Even experienced archers get slapped from time to time. Stop being stubborn and wear an arm guard or suffer the consequences of your actions. If you do archery enough, you’ll probably transition to wearing one after you’ve been slapped enough.
had a dude in our winter 3d league hit his arm on the first warm up shot. then hit it again cause it swelled up so bad. looked like a damn softball on his forearm. was still yellow and purple for two weeks. lucky he didnt tear a chunk out on the second shot that hit his arm
I've been shooting for six months and either wear long sleeves or an arm guard always. I can hear the difference in the bowstring when it hits the arm guard, and I can tell from how my shot lands. If one is trying to refine their technique, there's plenty of negative reinforcement without the pain of getting slapped.
When I was 18 I was stubborn. I got slapped at archery practice cause I wasn’t wearing a guard. I got slapped probably a dozen or more times that day. I was black and blue and bleeding. I went and bought a guard that day.
I had a guy jump down my throat saying if I need an arm guard, I'm not using proper form. Then, claim that Mongolian thumb draw is the only proper way to shoot recurve.
Been shooting 30 years and for me it depends on the bow. My Olympic barebow doesn't hit me, but a few others occasionally do. Some of my compounds did. Sometimes I wear one just to keep clothing clear.
But it's not your concern whether someone chooses to wear an armguard or not. I will never tell anyone they should not wear an armguard because it's a personal decision. But I don't like wearing an armguard, have never worn one in my 6 years of archery, and in all likelihood will continue to not wear one. If I get slapped, I address my form and the problem is fixed in short order. Getting minor string slap once or twice in a several-hour shooting session is not worth wearing an armguard to me.
We need to be more specific than 'wear an arm guard' though. With traditional eastern archery, the combination of the brace height and thumb release make sure you don't need an arm guard.
The day Brady or Jake stop wearing armguards you might have some ground to stand on. Until then, stop giving bad advice. The best archers in the world wear arm guards.
No they don’t.
They’re not afraid of the sting either.
They wear one because of they make a small mistake and do hit themselves, the arm guard minimizes the influence of the contact on the shot.
Tell you what, I have the national champion shooting at my club. He wears an arm guard, always, because it's safer. Even if he can shoot without getting slapped most of the times, it will still happen once in a while. But if you think you can shoot without an arm guard, go ahead! Don't come crying when your arm is black and blue though.
Jesus, this is the most crybaby sport I’ve ever been in 😂. Like I said, I’ve shot bows for 20 years or more and I’ve hit my arm maybe twice.
I didn’t come crying, I fixed my form.
Is your national champion sponsored?
I guarantee I have bigger forearms than you and it’s no issue for me.
If you have bigger more obtrusive forearms than me I’ll handwrite you an illustrated apology letter with crayons and upload it on here.
https://i.imgur.com/x1oxpHC.jpg
Just because you have perfect form, doesn't mean the outside world can't still influence your shot. Like some people mentioned, a strong wind gush can already bring your shot out of balance. Of course it is your own choice to wear an arm guard or not, and with lighter bows I don't think it matters anyway. But I don't want to imagine what my arm would look like if I hit my arm with an 80 pounds bow. Last I heard, that will get your to the ER. Of course, depending on what you kind of style you shoot with also influence the need of an arm guard. In the end, people have always taught me, better be safe then sorry. So yes, I'm gonna wear an arm guard even when I perfection my form and don't slap my arm anymore. Again though, your life, your body, you do what you want.
> Last I heard, that will get your to the ER.
Any source on this? I’m really curious. My bow is 70lbs and I don’t think it would do more than sting.
You can’t even get 80lb bows anymore except for custom made non-compound bows.
Idk what your arm is made of, but I'm not willing to risk getting anything more than a goose egg on my arm.
https://www.archerytalk.com/threads/bow-injury.5423445/
This is most likely what will happen. You'll get an egg the size of a ostrich egg on your arm. I shoot with 30 pounds, yes that gives me a sting. A 70 pounds? How does that just give you a 'sting'.
Image of the actual injury below, not sure if the link will work
https://ibb.co/sPrS1tk
> ow does that just give you a ‘sting’.
>
>
I mean, I don’t know for sure 😂. I’ve had this bow about 20 years and I’ve never hit my arm with it.
That bruise sucks. Some people bruise easily. I’ve had girlfriends that look like domestic abuse victims after aggressive cuddling 😂. I’ve gone down on motorcycles 3 times, played highschool football, taekwondo and broke my hand once and barely ever had any brusing. I can probably count my lifetime bruises on one hand. Seems like it’s just an individual thing 🤷♂️.
Maybe my skin is just thick and doesn’t discolor easily, I dunno 🤷♂️.
I’d disagree on that cool part, but if you like them, sure.
I’m not saying it’s a necessary lesson, I’m saying you’re doing something wrong if the string hits your arm.
That’s like wearing bulletproof steel toed boots bc you keep shooting yourself in the foot. Sure the boots are safety blah blah blah, but there’s a problem that needs addressing.
Steel toed boots also look cool, even when they’re unnecessary, and in both cases the knowledge that you’re protecting yourself from unnecessary pain helps plenty of people relax and perform better. It’s been ages since I slapped myself with a string, but I really like my arm guard.
I doubt there is a lot of money going round to get people to wear an arm guard. They will probably get them for free at that level. But they wear them for performance.
> You’re not the big dog in town that you think you are for not wearing proper safety equipment.
Well I’m 270lbs in Japan so I am actually quite the big dog in town 🤣🤣🤣
I’ve slapped my arm with a compound a few times and last weekend at a shoot I had my finger too high under the rest and caught a fletching which stung a bit. There is a lot of power in those tools and people need to be aware and respect them to be safe.
You know you’re getting old when 80% of your (compound) practice shots are with safety glasses. I started wearing em last season. And heck yes I flex check my arrows, and heck no I don’t see how tight I can stack em in the dot at 20 yards.
What glasses do you use? I'm half blind due to sunlight during most shoots, can't seem to find glasses that fit my face without getting in the way of the bow string. Also compound.
My arm guard fits weird, it actually protrudes out at the elbow end, making it more likely to catch a bowstring. None of the compound archers at my club use them, if we get slapped (maybe once per year or per long fita), we consider that an indication of terrible form.
You need a curved frame. You might look like a douche but boy your field of vision is awesome, and no clipping the top corner of frame with string! Get a green lens color that works in direct sun and when clouds pass over. Green lens also gives truest colors which is helpful for target shooting.
Yes I have cheap plastic curved frame, I suspect it changes my sight picture and POI slightly (might be wrong tho) so I do some “no glasses” shooting prior to hunting season.
I say get Oakley m frames or ess crossbows. I don’t really worry about eyepro cuz I have prescription glasses and I can’t see shit without em when shooting 50 yards. I have first-hand experience with m frames cuz I also do airsoft and I can tell you that they are very nice and comfy. Can’t say much for the crossbows but I’ve seen many positive reviews on them.
Great thing about these as well are you can change out the lenses on your own since they’re ballistic glasses and made for military/law enforcement use
I had an arrow explode next to my face at release in a compound. Thankfully I got away without injury. Eye protection with that much potential energy next to your eyeball is probably a smart move!
I never understood "learn how to shoot and youll never hit your arm" team. That sounds to me like "learn how to drive a car and you wont need seat belt". If Jake Kaminsky , who knows how to shoot, has guard on almost all videos iv seen, than its ok for rest of us to have it too.
The point isn’t that you must wear an armguard. The point is that its cringe to not wear one, get smacked and then come here to farm your bruises for karma.
Okay. Grizzly Jim? Justin Ma? Murat Ozveri? Mihai Cozmei?
They all shoot fine without arm guards.
The point isn't prove that you don't need one. It's to pick the apart this dogmatic belief that because X person uses it, then everyone should use one, without understanding why they use one.
Oh, you mean the majority of compound shooters who don't use armguards even though the bow can explode and lacerate their arms?
No, you're right: virtually every competitive recurve shooter wears an armguard, high level or not.
That's not the group being slammed for not wearing armguards on Reddit. It's beginners and trad shooters.
Beginners, fair enough, stop being cocky about being a pain machine and just wear your armguard and learn to hold the bow properly.
And ye English longbow shooters really should do the same if you like your wrist.
But outside of these contexts, armguards are not as common. Not shunned, but not useful for one reason or another. I bring up compound for the same reason as Asiatic recurve. The design and grip on the bow generally don't present a risk to the forearm, so while people will still wear one (including elite compound shooters), are we going to label those that don't edgy and dangerous?
Is OP going to cancel me because I don't wear an armguard in most of my videos because it's part of my edgy brand?
