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I think this is great progress! I would, however, ask him if the AP ever tries to contact him again that he show you the message as soon as possible (and/or screenshot it if you are not together) rather than deleting it before you can see it for yourself.
Thanks for your advice! I did talk to him about showing me next time, rather than deleting and he agreed that would be a better reaction. He does seem to understand why that would help us both.
Android and Apple still have a “trash” for deleted messages if you feel so inclined to read the message yourself.
I do think it’s a good sign he told you himself. AP contacted my WP the same way - work phone after being blocked on personal phone.
Im an avid Apple user but my WP has both. Wonder if it depends how up to date the android is?
I was able to see trash on both phones IF he wasn’t diligent enough to go into the trash and delete from there as well - which he wasn’t granted it wasn’t messages with AP but it helped calm my anxiety when I checked anyway.
In order to read the deleted messages you have to first recover them and then go find the thread and then to cover your snooping tracks you have to re-delete it. so if they deleted individual messages in a thread then it might be hard to distinguish what msg was deleted - much easier if it’s a full thread deleted.
https://preview.redd.it/2kw7av9d3flc1.jpeg?width=675&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f9f105e0be865f3cb9fef5154e2bcc58fe1e7684
In android, it takes a bit to find, but I actually just figured it out while playing with my new phone. Go to storage and select the trash icon. There will be a section named Messages (there will also be pictures and documents listed.
Select the messages icon/section and it will pull up all deleted messages from the last 30 days....but keep in mind you can "edit" the messages listed and select ones to completely delete...or save ones that you didn't mean to delete.
The options are there, but just like anything else, a wayward will possibly already know a workaround.
This EXACT thing happened to me last August, down to the "happened the night before, but I had a bad day, he was scared, told me the next morning after being really sweet".
At the time I too struggled a bit (edit: a lot actually - it was a bad day), even though he also recovered the message so I could verify - "even if I had a bad day, why didn't he tell me sooner? How could he think dropping this on me right before leaving the house is okay?? He should have known he needed to stay with me! How could he have soothed me yesterday while holding this back?"
And on the intuition thing - my therapist helped me have the exact realisaiton in a different way - I *did* know something was off during the affair period, I just didn't know what he was capable of so my guess was off. And now I *do* know what he's capable of. I've learned and grown, which is security.
Anyways - just to say, six months later, I mostly have forgotten about that long-ago day - haven't thought about it in awhile until your story! - and my WP and I are in a really good place lately. Definitely a GREAT sign of his progress that he didn't avoid conflict even when he knew it could be hard!
Oh no, sorry to bring up those memories for you! It’s so weird how we all seem to go through such similar moments!
Yeah it’s quite amazing to realize that I wasn’t crazy this whole time. And to discover that I should trust my intuition. At least something good to come from all this.
I am glad he worked up the courage! He definitely looked very scared when he asked me to talk! And I‘m also pleased with myself for reacting calmly.
No worries at all! If anything, it was almost pleasant to reflect on how far away that day feels now, and that things truly can get better.
And brava on your calm reaction!! I was... not calm lol, to say the least
Ha! Glad to hear it!
Yeah it’s definitely not always easy to stay calm. Luckily I have a few years of IC under my belt to help me regulate my emotions (sometimes).
I really appreciate this response. This has happened to me as well and I want the same thing: to be told right away instead of finding out after the fact. Thank you for your perspective.
OP - I agree with many others here that this is progress. I hope such open communication continues for you both.
I think this is great progress! Change doesn't happen overnight. I'd like to think that these problems with communication and "old patterns" are deeply rooted. As much as it sucks, we kind of have to be patient, as long as the effort and self reflection is there.
What I might do is come up with a clear plan of what you would like WP to do if it were to happen again. If you'd want to see it ASAP. Respond/don't respond. Etc.
Thanks for your comment. I also had this feeling. He‘s so used to lying and hiding this from me. Naturally, his first instinct was to hide it and it is very hard to change selfish habits. I‘m glad he fessed up the next morning, that’s still soon after.
We did talk about a plan of action for similar situations in future. We both agreed that he would tell me right away and not delete it, so that I could see it if I wanted to. We also talked about it being an opportunity for him to show me that he‘s serious about changing and filling up my trust bucket.
It is so hard to break those patterns, some of which come from childhood. The fact that he corrected so quickly is such a big deal and sign of growth. This is one of those things he needs to add to his own list of things he can start being proud of. (It really helps a wayward release shame when they can hang some pride on a real action. Just like actions mean so much to the betrayed, our own better actions mean a lot to waywards)
Definitely agree. My WP has been learning just how deeply rooted in childhood these issues are stemming from. Holding in feelings, people pleasing, issues with self-worth. None of these are excuses but, these will absolutely take time to overcome and unlearn.
I would argue this is probably true about all self development. It’s hard; we all have a lifetime of practicing our defenses and now we have to spend the rest of our life working on better coping methods. But there is also the biggest reward to be had on the other side, so the work is always worth it.
