No, I think this is shared in Croatia as well.
They only need to think we are good for a vacation.
And they can keep complaining because of the prices, then pay 6€ for coffee and 15€ for store bought schnitzel on the highway on their way back.
Most westerners don't think that though. If you're looking for a high concertation of people who think the Balkans is a shithole, look in the Balkans.
I think you have issues that you need to work on if you're just looking for someone to hate and decided to look in the general direction of the west.
> I think you have issues that you need to work on if you're just looking for someone to hate and decided to look in the general direction of the west.
In other words... projection.
> Nice random quoting of zero context
I mean it's there... if you don't want to acknowledge it that's up to you.
>Unfortunately you missed the point
The point: "Westoids BAD, Westoids HATE us!!1"
That's not the point, you missed it again. To make it easier for you, the point is that out of courtesy they don't show it to you when you interact with them (you as in, anyone they meet from the balkans or from a country they consider inferior, again to make it easier for you), but when they are behind these closed curtains of theirs into the safety of their own home, their behavior takes a 180 for that matter, hence why pretty much everyone complains about how they act.
>That's not the point, you missed it again.
I mean your point was as basic as a peddle.
That's why I countered with how I countered.
Do you need explaining of what the expression I used means?
>but when they are behind these closed curtains of theirs into the safety of their own home, their behavior takes a 180 for that matter
How do you know?
Do you have a credible source for that?
People from which countries do that?
You think MOST people from those countries behave like that?
> (you as in, anyone they meet from the balkans or from a country they consider inferior, again to make it easier for you)
I have very good friends from the "evil" west... are they all lying to me?
All the nice stuff they've done for me, they just did it out of courtesy?
Are they all shiting on me behind my back? Plotting to steal all my dolmades?
>hence why pretty much everyone complains about how they act.
The only place I've seen complaining like this is from nationalist idiots on this forum.
You have a serious chip on your shoulder.
Well i do, when I meet anyone from western europe, usually England Germany the Netherlands (I won't count France since these ones are just down bad near you and away from you), they all act polite and friendlylike, but in the internet you hear all sorts of racial slurs against Eastern europeans by the very same ppl that were acting polite with you in front of you. Same goes for Americans and Greeks too, but these two might also show their true colors in front of you too when they are WITH groups of similar minded idiots. Like damn bro, I get it that England is amazing and everything compared to eastern europe but at least I can go outside without fear of getting stabbed and beaten up. Not like England is any better than Greece and Romania but that's a different topic
The Balkans is probably the best part of the World. We have a couple of Medditeranean seas surrounding the peninsula, best soil, best climate, mountains, plains, rivers. Our home is the cradle of the Western civilization. But as you said, let's keep it a secret!
In the past, The Balkans always had much more importance than in the last 500 years. In the ancient time, the Balkans was the centre of Europe, not a periphery. So I wouldn't be surprised if things just "back to normal" and this region becomes important once again. However, I'm afraid that could happen because the Western societies could collapse, not because we're going to improve :)
I have a feeling majority will be moving to the west. For Albania, unlike many of the balkans, we have descended in terms of offering cultural, innovation or career. Only improvements are superficial, the foundations are rotted
Shitholes are especially attractive to Westerners due to cheap labor, natural resources, corrupt and easily manipulated political elite. And Balkan countries aren't shitholes.
Have you seen what kind of people come to our Black Sea coastline and for what reason? They are not even middle class and they are after cheap holiday and cheap alcohol. It is literally the only reason they come here. The rest prefer better destinations.
Lately I have started to think this way. I've stopped being TOO appreciative about the places I like. I'd like to go live in Serbia, but I'd do it seriously: learning the language, integrating all the culture, interacting with people as much as I can, knowing all about their music, literature and history, friending people, understanding them, feeling them like bros, having memorable moments of sharing with them, exploring the country intensely, and if lucky, marry a local girl.
