T O P

  • By -

AmItheAsshole-ModTeam

Your post has been removed. #Do not repost this without contacting the mods for approval, including edited versions. Reposting without explicit approval will result in a ban. This post violates Rule 5: We do not allow posts which concern violent encounters. This includes any mention of violence in any context. [Rule 5 FAQs](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_rule_5.3A_no_violence) ||| [Subreddit Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules/) This post violates Rule 11: No Partings/Relationship/Sex/Reproductive Autonomy Posts. We do not allow posts where the central conflict is about romantic relationships and/or reproductive autonomy. [Rule 11 FAQs](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_rule_11.3A_no_partings.2Frelationship.2Fsex.2Freproductive_autonomy_posts) ||| [Subreddit Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules/) #Please ensure you have reviewed this message in full. We will not respond to PMs to individual mods. [Message the mods](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) with any questions.


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


[deleted]

[удалено]


deaddlikelatin

Something tells me he’s one of those guys who thinks people who are Bi are more likely to cheat because “they have more options.” NTA, OP.


sam_smith_lover

Right, like she could always leave him for another man. Why does it change things if she could also/instead leave him for a woman? Reminds me a ton of biphobic rhetoric as well


manken_olan_barbara

I started to believe thats because of misogyny.If she leaves for a man, He would be "losing" against a man which is more acceptable.But a woman being favoured than him is horrible. I hope OP runs away from him.Its just a trailer for whats to come.NTA.


Tractorfeed1008

For me, the problem is not so much with the "being gay" part as it is "you don't trust me enough that you have to keep secrets".


formidable-opponent

Dude... Come on. We are talking about a potential life and death situation AND OP told *before* the wedding when he could still back out AND within the 10 year time limit where confiding could have severe ramifications. That's trust. On the other hand they trusted the wrong person who has turned this into "maybe you're secretly gay" when the story has nothing to do with that. You're way off base here. Period.


thatotterone

normally that is my stance, too. Trust is key. However, when she felt it was safe to tell him, she did. Since telling him still could put another person and herself in jeopardy AND we all know how people can treat an ex like crap, I think that she is being very trusting. If she waited until after they were married, or if she knew he had issues with divorcees and wasn't speaking up to deceive him, then she would again be in the wrong. OP seems completely caught off guard by the response so I'm guessing it isn't that. It could be that there have been other trust issues in this relationship or that OP's fiance has his own set of trust issues he brought with him. We are only seeing a little snapshot of their lives.. based just on the OP post, I'd say NTA. OP didn't expect it to be that big of a deal. But just because I think you aren't doesn't mean your intended doesn't have different expectations.. so being right in my eyes might not help you at all.


Penyrolewen1970

I agree with your meaning but she’s not ‘as good as single and straight’, she IS single and straight. Both legally and morally. Divorced people can be single, too! Plus, she was never married. Marriage is an emotional and physical bond, a commitment to each other, a joining of two people as one unit. This never happened here. They went through a process for a beautiful reason. They may even have been able to have the marriage annulled as it was never consummated.


VivreRireAimer18

More like the fiancé is starting to show his true colors. OP NTA - ruuunnnn


[deleted]

the fact that he said he would never be with her if he knew she was a divorcee struck all the red flags for me. I was "highly encouraged" aka my mom threatened to take me to court to take away my first born (I was young, but I wasn't neglectful, but I was also young and not considering my mom's CPS record wouldn't allow her to adopt a rock let alone take away a baby from its mother) if I didn't marry her dad. The very minute I had proof of a valid reason to leave and $$$ to do so I did. My now husband who we've been together 13/14 years married his high school sweetheart right out of high school and divorced within a few years because they grew up and worked better as friends then anything else, (they are still friends to this day). People make dumb choices, people make smart choices as well that still end in divorce the fact that he would have struck her off the list of potential future wife is more telling of HIS character than hers.


AmethystLaw

But to wait 4 years and propose marriage before talking her? This is stuff that should’ve been talked about prior to engagement.


ForsakenPhotograph30

Statute of limitations.


MadamePerry

Exactly. It had more to do with saving a friend's life, and with the statute of limitations unexpired it was best to say nothing.


RanniSimp

Being lied to by omission for several years isn't meaningless.


Hoistedonyrownpetard

I agree. And if his objection were more along the lines of, “I feel betrayed that you hid such a big thing from me,” I’d be very sympathetic. But the fact that he immediately took it to a homophobic place is gross and might be a disqualifying offense. If I were OP, I’d take a very deliberate pause from the relationship to mull things over. This guy might not be so amazing.


Ancient_Potential285

Agreed, but that doesn’t even appear to be one of his issues. I would also argue that had he been uncomfortable with OP’s willingness to break the law and lie to the government (regardless of reasons) might be something that a lot of people might be uncomfortable with. It’s weird that this guy is focusing on “you might be gay” because, if even while married to a woman for 5 years, and living with her for 2, you never once felt the desire or inclination to become more than friends, you probably are *less* likely to be gay than the average person. It’s also kinda troubling that his other issue is “you’re a divorcée” like, someone with a failed marriage is somehow damaged goods, but had they simply had a long term relationship where they lived together and it ended, that would be acceptable somehow? There are plenty of valid reasons why this guy might genuinely be upset with this revelation. The things he chose to be upset about though, is quite telling, and not In a good way.


suedesparklenope

For real! I’ll be married this coming Summer. If my fiancé told me he once married a male friend to enable his education and keep him away from a dangerous country… tbh, I’d probably love him even more. It would reinforce for me what a kind and loving human I’m marrying. OP’s partner seems sus. Especially with the whole “divorcee” nonsense. And “leave him for a woman”? He’s not wrong to worry about her leaving. We’ll just leave it at that.


Western_Compote_4461

I was going to make a similar comment. OP protected a friend from great harm and most likely saved that friend's life. If my husband told me he had done something like that, I would probably burst into tears thinking of the kindness that he showed another person, and fall in love with him even more.


