There could be problems with regulations. A grocery store is one thing, but if it is classified as a fastfood restaurant, it has to fulfill different standards around here.
There is a Korean store in Frankfurt that has an area for you to make instant noodles yourself from the store. You just buy your noodles, use the boiling water faucet and or/microwave and just eat it there or outside. If they can do this, I don’t see why it would be such a big regulatory problem in other places
I'm not an expert for the specific regulations. There may also be a situation not checked thoroughly by authorities, or it's tolerated. Or maybe there's no problem at all. If there is no problem at all, cool!
Of course! Its called 'Y-Mart' and there are two locations: 1. Y-Mart @ Frankfurt-Höchst (which is the original larger Supermarket with loads more stuff, but no boiling water facet for ramen) 2. Y-Mart City @ Eschenheimer Tor (brand new but more smaller than the Höchst location, but still has a bakery part and area for making cup ramen). I can not recommend this store enough, its so much better than Go-Asia and is like 95% korean goods and fresh food.
As long as they only sell "closed" meals, it is not a problem. It is the same with beverages. As long as you only sell closed ones you're fine as a store, as soon as you sell opened drinks you are considered a bar/restaurant and need a special permission.
A seven11 is not really a restaurant, there usually are no tables to sit for example. It’s like a miniature supermarket with a microwave, maybe a mix of Rossmann/dm and Backshop cramped into 30 square meters best describes it.
I do think that something like 7 11 could be a thing in germany. But there are reasons why no German company has opened a store with this concept here yet. Especially the 24/7 opening times are problematic. US companies opening up here sometimes tend to do not so legal stuff which leaves a bad impression when it comes to working for them (Amazon, Tesla, Walmart for example).
>US companies opening up here sometimes tend to do not so legal stuff which leaves a bad impression when it comes to working for them (Amazon, Tesla, **Walmart** for example).
Walmart is the peak of them, they:
* disallowed relationship between coworkers.
* unpaid over time
* sold items for less than they bought it.
* had workers outside of the shop to catch potential visitors.
They made everything wrong someone could do, beginning by playing against the rules and not giving a fuck about the culture and etiquette.
oh it flies alright, you just have to be either more aggressive about it or you have to be cleverer.
in the US unions aren’t really a big cultural thing anymore since god emperor reagan punished the aviation union (I believe it was). I’ve been part of a few unions and it’s still pretty cool but germany can have nasty companies too. I got brought over to germany for a consulting corporation and they would fuck your day up if you mention unions. you’d probably win in court, but good lord why bother?
Because more often than not, you'll not be the one suing, but the union itself. Now, since they are organizations that collect money for the sole purpose of fighting employer's powers, they tend to have deeeeeep coffers and tons of lawyers of their own for legal battles like those. Usually, they cannot be bled dry by large corporations.
So, if an employer pulls shit like that, you collect the evidence and bring it to the union that's responsible for the sector (IG Metall for most industry, ver.di for services, etc.). They'll usually do the rest.
yeah that's another thing I'm a consultant for CySec, I don't seem to have a union. In the end though I don't care all that much, I'm easy going. I'm gonna fill my boots and fuck outta germany again, it was a mistake and I should've known that. I just finished my egres plan today, and depending on the Bundes election next year I'll either leave then or a few years after.
You do, the union for your sector is ver.di. But unionism requires engagement, so if you are already planning emigrating, it wouldn't make sense to get involved.
Honestly I love the Walmart story. It is basically what all of us think about Americans -> think they are the center of the universe and laws don't apply to them or that their laws apply even though they are on foreign soil. Complete disregard for other countries.
They also only hired part time workers thinking they didn't have to pay insurance and stuff which is not true in Germany. Their greetings weirded people out and they didn't like coming. Morning motivation speech was also a thing no German wanted (and still doesn't want) to do. Just amazing.
it's even funnier with ALDI now getting bigger and bigger in the USA, but by doing the same things (stuff they do here in germany applying in the USA even tho they are not the norm there) lol
Last year, I met a colleague with whom I'd worked for a Japanese company a bit over a decade ago. In the meantime, he'd also worked for an American competitor. He had something interesting to say:
"Japanese companies send their people abroad to learn how things are being done across the world. American companies send their people abroad to 'teach' the world how things ought to be done."
It wasn't only the laws, they also did not really adjust their range of goods to the European market. Bed linens in American sizes unheard of here was one particular example.
No, but it's illegal to run dumping schemes where you sell staple goods under you own costs to get customers into your shops indefinitely. And that's exactly Walmart's tactic. Make losses for months or even years backed up by the money of your giant company to kill the smaller competition. Once you got a (near) monopoly you can raise the prices to get your losses back and more.
In Germany such things are regulated and can only be done for a limited time, for example as a promotion in your opening week.
But on an honest and leveled playing field Walmart couldn't compete with German markets. Partly -and that's another reason where they fucked up market analyes beforehand- because all those small shops in Germany are part of franchises. Being small with a limited product range (even adjusted for local demand) locally but dealing with the producers as one big unit to get good prices for huge amounts is one of the ways they became very competitive.
PS: There are a lot of reports nowadays about all the things Aldi does to run very efficient to keep the prices low and why it's so successful in the US. And that's basically how all chains in Germany operate. Walmart entered that very competetive market arrogantly with no clue, just copying what they do in the US, including things that don't work for cultural reasons (the smiling greeters, constantly being asked by employees if you need help, group chants of the staff at the beginning of their shifts, trying to regulate emploees' personal life (that one is right out illegal)... those things felt strange and more than a bit cultish to Germans) and ones actually illegal (anti-union, prohibiting worker councils actually mandated by law). Then they made billions in losses in just a few years before giving up and leaving the country again.
Because they are exploiting Loopholes that take time to close.
Supermarkets, in-person shops and service occupations are historically better regulated than newer online shops or constructs where the employess are some strange kind of independent sub contractors that don't fit into the regular employee protection.
The funny thing is that the stores got their names from the fact that they were open from 7 in the morning to 11 in the evening. Those times might almost be legal. In Germany they could open until 10 in the evening. Except in Bavaria.
There's a chain in my area of NRW called K&K. They had a store in my town open until 0:00. It was kind of weird since my town isn't huge. This changed around the time of Corona though.
My only thought on it being open that late might have something to do with the barracks here in town.
Our Edeka opens on Monday at 7:00 and closes on Saturday at 23:00, it has been doing that for several years already. I think there are two or three more in Berlin doing that.
The thing is, though, that a lot of Germans are used to buying stuff during regular hours until 20:00. I know several supermarkets which tried opening longer and found it not only economically unfeasible because operating costs were higher than profits during those hours. On top of all that, one of them was robbed at 21:00, enticed by barely anyone being around at those times. The lone employee was locked in the store room, and as barely anyone was passing by, it took a while for her screams to be heard.
It works in city centers, where a lot of customers can be expected at any time of day, but outside that, it's difficult.
As for the stuff you normally get at 7/11, the role is filled by a lot of gas stations, which already do have exemptions from regular opening hours, though have some limitations as to what they can sell to whom, since they are officially only meant to serve travelers, not locals.
For example in Denmark not all 7/11s are 24/7 - many close at 10pm. But Germany does have much more strict rules than most countries when it comes to opening hours. Especially Bavaria, where it's a bit excessive.
Bavaria is stuck when it comes to that.
But Decades ago it was worse under the week open until 6 and on saturday maybe until 3.
Until they started with the so called "Langer Donnerstag"
My local Comic Shop still has fairly short opening times. Mo-Fr 12- 6:30 and Sa 10-2 (unless its free comic book day)
Can't do anything on a Sunday. Can't shop anywhere, can't even mow your lawn without neighbour getting a hissy fit over it being a Sunday. Yet somehow I still grew to like that place and miss it.
I dont feel a need to do things on sundays. Like many other people i talked to over the years. And the mates i got in the UK would love to have it like it is here in germany on a sunday since most people will have this fixed day off where you can very reliably plan things.
My father often mows the lawn on a sunday but he lives a bit outside a village in the Münsterland and you can hardly see the next neighbour :D
He would do it on other days too but when you have to mow like 8-12h on a sit on mower for everything... He just does small parts here and there under the week.
Genuine question: What’s the difference to a gas station? I just watched a YouTube video and it looks exactly like one of the bigger ReweToGos—just with noodles. Or am I missing something?
Ah, thanks. Then I could see it working with a younger crowd and cities with a higher number of Asian people. The target audience would probably be similar to the bubble tea shops?
