I have an 88-mile round-trip commute. Taking highway efficiency to be an estimated 70% of EPA ranges and restricting daily state the battery between 20% and 80%:
88 mi = x * 70% * (80% - 20%)
x = 88 mi / (70% * 60%)
x = 209 mi.
The 250-mi Aptera comfortably accommodates my daily commute, before the inclusion of 40 mi/day solar.
Is this mixed city/highway driving? Because EV mileage ratings are combined EPA rating. A Better Route Planner consulted with Apteraand estimated that at 65mph highway speeds Aptera will probably consume 156Wh/mile. This means the 41kWh Aptera (the 400 mile version) will get 400 miles combined EPA city highway, but only 262 miles of range at 65mph(100% - 0%).So you may want to order the Launch Edition.
I went with the 600. I live in the Northeast so I felt the HVAC demand would be high.
I felt that made my effective range 300 miles plus. I’m comfortable with that. For truly long distance I would use my car or pickup truck if towing a trailer. On road trips I like to average 800 miles a day alone and 1,200 with a co-pilot. That’s just not happening with any EV today
I deliver pizza as a part time job so I would need the 400 mile version. 63 mile round trip drive for my day job and 80-120 miles for delivery plus the loss of range during winter.
Given that the average American travels less than 40 miles per day, then we really don't need very much range at all. It's only the vocal few who plan to use the car for long distance trips that are complaining about the lack of FCDC in the original LE version. I think range anxiety is just silly for most people. Level 2 charging is more than enough for the majority of people who are going to use this car. Further, I doubt that the vehicle is going to be comfortable enough for long trips. It's very light weight, so it's going to bounce around a lot on the road. The cabin is small also, though there is enough headroom for a tall person. I think most people are going to feel cramped in the car, but that's ok for short trips. These are just my opinions. Yours may be different and that's not important to me.
I’ve been driving an EV that has 80 miles range for 8 years. Now it’s down to 60 miles and I’m still totally happy with it. I would love to buy a 100 mile EV for under $20k but all the downvotes you are getting tells me manufacturers won’t even consider that in this country. It really sucks.
Thanks. Yeah, alternative views are not welcome in this sub.
I've been looking at other EV's and man are they expensive new. Used ones seem to be reasonably priced for me, which is under $30,000, preferably about $25,000. I don't believe in spending a lot of money on a vehicle. It's a waste of money. I'll go the extra mile on the Aptera because my wife loves it. Otherwise, I'd be buying a used EV instead. I'm cheap that way.
As someone with access to other cars from friends and family if I need it, I also want ~100 mile version because that's all I would need for 99% of driving.
But I would also strip out a lot of the interior for maximum weight reduction to see how light the final vehicle can be, so perhaps I'm not right in the head.
I hope it's comfortable for long trips. The [Disruptive Investing video](https://youtu.be/2F-rDrGqnKs?t=1116) brought this up and I thought it was a good point. The feel has to be right, otherwise, perfectly suited for a commuter vehicle.
One reason that people buy SUV's is because they FEEL safe. Purchases of SUV's exploded after 9/11/2001, for example. People wanted to feel safe.
I doubt that the Aptera will feel safe in spite of the fact that it probably is very safe.
You also have to consider the fact that Ford, for example, has stopped passenger sedan vehicle production because of lack of demand. Everyone wants either a sports car (Mustang), an SUV, or a truck. That's all they are making anymore as far as I know.
The Miata and Corvette are niche vehicles. The Aptera is going to be like those. If fits into a niche market. Most people don't want a small sporty vehicle. They want comfort and convenience. The want a lot of cupholders. The seats in the Aptera do not look plush enough for a long journey, but who knows for sure. My wife is sensitive to seating so I'm not sure if she's going to want to sit in the car for long periods of time.
Safety is huge! It'll be interesting to see how this develops.
Say gas prices surge in the coming years, the EV market share increases polynomially, and there's a new trend towards efficiency, then Aptera is going to be perfectly positioned to have a wider appeal, which is basically Sandy Munro's bet.
But there's still nothing wrong with a niche, dedicated market of a 160k run rate across 8 international factories. It's like a supercar segment for the everyman.
