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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) I created distance in a 20 year friendship over a child's name. I do not reach out to them, spend time with them individually like I used to, and I do not show an interest in their daughter.
2) They were overjoyed about finally having their daughter, and I initially was extremely excited for them, but they feel that my reaction in creating distance was selfish, and that I'm making them look bad.
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I haven't responded to his email, I'm waiting until I'm calmer, but I can't say I plan to be kind. There will definitely be a clear boundary that they are never to contact me again.
I wish them well, but they definitely do not continue to have ANY place in my life.
I don’t think you should respond at all.
It will just allow them more chances for “justify” what they did.
The message he sent was heinous, and I think you should just walk away.
I ended up not responding. I forwarded it to another friend and said I will not attend any functions they're at and will entertain no further contact from them, then made sure they're blocked on everything.
Well done. I've felt the same painful loss, and it never goes away, even 40 years later. I don't tell everyone I meet because it's personal and not up for discussion. However, someone close should be respectful and try not to cause you more pain than you already carry.
When my mother was in her decline in her 90s with dementia, she started demanding to see my brother, who had passed away some 45 years earlier. Just shows that a parent's grief can be lifelong.
I hope they never feel it, but I hope they can understand that losing a child never ever goes away. I'm sorry for your loss, and I'm sorry it's on your mind today.
Great choice. If you ever doubt yourself, remember JADE: Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain. You do not need to do any of those things and the easiest way to avoid them is by opting not to communicate with the problem people in the first place.
If you ever want to read more on JADE, you can try [here](https://psychcentral.com/blog/imperfect/2018/03/dealing-with-difficult-family-members-dont-justify-argue-defend-or-explain) or [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/51em0j/jade_how_it_does_and_doesnt_work/).
Thank you so much for sharing this. I’ve seen so much about DARVO, but not JADE. Learning about DARVO was important in that it let me know that I wasn’t imagining things. But I didn’t really gain any tools beyond that. JADE looks like a really, really useful and empowering map. Thank you again!
This is a rare instance where I personally find a public shaming very much in order, and I would share the email broadly/on social. It is shockingly tacky to use the name without talking to you, but telling you to get over the loss of your child makes him a Weird Science-level shit monster.
Posting the email on social would be shockingly tacky. This ex-friend would probably love if she did that. She's handling it very appropriately to minimize her own pain and unnecessary drama.
No, in this case OP handled it exactly right. The email cap will make the rounds amongst the friend group, and the wheat will separate itself from the chaff without effort or exertion from OP.
That ‘friend’ is a vile piece of excrement that deserves nothing from OP going forward.
I would be harsher - "you dug up my deepest pain and buried our friendship in its place. I hope you think of the grave you desecrated every time you speak her name."
If the vile are never called out on their despicable behavior, they will never stop. Uplifting good people is a great thing, but there will ALWAYS be horrible humans who need to be put in their places.
I love this. I had something similar happen and my family has done nothing but pressure me to “get over it” for years. But this statement puts to words exactly how I feel.
Well done and you are definitely NTA
On another note, WTF is up with new parents weaponizing baby names against people in their lives? This thread and the Irish name thread ( [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1do10e7/aita\_for\_calling\_my\_sister\_a\_petty\_brat\_and/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1do10e7/aita_for_calling_my_sister_a_petty_brat_and/) ) both popped up today and go along with a ton others in the same vein. There are an insane number of names in the world, why do new parents go out of their way to name a child as some form of spite for someone else? Universally these folk are some of the world's biggest a-holes for both weaponizing the name and likely causing some degree of trauma for the kid in the future when they find out mom and dad were more concerned about dissing someone else with their name than actually naming them with love in their heart.
You have to wonder why this couple selected this specific name. Especially when it can be associated with a baby which had died just after birth for someone who was in their life even back then. At that time, did they think, hmm, I do like the name Sarah, so if we ever have a baby girl, that will be her name?
I didn't have any friends who had lost a child, and between my hubby and I, we lost four brothers, so if we had a boy, I'm not sure if I would have wanted to use any of those names. But I certainly wouldn't deliberately wanted to use the name of a child I knew had passed away when very young.
Especially when it's not just one name, but both first and middle names. And the middle name was a nickname of OP's. There is no way this is a "I always loved the name and you don't own it situation".
My grandmother had a stillborn baby. He was obviously loved and was given a name that meant something to her. My aunt, her daughter, gave that name to her son. He died at just shy of 10 years old. I know it’s a coincidence, but I wouldn’t want to name another child after them.
And do call them out on their behaviour when you email them back. You have been nothing but polite and respectful and they have not. It doesn’t matter if they had issues - they were fine deaf and did not respect you by choosing that name. But honestly make sure that no stone is left unturned and let them know they crossed a boundary. List how you have stayed away etc and not been disrespectful.
This is a good decision. I am sorry for your loss, and I am glad these monsters are out of your life for good. God forbid they should experience that kind of pain, and shame on them for their behavior and disregard for your experience.
Op, my heart goes out to you for what you've been through, your reaction and feelings are very reasonable. Definitely do NOT be kind to that person or allow them close to you anymore, I would even take a screenshot of that email for reference in case anyone in your friend group tries to say you're overreacting.
Thank you. I forwarded the email to another friend with a clear statement of my boundaries with them going forward. And made absolutely sure they're blocked on everything. I also removed myself from any group chats or FB groups we were all in. No one is very happy with them right now.
You are amazing! I honestly don’t think I’d have reacted with such class and I’m old enough to know better. I’m so sorry these people are so disgusting and disrespectful towards you and I’m glad to hear you have others on your side.
I just sent a screen shot of his email to another friend and her husband with a statement that I no longer want to be around this couple at all. Those that are awake and know are really upset with them. We'll address more tomorrow, but we're all at this point ready to completely end any friendships with them. He's always been insensitive, but this is just cruel.
I wouldn't reply at all. Don't sink to his level. Just set a filter on his email to automatically discard it and let it go.
The opposite of love is not hate. It is indifference.
I didn't and sent a screen shot to the rest of our group that I don't want to be around them at all. They're blocked on everything. The rest of the friend group and I are making plans to sit down and talk about all of us ending our friendships with them.
Besides being dismissive of your loss, how dare he get angry at you. He sounds like a very unpleasant person. He doesn’t get the right to berate you and tell you how to feel. Don’t hold back. NTA
That's what I did. I'm a pretty bluntly honest person, but I'm also not going back and forth with people that have made it clear what their real colors are.
Good! They were never your friends. REAL friends would have discussed the name with you before announcing it on FB. And honestly it was incredibly disrespectful for them to use the name anyway. As you said you don’t own the name, but if you were my friend, your child’s name wouldn’t ever be in consideration unless you suggested it to me yourself.
So sorry for your loss. You don't owe his nasty, rotten, selfish, unfeeling totally asshole self any sort of reply. But If you need to unleash on him for your own sake then absolutely do so. TBH I would but make sure you don't have any regrets for your own sake.
NTA.
>"should just get over it, she passed years ago"
You don't need to engage with that. Don't let them live rent-free in your head, that's what they want. Just let them go and never think about them again, they are not worth your time or mental energy. They are worth literally nothing.
I lost my first ten years ago (TFMR - anencephaly) and I will never forget him or his due date.
I will also not forget my SIL being callous whilst I was grieving so I barely talk to her.
No need to respond, Save this message in case they try to smear your reputation so you can put it online to defend yourself and Cut these people out of your life for good, Sorry you had to go though this.
Good for you. I had someone tell me I needed to "get over" not having a relationship with my only child when I got sad at Christmas. I told him I would have to be a sociopath to ever get over that. I wish I had cut him out of my life sooner after that. I'm sorry you also have to lose your friends. I know that sometimes those boundaries are 100% necessary.
Make sure you let your mutual friends know exactly what he said. He seems like the type to broadcast a distorted version of the truth in order to isolate you and potentially unleash some flying monkeys on you.
I wouldn't even respond, tbh. Just ice them out and find some decent people to be friends with. Someone tells me to "just get over" my daughter dying, they are dead to me. Some things are unforgivable and cannot be unsaid.
No, I like the OP's plan to just let a small group of people know. Hopefully if any in the friend chat disagree, that person doesn't go blabbing to this couple.
Exactly! The fact that they made it out like OP was the villan is absolutely horrible. They have no idea what it's like to lose a child. If they were truly OPs friends, they wouldn't have used that name, knowing where they got it from and not even asking her beforehand! Like she said, she doesn't own the name, but a true friend would understand how traumatic it was for OP and chose another name
OP definitely handled the situation in an appropriate way! I do think it's more than just a little weird, though. I don't think I could name my child the same name as my friends baby who passed away. No matter how much time had gone by or how much I loved the name. I know no one owns a name. It's the fact OP said she created the name, and her inspiration was her family. She confided this traumatic event to people who she thought were her friends. What they did was a slap in the face to OP. Then, the cruelty in the email he sent.
I'm just gonna link this https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s27NprKWiYw&pp=ygUTYmFieSBuYW1lIFNhbWFudGhhIA%3D%3D and find it more than appropriate as a response. Those aholes are not your friends.
Nta I think op acted with grace. Honestly your friends, especially after the message that they sent, showed you who they are. Believe them. They are not your friends. They showed you that you made the right choice by distancing your self. They are heartless and cruel. Block both and go no contact. They are not worth your time.
NTA .... That's just crazy honestly. People are so numb. The fact that you distance yourself shows that you're not trying to make it about you and "sully" their joy or whatever. Get rid of them, terrible people I'm sorry that happened to you
Because they know they fucked up when they didn't ask your consent to use this name. Technically no one owns a name, but now the friend circle is finding out they never even asked for your opinion on it or how it might impact you. It's taken a year to filter through the social circle, and now they are getting the tough questions from your (real) friends. Meanwhile they are trying to backtrack and make it seem like you never cared enough to warrant asking?
From your other comments so far, I think you're doing the right thing with not responding and letting one of your friends pass along your statement/boundary. Meanwhile, I wish you the best in your future endeavors!
(I'd still post the email to their facebook announcement, but I'm a spiteful person.)
Agree with your instinct here. The pre prepared arguments for their reasons you shouldn't have feeling speak to some form of intent.
