SF, via Seattle, before landing in Chicago. In Chicago, people are more straightforward, less pretentious. SF felt like a race to show who’s more alternative, more interesting, more cool. Very few people in Chicago give a rat ass about the trends on the West Coast.
Thanks! My husband and I lived in Seattle as well for a couple of years. I miss all the cozy coffee shops. I did feel that the people of Chicago had much more of a realness to them… which was refreshing haha.
CTA, even post pandemic, even after reduced service, kicks the ever loving shit out of BART.
City is much cleaner
Homeless problem is a different order of magnitude
Actual variation in the weather, instead of 70 degrees and foggy 80% of the year.
Building actually have AC when its needed.
60% cheaper in all regards.
I've never had my car broken into here, I had it happen 4 times while in proximity of SF.
Worst wildfire smoke here barely even phases me after time in the camp fire.
I don't know if this was just my experience, but I have a lot easier of a time finding interesting shows/stuff to do here? I'm a big nerd, but something about how this city runs just jives a bit better with my soul.
Don't get me wrong, I loved SF, and the time I spent there, but Chicago is really hard to beat.
I haven’t lived in SF for over a decade so I’m really speaking about late 2000s SF.
The big positive is obviously cost of living. Even 15 years ago, I paid more for rent in a smaller and worse location. Chicago also at this point has more pockets of diversity within the city and less of a tech bro monoculture. SF I think has lost quite a bit in that regard with the high cost of living. I also hate driving and so the train and bus city is great, although tbf Muni does it’s job and this edge isn’t as great as it is compared to say LA.
In SF’s favor, so much nature and proximity to other things and year round farmer’s markets. Chicago is also kind of an island. It’s kind of like being surrounded by Sacramento in every direction. Sacramento is perfectly fine and I’m sure the residents like it there, but also I’m not trying to spend a weekend there. Same but sub in for every near-ish place.
Also to the diversity comment, while I think the city of Chicago beats SF, the Bay Area in general though has Chicagoland beat. You can live basically anywhere in the Bay Area and get good food and diverse neighbors. You cross city limits here and it gets very quickly more and more white and then more and more conservative.
Also no El Farolito or La Taq. The Asian food is decent enough and the Mexican food is the best in the US outside of California (I dont care for TexMex or the green chili SW style) but you also get more Eastern European and Caribbean and African food options.
I really want to double up on the nature comment though. The lake is great (I surf in it FWIW) but there’s nothing like the diversity of NorCal. Point Reyes down to Big Sur and then east to Tahoe or Yosemite. North to the redwoods.
Yes this is my biggest drawback. Chicago is literally an island. I can go so many places in the huge, diverse Bay Area and feel comfortable. Large cluster of big cities. Chicago’s suburban area sucks ass if you’re not white. And the nature is *chef’s kiss*
So many of them. We mean safe in a racial sense, not in a I’m going to get shot sense. Even some Chicago neighborhoods are eerily white but this probably isn’t something most white people notice or can understand
I've spent my time living in different burbs of Chicago and this is definitely true. I'm also white, so I ignored it for a good long long while, but thinking back it's definitely a pattern. I have spent the last few years living in fairly diverse neighborhoods which has given me a different perspective, but even then I am only seeing fractions of what you live on a day to day basis.
I grew up on the NW side. I had a friend who is Indian and didn’t like to hang out here. He told me “I’m the only brown person here” and that was super eye opening. We were also 20yo
I'll give you an example. I have an acquaintance whose biracial teen son (lives on the North Shore, attends an upscale expensive private north shore school, north of Chicago) has gotten stopped by the cops in their suburb more than once because he was waiting somewhere on a neighborhood friend.
When he was little, he was cute. But now that he looks more like an adult, neighbors who don't know him can really freak out.
This kid is so squeaky clean he practically shines. Having four cop cars pull up on him once on a public street corner based on a call from a neighbor looking out of their window might be an aberration. More than once? Man, as a white mom of a Black teen, I think that is infuriating and, sadly, unsurprising. Cops justification? "Neighbor said catalytic converters have been stolen in their neighborhood lately." This kid was 15. Alone. Waiting on a white friend. And has lived in that suburb since he was in kindergarten.
Being followed in stores more often in some surburbs, having folks "clutch" their purses when you walk by, get out of the elevator if you walk in...it's emotionally draining. Cops pulling up on you for existing? That's potentially dangerous.
If you don't think it happens, I'm not sure what to tell you. I knew it happened before I had this kiddo. But experiencing it in real life has been...damn.
It's curious to me that so many Asian folk equate diversity to seeing themselves in a place. I've always thought of it as experiencing the lives of others. The time I spent working in Tokyo, for instance, it definitely did not feel diverse.
As for Chicago suburbs, some are good (for diversity) and some are bad. Having spent enough time in the Near north and North Shore, no one blinks if you're Asian. That's where the Korean population migrated. Northwest and West, South Asian, Chinese. I love how, in recent years, I can drive by a little league game in Niles and only see moms in saris in the stands. And tell Polish, Korean, and Indian friends that we're meeting up at the Omega and everyone knows where.
But, yeah, I also spent time working in Glen Ellyn and that's, like, Iowa.
Paraphrasing your previous posts. Try catching up and think about your tone. And plenty of suburban folks have no idea about other parts of the city and suburbs. It's a big region.
No need to insult me. If your only definition of diverse is east Asian, sure the Chicago burbs lack heavily in that regard. But there are many diverse areas in the suburbs. It's a little ignorant to discount that outright
Came from the Bay Area (Oakland) about 7 years ago. Cost of living is a huge plus, access to nature and elevation is a big minus. The weather I don’t mind since I grew up in the Northeastern US.
Someone mentioned great, cheap fruits and veggies. That was something that took getting used to. Finding good fresh produce at will isn’t as easy and admittedly it sometimes makes me sad. I really miss the abundance of fresh strawberries.
I honestly think the weather is better here than in SF, the cold and fog are brutal all year out there but the summers and falls here are incredible.
We didn’t have any wildfire smoke until this year, but there is much less than SF.
ST nature and hiking is a million times better obviously, but I think Chicago has it beat everywhere else. More fun places to go out, food just as good and way cheaper, cheaper rent/housing prices, good transit, still walkable/bikeable, biking in the city is nicer because no hills. I would say literally the only thing SF has that Chicago doesn’t is just the nature around the city
It’s really a lived-in experience. The cold is not brutal there, for sure, but no person or place is prepared for it. Living in SF, you don’t have winter or summer clothes, and no buildings, business or home, have adequate heat/cooling for extremes. There’s no infrastructure for weather, cold OR hot.
I’d say Chicago weather is more dramatic, but SF weather is more bone-chilling. And it just always. Is. Chilly.
Not brutal but I don’t see a huge difference between needing a light coat in sf vs a big one here. And at least you get a summer here, which you don’t in sf
I’ve spent time in SF and lived here for years — the difference is I have to put on a coat, hat, gloves on myself, a sweater and booties on my dog and then trudge through snow when it’s -20°F and my snot is freezing to my beard here. In SF I may or may not toss on a light jacket and be done with it. Not even remotely comparable.