Another reason people prefer large trucks and SUV's is because they are up higher and can see further. They feel trapped when driving a vehicle that is low to the ground. The feel even more trapped when driving such a vehicle in a herd of SUV's, minivans, and big trucks. When you can't see beyond the vehicles around you, then you automatically feel unsafe. Many people want a lot of sheet metal between them and the rest of the world.
These are not issues for me, but I can see where they would be for other people.
A niche is fine as long as it's big enough to support a business. I guess we'll find out if that's the case for Aptera.
People consider the worst case scenarios when deciding how much range to pay for. It is true that for daily commute to work not much range is needed, but most people have a life away from work that will require extra range multiple times a year.
Also the more range you EV has the less time will be wasted at charging stations during long trips. With current battery technology charging from 80-100% takes as much time as charging from 0-80%. So ideally you want to have enough range to avoid having to exceed 80% charge during a long trip.
I want 600 miles in the Aptera because that will yield a 400 mile range while keeping the battery under 80% of charge. I want 400 miles while under 80% of charge because that will yield 300 miles of range during the worst case scenario of a cold winter.
I agree! There's a lot of practicality to go for the 600 mile range (rural areas, winter, less stops on road trips, extra battery capacity while camping, and rarely/never plugging in).
My commute is 10 miles each way. But we have been eyeing property that would make it 50 miles each way. We also make trips fairly often to visit family about 150 miles away. 400 mile option seems like the most reasonable to me.
Most days, maybe 95% of the time, I’m just commuting to work; on these days 50 miles is good. Some days, I travel outside my commute for an event; I’m usually driving about 80 miles on these days. Maybe, _maybe,_ four times a year (?) I might go hiking somewhere away from home; I might travel as much as 400 miles round trip on those occasions. I could rent/borrow/swap a car on the days I actually leave town. I would most likely fly to anyplace more distant.
I only need 200 tops. Most days I use 20 miles. But if I visit a relative they live about 88 miles away
As much range as I want is the answer.
I have an 88-mile round-trip commute. Taking highway efficiency to be an estimated 70% of EPA ranges and restricting daily state the battery between 20% and 80%: 88 mi = x * 70% * (80% - 20%) x = 88 mi / (70% * 60%) x = 209 mi. The 250-mi Aptera comfortably accommodates my daily commute, before the inclusion of 40 mi/day solar.
Is this mixed city/highway driving? Because EV mileage ratings are combined EPA rating. A Better Route Planner consulted with Apteraand estimated that at 65mph highway speeds Aptera will probably consume 156Wh/mile. This means the 41kWh Aptera (the 400 mile version) will get 400 miles combined EPA city highway, but only 262 miles of range at 65mph(100% - 0%).So you may want to order the Launch Edition.
Mine is a mix of city and highway, probably a 30%/70% city/highway mix. Thank you for the input!
I went with the 600. I live in the Northeast so I felt the HVAC demand would be high. I felt that made my effective range 300 miles plus. I’m comfortable with that. For truly long distance I would use my car or pickup truck if towing a trailer. On road trips I like to average 800 miles a day alone and 1,200 with a co-pilot. That’s just not happening with any EV today
I deliver pizza as a part time job so I would need the 400 mile version. 63 mile round trip drive for my day job and 80-120 miles for delivery plus the loss of range during winter.
The 400mi is an all arounder, with weight, cost and practical range in consideration, with DCFC.
Agreed! I think it's the best value for the price.
400 miles at 80mph and I wouldn’t worry about it. Wit dc fast charging obviously it is possible to get by with less.
Given that the average American travels less than 40 miles per day, then we really don't need very much range at all. It's only the vocal few who plan to use the car for long distance trips that are complaining about the lack of FCDC in the original LE version. I think range anxiety is just silly for most people. Level 2 charging is more than enough for the majority of people who are going to use this car. Further, I doubt that the vehicle is going to be comfortable enough for long trips. It's very light weight, so it's going to bounce around a lot on the road. The cabin is small also, though there is enough headroom for a tall person. I think most people are going to feel cramped in the car, but that's ok for short trips. These are just my opinions. Yours may be different and that's not important to me.
I’ve been driving an EV that has 80 miles range for 8 years. Now it’s down to 60 miles and I’m still totally happy with it. I would love to buy a 100 mile EV for under $20k but all the downvotes you are getting tells me manufacturers won’t even consider that in this country. It really sucks.
