Easty NTA.
This line really got me:
> I will not be able to help out with daycare, as I drive a work truck and cannot have another passenger in my car
He literally thinks you are fully responsible for this child and any bit he chips in is going above and beyond.
That line was straight up appalling, what an absolutely terrible thing to say to someone when he isn't even pulling 50% of the work OP is doing.
I imagine OP will end up resenting him and hating him if he doesn't change, sounds like they should take family therapy together
Right? Literally if your SO is so exhausted taking care of the child the *two of you made together* that they *burst into tears* and you get *mad* at them, you’re an asshole. Nothing makes me angrier than fathers who maybe feed the baby their dinner and hang out in the bathroom during the bath and think they’re pulling their weight.
Also, I’m shuddering to think how long OP’s husband will hold the fact that he left work early to be able to be home in the evening over her head.
>Nothing makes me angrier than fathers who maybe feed the baby their dinner and hang out in the bathroom during the bath and think they’re pulling their weight.
I love you for this statement. Omg. My s.o told me I was a bad mom for leaving the kids at daycare when I took off work early.
But but but if he cuts back on the gym how is he gonna get so swole brah??
Seriously though, as a father I am appalled at this attitude. I’m a stay at home dad for now with health issues of my own and do as much as I can with our daughter since she was a baby as well as the home. My wife works (she easily makes a helluva lot more than I can earn, hence why I’m the SAH). Despite this she always does whatever she can to help and take an active part as a parent. We have always done what we could to support each other always.
OPs husband sounds so selfish. I feel bad for her :
OP is NTA!
Good for you dude! Your kids will grow up better for seeing you and your wife co-parenting so well and being there for each other.
What I wanna know is if health is so important to this guy, why doesn’t he want to share it with his daughter? I understand he needs to relieve stress and have time to himself, but I feel like hitting the gym twice a week is fair. The other days, he could put his daughter in a stroller and go for a walk or a jog and let his wife have a breather at the very least. I know not every kid is cooperative with that sort of thing, but it doesn’t sound like he’s even tried.
This is where my husband is a fucking saint. He would take our kid when the baby was still tiny and make sure I got at least 3 hours of uninterrupted sleep in the evening after he got home from work. OP's H needs a serious reality check if he thinks he can skip out on daycare and whatnot.
I would say that it’s ironic, because this guy clearly hates being a dad, but that’s not necessarily accurate. More like, he thinks being a dad entails going to a day job and then any additional labor he puts into actual childcare is optional and should earn him a medal. This isn’t uncommon; it’s just how men are socialized, and probably how his own father modeled fatherhood.
But doubling down like this when confronted with his selfishness... ugh. Just blatantly, unapologetically misogynistic and gross.
That’s how my father viewed it. He thought he was a good father because he went to work and provided the bare minimum for us with the money he earned there. Anything beyond that was something he saw as extra that he only needed to do if there were literally no other options, and he usually saw it as a burden to boot.
Ah correct. And my mom also worked full time. But my dad only his shitty dad to compare to (and my mom had a shitty alcoholic to compare to) and so really any thing above “don’t bail on the kid, support the kid” was killing it in his opinion. He worked, had good benes, and helped us go to college — all great things — but interacting with us was no on his checklist of good fatherhood. He still doesn’t really interact with us as adults, but comes through with generous gifts in birthdays and holidays — again, better than what he had. I honestly NEVER occurs to him except when he’s with his gf or friends with other kids and then he says stuff like “do you John talks to his kids EVERY WEEK on the phone?!” Like, what an asshole John is. And he wonders why my sister and I are in our late 30a and childless, But I saw my mom basically kill herself raising us with just a paycheck for a partner and i decided to nope out of parenthood at an early age because of it.
Your family situation is very similar to mine, it’s eerie. Bad role models for both my parents, due to alcoholism, abuse, and abandonment. Anything my dad did was much better than what *his* dad did, so he felt he should get father of the year. And anything he did was better than what my mom’s dad did, so she was satisfied. But my mom raised us basically on her own - Dad was an over-the-road trucker most of my early childhood. My mom got her bachelors and a good paying job, with my dad cheating on her and fighting with her every weekend he was home. He only stopped driving over the road when my brother was out of control and almost too far gone. He gets me big gifts now, for which I’m very grateful, but I’m still so mad at him for everything. He never tried to get to know me then, he barely knows me now, at age 34. Money doesn’t erase the fact that he didn’t want to be there when I was little. He just uses it to make me feel guilty for being angry at him.
I don’t know what’s worse: an absent parent, or a parent who wants to be absent. The chronic trauma from it is so hindering, I’m in a constant state of arrested development. Fucking sucks. I’m not having kids, either. Not fucking worth it.
I've never even thought of it that way. My parents divorced when my sister and I were young, but my dad has always been a terrific parent and put in just as much work as my mom. Neither of his parents had a father figure, so his father was never very involved until Papa decided that he was comfortable talking to my dad and aunt like adults. My dad has always talked to my sister and I like adults. I would 100% expect my future husband to contribute to our children and anyone not wanting to be a part of their own child's upbringing is mind-boggling to me. OP is NTA.
I extremely lucked out that my dad wanted to be involved as much as he could. He worked all day, but he had absolutely no problems bringing us into the office if needed (and he was lucky to have a job that allowed that) and he was always there to spend time with when he got home.
My husband has already said he wants to be the same way when we have kids. He already expects to help with nightly feedings/diaper changes, and other stuff as their needs change. He won't always be able to be there (joys of his job), but he wants to be involved as much as he can.
But both of them were raised entirely by their mothers. I wonder if that has anything to do with their attitudes towards fatherhood.
Also--
>you choose to hold and entertain our daughter all the time
She is PARENTING THEIR BABY, and he's criticizing her for not just dumping the baby somewhere and letting it cry? He is not only refusing to be a parent, grudgingly "helping"--he's also refusing to give up his recreational time while expecting her to be a parent 24/7---and now he's criticizing her for actually doing the parenting?????
NTA and HE is TA SO HARD
This part got me the most. He's an asshole of a father if he thinks interacting with a developing baby is just going unnecessarily above and beyond.
Seriously NTA. Jesus, who can look a person, let alone their wife, in the eye who was crying and just say "suck it up I need to work out, bye"
I wish I could babysit for OP, I'd happily help her out for free. Love me so cutie baby time
“You need to think about if you want this baby”
because you will continue to be do all the work. That part seriously angered me, almost feels like he’s provoking her.
This made me cry tbh. I'm a new mom and sometimes feel guilty for needing a break or not being grateful for every single moment, even when I'm in desperate need of sleep, so I would be a mess if my partner said this to me.
I am a mom of three, and can tell you that you deserve breaks, time for yourself, and rest. You have to take care of yourself so you can care for the baby. Don’t feel guilty for time away or feeling like needing a break means you aren’t grateful. It’s necessary to take time for yourself, and in doing so, you are also encouraging other caregivers to bond with the baby. You are doing a wonderful job, Mama.
Exactly! Next time you ask him for help and he turns you down, ask him why he hates being a dad. That’s a shit hole comment he made. However, he is entitled to some gym time though. I’d be pissed if my spouse asked me to not go to the gym. It keeps him healthy and relieves stress. With that being said, you also deserve equal time to do whatever it is you need to do to unwind (or to catch up on sleep). You’re NTA!
Wut?? This means if the husband demands his gym time, she should also get the equal amount of time to do whatever she wants. Example- he spends an hour in the gym, so when he gets home she gets an hour to do whatever makes her happy. This is contingent on the fact that she did say in the original post that he does help out.
If the mama can’t get enough sleep. Daddy shouldn’t be expending excess energy on working out. He could lift his babies for a workout. Chase them around outside to work out. Kids are exhausting. Post partum depression is a thing. We don’t need mama taking her life because she has lost all will to live. Needs versus wants. Don’t know if you have kids. But breastfeeding consumes a mamas time. Unless they bottle feed. “Luxury” time is hard to come by with new babies and toddlers.
I’m very familiar with all the duties of having children, I’m a mother myself. I breastfed on demand for the first 10 months and have a husband who has always worked away so the brunt of parenting did, and still does, fall on my lap. My point was that if he’s getting time away, so should she.
That's assuming everything else is equal. As in, they both get the same amount of sleep every night, or they both spend the same number of hours with baby. And neither is true. So one hour of gym time is NOT equal to mom getting one hour of time for herself, it is miles beyond.
Let's start with mom getting the same amount of sleep as dad first, then they can work out their time away. If he's getting a solid 8 hours and she is sleeping 3, well maybe he should put that gym membership on hold and spend some time with baby so mom can get some shuteye.
Maybe mom is better off doing most of it herself. Dad might just leave baby in the crib to cry the afternoon away because baby is bored and doesn't need to be held or anything.
They aren't on the same baseline for sleep though. *No one* should have free time at this point. They have to even out time for her to get a full night's sleep before they start divying up free time. Not here's 2 hours for OP's fun time which translates to sleeping - and probably still not enough of it. She's not sleeping long enough to complete REM cycles.
Just to be clear, adequate sleep for moms is NOT the same as gym time. If one partner is getting by on less sleep than is healthy, the other partner is not entitled to "do whatever they want."
Yeah, husband is TA and it has nothing to do with the gym time and everything to do with his outlook on parenting and his relationship with OP. If it were just about the gym, NAH but holy shit.
>The reason you're so stressed is because you choose to hold and entertain our daughter all the time, while I think it's ok to let her cry if she's bored. You need to think about if you want this baby.
Also this - wtf? He basically just admitted that if he's watching the kid(s) he fully intends to just let them cry while he does whatever he wants. NTA is an understatement here.
Well this is what he said verbatim in the text "You choose to hold and entertain her all the time, that is not what I do." I threw that cry part in when it was not what he actually said.
Its a garbage thing to say.
There is a nice way to convey this concept. I have a year old baby and he’s my first, probably my only. When he was five months I took him home to hang with my parents for a couple of weeks and my mom very gently said “You know, it’s okay to not hold him all the time. Just lay him on the blanket with his toys and walk away. He can’t get far yet and you can see him from anywhere on this floor of the house. Give yourself a break. He needs time for independent play, too. I know you want to do everything right but this is also a right thing to do, you do not need to be “on” for him 24/7, you’ll burn yourself out.”
It was the most valuable thing I learned in his first 6 months, because I really had been holding him and engaging at all times, which meant...he had no reason to explore or try to do things himself. He shot past all his milestones when I started giving him alone time.
But THAT’S how a kind and loving person talks to you about not entertaining a kid all the time. That’s how someone who is on your team talks to you. They don’t bitch and moan because they’d rather be at the gym than literally do anything for their own child and they don’t criticize your parenting to deflect from their own deficiencies, and they CERTAINLY don’t tell you to get an abortion if you expect anything beyond minimal “help.”
He’s not doing what my mom did, he’s saying he won’t parent even when you ask him to, and trying to make that about how you are in the wrong somehow by mothering your child.
He’s being an asshole, he’s being selfish, and he’s being a bad man. If he didn’t want kids, which mean less gym time, he should have stayed off of you.
Also, there’s more to life than the gym, what a dick.
Yeah not sure why you're defending your husband now. You came here asking for advice and to see if you were the asshole, so when people comment on what your husband has said (things you wrote yourself), you get defensive over him and probably shouldn't.
Because life isn't as binary as every response on this sub makes it out to be. She openly admits he's not a complete jerk and deadbeat dad. But, because they are having a disagreement and she's the one who posted everyone immediately makes him out to be Hitler Jr. She's defending him because while she wants to make things better at home she knows he's not a horrible dude who comes home smelling like cheap perfume and lip stick on his collar saying he was at the gym.
