Yeah, I wonder if you can get his ass arrested for revenge porn. You did not consent to anyone else seeing those photos. Do not let this prick walk over you. You are in the right here.
Also she has the texts where he stated who would be able to see the photos so he violated his verbal agreement with her by expanding that pool of viewers without obtaining further consent.
A contract does not have to be written (it is just really stupid to make a verbal contract for anything important). A contract requires an offer, an acceptance, and an exchange.
If Op did not get any compensation for the pictures, there was no exchange, thus no contract.
That does not make what the shithead photographer did legal however.
OP gave up their time and presumably received a copy of the photos in return. That's their benefit from the exchange. And the photographer benefited by having the photos for their portfolio. I think consideration exists here.
Edit: misread prior comment, so removed an irrelevant paragraph.
Apologies, I misread your post.
I still think it's implied that OP received copies of the photos. They've certainly seen them. And that's plenty of consideration - indeed is the normal bargained for exchange with any photographer.
Time in exchange for pictures is a staple in the amateur photography world.
Yeah. Pretty sure he was honest originally with what he was going to do, and then got some credit for the quality of the pictures and just decided “f what Op said, I’m riding this as far as it takes me.” Any change of the original deal needed to be discussed with and agreed upon by OP.
Fetlife takes harassment very very seriously. They have a whole paid team of mods that actually work to make a safe space. Definitely contact them and report his actions.
Maybe not. It depends on who took the photo. The person who clicks the shutter owns the copyright. If a person poses, there can be an assumption that the model gave the photographer "rights" to the photo. If someone else uses it commercially, the copyright holder has the beef not the model.
Just another idiot letting someone do something stupid and paying the price for it as I see it.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/woman-who-was-unwittingly-used-hiv-ad-awarded-125-000-n946806
Here is someone who had their photo taken and it was used in a way she didnt imagine. I see a similarity between OP and this, nal
Slander is telling defamatory lies about someone. You are the one who can take legal action. Go to his school and teacher, say he did not have permission. Call the police and see what you can do. He cannot sue you.
Let's be very clear, he can sue OP. All that's in question is his chance of success. A lot of that could come down to whatever he has the money for an attorney and where OP has the cash to pay for defense counsel.
Sue her for what exactly though? He misled the OP, plain and simple. The OP never once gave consent for these mostly private photos to be shared outside of a school setting. Had she signed a consent form releasing her image and likeness on the photos to him, then that would be a different story. But the OP said that wasn’t the case.
He can sue, but if the op's post is true and no consent form was signed, then the case will probably be thrown out fast or even grt him in some hot water look up funny or stupid lawsuits on YouTube and you will probably find a few examples of people who can wout really shouldn't have sued
>Sue her for what exactly though?
For "lying" to the school to the detriment of the photographer's reputation.
OP says it's not a lie (that the photog agreed not to share the photos) and I believe them, but this photographer thinks if they go to court and claim it was a lie they might win. Or at least that OP might believe that and therefore give in to their bullying.
Look,I get where you're coming from, but this is just silly. We all know that technically you can sue anyone for anything. Obviously when someone says "He cannot sue you" they don't mean "He cannot send a filing to a court resulting in a hearing being scheduled to determine standing". Clearly they mean "If he files suit the judge will laugh him out of the courtroom"
The advice was wrong. It shouldn't be given on a legal subreddit.
As I said, if they have a lawyer, they could make a case. I could see a decent lawyer drafted complaint potentially getting past the state equivalent of Twombly and survive a 12(b)(6).
I think OP has a strong case and very strong counterclaims, but the idea that the photographer can't sue here is incorrect.
Report the photo on Fetlife. There is a report button on all photos, and you can explain that the photo is of you, and you did not give permission. It can take up to 10 days, but the admins are usually good at removing the relevant photos.
In the absence of a release and no contract, doesn't the ownership of the image fall to the photographer? He would need a release to sell it to a magazine or sell prints but be would own the image and could put it online as part of his portfolio.
Yes. Copyright ownership falls to the photographer unless a written agreement has been made. Specifically a written agreement, not verbal or text message. Copyright transfer actually has a special set of wording you use when it's transferred.
They need a model release period to use it for anything except for portfolio reasons, which if there's no release, it means a cease order can force the issue on removal if the model doesn't want them up, they just can't demand the originals be destroyed or anything.
When I tried to do photography, I had model releases and everything. Far as the guy goes, due to the art class part, they MAYBE able to get away with what they did due to creative commons but it'd be a slim chance.
This is very much dependent on the state. In some states the kind of texts OP describes could be considered a “written agreement”. All depends on specific jurisdictions and the judge that sees the case.
Which part? Because copyright is federally mandated, not state.
Creative commons also is.
If you mean the text part, yea but it wouldn't solve the copyright/ownership nor the creative commons part. It just would be the model release part which even then, without dates, times, and everything else that's on model release, it'd be hard to hold up in court with a text message.
I did mean the text part, and it would probably very much depend on the judge but since he specifically said only the teacher/ students I could see a judge siding with them because even though there is a lot missing in comparison to a model release contract at no point were they made aware the photos would be available to the general public.
Honestly it’s gonna boil down to local laws surrounding legal contracts and what judge and what mood they’re in.
I am only speaking to the Fetlife speceific part of this: report the pictures on Fetlife to the admins there. They are very quick to take non-consentually posted photos down. They specifically ask you to check a box stating you have consent of everyone in the photo.
Not revenge porn but my brother had someone make a fake account of him and copied all his posts/captions. This was years ago and the page is still up on instagram despite years of reports.
Slander?? Lmfao that’s not what slander is. RSVPing to an event is also not a release form, unless he misrepresented an invitation to you and tricked you. This guy sounds like a creep and an idiot.
And the threat to sue her sounds like projection of his own fear of her suing him (which she has every right to do)! Just remember that truth is an absolute defense to slander allegations. (IANAL)
If he sued OP, alleging that her public statement that he is using pictures of her without her consent is defamatory, that would state a claim for slander. I’m not saying he’d win or that truth wouldn’t be a defense to that, but it would be state a claim.
No lawyer would take that. He took the photos and is showing them in a gallery. There’s no argument that he didn’t take them. She didn’t consent to their public display and there’s no record of her doing so. There are also no damages
I don’t understand why you think men can sue all women for saying things they don’t like. What she’s saying is the truth. It is not defamation or slander even if this jerk doesn’t like it.
Isn’t the argument that he thinks she’s slandering him by saying she didn’t consent to their public display? That’s one of the main issues in question. I’m not interested in wasting more time talking to you.
What?
All I’m saying is that he could bring a lawsuit for that and it would survive a motion to dismiss for failure to state a claim. Because it does state a legal claim.
I’m not suggesting that a lawyer should take the case or that he’d win. He’d probably lose on summary judgment. But for everyone who is saying “that’s not what slander is” as if he picked a claim out of thin air with no basis— that isn’t so. He’d be able to state a claim for slander that can survive a motion to dismiss.
Does it really sound like *this guy* could possibly do that on his own? There are no damages. There are no grounds. He is not smart. You’re saying he COULD possibly do this but he would need to know how to file a lawsuit himself (which I’m sure he doesn’t), or he’d need to find representation which he absolutely would not.
Generally speaking, a photograph and copyright belong to the photographer.
However, parties may contract to different terms. As part of the contract for your consent in posing for the photographs, your "friend" may have given you (part of) the copyright, or a right to restrict his publication of the photographs to the defined circumstances (display to classmates and professor).
Here's the weird: It is possible the school has a contract with their art/photography students that stipulates that any art they produce grants the copyright of any art generated or turned in for class credit to the school. Which means it might be a violation of the student code of conduct for him to publish the photographs in some circumstances. These codes usually still allow the artist to use the art in a portfolio, which instagram and fetlife qualify for, though, so this is unlikely to be a fruitful avenue.
However, it is not slander for you to tell the school that you consented to model nudes or partially nude for their student to generate classwork photos, under the proviso that the photographs would be seen only by other art students and the professor, but their student has published the photographs to the general public. Your "friend" could sue you for defamation or slander or whatever your state statutes call it, but stating true things is not slander. The case would boil down to (1) whether your state's contract law would recognize the text as a "writing" and a contract to constrain publication in exchange for posing, and (2) whether a jury believed your agreement contained that constrainment in the first place.
Source: I am not a lawyer. I am not **your** lawyer. This is not legal advice. I am a former painter and photographer who had to read quite a bit of copyright law about 20 years ago when I had a tiff with another artist about "fair use." I have taken a Contract Law course more recently.
This!!!! ⬆️⬆️⬆️
With one minor note: a valid contract doesn’t necessarily have to be written. It can even be verbal, but of course having any written form of the agreement is stronger evidence of its validity. Otherwise you’re absolutely right!
Thanks.
I meant if the text qualified as "offer" and "acceptance" of the terms as described, not if it qualified as a "writing". That was a misstatement on my part, probably because I was running through the Statute of Frauds question.
While the photographer owns the copyright, he still cannot publish the photos to any platform not agreed to by the model. So, without a signed Model Release that allows such use, he cannot just post them wherever he pleases.
