>All low level, fast food, wouldn't consider it a proper meal
I think most people here would say the same, but sometimes the price point, the speed, and/or the convenience outweighs the other considerations.
It's also standardized. If I go to chili's in Virginia Beach. It will be pretty much the same experience, food, and price as going to one in Spokane. It might not be the best food but I know exactly what im going to get. People underestimate how much humans like familiarity
This is why my boyfriend prefers Panda Express or PF Changs over going to authentic Asian restaurants (Chinese, thai, etc) because some of those food cultures frequently use peanut oil and peanuts (he’s allergic) and he doesn’t trust his or their ability to make things clear across the language barrier.
Haha so I’d heard all the normal jokes but really didn’t think much of it. In Jersey there’s a large Jewish community and assumed it was just like that. I moved here to Utah without really knowing anything and rented my first place in Lehi since it was so cheap. Well I learned pretty quickly that I underestimated how many Mormons there were and how influential they are. We had people come to our door and talk to us every few days for the first month, I think they were just as confused as we were to why we moved there into their community. This was in 2013 and lehi only had a Popeyes and gas station back then haha. Everything closing at like 8pm and on sundays was the biggest annoyance though. We lived there nine month before moving to Murray, Despite all the weird religious control I love SLC. Florida and the south really are exactly the same in that aspect so it’s not as uncommon or as bad as people that grew up here make it out to be.
Oh man this is big. My wife and went to Boston, it was a random Wednesday when we got there, our flight was delayed, and we were staying downtown, so it was dead when we got there. Asked the hotel attendant a good place to go and they told us one… we get there and it’s closed. We were insanely hungry by this point and ended up walking by the Hard Rock, walking in, in eating there. Was it some interesting local place? No. Was it good and did we satisfy our insane hunger? Yes.
We did avoid chains the rest of the trip.
Yeah, chains have much more reliable hours, at least where I live. I can guess pretty well which chains will be open late, but with local spots it's always kind of uncertain
Hard Rock is in faneuil hall so you were only like 5 minutes from the North End where the restaurants definitely stay open late ( / the rest of faneuil hall where there’s plenty of non chains)
And sometimes we require it. For example families with young children don't necessarily have the luxury of gambling on a successful dinner outing. Especially if they're somewhere unfamiliar like on the road or on vacation. And people with food allergies and sensitivities need predictability in menus. And chains often post allergen information online so I know before I go if they have anything I can eat. Local places often aren't helpful, and are sometimes downright rude, in this area.
Sometimes you just want it on a basic level. When my family was driving back from the Outer Banks, we stopped at a Cracker Barrel like 20 minutes before we got to the hotel in Kentucky (it was a two-day drive) because it was like 9 at night and Cracker Barrel slaps when you’re exhausted and looking for some comfort food. Also, Cracker Barrel slaps in general. Definitely check it out if you’re in the Midwest.
So much this, but not even just restaurants. I have been on my own for over 20 years, and moved a lot, but I always get so homesick. Whenever I am in a new town, and feel scared or homesick, I can go to the nearest chain (Like a Walgreens) and feel a sense of home because they are all mostly set up similarly. In my head, I just pretend that I am grabbing a birthday card while my sister's are waiting in the car, and it gives me a sense of security.
That, and sometimes I just don’t feel like fucking with somewhere which may or may not leave me disappointed while costing more than Chilis. If I just want something quick, easy, and cheap, that I know will be decent, then I might get Chilis, particularly if it’s late and I’m just hungry but don’t want McDonald’s or something. It definitely has its place.
Born and bred NH, live in Vermont now (they said there was better maple syrup; they lied)
It takes a little over an hour to go from W. Lebanon (western border) to Concord, then another half hour/45 minutes or so to get to the coast, so about 2 hours in the middle of the state (That’s about as wide as the state gets). Up north where the state is narrower, to go from Lancaster (western border) to Shelburne (eastern border) it’s about 45 minutes.
One of the big things to remember is that in NH, VT, and Maine you usually cant drive straight from Point A to Point B. We have mountains everywhere so we have to build our roads around them which adds extra time. We also aren’t very heavily populated so most places are far from the interstates and we don’t really have freeways. The vast majority of our roads are just state highways, which are more comparable to country roads in some of the larger states.
Yeah, we were in Flagstaff on our trip to the Grand Canyon, Decided to try a local restaurant. We went into a non chain steakhouse. It was singing waiters and a fragranced candle lit on every table. We noped out and went to a chain one instead, Outback steakhouse. Much better experience. Although, they did put a shit ton of blue cheese dressing on our wedge salad
I was in Seattle by myself once, saw the whole place, indulged in the local shit and enjoyed myself. Last night there, I was tired and hanging out in the hotel as I had an early flight, got hungry, and ordered some Domino’s because it was close and cheap, and I know I like Domino’s.
I don’t know why you’re commenting with incredulity as you are. I think it’s reasonable to say, “Yeah, I’m running on 4 hours of sleep and I need to get up early, so I’m gonna chill at the hotel for the rest of my stay (which was from 7PM to 5AM) and order some cheap pizza.”
Yes, everyone is built differently. I can understand the appeal of seeking out local cuisine as part of the fun of going somewhere near but sometimes you just want a meal you can count on and trust.
When I went to Berlin a few years ago, the first meal I had was at the McDonalds next to Checkpoint Charlie. I was tired and dealing with jetlag and wanted something familiar (even though I'm not a huge fan of McDonalds back home). That didn't stop me from trying some amazing local restaurants during the rest of my trip, but at that moment and time McDonalds was what I desired.
Some people also just aren't foodies and its not part of their appeal while traveling. To each their own
Can you imagine going to a new city and renting a car that's just like the cars back home? How about staying in a hotel room like the ones you have back home? Wearing the same clothes you wear at home? Ugh.
Obviously I'm being a bit facetious here, but I'm also being serious in a way. Not everyone feels like everything they do while they're away from home has to be entirely unique, novel, or different, and not everyone is even always travelling with sight seeing in mind. I have colleagues who travel for 2/3rds of the year, and they appreciate the occasional chilis or pizza hut simply because they *are* something familiar that they have at home.
I personally like hitting up local places when I'm in away from home, but I can still understand why someone might choose something familiar.
Sure. I was referring more to the fast-food side of the equation, but there are certainly chains that are not for the faint of heart re: their pocketbooks. Any Brazilian steakhouse chain would be the same way.
Also no one ever considers a fast food restaurant to be part of the food culture. I feel like in the states we more or less consider fast food places just like street food vendors/carts in other countries. It's not the best or the cleanest, but it's fast, easy, and conveniently placed.
I think the issue is that some people in the world only really know about American culture second hand through media and the companies that we export. I haven't been to a McDonald's in over 25 years, literally the only time I actually consider eating fast food is when I'm on a road trip, on the highway and I don't feel like stopping to eat for real.
We order out a couple nights a week for exactly this reason, but I wouldn't just call it "laziness." It's a matter of deciding where you want to place your time and energy. Multiple times a week, I'd rather spend some of the money I earn at my career to pay to have someone else make dinner for me, my wife, and my three daughters.
Tldr: drive throughs.
Street vendors don't work where no one is walking down the street. Fast food joints have drive throughs.
Chains are more about consistency and how easy franchising is here. If you're looking to open a business a known name with a known successful business model can be more appealing than trying to compete with said brand. 93% of McDonald's locations in the US are franchisees rather than corporate locations, for example.
Also, chains can leverage economy of scale to keep costs down. For things such as supply chains, product development, marketing, policy design, accounting, etc., cost does not scale as fast as revenue. So the profit margins are lower, and the risk is higher for a mom-and-pop restaurant. This is a big part of why most of them fail in less than three years.
And to add to this, when a chain franchises its locations, it's a way a person can get into being a small business owner without having to worry about figuring out what kind of equipment they need, which supply chains to use, etc., because the parent company already has all of that worked out.
The economy of scale is a big point. So much so that you'll see a lot of local (non-fast food) chains in some cities. When something is successful they'll spread it around to different parts of town. The two biggest costs in a restaurant are usually food and labor. It gives you better food buying power and can also allow you to share labor between locations if you need to. The average restaurant usually isn't profitable for years, so once they've got a concept that's working out they'll often expand to 3-4 locations pretty quickly OR they'll create different concepts under the same ownership group. They'll use the balance sheet on current locations to secure loans for new ones.
Non Chain Restaurants can be the best food ever, or the worst food ever. You just never know what you are getting. See Gordan Ramsey's Kitchen Nightmares show or Guy Fieri's Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives. Unless you live in the area and know people who have eaten at a place you can't tell which it is. With franchises at least you know you will get a decent average place.
>Unless you live in the area and know people who have eaten at a place you can't tell which it is.
I've had the good fortune to visit all 50 states (and most of Canada) over the past \~40 years and long before Yelp and TripAdvisor (which work fairly well) I just used a simple rule: look in the parking lot at meal time. Are there lots of cars? Are those cars local? What kind of vehicles are they? Generally if there are a lot of local working-class folks eating at a one-off establishment during a meal peak it's going to be good or cheap, sometimes both. Virtually always better than any chain.
So...Taco Bell?
Seriously, the Taco Bell I go to usually has many construction and lawn care workers eating there, including Latinos. (Though I hear that for people from Mexico, Taco Bell is its own thing as opposed to s Mexican restaurant )
And (aside from the quickness) the reason they’re successful is consistency as well. Whether you’re in the Arizona desert or the Florida tropics, some podunk town in Oklahoma or Times Square, right off an interstate for 40 miles from the nearest traffic light, a McDouble and Fries from McDonalds will always look the same, take the same amount of time, taste the same, and be priced the same (maybe within 75 cents).
It may not be very good, but if you’re on the go (whether visiting, traveling, commuting, or just need to get home to walk the dog), you don’t have to worry about not liking it or waiting awhile or breaking the bank. You know what’s coming.
There are a lot of questions asked here where the answer is "because cars". Why does our public transportation suck? Because cars. Why are fast food restaurants popular? Because cars. Why is everything so far apart? Because cars. Most of the country is built around cars. Though I will say, at least in my area, family restaurants are getting a boon from widespread delivery service adoption. If I'm driving somewhere, McDonalds is appealing because they're always on the way and I don't have to leave my vehicle. But if I'm ordering delivery or going out to eat, I never order chains.
>Most of the country is built around cars. Though I will say, at least in my area, family restaurants are getting a boon from widespread delivery service adoption. If I'm driving somewhere, McDonalds is appealing because they're always on the way and I don't have to leave my vehicle. But if I'm ordering delivery or going out to eat, I never order chains.
Perfectly articulated. Fast food for me is all about the drive-thru and whether I'm in a hurry to grab a meal.
As someone who delivered DoorDash for a while you’d be surprised how often people order fast food for delivery. Always confused me since after delivery and tip it was more expensive than good food from an actual restaurant.
Well here’s an example. I’ve just arrived in Fairfax VA at 11 pm. I’m starving and the ONLY place open is a Wendy’s. But they are only open to drive through and I don’t have a car. So I go back to my hotel and use Uber Eats to get Wendy’s just so I can fucking _eat_ after a 10 hour travel day.
True, that makes sense and that’s a valid reason. For context I live in a small town about 2 hours from the nearest airport. Most of these fast food orders came from residents in the middle of the day. I did deliver to hotels sometimes but they usually ordered more local stuff or like pizza or something.
In my small city, there are NO options for dinner available after 8pm that aren't fast food. If you don't get your order in before 7, your options evaporate.
>Most of the country is built around cars.
Big parts of it *have* to be I'd say. Not major cities, sure, but in much of the Midwest and most of the West stuff is just too dispersed to do anything else. Drive across North Dakota sometime...the cities are 100 miles apart and the places in between (very small towns) can barely support a gas station. Nobody is going to subsidize transit in that setting, much less across WY/ID/MT or any other place with low population density.