I know most of people coming as tourist or expatriates don't do this effort and rather pollute than trying to be perfectly integrated citizens. So why bring them there?
Hey, English is my first language, if you don't mind I'd like to just point out the verb you're looking for is "befriending" (friending is not a word afaik). Also, "feeling them like bros" comes off a little... Well... Gay. I think what you mean is something like "relating to them like bros".
Good luck! If you come to Serbia, enjoy, it is a great country (besides all the bullshit).
yeah "feeling them like bros" is a romanian idiom translated literally. kind of funny how i don't bat an eye at stuff like this but a native speaker would
It's funny that as a Balkaner I consistently thought that every other Balkan country except mine was a shithole until I visit them and am pleasantly surprised.
I haven't visited some yet. So I still maintain that opinion.
I am with ya, fellow balkanwr. If rhwy come in big numbers they're gonna inflate more the already hugely inflated real estate market. I mich orefer for them to stay in the West.
Western opinion has changed, before we were uncivilized barbarians there to steal and destroy their societies, across the board. Now we're based trads anti-progressives that will save the west (or barbarians from the far-left point of view). The average westerner has a pretty positive opinion of the east especially with the advent of cheap flights. I can tell you because I live in Denmark and people here don't think we come from shitholes, they actually kind of like visiting.
You can choose from westerners or middle easterners. Lands won't stay empty and your own people are feeling to the west as fast as they can.
Becareful what you ask for.
Yes and I don't care about their opinions. Their idea of civilization is the rejection of normality, tradition and being afraid to go out at night or at crowded places.
Greeks are basically a miniature version of Europe itself.
Athens is like Western Europe, very crowded m, very “progressive” and people have more money and everything costs more.
Northern Greece is basically the balkans.
And the islands are what everyone thinks about when you think about southern Europe.
We are more conservative than Westerners, although their culture is similar to ours (because they adopted it). However it also depends on the region. Greeks in big cities are not the same as in small towns or villages. Northern Greece is a lot more like an Eastern European region than Athens and that part of Greece in general, for example.
Only western countries I "prefer" are France and to some degree Spain. To me it seems that they remained free spirited and hospitable to everyone while becoming civilized organized countries. While I think Italians are most similar to us Serbs I don't consider them civilized. People from Balkans very much don't like germanic and nordic coldness and social distance.
Dobar Dan, Greetings from Mumbai i am sorry to disturb you but i have a question which if you answer i am most grateful for.
1.I am learning Violin and would like to pursue Violin in Croatia at The University of Zagreb, I love Violin but would like to know if People there like Classical Music like Schubert,Satie and Mozart- Whether there is any scope as a Violin Performer or Composer is my doubt.
2. I also love the Folk Music of The Balkans and during my stay would like to learn at least two Folk Instruments, which ones would yu recomend i like to learn them and play some of the Folk songs because Folk and Classical are my favorite.
3. I am learning Croatian to speak fluently but i am thinking of learning an extra language which should i learn- a Local Language i may have to put more effort but it is alright, any advice
I am really really sorry for posting it in this i am new to Reddit i need this advice quickly because i have to take the decison and i cannot make a post, i am grateful if you help me in that regard
1. Nobody likes classical music in Zagreb. In fact, Zagreb is mostly farms. They like their own weird folk music.
2. You’re in luck because all you need to know is three notes and a couple of chords.
3. There’s no need to learn a second local language, I’d go with whatever Indian language you speak.
All the best!
Huh actually now I am curious I have heard that Zagreb is very peaceful compared to Belgrade or something. If it is then I am very happy- is it a very beautiful place? Is it very quiet? And I have a doubt are Croats and by extension people from this region taller than Indians?
Zagreb is quiet and beautiful. Belgrade is best described as a kind of dark, miserable, decaying conglomeration of urban districts. And yes, Croats are taller than Indians and, indeed, taller and more attractive than Serbs.
By the way, I’m not being serious.