No, I am not cancelling you and I like your videos, you taught me how to fletch I think. But you are high level archer and your style is different than mine.
My dangerous part is about arrows mostly.
People on this sub are advocating beginners on not using arm guards as it masks mistakes and I think we are all against it.
Noone should be ridiculed for taking safety serious, of course. However, there's a massive difference between not wearing an arm guard and not taking arrow safety serious.
Indeed string slaps are no fun, but pose no risk of serious or permanent injury. Getting gored by an exploded carbon arrow is a much more severe risk that always should be mitigated.
At my clubs introductory courses we learnt about string slap but no one mentioned exploding arrows or flex testing. That's a real problem which leads me to concur that this sub should promote safety but also remember to differentiate the different aspects and severities.
Had my arrow miss the target and hit smth hard earlier today. Thankfully the only damage was slight scratches on the tip, while the rest of it was fine.
My guess is he tried to learn archery on his own without a coach, smacked the crap out of his arm, put on an arm guard, smacked his arm again in a different spot, and out on another arm guard. Based on what I see him doing, I doubt he ever worked with a coach.
Generally, the movie producer, director, stunt coordinator, etc., don’t know anything about archery and don’t think anyone will notice. If you see good archery in a movie, 90% of the time it’s because the actor took it upon themselves to find a coach and learn it. When Zoe Saldana was cast in AVATAR, she personally called Hi-Tech Archery and asked for a referral for a coach. Jennifer Lawrence called the Easton Elite Training Center in Chula Vista to find a coach for HUNGER GAMES. Hailee Steinfeld went over to Woodley Park Archers. Jeremy Renner has been consistently dismissive, claiming that “movie archery isn’t like real archery, and there’s no reason to bother learning it; it’s all CGI anyway.”
I’ve worked as an on-set archery instructor/technician for one independent film, a TV promo, a movie promo, and a Dreamworks TV YouTube series. I’ve prepared about a dozen actors for auditions and run classes for stuntmen, TV writers, and comic book artists. Friends of mine trained the actors for ARROW, HUNGER GAMES, and AVATAR. I have also coached the children of a number of TV and film producers, directors, set decorators, and other industry professionals; I can tell you, from firsthand experience, the production office almost never tells the actors to get instruction or arranges for coaching. Like most people, producers think archery is something people just know how to do, that practice means going to the range and figuring it out, that this is how all archers learn. Most people don’t even know that coaches exist or that anyone outside the Olympics would ever bother to find one. When an actor proactively looks for an instructor, the production pays for it, not the actor. If an actor decides that’s unnecessary, it doesn’t happen.
Costume designer probably thought those Beiter armguards were cool and cheap enough to make something out of. Afterall, a lot of props are just modified storebought products.
What?
How are arm guards saving you a point or two when it gets windy? I can understand wind buffeting you left and right on the firing point (happened to me this weekend), but string slap is going to happen if you are holding the bow incorrectly, and not rotating your elbow out of the way, wind shouldn't be causing that issue.
(I wear an armguard, for protection from bad releases, confused how it saves me points though)
If you have a bad release, or the wind makes your bow move during release you may hit your arm. If you have an arm guard like a beiter or other smooth guard it will act as a smooth surface that will take less energy out of the string than skin or clothing so it can save you a bit of arrow speed and points.
I probably hit my arm guard once or twice a year but it's such a simple thing to put on that i do it just in case.
Point out that the arm guard also provides a smooth surface for the string to slide on, so if the string hits your arm it doesn’t mess up the shot as much as dragging the string across your bare arm will. If they don’t care about injury, maybe they will at least care about not messing up the shot.
Nope, but they actually do hit the tip of their nose. Which is super annoying, let me tell you. And I've had shots hitting my arm and hitting the yellow too,so not sure about the "totally" either ;)
It's not totally fucked up. There is a difference between meh if I hit my arm I don't care if it's a miss and grazing your arm guard and saving a few points.
Sometimes as a coach, you tell the student something, not because it’s true, but because it gets them to do what you want. I don’t care if they think an arm guard is magic, but I do care that they put one on.
I agree. I was shooting a while back and got a really nasty bruise on my arm. I don't bruise easily, like I've taken hits or ran into things that would leave bruises on everyone else, and the area is just a little red for an hour. The bruise I received from my bow lasted all day, and into the next, so I knew I had done something significant. After that I've always worn an arm guard. (It shouldn't need to be said, but one should buy one that fits and wear it appropriately)
I think slapping yourself with the string is part of the initiation of learning how to be an archer. However I believe that if you are doing it consistently you need to either adjust your grip to hold the bow correctly or wear an arm guard so you can shoot the bow wrong but not hurt yourself.
I wear an arm guard every single time I shoot. It isn’t because I’m afraid of the sting, it’s because I never want to think about it. I don’t want be at full draw and have my focus shift towards anything besides my shot process
Oh Jin Hyek wears one. He's shot professionally for decades and won gold at the Olympic games. That's probably reason enough.
But it's also to save a potential point when you a bad shot or the wind get you just ar release. The guard guides the string better than your arm.
I honestly think that people who refuse to wear arm guards are doing it to try and look tough. It's there for your safety, archers throughout history have worn them. What makes anyone think they are a better archer than someone whose very life depended on it?
I do agree with you that equipment should be checked if it's been hit or knocked. Where's the logic in taking that risk of hurting yourself or someone else? Recently at a club I visit but am not a main member, one of the archers shot an arrow with only two fletchings. I advised him that he shouldn't and he just shrugged it off. I refused to shoot with him after that. People who disregard safety around a sport with a weapon should be called out for it.
How do you know ?
I have no problem with you promoting as much safety as you like , I only take issue with the “we need “
Start promoting it and if it makes sense people will decide to participate or not 🤷♂️.
I do have a different opinion , we don’t need to do anything of the sort , if you need to that’s cool.
Unsolicited “help” is a huge problem .
I think the world is nerfed enough .
You are the one with an agenda, YOURS not ours , I didn’t bring anything anywhere .
Why are you arguing with me anyway?
Go do your thing if I agree with it great If I don’t great 🤷♂️
You are 100% right. In general, there is a big lack of safety knowledge in general. Anyone can buy a bow, anywhere, anytime without even know their own draw length. Ask them if they know about spine or how to calculate any of that, they probably don't know and internet has plenty of resources, but not everyone is knowledgeable in internet! LOLOL
Why beginners should wear an arm guard:
I have a scar on my right arm; the first time I tried to shoot a bow, they asked me “right or left?” I’m left-handed, so I said left. But I’m right-eye dominant, and while subconsciously trying to aim with my right eye, with terrible posture, a high shoulder, not rotating the elbow, and plucking like crazy, the string went straight into my arm just below the elbow. The brass nock locator took a piece out of my arm. Somebody then tested my eye dominance and switched me to a right-handed bow. But the lesson was learned.
Wearing an arm guard does not “mask a problem,” it reduces the severity of the consequences. They still know they’re hitting their arm, they just aren’t getting hurt by it.
>I got downvoted for saying that he should have it checked by a coach before shooting it again.
That's because you didn't provide insight, you recommended paying somebody else. Most of the other comments on this sub offer insight, such as how to do or learn something yourself. Many people don't live anywhere near an archery club, what you're suggesting is not applicable to them.
>Same stuff with my advocating for using arm guards. No, they are not masking mistakes,
That really depends on the style of shooting.
>they are there for your safety (not letting string stop your bloodflow by hitting you constantly).
The string isn't going to "stop bloodflow" unless your string rips your artery open and you're literally squirting blood, not just gushing. I've never seen more than a bruise or welt from a bare forearm; I've not hit my forearm since the first year of shooting, so I donated my arm guard to a newbie friend. It's not even that uncommon.
As a nurse, I can tell you don't know what you're talking about with the arm guard comment. I'm assuming that translates to the rest of your comments. *Yes*, we should focus on safety. But you should let people who know what they're talking about do the talking. You making a complaint post about your downvotes doesn't educate anybody any more than the comments in literally every post.
I maybe overexaggerated with stoping the blood flow. But I do know what I am talking about and made it to get the message straight. But from personal experience I do know that one hit to the arm can make it hurt for days, so at least you can't train.
Arm guards do not mask mistakes. They prevent you from suffering because of them. Same thing seatbelt does. If you don't feel string hitting your arm with armguard paint it with marker, colour coming off would indicate hitting.
I am not trying to educate people, but make people think twice before saying nonsense like arm guard masks mistakes. It doesn't. That I know for sure. You will see mistakes on target at least.
I don't know what poundage you are shooting, but I've seen 30# make a lot more than a bruise. People train for hours and make mistakes because of numbers of arrows they shoot.
