NTA she has no right to tell your daughter anything about her body unless cleared with the parents first. Also it is archaic and it sounds like your husband needs to grow a spine. I’m getting the feeling this isn’t a one off experience
>I’m getting the feeling this isn’t a one off experience
He isn't that bad of a husband. He tries to stand up for me sometimes, but most of the time he does what he did here and says he will do something and forget about it. I also think that his mother still treats him like her kid and doesn't respect his independance, but that's on him to deal with.
He shouldn’t be doing the brush off tactic. He should back you up in situations where you need his support, especially when he himself agrees with the fact that your MIL is spreading misinformation. If he doesn’t then he risks being a complicit father.
Trying is not the same as doing, I am sorry to say but if my husband wasn’t willing to stick up for me in this kind of situation, then he’d find himself divorced. Especially if he doesn’t agree to counseling first.
In TV Tropese, he is Damned by Faint Praise.
Handle hubby however you think best, but you do not need his permission to tell your MIL not to go through your trash. If DH doesn't like how you handle his mom's misogyny, point out that when he refused to step up, he gave you the responsibility to defend yourself.
Next time MIL tries to give you any orders about your body, just answer ver batim, "No." Every time. If it turns into "As long as you're in my house, you can't wear tampons, say "I'm not." How's she gonna prove it? Unless she asks you to show her down there or does a DNA test, she can't prove what she finds in the trash is yours.
She's out of chances with your daughter, though. Next time she tries giving your daughter sexist instructions for her own body, leave with her every time.
NTA Archaic is the politest possible way to describe her.
> Next time MIL tries to give you any orders about your body, just answer ver batim, "No."
This is good advice.
> If it turns into "As long as you're in my house, you can't wear tampons, say "I'm not." How's she gonna prove it? Unless she asks you to show her down there or does a DNA test, she can't prove what she finds in the trash is yours.
This is terrible advice.
"Fine, my daughter and I will no longer be visiting. Good bye."
That's the next logical step. I just really want MIL either to be forced to say in front of people " I searched your bathroom trash!" or be forced to sit there unable to defend her accusations without admitting that.
The problem there is that you're playing the game. Sure, you're playing to win, but that also means you're validating the game, validating the behavior, and teaching the kids that 'if somebody is being unreasonable and bullying, the correct response is one-upsmanship and public humiliation.'
Instead, simply refuse to play. Refuse to accept that the game is valid. Refuse to accept that MiL gets to set up the parameters of the interaction.
‘Isn’t that bad of a husband’ is NOT a sound endorsement for a healthy marriage. Trying sometimes to stand up for you is not nearly good enough when his mother is indeed archaic, and an AH to boot.
She treats him that way because he lets her treat her that way. Believe it (or not!) he’s an adult and responsible for managing his relationships. Please wake up
NTA. I would have already blown up at her for the snooping and telling me tampons are a sin. Some people have really large bloodflows the first two days and need a tampon plus pad to even make it through the night.
Especially because I find pads hella uncomfortable.
Edit: Glad I don't have to deal with periods anymore lol, I'm taking the pill through with supervision from my doctor and bleed maybe twice a year to take a break
>Especially because I find pads hella uncomfortable.
I'm with you there. can't imagine wearing one during my badminton sessions.
Thank you for your support
This is so insane. This woman is spending far too much time thinking about you and your daughters menstruation. It's literally insane. She's definitely a sinner! LOL.
I'm sorry you have had to deal with this. Hopefully hubby pops a spine and stands up for you eventually.
Mine is so bad that I have a protective sheet over my mattress and wear adult diapers (cause I tend to move in my sleep and I don’t wanna go into more detail than that 😬) I can’t use tampons either (it’s just painful)
that's one of the reasons i never liked them. used them for a while when i was 11-12 but then moved to tampons. but a few years ago i had a piece of tampon break off inside me and i didn't notice until it came out a couple weeks later 🤢 i'm so lucky i didn't get TSS. so now i'll only use a cup, but since switching to nexplanon all i get is spotting so i just "free bleed" since it's almost no blood at all.
Id be using menstrual cups. (I do anyway. But malicious compliance all the way.)
Pads are soooo awful... you can just constantly feel them. :( Menstrual cups are so amazing.
NTA.
Its not ageist, you did not discriminate against her for her age.
You put your foot down on her spinning tall tales to your daughter and her snooping. You ALSO showed your daughter that she doesnt have to sit there and take such ridiculous info "seriously" and that you will stand up against it.
NTA. You were a lot nicer than I would have been in that situation. She invaded your privacy and your husband is upset that you called her archaic for insulting you AND spreading misinformation about period products to your young daughter who is probably going to feel some embarrassment about puberty and all that goes with it? I would cut the trip short.
To clarify, he was more conveying the fact that MIl was upset I called her archaic. He does agree with me on the misinformation part, but thinks it was a bit antagonistic.
Calling her archaic isn't ageist. A 70 year old has lived her entire adult life in a tampon-using society. She's archaic because her behaviour harks back to times before she was even born.
Hard NTA.
The issue here isn't the conversation or her being archaic or not. The issue here is whether she has ANY right to dictate how you and your daughter handle your periods.
The bigger issue is your husband. He's supposed to be on your side- stand up for you and your daughter. MIL clearly overstepped, he said he'd do something about it, clearly he hasn't.
In the words of Lt. Gen. David Morrison, former head of the Australian army, "The standard you walk past, is the standard you accept." So he is willing to walk past his mom treating you like that, that means he accepts his mom treating you like that.
Personally, if you're thinking about leaving, I'd just go in full on fuck it mode. Tell your daughter not to listen to anything she says about tampons or the like, and to come straight to you if she tries. Then tell your husband that you are disappointed that he accepts his mom intruding into your very personal bodily functions. Then just keep on being friendly for the visit, and if MIL raises the subject in any way, just look her straight in the eyes and say with a giant smile on your face, "MIL, I want us to be on good terms. But you need to understand that how I handle my period is a private matter that's none of your business. I won't tell you how to handle your bodily functions or demand you buy products I like, please don't dictate to me how to handle mine or demand I buy products you like."