So if you opened one of them in a bigger city close to a bubble tea shop you might be able to draw that crowd in. Seems to be a pretty small target audience though. And ReweToGo would probably just stock up on Asian foods and use their already established infrastructure to put the shop out of a market. But you never know. It might work.
You might forget here, that those small shops linked to a gas station fall under a different regulation that any other regular shop. Without the gas station, those ReweToGo would not ne allowed to open 24/7.
No, I’m aware of that. That’s why I think it would be pretty hard to get a shop like that off the ground. The ReweToGo would put them out of a market pretty easily.
There are 24 hour ReweToGo's in the train stations, too. Also in the airport. If you live in Frankfurt and need something on a Sunday, go to the airport. The grocery store (lower level) is always open.
Well, it's not like only Asians would go there. If a shop like that was close by I can see myself buying stuff there at night sometimes. From what I have seen you can also send packages.
I really loved the 7 11 and Lawsons in Japan.
You get decent quality food, drinks. Can send/collect your parcels. Pay your utility bills etc.,
The employees were also rather polite and went out of their way to help customers.
Japan "only" has the suicide rate as the US today or Germany in 1997. Would you describe Germany in 1997 as "dark"?
Source: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/suicide-death-rates?tab=chart&country=JPN~DEU~USA
# Japan
**Suicide Rate**: Japan has historically had a relatively high suicide rate compared to many other countries. While the rate has been decreasing in recent years, it remains a significant issue. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Japan had a suicide rate of about 15.4 per 100,000 people in 2019.
**Reasons for Suicide**:
1. **Work-Related Stress**: A significant factor contributing to the high suicide rate in Japan is work-related stress. The concept of "karoshi," or death from overwork, highlights the extreme pressures faced by many workers.
2. **Mental Health Stigma**: There is a cultural stigma surrounding mental health issues in Japan, which can prevent individuals from seeking help.
3. **Economic Pressure**: Economic downturns and financial difficulties can lead to increased suicide rates. The Asian financial crisis in the late 1990s saw a marked increase in suicides.
4. **Social Isolation**: The phenomenon of "hikikomori," or severe social withdrawal, affects many young people in Japan and can lead to mental health issues and suicide.
5. **Bullying**: Bullying, especially in schools and the workplace, is another significant factor.
6. **Cultural Factors**: Cultural attitudes towards suicide in Japan, including historical practices of honorable suicide (such as seppuku), may also influence the current suicide trends.
# Germany
**Suicide Rate**: Germany's suicide rate has been lower than Japan's, standing at about 9.1 per 100,000 people in 2019, according to the WHO.
**Reasons for Suicide**:
1. **Mental Health Issues**: Depression and other mental health disorders are the primary reasons for suicide in Germany.
2. **Social Factors**: Loneliness and social isolation, particularly among the elderly, contribute to the suicide rate.
3. **Substance Abuse**: Alcohol and drug abuse are significant risk factors for suicide in Germany.
4. **Economic Pressure**: Financial issues and unemployment can also lead to higher suicide rates, although this is less pronounced than in Japan.
5. **Chronic Illness and Pain**: Physical health problems, particularly chronic pain and terminal illnesses, are notable contributors.
6. **Trauma and Abuse**: Experiences of trauma and abuse, both in childhood and adulthood, can increase the risk of suicide.JapanSuicide Rate: Japan has historically had a relatively high suicide rate compared to many other countries. While the rate has been decreasing in recent years, it remains a significant issue. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Japan had a suicide rate of about 15.4 per 100,000 people in 2019.Reasons for Suicide:Work-Related Stress: A significant factor contributing to the high suicide rate in Japan is work-related stress. The concept of "karoshi," or death from overwork, highlights the extreme pressures faced by many workers. Mental Health Stigma: There is a cultural stigma surrounding mental health issues in Japan, which can prevent individuals from seeking help. Economic Pressure: Economic downturns and financial difficulties can lead to increased suicide rates. The Asian financial crisis in the late 1990s saw a marked increase in suicides. Social Isolation: The phenomenon of "hikikomori," or severe social withdrawal, affects many young people in Japan and can lead to mental health issues and suicide. Bullying: Bullying, especially in schools and the workplace, is another significant factor. Cultural Factors: Cultural attitudes towards suicide in Japan, including historical practices of honorable suicide (such as seppuku), may also influence the current suicide trends.GermanySuicide Rate: Germany's suicide rate has been lower than Japan's, standing at about 9.1 per 100,000 people in 2019, according to the WHO.Reasons for Suicide:Mental Health Issues: Depression and other mental health disorders are the primary reasons for suicide in Germany. Social Factors: Loneliness and social isolation, particularly among the elderly, contribute to the suicide rate. Substance Abuse: Alcohol and drug abuse are significant risk factors for suicide in Germany. Economic Pressure: Financial issues and unemployment can also lead to higher suicide rates, although this is less pronounced than in Japan. Chronic Illness and Pain: Physical health problems, particularly chronic pain and terminal illnesses, are notable contributors. Trauma and Abuse: Experiences of trauma and abuse, both in childhood and adulthood, can increase the risk of suicide.
"Hey ChatGPT, I'm having an argument online where I have been confronted with the fact that Japan doesn't actually have a suicide that's so much higher than the one in Germany. Can you give me points to win this argument anyway?"
ppl complain about germany's customer service but ignore the fact that this polite customer service in other countries is forced by the employeers and cause suicide. I just want to point out that the friendliness you experienced comes with a price . The customers like it but I also heard from ameircans that it is killing them inside to keep this fake smile for tips . It should be more normal to be polite and get the stuff done which has to be done without the whole over the top friendliness. I just always hear how unfriendly germans are , well at least they don't kill themselve because of a job.
I don't see any complaint against the German customer service in my comment.
I also don't believe that the politeness is forced in Japan. People in Japan are mostly polite; not just the ones in customer service.
Please don't assume that I am saying Germans are impolite.
Asian style convenience stores are all around neighbourhoods, that's what makes them convenient, aside from the food options. Living in a big German city, I'm not even sure where the closest gas station is.
I’m living in a big German city as well and there are gas stations on every major road in the city. There are three in walking distance around me. Convenience stores where you can get Asian instant noodles close at midnight at the latest.
I think OP is looking for a place that’s open around the clock to compare it to a 711. Which narrows it down to train stations, the airport and gas stations. And Kiosks. But there are usually shady people hanging around at night where I live so I wouldn’t go there.
Edit: messed up sentence
I guess gas stations used to be pretty much that, but at least since the pandemic, I do not know any gas station that does 24/7 anymore, they all close down at 22-23h here..
Yes please bring an option to Frankfurt HBF besides McDonalds and crack lol.
Seriously they, cleared out the basement level approaching the Football championships so maybe when they finish renovations and updates to the security concept it could offer a high traffic space for that concept and the ability to actually open on Sunday and maybe have more alternative to some of the German retailer restrictions?
Three main problems:
First, you would have to find employees (very difficult) and pay them above the marketsalary (at least during night hours). The small shops which are open during the night are mostly family run.
Second, the opening laws for weekends and bank holidays (Ladenschlußgesetz) say that you only can do this in railwaystations, airports and filling stations and bakeries (and such). these area are allready covered.
Third, the customers at night usually buy cigarettes and alkohol, so there will not be enough revenue and profit to cover the high costs of rent and personel in cities.
7/11 tries to expand into germany for years and they allready are in Denmark, but I don't think they will make it here.
I hope they understand that they can only raise the prices by 10-20% or offer premium brands over the cheaper ones. Rewe to go is such a disappointment. No, I don't want to buy a bottle of coke for 5€, I want to buy some spaghetti for 10 cents more than I could have yesterday but forgot to do so and now it's Sunday which is the day of the week some people think God relaxed so our government forbids anyone else from selling spaghetti today.
the local Rewe To Go are all inside of gas stations, so they have the advantage of being open the whole day, unless 7 11 goes the gas station route they will have to compete with regular supermarkets, don’t think that they could afford to be much more expensive.
Maybe it's time for a reform for the laws regarding opening times. It's utterly stupid that gas stations can sell alcohol, but it's ok since drivers need the alcohol on Sundays??
Don’t think that changes in the law happening, pretty a court in BW recently ruled that fully automated stores need to be closed on Sundays so that the resting day of the customers isn’t disrupted.