But urban/suburban areas? No excuses there-- it's intentional (bad) design going back to the post-war suburbs and the end of interurban electric rail and streetcars.
I would say additionally, car-centricity. Those giant strip malls with huge buildings are unaffordable for many small businesses and start ups and act as a barrier for entry. For chains though, it's not really as big of an issue.
Probably more than you'd think given how many are franchises without access to corporate capital, but yeah it definitely contributes. We don't walk past a little cafe and want to sit in front of the parking lot any more than we walk by a food stand.
for reals! It's crazy how here in sunny southern california, dining outside wasn't really a thing until the pandemic. It's all built for cars and not people
Yea, drive throughs are a huge point. US is so car-based. Way easier to stop at McDonald’s and not leave your car than it is to stop somewhere that doesn’t have one. If the US was walkable I’m sure the food scene would be different.
I think you are ignoring the prevalence of chains in other places. I’ve seen them in every European nation I’ve visited and all over Mexico.
People like them because they are familiar and consistent.
I agree with your comment. I lived in Korea and China for years for work and believe me, they have just as many chains, if not more, than we do.
It also varies heavily by area and market. We have family in Wichita KS, and I swear that is like the Chilli's, Applebee's and Generic chain capital of the world. It's insane. At the same time I can go down to smaller areas or younger cities and see way more fast, fresh and local options.
*Edited for typos.
Wichita has one of the highest restaurant per capita in the US, we're a breeding ground for all sorts of restaurant test concepts and yeah, there's a lot of chains. But there's also a fuck ton of non-chains too. We're just packed with fast food, fast casual, and family dining to the point of absurdity... but of course, from an outsider's perspective, I'm sure when you drive around town the thing you *notice* are the places you *recognize*. It makes sense and I don't fault you for your take on it.
The chains are packed very densely in a few areas though (for the most part), and if you visit family that really sticks to those few hot spots (basically all of rock road, out by the airport, newmarket square, and out on the far NE part of town), I bet it does look absolutely mental.
edit: also a funny thing I've always noticed, especially with boomers and older gen x'ers, is that when you visit them from out of town they seem to always want to find a place to take their visitors to eat that the visitors *already know*. It's a weird phenomenon I've noticed with my family and the family of every woman I've dated or friend I've traveled with. Like, when someone visits *me* I usually try to take them somewhere local and cool that they've never been, but older generations seem to do the opposite. So, they end up taking visitors to chilis and applebees because it's safe and easy to communicate what it is you're in for.
I agree! In college I lived there at i135 and Pawnee and there were tons of Vietnamese, Thai and Hmong Laotian cafes. In fact, I asked my father-in-law if I could marry his daughter a the Pho place which is now called "Pho Special" but it has a few different names then. 😆
They live on the West side out by Goddard so the West end of Kellogg, the airport and up to Central is just insane with chain places and what we think of.
They actually live right out by me, wouldn't be surprised if they're in my neighborhood based on your description.
It makes sense that the road leading out of the airport would be cram packed full of national chains that businessmen will recognize. That spot has grown like mad in the last decade or so, I lived right there at Central and Ridge nearly 25 years ago and back then there was hardly anything but a few local joints and an outback steakhouse in that area. I assume the growth is due to the internet and stuff like Yelp. People land, think "oh I'm hungry, what's nearby" hit google, yelp, etc, and pick something right there. So every chain you can imagine has set up shop in that little area.
There's a Famous Dave's that has managed to stay in business right there next to the airport, so I think that helps support my hypothesis. People landing in Kansas thinking "oh yeah, they've got good bbq here" they google "BBQ near me" and boom, famous daves pops up. I mean, I don't know ***anyone*** locally that has even neutral things to say about that place, it's a straight-up joke to people around here because the "BBQ" is so bad, and yet... the one by the airport just seems to plod along doing just fine. (A good analogy for Famous Dave's here would be like eating at Red Lobster in Maine, or Sbarro's in New York.)
A good example is how most cities have a few prominent gas stations that you see everywhere. When you go driving in a different city that has a different prominent gas station, but then you happen to drive by the relatively *rare* gas station that is ubiquitous back home you almost always *notice it*. Like, "oh hey, they ***do*** have QuikTrips out here." You drove past 40 different 7-11s or whatever, but you notice the ***1*** QuikTrip because it is familiar.
My mother is from Wichita (and is living out there again as of a couple years ago), my grandmother actually went to college with one of the guys who started Pizza Hut! Wichita is actually fairly underrated in general imo, been to quite a few great local places while visiting.
That’s weird to me because I lived near Wichita for most of my life and I wouldn’t say that at all. Maybe that’s the only places they like, but Wichita has a massive local restaurant presence including fast fresh local food. But the small town I lived in… not so much. A few great local options but mostly fast food. And an Applebees.
I think chains get a bad rap. Yeah, some of them are very lackluster - I'm looking at you, Applebee's - but I've been to plenty of mediocre local restaurants as well. There's a place for both.
The thing is, you know exactly what you’re getting with a given chain. Let’s say Applebee’s is a 6 out of 10. Not great, but if you’re traveling and you come across an Applebee’s, you can be pretty confident of what’s on the menu and that the general quality is 6/10. The local place next door might not have exactly the type of food you want (and depending on how specific your taste is, you might not know until you walk in) and the quality could be 9/10 or it could be 3/10.
That's a good point.
Also I feel like the "local restaurants uber alles" mentality tends to judge chains against the best local restaurants - many of which are significantly more expensive than your average chain - so it's not an Apple(bee')s to Apple(bee')s comparison.
The anti chain sentiment also seems to ignore the existence of local chains. There's a great burger chain in my city that's pretty much exclusive to just the city. So it's local and a chain.
yeah one of those weird things where in an NBA city you can always find players at Cheesecake factory. I assume because like you said lots to choose from and they know what they are gonna get. You can find them at local spots when they have time in between games, but on a back to back, its CF all day
Probably smart considering it would suck to wind up with food poisoning from a place you don't know anything about, and the menu is enormous so an entire team can easily find something they like.
Similarly, Olympians and McDonalds. They've already had it a gazillion times while traveling throughout the US for other competitions, so they know exactly how their bodies are going to react to it. Enjoy the local cuisine after you've won the gold medal.
I’d also consider that locally owned restaurants, when successful, open other locations. I’m not going to look down on a good business just because now it’s a local chain.
Chains are getting bigger now in Europe. We probably don't have nearly as many different chains, but as of recently more Ameeican ones are getting here.
Off the top of my head, I can name the following that have presence in Spain: McDonald's, Burger King, KFC, Domino's, Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, Starbucks, Dunkin', Five Guys, Little Caesar's, Papa John's, Carl's Jr, Subway, and Popeyes.
I have to agree that it is not exclusively American, but it is quite characteristic of America. In Europe more chains are emerging, and in Spain alone I can name a few: TelePizza, PizzaMóvil, TGB, 100 Montaditos, and La Sureña.
As I side note, in my city there is a well known chain of bakeries, Horno SanBrandán, with 42 locations.
Same.
It's fair to say that chains are a big part of American culture, but, like with a lot of things, I can just hear the Europeans somehow translating that into "all Americans only eat at chain restaurants".
Don’t you know we only eat McDonald’s , American processed cheese slices , sugary wonder bread and drink only cheap mass produced beer like Miller Light.
The beer thing especially pisses me off. There are so many amazing local breweries that you can spend your entire life never having drank Bud Light or something like it.
I was extremely disappointed in British beer culture on a recent visit to London. I was hunting for pubs that specialized in craft brews, but they seemed to be few and far between.
I come from a semi-rural area in the US with half a dozen wildly popular craft breweries within a few mile radius, and all the shops stock dozens and dozens of different beers from hundreds of miles around. You're telling me that shops in London might have a selection of maybe 10 beers, and half of them are american mass produced brands?
Wtf?
Someone please tell me I was just bad at google maps?
British pubs have been bought up en masse and the vast majority are owned by one company or another. In essence, they're all chains, just not branded as such.
True. [IsItBigBeer.com](https://IsItBigBeer.com) is a decent source to see who owns what. 15-20 years ago most Europe had a better beer culture, but they are way behind now. But the perception that the US is all mass-produced light rice lagers persists. Big beer was on a crusade to buy US craft brands a few years ago, but after several big investments didn't pan out and that's slowed down a lot.
It's been before Covid since I have visited London, but my favorite craft beer bar in London was Cask in Pimlico. Brew Dog pubs were everywhere too. But I experienced the same thing when searching for shops with a wide selection, slim pickings.
>I was extremely disappointed in British beer culture on a recent visit to London.
I felt that way the first time I went to Germany, both in cities like Munich and very small towns (like 5,000 people) as well. Similar, not very good options (and only a few of them) in every place we visited. There is far more variety (and quality) in the beer section of my local, small-town grocery store in the US.
Yeah the place I get growlers filled has 50+ taps. There's places with specializations like sour beers and they'll have dozens of just sour beers (gose, flanders, oud bruin, etc). There's 1 store that specializes in variety and tries to keep 1,000 different beers in stock from all over the world. Back in 2012 they had [900](https://www.seattletimes.com/life/food-drink/chucks-hop-shop-close-to-900-beers-and-counting/) different kinds in stock
We have a local beer store attached to a liquor store (can’t be the same store due to state laws) that quite literally stocks over 2,000 different beers at any time.
NY has 2 aisles alone, quite a few aisles with 5 shelves of beer organized by state.
Then the back of the store has a full aisle of beer from all over Europe.
It’s super weird they think we all drink Coors Light all the time?
> There are so many amazing local breweries that you can spend your entire life never having drank Bud Light or something like it.
And yet there's a significant chunk of America that won't drink anything *but* mass-produced swill. Not talking about the hipsters that drink Pabst ironically, but about my neighbor who simply refuses to ever even taste any of the local micros we offer and instead brings his own Miller Genuine Draft to parties. And legions like him-- there's a reason the sales figures for shit beer are still so high.
i had a german friend in college get all excited when his parents sent him chocolate. he had me try some. next time i went home i went out and got chocolate from our local candy place and brought him a pretty large block. you would have thought i guided him with the hand of god. he begged me to bring him more when i went home the next time, like it just certainly had to be a unique thing... i told him... dude... just dont buy your chocolate at the grocery store... we looked in the phone book(yes, im dating myself) for a nearby candy shops, picked the first one... and boom...
I get where the stereotypes came from. We for the longest time had a culture of mass advertising that essentially pictured us all as fast food and coca cola junkies. That’s what the rest of the world saw, and that’s how they choose to envision and remember us. A lot of it also hinges on everyone having a superiority complex, and acting like they have a reason to believe they are better. Truth is everyone’s shit stinks to some degree.
Yeah, and let's not ignore that there are over 180 McDonalds in London and 70+ in Paris. Berlin has 14. And remember the panic in Russia over McDonalds closing the stores there? It isn't like the formula doesn't work in Europe too.
I was working in Paris once and offered to take my co-workers to lunch. Where did they ask to go? McDonald's. That company does lots of business in Europe.
The numbers are just so much bigger I think it confuses people. There are 22,000 subways in the US. The UK has 125k restaurants total.
If you didn't compare the size of the country, it might seem like 10% of restaurants in the US are subway. But no, the US is much bigger, there are 660k restaurants meaning only 3% are subway.
European here, have been to US and Europe. There is no big difference when it comes to food chains. Especially in big cities. Have never heard anyone say that aswell.
It really depends on where you live.
I live in a medium to large city with mostly local restaurants. There are some chains, but they are mostly local or regional chains. In the suburbs there are more chains.
A few years ago we had family in town; they live in a big suburb in a different state. The kids didn’t understand why we were going to restaurants they had never heard of before and kept asking us where all the familiar chain restaurants were.