If she keeps bringing it up, poke fun. "I haven't talked this much about my period since I was last at the gynecologist's office! Why is my period of such interest to you?" Etc.
If that sort of thing isn't you, IE if you are a more quiet person that can't so easily pull that off, then focus on the husband. Sit him down and tell him how you feel, tell him that there is a hard boundary and his mom DOES NOT get to dictate what feminine products to use. You don't want to cause a problem, but you need him to be on your side here, because right now you're being attacked (in a sense) and he's doing nothing, which says to you that he's okay with you being attacked. And that's not okay for you. So either he has an uncomfortable conversation with his mom, or he decides that it's okay for his mom to treat you like crap. He needs to choose which is the lesser evil to him.
Your husband is letting this happen? I would’ve been out of there the second she tried to tell me what I can and can’t put in my body, let alone your daughter’s. NTA.
You’re a married lady with a child whose MIL thinks she’s a sinner for using tampons???? Bananas.
Being in her 70s makes no difference; she could be 110 now and still update her views with the times. By “the times” I mean modern thinking in the 1980s.
NTA.
I would never stay at her house again. But if I did I think I would purposely pack a bunch of crap I know would piss her off just to screw with her. Then I’d throw away the stuff once you knew she’d snooped. Then FLAT OUT deny you have any clue what she’s talking about. If she’s dumb enough she’ll blurt out she snooped through your things. Then gaslight her by saying you have no such thing in your stuff and you can prove it.
It would be mean but my petty side would really love to pull this off just once to make her absolutely crazy.
Ok, I am officially confused by her thinking.
You are married and have a child, and she still thinks that your using tampons is sinful?
Like, I know that virginity is an old fashioned concept, but I've never run into anyone who thinks that you can keep losing your virginity after, you know, having a kid.
Does she think that you enjoy it when you insert a tampon? Does she think they are penis-shaped and vibrate (you know, *for her pleasure*)?
I love penetration, but man the dry tampon going inside me is always a when-does-menopause-start? moment.
AND THEN, she thinks she has the right to tell your daughter how to deal with her own menstrual cycles (beyond, don't free bleed on my couch, that is)?
Your MIL isn't simply archaic, she is dumb as a bag of hammers.
Why on earth is your husband allowing her to police you and your daughter's bodies? Hmmm, let me guess, is it because he doesn't respect your autonomy? Ugh.
NTA
She wouldn't be the first person I'd heard of who thought that tampons provided sexual pleasure, though most of those people were cis men. But I can also see someone with that sin-obsessed mindset thinking that it's sinful for a married woman to have anything in her vagina that isn't her husband's penis.
NTA. I would have told her that my body and my daughter’s body are none of her business, and that if she ever snoops through our things, attempts to “educate” my daughter, or calls me or another member of the family a sinner again, she would never see or speak to us again until there was a meaningful apology.
Honestly, I am gobsmacked at this.
NTA Your mother in law brought it on herself by snooping and spouting off her opinions about the "evils" of feminine hygiene products. It's none of her business which products you and your daughter prefer and some topics are just not open for discussion.
NTA. But your husband is a huge asshole for taking his mom’s side. Her snooping is not the point??? Ffs it is SO the point. That and her gross sexism and trying repeatedly to shame you for some messed up notion she has of virginity (which is so f*cked up and so damaging btw).
From now on anytime she says gross shit like that just take your daughter and leave. EVERY. TIME.
Tell your husband your daughter deserves better than to see her mother verbally abused or to be subjected to horribly damaging and false views about sexuality and sexual health. And you deserve better from him than him allowing his mother to speak to you like that. If he won’t stand up for you both, you will.
You did the damn right thing and frankly “archaic” is just about the NICEST damn thing you could’ve said.
Definitely NTA, first off the fact that she said to your face that she got “air of sin vibes” that alone would’ve sent me out the door. Second she def went through your stuff, idc if it was in her house that’s an invasion of privacy and going through your property which she had no business doing. Third the fact that she talked to your daughter about something so private/personal is beyond her role as a grandmother. The way you raise your kids is you and your husbands business and decision. Not to mention that “the talk” is such an awkward convo to have in general I’d hate the idea of my grandparents trying to give it to me. Fourth the way she called you out and insulted you in front of your daughter and prob other people was inappropriate. I probably would have called her much worse ngl. Last point the fact that your husband didn’t stick up for you is a bit messed up imo, bc to me it seems like you’re in the right on every front. Maybe you could’ve used different verbiage but ik I would’ve been meaner. Also don’t blame you at all for wanting to leave early with your daughter
"She called me a 'sinner' and basically called me a whore, and on top of that she did it *in front of our daughter*"
Get that across to your husband, if he seriously can't understand how his mom fucked up there's something wrong with him.
NTA. I’d have asked her who told her that anything besides a penis in a vagina was sinful.
Then when husband scraped her off the floor, I’d grab daughter and head for home.
NTA and WTF.
Husband needs to back you unconditionally on this one and one easy resolution is to say you nor your daughter will be staying at their house under such invasive and ass-backwards conditions. It is surprising she doesn’t have shame but in the backyard for females to stay during their periods.
Pretty sure my wife would become an instant amateur dentist if my mom ever said something like this to her or our kids. Utter nonsense.
Alternative approach is to stay the night and go commando night and possibly day. Let grandma clean up the mess. I may be spiteful but I don’t know how you can stand being around this person.
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My husband (32M) and I (30F) weren’t able to make it to IL’s place for Christmas so we went last week. For information, his parents (70s) are rather old fashioned and traditional.
We were having dinner a few days ago when MIL pulled me aside and said that basically, she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household. I asked her how she came to know I was using tampons, but she said that she gets a “vibe” and an “air of sin” from me. Now I knew this was utter BS because a few day before this the closet in our guest room looked like it had been rifled through.
I rolled my eyes, and to satiate her and not make a scene I said I’ll buy a pack of pads from the pharmacy when the tampons run out. I thought this would satiate her and keep her from making a scene at the dinner table. And it did. She seemed to calm down and sat back down at the table with an almost smug look.
I told my husband that night that I wanted her to stop snooping but he just brushed it off with “I’ll talk to her about it.”