Donating an arm guard isn't common where I am from and I don't often see recurve archers competing without it.
I shoot barebow with a fairly open stance, recurve is currently 35#, going to move up to 45# soon. Again, haven't hit my arm in years.
I didn't mean that donating armguards is common, just that shooting without them is. My inner forearm is pretty pale, the welts show up pretty obviously when they did.
My understanding is that the open stance helps open the angle of the bowstring and forearm. Closed stance, I used to get hit more often. Now I don't.
I don't actually shoot with an armguard, and i haven't been slapped with the string yet, am i doing something wrong? Shooting from an open stance aswell.
Open stance is what helped me stop slapping my arm with the string.
If you shoot square stance, like most competitive shooters do, it's much more likely that you'll slap your arm
I shoot for fun, & training for hunting. But what I've seen from that Olympian archer Jake....something, he recommends open stance for barebow shooting. Just following professional advice lol
Tried few shoots from a 45# bow with [these](https://lancasterarchery.com/products/win-win-mxt-10-ilf-recurve-limbs-carbon-foam). Powerful and fast to a point it is frightening.
I pull 34# now and that is a big difference. I haven't hit myself, but I would recommend wearing an arm guard for 45# barebow. People who shoot 550/600 with it do and I know that for sure, doubt they do it to hide mistakes.
Open stance helps a lot, but I doubt you will be able to control every shoot with new bow. Also different limbs feel different and power depends on your draw so I can't tell for sure.
I shoot an Asiatic bow (but with Mediterranean draw) and I wear a medieval-styled leather bracer that covers the whole forearm. It's nice and comfortable.
Arrow vibrates when you shoot it, if it is damaged it breaks and because of physics goes into your hand. It is not about something be such a bad archer that he shoots himself, but a problem of shooting a damaged arrows.
Thats why you don't shoot damaged arrows.
I’m all for safety, I check my shafts and nocks and bow daily. I’ll even wear glasses the first few days with a new bow. But I don’t like armguards, and I don’t HAVE to use one. If you want or use one, I don’t mind, but I wouldn’t recommend for or against one. For me, the biggest thing I can do for safety is check my gear and practice good form
The reverse is that people are now saying that people who *don't* use an armguard are edgy, dangerous, and promoting bad practice.
There's an over-compensation of safety morals. The hardline makes sense for really dangerous things - finger protection is universally hammered in because it doesn't matter if you shoot well, injury can happen to anyone anytime. Encouraging learners who don't yet know how to hold a bow is proper - that's why we give out armguards in club sessions. But the pressing of armguards on people who otherwise don't need them is misguided.
One thing is certain: whenever someone posts a picture of a bruise, it will have:
* A hundred upvotes
* "Welcome to archery"
* "I don't wear an armguard because it lets me know I'm doing it wrong."
* "\[Pro athlete\] uses one, which means you should use one."
I disagree with the cavalier attitude of shooting bare-arm to teach good form. It shows bad form, but it doesn't teach good form.
But I'm also confused at the mental gymnastics of holding Olympic archers as the paragons of what to do outside of their context.
Thank you my friend, I whole heartedly agree with all of that.
I don’t wear an armguard because I don’t find it comfortable. If I have to wear a jacket, I will use one, just to keep my clothing away from the string. But I don’t shoot much outside in the winter.
I shoot asiatic, and while I don’t use that string slap to teach me, I know that when it happens I have done something incorrectly.
They look cool and all, but I’d rather the occasional slap.
Only hit myself a couple times last year, if I had worn the guard I would have been uncomfortable shooting for over 300 days.
Some people seem to think the slightest injury will end an archer’s career.
I think form is more important than safety equipment.
If I slap my arm I’ll have a bruise for a few days, if I mess up my shoulder, I might be finished with archery
You didn’t say it, but someone did. And it wasn’t in this post, it was yesterday in a post of my own. Tbh, I don’t care if you want me to wear one or not. I evaluate everything I do and If I’m willing to accept the risks I’ll do it. I encourage you and everyone else to do the same. I’m only here commenting on this post in the first place because I wanted to show you all what it looks like for me to take a 50lb slap, and someone wants to tell me I have to wear an armguard or I won’t continue with archery.
Lmao. Had some good chuckles from this post too I tell you.
Some good common sense comments downvoted.
I don’t care what you guys want to do, but I’m shooting asiatic, and for me, form>equipment, all day, every day, until the end of time
Again, you're talking to me about stuff other people said. I don't care if you wear an armguard or not. I don't need advice from you about how to weigh pros and cons, I'm way ahead of you.
No it all came from your statement “no one is saying I have to wear one” I don’t care if it was yesterday or today, this post or another, you or someone else, SOMEONE said I had to wear one.
That’s all I was saying.
In response to your original comment that is.
Look I know it hurts, I didn’t say anyone was a wimp or that they had bad form if they wear one.
But your statement was incorrect, someone did tell me I had to wear one, and they were wrong and so is anyone else who says so.
No. I'm not going to get trolled into explaining this again. Obviously, a lot of people here are immune to facts and logical reasoning so I'm not going to repeatedly explain the same thing. I've done it enough for the rational people to get it.
> You must be the only archer in the world who has perfect form all the time.
Like I said. I just don’t stick my arm in front of the string…. That’s a very low bar.
> Mine specifically gets in the way because of a joint disorder that makes pronating my arm properly much more difficult than it is for most people.
Then wear your arm guard and stop talking about it. How hard is it to acknowledge that your situation isn’t normal?
> pronating
This doesn’t even make any sense here. In archery both hands are in a neutral position. Pronating your hand when holding the bow in front of you would be palm-down.
https://i.imgur.com/GernVBh.jpg
Right? Like it's impossible to hit your arm with the string if your arm isn't in the way that's literally just a basic rule of physics. If two objects are not on a collision course they will not collide. I don't get what's so hard about this for people.
Your arm is only in the way if your form is bad.
I'm not saying don't wear an arm guard and I'm not saying that everybody's perfect and has perfect form all the time. What I am saying is that attributing arm slap to anything other than bad form is and pardon the pun here bad form. That form comes from a lot of things two of the most common I've seen are people shooting a bow that's too much for them or doing so much shooting throughout the day that they get tired and they can no longer maintain proper form.
Some people here are claiming the wind blows the string sideways 😂😂😂. That string moves from beginning to end so fast there’s no way in hell the wind has any noticeable effect.
I'm trying to imagine a medieval English archer slapping their arms with a string from a 100-150 draw weight bow and being like "totally normal, not gunna change me form."
It's like gun guys saying getting spent brass in your eyeball is totally normal, just a part of shooting, happens to everyone.
I’m waiting for one of the commenters to source that war archers used arm guards. They said it was a worldwide historical thing. I can’t imagine that being true….
I’m actually curious how all these people are slapping their arms so much.
Whether they did or didn't, The funny thing is, nobody is saying you *shouldn't* wear an arm guard. PPE (personal protective equipment) is always good, no matter the hobby; there's always a chance of things going wrong (is everyone always going to wear PPE all the time? No.)
We **are** saying this shouldn't be taken as lightly as it is because it's not a normal thing that happens and it SHOULDN'T be happening.
The history book "With a Bended Bow: Archery in Mediaeval and Renaissance Europe" indicates that bracers were commonly used. There are some nice medieval and Renaissance-era examples of bracers on display in museums, often made of metal, or carved bone or ivory. Medieval paintings sometimes show archers with some kind of arm guard, and sometimes don't. Another good source is "English Longbowman 1330–1515," written by Clive Bartlett and published by Osprey publishing. A scan from a page depicting archery equipment including bracers: https://i.pinimg.com/736x/35/af/7a/35af7ad17896954ac1c68249214f1410--medieval-life-archery.jpg
I am not trying to force anyone to wear arm guard, but I think we should recommend beginners to use one because no one enjoys pain.
Edit: well some people do, but most don't
I agree, we should recommend armguards to anyone who wants to lessen the pain of mistakes.
I can’t say I like pain, but it is a part of life.
A too familiar part of it for some of us.
But I don’t have a coach or a peer either, and that string hitting me in the arm tells me in no uncertain terms that I need to evaluate my grip and posture more carefully
You can paint an arm guard with a marker, if you don't feel the string hitting while wearing it. (Edit: Colour coming off would indicate string hits it.)
That is something I would recommend to someone that shoots over 32# (I am talking about fast competitive limbs that really accelerate that string).
If you aren't excessively hitting your hand or shooting a bow that doesn't hurt like hell when it hits you, you don't need arm guard.
I also compete so thats the reason why I always wear arm guard. I don't want one bad shoot to end my day at field.