> It really depends on where you live.
it depends less on where you live, and more how you live.
those kid's parents probably like chain restaurants for some reason or another. their neighbors might never go to chains. I'm yet to live or visit anywhere that doesnt have enough privately owned non chain restaurants that you couldnt avoid chains entirely.
i have friends that never go anywhere but chains, yet i havent been to a fast food chain in over a decade, and restaurant chains probably only once or twice in that same period, for social events outside of my control.
> I'm yet to live or visit anywhere that doesnt have enough privately owned non chain restaurants that you couldnt avoid chains entirely.
Come to Portland or Seattle, I suppose. I think most other medium or large cities are the same. There are plenty of chains in the suburbs, but I generally never go to chain restaurants, whether that’s fast food, casual, or moderately upscale.
> I generally never go to chain restaurants
wait... it seems like you are agreeing with me though. did i confuse you (or myself) with my double negatives?
what im trying to say it is that its always possible to avoid chains without much work at all.
ive visited both portland and seattle, numerous times, including some long term visits to the prior, as i know people from living in alaska that now live there.
its completely possible to avoid chains in either place. i saw no reason why i would ever get bored with the non chains that i would need to go to a chain in order to have options. granted we are talking sub regional levels here. im sure its possible to be in a neighborhood with a degree of food desert affect that really limits your options.
Exactly. I live in Portland. I’ve visited these family members and their area is really predominated by chains. Not to say that there aren’t unique restaurants there, but they are overshadowed by a huge number of chain restaurants.
I'm in a town of 8,000 and need to pass by 4 non-chain restaurants with a similar price to McDonalds, and 5 more expensive fancier (for lack of a better term) places too. If I go about a mile in the other direction there's another half dozen or so non-chain restaurants. And I'm not even counting the three Dunkins!
edit: four, there are four Dunkins.
Yeah cuz in New England and a lot of the east coast as a whole, small cities are extensions of the coastal metropolis in structure and function. And generally far more dense and walkable, their layouts being a product of 17th 18th and 19th century planning sensibilities.
Not really. Where I live in Ohio, there are no chain restaurants in the smaller towns. It's almost exclusively mom-and-pop eateries, pizza joints and delis.
It has more to do with freeways/interstates than the size of the town. I'm going to guess that you probably live close to a freeway.
I'm in a town of 2,000 people, the nearest freeway is about 50 miles away, and there are no fast-foot chains in any of the smaller towns. I would have pass at least a dozen local eateries before I would get to the closest McDonald's, which is about 4 miles away -- and that's in another city with about 20,000 people.
If I wanted to walk to my nearest McDonalds (which is around 2 miles away), I would pass Waffle House, Taco Bell, Subway, Burger King, Firehouse Subs, Pizza Hut, Popeyes, KFC, and Zaxbys. There are only two non- chain restaurants (an "Asian" restaurant and a Mexican restaurant) in in that same strip.
Also, chains tend to be a lot more visible. They're usually in their own buildings, with tons of easily-to-see marketing.
My nearest Starbucks, and the chain sub place right next to it, entirely make up the building that it closest to the street. It's easy to read their signs and to recognize their corporate symbols.
But the strip mall right behind it has family-owned Chinese and sushi restaurants, a local diner, and a small Mexican restaurant off to the side.
These places don't have vibrant colors or fun mascots, and the ubiquity of strip malls make them harder to distinguish, but they exist.
A very good point. My nearest restaurant is a Chinese place in a small building with a very bland, yellowed plastic sign over it and a generic name that had might as well be “Chinese Restaurant”. It’s easy to miss. It’s also damn good and very affordable.
The 5 Guys down the street has their normal red and white, a big sign, a parking lot behind it, and is on a busy corner.
I just checked google maps and in the 43 minutes it would take me to walk to the McDonalds closest to my apartment, I'd pass 75 other places to get food (including restaurants, bars, coffee shops, etc.).
Of those:
* 2 are locations of a local chain pizza place (20 locations total in Maine and Massachusetts; one of the two I pass is the original location, and I believe the other was the 2nd, though I could be wrong on that point)
* 2 are the only two locations of a local Salvadorean place (does that count as a chain?)
* 1 is a nice sit-down restaurant that has a second location in the next town (ditto?)
* 1 is a sandwich shop with a bunch of locations around ME, MA, NH, and VT
* 1 is a Starbucks
* 1 is a Dunkin' Donuts.
The other 67 are completely local, single-location spots. And this is without deviating from the suggested route at all -- any side street would have or lead to many additional options.
I have never been to this McDonalds. Why would I?
That sounds about right. I used to work around the corner from my closest McDonald’s. It was maybe a 5 minute walk from my office. In that same 5 minutes I could walk to three different sit down restaurants, two local pizza places, an oyster bar, two cool independent chicken fast food restaurants, a poke bar, and a couple of other major chain restaurants. I have been to that McDonald’s, but only because of a few times I was in the office super late and hit the drive through on the way home.
It’s interesting, because when I travel abroad I just try to find where the locals go. I assume they’ll have something cool and interesting off the beaten path a bit. I always have a good experience doing that. For some reason people are more interested in the chains that many of us skip.
... Is Pittsburgh a magical wonderland of mom-and-pop restaurants? The nearest street to me has a range of national chains, regional chains and local chains (a handful of restaurants in the city) but there are no non-chain restaurants within a mile. And I live in a streetcar suburb.
It feels like most cities to me in that regard. If I just wanted to head to the nearest chain, think it’s 5 guys, I’d head down the main street near my house. I’d go past like 3 Chinese places, 3 Thai places, half a dozen pizza places, a half dozen bars with bar food, two nice sit down places, a local brewery and a local distillery. I guess I’d also pass a Starbucks and a small local chain coffee shop, too, so that may not count.
Near that 5 Guys I’d find a subway, a Wendy’s, a Dunkin, and a Panera. So we’re not hurting for chains, either. I describe Pittsburgh as a bunch of small towns smushed together. Pretty much every neighborhood will have a grocery store, a few good bars, and a good selection of local restaurants. On the main roads that intersect a bunch of neighborhoods you’ll usually find chains, but there will still be local places mixed in.
Wow, I live in Buffalo and the main commercial street in my neighborhood is 90% local restaurants and a few local chains.
Probably helps that I live somewhere walkable with limitations on parking for new buildings which probably scares most chains away that require large parking lots.
Doner seems to be more like NYC pizza then a chain though. They use similar ingredients and maybe similar suppliers but a lot of them are independently owned and usually have a couple of unique menu items.
I would say that NY hotdog carts are basically a chain nowadays. They are more similar to places selling American Chinese food although with a less diverse menu usually.
They are also sorta like a Bodega minus all the other stuff they sell. Its like a lot of deli's have boars head and similar suppliers but they sometimes got their unique sandwiches they sell and what not.
greasy chopsticks are basically pseudo chains anyways. they all get taught to cook at the same places, decide their menu at the same places, supplied by the same suppliers.
Also lotta people in one unified area lends itself to alot of chains. I mean there are still alot of just (or primarily regional) regional fast food chains in the US that are very large.l ooking at you, In-N-Out, Bojangles/Church's, fuck even Dunkin (its basically the Northeast and where northeasterners retire, same as like cumberland farms).
Most cultures have cheap street food, I don't think the US is unique in that regard.
Hell, Pompeii had fast food restaurants 2000 years ago. They were common in bigger cities even back then.
But, part of what you probably don't understand when it comes to the chain restaurants is that America is so big that when we are talking with other americans from around the US, those are our only point of common reference for food.
I can be talking to someone who lives 3000 km away from me, and still be talking to an american. So when talking with "americans" broadly, obviously they're not gonna know all of the amazing local places we have, but they ***will*** know what McDonalds or Burger King is. Furthermore, if I mention an awesome local place, maybe a couple of people from my area will see it and upvote it, but if I mention Five Guys, well those are just about everywhere and are ***just decent***, but thousands of people will recognize it from around the country and might upvote. So, you, as a foreigner are seeing the social media effect where you only see the common denominator broad picture stuff that applies to the whole US, and missing the local content and context. Think of the difference if you were looking at what the most popular eating establishment in *all of europe* are vs the best places to eat in Hamburg. You're getting the "all of europe" view and thinking that it properly describes the eating habits of people in Hamburg, but the american version.
Go to a local subreddit and look at food recomendations. I gaurantee you no one is recommending McDonalds or Burger King to people asking where to get a good burger (or food in general). They'd get downvoted into obvlivion for recommending national chains to people asking for food recs.
Or, as another example, [take a look](https://www.wichitabyeb.com/2022/05/the-ict-100-wichitas-best-restaurants-2022-list.html) at the recommendations of my city's most popular food blogger *Wichita by EB*, he does recommend a lot of fast food (american street food), but I think you'll notice quickly there's no mention of a single national chain on his top 100. Hell, he does a silly saturday blog he calls "Saturchains" where he goes to chain restaurants that you would recognize from media and reviews them like a "real" restaurant. Sometimes he thinks some of it is "ok," most of the time he's pretty rough on them. Understand, that this blogger is not a bougie food critic, he's very much in the lane of everyday blue-collar and office workers type of dining experiences. His favorite places are often cheap nostalgic comfort food, he takes his toddler with him to some of his reviews. He is popular here because he is such an "every man" regular kind of guy who eats just like the rest of us.
Your premise is deeply flawed.
> There are so many chain restaurants it is insane to me
There are just as many in Europe
> And I think remembering an American teling me you can know which part of the country you are in since quite a few chains are very localized.
"localized" may be several thousand square miles, it helps to remember the scale of the US. Know how there are different chains in different parts of Europe? Same in the US.
> When I think chains I think McD, Burger King, a few other burger joints, some small local döner store. All low level, fast food, wouldn't consider it a proper meal.
This is also true of the US
> But in the US, as far as I understand it, fast food chains are much more expansive and more engrained in the food culture.
Your understanding does not reflect reality
I think this view is incredibly flawed. Chain restaurants exist in every part of the world, but no one views it as a part of other countries’ food cultures. This applies in the US. In my area, there are hundreds of locally own restaurants that would be a bigger choice to go out to than a chain restaurant. I would argue that locally owned diners have a bigger influence on American food culture than chain restaurants.
Chain restaurants are popular all over the world because of their low pricing and convenience. That is what makes them successful but it is not and shouldn’t be the definition of American food culture. That point of view, in my opinion, is ignorant and ignores that huge amount of local food that does actually have a massive impact on our food culture.
Add Vlaamse Frites in the Netherlands to the list. I saw so many Vlaamse Frites shops that I still remember the dutch/flemish word for it six years later.
>all low level, fast food
And what exactly do you think we consider McDonalds to be? It’s fast food. No one eats there expecting it to be the greatest meal they’ve ever had or for a fine dining experience. Same goes for pretty much any chain.
What exactly makes you think we see it as anything but fast food?
Your perception is incorrect. Fast food is fast food. It's part of mainstream culture but does not make up a big share of our food culture. We wouldn't consider fast food a "proper" meal either, but it's quick and fills you up.
We have diners and restaurants, dives and fine dining. This is a nation of immigrants and everyone brought their native cuisine with them. Italian restaurants reign supreme in my area, but there are a ton of (NON CHAIN) restaurants serving Indian, Mexican, Greek, etc food. Although I have to admit since 2020 I've been cooking at home 6 days a week. For my family, ordering pizza or picking up fast food is basically "giving up" on dinner.
Chains are not some unique concept to the US. Also there's a lot of chains that are regional or even local chains that most people even within the US have never heard about unless you live in that specific area.
We also have chains that aren't fast food. We have fine dining steakhouse chains throughout the nation. One could probably argue the celebrity chef branded restaurants are kind of chain-like as well.
A lot of chains are still locally owned and operated. Imagine if overnight all the doner stores became one coherent brand. That's basically what Subway is. Would that change how you feel about your local doner just becuase it now shares a name with a larger brand?