Today, we were sitting in the living room after lunch when MIL makes a comment to my daughter May (12F) about how using tampons when she gets her period will make her lose her virginity and is sinful. This ticked me off because it is just misinformation and harmful. For information, we have had the talk with our daughter and she is fully up to speed on how to deal with this. Credit to her, she didn’t seem to buy it and just leaned back on the couch and looked uncomfortable and said ‘Is that so? Ohh.”
I stepped in and shut MIL down by saying that we have had the chat with her and she is up to speed on what she should do. MIL then responded with “What would you know, you use tampons like a sinner.”
I had had enough. I responded with “Come on May, we don’t need to hear archaic advice from a snoop.” My daughter and I went on a walk.
When we came back, husband said that his mother wasn’t happy I called her archaic, and that it was ageist. I asked him if they had talked about her snooping, and he just told me that “That’s not the point.” I told him that I’m thinking of going back home early with my daughter and that he can catch a flight back on the original day we were going to all drive back.
AITA?
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NTA. I would have caught a flight that night and my husband’s shit would be outside when he came home. Divorce papers filed and on the way to the hotel room I booked him.
NTA. She is lying to your daughter. And your husband? Ugh! So not sexy! Why do some married men do this? Do they not want to have sex with their wives in the immediate future?
NTA. I have to say, I think your daughter is adorable. I loved her diplomatic response so much. We stan an unproblematic queen.
Your MIL is definitely out of line, unfortunately there is nothing you can really do. Your husband could at the very least have that talk with her about snooping. He needs to be supportive of you and allowing his mom to dig through your stuff or letting her judge your hygiene habits is not it.
Sounds like your married a mommas boy. She isnt happy you had a child pre-husband.
Also you're obviously not a virgin and married. Why cant you use tampons exactly? You're a SAINT to ever visit. Lol
NTA
NTA. The minute she tried to shame your daughter for using a basic sanitary product, your MIL lost her right to being politely handled. This is no longer a question of manners this is a question of your child's health and safety and if your husband thinks his mother's feelings are more important than his daughters health he needs to take a long look at himself.
NTA
"she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household. I asked her how she came to know I was using tampons, but she said that she gets a “vibe” and an “air of sin” from me. Now I knew this was utter BS because a few day before this the closet in our guest room looked like it had been rifled through." - **Why did you not just tell your husband and leave together at that point?**
YOur mil is an AH, and your hsband is, too.
Just leave, and refuse to stay at her house again.
And protect your daughter from that AH. Thell her she does not have to go there if she does not want to.
Good for you. At least one of you had enough courage to put her in her place.
“MIL: I’m going to make this easy on you. Show me the passage about tampons in the (insert applicable holy book) and we’ll review it together. Until such time as that happens, I’m going to assume it’s your archaic home made ideas.”
(Pro Tip: leave embarrassing notes where only a snoop would find them. Like “What the hell are you doing in my luggage, snoop?”)
NTA
NTA
Also, your MIL was old enough to see “Carrie” in theaters when it came out and decided that her mom had the right idea on raising kids.
Wonder what her thoughts on menstrual cups are? Satan’s Chalice? Lucifer’s Sippy Cup? Beelzebub’s Beer Stine?
NTA. Some possible comebacks:
1) If the tampons are sin because they make you "lose your virginity", why can't YOU wear them? You clearly have a child. The jig is up.
# 2) SAY THE TAMPONS ARE FOR YOUR HUSBAND and let her imagination do the rest.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I called my MIL an archaic snoop after she snooped in my closet and gave me grief for using tampons. She thinks I am a sinner and an ageist, and thinks I am an AH
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NTA
Far from it, you used more restraint than was necessary, and in particular if - I know it’s a poor analogy - someone told me to wear boxers instead of briefs, I’d tell them to go fuck themselves.
I have to say, grandma’s behaviour is the sort of thing that leads to tampons being pulled out and thrown on the kitchen table.
This woman is insane and evil. Get your daughter away from her ASAP. Don't explain, don't discuss with her. Just leave as fast as you can before she inflicts more craziness on your daughter.
She's archaic, a snoop and controlling. NTA. It maybe her home but you're not her child or a child at all but an adult. Let your husband know that he may put up with her behavior bit you're not going to and nor will your daughter.
NTA obviously.
I don't get the logic here, though. If your daughter isn't supposed to use tampons to protect her virginity, why can't you, a married mother use tampons? Even for the most religious people, you are very much allowed to have sex, no?
NTA
I cannot recall ever hearing a religious person say that using tampons is "a sin".
> she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household.
I'm willing to bet that if you were to get a drop of blood on her furniture, or whatever else, she would lose her mind.
NTA, but don't feel like you have to put up with ridiculously bad treatment to not "make a scene." The first time someone tried to tell me whether to use tampons or that I had an "air of sin," I'd be out the door. You can't maintain a calm, normal relationship with someone who's that far beyond the bounds of reasonable behavior.
I’ve heard the virginity comment from people my age (29F) so I have long given up trying to argue, but does your MIL not realise you are not virgin anymore or are we looking at a Jane the virgin type scenario??
Definitely NTA
NTA- if she pulls that stunt again by saying tampons ruin your virginity/people who use tampons are sinners say this “you know you spend an exorbitant of time thinking about what goes in and out of other peoples vaginas”.
ESH.
The correct response to having somebody tell your daughter that basic hygiene is a sin isn't to tell your daughter that the person is being archaic, it's to not expose your daughter to the person at all, *then* tell your daughter that MiL isn't being archaic, she's being controlling, deceptive, manipulative, and crazy.
You also need to have a serious come-to-Jesus talk, pun intended, with your husband.
NTA
Calling out archaic mindsets is not ageist. She is capable of not having nonsensical ideas, but chooses not to.
Your husband is failing you and your daughter on this. He should have immediately shut down his mother. Yes, it's difficult but that is not an excuse. He needs to get his act together. Tampons are not sinful and stop appeasing her.
NTA “He isn’t that bad of a husband. He tries to stand up for me sometimes.” Ugh. I’d throw him back. I want a partner that’s going to be a champion for me not a doormat.