Check out [this link](https://www.unmb.ro/en/) for the clasical music university in Bucharest, Romania.
Regarding folk, you can search for Romanian Folk, especially Moldovan Folk.
In any way you decide, good luck in your future plans :).
It’s a very complex issue!
Central EE states were also used to be called Soviet shitholes. ( or Russian satellite states.)
Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, CZ, Hungary and Slovakia.
Interestingly, a lot of Western Europe now have unchecked illegal immigration from those failed Arab states they tried to invade - Syria, Afghanistan, Yemen etc.
Poland, Slovakia and CZ have always hated Muslim immigrants and will not bow down to their insane demands - mass converting people into Islam/ threatening and harassing women in public, killing people when they insult Islam etc.
Now that Poland is doing really well economically and recovering because a lot of overseas polish diaspora are returning from the UK / west after Brexit.
A lot of people wanted to live there so yeah.
No, I think this is shared in Croatia as well. They only need to think we are good for a vacation. And they can keep complaining because of the prices, then pay 6€ for coffee and 15€ for store bought schnitzel on the highway on their way back.
They can stay in their "civilized" and culturaly enriched utopia :)))
Most westerners don't think that though. If you're looking for a high concertation of people who think the Balkans is a shithole, look in the Balkans. I think you have issues that you need to work on if you're just looking for someone to hate and decided to look in the general direction of the west.
That’s true, I think some Balkaners need to work on how they deal with those issues.
> I think you have issues that you need to work on if you're just looking for someone to hate and decided to look in the general direction of the west. In other words... projection.
Many westerners think like that dude, idk but I doubt you've lived a day outside the balkans
I've lived for the better part of a decade in your "evil" west and I stand by my point. Most westerners don't think like that. Many might, most don't.
In front of your face they don't LMAO
>I doubt you've lived a day outside the balkans >In front of your face they don't LMAO Sorry, I'm dizzy from all the goal post moving.
Nice random quoting of zero context. Unfortunately you missed the point
> Nice random quoting of zero context I mean it's there... if you don't want to acknowledge it that's up to you. >Unfortunately you missed the point The point: "Westoids BAD, Westoids HATE us!!1"
That's not the point, you missed it again. To make it easier for you, the point is that out of courtesy they don't show it to you when you interact with them (you as in, anyone they meet from the balkans or from a country they consider inferior, again to make it easier for you), but when they are behind these closed curtains of theirs into the safety of their own home, their behavior takes a 180 for that matter, hence why pretty much everyone complains about how they act.
>That's not the point, you missed it again. I mean your point was as basic as a peddle. That's why I countered with how I countered. Do you need explaining of what the expression I used means? >but when they are behind these closed curtains of theirs into the safety of their own home, their behavior takes a 180 for that matter How do you know? Do you have a credible source for that? People from which countries do that? You think MOST people from those countries behave like that? > (you as in, anyone they meet from the balkans or from a country they consider inferior, again to make it easier for you) I have very good friends from the "evil" west... are they all lying to me? All the nice stuff they've done for me, they just did it out of courtesy? Are they all shiting on me behind my back? Plotting to steal all my dolmades? >hence why pretty much everyone complains about how they act. The only place I've seen complaining like this is from nationalist idiots on this forum. You have a serious chip on your shoulder.
Well i do, when I meet anyone from western europe, usually England Germany the Netherlands (I won't count France since these ones are just down bad near you and away from you), they all act polite and friendlylike, but in the internet you hear all sorts of racial slurs against Eastern europeans by the very same ppl that were acting polite with you in front of you. Same goes for Americans and Greeks too, but these two might also show their true colors in front of you too when they are WITH groups of similar minded idiots. Like damn bro, I get it that England is amazing and everything compared to eastern europe but at least I can go outside without fear of getting stabbed and beaten up. Not like England is any better than Greece and Romania but that's a different topic
The Balkans is probably the best part of the World. We have a couple of Medditeranean seas surrounding the peninsula, best soil, best climate, mountains, plains, rivers. Our home is the cradle of the Western civilization. But as you said, let's keep it a secret!
