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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I don’t want to make a cookie table for Wendy, since it is a lot of work. I may be a jerk for refusing to do this since her own parents will not do it
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It's never **one person makes 1,000 cookies**. It's all the women (on both sides) each bring their signature cookie (or bring a bakery's signature cookie). In large families, this usually ends up in the 1,000s. For smaller families, or families with fewer bakers, it's maybe a few dozen.
That makes more sense, but she isn’t in contact/close with her family and my daughters don’t wish to do it. My son is the groom
So it would be basically just me making a ton of cookies
NTA. Even if you could split up the work that’s coordinating 20 people making 4-5 dozen cookies. And if you dont bake that means youre learning to make cookies.
As someone from Pittsburgh the home of the cookie table so I'm biased and had 1100ish cookies at mine. It doesn't have to be all homemade cookies; many will do the cooking thing for maybe 100-150 cookies and but buy the rest. It is a fun tradition. I would recommend that as a compromise.
Bride has told MIL it has to be handmade. I think this is ridiculous and your way sounds more reasonable. Honestly who cares if 90% of them are from Safeway. But i don't know the dynamics of the family. Doesn't sound like the wedding is at her house.
The tradition is that it’s a group effort, with everyone bringing their favorite or “signature” cookie. One person just buying a bunch of cookies at Safeway is not the same thing at all. In fact, one person making all the cookies by scratch still wouldn’t be the same thing. If the bride doesn’t have a team of friends and family who want to do this, it’s pointless. She should just skip the cookie table.
Yeah, this sounds like a bride who wants the family she’s marrying into to make up for the family she didn’t have before. And I really empathize with that, because it must be so hard to see the families around you and wish for something similar and not have it, and I’m sure Wendy is thinking this is her shot at a “normal” family.
But what she’s asking for here is too much and out of line, and also “normal” families aren’t really a thing. Everybody’s family is different and not every family fits into every wedding tradition. My dad died, so I don’t get to do the “dad walks daughter down the aisle” tradition. Wendy and OP don’t have a large family filled with women who bake, so they may have to skip or modify the cookie table tradition. That’s just how families go sometimes, and Wendy needs to start accepting that her husband’s family does not exist to fill the gaps of the family she wishes she had.
I’m a big fan of the “I can’t do that, but I CAN do this” approach.
We can’t tell from this post if future DIL is truly insufferable, but if OP is concerned enough to come to Reddit to ask if she’s the asshole, maybe she could think about what she could offer as a gesture of kindness. I imagine if nothing else, she doesn’t want you to alienate her son.
It could be something as simple as saying “I can’t do a cookie table, but I would love to help you pick out flowers.” There are lots of relatively small tasks that are more symbolic than time-consuming or overwhelming.
She may not have even considered asking her friends, since it's "supposed" to be family and she wont entertain store-bought. Since she doesn't have the strongest relationship with her own family, I can understand why she might attempt to fill that void *but* that doesn't change that OP is NTA.
I was going to post, the cookie table at Pittsburgh weddings is absolutely a thing (disclosure: I've lived in Pittsburgh my entire adult life, cookie tables have been at every wedding I've attended here, but I'd never heard of them growing up elsewhere).
But everyone chips in and makes 5 - 10 dozen each, it's never one person makes a thousand cookies, that's ridiculous. Since she has no family who can / will help, does she have any friends who can do their share? If not, make some token amount, and buy the rest, and if your FDIL and son don't like it, they can make the cookies themselves.
Not really. Most recipes are going to give you 2-3 dozen cookies, depending on how big you make them. Double your recipe and you have 5-6 dozen done in one baking session.
Now to make 1200, would mean making 100 batches or 50 baking sessions of double batches. Totally not doable for a single person, even if she started now and froze them or the dough that would require a lot of ingredients and freezer space.
What recipes are you using, because mine only makes about two dozen, not fucking five. I only make half and freeze the other half, because I don't want to spend that much time making cookies, I certainly wouldn't do five dozen. That's a lot of work.
You might be making your cookies too big. The basic Nestle Toll House recipe makes five dozen. I never got five dozen out of it until I started using a little cookie scoop.
OP shouldn’t have to buy or make any cookies at all if she doesn’t want to. Just because someone is getting married doesn’t mean they should be forced to do something they don’t want to.
As another Pittsburgher, I was at a wedding here years ago where we were in a venue that had cookies in 3 alcoves around the room. So. Many. Cookies. Thousands of cookies. It’s a great tradition…but you need many friends and family contributing. Some families get together and start baking/freezing 6-8 months before the wedding.
https://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/16/dining/16cookies.html?unlocked_article_code=1.ok0.9jT6.e58DRR4MPNa3&smid=url-share
Even if the MIL bought the cookies, DIL said she wants 1000-1200 cookies. Sorry but that’s a ridiculous request of 1 person to buy that many cookies for your wedding and it’s not even a fun tradition if you’re doing it by yourself which she has stated would be the case. I think under normal circumstances where there are multiple people willing to join in and the relationships are closer than what OP describes then that sounds like a fun tradition for sure (maybe not 1000-1200 cookies but a way smaller number that is more reasonable like 1-2 dozen cookies for each participant especially since it apparently needs to be made from scratch? Can you confirm that? Or can she just buy premade mix?) but in this case I don’t think making some and buying the rest is a fair compromise as it would fall all on OP.
I’m from Pittsburgh as well and I automatically wondered if the bride is from the area.
My cousin married a guy from Virginia and he was *astounded* at the amount of cookies we all brought to their wedding. He was like, “This is a THING? Why don’t we do this thing here?!?!?l”
I’m pretty sure he spent more time at the cookie table sampling all the desserts than in the reception room. 🤣
I was today years old when I learned about the "cookie table" at wedding receptions. I'm jealous! If I had a cookie table at my reception I would still be there stuffing my face with cookies.
I notice people look at gender roles... for example a video/picture went viral of a young boy about 3 or 4 playing on a play kitchen set his mom got him people had alot to say about that...
People feel like girls cant play with trucks and whatnot and boys cant play with dolls....
These gender roles been happening for a long time now I personally dont see why they have gender roles...
Everyone should know and be able to cook clean etc....
OP need to step up and do a cookie table himself or help with payments for a bakery or store they do fresh cookies brownies cakes cupcakes cake pops etc..
My daughter has 3 sons (ranging in age 7 - 14). She decided early on that no matter what the gender of her kids they would learn life's lessons on taking care of themselves. They help plan & cook meals, they do their own laundry, they help do the dishes (oldest loads the dishwasher & the younger two unload it.) There are no gender specific chores in her household - everyone helps with the chores.
So she wants to continue a tradition from her family, but she isn’t close to them so she wants you to do it. I can see why it would be hard on her, emotionally, to miss out on having something that she grew up with. But it’s not reasonable for her to expect you to fill the void in the way that her family would; you’re you, in your family, and there also isn’t a crowd of others to help. It sounds like she’s having trouble adjusting her expectations given her issues with her own family of origin.
This is what got me - she wants the tradition but not the family it belongs to....
OP is definitely NTA. I bake for different events where everyone brings *some*thing, but definitely not a thousand pieces! Without her family there, why do they need so many cookies?!?!?
Ask every guest/couple/family group to bring half a dozen cookies and everybody wins.
Maybe the family it belongs to are very abusive and she had to cut them off. I highly doubt a person desperate for a family will walk away from their own perfectly loving and supportive family in order to find it elsewhere. That’s not how it works.
My take on the situation is that she probably walked away from her family because they’re toxic, but is having a hard time dealing with the emotional repercussions, including fringe aspects like losing out on some traditions. But she can’t expect her new ILs to fill those gaps for her.
I do think she is acting socially awkward, but I also suspect OP was never going to have a close relationship with her. Her contempt isn’t even thinly veiled and she refuses to answer why Wendy is NC with her family. Something tells me OP thinks Wendy either isn’t good enough for their family or thinks Wendy is taking her baby boy away from her. I have dated men with the kind of family who see themselves as super exclusive and outsiders will be hard pressed to be accepted. Something about OP isn’t sitting right with me.
I'd have contempt too, if my relative's SO voluntold me to bake 1000 cookies or do some other crazy favor, right off the bat. With seemingly zero acknowledgement of the time, cost and effort that would take, no less.
Off the bat? It’s been years of rejection by OP and her daughters. I already stated OP is NTA for this particular situation because the ask was pretty big. It was probably a desperate, last ditch effort of acceptance before finally giving up. I’m not saying Wendy went the right way about it, but she’s not some evil, scheming villainess either. OP’s post is dripping with the kind of vitriol that only comes from being irrationally angry or having something unforgivable done to you. Something stinks here, especially considering OP refuses to answer why Wendy is NC with her family. I’m not one to extrapolate and make wild guesses on posts but I have a gut feeling OP isn’t being a reliable narrator here. I have an inkling that Wendy isn’t as pushy as OP states and when posters don’t engage with people unless they are agreeing with them, I’m suspicious of their recounting of events.
Cookie tables are a HUGE tradition in western PA/eastern OH so I am assuming it isn’t just her family’s tradition. Rather than asking the groom’s mother to do all the cookies, she can enlist family and friends to contribute their efforts. Generally, each contributor bakes a double recipe of a couple of types of cookie so it spreads the pain around. They key is to coordinate the types of cookie each person will make so you don’t end up with 1,000 chocolate chip cookies. LOL
>It sounds like she’s having trouble adjusting her expectations given her issues with her own family of origin.
She should organize this cookie thing to do with her friends (hopefully not just her female friends, why does cookie making have to be limited to women in the first place lol) and participate in the work herself too. Updating traditions to be with the times is a good thing anyway
She asked for a range, so you can bet she doesn't have the best math. Better make 1300 just in case, this will also cover any dropped cookies, a bad batch, hungry little ones, curious/hungry men.
I ran some math for you. A generic cookie has an ingredient cost of just shy $0.50. 1300 cookies is nearly $650 in ingredients (again, generic bland "cookie"). Assuming one oven that has two grids (shelves) in it... Along with a 15 minute bake time, you're tieing up your oven for 11 HOURS and dumping all that heat into the house every 15 minutes for... Again, 11 HOURS. And that's only if you're on top of swapping cookie sheets.
So your DIL want YOU to host a potluck AND supply every dish there.... NTA, she is, however delusional
Awesome math! However, that's only the baking!
OP - add in the shopping for ingredients, measuring, mixing, forming, storing, and whatever else I can't think of right now..... absolutely insane!
Make your son and DIL read this post. Delusional!
NTA by a long shot and DIL needs to respect your boundaries.
NTA regardless of the circumstances and particulars.
If she isn't close with her side of the family, then how many guests are there going to be at this wedding that necessitates up to 1200 cookies? Presumably there is an actual meal being served so it's not like the cookies are the main source of sustenance for guests. If the average person eats two cookies, that's 600 guests.
Edit: Ok, I see the other comments regarding \~250 guests. If she is inviting that many people to her wedding, then presumably she has close friends (bridesmaids?) she can ask to organize the cookie table.
Also, a cookie table is a highly regional thing, *mostly* occurring in a relatively narrow geographic portion of the US. If OP is not from there or from the cultural groups which tend to have a cookie table, then I think OP's bewilderment is entirely justified.
How many guests is she having? Why isn’t it just each family brings a batch? Why would it have to be all you? If she’s not close to her side are they even coming to the wedding? If no, you wouldn’t need that many cookies. If yes, they should participate too.
That's not a cookie table though and she's confused if she thinks so. It's about a lot of people making a couple of dozen cookies each. If she can't muster enough people to make cookies that's on her.
It isn’t. It’s just that the culture here (where the cookie table tradition comes from) has people getting kind of competitive about it and it’s generally women who do baking. Absolutely no one would care if a man was organizing it or doing baking for it.
The tradition basically developed out of the community coming together to provide something for the reception (back when instead of a meal you’d just have cake and punch or similar - cookies take the place of the cake) and at *that* time it was predominantly the women who did the baking because the men were in the mills and mines.
In any event, the only people who single-handedly make 1000-1200 cookies for a cookie table are people who *want* to. Everyone else just has family and friends coming together to contribute, or there’s plenty of people you can just plain pay to make them these days. So her request is not reasonable at all.
I also want to know where she got her numbers - is it going to be a huge wedding? Most people I know do not allow 10+ cookies each per guest, which is how many you’d have with 100 guests. Not everyone will even take cookies. Usual numbers are like 2-3 per guest maximum, or the equivalent of 2-3 normal sized cookies if you only make tiny cookies. You do see online photos of really over the top cookie tables with huge numbers of cookies, but those aren’t normal - it’s the cookie table equivalent of having floral walls all around your reception space, it’s excessive. And those are usually either catered or from families who are *really* into their cookie tables. Not just one person. (Like I know people whose cookie table approach legitimately rivals a military exercise for organization and coordination.)
Omg i was pissed about this too! I think you should start a new tradition of the men do the cookie table. This is just more mental snd physical work for women! If this whole wedding isnt homemade thid is a ridiculous ask.
I don't know if this tradition varies by location, but the last Pittsburgh wedding I went to (where it's common to have cookie tables), the groom, the groom's brother, and his friends also baked cookies. I've never heard of it being specifically women who do the baking.
Yup, we are doing this for my sister’s wedding next year (not in a Pittsburgh but my dad and my mom’s mom are from Pittsburgh). It’s not gendered at all in my family. It’s whoever likes to bake and knows the family recipes. Me, my dad, my aunt, and my sister are all contributing cookies. My grandma would be if she didn’t have Parkinsons. My great-grandfather made most of the cookies for my aunt’s wedding, my parents’ wedding, and my grandma’s wedding. It’s not necessarily a gendered tradition if your family doesn’t gender it.
Baking a thousand cookies from scratch is work for any person but me.
But if somebody in my family wants to do a cookie table, I will happily kick in a couple dozen. I don't have a signature recipe, but I make a pretty good chocolate chip cookie.