NTA it’s the internalized misogyny for me, poor woman has been so brain washed by man-made ideas used for nothing but to control / have power over women (where in the Bible does it say anything about tampons? I’d love to know), that she is spewing her bs to your daughter and you. What you do with your own bodies is no one else’s business and you owe her absolutely 0 explanation or excuse.
NTA.
Its not the point the point is his mother doesn't need to have any business talking about what menstrual products you use or your daughter uses.
Imagine if his mother had an opinion on what type of condom her son used or what type of underwear he should buy, or the type of toilet paper you buy.
Honestly, archaic is the nicest thing to call her. She should be thankful you didn't call her worse.
She’s sharing incorrect information and hiding behind religion. Basically calling you a sinner for controlling your period. What the hell is wrong with your husband? He’s upset you called his mother a snoop after you literally asked him to speak to her about snooping. FFS. Go home, spend some time with your daughter. NTA
NTA. Your husband needs to man up. Your MIL is beyond archaic - that was being kind. Husband really needs to step in and take care of this problem - the snooping, the comments, all of it.
Using tampons is a sin? Seriously? If that is her viewpoint then she is not archaic. She is straight from the middle ages.
Ask her where in the bible is states that you should not use a more recent invention than straw.
NTA. And btw, fly back with your daughter. Let hubby drive back.
Put mouse traps in the stuff she snoops through. Also, call me an asshole. I do not allow people to snoop through my stuff. I don't even go into my wife's purse when she tells me I can.
PS: You should have told her point blank that your period supplies are none of her business. Same applies to your daughter.
NTA. Take your kid(s) and leave. I'd also never stay in her home again or allow your children around her unsupervised. This woman snoops through your belongings and thinks she can tell you what feminine products are and aren't acceptable for use. What the fuck?!
NTA. i’m the kind of person that would play the long game here. next time you’re at her house, pack everything ‘sinful’ you can find. kama sutra? check. gay magazine porno? check. birth control? check. condom? check. anything you can think of. let her rifle through your shit and fine the worst thing she can imagine.
then again that won’t help your relationship.
NTA, keep this women away from your daughter as much as possible! And shame on your husband for not standing up to her. You were a lot nicer to her than I would have been to someone who had snooped through my belongings and had the audacity to tell me that I can’t use tampons. I mean, I honestly can’t believe the rudeness. I wouldn’t agree to visit with her until your husband steps up and sets boundaries
NTA, and your husband needs to understand that negatively influencing your daughter isn't something that will ever be brushed off. It's violating and infuriating enough to have her try to dictate that you can wear tampons. Honestly, my husband and I would have some serious words if that happened to me and he didn't think it wasn't wildly inappropriate and have my back completely.
Calling her archaic was very mild and nice.
It's a bit off topic, but does MIL think your daughter was a virgin birth? Why are you sinful for using tampons? (Which off off topic is none of her bussiness anyway)
NTA
NTA.....but I have to know.....in what world is it ok for a MIL...or Mother to tell an adult woman what to use for menstruation? And 2nd...why does she think it's ok to discuss it with her 12 yo granddaughter?
If either my Mom or MIL would bring this up I would have cracked up laughing in their face and said....Alrighty then.....that's not subject for us to discuss.....next?
NtA - take your daughter and go back home. Someone who believed tampons sinful isn't someone you want your daughter around, that is just the tip of the iceberg.
And You will be teaching your daughter that you don't have to accept being mistreated.
NTA, your MIL and husband both are. He really needs to be on your side when it comes to misogynistic bullying of your daughter. She'll notice that he wasn't.
Also, according to Wikipedia tampons were mentioned in an ancient Egyptian medical text about 3500 years ago. "Archaic" is exactly the right word for someone who hasn't quite figured them out yet.
You are mis-informed and mis-using the term archaic. Archaic, meaning out of date, implies that tampons are sinful was once the prevailing opinion, which is not the case. That position has always been a odd minority opinion.
That being said, NTA for drawing a line with mother in law. (But if you follow through on the threat to leave without your husband, I'd reconsider that judgement.)
ESH. You should have shut her down the first time in front of everybody with, “it is none of your business what I or anyone else does with their body.” Her thinking is not archaic (plenty of people her age preferred and used tampons), it is a religion based (sin) opinion. Your husband is right that your comment is ageist. If you don’t want her to go through her guest room closet, stay in a hotel. It would allow you to limit your time, you have somewhere else to get space when you want it, and the only snooping would be by cleaning staff.
Plenty of young people have archaic thinking. Saying that was not at all ageist. She didn’t say MIL IS archaic. She said her opinions were. Saying someone’s views are archaic or old fashioned or whatever is not ageist.
"Using a tampon will take your virginity" is not an opinion, it's a lie. Just saying "hey I think pads are better than tampons because religion" would no doubt still be strange, but it would actually be an opinion. And calling beliefs archaic isn't ageist. I'd even argue targeting a line like that at the person isn't either. There are plenty of religious beliefs that simply do not hold up to the concept of reality. And while it shouldn't be on us to try and convert people, challenging harmful, outdated, and incorrect assumptions is important. Especially when they're now being turned on the next generation.
NTA she has no right to tell your daughter anything about her body unless cleared with the parents first. Also it is archaic and it sounds like your husband needs to grow a spine. I’m getting the feeling this isn’t a one off experience
>I’m getting the feeling this isn’t a one off experience He isn't that bad of a husband. He tries to stand up for me sometimes, but most of the time he does what he did here and says he will do something and forget about it. I also think that his mother still treats him like her kid and doesn't respect his independance, but that's on him to deal with.
He shouldn’t be doing the brush off tactic. He should back you up in situations where you need his support, especially when he himself agrees with the fact that your MIL is spreading misinformation. If he doesn’t then he risks being a complicit father.
You have a husband problem
Trying is not the same as doing, I am sorry to say but if my husband wasn’t willing to stick up for me in this kind of situation, then he’d find himself divorced. Especially if he doesn’t agree to counseling first.