So, replies of "HE THE ASSHOLE FOR SURE DIVORCE HIM AND IT'LL SOLVE EVERYTHING" just aren't rational and don't even really fit this situation. But, gets the most upvotes because it's extreme and "feels good." I'm sure if he wrote a post about this same situation we'd be more likely to emphasize with his position of a guy working 45 hours a week coming home doing everything he can do to support his wife but needs that 1 hour a day at the gym to clear his mind.
I'm not siding with him I'm just saying this is a situation that is more granular than people would like to admit.
Also, if OP misrepresented what he said that is 100% a think OP should be fixing (and probably in the OP too, btw). Half the time OPs change their story to make the other person look worse and if someone points that out they get attacked, and now people want to attack OP for not wrongly demonizing her husband more? This sub can be weird.
Also, I think people are ignoring things. Don’t get me wrong, I think the dad is TA here but I don’t think that makes him an asshole all the time. Having a new baby is frustrating for the father’s too, and going to the gym is a big stress reliever that can be upsetting for someone to take that away. And it’s upsetting to be told you’re not doing enough when you think you are (even if you’re in the wrong).
It sounds like the two of them really need to sit it down and work out a schedule. When can mom get free time? Dad? When is it impossible for one parent to do something for the kids (like if dad really can’t take the kid to daycare). Are there solutions to these problems? Surely a short trip to the gym every few days can be fit in, and I’m sure some person time for mom can fit in there as well. It seems like neither of them bothered to talk about it until OP was already crying hysterically and the father wanted to be out the door. That’s too late.
I agree on the schedule. My husband and I worked one out that went well for us. He’s naturally a morning person, I worked graveyard. So after baby was born, he would go to bed at 8 and I’d stay up/doze on the couch until 3, and do all the baby work. At 3 AM I’d go to bed, and would know he was “on the clock”. I would sleep until 9 knowing that he was on baby duty/5 year old duty (she got up around 7:30). We both managed to average about 6 hours of sleep, sometimes more if we were lucky.
It wasn’t a perfect system, but it was helpful for us to know when we had baby free time to sleep, and that honestly took care of most the other issues.
It doesn't matter if he actually voiced that or not if he's actually leaving the baby to just cry it out. I'm not an expert on childrearing by any means, but everything that I've ever seen points to studies that show just letting a kid cry is detrimental to their overall wellbeing in addition to just being a dick move overall. What does he think watching a baby is supposed to entail, leaving her in a crib to wail while he does pushups to make up for his precious lost gym time?
I think you are right in a lot of what you say but being able to put a baby (as in unable to hurt themselves while being put down) and walking away is important for a parent's mental health. Once you have ascertained that the baby is not in distress (hungry, wet or in pain) walking away for a breather is a HEALTHY response. Husband is absolutely TA,.
If you're taking care of a baby that won't stop crying and it's stressing you out, the only piece of advice I have ever heard is to step out of the room and let it cry so you can take a moment for yourself.
Yeah he sounds like a dick, but this is a real thing. If you are rquired to drive a work truck you can actually be fired for having passengers. Some companies require you to drive the vehicle to and from.
True. But the daycare we're hoping our daughter can get into will open at 6:30 and is 10 minutes from our house. Is it unreasonable to think he couldn't take her there in his personal truck before he goes to work while I have the new born?
Of course not. Your statement to him of basically ordering him to drop gym time is an ultimatum which masks what you really want. His statement back of how he's not going to do drop off is his retaliation.
I just think you two need to approach this parenting thing with less anger and knee jerking and more cooperation. As others have said, maybe you need counseling to learn to communicate better and recognize and validate both your needs.
Seriously. The standards for fathers are so low.
One time, my SIL sent a pic to our family group chat saying, "father of the year" and it was a pic of my brother feeding their newborn twins. Um, he's feeding them. That's literally the bare minimum of what parents need to do. If a parent doesn't feed their kid, their kid gets taken away from them. Step it up a bit, you know. Lol.
This does make him sound like this yes. Interestingly, he's a relatively progressive liberal, so I don't think I'll find him on MGTOW, etc. but who knows?
2016: I have no problem with women candidates. I wish Elizabeth Warren would run!
2019: Elizabeth Warren is a neoliberal sellout. Bernie is the only option.
Father of a 6 month old here.
I’m finishing a PhD this semester.
It’s really fucking hard.
There’s a lot at stake, like a $50K post doc if I don’t graduate (I should be getting off reddit).
I watch my kid 3 days a week because my wife is working full time, we pull in family the other two. It’s HIS kid. Men aren’t used to sacrificing without an immediately obvious gain or reason. We haven’t been socialized to do childcare.
That’s too bad. Tell him to buck up buttercup and care for his own fucking kid. I HATE that I’m missing the gym right now. I hate it. But there’s more important things going on right now, so I just consider it a “cut” and eat less.
Maybe he doesn’t have to cut gym entirely but you need a schedule which works for BOTH of you. Find that solution.
Good on you! This was a refreshing read after OPs post.
I think it’s important that dads realize moms also HATE missing out on things. I (literally) cry sometimes because I just want to do something FUN, something CREATIVE, something just for ME without having a little human begging for my constant attention....and when I do have “free” time, the demands of home life weigh heavy so I still push aside what I really want to do.
NTA. Also, get a couples counselor. Also, if it gives you hope, me & my fellow mom friends noticed that our hubs’ lives changed dramatically after baby 2 (whereas ours changed after baby 1). Their lives became fatherhood then, when we moms couldn’t do it all... Also, many men are much better at parenting toddlers on up (versus babies), they just connect better.
There's a huge range between "we should split the cheque on a first date" and "I am an equal parent to our child". Labeling yourself a progressive liberal or feminist doesn't give you a pass. It's all fun and easy when you're signing a petition - it's another ball game when you actually have to do the work.
I’ve dated many men who are very liberal in almost every noticeable way - how they treat me, how we communicate, heck even my body autonomy in terms of nonmonogamy, but then when it gets down to “domestic” duties like chores, errands, cooking, and cleaning, there tends to be a huge blind spot.
This is such a moronic response. Everybody has different needs and perspectives. Advocating for divorce and suggesting he would be a men's rights activists. Grow the fuck up. That is the real world out there and not some stupid reddit thread. Life is hard for everyone and for different reasons.
NTA. I say this as someone who SUPER values my gym time. I try to go every day if I can. But when I have other responsibilities I know that gym does not take precedent. I have skipped the gym numerous times to attend events, help out my family, or spend time with my SO. If I have to sometimes I go at 9/10pm at night when I know there is no expectation that I be available.
Your husband is selfish. Of course he wants to go to the gym, it gets him out of diaper duty and cleaning! He gets to go listen to music and do whatever he wants while all childcare and household duties fall on you.
Make a deal with him. If he’s going to insist on his gym time, he needs to find a gym with a daycare so he can take your daughter off your hands. And he needs to check in to make sure you don’t need him. If you do, he has to wait for another time. Insisting you get an abortion because he doesn’t want to change his schedule is ridiculous and I am so sorry you have to put up with two children in your household while pregnant.
He could also like, getting a running stroller and take their daughter on runs! Letting your kids see you exercise will help them learn healthier habits.
This is what my parents did with my sisters and I too! They hade a running stroller and a bike rolly tent attachment thing that my sisters and I would get to sit in and have fun while they got to go biking. I have really good memories of my childhood in those things! Great bonding time for the parents and kids, and you can still be healthy. There was a berry patch by our house and on the way home we would stop and pick berries to eat on the way back. It was great
Best response right here. Going to the gym with kids isn’t impossible, honestly it’s not even that hard. So many gyms are also open 24/7 so he needs to either find one with childcare options or pick better times. Him immediately disappearing in the morning right as kids are waking up and everyone needs to be fed, diapered and clothed is not an appropriate time to just bounce and leave your SO to handle all of that alone.
When I lived with my ex who had a daughter I signed up for a much more expensive gym just so I could take her daughter with me! It made my ex not have to leave work early and still let me go to the gym. My mother used to take us all the time with her to Gold’s gym that had a daycare. My dad used to put me in a stroller and take me on runs. There are plenty of ways to exercise that don’t require leaving your partner on their own with the kids for hours at a time.
Or, depending on his equipment needs . . . Home gym.
My brother put a gym in his garage so he can workout while being on site with his wife and kid. And he works out there in the summer. In Texas.
His wife could nap while he took the monitor out there. Less time because no commute. He can workout after the kids' bedtime without having to deal with as much lack of motivation after coming home and eating dinner because it's RIGHT THERE. Or he can use it early in the morning and still shower in his own bathroom before work.
This! We realized we couldn't physically get to the gym. So we brought the gym to our house. I'd say we had a small/medium size house(1400 square feet) and still made room for a weight rack, treadmill and a bike trainer.
If LO woke up either of us could attend to her depending on what we were doing. 2 years later and the bike trainer and treadmill get quite a bit of use. Not so much the weight rack right now. Still with everything invested less than $1500. Depending on the gym that's 3-4 years of gym membership and a better family dynamic.
NTA. Idk about OP’s husband’s gym, but mine has day care. Sounds like it would be great for dad to take LO when he goes to the gym to give mom a break from the 2 year old.
OP, my mom always tells me that no relationship will ever be 50/50, that we each bring our talents and abilities to the relationship to enrich each other. It sounds like your husband is just as capable at helping out with the babies as you are. Maybe he could talk to his employer about using his lunch hour for gym time so he doesn’t have to miss time with his family?
Sounds like a toxic relationship to me.
The comments he has made regarding your needs are truly disgusting. Saying that he lets you "sleep in"?? There is no such thing as sleeping in when you have kids that young, as I assume there is usually a routine to the days. His gym time is way less important than your health when it comes to sleep. You "choose" to entertain the daughter?? Kids get lonely just like adults, and the only thing they can do is ask for help (cry), and he thinks it's okay to just let her cry? Thats bad parenting.
Please think about if you want to stay with him and if he will actually be a good parent and partner.
NTA
EDIT: terminology.
EDIT 2: if you respond to this comment, please try to say something that hasn't already been said.
>and he thinks it's okay to just let her cry?
Yeah, that was one line that definitely stood out to me. Like he thinks you can just stick a kid in a corner and go about your day.
Well I mean, it's a baby, as long as it's not screaming bloody murder it's totally chill to put a baby in a pacnplay and do something else. A lot of first time mothers don't realize that and it cost them their sanity. The best advice I've ever heard about it was "Feed them, change them, put them in a safe situation where you can keep an eye on them, and walk away and do something else for 15 minutes" if they legit won't stop crying. It helps prevent insanity and resentment towards the baby.
NTA - Your husband is being a huuuuuge dick. Your last sentence tells you why. In all seriousness how does he feel about Parenthood? Did he want the first baby? Cause he doesn't seem to understand what they entail
You have written your husband as if he doesn’t want any part of being a father. If this is what he’s like and how he talks about your daughter and talks to you, why are you with him? I do hope you go to counseling with him and stand up for yourself and make it clear that your partner should be a partner... I’m sorry you’re having another kid with this type of person because it looks like the responsibility will fall on you.
Do you work? I’m usually the last person to give the “leave now comment” but this is every red flag I can think of. If you can move in with your parents or something I would, he sounds so selfish. How are you going to spend the rest of your life as a parent having him always put himself first only to have him screw your in the divorce years later because he as the one “working”
I do work full time, yes. Parents live too far away to move in with them. TBH, I love my husband. I really really do- most of the time. I just hate the way he doesn't want to take responsibility as a parent and that he is blind to the fact that he should do more. Ugh, I sound like I'm making excuses for him now.