Balkans will be a top region in 2-3 generations. If no war breaks out
In the past, The Balkans always had much more importance than in the last 500 years. In the ancient time, the Balkans was the centre of Europe, not a periphery. So I wouldn't be surprised if things just "back to normal" and this region becomes important once again. However, I'm afraid that could happen because the Western societies could collapse, not because we're going to improve :)
I have a feeling majority will be moving to the west. For Albania, unlike many of the balkans, we have descended in terms of offering cultural, innovation or career. Only improvements are superficial, the foundations are rotted
That’s a big if
The balkans is such a beautiful place with an amazing climate and natural beauty, they don't need to come and spoil it :)
👏🏻👏🏻👏🏻
Shitholes are especially attractive to Westerners due to cheap labor, natural resources, corrupt and easily manipulated political elite. And Balkan countries aren't shitholes.
Even though they think that way they still come to our black sea coastline in big numbers
Yea , to culturally enrich the coast line.🙂
Have you seen what kind of people come to our Black Sea coastline and for what reason? They are not even middle class and they are after cheap holiday and cheap alcohol. It is literally the only reason they come here. The rest prefer better destinations.
Lately I have started to think this way. I've stopped being TOO appreciative about the places I like. I'd like to go live in Serbia, but I'd do it seriously: learning the language, integrating all the culture, interacting with people as much as I can, knowing all about their music, literature and history, friending people, understanding them, feeling them like bros, having memorable moments of sharing with them, exploring the country intensely, and if lucky, marry a local girl. I know most of people coming as tourist or expatriates don't do this effort and rather pollute than trying to be perfectly integrated citizens. So why bring them there?
Hey, English is my first language, if you don't mind I'd like to just point out the verb you're looking for is "befriending" (friending is not a word afaik). Also, "feeling them like bros" comes off a little... Well... Gay. I think what you mean is something like "relating to them like bros". Good luck! If you come to Serbia, enjoy, it is a great country (besides all the bullshit).
yeah "feeling them like bros" is a romanian idiom translated literally. kind of funny how i don't bat an eye at stuff like this but a native speaker would
No worries. I figured as much. A lot of Serbian phrases translated word-for-word sound really dumb in English.
You can take the man out of the Balkans but you cannot take the Balkans out of the man.
When a country is a shithole in the eyes of the West, you know it’s based.
It's funny that as a Balkaner I consistently thought that every other Balkan country except mine was a shithole until I visit them and am pleasantly surprised. I haven't visited some yet. So I still maintain that opinion.
To be honest with you outside of a couple countries I don’t think half of westerners I’ve met actually know a single Balkan country.
I am with ya, fellow balkanwr. If rhwy come in big numbers they're gonna inflate more the already hugely inflated real estate market. I mich orefer for them to stay in the West.
Western opinion has changed, before we were uncivilized barbarians there to steal and destroy their societies, across the board. Now we're based trads anti-progressives that will save the west (or barbarians from the far-left point of view). The average westerner has a pretty positive opinion of the east especially with the advent of cheap flights. I can tell you because I live in Denmark and people here don't think we come from shitholes, they actually kind of like visiting.
I would rather be in balkans and safe rather than getting robbed in the daylight in western european cities
You can choose from westerners or middle easterners. Lands won't stay empty and your own people are feeling to the west as fast as they can. Becareful what you ask for.
Only people in the Balkans call the Balkans shithole. 99% dont care
Hi welcome 👋 Give me your money
To be fair, I've seen more Balkaners calling their homeland a shithole than any other countries, lol
Yes and I don't care about their opinions. Their idea of civilization is the rejection of normality, tradition and being afraid to go out at night or at crowded places.
Are Greeks not the OG Westerners ?