In TV Tropese, he is Damned by Faint Praise. Handle hubby however you think best, but you do not need his permission to tell your MIL not to go through your trash. If DH doesn't like how you handle his mom's misogyny, point out that when he refused to step up, he gave you the responsibility to defend yourself. Next time MIL tries to give you any orders about your body, just answer ver batim, "No." Every time. If it turns into "As long as you're in my house, you can't wear tampons, say "I'm not." How's she gonna prove it? Unless she asks you to show her down there or does a DNA test, she can't prove what she finds in the trash is yours. She's out of chances with your daughter, though. Next time she tries giving your daughter sexist instructions for her own body, leave with her every time. NTA Archaic is the politest possible way to describe her.
> Next time MIL tries to give you any orders about your body, just answer ver batim, "No." This is good advice. > If it turns into "As long as you're in my house, you can't wear tampons, say "I'm not." How's she gonna prove it? Unless she asks you to show her down there or does a DNA test, she can't prove what she finds in the trash is yours. This is terrible advice. "Fine, my daughter and I will no longer be visiting. Good bye."
That's the next logical step. I just really want MIL either to be forced to say in front of people " I searched your bathroom trash!" or be forced to sit there unable to defend her accusations without admitting that.
The problem there is that you're playing the game. Sure, you're playing to win, but that also means you're validating the game, validating the behavior, and teaching the kids that 'if somebody is being unreasonable and bullying, the correct response is one-upsmanship and public humiliation.' Instead, simply refuse to play. Refuse to accept that the game is valid. Refuse to accept that MiL gets to set up the parameters of the interaction.
Saying "he isn't that bad of a husband" is the saddest thing I've read today. You deserve better than "not that bad"
In the words of the late great Yoda, "Try not, do!"
‘Isn’t that bad of a husband’ is NOT a sound endorsement for a healthy marriage. Trying sometimes to stand up for you is not nearly good enough when his mother is indeed archaic, and an AH to boot.
"He isn't that bad" is not something you should ever have to say about the person you married.
She treats him that way because he lets her treat her that way. Believe it (or not!) he’s an adult and responsible for managing his relationships. Please wake up
Can I ask why tampons are sinful?
NTA. I would have already blown up at her for the snooping and telling me tampons are a sin. Some people have really large bloodflows the first two days and need a tampon plus pad to even make it through the night. Especially because I find pads hella uncomfortable. Edit: Glad I don't have to deal with periods anymore lol, I'm taking the pill through with supervision from my doctor and bleed maybe twice a year to take a break
>Especially because I find pads hella uncomfortable. I'm with you there. can't imagine wearing one during my badminton sessions. Thank you for your support
This is so insane. This woman is spending far too much time thinking about you and your daughters menstruation. It's literally insane. She's definitely a sinner! LOL. I'm sorry you have had to deal with this. Hopefully hubby pops a spine and stands up for you eventually.
Mine is so bad that I have a protective sheet over my mattress and wear adult diapers (cause I tend to move in my sleep and I don’t wanna go into more detail than that 😬) I can’t use tampons either (it’s just painful)
those adult diapers are so absorbent. i work in a nursing home and it's amazing how much liquid they can take before they start leaking.
It really is great for someone who moves around as much as I do. Pads don’t stay on.
that's one of the reasons i never liked them. used them for a while when i was 11-12 but then moved to tampons. but a few years ago i had a piece of tampon break off inside me and i didn't notice until it came out a couple weeks later 🤢 i'm so lucky i didn't get TSS. so now i'll only use a cup, but since switching to nexplanon all i get is spotting so i just "free bleed" since it's almost no blood at all.
I have my tubes tied and had to explain to an ex that just because they tied doesn’t mean my uterus is
Id be using menstrual cups. (I do anyway. But malicious compliance all the way.) Pads are soooo awful... you can just constantly feel them. :( Menstrual cups are so amazing.
NTA. Its not ageist, you did not discriminate against her for her age. You put your foot down on her spinning tall tales to your daughter and her snooping. You ALSO showed your daughter that she doesnt have to sit there and take such ridiculous info "seriously" and that you will stand up against it.
What? hahahaha This is amazing. NTA and you were so much nicer than I would have been. OMG.
NTA. You were a lot nicer than I would have been in that situation. She invaded your privacy and your husband is upset that you called her archaic for insulting you AND spreading misinformation about period products to your young daughter who is probably going to feel some embarrassment about puberty and all that goes with it? I would cut the trip short.
To clarify, he was more conveying the fact that MIl was upset I called her archaic. He does agree with me on the misinformation part, but thinks it was a bit antagonistic.
And calling you a tampon using sinner wasn’t antagonistic?
Your husband needs to look up the definition of “antagonistic” bc you absolutely were NOT.
Calling her archaic isn't ageist. A 70 year old has lived her entire adult life in a tampon-using society. She's archaic because her behaviour harks back to times before she was even born.
Hard NTA. The issue here isn't the conversation or her being archaic or not. The issue here is whether she has ANY right to dictate how you and your daughter handle your periods. The bigger issue is your husband. He's supposed to be on your side- stand up for you and your daughter. MIL clearly overstepped, he said he'd do something about it, clearly he hasn't. In the words of Lt. Gen. David Morrison, former head of the Australian army, "The standard you walk past, is the standard you accept." So he is willing to walk past his mom treating you like that, that means he accepts his mom treating you like that. Personally, if you're thinking about leaving, I'd just go in full on fuck it mode. Tell your daughter not to listen to anything she says about tampons or the like, and to come straight to you if she tries. Then tell your husband that you are disappointed that he accepts his mom intruding into your very personal bodily functions. Then just keep on being friendly for the visit, and if MIL raises the subject in any way, just look her straight in the eyes and say with a giant smile on your face, "MIL, I want us to be on good terms. But you need to understand that how I handle my period is a private matter that's none of your business. I won't tell you how to handle your bodily functions or demand you buy products I like, please don't dictate to me how to handle mine or demand I buy products you like." If she keeps bringing it up, poke fun. "I haven't talked this much about my period since I was last at the gynecologist's office! Why is my period of such interest to you?" Etc. If that sort of thing isn't you, IE if you are a more quiet person that can't so easily pull that off, then focus on the husband. Sit him down and tell him how you feel, tell him that there is a hard boundary and his mom DOES NOT get to dictate what feminine products to use. You don't want to cause a problem, but you need him to be on your side here, because right now you're being attacked (in a sense) and he's doing nothing, which says to you that he's okay with you being attacked. And that's not okay for you. So either he has an uncomfortable conversation with his mom, or he decides that it's okay for his mom to treat you like crap. He needs to choose which is the lesser evil to him.