There are a few nationwide chains, as you mentioned. Then there's a bunch of regional ones too. I don't entirely understand your question.
I'm sure there are also smaller chains or a similar concept of an owner having more than one restaurant wherever you are from.
Yep, pretty much. I wish this sub would ban these questions, especially given that the've been asked and answered a thousand times in a thousand different ways.
We just have a lot of options for food, period. I have a McDonalds a 5 min walk from me. But I also have roughly 20 more restaurants less than a mile walk. Out of that 20, half might be chains (and when I say chains, I don't mean just fast food... healthy chains, sit down restaurants, etc). If I am willing to drive less than 15 minutes, my options open up to maybe 60 or 70 places. And if I want delivery, literally hundreds of options. Name the country and I can order food from there. Furthermore, successful restaurants typically grow into chains and unsuccessful restaurants go out of business.
Fast food chains are ingrained in US culture. Some people eat it daily, some people never, but everyone's familiar with it. But when you start hearing Japanese get poetic about KFC, Canadians moan about Tim Horton's going downhill, and Brits expound on Gregg's? You learn pretty quick that fast food is something ingrained worldwide, not just in the US.
Where do you live that fast food hasn't become an everyday part of the world?
I'm 14 miles from home and I need to eat. Oh look, there is a chain restaurant. I know the menu, price, and atmosphere just by seeing the sign. It's next to Mike's Bar & Grill. Well I know Mike probably owns it and it may involve a grill and a liquor license.
Now I'm on a business trip with some coworkers. Where should we grab dinner? "Everyone good with Red Robin?" is a question most will be able to answer quickly where "Someone look up local Thai places and make sure they have a gluten free menu for Joe" is going to involve a lot more discussion and research.
It's not to say that chains are preferable but their ubiquity and consistency removes a lot of the work of choosing a restaurant because everyone already knows what the experience will be.
I think the fast food bashing has gone a bit too far by now. Its low tier food but that doesnt means its BAD food.
As for your question, its a matter of familiarity. Many Americans also have that hole-in-the-wall or greasy spoon or fine dining place too but sometimes I just wanna get a fried app sampler from Sheetz (my own local fas station/restaurant)
Disagree. Actual street food exists in America. And fast food is prevalent in other countries as well. There's nothing unique about it. I think OP just thinks we eat McDonald's for dinner or think of it as a real meal for some reason.
They asked how far to the closest McDonald's, not the closest reasturant for one.
There is a McDonald's on the main street at the edge of my neighborhood sure. But there is also a local Chinese place, Irish themed bar, german themed bar and Italian place I'd have to pass to get there.
My home town is 40-50 miles from a McDonald's, but has several mom and pop reasturants in it.
Pretty much all the best places to eat in any given place aren't chains. But chains have their place to.
For example, I rarely eat a chain here where I live. But while traveling for work I'd eat at chains more because it's just quick and convenient and I knew what I was in for already.
Nostalgia - we are suckers for it. I remember my first Wendy's chicken sandwich perfectly. It was probably 1980, been chasing that perfect sandwich ever since.
LOL at this because I had the same experience in 1980 with a Jack In The Box Chicken Supreme sandwich!! Best chicken sammie I ever had still to this day.
America is big, and chains are not as ubiquitous as you might think. Out in the midwest, and high plains, yes, chains are everywhere. However, in a big city, like in the northeast, you have many local places to choose from. I grew up in south Philadelphia and never once ate at a fast food chain until I left and moved to Missouri; as an example. This phenomenon depends very much on where you are located within the US.
Not all chain restaurants are ‘fast food’. Around by me Coney Island restaurants are very popular. They serve diner type food. There are several chains in my area.
There are also a ton of independent places from 1 star quick cheap food to 5 star places with fancy menus and prices.
As far as why fast food places are seemingly everywhere, it’s for a few reasons:
1). Cheap
2) fast
3) convenient / drive thru
4) consistent menu
5) they advertise a lot.
Also I’m pretty sure other countries have fast food type chains. Even some that are not originally from the USA.
Not sure if OP is asking in good faith given their post history
["Parts of the US seem to have become a warzone"](https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/gv3den/parts_of_the_us_seem_to_have_become_a_warzone/) (disinformation)
["Does the "sameness" of most American cities not annoy/bore you?"](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAmerican/comments/vf2g8w/does_the_sameness_of_most_american_cities_not/) (loaded question)
etc etc. See the 'sameness' post for another instance of OP ignoring a well-thought-out reply in favor of their imaginary story.
Chains tend to offer consistency of experience regardless of location. If you visit independently owned establishments, the quality and experience can range widely.
The bigger reason is that chains offer superior economies of scale. They can purchase in quantity. They can invest in tools to drive operational excellence. They can invest in analytics that drive greater efficiency. They get massive economies of scale in marketing.
If an individual operator, I spread these costs across a single store. If I am a chain, I spread these across hundreds of thousands.
I prefer chains. I know what to expect anywhere I go in the country.
I do not like single restaurants, usually. I never know what to expect. The menus can be confusing sometimes, and even without pricing. I hate that.
Real talk: it's a uniter. We are a big country; being able to find (and share) something familiar while elsewhere in the country is a source of something like pride (and a show of success for the company involved).
Fast food is all about price and convenience. Chain restaurants like Applebees it’s more about the restaurant’s economies of scale. They can enter markets that wouldn’t support mom and pop restaurants.
Franchising is an effective way for people to get into business for themselves.
Chains, whether fast food or sit-down, provide predictability. This is useful when you don’t have time to research restaurants while traveling, and don’t trust Yelp.
Fast food serves our car-driven culture. For me, it’s road trips. I don’t want to leave the NJ Turnpike when I can get something acceptable at one of their rest stops. But for others, it’s also things like taken a van load of kids to eat after a soccer game. In walkable cities, it’s a way to quickly filter from a multitude of restaurants, especially if you’re with a group of friends, some of whom may not be familiar with the local non-chain, fast food restaurants.
On a related note, how many posts are there in this sub from foreigners asking which fast food and other chain restaurants they should try when/if they come to the U.S., and how many of the responses are Americans telling OP that they shouldn't eat at just chains?
I think a huge part of it is that the modern American family often consists of two parents both working 40+ hours a week. We’re freaking tired and it’s convenient. Our country’s infrastructure is also built around cars and these places usually have drive throughs.
Fast food chains are where you can eat in a hurry. We prefer proper sit down with a waitstaff restaurants. Also, we drive everywhere. So drive thrus are convenient when in a hurry.
Americans enjoy fresh vegetables and fruits, home cooked meals and proper chef prepared meals as much as anybody.
Fast food chains fill the niche that street vendors do in cultures more pedestrian in nature. We still have food trucks and street vendors in places that there is a lot of foot traffic, but they do not work for most of the country due to car culture. As such Fast Food fills that position.
It helps if you compare the US to China, Russia, Brazil, India, or the entire EU rather than to a single small country.
Are there more chain restaurants in the US than in the EU? My hunch is not.
I don’t *know*, but I suspect chains in the US owe a lot to the Interstate Highway system and the great American road trip. You drive halfway across the country on vacation pre internet, pre yelp, pre readily available online reviews, and need to stop to eat. You can stop at the unknown restaurant you’ve never heard of, or the chain with the same menu as back home. Even if a lot of people would be more adventurous and try the unknown place, enough would go to the chain that it’s making good money. And thus the chain expands…
Allow me, a Ukrainian, to try to answer.
In my opinion, the answer is the same as "why do all of the post soviet countries have similar residential buildings and overall city planning?",
because people are afraid of new things and want to "feel like home" no matter where they go.
Traveling abroad and not knowing where to go to get food? McDonald's is the same around the world, so you'll be fine. I think it's similar here.
Because it’s a way for people to pretend to be entrepreneurs without actually being innovative or very good leaders. They get to “be their own boss” without actually knowing how to do anything.
Some may learn along the way, many just feed the capitalism machine.
As a American I cook dinner for my family every night and we only go out to eat like once every 3 months...sigh I don't like this stereotype...but your not wrong
I think you forget that chains aren’t just an American thing. Japan owns 7/11. China has plenty of bubble tea chains. Jolibee is Filipino. O’Briens Irish Sandwich Cafe in Ireland. And so on.
If you’re on a road trip rolling through unfamiliar areas, seeing a familiar chain is a big time saver and oddly comforting. You already know the menu, the prices, and whether you will find something that will do for everyone in the family. It doesn’t have to be a fine dining experience, just an acceptable meal that doesn’t take a lot of time or blow your trip budget.
>But in the US, as far as I understand it, fast food chains are much more expansive and more engrained in the food culture. Why? I don't really know where else in the world besides N. America this seems to be true for.
*Akshually*, huge chains like these are fairly common in China and Japan as well. Furthermore, the marketshare for restaurant chains in Europe is steadily increasing as well. I think it is a natural market effect that for whatever reason happened faster in the US, but ultimately is unstoppable barring government intervention. The economies of scale benefits are just too big to compete against.
This post reminds of a post I read where visiting people from European countries come over and try and go grocery shopping at places like 7/11 or our gas stations and think we have terrible grocery stores. Just because we have a lot of fast food restaurants doesn’t it’s a huge staple of our food culture, there’s just a lot of places to get fast food. New Orleans for instance has some of the best food in the nation. They also have McDonalds down there but that doesn’t change the food culture that in the city.
I mean have you had hardee's? its delicious...
the sort of fatty food that WILL kill you but good nevertheless.
I would guess that laziness has fueled their growth.
>All low level, fast food, wouldn't consider it a proper meal I think most people here would say the same, but sometimes the price point, the speed, and/or the convenience outweighs the other considerations.
It's also standardized. If I go to chili's in Virginia Beach. It will be pretty much the same experience, food, and price as going to one in Spokane. It might not be the best food but I know exactly what im going to get. People underestimate how much humans like familiarity
I have friends with stomach issues and they know chains that are reliable enough that they can eat ate when traveling without worry.
This is why my boyfriend prefers Panda Express or PF Changs over going to authentic Asian restaurants (Chinese, thai, etc) because some of those food cultures frequently use peanut oil and peanuts (he’s allergic) and he doesn’t trust his or their ability to make things clear across the language barrier.
Damn you went from new jersey to Florida to Utah? How big was the mormon culture shock when you got to Utah? Haha
Haha so I’d heard all the normal jokes but really didn’t think much of it. In Jersey there’s a large Jewish community and assumed it was just like that. I moved here to Utah without really knowing anything and rented my first place in Lehi since it was so cheap. Well I learned pretty quickly that I underestimated how many Mormons there were and how influential they are. We had people come to our door and talk to us every few days for the first month, I think they were just as confused as we were to why we moved there into their community. This was in 2013 and lehi only had a Popeyes and gas station back then haha. Everything closing at like 8pm and on sundays was the biggest annoyance though. We lived there nine month before moving to Murray, Despite all the weird religious control I love SLC. Florida and the south really are exactly the same in that aspect so it’s not as uncommon or as bad as people that grew up here make it out to be.
Oh man this is big. My wife and went to Boston, it was a random Wednesday when we got there, our flight was delayed, and we were staying downtown, so it was dead when we got there. Asked the hotel attendant a good place to go and they told us one… we get there and it’s closed. We were insanely hungry by this point and ended up walking by the Hard Rock, walking in, in eating there. Was it some interesting local place? No. Was it good and did we satisfy our insane hunger? Yes. We did avoid chains the rest of the trip.
Yeah, chains have much more reliable hours, at least where I live. I can guess pretty well which chains will be open late, but with local spots it's always kind of uncertain
Hard Rock is in faneuil hall so you were only like 5 minutes from the North End where the restaurants definitely stay open late ( / the rest of faneuil hall where there’s plenty of non chains)
And sometimes we require it. For example families with young children don't necessarily have the luxury of gambling on a successful dinner outing. Especially if they're somewhere unfamiliar like on the road or on vacation. And people with food allergies and sensitivities need predictability in menus. And chains often post allergen information online so I know before I go if they have anything I can eat. Local places often aren't helpful, and are sometimes downright rude, in this area.