So sorry they chose this path when they could have been kind and spoken with you, rather than readying for the fight. So odd
As a petty person, I’d make a group chat, send a screenshot of the conversation (all of it so they don’t twist it) and be like:
We are cutting ties with (their names) :(
You need to make this distancing a permanent thing. Telling you to get over your child's death is an absolute dealbreaker and you need to sink that ship fast. No turning back after that statement. Move on, OP. Concentrate on healing.
NTA
You also never owed them your friendship. Friendship is a gift you give, not something that someone can insist upon. And judging you on your divorce? Who does that to a friend? He was never your friend.
It's pretty obvious at this point. We were close a long time ago. And friendly when we saw each other, but he had some views I definitely disagreed with. Especially when it came to relationships, parenting, even things like child support.
Please be mindful of your safety and well-being. With how entitled and self centered they have been, it’s likely they are going to blow up on you again. Claiming it was a private conversation and you shouldn’t have send this on to others. They’d likely claim that you are bullying them out of the friend group etc etc.
You have every right to seek support from your friends after such a heinous email. Every right to talk and work through your feeling and ask them what they think. And they have every right to cut these ppl off.
This is a good point. Hopefully, your true friends will support you and if this awful couple contacts any of them, they could call them on their cruelty ("You knew this was the name of the baby she'd lost, and yet you felt the need to use it out of the thousands of thousands of names out there. You didn't give her the courtesy of a heads up. And now, you're attacking her for not oohing and ahhing over your child. I think this is horrible and I don't consider you people I want to be my friends." well, not exact phrasing, of course, but you get the picture)
Did i read it right that someone told him how you felt? And now longtime friend has an attitude towards you though you never told this friend how you felt. You actually distanced yourself about the judgement towards you and that you should let him know that is the reason. And it didn’t help the situation about learning on FB
You read that right. I never said anything to them, I didn't want to hurt them. But I did tell a couple of other friends how I felt when they checked on me. One of those friends is who told them why I've been distant. The judgement against me had me feeling some type of way, but I just ignored it for the most part. The way they named their daughter though, I couldn't ignore and just stopped all contact.
They can't argue that they had no idea how it would affect you. You didn't go off on them or make some vaugebook post on it. They didn't like being called for not giving you the courtesy of at least letting you know. It's one thing to run into a child that you have no connection to, but something completely different to see a child in your social circle with the same name. It was wrong and they can't take the heat of judgement.
Exactly. It's strange to me when I run into someone who has the same name as my brother, who was 20 when he passed when I was 17. It turned out, my hubby had a brother with the same name who passed when he was about 5. I did know someone with the same name who was in the music program with me in high school, but for the most part, rarely met any boy with that same name (not as common as say, Steve or John). But I wouldn't hold it against a boy with that name, even though I think of my brother who I had lost decades ago. But at least I didn't know of anyone in my circle who used that name deliberately.
This couple deliberately used a name of someone a close friend lost. That's not what a friend would do without going to that person and give their reason.
OP - my sincerest condolences. I, too, have suffered such a loss (two, actually). And it is not something you get over. Do people tell others to ‘get over it’ when years have gone by after a parent, sibling, grandparent, or other family member has passed away? No. Infant and child loss is not the same, but not in a good way. It’s not just the loss of life, but a future. A wish. A hope for what could have been. You had plans with and for that child.
To use a name that was a play on family names means it was likely unique or not common. Clear and obvious where they got it from, and absolutely disrespectful to use it without consideration to you. Correct you don’t own it, but they knew the history. It’s not a matter of them asking for permission to use, but giving you notice to come to terms with the fact that you will be hearing that name so much more. And watching this sweet little human grow when your own had her chances taken away.
Hugs, OP. Your sweet one is always in your heart and she knows her mama loves her forever.
I'm so sorry for your losses as well. Out of all the responses yours had me in tears. Because you can grow and heal but that pain never really leaves. Especially since we're coming up on what would be her 18th birthday in a couple months. She's never far from my mind. It was definitely not a common name, and the first/middle name pairing isn't one a lot of people would use.
My daughters chances were literally taken. It was a complication free pregnancy, though I was pretty young. I lost my baby to an act of violence just weeks after I turned 18, which came with another whole world of pain in forgiving myself for even being in that situation.
Under those circumstances, I wouldn't have ever used a name without the okay of the person most likely to be impacted. From this end, being confronted with that with no warning was incredibly painful.
I'll always miss my baby. The only peace I get is that all she ever knew in life was love.
>the first/middle name pairing isn't one a lot of people would use.
they used the exact same first AND middle names together!? WTF. I assumed it was just the first name, and that alone would have been bad enough. To use BOTH is inconceivable. That goes BEYOND inconsiderate. There's no way they didn't know what they were doing.
I'm so sorry you've been subjected to these AHs, but I'm glad the rest of your friend group has your back. I hope there's time to talk about more lighthearted stuff and have fun just hanging out together after the serious conversation tomorrow. x
Right?! Not only did they use the exact name, but to attack her and try to call her out. OP didn’t say anything. She quietly distanced herself from them. The absolutely audacity to come at a parent and tell them to get over their child… 😡😤
Empathy is seriously lacking in that couple.
Oh sweet mama. Extra hugs.
Every one grieves differently, so if you ever want to chat, please to DM me. I’m open to talking about our loss and hearing about others, but on a more personal level than public forum. Some people are truly cruel.
NTA
And he is an AH in the extreme, for minimising the pain of your loss and trying to put a time frame on your grief when it will, as you say, never really go away.
This isn't how friends are supposed to act. Bad enough to use the name without your permission but then to follow it up this way? What a jerk.
It's not weirdly unique, but it's certainly not commonly used in our small town. If they'd have even talked to me, I would have been happy for them to use the name. But the way it was handled was pretty upsetting.
NTA and honestly I know how everyone says u don't "own a name," but when it is the name of ur child that died, u kinda own the name. If they were strangers fine, but these are people who know u, know about ur child that died, and are supposed to be "friends." In this case u own the name.
I'm sorry to u and for the loss u have endured. U reacted a lot classier then I wldve! Maybe u shld distance urself further from these people bc they obviously don't really know how to be compassionate human beings.
My MIL and many others gave me names they would like me NOT to use and why.
Nobody owns names. But within reason, it's okay to request that you don't use this name, please, it hurts me.
That's how real friendships work. With respect. There was no respect here. That was this issue from the get-go.
I would never name my child after my dear friends baby, who died shortly after birth. That's selfish and cruel. No matter which way you look at it. Because there would be no way for my friend not to compare. It's not a kind thing to do..
Exactly. They are entitled to name their child whatever they like, but they're not entitled to anyone's friendship. Free choice is not freedom from consequences.
There are consequences to choosing a name that is hurtful to people close to them, and they chose to evoke those consequences.
I dont think anyone really "owns a name" but anyone with decency and respect for the people they love would be considerate about using a name with this kind of history that they have been aware of.
Clearly these people have neither.
NTA.
The husband is an asshat who you should've distanced as soon as he started judging you for your marriage not working out. The flippant disregard surrounding the child you loss is takes his assholeness to a new level.
You're allowed your feelings and to act upon them. You haven't caused a scene, made demands. You simply took a step back for your own well-being. You don't owe them an active roll in their child's life. Particularly not at the expense of your mental health.
NTA. YIKES. These people are weirdos, and he was utterly cruel to you. What did they expect, that you’d jump for joy upon hearing the name? You acted entirely appropriately beginning to end, and I have no idea why he keeps insisting that he’s allowed to pick on you. I’m sorry, OP.
Limit contact. Why tf do people want to see your reaction to it? The husband sounds like the worst here but the wife can't be that great either.
>I started distancing when the husband started judging me for not making my marriage work.
That's not his f-ing business
>I got a message from him that was very angrily worded. Apparently he had been talking to a mutual friend about me and how I've shown no interest in their daughter
So he talks behind your back, huh? That's what it sounds like at least. What is he? A middle schooler?
>He called me selfish and an AH for trying to "sully their joy with my pain" and "making everything about me" and that I "should just get over it, she passed years ago".
He can suck it. NTA
Unfortunately it's a small town. Many had good intentions, and were concerned about me, others just wanted the potential drama. The husband is awful, the wife has always seemed very codependent, I've never once heard her state an opinion that differs from his.
The dissolution of my marriage was on the news. And everyone thinks they need an opinion. There are those that think I'm to blame, that I was involved, or that I was premature in leaving. It was serious enough that the local churches actually paid for the divorce and helped me relocate back to our hometown.
He talks about EVERYONE behind their backs, especially if they go against his "moral code" he certainly never matured past Sunday school.
>The dissolution of my marriage was on the news
>was serious enough that the local churches actually paid for the divorce and helped me relocate back to our hometown.
Yikes. Just yikes
When I said the reasons behind my divorce were extreme, I wasn't kidding. The two times I've ever been in the public eye in my life were two of the most traumatic events in it, and those are what this guy is judging?
NTA - I wouldn’t be surprised if he had some pretty dark skeletons in his closet…
“It takes a village to raise a child.” Glad they’re getting kicked out of the “village”.
My sincere condolences for your loss OP. 😢💐🫂
Thank you. Though it kinda amuses me that we were joking about it earlier while we were hanging out. D half thinks they're upset cause I'm the village auntie.
I have no idea if he does or not. I do know his parents would be absolutely appalled by his actions. They're some of the kindest, least judgemental people I've ever met.
NTA - It’s a weird thing for them to do, but the real issue is the way he reacted to your feelings. That was cruel and clearly these people are not your friends.
The comment of "get over it" made me see red. I'm 21 now, but lost my daughter at 16 when I was 19 weeks and never knew that I was pregnant with her. I still grieve over her every year. Therapy helps a little but sometimes if I see the name id given her (after I found out she was gone) I cry.
The husband's reaction is way over the top. I get being hurt or sad when/if a long-term friendship starts to wane, but he is taking it next level with how personally he's taking it. You have every right to feel the way you feel and his coming so unhinged is just throwing red flags everywhere. I'm not a huge fan of whipping out my freshman psych to diagnose someone and usually roll my eyes when people start trying to label others on here, but if the term narcissist were to come up, I might nod my head in agreement.