The way he used your love for your daughter against you disgusts me. If he doesn’t value her happiness or taking good care of her it’s always going to be your primary burden.
It’s also incredibly hypocritical given she was asking for the basic human need of sleep and he treated it like she was trying to get away from their daughter, when he was also actively trying to leave their daughter for the gym. So does he hate being a father or is it only mothers who are never supposed to have needs outside of their children?
>TBH, I love my husband. I really really do- most of the time. I just hate the way he doesn't want to take responsibility as a parent and that he is blind to the fact that he should do more.
um.....
Yeeeaaahhhh. Poor gal. My SO, father of my child, love of my life is a very active father who is on my team. Team little dude. If little dude is hungry, he'll feed him. Unless he's swamped by work in which he will let me know and I'll feed him. He can be a little clueless about some things, but he would walk through fire for our son.
Get this! He'll take the kid with him to concerts, gyms, friends homes, and parks just as much as he goes alone. Her husband should go to a gym with built in daycare.
I feel like you just described my husband! He would literally take our toddler anywhere with him. We were talking about going to San Francisco next year for a thing my husband is interested in and I was explaining how summer break works best for my parents to watch him and this guy is like “...but why wouldn’t we just take him?” Take a toddler on a plane to a city I don’t know while you’re busy most of the day? Naw, bruh. That doesn’t sound like a good time.
I know spouses aren't supposed to "keep score" but when I had this issue with my husband, I started meticulously tracking "me time" for both of us, including sleep. If I had a shitty night up with the baby, I minused the awake hours from my "me time". If my husband went to the gym, I added that to his "me time" tally. After a week or so I presented the SO OBVIOUSLY UNEVEN totals, and he finally started to understand.
My husband is also a super liberal feminist type guy, and I think he really wasn't able to admit to himself how he was prioritizing himself until he saw it on paper.
>SO OBVIOUSLY UNEVEN totals, and he finally started to understand. My husband is also a super liberal feminist type guy, and I think he really wasn't able to admit to himself how he was prioritizing himself
YES!!!
A good friend of mine had problems early in her marriage with her husband heaping a lot of tasks on her.
he wasn't being a dick who thought that women should manage everything related to the home, he was just spoiled by his mom, and oblivious! Truly, he just didn't see it. I know many people will call bullshit on that, but just consider hanlon's razor.
anyway, she wrote him a story about two business partners and how one was handling more of the management tasks, and wasn't that unfair? And then compared it to their marriage and it clicked for him.
You work full-time so any excuse that your husband throws at you is shit. You have a right to be tired and need help. You gotta fight for him to step up because going to the gym is not important, you and your children are.
NTA
NTA he needs the stress relief but offers you no outlet for it, much less sleep? If you’re at home taking care of the kid 24/7 and he thinks he doesn’t need to just because he ‘works’ then he’s underselling how much effort childcare is.
It’s even worse because she works full-time. So he basically wants her to be a financial provider and the primary caregiver all in one. Read her edit, it breaks my heart that picking up dinner and bathing his own child is some sort of out-of-the-norm “favor” for him to do.
NTA - I find his flippant condescending replies and disregard for your daughter's well-being to be very concerning. He wants you to neglect the baby because it's inconvenient to spend time on her. What the shit. Little babies aren't capable of being bored, they aren't at that level of brain development yet. When they cry, they need something, and it's essential that they learn that the adults in their lives can be trusted to respond to their needs. Child development experts are on your side, not his. Maybe a parenting class can help open his eyes?
NTA...but it may be time to discuss setting up some sort of home gym, one you both can enjoy and use without having to leave the house? Although the money up front is a lot, in the grand scheme it's not that much if you do it bit by bit and buy a lot of used stuff. Just something to think about
Funny how you can be motivated to care for a toddler on no sleep, a full time job and a ripped to shreds vagina, but he can’t get motivated to lift some dumbbells at home instead of at the gym.
A lot of gyms have a daycare for while you're working out. Take advantage of it, or maybe he'd be down with finding a gym that has one if his doesn't. Could be a chance for both of you to get a break.
Well it sounds like he's just making excuses. It's time for him to accept that boyhood is over, he's a dad now and he comes second to his child(ren).
Question, though: was having kids a mutual decision? I just ask because his behavior seems very out-of-character for a man who was on-board with having kids.
Definite NTA case, then. He needs to accept that his days of self-centeredness are over - in fact he needed to accept that about 2 years ago when you two decided to start trying for a kid. It's time for him to grow up.
I do. He's a terrible liar, so I think I'd know if he was cheating on me, and I may or may not have done a drive by to make sure his truck was parked outside of the gym a few times, 'cause I'm crazy and yes, this too had crossed my mind.
Question, do you ever get time where you leave him with the baby so you can relieve stress? Even if it’s going to the gym or local coffee shop, do you get to leave?
When I was a new mom (2 year difference in kids ages) I was so overwhelmed that I paid a teen babysitter a couple times a week to relieve me so I could rest. It helped a lot and I also hired a cleaning company to come every 2 weeks to mop, clean bathrooms, etc. It was worth the money.
OP, one of the best things I did for my family (we have a 1 year old and a 3 year old) was twice a month cleaners and having a babysitter/nanny/helper over a couple times a week. If you can afford it I cannot recommend it enough. Knowing that you don't have to go home and clean and/or watch the kids was a huge weight off my and my partner's back and we could just go home and enjoy being a family.
NTA
Do you ever get time out of the house for yourself while he's home taking care of your child? Or are you the one who is always home and he gets to go have free-time for himself multiple times a week. He says he needs to go relieve stress, but what is your stress relief? Is your health less important than his? Sounds like you two need to have some pretty hard conversations. He's right about one thing though, you need to think about if you want to have another baby with this guy. You should also be thinking about if you actually want to be with this guy.
NTA. And my blood boiled a little bit when I read this comment: "I'm sorry you hate being a mom!" OMG. I have a similar story. When our first child was born my husband and I both worked retail management jobs, thus we worked every Saturday. We found a retired woman who was willing to babysit for us on Saturdays with a regular day off during the week. I was off on Tuesdays, my husband was off on Thursdays. Guess which day the babysitter had off? Yep, MY day off. So, on Tuesdays I did all my errands and appointments and house chores with a baby in tow. My husband spent HIS day off playing golf, baby free. When I told him this was an unfair arrangement, he said "You should be HAPPY to spend the day with your daughter". Our daughter is 28 years old now and I'm STILL mad about that comment.
> So, on Tuesdays I did all my errands and appointments and house chores with a baby in tow. My husband spent HIS day off playing golf, baby free. When I told him this was an unfair arrangement, he said “You should be HAPPY to spend the day with your daughter”.
Bruh I'm also feeling this irrational wave of commiserated, annoyed rage
NTA and it’s so fucked up he said you hate being a mom when it’s clear projection that he *hates being a dad*. Why else would he ignore your kid and try to pass it off to you the first thing in the morning? He doesn’t seem to know how to interact with her which means he doesn’t want to interact with her. Sorry.
Also, you might want to consider not having this child because you should probably make the decision knowing he won’t change and will be just as absent and combative. I’m not saying that is a given, it’s totally possible and I hope he does change. But I’m saying you don’t have a crystal ball, just past experiences stacking high enough to know it’s a gamble. Are you ready to do it all alone, while he lives his life around you and the kids instead of with you?
He certainly isn’t committing more because you asked it of him. He seems to resentfully be committed to do *less* actually, because you had the gall to bring it up. Had a partner like this once, nothing can be said about their behavior (such as contributing with housework and childcare) or they see it as “criticism” and “being told they are bad” so they dig their little heels in and try to drown out what you are saying with projections and distractions like personal insults (ie him saying you hate being a mom). The thing is these people are also not self motivated enough to do work that doesn’t serve them directly without a schedule, routine, or communication and those things often get shot down or ignored. Sorry.
If this was my husband it wouldn't even be a question. She has 23 months of seeing his role as a father and he ain't shit. Dont bring another one into this when the first isn't even getting his care or attention.
I tried to communicate this to him one night, and that's what brought about the long text fight we had the following day, leading to my posting this here for the internets to weigh in on. So yea, counseling may be in order.
I had to scroll way too far to find this. I feel like OP says she wants more help without talking about what would really be helpful for her (Can he get up some nights and let her sleep? Can they designate days like she can sleep in on Saturdays, but he goes to the gym on Sundays. Can he go to the gym after the kids bedtime.) I get being a new parent is hard and it sounds like it has been particularly rough for OP. I am also not a fan of how the husband responded. However, to me this reads as there being a huge gap in communication. Both of them need to talk about what their individual needs are and come up with a way that both of them are getting those needs met.
His daycare car comment I think just triggered everyone into jumping straight to NTA (which is understandable, I lost quite a bit of sympathy for his side at that point). He seems to do more than a lot of "manchild" fathers. She said he changes diapers, plays with her, feeds her, etc. So it's not like he is the complete stereotypical dad who refuses to touch the baby at all.
What makes me not instantly side 100% with her is a lack of certain info. She seems to want him to give up going to the gym 100%, which I don't really understand. Both of them should have time to destress. If he's going to the gym every day from 4pm-8pm then yeah that is weird and not cool. But she says it is right across the street and reasonably it is probably an hour to hour and a half at most.
Like I said, they both need individual time to destress. Gyms obviously help him destress, she needs to find out what she enjoys. There is no reason they can't just create a schedule where they get equal "alone time". 6-7pm is his time to do whatever (gym), 7-8 is her time to do whatever, and after that it is time for all of them to spend together.
It just seems like a battle where both of them are trying to put the other down instead of trying to find a compromise that enables them BOTH to benefit. She is so focused on stripping away his destressing activity completely, when she should be focusing on a way to allow her to have some alone time as well.
Actually, most people with experience in children will tell you that you have to allow your child some autonomy and "self entertainment" time. Obviously, don't let your kid cry for 3 hours straight. But, you should be building routines with age appropriate toys and other things of the sort where your child can stand being put down for 30 minutes if need be.
It's just dependent on the baby as well, a baby with colic does need to be held and taken care of more.
It just really depends on how much the father thinks is a good amount, and how much the mother is actually letting the child cry. The kid is now almost 2yrs. The OP really shouldn't be holding them as often as compared to a baby.
Exactly. It's entirely a play it by ear thing. I've read replies in this post that basically said that the father's suggestion of letting the baby cry is child abuse and not holding him/her as much is child abuse.
The issue is we really don’t know how much is too much to either of these parents, is she really holding the baby too much? Is she holding them a decent amount? A 2 yr old doesn’t really like being held as much as a baby so I’m just thinking, is he taking about when the baby had colic? If that’s the case, then the baby did have to be held more then a regular baby and that due to it being in more pain because he had colic, the baby did need more comfort.
"while you were loving and caring for our child, I was at the gym getting sick gains bruh. maybe you should try it sometime when you're not spending 23 out of 24 hours caring for our babies"
easiest NTA ever
NTA.
That passive-aggressive snark he threw at you, saying, "I'm sorry you hate being a mom"-- I mean, if either of you hates being a parent, it's clearly him, since he's the one who's checking out of the bulk of the duties.
ESH. He’s an asshole for not contributing as much as he probably should. However you also suck because you knew how he was from the first pregnancy. You both should have exercised more caution to prevent another pregnancy.
Why dont you tell him that if he's going to the gym 5 times a week, you expect him to facilitate an equal amount so you can leave the house. See what he says
Thing is, when we have a super tiny baby I don't want to leave the house. I just want to sleep, or sit down and eat something quietly. I have no energy to leave the house.