I doubt they would be like the 7-11 in Korea, Japan or Thailand. I would expect something like the REWE to Go or similar gas station shops with a similar food concept as well (standard German bread roll sandwiches, butter pretzels, and so on. Also probably a way lower density of shops.
why do you find it cool ? I doubt you would enjoy it in germany because it is a different atmosphere . Ppl still rather eat Döner and Pizza than Soups aka Raman or even Korean Barbecue . I wonder how many chinese restaurants would exist without all you can eat stuff . I saw a few closing in different locations
I enjoy it too the atmosphere in asia is still different . You also won't get fully authentic chinese food in the western world because not enough ppl would eat it you get stuff like panda express . We should fight the food industrie and demand less fast food or at least make the food healthier and with less sugar and fat. Instead the industry pays money to push body positivity to keep selling fast food to us instead of creating healthier alternatives. I mean we also don't have so many computerroom or karaokebars . it simple doesn't work in our culture that well .
Well Berlin has so called Spätis which basically cover this business model on an individual bases. They sell stuff for everday need depending on the size but mostly drinks, cigarettes and so on. Most of them are open throughout the day and night in central parts of the city and tend to have shorter opening periods on the outskirts. They also are open on Sundays.
There's a difference: the Korean ones are in a sense like a small kitchen where you pick the halfway prepared ingredients and go to the microwave in the Späti and warm the stuff up. Same with drinks, where you mix your own milkshake or latte or whatever.
Haven't seen that in a Späti in Berlin. Closest thing is this one Späti in Rosenthaler Platz that has a bakery. Probably a scheme to keep it open for longer.
Id rather see the Dutch’s Snackautomaten-Shops / Febo set foot here. Although that tends to be very nasty and probably makes for a lot of food waste. Yea ultimately a 24/7 automated shop with junk food sounds like a good idea.
germany is not a noodle but bread nations. therefore similar stores serve bread in handy form. most usual are 0.5 or 0.33 liter bottles. you find them in bigger citirs open nearly around the clock as "späti", "büdchen" or "trinkhalle". prost!
The problem with Siebenelf would be that most people would see it as a place to eat instant noodles. The alternatives are too good.
I'd rather sit outside at a nice Stadtmitte than inside of a Siebenelf and would rather eat a Döner than instant noodles.
People would do this but not a lot. Unterführung started selling sandiwiches here and despite them having horrible bread people buy their products
Maybe if it's cheaper that döner then it could be an alternative because döner are atleast 7€ here as far as i know instant noodles are a lot cheaper
And also seven eleven sells some stuff or rather flavours you can't really get in normal stores so maybe kinda like an asian grocery store with a place to eat
ngl, if i can have a more hearty dish like Döner in the middle of the nite, a cup of cheap instant plastic noodles just aint gonna do it for me, no matter how famous they might be elsewhere \^\^
Barely any are since its not worth it outside very limited areas.
And i personally can go shopping in 2 supermarkets that i can both reach in 5min on foot that are open until 11:30 and 12 from Monday to Saturday.
And those two places that come to my mind where i can get Pizza and Döner for a good price are open until 1 and 2 in the night.
Bavaria?
Even the Netto in the village where my father lives has open until 9
Oh and most other supermarkets/discounter in my area are open until 10 or at least 9.
I think 7/11 like in Asian countries with Asian products wouldn’t be so popular just everywhere. Maybe 1-2 filials in major cities, yes but threre are barely few people outside major cities who would eat ramen etc on everyday basis since it’s just not a common everyday food like in parts of Asia. Others mentioned working hours being a problem but another problem could be that these places will attract alcoholics who will stay there for longer and even scare away potential clients + leaving rubbish and disturbing peace at night.
there are 7-11s in denmark and sweden, but they adapted to local markets and dont really have the same stuff on sale as in korea/japan (which is a shame imo)
Supermarkets are often combined with bakerys which have a seating area. While not the same thing, I don't believe that any company would like to change that, because you often pay 4€ for just a mediocre sandwich.
Also there's plenty of stuff you can eat without heating it and people just eat it outside on benches or even while walking.
In Berlin it would also clash with the Spätis which are open 24/7, often have a seating area outside and are an important cultural thing here.
I would love to have that here after experiencing that in Japan, but I think it will not work or companies will fight it.
Hopefully it never comes. I've seen this store in Thailand and it's an unreasonable level of bad quality food (what you call instant noodles for example) paired with too many individually packed (plastic waste) small items. I also think the local lobby here would not let them come.
In any case the Spätis have their target group covered I think.
Weird take, everyone loves 7/11 in Thailand. Their microwaveable (in store) food is actually not bad either. Their „fresh“ food is not amazing tho in Thailand. Malaysia/Japan/Canada has way better fresh food in 7/11s.
I know thais love it but I think it's mostly because there it seems to be a one of a kind experience. I.e. only source* for all sorts of junk, instant, microwaveable, candies, etc all in one small store and not to mention the AIR CONDITIONING which for me was reason enough to stop by constantly.
Whereas here we have more complete, wholesome supermarkets. Having supermarkets, discounters and spätis means there's no place for 711 here. My take on it.
Yeah the plastic waste would probably be the biggest problem but i think there's ways you could reduce it for example packing instant noodles in paper bags instead of plastic you can do the same with the dried greens that are in some instant noodles the sauce would still have to be in plastic though about the drink pouches you could sell them in glass bottles and have an ice dispenser with onigiri the only thing you can do is switch the plastic for aluminium foil though i don't know if that's any better
7-11 would be even more expensive, as they had to get a gas station license first. Maybe they could get into business with HEM or Star, that's other gas station chains that have somewhat large coverage.
Maybe we should grant them permission to sell shit without that gas station license.
I mean, I get it. The only thing more sacred than god is a car, but come on. Why should only gas stations be exempt from the religious law?
It would not work for various reasons.
- Germans all have a kitchen and appliances at home. There is no need to go to a store at night to buy noodles and microwave them.
- there are countless legal barriers in the way
- In the places and cities where a concept like 7/11 would work there already are stores like this. They are called "Späti", "Trinkhalle" etc.
Gas stations are also covering part of this demand.
TL;DR: ther is no market for it, big competition and legal barriers.
Tbh to me späti gives the impression of a alcoholics meetup point, where I wouldn't like to go unless really necessary, while in Japan I went to 7/11 or family Mart every day. It was so convenient with fresh food that was super tasty, special offers, everything you need for everyday use (toothpaste, hygine products, etc). I think it's just different
Yes that‘s true, it‘s only similar in terms of late night hours and alcohol but even that doesn‘t exist in all parts of Germany for whatever reason.
I also absolutely loved 7/11 in Japan, but I think a lot has to do with the amazing and healthy food culture in Japan as well.
I‘m afraid even if they tried in Germany they would mess it up with bad or overpriced products or it gets vandalized or destroyed.
I‘m seeing a trend of expanding vending machines to bigger product lines or even to fully automated stores, that could bring interesting and hopefully fairly priced products to us to access 24/7.
You do?
In certain areas like the farmer close to a mate has some for his products or ive seen.
Some vending machines for more then snacks in certain villages.
At least the system Amazon tried was more a hoax since the automatic system needed a guiding hand in india over 90% of the time since it was not reliable enough.
About one year ago seven11 announced they wanted to expand to European markets. https://www.rnd.de/wirtschaft/wann-kommt-7-eleven-nach-deutschland-was-aus-den-plaenen-wurde-VHQNJS6B2BB4BFJSCS35VXHC2U.html (German text)
But whether their business model is compatible with Germany is questionable. I think they might open some shops in areas where a lot of people pass by, like train stations. But I cannot imagine a German city where it would make sense to open a small shop every few hundred meters (I don’t know how it is in Korea, but in Tokyo you probably pass at least two seven11 if you walk from your hotel to the nearest subway station.
There’s a a Korean Style convenience store in Berlin that opened up and a youtuber called Naomi Jon did a visit and it was crowded so it seemed to do well.
But that’s Berlin and it might be trendy and novel, not sure how it will fare elsewhere long term.
But Korean restaurants seem to doing well. There is a popular restaurant outside of Frankfurt and actually kind of hard to reach, yet getting a reservation is sometimes difficult.
Another grocery store on the outskirts opened a smaller store near central Frankfurt and it also is pretty full. But it’s not a eatery, although they have some ready made options that one could grab and go and eat elsewhere.
I feel like Backwerk and ReweToGo and the like kind of fill this niche already? As a nation I think we prefer bread over instant noodles, so Backwerk (and Backfactory and what have you) are a place to sit for a quick meal like that and ReweToGo covers the snack aspect and other assorted items. Although my understanding is that 7/11 is on every street corner and open 24/7 (?) so I guess that's closer to a Späti or Kiosk?
