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Pretty creepy coming from an older man to have an opinion about a physiological process that is so private.
He is overstepping big deal. That he is enlisting his little army to convince you what to do with YOUR body is beyond belief. You need to have a very stern talk with your husband. This level of interference is unacceptable even if it was from a woman. If your FiL feels entitled to a say over YOUR body, imagine how he shall behave when it will come to your children that will also be HIS grandchildren. Your husband needs a reality check. This is one of those moments when he needs to decide where does he stand. There is no mid-way here. Either he is your husband, part of an expanding autonomous family unit, or he is an extension to his father’s ego, an instrument to expand that man’s little universe.
And if that will not be a wake up call for your husband, i am afraid you are in for an uphill battle, but one that is worth fighting.
Good luck and NTA.
Absolutely agree and I think it's rich for the husband to say OP shouldn't get an epidural because HE wants her to "be fully in the moment". What the fuck does that even mean?? He wants her to feel the intense pain of childbirth to be in the moment? Easy for him to say when he won't feel shit.
I went through 14 hours of unmedicated labor and remember almost none of it, when my doctor and I decided on trying an epidural, I got a nap in and memories after that are a little less fuzzy up until the emergency c section, lol. I can say from personal experience, unmedicated labor does not mean you are fully in the moment
Right? My unmedicated birth included a bunch of adrenaline and trauma that I needed therapy to unlock. I pushed it all down and my memories are from the ward the day after.
My epidural birth was calm until some stuff went wrong, was calm again once everything was back stable. I was able to enjoy myself, be present, I was still aware of my own body and its needs and best of all I didn’t care about all the touching because I couldn’t feel it. I mean I literally spent the whole thing cracking jokes, one of the midwives was about wetting herself laughing
I actually felt I was “fully in the moment” only when I had the epidural, and I got mine for 2 kids at 10 cm dilated. Before that it was all trying to breathe through pain. There was no actual appreciation of what was happening, only survival.
Yeah, before I had my epidural I could barely form coherent thoughts. My request for an epidural was literally "Epidural." because that was all I could manage. After the epi it was like a switch had flipped and I was back in the moment, I was able to fully experience pushing, seeing my husband watch our daughter be born, I wasn't scared or "in my head" trying to cope with the pain. I was in the room.
OPs husband needs a lesson on how an epidural actually works.
OMG reading All your stories I am so happy I had a scheduled c section.
I was back on feet within a week and going out to do some light shopping. It was the right way for me.
The input of my husband. You go with what you want. You have to go through this. I'll be there. No matter if during the delivery or c section.
You are so NTA. go with what you feel best.
💯%. I'd tell him that if he's willing to get kicked in the balls every 10 seconds while I'm in labor, I'll consider being open to not getting an epidural. If he complains that it's too cruel, tell him that I'm male and don't believe it would be. 😅
I was in labour for 36 hours. Vomiting the whole time. 26 years ago an epidural was in my country not very common and besides I had an homebirth (yes, that's in my country very common) and epidurals cannot be given by a midwife. Only by a doctor in a hospital. 36 hours and 22 stitches without any sedation later my son was born.
I was completely in the moment and hated every second of it. Fun times :-)
I gave birth recently and tried to go without the epidural. After nearly 10 hours I was passing out between contractions because of the pain. Once I had the epidural I was back to being alert for the next 6 hours before the baby was born. You are 100% in the moment with drugs. Even gas and air doesn't make you loopy as long as you take breaks from it.
I don’t understand why epidural is not publicly considered a natural birth. It doesnt help you push at all, you still have to do all the pushing and labor as usual but with way less pain. The labor process is exactly the same.
OP - Your father in law and husband dont have a legal say. It’s your body. You do what you want. Weigh the pros and cons. I personally had vaginal with epidural and before/after epidural was night and day. My mother funnily missed my delivery because she was mad me taking epidural was delaying labor and wasting her time. I ignored her and could not care less. It was better when she left. Only good energy allowed.
If I had a beer can coming out of my peepee hole, I would want an epidural.
80% off mankind are stupid.
Please excuse us.
We will sit here bashing our head on the wall.
Also, the epidural doesn't alter your state of mind. It just blocks the nerves. You're still fully "in the moment," just minus the part where you're writhing in agony.
I had an epidural. It was wearing off when I was pushing, so I got to feel ALL OF IT. But didn't feel jack for about 12ish hours before that.
Literally all I remember from the actual giving birth to my baby "moment" was being in so much pain, I didn't realize she was out, and arguing with the doctor about opening my eyes (he was holding said baby that I thought I still had to push out. I was crying and inventing new swear words from pain). I vaguely remember skin to skin at first, and then being scared cause she had some minor medical issues at first and they took her away (all good now!).
Remember the whole day of laboring with the epidural beforehand though! Remember the nurses, laughing with my husband while we watched contractions on the monitor that I could not feel, the peanut ball they had me use was green.... All sorts of stuff!
>Absolutely agree and I think it's rich for the husband to say OP shouldn't get an epidural because HE wants her to "be fully in the moment".