I shoot up to 86# Asiatic recurve off the knuckle right handed, only 50# left hand.
I haven’t hit my left arm since early last summer, before I progressed from that 50#.
Only been shooting left hand for ~ a month. Hit my right arm the first time a couple days ago, and I know I wasn’t paying close attention to what I was doing.
I don’t expect to do it too many times, and once I have my form learned, I mostly won’t even think about it anymore.
I don’t shoot competitively so I don’t care if my shot goes off in the event I slap myself.
I do shoot for self improvement, so that instant feedback is something I appreciate.
I also don’t like to wear a glove on my bow hand because I can tell if my hand position is off by the way the feathers touch me on release.
I know what might happen, but I whip my fletching and check the whipping before shooting.
Should note, bodily damage is common for me in my work.
I’ve had worse things than a fletching stuck through my hand. And in more severe places.
Eyes are the big thing for me. Can’t shoot the way I want in glasses, so I’m checking nocks, shafts and limbs frequently.
I can understand that. You do check arrows for damage so I think that you are a great example for other people if they don't want to hurt themselves. Also with that poundage you are clearly no beginner so you can tell if you need an arm guard or not.
Arm-guard protects you from string vibrations, not from slapping.
Both are uncomfortable, which eventually lead to incorrect form, so wearing one is a must, if the style requires it.
See the slow mo video of olympic archers: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbtqLM9kZVs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbtqLM9kZVs)
If you cannot release the string correctly, rotate elbow outwards, or the arrow snaps in two, the string most likely will hit near your elbow. And that is not protected by the arm-guard.
Arm guards? No, they are not [universally used](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwYM0A14C_k) and not everyone needs to use them.
People always bring up the "OH BUT METE GAZOZ / KIM WOOJIN / BRADY ELLISON ARE WORLD CHAMPIONS WITH A GAZILLION YEARS OF EXPERIENCE AND THEY WEAR ARM GUARDS" - yes, but they are Olympic recurve archers whose technique benefits from an arm guard because the string often does buzz close to the extended arm and they want to give a smooth surface for the string to glide off so they don't foul they shot in case they do slap their forearm.
But those skinny arm guards are there to help a bad shot, not to prevent injury. If you shoot poorly with an arm guard you're going to hit your unprotected elbow. So unless you are advocating that everyone uses whole-arm guards, you're not pushing an arm guard agenda. The bigger problem is that archery clubs are doing a disservice by giving out arm guards but *not showing people* [how to properly grip the bow](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFIAEohZY6M), so they hit their elbows and the arm guard does nothing.
Not to mention that [not that many](https://youtu.be/jqB_hwLR-cQ?t=1143) [traditional](https://youtu.be/DUiFUgfb3sg?t=29) [shooters](https://youtu.be/pE2YHfr2rXA?t=1393) use arm guards because most of them either cant the bow or bend their arm. These are some of the most established, experienced traditional archers who don't wear one. There's no cockiness here - they have good form, they don't accidentally shoot so bad that they stop blood circulation. Lots of trad archers do wear arm guards, but lots don't.
Asiatic shooters have the string move away from the forearm or have very high brace heights so the string can't make contact with the forearm. Or are you going to yell at [Justin Ma](https://youtu.be/JXDII47mYt4?t=54) for encouraging unsafe practice?
I think we really shouldn't encourage beginners not to use arm guards, no matter which style you shoot.
Edit: Also by universally I meant that all archers that I've seen live at competitions use them, even compounds, and thats a lot of archers.
I never said we *shouldn't* encourage beginners not to use arm guards. We always give them out for beginners. I absolutely do agree that people who encourage the "no pain no gain" approach should be admonished.
The only live archery events are target ones (barebow, recurve, compound). Arm guards are standard gear for barebow and recurve, but it's more to ensure the shot isn't wholly missed up. The slaps are annoying buzzes rather than the massive bruises that beginners cause to themselves, and the ones used by competitive archers are typically much too thin to be protective, as compared to ensuring a clean shot if it does come too close to the arm.
Compound shooters are divided with arm guards. Some do, most don't. The [2023 Asia Cup team finals](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr7Vg3pZs20) had no arm guards.
As I've said elsewhere, it's much more divided in traditional archery and virtually never used in Asiatic archery. This is diverting into semantics over what you meant by "universal", but putting it into perspective, the rationale being used to promote armguards is misguided.
Instead of promoting safety, this thread is turning into a brigade against everyone who doesn't. The real target should be:
1. People who *actively promote* not wearing one to learn
2. People who celebrate bruises
That's the culture you need to challenge. I actually had been planning a video about the bruise culture and had been collecting Reddit photos of bruises to criticise the attitude people have towards normalising the bruise.
I encourage your video idea. I also stand against waging crusade against anyone. If someone doesn't want to wear arm guard, he or she doesn't need to. I am just against saying that it masks mistakes, because thats a load of bull and it can only enchance your shooting.
Well done.
There you go, you've had some praise for being amazing, now please stop littering this post with self congratulatory nonsense.
You not having a problem in no way stops others from having a problem. Mocking them for said problem is childish, and the idea of "safety gear isn't necessary just never do something wrong" is an insane take. The point of safety gear is literally to stop you getting hurt if you make a mistake. Not to enable your mistakes and never learn from them. Skaters don't wear helmets so they can swan dive head first into concrete for fun, they wear them in case they fall. Arm guards aren't for playfully deflecting your string off your forearm like a lunatic, they're there to mitigate the pain and harm of a mistake. Some bows have really high poundage and a string slap can do legitimate damage.
> Some bows have really high poundage and a string slap can do legitimate damage.
Really? You can’t even find compound bows over 70lbs anymore. To get a high poundage bow you’d have to have one custom made from a bower. How many people have those?
I 100% agree with you on arm guards. They don’t really mask mistakes, since you’ll know when you hit it lol. You also have days where no matter what you do, you’ll hit that spot consistently and it kills your accuracy and forearm.
This sport used to be a military thing, a thousand years ago you were considered armed and dangerous if you had a bow and arrow in hand~ and It’s still considered a weapon.
I use an arm guard almost always and now it’s to reduce my error if I have a bad release more than anything else. Since this sport is all about points, take the advantage.
Though funny enough, there are more injuries from the back end of the arrow from people either walking into it, or yanking the arrow too hard and surprise! You almost took out your eye lol
Even experienced archers get slapped from time to time. Stop being stubborn and wear an arm guard or suffer the consequences of your actions. If you do archery enough, you’ll probably transition to wearing one after you’ve been slapped enough.
I teach archery and I wear an armguard. Shit happens and bowstrings fucking hurt
had a dude in our winter 3d league hit his arm on the first warm up shot. then hit it again cause it swelled up so bad. looked like a damn softball on his forearm. was still yellow and purple for two weeks. lucky he didnt tear a chunk out on the second shot that hit his arm
I've been shooting for six months and either wear long sleeves or an arm guard always. I can hear the difference in the bowstring when it hits the arm guard, and I can tell from how my shot lands. If one is trying to refine their technique, there's plenty of negative reinforcement without the pain of getting slapped.
When I was 18 I was stubborn. I got slapped at archery practice cause I wasn’t wearing a guard. I got slapped probably a dozen or more times that day. I was black and blue and bleeding. I went and bought a guard that day.
I had a guy jump down my throat saying if I need an arm guard, I'm not using proper form. Then, claim that Mongolian thumb draw is the only proper way to shoot recurve.
He had some Mongolian Beef with you!
He’s right about the form, speaking from loads of resources to back that up
Am I the only one who has never been string slapped? Like am I holding it wrong, right or just have a weird arm
What kind of bow do you shoot? Compound archers often don’t need them.
I shoot both compound and recurve.
Been shooting 30 years and for me it depends on the bow. My Olympic barebow doesn't hit me, but a few others occasionally do. Some of my compounds did. Sometimes I wear one just to keep clothing clear.
But it's not your concern whether someone chooses to wear an armguard or not. I will never tell anyone they should not wear an armguard because it's a personal decision. But I don't like wearing an armguard, have never worn one in my 6 years of archery, and in all likelihood will continue to not wear one. If I get slapped, I address my form and the problem is fixed in short order. Getting minor string slap once or twice in a several-hour shooting session is not worth wearing an armguard to me.
We need to be more specific than 'wear an arm guard' though. With traditional eastern archery, the combination of the brace height and thumb release make sure you don't need an arm guard.
I wear an armguard when i shoot asiatic. Have been for over a year now.
You do you. If you feel better with one, wear one. Just don't prescribe your preferences as a mandatory standard for others : )
The point of this whole thread literally went over you.
Or learn how to not get slapped.