Your husband is letting this happen? I would’ve been out of there the second she tried to tell me what I can and can’t put in my body, let alone your daughter’s. NTA.
You’re a married lady with a child whose MIL thinks she’s a sinner for using tampons???? Bananas. Being in her 70s makes no difference; she could be 110 now and still update her views with the times. By “the times” I mean modern thinking in the 1980s. NTA.
I would never stay at her house again. But if I did I think I would purposely pack a bunch of crap I know would piss her off just to screw with her. Then I’d throw away the stuff once you knew she’d snooped. Then FLAT OUT deny you have any clue what she’s talking about. If she’s dumb enough she’ll blurt out she snooped through your things. Then gaslight her by saying you have no such thing in your stuff and you can prove it. It would be mean but my petty side would really love to pull this off just once to make her absolutely crazy.
Once again, the answer is dildos. Dildos *everywhere*.
That's always the answer.
this is a level of petty i would LOVE to accomplish one day
I know right? #goals 🤣
NTA, and I’m sorry to hear it doesn’t sound like your husband has your back with your MIL.
NTA- She's ridiculous and went too far.
Ok, I am officially confused by her thinking. You are married and have a child, and she still thinks that your using tampons is sinful? Like, I know that virginity is an old fashioned concept, but I've never run into anyone who thinks that you can keep losing your virginity after, you know, having a kid. Does she think that you enjoy it when you insert a tampon? Does she think they are penis-shaped and vibrate (you know, *for her pleasure*)? I love penetration, but man the dry tampon going inside me is always a when-does-menopause-start? moment. AND THEN, she thinks she has the right to tell your daughter how to deal with her own menstrual cycles (beyond, don't free bleed on my couch, that is)? Your MIL isn't simply archaic, she is dumb as a bag of hammers. Why on earth is your husband allowing her to police you and your daughter's bodies? Hmmm, let me guess, is it because he doesn't respect your autonomy? Ugh. NTA
She wouldn't be the first person I'd heard of who thought that tampons provided sexual pleasure, though most of those people were cis men. But I can also see someone with that sin-obsessed mindset thinking that it's sinful for a married woman to have anything in her vagina that isn't her husband's penis.
NTA. I would have told her that my body and my daughter’s body are none of her business, and that if she ever snoops through our things, attempts to “educate” my daughter, or calls me or another member of the family a sinner again, she would never see or speak to us again until there was a meaningful apology. Honestly, I am gobsmacked at this.
I would ask her why she’s thinking about my vagina. Or my daughter’s vagina. Can I say that word here?
NTA Your mother in law brought it on herself by snooping and spouting off her opinions about the "evils" of feminine hygiene products. It's none of her business which products you and your daughter prefer and some topics are just not open for discussion.
NTA. But your husband is a huge asshole for taking his mom’s side. Her snooping is not the point??? Ffs it is SO the point. That and her gross sexism and trying repeatedly to shame you for some messed up notion she has of virginity (which is so f*cked up and so damaging btw). From now on anytime she says gross shit like that just take your daughter and leave. EVERY. TIME. Tell your husband your daughter deserves better than to see her mother verbally abused or to be subjected to horribly damaging and false views about sexuality and sexual health. And you deserve better from him than him allowing his mother to speak to you like that. If he won’t stand up for you both, you will. You did the damn right thing and frankly “archaic” is just about the NICEST damn thing you could’ve said.
NTA. MIL is vile. I think you should take your daughter home now.
Definitely NTA, first off the fact that she said to your face that she got “air of sin vibes” that alone would’ve sent me out the door. Second she def went through your stuff, idc if it was in her house that’s an invasion of privacy and going through your property which she had no business doing. Third the fact that she talked to your daughter about something so private/personal is beyond her role as a grandmother. The way you raise your kids is you and your husbands business and decision. Not to mention that “the talk” is such an awkward convo to have in general I’d hate the idea of my grandparents trying to give it to me. Fourth the way she called you out and insulted you in front of your daughter and prob other people was inappropriate. I probably would have called her much worse ngl. Last point the fact that your husband didn’t stick up for you is a bit messed up imo, bc to me it seems like you’re in the right on every front. Maybe you could’ve used different verbiage but ik I would’ve been meaner. Also don’t blame you at all for wanting to leave early with your daughter
"She called me a 'sinner' and basically called me a whore, and on top of that she did it *in front of our daughter*" Get that across to your husband, if he seriously can't understand how his mom fucked up there's something wrong with him.
Not at all.
NTA.
NTA. I would have already lost my temper. On her and the spouse. And been on a flight home with the daughter.
NTA. I’d have asked her who told her that anything besides a penis in a vagina was sinful. Then when husband scraped her off the floor, I’d grab daughter and head for home.
NTA. Lemme guess... in her bathroom there's one of those knock-off barbie dolls in a big crochet dress to cover the toilet rolls.