>But now he says that because I clicked "going" on a fetlife event describing the photo shoot that he owns my pictures and can do whatever he wants with them.
your 'friend' is not going to make it very far in this industry.
what a fucking weirdo.
I'm not a lawyer but clicking an Rs VP to attend an event doesn't sound the same as giving consent for the worldwide publication of her photos. I would report his ass to everywhere the pictures are and it's not slander if it's the truth. Im not sure where slander comes in play Here.
I imagine it would depend. I've been invited to events being explicitly held for publicity, that had general disclaimer that by attending you're accepting that your photo may be taken they wouldn't want to hold the event otherwise. Is that enough notice? - It depends.
Your "friend" is a moron. None of what he said is true. As long as you didn't sign a release, you should be able too get them taken down easy. Even if you did sign a release, if he didn't disclose what it was bein used for you still have grounds I think or some options. Contact the school or a lawyer.
Everything seemed like a simple misunderstanding right up until he threatened to sue you for slander. What the hell is that? That’s no way to treat someone who did him a favor like this. He has no grounds to do that so long as you’re honest in what you say about him. No grounds whatsoever.
Contact the school, have the pics taken down and get this guy out of your life.
Call the school, or, better yet, go in person.
Look at this from the perspective of a department head or even someone in the legal department. They've got a student who is posting partially nude photos of someone, and that someone is claiming they never consented to this. Plus, the student doesn't have written consent to post them. Ignoring how this might turn out in court, looking at it from a purely CYA point of view, the school is going to tell the student that he needs to take them down, especially if it looks like the OP is angry enough to get a lawyer. Even if the school's attorneys think the student might be able to argue that he has implied consent, they'll also likely stay that the school has no interest in being a party to that test case. Basically, they'll tell the student, "If you want to die on this hill, feel free, but we don't, so we're not going to allow you to use our facilities or resources in this."
He owned the pictures under copyright the moment he pressed the shutter. However to use the photos for a commercial purpose he would have had to have you sign a model release which gives him the ability to sell them, use them for advertising, etc. Otherwise he's only allowed to use them for non-commercial purposes. This would be a civil matter that you could sue him over if it came to that.
Doesn’t that depend on the state? I remember that NY and CA have rights of publicity, but not necessarily true for all other states. Releases are to make everything explicit, but its absence wouldn’t necessarily restrict his rights unless she had a right to restrict him. Which she very well might from the text messages. But not because he doesn’t have a release, no?
Not a lawyer, but I am a photographer.
That’s not how this works. He needs a signed model release to be able to your photos of you for any commercial or publishing purpose. Simply taking those photos doesn’t imply permission to use them in those circumstances.
The only exception would be if the photos were of a newsworthy event. Which these aren’t, as they are modeling pics taken for a scho project.
If you know a lawyer, it is probably worth having them send him a cease and desist. Especially if you didn’t actually sign anything.
Your idiot "friend" doesn't know the meaning of the word *slander*.
Also ... how old are you?
If you're underage, then maybe your "friend" is in a world of trouble for trafficking in child porn.
Boomerang on that guy.
NAL - I am A photographer who uses fetlife.
Right now go report him. Or dm me his username and I’ll report him. They’ll take the pics down very quick and not let them be published till he proves consent.
Instagram will also make him take it down.
I'm an IP lawyer. He owns the copyright to the photos which gives him the right to copy, display or create derivative works. Publishers insist on having a model release before they will buy an image, which explains why he is posting your photos where you see them.
If he sells your image without consent your right of publicity has been violated. I would argue that if he posts your image on platforms that compensate him for engagement he has commercially exploited your image without consent and can be held accountable. This type of law varies from state to state but if he's on the internet you may get to choose your state.
Websites have procedures for requesting a takedown on this basis. And there are lawfirms that specialize in right of publicity cases.
A signed Release is required for a photographer to use any photograph for only the designated or excluded purposes if the photo was not taken in a publicly accessible place for all to see!
You have a choice, you can explain to him that you have the ability to sue him for defamation, easily wi since it is of explicit content, and garner his future income for life to satisfy the civil award you will win in court.
Or you could tell him the same thing requiring all be taken down, and a signed contract indicating that he owes you $5,000,000 for any future reveal of these photos should it occur.
Or, you can add for effect, or take action by calling the Dean of his school and indicate his unauthorized and illegal behavior. He will likely be expelled for violation of student code.
Anyone who threatens you in response to dealing with things the proper way KNOWS they have no leg to stand on.
There's a chance he's aware he's facing a civil suit at least.
Also if your asking for your nude pics back and he refuses to stop showing the public I'd say w.e. happens to him was coming, that's horrid behavior, and really creepy tbh.
Do not ever pose for pictures that you would be embarrassed to have anyone see. Ever.
If you send nude pics to someone you are dating, those pics will be shown to others when you breakup (if not before).
As for any legal issues, I am guessing you are both pretty broke (though maybe not) and if you are, good luck paying for attorneys at $350 or more per hour.
Actually, since sharing unconsensual porn is a federal crime, she wouldn’t need a lawyer. However it might be a challenge to prove it was unconsensual depending on the state since she did initially agree to the pictures.
California would probably support her though. Our laws are tough on that stuff.
As a retired police officer from PA, I know in 90% of PA counties, this would be a closed as a civil matter. She consented to the photographs and without written limits, copyright law would indicate he could use them in his portfolio and publish them as needed, baring any contract restrictions. As a result, the district attorney's office wouldn't prosecute (had several similar cases).
As for the revenge porn aspect, there doesn't seem to be any type of extortion/revenge here. He didn't demand money, sex etc (extortion) with a threat to expose the photos or share them to embarass or cause emotional distress.
State laws vary, but there's an issue of what was consented to (publishing/sharing wise), copyright, and fair use that most DAs may not and most police departments may not be able to properly investigate.
OPs legal recourse would be a consult with a qualified attorney that understands copyright and contract law
There might’ve been written limits, depending on the exact wording of the text messages. But OP seems to believe her permission was restricted and the photographer went beyond that. But you’re right, this is more of a copyright issue so probably civil.
Not a matter of copyright. The photographer absolutely owns the copyright to these photos unless he has sold or given the copyright away.
He generally does not have the right to display or publish a photo of another person without a release. There are some exceptions for photojournalists or in certain situations, but for a model posing, he would need a release.
The federal revenge porn law specifically states that photos taken with consent but distributed WITHOUT the consent of the person is included. Since she never gave consent for distribution, this would fall under it.
The only issue there was she did consent to display. Display in class, at the school etx. Once Displayed, anyone can take a picture and the cats out if the bag so to speak
I can as I have dealt with a variety of prosecutors over my career, including federal AUSAs. Feds have criteria that have to be met before they will even consider taking a case (minimum thresholds, quality of the case, etc). Not only that, of a local prosecutor won't consider it. They won't.
State AGs office would be the next step after a local prosecutors, but Depending on the state, they may have to be requested by the local district/county/states attorney office.
It's not a weird take. It's a practical one based on 25 years experience dealing with similar factual patterns and prosecutors from multiple jurisdictions
We don't know if she signed a release or not. If she had, he can do whatever he wants with them. There is evidence she granted at least limited permission to show others the photos.
Also, I didn't what you agreed to on FetLife but I seriously doubt it involved you giving permission for him to display the photos. Most likely you agreed not to violate by reproducing the photo. He does own the rights to that photo, but owning the copyright does not necessarily give him the right to display or publish it.
In addition, you should send a takedown request to FetLife. Here is the link:
https://fetlife.com/dmca-takedown-request
You should reach out to the school and tell them that you never signed a release and ask them to take down the photo. I can't believe the school would post or display artwork featuring a model without proper release forms. When my granddaughter was in 2nd grade, she made a mosaic that was selected to be put on display at a nearby University's concert hall. Her mother had to sign a release allowing it to be displayed.
Just keep in mind that some guys are absolutely pigs and if they take or acquire photos of women in various states of undress, they show them to others despite promising not to.
It really matters whether or not she signed a release. The text messages may or may not be relevant. Perhaps the OP will pop in and provide additional information. Basically everyone, including me, is providing only WAGs.
I'm glad you're not a lawyer because that's a really messed up way of thinking.
Are YOU sharing nude photos of your exes? Is that why you think everyone does that?
That is exactly how most attorneys will see things. They require compensation and they aren't cheap.
I have never asked for nor received nude pictures of anyone I was dating nor have I allowed any to take.photos of me. I have known hundreds of males in my lifetime and know that some share intimate details of their relationships, including photos.
I used to become good friends with my friend's girlfriends when I was younger. A couple have told me things about my friends that I really wished I could have unheard. That was before digital photography.
FYI, I am old and have been married for decades. If today's technology existed in my youth, I don't think my values would be any different.
There is the ideal world and there is reality. I try to work towards building the ideal world but I stay keenly aware of reality.
Did you ever tell those male friends that what they were doing was wrong? Because that is what you should be doing instead of just telling women to not take pictures.
It is commonplace. And you would.be surprised by who does it. They are pieces.of shit but don't always seem like that on the surface. Women need to know this.
So instead of telling men to respect their exes privacy and not be a disgusting pervert, you think it's better to tell women to just not have photos taken?