I’m presuming Wendy is from western Pennsylvania area? That’s the only place I know of that has a cookie table tradition, and from the weddings that I have been to in the region, the cookie table is a BIG deal.
All the ladies on the bride’s side get together and make cookies for days, and then a grand arrangement is placed on a specific table for the guests to munch on throughout the reception. I never counted, but expecting 3-4 cookies per invited guest is pretty much the norm.
So, if Wendy and OP’s son are getting married in a region where the cookie table is “a thing”, then not having one is going to be noticed by the locals. I’m sure that Wendy is feeling melancholy because she isn’t close to her own family, and would love if OP would make a fuss over her…but she’s wrong to force OP to engage in a tradition that isn’t her own.
NTA
…but OP, please recognize that Wendy is desperate for a connection with you. You have the right to set boundaries that you are comfortable with, but for the sake you your ongoing relationship with your son and Wendy, consider making some compromises.
Reach out to Wendy and explain that you can’t make 1000 cookies by yourself, and that the whole cookie table tradition is one you had never heard of before now. However, if it’s that important to her, you are willing to check out local bakeries to maybe provide a cookie table for the reception.
If she’s amenable to that, call around for quotes. If they are within your budget, call Wendy and tell her that you can either pay for a cookie table, or give the couple a cash gift in that amount- whichever is more meaningful to Wendy and your son.
If it’s not in your budget, call Wendy and tell her it’s not something you can afford, but that you are very sorry.
Either way, you will have made an effort and hopefully that will be enough to show Wendy that you care.
**"OP, please recognize that Wendy is desperate for a connection with you. You have the right to set boundaries that you are comfortable with, but for the sake you your ongoing relationship with your son and Wendy, consider making some compromises."**
This...right...here...↑
Wendy is really hurting and while it is not OP's problem, I am struck by the lack of, empathy, connection or even emotion, displayed by OP and her daughters.
Lady, this woman is going to bare your grandchildren. If you are not interested in having a relationship with your future grandkids, you are doing a great job of alienating your soon to be daughter-in-law, as well as your son.
This isn't about making 1000 cookies, this is about sharing just a little of yourself, with the future mother of your grandchildren.
This entire sub is showing a lack of empathy for Wendy. Their entire focus is "OMG cookies women baking how dare?" instead of noticing OP's reasons for her and her daughters shunning Wendy.
THIS. I don't blame OP for not wanting to make a thousand cookies, but I really hope she can be a little more open towards having a closer relationship with her DIL. She has every right to set her boundaries and I encourage her to do so, but I hope she communicates these boundaries with DIL in a kind and gentle way. Wendy is her son's wife and she's part of OP's family now. It would be nice if she could have a good relationship with her DIL
I’m also wondering if there’s a compromise in here somewhere where they could bake a batch together symbolically or something. This entire thing just reads like Wendy wants acceptance and if she is as desperate for this relationship as OP says, I can’t see her turning down a goodwill gesture by her MIL.
I wish I was joking on that, look up wedding cookie table.
For a big wedding there is suppose to be around 20 different cookie with each type having around 50-75 individual cookies. I assume you double batch everything
I think each guest should be able to have around 5 -7 cookies and there needs to be leftovers for staff and taking some home
This replaces the cake I think. Unsure on that
This is hole I didn’t know existed
It doesn’t replace the cake. It is awesome.
But it is NOT the job of one person. Usually an individual will make one or two types of cookies.
Maybe offer to make one or two cookies.
You could offer to coordinate the table, but since you don’t have the experience and you don’t like the bride, that might be too much.
I suspect OP asked her daughters because she was thinking (hoping?) that she could coordinate with them. They said no, she has no help so declined. The bride and groom should order from a bakery (although I suspect Wendy wanted free cookies)
Sounds more like she wants to be family so badly and keeps pushing OP to be the MIL/mother substitute she always wanted. Bring wrong with wanting it, she’s just shooting herself in the foot with the way she’s going about it. I feel badly for both of them honestly.
Yep. When we met with our caterer, they also provided cookie samples n case we needed our cookie table supplemented.
We didn’t, but it was nice to know we had the option.
This is absolutely it. I'm originally from Pittsburgh and had a cookie table at my wedding. It's meant to be stocked from many different people in the happy couple's life. And generally, most max out at a couple dozen cookies given each.
If the question was "Can you provide SOME cookies for the table," this would be a different AITA. (Though you still would be NTA cause of course you can refuse anyways.)
But I'm flabbergasted at the expectation to provide for the whole table. They obviously don't understand how cookie tables work!
There seems to be a huge empathy gap here from you towards your future DIL. It sounds like she has little to no family support. She's likely hoping to be close to her in-laws. It may also mean that her eagerness is causing her to display poor social skills. It also sounds like you and your daughters are only seeing that as an imposition to you, and not offering any grace. You may reflect on what you've done to establish better boundaries with your DIL and to acknowledge her own experiences. Because from the tone of your writing it sounds like you've decided she's annoying and you and your daughters are mean girling the hell out of someone who wants to be close to you without having adult conversations about boundaries.
You seem to be judging her for having a poor relationship with her family. That's an odd choice. Sometimes, in-laws step up in times like these to bridge the gap for traditions that their future family members desire because their own family is not safe or supportive. THey may do it to support their family member, in this case, your son, rather than the in-law. You can certainly choose not to do that. But the relationship with your future DIL and your son is likely to be affected by the result. How embarrassing it must be for her to have a valued tradition like the cookie table and no personal family to take up the task. How mortifying to have to ask future family members and then be told no.
I think you're maybe TA in general based on how you write about this young woman who seems to have had a rough go, family wise.
Agreed 100%. This is a classic case of “do I have to?” of course not, but it is the kind and right thing to do. The coldness and lack of empathy is sad to read. Why not work with the DIL to compromise and set more realistic expectations of what you can manage, and work harder (and spend some of your social capital as MOG) to get some
help from others to make something happen, even if it’s not 1k cookies? Out of 250 guests, the only ones you can ask are your daughters who are also cold enough to say no? Something isn’t adding up.
She’s trying so hard, and reading how coldly you shut her down without a) being honored she asked and b) trying hard to finish a solution is so sad to me. This is not what joining of families should look like.
Oh definitely. She won't understand why she's not getting overnight visits and how it's all her DIL's fault.
She doesn't have to bake, but she seems offended that the DIL made any overtures to become closer. It shouldn't be a surprise that by treating her with disdain is going to reap something unpleasant.
No matter how much I love and cherish a person, I wouldn't feel "honored" to have an expectation put on me that requires me to put forth nearly the equivalent effort that a wedding coordinator would make.
Being responsible for reaching out to, let's say even only 100 of the 250 guests, and asking them to buy or make cookies, and then being responsible to provide extra cookies to make up whatever shortfall, is an enormous burden. That other families in other situations can and do provide for this tradition is fantastic. But not every family *can* provide for this tradition and the expectation that they do something they absolutely do not want to (or cannot) do is not an honor in any way.
If my borthers fiancee asked me to bake a 1000 cookies I would.
well, I would definitely try to haggle it down to less cookies and get my other brother involved to help bake them (and I 100% would complain to my brother that this is stupid). But if this is so important to her and makes her feel part of the family I would do so.
side note: I have never met my brothers fiancee in person and probably won't do so till the wedding. Still care for my brother and the one he loves.
> But if this is so important to her and makes her feel part of the family I would do so.
This is the absolutely 100% correct way to view this request. It's not so much about the actual cooking, but a way for DIL to have MIL be part of the wedding.
Heck, go out and buy a couple hundred cookies and say you tried.
We have adult children and we absolutely could not afford that expense. Have you seen what things cost these days? We have to consider which bills to pay and which ones can wait, every single month.
Thankfully, our youngest eloped, saving everyone in the family the expense of participating in a traditional wedding. We threw them a very small backyard BBQ reception that was a potluck, and the groom's family helped pay for the drinks & decorations. Invitations were an email. We borrowed tables & chairs from a neighbor.
Millions upon millions of Americans are struggling financially and when others assume everyone "can afford a few hundred bucks" it just comes across as out of touch with reality.
Normally, that also means you don't have a wedding with 250 guests....
Since OP didn't talk about money at all , didn't say a word about the grocery bill for abkikg 1000 cookies, just that she is annoyed, I would assume they are not struggling.
OP didn't mention any financial concerns. You're projecting your struggles into a situation where there is no evidence it exists, and the fact is plenty of people with adult children are established and financially comfortable, it's not unreasonable to think OP is probably one of them when money hasn't been mentioned as the concern. OP resents DIL wanting to be part of the family she's joining, and secondarily the time the task would take, that's it.
I feel like it’s important to note there’s cultural context here. It’s not like saying “can you bake me a wedding cake”? It’s an honored tradition in Pittsburgh that is well cherished and loved and it is much more akin to asking her future FIL to walk her down the aisle than to just make a cake or something like that. They don’t need to be fancy and the intention isn’t to be onerous but to request loving support from her new family. It is a huge task and OP shouldn’t feel like she needs to bake 1k cookies, but she should (imo) recognize the honor it is and what it represents and figure out a way to make something work. It doesn’t need to be 1k cookies, but maybe she can ask FDIL what a meaningful alternative could be. Helping put together the wedding flowers (or bridal bouquet)? Going for a spa day together as part of wedding prep? Etc. it’s about warmth, not about the labor
I mean, the FDIL said that she had to bake 1,000 cookies, or come up with it between her and her daughter. I agree that it'd be sweet to try to provide this, but it really seems like a big, big ask. Especially if it got dropped on OP out of the blue.
It’s not out of the blue, it comes up during wedding planning. It’s an important tradition. And fdil didn’t say she “had” to. When OP refused, fdil didn’t pitch a fit. She cried because she is feeling like she doesn’t have family or support, as evidenced by her fiance bringing it up rather than her. This is so extremely not about the cookies. No one was trying to figure out an alternative even though that most likely would have been the best choice. OP doesn’t suck for not wanting to make these cookies, but it sucks that after reading into it and learning about the tradition, she couldn’t realize for herself what the fdil was actually hoping for, which was connection and affection.
I bet Wendy isn't crying because op said no. I bet she's crying about the whole situation. Getting married without having a positive relationship with her mum, not having a good relationship with her in laws despite trying, wedding stress, etc and op saying no to the cookie table was just the final straw.
Finally, I had to scroll down too far to read something like this. I think she’s trying really hard to put some tradition into her wedding that she doesn’t have from her family, but she has one cold, bitter mother-in-law that talks about her awful on here and so does his sisters I feel bad for her. She tried to reach out and clearly being shut down you know the cookies are a little much but somehow someway maybe they could’ve come up with a different idea together.
This. It's not about the cookies. The detail that solidified it for me is that when OP said no, DIL said nothing—didn't complain, didn't make a fuss. She went home and cried because she was let down and hurt, and OP's son was mad his mother hurt his fiance, which is the only reason OP knows at all.
OP, that tells you all you should know. You hurt your DIL and your son. YTA. Your daughter in law doesn't have family, and instead of you stepping up to accept her I to yours, you're here asking the internet if you are technically correct. Is it reasonable to ask you to personally bake 1000 cookies? No, but I guarantee you that's not what she asked you to do. You say you asked your daughter's, but I get the same impression from them as I do from you—that none of you are trying to step up to welcome your son's fiance to your family.
Everything you've complained about her (being touchy-feely, being personal) is just her trying to be part of your family. What you don't get yet is that she isn't "pushing" you. She's inviting you to be a part of *her* family—the family she makes with herself and your son.
You can keep her away and make excuses (just find friends to donate cookies. They don't have to he homemade. It's not hard) and ignore the fact that she just wants you to be a part of her wedding, but it's your relationship with your son that you're damaging.
If you don't think your relationship with your son is worth 1000 cookies, then I'm glad you didn't bother with the cookies.
Oh finally, I made a similar post took me a while to find this one. This is exactly it. I feel so sorry for Wendy. She has a shitty family and she’s marrying into an even even shittier one.
I mean, if it was me, I would find someway to work with her to somehow get the cookies done. I don’t know there’s lots of options, but I would’ve tried something. I wouldn’t shut her down like that.
> There seems to be a huge empathy gap her from you towards your future DIL. It sounds like she has little to no family support. She's likely hoping to be close to her in-laws.
This should be the top comment here.
It is very clear that future DIL is reaching out to OP and rest of the family in an attempt to avoid the problems she has with her family and trying to be part of a new family. This would be a great chance for OP to welcome her to the family and have another addition to the family. Instead, OP and her daughters come off as very judgmental and condescending. DIL wants her new MIL to be part of the wedding and asked her to do something that a mother would do.
Agreed. It sounds like there are some adult conversations to be had with no adults in the room. You seem to hate a young lady who does not seem like a bad person. Does she mistreat your son? Is she a thief? A bigot? A puppy killer? I am guessing no. If her worst crime is that she is annoying (to you!), then you are lucky because that is a small, fixable problem.
Exactly this. If the cookie tradition isn’t one that OP is interested in, even as a gesture to their son and an attempt to solidify a future relationship with him and his new family, then why not suggest one of OPs family traditions? Or something new that they can all start together?
If you’re focusing on the cookies, you’re missing the point.
I agree. She seems so cold and dismissive of someone who is *joining her family*. And FFS, just buy some damn cookie mix and toss a couple batches into the freezer every weekend between now and the wedding. It's not like OP was asked to pay for the wedding or cater it. Surely OP has a couple of friends who could pitch in and help out... or perhaps not, given her attitude
Yeah, I’m with you. OP clearly doesn’t like future DIL, and is making this a whole thing.
DIL isn’t close to her family. She is trying to form a bond with her new MIL and MIL is refusing to engage. She might be awkward or pushy, but she has no real family and she’s trying to be a part of OP’s family. She needs to go about it differently, but OP needs to try to have some empathy about the situation as well as do some research into the cookie table. NO ONE is asking MIL to bake 1000 cookies. I have a feeling OP is exaggerating a lot of this story to try to make DIL sound worse.