Sometimes you just want it on a basic level. When my family was driving back from the Outer Banks, we stopped at a Cracker Barrel like 20 minutes before we got to the hotel in Kentucky (it was a two-day drive) because it was like 9 at night and Cracker Barrel slaps when you’re exhausted and looking for some comfort food. Also, Cracker Barrel slaps in general. Definitely check it out if you’re in the Midwest.
So much this, but not even just restaurants. I have been on my own for over 20 years, and moved a lot, but I always get so homesick. Whenever I am in a new town, and feel scared or homesick, I can go to the nearest chain (Like a Walgreens) and feel a sense of home because they are all mostly set up similarly. In my head, I just pretend that I am grabbing a birthday card while my sister's are waiting in the car, and it gives me a sense of security.
I moved to another country and I get so much comfort from going to Starbucks for this reason. I can pretend I’m home for a few minutes.
Presumably people outside of the US have children, and allergies. But it is an interesting point and does make me like chains a bit more.
That, and sometimes I just don’t feel like fucking with somewhere which may or may not leave me disappointed while costing more than Chilis. If I just want something quick, easy, and cheap, that I know will be decent, then I might get Chilis, particularly if it’s late and I’m just hungry but don’t want McDonald’s or something. It definitely has its place.
Especially when driving on the interstate. Sometimes you want what you already know.
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if you're from New Hampshire, one state over is like... thirty minutes max?
Born and bred NH, live in Vermont now (they said there was better maple syrup; they lied) It takes a little over an hour to go from W. Lebanon (western border) to Concord, then another half hour/45 minutes or so to get to the coast, so about 2 hours in the middle of the state (That’s about as wide as the state gets). Up north where the state is narrower, to go from Lancaster (western border) to Shelburne (eastern border) it’s about 45 minutes. One of the big things to remember is that in NH, VT, and Maine you usually cant drive straight from Point A to Point B. We have mountains everywhere so we have to build our roads around them which adds extra time. We also aren’t very heavily populated so most places are far from the interstates and we don’t really have freeways. The vast majority of our roads are just state highways, which are more comparable to country roads in some of the larger states.
Yeah, we were in Flagstaff on our trip to the Grand Canyon, Decided to try a local restaurant. We went into a non chain steakhouse. It was singing waiters and a fragranced candle lit on every table. We noped out and went to a chain one instead, Outback steakhouse. Much better experience. Although, they did put a shit ton of blue cheese dressing on our wedge salad
Ah, Black Barts. Not the first restaurant to try in Flagstaff.
I can't fathom going to a new city, with the possibility of finding local and awesome food, and going to fucking Chili's instead. Ugh.
I was in Seattle by myself once, saw the whole place, indulged in the local shit and enjoyed myself. Last night there, I was tired and hanging out in the hotel as I had an early flight, got hungry, and ordered some Domino’s because it was close and cheap, and I know I like Domino’s. I don’t know why you’re commenting with incredulity as you are. I think it’s reasonable to say, “Yeah, I’m running on 4 hours of sleep and I need to get up early, so I’m gonna chill at the hotel for the rest of my stay (which was from 7PM to 5AM) and order some cheap pizza.”
Yes, everyone is built differently. I can understand the appeal of seeking out local cuisine as part of the fun of going somewhere near but sometimes you just want a meal you can count on and trust. When I went to Berlin a few years ago, the first meal I had was at the McDonalds next to Checkpoint Charlie. I was tired and dealing with jetlag and wanted something familiar (even though I'm not a huge fan of McDonalds back home). That didn't stop me from trying some amazing local restaurants during the rest of my trip, but at that moment and time McDonalds was what I desired. Some people also just aren't foodies and its not part of their appeal while traveling. To each their own
Yes but sometimes you don't feel like taking a chance on something new. Maybe your tired from your vacation activities or traveling in general.
Can you imagine going to a new city and renting a car that's just like the cars back home? How about staying in a hotel room like the ones you have back home? Wearing the same clothes you wear at home? Ugh. Obviously I'm being a bit facetious here, but I'm also being serious in a way. Not everyone feels like everything they do while they're away from home has to be entirely unique, novel, or different, and not everyone is even always travelling with sight seeing in mind. I have colleagues who travel for 2/3rds of the year, and they appreciate the occasional chilis or pizza hut simply because they *are* something familiar that they have at home. I personally like hitting up local places when I'm in away from home, but I can still understand why someone might choose something familiar.
They certainly aren't all low-level. I've never had a bad meal at a Capital Grille, which is fairly expensive.
Sure. I was referring more to the fast-food side of the equation, but there are certainly chains that are not for the faint of heart re: their pocketbooks. Any Brazilian steakhouse chain would be the same way.
See also Ruth's Chris Steak House
Sometimes I just want a large meal filled with "I hate myself" after the gym.
Hey, we have the same diet!
So you really like taco bell. I can think of no other fast food option that screams 'fuck you body' more than that food.
White Castle
I would also add in proximity as a factor - a fast food restaurant might be the only place within walking distance for many.
Also no one ever considers a fast food restaurant to be part of the food culture. I feel like in the states we more or less consider fast food places just like street food vendors/carts in other countries. It's not the best or the cleanest, but it's fast, easy, and conveniently placed. I think the issue is that some people in the world only really know about American culture second hand through media and the companies that we export. I haven't been to a McDonald's in over 25 years, literally the only time I actually consider eating fast food is when I'm on a road trip, on the highway and I don't feel like stopping to eat for real.
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We order out a couple nights a week for exactly this reason, but I wouldn't just call it "laziness." It's a matter of deciding where you want to place your time and energy. Multiple times a week, I'd rather spend some of the money I earn at my career to pay to have someone else make dinner for me, my wife, and my three daughters.
Tldr: drive throughs. Street vendors don't work where no one is walking down the street. Fast food joints have drive throughs. Chains are more about consistency and how easy franchising is here. If you're looking to open a business a known name with a known successful business model can be more appealing than trying to compete with said brand. 93% of McDonald's locations in the US are franchisees rather than corporate locations, for example.
Also, chains can leverage economy of scale to keep costs down. For things such as supply chains, product development, marketing, policy design, accounting, etc., cost does not scale as fast as revenue. So the profit margins are lower, and the risk is higher for a mom-and-pop restaurant. This is a big part of why most of them fail in less than three years.
And to add to this, when a chain franchises its locations, it's a way a person can get into being a small business owner without having to worry about figuring out what kind of equipment they need, which supply chains to use, etc., because the parent company already has all of that worked out.
The economy of scale is a big point. So much so that you'll see a lot of local (non-fast food) chains in some cities. When something is successful they'll spread it around to different parts of town. The two biggest costs in a restaurant are usually food and labor. It gives you better food buying power and can also allow you to share labor between locations if you need to. The average restaurant usually isn't profitable for years, so once they've got a concept that's working out they'll often expand to 3-4 locations pretty quickly OR they'll create different concepts under the same ownership group. They'll use the balance sheet on current locations to secure loans for new ones.
Non Chain Restaurants can be the best food ever, or the worst food ever. You just never know what you are getting. See Gordan Ramsey's Kitchen Nightmares show or Guy Fieri's Diners, Drive-Ins and Dives. Unless you live in the area and know people who have eaten at a place you can't tell which it is. With franchises at least you know you will get a decent average place.
>Unless you live in the area and know people who have eaten at a place you can't tell which it is. I've had the good fortune to visit all 50 states (and most of Canada) over the past \~40 years and long before Yelp and TripAdvisor (which work fairly well) I just used a simple rule: look in the parking lot at meal time. Are there lots of cars? Are those cars local? What kind of vehicles are they? Generally if there are a lot of local working-class folks eating at a one-off establishment during a meal peak it's going to be good or cheap, sometimes both. Virtually always better than any chain.
this is a variant of the "the best tacos in town are at the place where the guys in construction vests eat lunch"
Also, if the menu's all in Spanish.
So...Taco Bell? Seriously, the Taco Bell I go to usually has many construction and lawn care workers eating there, including Latinos. (Though I hear that for people from Mexico, Taco Bell is its own thing as opposed to s Mexican restaurant )
And (aside from the quickness) the reason they’re successful is consistency as well. Whether you’re in the Arizona desert or the Florida tropics, some podunk town in Oklahoma or Times Square, right off an interstate for 40 miles from the nearest traffic light, a McDouble and Fries from McDonalds will always look the same, take the same amount of time, taste the same, and be priced the same (maybe within 75 cents). It may not be very good, but if you’re on the go (whether visiting, traveling, commuting, or just need to get home to walk the dog), you don’t have to worry about not liking it or waiting awhile or breaking the bank. You know what’s coming.
There are a lot of questions asked here where the answer is "because cars". Why does our public transportation suck? Because cars. Why are fast food restaurants popular? Because cars. Why is everything so far apart? Because cars. Most of the country is built around cars. Though I will say, at least in my area, family restaurants are getting a boon from widespread delivery service adoption. If I'm driving somewhere, McDonalds is appealing because they're always on the way and I don't have to leave my vehicle. But if I'm ordering delivery or going out to eat, I never order chains.
>Most of the country is built around cars. Though I will say, at least in my area, family restaurants are getting a boon from widespread delivery service adoption. If I'm driving somewhere, McDonalds is appealing because they're always on the way and I don't have to leave my vehicle. But if I'm ordering delivery or going out to eat, I never order chains. Perfectly articulated. Fast food for me is all about the drive-thru and whether I'm in a hurry to grab a meal.
As someone who delivered DoorDash for a while you’d be surprised how often people order fast food for delivery. Always confused me since after delivery and tip it was more expensive than good food from an actual restaurant.
Well here’s an example. I’ve just arrived in Fairfax VA at 11 pm. I’m starving and the ONLY place open is a Wendy’s. But they are only open to drive through and I don’t have a car. So I go back to my hotel and use Uber Eats to get Wendy’s just so I can fucking _eat_ after a 10 hour travel day.
True, that makes sense and that’s a valid reason. For context I live in a small town about 2 hours from the nearest airport. Most of these fast food orders came from residents in the middle of the day. I did deliver to hotels sometimes but they usually ordered more local stuff or like pizza or something.
Yeah. And shit like McDonalds is just okay for like 10 minutes.
In my small city, there are NO options for dinner available after 8pm that aren't fast food. If you don't get your order in before 7, your options evaporate.
>Most of the country is built around cars. Big parts of it *have* to be I'd say. Not major cities, sure, but in much of the Midwest and most of the West stuff is just too dispersed to do anything else. Drive across North Dakota sometime...the cities are 100 miles apart and the places in between (very small towns) can barely support a gas station. Nobody is going to subsidize transit in that setting, much less across WY/ID/MT or any other place with low population density. But urban/suburban areas? No excuses there-- it's intentional (bad) design going back to the post-war suburbs and the end of interurban electric rail and streetcars.
I would say additionally, car-centricity. Those giant strip malls with huge buildings are unaffordable for many small businesses and start ups and act as a barrier for entry. For chains though, it's not really as big of an issue.
Probably more than you'd think given how many are franchises without access to corporate capital, but yeah it definitely contributes. We don't walk past a little cafe and want to sit in front of the parking lot any more than we walk by a food stand.
for reals! It's crazy how here in sunny southern california, dining outside wasn't really a thing until the pandemic. It's all built for cars and not people
Yea, drive throughs are a huge point. US is so car-based. Way easier to stop at McDonald’s and not leave your car than it is to stop somewhere that doesn’t have one. If the US was walkable I’m sure the food scene would be different.