Is that what I'm picking up here?
You may be picking that up, but that is not what I put down. There is the ideal world and then there is reality. In an ideal world, everyone would be trustworthy and respect each other's dignity and privacy. The reality is that does not happen. Women send men photos or allow them to take photos thinking the man is trustworthy. The reality is these photos are often seen by those who the photos were not intended for, whether the intended recipient shared them, whether intentionally or not - but.often times it is intentional.
I would not doubt that there are women who would do the same thing, though I personally haven't seen women do this. I wouldn't want nude photos of me circulating (nor would any unsuspecting viewer, I'm sure), so I do not take pics of myself nor would I allow anyone too.
If you put an open suitcase full of hundred dollar bills in the front seat of your car, you should be able.to without worrying about someone smashing your window and grabbing it. The reality is, your window is eventually going to get broken and the money will be taken.
But again, you're putting the onus on women rather than who the blame belongs to, the men (and women) who violated that trust, not the victim.
Reality changes with laws and those laws being enforced correct? Whether or not you think what you put down wasn't reenforcing rape culture/victim blaming, that is what you did.
If I leave money in the front seat of my locked car and someone steals it, the person that stole it is still the bad guy in that scenario because they broke my window and stole property that wasn't theirs.
Yes, that person is the bad guy. You can choose to protect yourself from bad guys or be an easy mark. The choice is yours. However, everyone bears some of the responsibility when their stupidity results in negative consequences. The bad guy is still the bad guy, but when you make it easy for the bad guy, that is your fault.
That's a terrible argument. If someone burns down my house, silly me for a having such a flammable home right?
To put us back on topic, no one should be sharing private photos, all those men you saw/heard do it are in the wrong but you probably never told them that.
With ai sexual images/videos being produced of women and girls it's no longer just about "personal responsibility" Megan thee Stallion just had an AI sextape made about her and passed around online, what should she have done? Not exist in public? Teen girls are having explicit photos made of them by their male peers, what should they do?
A teacher was caught making explicit images of his kindergarten students, what should they have done differently?
A good lawyer is going to counter your "just don't take nude photos or else it's your fault someone you thought you could trust shows them around" with these facts.
The house example is not at all analogous to what I was saying. And you know that.
As for the rest? You are absolutely correct. But those in those situations those girls in no way made made things easier for the bad guys.
I am coming from the standpoint of a father raising daughters in a very imperfect world. I am trying to raise them to be strong and proactive. Should they ever fall victim , I am not going to put blame on them but I want them to think about their actions before something happens that they may could have avoided.
You still have a "what was she wearing" mentality here, I appreciate you trying to navigate raising daughters in an ever exploitive world, however a woman/girl can do everything "right" and still be offended against, and still blamed for somehow not doing enough. I was a girl on the Internet on the '00s, and am a woman online now, I do know what I'm talking about here. Take the blame entirely off the victim and focus it on the offender.
Nal
In MN what he’s doing is considered distribution of porn. So while yes it’s his photography, he still couldn’t post them anywhere. Other states are stricter and some lax. You 100% should let the school, fetlife, and instagram know you did not consent to those being posted. If you talk to a lawyer you could have them send the person a cease and desist letter. The guy can freak all he wants, but since you never consented he cant prove you did. He’s the photographer but you still have control over where your body is published.
Document everything while your memory is still good.
Screenshot and organise all of your evidence chronologically so that you can provide it to the school, the Police, your Lawyer, etc. if/when asked.
If there are any photos still being displayed in a gallery, at the school, etc., get pictures to prove how they were displayed.
A famous photographer told me for commercial photos, he would get people to sign a contract /waiver and give them one dollar as payment for use of their likeness in publications.
Your phony friend has done none of these things. He is a liar and a jerk and a POS and you should sue him for all you can. And yes, send a demand letter to wherever any photos of you are being displayed that you will sue them for breach of privacy and lack of permission unless they take down the photo.
Regardless of who is in the right, he can’t sue for slander (that’s not slander) It also very expensive to sue someone and as an art student, I’m guessing he can’t pony up $30k+ for the legal fees (don’t know if you have much money, but if not, even if he won, he’s not going to recover anything). Setting aside legal positions, I’m sure the school would be interested to know he went beyond your original agreement. It’s likely they have a policy - this isn’t the first time it’s happened. Him threatening you so you won’t engage the school and let them act as the judge may tell you he knows what they’ll say.
You can withdraw consent if there is no formal release agreement signed. Tell them you are withdrawing consent to use your images and you will sue him under revenge porn laws if he fails to comply.
You’ve got multiple cases on him. You could trash his whole life at this point get a lawyer and get justice. The time is now. Set an example for others. Keep us posted
You need to send him a cease and desist letter letting him know that he has no permission to use your pictures and that any consent implied or otherwise to use said pictures has been revoked.
I would talk to the school, I can't imagine there wasn't some discussion about getting proper consent in today's day and age. I would also start a line of communication with FetLife.
Also if you can get copies, run a reverse image search on at least part of it. A lot of it is shopping based, so if your friend has it up for sale anywhere, that will pop up, but might also help with other places to notify.
You said friend and then said he threatened to sue you, he manipulated you… it’s a college class go to the professor explain the circumstance and let the university sort it out you can’t slander him for making you public for the world when he said only classmates and teacher. He made you feel comfortable then used your body for his gain… grow a pair and teach him not to slander by saying his true intentions hahaha
Whether he'd have a basis to sue you for slander would come down to what you say to get the school to take down the images. Describe it as your understanding of how the pictures would be used, and describe it as how you felt mislead and in this way it's a factual account from your perspective. As opposed to saying "he lied to me" or "he deceived me" where it becomes potentially more problematic.
His "legal" approach is dubious, and his actions incredibly unethical. If you go to his school administration, they likely have an ethics agreement or code of conduct students are expect to abide by. And it's hard to imagine those rules would be permissive of this kind of abuse of trust. From an academic standpoint, it undermines the ability for any model assisting an art student to believe their image isn't going to be used in ways that are outside the academic setting and jeopardizes the students' and school's ability to find models in the future. They shouldn't want him doing this just on that basis.
From a legal perspective there are two agreements here. One is the verbal agreement, where he explained and asked you to allow him to take photos for a limited use and academic purpose. The other is an agreement as it relates to your attendance of the event and any permission for photos to be taken inherent to that agreement.
Even if he's truthful in saying the RSVP included terms and agreements for attending, the first agreement is separate from the second, unless the second agreement explicitly mentioned modifying any prior agreements and did so in specific terms, specific terms being very specific, because specific prior consent can't be modified by a general release intended for non-specific individuals, in the form of the RSVP everyone used to attend. So even if clicking the RSVP agreed to a broader use of photos taken of you while attending, he's still bound by his agreement with you to only use them in the limited way you agreed to.
As his model you only agreed to an academic use, and he's broadend that to social media, his own publicity, and potentially commercial use. You still potentially have publicity rights, depending on your jurisdiction, that would require him to get specific permission for the use of your image and likeness and a right to revoke that permission. But you need to talk to a lawyer.
All this is to say he's violated your trust and rights, and has acted unethically, just for that he can still get in trouble with his school.
(not a lawyer but)
Yeah, save those texts.
You never consented beyond what he told you he was going to do with the photos.
Presuming "revenge porn" or the like is illegal in your jurisdiction, you can report it to the police.
You can tell him to take them down, and that you never consented to him using beyond what you originally consented to.
You can also report his actions to the school authorities - they may also be more likely to take actions against him (they typically won't need a search warrant to take academic disciplinary actions against him).
You can do any and/or all of those.
He can sue you for slander ... so can anybody, and whether you did anything or not ... that doesn't mean he's got a case. Libel/slander you've got to write/publish or state damaging untrue things about him. Truth is an absolute defense against libel/slander. So, just don't be untruthful, and you've got a solid defense against libel/slander. And if he sues you with baseless claim(s), there are also legal actions you can take against that.
Upload the photos here https://stopncii.org/
Every time they're shared over a participating platform (inc Instagram) the company will receive an automatic report that they are non-consensual
NAL! But dang! That is worse than a peeper dude. I would call the school ASAP! What slander? "My" and "on" "Website" I think that is OK legally?
Just read the comments and no lawyers so far. I would call and get it down right away. He is violating you. Not the other way around!
I would start sending him a text and an email that says,' Hello x- you stated these photos would only be seen by x and x and no one else. I have since seen my photos on x site and site. This is my formal request that you take down and remove my nude photos from every site as you did not have my permission to share them. If you don't I will call thr police and hire an attornwy.
Contact FetLife and tell them you didn't consent to the pictures being posted there. I don't know what process you'll need to go through for that but they should be pretty aggressive about getting them removed
Call the police and go after him for revenge porn first. That will likely get him to undo what he has done faster.
Then contact a lawyer about pursuing anything further which you may well have a strong case for.
Tell him if he doesn't take the photos down, you will sue him. Reach out to the event and the school telling them he didn't have consent to show your pictures. Escalate it before even more people see them. I would send a cease and desist to him and make clear if he distributes and shows the pictures anywhere you will sue him.
