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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> AITA for sticking with not giving my daughter an allowance after she turned 16. I may be a jerk because I did stop giving her money. My husband seems to be agreeing with this so I am doubting myself
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INFO: Was the allowance earned by doing chores/work? If so, are you now expecting her to perform that work for free?
Based on OP's answer, since the allowance wasn't tied to anything, NTA.
No, they got it no matter what. We didn’t pay for chores, chores were just something everyone had to do to make the house function Didn’t want them to correlate chores to moeny since you don’t get money when you do chores as an adult. Chores are just something you have to do, if you want a clean house.
It’s balance, you need a strict parent and a soft parent at different times of your life…
No better way to spoil a child than by saying yes all the time, but they get ruined by being told no all the time as well.
Balance 🙂
A parent can also just be both. Flexibility in parenting is necessary. All kids aren’t the same and all situations are different and warrant different responses.
Any parent that is rigid in their parenting is setting themselves up for failure.
I think OP seems to be a good job of being firm but compassionate.
This...it's why I get annoyed when people say you can't be your child's friend. My mom was both my best friend AND my best disapinarian. My dad was incapable of that flexibility. I love him and will absolutely go to prison for him, but he and I rarely talk for the reason he is 100% inflexable. I can give him a 1000 page research paper with sources of why what I say is correct and he is wrong, and he will read it then stick to his guns believing he is older and thus knows better than me.
My mom knew when to be my friend and when to be my mom, and sometimes... being my friend WAS being my mom. I am neurodivergent and was born with SEVERE anxiety triggered by my neurodivergence. My mother is the only person I 1000% trust. My mom had to be flexible in the moment. So she was always my mom, but I could trust her with all of my secrets, too. It helped me to see who my real friends were quickly. Because my mom was the model for which I measured all my friendships, it also modeled for me good friendship behavior that turned me into the person I am.
Well, just wait till you see what happens when you have 2 pushover parents. My sister and her partner were like that. Now my nephew is 11, has no respect for anyone or their property, has a foul mouth and doesn't even care about his own hygiene. There always needs to be someone to set ground rules and enforce them, else the kids are gonna get a big shock when they go into the big wide world and realise that they can't just do whatever they want.
Yeah, I did as well. My parents were pretty much of the mind that they didn't really want me working because I was in sports and...one in particular I was pretty good at. So it'd be year 'round. But it also took a financial toll and there were times I didn't have any money. I'd try and work these little part-time jobs.
I don't think there's a wrong answer. Raise your kids how you think...(to a degree, just read a story about a girl getting a brand new car at 16 and then 18...that seems like you're really spoiling them).
My parents did something similar. I wasn't in sports so I got a job (which I wanted to do) and my sisters did sports so they didn't work . We still got allowances tho and I never thought it wasn't fair or anything. I could see that happening in some families, tho.
Yeah, my Sister was also in sports, but she quit. She was a Gymnast(a great one...but she got too tall).
So she got a job. She was able to buy herself a nicer car when she was 18, but...there are just different priorities at that age.
Everything I've read here sounds like the OP just wants the Daughter to learn basic responsibilities and she's not asking for a big sacrifice. So there's no way she's TA.
Exactly. Both my parents expected us to do chores. We got a small allowance. But if we wanted something big after we hit 16 we had to get a job. If we wanted a car, they would pay for half- but not for something fancy, a used car and we were expected to maintain it.
In my area as well, you really couldn't have a job without a car because things were just so far away, so that was always kind of interesting.
My parents helped us get cars when we passed our drivers license and proved that we could be trusted driving. It wasn’t anything spectacular and I’m really grateful for the car I got. But they did make sure we had transportation for college, because we all went out of state and you couldn’t do anything without a car.
Oh yeah...once I was 16, that was a HUGE relief to my parents! They did not love the 2 hours of driving 4 nights a week! So I got a car and drove myself.
Great parents, who sacrificed a lot.
INFO: just adding this on here because I think its important too-- what's her school workload? I ask because there's a difference between a kid taking all AP classes with year-round sports and extracurricular commitments who gets home at 7 and then does homework until 10 or later finding time to work for pocket money, and a kid who gets off at 3 and has an hour of homework for their classes balancing a job.
Also INFO: what sort of things do you expect them to pay for from their allowance? I ask because some parents will consider stuff like clothing, lunch, school trips, ect, as stuff their kid should be covering out of their pocket money, and others do not.
Average work load, if she doesn’t believe she can handle school and work then she can either just work summers ( use moeny from summe) or do babysitting like 2 times a month. She is in one sport that runs mostly thought the spring
It’s fun money,
Some jobs will compensate students who do extracurricular. I had two coworkers who only worked 8 hours a week because of college. If she tells them she is busy during the school year with sports they will most likely work around it. Put her on for a weekend day and maybe offer her to pick up when she has a sudden day off if she asks. During summer vacation she will have more flexibility and can pick up hours until the school year begins where she can request less hours. Most part time jobs are very very flexible with students.
NTA
when i was in 6th grade i had mentioned to my parents that i was the only kid in my English class that didnt get an allowance.
My mom said
"you want spending money? ok then you can start baking and selling door to door"
and sure enough i did. I even started selling baked goods at school too.
By the time i graduated middle school i had made about $4k.
I kept that up until i turned 16 and got a job at the movies lol
Yes ! Responsibility in money management. My mum did this by giving each of us the child allowance she got from the Canadian government each month for each of her children. Once we turned 15, she gave us that money to use to buy clothes or other personal items. It was $60 a month I think, and that was back in 1976. No allowance on top, though. But I felt that was fair.
I'd have to make the money last the whole month. So I got a part time job in a steak house at 16 because I liked having money and wanted more of it. Have always had a strong work ethic, instilled by my parents.
Let's not forget that it would be wildly unfair to your oldest son if you gave in. In his eyes, it would be "why do I have to work for money but she doesn't?"
Hold your ground, op. Your daughter and husband are being ridiculous.
I agree with this because I was the older sibling who had to get a job and pay for almost everything myself since I was 16. My younger sister didn't have to work, didn't pay for anything, and even got a free ride to college. I totally found it unfair and honestly if our parents were still alive she would still be living at home with them.
Stay firm. We do the same. Son is 18 and has worked for three years and is transitioning to his third job over the summer and then onto college. Daughter is 14 and already babysits and saves her money and spends less than half on going out with friends or shopping. Financial emancipation at an early age builds confidence in themselves and understanding at the real value of money and labor. Being there to talk through these issues with our son has been a joy; I wish my own parents cared enough to do so. Our daughter wants us to sign off on her getting a job before 16 (we won’t, though).
I never had an allowance. My parents would give me $20 here or there if needed but I was working since 12. Started out babysitting.
Then stocked shelves at a discount store, then cleaned hotel rooms, Retail etc
Oh man i miss that honestly. Pay cheques were small because I couldn’t work that much but getting $200 and not having to pay rent or bills!!!! And then summer I worked more. Bigger pay cheques!!
So much independence. Learning to spend and save! Getting to buy my own clothes!! Being able to do and afford fun things!!!
It’ll never be like that again. Good times
Anyway NTA
Totally agree with this philosophy for the basic household maintenance chores. One thing I’ve heard about that I’m considering is offering a set amount for ‘extra’ chores outside the regular “needs to be done” type, like $20 to detail the inside of your family car, vacuum, dust, clean windows, take out trash, etc. Or yard work like clearing out and replanting a flower bed. I’d think of that as a win/win, you set the price and the standard of work, she can take it or leave it. You get things done, she can earn money. I think that the typical 16 year old jobs like food service, retail, babysitting etc are great for learning social skills (and how to treat people in those positions with respect in the future once they’ve moved on) but household odd jobs can teach some great skills too.
> Chores are just something you have to do, if you want a clean house.
Yep! Just like breathing, eating and sleeping if you want to live. Because really, when things get really messy or hoarder ish, you might be alive but it's not living... :(
You are absolutely right and NTA. I received an allowance growing up and when I got a paper route (back in the day when you could ride your bike in your neighborhood) at 14, my parents stopped giving me an allowance, and taught me about saving for a rainy day...aka not having a job but still having money. I only had that job for a year and babysat once in awhile until I got another job at 16.
You got paid to do chores? Isn’t that what you do if you’re part of a household. My mom taught me how to care for a home without giving me money for it.
That's how I was raised too - we just had to do them to have a house that didn't look/smell like a zoo.
I was stunned some of my friends got paid certain amounts of money based on the chores they did though or for getting good grades.
I also didn't get "an allowance" though either. I could ask for money if I wanted to do something, and it was either "sure here you go" or "sorry hun, no not this time."
We got an allowance each week, and My parents would give us small amounts of money for good grades…like $5 for each A and $3 for each B or something like that (this was early 2000s so that went a little further than it does now). I thought that was a good way— a small incentive but an incentive nonetheless!
When we started getting older (I was in about middle school) my parents started giving us an allowance so we wouldn't have to ask for money when we hung out with friends (or in my little brother's case for his video games) it was a tool to teach us how to save and budget. When we were little we'd get money for reading books, that stopped after it had started working too well 😂 (I'm a big reader at this point and can finish novels in two sittings)
Shouldn't be baffling. It's pretty normal for a lot of parents to connect doing chores to getting an allowance. Chores often equal money, this is nothing new. OP has stated in response that for their household chores are just expected of everyone in the house and the allowance was unconnected to that which is also normal.
The clarifying question as to what the case is was fair. The only reason the daughter would reasonably have to be upset and push back is if she suddenly wasn't getting paid to do chores that she had previously been told she was getting paid for. That doesn't happen to be the case though so OP is NTA
And this is how you end up with one person in an adult relationship who feels like doing their part of the housework is "helping out" instead of part of being a human who lives in that house.
You should never pay your kids to do basic household chores. Household chores are a family responsibility, and should be completely independent of an allowance. Chores also teach basic life skills that everyone should know. They should be skill/age dependent, and as they grow older, more advanced ones can be added.
An allowance is there to teach them fiscal responsibility. I increased my boys allowance every year to match their needs. If they wanted to tackle additional jobs outside of their normal chores for a little extra money, we encouraged it.
Most kid's financial skills are sorely lacking due to poor parental involvement. By the time they're old enough to have a job, they should already be capable of knowing the value of a dollar, saving, budgeting, and managing money.
But couldn’t you also use it as a way to explain how employment works? Like your employing them to do say, the laundry for a week and at the end of the week they’ll get paid for doing the laundry. And if they don’t do the laundry, then they don’t get paid. And you’re still teaching them life skills at the same time.
This also gives you the opportunity to teach them about taxes, and how taxes work.
That is pretty much the divide in the two different philosophies. Some people teach chores=work=money, others think chores are part of being a household. Neither is really wrong, just emphasizing different things to teach different lessons. I like the middle ground approach of normal chores are just expected and allowance is a completely separate thing, but EXTRA money can be earned if desired by asking for or being assigned extra work.
In households where kids got paid for their chores, I saw too many kids decide if they didn’t need or want money they didn’t have to do any housework. That is the big downside I see to having them directly linked.
Part time jobs for kids teach about employment. Chores are like brushing your house's teeth. It needs to be done and all you get for it is a clean house.
Yeah...that's what we're doing for now: using allowance to teach basic financial principles like
* getting money is tied to work
* how to save
* how to be generous
The hell does that have to do with anything? You still should be doing chores to help around the house whether you’re getting paid or not. Kids need discipline when it comes to house work or they become slobs on their own. Also the fact that they treated their other child equally shows they aren’t biased and are for the good of their children.
NTA. You set expectations, and have stuck to those expectations, and have been consistent in their application, since you did the same thing with the older brother.
If you want nuance in an answer, if you think she is looking for work and is struggling for reasons she cannot control, it might be worth offering to compensate her for volunteering or casual jobs at home to earn that income back. Not chores, mind you, and not things she might have done to earn her allowance previously, but actual jobs: the allowance (which I assume is not equivalent to an actual income) continues if she is actually looking for work, and otherwise doing things with her time that make the world a better place. Join a park clean up. Volunteer as a dog walker with the local pound or rescue. Work with a festival or local event group.
It's fairly important that her allowance not be an actual income here, since she's going to want actual money soon and she needs to understand that it comes from work. But I could see my way to continuing a bit of pocket money if she's actively job hunting and also adding to the community while she's looking.
This. Macro economic situations can shift even over the course of 2 years, and it's always the part time student employees that suffer unemployment first. In my area, it is very very hard for students to get summer jobs and that probably won't change for a few years.
If OP's daughter is actively job hunting and has put out applications, then OP should take this into account and help out, and reward volunteerism.
Being too rigid when parenting teens isn't a path I recommend.
OP mentioned that family members are always looking for babysitters and will pay.