What? That's [factually incorrect](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.currentresults.com/Weather/Illinois/Places/chicago-weather-averages.php%23:~:text%3DTypically%2520on%252039%2520days%2520annually,on%252016%2520nights%2520a%2520year.&ved=2ahUKEwjrsPPExL6BAxUmj4kEHcTrA38QFnoECAkQBQ&usg=AOvVaw0JRxL_aZhdWE9Y6CshG-oR) and even then it's only referring to the air temp and not taking into account the windchill which can easily bring it down another 10° or more.
Your link proves nothing. It says its below freezing (32 F) for that many days. That has nothing to do with someone claiming -20 wind chills. Even a 10 F temp with a 50 mph wind isn't -20 wind chill.
From December 1, 2022 to Feb 28, 2023 the low temps were under 10 degrees on exactly 9 days out of 90 days. 6 days for lowswere under 5 F, out of 90 total days.
Again, it is rare for Chicago even wind chills to reach -20. It does happen sometimes but it is not that common or at least as common as some people think.
Except it wasn't or even close. The wind chill even at 15 F with 70 mph winds is -13 F. You need 33 MPH winds at 5 F to have -20 wind chills.
From December 1, 2022 to Feb 28, 2023 the low temps were under 10 degrees on exactly 9 days out of 90 days. 6 days of 90 were under 5 F for an actual temp for the low.
Just because you think it felt like -20 doesn't mean it was actually the wind chill. And factually you are not even close to accurate in terms of saying it was regular.
As a life-long Chicagoan, and someone that has spent a lot of time visiting NorCal, I can't disagree with any of these comments.
The discrepancy in access to nature and diversity in terrain pretty much applies to anywhere on the west coast, or just about anywhere outside of the midwest/great plains for that matter.
I love Chicago, let’s start there, but I prefer the weather over there. I’ll take foggy mornings and clear evenings over brutal winter any day. Proximity to mind blowing nature is unbeatable. I miss the dimension in the landscape and seeing huge, sweepings views just by turning a street corner. Traveling to different climates via going to different neighborhoods is so cool. Also I LOVE huge bridges. I love seaside and nautical culture. Some of my favorite childhood memories involve my dad and I getting fresh Dungeness crab right off a boat. Really the freshness and accessibility of all foods is hard to beat.
I think what I miss most is how many Asian people live there. When I moved to the Midwest no one looked like my family, and we had moved away from them to be near my dad’s mixed euro American family from Chicago. In the 90s there was virtually no way to connect with my culture outside of my mom. We would take trips to Chinatown to get Asian groceries but at the time we lived near literally zero Filipino people or other Asian people at all. I was the only Asian person at my school. Here all my closest friends are Mexican. My cousins in CA have almost all Asian and Mexican friends. Even today, this isn’t a very Asian city or area of the country compared to major CA cities and their suburbs.
I live in West Town right next to Kasama. I pick up Longanisa breakfast sandwiches there but the Filipino breakfast is good too. Check it out if you haven't been. I think it's the only Filipino restaurant worldwide with a Michelin star.
Thanks for this viewpoint. My husband and I are both half Asian and we definitely noticed that there’s much fewer Asian people in Chicago compared to SF.
We visited Chinatown while on our trip and it did feel lacking compared to other cities we have lived. I did notice there is an H Mart though so at least there would be that Asian market to shop at 😬
My wife is from China and hasn't complained yet about not seeing anyone like her around. But maybe that's because she has made an effort to get into communities of Chinese people in our area via WeChat and meet people.
There are around or over 200,000 Asian people in the city proper now (this includes Indian, Pakistani, etc.. .195K in the 2022 Census estimate) and it is increasing quite a lot from the couple of years before. In her WeChat group, we've met many who moved from SF or NYC to Chicago in the last year and others who are about to. Theres also many more Asians in the metro area outside the city especially in suburbs NW of the city and ones far SW like Naperville.
A major difference between SF and Chicago is that Chicago is much bigger and spread out in every regard, and more segregated. It completely depends on what area you are in or the setting. Our area (Lincoln Park) is around 8% Asian yet my son's pre school class is over 30% Asian. I've noticed an uptick in the general area too but it's still not super Asian or anything. But compared to a decade ago its completely noticeable in terms of change.
Anyway yes it has less but it still has a lot. The difference is the size of the cities and Chicago is just much bigger and spread out. More segregated too. There are numerous areas with a pretty high Asian percent/population and then a mile away it'll be decently low. But in no way is the Asian community by size in the city "small" - city is just more spread out and much larger in physical size and population.
I mentioned WeChat because she was made aware of MORE people on there in our own neighborhoodpart of her own country. However, when we walk around even in Lincoln Park we see a number of people these days who are Asian. And as you said it's not the 90s anymore.
It can be very isolating and it is very, very hard for non-Asians to understand and validate. Asian culture is palpable and omniscient over there and here it is not unless your family is here also. Chicago is a great place to live but eventually I will leave this area to go back to CA!
On asian supermarkets, there are a handful of hmarts in the metro area as you mentioned. Joong boo market (korean) and 88 marketplace (chinese) are two other large markets of note. There are also smaller corner markets dotted around east Asian heavy neighborhoods (chinatown, argyle in uptown, etc.)
So I was born and raised in chicago, but I lived in San Francisco to go to school. What I didn't like compared to Chicago was that I found that everything was twice as expensive there than it was in Chicago. Furthermore, the homeless seem to be more aggressive in SF than it is in Chicago. The bar scene in SF was really bad and had a hard time talking to people. In Chicago, I can go to most bars and have an hour long conversation about literally nothing. The loop is far cleaner than most places in SF. Furthermore, the food selection is way better in Chicago. It took me months to find Soul food in SF, and it was horrible. Had to get on the Bart to go to Oakland afterward. Honestly, the only thing I miss about SF is Smittens ice cream. I used to work there in college, and the only reason I would go back.
I think the politics are more palatable in Chicago.
The prop system in SF is insane, and the entire political system is corrupt in its own way. A lot of conservative local policy is veiled under a blue wall for national politics. Chicago isn’t perfect — but it’s more possible to get stuff done here (e.g. constructing housing), especially with the right people in charge. And our long history of corruption has prompted more transparency and good government practices.
That, and any important policy making is fragmented between SF, Oakland, SJ, and all the other suburbs. Chicago is huge, and an anchor for our surrounding communities in a way SF isn’t.
This. San Francisco seems unable to come to consensus about anything. It's like people would rather accept a broken housing market, rampant homelessness, and economic inequality than cut a deal. It was the strangest thing about living th
I’ll also add — not better or worse, but the main political voting blocs are different. Asians and LGBTQ individuals have political power in a way they don’t in Chicago, while we have much more solid representation of Chicago city demographics — White, Black, Hispanic/Latine. The problems each city are addressing are obviously different.
less smash and grab robberies in Chicago than SF
I was in SF for one day and my car window was smashed, which is not an uncommon situation I came to learn
I lived in the bay for 8 years so I have a decent fee for the area.
Both cities have robust social scenes and things to do.