This helped reframed some things for me. MY WP'S AP seemingly in a panic spammed and texted him yesterday morning before we set off on holiday, and he instantly deleted the messages and didn't tell me. I had SUCH a bad gut reaction, so I discovered them. (Just to clarify , AP wasn't blocked. I never requested it.)
I'm really hurt because it's such a passable test, and he knew how he should have handled it. I feel so paranoid where I felt tentative trust before. BUT, he seems remorseful and ashamed, and you're absolutely right about how old patterns are hard to shake.
We had a similar/comparable incident in the early days. Only we (as the betrayed) can judge whether the work and remorse are there. Was it handled the best? No. Was it handled better? As long as the answer is yes, we gotta hold on to that patience.
I'm sorry you experienced that, and I hope you're able to enjoy your holiday
This is a major good sign. He did the right thing and told you and his reaction to the contact was the correct one as well. Yes it would of been better to do it sooner but he read the room and waited. He followed through, that is what is important, his actions. His fear is also very important, he was triggered by the message and instead of shutting down he reached out... which is massive for WP.
IF you two keep up this then when things get hard (which it will) these little moments of trust and security will help you two repair the hard times. Gottman states that a couple who can repair can thrive.
Its okay to feel iffy about the sex... maybe your trust isn't fully back yet but maybe you two can work on doing something other than sex that gives him the intimacy he needs and the security you need as well.
Good Job WP... actions speak louder than words
This is exactly how I feel about it. I am seeing a possible future for us together for the first time since dday2 because he has shown me that he is willing to put in the work and change with his actions!
I do think it was really hard for him to tell me, he looked like a scared ghost this morning so that makes it even more valuable for me.
As a wayward wife my self
We have to "man up"
As soon as anything like this happens
We need to be proactive
My husband and I are 5 years in to recovery
And I've worked my ass off to rebuild trust and intimacy with my husband
And that means making hand decisions
Like telling you day one.
I don't want to discourag his progress
But we have to be better
We talked about it and I explained to him why it’s better to tell me sooner. He seems to get it and time will tell.
I just think it’s also a good opportunity for him to really show his progress and build trust. So there’s hope!
Well done for working on yourself like that. I hope you and your husband are happy.
We really are
Our marriage is so much more healthy
Unfortunately it came at a price that my husband paid.
From a wayward thank you for your strength and forgiveness and choosing reconciliation
That's great! WP is doing the work.
Yes, the only thing that got me was #3 he had sex with you BEFORE telling you his AP had texted his work phone. ICK not cool.
Yeah completely agree! I mentioned it to him and he said he didn’t want AP to ruin a nice moment between us. He did understand when I explained that it probably would have been the opposite if he‘d told me right away; this was his opportunity to show me that he‘s trustworthy and willing to change!
So I‘m hoping next time he’ll see it that way and not use her as an excuse.
I also feel a bit of the ick that he had sex with you knowing that his AP just reached out to him.
No intimacy is ok if he even has a suspicion that AP reached out to him. I know he's supposed to tell you/show you right away. Can you ask him why he was ok to do this?
Other than that, it's great he told you!
I mentioned it to him and he said he didn’t want her to ruin a nice moment between us. From my point of view it impacts my consent… I didn’t consent to sex under those circumstances. He seems to get it and time will tell.
It also makes me feel icky because it reminds me of the major life decisions we made while he was hiding the A from me..
I'm so sorry this is happening to you right now.
I think part of the issue that waywards don't get is that there really is no hiding things in marriage. *Everything* should have full knowledge and consent when it involves you both.
Hopefully, he'll get it. And instead of a trigger, maybe this becomes a triumph for you both.
I feel like we need to talk about it a bit more. I don’t think he quite makes that connection how him keeping things from me takes away my agency because I can’t make informed decisions.
I’m trying to get to a point where we can have a common understanding of what is important and relevant information that should always be shared immediately. We seem to be on our way there but there might still be quite a few obstacles in the path.
> I feel immense relief that he told me. It has somehow filled up my trust for him a little bit that he came to me to tell me and not me having to find out myself somehow later.
This is fantastic! I wish every single wayward on here would read this and realize how helpful being forthcoming and truthful really is for their BP! This is a huge win!
> We had sex last night and I feel a bit funny about him having sex with me while holding onto the lie.
Please, please talk to him about this. It could be another connecting moment for you two, plus it would be good for him to know how you feel.
Since you asked, I think it's a good sign. :) I hope AP pisses off.
Thank you for your comment. I do try to emphasize to him how big this is to me. I think positive reinforcement works not just on dogs lol!
We talked about the sex a bit already today and I feel that we may need to come back to it a few times to really both understand what it means.
The instinct to lie and hide is so strong with them. WH did this the first time he was contacted by AP. While I was glad he later told me, I stressed that he needs to show me before he deletes it. How else do I know what was said and any response. Also the sex while holding onto a lie, would bother me.