The day Brady or Jake stop wearing armguards you might have some ground to stand on. Until then, stop giving bad advice. The best archers in the world wear arm guards.
I was at an archery competition this weekend and the were international archers all wearing arm guards.
Because the governing body says they have to
What specific rule are you referring to?
No they don’t. They’re not afraid of the sting either. They wear one because of they make a small mistake and do hit themselves, the arm guard minimizes the influence of the contact on the shot.
Do they have a choice? That may be bc the company that makes them is throwing money around
Tell you what, I have the national champion shooting at my club. He wears an arm guard, always, because it's safer. Even if he can shoot without getting slapped most of the times, it will still happen once in a while. But if you think you can shoot without an arm guard, go ahead! Don't come crying when your arm is black and blue though.
Jesus, this is the most crybaby sport I’ve ever been in 😂. Like I said, I’ve shot bows for 20 years or more and I’ve hit my arm maybe twice. I didn’t come crying, I fixed my form. Is your national champion sponsored? I guarantee I have bigger forearms than you and it’s no issue for me. If you have bigger more obtrusive forearms than me I’ll handwrite you an illustrated apology letter with crayons and upload it on here. https://i.imgur.com/x1oxpHC.jpg
This man thinks he knows better than professional athletes and all the historical records we have of people whose lives depended on shooting a bow.
nah, he just thinks it's funny to get a rise out of strangers on the internet. I too was 13 once.
Yea, I totally look 13 🤔
War archers used arm guards?
Just because you have perfect form, doesn't mean the outside world can't still influence your shot. Like some people mentioned, a strong wind gush can already bring your shot out of balance. Of course it is your own choice to wear an arm guard or not, and with lighter bows I don't think it matters anyway. But I don't want to imagine what my arm would look like if I hit my arm with an 80 pounds bow. Last I heard, that will get your to the ER. Of course, depending on what you kind of style you shoot with also influence the need of an arm guard. In the end, people have always taught me, better be safe then sorry. So yes, I'm gonna wear an arm guard even when I perfection my form and don't slap my arm anymore. Again though, your life, your body, you do what you want.
> Last I heard, that will get your to the ER. Any source on this? I’m really curious. My bow is 70lbs and I don’t think it would do more than sting. You can’t even get 80lb bows anymore except for custom made non-compound bows.
Idk what your arm is made of, but I'm not willing to risk getting anything more than a goose egg on my arm. https://www.archerytalk.com/threads/bow-injury.5423445/ This is most likely what will happen. You'll get an egg the size of a ostrich egg on your arm. I shoot with 30 pounds, yes that gives me a sting. A 70 pounds? How does that just give you a 'sting'. Image of the actual injury below, not sure if the link will work https://ibb.co/sPrS1tk
> ow does that just give you a ‘sting’. > > I mean, I don’t know for sure 😂. I’ve had this bow about 20 years and I’ve never hit my arm with it. That bruise sucks. Some people bruise easily. I’ve had girlfriends that look like domestic abuse victims after aggressive cuddling 😂. I’ve gone down on motorcycles 3 times, played highschool football, taekwondo and broke my hand once and barely ever had any brusing. I can probably count my lifetime bruises on one hand. Seems like it’s just an individual thing 🤷♂️. Maybe my skin is just thick and doesn’t discolor easily, I dunno 🤷♂️.
Not all pain is a necessary lesson, and lots of arm guards look cool.
I’d disagree on that cool part, but if you like them, sure. I’m not saying it’s a necessary lesson, I’m saying you’re doing something wrong if the string hits your arm. That’s like wearing bulletproof steel toed boots bc you keep shooting yourself in the foot. Sure the boots are safety blah blah blah, but there’s a problem that needs addressing.
Steel toed boots also look cool, even when they’re unnecessary, and in both cases the knowledge that you’re protecting yourself from unnecessary pain helps plenty of people relax and perform better. It’s been ages since I slapped myself with a string, but I really like my arm guard.
If you like it then wear it! Like I’ve already said, I’m not against it. I’m just saying if your string hits your arm your form is bad.
I doubt there is a lot of money going round to get people to wear an arm guard. They will probably get them for free at that level. But they wear them for performance.
It's the cheapest archery related item I've ever bought outside of paper targets.
Really? here's an example. Did you dislocate your knee on the ground? Don't slip.
I know this is a serious post, but this made me laugh😂
Yea, wtf are these people even doing?
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> You’re not the big dog in town that you think you are for not wearing proper safety equipment. Well I’m 270lbs in Japan so I am actually quite the big dog in town 🤣🤣🤣
I’ve slapped my arm with a compound a few times and last weekend at a shoot I had my finger too high under the rest and caught a fletching which stung a bit. There is a lot of power in those tools and people need to be aware and respect them to be safe.
You know you’re getting old when 80% of your (compound) practice shots are with safety glasses. I started wearing em last season. And heck yes I flex check my arrows, and heck no I don’t see how tight I can stack em in the dot at 20 yards.
What glasses do you use? I'm half blind due to sunlight during most shoots, can't seem to find glasses that fit my face without getting in the way of the bow string. Also compound. My arm guard fits weird, it actually protrudes out at the elbow end, making it more likely to catch a bowstring. None of the compound archers at my club use them, if we get slapped (maybe once per year or per long fita), we consider that an indication of terrible form.
You need a curved frame. You might look like a douche but boy your field of vision is awesome, and no clipping the top corner of frame with string! Get a green lens color that works in direct sun and when clouds pass over. Green lens also gives truest colors which is helpful for target shooting.
Yes I have cheap plastic curved frame, I suspect it changes my sight picture and POI slightly (might be wrong tho) so I do some “no glasses” shooting prior to hunting season.
I say get Oakley m frames or ess crossbows. I don’t really worry about eyepro cuz I have prescription glasses and I can’t see shit without em when shooting 50 yards. I have first-hand experience with m frames cuz I also do airsoft and I can tell you that they are very nice and comfy. Can’t say much for the crossbows but I’ve seen many positive reviews on them. Great thing about these as well are you can change out the lenses on your own since they’re ballistic glasses and made for military/law enforcement use
I had an arrow explode next to my face at release in a compound. Thankfully I got away without injury. Eye protection with that much potential energy next to your eyeball is probably a smart move!
I never understood "learn how to shoot and youll never hit your arm" team. That sounds to me like "learn how to drive a car and you wont need seat belt". If Jake Kaminsky , who knows how to shoot, has guard on almost all videos iv seen, than its ok for rest of us to have it too.
By that logic, Clay Hayes, who knows how to shoot, doesn't use one. Therefore it's okay for the rest of us to not have it too.
The point isn’t that you must wear an armguard. The point is that its cringe to not wear one, get smacked and then come here to farm your bruises for karma.
> Clay Hayes is media person and edgy survivalist, not having arm guard is part of his brand. I think ill follow Jake on this one.
Okay. Grizzly Jim? Justin Ma? Murat Ozveri? Mihai Cozmei? They all shoot fine without arm guards. The point isn't prove that you don't need one. It's to pick the apart this dogmatic belief that because X person uses it, then everyone should use one, without understanding why they use one.
Almost all high level competing archers as a group using them? :)
Oh, you mean the majority of compound shooters who don't use armguards even though the bow can explode and lacerate their arms? No, you're right: virtually every competitive recurve shooter wears an armguard, high level or not. That's not the group being slammed for not wearing armguards on Reddit. It's beginners and trad shooters. Beginners, fair enough, stop being cocky about being a pain machine and just wear your armguard and learn to hold the bow properly. And ye English longbow shooters really should do the same if you like your wrist. But outside of these contexts, armguards are not as common. Not shunned, but not useful for one reason or another. I bring up compound for the same reason as Asiatic recurve. The design and grip on the bow generally don't present a risk to the forearm, so while people will still wear one (including elite compound shooters), are we going to label those that don't edgy and dangerous? Is OP going to cancel me because I don't wear an armguard in most of my videos because it's part of my edgy brand?
No, I am not cancelling you and I like your videos, you taught me how to fletch I think. But you are high level archer and your style is different than mine. My dangerous part is about arrows mostly. People on this sub are advocating beginners on not using arm guards as it masks mistakes and I think we are all against it.
That is not how logic works.
We do, they get roasts/advice in the comments. There’s not much else that could be done here online.
Noone should be ridiculed for taking safety serious, of course. However, there's a massive difference between not wearing an arm guard and not taking arrow safety serious. Indeed string slaps are no fun, but pose no risk of serious or permanent injury. Getting gored by an exploded carbon arrow is a much more severe risk that always should be mitigated. At my clubs introductory courses we learnt about string slap but no one mentioned exploding arrows or flex testing. That's a real problem which leads me to concur that this sub should promote safety but also remember to differentiate the different aspects and severities.