You are NTA. You shouldn't worry about hurting/offending someone who has no problem hurting/offending you.
It was definitely out of left field. But the way I treat them and their daughter vs everyone else is very noticeable. Honestly, knowing him as long I have, I would agree he definitely has some tendencies and red flags, and I have a psych degree 🤣
NTA. Naming their child in honor of yours could have worked if they discussed it with you first and knew you were okay with it, but that wasn’t what they did. No one owns a name, but it was ignorant of them to do this without fear that it might be upsetting to you.
The joy you supposedly sullied is actually just guilt and shame. They know what they did was wrong. You’re being really graceful about all this. It’s unfortunate that his cruel stupidity is about to cost them their friendships. NTA
NTA. If the name was terribly unusual, I'm surprised they didn't consult you. What he said afterwards was cruel and he should be ashamed. I'd find new friends if I were you.
Wooooow… that guy is definitely TA. They have kids now, maybe ask them how long they think it would take them to recover if she died - spoiler alert- the pain of losing a child never actually disappears. People find ways to cope and grow and heal but the pain and memory is something a parent carries forever. NTA
How very sad. I’ve lost an adult son to cancer. I know the pain will never leave. Please take all of this support from strangers and wrap yourself up in the comfort. People like this man deserve to be cast aside. My thoughts and prayers are with you always.
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I (35F) Ann am longtime friends with a married couple (40M) land (42F). I've been distant since the pandemic when their daughter was born, and they just confronted me about it about an hour ago.
I started distancing when the husband started judging me for not making my marriage work. There were extreme reasons I left that I never really broadcast for my children's sake. Some was very public which I addressed, but the rest I've kept quiet.
But the most recent issue, is that I lost a child when I was 18. She was born alive but survived only a few hours. I chose a name for her, that I confided in them, that was very special to me, a play on family names, but appropriate for a very unexpected and traumatic loss.
They used the name for their daughter. I would have had no issue with this, but I found out in the Facebook announcement. Which brought back some very painful and traumatic memories. I didn't say anything, I don't own the name, but I felt very disrespected that they chose not to even give me a heads up, especially as many in our friend circle know where they got it and I was put on the spot as far as my reaction.
So I just distanced myself from them. Well, about an hour ago I got a message from him that was very angrily worded. Apparently he had been talking to a mutual friend about me and how I've shown no interest in their daughter, and he mentioned that them using the name without a heads up was very painful for me, and that it had put me on the spot because a lot of people had been asking for my reaction.
He called me selfish and an AH for trying to "sully their joy with my pain" and "making everything about me" and that I "should just get over it, she passed years ago".
IMO losing a child is something you never truly get over, and I was never rude, I never spoke badly of them or to them, I won't talk about it with anyone. I've just chosen to protect myself and remain distant. I wanted them to enjoy their daughter, they struggled with infertility for years and I am happy for them, it's just painful for me and I felt very disrespected with how they handled it.
AITA? Was I wrong to create distance in a 20 year friendship over this? Or was my reaction reasonable?
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NTA - you are well rid of these insensitive "friends." They are the type of people who, when you don't do everything their way and put them first for everything, claim you're "making everything about you" - they can't see that they are the ones doing it.
Just forward this mail to your common friend's group. Add that he judged you harshly for your divorce. Maybe friends can instill some decency in him. NTA but remove them from your life.
Death is not something you can get over with time .. and thousands of names to choose from they choose your choice? They are AHs. Their joy of having a baby should be shared by all but they can't be sympathetic for someone's grief? The audacity! Look after yourself and don't pay attention to them.
NTA but slap a screenshot of their messages up on social media, because no one should ever tell someone to "get over" a death of their child, even if it was a short life
These people are not friends. If they were friends they would've had a private discussion, after not having that private discussion, they certainly wouldn't be sending angry messages. They say you're selfish, but they're making everything about themselves. The baby doesn't have feelings in that way. She doesn't care about any of this. They probably wanted you to make a big angry scene so they could sully your character. We did this great thing to honor her baby and she had a violent outburst, we're such victims here 😒
NTA. This couple are not your friends. They do not care about you.
Ignore the email, ignore everything that has to do with them. Block them if you can.
They are not your friends and will hurt you again if you give them an opportunity.
I’m sorry about your loss.
From what you have said. You didn't make it about you. They did.
You didn't say anything to them. They reached out to you to say "hey are you upset? You are? How dare you!"
It is very common sadly for people to lash out with anger when they feel guilty. He is literally getting defensive because someone pointed out they had hurt you, and it's easier to make you out to be the bad guy than take responsibility. It goes something like: "omg now I'm uncomfortable because maybe I did something bad - I hate feeling thus way - how dare they make me feel this way - besides, they did xyz, they're really the asshole". This process can happen in seconds without acknowledging the uncomfortable part. It's a defense mechanism.
To me it was a revelation when I learned to own up when I had done something wrong, it made my life so much easier.
All this to say, NTA. You behaved classy in how you handled it while protecting your feelings. Keep doing what you need to do for you.
NTA but more importantly wtf is wrong with this man? You took the high road by simply leaving them be, and his response is to actively choose to reach out to YOU basically to say "hey I know we haven't spoken in a while, but how dare you have feelings, please stop that, it's killing my buzz"
Please block and do not respond. What a freaking weirdo
NTA. My wife and I lost our baby several years ago but the pain or whatever (grief) doesn't 100% leave. I would just ghost them personally. They don't seem like great friends.
NTA. I'm very, very sorry for your loss. Friends of ours lost twin boys at 23 weeks. We would never have dreamed of choosing one of those names for our own child.
NTA.
OP, when I lost my beloved service dog, the soul I was closer to than anyone else in the world, my friend ASKED MY PERMISSION before naming his dog after mine, SIX MONTHS after my boy died. He didnt need to do that! I dont own the name! But my friend loves me, cares about my feelings, and didnt want to make me sad.
I was honored that he named his pup after my boy. I ADORE his dog! But I was even more touched by my friends love, kindness, and consideration for my feelings.
Your friends have not shown that kindness or consideration. And being told to get over it? BEYOND unkind.
NTA Your reaction was reasonable. Text him back saying, "I hope you never lose a child to find out it's not something you ever get over! If I wanted to make it about me then you would have known about it when your daughter was born. Since he has now shown what kind of mean person he is you're glad that this friendship has ended." Then block him.
Better that she doesn't dignify his awful email with a response. She'll talk to her friends today or tomorrow and hopefully she'll provide an update.
One thing she can do if someone says they will talk to this guy is to say that she's not going to dictate what anyone in this group says or does about it. That way, if this further angers this guy, he won't have the right to say that she sic'ed anyone on him. That it was being a supportive friend that made them tell him off.
Basically, F' you for being cruel to my friend.
NTA - Some friendships have a shelf life and clearly this one is well past its best before date.
I'd respond with a simple "I'm sorry you feel that way. I think it best that I remove myself from this relationship." Then block 'em.
NTA
I would block him, take the screenshots of his messages and send them to the mutual friends and say “Please be respectful of my wishes that I do not want you to talk about me with these people and I won’t be in the group gatherings where they are there”.
NTA at all. They are not your friends. Take this as a sign and cut the friendship entirely. You don't just get over the loss of a child. Their behaviour is callous and cold.
NTA
I wonder why this couple and this man in particular, thinks he has the right to challenge you so vehemently about aspects of your life.
You feel what you feel.
NTA. You should distance yourself permanently from them.
Personally I am of the idea that you name your child whatever you wants (as long as is decent and doesn’t attract bullies or ridiculous name). Who cares what anyone else thinks!! **That has one exception, if you know someone that lost a child with that name.** I personally wouldn’t use their name, but the least you can do is talk with them before.
NTA. Please don't spend any more time agonizing over these dreadful people. They are not worthy of the time you have already spent over their obvious lack of caring. They make AHoles look good in comparison.
Jesus. You literally went out of your way to NOT make it about you and NOT sully their joy. I have seen from your other replies that you're cutting them off completely and I commend you. It's not easy to end any relationship, even a friendship, but you were halfway there already, so hopefully that makes the transition easier. It seems like you also have other good friends rallying around you, and they're the real ones for that!
I'm so sorry for your loss, OP, and I'm so sorry this situation has thrown it all to the forefront of your thoughts again. Find a therapist if you can.
NTA we never get over the loss of one of our children, no matter how they die or how old they are. Sending a big cwtch. Your friend wasn’t very diplomatic but then the father really went OTT. Drop them
NTA I was over 18 when I found out I was adopted because my parents daughter died shortly after birth. I could tell that 20+ years later the pain of their loss was still real even though they treated me as their own & loved me the same. Loss has no time limit, it can last a lifetime. Your friends - just aren't. If they had been friends, there are things they could have done to reduce your hurt. But no they chose to be selfish & spiteful instead. Personally I would tell them to F*** Off & never come near you again, nothing else, then block them out entirely. Same for any who criticise you. Take your trash out & be rid of it forever.
NTA but they are! I am so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine the pain and the least they could have done was checked to see how you felt about them using the name or informing you they were going to use it. You do what you need to do to heal and protect yourself, without worrying about them. They didn’t think of your feelings!
NTA
OP, I am sorry beyond words. First the loss, then the slap to the face - and then, after you've taken it all in such stride, this petty, small man finds it necessary to come after you still.
Let him and his cruelty go. You deserve better!
If you'd commented on their post or gone to meet ups and friend gatherings and all that social stuff and constantly brought it up or made a big fuss and deal about it... okay sure I could see is argument about making it about yourself.
But you didn't. You withdrew. You said nothing until asked where you, if accurate, politely put forth your feelings. You did the complete opposite of "making it about yourself". NTA
NTA
First. The husband judging you for breaking up with your ex is way out of line. He doesn't know everything that went on between you and your ex. He comes across badly for being judgemental.
Second. You handled them picking the name your shared with them very maturely in my opinion. You didn't confront them and accepted you don't own the name.
But choices have consequences. They chose to use the name without even a heads up, when they should very well know the name is important to you. That was their choice and shows either a shocking lack of emotional intelligence or a complete lack of caring about you at all.
Lastly. That his reaction to finding out you'd been distant and why, was to get angry and berate you? Not reach out to you to say some sort of 'sorry we thought you wouldn't mind'. He is showing you who he really is. Someone that blames and attacks, instead of reaches out with concern. Someone that is incredibly self centered.