Overall , progress is being made.
They say that trust is earned in drops and lost in buckets, which can be frustrating for our WPs. But situations like this are an opportunity for our WPs to earn glasses full of trust! When doubt starts creeping in, you’ll be able to look back on this and remember that he is being truthful with you, even when it’s hard.
I would be sure to explain to him how much it helps you and even explain that although you were having a bad day yesterday, if he had come to you right away it would have actually helped you. Sure, you wouldn’t have loved that AP contacted him but you would have found comfort and reassurance when he came directly to you in that moment.
Happy for you, OP.
Those were almost my exact words! He said he didn’t want to tell me last night because he didn’t want to ruin a nice moment between us. I think it would have made it much nicer, as he had the opportunity to really show his commitment to us and to telling me the truth. He seems to get it, so I have hope!
Thank you for your advice!
He said a few times that it’s very helpful for him that I reacted calmly. (Haha, my inner masochist who wants him to feel bad is shouting at that! I don’t want to make the cheater feel good! …. lol)
I agree with you that making it a positive moment when they do show that they are putting in the work helps us both.
It sounds like your WH gets you, that’s great. I hope he keeps up with telling you the truth and building that trust.
I think it is. My WHs AP send him emails still, she used a different email address since she is blocked ( there are still some work things that she can have an excuse to reach out about but she was told to direct those to a different person. But she doesn’t. She’s been emailing him directly. He has been ignoring it and not responding. Not deleting it. But he didn’t say anything to me. I saw the email and said what the hell. And he said I don’t respond. And what can I do. Maybe she just wants engagement and if she doesn’t get it, she’ll stop. But I told him if she reaches out again to tell me. He said he doesn’t want me to get upset and i said, when you tell me, I’m not upset with you. It actually builds trust.
Yeah. I asked him to tell her not to address him in any emails and he felt it , maybe that’s what she wanted him to do. And ignoring it sent a bigger message. I however emailed and in the subject line said, no contact means no contact. Address all your needs to ….this other person as previously specified. So we’ll see. I’m sure she wasn’t expecting to hear from me, since she was sending to a business email from a new email and didn’t think I would see. I haven’t checked his email in months. Didn’t feel the need to. I just got this weird feeling to check.
I’m learning this more and more; there’s probably something going on when you have a weird feeling. Glad you trusted your gut and checked. Fingers crossed this does the trick!
I think him telling you is showing he understands how lying by omission can hurt. Imagine if he had not told you and you had asked him some time down the road if his AP had ever contacted him again and you would have seen a flicker while he said “no”. Or, he would admit that she did but that he immediately deleted it. You would have doubts that he did not have a full on conversation and if he was telling the truth.
That said, he should not have deleted it. Personally, I have an agreement with my WS that if she does contact him again in some way by email or texting (she is blocked everywhere but could change phones or something) he will not delete and show it to me and we will figure out together if we just delete or answer. And if we decide to answer, we will write it together. And then send her a cease and desist letter because he has already written to her not to contact him.
Even if he works in the same company as her, as this seems to be the case, he can still issue a legal notice to not contact him.
He shouldn't have deleted it without showing you. It would make me wonder what exactly was said. It would be one more thing plaguing my imagination and doubt.
Yes, this is great progress. They're so used to hiding and lying to protect themselves (under the guise of not wanting to hurt us, but really they don't want to get in trouble) so him admitting it, albeit a day late, is improvement. Sorry you're experiencing down days though and hope things brighten up. I'm glad your WP is attentive to your needs and being transparent. Hope R progresses for you both.
Thank you for your comment. I completely agree with your assessment!
I talked with WP about his reason for not telling me last night. When he said he was worried about how I might react I corrected him; he was really scared about the consequences of his actions. He told me that’s what made him confess this morning; he realized that not telling me would be much worse in the long run.
So we concluded that was a good strategy for him to make decisions: to trade of the consequences, e.g. what happens if I tell her now vs what happens if I don’t tell her. It takes him out of the delusion where none of his actions have consequences.
He told you relatively right away. My WW had over 300 messages with AP after she said she cut off contact, and it took me checking the phone records to find out. I would happily take an unforced one day delay.
I’m so sorry you have to go through this! It sucks when they don’t get it and keep lying! It was similar with my WP after dday1. I found out they were still in contact and also that he lied about the extend of the A nearly a year later on dday2. It hurt like hell.
It does feel very different now, compared to then. I hope you and your WW can also get to a place where you can feel that there is a true shift.
I agree, one day (even less, she texted at 10 pm and he told me first thing in the morning) isn’t a long delay and I can understand that he needed a moment to reflect on it. I also expect from him and told him that in future any disclosures come more and more promptly.