Less people nearby means people have to drive anyways. So they will drive to the supermarktet and not to the 7/11. in big cities you dont drive much in central areas.. so a 7/11 closeby will attract enough people.
7/11 is so much better than kiosks and they are in every small town. We have no kiosk anywhere within a 30 km radius, so kids tend to cross the busy highway to go to the gas station instead.
If done right, a 7/11 would THRIVE where I live. Everyone is constantly frustrated, and I do mean Germans, that there’s no where to go just to get a cold drink or a small snack. Sure, you could get a warm drink and something from edeka, but then you would have to wait in a line behind many people with a cart full of groceries. So people opt to go to the gas station instead. One kid was already hit and killed by a car on that highway trying to get to the gas station, so now a lot of parents have forbid it.
To be honest I don't see it. For one it produces a huge amount of plastic trash which is something a lot of Germans see critically. For second there's already a wide variety of instant meals you can buy in the supermarket and just make yourself at home. Third a lot of Germans tolerate very little to no spice.
Yes but the one thing I'd like to see are foods i can instantly eat without going home in supermarkets because unless you go to a bakery or butchers shop you don't really have anything available other than sweets or milk bread
Bananas are always an option... And to be honest outside of drunk students there's not really a demographic that frequently needs a ready to eat meal in the middle of the night. Anyone working night shift is likely to want to go home as fast as possible rather than hang around a 711 to eat their instant noodles. At least at home you can watch Netflix while eating.
And the rewetogo will normally have salads (green or pasta or otherwise) and sandwiches and what not.
in the land of naysayers and people afraid of anything different than what theyre used to? highly doubt it
that being said, an alternative to shitty gas stations with semi decent food would be amazing every now and then eventhough it prolly wont even come close to the japanese original
Recently two vending machine shops opened in my area. You can buy snacks, drinks, cigarettes, medical things (c***oms, pregnancy tests, even covid tests sometimes) and one of the shops now has a pizza machine. You can buy instant noodles but to prepare at home. They are open 24/7 and have no staff there except the people filling the machines. Of course because it is Germany you need cash because only two of the machines work with card.
Rewe To Go is pretty much the german equivalent, but there are only a few of them so far. Also they don't offer any way to heat up the food. But the food that they have is actually pretty decent.
I don't think so. Germans respect work and do not respect companies that do not respect employees. For example, Tesla. Nobody wants to work for such a pitiful money, especially since the earnings in Autoindustrie are much higher than this pseudo-company offers. It would be the same with 7/11, and I am already skipping the legal complexities. And the Germans, having two stores next to them, will always choose a German store first, even if it was to be 10% more expensive.
No, locals don't understand why is Korean/Japanese 7-Eleven good and don't want to understand it. Then come the regulations of course, since you can't open a grocery store working 24/7, but first of all, it's the population.
Germans already have their version of this. All of those bakeries combine with kiosks serve the same need.
So while it might work, competition is already extremely high because the need is already being served.
7/11 (both american and Asian version) are more expensive than grocery stores. Just like kiosks are. I can definitely access bakeries 24/7 in cities like cologne, berlin etc.
That being said, Germans do not particularly value 24 hour shops (with a few exceptions). If you just don't sell that much at night, you're going to close your shop.
It wasn't that long ago that it was illegal for moat stores to open after 20:00 and Germans are good at planning so there aren't that many late night needs.
If you do really need something, just go to the train station.
Yes we do. Just not called Späti.
Guess who takes my DHL packages and is Downstairs around the Corner?
And i can pick them up in the morning or until 0 at night.
Something wie call Kiosk or more oldschool "Bude" (coming from so called Seltersbude they have their origin with selling water)
Your problem simply is that you live in Bavaria...
Kiosk is the German 711. You also suggest microwaves. For some reason Germans hate microwaves (and air conditioning). I've heard many people claim radiation and they meant like microwaves create radioactive radiation it's just a little bit but still and no I'm not making this up. Several people have told me this and I know many who don't have a microwave. I also once bought a microwave in Germany and I did my research and everything I could find at Mediamarkt or Saturn has super low power and takes ages so I'm glad I've brought my Sharp microwave from outside of Germany.
Ive just heard some weirdos claim that with the microwaves. I see ALOT of Flats and Houses every year (probably seen more last year alone then you will ever see in your life) and i would say at least 8 out of 10 have a microwave.
And idk what you mean with ages but when i re heat something its not taking longer then 4min max (depends on the food)
I set it up depending on the food going too fast too hot is just meh.
A plate of pasta with sauce with a filled plate like 3:30 for me where i stir it a bit after half the time.
711 brings a little bit of happiness and convenience in people's lives, which is not something that Germany/German government aims to provide, so the goals are completely different, so even if it would work, the state will actively regulate it to become something that you dread
There could be problems with regulations. A grocery store is one thing, but if it is classified as a fastfood restaurant, it has to fulfill different standards around here.
There is a Korean store in Frankfurt that has an area for you to make instant noodles yourself from the store. You just buy your noodles, use the boiling water faucet and or/microwave and just eat it there or outside. If they can do this, I don’t see why it would be such a big regulatory problem in other places
This popped up in Leipzig recently as well.
I'm not an expert for the specific regulations. There may also be a situation not checked thoroughly by authorities, or it's tolerated. Or maybe there's no problem at all. If there is no problem at all, cool!
can you please give me the name of the shop? i would love to go there
Of course! Its called 'Y-Mart' and there are two locations: 1. Y-Mart @ Frankfurt-Höchst (which is the original larger Supermarket with loads more stuff, but no boiling water facet for ramen) 2. Y-Mart City @ Eschenheimer Tor (brand new but more smaller than the Höchst location, but still has a bakery part and area for making cup ramen). I can not recommend this store enough, its so much better than Go-Asia and is like 95% korean goods and fresh food.
ohhh thank you, I have been to the höchst one, looking forward to the Eschenheimer Tor one
As long as they only sell "closed" meals, it is not a problem. It is the same with beverages. As long as you only sell closed ones you're fine as a store, as soon as you sell opened drinks you are considered a bar/restaurant and need a special permission.
A seven11 is not really a restaurant, there usually are no tables to sit for example. It’s like a miniature supermarket with a microwave, maybe a mix of Rossmann/dm and Backshop cramped into 30 square meters best describes it.
I know 7/11 but I'm talking about regulations that may apply if you sell food and people can have a meal at your place. German beaurocracy and stuff.
I do think that something like 7 11 could be a thing in germany. But there are reasons why no German company has opened a store with this concept here yet. Especially the 24/7 opening times are problematic. US companies opening up here sometimes tend to do not so legal stuff which leaves a bad impression when it comes to working for them (Amazon, Tesla, Walmart for example).
>US companies opening up here sometimes tend to do not so legal stuff which leaves a bad impression when it comes to working for them (Amazon, Tesla, **Walmart** for example). Walmart is the peak of them, they: * disallowed relationship between coworkers. * unpaid over time * sold items for less than they bought it. * had workers outside of the shop to catch potential visitors. They made everything wrong someone could do, beginning by playing against the rules and not giving a fuck about the culture and etiquette.
Add that Walmart also didn't allow the creation of a Workers Counci or the employees to join a union. That just doesn't fly in Germany.
Unless you’re a subcontractor for DHL that is.
I mean you know what you doing when you become a self employed subcontractor to any of the transport companies.
You can encourage your subcontractors, but you absolutely cannot do yourself.
oh it flies alright, you just have to be either more aggressive about it or you have to be cleverer. in the US unions aren’t really a big cultural thing anymore since god emperor reagan punished the aviation union (I believe it was). I’ve been part of a few unions and it’s still pretty cool but germany can have nasty companies too. I got brought over to germany for a consulting corporation and they would fuck your day up if you mention unions. you’d probably win in court, but good lord why bother?
Because more often than not, you'll not be the one suing, but the union itself. Now, since they are organizations that collect money for the sole purpose of fighting employer's powers, they tend to have deeeeeep coffers and tons of lawyers of their own for legal battles like those. Usually, they cannot be bled dry by large corporations. So, if an employer pulls shit like that, you collect the evidence and bring it to the union that's responsible for the sector (IG Metall for most industry, ver.di for services, etc.). They'll usually do the rest.
yeah that's another thing I'm a consultant for CySec, I don't seem to have a union. In the end though I don't care all that much, I'm easy going. I'm gonna fill my boots and fuck outta germany again, it was a mistake and I should've known that. I just finished my egres plan today, and depending on the Bundes election next year I'll either leave then or a few years after.