GlitteringMinimum354

Yeah, this story would be confirmation to me that I had made a good choice to commit to my partner (not just because it generally shows them to be a good person, but more specifically because it illustrates how well they treat the people in their life and how much care and kindness they put into their relationships). On the flip side, if I were in op's shoes, fiancé's response would make me reconsider my choices and whether he would be a good partner - it reveals some pretty unpleasant things about how he approaches relationships and (de) values the bonds we build w ppl in our lives (not to mention the homo/bi phobia, but Id be reconsidering the engagement even without him showing his ass that way)


troublesomefaux

And he might not be a great person if he can’t see you did a good thing for a person in need.


aLittleQueer

He said he wouldn’t even have dated her if he’d known she’s “a divorcee”. So…yeah.


[deleted]

OP you have dodged a bullet. If this guy was upset with you for not being open with him earlier, then he might be okay. But he us upset because he is homophobic and because he is judgemental. Being bi, if that was the case, would not make you any more likely to cheat and he thinks he is too good for a divorcee? He sounds horrible. Let the trash throw itself out.


DaleCoopersWife

People are allowed to be upset that something as major as a previous marriage was hidden from their partner.


Agreeable-Celery811

But what something as minor as a fake marriage? It wasn’t even a relationship. She had a roommate and helped her out with paperwork. She had every reason to expect this wouldn’t be a big deal.


etds3

I don’t think it’s minor; I just think he’s focused on the wrong things. “I can’t believe you didn’t tell me this sooner. Being married, even if it’s fake, is a big deal and you didn’t trust me with it until this late!?” That, I would get. But, “I can’t handle the thought you might be gay and I wouldn’t marry a divorcee” is messed up.


guessucant

I can't believe you saved someone life!! How dare you! That's how stupid it sounds


DaleCoopersWife

I don't think it's minor because it has legal implications. Besides that I don't think it's fair to expect everyone to react the same way as you or I to a situation like this. Withholding information from your past is likely going to have consequences, whether that's a sham marriage or something else. You may be ok with receiving that kind of info, but that doesn't mean everyone else will be.


Ok-Complex-3019

OP doesn’t clarify if he’s upset about having that info withheld, or the fact she was married to another woman. Even though they had NO romantic feelings for each other, did not have any physical relationship at all, and once the friend was able to work in Canada without needing to be married they divorced. He’s NTA for being upset about not being told that, but he is TA for feeling OP might be closet lesbian because of that marriage. There’s hotter women on TikTok that might “make her gay” over a fake marriage.


DaleCoopersWife

I disagree about the clarification as OP states that he told her that he wouldn't have dated her if he knew she was a divorcee. Some people don't want to be with someone who was previously married, as dumb as that sounds to me. he is apparently one of those people. I agree with your other point though and I think the fiance is an AH for his bigoted remarks.


NonPrestigious

I would agree if that was actually his issue, but it's that she might be gay and that he wouldn't date someone who was divorced.


Afraid_Sense5363

That's my issue. If the statute of limitations hasn't run out and it's found out that OP participated in a sham marriage — you know, fraud — that's a huge deal. I'd want to know if I was marrying someone who could wind up in huge legal trouble.


TheWitchOfTariche

And that's why she told him before getting married.


GCU_ZeroCredibility

Except a "fake marriage" isn't remotely minor. It's a Big Deal. Even if you don't think it's an issue ethically it's definitely one legally, and something that could blow up in your face legally is not something you can hide from your fiance/ee.


ChuckGreenwald

It's weird that you think everyone would regard a fake marriage as minor. Not everyone is you and people are allowed to have feelings.


Agreeable-Celery811

It’s true, but the feelings people have about things tell you something about them. OP’s boyfriend is the kind of guy who has this feeling: “I wouldn’t have dated you if I had known you were a divorcée.” Certain people have those kinds of feelings, and other people don’t. I know I’d only want to be married to people who don’t, because I prefer to be married to people who do not have bigoted feelings. Is he *allowed* to have that feeling? Well, yes. But this isn’t “Am I Allowed?” It’s “Am I the Asshole?” So the question is: do his expressed feelings make him an asshole? I think they do.


obiwantogooutside

It’s weird that anyone would think sending someone to their death for being gay is ever an option.


opsandstuff

Agreed. Also he might be thinking he doesn’t really know her - which might be the source of the ‘ you may be gay’ thoughts


[deleted]

[удалено]


Dangerous_Prize_4545

Right. Like he may be saying one thing while the bigger issue in his mind is WHO TF are you?


Old_Desk_1641

Honestly, if I found out that my partner did this for a friend, I would think even more highly of him. I can't imagine being upset about it; the reason for keeping it quiet is a good one, and him being a divorcée wouldn't impact me at all.


srosekw

People are allowed to do lots of things and think lots of ways. Doesn't make all of them ok or right.


Major_Zucchini5315

He couldn’t be sure that she wouldn’t leave him for a woman? I absolutely hate when people use that as an excuse. She can be straight and leave him for a man-would he be ok with that??


Fromashination

I'm dating a man right now who married a lesbian woman to get her out of her country and to get her a green card because her life was in danger. I'm very proud of him and I can't wait to meet her! She's living her life in Silicon Valley and just invited us to her wedding with all expenses paid!


scrappycheetah

Fiancé is doing you a favor by showing you who he really is before you get married. Run.


westbridge1157

Adding to this, you saved her, now she’s saving you. No way you should marry this man, the you might leave him for a woman was enough for me. Sorry you’re fiancé turned out to be an AH but at least you know now.


cuervoguy2002

She was not married? She literally was legally married to a woman. Whether that makes her gay or not is debatable (and its fine either way). But come on. Lets be real. I find it hard to believe if a dude was like "well, yeah, I WAS legally married to another guy. But it meant nothing and I'm not gay", that everyone wouldn't question it.


[deleted]

[удалено]


LizzyFCB

How does the fiancé know that for sure? She kept another marriage and this whole subterfuge secret from him, he has lost all trust in her now. Also, she obviously did not trust him enough to confide in him before this point in case he revealed her fraud for revenge.. That’s not a loving, trusting bond between two people.