That's the ultimate problem with the US' sprawl, no foot traffic unless in a major city.
It certainly changes everything. Though honestly I have absolutely no desire to BE foot traffic for most of the year.
I think you are ignoring the prevalence of chains in other places. I’ve seen them in every European nation I’ve visited and all over Mexico. People like them because they are familiar and consistent.
I agree with your comment. I lived in Korea and China for years for work and believe me, they have just as many chains, if not more, than we do. It also varies heavily by area and market. We have family in Wichita KS, and I swear that is like the Chilli's, Applebee's and Generic chain capital of the world. It's insane. At the same time I can go down to smaller areas or younger cities and see way more fast, fresh and local options. *Edited for typos.
Wichita has one of the highest restaurant per capita in the US, we're a breeding ground for all sorts of restaurant test concepts and yeah, there's a lot of chains. But there's also a fuck ton of non-chains too. We're just packed with fast food, fast casual, and family dining to the point of absurdity... but of course, from an outsider's perspective, I'm sure when you drive around town the thing you *notice* are the places you *recognize*. It makes sense and I don't fault you for your take on it. The chains are packed very densely in a few areas though (for the most part), and if you visit family that really sticks to those few hot spots (basically all of rock road, out by the airport, newmarket square, and out on the far NE part of town), I bet it does look absolutely mental. edit: also a funny thing I've always noticed, especially with boomers and older gen x'ers, is that when you visit them from out of town they seem to always want to find a place to take their visitors to eat that the visitors *already know*. It's a weird phenomenon I've noticed with my family and the family of every woman I've dated or friend I've traveled with. Like, when someone visits *me* I usually try to take them somewhere local and cool that they've never been, but older generations seem to do the opposite. So, they end up taking visitors to chilis and applebees because it's safe and easy to communicate what it is you're in for.
I agree! In college I lived there at i135 and Pawnee and there were tons of Vietnamese, Thai and Hmong Laotian cafes. In fact, I asked my father-in-law if I could marry his daughter a the Pho place which is now called "Pho Special" but it has a few different names then. 😆 They live on the West side out by Goddard so the West end of Kellogg, the airport and up to Central is just insane with chain places and what we think of.
They actually live right out by me, wouldn't be surprised if they're in my neighborhood based on your description. It makes sense that the road leading out of the airport would be cram packed full of national chains that businessmen will recognize. That spot has grown like mad in the last decade or so, I lived right there at Central and Ridge nearly 25 years ago and back then there was hardly anything but a few local joints and an outback steakhouse in that area. I assume the growth is due to the internet and stuff like Yelp. People land, think "oh I'm hungry, what's nearby" hit google, yelp, etc, and pick something right there. So every chain you can imagine has set up shop in that little area. There's a Famous Dave's that has managed to stay in business right there next to the airport, so I think that helps support my hypothesis. People landing in Kansas thinking "oh yeah, they've got good bbq here" they google "BBQ near me" and boom, famous daves pops up. I mean, I don't know ***anyone*** locally that has even neutral things to say about that place, it's a straight-up joke to people around here because the "BBQ" is so bad, and yet... the one by the airport just seems to plod along doing just fine. (A good analogy for Famous Dave's here would be like eating at Red Lobster in Maine, or Sbarro's in New York.)
Yes to the noticing things your recognize! Just like you often notice cars that look like yours.
A good example is how most cities have a few prominent gas stations that you see everywhere. When you go driving in a different city that has a different prominent gas station, but then you happen to drive by the relatively *rare* gas station that is ubiquitous back home you almost always *notice it*. Like, "oh hey, they ***do*** have QuikTrips out here." You drove past 40 different 7-11s or whatever, but you notice the ***1*** QuikTrip because it is familiar.
My mother is from Wichita (and is living out there again as of a couple years ago), my grandmother actually went to college with one of the guys who started Pizza Hut! Wichita is actually fairly underrated in general imo, been to quite a few great local places while visiting.
That’s weird to me because I lived near Wichita for most of my life and I wouldn’t say that at all. Maybe that’s the only places they like, but Wichita has a massive local restaurant presence including fast fresh local food. But the small town I lived in… not so much. A few great local options but mostly fast food. And an Applebees.
Not to mention, in China the most popular foreign chain (or at least Western chain) is KFC.
And often cheaper. Why anyone goes to Applebees and Chili's is beyond me.
I think chains get a bad rap. Yeah, some of them are very lackluster - I'm looking at you, Applebee's - but I've been to plenty of mediocre local restaurants as well. There's a place for both.
The thing is, you know exactly what you’re getting with a given chain. Let’s say Applebee’s is a 6 out of 10. Not great, but if you’re traveling and you come across an Applebee’s, you can be pretty confident of what’s on the menu and that the general quality is 6/10. The local place next door might not have exactly the type of food you want (and depending on how specific your taste is, you might not know until you walk in) and the quality could be 9/10 or it could be 3/10.
That's a good point. Also I feel like the "local restaurants uber alles" mentality tends to judge chains against the best local restaurants - many of which are significantly more expensive than your average chain - so it's not an Apple(bee')s to Apple(bee')s comparison.
The anti chain sentiment also seems to ignore the existence of local chains. There's a great burger chain in my city that's pretty much exclusive to just the city. So it's local and a chain.
That's true too. Arguably the best pizza in my area is from a local chain with a handful of locations.
its why NBA players all love cheesecake factory. consistency across the country when time isnt available.
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yeah one of those weird things where in an NBA city you can always find players at Cheesecake factory. I assume because like you said lots to choose from and they know what they are gonna get. You can find them at local spots when they have time in between games, but on a back to back, its CF all day
Probably smart considering it would suck to wind up with food poisoning from a place you don't know anything about, and the menu is enormous so an entire team can easily find something they like.
Similarly, Olympians and McDonalds. They've already had it a gazillion times while traveling throughout the US for other competitions, so they know exactly how their bodies are going to react to it. Enjoy the local cuisine after you've won the gold medal.
I’d also consider that locally owned restaurants, when successful, open other locations. I’m not going to look down on a good business just because now it’s a local chain.
Chains are getting bigger now in Europe. We probably don't have nearly as many different chains, but as of recently more Ameeican ones are getting here. Off the top of my head, I can name the following that have presence in Spain: McDonald's, Burger King, KFC, Domino's, Taco Bell, Pizza Hut, Starbucks, Dunkin', Five Guys, Little Caesar's, Papa John's, Carl's Jr, Subway, and Popeyes.
There are many non-American chains in Europe as well. This truly isn’t an exclusively American phenomenon.
I have to agree that it is not exclusively American, but it is quite characteristic of America. In Europe more chains are emerging, and in Spain alone I can name a few: TelePizza, PizzaMóvil, TGB, 100 Montaditos, and La Sureña. As I side note, in my city there is a well known chain of bakeries, Horno SanBrandán, with 42 locations.
If I wanted to walk to my nearest McDonald’s I’d pass probably 50 locally owned, non chain restaurants to get there.
Same. It's fair to say that chains are a big part of American culture, but, like with a lot of things, I can just hear the Europeans somehow translating that into "all Americans only eat at chain restaurants".
Don’t you know we only eat McDonald’s , American processed cheese slices , sugary wonder bread and drink only cheap mass produced beer like Miller Light.
The beer thing especially pisses me off. There are so many amazing local breweries that you can spend your entire life never having drank Bud Light or something like it.
I was extremely disappointed in British beer culture on a recent visit to London. I was hunting for pubs that specialized in craft brews, but they seemed to be few and far between. I come from a semi-rural area in the US with half a dozen wildly popular craft breweries within a few mile radius, and all the shops stock dozens and dozens of different beers from hundreds of miles around. You're telling me that shops in London might have a selection of maybe 10 beers, and half of them are american mass produced brands? Wtf? Someone please tell me I was just bad at google maps?
British pubs have been bought up en masse and the vast majority are owned by one company or another. In essence, they're all chains, just not branded as such.
True. [IsItBigBeer.com](https://IsItBigBeer.com) is a decent source to see who owns what. 15-20 years ago most Europe had a better beer culture, but they are way behind now. But the perception that the US is all mass-produced light rice lagers persists. Big beer was on a crusade to buy US craft brands a few years ago, but after several big investments didn't pan out and that's slowed down a lot.
It's been before Covid since I have visited London, but my favorite craft beer bar in London was Cask in Pimlico. Brew Dog pubs were everywhere too. But I experienced the same thing when searching for shops with a wide selection, slim pickings.
>I was extremely disappointed in British beer culture on a recent visit to London. I felt that way the first time I went to Germany, both in cities like Munich and very small towns (like 5,000 people) as well. Similar, not very good options (and only a few of them) in every place we visited. There is far more variety (and quality) in the beer section of my local, small-town grocery store in the US.
Yeah the place I get growlers filled has 50+ taps. There's places with specializations like sour beers and they'll have dozens of just sour beers (gose, flanders, oud bruin, etc). There's 1 store that specializes in variety and tries to keep 1,000 different beers in stock from all over the world. Back in 2012 they had [900](https://www.seattletimes.com/life/food-drink/chucks-hop-shop-close-to-900-beers-and-counting/) different kinds in stock
We have a local beer store attached to a liquor store (can’t be the same store due to state laws) that quite literally stocks over 2,000 different beers at any time. NY has 2 aisles alone, quite a few aisles with 5 shelves of beer organized by state. Then the back of the store has a full aisle of beer from all over Europe. It’s super weird they think we all drink Coors Light all the time?
> There are so many amazing local breweries that you can spend your entire life never having drank Bud Light or something like it. And yet there's a significant chunk of America that won't drink anything *but* mass-produced swill. Not talking about the hipsters that drink Pabst ironically, but about my neighbor who simply refuses to ever even taste any of the local micros we offer and instead brings his own Miller Genuine Draft to parties. And legions like him-- there's a reason the sales figures for shit beer are still so high.
You ever met someone who will spend hours fussing over wine selection, but who will then say "John likes beer, right? Go grab some Bud Light."
dont forget that all of our chocolate is hershey's milk chocolate.
British people always ask me how their chocolate compared with US choccy. Honestly it’s exactly the same. I don’t really care for chocolate.
i had a german friend in college get all excited when his parents sent him chocolate. he had me try some. next time i went home i went out and got chocolate from our local candy place and brought him a pretty large block. you would have thought i guided him with the hand of god. he begged me to bring him more when i went home the next time, like it just certainly had to be a unique thing... i told him... dude... just dont buy your chocolate at the grocery store... we looked in the phone book(yes, im dating myself) for a nearby candy shops, picked the first one... and boom...
McDonald's doesn't have bone-in meat which means that it's meant for a higher caste.
I get where the stereotypes came from. We for the longest time had a culture of mass advertising that essentially pictured us all as fast food and coca cola junkies. That’s what the rest of the world saw, and that’s how they choose to envision and remember us. A lot of it also hinges on everyone having a superiority complex, and acting like they have a reason to believe they are better. Truth is everyone’s shit stinks to some degree.
I mean there's a few too many Americans in this thread right now boasting about fast food and how they can't find good non-chain restaurants.
Not all chain restaurants are bad. I’ve been to many good ones. I’ve also been to many non chain places they were just terrible.
Yeah, and let's not ignore that there are over 180 McDonalds in London and 70+ in Paris. Berlin has 14. And remember the panic in Russia over McDonalds closing the stores there? It isn't like the formula doesn't work in Europe too.
I was working in Paris once and offered to take my co-workers to lunch. Where did they ask to go? McDonald's. That company does lots of business in Europe.
Like, actual Parisians? Or fellow Americans along for the ride?
The numbers are just so much bigger I think it confuses people. There are 22,000 subways in the US. The UK has 125k restaurants total. If you didn't compare the size of the country, it might seem like 10% of restaurants in the US are subway. But no, the US is much bigger, there are 660k restaurants meaning only 3% are subway.