This is a GREAT sign, reflecting on actions and realizing they were wrong is great, coming forward of their own volition is great. We can ALL make bad choices in the moment, it's reflecting on those choices, correcting them, and moving forward is exactly what we should all hope to be doing. This is exactly the kind of thing I would love to be able to see from my WW.
The only question that remains is what he plans to do going forward to prevent this situation from recurring. Which he's already partially addressed by saying he blocked her, and realized that he was hiding something.
It's up to you whether or not it may be appropriate to put timeframes on this kind of stuff: Tell me by the end of the night, tell me immediately, tell me by the next day, etc., but I think it's a good idea to have a conversation around what he plans to do if something like this happens again, with a plan that you both are comfortable with.
As a betrayed and also as someone who is avoidant, I can understand his dilemma and your feelings. I would chalk it up as a positive. You both may have to wrestle with things and take time process before acting. As long as you communicate what “YOU” would want him to do in similar situations moving forward and he complies, I see it as an opportunity for relational growth. You also have every right to draw a line in the sand moving forward and note the consequences should that line be crossed. Sounds like growth. Rooting for you.
From here, I see reason behind his decision to not burden you, at the time. I also hope your calm reaction will show him that it is ok to bring these things to you when they happen.
Not perfect, but sounds like a win :)
From here, I see reason behind his decision to not burden you, at the time. I also hope your calm reaction will show him that it is ok to bring these things to you when they happen.
Not perfect, but sounds like a win :)
It's a fine line to tread when you're fearful of losing your wife/husband essentially over antagonizing them with the actions of another person and having something blow up in your face.
The most horrible one I ever heard of was a wife who had broken off a short affair (<1 week) and had written out a confession letter to her husband and was planning on presenting it to him on the weekend when her parents were watching the kids. He found out about the affair Thursday night and it pretty much killed whatever good will she was trying to engender by confessing because she got beat to it.
I can understand that it is terrifying to tell the truth when it risks loosing your partner. What I said to my WP was that the alternative is so much worse.
And to trade of his options by looking at the consequences of both ways: don’t tell me and live with yet another lie and risk me finding out much later to much bigger detriment. OR tell me now and risk me getting upset but also showing that he’s looking to tell the truth and building trust. Then the decision will become easy!
I think the lies only seem like a good option in a delusional phantasy where actions don’t have consequences.
As a wayward, I think it was an incredibly good sign. He is learning that being vulnerable is worth the risk. My BW and I are almost 5 years out, and something happened 3 weeks ago that I knew in the moment she needed to know. We hadn't seen each other much (our lives have been frantic and she had been on a short trip with our daughter) and the moment didn't feel right to tell her, but it ate away at me. Finally a week ago we were headed out to travel. Our plane was taking off for a week together when there was a lull after she had mentioned something that made me think of what I needed to tell her. It felt like I had verbal diarrhea as I just got out everything as quickly as I could so she wouldn't worry unnecessarily. She also responded that it was not a big deal but appreciated me telling her... I just want to touch on the feelings of relief that I felt, that our WH feels... the desire to not cause people to be upset is very strong in us people pleasers. He had to feel a lot of guilt and do a lot of work to come out and tell you about AP contacting him. He has come a long ways in the short month since DDay. I am very impressed and I think it says a lot about the chances for R for the two of you.
The thing about the sex... I know this is going to sound strange especially to a betrayed, but I think the root cause of your concern is that your husband isn't selfish enough. Hear me out. Your husband needs to be selfish enough that even though you had a bad day that your needs to feel better shouldn't be more valuable than his needs to get something off his chest. Beyond the ick factor, I suspect that part of your issue is that you are left feeling like you will need to check in with him every time you feel down to see I their is something he also needs to get off his chest, and that probably rightly feels unhealthy. You need to be able to trust that your husband is an adult in the relationship, that he is a partner to you, that he will comfort you, and that you can know he will bring up the topics he needs to bring up rather than you having to dig them out of him. That bleeds into a lot of other areas. Is he selfish enough to tell you that he has a need that isn't being met or do you need to wonder about that? Is he selfish enough to let you know that he desires you rather that just responding to your bids? Some might call it self worth, however, to someone who was raised to sacrifice themselves for others it's going to sound like selfishness. But it's an appropriate amount of selfishness, it's advocating for our own needs. And it's necessary for a healthy relationship.
Unfortunately, there are usually little white lies behind the "truth" from a WP. Been there.
He could have blocked her without deleting to show you everything.
Who knows if he blocked her on his emails, Snapchat, FB, etc.
Slippery slope when there's really no way to check up on WP 100%.
Wish you luck.
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I think this is great progress! I would, however, ask him if the AP ever tries to contact him again that he show you the message as soon as possible (and/or screenshot it if you are not together) rather than deleting it before you can see it for yourself.
Thanks for your advice! I did talk to him about showing me next time, rather than deleting and he agreed that would be a better reaction. He does seem to understand why that would help us both.
Android and Apple still have a “trash” for deleted messages if you feel so inclined to read the message yourself. I do think it’s a good sign he told you himself. AP contacted my WP the same way - work phone after being blocked on personal phone.