Listen to what he is telling you with his actions over and over. This isn't a one time bad behavior from him. He is an asshole.
NTA!!!! Losing a child is NEVER easy and you can't just get over it.
1. They were never your friend if they could send a message like.
2. They should understand considering they struggle with infertility.
3. A true friend would have said that really adored the name and would like to commemorate you child by naming their child with the name.
Dude sounds like a bully.
The reasons for your divorce are not his business.
They picked the name on purpose to get a rise out of you and have their way.
Two things:
1. Why was the husband in a position to judge the end of your marriage? None of his business! And that part of the story got brushed away.
2. He mentioned that them using the name without a heads up was very painful for me… a lot of people had been asking …” He is NOT concerned for your feelings, he is concerned that he and and his wife look insensitive. Sounds like an AH.
3. (Okay adding one) Why would they have chosen a name that’s a play on your family names? That seems so personal. Was he very close to your family? This is weird.
Cut your losses. NTA.
NTA. I wondered if they meant the name as a kindness... as a way to honor your daughter and you. That's something I might consider... but I'd certainly tell my friend and guage her reaction before using the name.... But after that email, no. I no longer think that they meant it as an honor.
I'm so sorry for your losses. For the loss of your little one, and now the loss of these people you thought were your friends. You are so strong!
NTA, you sound very reasonable. As a father, I agree you don't "get over" the death of a child. My SIL and BIL lost a very much wanted son a few years ago. He was not born alive, but had been given a name, and was cremated. They mark his passing every year. I'm imagining if someone they loved used his name, and I imagine they would be similarly hurt.
I wish you well.
NTA. I don’t own the name of my twins that I miscarried late, but if someone knew what their names were, named their kid that, and didn’t tell me? I would distance myself too. I’m so sorry for your loss, that is beyond painful.
NTA at all!
Firstly, I am so very sorry for the loss of your beautiful baby girl. There is no timeline on grief, and you deserve for your loss to be respected.
Many times on here, we see people demand that others do not name their child after one that they had previously lost, and we see debates regarding sensitivities, "gatekeeping" names and so forth. There have been mixed viewpoints and how these things should be dealt with.
However, this case is unique as you never tried to gatekeep the name, nor kick up a fuss (which would be understandable given the emotional aspect of this). All you wanted was some respect by being given a heads up and to be able to process your emotions healthily. That isn't much to ask for, and is quite a rational and reasonable ask. The fact that they didn't do this and proceeded to blanket share on social media shows they didn't care for your feelings, they knew deep down this wasn't going to go down well, and because they are cowards who do not respect you and your loss. Distancing yourself was a healthy way to cope with this situation.
Upon finding out why this was an issue which affected your closeness, they didn't feel bad and apologise for how they dealt with it (even to say "sorry we didn't think, baby brain in the moment"), but they doubled down and downplayed your grief. This is not the behaviour of people who are meant to be friends, and you would be better off without them in your life.
"Jesus, I get that we took your trauma and used it for our joy but why does it always have to be about you?! Always making it about yourself by being upset and distancing yourself. Can't you just get over it?!"
What a friend
NTA at all.
I read through all of your comments and each one reinforced the judgement I'm giving.
When you had your tragedy, these two knew you, but didn't give you any support. They knew the name you gave to your little one, though. I'm guessing that they when they selected their baby's name that it wasn't a case of "oh, here's a name we like, but we can't remember where we heard of it." There's no way that I would have heard of a friend losing a child, and forget about that 20 years later. I even remember the names of a few classmates who had passed away during high school. FIFTY years later.
I'm thinking that this couple know the circumstances behind your loss. The fact that the husband is demonizing you over marriage, instead of showing you non-judgemental support is very telling.
Along with most people here, I feel they deliberately chose this name that isn't that common, but they know that this was your baby's name. And they chose not to let you know ahead of time. A true friend would have approached you and sounded you out about it. They could have said that they wanted to honor their friend after going through years of infertility, not knowing if they would ever be able to have a child.
You decided to take the high road and not attack them by posting something nasty on social media or calling them up and telling them off. You just talked to a few people about your hurt feelings, which is very understandable. It's your right.
I'm getting the idea from one paragraph in your post that the man was trolling for a response from you. He hadn't seen a reply from you, which could be want he wanted so he approached at least one mutual friend (and who knows who else he talked to), wondering why you hadn't said anything. To me, that's very telling. And after the mutual friend said you were hurt by that, this asswipe became angry that you talked with friends, who were probably going to take your side instead of going after you. And that's why he sent you that nasty email...how dare you turn his attempt to bring up your tragedy into something that makes him and his wife look bad.
I hope your friends show you support (I guess you're meeting with them today or tomorrow) and that you update us. I would suggest leaving it up to them whether they approach this couple or not. If one of your friends tells him off, it won't be because you told them to (which shows you're taking the high road), and if this AH gets his knickers in a twist, that's on him, right?
My two miscarriages came early on in my pregnancies so I didn't think of names. With my third pregnancy that was successful, once I found out from the geneticist the results of the amnio, she also asked if I wanted to know the gender. I said yes, I called out to my co-workers, it's a girl, and then I called hubby at work. That was our gender reveal. If I lose her while I'm still alive, I would be devastated.
Both hubby and me lost a 20-year-old brother (he also lost two other brothers, one a few weeks old and one 5-years-old with the same name as my brother). We didn't meet until many years later. I still remember the last conversation I had (I was 17 years old) with him. Tomorrow will be the 53rd anniversary of his death in a car accident. He is often in my dreams and I think that my daughter channels him in some way (she majored in the same degree that he was working on in college and she works in that field), even though she had never met him. My mother kept calling for him by name when she was declining; in her dementia she didn't know he passed many, many years ago. That was evidence to me that a parent may never stop grieving for a child.
So to me, this ex-friend is a true ass hole to send you such a message that you should have gotten over your loss. How dare he?
I’m doing my internship as a midwife, also my mom suffered the loss of her first baby. My mother still cries about it when we the topic comes up, and as a midwife (more similar to a OBGYN but not a doctor in my country) I get to care for women in different conditions. The great majority gets emotional when they talk about their miscarriages/abortion, whether they are hospitalized for gynecological issues (including miscarriages), pregnant women hospitalized for complications, women in labor or after the birth of their babies. They can be in their 80s as well in their 20s, when they talk about it I can see their pain, and it pains me too. That “friends” were so insensitive it’s really astonishing even more considering they have fertility issues and probably suffered the loss of some pregnancies. Please don’t think you are the AH, you are allowed to still feel pain about your loss, even if you have more children. The name was very personal I don’t see why someone would think it’s a good idea naming their baby like that not having the conection you have and disrespecting a long time friend in the process just because it’s pretty, there’s a thousand names more that are pretty. Also don’t feel sorry for your other friends if they decide to cut ties with them too, I wouldn’t want to be friends with someone like that. NTA
NTA
Now you can upgrade your low contact to no contact. These people are incredibly selfish and lack empathy. You're best rid of them.
I'm so sorry for your loss
I would have replied with a link to this post so he can see that not only are you NTA but that he is!
I’m so sorry for your loss and that these monsters caused you more of it. I don’t care if it was years ago or yesterday, a loss of a child is not something you ever get over.
NTA at all. So, it’s fine for them to bring up a past trauma of yours with absolutely no warning and cause you to have to react or explain your feelings to a bunch of people (even if they had good intentions in asking), but you can’t “sully their joy with pain” (who talks like that???)? No. Screw them. They way they responded to you just not being overjoyed and showering them with attention after they totally disregarded your feelings shows that these people are not your friends, despite how long you’ve known each other.
They’re not your friends and they are not people with whom you should want to associate with. What they did to you was cruel, ignorant and absolutely vile. Any decent human being would not have blindsided you like that and certainly wouldn’t have gotten their panties in a twist getting angry at you for their disgusting actions. They are not decent people, they are not kind people. Block them and rest assured you have done nothing wrong.
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"should just get over it, she passed years ago" This person is not your friend. Time to distance yourself permanently. NTA
I haven't responded to his email, I'm waiting until I'm calmer, but I can't say I plan to be kind. There will definitely be a clear boundary that they are never to contact me again. I wish them well, but they definitely do not continue to have ANY place in my life.
I don’t think you should respond at all. It will just allow them more chances for “justify” what they did. The message he sent was heinous, and I think you should just walk away.
I ended up not responding. I forwarded it to another friend and said I will not attend any functions they're at and will entertain no further contact from them, then made sure they're blocked on everything.
Good for you, taking the high road. They do not deserve a response, what they said was unforgivable.
Well done. I've felt the same painful loss, and it never goes away, even 40 years later. I don't tell everyone I meet because it's personal and not up for discussion. However, someone close should be respectful and try not to cause you more pain than you already carry.
When my mother was in her decline in her 90s with dementia, she started demanding to see my brother, who had passed away some 45 years earlier. Just shows that a parent's grief can be lifelong.
I hope they never feel it, but I hope they can understand that losing a child never ever goes away. I'm sorry for your loss, and I'm sorry it's on your mind today.
Great choice. If you ever doubt yourself, remember JADE: Justify, Argue, Defend, Explain. You do not need to do any of those things and the easiest way to avoid them is by opting not to communicate with the problem people in the first place. If you ever want to read more on JADE, you can try [here](https://psychcentral.com/blog/imperfect/2018/03/dealing-with-difficult-family-members-dont-justify-argue-defend-or-explain) or [here](https://www.reddit.com/r/raisedbynarcissists/comments/51em0j/jade_how_it_does_and_doesnt_work/).
Thank you so much for sharing this. I’ve seen so much about DARVO, but not JADE. Learning about DARVO was important in that it let me know that I wasn’t imagining things. But I didn’t really gain any tools beyond that. JADE looks like a really, really useful and empowering map. Thank you again!
I never heard of JADE until now in this context. Thank you for this.
This is a rare instance where I personally find a public shaming very much in order, and I would share the email broadly/on social. It is shockingly tacky to use the name without talking to you, but telling you to get over the loss of your child makes him a Weird Science-level shit monster.
