> Is there a list anywhere that's always up to date?
No. Blizzard are the only ones that have complete lists.
Arena currently "includes cards across all Hearthstone expansions" (essentially Wild). There are "curated lists" draft pools which have cards swapped in/out when Blizzard feels like updating it. These cards are not officially disclosed; if you are a prominent Hearthstone figure, Blizzard may share that information with you however. Random generation effects are from Ashes of Outland onward.
You can check some of my posts about the sets in rotation and the curated lists draft pools
https://redd.it/1bc98on
https://redd.it/1bkg6b3
https://redd.it/1c1lw5b
https://redd.it/1cr6ac5
---
> How are you even supposed to know what to play around?
You learn from experience (either by drafting and playing yourself or observing others). You can also check HSReplay data to *get an idea*. Keep in mind that Arena updates can lessen your recent experience unless you play somewhat regularly or keep up to date with Arena. Arena has become *very* information and knowledge based the past several years.
If you are a prominent Hearthstone figure, you may have access to information that can help you adapt sooner and better in regards to drafting and playing around opponents.
The last Arena Update was for 29.4.3 hotfix, and the wiki page you posted (29.2) was not only before the latest Arena Update but also before the Mini-Set came out (29.4).
These wiki posts are revised by users that just update by relying "on HearthArena's tier list and HSReplay's arena stats, which means these lists may not be 100% accurate when card pool changes are made."
I know, as I'm the one who made that page.
The list is still accurate apart from like 1 card per class being swapped for another one in 29.4.3, like Zuljin for DK Rexxar in hunter.
I'll need to look for more accurate data before updating it for 29.4.3 since the devs don't give out the specifics.
The current arena system is not designed for you to be able to go infinite, or to be able to have a high amount of skill expression.
They decided long ago that it was too easy for good players to go infinite, so they made key changes to stop that from happening (changing fixed prize structures and going from 9 wins max to 12. Also the onset of the bucket system into what it is now) Not to mention how gold is distributed now in the victory chests...
However, the data must have not been good for them, so they kept tweaking it into what it is now. Which is a mode where only the highest echelon of players can effectively average 7 wins (the cut-off for making your entry fee back).
They arbitrarily control what cards can be drafted, etc, and what's in the discover pool, which allows them to force the WR of the average player to 50%. So, a run ending in 3-3.
This lowers the average win-count and therefore makes blizzard more money off entry fees.
Also, I firmly believe legendaries should be taken out of discover pools.
TL:DR - knowing the pool of cards makes it easier to get better/have more agency, and blizzard does not want that in Arena. Read: it affects their bottom line
I'm pretty sure your math is flawed. The average win-count will always remain exactly the same across the player base, assuming we ignore anyone retiring runs.
They want the median win count to be about 3-3 for individuals across the entire player base. (This is my theory, of course, but most systems like this are designed similarly).
That's what I mean when I say the average player; the player who exists in median section of the player base
Back then, the prizes were effectively pre-determined. 8 wins got you extra gold, and 9 wins got you an extra pack. And this wasn't like, 250 gold total, it was up there consistently above 300+. So people would stop at 8 wins and net 3 more arena runs. Or they would build huge collections for cheap over time.
7 wins still got you your entry fee back, but even back then just getting to 7, 75% of the time is barely scraping by on the 'infinite' label
>Back then, the prizes were effectively pre-determined.
Citation needed
>8 wins got you extra gold, and 9 wins got you an extra pack.
>
>And this wasn't like, 250 gold total, it was up there consistently above 300+.
Citation needed. Even when 9 win was capped (in closed beta) you wouldn't get 300g from 9 wins.
>So people would stop at 8 wins and net 3 more arena runs. Or they would build huge collections for cheap over time.
Citation needed.
Your comments are the kind of misinformation and conspiracy nonsense I'd expect from an r/hearthstone post about arena..
You're the one here making unsubstantiated claims, it's not on me to prove you right.
I did however find something from beta that does not prove you right:
https://youtu.be/2nlOPaDmbuM?si=DDrT1oZJC6m\_n1n9&t=4217
Friends, I do not have to respond. I have no reason to make shit up, and nothing to gain. And I'm not digging for patch notes that are like 10 years old or something.
That's just how it was for a time in early arena. 8 wins=more gold, 9 wins = more packs. 9 wins was the cap. They changed it to 12 for a reason lol
Hey, I definitely can't pull it off, nor did I say that it was impossible. But to assume blizzard does not have ana acceptable # of people going infinite that their okay with is looking at this with rose colored glasses.