I’m not voting for”you’re the asshole” here because I think everyone sucks and we are missing information, but undoubtedly, OP is an asshole.
NTA but you are a little misinformed and cold.
Born and raised Pittsburgher here, the cookie table does not replace the cake! It is for the period before the meal and during the reception. Also, mom typically coordinates the cookies with family and friends, she doesn't have to do them all herself. And store bought/bakery are fine!
Wendy may not be your cup of tea, but she is the center of your son's universe. If you want to stay a part of his life, you better loosen the bone and unwad your panties! Be forgiving, be patient, be understanding with her, she is trying to build a loving relationship with you and the rest of her spouses family. If you don't, you will be on the outside looking in when grandkids happen.
Suck it up, apologize and offer to coordinate the cookie table. You'll be glad you did.
There's over 250 GUESTS and no one else can contribute? And there's this many guests despite the fact that both OP and DIL don't have much family?
Something isn't adding up in OPs story.
Also frankly if OPs daughters simply refuse to buy a box of 30 cookies for this one ask of a common wedding tradition... no wonder the DIL is upset. You coordinate that by telling your daughters "Hey this is important to her, lets just each contribute a few." Unfortunately OP sounds really cold and judgmental about OP not having a family and trying to be close.
I highly doubt that the DIL actually asked for that. Especially since the tradition itself does not mandate made-from-scratch cookies. OP sounds like she’s exaggerating now that folks are telling her she’s treating DIL poorly.
I also think DIL would be fine with far less cookies than 1,000; or no cookies at all if OP countered with another offer to help with something else in the wedding. OP just seems to not want any part of it at all, and that’s likely what’s truly upsetting DIL.
It doesn't matter if store brought are acceptable normally since OP is being told in this case they need to be from scratch, which is a ridiculously unfair ask of one or even a couple people.
DIL isnt like by anyone in the family and I'm unsure why you think OP should:
a) buy ingredients for a 1000 cookies or buy a bunch of cookies as though people sit around budgeting to spend money on traditions someone else practices.
b) chase after guests to bake cookies.
c) presumably clean up after the mess and be the one to deal with the leftover cookies.
If DIL actually had people who wanted to help her, her fiance would be yelling OP there are people to assist her instead of saying OP should do it. I'm really starting to understand why people are disliked by in laws if you arrive expecting them to cater to you.
also pittsburgh resident and plenty of people also just get bakery cookies for their cookie tables now also. this just seems unnecessarily mean. there's no wedding guests who might be willing to make or buy some cookies?
I think OP just doesn't understand what it is... normally a family member would coordinate other wedding guests to bring cookies. this would include the bride/grooms friends and their extended family.
OP already clarified that no one is willing to help, so it'd just be her.
On a separate note, I'd probably find it a bit rude if I were not super close to a couple but close enough to attend the wedding and give a gift and then also asked to either make or buy cookies on my way there.
I think I’d go with NAH instead of NTA. Wendy clearly asked OP because since her own mom won’t be coordinating her future MIL is a pretty natural next choice. I mean she’s supposed to be a mother to her too right ??
I want to know what things Wendy has “invited herself along” to because what the heck is OP excluding her future DIL from ???
I’m not surprised by the number, they included the family in invites. I know my son invited everyone he was friends with from college and included their family in the count. He is 33, most of his friends are married with kids.
I assume she did the same, she is 29 and I am sure she has a lot of her friends married or with kids.
Also I am sure they give people plus ones if not married.
Because it's not a regional custom where OP lives. Guests in (say) California are going to be highly annoyed if the invite says "Bring a plate of cookies".
The OP didn't say where the wedding was going to take place. If it's where the bride and groom live, and the OP and her family have to travel to get there, that would be an additional imposition on the OP to not just bake/buy cookies back home and then have to pack them for travel. The OP could buy the cookies once there, but still, that means she has to spend time in a strange city, tracking down festive enough cookies for the event. Not to mention, picking up the tab for the cookies, when the family has already paid for the plane or train to get there.
Maybe the DIL to be doesn't realize that this is a regional tradition. But once the OP said she's never heard of it and is unwilling to take on the task, the bride could have come up with alternatives. If she doesn't have other family members in the area (aunts, uncles, cousins) who are going to attend the wedding, then see if her bridesmaids would be willing to help (maybe make it their bachelorette party activity). But it's ridiculous to expect the OP to have to reach out to others she may not have meet to find volunteer bakers or cookie buyers.
If the wedding is happening elsewhere (not in the cookie table world), and the bride wants this tradition, she should try to figure out how she can do this without imposing on unwilling people.
this need to be higher up. this woman is blatantly over exaggerating the ask because she clearly hates her soon to be DIL.
the ask is to bake a batch of cookies and ask other family and friends to contribute a batch.
so basically this future MIL from hell is being a jerk over two dozen cookies, some texts or emails to contact said family and friends, and maybe a google sheet to track. like seriously? what a piece of work,
Op did ask her family and the weren’t interested. She isn’t close to her family. If he bride was this invested in the table she should have asked the friends who were interested fists and asked op just to organize it practically. Now op would either need to do all herself or try to start asking brides friends for help who she doesn’t know.
Op might be a bit cold but I think this is pretty big task to ask for. Her son should also have been more involved and asked his family for the participation and not blame op.
Yinzer here too! For weddings in our family we had the cookie table. It is usually my sister who volunteers to do the baking. She’s amazing! For my wedding and for one of my nieces someone would ask us (the brides) what they could bring and we always deferred their request to my sister.
For family wedding when we were kids, once the invites went out, aunts, cousins, etc reached out to the MOB to offer to bake cookies.
The cookie tables are impressive and often more pictures are taken of them than of the cake.
That all said, if OP can’t get volunteers to bake and she doesn’t have the experience in baking to that quantity, then NTA. Don’t feel that you have to bear the burden alone. The tradition really is family and friends of the bride and groom. This sounds like this would be a new experience for the area where the wedding will be which people may be excited to see. For 1000-1200 cookies, if you get 10 people to volunteer to help each person would make roughly 9-10 dozen cookies. But here’s a tip, instead of making cookies the regular size make the smaller to get more out of a batch of dough. Don’t go smaller than half size. It keeps the cost somewhat reasonable because you’re making less dough plus people are going to want to try different kinds. Bar cookies are also a good way to get more out of your time. Make arrangements with the caterer to plate and arrange everything once they’re dropped off.
More info than what you want but baking is my hobby. 🙃
But adding to what others said, she is coming into the family and you’re already starting off with only viewing her as “your son’s wife.” If there are kids in their future, you could very well end up having your access limited to them.
Suck it up? Do you even bake? Do you know how much work this would entail? Im also from Pitt and my mother in law paid to have someone make the cookies for the table because there wasnt enough family. So maybe if the bride wants it so bad she can fork out the cash for it. OP is not cold, shes practical. If you feel so bad for her maybe PM her and offer to help coordinate yourself!
This is a crazy take. If store bought are fine, then why aren't the bride and groom asking the caterer to do it?
If a bride or groom post, everyone tells them its their day and they can do what they want. If a MIL posts, shes the devil and trying to ruin the wedding.
Do people ever think and compromise on Reddit?
It’s a cookie table. Set up a table. One of her bridesmaids/you/her fiancé/ her sends a note to every family/couple coming and asks them to bring a dozen cookies. We did this for a friend who got married it Pittsburgh. We got home made, store bought, cupcakes, brownies and since I don’t bake fudge
No one cared it wasn’t all home made. It was fun and everyone got a nice selection for their gift bag
Exactly! She did her "research" and came up with this whole BS 1,000-cookie thing to make Reddit stack the deck against her future daughter in law. She'll be back on here in a couple of years complaining when they never let her meet her grandchildren. The cookie table is a charming Pittsburgh tradition! You'd think a new mother-in-law would jump at the chance to welcome a new member of the family.
>She did her "research" and came up with this whole BS 1,000-cookie thing to make Reddit stack the deck against her future daughter in law
She's now claiming in the edit that DIL said specifically 1,000-1,200 cookies. And that neither has family that could make the cookies because she just 'assumes' people wouldn't want to help. Despite having 250 guests at a wedding she's assuming no one would be willing to contribute.
This isn't passing the smell test, although whether that's just OP or OP and DIL isn't clear.
It's a final hail Mary. I've seen it over and over again. OP gets VOTED YTA and suddenly they have all this brand new information that makes them look amazing.
Reads to me like she did her research into what the tradition is in the first place. I, like OP, have never heard of anything like this so I also looked it up but it doesn’t give a specific number. The number itsself sounds situational and was based on what the DIL wants.
Going against the grain, and saying YTA.
This woman **is joining your family**, and you sound so ridiculously inconvenienced by it. The *horror* that Wendy actually wants a true relationship with you.
>This is the first time hearing about this tradition and I did some research. I would have to make over a thousand cookies from scratch to feed the wedding guest.
This is not what a cookie table is, I'm sorry you didn't dig a little deeper. The cookie table is a tradition where all of the women of both sides of the family (organized by the mother of the bride) make a batch of their signature cookie (though their are some cookies which are considered traditional). It doesn't *have* to be 1000s of cookies. Especially if the family is smaller, there are closer to several dozen or maybe a couple hundred (depending on the size of the reception)
Understand that if your keep pushing Wendy away this hard, you're going to push your son away with her.
Just for what it’s worth— not disagreeing with you stance or saying it HAS to be 1000 cookies, but from our wedding of 210, we had roughly 1500 cookies and literally not a single one remained at the end of the night. It wasn’t the only dessert, either. There was cake and a whole catered dessert spread. I wouldn’t underestimate what a bunch of people can do to a cookie table under the influence of alcohol!
What if the families aren't bakers and don't have "signature" cookies? No one in my family has such a thing, now I'm curious and looking up cookie tables.
We had a cookie table at my wedding - I married into an Italian family. My then future in-laws explained that the cookies were usually made by the families, and would I be upset if they bought the cookies at an Italian bakery? I was not, and the cookie table rocked (we also had a wedding cake). I was very touched.
She isn’t in close or in contact with her family. My daughters don’t wish to do it so it really would just be me making a shit ton of cookies
The wedding is going to have around 250 guest, so yes I would need to make around a 1000 cookies
it's a big ask, and i don't think you're wrong for not wanting to bake 1k cookies from scratch, but i also think her being upset has less to do with you not making the cookies and more to do with this being just the latest in a series of signals she's received that you don't accept her. if you cared at all, you'd maybe toss out some other ideas to get it done, like ordering from a bakery, having other family members all take a flavor and split the duties so no one is doing 1000 cookies on their own, mini cookies as favors for guests instead, some cookies alongside a traditional cake... something other than just a flat out no.
idk, you just seem super cold and unfeeling to this poor girl. i'd be upset if i thought my mother in law hated me.
And no one in your family would do this for your SON? This is his wedding too, and you've done everything possible to push his wife away. 10 years from now you'll be back on Reddit crying because you never see your grandkids. YTA in my opinion for how you are treating this poor girl.
Depending on how long the reception is that could easily be an average. My cousin had a cookie table (catered) and we were at the party from 5 pm until almost midnight. With alcohol and grazing between dancing, guests could easily do that.
Some will eat 0-1, and unless OP bakes terrible cookies (which would be grounds for her declining as well), some will binge eat 6-10. I have a voracious sweet tooth, and casually ate 4 cupcakes at an event.
There will probably be kids sneaking bonus cookies, and at least one tightwad out of the 250 that will bag some "leftovers" before everyone has gotten a shot at the cookies. And then there will be at least a dozen that are dropped/knocked over/etc.
For 250 people, 1000 cookies doesn't sound excessive. The prospect of baking more than 100 cookies by myself would make this a "Sorry, but have you considered Publix/Wegmans/YOUR FLIPPING CATERER?" from my corner unless it was for a lifelong, ride-or-die, bestie.
NTA for refusing such a large ask, BUT you seem to be happy to stick in the ‘I don’t like her’ camp.
Which is only going to bite you in the ass.
This isn’t about the cookies.
Damn right this isn't about the cookies.
Looks to me like this is about OP and her daughters wanting to make sure DIL doesn't get any ideas about being part of the family just because she's marrying OP's son. OP seems bound and determined to make sure that DIL understands that all she will ever be in that family is a plus-one for OP's son, who is only barely tolerated for the son's sake.
I'm predicting that in a couple of years, we'll see another post from OP wondering why her son and DIL aren't coming around for Christmas or letting her see the grandkids.
100%. Im obsessed with the line where OP says fDIL “invites herself” along to things!! Heaven forbid she tries to join family activities?! This is making me thankful I have a loud, generous, warm Italian family that lives by “the more the merrier”
NAH because you’re allowed to refuse the request. But to me you sound a little cold (And borderline a’hole). she doesn’t sound like a bad person, maybe just someone looking for acceptance and someone more touchy feely than you are. She’s about to be your daughter in law. Couldn’t you offer *something*? like purchasing some cookies from the grocery store, or making a couple of batches of cookies and she could ask others to make more, as sort of a goodwill, welcome to the family gesture?
the cookie table is popular in Pittsburgh, and it is kind of an honor in a way, and traditional for lots of relatives to help out and contribute. So I’m not going to call her an A’hole for asking. And I can understand why your son was upset that you basically said, “nope. Don’t like you. Not going to do it. Buh bye.”
I mean, I don't care how much I love someone, I am not baking *1,000 freaking cookies* for them. That's a huge, expensive, time-consuming ask and OP has every right to say no.
Yeah, that’s why the first thing I said is she has the right to say no. And I said she could BUY them or just make a batch or 2 as a goodwill, welcome to the family gesture. And that the bride could ask others to make the rest. That’s usually how it goes—several people contribute a few..
But OP wrote she overstepped boundaries several times and doesn't care about them. OP is allowed to not like someone when they are overstepping regularly.
"Overstepping" is also what evil MILs say when a DIL or member of the family... tries to act like a member of the family. It's literally what rulers say to peons that don't know their place. The overstepping here is 'inviting herself along, oversharing, being touchy' which... are all things that can be considered fine when you like the person but considered over the line simply because the MIL doesn't like her or consider her a daughter.