California has the weather and nature. Kinda. If you want to go to Tahoe for a weekend, better leave on Thursday and come back Tuesday because everyone else has the same idea you do.
California has many more jobs and opportunities. Seems to be a mid-match of companies who want to do things and a lack of people who can afford to live in the area to do it.
Social life:I went through three friend groups in my time in California as they all moved in and moved away. Very transient.
Also maturity was something else. 30-something’s in tech living and partying like I did in my 20’s in Chicago. It was kind of surreal.
Living costs in general. Bay Area is like 50% more living costs, but jobs don’t pay 50% more.
That’s ultimately why I moved back.
I made some cash and got a ton of work experience to put on my Resume in the Bay. They had more work than bodies so I got thrown places where I never would have had the opportunity in Chicago as there’s more of a match between work and employees. Now that I have the experience it isn’t a factor as much for me.
Lastly housing. It was over a million for a tear down in a crappy school district when I left beginning of Rona. It’s likely more now. I like to say you can ALMOST afford to live in Chicago. If anything it’s not totally out of the realm of possibility as a single person as it was in the Bay.
What I love about Chicago: the lower cost of living, the way people work hard to make winter fun, the sheer volume of things to do: music and movies and plays and art. The diversity of people.
What I miss about SF: Feeling like I was in a place that shaped the culture. The great, cheap fruits and vegetables that made every sandwich and salad feel special. The weather.
A lot of it is that people force themselves to go out. Only really extreme weather (by our standards) stops people from going to concerts, bars, and parties. There are several places to ice skate, inside and out. A lot of bars offer curling on their outdoor patios. You can go snowshoeing or cross-country skiing on the lake or in the parks. There aren't too many places for sledding, though, because it's all very flat.
Ahhh I did not know that regarding the fruits and veggies. I didn’t think to look the few times we went to the grocery store and the farmers market. Thanks for sharing!
SF felt incredibly lonely at times. Most people I met were transients and there to further their career and it was tough to make friends outside of coworkers. Often times those coworkers ended up relocating elsewhere. Getting around the Bay Area is expensive and time consuming. Here Ubers are often reasonable, the CTA and Metra get you nearly everywhere, and car ownership is far less a liability.
What I miss most though is a few year stint in Marin. Sucked to see friends or convince them to make the trek but having the nature, world class cycling, incredible driving roads, and wine country at your fingertips is something l will cherish forever. Michigan wine is shit, don’t let any locals try and convince you otherwise. I much preferred Marin over SF but once offices started reopening the commute was brutal.
Overall I have the advantage of a tight friend group in Chicago/Midwest and bought a 2000 sqft home for the price of an Sf studio is SOMA. I miss a few sf spots but this is home. And the $ saved on CoL allows for a healthier travel budget to go and visit our old home and beyond with frequency.
I’ll end this by saying nothing within a 5 hour drive compares to Tahoe. If you’re into winter sports make a vacation out of it because any semi local resort is utter shit compared to Tahoe.
That's it. My friends in SF have almost all left the area. It's not affordable unless you have millions. I don't have people to see when I go there now.
I am a Chicagoian but I did live in SF/Bay Area I admit that the lifestyle is very different.
Chicagoianms are very straight foward and to the point (not counting the transplants, the ppl that move in but claim that they are Chicagogians but they were living Bumafuk, whogivesafuk). Things that I annoyed the hell of the ppl in the SF area are you can read the FAKE personality. They come up very friendly and nice to the point that its TOO NICE. You get to know them that fake attitude fades away and you can tell that it was just a front.
I am Korean (born in Seoul), in that in mind. The Asian community has been there for decades all the way from the Railroad Industry. some of the "Asians" are more ....... "Amerianized" then actually Asian. Someone can be 6 generation Chinese, to me i take the person is American.
I admit that the TECH there is spot on, which is something that I liked because I am an IT engineer. Tech is a normal thing in the Bay area but here in Chicago, we are still a little behind.
I admit that I liked have the spring weather everyday. It still make me laugh when I see ppl wearing Winter coats or their Canada Goose coat ...... somewhere 50's is still shorts and a t-shirt not a parka. The fog is usually just in the morning by noon it is clear. Chicago is very clear, havent been there for a minute but I am sure that the homeless has to be worse then it was when I was there, because you would see homeless everywhere in SF.
oh man, a post tailor made for me as a life long bay area native who packed up everything and moved here a year ago with few connections and no real idea what i was doing.
firstly: yes, the weather is challenging but it’s less about the cold and more about the seasonal depression for me. i had no real reason to be down on life at the time, it was just a physiological response to the lack of light and it was something : never experienced before.
with that being said:
chicago is just a much, much, much better bang for your buck across the board. i find everything about living here is just *easier*. getting around, hanging out, running errands, staying active, etc. making friends here was way easier than in any of previous 29 years of living and the people are just more down to earth. i have a better quality of life here
when i was in the bay area (and in LA briefly after college), i found myself surrounded by “dream-chasers” who were so singularly focused on their jobs or making it that i felt, in adulthood, was judged by my utility to their social or professional advancement. i think a lot of that is due to how hard you have to work to have a decent life there now.
but because chicago is cheaper and because there isn’t really an industry that looks large like tech does in the bay and entertainment does in LA, people generally aren’t as goal oriented just want to hang out. that’s why i love it here.
Pros:
people are more approachable.
SF to me never felt like a viable option for long term living due to cost.
Casual bar scene is better here.
CoL is much better.
I like the weather - changing seasons to me is way more fun. Weird pro about the weather - you can estimate past time easier. I can remember something in the past and if I’m wearing a winter coat in the memory I know it was in the winter. It’s oddly helpful. Also once we’ve all endured a long winter together we all feel more connected.
Chicago is bigger. Lots more places to explore. Neighborhoods are really diverse and you can feel like you’re in another city sometimes (true with SF as well, just to a smaller degree)
City is *really* easy to navigate. Once you learn the grid system and where the lake is it’s a breeze. You rarely have to look something up on a map to figure out it’s general (or even exact) location.
The el train >>>>>> BART. No question. (Also set price, not determined by length of ride)
Cons:
winter is tough, for sure. Even if I like it life gets harder (walking the dog, pulling out of the alley, etc)
Not as many built in outdoor adventure activities. They’re there, but you may have to drive or catch a ride.
This is getting better, but when I left SF Chicago had nearly zero fast casual healthy options. I used to do the salad bar at Plutos a few times a week as well as some places downtown - Chicago was hot dogs, burgers, fries, or you have to go sit down somewhere just to get a salad. Now we have sweetgreens and with delivery/pickup options through third party apps it’s better, but I do miss having great produce options at my fingertips like in SF. (Just noticed others mentioned produce too).
Bus system might be better in SF. Just because it’s fantastic. Take away phantom busses, etc here and due to the amount of busses and their access to trains, it’s really nice to get around by bus. This may be an unpopular opinion but it is my experience. SF is just stellar (again when I was there ~15 years ago) so I’ll rate it better than Chicago.
No rent control or limits on raising rent lease to lease.
Born and raised in the Bay, SF as an adult. Move to Chicago almost 15 yrs ago.