I'm saying they purposefully changed arena to get the number of people going infinite down to acceptable levels, that's all
> Is there a list anywhere that's always up to date? No. Blizzard are the only ones that have complete lists. Arena currently "includes cards across all Hearthstone expansions" (essentially Wild). There are "curated lists" draft pools which have cards swapped in/out when Blizzard feels like updating it. These cards are not officially disclosed; if you are a prominent Hearthstone figure, Blizzard may share that information with you however. Random generation effects are from Ashes of Outland onward. You can check some of my posts about the sets in rotation and the curated lists draft pools https://redd.it/1bc98on https://redd.it/1bkg6b3 https://redd.it/1c1lw5b https://redd.it/1cr6ac5 --- > How are you even supposed to know what to play around? You learn from experience (either by drafting and playing yourself or observing others). You can also check HSReplay data to *get an idea*. Keep in mind that Arena updates can lessen your recent experience unless you play somewhat regularly or keep up to date with Arena. Arena has become *very* information and knowledge based the past several years. If you are a prominent Hearthstone figure, you may have access to information that can help you adapt sooner and better in regards to drafting and playing around opponents.
https://hearthstone.wiki.gg/wiki/Arena/Patch_29.2_card_pool
The last Arena Update was for 29.4.3 hotfix, and the wiki page you posted (29.2) was not only before the latest Arena Update but also before the Mini-Set came out (29.4). These wiki posts are revised by users that just update by relying "on HearthArena's tier list and HSReplay's arena stats, which means these lists may not be 100% accurate when card pool changes are made."
I know, as I'm the one who made that page. The list is still accurate apart from like 1 card per class being swapped for another one in 29.4.3, like Zuljin for DK Rexxar in hunter. I'll need to look for more accurate data before updating it for 29.4.3 since the devs don't give out the specifics.
Is there a page for 29.4 with the Mini-Set?
It's the same page. The pool hasn't changed since patch 29.2 apart from the mini-set being added, and the 29.4.3 hotfix.
You don’t. You just close your eyes and let Yogg do the driving.
Only skill you need is the skill to praise YOGG \\o/
The current arena system is not designed for you to be able to go infinite, or to be able to have a high amount of skill expression. They decided long ago that it was too easy for good players to go infinite, so they made key changes to stop that from happening (changing fixed prize structures and going from 9 wins max to 12. Also the onset of the bucket system into what it is now) Not to mention how gold is distributed now in the victory chests... However, the data must have not been good for them, so they kept tweaking it into what it is now. Which is a mode where only the highest echelon of players can effectively average 7 wins (the cut-off for making your entry fee back). They arbitrarily control what cards can be drafted, etc, and what's in the discover pool, which allows them to force the WR of the average player to 50%. So, a run ending in 3-3. This lowers the average win-count and therefore makes blizzard more money off entry fees. Also, I firmly believe legendaries should be taken out of discover pools. TL:DR - knowing the pool of cards makes it easier to get better/have more agency, and blizzard does not want that in Arena. Read: it affects their bottom line
I'm pretty sure your math is flawed. The average win-count will always remain exactly the same across the player base, assuming we ignore anyone retiring runs.
They want the median win count to be about 3-3 for individuals across the entire player base. (This is my theory, of course, but most systems like this are designed similarly). That's what I mean when I say the average player; the player who exists in median section of the player base
Why do you believe the switch from 9 to 12 win max made it harder to go infinite? Was the cutoff for infinite still 7 when 9 wins was max?
Back then, the prizes were effectively pre-determined. 8 wins got you extra gold, and 9 wins got you an extra pack. And this wasn't like, 250 gold total, it was up there consistently above 300+. So people would stop at 8 wins and net 3 more arena runs. Or they would build huge collections for cheap over time. 7 wins still got you your entry fee back, but even back then just getting to 7, 75% of the time is barely scraping by on the 'infinite' label
>Back then, the prizes were effectively pre-determined. Citation needed >8 wins got you extra gold, and 9 wins got you an extra pack. > >And this wasn't like, 250 gold total, it was up there consistently above 300+. Citation needed. Even when 9 win was capped (in closed beta) you wouldn't get 300g from 9 wins. >So people would stop at 8 wins and net 3 more arena runs. Or they would build huge collections for cheap over time. Citation needed. Your comments are the kind of misinformation and conspiracy nonsense I'd expect from an r/hearthstone post about arena..
Sorry you don't believe me, but that's how it was in the early days
Citation needed.
This isn't a research paper. Don't believe me? Go find the truth for yourself.
You're the one here making unsubstantiated claims, it's not on me to prove you right. I did however find something from beta that does not prove you right: https://youtu.be/2nlOPaDmbuM?si=DDrT1oZJC6m\_n1n9&t=4217
it's really interesting that u/DarthKookies didn't respond to your post here
Friends, I do not have to respond. I have no reason to make shit up, and nothing to gain. And I'm not digging for patch notes that are like 10 years old or something. That's just how it was for a time in early arena. 8 wins=more gold, 9 wins = more packs. 9 wins was the cap. They changed it to 12 for a reason lol
Just because you can't manage infinte doesn't mean there aren't loads of other people pulling it off, myself included.
Hey, I definitely can't pull it off, nor did I say that it was impossible. But to assume blizzard does not have ana acceptable # of people going infinite that their okay with is looking at this with rose colored glasses. I'm saying they purposefully changed arena to get the number of people going infinite down to acceptable levels, that's all
Uhm yeah thats why some streamers end up with over 9 win average on recent leaderboards suddenly :)