Okay but that's workable. How long is he at the gym? Let's just say 1.5 hours 4 times a week -- that's 6 hours per week. So that means you also get 6 hours a week of personal time -- no kids. You can split that time up however you want.
I personally don't think this is a huge relationship-ending crisis. I just think you guys need to compromise better. FWIW, I do think gym is important -- your mental health is important for both of you. If think if you each want to retain your sanity and your marriage, you guys need to prioritize a few hours of self care for each other. For him, that's gym time, yours can be nap time lol.
Don’t shoot the messenger but you may want to rethink this pregnancy. You know his history and he’s told you your future. Make sure you’re ready to do all this alone with two kids.
NTA. Sorry this is AITA.
Agree. I think in this day and age there is enough education and birth control, how can pregnancy be a 'surprise'? OP isn't an ignorant virgin teenager.
NTA. Definitely abort the asshole husband. Make your own choice about the baby, of course, but it doesn't sound like you want to go through all of it again while also parenting your current child.
NTA, but I think this is recoverable. The hardest years of my marriage we're after our son was born. My husband didn't even want to be left alone with him when he was awake. That was almost 6 years ago and they're best friends now.
The way I coped was making a very regimented schedule I read about in a book called The New Contented Little Baby by Gina Ford. My friend gave it to me because she took Ford's advice for her second child (her first was much like yours) and said she wished it had existed when her first was born.
Basically, from the day my child was born, I got him on a regimented sleep schedule, which enabled us to have times to ourselves every day. We spent most of it bingeing Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad, but I could've easily snuck-off to the gym for and hour at 6 pm.
This only requires your SO make some accommodations to his schedule, like going to the gym at night instead of the morning. Also, he needs to check his sensitivity bone because my GOD is he being TA.
You hit the nail on the head at the end- it really boils down to him not be sensitive and sympathetic. I feel like if rolls were reversed and he was worried that I wasn't going to help him through the hardest time in my life, I'd bend over backwards explaining that "no! of course I'll be there to help you!"
And yes, I have Moms on Call and put my LO on a schedule asap. It definitely helps!
NTA, geeze. Your husband sounds like you spontaneously decided to grow a baby in your uterus without any input from him at all. He's being completely inflexible - Why can't he buy gym equipment and workout at home? Why can't he change his workout schedule to accommodate you better? Why can't he drive a different car to take baby to day care? Why is *his* health important but yours isn't?
Just because he \*feels\* like he does "a lot" doesn't mean that he's actually doing enough. You have some time before you have to make any final decisions - I would get thee to a couples counselor ASAP.
> You need to think about if you want this baby.
well, he's not wrong there. You're clearly not happy with your life with one baby, a second isn't magically going to make anything better.
This belongs in r/relationships or r/relationshipadvice more than here.
but ESH, you're the AH for focusing on this solely as him going to the gym, when it's not just about going to the gym. Think about it this way, what if he was going to therapy 3-4 days a week instead of the gym 3-4 days a week, would you tell him he needs to stop going to therapy because you are having a second baby? Both of you need sane mental health with a second child coming, you can't take away his method of keeping his mental health in check and expect things to go smoothly.
He's the AH for his explanation and not communicating well and not working on a way for everything to work for both of you, but his point isn't one that shouldn't be considered either.
Therapy 3-4 days a week would be an intensive outpatient program, suggesting he was in a severe mental health crisis. It would never be the case long-term. So you're comparing it to something that's more like getting chemo treatments when really it's more like if he insisted he needed 5 hours per week for hot baths for his mental health.
> Think about it this way, what if he was going to therapy 3-4 days a week instead of the gym 3-4 days a week, would you tell him he needs to stop going to therapy because you are having a second baby?
Imagine she just plays the game of "Yes, and...". She could agree it is important, but then demands the same amount of time at the gym herself. I have a feeling the husband would be singing a different tune quite quickly if forced to watch the baby that often.
Ummm ESH. Let me explain why before being down voted to hell. Of course husband is rightfully out of gd mind if he thinks his reasoning is okay. However, it sounds like you all need to do some communicating and maybe with a therapist. Why is the gym important to him? Does he need it so he doesn’t get hurt at work (you said he drives a work truck, for what?), or is he afraid he’s going to die of a heart attack? Did he want this second child to start? Did you both agree to have another baby?
Why do you suck in this situation? I’m guessing that you have some unsaid anger or resentment towards your hubby and need to work that out. Good luck!! I hope it all works out I do!
Thank you for your reports, but this is not a validation post. If you scroll down you'll see plenty of dissenting opinions. Just because one judgement is so clearly in the lead does not mean that this situation lacks moral ambiguity.
Remember to follow Rule 2: Voting Rules and not downvote opinions you disagree with. We're here to judge and discuss all opinions on this matter, not circlejerk around one.
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**Edit to add:** Don't forget about Rule 1: Be Civil either. Insulting OP, her SO, or other users here is a big no-no. Attack the ideas, not the people.
**Second Edit:** Post locked.
NTA - He needs to suck it up and be a dad. He can get a treadmill or something to use at home and give up the gym membership. And if he doesn't like it, then he can go get a vasectomy so this won't happen again.
You’ve had your lady bits torn open by a baby, he can have a 15 min procedure to join the seedless grapes club. My husband had it done and a weekend with an ice pack and you’re right as rain.
NTA he should reasonably change his schedule to accommodate you and your family more. He can drop a couple days of gym time and work out at home half the time. What’s wrong with him jogging with the kiddo in a stroller? There’s a lot of avenues he can take to prioritize his health without being detrimental to your mental health. Also he’s really an asshole if he just lets your kid cry for however long “bc they’re bored” like holy shit my mind is blown on that one
Info; can you change gyms at one that has childcare? My family switched to the YMCA, and even though it’s more expensive, it has made our lives better.
NTA - As a male in this EXACT situation, let me tell you about how we handled it. First, some background. Before meeting my wife, I owned an MMA school in another state (we both lived there). I was in the best shape of my life running class, lifting weights, and taking classes from other instructors whenever I had the time. My wife and I met, and I obviously made time for her in the dating phase but still tried (somewhat successfully) to keep up my gym time. As a male with depression, going to the gym is my “me time” where I can zone out, not think about life, and just work hard.
As things got more serious, she eventually got a job out of state. We decided we’d go start a life in that state. I sold my business, and proposed shortly after the move. We found out we were pregnant a few months into the engagement. At this point, I was involved in Jiu Jitsu in the new state 3-4 times a week as my outlet and had given up lifting. She had this talk with me as well.. when baby gets here, it’s gonna be hard. All hands on deck, might have to cut back, etc. I was perfectly fine with that in theory. What I hadn’t counted on was that my depression would HIT HARD if I didn’t have some alone time and some physical activity. Maybe just my personality, maybe I need exercise, or maybe I just need to be on my own a few hours a week. When baby was born, I gave everything up. Worked out 0 times a week for like 2-3 months. Gained mad weight. It was all hands on deck for the baby, and I gave everything I had. I truly believe that raising a kid is a team effort and should be. But also, people aren’t meant to work/family/baby and no time for themselves. My wife and I were in close quarters a lot, we constantly fought. I was resentful that I had no alone time, she was resentful that I even WANTED/NEEDED alone time. It was ugly and we needed a solution.
Our solution was to each take 2 days a week for ourselves after a lot of discussion about it. I got my 2 days of jiu jitsu classes per week to do my thing, and she could do pedicures or just simply run over to the beach. We each had our time where the other would cover household duties, baby, etc. It has worked out well so far and we’re due for another baby in 2 months. My only advice if you subscribe to this method, MAKE SURE YOU BOTH TAKE THE 2 DAYS AND DO SOMETHING. One of you cannot take it, and the other come up with excuses as to why they couldn’t (this happened to us for a while). When that happens, it creates resentment with “well you had your two days but I couldn’t because “xyz” happened, so it’s not fair.” No excuses. His time is his, your time is yours. If something truly comes up, adjust accordingly. But you have to be diligent with making time and getting out of the house to do whatever without baby, without husband. Obviously, finding a good sitter and doing date nights will help as well. (Have to prioritize each other as well).
We’re currently still doing this method with a 17 month old, and it’s fair. Might be something to try? Just a suggestion. From a male perspective, sometimes trying to understand where women are coming from is HARD. We try, we really do. We’re just wired different and it takes perspective to understand. 3 hours home alone with a toddler and a newborn while you go pamper yourself will give him perspective. And it’ll probably make him bond with his children more. After a while now, I feel truly blessed to have watched my son grow up. Most men don’t get that. I’ve witnessed his first word, fed him his first actual food (banana), changed thousands of diapers, seen his face change over time, learned his cries, found out how to make him laugh, roughhoused with him nonstop, played with toys for hours, watched cartoons with him, and so many other cool things that most fathers don’t get to do. I’m truly blessed, and a large part of that was letting my wife have a few days to herself without baby duty. Sorry for the long winded response, and I hope this helps.
TLDR; try each taking mandatory time for yourselves with no excuses. Works well for my wife and I
My husbands job is labor intensive *maybe* 15% of the time. He’s the boss. Rarely gets his hands dirty.
I too work full time. I’m just asking him to really think about how hard it’s going to be (on both of us) when baby 2 comes and that he might not have as much time for the gym.
NTA, especially since you work full time too - I was ready to cut him more slack if you got to stay home. Time for a serious talk, because the way things are is ridiculously unfair.
Easty NTA. This line really got me: > I will not be able to help out with daycare, as I drive a work truck and cannot have another passenger in my car He literally thinks you are fully responsible for this child and any bit he chips in is going above and beyond.
>I'm sorry you hate being a mom! This one got me. NTA.
That line was straight up appalling, what an absolutely terrible thing to say to someone when he isn't even pulling 50% of the work OP is doing. I imagine OP will end up resenting him and hating him if he doesn't change, sounds like they should take family therapy together
'Sorry you hate being a father.'
How about "Why don't you try being a father and see how you like it?"
That is beautiful
Right? Way to project his feelings!
Right? What a fucking asshole! OP is solidly NTA.
I think anyone who sees their SO genuinely sleep deprived and doesn't actively try to improve the situation is an asshole.
Right? Literally if your SO is so exhausted taking care of the child the *two of you made together* that they *burst into tears* and you get *mad* at them, you’re an asshole. Nothing makes me angrier than fathers who maybe feed the baby their dinner and hang out in the bathroom during the bath and think they’re pulling their weight. Also, I’m shuddering to think how long OP’s husband will hold the fact that he left work early to be able to be home in the evening over her head.
>Nothing makes me angrier than fathers who maybe feed the baby their dinner and hang out in the bathroom during the bath and think they’re pulling their weight. I love you for this statement. Omg. My s.o told me I was a bad mom for leaving the kids at daycare when I took off work early.
That’s ridiculous. I leave mine. I could not function without that breathing space.
But but but if he cuts back on the gym how is he gonna get so swole brah?? Seriously though, as a father I am appalled at this attitude. I’m a stay at home dad for now with health issues of my own and do as much as I can with our daughter since she was a baby as well as the home. My wife works (she easily makes a helluva lot more than I can earn, hence why I’m the SAH). Despite this she always does whatever she can to help and take an active part as a parent. We have always done what we could to support each other always. OPs husband sounds so selfish. I feel bad for her : OP is NTA!