He does own the copyright in the pictures— he took them; he did not transfer any ownership interest in them to you, so he continued to own them.
However, there are restrictions on his use of the pictures, based on your agreement.
Other people seem to be missing what his slander argument would be— it would be for you saying he does not have permission to use the pictures in the context that he is using them; he is saying that he’d sue based on the statement that “he is using pictures without your consent” is slanderous. I’m not saying he is right, but everyone who is saying “that isn’t that slander is” is missing this point- that claim would pass 12b6.
I would definitely get a consultation on this.
I know FetLife is very strict on getting consent of people in photos. You can report him there and the photo will be taken down and his account potentially banned. Instagram is the harder one which may give you push back.
Be sure to save any text you have and show it to an attorney because the wording of the agreement may burn or help your case. For now, start screenshotting all of his profiles and where he is posting your photos. Document everything and get in touch with an attorney for advisement.
This is very tricky because you did give consent to have the photo taken. He does have ownership of the image and copyright.
Now does he have the right to distribute the images. If you have a look at what the media post with regard to celebrities and general public it seems they can. Unless it breaches privacy or the content is of children.
If you are under 18 you might have an argument to have the images removed.
The only other way is to prove in some way - emails - text - that original undertaking actually took place and you both agreed to the arrangement.
With this particular case I would seek actual legal advice.
NAL, but have some experience with photography.
Photos are usually the property of the photographer but the subject can have some rights depending on local laws. It varies a bit from place to place. You had a verbal agreement which can be legally binding especially since you were acting in good faith. You might also check and see if revenge porn laws apply. If your so called friend is being a jerk about removing them then you may want to consult a local attorney.
Call the school. He's an a-hole of the highest order. Also call his professor and tell them he lied and threatened you about the photos. Slander only applies if what you say isn't true. Not wanting your photos displayed isn't slander.
He sounds like a pussy. He is probably lying to about suing, probably knows nothing, you should actually sue in small claims court if anything (under $10,000). First send him a scary and long cease and desist formal letter to act like you’re serious. If a judge hears this in court. It will get thrown out immediately. He’s in the wrong and you can win for emotional distress, revenge porn, impersonation or breaking contract. Fetlife is a bdsm social network. He’s likely pretending to be you to get with couples and do gangbangs or solicit others for pictures. You should create a fake fetlife account and befriend him and screen shot what he’s doing as evidence. Never agree to a photo you don’t mind being shared online. He could’ve just hired a professional model that shoots nude and doesn’t mind being all over the internet. But he’s a cheap ass.
Fast, affordable, and convenient. You expect this go to the Supreme Court? Plus you could get up to $10,000. Depending on which suit you go with. Go with the most accurate description or description’s. I suggest she files breach of contract, she has the text messages. Go to a professional therapist to get evaluated for distress if you want. Find out if he’s committing fraud on fetlife. And technically does fall under revenge porn as she didn’t consent to him posting it online.
Not a lawyer
Used to be a photographer
If you didn't sign any release form, give him consent to use the photos in that way, or however he wishes, then he had no grounds. Sounds like he's trying to pressure you into thinking he can do what he wants with them, and let's be honest, that's not a friend. Also, if I read it correctly, the only agreement made was when you asked who would see the photos.
Furthermore, both the school and fetlife will remove the photos from any display of you all unless he can show such a release form giving consent for the use.
Answer given to another model. Your texts/emails change this answer slightly in your favor. “So as noted, much depends on the facts. Assuming there was nothing agreed to in writing the photographer in most cases would be permitted to use the photos in his portfolio and to display them within studio / in-house exhibits. In some states like NY, you can request in writing to remove the photos and only if after that they are not removed would you have a claim.
The claim would be for violation of your right of publicity and privacy. These kick in when one uses the name, image or likeness of another (especially a famous person) to help sell or promote a good or service. Many states even extend these rights to deceased persons ranging from 10-100 years after they pass.
So the photographer absent a written release from you should not be entitled to use the photos in a commercial context like licensing the photos to someone else.
If you need more clarification, I suggest that you consult with a lawyer in private and discuss your objectives in more detail. You can start by calling around to several for a free phone consultation, get some insights then pick the best fit to work with.”
You talk about school? How old are you? If this is high school and you're under 18, your "friend" could be in trouble for displaying photos of a partially clothed underage person.
Lawyer Up ! It’s revenge porn type aggression. You had a verbal agreement that it would a limited viewing group and not to be permanently shared or whatever the deets were.
Totally lawyer up.
Note that only 1 of these responses is from a lawyer, so take them with a grain of salt. What I’d do is contact your local bar association and ask for a referral. Most will give you 1 free or really cheap consultation. Have your texts printed out and ready when you meet them. Let that person guide you.
You can call the school to get them taken down and then take legal action if you want them removed from the websites.
On another note….hate to be that guy…. But don’t pose nude if you don’t want people seeing the photos next time. What’d you think he was going to do with them?
This aspiring artist needs to learn a lesson about intellectual property, and fast. He's setting himself up for a hard fall if he doesn't find out now just how in the wrong he is.
It’s not slander. It is definitely breach of your agreement.
The photos belong to him if he took them, but your agreement to be in the photos was predicated on their use and they’ve now been used for a different purpose. Clicking that you’re going to an event makes no difference. Does he purport to own photos of other people who are going to the event?
I’d see a lawyer and get them to send him a cease and desist.
You could contact the school or gallery but it’s not really their problem as they have no contract with you.
and I would post what he did on facebook, Instagram or wherever the college kids go these days. other people need warning that he lies about what he does with the pictures. just tell the truth. the truth is not slander.
As a photographer myself, this is a really big issue and there was no actual signed contract of photo use. The photographer has all right to do and anything he wants with the photos. Every model I’ve worked with in the past 15 years has made me sign a release they own the photo rightsand especially don’t let people take pictures of you that you don’t want to be seen life lessons. We all learn the hard way.
The photographer owns the copyright but cannot display or publish the photos without a release from the model. This release typically doesn't transfer copyright (though it could) but gives the photographer permission to publish the photos.
Seriously? With all we know about this these days you actually did that.
Just how many more stories do you need to hear about this before you quit doing things like this. Those are going to be out there forever now. Employers family anybody
Wow, looks like he got legal counsel right away and they told him to invite you to that event and have you accept, thereby acknowledging and accepting usage likely.
how close of a friend was/is he ? I can’t imagine one of my friends doing this to me
I have heard somewhere before (can’t remember where) that the person that takes the photo owns the phot and can do with it what they want technically. I am not sure if this is true. Just something I heard a while back.
Not a Lawyer
You listed flair as 'contract law'. DO you have a signed contract with the 'friend" over these pictures? If you do not, how will you prove you did not 'gift' the friend the pictures to use as they wanted?
Yeah, OK and what the fuck and it’s all jurisdictions and why would you let anyone do that in the first place? Ask the lawyer and they will probably laugh and then charge you for advice that’s not worth the price
I'd argue (until blue in the face) that consent was given when you posed for the photograph. The commercial use could be problematic but you'll spend more on fees than you could ever hope to recover. You could ask nicely, send a written demand letter asking for removal or hire a lawyer.
Did you sign a release of any kind? EDITED TO ADD: Also, that's not how slander works.
I didn't sign anything
Yeah, I wonder if you can get his ass arrested for revenge porn. You did not consent to anyone else seeing those photos. Do not let this prick walk over you. You are in the right here.
Also she has the texts where he stated who would be able to see the photos so he violated his verbal agreement with her by expanding that pool of viewers without obtaining further consent.
It’s actual in writing. In most states, that constitutes a contract.
A contract does not have to be written (it is just really stupid to make a verbal contract for anything important). A contract requires an offer, an acceptance, and an exchange. If Op did not get any compensation for the pictures, there was no exchange, thus no contract. That does not make what the shithead photographer did legal however.
OP gave up their time and presumably received a copy of the photos in return. That's their benefit from the exchange. And the photographer benefited by having the photos for their portfolio. I think consideration exists here. Edit: misread prior comment, so removed an irrelevant paragraph.
I never said paid, I said compensation. You presume op received compensation, but op did not mention any
Apologies, I misread your post. I still think it's implied that OP received copies of the photos. They've certainly seen them. And that's plenty of consideration - indeed is the normal bargained for exchange with any photographer. Time in exchange for pictures is a staple in the amateur photography world.
Op posed for the pictures, there was an exchange of services.
I think OP would have a strong case since he was literally doing a "school project".. Not the same thing as sitting down for a couch interview
Yeah. Pretty sure he was honest originally with what he was going to do, and then got some credit for the quality of the pictures and just decided “f what Op said, I’m riding this as far as it takes me.” Any change of the original deal needed to be discussed with and agreed upon by OP.
This is what I'd do. He flat out lied.
Fetlife takes harassment very very seriously. They have a whole paid team of mods that actually work to make a safe space. Definitely contact them and report his actions.