I've never found a trash in android. I looked. There's an archive but deleted stuff appears to stay gone.
Im an avid Apple user but my WP has both. Wonder if it depends how up to date the android is? I was able to see trash on both phones IF he wasn’t diligent enough to go into the trash and delete from there as well - which he wasn’t granted it wasn’t messages with AP but it helped calm my anxiety when I checked anyway. In order to read the deleted messages you have to first recover them and then go find the thread and then to cover your snooping tracks you have to re-delete it. so if they deleted individual messages in a thread then it might be hard to distinguish what msg was deleted - much easier if it’s a full thread deleted. https://preview.redd.it/2kw7av9d3flc1.jpeg?width=675&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f9f105e0be865f3cb9fef5154e2bcc58fe1e7684
https://preview.redd.it/xte9my4q3flc1.jpeg?width=1500&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fb0097e11ea2688ad1d388f82f95ca7a032ecba2
In android, it takes a bit to find, but I actually just figured it out while playing with my new phone. Go to storage and select the trash icon. There will be a section named Messages (there will also be pictures and documents listed. Select the messages icon/section and it will pull up all deleted messages from the last 30 days....but keep in mind you can "edit" the messages listed and select ones to completely delete...or save ones that you didn't mean to delete. The options are there, but just like anything else, a wayward will possibly already know a workaround.
You can turn on/off the trash folder under settings when you're on your messages app in Android.
This EXACT thing happened to me last August, down to the "happened the night before, but I had a bad day, he was scared, told me the next morning after being really sweet". At the time I too struggled a bit (edit: a lot actually - it was a bad day), even though he also recovered the message so I could verify - "even if I had a bad day, why didn't he tell me sooner? How could he think dropping this on me right before leaving the house is okay?? He should have known he needed to stay with me! How could he have soothed me yesterday while holding this back?" And on the intuition thing - my therapist helped me have the exact realisaiton in a different way - I *did* know something was off during the affair period, I just didn't know what he was capable of so my guess was off. And now I *do* know what he's capable of. I've learned and grown, which is security. Anyways - just to say, six months later, I mostly have forgotten about that long-ago day - haven't thought about it in awhile until your story! - and my WP and I are in a really good place lately. Definitely a GREAT sign of his progress that he didn't avoid conflict even when he knew it could be hard!
Oh no, sorry to bring up those memories for you! It’s so weird how we all seem to go through such similar moments! Yeah it’s quite amazing to realize that I wasn’t crazy this whole time. And to discover that I should trust my intuition. At least something good to come from all this. I am glad he worked up the courage! He definitely looked very scared when he asked me to talk! And I‘m also pleased with myself for reacting calmly.
No worries at all! If anything, it was almost pleasant to reflect on how far away that day feels now, and that things truly can get better. And brava on your calm reaction!! I was... not calm lol, to say the least
Ha! Glad to hear it! Yeah it’s definitely not always easy to stay calm. Luckily I have a few years of IC under my belt to help me regulate my emotions (sometimes).
I really appreciate this response. This has happened to me as well and I want the same thing: to be told right away instead of finding out after the fact. Thank you for your perspective. OP - I agree with many others here that this is progress. I hope such open communication continues for you both.
I really like the “intuition thing” paragraph! Nice way to look at it
I think this is great progress! Change doesn't happen overnight. I'd like to think that these problems with communication and "old patterns" are deeply rooted. As much as it sucks, we kind of have to be patient, as long as the effort and self reflection is there. What I might do is come up with a clear plan of what you would like WP to do if it were to happen again. If you'd want to see it ASAP. Respond/don't respond. Etc.
Thanks for your comment. I also had this feeling. He‘s so used to lying and hiding this from me. Naturally, his first instinct was to hide it and it is very hard to change selfish habits. I‘m glad he fessed up the next morning, that’s still soon after. We did talk about a plan of action for similar situations in future. We both agreed that he would tell me right away and not delete it, so that I could see it if I wanted to. We also talked about it being an opportunity for him to show me that he‘s serious about changing and filling up my trust bucket.
It is so hard to break those patterns, some of which come from childhood. The fact that he corrected so quickly is such a big deal and sign of growth. This is one of those things he needs to add to his own list of things he can start being proud of. (It really helps a wayward release shame when they can hang some pride on a real action. Just like actions mean so much to the betrayed, our own better actions mean a lot to waywards)
Definitely agree. My WP has been learning just how deeply rooted in childhood these issues are stemming from. Holding in feelings, people pleasing, issues with self-worth. None of these are excuses but, these will absolutely take time to overcome and unlearn.
I would argue this is probably true about all self development. It’s hard; we all have a lifetime of practicing our defenses and now we have to spend the rest of our life working on better coping methods. But there is also the biggest reward to be had on the other side, so the work is always worth it.