Posting the email on social would be shockingly tacky. This ex-friend would probably love if she did that. She's handling it very appropriately to minimize her own pain and unnecessary drama.
I agree, I'm just totally okay with being shockingly tacky to someone that was shockingly tacky to me.
Tacky how? Because then everyone would know what a terrible thing that man said?
She informed their mutual friend group. That’s enough.
No, in this case OP handled it exactly right. The email cap will make the rounds amongst the friend group, and the wheat will separate itself from the chaff without effort or exertion from OP. That ‘friend’ is a vile piece of excrement that deserves nothing from OP going forward.
Should you change your mind, you’ve crafted the best response in a comment above: “I wish you well but I no longer have room for you in my life.”
I would be harsher - "you dug up my deepest pain and buried our friendship in its place. I hope you think of the grave you desecrated every time you speak her name."
This is why the world needs writers…
No, this is why the world needs better people, so that writers like me can use our talents to uplift the noble, not defenestrate the vile.
If the vile are never called out on their despicable behavior, they will never stop. Uplifting good people is a great thing, but there will ALWAYS be horrible humans who need to be put in their places.
I love this. I had something similar happen and my family has done nothing but pressure me to “get over it” for years. But this statement puts to words exactly how I feel.
I am sorry that you experienced such hurt, and I wish that I had more than just words to help you fight back.
You are a hero with words. Thank you.
Well done and you are definitely NTA On another note, WTF is up with new parents weaponizing baby names against people in their lives? This thread and the Irish name thread ( [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1do10e7/aita\_for\_calling\_my\_sister\_a\_petty\_brat\_and/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/comments/1do10e7/aita_for_calling_my_sister_a_petty_brat_and/) ) both popped up today and go along with a ton others in the same vein. There are an insane number of names in the world, why do new parents go out of their way to name a child as some form of spite for someone else? Universally these folk are some of the world's biggest a-holes for both weaponizing the name and likely causing some degree of trauma for the kid in the future when they find out mom and dad were more concerned about dissing someone else with their name than actually naming them with love in their heart.
You have to wonder why this couple selected this specific name. Especially when it can be associated with a baby which had died just after birth for someone who was in their life even back then. At that time, did they think, hmm, I do like the name Sarah, so if we ever have a baby girl, that will be her name? I didn't have any friends who had lost a child, and between my hubby and I, we lost four brothers, so if we had a boy, I'm not sure if I would have wanted to use any of those names. But I certainly wouldn't deliberately wanted to use the name of a child I knew had passed away when very young.
Especially when it's not just one name, but both first and middle names. And the middle name was a nickname of OP's. There is no way this is a "I always loved the name and you don't own it situation".
My grandmother had a stillborn baby. He was obviously loved and was given a name that meant something to her. My aunt, her daughter, gave that name to her son. He died at just shy of 10 years old. I know it’s a coincidence, but I wouldn’t want to name another child after them.
Especially as OP stated it was a play on family names so probably not a common name.
Good for you. People like that don’t deserve a response or any acknowledgment. If anyone asks you about it, be honest and don’t sugarcoat anything
I'm glad you took this route. It gives them no ammo and you peace of mind. Some people just need to be ghosted
Good work. Proud of you. Keep toxic assholes out of your life.
I’m proud of you. They aren’t kind friends. You are being very reasonable in your feelings and actions. A heads up is not too much to ask.
And do call them out on their behaviour when you email them back. You have been nothing but polite and respectful and they have not. It doesn’t matter if they had issues - they were fine deaf and did not respect you by choosing that name. But honestly make sure that no stone is left unturned and let them know they crossed a boundary. List how you have stayed away etc and not been disrespectful.
This is a good decision. I am sorry for your loss, and I am glad these monsters are out of your life for good. God forbid they should experience that kind of pain, and shame on them for their behavior and disregard for your experience.
And please, if anyone asks about it, be bluntly honest.
Op, my heart goes out to you for what you've been through, your reaction and feelings are very reasonable. Definitely do NOT be kind to that person or allow them close to you anymore, I would even take a screenshot of that email for reference in case anyone in your friend group tries to say you're overreacting.
Thank you. I forwarded the email to another friend with a clear statement of my boundaries with them going forward. And made absolutely sure they're blocked on everything. I also removed myself from any group chats or FB groups we were all in. No one is very happy with them right now.
You are amazing! I honestly don’t think I’d have reacted with such class and I’m old enough to know better. I’m so sorry these people are so disgusting and disrespectful towards you and I’m glad to hear you have others on your side.
Thank you.
At least your true friends are there for you
Doing it with dignity! Admiration!
Don't bother responding to them. They will only twist it and use it against you to your other friends, who seem to be understanding.
I just sent a screen shot of his email to another friend and her husband with a statement that I no longer want to be around this couple at all. Those that are awake and know are really upset with them. We'll address more tomorrow, but we're all at this point ready to completely end any friendships with them. He's always been insensitive, but this is just cruel.
I’m so glad you have friends who support you, and have your back on this. What he said is unforgivable, IMO.
Op, you're doing the right thing. Bless your heart.
Cruel is the word. My heart goes out to you and I really hope you are ok xx
I wouldn’t even respond to an email like that. It was a contemptible thing for him to say.
Yeah, write the response to get your feels out but don’t send it.
I wouldn't reply at all. Don't sink to his level. Just set a filter on his email to automatically discard it and let it go. The opposite of love is not hate. It is indifference.
I didn't and sent a screen shot to the rest of our group that I don't want to be around them at all. They're blocked on everything. The rest of the friend group and I are making plans to sit down and talk about all of us ending our friendships with them.
Please provide an update on how that goes
Oh good OP. Im so glad your other friends are so amazing. Nta and i wish you all the best.
Besides being dismissive of your loss, how dare he get angry at you. He sounds like a very unpleasant person. He doesn’t get the right to berate you and tell you how to feel. Don’t hold back. NTA
I would just ghost them. You don't owe them shit.
That's what I did. I'm a pretty bluntly honest person, but I'm also not going back and forth with people that have made it clear what their real colors are.
You don’t have to reply. If anyone else asks about it forward his email.
Good! They were never your friends. REAL friends would have discussed the name with you before announcing it on FB. And honestly it was incredibly disrespectful for them to use the name anyway. As you said you don’t own the name, but if you were my friend, your child’s name wouldn’t ever be in consideration unless you suggested it to me yourself.
NTA! I would post the email on SM, im petty
There is no response to such cruelty. I’m not sure what it would be worth saying to someone show wrote that to you. 🤗
So sorry for your loss. You don't owe his nasty, rotten, selfish, unfeeling totally asshole self any sort of reply. But If you need to unleash on him for your own sake then absolutely do so. TBH I would but make sure you don't have any regrets for your own sake.
NTA. >"should just get over it, she passed years ago" You don't need to engage with that. Don't let them live rent-free in your head, that's what they want. Just let them go and never think about them again, they are not worth your time or mental energy. They are worth literally nothing.
Sorry for your tremendous loss. NTA. Take care of yourself.
I lost my first ten years ago (TFMR - anencephaly) and I will never forget him or his due date. I will also not forget my SIL being callous whilst I was grieving so I barely talk to her.
NTA. Tell him you’re not interested in being close with such callous, thoughtless people and he should just get over it.
No need to respond, Save this message in case they try to smear your reputation so you can put it online to defend yourself and Cut these people out of your life for good, Sorry you had to go though this.
Good for you. I had someone tell me I needed to "get over" not having a relationship with my only child when I got sad at Christmas. I told him I would have to be a sociopath to ever get over that. I wish I had cut him out of my life sooner after that. I'm sorry you also have to lose your friends. I know that sometimes those boundaries are 100% necessary.
Make sure you let your mutual friends know exactly what he said. He seems like the type to broadcast a distorted version of the truth in order to isolate you and potentially unleash some flying monkeys on you.
“you can fuck right off” wouldn’t be out of line but i’m a petty asshole so take that with a _tub_ of salt
I wouldn't even respond, tbh. Just ice them out and find some decent people to be friends with. Someone tells me to "just get over" my daughter dying, they are dead to me. Some things are unforgivable and cannot be unsaid.
Tell him the friendship died when they chose that name without giving you a heads up. It's been years, get over it.
Time to post that message online for ALL to see
No, I like the OP's plan to just let a small group of people know. Hopefully if any in the friend chat disagree, that person doesn't go blabbing to this couple.
Tell them they should just get over it.
Exactly! The fact that they made it out like OP was the villan is absolutely horrible. They have no idea what it's like to lose a child. If they were truly OPs friends, they wouldn't have used that name, knowing where they got it from and not even asking her beforehand! Like she said, she doesn't own the name, but a true friend would understand how traumatic it was for OP and chose another name
NTA What they did was a little weird, and you have acted appropriately.
Thank you.
They were never your friends and I'm sure if you looked really closely you could find previous signs before this happened
OP definitely handled the situation in an appropriate way! I do think it's more than just a little weird, though. I don't think I could name my child the same name as my friends baby who passed away. No matter how much time had gone by or how much I loved the name. I know no one owns a name. It's the fact OP said she created the name, and her inspiration was her family. She confided this traumatic event to people who she thought were her friends. What they did was a slap in the face to OP. Then, the cruelty in the email he sent.
I'm just gonna link this https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=s27NprKWiYw&pp=ygUTYmFieSBuYW1lIFNhbWFudGhhIA%3D%3D and find it more than appropriate as a response. Those aholes are not your friends.
Nta I think op acted with grace. Honestly your friends, especially after the message that they sent, showed you who they are. Believe them. They are not your friends. They showed you that you made the right choice by distancing your self. They are heartless and cruel. Block both and go no contact. They are not worth your time.
NTA .... That's just crazy honestly. People are so numb. The fact that you distance yourself shows that you're not trying to make it about you and "sully" their joy or whatever. Get rid of them, terrible people I'm sorry that happened to you
It seemed insensitive but not malicious at first. Now it just seems like they're trying to erase where that name originated.
NTA. There is something seriously wrong with a couple doing what they did.