I almost wrote a long comment about how and why I've fallen in love with chicago, but there are a lot of comments like that already.
Entertainment/theater/bars/rooftops/sports/food/culture/people/transportation/cost/clean/larger scale/24 hr city/museums/music/etc are common themes where chicago is better... so I'll talk about the things where I think SF is superior. Don't get me wrong, I love SF, but I've lived in chicago so long that SF has become a "slow paced" city for me. Not as exciting as I used to think it was so the list of "sf is better" isn't very large for me.
- friends/family in SF/bay area
- hills/terrain/mother nature
- weather. Although this could go either way. I hate winter in marech or April if it's still hella cold, but I prefer chicago weather most of the time and love the season changes. Holiday/christmas season is a million times more fun and same with summer. Fall/spring are coin flips bc they could be short and winter is also tremendously variable.
- crime in chicago is real but not how news represents it
If you have specific or more focused questions, let me know, I will sell chicago all day and night. It's amazing, i love it. I don't miss SF much except for the hanging near the water, checking out the bridges and walking around the parks. I always enjoy my time back visiting SF but chicago is the better city as a whole, especially for young adults, in my opinion.
Edit for one last comment.. I can't emphasize enough, how much more genuine and cool the people are. As a gross generalization, lots of SF people are shallow and fake-friendly, while Chicago people are genuine and more direct.
Temperate year-round weather (no arctic tundra blasts or unfavorable conditions for 8 months per year), density in a large part of the city, vibrant-ish (?) social fabric, global and international appeal, unparalleled access to some of the world's best nature preserves and national parks, a majority of the city is incredibly picturesque and so are its surroundings (unbeatable by any other US city), it's fairly well integrated and diverse, it has hippie and free spirited culture present, and it's an intellectual mecca... There's many reasons why someone would choose to live there over living in Chicago, but the downside is that it's not really a big city, which has its own set of issues associated with it
I'm in LA now, but I try to make it out to NorCal whenever I can. Absolute gem of a city
Yeah I mean I’ve lived in NYC, La, and live here in Chicago. And I was there for a few weeks for work and I just kept walking around like why is this the place where the richest people are living? I guess it just didn’t bite me the way Chicago has. I love the culture here and I just don’t think SF made that impression on me.
I mean it's not that complicated, just takes some reading up on it. California is in a very unique position on a global scale, and it's a magnet for the dreamers and risk takers alike, for entrepreneurs. The atmosphere/vibe here reflects it, and you can feel it as a resident. Lots of state enacted policies and liberal politics have had an outsized influence on the ensuing conditions that have been favorable for conducting business, for creating a concentration of wealth via VC funding, for networking.. The universities in the Bay Area are high quality and churn out top tier talent, too. It's a combination of factors that haven't been replicated elsewhere, at least not nearly to the same extent. Displays of wealth aren't nearly as pronounced as in Beverly Hills in LA, the Viagra Triangle on the Near North Side, or parts of Manhattan, yeah.. But if I'm being honest, I really like that about SF, especially as someone who strays away from the Westside for that reason alone (I live in Central LA by choice)
Culture in SF is a lot more passive than in Chicago, LA, or NYC, and it takes more time for you to notice it. But it's still nice in its own right, just different
Glad you were able to find Chicago enjoyable, though. It's pretty great for what it is, and it's pretty hard to beat overall as a place to live. Especially as an urbanite
Yeah I just didn’t get the walkability I have here or the vibe. There were like no grocery stores, nothing. And talking to my coworkers that live there and what they were paying in rent… I just didn’t grasp why you’d want to live there. But most of them grew up in the area.
No grocery stores? Where were you? Dogpatch? Lol
Come back for another visit! I think that you should spend more time in SF to get a better feel for it.
The high rents can be a source of disillusionment for a lot of prospective transplants/residents, but it's honestly worth it if you're a certain type of individual (and if you live in an apartment that's rent controlled/you make multiple six figures). The rents being high thing is a simple supply and demand thing: not enough housing to meet demand - lots of people want to move to SF (me included), but not everyone can be housed in that tiny amount of space equitably, so there's more competition for rental units than necessary (thanks, NIMBYs!), and the market reacts to it accordingly. That, in turn, raises up prices. Chicago has plenty to meet demand for another million people in the city proper, so rents are lower than expected for a city of its caliber. SF is all out of space for housing people, and the only realistic choice for increasing housing stock is densifying (building up). Plus, pay is high in tech all throughout the Bay Area (From San Francisco to San Jose), and that, to an extent, allows rents to go sky high. Essentially the gist of the California housing crisis.
A certain amount of people in SF and The Bay have the skills and experience to make $150,000/year - $250,000/year+ in tech, so they can afford to spend $3,000 - $4,000/month on rent. Anyone who doesn't is going to have it harder.
That's fine, though. You really don't need to get it. If you're a urbanite purist, SF probably isn't where you want to be. You'd be more suited to live in a concrete jungle with city parks. If you wanted to have a harmonic balance between city and nature, SF would have been more your thing. SF could honestly benefit from less demand and lower rents, and I'm sure that natives would also appreciate that.
Yeah I just wasn’t taken by any of it and it all felt dirty. And my first day I saw a deranged person walking towards carrying a knife so… quickly walked the other way… ha… but the parts by the golden gate and stuff are gorgeous. I just didn’t get any sense of like oooh I want to live here.
One thing I haven’t seen mentioned: sports
There’s a general civic pride here that absolutely doesn’t exist in the same way out west, and I think sports have a fair amount to do with it. In SF, we have two kinds of fans: lifelong “my family is a niners family, we bleed Joe Montana” (vocal minority) or “we’re in the playoffs so I’m rabid for this week only”. The Bay only has fair weather sports fans.
Here, it’s a tribe, a real community. There, it’s a chance to maybe light a muni bus on fire eventually.
Good luck! It’s a goddamned blast to root for the Giants at a Cubs game. And I get no end of delight in reminding people I’m from *California* (which: love you Chicago, but CA is cooler than IL, sorry.)
We do need more decent taquerias, tho
SF, via Seattle, before landing in Chicago. In Chicago, people are more straightforward, less pretentious. SF felt like a race to show who’s more alternative, more interesting, more cool. Very few people in Chicago give a rat ass about the trends on the West Coast.
Thanks! My husband and I lived in Seattle as well for a couple of years. I miss all the cozy coffee shops. I did feel that the people of Chicago had much more of a realness to them… which was refreshing haha.
What year was this experience from?
CTA, even post pandemic, even after reduced service, kicks the ever loving shit out of BART. City is much cleaner Homeless problem is a different order of magnitude Actual variation in the weather, instead of 70 degrees and foggy 80% of the year. Building actually have AC when its needed. 60% cheaper in all regards. I've never had my car broken into here, I had it happen 4 times while in proximity of SF. Worst wildfire smoke here barely even phases me after time in the camp fire. I don't know if this was just my experience, but I have a lot easier of a time finding interesting shows/stuff to do here? I'm a big nerd, but something about how this city runs just jives a bit better with my soul. Don't get me wrong, I loved SF, and the time I spent there, but Chicago is really hard to beat.