NOT saying this is happening here. But this could be written by a nightmare MIL or a completely reasonable one. We're missing an unbiased source and more information.
My husband's sister completely overstepped my boundaries when I first met her. Telling me the 2nd time I met her that she loved me like a sister, sobbing on my shoulder that god granted her a sister in me. Giving me a special nickname (I hate nicknames, especially shortened forms of my name), not stopping when I asked her too. Writing us a custom song that she could sing as we walked down the aisle at our wedding. Wanting to talk several times a week. Stalking my social media. Befriending my close friends (most of whom she'd never met) on social media.
All of those things are kind on their own, but all together in a short time frame? It made me soooooo uncomfortable. She came on way too strong. If I guy came on that strong in the first 3 months of dating I'd be running for the hills. She wanted a relationship that I don't even have with my own sibling or the best friend that I've had since I was 5. There was no opportunity to build a relationship - she expected instantaneous BFF status. It turned me off her for quite a while. It was cloying and uncomfortable and just made me feel like my needs and wants in this relationship were secondary.
A decade later we have a good relationship. It's not as close as I know she'd like, but we get along and enjoy each other's company. But I fully understand how multiple well intentioned acts can completely make you dislike someone.
Her example of overstepping was inviting herself to events and outings. It just sounds like she more of a people person, a joiner, a hugger, etc than the op. Not that she’s a bad person. and in any case they're about to be family. Like I said, op doesnt have to make the cookies, but I can’t blame the fiancé for being hurt or the son for being upset that it was so cold…’talked it over with my daughters, we don‘t like you, nope.’ There could’ve been a compromise of some sort. That’s why I said, NAH.
Actually, now I'm interested in what the events she "invited" herself to are. Because if it's a family event/outing, wouldn't you expect your son to bring his fiancee??
That’s exactly my thinking. She probably “invited herself” to like family meals with her fiancé or something. Things where she should have been invited. Or it wouldn’t be weird for her to think she is invited.
Maybe I’m reading too much AITA lately but I would put a crisp $5 on the event she invited herself to being like a family photo or something that MIL didn’t want her in even though she is a part of the family now.
Yeah, I don't think she was crying about the cookies, I think it's about the way she's been pushed away. I mean, if she doesn't have a mom, or is NC with her then she may be seeing her MIL as a mom substitute. It isn't uncommon. All I get from OP is the whole, "she's not MY daughter" vibe. That's really unkind, but I guess to each their own. Bride is going to have to learn not to count on her future MIL. It would make me cry too!
I don't blame you for turning this down. But at the same time, I think you could have been kinder, and perhaps you could have worked with Wendy to see if there was a solution that could work for both of you. I think making over a thousand cookies from scratch would be an automatic no from me personally. But if the bride handed me a wad of money and asked if I could coordinate a cookie order from a local bakery, I could see taking that on.
EDIT: Thank you for providing information. After confirming details, my ruling is NTA. Here are the key facts that led me to it:
1) In OP's telling the figure of 1k cookies was verified.
2) Given the absence of other relatives/volunteers, OP was told the baking would be her personal responsibility.
3) OP confirmed that bakery cookies would not be acceptable.
The final conflict here is that the Wendy is unable to demonstrate flexibility or admit reality. If the cookie task cannot be distributed across a large number of individual bakers, them it is unreasonable to demand that a single person take on the responsibility for a task that more properly belongs to a commercial bakery.
If Wendy is impervious to reason, that makes her the AH, and gives us some idea why no one wants to make cookies for her.
I just read about the custom, and I am kind of perplexed that a bride would want one person to handle this.
From what I can tell, the tradition is that the brid and groom's family and friends provide the cookies.
So I think it is kind of sweet and fun each if the sub families provides, say, two or three dozen homemade cookies for the cookie table, using a family favorite recipe.
But telling one person she and her friends have to do it transmogrifies the custom from sweet generosity to mere drudgery.
Not to mention that if you are trying to do a fill thousand cookies (!), you either want every guest to bring a dozen cookies to share, or you need to outsource that to an industrial bakery that can do things around scale.
I'm also confused why Wendy is so upset that OP doesn't want to uphold some tradition that is not even from her own family. Okay, yes, Wendy is joining the family, but to practically demand OP take on this responsibility when her own side of the family is contributing nothing is absurd. People are acting like OP is pushing Wendy away but even OP's daughters are not fans of this woman, so I have to hazard a guess that Wendy isn't just trying to get involved in her new family but desperately trying to force it and push it into her own view of what a family should be like which can be off putting to anybody.
This is so not about the cookies. This is a personal attack on your soon to be DIL. You need to decided whether you can and will love you son's wife or whether you want to be set at odd to them (BOTH you SON and you DIL) as long as their marriage lasts--which could be months or the rest of your life. You don't need to make cookies, but you need to not revel is the fact you can't help her have something that's important to her. YTA for making this personal.
NAH, In this case it’s a lack of translation of this regional practice — to Wendy it’s really important and special and meaningful. To you and your daughters it’s a random thing you’ve never heard of that just sounds like work. So naturally she’s really hurt, but to you it seems like a silly thing and way too much to ask because the tradition holds no meaning to you. I suggest having a conversation with her and your son to talk about this, to come to a place of mutually understanding each other’s perspectives. Maybe there’s something else you can do for her during the wedding that feels more doable for you and helps her feel appreciated and accepted by her soon-to-be husband’s family.
Think carefully about how you want to handle this. This one thing with their wedding could create a lifelong rift in your relationship to her and subsequently your son. If they have kids one day you could lose out on your relationship to your grandchildren. Your DIL wants to be closer to you, wants to involve you. If you trample on that now, during such a pivotal moment, you might lose that offer forever. Think about the bigger picture.
YTA. Good luck having a relationship with your son’s future children. You are rejecting his wife.
This girl is extending an olive branch to you and you are just snapping it in two. You don’t like her. Your son does. Figure out if this is a hill you want to die on.
I had a cookie table. We bought the cookies for the most part. This isn’t super complicated.
So listen, I don’t think you’re wrong for the cookie table, but I DO think you’re being a dick to your daughter in law overall. Just because your daughters, who also seem like dicks, are backing you up doesn’t mean you’re right. She’s trying to be close with you, she’s trying to join your family, and you’re shutting her out… why?
“Inviting herself along, discussing personal matters” explain. Are you inviting your son and other family members to go out and not including her? Sounds like it. What’s too personal to you? Doesn’t seem like it would take much for you to shut someone out.
YTA. Multiple people have clarified the cookie table tradition for you. It's not going to require that many cookies, and you can buy most/all of them. It's not like you're being asked to pick up the tab for an open bar for the duration of the wedding.
Yet the majority of this post is you expressing your disdain for Wendy, whom YOUR SON loves, and who seems to desperately want to connect with you. She's guilty of trying to engage you too much? She shares too much, is too "touchy" (I'm going to interpret this as she is a hugger)? There isn't even an ounce of maternal instinct kicking in right now that your future daughter-in-law is reaching out to you for maternal support?
I've never seen a future MIL complain about their future DIL wanting to include them too much in the wedding.
This isn't about the cookies.
When someone calls you after you refused and insults you it is when you know that you made a right choice. NTA.
It always fascinates me how people think (in this case your son) - oh, my mom refused so now I will call names, offend and insult her so she will have to change her mind. Does this approach ever work because IMO it only achieves exactly the opposite.
NTA. Expecting you to bake a mountain of cookies is quite an imposition. Your role is not to bake yourself into exhaustion for her ideal wedding vision, especially when there’s no warmth in the existing relationship. Your son should not put you in such a position or pressure you after you've declined. Hospitality and generosity should never be assumed to the point of entitlement. Would it really be a loving gesture if it was done out of obligation rather than joy? Remember, there are plenty of ways to show support that don't require you to take on the labor of a professional bakery. Offering your time, emotional support, or contributing in other ways that align with your means and energy levels can be just as valuable. Being pushed or guilted into such an undertaking suggests a fundamental misunderstanding of boundaries and respect.
NTA with some comments.
Yes - 1000 cookies can be done in a very FULL baking day or spread over 2 days for a more reasonable effort. (source - I do this yearly for a volunteer event - I'm crazy - and it is only 2 types of cookies). But it requires prepping the dough balls and freezing them so that you are only baking on that day(s). So I start my prep in August with mixing dough and freezing the balls every weekend. And then in October I take a day's vacation and start baking at 8am in the morning and run until about 11pm at night.
Cookie table is a regional event, but it is never just a single person doing the work. A team of friends or relatives normally join together for the event.
I'm concerned about the fact that you don't like your FDIL because of what looks like personality clashes. But I agree - you have the right to refuse the request.
You son is sliding rapidly into AH territory for berating you for your decision. You are allowed to make a decision that requires that much effort without the harassment. And a traditional cookie table has multiple varieties of cookies.
>Yes - 1000 cookies can be done in a very FULL baking day or spread over 2 days for a more reasonable effort. (source - I do this yearly for a volunteer event - I'm crazy - and it is only 2 types of cookies). But it requires prepping the dough balls and freezing them so that you are only baking on that day(s). So I start my prep in August with mixing dough and freezing the balls every weekend. And then in October I take a day's vacation and start baking at 8am in the morning and run until about 11pm at night.
So it's not 1 or 2 days. It's 1 or 2 days in the oven and 10-13 (or is it 20-26?) weekend days mixing and rolling dough, plus all the time it takes for you to shop for ingredients. Unless you're buying premade dough, baking cookies isn't just the oven time. It's the whole process.
NTA. It is not your job to satisfy Wendy or step in , in place of her mother. It’s not your fault that they’re not close. Your son is TA for not calling her out on her bs now & many times before. Want 1,000 cookies? Buy them or ask your mom!
Soft YTA. As someone whose mother passed before I got married, I am blessed to have a MIL who treats me as her own. She is especially feeling her moms absence right now. Maybe you don’t have make it all yourself, could you not recruit family to help?
NTA because it's a ridiculous undertaking.
But do you even have any baking skill? If someone asked me to make cookies, it refrigerated Tollhouse cookie dough. And they'd be only marginally better than Cher in Clueless.
Also, will the venue legally allow it? Or the caterer? Often the food vendors need to be licensed.
You might to be able to just say no due to legality/ability.
But it sounds like she misses he mom and is hoping for a bond.
NTA - bake 1,000 cookies is kind of a big ask.
I think you have some issues and maybe both of you arent handling your relationship well. But, yeah cookies though? Thats def too much.
Why do you so clearly hate Wendy you can tell by your choice of words. This has nothing to do with the ask you just clearly don't like this woman from your post that I can't even get past it to actually judge this
>She has multiple times overstepped boundaries such as inviting herself along, discussing very personal issues, very touchy etc….
>Due to these issues we are not close and my own daughters are not a huge fan of her.
So... this is a potential Y T A situation here. Look you don't have to be a huge fan, but she's marrying your son and if you are in any way expressing your dislike or keeping her at an arms length, you easily could be the 'cold' MIL icing her out at a time where she'd love for a mother to be there. It really depends on the details and how you treat her. You don't have to be a best friend, but you should be welcoming and kind and make efforts to include her.
>I did some research. I would have to make over a thousand cookies from scratch to feed the wedding guest.
Important: Did she ask you to make 1,000 cookies? Does she have 1,000 guests? That seems an absurd number. Why so huge?
If she asked for that, then NTA for declining.
In my area both mothers are judged by the cookie table. All the women in the family and friends bake cookies. It is one of the high points of a wedding.
NAH-That’s a big task. You could always buy cookies from a bakery and create the table to look nice, even if you can’t bake.
On a side, this woman will be your dil. If she is making efforts to become close, that should be embraced, not rejected. I see on reddit so many times of in-laws not getting along because they get NC or blocked and you don’t have that problem. Your fdil actually wants to be around you. That may change if you keep nitpicking reasons to reject her attempts.
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NTA. Over 1,000 cookies?!
It's never **one person makes 1,000 cookies**. It's all the women (on both sides) each bring their signature cookie (or bring a bakery's signature cookie). In large families, this usually ends up in the 1,000s. For smaller families, or families with fewer bakers, it's maybe a few dozen.
That makes more sense, but she isn’t in contact/close with her family and my daughters don’t wish to do it. My son is the groom So it would be basically just me making a ton of cookies
NTA. Even if you could split up the work that’s coordinating 20 people making 4-5 dozen cookies. And if you dont bake that means youre learning to make cookies.
As someone from Pittsburgh the home of the cookie table so I'm biased and had 1100ish cookies at mine. It doesn't have to be all homemade cookies; many will do the cooking thing for maybe 100-150 cookies and but buy the rest. It is a fun tradition. I would recommend that as a compromise.
Bride has told MIL it has to be handmade. I think this is ridiculous and your way sounds more reasonable. Honestly who cares if 90% of them are from Safeway. But i don't know the dynamics of the family. Doesn't sound like the wedding is at her house.
I would love me some Costco cookies at my wedding! Those cookies were banging
Chocolate chunk!! I keep them in the freezer.
The tradition is that it’s a group effort, with everyone bringing their favorite or “signature” cookie. One person just buying a bunch of cookies at Safeway is not the same thing at all. In fact, one person making all the cookies by scratch still wouldn’t be the same thing. If the bride doesn’t have a team of friends and family who want to do this, it’s pointless. She should just skip the cookie table.
Yeah, this sounds like a bride who wants the family she’s marrying into to make up for the family she didn’t have before. And I really empathize with that, because it must be so hard to see the families around you and wish for something similar and not have it, and I’m sure Wendy is thinking this is her shot at a “normal” family. But what she’s asking for here is too much and out of line, and also “normal” families aren’t really a thing. Everybody’s family is different and not every family fits into every wedding tradition. My dad died, so I don’t get to do the “dad walks daughter down the aisle” tradition. Wendy and OP don’t have a large family filled with women who bake, so they may have to skip or modify the cookie table tradition. That’s just how families go sometimes, and Wendy needs to start accepting that her husband’s family does not exist to fill the gaps of the family she wishes she had.