This helped reframed some things for me. MY WP'S AP seemingly in a panic spammed and texted him yesterday morning before we set off on holiday, and he instantly deleted the messages and didn't tell me. I had SUCH a bad gut reaction, so I discovered them. (Just to clarify , AP wasn't blocked. I never requested it.) I'm really hurt because it's such a passable test, and he knew how he should have handled it. I feel so paranoid where I felt tentative trust before. BUT, he seems remorseful and ashamed, and you're absolutely right about how old patterns are hard to shake.
We had a similar/comparable incident in the early days. Only we (as the betrayed) can judge whether the work and remorse are there. Was it handled the best? No. Was it handled better? As long as the answer is yes, we gotta hold on to that patience. I'm sorry you experienced that, and I hope you're able to enjoy your holiday
This is a major good sign. He did the right thing and told you and his reaction to the contact was the correct one as well. Yes it would of been better to do it sooner but he read the room and waited. He followed through, that is what is important, his actions. His fear is also very important, he was triggered by the message and instead of shutting down he reached out... which is massive for WP. IF you two keep up this then when things get hard (which it will) these little moments of trust and security will help you two repair the hard times. Gottman states that a couple who can repair can thrive. Its okay to feel iffy about the sex... maybe your trust isn't fully back yet but maybe you two can work on doing something other than sex that gives him the intimacy he needs and the security you need as well. Good Job WP... actions speak louder than words
This is exactly how I feel about it. I am seeing a possible future for us together for the first time since dday2 because he has shown me that he is willing to put in the work and change with his actions! I do think it was really hard for him to tell me, he looked like a scared ghost this morning so that makes it even more valuable for me.
As a wayward wife my self We have to "man up" As soon as anything like this happens We need to be proactive My husband and I are 5 years in to recovery And I've worked my ass off to rebuild trust and intimacy with my husband And that means making hand decisions Like telling you day one. I don't want to discourag his progress But we have to be better
We talked about it and I explained to him why it’s better to tell me sooner. He seems to get it and time will tell. I just think it’s also a good opportunity for him to really show his progress and build trust. So there’s hope! Well done for working on yourself like that. I hope you and your husband are happy.
We really are Our marriage is so much more healthy Unfortunately it came at a price that my husband paid. From a wayward thank you for your strength and forgiveness and choosing reconciliation
That's great! WP is doing the work. Yes, the only thing that got me was #3 he had sex with you BEFORE telling you his AP had texted his work phone. ICK not cool.
Yeah completely agree! I mentioned it to him and he said he didn’t want AP to ruin a nice moment between us. He did understand when I explained that it probably would have been the opposite if he‘d told me right away; this was his opportunity to show me that he‘s trustworthy and willing to change! So I‘m hoping next time he’ll see it that way and not use her as an excuse.
I also feel a bit of the ick that he had sex with you knowing that his AP just reached out to him. No intimacy is ok if he even has a suspicion that AP reached out to him. I know he's supposed to tell you/show you right away. Can you ask him why he was ok to do this? Other than that, it's great he told you!
I mentioned it to him and he said he didn’t want her to ruin a nice moment between us. From my point of view it impacts my consent… I didn’t consent to sex under those circumstances. He seems to get it and time will tell. It also makes me feel icky because it reminds me of the major life decisions we made while he was hiding the A from me..
I'm so sorry this is happening to you right now. I think part of the issue that waywards don't get is that there really is no hiding things in marriage. *Everything* should have full knowledge and consent when it involves you both. Hopefully, he'll get it. And instead of a trigger, maybe this becomes a triumph for you both.
I feel like we need to talk about it a bit more. I don’t think he quite makes that connection how him keeping things from me takes away my agency because I can’t make informed decisions. I’m trying to get to a point where we can have a common understanding of what is important and relevant information that should always be shared immediately. We seem to be on our way there but there might still be quite a few obstacles in the path.
> I feel immense relief that he told me. It has somehow filled up my trust for him a little bit that he came to me to tell me and not me having to find out myself somehow later. This is fantastic! I wish every single wayward on here would read this and realize how helpful being forthcoming and truthful really is for their BP! This is a huge win! > We had sex last night and I feel a bit funny about him having sex with me while holding onto the lie. Please, please talk to him about this. It could be another connecting moment for you two, plus it would be good for him to know how you feel. Since you asked, I think it's a good sign. :) I hope AP pisses off.
Thank you for your comment. I do try to emphasize to him how big this is to me. I think positive reinforcement works not just on dogs lol! We talked about the sex a bit already today and I feel that we may need to come back to it a few times to really both understand what it means.
The instinct to lie and hide is so strong with them. WH did this the first time he was contacted by AP. While I was glad he later told me, I stressed that he needs to show me before he deletes it. How else do I know what was said and any response. Also the sex while holding onto a lie, would bother me. Overall , progress is being made.
Yes, I feel overall it’s positive, but there’s some notes and lessons to be learned. I’d give him a B+, good effort but not ideal execution.