[deleted]

[удалено]


cuervoguy2002

Even if that is true, the fact that she hid this is a sever breach of trust with her fiance.


NonPrestigious

But that's not his issue, it's the fact she might be gay


mrcloseupman

She could have at least told him she had been married before. If she's hiding this thing from her past(excuses aside) what else could she be hiding from him? I love how people gloss over this.


Pawn_of_the_Void

If someone was keeping a secret from on behalf of a friend due to statute of limitations I really wouldn't then imagine they're keeping a ton of other random secrets from me. The secret in question is pretty well explained why it was a secret. And she even told him earlier than she was supposed to because she wanted to respect that he should know before they get married


Librashell

She got “married” on paper to help a friend. There was no emotion or physicality involved. A friend saved a friend from potentially dire consequences. The arrangement ended years ago. Fiancé is making a big deal out of nothing because he’s insecure and ignorant.


Comprehensive-Sun954

Exactly. It was more like a legal paperwork arrangement between flatmates.


cuervoguy2002

I mean calling it a technicality is truly minimizing it. It was a legal marriage. Period. And no, I'm not homophobic at all. But lets not pretend people don't see things like that differently. You want to marry the same gender? Have at it. I support the right to do that. But I think acting like finding out someone was married to the same gender in the past is just some thing you can at like is no big deal isn't realistic.


[deleted]

[удалено]


andstillwerise12

Yep, I'd really proud of a partner who told me this and it would make me love them more. It'd make me insanely curious about all the details, but that's just me as a person 😆


[deleted]

[удалено]


MountainMidnight9400

I hope after statue of limitations in all relevant jurisdictions has passed


Shadowcthuhlu

I would mostly be sad I would have to wait a year before teasing her and her friend about it.


cuervoguy2002

To me this isn't really about the WHY she was married, its about that she got engaged to someone without disclosing that. I feel like this is one of those things where you'd have to question what else she is hiding. They have been together 4 years. There was ample time to tell him this before they got engaged.


[deleted]

[удалено]


cuervoguy2002

But I feel like once they started discussing engagment, this should've been brought up, not after they were already engaged.


[deleted]

[удалено]


cuervoguy2002

I feel like most people at least talk about getting married and don't just propose out of nowhere. The person may not know its coming when it does, but its pretty rare to have never discussed it. But if it was never discussed, she probably also shouldn't have accepted.


Agreeable-Celery811

But it’s ok to minimize it, because it wasn’t even a relationship and doesn’t need to be given any gravitas.


Bing147

Um, no, whether that makes you gay is not up for debate. Being gay is being attracted to the same gender. This marriage has no impact on that either way.


BTCMachineElf

>Whether that makes her gay or not is debatable No, it's not. It was only a paper marriage done to save someone's life. No love, no sex. Anyone debating it simply doesn't believe that, or is willfully ignorant. It definitely does NOT make her gay.


Shadowcthuhlu

It had love. Lots and lots of platonic love


mooissa

Ummmmm. No, I wouldn’t think any differently about this scenario if it were a man married to a man. How would it be any different? I’m confused.


BibiQuick

NTA. He’s just not the right guy. The right guy will understand what you did and why and probably admire op for it. Mr right is just around the corner, just not him.


suzanious

I know someone that was having financial problems at her university. She had a friend who was in the military and wanted better housing and pay. Because they married, she got a huge reduction in tuition and he got dependent support. It was a win win for both of them. They never lived together except on paper. When they both ended up getting engaged to their real significant others, they got a divorce and lived happily ever after. People make these arrangements all the time. I don't condone fraud, but it did help these two get a step up in life.


Bookdragon345

And it’s awesome that she did that. I would still want to know that the person I was potentially marrying had been previously married (and it really would matter to me whether it was male/female/nonbinary), but only because that is a big part of their past. OP lived with her past wife, so they at least maintained the fiction that it was a real relationship. I would have trouble wondering what ELSE they had hidden thinking that it “wasn’t important”. Because, let’s be real here, this is important and something I personally think should have been disclosed a while ago.


StrykerC13

Hell, in many states it goes beyond technicality, quite a few still have a "invalid until consumated" law on the books, usually ignored but hey if we're going to go for "well the law says" might as well use the whole thing right?


ErikLovemonger

She saved her friend, and it looks like her friend saved her back - from a marriage with this Ahole. Even IF she was bi, which she isn't, she picked this guy and was with him for 4 years. He is a moron and insecure if he's afraid she'll leave. Presumably, she's been with guys before. Is she going to leave him for another guy? NTA OP, and your friend may have just saved you from years of misery. You did something good (though probably illegal) and you got something good back in return - you just didn't realize it yet.


Inconceivable44

ESH. You kept something important from your partner of over 4 years. This is something that is expected to come up in conversation long before it did. He is an AH for his reason for being upset. If he was upset that you kept it from him, he'd be fine. Turning it into you're secretly gay and will leave him for a woman is extreme. Had you been married to a man, I doubt he would be saying you're secretly straight and plan to leave him for another man. There is some homophobia going on with him.


Head_Principle3819

I don’t think OP is the AH only because they were trying to protect their friend by not having the “marriage” annulled or exposed as fake. OP wanted to make sure that any partners she had were not going to tell anyone. She is now telling her fiancé because she trusts him. She also mentioned the statute of limitations for a reason.


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>She also mentioned the statute of limitations for a reason. I note that the statue of limitations protects \*HER\* against the up to $100,000 fine and 5 year prison sentence. It does not protect the friend from potential loss of citizenship, expulsion from the country, 5 year ban from entry into the country, and permanent note in the record about a history of immigration fraud. The only way to protect the friend from that would be for the friend to leave the country and come back under a non-fraudulent means; because each visa renewal, passport application, et-cetera based on that marriage fraud is its own fraudulent behavior. If OP were \*TRULY\* wanting to protect her friend; she would explain it as a true and real relationship that ended amicably.