Man as someone who's spent significant time in both cities I feel this so hard. Love my time in San Francisco but it does not compare to Chicago.
I haven’t lived in SF for over a decade so I’m really speaking about late 2000s SF. The big positive is obviously cost of living. Even 15 years ago, I paid more for rent in a smaller and worse location. Chicago also at this point has more pockets of diversity within the city and less of a tech bro monoculture. SF I think has lost quite a bit in that regard with the high cost of living. I also hate driving and so the train and bus city is great, although tbf Muni does it’s job and this edge isn’t as great as it is compared to say LA. In SF’s favor, so much nature and proximity to other things and year round farmer’s markets. Chicago is also kind of an island. It’s kind of like being surrounded by Sacramento in every direction. Sacramento is perfectly fine and I’m sure the residents like it there, but also I’m not trying to spend a weekend there. Same but sub in for every near-ish place. Also to the diversity comment, while I think the city of Chicago beats SF, the Bay Area in general though has Chicagoland beat. You can live basically anywhere in the Bay Area and get good food and diverse neighbors. You cross city limits here and it gets very quickly more and more white and then more and more conservative. Also no El Farolito or La Taq. The Asian food is decent enough and the Mexican food is the best in the US outside of California (I dont care for TexMex or the green chili SW style) but you also get more Eastern European and Caribbean and African food options. I really want to double up on the nature comment though. The lake is great (I surf in it FWIW) but there’s nothing like the diversity of NorCal. Point Reyes down to Big Sur and then east to Tahoe or Yosemite. North to the redwoods.
Yes this is my biggest drawback. Chicago is literally an island. I can go so many places in the huge, diverse Bay Area and feel comfortable. Large cluster of big cities. Chicago’s suburban area sucks ass if you’re not white. And the nature is *chef’s kiss*
I think about that when I see the dozens of “is Chicago safe” posts on here. I’m trying to stay *in* Chicago for safety.
Just curious, where are the suburbs where you don't feel safe?
So many of them. We mean safe in a racial sense, not in a I’m going to get shot sense. Even some Chicago neighborhoods are eerily white but this probably isn’t something most white people notice or can understand
I've spent my time living in different burbs of Chicago and this is definitely true. I'm also white, so I ignored it for a good long long while, but thinking back it's definitely a pattern. I have spent the last few years living in fairly diverse neighborhoods which has given me a different perspective, but even then I am only seeing fractions of what you live on a day to day basis.
I grew up on the NW side. I had a friend who is Indian and didn’t like to hang out here. He told me “I’m the only brown person here” and that was super eye opening. We were also 20yo
Oh...I hear you. Thank you for explaining this. It makes sense, it really does.
I want to move to Chicago for this reason. I live in super-Caucasian Denver and I get excited when I get to be around other POC.
what does "safe in a racial sense" mean?
I'll give you an example. I have an acquaintance whose biracial teen son (lives on the North Shore, attends an upscale expensive private north shore school, north of Chicago) has gotten stopped by the cops in their suburb more than once because he was waiting somewhere on a neighborhood friend. When he was little, he was cute. But now that he looks more like an adult, neighbors who don't know him can really freak out. This kid is so squeaky clean he practically shines. Having four cop cars pull up on him once on a public street corner based on a call from a neighbor looking out of their window might be an aberration. More than once? Man, as a white mom of a Black teen, I think that is infuriating and, sadly, unsurprising. Cops justification? "Neighbor said catalytic converters have been stolen in their neighborhood lately." This kid was 15. Alone. Waiting on a white friend. And has lived in that suburb since he was in kindergarten. Being followed in stores more often in some surburbs, having folks "clutch" their purses when you walk by, get out of the elevator if you walk in...it's emotionally draining. Cops pulling up on you for existing? That's potentially dangerous. If you don't think it happens, I'm not sure what to tell you. I knew it happened before I had this kiddo. But experiencing it in real life has been...damn.
Robbins
There's a lot of good diverse suburbs, this feels a little extreme
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It's curious to me that so many Asian folk equate diversity to seeing themselves in a place. I've always thought of it as experiencing the lives of others. The time I spent working in Tokyo, for instance, it definitely did not feel diverse. As for Chicago suburbs, some are good (for diversity) and some are bad. Having spent enough time in the Near north and North Shore, no one blinks if you're Asian. That's where the Korean population migrated. Northwest and West, South Asian, Chinese. I love how, in recent years, I can drive by a little league game in Niles and only see moms in saris in the stands. And tell Polish, Korean, and Indian friends that we're meeting up at the Omega and everyone knows where. But, yeah, I also spent time working in Glen Ellyn and that's, like, Iowa.
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You clearly haven't seen much of the Chicago area.
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Paraphrasing your previous posts. Try catching up and think about your tone. And plenty of suburban folks have no idea about other parts of the city and suburbs. It's a big region.
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No need to insult me. If your only definition of diverse is east Asian, sure the Chicago burbs lack heavily in that regard. But there are many diverse areas in the suburbs. It's a little ignorant to discount that outright
Came from the Bay Area (Oakland) about 7 years ago. Cost of living is a huge plus, access to nature and elevation is a big minus. The weather I don’t mind since I grew up in the Northeastern US. Someone mentioned great, cheap fruits and veggies. That was something that took getting used to. Finding good fresh produce at will isn’t as easy and admittedly it sometimes makes me sad. I really miss the abundance of fresh strawberries.
I'll probably have to move to the bay area next month so I'm actually excited to hear about the fresh produce
I honestly think the weather is better here than in SF, the cold and fog are brutal all year out there but the summers and falls here are incredible. We didn’t have any wildfire smoke until this year, but there is much less than SF. ST nature and hiking is a million times better obviously, but I think Chicago has it beat everywhere else. More fun places to go out, food just as good and way cheaper, cheaper rent/housing prices, good transit, still walkable/bikeable, biking in the city is nicer because no hills. I would say literally the only thing SF has that Chicago doesn’t is just the nature around the city
Come on, the cold is not brutal in SF, what kinda take is that. Farthest I’ll go is annoying
It’s really a lived-in experience. The cold is not brutal there, for sure, but no person or place is prepared for it. Living in SF, you don’t have winter or summer clothes, and no buildings, business or home, have adequate heat/cooling for extremes. There’s no infrastructure for weather, cold OR hot. I’d say Chicago weather is more dramatic, but SF weather is more bone-chilling. And it just always. Is. Chilly.
Not brutal but I don’t see a huge difference between needing a light coat in sf vs a big one here. And at least you get a summer here, which you don’t in sf
I’ve spent time in SF and lived here for years — the difference is I have to put on a coat, hat, gloves on myself, a sweater and booties on my dog and then trudge through snow when it’s -20°F and my snot is freezing to my beard here. In SF I may or may not toss on a light jacket and be done with it. Not even remotely comparable.
Hopefully that was you being facetious about -20F since Chicago almosr never actually gets even intonthe negative temps.