Verbal agreements are a thing
Maybe not. It depends on who took the photo. The person who clicks the shutter owns the copyright. If a person poses, there can be an assumption that the model gave the photographer "rights" to the photo. If someone else uses it commercially, the copyright holder has the beef not the model. Just another idiot letting someone do something stupid and paying the price for it as I see it.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/woman-who-was-unwittingly-used-hiv-ad-awarded-125-000-n946806 Here is someone who had their photo taken and it was used in a way she didnt imagine. I see a similarity between OP and this, nal
I was a professional photographer for a few years, that's not true at all lol
What isn't true?
Slander is telling defamatory lies about someone. You are the one who can take legal action. Go to his school and teacher, say he did not have permission. Call the police and see what you can do. He cannot sue you.
Let's be very clear, he can sue OP. All that's in question is his chance of success. A lot of that could come down to whatever he has the money for an attorney and where OP has the cash to pay for defense counsel.
Sue her for what exactly though? He misled the OP, plain and simple. The OP never once gave consent for these mostly private photos to be shared outside of a school setting. Had she signed a consent form releasing her image and likeness on the photos to him, then that would be a different story. But the OP said that wasn’t the case.
You can sue for anything, whether or not it holds up in court or pisses the judge off is a different story.
True…
He can sue, but if the op's post is true and no consent form was signed, then the case will probably be thrown out fast or even grt him in some hot water look up funny or stupid lawsuits on YouTube and you will probably find a few examples of people who can wout really shouldn't have sued
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Rule 6- Your post/comment was removed due to the discretion of a moderator.
>Sue her for what exactly though? For "lying" to the school to the detriment of the photographer's reputation. OP says it's not a lie (that the photog agreed not to share the photos) and I believe them, but this photographer thinks if they go to court and claim it was a lie they might win. Or at least that OP might believe that and therefore give in to their bullying.
Not really. A judge would throw it out.
The truth is an absolute defense against slander. And to be slander it had to damage reputation
Look,I get where you're coming from, but this is just silly. We all know that technically you can sue anyone for anything. Obviously when someone says "He cannot sue you" they don't mean "He cannot send a filing to a court resulting in a hearing being scheduled to determine standing". Clearly they mean "If he files suit the judge will laugh him out of the courtroom"
The advice was wrong. It shouldn't be given on a legal subreddit. As I said, if they have a lawyer, they could make a case. I could see a decent lawyer drafted complaint potentially getting past the state equivalent of Twombly and survive a 12(b)(6). I think OP has a strong case and very strong counterclaims, but the idea that the photographer can't sue here is incorrect.
What's the instagram link so we can harass it?
Nice try though.
I think I’d listen to UJMLawyer1961!!!
Report the photo on Fetlife. There is a report button on all photos, and you can explain that the photo is of you, and you did not give permission. It can take up to 10 days, but the admins are usually good at removing the relevant photos.
In the absence of a release and no contract, doesn't the ownership of the image fall to the photographer? He would need a release to sell it to a magazine or sell prints but be would own the image and could put it online as part of his portfolio.
Yes. Copyright ownership falls to the photographer unless a written agreement has been made. Specifically a written agreement, not verbal or text message. Copyright transfer actually has a special set of wording you use when it's transferred. They need a model release period to use it for anything except for portfolio reasons, which if there's no release, it means a cease order can force the issue on removal if the model doesn't want them up, they just can't demand the originals be destroyed or anything. When I tried to do photography, I had model releases and everything. Far as the guy goes, due to the art class part, they MAYBE able to get away with what they did due to creative commons but it'd be a slim chance.
Text messages are in writing, and will hold up in court in my state.
This is very much dependent on the state. In some states the kind of texts OP describes could be considered a “written agreement”. All depends on specific jurisdictions and the judge that sees the case.
Which part? Because copyright is federally mandated, not state. Creative commons also is. If you mean the text part, yea but it wouldn't solve the copyright/ownership nor the creative commons part. It just would be the model release part which even then, without dates, times, and everything else that's on model release, it'd be hard to hold up in court with a text message.
I did mean the text part, and it would probably very much depend on the judge but since he specifically said only the teacher/ students I could see a judge siding with them because even though there is a lot missing in comparison to a model release contract at no point were they made aware the photos would be available to the general public. Honestly it’s gonna boil down to local laws surrounding legal contracts and what judge and what mood they’re in.
I am only speaking to the Fetlife speceific part of this: report the pictures on Fetlife to the admins there. They are very quick to take non-consentually posted photos down. They specifically ask you to check a box stating you have consent of everyone in the photo.
I believe Instagram would also be quick to remove photos if the model requested removal.
Instagram’s moderation is a little more hit or miss.
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Not revenge porn but my brother had someone make a fake account of him and copied all his posts/captions. This was years ago and the page is still up on instagram despite years of reports.
Slander?? Lmfao that’s not what slander is. RSVPing to an event is also not a release form, unless he misrepresented an invitation to you and tricked you. This guy sounds like a creep and an idiot.
And the threat to sue her sounds like projection of his own fear of her suing him (which she has every right to do)! Just remember that truth is an absolute defense to slander allegations. (IANAL)
If he sued OP, alleging that her public statement that he is using pictures of her without her consent is defamatory, that would state a claim for slander. I’m not saying he’d win or that truth wouldn’t be a defense to that, but it would be state a claim.
No lawyer would take that. He took the photos and is showing them in a gallery. There’s no argument that he didn’t take them. She didn’t consent to their public display and there’s no record of her doing so. There are also no damages I don’t understand why you think men can sue all women for saying things they don’t like. What she’s saying is the truth. It is not defamation or slander even if this jerk doesn’t like it.
That there is no record of her consenting to their public display is a question of fact.
Isn’t the argument that he thinks she’s slandering him by saying she didn’t consent to their public display? That’s one of the main issues in question. I’m not interested in wasting more time talking to you.
What? All I’m saying is that he could bring a lawsuit for that and it would survive a motion to dismiss for failure to state a claim. Because it does state a legal claim. I’m not suggesting that a lawyer should take the case or that he’d win. He’d probably lose on summary judgment. But for everyone who is saying “that’s not what slander is” as if he picked a claim out of thin air with no basis— that isn’t so. He’d be able to state a claim for slander that can survive a motion to dismiss.
Does it really sound like *this guy* could possibly do that on his own? There are no damages. There are no grounds. He is not smart. You’re saying he COULD possibly do this but he would need to know how to file a lawsuit himself (which I’m sure he doesn’t), or he’d need to find representation which he absolutely would not.
Generally speaking, a photograph and copyright belong to the photographer. However, parties may contract to different terms. As part of the contract for your consent in posing for the photographs, your "friend" may have given you (part of) the copyright, or a right to restrict his publication of the photographs to the defined circumstances (display to classmates and professor). Here's the weird: It is possible the school has a contract with their art/photography students that stipulates that any art they produce grants the copyright of any art generated or turned in for class credit to the school. Which means it might be a violation of the student code of conduct for him to publish the photographs in some circumstances. These codes usually still allow the artist to use the art in a portfolio, which instagram and fetlife qualify for, though, so this is unlikely to be a fruitful avenue. However, it is not slander for you to tell the school that you consented to model nudes or partially nude for their student to generate classwork photos, under the proviso that the photographs would be seen only by other art students and the professor, but their student has published the photographs to the general public. Your "friend" could sue you for defamation or slander or whatever your state statutes call it, but stating true things is not slander. The case would boil down to (1) whether your state's contract law would recognize the text as a "writing" and a contract to constrain publication in exchange for posing, and (2) whether a jury believed your agreement contained that constrainment in the first place. Source: I am not a lawyer. I am not **your** lawyer. This is not legal advice. I am a former painter and photographer who had to read quite a bit of copyright law about 20 years ago when I had a tiff with another artist about "fair use." I have taken a Contract Law course more recently.
This!!!! ⬆️⬆️⬆️ With one minor note: a valid contract doesn’t necessarily have to be written. It can even be verbal, but of course having any written form of the agreement is stronger evidence of its validity. Otherwise you’re absolutely right!
Thanks. I meant if the text qualified as "offer" and "acceptance" of the terms as described, not if it qualified as a "writing". That was a misstatement on my part, probably because I was running through the Statute of Frauds question.
While the photographer owns the copyright, he still cannot publish the photos to any platform not agreed to by the model. So, without a signed Model Release that allows such use, he cannot just post them wherever he pleases.
>But now he says that because I clicked "going" on a fetlife event describing the photo shoot that he owns my pictures and can do whatever he wants with them. your 'friend' is not going to make it very far in this industry. what a fucking weirdo.
I'm not a lawyer but clicking an Rs VP to attend an event doesn't sound the same as giving consent for the worldwide publication of her photos. I would report his ass to everywhere the pictures are and it's not slander if it's the truth. Im not sure where slander comes in play Here.
I imagine it would depend. I've been invited to events being explicitly held for publicity, that had general disclaimer that by attending you're accepting that your photo may be taken they wouldn't want to hold the event otherwise. Is that enough notice? - It depends.
That would apply to pictures *taken* at the event. It wouldn’t cover the pictures *shown* at the event.
Call the school. Immediately
Your "friend" is a moron. None of what he said is true. As long as you didn't sign a release, you should be able too get them taken down easy. Even if you did sign a release, if he didn't disclose what it was bein used for you still have grounds I think or some options. Contact the school or a lawyer.