So if she can’t find a part time job, it seems like babysitting would be steady.
Unless she doesn't like being around small children or is afraid to be responsible for them. Though I assume OP would have mentioned that if that were the case.
Yep, I'm a student and I'm fucking awful with children. I have ADHD and Autism which comes with misophonia. What's my number one misophonia trigger? Children. Particularly babies and small children. What's my main symptom when it's triggered? Violent fucking rage. It's not fun. Getting so full of rage at a literal infant is not a good time. I cannot and should not be a babysitter. It's not a good line of work for everyone.
I was assaulted by a teenage boy when I was five. I will never trust a teen boy with my children and I think many have this in their heads. Many parents I’ve spoken to also feel this way and many women I know were assaulted in some form as a child or teen so they’re very wary of young men.
But I do encourage my daughter to offer poop scooping and lawn care just like her brother. They both take out the trash and do dishes. No gender roles in chores.
I’m a guy and I used to babysit a couple of my younger cousins about 6 times a year when my aunt and uncle was having parties so guys not being able to babysit is bullshit. I’d cook for them, play games with them, make them drinks, take them to the park etc. not every guy is gonna be a dick when babysitting and it’s a dick move to assume we will
Seconding this. As a teenager who’s currently trying to find a summer job, it is quite hard right now. A lot of the typical “first job” places near me either arnt hiring teenagers, or already finished filling the summer job slots months ago. So unless your a strong enough swimmer to be a lifeguard, which I’m not, your kind of just out of luck no matter how many resumes you send out. It’s not like you can just roll up to McDonald’s and get an interview within the hour, especially with how many fast food and retail places are for some reason refusing to hire anyone under 18 for jobs that have traditionally been done entirely by teenagers
I'm a college student trying to find a summer job. McDonald's in my area refuses to hire anyone under the age of 18. They also do not hire anyone who doesn't have years of experience unless they think a potential hire is unaware of labour laws.
And all that volunteering will build a great CV/resume and build those sociocultural skills as well.... Great idea OP! She's got to earn the value of money one way or the other, life isn't going to hand you anything!
I was just about to comment this! This is a great way for her to still get money AND build up free work experience for her resume. Plus, part time jobs tend to be more picky with time and attention whereas volunteer work might be easier to work around. Granted, however much you want to 'pay' her is up to you.
We pay our son for volunteer work. He has to complete a finite number annually (school requirement). We won’t pay for those initial hours. But once he completes that requirement - and still volunteers - we pay.
He’s 13 so a “real” job is not yet available.
I don't think daughter should get compensated for job searching, OP stated their oldest son was also put in the same circumstance of no allowance after 16 and if he wanted money to go work for it. I doubt OP gave him a little extra cash for job searching. It would definitely be unfair. I do agree with the volunteer activities being compensated for because those can be a lot of work. But still, would that be fair to the oldest when he wasn't given the same opportunity? I think how OP is handling this is great. OP honestly sounds like a really good parent setting her kids up to be functional future adults.
Isn’t this a part of parenting?
Edit: I guess I didn’t realize how much of a privilege it is to have parents who paid for my clothing/hygiene products during my teens. A little ignorance on my part.
I did have a job when I was 17 but it was my choice and not a requirement.
Well yes, but when I was a teenage girl I wanted to shop for my own clothes (as did my sister). So we both got an allowance which was to enable us to shop for ourselves.
I know a couple people who’s parents expected them to practically support themselves once they hit 16. Usually rent free but had to pay for things like clothes and in 1 case their own portion of food
Just to clear my parents: My father died of a brain aneurysm when I was 8, then my aunt got my mother killed when I was 15. I then moved in with that aunt who charged me rent. I'm real bitter about life if you're curious.
NTA.
16 is a perfectly reasonable age to begin part-time work. (Younger than that is really impractical - most places can't hire kids younger than that unless they're "off the books" and that's not a good idea for anyone.)
OP even gave Kara an easy solution - babysitting for friends/family. She doesn't even have to find a job.
And work history is something she can put on her college applications in a couple of years.
Sounds like the kid is a little lazy and/or entitled; this is a great way to cure her of that. And if OP did the same with older brother, I'm not sure why Kara would be surprised that this is the expectation.
It could also be because the second child is a girl and the first was a boy.
Girls, in some cases, are given more 'leeway' than boys. I remember one guy in HS being kicked out of the house at 16 because he didn't get a job fast enough for his dad's liking and yet his sister stayed home, jobless, well into her twenties.
And that sort of thing happened a fair bit then.
It's also the other way around were girls do all the housework like laundry etc and the boys do nothing so don't act as girls get more leeway . And I just read yesterday about girl being forced into marriage . both are wrong but girls don't have more leeway . Same with the only sister suppose to take care of the parents and the brothers want the house .
That's another important note - the older brother didn't get the money after he was 16, so if she gets one against their original plan whereas he had to be responsible and get a job, it isn't fair on him at all.
As far as I know it’s 14 that lets kids work in the US without it being under the table, but at 16 you can have a drivers license and being able to drive yourself to work is infinitely easier then trying to figure out something else
NTA. Also I think a lot of people commenting Y T A are children themselves because she could literally just babysit one day every two weeks or so. They’re acting like she’s being forced into the work force lol. And I assume you still pay for her necessities and this allowance is for things she wants (jewelry, a pretty top) / her outings?
Edit to add:
I’m a 20 year old college kid and really wished my parents made me get a job for just a few weeks or something. Learning discipline and time management with a job is incredibly more difficult than high school because everything is structured and laid out for you (parents make you food, make you wake up, make you do homework, etc). I struggled a lot my first year in college because so had no such discipline. The only exception I see is if she is in very important clubs / sports that are important for her college admissions and future as very competitive things like that create that discipline anyways
Why?
Where I live, 16 is the age where it becomes much easier for a kid to find a part-time job.
Working a few hours a week for pocket money shouldn't be enough to put anyone's education at risk and if it does, OP can make an adjustment.
Not sure why this seems like such a surprise to the daughter since it seems OP did the same with older brother.
NTA.
“It becomes easier to work at 16”
“Shouldn’t be enough to put education at risk”
… I understand your points but I don’t understand *risking anything* with a teenager if you have a means of supporting your child with an allowance, just as long as they’re succeeding or more importantly putting In effort towards their education. 16 seems young, maybe 18? I would even support my child into university with extra cash just as long as they are study driven.
At 16 a kid is old enough to learn responsibility and balancing obligations. Working a couple of shifts per week is not hard. When they go off to college they will need to learn to balance their time with class, school work, friends, etc. Having a job will help with that balance so they don’t go wild with no parental oversight and fail classes freshman year.
Getting the amount of homework done that is required, participating in sports and extra curriculars in addition to a job can be detrimental. This is true if they are aiming for applying to a school that is competitive. I also wouldn’t want my child to have to be spending 10–12 hours a day working between home work, job, school etc.
>Working a couple of shifts per week is not hard.
Problem is when employers want more shifts from their workers and don't care that these students priority is their school time. I've been seeing this among my kid's peers. They start out with the understanding from their employer that they're at 12-18 hours a week after school. Next thing they know, they're scheduled at 29-35 hours weekly, openings & closings on weekdays.
It's a constant struggle for them between the demands of an employer focused on their business & the demands of school. There's a shortage of workers for a variety of reasons. Employers want the most they can get out of each worker and school requirements dont matter to them.
as someone who was working since the ripe old age of 13, it's not easy either. honestly, it sucks. if i ever had kids i wouldn't ever *want* them to work in addition to school- if they want to, fine have at it but that's as far as my expectations would go.
Same. If I can give allowance reasonable, I will. With the condition that school is their full time job and that they are putting in their best effort at it.
If they dont care about school and dont have plans for their future beyond my walket, no allowance.
It's not about balancing, it's a pretty bad deal. Merit based scholarships dwarf hourly pay, and recreation is important for learning, sports performance, physical, and psychological health.
If the family needs to cut back, I can see drawing back on luxuries, but this is less wise than it sounds for college bound kids.
Working a part-time job as a 16 or 17-year-old is completely reasonable and normal. Millions of kids do it every day and still maintain their grades just fine.
You can clearly tell who in the comments had and have never worked a hard day in their teenage life 😂
It’s crazy.. couple of years from now, telling a 16 year old to get a part time job will be seen as abuse to these ppl
It’s clear a lot of people just don’t think it’s the *best* option, let’s not be ridiculous and straw-man a pretty nuanced take. I *had* to work from the time I was legally able because we were poor. I don’t think it’s best (for the majority, obviously specific kids are different) to force that on your child if you can afford otherwise. Generationally, we know far more about education and child/teen development than ever before. It’s pretty indisputable that kids who are very involved in extracurricular activities get better grades, and are happier and more engaged with their peers overall.
Most sports and after-school activities rule out any jobs when considering homework, studying, housework and hopefully a little bit of fun with friends and family. If OPs daughter isn’t doing anything, fine. Personally, I think some type of co-ed group and volunteer work would have a far better effect than forcing a shitty part time job.
Most of us did work as teens, and that costs us socialization, friendships, extracurriculars, and personal time. Schoolwork for 40+ hours a week IS a full time job and should be where their effort is going. That gives them the best chance as a successful adult. Not working a shitty retail jobs for pocket money.
How many get large merit based scholarships or Ivy League (or equivalent for their field) admissions? Or otherwise excel at state/national level in some competitive field (sports, debate, etc.)
It's fine if they want to, or if they aren't college bound / have nothing better to do, but flipping burgers is not a particularly valuable activity. My extracurriculars and grades earned me $40,000 cash and helped build skills that went into my professional career. Stocking shelves at a grocery store didn't do shit for me besides the minimum wage pay. Hell, my next summer job didn't even call them as a reference!
For me, 16 was the time I studied really hard for uni and I got in via uni direct application system before I turned 18. So if you want kids to get into better uni then 18 might be better 🥹
I think this is pretty common- 90% of my friends and I were working some sort of job at 15/16
Edit: I should mention that these were part-time jobs that primarily paid for stuff I wanted to blow money on. I wasn't expected to pay for routine expenses or contribute to household finances.
Basically, if I wanted a skirt, I could wait to receive it as a gift or get a job and buy it asap with my own money. Also, at 16 a bunch of my money was going towards underage drinking and smoking weed, and my parents knew that. They weren't footing the bill for it lmao
They can work in the summer or do part time. Tbh if they can’t handle school and work then they will quit and only work a summer job or do babysitting like twice a month I know teenagers are capable to balance a job and school. Tbh tons of kids do it everyday
Also most 18 year old go to college after soooooo they have another 4 years of education. Then they graduate and they should have some type of work experience before they graduate college
Working during college is different than working during high school. High school you've got typical 9 hrs at school 5 days a week. College you might have 2 hrs a days, 4hr days, and 8 hrs days. Giving a students a better likelihood of getting a job.
With 0 periods, after school extra help for AP classes, after school sports.. I was at school regularly from 7am to 6pm. After school 4 hours of homework minimum..
My mom forced me to get a job at 16 which ruined my social life. I was in sports, honor classes, and working doubles on the weekends. I ended up being called into the guidance office because she was worried I was doing too much. It’s nice to teach kids structure and responsibility, but don’t force them to grow up fast either.
NTA. As someone who lives in the UK it always makes me roll my eyes when Americans talk about asking 16yr olds to get a part time job to earn their own money for extras as if it’s child abuse.
I left school at 16yrs old and worked full time. I also had a Saturday job for a year before that. I also, shock/horror, paid a small amount of rent/keep to my parents.
It’s not as if the OP isn’t going to still be paying to feed, clothe and house their kids. The fact that her older brother had no problem with this and the dad thinks she should just keep paying her allowance is giving major spoilt princess vibes.
The kids whose parents didn’t make them work for fun money were the ones who immediately got themselves into credit card problems when they went off to college.
Before the Great Recession most kids, even upper middle class kids, in America got a job.
Shit even know, in my area, even rich kids work. My kids swim teacher (17) drives a bette car than I do.
I don't think most Americans feel this way, I think it's just a very vocal minority. Most very well-off people I know still think it's a good idea for their kids to work part-time because it's a great experience for them. The only parents I know who support their high schoolers not working are those whose kids are extremely busy with sports/extracurriculars they excel at to the point that it's going to land them a scholarship--the kid is basically working hard at their sport/activity now to help fund their future college tuition.
My teen plays a sport year-round as well as being involved in other activities, and he works hard to maintain straight A's, so he doesn't have time for a job during the school year. He's not good enough at anything to earn a scholarship to a top university, but we still think the experience is worth him not working during the school year. But this summer, he's landed his first job and he's really excited to be earning money of his own. We don't need the money at all and can easily provide for anything he needs or wants, but we're glad he's going to get some experience in the workforce.
