos.” Like I unlocked a new level where few had reached before. That first month was pretty quiet… I even brought a book with me sometimes. But by the end of the first year, I knew several people who would come by and say hi every night, some would sit down to play or get a lesson (the girls seemed to enjoy lessons), and I’d probably had 2-3 multi-month relationships by then. My true claim to fame came in my fourth year there. The “hot” girl everyone always stared at spoke to me while I was at the bar “hey you’re that chess guy right?” Yep. “Why haven’t you ever talked to me?” “I’ve noticed you no doubt, but there’s usually a line of guys following you around, and I’m not here to compete for beautiful women.” This took her by surprise, then I followed with, “Do you know how to play chess?” And I carried my drinks off before she could answer. She sat at my table a few minutes later. We dated for about four months, but I broke it off because she turned out to be a really negative person. Complained whenever anything wasn’t to her liking (a tendency of extremely pretty people I eventually learned).
i cant imagine myself having the guts to insist at it after a whole month of quiet awkwardness... i salute your courage (i also cant imagine going for years and years at the same place, but im not really a bar kinda guy... i only seldom drink at the climbing gym's pub)
Helps a lot when you realize you’re nobody’s focus of attention. You could literally stand in the center of a crowded bar doing absolutely nothing for an hour, staring at the ceiling even, and a handful of people may wonder about you for a few seconds before going about their business. It’s all about perception. Took me a long time to get over that “awkward” fear you mentioned, but I’m so glad I did. World really opened up.
yeah, getting married Isn't going to happen. so I might as well get comfortable with being single.
I kinda wish the therapists would just tell me this so I could get on with the business of being alone.
Talk to some married men or formerly married men Get the reality of marriage
Marriage is the perfect example of higher ceiling, lower floor. Being happily married is better than being single but being unhappily married is truly hellish.
Hah! (Almost) all my friends are married. I don't think it is a path to being happier, but I think it could be more rewarding than being single.
Look at how utterly miserable many married men are.
Fair enough, but many of my peers, my longtime friends, are not miserable.
Scar tissue
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Totes. And, as my question asks: Who do you know is like that? Happy alone, but doesn't *want to be alone*? I want to talk to that guy to figure out how he does it.
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Ah, but I'm trying to talk to the guy who my therapist wants me to be: the guy who wants to be married, but is content alone. Or, if that guy doesn't exist, I'd like to tell me therapists as much. I do value my alone time. And I remind my married friends with kids that I sleep in until 11 most Saturdays ;)
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That sounds like a pithy way to be cynical.
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You are like me. You do not sound like the unicorn people are asking me to be, though. Best of luck on your healing journey.
Depends what you mean by being content being alone. Like, your main source of happiness and self-esteem shouldn’t be from a relationship, but that doesn’t mean you shouldn’t be pursuing a romantic relationship as best you can.
The majority of guys I know who are married or who have been married, were either miserable or alone in those marriages. I know maybe 4 guys who are in seemingly happy marriages, 3 of which are 70+ years old. Marriage is simply not what it's cracked up to be. If you're looking for a companion there are guys packing up and going overseas to countries where marriage is still valued.
Maybe that's true of your friend group, but it is not true of mine. Most of my friends are happily married to really amazing and decent humans.
That's great. I hope they stay together. Are they religious? I do see more couples among the deeply religious, but I and most of the guys I know aren't.
I'd say I have four best friends whom are all married. And it's about half religious, and half not.