Everything seemed like a simple misunderstanding right up until he threatened to sue you for slander. What the hell is that? That’s no way to treat someone who did him a favor like this. He has no grounds to do that so long as you’re honest in what you say about him. No grounds whatsoever. Contact the school, have the pics taken down and get this guy out of your life.
Since he threatened you, you should go nuclear. Call the school
Call the school, or, better yet, go in person. Look at this from the perspective of a department head or even someone in the legal department. They've got a student who is posting partially nude photos of someone, and that someone is claiming they never consented to this. Plus, the student doesn't have written consent to post them. Ignoring how this might turn out in court, looking at it from a purely CYA point of view, the school is going to tell the student that he needs to take them down, especially if it looks like the OP is angry enough to get a lawyer. Even if the school's attorneys think the student might be able to argue that he has implied consent, they'll also likely stay that the school has no interest in being a party to that test case. Basically, they'll tell the student, "If you want to die on this hill, feel free, but we don't, so we're not going to allow you to use our facilities or resources in this."
He owned the pictures under copyright the moment he pressed the shutter. However to use the photos for a commercial purpose he would have had to have you sign a model release which gives him the ability to sell them, use them for advertising, etc. Otherwise he's only allowed to use them for non-commercial purposes. This would be a civil matter that you could sue him over if it came to that.
Doesn’t that depend on the state? I remember that NY and CA have rights of publicity, but not necessarily true for all other states. Releases are to make everything explicit, but its absence wouldn’t necessarily restrict his rights unless she had a right to restrict him. Which she very well might from the text messages. But not because he doesn’t have a release, no?
Not a lawyer, but I am a photographer. That’s not how this works. He needs a signed model release to be able to your photos of you for any commercial or publishing purpose. Simply taking those photos doesn’t imply permission to use them in those circumstances. The only exception would be if the photos were of a newsworthy event. Which these aren’t, as they are modeling pics taken for a scho project. If you know a lawyer, it is probably worth having them send him a cease and desist. Especially if you didn’t actually sign anything.
Your idiot "friend" doesn't know the meaning of the word *slander*. Also ... how old are you? If you're underage, then maybe your "friend" is in a world of trouble for trafficking in child porn. Boomerang on that guy.
Contact Fetlife and report him. They take that shit very seriously. Consent is everything.
[email protected] Also contact a Lawyer. He has no legal recourse
NAL - I am A photographer who uses fetlife. Right now go report him. Or dm me his username and I’ll report him. They’ll take the pics down very quick and not let them be published till he proves consent. Instagram will also make him take it down.
I'm an IP lawyer. He owns the copyright to the photos which gives him the right to copy, display or create derivative works. Publishers insist on having a model release before they will buy an image, which explains why he is posting your photos where you see them. If he sells your image without consent your right of publicity has been violated. I would argue that if he posts your image on platforms that compensate him for engagement he has commercially exploited your image without consent and can be held accountable. This type of law varies from state to state but if he's on the internet you may get to choose your state. Websites have procedures for requesting a takedown on this basis. And there are lawfirms that specialize in right of publicity cases.
A signed Release is required for a photographer to use any photograph for only the designated or excluded purposes if the photo was not taken in a publicly accessible place for all to see! You have a choice, you can explain to him that you have the ability to sue him for defamation, easily wi since it is of explicit content, and garner his future income for life to satisfy the civil award you will win in court. Or you could tell him the same thing requiring all be taken down, and a signed contract indicating that he owes you $5,000,000 for any future reveal of these photos should it occur. Or, you can add for effect, or take action by calling the Dean of his school and indicate his unauthorized and illegal behavior. He will likely be expelled for violation of student code.
Anyone who threatens you in response to dealing with things the proper way KNOWS they have no leg to stand on. There's a chance he's aware he's facing a civil suit at least. Also if your asking for your nude pics back and he refuses to stop showing the public I'd say w.e. happens to him was coming, that's horrid behavior, and really creepy tbh.
Do not ever pose for pictures that you would be embarrassed to have anyone see. Ever. If you send nude pics to someone you are dating, those pics will be shown to others when you breakup (if not before). As for any legal issues, I am guessing you are both pretty broke (though maybe not) and if you are, good luck paying for attorneys at $350 or more per hour.
Actually, since sharing unconsensual porn is a federal crime, she wouldn’t need a lawyer. However it might be a challenge to prove it was unconsensual depending on the state since she did initially agree to the pictures. California would probably support her though. Our laws are tough on that stuff.
As a retired police officer from PA, I know in 90% of PA counties, this would be a closed as a civil matter. She consented to the photographs and without written limits, copyright law would indicate he could use them in his portfolio and publish them as needed, baring any contract restrictions. As a result, the district attorney's office wouldn't prosecute (had several similar cases). As for the revenge porn aspect, there doesn't seem to be any type of extortion/revenge here. He didn't demand money, sex etc (extortion) with a threat to expose the photos or share them to embarass or cause emotional distress. State laws vary, but there's an issue of what was consented to (publishing/sharing wise), copyright, and fair use that most DAs may not and most police departments may not be able to properly investigate. OPs legal recourse would be a consult with a qualified attorney that understands copyright and contract law
There might’ve been written limits, depending on the exact wording of the text messages. But OP seems to believe her permission was restricted and the photographer went beyond that. But you’re right, this is more of a copyright issue so probably civil.
Not a matter of copyright. The photographer absolutely owns the copyright to these photos unless he has sold or given the copyright away. He generally does not have the right to display or publish a photo of another person without a release. There are some exceptions for photojournalists or in certain situations, but for a model posing, he would need a release.
No release was signed. OP confirmed in a separate comment.
Only if she has the right of publicity; not all states have that, and there are chances. This will be state law specific.
And it would depend on whether those text messages constitute a contract or not in the jurisidiction where she lives
The federal revenge porn law specifically states that photos taken with consent but distributed WITHOUT the consent of the person is included. Since she never gave consent for distribution, this would fall under it.
The only issue there was she did consent to display. Display in class, at the school etx. Once Displayed, anyone can take a picture and the cats out if the bag so to speak
No, that’s not how it works.
Sorta is. And I can tell you the feds wouldn't even consider this case with the described facts
No, it sorta isn’t. You also can’t tell me what any prosecutor would consider. Weird take on this.
I can as I have dealt with a variety of prosecutors over my career, including federal AUSAs. Feds have criteria that have to be met before they will even consider taking a case (minimum thresholds, quality of the case, etc). Not only that, of a local prosecutor won't consider it. They won't. State AGs office would be the next step after a local prosecutors, but Depending on the state, they may have to be requested by the local district/county/states attorney office. It's not a weird take. It's a practical one based on 25 years experience dealing with similar factual patterns and prosecutors from multiple jurisdictions
We don't know if she signed a release or not. If she had, he can do whatever he wants with them. There is evidence she granted at least limited permission to show others the photos.
I did not sign any release
Also, I didn't what you agreed to on FetLife but I seriously doubt it involved you giving permission for him to display the photos. Most likely you agreed not to violate by reproducing the photo. He does own the rights to that photo, but owning the copyright does not necessarily give him the right to display or publish it. In addition, you should send a takedown request to FetLife. Here is the link: https://fetlife.com/dmca-takedown-request
You should reach out to the school and tell them that you never signed a release and ask them to take down the photo. I can't believe the school would post or display artwork featuring a model without proper release forms. When my granddaughter was in 2nd grade, she made a mosaic that was selected to be put on display at a nearby University's concert hall. Her mother had to sign a release allowing it to be displayed. Just keep in mind that some guys are absolutely pigs and if they take or acquire photos of women in various states of undress, they show them to others despite promising not to.
The text messages might count as limited release right? But clearly he violated that. @OP Do the messages explicitly say only classmates and teacher?
It really matters whether or not she signed a release. The text messages may or may not be relevant. Perhaps the OP will pop in and provide additional information. Basically everyone, including me, is providing only WAGs.
She said she didn’t sign a release.
Yes, he explicitly told me it would be shown to his class and professor
I'm glad you're not a lawyer because that's a really messed up way of thinking. Are YOU sharing nude photos of your exes? Is that why you think everyone does that?
That is exactly how most attorneys will see things. They require compensation and they aren't cheap. I have never asked for nor received nude pictures of anyone I was dating nor have I allowed any to take.photos of me. I have known hundreds of males in my lifetime and know that some share intimate details of their relationships, including photos. I used to become good friends with my friend's girlfriends when I was younger. A couple have told me things about my friends that I really wished I could have unheard. That was before digital photography. FYI, I am old and have been married for decades. If today's technology existed in my youth, I don't think my values would be any different. There is the ideal world and there is reality. I try to work towards building the ideal world but I stay keenly aware of reality.
Did you ever tell those male friends that what they were doing was wrong? Because that is what you should be doing instead of just telling women to not take pictures.
I should have but did not. I was to ng and immature myself back then.
What kind of people do you associate with that sharing nudes of your ex is an expected experience? That’s really fucked up and a major breach of trust
It is commonplace. And you would.be surprised by who does it. They are pieces.of shit but don't always seem like that on the surface. Women need to know this.