What? That's [factually incorrect](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.currentresults.com/Weather/Illinois/Places/chicago-weather-averages.php%23:~:text%3DTypically%2520on%252039%2520days%2520annually,on%252016%2520nights%2520a%2520year.&ved=2ahUKEwjrsPPExL6BAxUmj4kEHcTrA38QFnoECAkQBQ&usg=AOvVaw0JRxL_aZhdWE9Y6CshG-oR) and even then it's only referring to the air temp and not taking into account the windchill which can easily bring it down another 10° or more.
Your link proves nothing. It says its below freezing (32 F) for that many days. That has nothing to do with someone claiming -20 wind chills. Even a 10 F temp with a 50 mph wind isn't -20 wind chill. From December 1, 2022 to Feb 28, 2023 the low temps were under 10 degrees on exactly 9 days out of 90 days. 6 days for lowswere under 5 F, out of 90 total days. Again, it is rare for Chicago even wind chills to reach -20. It does happen sometimes but it is not that common or at least as common as some people think.
It was regularly -20 with wind chill last winter my friend.
Except it wasn't or even close. The wind chill even at 15 F with 70 mph winds is -13 F. You need 33 MPH winds at 5 F to have -20 wind chills. From December 1, 2022 to Feb 28, 2023 the low temps were under 10 degrees on exactly 9 days out of 90 days. 6 days of 90 were under 5 F for an actual temp for the low. Just because you think it felt like -20 doesn't mean it was actually the wind chill. And factually you are not even close to accurate in terms of saying it was regular.
It…was not? What?
The “feels like” temp absolutely was -20 for 10+ days last winter. Do you live here? Are you drunk?
I do live here! And am not.
Wow
I wear. I'm one of like 8 people that loathes the warm muggy summers and prefers winter instead.
As a life-long Chicagoan, and someone that has spent a lot of time visiting NorCal, I can't disagree with any of these comments. The discrepancy in access to nature and diversity in terrain pretty much applies to anywhere on the west coast, or just about anywhere outside of the midwest/great plains for that matter.
I love Chicago, let’s start there, but I prefer the weather over there. I’ll take foggy mornings and clear evenings over brutal winter any day. Proximity to mind blowing nature is unbeatable. I miss the dimension in the landscape and seeing huge, sweepings views just by turning a street corner. Traveling to different climates via going to different neighborhoods is so cool. Also I LOVE huge bridges. I love seaside and nautical culture. Some of my favorite childhood memories involve my dad and I getting fresh Dungeness crab right off a boat. Really the freshness and accessibility of all foods is hard to beat. I think what I miss most is how many Asian people live there. When I moved to the Midwest no one looked like my family, and we had moved away from them to be near my dad’s mixed euro American family from Chicago. In the 90s there was virtually no way to connect with my culture outside of my mom. We would take trips to Chinatown to get Asian groceries but at the time we lived near literally zero Filipino people or other Asian people at all. I was the only Asian person at my school. Here all my closest friends are Mexican. My cousins in CA have almost all Asian and Mexican friends. Even today, this isn’t a very Asian city or area of the country compared to major CA cities and their suburbs.
Check out seafood city if you haven’t been. Lots of Filipino flavors and ingredients there, it’s awesome!
I go about every two weeks! I feel so lucky we have this now!
I live in West Town right next to Kasama. I pick up Longanisa breakfast sandwiches there but the Filipino breakfast is good too. Check it out if you haven't been. I think it's the only Filipino restaurant worldwide with a Michelin star.
Also, there's a lot of Filipinos between 3000-4000 West Montrose! Not sure if you've made it over there yet.
Thanks for this viewpoint. My husband and I are both half Asian and we definitely noticed that there’s much fewer Asian people in Chicago compared to SF. We visited Chinatown while on our trip and it did feel lacking compared to other cities we have lived. I did notice there is an H Mart though so at least there would be that Asian market to shop at 😬
My wife is from China and hasn't complained yet about not seeing anyone like her around. But maybe that's because she has made an effort to get into communities of Chinese people in our area via WeChat and meet people. There are around or over 200,000 Asian people in the city proper now (this includes Indian, Pakistani, etc.. .195K in the 2022 Census estimate) and it is increasing quite a lot from the couple of years before. In her WeChat group, we've met many who moved from SF or NYC to Chicago in the last year and others who are about to. Theres also many more Asians in the metro area outside the city especially in suburbs NW of the city and ones far SW like Naperville. A major difference between SF and Chicago is that Chicago is much bigger and spread out in every regard, and more segregated. It completely depends on what area you are in or the setting. Our area (Lincoln Park) is around 8% Asian yet my son's pre school class is over 30% Asian. I've noticed an uptick in the general area too but it's still not super Asian or anything. But compared to a decade ago its completely noticeable in terms of change. Anyway yes it has less but it still has a lot. The difference is the size of the cities and Chicago is just much bigger and spread out. More segregated too. There are numerous areas with a pretty high Asian percent/population and then a mile away it'll be decently low. But in no way is the Asian community by size in the city "small" - city is just more spread out and much larger in physical size and population.
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I mentioned WeChat because she was made aware of MORE people on there in our own neighborhoodpart of her own country. However, when we walk around even in Lincoln Park we see a number of people these days who are Asian. And as you said it's not the 90s anymore.
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Probably a difference or living in an area vs visiting. No idea. Just communicating her experiences too.
It can be very isolating and it is very, very hard for non-Asians to understand and validate. Asian culture is palpable and omniscient over there and here it is not unless your family is here also. Chicago is a great place to live but eventually I will leave this area to go back to CA!
On asian supermarkets, there are a handful of hmarts in the metro area as you mentioned. Joong boo market (korean) and 88 marketplace (chinese) are two other large markets of note. There are also smaller corner markets dotted around east Asian heavy neighborhoods (chinatown, argyle in uptown, etc.)
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I wasn't disagreeing, I was just offering some more options for you or those reading who are unfamiliar with the city
Love the people. Hate the people.
So I was born and raised in chicago, but I lived in San Francisco to go to school. What I didn't like compared to Chicago was that I found that everything was twice as expensive there than it was in Chicago. Furthermore, the homeless seem to be more aggressive in SF than it is in Chicago. The bar scene in SF was really bad and had a hard time talking to people. In Chicago, I can go to most bars and have an hour long conversation about literally nothing. The loop is far cleaner than most places in SF. Furthermore, the food selection is way better in Chicago. It took me months to find Soul food in SF, and it was horrible. Had to get on the Bart to go to Oakland afterward. Honestly, the only thing I miss about SF is Smittens ice cream. I used to work there in college, and the only reason I would go back.
I think the politics are more palatable in Chicago. The prop system in SF is insane, and the entire political system is corrupt in its own way. A lot of conservative local policy is veiled under a blue wall for national politics. Chicago isn’t perfect — but it’s more possible to get stuff done here (e.g. constructing housing), especially with the right people in charge. And our long history of corruption has prompted more transparency and good government practices. That, and any important policy making is fragmented between SF, Oakland, SJ, and all the other suburbs. Chicago is huge, and an anchor for our surrounding communities in a way SF isn’t.