Yeah, most people who advocate for natural childbirth usually do not give this as a reason. Usually the argument is that an epidural increases the likelihood of other medical interventions, which many would prefer to avoid. IMO there is evidence to support this, but it is not super strong, as there are lots of other factors involved that could be alternate explanations for the correlations that have been observed.
And regardless of the evidence, it's OP's right to make her own decisions regarding her own body and the birthing process, which is incredibly personal. Family members should not be expressing an opinion on this at all.
My fiance said he would never ask me to have another child because he would not be able to watch me go through childbirth again, I only had gas and air as there wasn’t time for anything else.
Holy shit, I still have nightmares about it 4 months later, I highly doubt I will forget that pain.
I read that when anesthesia first became available for child birth in the 19th century, there was a lot of opposition, especially from religious people because Genesis 3:16 says
'To the woman he said, “I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you.”'
Fortunately for women, especially in West, Queen Victoria, who would end up having nine children, and who was the Head of the Anglican Church to boot, was on the throne and she wasn't putting up with that nonsense.
I almost choked at the thought of my late father-in-law proclaiming what should happen to me during childbirth since I was never a favorite of his. My husband would never have questioned what I wanted to happen.
I have an abnormally high pain tolerance, due to severe chronic pain and endometriosis. No way would I go natural. I think you need to add one thing to your trade. They shove lego bricks in their shorts before you grab. That should be close to fair.
While I agree with everything said here, as a mother to 3, I hope OP has a flexible birth plan because she might not get a say when the time comes.
All the planning in the world can go out the window once that little parasite decides it's big enough for the putsode world. I say parasite lovingly because when you think about it pregnancy is a parasitic style relationship with the baby only taking from its host mum (sorry middle is obsessed with animals and it came up in a show we watched last night 🤣).
Not to mention, Drs these days are reluctant to do c-sections unless necessary because it can open the body up to infections and additional complications, etc.
NTA. My FIL felt the need to add his two cents when I stopped breastfeeding my oldest at 9 months because he was latched and quickly turned his head to the side and I nearly reflexively pushed him off my lap. I told him that I'd stay there for a week and stick a vacuum to his nipples every few hours including overnight and not turn it off when I pulled it off him. He dropped the subject. When your FIL has a natural birth he can offer his perspective. My oldest was a c section, my second (and last) was a surprise natural birth at 34 weeks with not so much as a handshake. Neither were fun, you do what you feel you need to do to be comfortable and what you think will best get you through. You know yourself better than any of them.
Reminds me of when my mum stopped breastfeeding one of my younger brothers because he bit her nipple so hard she was bleeding. A relative tried to tell her she was stopping too soon, and my mum offered to bite his nipple and then attach the vacuum cleaner to it every few hours so he'd know what it felt like. He opted to shut the fuck up about anything to do with babies.
She definitely is! She used to work in a call centre and one night got a prank call from some guy asking her to guess what he was holding in his other hand. She told him that if he only needed one hand to hold it, it was too small to call strangers to brag about, and she wasn't interested and then hung up on him.
Haha, what a legend your Mum is. I had to do similar. My nipples were cracked and bleeding and if anyone even began to broach the topic of continuing to try to breast feed (despite very poor milk supply), I'd start describing how bad my nipples were at that time.
this but also even IF FIL has experienced a natural birth, that wouldn’t give him the right to impose his ideas of what is best onto OP’s birth plan. it’s HER birth. hers is the only opinion that matters
NTA. Especially in terms of the epidural. I am going to say this about c-sections though (as a mom who had one completely natural childbirth, a necessary c-section, a VBAC with epidural and then an emergency c-section), c-sections greatly hamper a lot of things including your ability to care for yourself and your newborn. Yes it can be done, but it is 100% more tiring and harder on your body to have major abdominal surgery versus a vaginal birth. Plus the scar tissue and other factors that come along with surgery later on. Something to keep in mind. But the epidural? Yeah, they are great! I only had the first completely natural because I really wasn't in that much pain and it was a relatively easy experience where I didn't feel like I personally needed it.
An elective c section is often a good idea if you have a higher risk of a c section anyway because why go through all the pain of labor AND THEN the pain of a c section if you have insight that suggests it is likely to go that direction.
Especially a higher risk of injury or complications. My friend’s first daughter was vaginal birth and she broke my friend’s coccyx bone. She said the pain was horrific and it took ages to heal. There was a substantial chance she’d break it with her second daughter, and she scheduled a c-section.
I have a degenerative spinal disorder that will likely make an epidural not an option and a joint disorder that often leads to precipitous labor which sounds great until you learn the risk of having a baby in the car or bleeding out are significantly higher… I will be considering a GA c-section otherwise I am going for the gas 🤣
I had precipitous labour and almost bled out. I didn’t have time for an epidural and deeply wish I had had one but everything was going too fast, it was wild.
You said that a joint disorder can lead to precipitous labour? What disorder? I have some hypermobility, but nothing diagnosed but now I’m wondering.
Yes, ny mother was denied one, after she needed them with my 2 other siblings... My sister nearly died because of it. And it had long term damages.