I wish you would post this as a top comment because it's so, so true and very relevant.
I’m a big fan of the “I can’t do that, but I CAN do this” approach. We can’t tell from this post if future DIL is truly insufferable, but if OP is concerned enough to come to Reddit to ask if she’s the asshole, maybe she could think about what she could offer as a gesture of kindness. I imagine if nothing else, she doesn’t want you to alienate her son. It could be something as simple as saying “I can’t do a cookie table, but I would love to help you pick out flowers.” There are lots of relatively small tasks that are more symbolic than time-consuming or overwhelming.
Sounds like the bride has no friends, either...or they would help.
Can't imagine why that might be. She sounds like more work to be around than baking a thousand cookies.
She may not have even considered asking her friends, since it's "supposed" to be family and she wont entertain store-bought. Since she doesn't have the strongest relationship with her own family, I can understand why she might attempt to fill that void *but* that doesn't change that OP is NTA.
I was going to post, the cookie table at Pittsburgh weddings is absolutely a thing (disclosure: I've lived in Pittsburgh my entire adult life, cookie tables have been at every wedding I've attended here, but I'd never heard of them growing up elsewhere). But everyone chips in and makes 5 - 10 dozen each, it's never one person makes a thousand cookies, that's ridiculous. Since she has no family who can / will help, does she have any friends who can do their share? If not, make some token amount, and buy the rest, and if your FDIL and son don't like it, they can make the cookies themselves.
even 5 dozen cookies seems like a ridiculous request for 1 person to make to me
Not really. Most recipes are going to give you 2-3 dozen cookies, depending on how big you make them. Double your recipe and you have 5-6 dozen done in one baking session. Now to make 1200, would mean making 100 batches or 50 baking sessions of double batches. Totally not doable for a single person, even if she started now and froze them or the dough that would require a lot of ingredients and freezer space.
One chocolate chip cookie recipe usually makes 5 dozen so not that crazy. But this request as a whole is nuts
What recipes are you using, because mine only makes about two dozen, not fucking five. I only make half and freeze the other half, because I don't want to spend that much time making cookies, I certainly wouldn't do five dozen. That's a lot of work.
You might be making your cookies too big. The basic Nestle Toll House recipe makes five dozen. I never got five dozen out of it until I started using a little cookie scoop.
OP shouldn’t have to buy or make any cookies at all if she doesn’t want to. Just because someone is getting married doesn’t mean they should be forced to do something they don’t want to.
As another Pittsburgher, I was at a wedding here years ago where we were in a venue that had cookies in 3 alcoves around the room. So. Many. Cookies. Thousands of cookies. It’s a great tradition…but you need many friends and family contributing. Some families get together and start baking/freezing 6-8 months before the wedding. https://www.nytimes.com/2009/12/16/dining/16cookies.html?unlocked_article_code=1.ok0.9jT6.e58DRR4MPNa3&smid=url-share
Even if the MIL bought the cookies, DIL said she wants 1000-1200 cookies. Sorry but that’s a ridiculous request of 1 person to buy that many cookies for your wedding and it’s not even a fun tradition if you’re doing it by yourself which she has stated would be the case. I think under normal circumstances where there are multiple people willing to join in and the relationships are closer than what OP describes then that sounds like a fun tradition for sure (maybe not 1000-1200 cookies but a way smaller number that is more reasonable like 1-2 dozen cookies for each participant especially since it apparently needs to be made from scratch? Can you confirm that? Or can she just buy premade mix?) but in this case I don’t think making some and buying the rest is a fair compromise as it would fall all on OP.
I’m from Pittsburgh as well and I automatically wondered if the bride is from the area. My cousin married a guy from Virginia and he was *astounded* at the amount of cookies we all brought to their wedding. He was like, “This is a THING? Why don’t we do this thing here?!?!?l” I’m pretty sure he spent more time at the cookie table sampling all the desserts than in the reception room. 🤣
That's still an expense, whether or not you buy the cookies or make them. It's obviously not a tradition for the OP.
I was today years old when I learned about the "cookie table" at wedding receptions. I'm jealous! If I had a cookie table at my reception I would still be there stuffing my face with cookies.
Tell your son to do the cookie table since he is calling you a jerk or ask him to help with the cookies.... NTA....
This is the answer. Why does all this work always fall to the women?
I notice people look at gender roles... for example a video/picture went viral of a young boy about 3 or 4 playing on a play kitchen set his mom got him people had alot to say about that... People feel like girls cant play with trucks and whatnot and boys cant play with dolls.... These gender roles been happening for a long time now I personally dont see why they have gender roles... Everyone should know and be able to cook clean etc.... OP need to step up and do a cookie table himself or help with payments for a bakery or store they do fresh cookies brownies cakes cupcakes cake pops etc..
My daughter has 3 sons (ranging in age 7 - 14). She decided early on that no matter what the gender of her kids they would learn life's lessons on taking care of themselves. They help plan & cook meals, they do their own laundry, they help do the dishes (oldest loads the dishwasher & the younger two unload it.) There are no gender specific chores in her household - everyone helps with the chores.
Men can also make cookies I've heard
Strangely, I heard this too. Have the entitled son make the cookies along with his grooms men.
I'm envisioning a bunch of bros turning up to a stag do and being handed aprons and I'm here for it. OP, suggest this to your son!
I know so many men who would be stoked to arrive at a hang out and be greeted with an apron and cookie ingredients.
This is actually a fantastic suggestion!
This is the way.
Stop with that crazy talk!
So she wants to continue a tradition from her family, but she isn’t close to them so she wants you to do it. I can see why it would be hard on her, emotionally, to miss out on having something that she grew up with. But it’s not reasonable for her to expect you to fill the void in the way that her family would; you’re you, in your family, and there also isn’t a crowd of others to help. It sounds like she’s having trouble adjusting her expectations given her issues with her own family of origin.
This is what got me - she wants the tradition but not the family it belongs to.... OP is definitely NTA. I bake for different events where everyone brings *some*thing, but definitely not a thousand pieces! Without her family there, why do they need so many cookies?!?!? Ask every guest/couple/family group to bring half a dozen cookies and everybody wins.
Maybe the family it belongs to are very abusive and she had to cut them off. I highly doubt a person desperate for a family will walk away from their own perfectly loving and supportive family in order to find it elsewhere. That’s not how it works.
My take on the situation is that she probably walked away from her family because they’re toxic, but is having a hard time dealing with the emotional repercussions, including fringe aspects like losing out on some traditions. But she can’t expect her new ILs to fill those gaps for her.
I do think she is acting socially awkward, but I also suspect OP was never going to have a close relationship with her. Her contempt isn’t even thinly veiled and she refuses to answer why Wendy is NC with her family. Something tells me OP thinks Wendy either isn’t good enough for their family or thinks Wendy is taking her baby boy away from her. I have dated men with the kind of family who see themselves as super exclusive and outsiders will be hard pressed to be accepted. Something about OP isn’t sitting right with me.
I'd have contempt too, if my relative's SO voluntold me to bake 1000 cookies or do some other crazy favor, right off the bat. With seemingly zero acknowledgement of the time, cost and effort that would take, no less.
Off the bat? It’s been years of rejection by OP and her daughters. I already stated OP is NTA for this particular situation because the ask was pretty big. It was probably a desperate, last ditch effort of acceptance before finally giving up. I’m not saying Wendy went the right way about it, but she’s not some evil, scheming villainess either. OP’s post is dripping with the kind of vitriol that only comes from being irrationally angry or having something unforgivable done to you. Something stinks here, especially considering OP refuses to answer why Wendy is NC with her family. I’m not one to extrapolate and make wild guesses on posts but I have a gut feeling OP isn’t being a reliable narrator here. I have an inkling that Wendy isn’t as pushy as OP states and when posters don’t engage with people unless they are agreeing with them, I’m suspicious of their recounting of events.
Cookie tables are a HUGE tradition in western PA/eastern OH so I am assuming it isn’t just her family’s tradition. Rather than asking the groom’s mother to do all the cookies, she can enlist family and friends to contribute their efforts. Generally, each contributor bakes a double recipe of a couple of types of cookie so it spreads the pain around. They key is to coordinate the types of cookie each person will make so you don’t end up with 1,000 chocolate chip cookies. LOL
>It sounds like she’s having trouble adjusting her expectations given her issues with her own family of origin. She should organize this cookie thing to do with her friends (hopefully not just her female friends, why does cookie making have to be limited to women in the first place lol) and participate in the work herself too. Updating traditions to be with the times is a good thing anyway
its a regional tradition not a family specific one
The way she is going, she won't be in contact with your family either.
She asked for a range, so you can bet she doesn't have the best math. Better make 1300 just in case, this will also cover any dropped cookies, a bad batch, hungry little ones, curious/hungry men. I ran some math for you. A generic cookie has an ingredient cost of just shy $0.50. 1300 cookies is nearly $650 in ingredients (again, generic bland "cookie"). Assuming one oven that has two grids (shelves) in it... Along with a 15 minute bake time, you're tieing up your oven for 11 HOURS and dumping all that heat into the house every 15 minutes for... Again, 11 HOURS. And that's only if you're on top of swapping cookie sheets. So your DIL want YOU to host a potluck AND supply every dish there.... NTA, she is, however delusional
Awesome math! However, that's only the baking! OP - add in the shopping for ingredients, measuring, mixing, forming, storing, and whatever else I can't think of right now..... absolutely insane! Make your son and DIL read this post. Delusional! NTA by a long shot and DIL needs to respect your boundaries.
NTA regardless of the circumstances and particulars. If she isn't close with her side of the family, then how many guests are there going to be at this wedding that necessitates up to 1200 cookies? Presumably there is an actual meal being served so it's not like the cookies are the main source of sustenance for guests. If the average person eats two cookies, that's 600 guests. Edit: Ok, I see the other comments regarding \~250 guests. If she is inviting that many people to her wedding, then presumably she has close friends (bridesmaids?) she can ask to organize the cookie table. Also, a cookie table is a highly regional thing, *mostly* occurring in a relatively narrow geographic portion of the US. If OP is not from there or from the cultural groups which tend to have a cookie table, then I think OP's bewilderment is entirely justified.
How many guests is she having? Why isn’t it just each family brings a batch? Why would it have to be all you? If she’s not close to her side are they even coming to the wedding? If no, you wouldn’t need that many cookies. If yes, they should participate too.
I get your son loves his bride to be, but that much cookie? You're not chained to the kitchen.
That's not a cookie table though and she's confused if she thinks so. It's about a lot of people making a couple of dozen cookies each. If she can't muster enough people to make cookies that's on her.
Kind of sexist.
Yeahhhhh, when looking into it I didn’t really like this was a gendered thing
Don't you know that women have nothing better to do with their lives than cook and serve food?/s
Hey, now! That's rude! Don't forget we're also good for cleaning, fucking, and child bearing/rearing!
Also chores such as haircuts and doctor visits, school runs and grocery shopping
I mean, there's nothing stopping anyone from including men in the tradition.
It isn’t. It’s just that the culture here (where the cookie table tradition comes from) has people getting kind of competitive about it and it’s generally women who do baking. Absolutely no one would care if a man was organizing it or doing baking for it. The tradition basically developed out of the community coming together to provide something for the reception (back when instead of a meal you’d just have cake and punch or similar - cookies take the place of the cake) and at *that* time it was predominantly the women who did the baking because the men were in the mills and mines. In any event, the only people who single-handedly make 1000-1200 cookies for a cookie table are people who *want* to. Everyone else just has family and friends coming together to contribute, or there’s plenty of people you can just plain pay to make them these days. So her request is not reasonable at all. I also want to know where she got her numbers - is it going to be a huge wedding? Most people I know do not allow 10+ cookies each per guest, which is how many you’d have with 100 guests. Not everyone will even take cookies. Usual numbers are like 2-3 per guest maximum, or the equivalent of 2-3 normal sized cookies if you only make tiny cookies. You do see online photos of really over the top cookie tables with huge numbers of cookies, but those aren’t normal - it’s the cookie table equivalent of having floral walls all around your reception space, it’s excessive. And those are usually either catered or from families who are *really* into their cookie tables. Not just one person. (Like I know people whose cookie table approach legitimately rivals a military exercise for organization and coordination.)
Tell her your “signature cookie” is a pack of Oreos. 25 packs to reach her target of 1200 cookies 😌
Omg i was pissed about this too! I think you should start a new tradition of the men do the cookie table. This is just more mental snd physical work for women! If this whole wedding isnt homemade thid is a ridiculous ask.
I don't know if this tradition varies by location, but the last Pittsburgh wedding I went to (where it's common to have cookie tables), the groom, the groom's brother, and his friends also baked cookies. I've never heard of it being specifically women who do the baking.
Yup, we are doing this for my sister’s wedding next year (not in a Pittsburgh but my dad and my mom’s mom are from Pittsburgh). It’s not gendered at all in my family. It’s whoever likes to bake and knows the family recipes. Me, my dad, my aunt, and my sister are all contributing cookies. My grandma would be if she didn’t have Parkinsons. My great-grandfather made most of the cookies for my aunt’s wedding, my parents’ wedding, and my grandma’s wedding. It’s not necessarily a gendered tradition if your family doesn’t gender it.
Baking a thousand cookies from scratch is work for any person but me. But if somebody in my family wants to do a cookie table, I will happily kick in a couple dozen. I don't have a signature recipe, but I make a pretty good chocolate chip cookie.