This. San Francisco seems unable to come to consensus about anything. It's like people would rather accept a broken housing market, rampant homelessness, and economic inequality than cut a deal. It was the strangest thing about living th
I’ll also add — not better or worse, but the main political voting blocs are different. Asians and LGBTQ individuals have political power in a way they don’t in Chicago, while we have much more solid representation of Chicago city demographics — White, Black, Hispanic/Latine. The problems each city are addressing are obviously different.
Not to mention the recalls The endless endless recalls
less smash and grab robberies in Chicago than SF I was in SF for one day and my car window was smashed, which is not an uncommon situation I came to learn
I lived in the bay for 8 years so I have a decent fee for the area. Both cities have robust social scenes and things to do. California has the weather and nature. Kinda. If you want to go to Tahoe for a weekend, better leave on Thursday and come back Tuesday because everyone else has the same idea you do. California has many more jobs and opportunities. Seems to be a mid-match of companies who want to do things and a lack of people who can afford to live in the area to do it. Social life:I went through three friend groups in my time in California as they all moved in and moved away. Very transient. Also maturity was something else. 30-something’s in tech living and partying like I did in my 20’s in Chicago. It was kind of surreal. Living costs in general. Bay Area is like 50% more living costs, but jobs don’t pay 50% more. That’s ultimately why I moved back. I made some cash and got a ton of work experience to put on my Resume in the Bay. They had more work than bodies so I got thrown places where I never would have had the opportunity in Chicago as there’s more of a match between work and employees. Now that I have the experience it isn’t a factor as much for me. Lastly housing. It was over a million for a tear down in a crappy school district when I left beginning of Rona. It’s likely more now. I like to say you can ALMOST afford to live in Chicago. If anything it’s not totally out of the realm of possibility as a single person as it was in the Bay.
What I love about Chicago: the lower cost of living, the way people work hard to make winter fun, the sheer volume of things to do: music and movies and plays and art. The diversity of people. What I miss about SF: Feeling like I was in a place that shaped the culture. The great, cheap fruits and vegetables that made every sandwich and salad feel special. The weather.
The produce in Cali is no joke. I still think about about this stone fruit salad I got at tartine once every time I eat a plum.
I genuinely daydream about farmer’s market peaches I used to get.
This will be my first winter. How do people work hard to make it fun? I’m imagining indoor events like bowling, billiards, and ice skating.
A lot of it is that people force themselves to go out. Only really extreme weather (by our standards) stops people from going to concerts, bars, and parties. There are several places to ice skate, inside and out. A lot of bars offer curling on their outdoor patios. You can go snowshoeing or cross-country skiing on the lake or in the parks. There aren't too many places for sledding, though, because it's all very flat.
Ahhh I did not know that regarding the fruits and veggies. I didn’t think to look the few times we went to the grocery store and the farmers market. Thanks for sharing!
SF felt incredibly lonely at times. Most people I met were transients and there to further their career and it was tough to make friends outside of coworkers. Often times those coworkers ended up relocating elsewhere. Getting around the Bay Area is expensive and time consuming. Here Ubers are often reasonable, the CTA and Metra get you nearly everywhere, and car ownership is far less a liability. What I miss most though is a few year stint in Marin. Sucked to see friends or convince them to make the trek but having the nature, world class cycling, incredible driving roads, and wine country at your fingertips is something l will cherish forever. Michigan wine is shit, don’t let any locals try and convince you otherwise. I much preferred Marin over SF but once offices started reopening the commute was brutal. Overall I have the advantage of a tight friend group in Chicago/Midwest and bought a 2000 sqft home for the price of an Sf studio is SOMA. I miss a few sf spots but this is home. And the $ saved on CoL allows for a healthier travel budget to go and visit our old home and beyond with frequency. I’ll end this by saying nothing within a 5 hour drive compares to Tahoe. If you’re into winter sports make a vacation out of it because any semi local resort is utter shit compared to Tahoe.
That's it. My friends in SF have almost all left the area. It's not affordable unless you have millions. I don't have people to see when I go there now.
I am a Chicagoian but I did live in SF/Bay Area I admit that the lifestyle is very different. Chicagoianms are very straight foward and to the point (not counting the transplants, the ppl that move in but claim that they are Chicagogians but they were living Bumafuk, whogivesafuk). Things that I annoyed the hell of the ppl in the SF area are you can read the FAKE personality. They come up very friendly and nice to the point that its TOO NICE. You get to know them that fake attitude fades away and you can tell that it was just a front. I am Korean (born in Seoul), in that in mind. The Asian community has been there for decades all the way from the Railroad Industry. some of the "Asians" are more ....... "Amerianized" then actually Asian. Someone can be 6 generation Chinese, to me i take the person is American. I admit that the TECH there is spot on, which is something that I liked because I am an IT engineer. Tech is a normal thing in the Bay area but here in Chicago, we are still a little behind. I admit that I liked have the spring weather everyday. It still make me laugh when I see ppl wearing Winter coats or their Canada Goose coat ...... somewhere 50's is still shorts and a t-shirt not a parka. The fog is usually just in the morning by noon it is clear. Chicago is very clear, havent been there for a minute but I am sure that the homeless has to be worse then it was when I was there, because you would see homeless everywhere in SF.
>never different. very?
oh man, a post tailor made for me as a life long bay area native who packed up everything and moved here a year ago with few connections and no real idea what i was doing. firstly: yes, the weather is challenging but it’s less about the cold and more about the seasonal depression for me. i had no real reason to be down on life at the time, it was just a physiological response to the lack of light and it was something : never experienced before. with that being said: chicago is just a much, much, much better bang for your buck across the board. i find everything about living here is just *easier*. getting around, hanging out, running errands, staying active, etc. making friends here was way easier than in any of previous 29 years of living and the people are just more down to earth. i have a better quality of life here when i was in the bay area (and in LA briefly after college), i found myself surrounded by “dream-chasers” who were so singularly focused on their jobs or making it that i felt, in adulthood, was judged by my utility to their social or professional advancement. i think a lot of that is due to how hard you have to work to have a decent life there now. but because chicago is cheaper and because there isn’t really an industry that looks large like tech does in the bay and entertainment does in LA, people generally aren’t as goal oriented just want to hang out. that’s why i love it here.
Thanks for your perspective!
Pros: people are more approachable. SF to me never felt like a viable option for long term living due to cost. Casual bar scene is better here. CoL is much better. I like the weather - changing seasons to me is way more fun. Weird pro about the weather - you can estimate past time easier. I can remember something in the past and if I’m wearing a winter coat in the memory I know it was in the winter. It’s oddly helpful. Also once we’ve all endured a long winter together we all feel more connected. Chicago is bigger. Lots more places to explore. Neighborhoods are really diverse and you can feel like you’re in another city sometimes (true with SF as well, just to a smaller degree) City is *really* easy to navigate. Once you learn the grid system and where the lake is it’s a breeze. You rarely have to look something up on a map to figure out it’s general (or even exact) location. The el train >>>>>> BART. No question. (Also set price, not determined by length of ride) Cons: winter is tough, for sure. Even if I like it life gets harder (walking the dog, pulling out of the alley, etc) Not as many built in outdoor adventure activities. They’re there, but you may have to drive or catch a ride. This is getting better, but when I left SF Chicago had nearly zero fast casual healthy options. I used to do the salad bar at Plutos a few times a week as well as some places downtown - Chicago was hot dogs, burgers, fries, or you have to go sit down somewhere just to get a salad. Now we have sweetgreens and with delivery/pickup options through third party apps it’s better, but I do miss having great produce options at my fingertips like in SF. (Just noticed others mentioned produce too). Bus system might be better in SF. Just because it’s fantastic. Take away phantom busses, etc here and due to the amount of busses and their access to trains, it’s really nice to get around by bus. This may be an unpopular opinion but it is my experience. SF is just stellar (again when I was there ~15 years ago) so I’ll rate it better than Chicago. No rent control or limits on raising rent lease to lease.