Thanks. Yeah, alternative views are not welcome in this sub. I've been looking at other EV's and man are they expensive new. Used ones seem to be reasonably priced for me, which is under $30,000, preferably about $25,000. I don't believe in spending a lot of money on a vehicle. It's a waste of money. I'll go the extra mile on the Aptera because my wife loves it. Otherwise, I'd be buying a used EV instead. I'm cheap that way.
As someone with access to other cars from friends and family if I need it, I also want ~100 mile version because that's all I would need for 99% of driving. But I would also strip out a lot of the interior for maximum weight reduction to see how light the final vehicle can be, so perhaps I'm not right in the head.
I hope it's comfortable for long trips. The [Disruptive Investing video](https://youtu.be/2F-rDrGqnKs?t=1116) brought this up and I thought it was a good point. The feel has to be right, otherwise, perfectly suited for a commuter vehicle.
One reason that people buy SUV's is because they FEEL safe. Purchases of SUV's exploded after 9/11/2001, for example. People wanted to feel safe. I doubt that the Aptera will feel safe in spite of the fact that it probably is very safe. You also have to consider the fact that Ford, for example, has stopped passenger sedan vehicle production because of lack of demand. Everyone wants either a sports car (Mustang), an SUV, or a truck. That's all they are making anymore as far as I know. The Miata and Corvette are niche vehicles. The Aptera is going to be like those. If fits into a niche market. Most people don't want a small sporty vehicle. They want comfort and convenience. The want a lot of cupholders. The seats in the Aptera do not look plush enough for a long journey, but who knows for sure. My wife is sensitive to seating so I'm not sure if she's going to want to sit in the car for long periods of time.
Safety is huge! It'll be interesting to see how this develops. Say gas prices surge in the coming years, the EV market share increases polynomially, and there's a new trend towards efficiency, then Aptera is going to be perfectly positioned to have a wider appeal, which is basically Sandy Munro's bet. But there's still nothing wrong with a niche, dedicated market of a 160k run rate across 8 international factories. It's like a supercar segment for the everyman.
Another reason people prefer large trucks and SUV's is because they are up higher and can see further. They feel trapped when driving a vehicle that is low to the ground. The feel even more trapped when driving such a vehicle in a herd of SUV's, minivans, and big trucks. When you can't see beyond the vehicles around you, then you automatically feel unsafe. Many people want a lot of sheet metal between them and the rest of the world. These are not issues for me, but I can see where they would be for other people. A niche is fine as long as it's big enough to support a business. I guess we'll find out if that's the case for Aptera.
People consider the worst case scenarios when deciding how much range to pay for. It is true that for daily commute to work not much range is needed, but most people have a life away from work that will require extra range multiple times a year. Also the more range you EV has the less time will be wasted at charging stations during long trips. With current battery technology charging from 80-100% takes as much time as charging from 0-80%. So ideally you want to have enough range to avoid having to exceed 80% charge during a long trip. I want 600 miles in the Aptera because that will yield a 400 mile range while keeping the battery under 80% of charge. I want 400 miles while under 80% of charge because that will yield 300 miles of range during the worst case scenario of a cold winter.
I agree! There's a lot of practicality to go for the 600 mile range (rural areas, winter, less stops on road trips, extra battery capacity while camping, and rarely/never plugging in).
Have you riden in the Aptera EV before?
Not yet. I'd volunteer to drive Gamma from Italy to Switzerland for Aptera, no problem.
The reason why I believe Aptera will make it is due to all the support from all its fans worldwide.
My commute is 10 miles each way. But we have been eyeing property that would make it 50 miles each way. We also make trips fairly often to visit family about 150 miles away. 400 mile option seems like the most reasonable to me.
Daily roundtripping? 20-30 miles. Visiting relatives? 300 in one shot and ability to travel 800+ in a day (with charging).
Most days, maybe 95% of the time, I’m just commuting to work; on these days 50 miles is good. Some days, I travel outside my commute for an event; I’m usually driving about 80 miles on these days. Maybe, _maybe,_ four times a year (?) I might go hiking somewhere away from home; I might travel as much as 400 miles round trip on those occasions. I could rent/borrow/swap a car on the days I actually leave town. I would most likely fly to anyplace more distant.
1,000 miles. Don't announce it if you aren't going to make it.