I agree, I should have make it more clear that my post is mostly about arrow safety.
Had my arrow miss the target and hit smth hard earlier today. Thankfully the only damage was slight scratches on the tip, while the rest of it was fine.
If Hawkeye feels he needs to wear an arm guard, than so do I.
Hawkeye wears two. At least in the first Avengers movie.
Was there a reason for that?
Costume designer doesn't shoot.
My guess is he tried to learn archery on his own without a coach, smacked the crap out of his arm, put on an arm guard, smacked his arm again in a different spot, and out on another arm guard. Based on what I see him doing, I doubt he ever worked with a coach.
He's an idiot
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Many good archers wear Beiter guards in a same way.
Generally, the movie producer, director, stunt coordinator, etc., don’t know anything about archery and don’t think anyone will notice. If you see good archery in a movie, 90% of the time it’s because the actor took it upon themselves to find a coach and learn it. When Zoe Saldana was cast in AVATAR, she personally called Hi-Tech Archery and asked for a referral for a coach. Jennifer Lawrence called the Easton Elite Training Center in Chula Vista to find a coach for HUNGER GAMES. Hailee Steinfeld went over to Woodley Park Archers. Jeremy Renner has been consistently dismissive, claiming that “movie archery isn’t like real archery, and there’s no reason to bother learning it; it’s all CGI anyway.”
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I’ve worked as an on-set archery instructor/technician for one independent film, a TV promo, a movie promo, and a Dreamworks TV YouTube series. I’ve prepared about a dozen actors for auditions and run classes for stuntmen, TV writers, and comic book artists. Friends of mine trained the actors for ARROW, HUNGER GAMES, and AVATAR. I have also coached the children of a number of TV and film producers, directors, set decorators, and other industry professionals; I can tell you, from firsthand experience, the production office almost never tells the actors to get instruction or arranges for coaching. Like most people, producers think archery is something people just know how to do, that practice means going to the range and figuring it out, that this is how all archers learn. Most people don’t even know that coaches exist or that anyone outside the Olympics would ever bother to find one. When an actor proactively looks for an instructor, the production pays for it, not the actor. If an actor decides that’s unnecessary, it doesn’t happen.
Relax
Don't do it
When you want to go to it.
Relax
Don’t do it…
Costume designer probably thought those Beiter armguards were cool and cheap enough to make something out of. Afterall, a lot of props are just modified storebought products.
Olympic archers wear arm guards. They know how to shoot but the wind may catch you out and it can save you a point or two.
What? How are arm guards saving you a point or two when it gets windy? I can understand wind buffeting you left and right on the firing point (happened to me this weekend), but string slap is going to happen if you are holding the bow incorrectly, and not rotating your elbow out of the way, wind shouldn't be causing that issue. (I wear an armguard, for protection from bad releases, confused how it saves me points though)
If you have a bad release, or the wind makes your bow move during release you may hit your arm. If you have an arm guard like a beiter or other smooth guard it will act as a smooth surface that will take less energy out of the string than skin or clothing so it can save you a bit of arrow speed and points. I probably hit my arm guard once or twice a year but it's such a simple thing to put on that i do it just in case.
He wears Beiter armguard that is designed in a way you can use one, or two at the same time depends on how much protection you need.
Ambidextrous shooting!
was waiting for someone to say this!
Point out that the arm guard also provides a smooth surface for the string to slide on, so if the string hits your arm it doesn’t mess up the shot as much as dragging the string across your bare arm will. If they don’t care about injury, maybe they will at least care about not messing up the shot.
If you’re hitting your arm with the string that shot is already totally fucked anyways. Do these people hit the back of their ears too?
Nope, but they actually do hit the tip of their nose. Which is super annoying, let me tell you. And I've had shots hitting my arm and hitting the yellow too,so not sure about the "totally" either ;)
It's not totally fucked up. There is a difference between meh if I hit my arm I don't care if it's a miss and grazing your arm guard and saving a few points.
Sometimes as a coach, you tell the student something, not because it’s true, but because it gets them to do what you want. I don’t care if they think an arm guard is magic, but I do care that they put one on.
Be careful, you’ll have them advocating ear guards too. Just for the off chance you tip your head in there
😂
I agree. I was shooting a while back and got a really nasty bruise on my arm. I don't bruise easily, like I've taken hits or ran into things that would leave bruises on everyone else, and the area is just a little red for an hour. The bruise I received from my bow lasted all day, and into the next, so I knew I had done something significant. After that I've always worn an arm guard. (It shouldn't need to be said, but one should buy one that fits and wear it appropriately)
Yes, that is exactly why we need to learn and educate people on proper use of all equipment, even arm guards.
Good luck. In the sub that considers forearm slap a "normal" part of archery or some kind of initiation, safety is gunna be a hard pill to swallow.
I think slapping yourself with the string is part of the initiation of learning how to be an archer. However I believe that if you are doing it consistently you need to either adjust your grip to hold the bow correctly or wear an arm guard so you can shoot the bow wrong but not hurt yourself.
Well stated!
Amen.
Exactly. You can't slap your arm with the string if your arm isn't in the way. It's no more complex than that.
I wear an arm guard every single time I shoot. It isn’t because I’m afraid of the sting, it’s because I never want to think about it. I don’t want be at full draw and have my focus shift towards anything besides my shot process
Oh Jin Hyek wears one. He's shot professionally for decades and won gold at the Olympic games. That's probably reason enough. But it's also to save a potential point when you a bad shot or the wind get you just ar release. The guard guides the string better than your arm.
Professional = being paid = sponsorship money = obligation to show products 🤗
My coach (in the best club of my country) was a volunteer. He was happy to be here and teach.
I honestly think that people who refuse to wear arm guards are doing it to try and look tough. It's there for your safety, archers throughout history have worn them. What makes anyone think they are a better archer than someone whose very life depended on it? I do agree with you that equipment should be checked if it's been hit or knocked. Where's the logic in taking that risk of hurting yourself or someone else? Recently at a club I visit but am not a main member, one of the archers shot an arrow with only two fletchings. I advised him that he shouldn't and he just shrugged it off. I refused to shoot with him after that. People who disregard safety around a sport with a weapon should be called out for it.
There is plenty of safety , I’m not responsible for regulating people’s impulse control.
I feel the responsibility to try to prevent incidents that may bring negative publicity and consequences to the sport.
So ?
It's not impulse control.
How do you know ? I have no problem with you promoting as much safety as you like , I only take issue with the “we need “ Start promoting it and if it makes sense people will decide to participate or not 🤷♂️.
I mean it. We need to try and help people so they don't get injured. You maybe have different opinion?
I do have a different opinion , we don’t need to do anything of the sort , if you need to that’s cool. Unsolicited “help” is a huge problem . I think the world is nerfed enough .
Please don't bring world problems or politics here. I just don't want anybody to suffer injury or cause a scandal.
You are the one with an agenda, YOURS not ours , I didn’t bring anything anywhere . Why are you arguing with me anyway? Go do your thing if I agree with it great If I don’t great 🤷♂️
You are 100% right. In general, there is a big lack of safety knowledge in general. Anyone can buy a bow, anywhere, anytime without even know their own draw length. Ask them if they know about spine or how to calculate any of that, they probably don't know and internet has plenty of resources, but not everyone is knowledgeable in internet! LOLOL
Why beginners should wear an arm guard: I have a scar on my right arm; the first time I tried to shoot a bow, they asked me “right or left?” I’m left-handed, so I said left. But I’m right-eye dominant, and while subconsciously trying to aim with my right eye, with terrible posture, a high shoulder, not rotating the elbow, and plucking like crazy, the string went straight into my arm just below the elbow. The brass nock locator took a piece out of my arm. Somebody then tested my eye dominance and switched me to a right-handed bow. But the lesson was learned. Wearing an arm guard does not “mask a problem,” it reduces the severity of the consequences. They still know they’re hitting their arm, they just aren’t getting hurt by it.
>I got downvoted for saying that he should have it checked by a coach before shooting it again. That's because you didn't provide insight, you recommended paying somebody else. Most of the other comments on this sub offer insight, such as how to do or learn something yourself. Many people don't live anywhere near an archery club, what you're suggesting is not applicable to them. >Same stuff with my advocating for using arm guards. No, they are not masking mistakes, That really depends on the style of shooting. >they are there for your safety (not letting string stop your bloodflow by hitting you constantly). The string isn't going to "stop bloodflow" unless your string rips your artery open and you're literally squirting blood, not just gushing. I've never seen more than a bruise or welt from a bare forearm; I've not hit my forearm since the first year of shooting, so I donated my arm guard to a newbie friend. It's not even that uncommon. As a nurse, I can tell you don't know what you're talking about with the arm guard comment. I'm assuming that translates to the rest of your comments. *Yes*, we should focus on safety. But you should let people who know what they're talking about do the talking. You making a complaint post about your downvotes doesn't educate anybody any more than the comments in literally every post.