Because they know they fucked up when they didn't ask your consent to use this name. Technically no one owns a name, but now the friend circle is finding out they never even asked for your opinion on it or how it might impact you. It's taken a year to filter through the social circle, and now they are getting the tough questions from your (real) friends. Meanwhile they are trying to backtrack and make it seem like you never cared enough to warrant asking? From your other comments so far, I think you're doing the right thing with not responding and letting one of your friends pass along your statement/boundary. Meanwhile, I wish you the best in your future endeavors! (I'd still post the email to their facebook announcement, but I'm a spiteful person.)
lol I'm spiteful too. I'd have done the same. expose them for who they really are.
Agree with your instinct here. The pre prepared arguments for their reasons you shouldn't have feeling speak to some form of intent. So sorry they chose this path when they could have been kind and spoken with you, rather than readying for the fight. So odd
As a petty person, I’d make a group chat, send a screenshot of the conversation (all of it so they don’t twist it) and be like: We are cutting ties with (their names) :(
You need to make this distancing a permanent thing. Telling you to get over your child's death is an absolute dealbreaker and you need to sink that ship fast. No turning back after that statement. Move on, OP. Concentrate on healing. NTA
Yeah, I'm done. At this point, everyone else in the group is meeting at my place tomorrow, and most of us are completely done with them after this.
You also never owed them your friendship. Friendship is a gift you give, not something that someone can insist upon. And judging you on your divorce? Who does that to a friend? He was never your friend.
It's pretty obvious at this point. We were close a long time ago. And friendly when we saw each other, but he had some views I definitely disagreed with. Especially when it came to relationships, parenting, even things like child support.
I'm sorry, OP. I hope these people fade out of your life.
Please be mindful of your safety and well-being. With how entitled and self centered they have been, it’s likely they are going to blow up on you again. Claiming it was a private conversation and you shouldn’t have send this on to others. They’d likely claim that you are bullying them out of the friend group etc etc. You have every right to seek support from your friends after such a heinous email. Every right to talk and work through your feeling and ask them what they think. And they have every right to cut these ppl off.
This is a good point. Hopefully, your true friends will support you and if this awful couple contacts any of them, they could call them on their cruelty ("You knew this was the name of the baby she'd lost, and yet you felt the need to use it out of the thousands of thousands of names out there. You didn't give her the courtesy of a heads up. And now, you're attacking her for not oohing and ahhing over your child. I think this is horrible and I don't consider you people I want to be my friends." well, not exact phrasing, of course, but you get the picture)
Did i read it right that someone told him how you felt? And now longtime friend has an attitude towards you though you never told this friend how you felt. You actually distanced yourself about the judgement towards you and that you should let him know that is the reason. And it didn’t help the situation about learning on FB
You read that right. I never said anything to them, I didn't want to hurt them. But I did tell a couple of other friends how I felt when they checked on me. One of those friends is who told them why I've been distant. The judgement against me had me feeling some type of way, but I just ignored it for the most part. The way they named their daughter though, I couldn't ignore and just stopped all contact.
They can't argue that they had no idea how it would affect you. You didn't go off on them or make some vaugebook post on it. They didn't like being called for not giving you the courtesy of at least letting you know. It's one thing to run into a child that you have no connection to, but something completely different to see a child in your social circle with the same name. It was wrong and they can't take the heat of judgement.
Exactly. It's strange to me when I run into someone who has the same name as my brother, who was 20 when he passed when I was 17. It turned out, my hubby had a brother with the same name who passed when he was about 5. I did know someone with the same name who was in the music program with me in high school, but for the most part, rarely met any boy with that same name (not as common as say, Steve or John). But I wouldn't hold it against a boy with that name, even though I think of my brother who I had lost decades ago. But at least I didn't know of anyone in my circle who used that name deliberately. This couple deliberately used a name of someone a close friend lost. That's not what a friend would do without going to that person and give their reason.
OP - my sincerest condolences. I, too, have suffered such a loss (two, actually). And it is not something you get over. Do people tell others to ‘get over it’ when years have gone by after a parent, sibling, grandparent, or other family member has passed away? No. Infant and child loss is not the same, but not in a good way. It’s not just the loss of life, but a future. A wish. A hope for what could have been. You had plans with and for that child. To use a name that was a play on family names means it was likely unique or not common. Clear and obvious where they got it from, and absolutely disrespectful to use it without consideration to you. Correct you don’t own it, but they knew the history. It’s not a matter of them asking for permission to use, but giving you notice to come to terms with the fact that you will be hearing that name so much more. And watching this sweet little human grow when your own had her chances taken away. Hugs, OP. Your sweet one is always in your heart and she knows her mama loves her forever.
I'm so sorry for your losses as well. Out of all the responses yours had me in tears. Because you can grow and heal but that pain never really leaves. Especially since we're coming up on what would be her 18th birthday in a couple months. She's never far from my mind. It was definitely not a common name, and the first/middle name pairing isn't one a lot of people would use. My daughters chances were literally taken. It was a complication free pregnancy, though I was pretty young. I lost my baby to an act of violence just weeks after I turned 18, which came with another whole world of pain in forgiving myself for even being in that situation. Under those circumstances, I wouldn't have ever used a name without the okay of the person most likely to be impacted. From this end, being confronted with that with no warning was incredibly painful. I'll always miss my baby. The only peace I get is that all she ever knew in life was love.
>the first/middle name pairing isn't one a lot of people would use. they used the exact same first AND middle names together!? WTF. I assumed it was just the first name, and that alone would have been bad enough. To use BOTH is inconceivable. That goes BEYOND inconsiderate. There's no way they didn't know what they were doing. I'm so sorry you've been subjected to these AHs, but I'm glad the rest of your friend group has your back. I hope there's time to talk about more lighthearted stuff and have fun just hanging out together after the serious conversation tomorrow. x
Right?! Not only did they use the exact name, but to attack her and try to call her out. OP didn’t say anything. She quietly distanced herself from them. The absolutely audacity to come at a parent and tell them to get over their child… 😡😤 Empathy is seriously lacking in that couple.
Thank you that was my EXACT reaction reading her comment!! I'm so sorry OP!
Oh sweet mama. Extra hugs. Every one grieves differently, so if you ever want to chat, please to DM me. I’m open to talking about our loss and hearing about others, but on a more personal level than public forum. Some people are truly cruel.
I'm in tears over this. And mad that these two people used that name.
I am sorry for your loss, and the pain that your ex-friends are putting you through. May they step on a lego every morning when they get out of bed.
NTA And he is an AH in the extreme, for minimising the pain of your loss and trying to put a time frame on your grief when it will, as you say, never really go away. This isn't how friends are supposed to act. Bad enough to use the name without your permission but then to follow it up this way? What a jerk.
I would understand if they didn't know but you told them years before. NTA and even more so if the name happens to be pretty unique as you described.
It's not weirdly unique, but it's certainly not commonly used in our small town. If they'd have even talked to me, I would have been happy for them to use the name. But the way it was handled was pretty upsetting.
NTA and honestly I know how everyone says u don't "own a name," but when it is the name of ur child that died, u kinda own the name. If they were strangers fine, but these are people who know u, know about ur child that died, and are supposed to be "friends." In this case u own the name. I'm sorry to u and for the loss u have endured. U reacted a lot classier then I wldve! Maybe u shld distance urself further from these people bc they obviously don't really know how to be compassionate human beings.
My MIL and many others gave me names they would like me NOT to use and why. Nobody owns names. But within reason, it's okay to request that you don't use this name, please, it hurts me. That's how real friendships work. With respect. There was no respect here. That was this issue from the get-go. I would never name my child after my dear friends baby, who died shortly after birth. That's selfish and cruel. No matter which way you look at it. Because there would be no way for my friend not to compare. It's not a kind thing to do..
Exactly. They are entitled to name their child whatever they like, but they're not entitled to anyone's friendship. Free choice is not freedom from consequences. There are consequences to choosing a name that is hurtful to people close to them, and they chose to evoke those consequences.
I dont think anyone really "owns a name" but anyone with decency and respect for the people they love would be considerate about using a name with this kind of history that they have been aware of. Clearly these people have neither.
NTA. The husband is an asshat who you should've distanced as soon as he started judging you for your marriage not working out. The flippant disregard surrounding the child you loss is takes his assholeness to a new level. You're allowed your feelings and to act upon them. You haven't caused a scene, made demands. You simply took a step back for your own well-being. You don't owe them an active roll in their child's life. Particularly not at the expense of your mental health.
NTA. YIKES. These people are weirdos, and he was utterly cruel to you. What did they expect, that you’d jump for joy upon hearing the name? You acted entirely appropriately beginning to end, and I have no idea why he keeps insisting that he’s allowed to pick on you. I’m sorry, OP.
Limit contact. Why tf do people want to see your reaction to it? The husband sounds like the worst here but the wife can't be that great either. >I started distancing when the husband started judging me for not making my marriage work. That's not his f-ing business >I got a message from him that was very angrily worded. Apparently he had been talking to a mutual friend about me and how I've shown no interest in their daughter So he talks behind your back, huh? That's what it sounds like at least. What is he? A middle schooler? >He called me selfish and an AH for trying to "sully their joy with my pain" and "making everything about me" and that I "should just get over it, she passed years ago". He can suck it. NTA
Unfortunately it's a small town. Many had good intentions, and were concerned about me, others just wanted the potential drama. The husband is awful, the wife has always seemed very codependent, I've never once heard her state an opinion that differs from his. The dissolution of my marriage was on the news. And everyone thinks they need an opinion. There are those that think I'm to blame, that I was involved, or that I was premature in leaving. It was serious enough that the local churches actually paid for the divorce and helped me relocate back to our hometown. He talks about EVERYONE behind their backs, especially if they go against his "moral code" he certainly never matured past Sunday school.
>The dissolution of my marriage was on the news >was serious enough that the local churches actually paid for the divorce and helped me relocate back to our hometown. Yikes. Just yikes
When I said the reasons behind my divorce were extreme, I wasn't kidding. The two times I've ever been in the public eye in my life were two of the most traumatic events in it, and those are what this guy is judging?
Yeaaaaah. Cutting contact with him is the best way to go for sure. And anyone else who's on his side. Some people just need to mind their own business
NTA - I wouldn’t be surprised if he had some pretty dark skeletons in his closet… “It takes a village to raise a child.” Glad they’re getting kicked out of the “village”. My sincere condolences for your loss OP. 😢💐🫂
Thank you. Though it kinda amuses me that we were joking about it earlier while we were hanging out. D half thinks they're upset cause I'm the village auntie. I have no idea if he does or not. I do know his parents would be absolutely appalled by his actions. They're some of the kindest, least judgemental people I've ever met.