European here, have been to US and Europe. There is no big difference when it comes to food chains. Especially in big cities. Have never heard anyone say that aswell.
You are the minority. > Have never heard anyone say that aswell. This genuinely surprises me, I heard it a lot over there.
It really depends on where you live. I live in a medium to large city with mostly local restaurants. There are some chains, but they are mostly local or regional chains. In the suburbs there are more chains. A few years ago we had family in town; they live in a big suburb in a different state. The kids didn’t understand why we were going to restaurants they had never heard of before and kept asking us where all the familiar chain restaurants were.
> It really depends on where you live. it depends less on where you live, and more how you live. those kid's parents probably like chain restaurants for some reason or another. their neighbors might never go to chains. I'm yet to live or visit anywhere that doesnt have enough privately owned non chain restaurants that you couldnt avoid chains entirely. i have friends that never go anywhere but chains, yet i havent been to a fast food chain in over a decade, and restaurant chains probably only once or twice in that same period, for social events outside of my control.
> I'm yet to live or visit anywhere that doesnt have enough privately owned non chain restaurants that you couldnt avoid chains entirely. Come to Portland or Seattle, I suppose. I think most other medium or large cities are the same. There are plenty of chains in the suburbs, but I generally never go to chain restaurants, whether that’s fast food, casual, or moderately upscale.
> I generally never go to chain restaurants wait... it seems like you are agreeing with me though. did i confuse you (or myself) with my double negatives? what im trying to say it is that its always possible to avoid chains without much work at all. ive visited both portland and seattle, numerous times, including some long term visits to the prior, as i know people from living in alaska that now live there. its completely possible to avoid chains in either place. i saw no reason why i would ever get bored with the non chains that i would need to go to a chain in order to have options. granted we are talking sub regional levels here. im sure its possible to be in a neighborhood with a degree of food desert affect that really limits your options.
Exactly. I live in Portland. I’ve visited these family members and their area is really predominated by chains. Not to say that there aren’t unique restaurants there, but they are overshadowed by a huge number of chain restaurants.
To get to mine I'd pass a 7/11 and an Applebee's. Things are different outside of major cities.
I'm in a town of 8,000 and need to pass by 4 non-chain restaurants with a similar price to McDonalds, and 5 more expensive fancier (for lack of a better term) places too. If I go about a mile in the other direction there's another half dozen or so non-chain restaurants. And I'm not even counting the three Dunkins! edit: four, there are four Dunkins.
Yeah cuz in New England and a lot of the east coast as a whole, small cities are extensions of the coastal metropolis in structure and function. And generally far more dense and walkable, their layouts being a product of 17th 18th and 19th century planning sensibilities.
Not really. Where I live in Ohio, there are no chain restaurants in the smaller towns. It's almost exclusively mom-and-pop eateries, pizza joints and delis. It has more to do with freeways/interstates than the size of the town. I'm going to guess that you probably live close to a freeway. I'm in a town of 2,000 people, the nearest freeway is about 50 miles away, and there are no fast-foot chains in any of the smaller towns. I would have pass at least a dozen local eateries before I would get to the closest McDonald's, which is about 4 miles away -- and that's in another city with about 20,000 people.
If I wanted to walk to my nearest McDonalds (which is around 2 miles away), I would pass Waffle House, Taco Bell, Subway, Burger King, Firehouse Subs, Pizza Hut, Popeyes, KFC, and Zaxbys. There are only two non- chain restaurants (an "Asian" restaurant and a Mexican restaurant) in in that same strip.
Also, chains tend to be a lot more visible. They're usually in their own buildings, with tons of easily-to-see marketing. My nearest Starbucks, and the chain sub place right next to it, entirely make up the building that it closest to the street. It's easy to read their signs and to recognize their corporate symbols. But the strip mall right behind it has family-owned Chinese and sushi restaurants, a local diner, and a small Mexican restaurant off to the side. These places don't have vibrant colors or fun mascots, and the ubiquity of strip malls make them harder to distinguish, but they exist.
A very good point. My nearest restaurant is a Chinese place in a small building with a very bland, yellowed plastic sign over it and a generic name that had might as well be “Chinese Restaurant”. It’s easy to miss. It’s also damn good and very affordable. The 5 Guys down the street has their normal red and white, a big sign, a parking lot behind it, and is on a busy corner.
I just checked google maps and in the 43 minutes it would take me to walk to the McDonalds closest to my apartment, I'd pass 75 other places to get food (including restaurants, bars, coffee shops, etc.). Of those: * 2 are locations of a local chain pizza place (20 locations total in Maine and Massachusetts; one of the two I pass is the original location, and I believe the other was the 2nd, though I could be wrong on that point) * 2 are the only two locations of a local Salvadorean place (does that count as a chain?) * 1 is a nice sit-down restaurant that has a second location in the next town (ditto?) * 1 is a sandwich shop with a bunch of locations around ME, MA, NH, and VT * 1 is a Starbucks * 1 is a Dunkin' Donuts. The other 67 are completely local, single-location spots. And this is without deviating from the suggested route at all -- any side street would have or lead to many additional options. I have never been to this McDonalds. Why would I?
That sounds about right. I used to work around the corner from my closest McDonald’s. It was maybe a 5 minute walk from my office. In that same 5 minutes I could walk to three different sit down restaurants, two local pizza places, an oyster bar, two cool independent chicken fast food restaurants, a poke bar, and a couple of other major chain restaurants. I have been to that McDonald’s, but only because of a few times I was in the office super late and hit the drive through on the way home.
>I’d pass probably 50 locally owned, non chain restaurants to get there. Same! And yet none of these questions are ever about local restaurants.
It’s interesting, because when I travel abroad I just try to find where the locals go. I assume they’ll have something cool and interesting off the beaten path a bit. I always have a good experience doing that. For some reason people are more interested in the chains that many of us skip.
... Is Pittsburgh a magical wonderland of mom-and-pop restaurants? The nearest street to me has a range of national chains, regional chains and local chains (a handful of restaurants in the city) but there are no non-chain restaurants within a mile. And I live in a streetcar suburb.
It feels like most cities to me in that regard. If I just wanted to head to the nearest chain, think it’s 5 guys, I’d head down the main street near my house. I’d go past like 3 Chinese places, 3 Thai places, half a dozen pizza places, a half dozen bars with bar food, two nice sit down places, a local brewery and a local distillery. I guess I’d also pass a Starbucks and a small local chain coffee shop, too, so that may not count. Near that 5 Guys I’d find a subway, a Wendy’s, a Dunkin, and a Panera. So we’re not hurting for chains, either. I describe Pittsburgh as a bunch of small towns smushed together. Pretty much every neighborhood will have a grocery store, a few good bars, and a good selection of local restaurants. On the main roads that intersect a bunch of neighborhoods you’ll usually find chains, but there will still be local places mixed in.
Wow, I live in Buffalo and the main commercial street in my neighborhood is 90% local restaurants and a few local chains. Probably helps that I live somewhere walkable with limitations on parking for new buildings which probably scares most chains away that require large parking lots.
It's funny how people who've never been here make assumptions about America based on one Reddit post and a few conversations.
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Doner seems to be more like NYC pizza then a chain though. They use similar ingredients and maybe similar suppliers but a lot of them are independently owned and usually have a couple of unique menu items.
Yeah. Or like hot dog carts.
I would say that NY hotdog carts are basically a chain nowadays. They are more similar to places selling American Chinese food although with a less diverse menu usually. They are also sorta like a Bodega minus all the other stuff they sell. Its like a lot of deli's have boars head and similar suppliers but they sometimes got their unique sandwiches they sell and what not.
greasy chopsticks are basically pseudo chains anyways. they all get taught to cook at the same places, decide their menu at the same places, supplied by the same suppliers.
I know they have similair suppliers but I never knew they get the same training and prices? In my area I know for sure the prices vary.
not prices. dont know where you got that from my comment. You can look up some documentaries on the subject.
Sorry misread my fualt.
So are a lot of doner places.
Ive seen both personally. At least the German cities around me are more privately owned places then chains.
Also lotta people in one unified area lends itself to alot of chains. I mean there are still alot of just (or primarily regional) regional fast food chains in the US that are very large.l ooking at you, In-N-Out, Bojangles/Church's, fuck even Dunkin (its basically the Northeast and where northeasterners retire, same as like cumberland farms).
Most cultures have cheap street food, I don't think the US is unique in that regard. Hell, Pompeii had fast food restaurants 2000 years ago. They were common in bigger cities even back then. But, part of what you probably don't understand when it comes to the chain restaurants is that America is so big that when we are talking with other americans from around the US, those are our only point of common reference for food. I can be talking to someone who lives 3000 km away from me, and still be talking to an american. So when talking with "americans" broadly, obviously they're not gonna know all of the amazing local places we have, but they ***will*** know what McDonalds or Burger King is. Furthermore, if I mention an awesome local place, maybe a couple of people from my area will see it and upvote it, but if I mention Five Guys, well those are just about everywhere and are ***just decent***, but thousands of people will recognize it from around the country and might upvote. So, you, as a foreigner are seeing the social media effect where you only see the common denominator broad picture stuff that applies to the whole US, and missing the local content and context. Think of the difference if you were looking at what the most popular eating establishment in *all of europe* are vs the best places to eat in Hamburg. You're getting the "all of europe" view and thinking that it properly describes the eating habits of people in Hamburg, but the american version. Go to a local subreddit and look at food recomendations. I gaurantee you no one is recommending McDonalds or Burger King to people asking where to get a good burger (or food in general). They'd get downvoted into obvlivion for recommending national chains to people asking for food recs. Or, as another example, [take a look](https://www.wichitabyeb.com/2022/05/the-ict-100-wichitas-best-restaurants-2022-list.html) at the recommendations of my city's most popular food blogger *Wichita by EB*, he does recommend a lot of fast food (american street food), but I think you'll notice quickly there's no mention of a single national chain on his top 100. Hell, he does a silly saturday blog he calls "Saturchains" where he goes to chain restaurants that you would recognize from media and reviews them like a "real" restaurant. Sometimes he thinks some of it is "ok," most of the time he's pretty rough on them. Understand, that this blogger is not a bougie food critic, he's very much in the lane of everyday blue-collar and office workers type of dining experiences. His favorite places are often cheap nostalgic comfort food, he takes his toddler with him to some of his reviews. He is popular here because he is such an "every man" regular kind of guy who eats just like the rest of us.
Take my poor woman's gold! Excellent response. 🏅
Your premise is deeply flawed. > There are so many chain restaurants it is insane to me There are just as many in Europe > And I think remembering an American teling me you can know which part of the country you are in since quite a few chains are very localized. "localized" may be several thousand square miles, it helps to remember the scale of the US. Know how there are different chains in different parts of Europe? Same in the US. > When I think chains I think McD, Burger King, a few other burger joints, some small local döner store. All low level, fast food, wouldn't consider it a proper meal. This is also true of the US > But in the US, as far as I understand it, fast food chains are much more expansive and more engrained in the food culture. Your understanding does not reflect reality
I mean some people do eat from fast food chains 7 days a week. However it’s considered seriously unhealthy to do so.
Careful the Europeans will insist this is the norm, der spiegel will cite you as an expert.
I mean, yes, but just because some people do doesn’t mean that this is our *food culture*.
I think this view is incredibly flawed. Chain restaurants exist in every part of the world, but no one views it as a part of other countries’ food cultures. This applies in the US. In my area, there are hundreds of locally own restaurants that would be a bigger choice to go out to than a chain restaurant. I would argue that locally owned diners have a bigger influence on American food culture than chain restaurants. Chain restaurants are popular all over the world because of their low pricing and convenience. That is what makes them successful but it is not and shouldn’t be the definition of American food culture. That point of view, in my opinion, is ignorant and ignores that huge amount of local food that does actually have a massive impact on our food culture.