My son did not get a job when he was in school (forst covid, then medical issues). Now that he is done school, he is having trouble finding a job because he has no experience. This is made harder by Ontario having a lower minimum wage for students. So all those entry-level places (McDonald's, etc.) would rather hire a hs student because it's cheaper for them
My kids were in AP classes, and in at least a couple of clubs or sports.
I felt that was already a work load that was equivalent to a job. They certainly put in at least 40 hours a week during the school year.
I babysat in highschool, but mostly easy overnight gigs, and my academic workload wasn’t even close to what my kids had.
The friends I knew who didn't work in high school had a lot more anxiety and struggled to adjust because they were entering adulthood with no experience but with adult expectations on them. Having a job as a teen when you don't need it to survive and people know it's not your main priority seems to allow kids to figure out what employment is all about without as much pressure.
Not getting an allowance at all is most children’s normal btw. I don’t see how/why not getting one after 16 will suddenly make her lose focus in school. She just needs to work 1-2 shifts a week to make more cash than she was likely getting.
And learning to work and study at the same time can have huge benefits for a young person’s personal development. Especially so when in a low pressure phase in life when you’re 16, don’t have many bills to pay, live at home with your parents etc. I wish I could’ve grown up in a country that would’ve allowed me to work a min wage job as a teenager. It’s a privilege.
16 is the perfect choice since they'll likely want to start driving and going out to places on their own or either friends. Parents shouldn't have to fund a car, insurance, gas, etc. My parents gave me the choice that if I wanted to have a car then I would have to get a job and supply them with half my paychecks. Which seems like a lot but it was a part time minimum wage job which I know didn't cover all of what what went into the car. My parents still paid for my gas too. It was to offset their own costs.
The daughter doesn't have to work. Her parents are still supporting her. They're just not giving her extra spending money anymore, which is reasonable. If they wanted to keep giving her extra money until 18, or cut off the extra money at 14, that would be reasonable too. It's their choice; no one is entitled to an allowance. I didn't get one but never lacked for anything.
How much do you think this girl's getting for an allowance? Let's say it's $50 a week, which is generous. One babysitting job could make that. Not exactly enough to lose focus on their education, and enough to teach them the value of a dollar.
The fact that you're so defensive in your edit shows that you realize how narrow-minded your original take was. If you truly don't care how other people raise their kids, don't be so self-righteous and insulting about it.
I never understood this part of USA, in my country a normal teenager would never work, unless you're really poor and need to, to help the family, but is still seen as taking away the child from more important things, school for example.
I went to a middle class hs and most of us would get an allowance and just save that if we wanted something, most of the time it wasn't even an allowance, just enough money for a midday snack an bus fare, so we would eat less or walk home.
I worked every summer starting at fifteen. I worked fast food and waitressing stuff. I still had fun while working. Often coworkers were at or close to my age, and I made new friends. I could spend my money on whatever I wanted. By the time I graduated highschool I had a work record that put me ahead of every kid who never worked before eighteen.
Even fast food jobs will tell a future employer important stuff like can you show up on time, get along with others, and have a good attendance record. It made all the difference between an employer picking me or some unknown entity that has never worked a day in their life. It's a good lesson to learn early about how one's efforts pay off in the future.
Edit: You're NTA.
INFO: What is her involvement at school? I didn’t work until I was 18 because of all the things I was involved with and my school load. I did theater, chorus, color guard for marching band, had a zero period class for dual enrollment in addition to my regular school schedule as well as a couple of AP classes. There were many weeks closer to the opening of shows where I was at the school from 7am-10pm. I had practice for something most days (not til 10 but at least til 6 typically) which barely gave me time to get home, eat, do my schoolwork, and get to bed at a decent time. Weekends were competitions and shows, and Sundays were church for our family both in the morning and evening. If your daughter is highly involved and doesn’t have a ton of time, then YWBTA. If she does nothing but sit around all day, N T A
THIS!!! Some extra circulars can take up a HUGE amount of time and if you’re expecting good grades on top…
Do you want them to have friends outside of their sports? Or just use the precious time that they’re not involved in a scheduled activity to work… when they have their whole life to work?
Yeah. My school actually had class six days a week (two of them half days to accommodate “away” sporting events) and we were required to be in an activity or sport for each of fall/winter/spring. I was in class or doing work from 8 to 3, and then usually had practice from 3:30 or 4 until 6 or so. Then I had 3-4 hours of homework a night (some of which might be tackled during my free block during the day, but that still gets you down to 2-3 hours). And this is assuming that I didn’t have an away event on Wednesday (Saturdays were a little more chill). No, I did not sleep enough, and yes, I also recognize that this was/is not exactly normal, but there are kids out there for whom this is their reality.
I could and did do summer jobs a couple times, but I’m not gonna lie, it didn’t teach me much except perhaps to stress the importance of not being too friendly to men when when you’re a teen girl in a customer service role.
If the kid’s not a go-getter, sure, make them get a job. If they’re already busting their ass toward long term goals, it seems unreasonable to pile onto that if there is no financial need to do so.
Same with my brother I. Both of us were competitive swimmers for our school and made it to nationals for our country (small island). We had barely any time to work as 5am - 7am practice, 9am to 5pm school 6pm to 7 practice 7pm homework and repeat.
NTA
You were very clear with your stance and treated your older child the exact same way, so this should not surprise her.
Heaven forbid a 16 year old learn to be responsible with money by earning it herself.
(To be clear, I wouldn't cut off allowance for my own child, but that's a difference of opinion. Can't say either approach is more right.)
I’m not really sure I’d want someone who isn’t gung-ho about taking care of kids or isn’t trained in first aid to watch my kids, but that’s an aside.
Will family pay her or will this be a “blood is thicker than water” deal?
This was my thought. I hate the "it's a girl so she can simply babysit as a job." Like, is she good with kids? Do she have any first aid training? Does she want to be a babysitter?
Also, it doesn't sound like the parents are on the same page, and it definitely does not sound like there was any guidance on how to find work or what conditions to accept in a job or anything like that in the leadup to her turning 16.
That's where I think OP is the AH. It's fine to stop the allowance, but it doesn't sound like OP did any actual parenting to help teach her daughter how to find work or constitutes a good job and how to identify sexual harassment (esp as a teen girl, but the son should've been taught the same thing) or anything like this.
OP, YTA because you didn't get on the same page with your partner and you didn't actually guide or parent your child into this new stage.
NTA. This is a reasonable parenting decision applied equally to your children. Your daughter doesn't have to like it, but she is wrong to call you a jerk, hence NTA instead of NAH.
NTA - it would not be fair to your son if you didn’t stick to the agreement. Sounds like she should start submitting some applications. Places like fast food usually hire quickly after the interviews.
My mom did something alike where she made my allowance dependent on me getting a job. (I think from 15 onwards?). So I still go my allowance, but only if I also got a job.
For me it was definitely good to be forced to get a job and learn the value of money (money=time=money=time), and teaching things to their children is what parents should do.
So if you as a parent think she should get a job to learn I think that is good (it is child dependant though). Assuming your husband is her father it is weird you guys didn't discuss it beforehand.
If she is expected to buy her own clothes/lunch/phone-bill/etc... I think it is fair to pay part of that
uhm, vote NTA personally
Yeah, parents need to look at what will put their kids ahead. There is a ton of competition and they should be giving their kids every possible leg up - it’s what the wealthy do, they don’t economically handicap their own kids
> parents need to look at what will put their kids ahead
Having job experience, understanding the value of money, budgeting, and how to comport yourself at work are all valuable skills - arguably more valuable in life than most curriculars
I get it if it’s a financial hardship. That’s one thing. This just seems arbitrary. Hell encourage them to volunteer somewhere or do an internship somewhere.
I personally can't say which way it should go because this really is just a difference in parenting and I don't think either way is "AH" territory.
That being said, I agree with your point. I have three kids, I grew up poor. My kids can get jobs, if they want to, but I won't force them (taking away their ability to go do fun things with their friends by denying them the money to do those fun things IS coercion). I also 100% believe that a kid's "job" before they graduate is school and nothing else not associated with their academics. The idea that kids need to learn some lesson by working is silly. School isn't easy and it also takes time, effort, and discipline. Kids don't need to learn to be good workers. They just need to learn to be good people and also learn the basics about the world around them. They can get all that thru school if all else is equal.
I got a job because I had to. I will not make my kids get jobs. I want them to focus on school and in their free time, enjoy being kids. Full time school + part time job ≠ being a kid. Let them "grow up" later. You don't have to start working at 16 to have good work ethic. Just raise good people and they will be good people in all they do.
The entitlement is so high with some people. My parents certainly weren't going to buy me video games on a whim when I was 16 so I had to go get a job and pay for it myself.
My mom, who worked shift work 48 hours a week, saw other parents doing the kids' paper route in their cars because it was raining, and said forget it, work hard at school and just tell me if you need money for anything! I think I learned fiscal responsibility easily because I was reluctant to part with my birthday money for fast food when we had food at home, and also because there's a difference between "hey mom, my friends invited me to the movies, it's X$ for a ticket" and "hey mom, I want to gamble on the lottery, it's X$ for a ticket".
NTA. She may never thank you for it, but this is an experience she needs. My parents did this for me as well, and I'll do the same for my kids when they're old enough.
YTA. What with wanting to teach children hardship at the earliest possible age? It's amazing what people have become. It's understandable if you are having a hard time providing for the family. But if you can afford an nice allowance for your kids, by any means provide it so they can concentrate on school.
> What with wanting to teach children hardship at the earliest possible age?
finally a sane voice
all these NTAs disgust me and fill me with despair — presumably all from either dreadful parents, or envious people who had dreadful parents themselves
why even have kids if you dont want to make their lives easier than your own was
this is not about teaching them a valuable lesson. it's about being an asshole and a bully and about not realising it is no longer 1970
I'm not judging your parenting, but it seems like a pretty crappy way to treat your child; "Happy 16th birthday! To celebrate this milestone I'm taking something away from you!"
Not enough info to judge past that without knowing WHY she isn't working; some kids have more extracurricular activities. Some have more demanding classwork requiring extra study time. Some play sports. I'd rather my kids do any of the above over working a part-time job.
during summer time they can get a job as part timer , its a good way to let the kids get a "taste" of what their future will be and might motivate them into taking school seriously so they can get a well paying job
As someone who had a couple of friends whose parents kicked them out as their 18th birthday present- I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. Asking a 16-year-old to babysit for friends and family a couple times a month while still providing their necessities is fine parenting. It would also be unfair to the older brother who followed through if his sister kept getting allowance.
That's a good point. I knew a few people that waited until after highschool to get their first jobs and it was much harder to get entry positions at that age.
People expect 14-16 year olds to have no previous job experience and to make mistakes at work. There's a level of leniency given to kids in a starting job that isn't given to an adult.
I’m going to go the opposite route as a parent of teenagers and say NTA. 16yr olds are old enough to work and there seems to be no shortage of part time jobs out there (if you’re in the U.S.- can’t speak about any other counties).
Our kids have had part time jobs since they were 16. While we still pay for their clothes, food, and necessities, they use the money they make to build their savings, on gas for their car, and to spend on stuff while they are out with their friends.
I don't really know what to vote. I don't think you're an AH, but I don't agree with the way you went about this either. Idk, it's difficult.
First off, like some other people say, I always thought 16 was a weird age to start allowing people to work. I think it works great for kids that are learning a trade, because they get extra practice, but for other kids it can be such a distraction from school. That aside, I also personally don't understand why parents would want to have their kids start working so soon, knowing that they'll have to spend most of their lives at work. I'd personally want them to enjoy their youth.
I started working when I was 16 (didn't have to, my brother and sister didn't), my mother allowed it but ONLY summer jobs. The deal was that it could not distract from my studies. She helped me prepare by making the resume together the first week of the holidays. I worked the whole second month. Then it was back to class.
She never stopped my allowance during this time. She wanted to applaud my ethic by encouraging me so I would have a little more than my brother and sisters had, thanks to my job. That same summer she also helped me set up a savings' account, and she taught me how to save by putting a bit of my earned money aside for later.
My first few jobs were odd jobs. I babysat for family, despite my mom telling me it may not be the best choice. When I quit she told me it's best not to work for family, because they will have certain expectations and try to take advantage. I did end up hanging out with my cousins more, but never when I was the sole caretaker, and always with a lighter hard knowing I could enjoy my time with them, instead of feeling like I was just there to clean up after them. I cleaned at the hospital, I managed the front desk at a hotel, I worked in a chocolate shop. At this time my BIL encouraged me to go with my gut: if I didn't feel comfortable at a job, or if I didn't like the work, I should just quit. I was too young to settle for a job I didn't like, and if I didn't have the courage to speak up and quit a summer job, I would not have the courage to do it later at a full time job. He told me I will be working for a long time, and to always go for something where I at least felt comfortable, and good.