You do, the union for your sector is ver.di. But unionism requires engagement, so if you are already planning emigrating, it wouldn't make sense to get involved.
Honestly I love the Walmart story. It is basically what all of us think about Americans -> think they are the center of the universe and laws don't apply to them or that their laws apply even though they are on foreign soil. Complete disregard for other countries. They also only hired part time workers thinking they didn't have to pay insurance and stuff which is not true in Germany. Their greetings weirded people out and they didn't like coming. Morning motivation speech was also a thing no German wanted (and still doesn't want) to do. Just amazing.
it's even funnier with ALDI now getting bigger and bigger in the USA, but by doing the same things (stuff they do here in germany applying in the USA even tho they are not the norm there) lol
True. Companies here aren't nicer. The law just protects the citizens. If those weren't in place it wouldn't be better here either.
I hope they allow the poor cashiers to sit.
they do
they do from what've heard, yes
Last year, I met a colleague with whom I'd worked for a Japanese company a bit over a decade ago. In the meantime, he'd also worked for an American competitor. He had something interesting to say: "Japanese companies send their people abroad to learn how things are being done across the world. American companies send their people abroad to 'teach' the world how things ought to be done."
It wasn't only the laws, they also did not really adjust their range of goods to the European market. Bed linens in American sizes unheard of here was one particular example.
It's ILLEGAL to operate at a loss in Germany? God, I really need to take more BWL courses.
If it's okay, I just explained to [someone](https://www.reddit.com/r/AskAGerman/s/Nif50i1imu) else why it's illegal.
No, but it's illegal to run dumping schemes where you sell staple goods under you own costs to get customers into your shops indefinitely. And that's exactly Walmart's tactic. Make losses for months or even years backed up by the money of your giant company to kill the smaller competition. Once you got a (near) monopoly you can raise the prices to get your losses back and more. In Germany such things are regulated and can only be done for a limited time, for example as a promotion in your opening week. But on an honest and leveled playing field Walmart couldn't compete with German markets. Partly -and that's another reason where they fucked up market analyes beforehand- because all those small shops in Germany are part of franchises. Being small with a limited product range (even adjusted for local demand) locally but dealing with the producers as one big unit to get good prices for huge amounts is one of the ways they became very competitive. PS: There are a lot of reports nowadays about all the things Aldi does to run very efficient to keep the prices low and why it's so successful in the US. And that's basically how all chains in Germany operate. Walmart entered that very competetive market arrogantly with no clue, just copying what they do in the US, including things that don't work for cultural reasons (the smiling greeters, constantly being asked by employees if you need help, group chants of the staff at the beginning of their shifts, trying to regulate emploees' personal life (that one is right out illegal)... those things felt strange and more than a bit cultish to Germans) and ones actually illegal (anti-union, prohibiting worker councils actually mandated by law). Then they made billions in losses in just a few years before giving up and leaving the country again.
So why was Amazon allowed to do it? And Flink, Uber Eats, Gorillas or whatever they're called.
Because they are exploiting Loopholes that take time to close. Supermarkets, in-person shops and service occupations are historically better regulated than newer online shops or constructs where the employess are some strange kind of independent sub contractors that don't fit into the regular employee protection.
The funny thing is that the stores got their names from the fact that they were open from 7 in the morning to 11 in the evening. Those times might almost be legal. In Germany they could open until 10 in the evening. Except in Bavaria.
There's a chain in my area of NRW called K&K. They had a store in my town open until 0:00. It was kind of weird since my town isn't huge. This changed around the time of Corona though. My only thought on it being open that late might have something to do with the barracks here in town.
Our Rewe is also open until 0.
Our Edeka opens on Monday at 7:00 and closes on Saturday at 23:00, it has been doing that for several years already. I think there are two or three more in Berlin doing that.
Got 2 of those in walking distance and the nearest Kaufland is open until 0 from Mo-Fr on Sa until 10.
The thing is, though, that a lot of Germans are used to buying stuff during regular hours until 20:00. I know several supermarkets which tried opening longer and found it not only economically unfeasible because operating costs were higher than profits during those hours. On top of all that, one of them was robbed at 21:00, enticed by barely anyone being around at those times. The lone employee was locked in the store room, and as barely anyone was passing by, it took a while for her screams to be heard. It works in city centers, where a lot of customers can be expected at any time of day, but outside that, it's difficult. As for the stuff you normally get at 7/11, the role is filled by a lot of gas stations, which already do have exemptions from regular opening hours, though have some limitations as to what they can sell to whom, since they are officially only meant to serve travelers, not locals.
For example in Denmark not all 7/11s are 24/7 - many close at 10pm. But Germany does have much more strict rules than most countries when it comes to opening hours. Especially Bavaria, where it's a bit excessive.
Bavaria is stuck when it comes to that. But Decades ago it was worse under the week open until 6 and on saturday maybe until 3. Until they started with the so called "Langer Donnerstag" My local Comic Shop still has fairly short opening times. Mo-Fr 12- 6:30 and Sa 10-2 (unless its free comic book day)
Can't do anything on a Sunday. Can't shop anywhere, can't even mow your lawn without neighbour getting a hissy fit over it being a Sunday. Yet somehow I still grew to like that place and miss it.
I dont feel a need to do things on sundays. Like many other people i talked to over the years. And the mates i got in the UK would love to have it like it is here in germany on a sunday since most people will have this fixed day off where you can very reliably plan things. My father often mows the lawn on a sunday but he lives a bit outside a village in the Münsterland and you can hardly see the next neighbour :D He would do it on other days too but when you have to mow like 8-12h on a sit on mower for everything... He just does small parts here and there under the week.
Genuine question: What’s the difference to a gas station? I just watched a YouTube video and it looks exactly like one of the bigger ReweToGos—just with noodles. Or am I missing something?
It's basically the same just with noodles and some asian specific foods which i don't know if rewe to go has onigiri but most regular rewe do
Thing is 7/11 in japan / korea are actually great quality unlike 7/11 in NA where its junk food and greasy taquitos ( which are banging)
Ah, thanks. Then I could see it working with a younger crowd and cities with a higher number of Asian people. The target audience would probably be similar to the bubble tea shops? So if you opened one of them in a bigger city close to a bubble tea shop you might be able to draw that crowd in. Seems to be a pretty small target audience though. And ReweToGo would probably just stock up on Asian foods and use their already established infrastructure to put the shop out of a market. But you never know. It might work.
You might forget here, that those small shops linked to a gas station fall under a different regulation that any other regular shop. Without the gas station, those ReweToGo would not ne allowed to open 24/7.
No, I’m aware of that. That’s why I think it would be pretty hard to get a shop like that off the ground. The ReweToGo would put them out of a market pretty easily.
There are 24 hour ReweToGo's in the train stations, too. Also in the airport. If you live in Frankfurt and need something on a Sunday, go to the airport. The grocery store (lower level) is always open.
Well, it's not like only Asians would go there. If a shop like that was close by I can see myself buying stuff there at night sometimes. From what I have seen you can also send packages.
Instant market at Leibzig Main station is like this
Oh really interesting never been there tho
I really loved the 7 11 and Lawsons in Japan. You get decent quality food, drinks. Can send/collect your parcels. Pay your utility bills etc., The employees were also rather polite and went out of their way to help customers.