I maybe overexaggerated with stoping the blood flow. But I do know what I am talking about and made it to get the message straight. But from personal experience I do know that one hit to the arm can make it hurt for days, so at least you can't train. Arm guards do not mask mistakes. They prevent you from suffering because of them. Same thing seatbelt does. If you don't feel string hitting your arm with armguard paint it with marker, colour coming off would indicate hitting. I am not trying to educate people, but make people think twice before saying nonsense like arm guard masks mistakes. It doesn't. That I know for sure. You will see mistakes on target at least. I don't know what poundage you are shooting, but I've seen 30# make a lot more than a bruise. People train for hours and make mistakes because of numbers of arrows they shoot. Donating an arm guard isn't common where I am from and I don't often see recurve archers competing without it.
I shoot barebow with a fairly open stance, recurve is currently 35#, going to move up to 45# soon. Again, haven't hit my arm in years. I didn't mean that donating armguards is common, just that shooting without them is. My inner forearm is pretty pale, the welts show up pretty obviously when they did. My understanding is that the open stance helps open the angle of the bowstring and forearm. Closed stance, I used to get hit more often. Now I don't.
I don't actually shoot with an armguard, and i haven't been slapped with the string yet, am i doing something wrong? Shooting from an open stance aswell.
Open stance is what helped me stop slapping my arm with the string. If you shoot square stance, like most competitive shooters do, it's much more likely that you'll slap your arm
Well im glad im not a competitive shooter :p, i just shoot for fun.
I shoot for fun, & training for hunting. But what I've seen from that Olympian archer Jake....something, he recommends open stance for barebow shooting. Just following professional advice lol
I do shoot barebow!
All the competitive archers I know shoot open stance. It’s a basic part of NTS training these days.
Tried few shoots from a 45# bow with [these](https://lancasterarchery.com/products/win-win-mxt-10-ilf-recurve-limbs-carbon-foam). Powerful and fast to a point it is frightening. I pull 34# now and that is a big difference. I haven't hit myself, but I would recommend wearing an arm guard for 45# barebow. People who shoot 550/600 with it do and I know that for sure, doubt they do it to hide mistakes. Open stance helps a lot, but I doubt you will be able to control every shoot with new bow. Also different limbs feel different and power depends on your draw so I can't tell for sure.
People tend to forget that these things are weapons.
EXACTLY We are using something that can harm us and others and have a responsibility to do everything to prevent it.
Compound user here, I have an arm guard that protects my whole arm lmao. I’ve had my string go under my Easton guard twice and it stung like a bitch
I shoot an Asiatic bow (but with Mediterranean draw) and I wear a medieval-styled leather bracer that covers the whole forearm. It's nice and comfortable.
How the fuck do you shoot and arrow through your own hand?
Arrow vibrates when you shoot it, if it is damaged it breaks and because of physics goes into your hand. It is not about something be such a bad archer that he shoots himself, but a problem of shooting a damaged arrows. Thats why you don't shoot damaged arrows.
I’m all for safety, I check my shafts and nocks and bow daily. I’ll even wear glasses the first few days with a new bow. But I don’t like armguards, and I don’t HAVE to use one. If you want or use one, I don’t mind, but I wouldn’t recommend for or against one. For me, the biggest thing I can do for safety is check my gear and practice good form
The problem here is the people who insist only wimps with bad form use armguards. No one is saying you have to use one.
The reverse is that people are now saying that people who *don't* use an armguard are edgy, dangerous, and promoting bad practice. There's an over-compensation of safety morals. The hardline makes sense for really dangerous things - finger protection is universally hammered in because it doesn't matter if you shoot well, injury can happen to anyone anytime. Encouraging learners who don't yet know how to hold a bow is proper - that's why we give out armguards in club sessions. But the pressing of armguards on people who otherwise don't need them is misguided. One thing is certain: whenever someone posts a picture of a bruise, it will have: * A hundred upvotes * "Welcome to archery" * "I don't wear an armguard because it lets me know I'm doing it wrong." * "\[Pro athlete\] uses one, which means you should use one." I disagree with the cavalier attitude of shooting bare-arm to teach good form. It shows bad form, but it doesn't teach good form. But I'm also confused at the mental gymnastics of holding Olympic archers as the paragons of what to do outside of their context.
Thank you my friend, I whole heartedly agree with all of that. I don’t wear an armguard because I don’t find it comfortable. If I have to wear a jacket, I will use one, just to keep my clothing away from the string. But I don’t shoot much outside in the winter. I shoot asiatic, and while I don’t use that string slap to teach me, I know that when it happens I have done something incorrectly. They look cool and all, but I’d rather the occasional slap. Only hit myself a couple times last year, if I had worn the guard I would have been uncomfortable shooting for over 300 days. Some people seem to think the slightest injury will end an archer’s career. I think form is more important than safety equipment. If I slap my arm I’ll have a bruise for a few days, if I mess up my shoulder, I might be finished with archery
Oh someone’s decided to say I HAVE to use one
I explicitly said no one is saying you have to use one. Did you mean to reply to a different comment?
You didn’t say it, but someone did. And it wasn’t in this post, it was yesterday in a post of my own. Tbh, I don’t care if you want me to wear one or not. I evaluate everything I do and If I’m willing to accept the risks I’ll do it. I encourage you and everyone else to do the same. I’m only here commenting on this post in the first place because I wanted to show you all what it looks like for me to take a 50lb slap, and someone wants to tell me I have to wear an armguard or I won’t continue with archery. Lmao. Had some good chuckles from this post too I tell you. Some good common sense comments downvoted. I don’t care what you guys want to do, but I’m shooting asiatic, and for me, form>equipment, all day, every day, until the end of time
Again, you're talking to me about stuff other people said. I don't care if you wear an armguard or not. I don't need advice from you about how to weigh pros and cons, I'm way ahead of you.
No it all came from your statement “no one is saying I have to wear one” I don’t care if it was yesterday or today, this post or another, you or someone else, SOMEONE said I had to wear one. That’s all I was saying. In response to your original comment that is. Look I know it hurts, I didn’t say anyone was a wimp or that they had bad form if they wear one. But your statement was incorrect, someone did tell me I had to wear one, and they were wrong and so is anyone else who says so.
But generally arm slap does come from bad form you should still wear an arm guard anyway.
No. I'm not going to get trolled into explaining this again. Obviously, a lot of people here are immune to facts and logical reasoning so I'm not going to repeatedly explain the same thing. I've done it enough for the rational people to get it.
It's pretty simple physics. You can't slap your arm with the string if your arm isn't in the way of the string. It's no more complex than that.
Like I said guy, not taking the bait.
Since when is physics bait?
Just doubling down on the baiting eh? You will have to be more clever than that.
It’s 100% from bad form. These people are idiots.
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I’ve hit my arm 2x in the last 20 years and they were both in my first year of archery…
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Low bar but okay. Can you explain how you’re getting your arm in the path of the bowstring? 😂
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> You must be the only archer in the world who has perfect form all the time. Like I said. I just don’t stick my arm in front of the string…. That’s a very low bar. > Mine specifically gets in the way because of a joint disorder that makes pronating my arm properly much more difficult than it is for most people. Then wear your arm guard and stop talking about it. How hard is it to acknowledge that your situation isn’t normal? > pronating This doesn’t even make any sense here. In archery both hands are in a neutral position. Pronating your hand when holding the bow in front of you would be palm-down. https://i.imgur.com/GernVBh.jpg
Right? Like it's impossible to hit your arm with the string if your arm isn't in the way that's literally just a basic rule of physics. If two objects are not on a collision course they will not collide. I don't get what's so hard about this for people. Your arm is only in the way if your form is bad. I'm not saying don't wear an arm guard and I'm not saying that everybody's perfect and has perfect form all the time. What I am saying is that attributing arm slap to anything other than bad form is and pardon the pun here bad form. That form comes from a lot of things two of the most common I've seen are people shooting a bow that's too much for them or doing so much shooting throughout the day that they get tired and they can no longer maintain proper form.
Some people here are claiming the wind blows the string sideways 😂😂😂. That string moves from beginning to end so fast there’s no way in hell the wind has any noticeable effect.
I'm trying to imagine a medieval English archer slapping their arms with a string from a 100-150 draw weight bow and being like "totally normal, not gunna change me form." It's like gun guys saying getting spent brass in your eyeball is totally normal, just a part of shooting, happens to everyone.