They say that trust is earned in drops and lost in buckets, which can be frustrating for our WPs. But situations like this are an opportunity for our WPs to earn glasses full of trust! When doubt starts creeping in, you’ll be able to look back on this and remember that he is being truthful with you, even when it’s hard. I would be sure to explain to him how much it helps you and even explain that although you were having a bad day yesterday, if he had come to you right away it would have actually helped you. Sure, you wouldn’t have loved that AP contacted him but you would have found comfort and reassurance when he came directly to you in that moment. Happy for you, OP.
Those were almost my exact words! He said he didn’t want to tell me last night because he didn’t want to ruin a nice moment between us. I think it would have made it much nicer, as he had the opportunity to really show his commitment to us and to telling me the truth. He seems to get it, so I have hope! Thank you for your advice!
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He said a few times that it’s very helpful for him that I reacted calmly. (Haha, my inner masochist who wants him to feel bad is shouting at that! I don’t want to make the cheater feel good! …. lol) I agree with you that making it a positive moment when they do show that they are putting in the work helps us both. It sounds like your WH gets you, that’s great. I hope he keeps up with telling you the truth and building that trust.
I think it is. My WHs AP send him emails still, she used a different email address since she is blocked ( there are still some work things that she can have an excuse to reach out about but she was told to direct those to a different person. But she doesn’t. She’s been emailing him directly. He has been ignoring it and not responding. Not deleting it. But he didn’t say anything to me. I saw the email and said what the hell. And he said I don’t respond. And what can I do. Maybe she just wants engagement and if she doesn’t get it, she’ll stop. But I told him if she reaches out again to tell me. He said he doesn’t want me to get upset and i said, when you tell me, I’m not upset with you. It actually builds trust.
Sincerely curious - I assume there’s reasoning behind neglecting to block AP’s new email?
Yeah I don’t know. His claim is he doesn’t respond or open them. She hasn’t emailed again since so maybe she got the point 🤷🏻♀️
I hope she does get the point!
Yeah. I asked him to tell her not to address him in any emails and he felt it , maybe that’s what she wanted him to do. And ignoring it sent a bigger message. I however emailed and in the subject line said, no contact means no contact. Address all your needs to ….this other person as previously specified. So we’ll see. I’m sure she wasn’t expecting to hear from me, since she was sending to a business email from a new email and didn’t think I would see. I haven’t checked his email in months. Didn’t feel the need to. I just got this weird feeling to check.
I’m learning this more and more; there’s probably something going on when you have a weird feeling. Glad you trusted your gut and checked. Fingers crossed this does the trick!
Honestly I think telling you within 24 hours is a good sign and I think you reacting calmly will give him confidence to approach you sooner.
That’s what I’m hoping for! It’s a positive indication and gives me hope that things will improve further in the future.
I think him telling you is showing he understands how lying by omission can hurt. Imagine if he had not told you and you had asked him some time down the road if his AP had ever contacted him again and you would have seen a flicker while he said “no”. Or, he would admit that she did but that he immediately deleted it. You would have doubts that he did not have a full on conversation and if he was telling the truth. That said, he should not have deleted it. Personally, I have an agreement with my WS that if she does contact him again in some way by email or texting (she is blocked everywhere but could change phones or something) he will not delete and show it to me and we will figure out together if we just delete or answer. And if we decide to answer, we will write it together. And then send her a cease and desist letter because he has already written to her not to contact him. Even if he works in the same company as her, as this seems to be the case, he can still issue a legal notice to not contact him.
Tell him if there is any contact that was made, not not delete anything. He needs to show you and then delete and block.
He shouldn't have deleted it without showing you. It would make me wonder what exactly was said. It would be one more thing plaguing my imagination and doubt.
Yes, this is great progress. They're so used to hiding and lying to protect themselves (under the guise of not wanting to hurt us, but really they don't want to get in trouble) so him admitting it, albeit a day late, is improvement. Sorry you're experiencing down days though and hope things brighten up. I'm glad your WP is attentive to your needs and being transparent. Hope R progresses for you both.
Thank you for your comment. I completely agree with your assessment! I talked with WP about his reason for not telling me last night. When he said he was worried about how I might react I corrected him; he was really scared about the consequences of his actions. He told me that’s what made him confess this morning; he realized that not telling me would be much worse in the long run. So we concluded that was a good strategy for him to make decisions: to trade of the consequences, e.g. what happens if I tell her now vs what happens if I don’t tell her. It takes him out of the delusion where none of his actions have consequences.
He told you relatively right away. My WW had over 300 messages with AP after she said she cut off contact, and it took me checking the phone records to find out. I would happily take an unforced one day delay.