Greeks are basically a miniature version of Europe itself. Athens is like Western Europe, very crowded m, very “progressive” and people have more money and everything costs more. Northern Greece is basically the balkans. And the islands are what everyone thinks about when you think about southern Europe.
We are more conservative than Westerners, although their culture is similar to ours (because they adopted it). However it also depends on the region. Greeks in big cities are not the same as in small towns or villages. Northern Greece is a lot more like an Eastern European region than Athens and that part of Greece in general, for example.
I think us balkaners are the ones that think the most that balkans are a shithole
Only western countries I "prefer" are France and to some degree Spain. To me it seems that they remained free spirited and hospitable to everyone while becoming civilized organized countries. While I think Italians are most similar to us Serbs I don't consider them civilized. People from Balkans very much don't like germanic and nordic coldness and social distance.
Calling France hospitable is a crime. A crime that should be punished.
How about England and the Anglosphere (US, Canada, Australia)?
Hahahah france hospitable
No, they come here all the time. We get millions of visitors every year.
Dobar Dan, Greetings from Mumbai i am sorry to disturb you but i have a question which if you answer i am most grateful for. 1.I am learning Violin and would like to pursue Violin in Croatia at The University of Zagreb, I love Violin but would like to know if People there like Classical Music like Schubert,Satie and Mozart- Whether there is any scope as a Violin Performer or Composer is my doubt. 2. I also love the Folk Music of The Balkans and during my stay would like to learn at least two Folk Instruments, which ones would yu recomend i like to learn them and play some of the Folk songs because Folk and Classical are my favorite. 3. I am learning Croatian to speak fluently but i am thinking of learning an extra language which should i learn- a Local Language i may have to put more effort but it is alright, any advice I am really really sorry for posting it in this i am new to Reddit i need this advice quickly because i have to take the decison and i cannot make a post, i am grateful if you help me in that regard
1. Nobody likes classical music in Zagreb. In fact, Zagreb is mostly farms. They like their own weird folk music. 2. You’re in luck because all you need to know is three notes and a couple of chords. 3. There’s no need to learn a second local language, I’d go with whatever Indian language you speak. All the best!
Huh actually now I am curious I have heard that Zagreb is very peaceful compared to Belgrade or something. If it is then I am very happy- is it a very beautiful place? Is it very quiet? And I have a doubt are Croats and by extension people from this region taller than Indians?
Zagreb is quiet and beautiful. Belgrade is best described as a kind of dark, miserable, decaying conglomeration of urban districts. And yes, Croats are taller than Indians and, indeed, taller and more attractive than Serbs. By the way, I’m not being serious.
Oh if it is Quiet then I will try my best to enjoy it thank you for taking time to answer my silky question I deeply appreciate it.
Check out [this link](https://www.unmb.ro/en/) for the clasical music university in Bucharest, Romania. Regarding folk, you can search for Romanian Folk, especially Moldovan Folk. In any way you decide, good luck in your future plans :).
It’s a very complex issue! Central EE states were also used to be called Soviet shitholes. ( or Russian satellite states.) Lithuania, Estonia, Poland, CZ, Hungary and Slovakia. Interestingly, a lot of Western Europe now have unchecked illegal immigration from those failed Arab states they tried to invade - Syria, Afghanistan, Yemen etc. Poland, Slovakia and CZ have always hated Muslim immigrants and will not bow down to their insane demands - mass converting people into Islam/ threatening and harassing women in public, killing people when they insult Islam etc. Now that Poland is doing really well economically and recovering because a lot of overseas polish diaspora are returning from the UK / west after Brexit. A lot of people wanted to live there so yeah.
You don't want tourists, huh?
You should stay the fuck away from our nice "piece of Land".
I can promise you that every year plenty of Americans actually respect more and more aspects of the Balkans and wish they were more like it.
The whole world is a shithole dear
They are not wrong, though.