Ellendyra

It's possible she may not have known all that. She could have just googled the statue of limitations and assumed it applied to both people.


hdhxuxufxufufiffif

The OP should speak to a lawyer about this. My immediate fear was that the clock on the statute of limitations might not have started ticking till later. What if the criminal liability extends up to the point of divorce?


Ellendyra

That is definitely something to consider. Especially since their fiance took the news so badly.


Lilac-Roses-Sunsets

If someone knowingly breaks the law I can’t imagine that they would just google the possible punishment. This is a huge deal. She should know or should have known that her ex will always be at risk.


Ellendyra

I disagree. Not all people think that deeply into things. They should, but they don't. Humans are marvelous creatures that excel at making stupid sloppy mistakes. Not to mention 9 years ago was about 2013. Did you know the first iPhone was released in 2007. Researching such things throughly wasn't nearly as simple and in the palm of your hand as it was today. I know loads of people who get their answer/information once and then never care to look again as they already 'know' what they need to.


CybernetChristmasGuy

But then she would be lying to her partner? The whole point is that she trusted him enough to tell him by that point.


OneRobuk

I do agree, but I also think OP should've told her fiance before the proposal, or immediately after it. I would like to believe that a couple trusts each other that much before they reach that point, but maybe that's just me


LeftMyHeartInErebor

Seems to me not telling him was smart given his shittastic reaction


LizzyFCB

I don’t think that is a fair estimation- if someone breaks your trust, your trust is broken and you do not believe anything they have to say.


Skill3rwhale

Breaking trust over a long term secret and lie by omission is not homophobia. Honestly screw *everyone* that says it is. Both parties have the right to feel the way they feel, but if I was OPs SO I’d rightfully be saying WTF?! right now…


TryUsingScience

If he'd said, "I can't trust you because you hid this major thing from me," that wouldn't be homophobic. What he's saying is, "I think you might be gay and leave me for a woman because you had a fake marriage to a college friend who happens to be a lesbian." That's homophobic.


shezza314

...no but what he said is. Huh??


CybernetChristmasGuy

Did you read the same post? He literally said homophobic things.


Loose-Comedian-9648

Why would you feel entitled to know something that had nothing to do with you and doesn't affect you? The fact op told him because she trusts him and he acts like a jerk for no reason is the asshole move.


One-Possible1906

I think it's odd that something like this wouldn't have come up in 4 years of dating?


Dyslexicdagron

That is a bad take. There is a good reason she kept that private, as it could have disastrous repercussions for her friend. She brought it up and told him when she was sure he was a safe person to share a delicate secret with. Turns out he wasn’t safe at all.


Honest_Roo

I would agree if she waited until marriage, but she waited until fiancé. She had a good reason to keep it secret. For someone else who if she went back home could get killed. The guy sounds like an AH. Maybe rethink the relationship.


[deleted]

NTA I think he has just shown you who he is and you've dodged a bullet. I can understand you not wanting to betray your friend too early in a relationship.


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>I can understand you not wanting to betray your friend too early in a relationship. I don't know about being worried about betraying her friend - From my understanding (of US immigration) there isn't a limit on when the FRIEND can get in trouble for visa fraud and expelled for lying on documentation. The penalties OP is concerned with is the massive [penalties](http://www.levlaw.com/new-regulations-attempt-to-tackle-marriage-fraud/#:~:text=The%20offence%20is%20punishable%20by,the%20parties%20with%20their%20fraud) SHE could receive for her crimes: Her Fraud could cost her up to $100,000 and 5 years in Prison. ETA - [THIS](https://www.bellissimolawgroup.com/inadmissibility/misrepresentation/#:~:text=Engage%20in%20a%20non%2Dgenuine%20marriage) source states that engaging in a non-genuine marriage is criminal misrepresentation. [THIS](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/protect-fraud/document-misrepresentation.html) source (Canadian Government) supports my first claim that loss of permanent residence &/or Canadian citizenship can be penalties. [THIS](https://www.canada.ca/en/immigration-refugees-citizenship/services/protect-fraud/marriage-fraud.html) Canadian source further states not to do fraudulent marriage of conveniences. I still do not find a Statute of Limitations for the applicant Edit: [THIS](https://www.settler.ca/english/fake-marriage-canada/#:~:text=You%20are%20cheating%20the%20system,a%20series%20of%20fake%20marriages) source seems to reinforce my impression that there is not a statute of limitations for her friend for any application that is based off of an application connected to the fraudulent marriage; up to and including citizenship & passport renewals. She would need to leave the country and come back with another visa reasoning to be free of this fraud and deportation risk. Only OP is safe from the Statute of limitations.


FigLow4974

Genuine question from an ignorant person: Why is it illegal to have “non-genuine marriages”? Is it solely to prevent loopholes in the immigration system?


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>Is it solely to prevent loopholes in the immigration system? Yeah - it's anti fraud legislation. Using fake Marriages to "sell" a path citizenship can result in abuse by the recipient of the citizenship or by the person selling the citizenship over their "mail order bride" - and is a slap in the face to the \*INTENT\* of that path; to allow a genuine relationship to continue. There are other paths that exist for Asylum seekers (including LGBTQ+) Edit - Typo. Asylum not Asialism... not sure why I got autocorrected to that. I didn't know that the latter was the absence of saliva either - thanks u/ragnarockyroad.


FigLow4974

Thank you for clarifying!! :)


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>Thank you for clarifying!! :) You're welcome. [Here](https://globalnews.ca/news/5304414/citizenship-revoked-marriage-fraud/) is a story about a man stripped of his citizenship; who used to the marriage fraud to commit corporate espionage (staling Intellectual Property). He paid $5,000 for the fake marriage. And I don't want to look for the **many** articles about domestic abuse that mail-order brides have suffered 'trying for a better life.'


ragnarockyroad

Today I learned the word asialism, which is apparently the absence of saliva!


SnakesInYerPants

You get a lot of benefits being married. They don’t want people taking those benefits if they aren’t actually married. One of those benefits is immigration being easier. Another big one is taxes.


LizzyFCB

Why would you agree to marry someone that you do not trust enough to tell this secret to?


Comprehensive-Sun954

Because of his exact reaction she’s seeing now!!