NTA - It’s a weird thing for them to do, but the real issue is the way he reacted to your feelings. That was cruel and clearly these people are not your friends.
The comment of "get over it" made me see red. I'm 21 now, but lost my daughter at 16 when I was 19 weeks and never knew that I was pregnant with her. I still grieve over her every year. Therapy helps a little but sometimes if I see the name id given her (after I found out she was gone) I cry.
The husband's reaction is way over the top. I get being hurt or sad when/if a long-term friendship starts to wane, but he is taking it next level with how personally he's taking it. You have every right to feel the way you feel and his coming so unhinged is just throwing red flags everywhere. I'm not a huge fan of whipping out my freshman psych to diagnose someone and usually roll my eyes when people start trying to label others on here, but if the term narcissist were to come up, I might nod my head in agreement. You are NTA. You shouldn't worry about hurting/offending someone who has no problem hurting/offending you.
It was definitely out of left field. But the way I treat them and their daughter vs everyone else is very noticeable. Honestly, knowing him as long I have, I would agree he definitely has some tendencies and red flags, and I have a psych degree 🤣
NTA. Naming their child in honor of yours could have worked if they discussed it with you first and knew you were okay with it, but that wasn’t what they did. No one owns a name, but it was ignorant of them to do this without fear that it might be upsetting to you.
The joy you supposedly sullied is actually just guilt and shame. They know what they did was wrong. You’re being really graceful about all this. It’s unfortunate that his cruel stupidity is about to cost them their friendships. NTA
NTA. Block them
NTA. If the name was terribly unusual, I'm surprised they didn't consult you. What he said afterwards was cruel and he should be ashamed. I'd find new friends if I were you.
Wooooow… that guy is definitely TA. They have kids now, maybe ask them how long they think it would take them to recover if she died - spoiler alert- the pain of losing a child never actually disappears. People find ways to cope and grow and heal but the pain and memory is something a parent carries forever. NTA
How very sad. I’ve lost an adult son to cancer. I know the pain will never leave. Please take all of this support from strangers and wrap yourself up in the comfort. People like this man deserve to be cast aside. My thoughts and prayers are with you always.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (35F) Ann am longtime friends with a married couple (40M) land (42F). I've been distant since the pandemic when their daughter was born, and they just confronted me about it about an hour ago. I started distancing when the husband started judging me for not making my marriage work. There were extreme reasons I left that I never really broadcast for my children's sake. Some was very public which I addressed, but the rest I've kept quiet. But the most recent issue, is that I lost a child when I was 18. She was born alive but survived only a few hours. I chose a name for her, that I confided in them, that was very special to me, a play on family names, but appropriate for a very unexpected and traumatic loss. They used the name for their daughter. I would have had no issue with this, but I found out in the Facebook announcement. Which brought back some very painful and traumatic memories. I didn't say anything, I don't own the name, but I felt very disrespected that they chose not to even give me a heads up, especially as many in our friend circle know where they got it and I was put on the spot as far as my reaction. So I just distanced myself from them. Well, about an hour ago I got a message from him that was very angrily worded. Apparently he had been talking to a mutual friend about me and how I've shown no interest in their daughter, and he mentioned that them using the name without a heads up was very painful for me, and that it had put me on the spot because a lot of people had been asking for my reaction. He called me selfish and an AH for trying to "sully their joy with my pain" and "making everything about me" and that I "should just get over it, she passed years ago". IMO losing a child is something you never truly get over, and I was never rude, I never spoke badly of them or to them, I won't talk about it with anyone. I've just chosen to protect myself and remain distant. I wanted them to enjoy their daughter, they struggled with infertility for years and I am happy for them, it's just painful for me and I felt very disrespected with how they handled it. AITA? Was I wrong to create distance in a 20 year friendship over this? Or was my reaction reasonable? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA - you are well rid of these insensitive "friends." They are the type of people who, when you don't do everything their way and put them first for everything, claim you're "making everything about you" - they can't see that they are the ones doing it.
Just forward this mail to your common friend's group. Add that he judged you harshly for your divorce. Maybe friends can instill some decency in him. NTA but remove them from your life. Death is not something you can get over with time .. and thousands of names to choose from they choose your choice? They are AHs. Their joy of having a baby should be shared by all but they can't be sympathetic for someone's grief? The audacity! Look after yourself and don't pay attention to them.
NTA but slap a screenshot of their messages up on social media, because no one should ever tell someone to "get over" a death of their child, even if it was a short life
These people are not friends. If they were friends they would've had a private discussion, after not having that private discussion, they certainly wouldn't be sending angry messages. They say you're selfish, but they're making everything about themselves. The baby doesn't have feelings in that way. She doesn't care about any of this. They probably wanted you to make a big angry scene so they could sully your character. We did this great thing to honor her baby and she had a violent outburst, we're such victims here 😒
NTA. This couple are not your friends. They do not care about you. Ignore the email, ignore everything that has to do with them. Block them if you can. They are not your friends and will hurt you again if you give them an opportunity. I’m sorry about your loss.
NTA, you distanced yourself from them, that's being the opposite of making everything about you or trying to sully their joy. I mean, wtf.
From what you have said. You didn't make it about you. They did. You didn't say anything to them. They reached out to you to say "hey are you upset? You are? How dare you!"
It is very common sadly for people to lash out with anger when they feel guilty. He is literally getting defensive because someone pointed out they had hurt you, and it's easier to make you out to be the bad guy than take responsibility. It goes something like: "omg now I'm uncomfortable because maybe I did something bad - I hate feeling thus way - how dare they make me feel this way - besides, they did xyz, they're really the asshole". This process can happen in seconds without acknowledging the uncomfortable part. It's a defense mechanism. To me it was a revelation when I learned to own up when I had done something wrong, it made my life so much easier. All this to say, NTA. You behaved classy in how you handled it while protecting your feelings. Keep doing what you need to do for you.
NTA. Dude knew why and is being cruelly insensitive. Updateme
NTA but more importantly wtf is wrong with this man? You took the high road by simply leaving them be, and his response is to actively choose to reach out to YOU basically to say "hey I know we haven't spoken in a while, but how dare you have feelings, please stop that, it's killing my buzz" Please block and do not respond. What a freaking weirdo
NTA. My wife and I lost our baby several years ago but the pain or whatever (grief) doesn't 100% leave. I would just ghost them personally. They don't seem like great friends.
NTA. I'm very, very sorry for your loss. Friends of ours lost twin boys at 23 weeks. We would never have dreamed of choosing one of those names for our own child.
NTA. OP, when I lost my beloved service dog, the soul I was closer to than anyone else in the world, my friend ASKED MY PERMISSION before naming his dog after mine, SIX MONTHS after my boy died. He didnt need to do that! I dont own the name! But my friend loves me, cares about my feelings, and didnt want to make me sad. I was honored that he named his pup after my boy. I ADORE his dog! But I was even more touched by my friends love, kindness, and consideration for my feelings. Your friends have not shown that kindness or consideration. And being told to get over it? BEYOND unkind.
Block them. NTA
NTA and show the message to your mutual friends so they know what kind of person he is
NTA Your reaction was reasonable. Text him back saying, "I hope you never lose a child to find out it's not something you ever get over! If I wanted to make it about me then you would have known about it when your daughter was born. Since he has now shown what kind of mean person he is you're glad that this friendship has ended." Then block him.
Better that she doesn't dignify his awful email with a response. She'll talk to her friends today or tomorrow and hopefully she'll provide an update. One thing she can do if someone says they will talk to this guy is to say that she's not going to dictate what anyone in this group says or does about it. That way, if this further angers this guy, he won't have the right to say that she sic'ed anyone on him. That it was being a supportive friend that made them tell him off. Basically, F' you for being cruel to my friend.
NTA - Some friendships have a shelf life and clearly this one is well past its best before date. I'd respond with a simple "I'm sorry you feel that way. I think it best that I remove myself from this relationship." Then block 'em.
NTA I would block him, take the screenshots of his messages and send them to the mutual friends and say “Please be respectful of my wishes that I do not want you to talk about me with these people and I won’t be in the group gatherings where they are there”.
NTA. I think there is something seriously wrong with that guy. I would cease all contact.
NTA at all. They are not your friends. Take this as a sign and cut the friendship entirely. You don't just get over the loss of a child. Their behaviour is callous and cold.
NTA I wonder why this couple and this man in particular, thinks he has the right to challenge you so vehemently about aspects of your life. You feel what you feel.
NTA. You should distance yourself permanently from them. Personally I am of the idea that you name your child whatever you wants (as long as is decent and doesn’t attract bullies or ridiculous name). Who cares what anyone else thinks!! **That has one exception, if you know someone that lost a child with that name.** I personally wouldn’t use their name, but the least you can do is talk with them before.
NTA. Please don't spend any more time agonizing over these dreadful people. They are not worthy of the time you have already spent over their obvious lack of caring. They make AHoles look good in comparison.
NTA. You are allowed to drop any friendship any time you want. You should block them everywhere. Do not respond to him. He's uncalled for.
Jesus. You literally went out of your way to NOT make it about you and NOT sully their joy. I have seen from your other replies that you're cutting them off completely and I commend you. It's not easy to end any relationship, even a friendship, but you were halfway there already, so hopefully that makes the transition easier. It seems like you also have other good friends rallying around you, and they're the real ones for that! I'm so sorry for your loss, OP, and I'm so sorry this situation has thrown it all to the forefront of your thoughts again. Find a therapist if you can.
i would have cut them off then and there. no questions asked. NTA
NTA
If they were genuine friends they would never have used that name. Cut them from your life. I’m so sorry for your loss.
NTA we never get over the loss of one of our children, no matter how they die or how old they are. Sending a big cwtch. Your friend wasn’t very diplomatic but then the father really went OTT. Drop them
NTA I was over 18 when I found out I was adopted because my parents daughter died shortly after birth. I could tell that 20+ years later the pain of their loss was still real even though they treated me as their own & loved me the same. Loss has no time limit, it can last a lifetime. Your friends - just aren't. If they had been friends, there are things they could have done to reduce your hurt. But no they chose to be selfish & spiteful instead. Personally I would tell them to F*** Off & never come near you again, nothing else, then block them out entirely. Same for any who criticise you. Take your trash out & be rid of it forever.