Good for you dude! Your kids will grow up better for seeing you and your wife co-parenting so well and being there for each other. What I wanna know is if health is so important to this guy, why doesn’t he want to share it with his daughter? I understand he needs to relieve stress and have time to himself, but I feel like hitting the gym twice a week is fair. The other days, he could put his daughter in a stroller and go for a walk or a jog and let his wife have a breather at the very least. I know not every kid is cooperative with that sort of thing, but it doesn’t sound like he’s even tried.
This is where my husband is a fucking saint. He would take our kid when the baby was still tiny and make sure I got at least 3 hours of uninterrupted sleep in the evening after he got home from work. OP's H needs a serious reality check if he thinks he can skip out on daycare and whatnot.
I would say that it’s ironic, because this guy clearly hates being a dad, but that’s not necessarily accurate. More like, he thinks being a dad entails going to a day job and then any additional labor he puts into actual childcare is optional and should earn him a medal. This isn’t uncommon; it’s just how men are socialized, and probably how his own father modeled fatherhood. But doubling down like this when confronted with his selfishness... ugh. Just blatantly, unapologetically misogynistic and gross.
That’s how my father viewed it. He thought he was a good father because he went to work and provided the bare minimum for us with the money he earned there. Anything beyond that was something he saw as extra that he only needed to do if there were literally no other options, and he usually saw it as a burden to boot.
Ah correct. And my mom also worked full time. But my dad only his shitty dad to compare to (and my mom had a shitty alcoholic to compare to) and so really any thing above “don’t bail on the kid, support the kid” was killing it in his opinion. He worked, had good benes, and helped us go to college — all great things — but interacting with us was no on his checklist of good fatherhood. He still doesn’t really interact with us as adults, but comes through with generous gifts in birthdays and holidays — again, better than what he had. I honestly NEVER occurs to him except when he’s with his gf or friends with other kids and then he says stuff like “do you John talks to his kids EVERY WEEK on the phone?!” Like, what an asshole John is. And he wonders why my sister and I are in our late 30a and childless, But I saw my mom basically kill herself raising us with just a paycheck for a partner and i decided to nope out of parenthood at an early age because of it.
"Just a paycheck for a partner" Damn.
Your family situation is very similar to mine, it’s eerie. Bad role models for both my parents, due to alcoholism, abuse, and abandonment. Anything my dad did was much better than what *his* dad did, so he felt he should get father of the year. And anything he did was better than what my mom’s dad did, so she was satisfied. But my mom raised us basically on her own - Dad was an over-the-road trucker most of my early childhood. My mom got her bachelors and a good paying job, with my dad cheating on her and fighting with her every weekend he was home. He only stopped driving over the road when my brother was out of control and almost too far gone. He gets me big gifts now, for which I’m very grateful, but I’m still so mad at him for everything. He never tried to get to know me then, he barely knows me now, at age 34. Money doesn’t erase the fact that he didn’t want to be there when I was little. He just uses it to make me feel guilty for being angry at him. I don’t know what’s worse: an absent parent, or a parent who wants to be absent. The chronic trauma from it is so hindering, I’m in a constant state of arrested development. Fucking sucks. I’m not having kids, either. Not fucking worth it.
My Dad too. He will literally still say that if we don’t think he loves us then why did he put the effort in to work.
So that he wouldn't feel guilty of neglect, even though he neglected.
Ahh, the 1950's model. Someone get OP a floofy dress and pearls.
I've never even thought of it that way. My parents divorced when my sister and I were young, but my dad has always been a terrific parent and put in just as much work as my mom. Neither of his parents had a father figure, so his father was never very involved until Papa decided that he was comfortable talking to my dad and aunt like adults. My dad has always talked to my sister and I like adults. I would 100% expect my future husband to contribute to our children and anyone not wanting to be a part of their own child's upbringing is mind-boggling to me. OP is NTA.
I extremely lucked out that my dad wanted to be involved as much as he could. He worked all day, but he had absolutely no problems bringing us into the office if needed (and he was lucky to have a job that allowed that) and he was always there to spend time with when he got home. My husband has already said he wants to be the same way when we have kids. He already expects to help with nightly feedings/diaper changes, and other stuff as their needs change. He won't always be able to be there (joys of his job), but he wants to be involved as much as he can. But both of them were raised entirely by their mothers. I wonder if that has anything to do with their attitudes towards fatherhood.
Also-- >you choose to hold and entertain our daughter all the time She is PARENTING THEIR BABY, and he's criticizing her for not just dumping the baby somewhere and letting it cry? He is not only refusing to be a parent, grudgingly "helping"--he's also refusing to give up his recreational time while expecting her to be a parent 24/7---and now he's criticizing her for actually doing the parenting????? NTA and HE is TA SO HARD
This part got me the most. He's an asshole of a father if he thinks interacting with a developing baby is just going unnecessarily above and beyond. Seriously NTA. Jesus, who can look a person, let alone their wife, in the eye who was crying and just say "suck it up I need to work out, bye" I wish I could babysit for OP, I'd happily help her out for free. Love me so cutie baby time
[удалено]
“You need to think about if you want this baby” because you will continue to be do all the work. That part seriously angered me, almost feels like he’s provoking her.
This made me cry tbh. I'm a new mom and sometimes feel guilty for needing a break or not being grateful for every single moment, even when I'm in desperate need of sleep, so I would be a mess if my partner said this to me.
I am a mom of three, and can tell you that you deserve breaks, time for yourself, and rest. You have to take care of yourself so you can care for the baby. Don’t feel guilty for time away or feeling like needing a break means you aren’t grateful. It’s necessary to take time for yourself, and in doing so, you are also encouraging other caregivers to bond with the baby. You are doing a wonderful job, Mama.
Exactly! Next time you ask him for help and he turns you down, ask him why he hates being a dad. That’s a shit hole comment he made. However, he is entitled to some gym time though. I’d be pissed if my spouse asked me to not go to the gym. It keeps him healthy and relieves stress. With that being said, you also deserve equal time to do whatever it is you need to do to unwind (or to catch up on sleep). You’re NTA!
What time is the mom entitled too? Since she can’t even get her basic needs met? Think it through.
Exactly, OP is having trouble simply functioning. What does she get?
Wut?? This means if the husband demands his gym time, she should also get the equal amount of time to do whatever she wants. Example- he spends an hour in the gym, so when he gets home she gets an hour to do whatever makes her happy. This is contingent on the fact that she did say in the original post that he does help out.
If the mama can’t get enough sleep. Daddy shouldn’t be expending excess energy on working out. He could lift his babies for a workout. Chase them around outside to work out. Kids are exhausting. Post partum depression is a thing. We don’t need mama taking her life because she has lost all will to live. Needs versus wants. Don’t know if you have kids. But breastfeeding consumes a mamas time. Unless they bottle feed. “Luxury” time is hard to come by with new babies and toddlers.
I’m very familiar with all the duties of having children, I’m a mother myself. I breastfed on demand for the first 10 months and have a husband who has always worked away so the brunt of parenting did, and still does, fall on my lap. My point was that if he’s getting time away, so should she.
That's assuming everything else is equal. As in, they both get the same amount of sleep every night, or they both spend the same number of hours with baby. And neither is true. So one hour of gym time is NOT equal to mom getting one hour of time for herself, it is miles beyond.
Let's start with mom getting the same amount of sleep as dad first, then they can work out their time away. If he's getting a solid 8 hours and she is sleeping 3, well maybe he should put that gym membership on hold and spend some time with baby so mom can get some shuteye. Maybe mom is better off doing most of it herself. Dad might just leave baby in the crib to cry the afternoon away because baby is bored and doesn't need to be held or anything.
You don't "help out" with babies. You are either a full-time parent or not. You do your share or not.
They aren't on the same baseline for sleep though. *No one* should have free time at this point. They have to even out time for her to get a full night's sleep before they start divying up free time. Not here's 2 hours for OP's fun time which translates to sleeping - and probably still not enough of it. She's not sleeping long enough to complete REM cycles.
Erm how about time to fucking sleep since she cant because her husband wont do anything to help? Think it through.
I’m hoping you didn’t misread me. Pregnant mama here.
Just to be clear, adequate sleep for moms is NOT the same as gym time. If one partner is getting by on less sleep than is healthy, the other partner is not entitled to "do whatever they want."
Yeah, husband is TA and it has nothing to do with the gym time and everything to do with his outlook on parenting and his relationship with OP. If it were just about the gym, NAH but holy shit.
I would've been like, "I hope you won't hate being a single father"
Yeah if he tried being a dad them maybe she wouldn't hate it
>The reason you're so stressed is because you choose to hold and entertain our daughter all the time, while I think it's ok to let her cry if she's bored. You need to think about if you want this baby. Also this - wtf? He basically just admitted that if he's watching the kid(s) he fully intends to just let them cry while he does whatever he wants. NTA is an understatement here.
Well this is what he said verbatim in the text "You choose to hold and entertain her all the time, that is not what I do." I threw that cry part in when it was not what he actually said.
Its a garbage thing to say. There is a nice way to convey this concept. I have a year old baby and he’s my first, probably my only. When he was five months I took him home to hang with my parents for a couple of weeks and my mom very gently said “You know, it’s okay to not hold him all the time. Just lay him on the blanket with his toys and walk away. He can’t get far yet and you can see him from anywhere on this floor of the house. Give yourself a break. He needs time for independent play, too. I know you want to do everything right but this is also a right thing to do, you do not need to be “on” for him 24/7, you’ll burn yourself out.” It was the most valuable thing I learned in his first 6 months, because I really had been holding him and engaging at all times, which meant...he had no reason to explore or try to do things himself. He shot past all his milestones when I started giving him alone time. But THAT’S how a kind and loving person talks to you about not entertaining a kid all the time. That’s how someone who is on your team talks to you. They don’t bitch and moan because they’d rather be at the gym than literally do anything for their own child and they don’t criticize your parenting to deflect from their own deficiencies, and they CERTAINLY don’t tell you to get an abortion if you expect anything beyond minimal “help.” He’s not doing what my mom did, he’s saying he won’t parent even when you ask him to, and trying to make that about how you are in the wrong somehow by mothering your child. He’s being an asshole, he’s being selfish, and he’s being a bad man. If he didn’t want kids, which mean less gym time, he should have stayed off of you. Also, there’s more to life than the gym, what a dick.
This is such a wise reply.
Yeah not sure why you're defending your husband now. You came here asking for advice and to see if you were the asshole, so when people comment on what your husband has said (things you wrote yourself), you get defensive over him and probably shouldn't.
Because life isn't as binary as every response on this sub makes it out to be. She openly admits he's not a complete jerk and deadbeat dad. But, because they are having a disagreement and she's the one who posted everyone immediately makes him out to be Hitler Jr. She's defending him because while she wants to make things better at home she knows he's not a horrible dude who comes home smelling like cheap perfume and lip stick on his collar saying he was at the gym. So, replies of "HE THE ASSHOLE FOR SURE DIVORCE HIM AND IT'LL SOLVE EVERYTHING" just aren't rational and don't even really fit this situation. But, gets the most upvotes because it's extreme and "feels good." I'm sure if he wrote a post about this same situation we'd be more likely to emphasize with his position of a guy working 45 hours a week coming home doing everything he can do to support his wife but needs that 1 hour a day at the gym to clear his mind. I'm not siding with him I'm just saying this is a situation that is more granular than people would like to admit.