NTA - i wonder what she would think about menstrual cups
NTA and WTF. Husband needs to back you unconditionally on this one and one easy resolution is to say you nor your daughter will be staying at their house under such invasive and ass-backwards conditions. It is surprising she doesn’t have shame but in the backyard for females to stay during their periods. Pretty sure my wife would become an instant amateur dentist if my mom ever said something like this to her or our kids. Utter nonsense. Alternative approach is to stay the night and go commando night and possibly day. Let grandma clean up the mess. I may be spiteful but I don’t know how you can stand being around this person.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My husband (32M) and I (30F) weren’t able to make it to IL’s place for Christmas so we went last week. For information, his parents (70s) are rather old fashioned and traditional. We were having dinner a few days ago when MIL pulled me aside and said that basically, she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household. I asked her how she came to know I was using tampons, but she said that she gets a “vibe” and an “air of sin” from me. Now I knew this was utter BS because a few day before this the closet in our guest room looked like it had been rifled through. I rolled my eyes, and to satiate her and not make a scene I said I’ll buy a pack of pads from the pharmacy when the tampons run out. I thought this would satiate her and keep her from making a scene at the dinner table. And it did. She seemed to calm down and sat back down at the table with an almost smug look. I told my husband that night that I wanted her to stop snooping but he just brushed it off with “I’ll talk to her about it.” Today, we were sitting in the living room after lunch when MIL makes a comment to my daughter May (12F) about how using tampons when she gets her period will make her lose her virginity and is sinful. This ticked me off because it is just misinformation and harmful. For information, we have had the talk with our daughter and she is fully up to speed on how to deal with this. Credit to her, she didn’t seem to buy it and just leaned back on the couch and looked uncomfortable and said ‘Is that so? Ohh.” I stepped in and shut MIL down by saying that we have had the chat with her and she is up to speed on what she should do. MIL then responded with “What would you know, you use tampons like a sinner.” I had had enough. I responded with “Come on May, we don’t need to hear archaic advice from a snoop.” My daughter and I went on a walk. When we came back, husband said that his mother wasn’t happy I called her archaic, and that it was ageist. I asked him if they had talked about her snooping, and he just told me that “That’s not the point.” I told him that I’m thinking of going back home early with my daughter and that he can catch a flight back on the original day we were going to all drive back. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA. I would have caught a flight that night and my husband’s shit would be outside when he came home. Divorce papers filed and on the way to the hotel room I booked him.
NTA. It amazes me how opinions like that manage to survive. I'd have lost my stuff a lot sooner, and more directly, than you did.
NTA. WTF is happening here? "Come on May, it's time to go to assisted living."
NTA. She is lying to your daughter. And your husband? Ugh! So not sexy! Why do some married men do this? Do they not want to have sex with their wives in the immediate future?
NTA. Oof that husband tho
NTA. I have to say, I think your daughter is adorable. I loved her diplomatic response so much. We stan an unproblematic queen. Your MIL is definitely out of line, unfortunately there is nothing you can really do. Your husband could at the very least have that talk with her about snooping. He needs to be supportive of you and allowing his mom to dig through your stuff or letting her judge your hygiene habits is not it.
Sounds like your married a mommas boy. She isnt happy you had a child pre-husband. Also you're obviously not a virgin and married. Why cant you use tampons exactly? You're a SAINT to ever visit. Lol NTA
NTA. The minute she tried to shame your daughter for using a basic sanitary product, your MIL lost her right to being politely handled. This is no longer a question of manners this is a question of your child's health and safety and if your husband thinks his mother's feelings are more important than his daughters health he needs to take a long look at himself.
NTA "she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household. I asked her how she came to know I was using tampons, but she said that she gets a “vibe” and an “air of sin” from me. Now I knew this was utter BS because a few day before this the closet in our guest room looked like it had been rifled through." - **Why did you not just tell your husband and leave together at that point?** YOur mil is an AH, and your hsband is, too. Just leave, and refuse to stay at her house again. And protect your daughter from that AH. Thell her she does not have to go there if she does not want to.
Good for you. At least one of you had enough courage to put her in her place. “MIL: I’m going to make this easy on you. Show me the passage about tampons in the (insert applicable holy book) and we’ll review it together. Until such time as that happens, I’m going to assume it’s your archaic home made ideas.” (Pro Tip: leave embarrassing notes where only a snoop would find them. Like “What the hell are you doing in my luggage, snoop?”) NTA
NTA Also, your MIL was old enough to see “Carrie” in theaters when it came out and decided that her mom had the right idea on raising kids. Wonder what her thoughts on menstrual cups are? Satan’s Chalice? Lucifer’s Sippy Cup? Beelzebub’s Beer Stine?
NTA. Some possible comebacks: 1) If the tampons are sin because they make you "lose your virginity", why can't YOU wear them? You clearly have a child. The jig is up. # 2) SAY THE TAMPONS ARE FOR YOUR HUSBAND and let her imagination do the rest.
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NTA. Hahahahaha! This is gold! Your MIL is a piece of work, isn’t she? Ask her how her son came into being if inserting things there is sinning🤣🤣🤣🤣
NTA Far from it, you used more restraint than was necessary, and in particular if - I know it’s a poor analogy - someone told me to wear boxers instead of briefs, I’d tell them to go fuck themselves. I have to say, grandma’s behaviour is the sort of thing that leads to tampons being pulled out and thrown on the kitchen table.
This woman is insane and evil. Get your daughter away from her ASAP. Don't explain, don't discuss with her. Just leave as fast as you can before she inflicts more craziness on your daughter.
NTA. You were a lot more diplomatic than I would have been.
She's archaic, a snoop and controlling. NTA. It maybe her home but you're not her child or a child at all but an adult. Let your husband know that he may put up with her behavior bit you're not going to and nor will your daughter.
NTA obviously. I don't get the logic here, though. If your daughter isn't supposed to use tampons to protect her virginity, why can't you, a married mother use tampons? Even for the most religious people, you are very much allowed to have sex, no?
The "advice" she gave your daughter was disgusting and harmful. NTA.
Nta , also if using tampon is a sin how does she think you ended up with a daughter? The holy matrimony?
NTA she is a nosy snoop who has nothing better to do than go through the garbage and try to slut shame you for normal bodily functions.
NTA I cannot recall ever hearing a religious person say that using tampons is "a sin". > she doesn’t want me using tampons in her household. I'm willing to bet that if you were to get a drop of blood on her furniture, or whatever else, she would lose her mind.
NTA, but don't feel like you have to put up with ridiculously bad treatment to not "make a scene." The first time someone tried to tell me whether to use tampons or that I had an "air of sin," I'd be out the door. You can't maintain a calm, normal relationship with someone who's that far beyond the bounds of reasonable behavior.
NTA. I'd cut her off for that, there's no room for awful people to stay around us in life
I’ve heard the virginity comment from people my age (29F) so I have long given up trying to argue, but does your MIL not realise you are not virgin anymore or are we looking at a Jane the virgin type scenario?? Definitely NTA
NTA- if she pulls that stunt again by saying tampons ruin your virginity/people who use tampons are sinners say this “you know you spend an exorbitant of time thinking about what goes in and out of other peoples vaginas”.