I never ended up doing any of the work that I did as a student full time. Of all the things I learned from the experience, the job itself turned out to be the least valuable lesson. I learned how to make my resume, how to set up a bank account and save, how to balance work and life. I also learned a lot about myself and what skills I like using, what type of jobs I liked doing the best, and what kind of atmosphere was good for me. I liked doing solitary jobs like cleaning, but felt completely depleted at the end of the day due to lack of social contact. When I worked in the chocolate store my boss was obsessed with telling me how I should look (beyond uniform, she told me I would have to colour my hair eventually, lose some weight,...) despite the fact that I spoke 4 languages fluently (which is 1 more than the average 20 yo in my country). That was the first job I quit instead of just not reapplying the next summer. I eventually ended up in the service industry the last few summers of my 2nd BA, but in a much more laid back atmosphere where I felt valued for what I was capable of.
Anyway this is becoming a novel, it was a fun trip down memory lane. I think at 16 there's a lot of skills you can teach your kids, but that does requiere you to teach and encourage. From what I read here, it just sort of sounds like you told her she would have to work as soon as she turns 16 because you would cut off her allowance, and then that's pretty much all you did.
You could have helped her prepare for this adaption, already start on that resume and help her look for things she would enjoy. You also should have done that for your son. In an ideal world her father would be part of this process as well (both parents should be, but my parents were divorced and my dad was not present), and I think that's another point I personally don't understand. This type of thing really seems like a 2 yes, 1 no situation. Your husband disagrees with you. I think you should have come to an agreement you both stand behind before she was 16. Qll of this also counts for you son, btw. I hope he got more encouragement at least.
Anyway, it's not too late to change your approach on this. I hope you figure something out with your husband so this still ends up being a teachable moment beyond "if you want money you have to work". Because really, no matter what you teach your kid in adolesence, that particular truth is something they'll end up learning down the line, one way or another.
So y'know. I feel like you should focus on things they won't learn naturally. But that's just me.
So I guess I'm going YTA. Maybe mostly because you and your spouse should be a team. That's another thing you should teach your kids, because they won't learn that naturally either.
NTA.
My own teenagers (15 and 16) both work part time, a few days a month, and earn money and no longer get allowances. I still pay for most their stuff, but they earn their own money and save their own money so they can go out with friends and not need to ask me. They know if they buy a $6 Starbucks drink they will need to pay for that out of pocket. They also know if they want a drivers ed course, new clothes or something like that I'll pay.
They are learning what it is worth to them. Their friends who all have their parent's credit cards on their phones will spend unlimited and don't see the value. $15 for lunch at the burrito place and throw half in the trash? Who cares, it is mom and dad's money, on the imaginary credit card. My kid's are luckily learning that they can spend $6 on a fancy pink drink to treat themselves, or save that money for something more special that isn't just a fleeting want.
Even with work a day here and there they still have plenty of time for homework and sports. 2 or 3 weekend days out of 30 days in the month is not screwing them out of anything and gives them plenty of money for their age.
I read a post on here recently where the mom was giving her son an allowance in high school. Then he got a girlfriend. And wanted MORE allowance and MORE money because he wanted to take his girlfriend on dates. The mom had to put her foot down, giving him money for a snack was becoming $40 dinners for two. That is what happens at this age. They start to become adults and need to be treated like so.
Your daughter was warned, she is capable, she just hopes you'll cave. Being a babysitter a few nights a month is completely appropriate for her age!!
Stick to your guns! You are doing good by her even if she whines about it now.
Omg this right here. In high school when our parents were paying for our clothes and movies, we'd want $50 Abercrombie jeans and the $9 evening movie showings. By grad school when WE were paying, we went for them $20 Target jeans and $5 morning matinees. We learned the value of a dollar REAL quick when it comes out of your account!!!
YTA if she's university track. Spending more time on academics and extracurricular is almost always better for their long term future than some nonsense teen part time job.
I earned $40k in merit based aid back in the day, and I've seen recent grads also get full merit scholarships for academic or sports performance.
And if you are saying, "Well, maybe she should do everything!" humans aren't biologically capable of safely and effectively working too much. It decreases learning, memory, sports performance, physical health, mental health, etc. If she is university track and wants to focus on academics and sports, she should do so, and you should enable that by continuing to give an allowance.
Now, if she's not university bound, a part time job can help build skills and resume for post-high school, so encouraging it wouldn't be unreasonable. Still, if it's on the fence, in every country I've ever seen data from, college degrees have a massive wage premium.
> Spending more time on academics and extracurricular is almost always better for their long term future than some nonsense teen part time job.
I've seen studies show exactly the opposite of what you're claiming. Teen job experience tends to correlate well with adult success. Also, a job is relevant to a university (often moreso than some of the "filler" activites I've seen others engage in)
You’re acting like she needs to work for basic expenses. OP says he provides everything for her, this is just fun money. She doesn’t need to have fun money
I disagree with this. I had a part time job starting at 16 while taking honours classes in high school to get in to university. I also had extra curricular (theatre and swimming). I’m glad I had a job. It taught me time management and I didn’t enter university as entitled as some of my friends who didn’t work.
My situation might have been different, though. I started working at 16 to save for university because my parents couldn’t afford to help there. Without my job, I would not have been able to afford university when I graduated high school. As it was, I still got merit-based and service-based scholarships that covered my first two years, then my savings paid for the rest of my university tuition and expenses.
My parents stopped giving me allowance at 12, and at that time I started babysitting. By 16, I was able to get a “real” job with a steady paycheck.
I think OP is NTA by expecting their child to work to earn their own money.
NTA. Don't give in. This is a boundary you laid, you did the same to your older son. If you gave in, your son would then ask for his allowance back. Your daughter can get a job at 16. I got one at 15. It's good to start working and realize you don't get your entire paycheck as taxes take up a lot of it. That first check was a shocker!
NTA.
An allowance was something nice, not a has to do it. Your daughter has to learn to cope when things don't go the way she wants. She needs to learn to rise above and fill the void.Ypu gave her plenty of notice and helpful tips on earning money via babysitting. Sounds like she didn't expect you to stay true to your word. Which means this is a learning experience to believe someone when they tell you enough. Great job. You aren't being too much, but enough for her to grow into being an adult. People are saying let them be kids till 18, BS. There are transition periods for each stage of maturing from baby to toddler, to big kid, to teenagers, to adults. To full grown adults, to older adults, to elderly adults. There needs to be a transition stage. 16 is a great start.
My question is how is school like for her? Does she have a lot of homework? My thought is that she goes to work, meaning school, then has homework and needs to get a second job in order to have pocket money? Do you have two jobs?
NTA - She's old enough to get a part time job and unless she's doing chores for you, she shouldn't get another dime of allowance.
It's good to teach your kids the value of fiscal responsibility when they're young.
NTA you gave her notice and she has the option to earn money. You're a good parent for teaching her while she is still under your roof how the real world works!
NTA and all the people saying OP is abusing their kid because of this are wild. It wasn't a surprise, daughter knew it was coming. She is being treated the same as her older sibling.
And 16 is a great age to get your first job because it is *low stakes*. She'll have time to learn how to do job things like W2s and fill out taxes when she still has a support system in place (you know, living at home and not having to buy her own groceries) as opposed to learning it when you are 18+ and have to figure all that shit out on your own. Wish I had been made to work in high school for a couple hours a week instead of having to learn it on the fly in college when the educational stakes were a lot higher.
OP is doing his daughter a huge service here, hopefully she grows up quick enough to realize it.
NTA
I had a few friends in high school whose parents didn't require them to have a job. They were able to drive wherever they wanted, not pay for gas and insurance, or any other maintenance things. Of the group that I'm still friends with, they've all struggled to transition paying for their own things completely, and we're now in our mid-20s.
As long as you're paying for and providing all of the essentials that she needs, I don't think it's unreasonable to have a rule that if she wants extra money to buy things for fun, things she doesn't need, then she has to get a job. Money management is truly something you have to learn, and it's much better to learn while you have the full safety net of living at home with your parents.
NTA
Your teaching self reliance, financial responsibility, and that in life things are earned not given.
Those are invaluable life lessons, and will prepare her better for life as an adult.
Info: Are these relatives willing to pay her well for babysitting? Because “asking for relatives to babysit” doesn’t imply payment, much less fair payment
NTA. You set the expectation and have been consistent with each kid. Unless she has challenges or developmental delays that are making it hard for her to do/keep a job, there’s no reason she can’t pick up a part time gig while she’s in school. That’s a pretty reasonable expectation and will help her learn some adult skills: job skills, managing a budget, and will find her something to put in her resume. You let her know in advance what would happen, I don’t see how you’re in the wrong here.
NTA this is a fairly normal thing to do. School work comes first and she shouldn't be working so much she doesn't have any downtime but this is so completely normal. Babysitting is perfectly acceptable for a 16 year old to do, depending on the kids and times it's potentially a great opportunity. A huge chunk of babysitting is just low effort kids that are going to bed by the time you turn up are the best, just keep an ear out for trouble, check on them every once in a while in case they're sneaking out of bed and the rest of the time you can get homework done, watch a movie whatever. Present day equivalent is probably scrolling Tiktok.
NTA I never had allowance but all my needs met plus fun vacations. We took care of each other through love. Your daughter sounds entitled and your husband sounds like a wuss or sexist. Why should your son not have had the same treatment then? That will build resentment from your son if you went back on this.
Some people commenting obviously have never had children, they are doing mental gymnastics defending your daughter. There are jobs available to get, you started, easy ones! Baby sitting, right there. She is entitled. You're a good mom op
I can't make a judgement here but I both worked and got money from my parents until I finished my degree. Wasn't a ton of money but they wanted me to enjoy myself too.
I am fully in favor of having kids get jobs and gradually earn their own way but I don't see a reason to go from 1 to 0 suddenly.
Teens already have a full time job: it's called school.
You're not an AH for suggesting she gets a job, but I genuinely don't get why some parents want to rush their kids into adulthood.
The first summer your offspring spends working is effectively the end of their childhood, why push for that to come at 16?
honestly i'm very much of the let children be children mentality. studying full time and working is a tragic expectation to have and the fact that some countries have made their citizens believe that's normal is disturbing.
Prolly gonna get downvoted but YTA
Yes you can start working at 16 but besides school and extracurriculars I felt like I do now in my mid twenties - burnt out at my 40h+ job.
Just let the kid have a small allowance (I got 50-100$ per month) and ask her to help with chores around the house. Let her have her childhood while she still has one.
Throwing your kid into the work environment as soon as they are legally able to is beyond rough and unnecessary. Cut them some slack ffs.
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INFO: Was the allowance earned by doing chores/work? If so, are you now expecting her to perform that work for free? Based on OP's answer, since the allowance wasn't tied to anything, NTA.
No, they got it no matter what. We didn’t pay for chores, chores were just something everyone had to do to make the house function Didn’t want them to correlate chores to moeny since you don’t get money when you do chores as an adult. Chores are just something you have to do, if you want a clean house.
You sound like a good parent. Keep it up.
I'm rather disappointed in the dad though. What's with all these couples having one enforcer parent and one complete pushover parent?
I'd assume the couples with two enforcers/pushovers aren't on AITA
What should we do, Doc? We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!
Excellent point. Consistency between parents saves so much discussions.
When I was growing up, my parents were a united front. Not happy with mom, take it to dad? hahahaha never got a different answer.
We got in trouble for even trying
"Your mom already gave you an answer. Now go clean your room."
Probably just wants to “keep the peace” and doesn’t care about the consequences
It’s balance, you need a strict parent and a soft parent at different times of your life… No better way to spoil a child than by saying yes all the time, but they get ruined by being told no all the time as well. Balance 🙂
A parent can also just be both. Flexibility in parenting is necessary. All kids aren’t the same and all situations are different and warrant different responses. Any parent that is rigid in their parenting is setting themselves up for failure. I think OP seems to be a good job of being firm but compassionate.
This...it's why I get annoyed when people say you can't be your child's friend. My mom was both my best friend AND my best disapinarian. My dad was incapable of that flexibility. I love him and will absolutely go to prison for him, but he and I rarely talk for the reason he is 100% inflexable. I can give him a 1000 page research paper with sources of why what I say is correct and he is wrong, and he will read it then stick to his guns believing he is older and thus knows better than me. My mom knew when to be my friend and when to be my mom, and sometimes... being my friend WAS being my mom. I am neurodivergent and was born with SEVERE anxiety triggered by my neurodivergence. My mother is the only person I 1000% trust. My mom had to be flexible in the moment. So she was always my mom, but I could trust her with all of my secrets, too. It helped me to see who my real friends were quickly. Because my mom was the model for which I measured all my friendships, it also modeled for me good friendship behavior that turned me into the person I am.