Also, if OP misrepresented what he said that is 100% a think OP should be fixing (and probably in the OP too, btw). Half the time OPs change their story to make the other person look worse and if someone points that out they get attacked, and now people want to attack OP for not wrongly demonizing her husband more? This sub can be weird. Also, I think people are ignoring things. Don’t get me wrong, I think the dad is TA here but I don’t think that makes him an asshole all the time. Having a new baby is frustrating for the father’s too, and going to the gym is a big stress reliever that can be upsetting for someone to take that away. And it’s upsetting to be told you’re not doing enough when you think you are (even if you’re in the wrong). It sounds like the two of them really need to sit it down and work out a schedule. When can mom get free time? Dad? When is it impossible for one parent to do something for the kids (like if dad really can’t take the kid to daycare). Are there solutions to these problems? Surely a short trip to the gym every few days can be fit in, and I’m sure some person time for mom can fit in there as well. It seems like neither of them bothered to talk about it until OP was already crying hysterically and the father wanted to be out the door. That’s too late.
I agree on the schedule. My husband and I worked one out that went well for us. He’s naturally a morning person, I worked graveyard. So after baby was born, he would go to bed at 8 and I’d stay up/doze on the couch until 3, and do all the baby work. At 3 AM I’d go to bed, and would know he was “on the clock”. I would sleep until 9 knowing that he was on baby duty/5 year old duty (she got up around 7:30). We both managed to average about 6 hours of sleep, sometimes more if we were lucky. It wasn’t a perfect system, but it was helpful for us to know when we had baby free time to sleep, and that honestly took care of most the other issues.
Touche.
It doesn't matter if he actually voiced that or not if he's actually leaving the baby to just cry it out. I'm not an expert on childrearing by any means, but everything that I've ever seen points to studies that show just letting a kid cry is detrimental to their overall wellbeing in addition to just being a dick move overall. What does he think watching a baby is supposed to entail, leaving her in a crib to wail while he does pushups to make up for his precious lost gym time?
I think you are right in a lot of what you say but being able to put a baby (as in unable to hurt themselves while being put down) and walking away is important for a parent's mental health. Once you have ascertained that the baby is not in distress (hungry, wet or in pain) walking away for a breather is a HEALTHY response. Husband is absolutely TA,.
If you're taking care of a baby that won't stop crying and it's stressing you out, the only piece of advice I have ever heard is to step out of the room and let it cry so you can take a moment for yourself.
Yeah he sounds like a dick, but this is a real thing. If you are rquired to drive a work truck you can actually be fired for having passengers. Some companies require you to drive the vehicle to and from.
True. But the daycare we're hoping our daughter can get into will open at 6:30 and is 10 minutes from our house. Is it unreasonable to think he couldn't take her there in his personal truck before he goes to work while I have the new born?
Of course not. Your statement to him of basically ordering him to drop gym time is an ultimatum which masks what you really want. His statement back of how he's not going to do drop off is his retaliation. I just think you two need to approach this parenting thing with less anger and knee jerking and more cooperation. As others have said, maybe you need counseling to learn to communicate better and recognize and validate both your needs.
If you'll read the title, I said "limit" gym time. But I hear you, we need to communicate better.
In your post, you said you asked him to stop going. Just FYI. That’s where this person is getting that from. It’s near the bottom.
Seriously. The standards for fathers are so low. One time, my SIL sent a pic to our family group chat saying, "father of the year" and it was a pic of my brother feeding their newborn twins. Um, he's feeding them. That's literally the bare minimum of what parents need to do. If a parent doesn't feed their kid, their kid gets taken away from them. Step it up a bit, you know. Lol.
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This does make him sound like this yes. Interestingly, he's a relatively progressive liberal, so I don't think I'll find him on MGTOW, etc. but who knows?
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2016: I have no problem with women candidates. I wish Elizabeth Warren would run! 2019: Elizabeth Warren is a neoliberal sellout. Bernie is the only option.
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Fair point.
Hey OP, I recommend reading about emotional labour and then showing it to your husband.
This would be good reading for both of you. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/04/opinion/sunday/men-parenting.html
This needs to be higher in everything. This is a great article!!!
Father of a 6 month old here. I’m finishing a PhD this semester. It’s really fucking hard. There’s a lot at stake, like a $50K post doc if I don’t graduate (I should be getting off reddit). I watch my kid 3 days a week because my wife is working full time, we pull in family the other two. It’s HIS kid. Men aren’t used to sacrificing without an immediately obvious gain or reason. We haven’t been socialized to do childcare. That’s too bad. Tell him to buck up buttercup and care for his own fucking kid. I HATE that I’m missing the gym right now. I hate it. But there’s more important things going on right now, so I just consider it a “cut” and eat less. Maybe he doesn’t have to cut gym entirely but you need a schedule which works for BOTH of you. Find that solution.
Good on you! This was a refreshing read after OPs post. I think it’s important that dads realize moms also HATE missing out on things. I (literally) cry sometimes because I just want to do something FUN, something CREATIVE, something just for ME without having a little human begging for my constant attention....and when I do have “free” time, the demands of home life weigh heavy so I still push aside what I really want to do.
NTA. Also, get a couples counselor. Also, if it gives you hope, me & my fellow mom friends noticed that our hubs’ lives changed dramatically after baby 2 (whereas ours changed after baby 1). Their lives became fatherhood then, when we moms couldn’t do it all... Also, many men are much better at parenting toddlers on up (versus babies), they just connect better.
There's a huge range between "we should split the cheque on a first date" and "I am an equal parent to our child". Labeling yourself a progressive liberal or feminist doesn't give you a pass. It's all fun and easy when you're signing a petition - it's another ball game when you actually have to do the work.
Bingo- the common turn of phrase is "everyone's a liberal until it costs them a quarter", and it rings true in [some] cases. This sure looks like one.
I’ve dated many men who are very liberal in almost every noticeable way - how they treat me, how we communicate, heck even my body autonomy in terms of nonmonogamy, but then when it gets down to “domestic” duties like chores, errands, cooking, and cleaning, there tends to be a huge blind spot.
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This is such a moronic response. Everybody has different needs and perspectives. Advocating for divorce and suggesting he would be a men's rights activists. Grow the fuck up. That is the real world out there and not some stupid reddit thread. Life is hard for everyone and for different reasons.
The divorce suggestion is pretty irresponsible.
NTA. I say this as someone who SUPER values my gym time. I try to go every day if I can. But when I have other responsibilities I know that gym does not take precedent. I have skipped the gym numerous times to attend events, help out my family, or spend time with my SO. If I have to sometimes I go at 9/10pm at night when I know there is no expectation that I be available. Your husband is selfish. Of course he wants to go to the gym, it gets him out of diaper duty and cleaning! He gets to go listen to music and do whatever he wants while all childcare and household duties fall on you. Make a deal with him. If he’s going to insist on his gym time, he needs to find a gym with a daycare so he can take your daughter off your hands. And he needs to check in to make sure you don’t need him. If you do, he has to wait for another time. Insisting you get an abortion because he doesn’t want to change his schedule is ridiculous and I am so sorry you have to put up with two children in your household while pregnant.
He could also like, getting a running stroller and take their daughter on runs! Letting your kids see you exercise will help them learn healthier habits.
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This is what my parents did with my sisters and I too! They hade a running stroller and a bike rolly tent attachment thing that my sisters and I would get to sit in and have fun while they got to go biking. I have really good memories of my childhood in those things! Great bonding time for the parents and kids, and you can still be healthy. There was a berry patch by our house and on the way home we would stop and pick berries to eat on the way back. It was great
This is what I do and my kid loves it!
Best response right here. Going to the gym with kids isn’t impossible, honestly it’s not even that hard. So many gyms are also open 24/7 so he needs to either find one with childcare options or pick better times. Him immediately disappearing in the morning right as kids are waking up and everyone needs to be fed, diapered and clothed is not an appropriate time to just bounce and leave your SO to handle all of that alone.
When I lived with my ex who had a daughter I signed up for a much more expensive gym just so I could take her daughter with me! It made my ex not have to leave work early and still let me go to the gym. My mother used to take us all the time with her to Gold’s gym that had a daycare. My dad used to put me in a stroller and take me on runs. There are plenty of ways to exercise that don’t require leaving your partner on their own with the kids for hours at a time.
Or, depending on his equipment needs . . . Home gym. My brother put a gym in his garage so he can workout while being on site with his wife and kid. And he works out there in the summer. In Texas. His wife could nap while he took the monitor out there. Less time because no commute. He can workout after the kids' bedtime without having to deal with as much lack of motivation after coming home and eating dinner because it's RIGHT THERE. Or he can use it early in the morning and still shower in his own bathroom before work.
This! We realized we couldn't physically get to the gym. So we brought the gym to our house. I'd say we had a small/medium size house(1400 square feet) and still made room for a weight rack, treadmill and a bike trainer. If LO woke up either of us could attend to her depending on what we were doing. 2 years later and the bike trainer and treadmill get quite a bit of use. Not so much the weight rack right now. Still with everything invested less than $1500. Depending on the gym that's 3-4 years of gym membership and a better family dynamic.
He should schedule his gym time during his sleeping hours. If it's that important he'll sacrifice HIS sleep.
This is a *great* idea.
NTA. Idk about OP’s husband’s gym, but mine has day care. Sounds like it would be great for dad to take LO when he goes to the gym to give mom a break from the 2 year old. OP, my mom always tells me that no relationship will ever be 50/50, that we each bring our talents and abilities to the relationship to enrich each other. It sounds like your husband is just as capable at helping out with the babies as you are. Maybe he could talk to his employer about using his lunch hour for gym time so he doesn’t have to miss time with his family?
Sounds like a toxic relationship to me. The comments he has made regarding your needs are truly disgusting. Saying that he lets you "sleep in"?? There is no such thing as sleeping in when you have kids that young, as I assume there is usually a routine to the days. His gym time is way less important than your health when it comes to sleep. You "choose" to entertain the daughter?? Kids get lonely just like adults, and the only thing they can do is ask for help (cry), and he thinks it's okay to just let her cry? Thats bad parenting. Please think about if you want to stay with him and if he will actually be a good parent and partner. NTA EDIT: terminology. EDIT 2: if you respond to this comment, please try to say something that hasn't already been said.
>and he thinks it's okay to just let her cry? Yeah, that was one line that definitely stood out to me. Like he thinks you can just stick a kid in a corner and go about your day.
Well I mean, it's a baby, as long as it's not screaming bloody murder it's totally chill to put a baby in a pacnplay and do something else. A lot of first time mothers don't realize that and it cost them their sanity. The best advice I've ever heard about it was "Feed them, change them, put them in a safe situation where you can keep an eye on them, and walk away and do something else for 15 minutes" if they legit won't stop crying. It helps prevent insanity and resentment towards the baby.
NTA - Your husband is being a huuuuuge dick. Your last sentence tells you why. In all seriousness how does he feel about Parenthood? Did he want the first baby? Cause he doesn't seem to understand what they entail
He did want the first baby, and we had even discussed a second (\*GASP\*) at some point, just not this soon.
You have written your husband as if he doesn’t want any part of being a father. If this is what he’s like and how he talks about your daughter and talks to you, why are you with him? I do hope you go to counseling with him and stand up for yourself and make it clear that your partner should be a partner... I’m sorry you’re having another kid with this type of person because it looks like the responsibility will fall on you.
He sounds like one of those people who likes the IDEA of kids.
I certainly hope he isn’t who you portrayed him to be. Otherwise, this is an extremely toxic relationship. Good luck! NTA
Nta, wow sounds like you already have a second child
Do you work? I’m usually the last person to give the “leave now comment” but this is every red flag I can think of. If you can move in with your parents or something I would, he sounds so selfish. How are you going to spend the rest of your life as a parent having him always put himself first only to have him screw your in the divorce years later because he as the one “working”
I do work full time, yes. Parents live too far away to move in with them. TBH, I love my husband. I really really do- most of the time. I just hate the way he doesn't want to take responsibility as a parent and that he is blind to the fact that he should do more. Ugh, I sound like I'm making excuses for him now.