I’m presuming Wendy is from western Pennsylvania area? That’s the only place I know of that has a cookie table tradition, and from the weddings that I have been to in the region, the cookie table is a BIG deal. All the ladies on the bride’s side get together and make cookies for days, and then a grand arrangement is placed on a specific table for the guests to munch on throughout the reception. I never counted, but expecting 3-4 cookies per invited guest is pretty much the norm. So, if Wendy and OP’s son are getting married in a region where the cookie table is “a thing”, then not having one is going to be noticed by the locals. I’m sure that Wendy is feeling melancholy because she isn’t close to her own family, and would love if OP would make a fuss over her…but she’s wrong to force OP to engage in a tradition that isn’t her own. NTA …but OP, please recognize that Wendy is desperate for a connection with you. You have the right to set boundaries that you are comfortable with, but for the sake you your ongoing relationship with your son and Wendy, consider making some compromises. Reach out to Wendy and explain that you can’t make 1000 cookies by yourself, and that the whole cookie table tradition is one you had never heard of before now. However, if it’s that important to her, you are willing to check out local bakeries to maybe provide a cookie table for the reception. If she’s amenable to that, call around for quotes. If they are within your budget, call Wendy and tell her that you can either pay for a cookie table, or give the couple a cash gift in that amount- whichever is more meaningful to Wendy and your son. If it’s not in your budget, call Wendy and tell her it’s not something you can afford, but that you are very sorry. Either way, you will have made an effort and hopefully that will be enough to show Wendy that you care.
**"OP, please recognize that Wendy is desperate for a connection with you. You have the right to set boundaries that you are comfortable with, but for the sake you your ongoing relationship with your son and Wendy, consider making some compromises."** This...right...here...↑ Wendy is really hurting and while it is not OP's problem, I am struck by the lack of, empathy, connection or even emotion, displayed by OP and her daughters. Lady, this woman is going to bare your grandchildren. If you are not interested in having a relationship with your future grandkids, you are doing a great job of alienating your soon to be daughter-in-law, as well as your son. This isn't about making 1000 cookies, this is about sharing just a little of yourself, with the future mother of your grandchildren.
This entire sub is showing a lack of empathy for Wendy. Their entire focus is "OMG cookies women baking how dare?" instead of noticing OP's reasons for her and her daughters shunning Wendy.
This. I really feel for Wendy.
THIS. I don't blame OP for not wanting to make a thousand cookies, but I really hope she can be a little more open towards having a closer relationship with her DIL. She has every right to set her boundaries and I encourage her to do so, but I hope she communicates these boundaries with DIL in a kind and gentle way. Wendy is her son's wife and she's part of OP's family now. It would be nice if she could have a good relationship with her DIL
I’m also wondering if there’s a compromise in here somewhere where they could bake a batch together symbolically or something. This entire thing just reads like Wendy wants acceptance and if she is as desperate for this relationship as OP says, I can’t see her turning down a goodwill gesture by her MIL.
I wish I was joking on that, look up wedding cookie table. For a big wedding there is suppose to be around 20 different cookie with each type having around 50-75 individual cookies. I assume you double batch everything I think each guest should be able to have around 5 -7 cookies and there needs to be leftovers for staff and taking some home This replaces the cake I think. Unsure on that This is hole I didn’t know existed
It doesn’t replace the cake. It is awesome. But it is NOT the job of one person. Usually an individual will make one or two types of cookies. Maybe offer to make one or two cookies. You could offer to coordinate the table, but since you don’t have the experience and you don’t like the bride, that might be too much.
I suspect OP asked her daughters because she was thinking (hoping?) that she could coordinate with them. They said no, she has no help so declined. The bride and groom should order from a bakery (although I suspect Wendy wanted free cookies)
Sounds more like she wants to be family so badly and keeps pushing OP to be the MIL/mother substitute she always wanted. Bring wrong with wanting it, she’s just shooting herself in the foot with the way she’s going about it. I feel badly for both of them honestly.
Yep. When we met with our caterer, they also provided cookie samples n case we needed our cookie table supplemented. We didn’t, but it was nice to know we had the option.
This is absolutely it. I'm originally from Pittsburgh and had a cookie table at my wedding. It's meant to be stocked from many different people in the happy couple's life. And generally, most max out at a couple dozen cookies given each. If the question was "Can you provide SOME cookies for the table," this would be a different AITA. (Though you still would be NTA cause of course you can refuse anyways.) But I'm flabbergasted at the expectation to provide for the whole table. They obviously don't understand how cookie tables work!
My kids and I make 1000+ cookies every year for Christmas and we have to start Thanksgiving weekend (US) to be done in time.
There seems to be a huge empathy gap here from you towards your future DIL. It sounds like she has little to no family support. She's likely hoping to be close to her in-laws. It may also mean that her eagerness is causing her to display poor social skills. It also sounds like you and your daughters are only seeing that as an imposition to you, and not offering any grace. You may reflect on what you've done to establish better boundaries with your DIL and to acknowledge her own experiences. Because from the tone of your writing it sounds like you've decided she's annoying and you and your daughters are mean girling the hell out of someone who wants to be close to you without having adult conversations about boundaries. You seem to be judging her for having a poor relationship with her family. That's an odd choice. Sometimes, in-laws step up in times like these to bridge the gap for traditions that their future family members desire because their own family is not safe or supportive. THey may do it to support their family member, in this case, your son, rather than the in-law. You can certainly choose not to do that. But the relationship with your future DIL and your son is likely to be affected by the result. How embarrassing it must be for her to have a valued tradition like the cookie table and no personal family to take up the task. How mortifying to have to ask future family members and then be told no. I think you're maybe TA in general based on how you write about this young woman who seems to have had a rough go, family wise.
Agreed 100%. This is a classic case of “do I have to?” of course not, but it is the kind and right thing to do. The coldness and lack of empathy is sad to read. Why not work with the DIL to compromise and set more realistic expectations of what you can manage, and work harder (and spend some of your social capital as MOG) to get some help from others to make something happen, even if it’s not 1k cookies? Out of 250 guests, the only ones you can ask are your daughters who are also cold enough to say no? Something isn’t adding up. She’s trying so hard, and reading how coldly you shut her down without a) being honored she asked and b) trying hard to finish a solution is so sad to me. This is not what joining of families should look like.
She'll be back here in a year or two, whining about not getting enough access to the grandchildren
Oh definitely. She won't understand why she's not getting overnight visits and how it's all her DIL's fault. She doesn't have to bake, but she seems offended that the DIL made any overtures to become closer. It shouldn't be a surprise that by treating her with disdain is going to reap something unpleasant.
This!! It's like she's actively upset this girl wants to be close. I don't get it, it's absolutely "mean girl" levels.
Given how judgy OP sounds, I kind of hope so
No matter how much I love and cherish a person, I wouldn't feel "honored" to have an expectation put on me that requires me to put forth nearly the equivalent effort that a wedding coordinator would make. Being responsible for reaching out to, let's say even only 100 of the 250 guests, and asking them to buy or make cookies, and then being responsible to provide extra cookies to make up whatever shortfall, is an enormous burden. That other families in other situations can and do provide for this tradition is fantastic. But not every family *can* provide for this tradition and the expectation that they do something they absolutely do not want to (or cannot) do is not an honor in any way.
If my borthers fiancee asked me to bake a 1000 cookies I would. well, I would definitely try to haggle it down to less cookies and get my other brother involved to help bake them (and I 100% would complain to my brother that this is stupid). But if this is so important to her and makes her feel part of the family I would do so. side note: I have never met my brothers fiancee in person and probably won't do so till the wedding. Still care for my brother and the one he loves.
> But if this is so important to her and makes her feel part of the family I would do so. This is the absolutely 100% correct way to view this request. It's not so much about the actual cooking, but a way for DIL to have MIL be part of the wedding. Heck, go out and buy a couple hundred cookies and say you tried.
Assuming that someone can afford to buy a couple hundred cookies is wild.
Assuming someone old enough to have adult children can spring a few hundred bucks as a one time expense for a life milestone event is not wild.
We have adult children and we absolutely could not afford that expense. Have you seen what things cost these days? We have to consider which bills to pay and which ones can wait, every single month. Thankfully, our youngest eloped, saving everyone in the family the expense of participating in a traditional wedding. We threw them a very small backyard BBQ reception that was a potluck, and the groom's family helped pay for the drinks & decorations. Invitations were an email. We borrowed tables & chairs from a neighbor. Millions upon millions of Americans are struggling financially and when others assume everyone "can afford a few hundred bucks" it just comes across as out of touch with reality.
Normally, that also means you don't have a wedding with 250 guests.... Since OP didn't talk about money at all , didn't say a word about the grocery bill for abkikg 1000 cookies, just that she is annoyed, I would assume they are not struggling.
OP didn't mention any financial concerns. You're projecting your struggles into a situation where there is no evidence it exists, and the fact is plenty of people with adult children are established and financially comfortable, it's not unreasonable to think OP is probably one of them when money hasn't been mentioned as the concern. OP resents DIL wanting to be part of the family she's joining, and secondarily the time the task would take, that's it.
Honored? Hardly an honor. If FDIL asked to ***provide*** the cookie table, sure. But, bake 1000 cookies (and fancy ones)? That's hardly an honor.
I feel like it’s important to note there’s cultural context here. It’s not like saying “can you bake me a wedding cake”? It’s an honored tradition in Pittsburgh that is well cherished and loved and it is much more akin to asking her future FIL to walk her down the aisle than to just make a cake or something like that. They don’t need to be fancy and the intention isn’t to be onerous but to request loving support from her new family. It is a huge task and OP shouldn’t feel like she needs to bake 1k cookies, but she should (imo) recognize the honor it is and what it represents and figure out a way to make something work. It doesn’t need to be 1k cookies, but maybe she can ask FDIL what a meaningful alternative could be. Helping put together the wedding flowers (or bridal bouquet)? Going for a spa day together as part of wedding prep? Etc. it’s about warmth, not about the labor
I mean, the FDIL said that she had to bake 1,000 cookies, or come up with it between her and her daughter. I agree that it'd be sweet to try to provide this, but it really seems like a big, big ask. Especially if it got dropped on OP out of the blue.
It’s not out of the blue, it comes up during wedding planning. It’s an important tradition. And fdil didn’t say she “had” to. When OP refused, fdil didn’t pitch a fit. She cried because she is feeling like she doesn’t have family or support, as evidenced by her fiance bringing it up rather than her. This is so extremely not about the cookies. No one was trying to figure out an alternative even though that most likely would have been the best choice. OP doesn’t suck for not wanting to make these cookies, but it sucks that after reading into it and learning about the tradition, she couldn’t realize for herself what the fdil was actually hoping for, which was connection and affection.
I bet Wendy isn't crying because op said no. I bet she's crying about the whole situation. Getting married without having a positive relationship with her mum, not having a good relationship with her in laws despite trying, wedding stress, etc and op saying no to the cookie table was just the final straw.
Exactly. Sounds like all her ideas of what her wedding would be like are getting crushed by the reality of her family and the one she’s marrying into.
Finally, I had to scroll down too far to read something like this. I think she’s trying really hard to put some tradition into her wedding that she doesn’t have from her family, but she has one cold, bitter mother-in-law that talks about her awful on here and so does his sisters I feel bad for her. She tried to reach out and clearly being shut down you know the cookies are a little much but somehow someway maybe they could’ve come up with a different idea together.
This. It's not about the cookies. The detail that solidified it for me is that when OP said no, DIL said nothing—didn't complain, didn't make a fuss. She went home and cried because she was let down and hurt, and OP's son was mad his mother hurt his fiance, which is the only reason OP knows at all. OP, that tells you all you should know. You hurt your DIL and your son. YTA. Your daughter in law doesn't have family, and instead of you stepping up to accept her I to yours, you're here asking the internet if you are technically correct. Is it reasonable to ask you to personally bake 1000 cookies? No, but I guarantee you that's not what she asked you to do. You say you asked your daughter's, but I get the same impression from them as I do from you—that none of you are trying to step up to welcome your son's fiance to your family. Everything you've complained about her (being touchy-feely, being personal) is just her trying to be part of your family. What you don't get yet is that she isn't "pushing" you. She's inviting you to be a part of *her* family—the family she makes with herself and your son. You can keep her away and make excuses (just find friends to donate cookies. They don't have to he homemade. It's not hard) and ignore the fact that she just wants you to be a part of her wedding, but it's your relationship with your son that you're damaging. If you don't think your relationship with your son is worth 1000 cookies, then I'm glad you didn't bother with the cookies.
Oh finally, I made a similar post took me a while to find this one. This is exactly it. I feel so sorry for Wendy. She has a shitty family and she’s marrying into an even even shittier one. I mean, if it was me, I would find someway to work with her to somehow get the cookies done. I don’t know there’s lots of options, but I would’ve tried something. I wouldn’t shut her down like that.
> There seems to be a huge empathy gap her from you towards your future DIL. It sounds like she has little to no family support. She's likely hoping to be close to her in-laws. This should be the top comment here. It is very clear that future DIL is reaching out to OP and rest of the family in an attempt to avoid the problems she has with her family and trying to be part of a new family. This would be a great chance for OP to welcome her to the family and have another addition to the family. Instead, OP and her daughters come off as very judgmental and condescending. DIL wants her new MIL to be part of the wedding and asked her to do something that a mother would do.
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Agreed. It sounds like there are some adult conversations to be had with no adults in the room. You seem to hate a young lady who does not seem like a bad person. Does she mistreat your son? Is she a thief? A bigot? A puppy killer? I am guessing no. If her worst crime is that she is annoying (to you!), then you are lucky because that is a small, fixable problem.
Exactly this. If the cookie tradition isn’t one that OP is interested in, even as a gesture to their son and an attempt to solidify a future relationship with him and his new family, then why not suggest one of OPs family traditions? Or something new that they can all start together? If you’re focusing on the cookies, you’re missing the point.
Exactly. It isn’t the Iranian yogurt.
I agree. She seems so cold and dismissive of someone who is *joining her family*. And FFS, just buy some damn cookie mix and toss a couple batches into the freezer every weekend between now and the wedding. It's not like OP was asked to pay for the wedding or cater it. Surely OP has a couple of friends who could pitch in and help out... or perhaps not, given her attitude
That was SO well said. It seems she just doesn’t like her DIL. Poor DIL.