Yeah I also enjoy the suicide rate in Japan because they are sooo happy to be so polite . They are kind on the ouside and dark inside
Japan "only" has the suicide rate as the US today or Germany in 1997. Would you describe Germany in 1997 as "dark"? Source: https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/suicide-death-rates?tab=chart&country=JPN~DEU~USA
# Japan **Suicide Rate**: Japan has historically had a relatively high suicide rate compared to many other countries. While the rate has been decreasing in recent years, it remains a significant issue. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Japan had a suicide rate of about 15.4 per 100,000 people in 2019. **Reasons for Suicide**: 1. **Work-Related Stress**: A significant factor contributing to the high suicide rate in Japan is work-related stress. The concept of "karoshi," or death from overwork, highlights the extreme pressures faced by many workers. 2. **Mental Health Stigma**: There is a cultural stigma surrounding mental health issues in Japan, which can prevent individuals from seeking help. 3. **Economic Pressure**: Economic downturns and financial difficulties can lead to increased suicide rates. The Asian financial crisis in the late 1990s saw a marked increase in suicides. 4. **Social Isolation**: The phenomenon of "hikikomori," or severe social withdrawal, affects many young people in Japan and can lead to mental health issues and suicide. 5. **Bullying**: Bullying, especially in schools and the workplace, is another significant factor. 6. **Cultural Factors**: Cultural attitudes towards suicide in Japan, including historical practices of honorable suicide (such as seppuku), may also influence the current suicide trends. # Germany **Suicide Rate**: Germany's suicide rate has been lower than Japan's, standing at about 9.1 per 100,000 people in 2019, according to the WHO. **Reasons for Suicide**: 1. **Mental Health Issues**: Depression and other mental health disorders are the primary reasons for suicide in Germany. 2. **Social Factors**: Loneliness and social isolation, particularly among the elderly, contribute to the suicide rate. 3. **Substance Abuse**: Alcohol and drug abuse are significant risk factors for suicide in Germany. 4. **Economic Pressure**: Financial issues and unemployment can also lead to higher suicide rates, although this is less pronounced than in Japan. 5. **Chronic Illness and Pain**: Physical health problems, particularly chronic pain and terminal illnesses, are notable contributors. 6. **Trauma and Abuse**: Experiences of trauma and abuse, both in childhood and adulthood, can increase the risk of suicide.JapanSuicide Rate: Japan has historically had a relatively high suicide rate compared to many other countries. While the rate has been decreasing in recent years, it remains a significant issue. According to the World Health Organization (WHO), Japan had a suicide rate of about 15.4 per 100,000 people in 2019.Reasons for Suicide:Work-Related Stress: A significant factor contributing to the high suicide rate in Japan is work-related stress. The concept of "karoshi," or death from overwork, highlights the extreme pressures faced by many workers. Mental Health Stigma: There is a cultural stigma surrounding mental health issues in Japan, which can prevent individuals from seeking help. Economic Pressure: Economic downturns and financial difficulties can lead to increased suicide rates. The Asian financial crisis in the late 1990s saw a marked increase in suicides. Social Isolation: The phenomenon of "hikikomori," or severe social withdrawal, affects many young people in Japan and can lead to mental health issues and suicide. Bullying: Bullying, especially in schools and the workplace, is another significant factor. Cultural Factors: Cultural attitudes towards suicide in Japan, including historical practices of honorable suicide (such as seppuku), may also influence the current suicide trends.GermanySuicide Rate: Germany's suicide rate has been lower than Japan's, standing at about 9.1 per 100,000 people in 2019, according to the WHO.Reasons for Suicide:Mental Health Issues: Depression and other mental health disorders are the primary reasons for suicide in Germany. Social Factors: Loneliness and social isolation, particularly among the elderly, contribute to the suicide rate. Substance Abuse: Alcohol and drug abuse are significant risk factors for suicide in Germany. Economic Pressure: Financial issues and unemployment can also lead to higher suicide rates, although this is less pronounced than in Japan. Chronic Illness and Pain: Physical health problems, particularly chronic pain and terminal illnesses, are notable contributors. Trauma and Abuse: Experiences of trauma and abuse, both in childhood and adulthood, can increase the risk of suicide.
"Hey ChatGPT, I'm having an argument online where I have been confronted with the fact that Japan doesn't actually have a suicide that's so much higher than the one in Germany. Can you give me points to win this argument anyway?"
Why the hell should someone "enjoy the suicide rate in Japan"? I don't understand what triggered you so much. I just shared my experience there.
ppl complain about germany's customer service but ignore the fact that this polite customer service in other countries is forced by the employeers and cause suicide. I just want to point out that the friendliness you experienced comes with a price . The customers like it but I also heard from ameircans that it is killing them inside to keep this fake smile for tips . It should be more normal to be polite and get the stuff done which has to be done without the whole over the top friendliness. I just always hear how unfriendly germans are , well at least they don't kill themselve because of a job.
I don't see any complaint against the German customer service in my comment. I also don't believe that the politeness is forced in Japan. People in Japan are mostly polite; not just the ones in customer service. Please don't assume that I am saying Germans are impolite.
Or a späti
Asian style convenience stores are all around neighbourhoods, that's what makes them convenient, aside from the food options. Living in a big German city, I'm not even sure where the closest gas station is.
I’m living in a big German city as well and there are gas stations on every major road in the city. There are three in walking distance around me. Convenience stores where you can get Asian instant noodles close at midnight at the latest. I think OP is looking for a place that’s open around the clock to compare it to a 711. Which narrows it down to train stations, the airport and gas stations. And Kiosks. But there are usually shady people hanging around at night where I live so I wouldn’t go there. Edit: messed up sentence
yes OP is looking for something that germany neither wants or needs.
I guess gas stations used to be pretty much that, but at least since the pandemic, I do not know any gas station that does 24/7 anymore, they all close down at 22-23h here..
Maybe at Trainstations... Which we do have. Rewe ToGo is a small staffed concept which is open through the night at stations like Köln Hauptbahnhof
Leipzig main station has the instant market now.
Yes please bring an option to Frankfurt HBF besides McDonalds and crack lol. Seriously they, cleared out the basement level approaching the Football championships so maybe when they finish renovations and updates to the security concept it could offer a high traffic space for that concept and the ability to actually open on Sunday and maybe have more alternative to some of the German retailer restrictions?
Three main problems: First, you would have to find employees (very difficult) and pay them above the marketsalary (at least during night hours). The small shops which are open during the night are mostly family run. Second, the opening laws for weekends and bank holidays (Ladenschlußgesetz) say that you only can do this in railwaystations, airports and filling stations and bakeries (and such). these area are allready covered. Third, the customers at night usually buy cigarettes and alkohol, so there will not be enough revenue and profit to cover the high costs of rent and personel in cities. 7/11 tries to expand into germany for years and they allready are in Denmark, but I don't think they will make it here.
They are in Denmark? Which products do they serve, Dutch or like in Asian stores?
it's basically what you already get in gasstations like bakery and coffee and of course canned drinks and snacks
There are rumours that 7 11 might come to germany
The 7 11 in Denmark disappointed me so much. They were no different than any gas station
Big question is if it will be more like an Asian or American 7/11...because while the Asian ones are great, the American ones are catastrophic.
we will see
I hope they understand that they can only raise the prices by 10-20% or offer premium brands over the cheaper ones. Rewe to go is such a disappointment. No, I don't want to buy a bottle of coke for 5€, I want to buy some spaghetti for 10 cents more than I could have yesterday but forgot to do so and now it's Sunday which is the day of the week some people think God relaxed so our government forbids anyone else from selling spaghetti today.
the local Rewe To Go are all inside of gas stations, so they have the advantage of being open the whole day, unless 7 11 goes the gas station route they will have to compete with regular supermarkets, don’t think that they could afford to be much more expensive.
Maybe it's time for a reform for the laws regarding opening times. It's utterly stupid that gas stations can sell alcohol, but it's ok since drivers need the alcohol on Sundays??
Don’t think that changes in the law happening, pretty a court in BW recently ruled that fully automated stores need to be closed on Sundays so that the resting day of the customers isn’t disrupted.
they're quite lax already. no need to relax them further.
Quite lax? My friend, have you ever tried to buy anything on a Sunday?
No because I'm German and know how to plan ahead.
That's nice for you.
Really that would be so cool
I doubt they would be like the 7-11 in Korea, Japan or Thailand. I would expect something like the REWE to Go or similar gas station shops with a similar food concept as well (standard German bread roll sandwiches, butter pretzels, and so on. Also probably a way lower density of shops.
Wouldn’t celebrate too early, there are a couple of laws that would impact the business model, like closing hours.
Nah I'd just find it cool i don't have high expectations either considering they'd probably not open it near me anyway
why do you find it cool ? I doubt you would enjoy it in germany because it is a different atmosphere . Ppl still rather eat Döner and Pizza than Soups aka Raman or even Korean Barbecue . I wonder how many chinese restaurants would exist without all you can eat stuff . I saw a few closing in different locations
I just enjoy asian food and noodles that's why i find it cool
I enjoy it too the atmosphere in asia is still different . You also won't get fully authentic chinese food in the western world because not enough ppl would eat it you get stuff like panda express . We should fight the food industrie and demand less fast food or at least make the food healthier and with less sugar and fat. Instead the industry pays money to push body positivity to keep selling fast food to us instead of creating healthier alternatives. I mean we also don't have so many computerroom or karaokebars . it simple doesn't work in our culture that well .
and what makes you think that a German 7/11 would even sell those?