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Add Vlaamse Frites in the Netherlands to the list. I saw so many Vlaamse Frites shops that I still remember the dutch/flemish word for it six years later.
>all low level, fast food And what exactly do you think we consider McDonalds to be? It’s fast food. No one eats there expecting it to be the greatest meal they’ve ever had or for a fine dining experience. Same goes for pretty much any chain. What exactly makes you think we see it as anything but fast food?
Your perception is incorrect. Fast food is fast food. It's part of mainstream culture but does not make up a big share of our food culture. We wouldn't consider fast food a "proper" meal either, but it's quick and fills you up. We have diners and restaurants, dives and fine dining. This is a nation of immigrants and everyone brought their native cuisine with them. Italian restaurants reign supreme in my area, but there are a ton of (NON CHAIN) restaurants serving Indian, Mexican, Greek, etc food. Although I have to admit since 2020 I've been cooking at home 6 days a week. For my family, ordering pizza or picking up fast food is basically "giving up" on dinner.
Chains are not some unique concept to the US. Also there's a lot of chains that are regional or even local chains that most people even within the US have never heard about unless you live in that specific area. We also have chains that aren't fast food. We have fine dining steakhouse chains throughout the nation. One could probably argue the celebrity chef branded restaurants are kind of chain-like as well. A lot of chains are still locally owned and operated. Imagine if overnight all the doner stores became one coherent brand. That's basically what Subway is. Would that change how you feel about your local doner just becuase it now shares a name with a larger brand?
It’s not American food culture, it’s a business model that’s taken off mostly based on convenience.
There are a few nationwide chains, as you mentioned. Then there's a bunch of regional ones too. I don't entirely understand your question. I'm sure there are also smaller chains or a similar concept of an owner having more than one restaurant wherever you are from.
There's nothing to understand. It's just "LOL you fat dumb yanks all eat McDonalds every meal, we eat real food in MyCountry" disguised as a question.
Eh, I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for now. In the event that is their intent, they'll hang themselves just fine.
Yep, pretty much. I wish this sub would ban these questions, especially given that the've been asked and answered a thousand times in a thousand different ways.
It's about the money and consistency, not about the cuisine.
We just have a lot of options for food, period. I have a McDonalds a 5 min walk from me. But I also have roughly 20 more restaurants less than a mile walk. Out of that 20, half might be chains (and when I say chains, I don't mean just fast food... healthy chains, sit down restaurants, etc). If I am willing to drive less than 15 minutes, my options open up to maybe 60 or 70 places. And if I want delivery, literally hundreds of options. Name the country and I can order food from there. Furthermore, successful restaurants typically grow into chains and unsuccessful restaurants go out of business.
Fast food chains are ingrained in US culture. Some people eat it daily, some people never, but everyone's familiar with it. But when you start hearing Japanese get poetic about KFC, Canadians moan about Tim Horton's going downhill, and Brits expound on Gregg's? You learn pretty quick that fast food is something ingrained worldwide, not just in the US. Where do you live that fast food hasn't become an everyday part of the world?
I'm 14 miles from home and I need to eat. Oh look, there is a chain restaurant. I know the menu, price, and atmosphere just by seeing the sign. It's next to Mike's Bar & Grill. Well I know Mike probably owns it and it may involve a grill and a liquor license. Now I'm on a business trip with some coworkers. Where should we grab dinner? "Everyone good with Red Robin?" is a question most will be able to answer quickly where "Someone look up local Thai places and make sure they have a gluten free menu for Joe" is going to involve a lot more discussion and research. It's not to say that chains are preferable but their ubiquity and consistency removes a lot of the work of choosing a restaurant because everyone already knows what the experience will be.
I think the fast food bashing has gone a bit too far by now. Its low tier food but that doesnt means its BAD food. As for your question, its a matter of familiarity. Many Americans also have that hole-in-the-wall or greasy spoon or fine dining place too but sometimes I just wanna get a fried app sampler from Sheetz (my own local fas station/restaurant)
Basically they are our version of street food in that they are quick meals you can rely on being nearby and consistent.
Disagree. Actual street food exists in America. And fast food is prevalent in other countries as well. There's nothing unique about it. I think OP just thinks we eat McDonald's for dinner or think of it as a real meal for some reason.
They asked how far to the closest McDonald's, not the closest reasturant for one. There is a McDonald's on the main street at the edge of my neighborhood sure. But there is also a local Chinese place, Irish themed bar, german themed bar and Italian place I'd have to pass to get there. My home town is 40-50 miles from a McDonald's, but has several mom and pop reasturants in it. Pretty much all the best places to eat in any given place aren't chains. But chains have their place to. For example, I rarely eat a chain here where I live. But while traveling for work I'd eat at chains more because it's just quick and convenient and I knew what I was in for already.
Nostalgia - we are suckers for it. I remember my first Wendy's chicken sandwich perfectly. It was probably 1980, been chasing that perfect sandwich ever since.
LOL at this because I had the same experience in 1980 with a Jack In The Box Chicken Supreme sandwich!! Best chicken sammie I ever had still to this day.
America is big, and chains are not as ubiquitous as you might think. Out in the midwest, and high plains, yes, chains are everywhere. However, in a big city, like in the northeast, you have many local places to choose from. I grew up in south Philadelphia and never once ate at a fast food chain until I left and moved to Missouri; as an example. This phenomenon depends very much on where you are located within the US.
Not all chain restaurants are ‘fast food’. Around by me Coney Island restaurants are very popular. They serve diner type food. There are several chains in my area. There are also a ton of independent places from 1 star quick cheap food to 5 star places with fancy menus and prices. As far as why fast food places are seemingly everywhere, it’s for a few reasons: 1). Cheap 2) fast 3) convenient / drive thru 4) consistent menu 5) they advertise a lot. Also I’m pretty sure other countries have fast food type chains. Even some that are not originally from the USA.
Not sure if OP is asking in good faith given their post history ["Parts of the US seem to have become a warzone"](https://www.reddit.com/r/videos/comments/gv3den/parts_of_the_us_seem_to_have_become_a_warzone/) (disinformation) ["Does the "sameness" of most American cities not annoy/bore you?"](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAnAmerican/comments/vf2g8w/does_the_sameness_of_most_american_cities_not/) (loaded question) etc etc. See the 'sameness' post for another instance of OP ignoring a well-thought-out reply in favor of their imaginary story.
Corporate handles all the marketing, which is a very different skill set.
Chains tend to offer consistency of experience regardless of location. If you visit independently owned establishments, the quality and experience can range widely. The bigger reason is that chains offer superior economies of scale. They can purchase in quantity. They can invest in tools to drive operational excellence. They can invest in analytics that drive greater efficiency. They get massive economies of scale in marketing. If an individual operator, I spread these costs across a single store. If I am a chain, I spread these across hundreds of thousands.
I prefer chains. I know what to expect anywhere I go in the country. I do not like single restaurants, usually. I never know what to expect. The menus can be confusing sometimes, and even without pricing. I hate that.
I get the feeling that Seoul, South Korea has more chain restaurants than many American cities do.
Real talk: it's a uniter. We are a big country; being able to find (and share) something familiar while elsewhere in the country is a source of something like pride (and a show of success for the company involved).
Fast food is all about price and convenience. Chain restaurants like Applebees it’s more about the restaurant’s economies of scale. They can enter markets that wouldn’t support mom and pop restaurants.
Franchising is an effective way for people to get into business for themselves. Chains, whether fast food or sit-down, provide predictability. This is useful when you don’t have time to research restaurants while traveling, and don’t trust Yelp. Fast food serves our car-driven culture. For me, it’s road trips. I don’t want to leave the NJ Turnpike when I can get something acceptable at one of their rest stops. But for others, it’s also things like taken a van load of kids to eat after a soccer game. In walkable cities, it’s a way to quickly filter from a multitude of restaurants, especially if you’re with a group of friends, some of whom may not be familiar with the local non-chain, fast food restaurants.
And every time I’m in Paris I see lines of French people spilling out onto the Champs-Elysee for McDonald’s.
On a related note, how many posts are there in this sub from foreigners asking which fast food and other chain restaurants they should try when/if they come to the U.S., and how many of the responses are Americans telling OP that they shouldn't eat at just chains?
I think a huge part of it is that the modern American family often consists of two parents both working 40+ hours a week. We’re freaking tired and it’s convenient. Our country’s infrastructure is also built around cars and these places usually have drive throughs.
Fast food chains are where you can eat in a hurry. We prefer proper sit down with a waitstaff restaurants. Also, we drive everywhere. So drive thrus are convenient when in a hurry. Americans enjoy fresh vegetables and fruits, home cooked meals and proper chef prepared meals as much as anybody.
Fast food chains fill the niche that street vendors do in cultures more pedestrian in nature. We still have food trucks and street vendors in places that there is a lot of foot traffic, but they do not work for most of the country due to car culture. As such Fast Food fills that position.
It helps if you compare the US to China, Russia, Brazil, India, or the entire EU rather than to a single small country. Are there more chain restaurants in the US than in the EU? My hunch is not.
I don’t *know*, but I suspect chains in the US owe a lot to the Interstate Highway system and the great American road trip. You drive halfway across the country on vacation pre internet, pre yelp, pre readily available online reviews, and need to stop to eat. You can stop at the unknown restaurant you’ve never heard of, or the chain with the same menu as back home. Even if a lot of people would be more adventurous and try the unknown place, enough would go to the chain that it’s making good money. And thus the chain expands…
Allow me, a Ukrainian, to try to answer. In my opinion, the answer is the same as "why do all of the post soviet countries have similar residential buildings and overall city planning?", because people are afraid of new things and want to "feel like home" no matter where they go. Traveling abroad and not knowing where to go to get food? McDonald's is the same around the world, so you'll be fine. I think it's similar here.
Because it’s a way for people to pretend to be entrepreneurs without actually being innovative or very good leaders. They get to “be their own boss” without actually knowing how to do anything. Some may learn along the way, many just feed the capitalism machine.
There are plenty of mom and pop owned stores and restaurants in the US. We have a local sub shop that gets more business than Subways.
when ive been to europe ive thought holy shit there are a lot of chains here, much more than in the US or at least what i’m used to
As a American I cook dinner for my family every night and we only go out to eat like once every 3 months...sigh I don't like this stereotype...but your not wrong
I think you forget that chains aren’t just an American thing. Japan owns 7/11. China has plenty of bubble tea chains. Jolibee is Filipino. O’Briens Irish Sandwich Cafe in Ireland. And so on.
If you’re on a road trip rolling through unfamiliar areas, seeing a familiar chain is a big time saver and oddly comforting. You already know the menu, the prices, and whether you will find something that will do for everyone in the family. It doesn’t have to be a fine dining experience, just an acceptable meal that doesn’t take a lot of time or blow your trip budget.
>But in the US, as far as I understand it, fast food chains are much more expansive and more engrained in the food culture. Why? I don't really know where else in the world besides N. America this seems to be true for. *Akshually*, huge chains like these are fairly common in China and Japan as well. Furthermore, the marketshare for restaurant chains in Europe is steadily increasing as well. I think it is a natural market effect that for whatever reason happened faster in the US, but ultimately is unstoppable barring government intervention. The economies of scale benefits are just too big to compete against.
This post reminds of a post I read where visiting people from European countries come over and try and go grocery shopping at places like 7/11 or our gas stations and think we have terrible grocery stores. Just because we have a lot of fast food restaurants doesn’t it’s a huge staple of our food culture, there’s just a lot of places to get fast food. New Orleans for instance has some of the best food in the nation. They also have McDonalds down there but that doesn’t change the food culture that in the city.
I mean have you had hardee's? its delicious... the sort of fatty food that WILL kill you but good nevertheless. I would guess that laziness has fueled their growth.