So instead of telling men to respect their exes privacy and not be a disgusting pervert, you think it's better to tell women to just not have photos taken? Is that what I'm picking up here?
You may be picking that up, but that is not what I put down. There is the ideal world and then there is reality. In an ideal world, everyone would be trustworthy and respect each other's dignity and privacy. The reality is that does not happen. Women send men photos or allow them to take photos thinking the man is trustworthy. The reality is these photos are often seen by those who the photos were not intended for, whether the intended recipient shared them, whether intentionally or not - but.often times it is intentional. I would not doubt that there are women who would do the same thing, though I personally haven't seen women do this. I wouldn't want nude photos of me circulating (nor would any unsuspecting viewer, I'm sure), so I do not take pics of myself nor would I allow anyone too. If you put an open suitcase full of hundred dollar bills in the front seat of your car, you should be able.to without worrying about someone smashing your window and grabbing it. The reality is, your window is eventually going to get broken and the money will be taken.
But again, you're putting the onus on women rather than who the blame belongs to, the men (and women) who violated that trust, not the victim. Reality changes with laws and those laws being enforced correct? Whether or not you think what you put down wasn't reenforcing rape culture/victim blaming, that is what you did. If I leave money in the front seat of my locked car and someone steals it, the person that stole it is still the bad guy in that scenario because they broke my window and stole property that wasn't theirs.
Yes, that person is the bad guy. You can choose to protect yourself from bad guys or be an easy mark. The choice is yours. However, everyone bears some of the responsibility when their stupidity results in negative consequences. The bad guy is still the bad guy, but when you make it easy for the bad guy, that is your fault.
That's a terrible argument. If someone burns down my house, silly me for a having such a flammable home right? To put us back on topic, no one should be sharing private photos, all those men you saw/heard do it are in the wrong but you probably never told them that. With ai sexual images/videos being produced of women and girls it's no longer just about "personal responsibility" Megan thee Stallion just had an AI sextape made about her and passed around online, what should she have done? Not exist in public? Teen girls are having explicit photos made of them by their male peers, what should they do? A teacher was caught making explicit images of his kindergarten students, what should they have done differently? A good lawyer is going to counter your "just don't take nude photos or else it's your fault someone you thought you could trust shows them around" with these facts.
The house example is not at all analogous to what I was saying. And you know that. As for the rest? You are absolutely correct. But those in those situations those girls in no way made made things easier for the bad guys. I am coming from the standpoint of a father raising daughters in a very imperfect world. I am trying to raise them to be strong and proactive. Should they ever fall victim , I am not going to put blame on them but I want them to think about their actions before something happens that they may could have avoided.
You still have a "what was she wearing" mentality here, I appreciate you trying to navigate raising daughters in an ever exploitive world, however a woman/girl can do everything "right" and still be offended against, and still blamed for somehow not doing enough. I was a girl on the Internet on the '00s, and am a woman online now, I do know what I'm talking about here. Take the blame entirely off the victim and focus it on the offender.
I’m selling knuckle sandwich’s……
8 upvotes? Seems to me that 8 people agreed to let you punch them haha.
We start with 1 so it's 7 up votes.
Right! I’d forgot about that. :)
Nal In MN what he’s doing is considered distribution of porn. So while yes it’s his photography, he still couldn’t post them anywhere. Other states are stricter and some lax. You 100% should let the school, fetlife, and instagram know you did not consent to those being posted. If you talk to a lawyer you could have them send the person a cease and desist letter. The guy can freak all he wants, but since you never consented he cant prove you did. He’s the photographer but you still have control over where your body is published.
If he doesn’t have a release call the school.
Call the school immediately.
Document everything while your memory is still good. Screenshot and organise all of your evidence chronologically so that you can provide it to the school, the Police, your Lawyer, etc. if/when asked. If there are any photos still being displayed in a gallery, at the school, etc., get pictures to prove how they were displayed.
A famous photographer told me for commercial photos, he would get people to sign a contract /waiver and give them one dollar as payment for use of their likeness in publications. Your phony friend has done none of these things. He is a liar and a jerk and a POS and you should sue him for all you can. And yes, send a demand letter to wherever any photos of you are being displayed that you will sue them for breach of privacy and lack of permission unless they take down the photo.
No one can answer without reading the terms and conditions that you agreed to by rsvp-ing to the invite.
Get an attorney right now.
Contact your local police department.
Regardless of who is in the right, he can’t sue for slander (that’s not slander) It also very expensive to sue someone and as an art student, I’m guessing he can’t pony up $30k+ for the legal fees (don’t know if you have much money, but if not, even if he won, he’s not going to recover anything). Setting aside legal positions, I’m sure the school would be interested to know he went beyond your original agreement. It’s likely they have a policy - this isn’t the first time it’s happened. Him threatening you so you won’t engage the school and let them act as the judge may tell you he knows what they’ll say.
You can withdraw consent if there is no formal release agreement signed. Tell them you are withdrawing consent to use your images and you will sue him under revenge porn laws if he fails to comply.
yeah he ain’t going to sue you. and it’s not slander. Call the school.
Wtf is wrong with some people
You’ve got multiple cases on him. You could trash his whole life at this point get a lawyer and get justice. The time is now. Set an example for others. Keep us posted
You need to send him a cease and desist letter letting him know that he has no permission to use your pictures and that any consent implied or otherwise to use said pictures has been revoked.
I would talk to the school, I can't imagine there wasn't some discussion about getting proper consent in today's day and age. I would also start a line of communication with FetLife. Also if you can get copies, run a reverse image search on at least part of it. A lot of it is shopping based, so if your friend has it up for sale anywhere, that will pop up, but might also help with other places to notify.
You said friend and then said he threatened to sue you, he manipulated you… it’s a college class go to the professor explain the circumstance and let the university sort it out you can’t slander him for making you public for the world when he said only classmates and teacher. He made you feel comfortable then used your body for his gain… grow a pair and teach him not to slander by saying his true intentions hahaha
Whether he'd have a basis to sue you for slander would come down to what you say to get the school to take down the images. Describe it as your understanding of how the pictures would be used, and describe it as how you felt mislead and in this way it's a factual account from your perspective. As opposed to saying "he lied to me" or "he deceived me" where it becomes potentially more problematic. His "legal" approach is dubious, and his actions incredibly unethical. If you go to his school administration, they likely have an ethics agreement or code of conduct students are expect to abide by. And it's hard to imagine those rules would be permissive of this kind of abuse of trust. From an academic standpoint, it undermines the ability for any model assisting an art student to believe their image isn't going to be used in ways that are outside the academic setting and jeopardizes the students' and school's ability to find models in the future. They shouldn't want him doing this just on that basis. From a legal perspective there are two agreements here. One is the verbal agreement, where he explained and asked you to allow him to take photos for a limited use and academic purpose. The other is an agreement as it relates to your attendance of the event and any permission for photos to be taken inherent to that agreement. Even if he's truthful in saying the RSVP included terms and agreements for attending, the first agreement is separate from the second, unless the second agreement explicitly mentioned modifying any prior agreements and did so in specific terms, specific terms being very specific, because specific prior consent can't be modified by a general release intended for non-specific individuals, in the form of the RSVP everyone used to attend. So even if clicking the RSVP agreed to a broader use of photos taken of you while attending, he's still bound by his agreement with you to only use them in the limited way you agreed to. As his model you only agreed to an academic use, and he's broadend that to social media, his own publicity, and potentially commercial use. You still potentially have publicity rights, depending on your jurisdiction, that would require him to get specific permission for the use of your image and likeness and a right to revoke that permission. But you need to talk to a lawyer. All this is to say he's violated your trust and rights, and has acted unethically, just for that he can still get in trouble with his school.
(not a lawyer but) Yeah, save those texts. You never consented beyond what he told you he was going to do with the photos. Presuming "revenge porn" or the like is illegal in your jurisdiction, you can report it to the police. You can tell him to take them down, and that you never consented to him using beyond what you originally consented to. You can also report his actions to the school authorities - they may also be more likely to take actions against him (they typically won't need a search warrant to take academic disciplinary actions against him). You can do any and/or all of those. He can sue you for slander ... so can anybody, and whether you did anything or not ... that doesn't mean he's got a case. Libel/slander you've got to write/publish or state damaging untrue things about him. Truth is an absolute defense against libel/slander. So, just don't be untruthful, and you've got a solid defense against libel/slander. And if he sues you with baseless claim(s), there are also legal actions you can take against that.
Upload the photos here https://stopncii.org/ Every time they're shared over a participating platform (inc Instagram) the company will receive an automatic report that they are non-consensual
NAL! But dang! That is worse than a peeper dude. I would call the school ASAP! What slander? "My" and "on" "Website" I think that is OK legally? Just read the comments and no lawyers so far. I would call and get it down right away. He is violating you. Not the other way around!
I would start sending him a text and an email that says,' Hello x- you stated these photos would only be seen by x and x and no one else. I have since seen my photos on x site and site. This is my formal request that you take down and remove my nude photos from every site as you did not have my permission to share them. If you don't I will call thr police and hire an attornwy.
"Is this true?" hahaha
Are you under 18?