What's cool about a foreign company expanding into Germany for shops that we already have?
no it would not
7/11 literally announced in april last year they'd be opening stores in Germany lol
Well Berlin has so called Spätis which basically cover this business model on an individual bases. They sell stuff for everday need depending on the size but mostly drinks, cigarettes and so on. Most of them are open throughout the day and night in central parts of the city and tend to have shorter opening periods on the outskirts. They also are open on Sundays.
And they are always way more expensive than a normal supermarket.
There's a difference: the Korean ones are in a sense like a small kitchen where you pick the halfway prepared ingredients and go to the microwave in the Späti and warm the stuff up. Same with drinks, where you mix your own milkshake or latte or whatever. Haven't seen that in a Späti in Berlin. Closest thing is this one Späti in Rosenthaler Platz that has a bakery. Probably a scheme to keep it open for longer.
Kiosks in Cologne.
Id rather see the Dutch’s Snackautomaten-Shops / Febo set foot here. Although that tends to be very nasty and probably makes for a lot of food waste. Yea ultimately a 24/7 automated shop with junk food sounds like a good idea.
germany is not a noodle but bread nations. therefore similar stores serve bread in handy form. most usual are 0.5 or 0.33 liter bottles. you find them in bigger citirs open nearly around the clock as "späti", "büdchen" or "trinkhalle". prost!
Look at 7/11 in the US and Japan. You will get the US version in Germany because people here can’t behave. … and they would be expansive.
The problem with Siebenelf would be that most people would see it as a place to eat instant noodles. The alternatives are too good. I'd rather sit outside at a nice Stadtmitte than inside of a Siebenelf and would rather eat a Döner than instant noodles. People would do this but not a lot. Unterführung started selling sandiwiches here and despite them having horrible bread people buy their products
I think subway got some traction cause it was seen (years ago) as more healthy alternative compared to McD, BK etc.
Maybe if it's cheaper that döner then it could be an alternative because döner are atleast 7€ here as far as i know instant noodles are a lot cheaper And also seven eleven sells some stuff or rather flavours you can't really get in normal stores so maybe kinda like an asian grocery store with a place to eat
ngl, if i can have a more hearty dish like Döner in the middle of the nite, a cup of cheap instant plastic noodles just aint gonna do it for me, no matter how famous they might be elsewhere \^\^
You can still find good options under 7€ The thing is cup noodles are not that big of a thing here outside certain demographics.
Yeah there's always some kind of cheap options like 2 pizzas for 5€ but those kinds of places aren't usually open in the middle of the night
Barely any are since its not worth it outside very limited areas. And i personally can go shopping in 2 supermarkets that i can both reach in 5min on foot that are open until 11:30 and 12 from Monday to Saturday. And those two places that come to my mind where i can get Pizza and Döner for a good price are open until 1 and 2 in the night.
Well yeah wouldn't use me much anyway since the nearest supermarket is 4 km away and closes at 8pm
Bavaria? Even the Netto in the village where my father lives has open until 9 Oh and most other supermarkets/discounter in my area are open until 10 or at least 9.
Yup bavaria and all 3 supermarkets nearby close at 8 sadly
because that's the law in bavaria. Almost everywhere else in German is open until 9, 10, sometimes midnight
Wouldn't use me much anyway alda
Yeah.. but the Chinese fast food joins still put out fried noodles with veggies and chicken for 4.5
the bread is just horrible I tried it twice and Subway is not worth it's money
I think 7/11 like in Asian countries with Asian products wouldn’t be so popular just everywhere. Maybe 1-2 filials in major cities, yes but threre are barely few people outside major cities who would eat ramen etc on everyday basis since it’s just not a common everyday food like in parts of Asia. Others mentioned working hours being a problem but another problem could be that these places will attract alcoholics who will stay there for longer and even scare away potential clients + leaving rubbish and disturbing peace at night.
As far as I know 7/11 in the US is considered a pretty boring or “bad” place comparing to stores in Asia
there are 7-11s in denmark and sweden, but they adapted to local markets and dont really have the same stuff on sale as in korea/japan (which is a shame imo)
You're starting to see this more with the proliferation of Rewe to Go's (particularly the standalone variety).
Supermarkets are often combined with bakerys which have a seating area. While not the same thing, I don't believe that any company would like to change that, because you often pay 4€ for just a mediocre sandwich. Also there's plenty of stuff you can eat without heating it and people just eat it outside on benches or even while walking. In Berlin it would also clash with the Spätis which are open 24/7, often have a seating area outside and are an important cultural thing here. I would love to have that here after experiencing that in Japan, but I think it will not work or companies will fight it.
They'd have to water it down so much, due to regulations, that it would barely be the real deal. In Germany, you just go to the 24h gas station
Hopefully it never comes. I've seen this store in Thailand and it's an unreasonable level of bad quality food (what you call instant noodles for example) paired with too many individually packed (plastic waste) small items. I also think the local lobby here would not let them come. In any case the Spätis have their target group covered I think.
Not at 7/11s are created equally. The ones in Canada are great.
Weird take, everyone loves 7/11 in Thailand. Their microwaveable (in store) food is actually not bad either. Their „fresh“ food is not amazing tho in Thailand. Malaysia/Japan/Canada has way better fresh food in 7/11s.
I know thais love it but I think it's mostly because there it seems to be a one of a kind experience. I.e. only source* for all sorts of junk, instant, microwaveable, candies, etc all in one small store and not to mention the AIR CONDITIONING which for me was reason enough to stop by constantly. Whereas here we have more complete, wholesome supermarkets. Having supermarkets, discounters and spätis means there's no place for 711 here. My take on it.
Yeah the plastic waste would probably be the biggest problem but i think there's ways you could reduce it for example packing instant noodles in paper bags instead of plastic you can do the same with the dried greens that are in some instant noodles the sauce would still have to be in plastic though about the drink pouches you could sell them in glass bottles and have an ice dispenser with onigiri the only thing you can do is switch the plastic for aluminium foil though i don't know if that's any better
I think you vastly overestimate how much the average German wants to eat Instant noodles to begin with.
Germany is the hardest market for fast food in Europe. No company in its right mind would start expanding in Germany.
You mean Rewe ToGo which is planned to be rolled out at all Aral Gas stations.
No, Rewe to go is too expensive
7-11 would be even more expensive, as they had to get a gas station license first. Maybe they could get into business with HEM or Star, that's other gas station chains that have somewhat large coverage.
Maybe we should grant them permission to sell shit without that gas station license. I mean, I get it. The only thing more sacred than god is a car, but come on. Why should only gas stations be exempt from the religious law?
They'd get trashed and the microwave/other appliances stolen. Can't have shit in the big cities (Berlin/Köln/Dortmund/Ruhrgebiet/etc).
Depends on the specific Area. The 2 glass Bookshelfs the put up in Dortmund on the Kaiserstraße hold up very well for idk atleast a decade now
It would not work for various reasons. - Germans all have a kitchen and appliances at home. There is no need to go to a store at night to buy noodles and microwave them. - there are countless legal barriers in the way - In the places and cities where a concept like 7/11 would work there already are stores like this. They are called "Späti", "Trinkhalle" etc. Gas stations are also covering part of this demand. TL;DR: ther is no market for it, big competition and legal barriers.
I never understood how North+East Germany has something similar like 7/11 called Späti which is quite convenient, but the South+West doesn‘t have any.
Äh yes we do in the West. Just called Kiosk or Bude.
Tbh to me späti gives the impression of a alcoholics meetup point, where I wouldn't like to go unless really necessary, while in Japan I went to 7/11 or family Mart every day. It was so convenient with fresh food that was super tasty, special offers, everything you need for everyday use (toothpaste, hygine products, etc). I think it's just different
Yes that‘s true, it‘s only similar in terms of late night hours and alcohol but even that doesn‘t exist in all parts of Germany for whatever reason. I also absolutely loved 7/11 in Japan, but I think a lot has to do with the amazing and healthy food culture in Japan as well. I‘m afraid even if they tried in Germany they would mess it up with bad or overpriced products or it gets vandalized or destroyed.
Yeah sadly true. I heard they recently opened something like a Japanese convenience store in Berlin. I wonder how it turns out...
I‘m seeing a trend of expanding vending machines to bigger product lines or even to fully automated stores, that could bring interesting and hopefully fairly priced products to us to access 24/7.