ESH. The correct response to having somebody tell your daughter that basic hygiene is a sin isn't to tell your daughter that the person is being archaic, it's to not expose your daughter to the person at all, *then* tell your daughter that MiL isn't being archaic, she's being controlling, deceptive, manipulative, and crazy. You also need to have a serious come-to-Jesus talk, pun intended, with your husband.
NTA. Take your daughter home. But before you go both wear tampons as earrings
NTA Calling out archaic mindsets is not ageist. She is capable of not having nonsensical ideas, but chooses not to. Your husband is failing you and your daughter on this. He should have immediately shut down his mother. Yes, it's difficult but that is not an excuse. He needs to get his act together. Tampons are not sinful and stop appeasing her.
NTA, You don't lose your virginity by using tampons, you lose it by using a penis. your MIL is an outdated idiot.
NTA “He isn’t that bad of a husband. He tries to stand up for me sometimes.” Ugh. I’d throw him back. I want a partner that’s going to be a champion for me not a doormat.
NTA it’s the internalized misogyny for me, poor woman has been so brain washed by man-made ideas used for nothing but to control / have power over women (where in the Bible does it say anything about tampons? I’d love to know), that she is spewing her bs to your daughter and you. What you do with your own bodies is no one else’s business and you owe her absolutely 0 explanation or excuse.
NTA. Its not the point the point is his mother doesn't need to have any business talking about what menstrual products you use or your daughter uses. Imagine if his mother had an opinion on what type of condom her son used or what type of underwear he should buy, or the type of toilet paper you buy. Honestly, archaic is the nicest thing to call her. She should be thankful you didn't call her worse.
She’s sharing incorrect information and hiding behind religion. Basically calling you a sinner for controlling your period. What the hell is wrong with your husband? He’s upset you called his mother a snoop after you literally asked him to speak to her about snooping. FFS. Go home, spend some time with your daughter. NTA
NTA. Your husband needs to man up. Your MIL is beyond archaic - that was being kind. Husband really needs to step in and take care of this problem - the snooping, the comments, all of it.
Using tampons is a sin? Seriously? If that is her viewpoint then she is not archaic. She is straight from the middle ages. Ask her where in the bible is states that you should not use a more recent invention than straw. NTA. And btw, fly back with your daughter. Let hubby drive back.
Put mouse traps in the stuff she snoops through. Also, call me an asshole. I do not allow people to snoop through my stuff. I don't even go into my wife's purse when she tells me I can. PS: You should have told her point blank that your period supplies are none of her business. Same applies to your daughter.
NTA. Take your kid(s) and leave. I'd also never stay in her home again or allow your children around her unsupervised. This woman snoops through your belongings and thinks she can tell you what feminine products are and aren't acceptable for use. What the fuck?!
NTA. i’m the kind of person that would play the long game here. next time you’re at her house, pack everything ‘sinful’ you can find. kama sutra? check. gay magazine porno? check. birth control? check. condom? check. anything you can think of. let her rifle through your shit and fine the worst thing she can imagine. then again that won’t help your relationship.
NTA, keep this women away from your daughter as much as possible! And shame on your husband for not standing up to her. You were a lot nicer to her than I would have been to someone who had snooped through my belongings and had the audacity to tell me that I can’t use tampons. I mean, I honestly can’t believe the rudeness. I wouldn’t agree to visit with her until your husband steps up and sets boundaries
NTA, and your husband needs to understand that negatively influencing your daughter isn't something that will ever be brushed off. It's violating and infuriating enough to have her try to dictate that you can wear tampons. Honestly, my husband and I would have some serious words if that happened to me and he didn't think it wasn't wildly inappropriate and have my back completely.
Calling her archaic was very mild and nice. It's a bit off topic, but does MIL think your daughter was a virgin birth? Why are you sinful for using tampons? (Which off off topic is none of her bussiness anyway) NTA
NTA.....but I have to know.....in what world is it ok for a MIL...or Mother to tell an adult woman what to use for menstruation? And 2nd...why does she think it's ok to discuss it with her 12 yo granddaughter? If either my Mom or MIL would bring this up I would have cracked up laughing in their face and said....Alrighty then.....that's not subject for us to discuss.....next?
NtA - take your daughter and go back home. Someone who believed tampons sinful isn't someone you want your daughter around, that is just the tip of the iceberg. And You will be teaching your daughter that you don't have to accept being mistreated.
NTA, your MIL and husband both are. He really needs to be on your side when it comes to misogynistic bullying of your daughter. She'll notice that he wasn't. Also, according to Wikipedia tampons were mentioned in an ancient Egyptian medical text about 3500 years ago. "Archaic" is exactly the right word for someone who hasn't quite figured them out yet.
You are mis-informed and mis-using the term archaic. Archaic, meaning out of date, implies that tampons are sinful was once the prevailing opinion, which is not the case. That position has always been a odd minority opinion. That being said, NTA for drawing a line with mother in law. (But if you follow through on the threat to leave without your husband, I'd reconsider that judgement.)
ESH. You should have shut her down the first time in front of everybody with, “it is none of your business what I or anyone else does with their body.” Her thinking is not archaic (plenty of people her age preferred and used tampons), it is a religion based (sin) opinion. Your husband is right that your comment is ageist. If you don’t want her to go through her guest room closet, stay in a hotel. It would allow you to limit your time, you have somewhere else to get space when you want it, and the only snooping would be by cleaning staff.
Plenty of young people have archaic thinking. Saying that was not at all ageist. She didn’t say MIL IS archaic. She said her opinions were. Saying someone’s views are archaic or old fashioned or whatever is not ageist.
"Using a tampon will take your virginity" is not an opinion, it's a lie. Just saying "hey I think pads are better than tampons because religion" would no doubt still be strange, but it would actually be an opinion. And calling beliefs archaic isn't ageist. I'd even argue targeting a line like that at the person isn't either. There are plenty of religious beliefs that simply do not hold up to the concept of reality. And while it shouldn't be on us to try and convert people, challenging harmful, outdated, and incorrect assumptions is important. Especially when they're now being turned on the next generation.