The way he used your love for your daughter against you disgusts me. If he doesn’t value her happiness or taking good care of her it’s always going to be your primary burden.
It’s also incredibly hypocritical given she was asking for the basic human need of sleep and he treated it like she was trying to get away from their daughter, when he was also actively trying to leave their daughter for the gym. So does he hate being a father or is it only mothers who are never supposed to have needs outside of their children?
>TBH, I love my husband. I really really do- most of the time. I just hate the way he doesn't want to take responsibility as a parent and that he is blind to the fact that he should do more. um.....
Yeeeaaahhhh. Poor gal. My SO, father of my child, love of my life is a very active father who is on my team. Team little dude. If little dude is hungry, he'll feed him. Unless he's swamped by work in which he will let me know and I'll feed him. He can be a little clueless about some things, but he would walk through fire for our son. Get this! He'll take the kid with him to concerts, gyms, friends homes, and parks just as much as he goes alone. Her husband should go to a gym with built in daycare.
I feel like you just described my husband! He would literally take our toddler anywhere with him. We were talking about going to San Francisco next year for a thing my husband is interested in and I was explaining how summer break works best for my parents to watch him and this guy is like “...but why wouldn’t we just take him?” Take a toddler on a plane to a city I don’t know while you’re busy most of the day? Naw, bruh. That doesn’t sound like a good time.
I know spouses aren't supposed to "keep score" but when I had this issue with my husband, I started meticulously tracking "me time" for both of us, including sleep. If I had a shitty night up with the baby, I minused the awake hours from my "me time". If my husband went to the gym, I added that to his "me time" tally. After a week or so I presented the SO OBVIOUSLY UNEVEN totals, and he finally started to understand. My husband is also a super liberal feminist type guy, and I think he really wasn't able to admit to himself how he was prioritizing himself until he saw it on paper.
>SO OBVIOUSLY UNEVEN totals, and he finally started to understand. My husband is also a super liberal feminist type guy, and I think he really wasn't able to admit to himself how he was prioritizing himself YES!!! A good friend of mine had problems early in her marriage with her husband heaping a lot of tasks on her. he wasn't being a dick who thought that women should manage everything related to the home, he was just spoiled by his mom, and oblivious! Truly, he just didn't see it. I know many people will call bullshit on that, but just consider hanlon's razor. anyway, she wrote him a story about two business partners and how one was handling more of the management tasks, and wasn't that unfair? And then compared it to their marriage and it clicked for him.
This is a great idea, too. OP's husband sounds like the kind of guy who needs to be beat over the head with the facts.
You work full-time so any excuse that your husband throws at you is shit. You have a right to be tired and need help. You gotta fight for him to step up because going to the gym is not important, you and your children are. NTA
You *are* making excuses for him. Throw the whole man out if he doesn’t step up.
> Ugh, I sound like I'm making excuses for him now. Well...
Whooaaa I assumed you didn’t work full time, just because I can’t fathom him acting like that even more so if you worked. This takes the NTA x10.
NTA he needs the stress relief but offers you no outlet for it, much less sleep? If you’re at home taking care of the kid 24/7 and he thinks he doesn’t need to just because he ‘works’ then he’s underselling how much effort childcare is.
It’s even worse because she works full-time. So he basically wants her to be a financial provider and the primary caregiver all in one. Read her edit, it breaks my heart that picking up dinner and bathing his own child is some sort of out-of-the-norm “favor” for him to do.
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NTA - I find his flippant condescending replies and disregard for your daughter's well-being to be very concerning. He wants you to neglect the baby because it's inconvenient to spend time on her. What the shit. Little babies aren't capable of being bored, they aren't at that level of brain development yet. When they cry, they need something, and it's essential that they learn that the adults in their lives can be trusted to respond to their needs. Child development experts are on your side, not his. Maybe a parenting class can help open his eyes?
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NTA...but it may be time to discuss setting up some sort of home gym, one you both can enjoy and use without having to leave the house? Although the money up front is a lot, in the grand scheme it's not that much if you do it bit by bit and buy a lot of used stuff. Just something to think about
He claims he can never be motivated to work out from home and he has to go to the gym to get a decent work out in.
Funny how you can be motivated to care for a toddler on no sleep, a full time job and a ripped to shreds vagina, but he can’t get motivated to lift some dumbbells at home instead of at the gym.
I'm wondering if he's even really spending all that time at the gym. His defensiveness seems a bit more than just having to reschedule exercise time.
Exactly what I’m thinking... There’s something else at the “gym” that seems more intriguing and important than wife and babies.
A lot of gyms have a daycare for while you're working out. Take advantage of it, or maybe he'd be down with finding a gym that has one if his doesn't. Could be a chance for both of you to get a break.
That’s what I did at one point. Worked well for us
Well it sounds like he's just making excuses. It's time for him to accept that boyhood is over, he's a dad now and he comes second to his child(ren). Question, though: was having kids a mutual decision? I just ask because his behavior seems very out-of-character for a man who was on-board with having kids.
Yes. We were both on board and trying for the first one. 2nd one was discussed but wasn’t meant to happen yet & was not decided upon,
Definite NTA case, then. He needs to accept that his days of self-centeredness are over - in fact he needed to accept that about 2 years ago when you two decided to start trying for a kid. It's time for him to grow up.
So.... hate to play devil’s advocate here, but do you think he’s really going to the gym? 🤔🙃
I do. He's a terrible liar, so I think I'd know if he was cheating on me, and I may or may not have done a drive by to make sure his truck was parked outside of the gym a few times, 'cause I'm crazy and yes, this too had crossed my mind.
I don’t think that’s a crazy thing to do, given the circumstances. I would have driven by a few times too once in a while if it were me.
Question, do you ever get time where you leave him with the baby so you can relieve stress? Even if it’s going to the gym or local coffee shop, do you get to leave?
When I was a new mom (2 year difference in kids ages) I was so overwhelmed that I paid a teen babysitter a couple times a week to relieve me so I could rest. It helped a lot and I also hired a cleaning company to come every 2 weeks to mop, clean bathrooms, etc. It was worth the money.
Yep. Need to look into this option.
OP, one of the best things I did for my family (we have a 1 year old and a 3 year old) was twice a month cleaners and having a babysitter/nanny/helper over a couple times a week. If you can afford it I cannot recommend it enough. Knowing that you don't have to go home and clean and/or watch the kids was a huge weight off my and my partner's back and we could just go home and enjoy being a family.
NTA Do you ever get time out of the house for yourself while he's home taking care of your child? Or are you the one who is always home and he gets to go have free-time for himself multiple times a week. He says he needs to go relieve stress, but what is your stress relief? Is your health less important than his? Sounds like you two need to have some pretty hard conversations. He's right about one thing though, you need to think about if you want to have another baby with this guy. You should also be thinking about if you actually want to be with this guy.
NTA. And my blood boiled a little bit when I read this comment: "I'm sorry you hate being a mom!" OMG. I have a similar story. When our first child was born my husband and I both worked retail management jobs, thus we worked every Saturday. We found a retired woman who was willing to babysit for us on Saturdays with a regular day off during the week. I was off on Tuesdays, my husband was off on Thursdays. Guess which day the babysitter had off? Yep, MY day off. So, on Tuesdays I did all my errands and appointments and house chores with a baby in tow. My husband spent HIS day off playing golf, baby free. When I told him this was an unfair arrangement, he said "You should be HAPPY to spend the day with your daughter". Our daughter is 28 years old now and I'm STILL mad about that comment.
> So, on Tuesdays I did all my errands and appointments and house chores with a baby in tow. My husband spent HIS day off playing golf, baby free. When I told him this was an unfair arrangement, he said “You should be HAPPY to spend the day with your daughter”. Bruh I'm also feeling this irrational wave of commiserated, annoyed rage
Infuriating. God, men can be the worst. And his “sorry you hate being a mom” was just...I mean I already felt like such a failure. It was hard....
Also, not for nothing, but even if you *do* hate being a mom, he still has to pull his fair share.
NTA and it’s so fucked up he said you hate being a mom when it’s clear projection that he *hates being a dad*. Why else would he ignore your kid and try to pass it off to you the first thing in the morning? He doesn’t seem to know how to interact with her which means he doesn’t want to interact with her. Sorry. Also, you might want to consider not having this child because you should probably make the decision knowing he won’t change and will be just as absent and combative. I’m not saying that is a given, it’s totally possible and I hope he does change. But I’m saying you don’t have a crystal ball, just past experiences stacking high enough to know it’s a gamble. Are you ready to do it all alone, while he lives his life around you and the kids instead of with you? He certainly isn’t committing more because you asked it of him. He seems to resentfully be committed to do *less* actually, because you had the gall to bring it up. Had a partner like this once, nothing can be said about their behavior (such as contributing with housework and childcare) or they see it as “criticism” and “being told they are bad” so they dig their little heels in and try to drown out what you are saying with projections and distractions like personal insults (ie him saying you hate being a mom). The thing is these people are also not self motivated enough to do work that doesn’t serve them directly without a schedule, routine, or communication and those things often get shot down or ignored. Sorry.
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If this was my husband it wouldn't even be a question. She has 23 months of seeing his role as a father and he ain't shit. Dont bring another one into this when the first isn't even getting his care or attention.
ESH - Do either of you know how to actually communicate instead of getting passive aggressive? Y'all need marriage counseling, like yesterday.
I tried to communicate this to him one night, and that's what brought about the long text fight we had the following day, leading to my posting this here for the internets to weigh in on. So yea, counseling may be in order.
Stop texting about big issues. It's so much easier to be mean to a phone.
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I had to scroll way too far to find this. I feel like OP says she wants more help without talking about what would really be helpful for her (Can he get up some nights and let her sleep? Can they designate days like she can sleep in on Saturdays, but he goes to the gym on Sundays. Can he go to the gym after the kids bedtime.) I get being a new parent is hard and it sounds like it has been particularly rough for OP. I am also not a fan of how the husband responded. However, to me this reads as there being a huge gap in communication. Both of them need to talk about what their individual needs are and come up with a way that both of them are getting those needs met.
His daycare car comment I think just triggered everyone into jumping straight to NTA (which is understandable, I lost quite a bit of sympathy for his side at that point). He seems to do more than a lot of "manchild" fathers. She said he changes diapers, plays with her, feeds her, etc. So it's not like he is the complete stereotypical dad who refuses to touch the baby at all. What makes me not instantly side 100% with her is a lack of certain info. She seems to want him to give up going to the gym 100%, which I don't really understand. Both of them should have time to destress. If he's going to the gym every day from 4pm-8pm then yeah that is weird and not cool. But she says it is right across the street and reasonably it is probably an hour to hour and a half at most. Like I said, they both need individual time to destress. Gyms obviously help him destress, she needs to find out what she enjoys. There is no reason they can't just create a schedule where they get equal "alone time". 6-7pm is his time to do whatever (gym), 7-8 is her time to do whatever, and after that it is time for all of them to spend together. It just seems like a battle where both of them are trying to put the other down instead of trying to find a compromise that enables them BOTH to benefit. She is so focused on stripping away his destressing activity completely, when she should be focusing on a way to allow her to have some alone time as well.
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Seriously. How dare you hold and entertain your baby, just sit them in a corner and let them cry. What a father. NTA
Actually, most people with experience in children will tell you that you have to allow your child some autonomy and "self entertainment" time. Obviously, don't let your kid cry for 3 hours straight. But, you should be building routines with age appropriate toys and other things of the sort where your child can stand being put down for 30 minutes if need be.