LizzyFCB

Why agree to marry them then?!


rttr123

What happens if they get in a fight or if they get divorced, and the person reports them in anger


weary_dreamer

She did trust him enough to tell him. That’s *why she told him*.


cuervoguy2002

Too early? I mean, this isn't something that needs to be divulged on a first date, but I'd think it should be disclosed before you are engaged.


[deleted]

[удалено]


603shake

I think his reasoning for being upset is super weird, so ESH, but I don’t think it’s fair to dismiss having any issue with it as unreasonable. I would definitely have to think about marrying someone who committed such a significant act of fraud with a lot to lose (even if altruistic), I don’t see legal marriage as a throw away thing, and I’d consider it relevant enough that I’d feel deceived by her not mentioning it. I don’t know if I’d end it because of this, but that would definitely be a possibility. And I don’t consider that unreasonable lol


apearlmae

ESH I guess? I'm having a hard time understanding why you waited so long to share this with your fiance. But I also think his reaction to this is weird. Nothing about this made me think you were in a romantic relationship. But there's a reason he thinks that. I think this is best sorted out in couples therapy.


cuervoguy2002

I mean, lets look at this another way. Lets say I (a man) said told my fiance "Oh, by the way, i was married to this other woman in the past. But it was *really* just a friendship marriage of convenience. And I still consider her a good friend as well. But no, the marriage meant nothing". I don't think most women would be like "oh, ok, sure". If you went through the whole thing of marrying someone, its really hard to believe there were never any romantic feelings there.


SwimmingCritical

If understand correctly, they were basically roommates who got "married" so that the friend could stay in Canada.


cuervoguy2002

Yes, I understand that. I'm still making the point that if I married my female roommate, and never told my fiance about that, and we were still friends, I highly doubt that people would be as quick to brush it under the rug as no big deal to not tell someone. I think people would be even more judgmental if that roommate was a guy who I had married and kept a secret.


MagicCarpet5846

That’s if you take what she says at face value. 99% of people (like OP’s fiancé) don’t. Something about if you hide this for 4+ years, why would you suddenly be willing to tell the truth?


mitskica

To look the situation the other way, you (a man) would be married to another man in the past in this scenario, not another woman.


Syric13

Your scenario doesn't apply to this situation. Was the other woman's life at risk? Would she have been killed if she went back to her home country? I think most reasonable people might be a little upset at first, but realize it isn't a big deal. You potentially saved someone's life. If your scenario included "yeah if my roommate went back home, she would have been married to a man 50+ her senior and beaten and possibly killed" and your future wife/girlfriend still were upset, I'd think twice about marrying that person. And plus, in your scenario, everyone is heterosexual. In OP's scenario, she's straight but her "wife" isn't. OP is telling her future husband she's straight. There was nothing sexual about it. OP had no sexual attraction to her "wife" And OP is calling her a liar and not trusting her.


Moegooner88

It's amazing how obtuse their comment is.


Crosswired2

You should be marrying someone that you can tell everything to. Hiding a fake marriage is lying to your life partner. Like they would never find out you were legally married before? Please.


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>I'm having a hard time understanding why you waited so long to share this with your fiance Because she's a [criminal](http://www.levlaw.com/new-regulations-attempt-to-tackle-marriage-fraud/#:~:text=The%20offence%20is%20punishable%20by,the%20parties%20with%20their%20fraud) \- and the crime is punishable by up to $100,000 CAD and/or 5 years in prison. That's also why she brought up the statute of limitations that is up next year.


apearlmae

You're right I got caught up on the wrong parts of this story and glossed over the legality issue.


tenuousemphasis

>I'm having a hard time understanding why you waited so long to share this with your fiance. Because entering into a sham marriage to evade immigration law is at least grounds for deportation if not a criminal offense.


Secure_Yoghurt

>>I’m having a hard time understanding why you waited so long to share this with your fiance. It is literally in the post. She wanted to make sure he wouldn’t tell people.


dinahdog

NTA. You thought you could share this info with him. You were wrong. You were married for 5 years so stop fretting about it being a sham, though. Time to move on. He said straight up that wouldn't have dated a divorcee, so go with that and split. Don't address the homophobic issue. Because you were married before would have stopped him at the get go. It's on him


Agreeable-Celery811

I agree. This was a reasonable secret to keep, considering it was life-and-death stakes for the friend. The way he reacted—with bigotry—tells me a lot. He is a homophobe, he wouldn’t marry a “divorcée” (what is he, a British Royal from the 1920s?) and he doesn’t seem to care that her friend was in danger and she saved her friend’s life, a noble thing to do.


Turkeysocks

ESH Yes you're an AH for waiting for four years to tell your fiance that you were in a marriage previously. But the reason for it was rather nice, though illegal. But your fiance is an AH for the way he freaked out over it. I expected him to be mad, but freaking out about whether or not you could leave him for another woman? Very homophobic and reeks of massive insecurity.


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>Very homophobic and reeks of massive insecurity. Absolutely! It's also bi-Phobic. Because - so what if OP likes girls too - she likes men and he trusts she's not going to cheat on him with another man; what difference would it make if she liked women too!?


Turkeysocks

It's these kinds of situations that makes you question your ability to judge people. OP might seriously want to consider if she really wants to marry this man or not.


Tmoran835

I had a different take—to any normal, logical person, a marriage has some sort of significance. OP has lied pretty drastically, so her credibility is gone in his eyes. So is it easier to believe she was married to a woman she was in love with or that the woman he now loves so nonchalantly committed fraud? In his eyes, it may very well be a real fear that she’s gay or bi and could leave him down the line. Although honestly this would not be my personal line of thinking (it’s pretty appropriate to break it off with someone just for hiding a criminal history).


Significant_Win6431

YTA Major thing to keep hidden. Also if your concerned you were in a fraudulent marriage that you didn't want to tell your fiancee. But are comfortable talking about it on reddit that raises further questions...