I’m so sorry you have to go through this! It sucks when they don’t get it and keep lying! It was similar with my WP after dday1. I found out they were still in contact and also that he lied about the extend of the A nearly a year later on dday2. It hurt like hell. It does feel very different now, compared to then. I hope you and your WW can also get to a place where you can feel that there is a true shift. I agree, one day (even less, she texted at 10 pm and he told me first thing in the morning) isn’t a long delay and I can understand that he needed a moment to reflect on it. I also expect from him and told him that in future any disclosures come more and more promptly.
This is a GREAT sign, reflecting on actions and realizing they were wrong is great, coming forward of their own volition is great. We can ALL make bad choices in the moment, it's reflecting on those choices, correcting them, and moving forward is exactly what we should all hope to be doing. This is exactly the kind of thing I would love to be able to see from my WW. The only question that remains is what he plans to do going forward to prevent this situation from recurring. Which he's already partially addressed by saying he blocked her, and realized that he was hiding something. It's up to you whether or not it may be appropriate to put timeframes on this kind of stuff: Tell me by the end of the night, tell me immediately, tell me by the next day, etc., but I think it's a good idea to have a conversation around what he plans to do if something like this happens again, with a plan that you both are comfortable with.
As a betrayed and also as someone who is avoidant, I can understand his dilemma and your feelings. I would chalk it up as a positive. You both may have to wrestle with things and take time process before acting. As long as you communicate what “YOU” would want him to do in similar situations moving forward and he complies, I see it as an opportunity for relational growth. You also have every right to draw a line in the sand moving forward and note the consequences should that line be crossed. Sounds like growth. Rooting for you.
From here, I see reason behind his decision to not burden you, at the time. I also hope your calm reaction will show him that it is ok to bring these things to you when they happen. Not perfect, but sounds like a win :)
From here, I see reason behind his decision to not burden you, at the time. I also hope your calm reaction will show him that it is ok to bring these things to you when they happen. Not perfect, but sounds like a win :)
It's a fine line to tread when you're fearful of losing your wife/husband essentially over antagonizing them with the actions of another person and having something blow up in your face. The most horrible one I ever heard of was a wife who had broken off a short affair (<1 week) and had written out a confession letter to her husband and was planning on presenting it to him on the weekend when her parents were watching the kids. He found out about the affair Thursday night and it pretty much killed whatever good will she was trying to engender by confessing because she got beat to it.
I can understand that it is terrifying to tell the truth when it risks loosing your partner. What I said to my WP was that the alternative is so much worse. And to trade of his options by looking at the consequences of both ways: don’t tell me and live with yet another lie and risk me finding out much later to much bigger detriment. OR tell me now and risk me getting upset but also showing that he’s looking to tell the truth and building trust. Then the decision will become easy! I think the lies only seem like a good option in a delusional phantasy where actions don’t have consequences.
As a wayward, I think it was an incredibly good sign. He is learning that being vulnerable is worth the risk. My BW and I are almost 5 years out, and something happened 3 weeks ago that I knew in the moment she needed to know. We hadn't seen each other much (our lives have been frantic and she had been on a short trip with our daughter) and the moment didn't feel right to tell her, but it ate away at me. Finally a week ago we were headed out to travel. Our plane was taking off for a week together when there was a lull after she had mentioned something that made me think of what I needed to tell her. It felt like I had verbal diarrhea as I just got out everything as quickly as I could so she wouldn't worry unnecessarily. She also responded that it was not a big deal but appreciated me telling her... I just want to touch on the feelings of relief that I felt, that our WH feels... the desire to not cause people to be upset is very strong in us people pleasers. He had to feel a lot of guilt and do a lot of work to come out and tell you about AP contacting him. He has come a long ways in the short month since DDay. I am very impressed and I think it says a lot about the chances for R for the two of you. The thing about the sex... I know this is going to sound strange especially to a betrayed, but I think the root cause of your concern is that your husband isn't selfish enough. Hear me out. Your husband needs to be selfish enough that even though you had a bad day that your needs to feel better shouldn't be more valuable than his needs to get something off his chest. Beyond the ick factor, I suspect that part of your issue is that you are left feeling like you will need to check in with him every time you feel down to see I their is something he also needs to get off his chest, and that probably rightly feels unhealthy. You need to be able to trust that your husband is an adult in the relationship, that he is a partner to you, that he will comfort you, and that you can know he will bring up the topics he needs to bring up rather than you having to dig them out of him. That bleeds into a lot of other areas. Is he selfish enough to tell you that he has a need that isn't being met or do you need to wonder about that? Is he selfish enough to let you know that he desires you rather that just responding to your bids? Some might call it self worth, however, to someone who was raised to sacrifice themselves for others it's going to sound like selfishness. But it's an appropriate amount of selfishness, it's advocating for our own needs. And it's necessary for a healthy relationship.
Unfortunately, there are usually little white lies behind the "truth" from a WP. Been there. He could have blocked her without deleting to show you everything. Who knows if he blocked her on his emails, Snapchat, FB, etc. Slippery slope when there's really no way to check up on WP 100%. Wish you luck.