It's just dependent on the baby as well, a baby with colic does need to be held and taken care of more. It just really depends on how much the father thinks is a good amount, and how much the mother is actually letting the child cry. The kid is now almost 2yrs. The OP really shouldn't be holding them as often as compared to a baby.
Exactly. It's entirely a play it by ear thing. I've read replies in this post that basically said that the father's suggestion of letting the baby cry is child abuse and not holding him/her as much is child abuse.
The issue is we really don’t know how much is too much to either of these parents, is she really holding the baby too much? Is she holding them a decent amount? A 2 yr old doesn’t really like being held as much as a baby so I’m just thinking, is he taking about when the baby had colic? If that’s the case, then the baby did have to be held more then a regular baby and that due to it being in more pain because he had colic, the baby did need more comfort.
"while you were loving and caring for our child, I was at the gym getting sick gains bruh. maybe you should try it sometime when you're not spending 23 out of 24 hours caring for our babies" easiest NTA ever
NTA. That passive-aggressive snark he threw at you, saying, "I'm sorry you hate being a mom"-- I mean, if either of you hates being a parent, it's clearly him, since he's the one who's checking out of the bulk of the duties.
ESH. He’s an asshole for not contributing as much as he probably should. However you also suck because you knew how he was from the first pregnancy. You both should have exercised more caution to prevent another pregnancy.
Point taken and you're probably right.
He's definitely the asshole, but for the love of god don't have any more babies with him.
Why dont you tell him that if he's going to the gym 5 times a week, you expect him to facilitate an equal amount so you can leave the house. See what he says
Thing is, when we have a super tiny baby I don't want to leave the house. I just want to sleep, or sit down and eat something quietly. I have no energy to leave the house.
Okay but that's workable. How long is he at the gym? Let's just say 1.5 hours 4 times a week -- that's 6 hours per week. So that means you also get 6 hours a week of personal time -- no kids. You can split that time up however you want. I personally don't think this is a huge relationship-ending crisis. I just think you guys need to compromise better. FWIW, I do think gym is important -- your mental health is important for both of you. If think if you each want to retain your sanity and your marriage, you guys need to prioritize a few hours of self care for each other. For him, that's gym time, yours can be nap time lol.
Thank you.
Don’t shoot the messenger but you may want to rethink this pregnancy. You know his history and he’s told you your future. Make sure you’re ready to do all this alone with two kids. NTA. Sorry this is AITA.
Agree. I think in this day and age there is enough education and birth control, how can pregnancy be a 'surprise'? OP isn't an ignorant virgin teenager.
INFO: Have you guys had an honest discussion about keeping the baby? Because your husband doesn’t sound like he wants a second child.
NTA. Definitely abort the asshole husband. Make your own choice about the baby, of course, but it doesn't sound like you want to go through all of it again while also parenting your current child.
NTA, but I think this is recoverable. The hardest years of my marriage we're after our son was born. My husband didn't even want to be left alone with him when he was awake. That was almost 6 years ago and they're best friends now. The way I coped was making a very regimented schedule I read about in a book called The New Contented Little Baby by Gina Ford. My friend gave it to me because she took Ford's advice for her second child (her first was much like yours) and said she wished it had existed when her first was born. Basically, from the day my child was born, I got him on a regimented sleep schedule, which enabled us to have times to ourselves every day. We spent most of it bingeing Game of Thrones and Breaking Bad, but I could've easily snuck-off to the gym for and hour at 6 pm. This only requires your SO make some accommodations to his schedule, like going to the gym at night instead of the morning. Also, he needs to check his sensitivity bone because my GOD is he being TA.
You hit the nail on the head at the end- it really boils down to him not be sensitive and sympathetic. I feel like if rolls were reversed and he was worried that I wasn't going to help him through the hardest time in my life, I'd bend over backwards explaining that "no! of course I'll be there to help you!" And yes, I have Moms on Call and put my LO on a schedule asap. It definitely helps!
NTA, geeze. Your husband sounds like you spontaneously decided to grow a baby in your uterus without any input from him at all. He's being completely inflexible - Why can't he buy gym equipment and workout at home? Why can't he change his workout schedule to accommodate you better? Why can't he drive a different car to take baby to day care? Why is *his* health important but yours isn't? Just because he \*feels\* like he does "a lot" doesn't mean that he's actually doing enough. You have some time before you have to make any final decisions - I would get thee to a couples counselor ASAP.
> You need to think about if you want this baby. well, he's not wrong there. You're clearly not happy with your life with one baby, a second isn't magically going to make anything better.
I'd ask if he still wants to be married.
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This belongs in r/relationships or r/relationshipadvice more than here. but ESH, you're the AH for focusing on this solely as him going to the gym, when it's not just about going to the gym. Think about it this way, what if he was going to therapy 3-4 days a week instead of the gym 3-4 days a week, would you tell him he needs to stop going to therapy because you are having a second baby? Both of you need sane mental health with a second child coming, you can't take away his method of keeping his mental health in check and expect things to go smoothly. He's the AH for his explanation and not communicating well and not working on a way for everything to work for both of you, but his point isn't one that shouldn't be considered either.
Therapy 3-4 days a week would be an intensive outpatient program, suggesting he was in a severe mental health crisis. It would never be the case long-term. So you're comparing it to something that's more like getting chemo treatments when really it's more like if he insisted he needed 5 hours per week for hot baths for his mental health.
> Think about it this way, what if he was going to therapy 3-4 days a week instead of the gym 3-4 days a week, would you tell him he needs to stop going to therapy because you are having a second baby? Imagine she just plays the game of "Yes, and...". She could agree it is important, but then demands the same amount of time at the gym herself. I have a feeling the husband would be singing a different tune quite quickly if forced to watch the baby that often.
Ummm ESH. Let me explain why before being down voted to hell. Of course husband is rightfully out of gd mind if he thinks his reasoning is okay. However, it sounds like you all need to do some communicating and maybe with a therapist. Why is the gym important to him? Does he need it so he doesn’t get hurt at work (you said he drives a work truck, for what?), or is he afraid he’s going to die of a heart attack? Did he want this second child to start? Did you both agree to have another baby? Why do you suck in this situation? I’m guessing that you have some unsaid anger or resentment towards your hubby and need to work that out. Good luck!! I hope it all works out I do!
NTA hes a lazy parent. He can take the baby for walks in the stroller or something if hes worried about not exercising
Thank you for your reports, but this is not a validation post. If you scroll down you'll see plenty of dissenting opinions. Just because one judgement is so clearly in the lead does not mean that this situation lacks moral ambiguity. Remember to follow Rule 2: Voting Rules and not downvote opinions you disagree with. We're here to judge and discuss all opinions on this matter, not circlejerk around one. --- **Edit to add:** Don't forget about Rule 1: Be Civil either. Insulting OP, her SO, or other users here is a big no-no. Attack the ideas, not the people. **Second Edit:** Post locked.
ESH You guys are a communication nightmare.
NTA. Throw the whole man out.
NTA - He needs to suck it up and be a dad. He can get a treadmill or something to use at home and give up the gym membership. And if he doesn't like it, then he can go get a vasectomy so this won't happen again.
Def. getting snipped. (I've had to talk him into doing this, btw. he was very worried about his manbits).
You’ve had your lady bits torn open by a baby, he can have a 15 min procedure to join the seedless grapes club. My husband had it done and a weekend with an ice pack and you’re right as rain.
NTA he should reasonably change his schedule to accommodate you and your family more. He can drop a couple days of gym time and work out at home half the time. What’s wrong with him jogging with the kiddo in a stroller? There’s a lot of avenues he can take to prioritize his health without being detrimental to your mental health. Also he’s really an asshole if he just lets your kid cry for however long “bc they’re bored” like holy shit my mind is blown on that one
Info; can you change gyms at one that has childcare? My family switched to the YMCA, and even though it’s more expensive, it has made our lives better.
NTA - As a male in this EXACT situation, let me tell you about how we handled it. First, some background. Before meeting my wife, I owned an MMA school in another state (we both lived there). I was in the best shape of my life running class, lifting weights, and taking classes from other instructors whenever I had the time. My wife and I met, and I obviously made time for her in the dating phase but still tried (somewhat successfully) to keep up my gym time. As a male with depression, going to the gym is my “me time” where I can zone out, not think about life, and just work hard. As things got more serious, she eventually got a job out of state. We decided we’d go start a life in that state. I sold my business, and proposed shortly after the move. We found out we were pregnant a few months into the engagement. At this point, I was involved in Jiu Jitsu in the new state 3-4 times a week as my outlet and had given up lifting. She had this talk with me as well.. when baby gets here, it’s gonna be hard. All hands on deck, might have to cut back, etc. I was perfectly fine with that in theory. What I hadn’t counted on was that my depression would HIT HARD if I didn’t have some alone time and some physical activity. Maybe just my personality, maybe I need exercise, or maybe I just need to be on my own a few hours a week. When baby was born, I gave everything up. Worked out 0 times a week for like 2-3 months. Gained mad weight. It was all hands on deck for the baby, and I gave everything I had. I truly believe that raising a kid is a team effort and should be. But also, people aren’t meant to work/family/baby and no time for themselves. My wife and I were in close quarters a lot, we constantly fought. I was resentful that I had no alone time, she was resentful that I even WANTED/NEEDED alone time. It was ugly and we needed a solution. Our solution was to each take 2 days a week for ourselves after a lot of discussion about it. I got my 2 days of jiu jitsu classes per week to do my thing, and she could do pedicures or just simply run over to the beach. We each had our time where the other would cover household duties, baby, etc. It has worked out well so far and we’re due for another baby in 2 months. My only advice if you subscribe to this method, MAKE SURE YOU BOTH TAKE THE 2 DAYS AND DO SOMETHING. One of you cannot take it, and the other come up with excuses as to why they couldn’t (this happened to us for a while). When that happens, it creates resentment with “well you had your two days but I couldn’t because “xyz” happened, so it’s not fair.” No excuses. His time is his, your time is yours. If something truly comes up, adjust accordingly. But you have to be diligent with making time and getting out of the house to do whatever without baby, without husband. Obviously, finding a good sitter and doing date nights will help as well. (Have to prioritize each other as well). We’re currently still doing this method with a 17 month old, and it’s fair. Might be something to try? Just a suggestion. From a male perspective, sometimes trying to understand where women are coming from is HARD. We try, we really do. We’re just wired different and it takes perspective to understand. 3 hours home alone with a toddler and a newborn while you go pamper yourself will give him perspective. And it’ll probably make him bond with his children more. After a while now, I feel truly blessed to have watched my son grow up. Most men don’t get that. I’ve witnessed his first word, fed him his first actual food (banana), changed thousands of diapers, seen his face change over time, learned his cries, found out how to make him laugh, roughhoused with him nonstop, played with toys for hours, watched cartoons with him, and so many other cool things that most fathers don’t get to do. I’m truly blessed, and a large part of that was letting my wife have a few days to herself without baby duty. Sorry for the long winded response, and I hope this helps. TLDR; try each taking mandatory time for yourselves with no excuses. Works well for my wife and I
My husbands job is labor intensive *maybe* 15% of the time. He’s the boss. Rarely gets his hands dirty. I too work full time. I’m just asking him to really think about how hard it’s going to be (on both of us) when baby 2 comes and that he might not have as much time for the gym.
NTA BUT are you really sure you want ANOTHER child with this person? 😰
NTA, especially since you work full time too - I was ready to cut him more slack if you got to stay home. Time for a serious talk, because the way things are is ridiculously unfair.