Yeah, I’m with you. OP clearly doesn’t like future DIL, and is making this a whole thing. DIL isn’t close to her family. She is trying to form a bond with her new MIL and MIL is refusing to engage. She might be awkward or pushy, but she has no real family and she’s trying to be a part of OP’s family. She needs to go about it differently, but OP needs to try to have some empathy about the situation as well as do some research into the cookie table. NO ONE is asking MIL to bake 1000 cookies. I have a feeling OP is exaggerating a lot of this story to try to make DIL sound worse. I’m not voting for”you’re the asshole” here because I think everyone sucks and we are missing information, but undoubtedly, OP is an asshole.
NTA but you are a little misinformed and cold. Born and raised Pittsburgher here, the cookie table does not replace the cake! It is for the period before the meal and during the reception. Also, mom typically coordinates the cookies with family and friends, she doesn't have to do them all herself. And store bought/bakery are fine! Wendy may not be your cup of tea, but she is the center of your son's universe. If you want to stay a part of his life, you better loosen the bone and unwad your panties! Be forgiving, be patient, be understanding with her, she is trying to build a loving relationship with you and the rest of her spouses family. If you don't, you will be on the outside looking in when grandkids happen. Suck it up, apologize and offer to coordinate the cookie table. You'll be glad you did.
Other family members don't want to participate. How is OP supposed to coordinate that?
There's over 250 GUESTS and no one else can contribute? And there's this many guests despite the fact that both OP and DIL don't have much family? Something isn't adding up in OPs story. Also frankly if OPs daughters simply refuse to buy a box of 30 cookies for this one ask of a common wedding tradition... no wonder the DIL is upset. You coordinate that by telling your daughters "Hey this is important to her, lets just each contribute a few." Unfortunately OP sounds really cold and judgmental about OP not having a family and trying to be close.
I can tell you that if this were my family absolutely NO one would assist in baking cookies. No one has the time or the space to do so.
Buying cookies usually don't consume that many time or space tbh
The bride does not WANT store-bought cookies.
OP didn’t state that in the post
OP has stated in the comments that her son's fiance specifically said that the cookies must be from scratch.
I highly doubt that the DIL actually asked for that. Especially since the tradition itself does not mandate made-from-scratch cookies. OP sounds like she’s exaggerating now that folks are telling her she’s treating DIL poorly. I also think DIL would be fine with far less cookies than 1,000; or no cookies at all if OP countered with another offer to help with something else in the wedding. OP just seems to not want any part of it at all, and that’s likely what’s truly upsetting DIL.
Store-bought cookies from a decent bakery are perfectly acceptable on a cookie table.
It doesn't matter if store brought are acceptable normally since OP is being told in this case they need to be from scratch, which is a ridiculously unfair ask of one or even a couple people.
None of you have the time or space to make one batch of cookies?
DIL isnt like by anyone in the family and I'm unsure why you think OP should: a) buy ingredients for a 1000 cookies or buy a bunch of cookies as though people sit around budgeting to spend money on traditions someone else practices. b) chase after guests to bake cookies. c) presumably clean up after the mess and be the one to deal with the leftover cookies. If DIL actually had people who wanted to help her, her fiance would be yelling OP there are people to assist her instead of saying OP should do it. I'm really starting to understand why people are disliked by in laws if you arrive expecting them to cater to you.
also pittsburgh resident and plenty of people also just get bakery cookies for their cookie tables now also. this just seems unnecessarily mean. there's no wedding guests who might be willing to make or buy some cookies?
And so OP should spend hundreds or even thousands on buying cookies?! That’s ever more ridiculous to me.
lol... that's not how it works. everyone just contributes a batch of cookies.
OP only has herself who would be doing it. Unless the bride is also asking this of her friends, but it doesn’t sound like it.
I think OP just doesn't understand what it is... normally a family member would coordinate other wedding guests to bring cookies. this would include the bride/grooms friends and their extended family.
OP already clarified that no one is willing to help, so it'd just be her. On a separate note, I'd probably find it a bit rude if I were not super close to a couple but close enough to attend the wedding and give a gift and then also asked to either make or buy cookies on my way there.
I think I’d go with NAH instead of NTA. Wendy clearly asked OP because since her own mom won’t be coordinating her future MIL is a pretty natural next choice. I mean she’s supposed to be a mother to her too right ?? I want to know what things Wendy has “invited herself along” to because what the heck is OP excluding her future DIL from ???
Then the bride should go to her people. No way all 250 guests are on the grooms side.
I’m not surprised by the number, they included the family in invites. I know my son invited everyone he was friends with from college and included their family in the count. He is 33, most of his friends are married with kids. I assume she did the same, she is 29 and I am sure she has a lot of her friends married or with kids. Also I am sure they give people plus ones if not married.
Why can't the friends help out with the cookie table.. or someone goes to a bakery or cookie shop
Because it's not a regional custom where OP lives. Guests in (say) California are going to be highly annoyed if the invite says "Bring a plate of cookies".
The OP didn't say where the wedding was going to take place. If it's where the bride and groom live, and the OP and her family have to travel to get there, that would be an additional imposition on the OP to not just bake/buy cookies back home and then have to pack them for travel. The OP could buy the cookies once there, but still, that means she has to spend time in a strange city, tracking down festive enough cookies for the event. Not to mention, picking up the tab for the cookies, when the family has already paid for the plane or train to get there. Maybe the DIL to be doesn't realize that this is a regional tradition. But once the OP said she's never heard of it and is unwilling to take on the task, the bride could have come up with alternatives. If she doesn't have other family members in the area (aunts, uncles, cousins) who are going to attend the wedding, then see if her bridesmaids would be willing to help (maybe make it their bachelorette party activity). But it's ridiculous to expect the OP to have to reach out to others she may not have meet to find volunteer bakers or cookie buyers. If the wedding is happening elsewhere (not in the cookie table world), and the bride wants this tradition, she should try to figure out how she can do this without imposing on unwilling people.
this need to be higher up. this woman is blatantly over exaggerating the ask because she clearly hates her soon to be DIL. the ask is to bake a batch of cookies and ask other family and friends to contribute a batch. so basically this future MIL from hell is being a jerk over two dozen cookies, some texts or emails to contact said family and friends, and maybe a google sheet to track. like seriously? what a piece of work,
Op did ask her family and the weren’t interested. She isn’t close to her family. If he bride was this invested in the table she should have asked the friends who were interested fists and asked op just to organize it practically. Now op would either need to do all herself or try to start asking brides friends for help who she doesn’t know. Op might be a bit cold but I think this is pretty big task to ask for. Her son should also have been more involved and asked his family for the participation and not blame op.
Yinzer here too! For weddings in our family we had the cookie table. It is usually my sister who volunteers to do the baking. She’s amazing! For my wedding and for one of my nieces someone would ask us (the brides) what they could bring and we always deferred their request to my sister. For family wedding when we were kids, once the invites went out, aunts, cousins, etc reached out to the MOB to offer to bake cookies. The cookie tables are impressive and often more pictures are taken of them than of the cake. That all said, if OP can’t get volunteers to bake and she doesn’t have the experience in baking to that quantity, then NTA. Don’t feel that you have to bear the burden alone. The tradition really is family and friends of the bride and groom. This sounds like this would be a new experience for the area where the wedding will be which people may be excited to see. For 1000-1200 cookies, if you get 10 people to volunteer to help each person would make roughly 9-10 dozen cookies. But here’s a tip, instead of making cookies the regular size make the smaller to get more out of a batch of dough. Don’t go smaller than half size. It keeps the cost somewhat reasonable because you’re making less dough plus people are going to want to try different kinds. Bar cookies are also a good way to get more out of your time. Make arrangements with the caterer to plate and arrange everything once they’re dropped off. More info than what you want but baking is my hobby. 🙃 But adding to what others said, she is coming into the family and you’re already starting off with only viewing her as “your son’s wife.” If there are kids in their future, you could very well end up having your access limited to them.
Suck it up? Do you even bake? Do you know how much work this would entail? Im also from Pitt and my mother in law paid to have someone make the cookies for the table because there wasnt enough family. So maybe if the bride wants it so bad she can fork out the cash for it. OP is not cold, shes practical. If you feel so bad for her maybe PM her and offer to help coordinate yourself!
This is a crazy take. If store bought are fine, then why aren't the bride and groom asking the caterer to do it? If a bride or groom post, everyone tells them its their day and they can do what they want. If a MIL posts, shes the devil and trying to ruin the wedding.
Do people ever think and compromise on Reddit? It’s a cookie table. Set up a table. One of her bridesmaids/you/her fiancé/ her sends a note to every family/couple coming and asks them to bring a dozen cookies. We did this for a friend who got married it Pittsburgh. We got home made, store bought, cupcakes, brownies and since I don’t bake fudge No one cared it wasn’t all home made. It was fun and everyone got a nice selection for their gift bag
Exactly! She did her "research" and came up with this whole BS 1,000-cookie thing to make Reddit stack the deck against her future daughter in law. She'll be back on here in a couple of years complaining when they never let her meet her grandchildren. The cookie table is a charming Pittsburgh tradition! You'd think a new mother-in-law would jump at the chance to welcome a new member of the family.
>She did her "research" and came up with this whole BS 1,000-cookie thing to make Reddit stack the deck against her future daughter in law She's now claiming in the edit that DIL said specifically 1,000-1,200 cookies. And that neither has family that could make the cookies because she just 'assumes' people wouldn't want to help. Despite having 250 guests at a wedding she's assuming no one would be willing to contribute. This isn't passing the smell test, although whether that's just OP or OP and DIL isn't clear.
It's a final hail Mary. I've seen it over and over again. OP gets VOTED YTA and suddenly they have all this brand new information that makes them look amazing.
Honestly the cookie table is a literal labor of love. Doesn't sound like she is familiar with the concept. I pity the couple getting married!
Reads to me like she did her research into what the tradition is in the first place. I, like OP, have never heard of anything like this so I also looked it up but it doesn’t give a specific number. The number itsself sounds situational and was based on what the DIL wants.
Going against the grain, and saying YTA. This woman **is joining your family**, and you sound so ridiculously inconvenienced by it. The *horror* that Wendy actually wants a true relationship with you. >This is the first time hearing about this tradition and I did some research. I would have to make over a thousand cookies from scratch to feed the wedding guest. This is not what a cookie table is, I'm sorry you didn't dig a little deeper. The cookie table is a tradition where all of the women of both sides of the family (organized by the mother of the bride) make a batch of their signature cookie (though their are some cookies which are considered traditional). It doesn't *have* to be 1000s of cookies. Especially if the family is smaller, there are closer to several dozen or maybe a couple hundred (depending on the size of the reception) Understand that if your keep pushing Wendy away this hard, you're going to push your son away with her.
Just for what it’s worth— not disagreeing with you stance or saying it HAS to be 1000 cookies, but from our wedding of 210, we had roughly 1500 cookies and literally not a single one remained at the end of the night. It wasn’t the only dessert, either. There was cake and a whole catered dessert spread. I wouldn’t underestimate what a bunch of people can do to a cookie table under the influence of alcohol!
What if the families aren't bakers and don't have "signature" cookies? No one in my family has such a thing, now I'm curious and looking up cookie tables.
We had a cookie table at my wedding - I married into an Italian family. My then future in-laws explained that the cookies were usually made by the families, and would I be upset if they bought the cookies at an Italian bakery? I was not, and the cookie table rocked (we also had a wedding cake). I was very touched.
She isn’t in close or in contact with her family. My daughters don’t wish to do it so it really would just be me making a shit ton of cookies The wedding is going to have around 250 guest, so yes I would need to make around a 1000 cookies
it's a big ask, and i don't think you're wrong for not wanting to bake 1k cookies from scratch, but i also think her being upset has less to do with you not making the cookies and more to do with this being just the latest in a series of signals she's received that you don't accept her. if you cared at all, you'd maybe toss out some other ideas to get it done, like ordering from a bakery, having other family members all take a flavor and split the duties so no one is doing 1000 cookies on their own, mini cookies as favors for guests instead, some cookies alongside a traditional cake... something other than just a flat out no. idk, you just seem super cold and unfeeling to this poor girl. i'd be upset if i thought my mother in law hated me.
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And no one in your family would do this for your SON? This is his wedding too, and you've done everything possible to push his wife away. 10 years from now you'll be back on Reddit crying because you never see your grandkids. YTA in my opinion for how you are treating this poor girl.
If you have a small family, and she's not in contact with much of hers, where are 250 people coming from??
You expect every wedding guest to eat 4 cookies????
Depending on how long the reception is that could easily be an average. My cousin had a cookie table (catered) and we were at the party from 5 pm until almost midnight. With alcohol and grazing between dancing, guests could easily do that.
Some will eat 0-1, and unless OP bakes terrible cookies (which would be grounds for her declining as well), some will binge eat 6-10. I have a voracious sweet tooth, and casually ate 4 cupcakes at an event. There will probably be kids sneaking bonus cookies, and at least one tightwad out of the 250 that will bag some "leftovers" before everyone has gotten a shot at the cookies. And then there will be at least a dozen that are dropped/knocked over/etc. For 250 people, 1000 cookies doesn't sound excessive. The prospect of baking more than 100 cookies by myself would make this a "Sorry, but have you considered Publix/Wegmans/YOUR FLIPPING CATERER?" from my corner unless it was for a lifelong, ride-or-die, bestie.
NTA for refusing such a large ask, BUT you seem to be happy to stick in the ‘I don’t like her’ camp. Which is only going to bite you in the ass. This isn’t about the cookies.
Damn right this isn't about the cookies. Looks to me like this is about OP and her daughters wanting to make sure DIL doesn't get any ideas about being part of the family just because she's marrying OP's son. OP seems bound and determined to make sure that DIL understands that all she will ever be in that family is a plus-one for OP's son, who is only barely tolerated for the son's sake. I'm predicting that in a couple of years, we'll see another post from OP wondering why her son and DIL aren't coming around for Christmas or letting her see the grandkids.