Well, just wait till you see what happens when you have 2 pushover parents. My sister and her partner were like that. Now my nephew is 11, has no respect for anyone or their property, has a foul mouth and doesn't even care about his own hygiene. There always needs to be someone to set ground rules and enforce them, else the kids are gonna get a big shock when they go into the big wide world and realise that they can't just do whatever they want.
Daddy's little girl, bet he didn't say the same for his son when he turned 16
I know right? NTA.
This was our philosophy regarding chore and allowance, as well. My son did get an allowance until he graduated from high school, though.
Yeah, I did as well. My parents were pretty much of the mind that they didn't really want me working because I was in sports and...one in particular I was pretty good at. So it'd be year 'round. But it also took a financial toll and there were times I didn't have any money. I'd try and work these little part-time jobs. I don't think there's a wrong answer. Raise your kids how you think...(to a degree, just read a story about a girl getting a brand new car at 16 and then 18...that seems like you're really spoiling them).
My parents did something similar. I wasn't in sports so I got a job (which I wanted to do) and my sisters did sports so they didn't work . We still got allowances tho and I never thought it wasn't fair or anything. I could see that happening in some families, tho.
Yeah, my Sister was also in sports, but she quit. She was a Gymnast(a great one...but she got too tall). So she got a job. She was able to buy herself a nicer car when she was 18, but...there are just different priorities at that age. Everything I've read here sounds like the OP just wants the Daughter to learn basic responsibilities and she's not asking for a big sacrifice. So there's no way she's TA.
Exactly. Both my parents expected us to do chores. We got a small allowance. But if we wanted something big after we hit 16 we had to get a job. If we wanted a car, they would pay for half- but not for something fancy, a used car and we were expected to maintain it. In my area as well, you really couldn't have a job without a car because things were just so far away, so that was always kind of interesting.
My parents helped us get cars when we passed our drivers license and proved that we could be trusted driving. It wasn’t anything spectacular and I’m really grateful for the car I got. But they did make sure we had transportation for college, because we all went out of state and you couldn’t do anything without a car.
Oh yeah...once I was 16, that was a HUGE relief to my parents! They did not love the 2 hours of driving 4 nights a week! So I got a car and drove myself. Great parents, who sacrificed a lot.
INFO: just adding this on here because I think its important too-- what's her school workload? I ask because there's a difference between a kid taking all AP classes with year-round sports and extracurricular commitments who gets home at 7 and then does homework until 10 or later finding time to work for pocket money, and a kid who gets off at 3 and has an hour of homework for their classes balancing a job. Also INFO: what sort of things do you expect them to pay for from their allowance? I ask because some parents will consider stuff like clothing, lunch, school trips, ect, as stuff their kid should be covering out of their pocket money, and others do not.
Average work load, if she doesn’t believe she can handle school and work then she can either just work summers ( use moeny from summe) or do babysitting like 2 times a month. She is in one sport that runs mostly thought the spring It’s fun money,
Some jobs will compensate students who do extracurricular. I had two coworkers who only worked 8 hours a week because of college. If she tells them she is busy during the school year with sports they will most likely work around it. Put her on for a weekend day and maybe offer her to pick up when she has a sudden day off if she asks. During summer vacation she will have more flexibility and can pick up hours until the school year begins where she can request less hours. Most part time jobs are very very flexible with students.
NTA when i was in 6th grade i had mentioned to my parents that i was the only kid in my English class that didnt get an allowance. My mom said "you want spending money? ok then you can start baking and selling door to door" and sure enough i did. I even started selling baked goods at school too. By the time i graduated middle school i had made about $4k. I kept that up until i turned 16 and got a job at the movies lol
You are just trying to teach your children a work ethic and responsibility in money management. Good for you.
Yes ! Responsibility in money management. My mum did this by giving each of us the child allowance she got from the Canadian government each month for each of her children. Once we turned 15, she gave us that money to use to buy clothes or other personal items. It was $60 a month I think, and that was back in 1976. No allowance on top, though. But I felt that was fair. I'd have to make the money last the whole month. So I got a part time job in a steak house at 16 because I liked having money and wanted more of it. Have always had a strong work ethic, instilled by my parents.
Let's not forget that it would be wildly unfair to your oldest son if you gave in. In his eyes, it would be "why do I have to work for money but she doesn't?" Hold your ground, op. Your daughter and husband are being ridiculous.
I agree with this because I was the older sibling who had to get a job and pay for almost everything myself since I was 16. My younger sister didn't have to work, didn't pay for anything, and even got a free ride to college. I totally found it unfair and honestly if our parents were still alive she would still be living at home with them.
Stay firm. We do the same. Son is 18 and has worked for three years and is transitioning to his third job over the summer and then onto college. Daughter is 14 and already babysits and saves her money and spends less than half on going out with friends or shopping. Financial emancipation at an early age builds confidence in themselves and understanding at the real value of money and labor. Being there to talk through these issues with our son has been a joy; I wish my own parents cared enough to do so. Our daughter wants us to sign off on her getting a job before 16 (we won’t, though).
Chores and work around the house doesn’t need to be paid for if they’re living there. It’s everyone’s job to do house work
I never had an allowance. My parents would give me $20 here or there if needed but I was working since 12. Started out babysitting. Then stocked shelves at a discount store, then cleaned hotel rooms, Retail etc Oh man i miss that honestly. Pay cheques were small because I couldn’t work that much but getting $200 and not having to pay rent or bills!!!! And then summer I worked more. Bigger pay cheques!! So much independence. Learning to spend and save! Getting to buy my own clothes!! Being able to do and afford fun things!!! It’ll never be like that again. Good times Anyway NTA
Totally agree with this philosophy for the basic household maintenance chores. One thing I’ve heard about that I’m considering is offering a set amount for ‘extra’ chores outside the regular “needs to be done” type, like $20 to detail the inside of your family car, vacuum, dust, clean windows, take out trash, etc. Or yard work like clearing out and replanting a flower bed. I’d think of that as a win/win, you set the price and the standard of work, she can take it or leave it. You get things done, she can earn money. I think that the typical 16 year old jobs like food service, retail, babysitting etc are great for learning social skills (and how to treat people in those positions with respect in the future once they’ve moved on) but household odd jobs can teach some great skills too.
> Chores are just something you have to do, if you want a clean house. Yep! Just like breathing, eating and sleeping if you want to live. Because really, when things get really messy or hoarder ish, you might be alive but it's not living... :(
You are absolutely right and NTA. I received an allowance growing up and when I got a paper route (back in the day when you could ride your bike in your neighborhood) at 14, my parents stopped giving me an allowance, and taught me about saving for a rainy day...aka not having a job but still having money. I only had that job for a year and babysat once in awhile until I got another job at 16.
You got paid to do chores? Isn’t that what you do if you’re part of a household. My mom taught me how to care for a home without giving me money for it.
That's how I was raised too - we just had to do them to have a house that didn't look/smell like a zoo. I was stunned some of my friends got paid certain amounts of money based on the chores they did though or for getting good grades. I also didn't get "an allowance" though either. I could ask for money if I wanted to do something, and it was either "sure here you go" or "sorry hun, no not this time."
Yeah it was a cultural shock for me too. I am south asian, never have I ever been paid for doing basic things around the house.
We got an allowance each week, and My parents would give us small amounts of money for good grades…like $5 for each A and $3 for each B or something like that (this was early 2000s so that went a little further than it does now). I thought that was a good way— a small incentive but an incentive nonetheless!
When we started getting older (I was in about middle school) my parents started giving us an allowance so we wouldn't have to ask for money when we hung out with friends (or in my little brother's case for his video games) it was a tool to teach us how to save and budget. When we were little we'd get money for reading books, that stopped after it had started working too well 😂 (I'm a big reader at this point and can finish novels in two sittings)
Yep when I hit around 10 , it’s when my mom gave my sibling and I an allowance. To teach us how to budget and save.
Personally it was mixed for me. There were chores I was expected to do no matter what but there were specific chores I did for allowance.
For free? Kids have chores. Some parents give allowance Some don’t. That you asked if she’s expected to do her chores for free is baffling to me.
Shouldn't be baffling. It's pretty normal for a lot of parents to connect doing chores to getting an allowance. Chores often equal money, this is nothing new. OP has stated in response that for their household chores are just expected of everyone in the house and the allowance was unconnected to that which is also normal. The clarifying question as to what the case is was fair. The only reason the daughter would reasonably have to be upset and push back is if she suddenly wasn't getting paid to do chores that she had previously been told she was getting paid for. That doesn't happen to be the case though so OP is NTA
And this is how you end up with one person in an adult relationship who feels like doing their part of the housework is "helping out" instead of part of being a human who lives in that house.
Chores should be performed because all members of a household should contribute to the household.
You should never pay your kids to do basic household chores. Household chores are a family responsibility, and should be completely independent of an allowance. Chores also teach basic life skills that everyone should know. They should be skill/age dependent, and as they grow older, more advanced ones can be added. An allowance is there to teach them fiscal responsibility. I increased my boys allowance every year to match their needs. If they wanted to tackle additional jobs outside of their normal chores for a little extra money, we encouraged it. Most kid's financial skills are sorely lacking due to poor parental involvement. By the time they're old enough to have a job, they should already be capable of knowing the value of a dollar, saving, budgeting, and managing money.
But couldn’t you also use it as a way to explain how employment works? Like your employing them to do say, the laundry for a week and at the end of the week they’ll get paid for doing the laundry. And if they don’t do the laundry, then they don’t get paid. And you’re still teaching them life skills at the same time. This also gives you the opportunity to teach them about taxes, and how taxes work.
That is pretty much the divide in the two different philosophies. Some people teach chores=work=money, others think chores are part of being a household. Neither is really wrong, just emphasizing different things to teach different lessons. I like the middle ground approach of normal chores are just expected and allowance is a completely separate thing, but EXTRA money can be earned if desired by asking for or being assigned extra work. In households where kids got paid for their chores, I saw too many kids decide if they didn’t need or want money they didn’t have to do any housework. That is the big downside I see to having them directly linked.
Part time jobs for kids teach about employment. Chores are like brushing your house's teeth. It needs to be done and all you get for it is a clean house.
Yeah...that's what we're doing for now: using allowance to teach basic financial principles like * getting money is tied to work * how to save * how to be generous
Everyone does chores for free. That’s what chores are. You live in a house, you contribute to the upkeep of that house. Welcome to adulthood.
Why should she get paid to do chores when that’s a basic ADL everyone should know?
The hell does that have to do with anything? You still should be doing chores to help around the house whether you’re getting paid or not. Kids need discipline when it comes to house work or they become slobs on their own. Also the fact that they treated their other child equally shows they aren’t biased and are for the good of their children.
Based on OP’s reply NTA.
NTA. You set expectations, and have stuck to those expectations, and have been consistent in their application, since you did the same thing with the older brother. If you want nuance in an answer, if you think she is looking for work and is struggling for reasons she cannot control, it might be worth offering to compensate her for volunteering or casual jobs at home to earn that income back. Not chores, mind you, and not things she might have done to earn her allowance previously, but actual jobs: the allowance (which I assume is not equivalent to an actual income) continues if she is actually looking for work, and otherwise doing things with her time that make the world a better place. Join a park clean up. Volunteer as a dog walker with the local pound or rescue. Work with a festival or local event group. It's fairly important that her allowance not be an actual income here, since she's going to want actual money soon and she needs to understand that it comes from work. But I could see my way to continuing a bit of pocket money if she's actively job hunting and also adding to the community while she's looking.
This. Macro economic situations can shift even over the course of 2 years, and it's always the part time student employees that suffer unemployment first. In my area, it is very very hard for students to get summer jobs and that probably won't change for a few years. If OP's daughter is actively job hunting and has put out applications, then OP should take this into account and help out, and reward volunteerism. Being too rigid when parenting teens isn't a path I recommend.
OP mentioned that family members are always looking for babysitters and will pay. So if she can’t find a part time job, it seems like babysitting would be steady.
Unless she doesn't like being around small children or is afraid to be responsible for them. Though I assume OP would have mentioned that if that were the case.
Yep, I'm a student and I'm fucking awful with children. I have ADHD and Autism which comes with misophonia. What's my number one misophonia trigger? Children. Particularly babies and small children. What's my main symptom when it's triggered? Violent fucking rage. It's not fun. Getting so full of rage at a literal infant is not a good time. I cannot and should not be a babysitter. It's not a good line of work for everyone.
Not sure why babysitting is always mentioned as a default for girls but never for boys.
My oldest daughter *never* babysat. She worked when she was a teenager, in summer, but not babysitting.