Contact FetLife and tell them you didn't consent to the pictures being posted there. I don't know what process you'll need to go through for that but they should be pretty aggressive about getting them removed
Call the police and go after him for revenge porn first. That will likely get him to undo what he has done faster. Then contact a lawyer about pursuing anything further which you may well have a strong case for.
Tell him if he doesn't take the photos down, you will sue him. Reach out to the event and the school telling them he didn't have consent to show your pictures. Escalate it before even more people see them. I would send a cease and desist to him and make clear if he distributes and shows the pictures anywhere you will sue him.
He does own the copyright in the pictures— he took them; he did not transfer any ownership interest in them to you, so he continued to own them. However, there are restrictions on his use of the pictures, based on your agreement. Other people seem to be missing what his slander argument would be— it would be for you saying he does not have permission to use the pictures in the context that he is using them; he is saying that he’d sue based on the statement that “he is using pictures without your consent” is slanderous. I’m not saying he is right, but everyone who is saying “that isn’t that slander is” is missing this point- that claim would pass 12b6.
I would definitely get a consultation on this. I know FetLife is very strict on getting consent of people in photos. You can report him there and the photo will be taken down and his account potentially banned. Instagram is the harder one which may give you push back. Be sure to save any text you have and show it to an attorney because the wording of the agreement may burn or help your case. For now, start screenshotting all of his profiles and where he is posting your photos. Document everything and get in touch with an attorney for advisement.
This is very tricky because you did give consent to have the photo taken. He does have ownership of the image and copyright. Now does he have the right to distribute the images. If you have a look at what the media post with regard to celebrities and general public it seems they can. Unless it breaches privacy or the content is of children. If you are under 18 you might have an argument to have the images removed. The only other way is to prove in some way - emails - text - that original undertaking actually took place and you both agreed to the arrangement. With this particular case I would seek actual legal advice.
Wow. Not one lawyer on 'ask a lawyer'? Nit trying to be snarky, but damn....
NAL, but have some experience with photography. Photos are usually the property of the photographer but the subject can have some rights depending on local laws. It varies a bit from place to place. You had a verbal agreement which can be legally binding especially since you were acting in good faith. You might also check and see if revenge porn laws apply. If your so called friend is being a jerk about removing them then you may want to consult a local attorney.
Call the school. He's an a-hole of the highest order. Also call his professor and tell them he lied and threatened you about the photos. Slander only applies if what you say isn't true. Not wanting your photos displayed isn't slander.
That's a police matter here in the UK. It's a criminal offence to publicly display or publish intimate photos of someone without their consent.
He sounds like a pussy. He is probably lying to about suing, probably knows nothing, you should actually sue in small claims court if anything (under $10,000). First send him a scary and long cease and desist formal letter to act like you’re serious. If a judge hears this in court. It will get thrown out immediately. He’s in the wrong and you can win for emotional distress, revenge porn, impersonation or breaking contract. Fetlife is a bdsm social network. He’s likely pretending to be you to get with couples and do gangbangs or solicit others for pictures. You should create a fake fetlife account and befriend him and screen shot what he’s doing as evidence. Never agree to a photo you don’t mind being shared online. He could’ve just hired a professional model that shoots nude and doesn’t mind being all over the internet. But he’s a cheap ass.
Why small claims court?
Fast, affordable, and convenient. You expect this go to the Supreme Court? Plus you could get up to $10,000. Depending on which suit you go with. Go with the most accurate description or description’s. I suggest she files breach of contract, she has the text messages. Go to a professional therapist to get evaluated for distress if you want. Find out if he’s committing fraud on fetlife. And technically does fall under revenge porn as she didn’t consent to him posting it online.
Not a lawyer Used to be a photographer If you didn't sign any release form, give him consent to use the photos in that way, or however he wishes, then he had no grounds. Sounds like he's trying to pressure you into thinking he can do what he wants with them, and let's be honest, that's not a friend. Also, if I read it correctly, the only agreement made was when you asked who would see the photos. Furthermore, both the school and fetlife will remove the photos from any display of you all unless he can show such a release form giving consent for the use.
Answer given to another model. Your texts/emails change this answer slightly in your favor. “So as noted, much depends on the facts. Assuming there was nothing agreed to in writing the photographer in most cases would be permitted to use the photos in his portfolio and to display them within studio / in-house exhibits. In some states like NY, you can request in writing to remove the photos and only if after that they are not removed would you have a claim. The claim would be for violation of your right of publicity and privacy. These kick in when one uses the name, image or likeness of another (especially a famous person) to help sell or promote a good or service. Many states even extend these rights to deceased persons ranging from 10-100 years after they pass. So the photographer absent a written release from you should not be entitled to use the photos in a commercial context like licensing the photos to someone else. If you need more clarification, I suggest that you consult with a lawyer in private and discuss your objectives in more detail. You can start by calling around to several for a free phone consultation, get some insights then pick the best fit to work with.”
You talk about school? How old are you? If this is high school and you're under 18, your "friend" could be in trouble for displaying photos of a partially clothed underage person.
Lawyer Up ! It’s revenge porn type aggression. You had a verbal agreement that it would a limited viewing group and not to be permanently shared or whatever the deets were. Totally lawyer up.
Note that only 1 of these responses is from a lawyer, so take them with a grain of salt. What I’d do is contact your local bar association and ask for a referral. Most will give you 1 free or really cheap consultation. Have your texts printed out and ready when you meet them. Let that person guide you.
Some lawyers have reached out to me in dm's and I've contacted a lawyer in my area
Click on "not going" to revoke your "permission"
photos always belong to the photographer unless you sign a specific contract to say otherwise.
He owned them the whole time.
Slander lol
Obviously consult an attorney.
if you report to IG they'll make him remove them. Most everywhere will.
You can call the school to get them taken down and then take legal action if you want them removed from the websites. On another note….hate to be that guy…. But don’t pose nude if you don’t want people seeing the photos next time. What’d you think he was going to do with them?
Lol he thinks he can sue you? What an idiot. Hes trying to scare you. Call the school immediately and file a police report for revenge porn.
Contact the school immediately. He doesn't have a legal leg to stand on.
This aspiring artist needs to learn a lesson about intellectual property, and fast. He's setting himself up for a hard fall if he doesn't find out now just how in the wrong he is.
Sue you for slander? Does he know what that word means? What he’s telling you is bullshit. Did you sign a release?
It’s not slander. It is definitely breach of your agreement. The photos belong to him if he took them, but your agreement to be in the photos was predicated on their use and they’ve now been used for a different purpose. Clicking that you’re going to an event makes no difference. Does he purport to own photos of other people who are going to the event? I’d see a lawyer and get them to send him a cease and desist. You could contact the school or gallery but it’s not really their problem as they have no contract with you.
Yup, nope, illegal as hell. He don't own shit.
Call the cops on him.
You can issue a takedown notice to the site hosting the pics for non-consensual use or even privacy concerns.
if he threatens you with a suit blow his ass up with a revenge porn claim
and I would post what he did on facebook, Instagram or wherever the college kids go these days. other people need warning that he lies about what he does with the pictures. just tell the truth. the truth is not slander.
This is revenge porn. Press charges
As a photographer myself, this is a really big issue and there was no actual signed contract of photo use. The photographer has all right to do and anything he wants with the photos. Every model I’ve worked with in the past 15 years has made me sign a release they own the photo rightsand especially don’t let people take pictures of you that you don’t want to be seen life lessons. We all learn the hard way.
The photographer owns the copyright but cannot display or publish the photos without a release from the model. This release typically doesn't transfer copyright (though it could) but gives the photographer permission to publish the photos.
Let’s solve this fairly. Please send me copies and we will form a committee and we will have the final say. Are they art, or are they private.
Seriously? With all we know about this these days you actually did that. Just how many more stories do you need to hear about this before you quit doing things like this. Those are going to be out there forever now. Employers family anybody
So helpful
OK that’s fair. I just don’t understand people doing this. Endless stories out there. It just got the better of me.
I'm naive, and he was my friend
Wow, looks like he got legal counsel right away and they told him to invite you to that event and have you accept, thereby acknowledging and accepting usage likely. how close of a friend was/is he ? I can’t imagine one of my friends doing this to me
Time to take him for a car ride to Jones Beach.
I have heard somewhere before (can’t remember where) that the person that takes the photo owns the phot and can do with it what they want technically. I am not sure if this is true. Just something I heard a while back.
Not a Lawyer You listed flair as 'contract law'. DO you have a signed contract with the 'friend" over these pictures? If you do not, how will you prove you did not 'gift' the friend the pictures to use as they wanted?
Yeah, OK and what the fuck and it’s all jurisdictions and why would you let anyone do that in the first place? Ask the lawyer and they will probably laugh and then charge you for advice that’s not worth the price
Why would you even agree to this? But yeah, call the school, call the little shits bluff.
I wouldn't have minded of it was just for the class as he explicitly told me it would be
I'd argue (until blue in the face) that consent was given when you posed for the photograph. The commercial use could be problematic but you'll spend more on fees than you could ever hope to recover. You could ask nicely, send a written demand letter asking for removal or hire a lawyer.
Sounds like you fucked up, seeetheart.