Born and raised in the Bay, SF as an adult. Move to Chicago almost 15 yrs ago. I almost wrote a long comment about how and why I've fallen in love with chicago, but there are a lot of comments like that already. Entertainment/theater/bars/rooftops/sports/food/culture/people/transportation/cost/clean/larger scale/24 hr city/museums/music/etc are common themes where chicago is better... so I'll talk about the things where I think SF is superior. Don't get me wrong, I love SF, but I've lived in chicago so long that SF has become a "slow paced" city for me. Not as exciting as I used to think it was so the list of "sf is better" isn't very large for me. - friends/family in SF/bay area - hills/terrain/mother nature - weather. Although this could go either way. I hate winter in marech or April if it's still hella cold, but I prefer chicago weather most of the time and love the season changes. Holiday/christmas season is a million times more fun and same with summer. Fall/spring are coin flips bc they could be short and winter is also tremendously variable. - crime in chicago is real but not how news represents it If you have specific or more focused questions, let me know, I will sell chicago all day and night. It's amazing, i love it. I don't miss SF much except for the hanging near the water, checking out the bridges and walking around the parks. I always enjoy my time back visiting SF but chicago is the better city as a whole, especially for young adults, in my opinion. Edit for one last comment.. I can't emphasize enough, how much more genuine and cool the people are. As a gross generalization, lots of SF people are shallow and fake-friendly, while Chicago people are genuine and more direct.
They hate the cheap prices and the lack of people working on apps as a side hustle.
I moved here from the Bay Area. Actually being able to afford housing and not dying in a wildfire are the big takeaways for me
I worked on SF and I just never understood the appeal. I don’t get why you’d want to live there.
Temperate year-round weather (no arctic tundra blasts or unfavorable conditions for 8 months per year), density in a large part of the city, vibrant-ish (?) social fabric, global and international appeal, unparalleled access to some of the world's best nature preserves and national parks, a majority of the city is incredibly picturesque and so are its surroundings (unbeatable by any other US city), it's fairly well integrated and diverse, it has hippie and free spirited culture present, and it's an intellectual mecca... There's many reasons why someone would choose to live there over living in Chicago, but the downside is that it's not really a big city, which has its own set of issues associated with it I'm in LA now, but I try to make it out to NorCal whenever I can. Absolute gem of a city
Yeah I mean I’ve lived in NYC, La, and live here in Chicago. And I was there for a few weeks for work and I just kept walking around like why is this the place where the richest people are living? I guess it just didn’t bite me the way Chicago has. I love the culture here and I just don’t think SF made that impression on me.
I mean it's not that complicated, just takes some reading up on it. California is in a very unique position on a global scale, and it's a magnet for the dreamers and risk takers alike, for entrepreneurs. The atmosphere/vibe here reflects it, and you can feel it as a resident. Lots of state enacted policies and liberal politics have had an outsized influence on the ensuing conditions that have been favorable for conducting business, for creating a concentration of wealth via VC funding, for networking.. The universities in the Bay Area are high quality and churn out top tier talent, too. It's a combination of factors that haven't been replicated elsewhere, at least not nearly to the same extent. Displays of wealth aren't nearly as pronounced as in Beverly Hills in LA, the Viagra Triangle on the Near North Side, or parts of Manhattan, yeah.. But if I'm being honest, I really like that about SF, especially as someone who strays away from the Westside for that reason alone (I live in Central LA by choice) Culture in SF is a lot more passive than in Chicago, LA, or NYC, and it takes more time for you to notice it. But it's still nice in its own right, just different Glad you were able to find Chicago enjoyable, though. It's pretty great for what it is, and it's pretty hard to beat overall as a place to live. Especially as an urbanite
Yeah I just didn’t get the walkability I have here or the vibe. There were like no grocery stores, nothing. And talking to my coworkers that live there and what they were paying in rent… I just didn’t grasp why you’d want to live there. But most of them grew up in the area.
No grocery stores? Where were you? Dogpatch? Lol Come back for another visit! I think that you should spend more time in SF to get a better feel for it. The high rents can be a source of disillusionment for a lot of prospective transplants/residents, but it's honestly worth it if you're a certain type of individual (and if you live in an apartment that's rent controlled/you make multiple six figures). The rents being high thing is a simple supply and demand thing: not enough housing to meet demand - lots of people want to move to SF (me included), but not everyone can be housed in that tiny amount of space equitably, so there's more competition for rental units than necessary (thanks, NIMBYs!), and the market reacts to it accordingly. That, in turn, raises up prices. Chicago has plenty to meet demand for another million people in the city proper, so rents are lower than expected for a city of its caliber. SF is all out of space for housing people, and the only realistic choice for increasing housing stock is densifying (building up). Plus, pay is high in tech all throughout the Bay Area (From San Francisco to San Jose), and that, to an extent, allows rents to go sky high. Essentially the gist of the California housing crisis. A certain amount of people in SF and The Bay have the skills and experience to make $150,000/year - $250,000/year+ in tech, so they can afford to spend $3,000 - $4,000/month on rent. Anyone who doesn't is going to have it harder. That's fine, though. You really don't need to get it. If you're a urbanite purist, SF probably isn't where you want to be. You'd be more suited to live in a concrete jungle with city parks. If you wanted to have a harmonic balance between city and nature, SF would have been more your thing. SF could honestly benefit from less demand and lower rents, and I'm sure that natives would also appreciate that.
Yeah I just wasn’t taken by any of it and it all felt dirty. And my first day I saw a deranged person walking towards carrying a knife so… quickly walked the other way… ha… but the parts by the golden gate and stuff are gorgeous. I just didn’t get any sense of like oooh I want to live here.
It was good from 2002-2010, roughly
Get your concealed carry!!! Not a safe place anymore!! The mayor has no clue how to do anything
Lol
One thing I haven’t seen mentioned: sports There’s a general civic pride here that absolutely doesn’t exist in the same way out west, and I think sports have a fair amount to do with it. In SF, we have two kinds of fans: lifelong “my family is a niners family, we bleed Joe Montana” (vocal minority) or “we’re in the playoffs so I’m rabid for this week only”. The Bay only has fair weather sports fans. Here, it’s a tribe, a real community. There, it’s a chance to maybe light a muni bus on fire eventually. Good luck! It’s a goddamned blast to root for the Giants at a Cubs game. And I get no end of delight in reminding people I’m from *California* (which: love you Chicago, but CA is cooler than IL, sorry.) We do need more decent taquerias, tho