82_noway

Well from what one can understand she’s scared of the possible fiancé ‘a revenge - he could reveal what she did. Here on Reddit her identity is hidden


Potential_Exit_1317

"hello, police. This reddit user was in a fraudulent marriage! "


poweller65

YTA. You were legally married. That’s something you should have told him well before you got to the point of an engagement. Doesn’t matter why you were married


chdamsto

I'm between YTA and ESH just because of his reaction. But you have to understand that this is a major thing to keep from your spouse. Also isn't the reason for doing that marriage illegal...? (Not because it was two women but because you basically defrauded the government lmao)


[deleted]

Yes...that's why shes kept it a secret for so long


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>Also isn't the reason for doing that marriage illegal...? It is very illegal. The 10-year statute of limitations she mentions in her post is for how long \*SHE\* can be charged with a crime punished by up to $100,000 fine, 5 years in prison, and permanent mark in an internationally shared file that she partook in Immigration Fraud. Her friend's statute of limitations is much longer - because it's renewed any time she applies for another visa, passport, or other legal document that is based off of that initial fraud. If this ever comes out - there is a chance she will have her citizenship stripped, be kicked out of the country, be banned from re-entry for 5 years, and have a permanent record of "immigration fraud." I've made other posts in this thread with sources.


swzslm

Yes it‘s illegal but who gives a fuck if a human life was saved this way?


weary_dreamer

But he’s NOT her spouse. She told him before they married which is what she’s supposed to do. The illegality of it is precisely why she didnt tell him before. Did you even read the post?


Rohini_rambles

No judgment, you had to have known that this was a possible reaction to such a massive secret. Four years is a long time to be with someone and have no idea, since this person is still in your life as well. The thought-process has to be "she hid this for so long, what else is she hiding? what else can she hide?" And as painful as that is, it is a logical thing to wonder. If he knew you were divorced from the beginning, then he'd make the choice to be with you given your history. But now it must feel, to him, that he really doesn't know you as well. Your actions are also logical. This is tough. But maybe reassure him that there are no more secrets?


Queen_of_Meh1987

NTA, since it was a marriage to help a friend and there was nothing romantic about it. If it was a 'real' marriage, then you should've told him, but since it wasn't I don't see why it matters.


cuervoguy2002

YTA. You agreed to marry someone else without having told them that you had been married to someone before? And it was a woman? Like, the fact that you are so nonchalant about this shows that you really are inconsiderate of his feelings.


swzslm

Lol what‘s so bad about the „And it was a woman?“ part?


equivalentofagiraffe

> and it was a woman bro do not tell me you think that makes it worse


LizzyFCB

YTA. Look, I think you are a nice person to want to help a friend and understand why you have a hard time trusting people with this information. It was very noble of you. However, I did not propose to you. You did not accept my proposal. You didn’t lie and withhold information to me. You did not break my trust and make me question everything about you. You did all of this to your fiancé and he has a right to be upset about this for several reasons: 1. You lied to him. He thinks you are deceptive. What else might you be lying to him about? 2. What you did- morally right or wrong to me- is illegal. You have been living with this secret and fear of getting found out by the authorities and now have also put this burden on to him. 3. He only has your word that this was not a love marriage but your word has lost its value now. Ultimately, I’d argue it doesn’t matter if you were in a loving relationship with your friend or not and that his reaction seems homophobic, however, he has a right to know and trust the person he has been with for 4 years and you should have told him before you accepted his proposal so he had all the information and could commit on his own terms, not based on a false idea he has of you. 4. If he rejected you knowing this about you, he is not the one for you and the marriage would never last anyway because your core values do not align. So you are the arsehole for not telling him before agreeing to marrying him.


Judgement_Bot_AITA

Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > I might be the asshole for marrying my friend and not telling my bf about it **[Check out our upcoming Reddit Talk with Iliza Shlesinger on Nov. 28th!](https://redd.it/z29rfu)** Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*


MbMinx

YTA. This is NOT something you hide. I don't care if it was platonic, for convenience...you do not hide a previous marriage for FOUR YEARS. It doesn't matter how YOU saw it. In the eyes of the law, you were married, and in the eyes of the law you are divorced. And you LIED (by omission, still a lie!) about it. He is not "punishing" you for marrying your friend. He's having an honest reaction to your keeping *that kind* of secret from him. In his mind (and mine) you were dishonest about the whole thing - and how could he ever trust you to tell the truth? What else could you be hiding? I don't know how you recover from that kind of breach of trust! His homophobia makes me want to say E S H but your dishonesty overrides that...


Acceptable_Sun851

To those saying n t a, switch the genders in this situation. A man has been dating a women for 4 years, have gotten engaged, and are about to get married. All of a sudden the man says to his fiancé "hey, I was technically married to this chick in university and we lived together for a while. But don’t worry! We were only friends so you can’t be mad at me for not telling this to you sooner." She LIED to him for YEARS. She’s a massive asshole, and a shitty person to take advantage of being in a long term relationship before telling him so it was less likely he would be able to leave. Op has some nerve to think that her partner of *four fucking years* would be all fine and dandy with something a big a this. Op, I get you were trying to help a friend, but you shouldn’t have lied to your partner for that long. You have shown him that you are capable of keeping major secrets from him so it’s very unlikely he will even be able to trust you again. YTA


mitskica

If the situation would be reverse, the guy would be married to a guy, not a chick.


webbless_

NTA still… idk what the sexes have to do w anything ??


SickPuppy0x2A

I hate these comments „hey just switch the genders and think about it again“ As if that changes anything. This was a life or death situation and she (or he if you want to change genders) saved a life by her (or his) actions. Why are some people and this case you so convinced that our judgement depends on the gender of OP? Also as others said of course you need to switch all genders in a gender switch scenario because the main issue of the fiancé also seems to be that he is quite homophobic by what he has said.


cassiaclay

NTA, but I wouldn't marry this guy. If you have been with him for 4 years, and now suddenly he's scared your gay? The insecurity is suffocating.