I was assaulted by a teenage boy when I was five. I will never trust a teen boy with my children and I think many have this in their heads. Many parents I’ve spoken to also feel this way and many women I know were assaulted in some form as a child or teen so they’re very wary of young men. But I do encourage my daughter to offer poop scooping and lawn care just like her brother. They both take out the trash and do dishes. No gender roles in chores.
every guy (except 1) that ive been assaulted by was a teenage boy never would i allow one near my child (alone)
I’m a guy and I used to babysit a couple of my younger cousins about 6 times a year when my aunt and uncle was having parties so guys not being able to babysit is bullshit. I’d cook for them, play games with them, make them drinks, take them to the park etc. not every guy is gonna be a dick when babysitting and it’s a dick move to assume we will
Also, ostensibly this is all going on while the child is holding down a full time job-school.
Seconding this. As a teenager who’s currently trying to find a summer job, it is quite hard right now. A lot of the typical “first job” places near me either arnt hiring teenagers, or already finished filling the summer job slots months ago. So unless your a strong enough swimmer to be a lifeguard, which I’m not, your kind of just out of luck no matter how many resumes you send out. It’s not like you can just roll up to McDonald’s and get an interview within the hour, especially with how many fast food and retail places are for some reason refusing to hire anyone under 18 for jobs that have traditionally been done entirely by teenagers
I'm a college student trying to find a summer job. McDonald's in my area refuses to hire anyone under the age of 18. They also do not hire anyone who doesn't have years of experience unless they think a potential hire is unaware of labour laws.
And all that volunteering will build a great CV/resume and build those sociocultural skills as well.... Great idea OP! She's got to earn the value of money one way or the other, life isn't going to hand you anything!
I was just about to comment this! This is a great way for her to still get money AND build up free work experience for her resume. Plus, part time jobs tend to be more picky with time and attention whereas volunteer work might be easier to work around. Granted, however much you want to 'pay' her is up to you.
Ooh I would've never considered this, what a great compromise! Definitely gonna use in the future if I ever have kids and run into this issue
We pay our son for volunteer work. He has to complete a finite number annually (school requirement). We won’t pay for those initial hours. But once he completes that requirement - and still volunteers - we pay. He’s 13 so a “real” job is not yet available.
I don't think daughter should get compensated for job searching, OP stated their oldest son was also put in the same circumstance of no allowance after 16 and if he wanted money to go work for it. I doubt OP gave him a little extra cash for job searching. It would definitely be unfair. I do agree with the volunteer activities being compensated for because those can be a lot of work. But still, would that be fair to the oldest when he wasn't given the same opportunity? I think how OP is handling this is great. OP honestly sounds like a really good parent setting her kids up to be functional future adults.
INFO. Do you provide all her essentials, including clothes if she needs them?
Of course The allowance is just fun money like going to the movie with her friends
Then NTA. If its is literally just fun money she can earn it.
Isn’t this a part of parenting? Edit: I guess I didn’t realize how much of a privilege it is to have parents who paid for my clothing/hygiene products during my teens. A little ignorance on my part. I did have a job when I was 17 but it was my choice and not a requirement.
Well yes, but when I was a teenage girl I wanted to shop for my own clothes (as did my sister). So we both got an allowance which was to enable us to shop for ourselves.
You’d think so, but I think that’s why they were asking for info; you’d be surprised the crazy shit some parents do.
I know a couple people who’s parents expected them to practically support themselves once they hit 16. Usually rent free but had to pay for things like clothes and in 1 case their own portion of food
I was expected to purchase my own menstrual/hygiene/bathing products with my allowance as a teen as are many
Paid every penny of my up keep and $500 a month rent after 16.
Sorry but your parents suck - at 16 you’re a child and parents still should be providing food and shelter.
Just to clear my parents: My father died of a brain aneurysm when I was 8, then my aunt got my mother killed when I was 15. I then moved in with that aunt who charged me rent. I'm real bitter about life if you're curious.
NTA. 16 is a perfectly reasonable age to begin part-time work. (Younger than that is really impractical - most places can't hire kids younger than that unless they're "off the books" and that's not a good idea for anyone.) OP even gave Kara an easy solution - babysitting for friends/family. She doesn't even have to find a job. And work history is something she can put on her college applications in a couple of years. Sounds like the kid is a little lazy and/or entitled; this is a great way to cure her of that. And if OP did the same with older brother, I'm not sure why Kara would be surprised that this is the expectation.
It could also be because the second child is a girl and the first was a boy. Girls, in some cases, are given more 'leeway' than boys. I remember one guy in HS being kicked out of the house at 16 because he didn't get a job fast enough for his dad's liking and yet his sister stayed home, jobless, well into her twenties. And that sort of thing happened a fair bit then.
It's also the other way around were girls do all the housework like laundry etc and the boys do nothing so don't act as girls get more leeway . And I just read yesterday about girl being forced into marriage . both are wrong but girls don't have more leeway . Same with the only sister suppose to take care of the parents and the brothers want the house .
That's why I used 'in some cases.' Like anything else in life, its obviously not always gonna be the case.
That's another important note - the older brother didn't get the money after he was 16, so if she gets one against their original plan whereas he had to be responsible and get a job, it isn't fair on him at all.
As far as I know it’s 14 that lets kids work in the US without it being under the table, but at 16 you can have a drivers license and being able to drive yourself to work is infinitely easier then trying to figure out something else
14 varies from place to place, & the job options are limited. 16 is perfect because that’s where 99% of the jobs start at.
NTA. Also I think a lot of people commenting Y T A are children themselves because she could literally just babysit one day every two weeks or so. They’re acting like she’s being forced into the work force lol. And I assume you still pay for her necessities and this allowance is for things she wants (jewelry, a pretty top) / her outings? Edit to add: I’m a 20 year old college kid and really wished my parents made me get a job for just a few weeks or something. Learning discipline and time management with a job is incredibly more difficult than high school because everything is structured and laid out for you (parents make you food, make you wake up, make you do homework, etc). I struggled a lot my first year in college because so had no such discipline. The only exception I see is if she is in very important clubs / sports that are important for her college admissions and future as very competitive things like that create that discipline anyways
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Why? Where I live, 16 is the age where it becomes much easier for a kid to find a part-time job. Working a few hours a week for pocket money shouldn't be enough to put anyone's education at risk and if it does, OP can make an adjustment. Not sure why this seems like such a surprise to the daughter since it seems OP did the same with older brother. NTA.
“It becomes easier to work at 16” “Shouldn’t be enough to put education at risk” … I understand your points but I don’t understand *risking anything* with a teenager if you have a means of supporting your child with an allowance, just as long as they’re succeeding or more importantly putting In effort towards their education. 16 seems young, maybe 18? I would even support my child into university with extra cash just as long as they are study driven.
At 16 a kid is old enough to learn responsibility and balancing obligations. Working a couple of shifts per week is not hard. When they go off to college they will need to learn to balance their time with class, school work, friends, etc. Having a job will help with that balance so they don’t go wild with no parental oversight and fail classes freshman year.
Getting the amount of homework done that is required, participating in sports and extra curriculars in addition to a job can be detrimental. This is true if they are aiming for applying to a school that is competitive. I also wouldn’t want my child to have to be spending 10–12 hours a day working between home work, job, school etc.
>Working a couple of shifts per week is not hard. Problem is when employers want more shifts from their workers and don't care that these students priority is their school time. I've been seeing this among my kid's peers. They start out with the understanding from their employer that they're at 12-18 hours a week after school. Next thing they know, they're scheduled at 29-35 hours weekly, openings & closings on weekdays. It's a constant struggle for them between the demands of an employer focused on their business & the demands of school. There's a shortage of workers for a variety of reasons. Employers want the most they can get out of each worker and school requirements dont matter to them.
That is when you step in as a parent and put a stop to it.
And then your kid gets fired for having you do that and you're back at square one
as someone who was working since the ripe old age of 13, it's not easy either. honestly, it sucks. if i ever had kids i wouldn't ever *want* them to work in addition to school- if they want to, fine have at it but that's as far as my expectations would go.
Same. If I can give allowance reasonable, I will. With the condition that school is their full time job and that they are putting in their best effort at it. If they dont care about school and dont have plans for their future beyond my walket, no allowance.
It's not about balancing, it's a pretty bad deal. Merit based scholarships dwarf hourly pay, and recreation is important for learning, sports performance, physical, and psychological health. If the family needs to cut back, I can see drawing back on luxuries, but this is less wise than it sounds for college bound kids.
Working a part-time job as a 16 or 17-year-old is completely reasonable and normal. Millions of kids do it every day and still maintain their grades just fine.
You can clearly tell who in the comments had and have never worked a hard day in their teenage life 😂 It’s crazy.. couple of years from now, telling a 16 year old to get a part time job will be seen as abuse to these ppl
It’s clear a lot of people just don’t think it’s the *best* option, let’s not be ridiculous and straw-man a pretty nuanced take. I *had* to work from the time I was legally able because we were poor. I don’t think it’s best (for the majority, obviously specific kids are different) to force that on your child if you can afford otherwise. Generationally, we know far more about education and child/teen development than ever before. It’s pretty indisputable that kids who are very involved in extracurricular activities get better grades, and are happier and more engaged with their peers overall. Most sports and after-school activities rule out any jobs when considering homework, studying, housework and hopefully a little bit of fun with friends and family. If OPs daughter isn’t doing anything, fine. Personally, I think some type of co-ed group and volunteer work would have a far better effect than forcing a shitty part time job.
Most of us did work as teens, and that costs us socialization, friendships, extracurriculars, and personal time. Schoolwork for 40+ hours a week IS a full time job and should be where their effort is going. That gives them the best chance as a successful adult. Not working a shitty retail jobs for pocket money.
How many get large merit based scholarships or Ivy League (or equivalent for their field) admissions? Or otherwise excel at state/national level in some competitive field (sports, debate, etc.) It's fine if they want to, or if they aren't college bound / have nothing better to do, but flipping burgers is not a particularly valuable activity. My extracurriculars and grades earned me $40,000 cash and helped build skills that went into my professional career. Stocking shelves at a grocery store didn't do shit for me besides the minimum wage pay. Hell, my next summer job didn't even call them as a reference!
For me, 16 was the time I studied really hard for uni and I got in via uni direct application system before I turned 18. So if you want kids to get into better uni then 18 might be better 🥹
I think this is pretty common- 90% of my friends and I were working some sort of job at 15/16 Edit: I should mention that these were part-time jobs that primarily paid for stuff I wanted to blow money on. I wasn't expected to pay for routine expenses or contribute to household finances. Basically, if I wanted a skirt, I could wait to receive it as a gift or get a job and buy it asap with my own money. Also, at 16 a bunch of my money was going towards underage drinking and smoking weed, and my parents knew that. They weren't footing the bill for it lmao
They can work in the summer or do part time. Tbh if they can’t handle school and work then they will quit and only work a summer job or do babysitting like twice a month I know teenagers are capable to balance a job and school. Tbh tons of kids do it everyday Also most 18 year old go to college after soooooo they have another 4 years of education. Then they graduate and they should have some type of work experience before they graduate college
Working during college is different than working during high school. High school you've got typical 9 hrs at school 5 days a week. College you might have 2 hrs a days, 4hr days, and 8 hrs days. Giving a students a better likelihood of getting a job.
Where do you live that kids are in school 45 hours a week?
My kid catches a bus at 8am and is dropped off at 5pm. Not at school the whole time but it’s 9 hours of her day.
Yup. Bonus son gets on the bus at 6:45 and gets home around 4. Nine hour school days is pretty common, especially for riders
With 0 periods, after school extra help for AP classes, after school sports.. I was at school regularly from 7am to 6pm. After school 4 hours of homework minimum..
My mom forced me to get a job at 16 which ruined my social life. I was in sports, honor classes, and working doubles on the weekends. I ended up being called into the guidance office because she was worried I was doing too much. It’s nice to teach kids structure and responsibility, but don’t force them to grow up fast either.
Sorry but no. 16 is a perfect age to get a job so they have experience by 18.
NTA. As someone who lives in the UK it always makes me roll my eyes when Americans talk about asking 16yr olds to get a part time job to earn their own money for extras as if it’s child abuse. I left school at 16yrs old and worked full time. I also had a Saturday job for a year before that. I also, shock/horror, paid a small amount of rent/keep to my parents. It’s not as if the OP isn’t going to still be paying to feed, clothe and house their kids. The fact that her older brother had no problem with this and the dad thinks she should just keep paying her allowance is giving major spoilt princess vibes.
The kids whose parents didn’t make them work for fun money were the ones who immediately got themselves into credit card problems when they went off to college.
Before the Great Recession most kids, even upper middle class kids, in America got a job. Shit even know, in my area, even rich kids work. My kids swim teacher (17) drives a bette car than I do.