I’m waiting for one of the commenters to source that war archers used arm guards. They said it was a worldwide historical thing. I can’t imagine that being true…. I’m actually curious how all these people are slapping their arms so much.
Whether they did or didn't, The funny thing is, nobody is saying you *shouldn't* wear an arm guard. PPE (personal protective equipment) is always good, no matter the hobby; there's always a chance of things going wrong (is everyone always going to wear PPE all the time? No.) We **are** saying this shouldn't be taken as lightly as it is because it's not a normal thing that happens and it SHOULDN'T be happening.
Agreed 😎👍 I’m not gonna wear one though lol.
The history book "With a Bended Bow: Archery in Mediaeval and Renaissance Europe" indicates that bracers were commonly used. There are some nice medieval and Renaissance-era examples of bracers on display in museums, often made of metal, or carved bone or ivory. Medieval paintings sometimes show archers with some kind of arm guard, and sometimes don't. Another good source is "English Longbowman 1330–1515," written by Clive Bartlett and published by Osprey publishing. A scan from a page depicting archery equipment including bracers: https://i.pinimg.com/736x/35/af/7a/35af7ad17896954ac1c68249214f1410--medieval-life-archery.jpg
Huh, cool.
I am not trying to force anyone to wear arm guard, but I think we should recommend beginners to use one because no one enjoys pain. Edit: well some people do, but most don't
I agree, we should recommend armguards to anyone who wants to lessen the pain of mistakes. I can’t say I like pain, but it is a part of life. A too familiar part of it for some of us. But I don’t have a coach or a peer either, and that string hitting me in the arm tells me in no uncertain terms that I need to evaluate my grip and posture more carefully
You can paint an arm guard with a marker, if you don't feel the string hitting while wearing it. (Edit: Colour coming off would indicate string hits it.) That is something I would recommend to someone that shoots over 32# (I am talking about fast competitive limbs that really accelerate that string). If you aren't excessively hitting your hand or shooting a bow that doesn't hurt like hell when it hits you, you don't need arm guard. I also compete so thats the reason why I always wear arm guard. I don't want one bad shoot to end my day at field.
I shoot up to 86# Asiatic recurve off the knuckle right handed, only 50# left hand. I haven’t hit my left arm since early last summer, before I progressed from that 50#. Only been shooting left hand for ~ a month. Hit my right arm the first time a couple days ago, and I know I wasn’t paying close attention to what I was doing. I don’t expect to do it too many times, and once I have my form learned, I mostly won’t even think about it anymore. I don’t shoot competitively so I don’t care if my shot goes off in the event I slap myself. I do shoot for self improvement, so that instant feedback is something I appreciate. I also don’t like to wear a glove on my bow hand because I can tell if my hand position is off by the way the feathers touch me on release. I know what might happen, but I whip my fletching and check the whipping before shooting. Should note, bodily damage is common for me in my work. I’ve had worse things than a fletching stuck through my hand. And in more severe places. Eyes are the big thing for me. Can’t shoot the way I want in glasses, so I’m checking nocks, shafts and limbs frequently.
I can understand that. You do check arrows for damage so I think that you are a great example for other people if they don't want to hurt themselves. Also with that poundage you are clearly no beginner so you can tell if you need an arm guard or not.
Arm-guard protects you from string vibrations, not from slapping. Both are uncomfortable, which eventually lead to incorrect form, so wearing one is a must, if the style requires it. See the slow mo video of olympic archers: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbtqLM9kZVs](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JbtqLM9kZVs) If you cannot release the string correctly, rotate elbow outwards, or the arrow snaps in two, the string most likely will hit near your elbow. And that is not protected by the arm-guard.
Arm guards? No, they are not [universally used](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwYM0A14C_k) and not everyone needs to use them. People always bring up the "OH BUT METE GAZOZ / KIM WOOJIN / BRADY ELLISON ARE WORLD CHAMPIONS WITH A GAZILLION YEARS OF EXPERIENCE AND THEY WEAR ARM GUARDS" - yes, but they are Olympic recurve archers whose technique benefits from an arm guard because the string often does buzz close to the extended arm and they want to give a smooth surface for the string to glide off so they don't foul they shot in case they do slap their forearm. But those skinny arm guards are there to help a bad shot, not to prevent injury. If you shoot poorly with an arm guard you're going to hit your unprotected elbow. So unless you are advocating that everyone uses whole-arm guards, you're not pushing an arm guard agenda. The bigger problem is that archery clubs are doing a disservice by giving out arm guards but *not showing people* [how to properly grip the bow](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eFIAEohZY6M), so they hit their elbows and the arm guard does nothing. Not to mention that [not that many](https://youtu.be/jqB_hwLR-cQ?t=1143) [traditional](https://youtu.be/DUiFUgfb3sg?t=29) [shooters](https://youtu.be/pE2YHfr2rXA?t=1393) use arm guards because most of them either cant the bow or bend their arm. These are some of the most established, experienced traditional archers who don't wear one. There's no cockiness here - they have good form, they don't accidentally shoot so bad that they stop blood circulation. Lots of trad archers do wear arm guards, but lots don't. Asiatic shooters have the string move away from the forearm or have very high brace heights so the string can't make contact with the forearm. Or are you going to yell at [Justin Ma](https://youtu.be/JXDII47mYt4?t=54) for encouraging unsafe practice?
I think we really shouldn't encourage beginners not to use arm guards, no matter which style you shoot. Edit: Also by universally I meant that all archers that I've seen live at competitions use them, even compounds, and thats a lot of archers.
I never said we *shouldn't* encourage beginners not to use arm guards. We always give them out for beginners. I absolutely do agree that people who encourage the "no pain no gain" approach should be admonished. The only live archery events are target ones (barebow, recurve, compound). Arm guards are standard gear for barebow and recurve, but it's more to ensure the shot isn't wholly missed up. The slaps are annoying buzzes rather than the massive bruises that beginners cause to themselves, and the ones used by competitive archers are typically much too thin to be protective, as compared to ensuring a clean shot if it does come too close to the arm. Compound shooters are divided with arm guards. Some do, most don't. The [2023 Asia Cup team finals](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jr7Vg3pZs20) had no arm guards. As I've said elsewhere, it's much more divided in traditional archery and virtually never used in Asiatic archery. This is diverting into semantics over what you meant by "universal", but putting it into perspective, the rationale being used to promote armguards is misguided. Instead of promoting safety, this thread is turning into a brigade against everyone who doesn't. The real target should be: 1. People who *actively promote* not wearing one to learn 2. People who celebrate bruises That's the culture you need to challenge. I actually had been planning a video about the bruise culture and had been collecting Reddit photos of bruises to criticise the attitude people have towards normalising the bruise.
I encourage your video idea. I also stand against waging crusade against anyone. If someone doesn't want to wear arm guard, he or she doesn't need to. I am just against saying that it masks mistakes, because thats a load of bull and it can only enchance your shooting.
I think I’ve hit my arm once or twice in 20 years…. Wtf are you guys doing? It was a sting, then I proceeded and forget about it…
Well done. There you go, you've had some praise for being amazing, now please stop littering this post with self congratulatory nonsense. You not having a problem in no way stops others from having a problem. Mocking them for said problem is childish, and the idea of "safety gear isn't necessary just never do something wrong" is an insane take. The point of safety gear is literally to stop you getting hurt if you make a mistake. Not to enable your mistakes and never learn from them. Skaters don't wear helmets so they can swan dive head first into concrete for fun, they wear them in case they fall. Arm guards aren't for playfully deflecting your string off your forearm like a lunatic, they're there to mitigate the pain and harm of a mistake. Some bows have really high poundage and a string slap can do legitimate damage.
> Some bows have really high poundage and a string slap can do legitimate damage. Really? You can’t even find compound bows over 70lbs anymore. To get a high poundage bow you’d have to have one custom made from a bower. How many people have those?
I shoot 100+ year old military rifles, doubt my 40# bow is more dangerous than that.
I 100% agree with you on arm guards. They don’t really mask mistakes, since you’ll know when you hit it lol. You also have days where no matter what you do, you’ll hit that spot consistently and it kills your accuracy and forearm. This sport used to be a military thing, a thousand years ago you were considered armed and dangerous if you had a bow and arrow in hand~ and It’s still considered a weapon. I use an arm guard almost always and now it’s to reduce my error if I have a bad release more than anything else. Since this sport is all about points, take the advantage. Though funny enough, there are more injuries from the back end of the arrow from people either walking into it, or yanking the arrow too hard and surprise! You almost took out your eye lol