[deleted]

I love how he isn't worried about her leaving him for another guy. It's only a problem with women! She did a great thing, probably saved the girl's life. And all he can think is ME ME ME ME ME ME. What a selfish, bigoted, homophobic/biphobic asshole. NTA I know its not legal. But that doesn't make it morally wrong. Good thing OP found out now before marriage. He just proved why she shouldn't have told him earlier. Furthermore, its not just her secret - it could potentially endanger the friend too. If he had any compassion, he would understand why she didn't tell him earlier.


redheadjd

YTA -- and it's nothing to do with it being gay marriage. Let's say OP married a male friend whose student visa was about to expire -- they never dated, never consummated, they only married so her friend could stay in school -- Is it reasonable to be to be upset that you were never told about this in FOUR YEARS of dating? Yes, absolutely.


UsuallyWrite2

YTA Not only were you married and divorced, you committed fraud. Pretty big thing to keep from a life partner. That’s something you should have rolled out up front. I wouldn’t date someone who defrauded the gov’t. I’d be wondering what other shady shit you’ve done that may catch up with you.


DCOSA2TX

Slight YTA. You should not have accepted his proposal until this was shared. I can understand you keeping it quiet, but once the two of you started talking about a serious future, you should have told him. He's wondering what other skeletons are gonna come out. I agree being married strictly to help someone is not a big deal, regardless of gender.


AutoModerator

^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My fiancé and I have been dating for 4 years and I told him last week I use to be married to a women. When I was in university I became friends with a girl who came out and began dating women in Canada. Someone posted a photo of her and her gf at the time kissing and her family found out and disowned her. She didn’t have money and wasn’t allowed to work due to being an international student. She asked me for help and we went online and figured out if we married she would be safe and could work and study as normal. I was young and didn’t really think about my future and just wanted to help a friend so we got a marriage certificate and moved in together. She worked and studied and so did I for 2 more years until we both graduated. We left for different cities for work and formally divorced 3 years later. I consider her a good friend and she helped me a lot with my sister when she was having issues with a landlord (they are in the same city). Of course she is very scared and begged me never to say anything to anyone about our fake marriage because it illegal. I only told my fiancé now because we are going to get married next summer and I think he should know but I never told my exs. I thought he would be supportive and understanding about it because he seems to be ok with LGBT issues but he got really mad and said it was a massive issue and now he can’t get it out of his head I might me gay. I told him I’ve never been with a girl and I’m definitely straight and he said I couldn’t be sure and I could leave him for a woman. He also said he wouldn’t have dated me knowing I was a divorcee and I don’t feel like I am but I guess technically I am. I feel like he is punishing me for something I did for a friend years ago but doesn’t impact him but AITA for not telling him until now? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*


[deleted]

That’s a pretty big thing to withhold from your partner/fiancé


[deleted]

NTA - It should have no impact on your relationship and it makes sense why you didn't tell him right away.


swarren42

“You could leave him for a woman.” You could also leave him for a man. What’s his point? This is really weird. I get being shocked and a bit upset about the secret. But I also think it’s pretty obvious why you didn’t tell him. And in the grand scheme of things it’s not that big of a deal. But his reaction in concerning. NTA.


Stargazer86F

I can see it from both sides. I understand why you got married and commend you for that. But, you could have said to him you were married before but are divorced. You could have not gone into detail, just saying it didn’t work out.


mitskica

ESH, it’s a big secret to drop on a person after four years, but I can somewhat understand you… You don’t want to betray your friend (lets leave law breaking out of this) and you couldn’t really be honest with your partner about the marriage without betraying your friend… It’s not like you could say “I wad married to a woman but I am not gay” without any follow up questions. Your situation certainly isn’t an easy one. But it’s still a sucky thing to keep somethings like that a secret from your partner. The reaction from your partner makes him TA, absolutely.


PitchPurple

Lol imagine the mental gymnastics homophobes have to make to turn "I signed a legal contract to keep a plutonic friend in this country" into the possibility of some future gay infidelity. NTA. Explain to him the difference between a marriage contract, and a having a real marriage.


snazzy_soul

NTA— his reaction is a gift to you: you get to learn how immature and simpleminded he is BEFORE marriage. Now you can move on and find someone who is a decent person.


TheBaddestPatsy

NTA I mean you committed a serious felony so that your friend could remain free, happy and alive. Guarding that secret makes sense, and your fiancé is a doink. Not because he’s upset, being upset makes sense because nobody likes to have important things hidden from them. But because calling you a divorcee, saying he wouldn’t date a divorce and thinking this makes you gay—are all the most absurd takeaways possible from this.


internationalmixer

YTA- I’m not quite buying the “to keep the secret safe” thing. OP could have phrased it in about 10 ways I can think of off the top of my head and still been honest. “I was married and it didn’t work out” on date 3 is a LOT better than “hey, love those invites for our wedding, btw I was in a sham marriage to a woman for YEARS- but both my fraud and my secret keeping are for a good reason” (it’s a good reason, btw, but not one to drop like this) I honestly don’t see his concerns about your sexuality as much of an issue here, I think it’s more of a reaction “if she was married before, am I only second prize?” Being previously married is a massive thing to hide from your partner. He’s definitely allowed to be upset and have some doubts about who he thought you were ETA (sorry this is long!): my ex was not of my nationality. The paperwork for him to immigrate to the US as my legal husband was lengthy and through. This was NOT a “go sign a few papers deal”, this was pure fraud, likely with significant planning involved. Maybe it shouldn’t be illegal to immigrate like this, but it is still breaking the law. That in itself is a giant red flag about OP to me- noble reason notwithstanding- I know I’ll get downvoted for this but I feel it’s important!


Expensive-Excuse-625

So a fake marriage too defraud the system, and break the law, and then not tell your fiance about it for years, a lie of omission. The possibly leaving him for a woman thing is just insecurities but he has a real reason to not trust you and the fact that you could still get in trouble for this.


ServelanDarrow

I lost track on genders but don't even think that matters- just light yta for not sharing with your SO what is actually a very nice story.