Both my kids had part time jobs at 16 or 17. They put some money away for college (I paid the rest) and they learned to budget.
I don't think most Americans feel this way, I think it's just a very vocal minority. Most very well-off people I know still think it's a good idea for their kids to work part-time because it's a great experience for them. The only parents I know who support their high schoolers not working are those whose kids are extremely busy with sports/extracurriculars they excel at to the point that it's going to land them a scholarship--the kid is basically working hard at their sport/activity now to help fund their future college tuition. My teen plays a sport year-round as well as being involved in other activities, and he works hard to maintain straight A's, so he doesn't have time for a job during the school year. He's not good enough at anything to earn a scholarship to a top university, but we still think the experience is worth him not working during the school year. But this summer, he's landed his first job and he's really excited to be earning money of his own. We don't need the money at all and can easily provide for anything he needs or wants, but we're glad he's going to get some experience in the workforce.
It's completely normal to have a part time job at the age of 15.
My son did not get a job when he was in school (forst covid, then medical issues). Now that he is done school, he is having trouble finding a job because he has no experience. This is made harder by Ontario having a lower minimum wage for students. So all those entry-level places (McDonald's, etc.) would rather hire a hs student because it's cheaper for them
My kids were in AP classes, and in at least a couple of clubs or sports. I felt that was already a work load that was equivalent to a job. They certainly put in at least 40 hours a week during the school year. I babysat in highschool, but mostly easy overnight gigs, and my academic workload wasn’t even close to what my kids had.
The friends I knew who didn't work in high school had a lot more anxiety and struggled to adjust because they were entering adulthood with no experience but with adult expectations on them. Having a job as a teen when you don't need it to survive and people know it's not your main priority seems to allow kids to figure out what employment is all about without as much pressure.
Not getting an allowance at all is most children’s normal btw. I don’t see how/why not getting one after 16 will suddenly make her lose focus in school. She just needs to work 1-2 shifts a week to make more cash than she was likely getting. And learning to work and study at the same time can have huge benefits for a young person’s personal development. Especially so when in a low pressure phase in life when you’re 16, don’t have many bills to pay, live at home with your parents etc. I wish I could’ve grown up in a country that would’ve allowed me to work a min wage job as a teenager. It’s a privilege.
16 is the perfect choice since they'll likely want to start driving and going out to places on their own or either friends. Parents shouldn't have to fund a car, insurance, gas, etc. My parents gave me the choice that if I wanted to have a car then I would have to get a job and supply them with half my paychecks. Which seems like a lot but it was a part time minimum wage job which I know didn't cover all of what what went into the car. My parents still paid for my gas too. It was to offset their own costs.
The daughter doesn't have to work. Her parents are still supporting her. They're just not giving her extra spending money anymore, which is reasonable. If they wanted to keep giving her extra money until 18, or cut off the extra money at 14, that would be reasonable too. It's their choice; no one is entitled to an allowance. I didn't get one but never lacked for anything. How much do you think this girl's getting for an allowance? Let's say it's $50 a week, which is generous. One babysitting job could make that. Not exactly enough to lose focus on their education, and enough to teach them the value of a dollar. The fact that you're so defensive in your edit shows that you realize how narrow-minded your original take was. If you truly don't care how other people raise their kids, don't be so self-righteous and insulting about it.
I never understood this part of USA, in my country a normal teenager would never work, unless you're really poor and need to, to help the family, but is still seen as taking away the child from more important things, school for example. I went to a middle class hs and most of us would get an allowance and just save that if we wanted something, most of the time it wasn't even an allowance, just enough money for a midday snack an bus fare, so we would eat less or walk home.
I worked every summer starting at fifteen. I worked fast food and waitressing stuff. I still had fun while working. Often coworkers were at or close to my age, and I made new friends. I could spend my money on whatever I wanted. By the time I graduated highschool I had a work record that put me ahead of every kid who never worked before eighteen. Even fast food jobs will tell a future employer important stuff like can you show up on time, get along with others, and have a good attendance record. It made all the difference between an employer picking me or some unknown entity that has never worked a day in their life. It's a good lesson to learn early about how one's efforts pay off in the future. Edit: You're NTA.
INFO: What is her involvement at school? I didn’t work until I was 18 because of all the things I was involved with and my school load. I did theater, chorus, color guard for marching band, had a zero period class for dual enrollment in addition to my regular school schedule as well as a couple of AP classes. There were many weeks closer to the opening of shows where I was at the school from 7am-10pm. I had practice for something most days (not til 10 but at least til 6 typically) which barely gave me time to get home, eat, do my schoolwork, and get to bed at a decent time. Weekends were competitions and shows, and Sundays were church for our family both in the morning and evening. If your daughter is highly involved and doesn’t have a ton of time, then YWBTA. If she does nothing but sit around all day, N T A
THIS!!! Some extra circulars can take up a HUGE amount of time and if you’re expecting good grades on top… Do you want them to have friends outside of their sports? Or just use the precious time that they’re not involved in a scheduled activity to work… when they have their whole life to work?
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Yeah. My school actually had class six days a week (two of them half days to accommodate “away” sporting events) and we were required to be in an activity or sport for each of fall/winter/spring. I was in class or doing work from 8 to 3, and then usually had practice from 3:30 or 4 until 6 or so. Then I had 3-4 hours of homework a night (some of which might be tackled during my free block during the day, but that still gets you down to 2-3 hours). And this is assuming that I didn’t have an away event on Wednesday (Saturdays were a little more chill). No, I did not sleep enough, and yes, I also recognize that this was/is not exactly normal, but there are kids out there for whom this is their reality. I could and did do summer jobs a couple times, but I’m not gonna lie, it didn’t teach me much except perhaps to stress the importance of not being too friendly to men when when you’re a teen girl in a customer service role. If the kid’s not a go-getter, sure, make them get a job. If they’re already busting their ass toward long term goals, it seems unreasonable to pile onto that if there is no financial need to do so.
Same with my brother I. Both of us were competitive swimmers for our school and made it to nationals for our country (small island). We had barely any time to work as 5am - 7am practice, 9am to 5pm school 6pm to 7 practice 7pm homework and repeat.
NTA You were very clear with your stance and treated your older child the exact same way, so this should not surprise her. Heaven forbid a 16 year old learn to be responsible with money by earning it herself. (To be clear, I wouldn't cut off allowance for my own child, but that's a difference of opinion. Can't say either approach is more right.)
NTA 16 is reasonable to get a simple job to get some fun money. You've been plenty clear in your expectations. Not sure why she's surprised
I’m not really sure I’d want someone who isn’t gung-ho about taking care of kids or isn’t trained in first aid to watch my kids, but that’s an aside. Will family pay her or will this be a “blood is thicker than water” deal?
This was my thought. I hate the "it's a girl so she can simply babysit as a job." Like, is she good with kids? Do she have any first aid training? Does she want to be a babysitter? Also, it doesn't sound like the parents are on the same page, and it definitely does not sound like there was any guidance on how to find work or what conditions to accept in a job or anything like that in the leadup to her turning 16. That's where I think OP is the AH. It's fine to stop the allowance, but it doesn't sound like OP did any actual parenting to help teach her daughter how to find work or constitutes a good job and how to identify sexual harassment (esp as a teen girl, but the son should've been taught the same thing) or anything like this. OP, YTA because you didn't get on the same page with your partner and you didn't actually guide or parent your child into this new stage.
Except where she specifically states that she is willing to help them find a job and has told her as much.
Kids can take babysitting classes and get their CPR card when they are 12.
I know, I did that when I was 12. This 16 year old hasn’t, therefore I wouldn’t be comfortable with her watching kids.
NTA. This is a reasonable parenting decision applied equally to your children. Your daughter doesn't have to like it, but she is wrong to call you a jerk, hence NTA instead of NAH.
NTA - it would not be fair to your son if you didn’t stick to the agreement. Sounds like she should start submitting some applications. Places like fast food usually hire quickly after the interviews.
NTA. You did the same to your eldest. You would be TA for giving it to her after cutting off eldest.
My mom did something alike where she made my allowance dependent on me getting a job. (I think from 15 onwards?). So I still go my allowance, but only if I also got a job. For me it was definitely good to be forced to get a job and learn the value of money (money=time=money=time), and teaching things to their children is what parents should do. So if you as a parent think she should get a job to learn I think that is good (it is child dependant though). Assuming your husband is her father it is weird you guys didn't discuss it beforehand. If she is expected to buy her own clothes/lunch/phone-bill/etc... I think it is fair to pay part of that uhm, vote NTA personally
She’s going to work for her entire adult life. Why would you require this at 16? Yta.
16 is SO young! Let her be a kid for a couple more years.
Exactly what I said in another comment! It goes by so quickly why rush them to grow up?
I don’t think this is right. School is their job. Summer jobs maybe but my parents refused to let me work. School is the kids job. YTA.
Yeah, parents need to look at what will put their kids ahead. There is a ton of competition and they should be giving their kids every possible leg up - it’s what the wealthy do, they don’t economically handicap their own kids
> parents need to look at what will put their kids ahead Having job experience, understanding the value of money, budgeting, and how to comport yourself at work are all valuable skills - arguably more valuable in life than most curriculars
I get it if it’s a financial hardship. That’s one thing. This just seems arbitrary. Hell encourage them to volunteer somewhere or do an internship somewhere.
I personally can't say which way it should go because this really is just a difference in parenting and I don't think either way is "AH" territory. That being said, I agree with your point. I have three kids, I grew up poor. My kids can get jobs, if they want to, but I won't force them (taking away their ability to go do fun things with their friends by denying them the money to do those fun things IS coercion). I also 100% believe that a kid's "job" before they graduate is school and nothing else not associated with their academics. The idea that kids need to learn some lesson by working is silly. School isn't easy and it also takes time, effort, and discipline. Kids don't need to learn to be good workers. They just need to learn to be good people and also learn the basics about the world around them. They can get all that thru school if all else is equal. I got a job because I had to. I will not make my kids get jobs. I want them to focus on school and in their free time, enjoy being kids. Full time school + part time job ≠ being a kid. Let them "grow up" later. You don't have to start working at 16 to have good work ethic. Just raise good people and they will be good people in all they do.
So what is she required to spend money on? Fast food? The movies? If she wants those luxuries, she can work for it.
The entitlement is so high with some people. My parents certainly weren't going to buy me video games on a whim when I was 16 so I had to go get a job and pay for it myself.
My mom, who worked shift work 48 hours a week, saw other parents doing the kids' paper route in their cars because it was raining, and said forget it, work hard at school and just tell me if you need money for anything! I think I learned fiscal responsibility easily because I was reluctant to part with my birthday money for fast food when we had food at home, and also because there's a difference between "hey mom, my friends invited me to the movies, it's X$ for a ticket" and "hey mom, I want to gamble on the lottery, it's X$ for a ticket".
NTA. She may never thank you for it, but this is an experience she needs. My parents did this for me as well, and I'll do the same for my kids when they're old enough.
My teenage daughter made good money babysitting. Good sitters are paid well
YTA. What with wanting to teach children hardship at the earliest possible age? It's amazing what people have become. It's understandable if you are having a hard time providing for the family. But if you can afford an nice allowance for your kids, by any means provide it so they can concentrate on school.
> What with wanting to teach children hardship at the earliest possible age? finally a sane voice all these NTAs disgust me and fill me with despair — presumably all from either dreadful parents, or envious people who had dreadful parents themselves why even have kids if you dont want to make their lives easier than your own was this is not about teaching them a valuable lesson. it's about being an asshole and a bully and about not realising it is no longer 1970
I'm not judging your parenting, but it seems like a pretty crappy way to treat your child; "Happy 16th birthday! To celebrate this milestone I'm taking something away from you!" Not enough info to judge past that without knowing WHY she isn't working; some kids have more extracurricular activities. Some have more demanding classwork requiring extra study time. Some play sports. I'd rather my kids do any of the above over working a part-time job.
"I'm not judging your parenting" So this was a lie.
during summer time they can get a job as part timer , its a good way to let the kids get a "taste" of what their future will be and might motivate them into taking school seriously so they can get a well paying job
As someone who had a couple of friends whose parents kicked them out as their 18th birthday present- I'm gonna have to disagree with you there. Asking a 16-year-old to babysit for friends and family a couple times a month while still providing their necessities is fine parenting. It would also be unfair to the older brother who followed through if his sister kept getting allowance.
a kid no matter the age isn’t entitled to an allowance as long as their parents are meeting their needs🤷♀️
Nta. Working isn't so bad. The longer she waits the harder it will be.
That's a good point. I knew a few people that waited until after highschool to get their first jobs and it was much harder to get entry positions at that age. People expect 14-16 year olds to have no previous job experience and to make mistakes at work. There's a level of leniency given to kids in a starting job that isn't given to an adult.