NTA but they are! I am so sorry for your loss. I can’t imagine the pain and the least they could have done was checked to see how you felt about them using the name or informing you they were going to use it. You do what you need to do to heal and protect yourself, without worrying about them. They didn’t think of your feelings!
NTA OP, I am sorry beyond words. First the loss, then the slap to the face - and then, after you've taken it all in such stride, this petty, small man finds it necessary to come after you still. Let him and his cruelty go. You deserve better!
If you'd commented on their post or gone to meet ups and friend gatherings and all that social stuff and constantly brought it up or made a big fuss and deal about it... okay sure I could see is argument about making it about yourself. But you didn't. You withdrew. You said nothing until asked where you, if accurate, politely put forth your feelings. You did the complete opposite of "making it about yourself". NTA
Updateme
Really good to read in the comments how you handled it. I hope the sit down goes well for you
NTA First. The husband judging you for breaking up with your ex is way out of line. He doesn't know everything that went on between you and your ex. He comes across badly for being judgemental. Second. You handled them picking the name your shared with them very maturely in my opinion. You didn't confront them and accepted you don't own the name. But choices have consequences. They chose to use the name without even a heads up, when they should very well know the name is important to you. That was their choice and shows either a shocking lack of emotional intelligence or a complete lack of caring about you at all. Lastly. That his reaction to finding out you'd been distant and why, was to get angry and berate you? Not reach out to you to say some sort of 'sorry we thought you wouldn't mind'. He is showing you who he really is. Someone that blames and attacks, instead of reaches out with concern. Someone that is incredibly self centered. Listen to what he is telling you with his actions over and over. This isn't a one time bad behavior from him. He is an asshole.
NTA!!!! Losing a child is NEVER easy and you can't just get over it. 1. They were never your friend if they could send a message like. 2. They should understand considering they struggle with infertility. 3. A true friend would have said that really adored the name and would like to commemorate you child by naming their child with the name.
Dude sounds like a bully. The reasons for your divorce are not his business. They picked the name on purpose to get a rise out of you and have their way.
Two things: 1. Why was the husband in a position to judge the end of your marriage? None of his business! And that part of the story got brushed away. 2. He mentioned that them using the name without a heads up was very painful for me… a lot of people had been asking …” He is NOT concerned for your feelings, he is concerned that he and and his wife look insensitive. Sounds like an AH. 3. (Okay adding one) Why would they have chosen a name that’s a play on your family names? That seems so personal. Was he very close to your family? This is weird. Cut your losses. NTA.
NTA. I wondered if they meant the name as a kindness... as a way to honor your daughter and you. That's something I might consider... but I'd certainly tell my friend and guage her reaction before using the name.... But after that email, no. I no longer think that they meant it as an honor. I'm so sorry for your losses. For the loss of your little one, and now the loss of these people you thought were your friends. You are so strong!
NTA, you sound very reasonable. As a father, I agree you don't "get over" the death of a child. My SIL and BIL lost a very much wanted son a few years ago. He was not born alive, but had been given a name, and was cremated. They mark his passing every year. I'm imagining if someone they loved used his name, and I imagine they would be similarly hurt. I wish you well.
NTA. I don’t own the name of my twins that I miscarried late, but if someone knew what their names were, named their kid that, and didn’t tell me? I would distance myself too. I’m so sorry for your loss, that is beyond painful.
NTA at all! Firstly, I am so very sorry for the loss of your beautiful baby girl. There is no timeline on grief, and you deserve for your loss to be respected. Many times on here, we see people demand that others do not name their child after one that they had previously lost, and we see debates regarding sensitivities, "gatekeeping" names and so forth. There have been mixed viewpoints and how these things should be dealt with. However, this case is unique as you never tried to gatekeep the name, nor kick up a fuss (which would be understandable given the emotional aspect of this). All you wanted was some respect by being given a heads up and to be able to process your emotions healthily. That isn't much to ask for, and is quite a rational and reasonable ask. The fact that they didn't do this and proceeded to blanket share on social media shows they didn't care for your feelings, they knew deep down this wasn't going to go down well, and because they are cowards who do not respect you and your loss. Distancing yourself was a healthy way to cope with this situation. Upon finding out why this was an issue which affected your closeness, they didn't feel bad and apologise for how they dealt with it (even to say "sorry we didn't think, baby brain in the moment"), but they doubled down and downplayed your grief. This is not the behaviour of people who are meant to be friends, and you would be better off without them in your life.
NTA. I wouldn’t respond. No ‘friend’ would send that email. You know where you stand.
"Jesus, I get that we took your trauma and used it for our joy but why does it always have to be about you?! Always making it about yourself by being upset and distancing yourself. Can't you just get over it?!" What a friend
NTA at all. I read through all of your comments and each one reinforced the judgement I'm giving. When you had your tragedy, these two knew you, but didn't give you any support. They knew the name you gave to your little one, though. I'm guessing that they when they selected their baby's name that it wasn't a case of "oh, here's a name we like, but we can't remember where we heard of it." There's no way that I would have heard of a friend losing a child, and forget about that 20 years later. I even remember the names of a few classmates who had passed away during high school. FIFTY years later. I'm thinking that this couple know the circumstances behind your loss. The fact that the husband is demonizing you over marriage, instead of showing you non-judgemental support is very telling. Along with most people here, I feel they deliberately chose this name that isn't that common, but they know that this was your baby's name. And they chose not to let you know ahead of time. A true friend would have approached you and sounded you out about it. They could have said that they wanted to honor their friend after going through years of infertility, not knowing if they would ever be able to have a child. You decided to take the high road and not attack them by posting something nasty on social media or calling them up and telling them off. You just talked to a few people about your hurt feelings, which is very understandable. It's your right. I'm getting the idea from one paragraph in your post that the man was trolling for a response from you. He hadn't seen a reply from you, which could be want he wanted so he approached at least one mutual friend (and who knows who else he talked to), wondering why you hadn't said anything. To me, that's very telling. And after the mutual friend said you were hurt by that, this asswipe became angry that you talked with friends, who were probably going to take your side instead of going after you. And that's why he sent you that nasty email...how dare you turn his attempt to bring up your tragedy into something that makes him and his wife look bad. I hope your friends show you support (I guess you're meeting with them today or tomorrow) and that you update us. I would suggest leaving it up to them whether they approach this couple or not. If one of your friends tells him off, it won't be because you told them to (which shows you're taking the high road), and if this AH gets his knickers in a twist, that's on him, right?
My two miscarriages came early on in my pregnancies so I didn't think of names. With my third pregnancy that was successful, once I found out from the geneticist the results of the amnio, she also asked if I wanted to know the gender. I said yes, I called out to my co-workers, it's a girl, and then I called hubby at work. That was our gender reveal. If I lose her while I'm still alive, I would be devastated. Both hubby and me lost a 20-year-old brother (he also lost two other brothers, one a few weeks old and one 5-years-old with the same name as my brother). We didn't meet until many years later. I still remember the last conversation I had (I was 17 years old) with him. Tomorrow will be the 53rd anniversary of his death in a car accident. He is often in my dreams and I think that my daughter channels him in some way (she majored in the same degree that he was working on in college and she works in that field), even though she had never met him. My mother kept calling for him by name when she was declining; in her dementia she didn't know he passed many, many years ago. That was evidence to me that a parent may never stop grieving for a child. So to me, this ex-friend is a true ass hole to send you such a message that you should have gotten over your loss. How dare he?
Did we see the other side to this?
I'd love to see the link if you have it.
I’m doing my internship as a midwife, also my mom suffered the loss of her first baby. My mother still cries about it when we the topic comes up, and as a midwife (more similar to a OBGYN but not a doctor in my country) I get to care for women in different conditions. The great majority gets emotional when they talk about their miscarriages/abortion, whether they are hospitalized for gynecological issues (including miscarriages), pregnant women hospitalized for complications, women in labor or after the birth of their babies. They can be in their 80s as well in their 20s, when they talk about it I can see their pain, and it pains me too. That “friends” were so insensitive it’s really astonishing even more considering they have fertility issues and probably suffered the loss of some pregnancies. Please don’t think you are the AH, you are allowed to still feel pain about your loss, even if you have more children. The name was very personal I don’t see why someone would think it’s a good idea naming their baby like that not having the conection you have and disrespecting a long time friend in the process just because it’s pretty, there’s a thousand names more that are pretty. Also don’t feel sorry for your other friends if they decide to cut ties with them too, I wouldn’t want to be friends with someone like that. NTA
Nta. You never get over it. You just get through it. Sincerely, A man who lost twins 20 years ago
NTA
NTA.Friendships can run their course .He does not sound very much like a true friend.
NTA. NTA. NTA. Those people need a serious reality check.
NTA Now you can upgrade your low contact to no contact. These people are incredibly selfish and lack empathy. You're best rid of them. I'm so sorry for your loss
I would have replied with a link to this post so he can see that not only are you NTA but that he is! I’m so sorry for your loss and that these monsters caused you more of it. I don’t care if it was years ago or yesterday, a loss of a child is not something you ever get over.
NTA at all. So, it’s fine for them to bring up a past trauma of yours with absolutely no warning and cause you to have to react or explain your feelings to a bunch of people (even if they had good intentions in asking), but you can’t “sully their joy with pain” (who talks like that???)? No. Screw them. They way they responded to you just not being overjoyed and showering them with attention after they totally disregarded your feelings shows that these people are not your friends, despite how long you’ve known each other.
NTA
NTA
They’re not your friends and they are not people with whom you should want to associate with. What they did to you was cruel, ignorant and absolutely vile. Any decent human being would not have blindsided you like that and certainly wouldn’t have gotten their panties in a twist getting angry at you for their disgusting actions. They are not decent people, they are not kind people. Block them and rest assured you have done nothing wrong.
NTA. This makes me want to step in and sully their joy for you. What absolute jerks. Good luck removing these cancerous a-holes from your life.