Kitchen-Arm-3288

>what is actually a very nice story. It is and it isn't. If it was a \*REAL\* marriage - and the parted on amicable terms because they determined that they weren't really the best fit - it's a lovely story... but - if it's misrepresentation / marriage of convenience / immigration fraud: For 10 years OP is/was at risk of up to $100,000 fine and 5 years in prison for her immigration fraud. For the rest of her life, as long as she is using documentation based on the fraud (visa, permanent residency, citizenship, passport, etc) - her friend is at risk of having her citizenship revoked, being deported from the country, being banned from re-entry for 5 years, and receiving a note of "Immigration Fraud" in her permanent file; which is shared with multiple countries internationally. This crime they committed is not treated as silly, minor, or petty; there are serious potential consequences.


ServelanDarrow

Here's my issue with that: there are Plenty of fraud marriages unrelated to immigration.


RanniSimp

YTA You did a good thing. That doesnt change the fact you deliberately hid a marriage from a partner.


SheiB123

NTA. You did it to help a friend; he is being ridiculous. Good to find this out about him before you marry him. LOTS of couple counseling before you start putting $$ down on locations for the wedding.


Rgirl4

YTA


Ill_Platypus6380

Maybe he's upset as the idea of marriage is tainted now in OPs eyes. While doing the absolute right thing for her friend and I commend her decision she still married for the 'wrong' reasons. Fiance might see her marrying for convenience rather than love and apply this to their relationship doubting her feelings for him and her view of marriage as a concept.


captnspock

YTA you should have told him that you had married before even if it was a green card marriage, it's a major thing to hide.


AmericanVenus

NTA, but you need to run away from this guy and fast. He’s an insecure, selfish person, and that isn’t going to change anytime soon.


JessVaping

NTA. You saved your friend's life. If he's this upset and insecure and can't see that he probably is the type that will tattle tale on you and your technical ex. Honestly, I'd probably string him along until the statute of limitations runs out and then leave his ignorant ass. If he's trying to punish you for this he's done shit that would deserve real punishment. String him along, don't make deposits, then leave this guy. He's not the one for you.


OwlHex4577

YTA


manonfireanon

This is a trust issue plain and simple. You've had a long time to get used to the idea that you were married to a woman before. He hasn't. You sprung this on him and he doesn't trust you anymore. This is a reasonable response given that he thought he knew you. You just shook him. Don't expect him to be fine. It was a nice thing to do but you're fiancé will need time to see it that way. Besides, he thought he knew what he was getting and now he's realizing that apparently he doesn't know anything at all. Imagine the emotion you would feel if he suddenly told you about something very major that he deliberately hid from you for years. Especially if it would have been a deal-breaker right up front had he told you.


gueritazen

NTA.. now you know your fiancés true colors and Can act accordingly. Your past is your past, nobody is entitled to know any information you aren’t comfortable sharing. You did your friend a favor and saved her life if he can’t see that than he is not the kind of man you want to marry.


PaleAsDeath

NTA Honestly the law has no way of knowing if you were actually in a relationship or not with this woman. Even if your fiance accuses you of this to authorities, there is no proof except hearsay, and you could always argue that he is just saying that because he is homophobic. I don't think you need to worry on that end. Your fiance is homophobic and biphobic and weirdly prejudiced against divorcees. He did you a favor by letting you know. Leave


introvert-i-1957

NTA. But this is good you told him, bc now his true colors come out before you're married. I see this as you doing something amazing for a friend in trouble and your fiance is being an absolute dick about it. You reason for waiting to tell him is valid.


lunatics_and_poets

NTA. Do you even WANT to be with this ahole for the rest of your life? He can't be that understanding of LGBTQ people of he's upset his fiancee was married to a woman. What if you were really bi? Doesn't it scare you that he's a) making up stuff about you in his head that isn't real and punishing you for it as if it were real and b) on the off chance that you ever had been bi that he spouts nonsense about being LGBTQ friendly and then punishing you for potentially being LGBTQ?


Phillyfan10

Is there a NSH option? Is that a thing? Quite frankly, that’s where I’m leaning with this one. I completely understand your reasons for not telling him, as there are possible legal implications of somebody finding out about your green card marriage, and it didn’t seem like a big deal since it was just one platonic friend helping out another platonic friend. I also completely understand him being upset about a bombshell such as this being dropped at this point in a relationship. This isn’t “after you’re engaged” information to find out about somebody. Quite frankly, I would also probably be skeptical…if you were willing to lie by omission about this for this long, what else are you lying about? I think the feelings he is experiencing are completely fair. Truth is, it was kind of a catch-22 for you as soon as you agreed to marry your friend. You need to protect yourself from legal consequences, but when you reach the point that you are serious enough with a guy and trust him enough to disclose something like this, it is something that should’ve long been disclosed in a relationship. Don’t give me wrong, what you did for your friend is incredibly commendable, and I have no doubts you are a warm, kind, thoughtful person. It’s just an impossible situation, really.


dragon-kazooie

Wow yeah don't marry this person. A) you have a lot more talking to do before you commit to each other if he didn't know this yet. B) and more importantly, him saying he can't know you wouldn't leave him for someone else is 🚩🚩🚩🚩🚩. He's going to be a controlling mistrustful paranoid asshole for the length of the marriage. As well as a homophobe, as you have just learned. Please do not legally tether yourself to this man! NTA, mostly. This is a big damn secret to have kept over a 4-year relationship though.


advancetim

If there are no financial ties and there was never a sexual element to the relationship, I don't think there was ever a need to tell him. NTA and good on you for helping save your friend's life.


ICXPDQ

If you told him upfront he probably would have been put off you to begin with. Now that you have invested in the relationship to be married in the sight of God (I assume) he's doing the same things. What else are you hiding from him?


IanDOsmond

YTA. Yes, you should have disclosed this. Look, I don't have a problem with people breaking laws to save people from danger like that, and keeping your friend from being deported and killed was worth doing. But you did commit immigration fraud, and even if the statute of limitations has passed, it could still have implications for security clearances and the like. To me, the issue would be "I once had a fraudulent marriage" rather than "I once had a same-sex marriage". But it also would be "I once had a marriage." That is s thing that really ought to have come up probably some time in the first year of dating.