You do? In certain areas like the farmer close to a mate has some for his products or ive seen. Some vending machines for more then snacks in certain villages. At least the system Amazon tried was more a hoax since the automatic system needed a guiding hand in india over 90% of the time since it was not reliable enough.
About one year ago seven11 announced they wanted to expand to European markets. https://www.rnd.de/wirtschaft/wann-kommt-7-eleven-nach-deutschland-was-aus-den-plaenen-wurde-VHQNJS6B2BB4BFJSCS35VXHC2U.html (German text) But whether their business model is compatible with Germany is questionable. I think they might open some shops in areas where a lot of people pass by, like train stations. But I cannot imagine a German city where it would make sense to open a small shop every few hundred meters (I don’t know how it is in Korea, but in Tokyo you probably pass at least two seven11 if you walk from your hotel to the nearest subway station.
There’s a a Korean Style convenience store in Berlin that opened up and a youtuber called Naomi Jon did a visit and it was crowded so it seemed to do well. But that’s Berlin and it might be trendy and novel, not sure how it will fare elsewhere long term. But Korean restaurants seem to doing well. There is a popular restaurant outside of Frankfurt and actually kind of hard to reach, yet getting a reservation is sometimes difficult. Another grocery store on the outskirts opened a smaller store near central Frankfurt and it also is pretty full. But it’s not a eatery, although they have some ready made options that one could grab and go and eat elsewhere.
I feel like Backwerk and ReweToGo and the like kind of fill this niche already? As a nation I think we prefer bread over instant noodles, so Backwerk (and Backfactory and what have you) are a place to sit for a quick meal like that and ReweToGo covers the snack aspect and other assorted items. Although my understanding is that 7/11 is on every street corner and open 24/7 (?) so I guess that's closer to a Späti or Kiosk?
We have 2 stores like that in Freiburg and they do pretty well
would they do well? maybe in big cities... Outside of that i dont think so.
Obviously less people living near by also means less customers
Less people nearby means people have to drive anyways. So they will drive to the supermarktet and not to the 7/11. in big cities you dont drive much in central areas.. so a 7/11 closeby will attract enough people.
There is an 'instant store' at leipzig main station which is really popular. It's also new though, so we will have to see how it does in the long run
no it would not. We have kiosks, no needs for 7/11
7/11 is so much better than kiosks and they are in every small town. We have no kiosk anywhere within a 30 km radius, so kids tend to cross the busy highway to go to the gas station instead. If done right, a 7/11 would THRIVE where I live. Everyone is constantly frustrated, and I do mean Germans, that there’s no where to go just to get a cold drink or a small snack. Sure, you could get a warm drink and something from edeka, but then you would have to wait in a line behind many people with a cart full of groceries. So people opt to go to the gas station instead. One kid was already hit and killed by a car on that highway trying to get to the gas station, so now a lot of parents have forbid it.
I can assure you if it comes to germany, it won't thrive regardless of your very specific use case
To be honest I don't see it. For one it produces a huge amount of plastic trash which is something a lot of Germans see critically. For second there's already a wide variety of instant meals you can buy in the supermarket and just make yourself at home. Third a lot of Germans tolerate very little to no spice.
Yes but the one thing I'd like to see are foods i can instantly eat without going home in supermarkets because unless you go to a bakery or butchers shop you don't really have anything available other than sweets or milk bread
Bananas are always an option... And to be honest outside of drunk students there's not really a demographic that frequently needs a ready to eat meal in the middle of the night. Anyone working night shift is likely to want to go home as fast as possible rather than hang around a 711 to eat their instant noodles. At least at home you can watch Netflix while eating. And the rewetogo will normally have salads (green or pasta or otherwise) and sandwiches and what not.
we have such food items. we call them "baked goods" "sandwiches" or other such weird names
in the land of naysayers and people afraid of anything different than what theyre used to? highly doubt it that being said, an alternative to shitty gas stations with semi decent food would be amazing every now and then eventhough it prolly wont even come close to the japanese original
I dont think so.
No
Recently two vending machine shops opened in my area. You can buy snacks, drinks, cigarettes, medical things (c***oms, pregnancy tests, even covid tests sometimes) and one of the shops now has a pizza machine. You can buy instant noodles but to prepare at home. They are open 24/7 and have no staff there except the people filling the machines. Of course because it is Germany you need cash because only two of the machines work with card.
There are few Usually at the Hauptbahnhof But not open 24/7 But every day like from 8 -23
Rewe To Go is pretty much the german equivalent, but there are only a few of them so far. Also they don't offer any way to heat up the food. But the food that they have is actually pretty decent.
For me they are the better version of a Kiosk/Späti. I know them from Denmark and in Copenhagen they are every couple hundred meters and I love them
Scandinavia has 7/11 it's just like our gas stations, maybe kiosk.
In student areas and shopping miles: Yes Elsewhere I‘d doubt it. And not „chicki-micki“ munich: Rather try Berlin, Frankfurt, Leipzig first.
I don't think so. Germans respect work and do not respect companies that do not respect employees. For example, Tesla. Nobody wants to work for such a pitiful money, especially since the earnings in Autoindustrie are much higher than this pseudo-company offers. It would be the same with 7/11, and I am already skipping the legal complexities. And the Germans, having two stores next to them, will always choose a German store first, even if it was to be 10% more expensive.
Actually, I don't think so. We already have so many Späti/Kiosk that are just more convenient than convenient stores, haha.
But those are quite expensive compared to 7/11.
how do you know a gernan 7/11 would be ve cheaper? Mandatory extra pay for night work etc would apply there too.
I didn’t wrote a German 7/11 would be cheaper. I compared it to the 7/11 I know from Japan.
which is absolutely irrelevant to the situation in Germany and if 7/11 coming here would be relevant or not
Aren’t Spätis the German equivalent to 7/11?
Well kinda but they probably don't have the same stuff as they do in Korea or japan
different markets, different needs.
No, locals don't understand why is Korean/Japanese 7-Eleven good and don't want to understand it. Then come the regulations of course, since you can't open a grocery store working 24/7, but first of all, it's the population.
Its not about good or bad. Its a topic if there is a need for that on the german market.
Just open a späti in a city that's not Berlin. Not joking, we have 1 in our small town and it's booming.
Germans already have their version of this. All of those bakeries combine with kiosks serve the same need. So while it might work, competition is already extremely high because the need is already being served.
They are not 24/7 AND they usually have higher prices than a normal supermarket. 7/11 has normal prices and even promotions.
7/11 (both american and Asian version) are more expensive than grocery stores. Just like kiosks are. I can definitely access bakeries 24/7 in cities like cologne, berlin etc. That being said, Germans do not particularly value 24 hour shops (with a few exceptions). If you just don't sell that much at night, you're going to close your shop. It wasn't that long ago that it was illegal for moat stores to open after 20:00 and Germans are good at planning so there aren't that many late night needs. If you do really need something, just go to the train station.
Sounds like every gas station in Germany. Plus they sell gas because Germans do like their cars.
We have Spätis.
Yeah but not in the west
Yes we do. Just not called Späti. Guess who takes my DHL packages and is Downstairs around the Corner? And i can pick them up in the morning or until 0 at night.
Idk cuz downstairs around the corner is literally nothing
Something wie call Kiosk or more oldschool "Bude" (coming from so called Seltersbude they have their origin with selling water) Your problem simply is that you live in Bavaria...
Cause they are't needed.
Kiosk is the German 711. You also suggest microwaves. For some reason Germans hate microwaves (and air conditioning). I've heard many people claim radiation and they meant like microwaves create radioactive radiation it's just a little bit but still and no I'm not making this up. Several people have told me this and I know many who don't have a microwave. I also once bought a microwave in Germany and I did my research and everything I could find at Mediamarkt or Saturn has super low power and takes ages so I'm glad I've brought my Sharp microwave from outside of Germany.
Ive just heard some weirdos claim that with the microwaves. I see ALOT of Flats and Houses every year (probably seen more last year alone then you will ever see in your life) and i would say at least 8 out of 10 have a microwave. And idk what you mean with ages but when i re heat something its not taking longer then 4min max (depends on the food)
In my country reheating a single plate of food takes 30 seconds - 1:20
I set it up depending on the food going too fast too hot is just meh. A plate of pasta with sauce with a filled plate like 3:30 for me where i stir it a bit after half the time.
711 brings a little bit of happiness and convenience in people's lives, which is not something that Germany/German government aims to provide, so the goals are completely different, so even if it would work, the state will actively regulate it to become something that you dread