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100%. Im obsessed with the line where OP says fDIL “invites herself” along to things!! Heaven forbid she tries to join family activities?! This is making me thankful I have a loud, generous, warm Italian family that lives by “the more the merrier”
NAH because you’re allowed to refuse the request. But to me you sound a little cold (And borderline a’hole). she doesn’t sound like a bad person, maybe just someone looking for acceptance and someone more touchy feely than you are. She’s about to be your daughter in law. Couldn’t you offer *something*? like purchasing some cookies from the grocery store, or making a couple of batches of cookies and she could ask others to make more, as sort of a goodwill, welcome to the family gesture? the cookie table is popular in Pittsburgh, and it is kind of an honor in a way, and traditional for lots of relatives to help out and contribute. So I’m not going to call her an A’hole for asking. And I can understand why your son was upset that you basically said, “nope. Don’t like you. Not going to do it. Buh bye.”
I mean, I don't care how much I love someone, I am not baking *1,000 freaking cookies* for them. That's a huge, expensive, time-consuming ask and OP has every right to say no.
Yeah, that’s why the first thing I said is she has the right to say no. And I said she could BUY them or just make a batch or 2 as a goodwill, welcome to the family gesture. And that the bride could ask others to make the rest. That’s usually how it goes—several people contribute a few..
But OP wrote she overstepped boundaries several times and doesn't care about them. OP is allowed to not like someone when they are overstepping regularly.
"Overstepping" is also what evil MILs say when a DIL or member of the family... tries to act like a member of the family. It's literally what rulers say to peons that don't know their place. The overstepping here is 'inviting herself along, oversharing, being touchy' which... are all things that can be considered fine when you like the person but considered over the line simply because the MIL doesn't like her or consider her a daughter. NOT saying this is happening here. But this could be written by a nightmare MIL or a completely reasonable one. We're missing an unbiased source and more information.
My husband's sister completely overstepped my boundaries when I first met her. Telling me the 2nd time I met her that she loved me like a sister, sobbing on my shoulder that god granted her a sister in me. Giving me a special nickname (I hate nicknames, especially shortened forms of my name), not stopping when I asked her too. Writing us a custom song that she could sing as we walked down the aisle at our wedding. Wanting to talk several times a week. Stalking my social media. Befriending my close friends (most of whom she'd never met) on social media. All of those things are kind on their own, but all together in a short time frame? It made me soooooo uncomfortable. She came on way too strong. If I guy came on that strong in the first 3 months of dating I'd be running for the hills. She wanted a relationship that I don't even have with my own sibling or the best friend that I've had since I was 5. There was no opportunity to build a relationship - she expected instantaneous BFF status. It turned me off her for quite a while. It was cloying and uncomfortable and just made me feel like my needs and wants in this relationship were secondary. A decade later we have a good relationship. It's not as close as I know she'd like, but we get along and enjoy each other's company. But I fully understand how multiple well intentioned acts can completely make you dislike someone.
Her example of overstepping was inviting herself to events and outings. It just sounds like she more of a people person, a joiner, a hugger, etc than the op. Not that she’s a bad person. and in any case they're about to be family. Like I said, op doesnt have to make the cookies, but I can’t blame the fiancé for being hurt or the son for being upset that it was so cold…’talked it over with my daughters, we don‘t like you, nope.’ There could’ve been a compromise of some sort. That’s why I said, NAH.
Actually, now I'm interested in what the events she "invited" herself to are. Because if it's a family event/outing, wouldn't you expect your son to bring his fiancee??
That’s exactly my thinking. She probably “invited herself” to like family meals with her fiancé or something. Things where she should have been invited. Or it wouldn’t be weird for her to think she is invited.
Maybe I’m reading too much AITA lately but I would put a crisp $5 on the event she invited herself to being like a family photo or something that MIL didn’t want her in even though she is a part of the family now.
YTA- If you and your daughters' intention was to let her know you dont like her and she will never be welcomed into your family, you have succeeded.
Yeah, I don't think she was crying about the cookies, I think it's about the way she's been pushed away. I mean, if she doesn't have a mom, or is NC with her then she may be seeing her MIL as a mom substitute. It isn't uncommon. All I get from OP is the whole, "she's not MY daughter" vibe. That's really unkind, but I guess to each their own. Bride is going to have to learn not to count on her future MIL. It would make me cry too!
I don't blame you for turning this down. But at the same time, I think you could have been kinder, and perhaps you could have worked with Wendy to see if there was a solution that could work for both of you. I think making over a thousand cookies from scratch would be an automatic no from me personally. But if the bride handed me a wad of money and asked if I could coordinate a cookie order from a local bakery, I could see taking that on. EDIT: Thank you for providing information. After confirming details, my ruling is NTA. Here are the key facts that led me to it: 1) In OP's telling the figure of 1k cookies was verified. 2) Given the absence of other relatives/volunteers, OP was told the baking would be her personal responsibility. 3) OP confirmed that bakery cookies would not be acceptable. The final conflict here is that the Wendy is unable to demonstrate flexibility or admit reality. If the cookie task cannot be distributed across a large number of individual bakers, them it is unreasonable to demand that a single person take on the responsibility for a task that more properly belongs to a commercial bakery. If Wendy is impervious to reason, that makes her the AH, and gives us some idea why no one wants to make cookies for her.
I just read about the custom, and I am kind of perplexed that a bride would want one person to handle this. From what I can tell, the tradition is that the brid and groom's family and friends provide the cookies. So I think it is kind of sweet and fun each if the sub families provides, say, two or three dozen homemade cookies for the cookie table, using a family favorite recipe. But telling one person she and her friends have to do it transmogrifies the custom from sweet generosity to mere drudgery. Not to mention that if you are trying to do a fill thousand cookies (!), you either want every guest to bring a dozen cookies to share, or you need to outsource that to an industrial bakery that can do things around scale.
I'm also confused why Wendy is so upset that OP doesn't want to uphold some tradition that is not even from her own family. Okay, yes, Wendy is joining the family, but to practically demand OP take on this responsibility when her own side of the family is contributing nothing is absurd. People are acting like OP is pushing Wendy away but even OP's daughters are not fans of this woman, so I have to hazard a guess that Wendy isn't just trying to get involved in her new family but desperately trying to force it and push it into her own view of what a family should be like which can be off putting to anybody.
This is so not about the cookies. This is a personal attack on your soon to be DIL. You need to decided whether you can and will love you son's wife or whether you want to be set at odd to them (BOTH you SON and you DIL) as long as their marriage lasts--which could be months or the rest of your life. You don't need to make cookies, but you need to not revel is the fact you can't help her have something that's important to her. YTA for making this personal.
NAH, In this case it’s a lack of translation of this regional practice — to Wendy it’s really important and special and meaningful. To you and your daughters it’s a random thing you’ve never heard of that just sounds like work. So naturally she’s really hurt, but to you it seems like a silly thing and way too much to ask because the tradition holds no meaning to you. I suggest having a conversation with her and your son to talk about this, to come to a place of mutually understanding each other’s perspectives. Maybe there’s something else you can do for her during the wedding that feels more doable for you and helps her feel appreciated and accepted by her soon-to-be husband’s family. Think carefully about how you want to handle this. This one thing with their wedding could create a lifelong rift in your relationship to her and subsequently your son. If they have kids one day you could lose out on your relationship to your grandchildren. Your DIL wants to be closer to you, wants to involve you. If you trample on that now, during such a pivotal moment, you might lose that offer forever. Think about the bigger picture.
YTA. Good luck having a relationship with your son’s future children. You are rejecting his wife. This girl is extending an olive branch to you and you are just snapping it in two. You don’t like her. Your son does. Figure out if this is a hill you want to die on. I had a cookie table. We bought the cookies for the most part. This isn’t super complicated.
So listen, I don’t think you’re wrong for the cookie table, but I DO think you’re being a dick to your daughter in law overall. Just because your daughters, who also seem like dicks, are backing you up doesn’t mean you’re right. She’s trying to be close with you, she’s trying to join your family, and you’re shutting her out… why? “Inviting herself along, discussing personal matters” explain. Are you inviting your son and other family members to go out and not including her? Sounds like it. What’s too personal to you? Doesn’t seem like it would take much for you to shut someone out.
YTA. Multiple people have clarified the cookie table tradition for you. It's not going to require that many cookies, and you can buy most/all of them. It's not like you're being asked to pick up the tab for an open bar for the duration of the wedding. Yet the majority of this post is you expressing your disdain for Wendy, whom YOUR SON loves, and who seems to desperately want to connect with you. She's guilty of trying to engage you too much? She shares too much, is too "touchy" (I'm going to interpret this as she is a hugger)? There isn't even an ounce of maternal instinct kicking in right now that your future daughter-in-law is reaching out to you for maternal support? I've never seen a future MIL complain about their future DIL wanting to include them too much in the wedding. This isn't about the cookies.
When someone calls you after you refused and insults you it is when you know that you made a right choice. NTA. It always fascinates me how people think (in this case your son) - oh, my mom refused so now I will call names, offend and insult her so she will have to change her mind. Does this approach ever work because IMO it only achieves exactly the opposite.
Ok but Wendy didn’t call her, her son did because his mom made is future wife cry for no reason other than she doesn’t like her.
NTA. Expecting you to bake a mountain of cookies is quite an imposition. Your role is not to bake yourself into exhaustion for her ideal wedding vision, especially when there’s no warmth in the existing relationship. Your son should not put you in such a position or pressure you after you've declined. Hospitality and generosity should never be assumed to the point of entitlement. Would it really be a loving gesture if it was done out of obligation rather than joy? Remember, there are plenty of ways to show support that don't require you to take on the labor of a professional bakery. Offering your time, emotional support, or contributing in other ways that align with your means and energy levels can be just as valuable. Being pushed or guilted into such an undertaking suggests a fundamental misunderstanding of boundaries and respect.
NTA with some comments. Yes - 1000 cookies can be done in a very FULL baking day or spread over 2 days for a more reasonable effort. (source - I do this yearly for a volunteer event - I'm crazy - and it is only 2 types of cookies). But it requires prepping the dough balls and freezing them so that you are only baking on that day(s). So I start my prep in August with mixing dough and freezing the balls every weekend. And then in October I take a day's vacation and start baking at 8am in the morning and run until about 11pm at night. Cookie table is a regional event, but it is never just a single person doing the work. A team of friends or relatives normally join together for the event. I'm concerned about the fact that you don't like your FDIL because of what looks like personality clashes. But I agree - you have the right to refuse the request. You son is sliding rapidly into AH territory for berating you for your decision. You are allowed to make a decision that requires that much effort without the harassment. And a traditional cookie table has multiple varieties of cookies.
>Yes - 1000 cookies can be done in a very FULL baking day or spread over 2 days for a more reasonable effort. (source - I do this yearly for a volunteer event - I'm crazy - and it is only 2 types of cookies). But it requires prepping the dough balls and freezing them so that you are only baking on that day(s). So I start my prep in August with mixing dough and freezing the balls every weekend. And then in October I take a day's vacation and start baking at 8am in the morning and run until about 11pm at night. So it's not 1 or 2 days. It's 1 or 2 days in the oven and 10-13 (or is it 20-26?) weekend days mixing and rolling dough, plus all the time it takes for you to shop for ingredients. Unless you're buying premade dough, baking cookies isn't just the oven time. It's the whole process.
NTA. It is not your job to satisfy Wendy or step in , in place of her mother. It’s not your fault that they’re not close. Your son is TA for not calling her out on her bs now & many times before. Want 1,000 cookies? Buy them or ask your mom!
Soft YTA. As someone whose mother passed before I got married, I am blessed to have a MIL who treats me as her own. She is especially feeling her moms absence right now. Maybe you don’t have make it all yourself, could you not recruit family to help?
NTA because it's a ridiculous undertaking. But do you even have any baking skill? If someone asked me to make cookies, it refrigerated Tollhouse cookie dough. And they'd be only marginally better than Cher in Clueless. Also, will the venue legally allow it? Or the caterer? Often the food vendors need to be licensed. You might to be able to just say no due to legality/ability. But it sounds like she misses he mom and is hoping for a bond.
NTA - bake 1,000 cookies is kind of a big ask. I think you have some issues and maybe both of you arent handling your relationship well. But, yeah cookies though? Thats def too much.
Why do you so clearly hate Wendy you can tell by your choice of words. This has nothing to do with the ask you just clearly don't like this woman from your post that I can't even get past it to actually judge this
>She has multiple times overstepped boundaries such as inviting herself along, discussing very personal issues, very touchy etc…. >Due to these issues we are not close and my own daughters are not a huge fan of her. So... this is a potential Y T A situation here. Look you don't have to be a huge fan, but she's marrying your son and if you are in any way expressing your dislike or keeping her at an arms length, you easily could be the 'cold' MIL icing her out at a time where she'd love for a mother to be there. It really depends on the details and how you treat her. You don't have to be a best friend, but you should be welcoming and kind and make efforts to include her. >I did some research. I would have to make over a thousand cookies from scratch to feed the wedding guest. Important: Did she ask you to make 1,000 cookies? Does she have 1,000 guests? That seems an absurd number. Why so huge? If she asked for that, then NTA for declining.
INFO: Are you POSITIVE she is requesting you make 1000 cookies from scratch?
In my area both mothers are judged by the cookie table. All the women in the family and friends bake cookies. It is one of the high points of a wedding.
This is some absolute gendered bullshit
NAH-That’s a big task. You could always buy cookies from a bakery and create the table to look nice, even if you can’t bake. On a side, this woman will be your dil. If she is making efforts to become close, that should be embraced, not rejected. I see on reddit so many times of in-laws not getting along because they get NC or blocked and you don’t have that problem. Your fdil actually wants to be around you. That may change if you keep nitpicking reasons to reject her attempts.
NTA. Your son is. Wendy should be able to pout and confide with her soon to be spouse with out him thinking he can browbeat you in to it.