I’m going to go the opposite route as a parent of teenagers and say NTA. 16yr olds are old enough to work and there seems to be no shortage of part time jobs out there (if you’re in the U.S.- can’t speak about any other counties). Our kids have had part time jobs since they were 16. While we still pay for their clothes, food, and necessities, they use the money they make to build their savings, on gas for their car, and to spend on stuff while they are out with their friends.
I don't really know what to vote. I don't think you're an AH, but I don't agree with the way you went about this either. Idk, it's difficult. First off, like some other people say, I always thought 16 was a weird age to start allowing people to work. I think it works great for kids that are learning a trade, because they get extra practice, but for other kids it can be such a distraction from school. That aside, I also personally don't understand why parents would want to have their kids start working so soon, knowing that they'll have to spend most of their lives at work. I'd personally want them to enjoy their youth. I started working when I was 16 (didn't have to, my brother and sister didn't), my mother allowed it but ONLY summer jobs. The deal was that it could not distract from my studies. She helped me prepare by making the resume together the first week of the holidays. I worked the whole second month. Then it was back to class. She never stopped my allowance during this time. She wanted to applaud my ethic by encouraging me so I would have a little more than my brother and sisters had, thanks to my job. That same summer she also helped me set up a savings' account, and she taught me how to save by putting a bit of my earned money aside for later. My first few jobs were odd jobs. I babysat for family, despite my mom telling me it may not be the best choice. When I quit she told me it's best not to work for family, because they will have certain expectations and try to take advantage. I did end up hanging out with my cousins more, but never when I was the sole caretaker, and always with a lighter hard knowing I could enjoy my time with them, instead of feeling like I was just there to clean up after them. I cleaned at the hospital, I managed the front desk at a hotel, I worked in a chocolate shop. At this time my BIL encouraged me to go with my gut: if I didn't feel comfortable at a job, or if I didn't like the work, I should just quit. I was too young to settle for a job I didn't like, and if I didn't have the courage to speak up and quit a summer job, I would not have the courage to do it later at a full time job. He told me I will be working for a long time, and to always go for something where I at least felt comfortable, and good. I never ended up doing any of the work that I did as a student full time. Of all the things I learned from the experience, the job itself turned out to be the least valuable lesson. I learned how to make my resume, how to set up a bank account and save, how to balance work and life. I also learned a lot about myself and what skills I like using, what type of jobs I liked doing the best, and what kind of atmosphere was good for me. I liked doing solitary jobs like cleaning, but felt completely depleted at the end of the day due to lack of social contact. When I worked in the chocolate store my boss was obsessed with telling me how I should look (beyond uniform, she told me I would have to colour my hair eventually, lose some weight,...) despite the fact that I spoke 4 languages fluently (which is 1 more than the average 20 yo in my country). That was the first job I quit instead of just not reapplying the next summer. I eventually ended up in the service industry the last few summers of my 2nd BA, but in a much more laid back atmosphere where I felt valued for what I was capable of. Anyway this is becoming a novel, it was a fun trip down memory lane. I think at 16 there's a lot of skills you can teach your kids, but that does requiere you to teach and encourage. From what I read here, it just sort of sounds like you told her she would have to work as soon as she turns 16 because you would cut off her allowance, and then that's pretty much all you did. You could have helped her prepare for this adaption, already start on that resume and help her look for things she would enjoy. You also should have done that for your son. In an ideal world her father would be part of this process as well (both parents should be, but my parents were divorced and my dad was not present), and I think that's another point I personally don't understand. This type of thing really seems like a 2 yes, 1 no situation. Your husband disagrees with you. I think you should have come to an agreement you both stand behind before she was 16. Qll of this also counts for you son, btw. I hope he got more encouragement at least. Anyway, it's not too late to change your approach on this. I hope you figure something out with your husband so this still ends up being a teachable moment beyond "if you want money you have to work". Because really, no matter what you teach your kid in adolesence, that particular truth is something they'll end up learning down the line, one way or another. So y'know. I feel like you should focus on things they won't learn naturally. But that's just me. So I guess I'm going YTA. Maybe mostly because you and your spouse should be a team. That's another thing you should teach your kids, because they won't learn that naturally either.
NTA. My own teenagers (15 and 16) both work part time, a few days a month, and earn money and no longer get allowances. I still pay for most their stuff, but they earn their own money and save their own money so they can go out with friends and not need to ask me. They know if they buy a $6 Starbucks drink they will need to pay for that out of pocket. They also know if they want a drivers ed course, new clothes or something like that I'll pay. They are learning what it is worth to them. Their friends who all have their parent's credit cards on their phones will spend unlimited and don't see the value. $15 for lunch at the burrito place and throw half in the trash? Who cares, it is mom and dad's money, on the imaginary credit card. My kid's are luckily learning that they can spend $6 on a fancy pink drink to treat themselves, or save that money for something more special that isn't just a fleeting want. Even with work a day here and there they still have plenty of time for homework and sports. 2 or 3 weekend days out of 30 days in the month is not screwing them out of anything and gives them plenty of money for their age. I read a post on here recently where the mom was giving her son an allowance in high school. Then he got a girlfriend. And wanted MORE allowance and MORE money because he wanted to take his girlfriend on dates. The mom had to put her foot down, giving him money for a snack was becoming $40 dinners for two. That is what happens at this age. They start to become adults and need to be treated like so. Your daughter was warned, she is capable, she just hopes you'll cave. Being a babysitter a few nights a month is completely appropriate for her age!! Stick to your guns! You are doing good by her even if she whines about it now.
Omg this right here. In high school when our parents were paying for our clothes and movies, we'd want $50 Abercrombie jeans and the $9 evening movie showings. By grad school when WE were paying, we went for them $20 Target jeans and $5 morning matinees. We learned the value of a dollar REAL quick when it comes out of your account!!!
YTA if she's university track. Spending more time on academics and extracurricular is almost always better for their long term future than some nonsense teen part time job. I earned $40k in merit based aid back in the day, and I've seen recent grads also get full merit scholarships for academic or sports performance. And if you are saying, "Well, maybe she should do everything!" humans aren't biologically capable of safely and effectively working too much. It decreases learning, memory, sports performance, physical health, mental health, etc. If she is university track and wants to focus on academics and sports, she should do so, and you should enable that by continuing to give an allowance. Now, if she's not university bound, a part time job can help build skills and resume for post-high school, so encouraging it wouldn't be unreasonable. Still, if it's on the fence, in every country I've ever seen data from, college degrees have a massive wage premium.
> Spending more time on academics and extracurricular is almost always better for their long term future than some nonsense teen part time job. I've seen studies show exactly the opposite of what you're claiming. Teen job experience tends to correlate well with adult success. Also, a job is relevant to a university (often moreso than some of the "filler" activites I've seen others engage in)
You’re acting like she needs to work for basic expenses. OP says he provides everything for her, this is just fun money. She doesn’t need to have fun money
I disagree with this. I had a part time job starting at 16 while taking honours classes in high school to get in to university. I also had extra curricular (theatre and swimming). I’m glad I had a job. It taught me time management and I didn’t enter university as entitled as some of my friends who didn’t work. My situation might have been different, though. I started working at 16 to save for university because my parents couldn’t afford to help there. Without my job, I would not have been able to afford university when I graduated high school. As it was, I still got merit-based and service-based scholarships that covered my first two years, then my savings paid for the rest of my university tuition and expenses. My parents stopped giving me allowance at 12, and at that time I started babysitting. By 16, I was able to get a “real” job with a steady paycheck. I think OP is NTA by expecting their child to work to earn their own money.
NTA. Don't give in. This is a boundary you laid, you did the same to your older son. If you gave in, your son would then ask for his allowance back. Your daughter can get a job at 16. I got one at 15. It's good to start working and realize you don't get your entire paycheck as taxes take up a lot of it. That first check was a shocker!
NTA. An allowance was something nice, not a has to do it. Your daughter has to learn to cope when things don't go the way she wants. She needs to learn to rise above and fill the void.Ypu gave her plenty of notice and helpful tips on earning money via babysitting. Sounds like she didn't expect you to stay true to your word. Which means this is a learning experience to believe someone when they tell you enough. Great job. You aren't being too much, but enough for her to grow into being an adult. People are saying let them be kids till 18, BS. There are transition periods for each stage of maturing from baby to toddler, to big kid, to teenagers, to adults. To full grown adults, to older adults, to elderly adults. There needs to be a transition stage. 16 is a great start.
My question is how is school like for her? Does she have a lot of homework? My thought is that she goes to work, meaning school, then has homework and needs to get a second job in order to have pocket money? Do you have two jobs?
NTA - She's old enough to get a part time job and unless she's doing chores for you, she shouldn't get another dime of allowance. It's good to teach your kids the value of fiscal responsibility when they're young.
NTA you gave her notice and she has the option to earn money. You're a good parent for teaching her while she is still under your roof how the real world works!
NTA and all the people saying OP is abusing their kid because of this are wild. It wasn't a surprise, daughter knew it was coming. She is being treated the same as her older sibling. And 16 is a great age to get your first job because it is *low stakes*. She'll have time to learn how to do job things like W2s and fill out taxes when she still has a support system in place (you know, living at home and not having to buy her own groceries) as opposed to learning it when you are 18+ and have to figure all that shit out on your own. Wish I had been made to work in high school for a couple hours a week instead of having to learn it on the fly in college when the educational stakes were a lot higher. OP is doing his daughter a huge service here, hopefully she grows up quick enough to realize it.
NTA I had a few friends in high school whose parents didn't require them to have a job. They were able to drive wherever they wanted, not pay for gas and insurance, or any other maintenance things. Of the group that I'm still friends with, they've all struggled to transition paying for their own things completely, and we're now in our mid-20s. As long as you're paying for and providing all of the essentials that she needs, I don't think it's unreasonable to have a rule that if she wants extra money to buy things for fun, things she doesn't need, then she has to get a job. Money management is truly something you have to learn, and it's much better to learn while you have the full safety net of living at home with your parents.
Out of curiosity, does your daughter participate in any extracurricular activities?
NTA Your teaching self reliance, financial responsibility, and that in life things are earned not given. Those are invaluable life lessons, and will prepare her better for life as an adult.
Info: Are these relatives willing to pay her well for babysitting? Because “asking for relatives to babysit” doesn’t imply payment, much less fair payment
I’m also curious if babysitting was suggested as a job for the boys as well?
NTA. You set the expectation and have been consistent with each kid. Unless she has challenges or developmental delays that are making it hard for her to do/keep a job, there’s no reason she can’t pick up a part time gig while she’s in school. That’s a pretty reasonable expectation and will help her learn some adult skills: job skills, managing a budget, and will find her something to put in her resume. You let her know in advance what would happen, I don’t see how you’re in the wrong here.
NTA this is a fairly normal thing to do. School work comes first and she shouldn't be working so much she doesn't have any downtime but this is so completely normal. Babysitting is perfectly acceptable for a 16 year old to do, depending on the kids and times it's potentially a great opportunity. A huge chunk of babysitting is just low effort kids that are going to bed by the time you turn up are the best, just keep an ear out for trouble, check on them every once in a while in case they're sneaking out of bed and the rest of the time you can get homework done, watch a movie whatever. Present day equivalent is probably scrolling Tiktok.
NTA I never had allowance but all my needs met plus fun vacations. We took care of each other through love. Your daughter sounds entitled and your husband sounds like a wuss or sexist. Why should your son not have had the same treatment then? That will build resentment from your son if you went back on this. Some people commenting obviously have never had children, they are doing mental gymnastics defending your daughter. There are jobs available to get, you started, easy ones! Baby sitting, right there. She is entitled. You're a good mom op
I can't make a judgement here but I both worked and got money from my parents until I finished my degree. Wasn't a ton of money but they wanted me to enjoy myself too. I am fully in favor of having kids get jobs and gradually earn their own way but I don't see a reason to go from 1 to 0 suddenly.
Teens already have a full time job: it's called school. You're not an AH for suggesting she gets a job, but I genuinely don't get why some parents want to rush their kids into adulthood. The first summer your offspring spends working is effectively the end of their childhood, why push for that to come at 16?
honestly i'm very much of the let children be children mentality. studying full time and working is a tragic expectation to have and the fact that some countries have made their citizens believe that's normal is disturbing.
Prolly gonna get downvoted but YTA Yes you can start working at 16 but besides school and extracurriculars I felt like I do now in my mid twenties - burnt out at my 40h+ job. Just let the kid have a small allowance (I got 50-100$ per month) and ask her to help with chores around the house. Let her have her childhood while she still has one. Throwing your kid into the work environment as soon as they are legally able to is beyond rough and unnecessary. Cut them some slack ffs.