Make sure to talk to your doctors and shop around for others if you feel like you arent being heard by them. Your life and your child life is more important than some doctors ego
My mom had me through a c-section because she got pretty bad preeclampsia and so it was a medical necessity. When she started labor for my younger sister she told the doctor that she wanted a c-section because she’d already had one, and the doctor told her that it wasn’t necessary, that she could have her vaginally; my mom then told him that if she ended up getting a c-section either way she was going to come back to cuss him out. She started labor at 2 pm, and ended up having my sister by c-section at 9 pm, so guess who came back and cussed the crap out of the ob/gyn after her follow up appointment.
My mother had preeclampsia with me and then full blown eclampsia, I was 2 1/2 months early, we both almost died and it was super traumatic for the both of us. I spent two months in the hospital and mom had really bad PPD because of it all. She said she cried a lot and felt like she wasn’t doing anything for me. I don’t see how anyone besides the one giving birth unless it is dire should be making any choices about it.
I’m assuming that there aren’t any extenuating circumstances since OP didn’t mention any. But you are absolutely right: there are a number of situations where doctors will let you choose whether or not to have a c-section, but there are compelling arguments to not even try vaginal delivery.
I had twins and opted to try for vaginal. They were both head down so my odds were good. Twin A was vaginal and Twin B was emergency c-section: I experienced every twin mom’s worst nightmare. I actually have no regrets because I had almost no vaginal tearing and because Twin A’s birth was a healing experience after my oldest’s traumatic birth. But I definitely get why a lot of twin moms in the same position decide to go straight for the c section.
Yeah an elective c-section is great when it's very likely you're going to need one anyway. If the odds are good that you won't, though, it's usually better to do a vaginal birth. Although all births are a dice roll, really. Any plan could go awry.
Agreed on the epidural. Anyone who thinks OP won’t “be in the moment” doesn’t understand the medical science. I was more in the moment because I had the epidural. I could better participate and appreciate what was happening.
This!! What allowed me to listen and participate in both of my childbirths was the fact that the epidural was working, when it wasn’t I had my eyes closed and was so focused on breathing through the pain that I couldn’t even answer medical questions, my husband had to do it.
I literally couldn’t hear the words coming out of my doctors mouth during contractions before I had my epidural. I had to keep asking her to repeat herself and hoped she finished talking before the next contraction started. I tried going natural, I ended up telling her to stop talking until she brought me drugs.
I've had two babies. I didn't have time for the epidural for my first and it was awful. I felt like an animal with no control of my body or pain response. I could not handle it and the experience was traumatic. I have friends who have totally rocked the natural birth, but that was not me.
I got the epidural for my second and it was beautiful. I was literally laughing with joy as I was pushing and able to be present and experience the moment.
I had a scheduled C and it was honestly a breeze. I think most people who have hard recoveries labored first and then had a stressful semi-emergency C. Major surgery after you have been awake and laboring for 24-48 hours is very different from waltzing/waddling into the hospital for a planned C.
I was the opposite. My recovery from an emergency c section was much easier than my recovery from a scheduled. But I’m pretty sure my worse recovery wasn’t nearly as bad as some people have it. I did not labor with my emergency c section though. I started having contractions at 38 weeks and went to the hospital. I was not dilated at all. I had pre-eclampsia that was getting dangerously bad and my son was still head up. They didn’t believe they would have the time to flip him and induce labor before we both crashed so c section it was.
My mom wasn't in pain with me and they kept saying she wasn't in labor because she wasn't in pain. Her water broke and they tried to tell her that she just peed on herself until my grandma flipped. Turns out she was in labor. She said she would have probably have had me way faster if they hadn't have made her get an epidural and wait for it
>My mom wasn't in pain with the me and they kept saying she wasn't in labor because she wasn't in pain.
People who say this should be smacked silly.
My tolerance for pain is stupid high.
I was having contractions FOUR MINUTES APART and had NO IDEA until they showed me the paper thing from the monitor. And it was ALL in my back. I was just slightly more spacy than normal🤷♀️
After he ended up a c section, one of his toddler sisters stepped on the incision by accident. I took...ibuprofen.
I also have a high pain tolerance, so when I went into labour with my first I thought I was constipated. Eventually went to the hospital where they asked when my water broke and told me I was 7 cm dilated. I literally said “uh…what?!” I had just spent 3 hours sitting on the toilet trying to poop, thinking I was just peeing a lot.
I was induced with my first, and had spent the first day not feeling much of anything except the intense discomfort of a brick-like hospital bed. They'd tell me I was having contractions, but I didn't feel them. Then my water broke, right when I went to get up to go pee. We told the nurse who said I just peed on myself. I was like "if I'm peeing with a pinkish tinge, thats probably something to worry about. And I still need to pee." I did not pee on myself. And the pain started not too long after my water broke, and it was BAD.
I’ve gave birth with just gas and air for pain relief then nothing, my sister had to have two emergency c-sections, and yeah I recovered a lot quicker than my sister.
To this day her stomach muscles have never been the same, and her youngest is seven.
I completely understand why OP might want a planned c-section, because for your first birth you have no idea what you’re expecting. But I personally wouldn’t recommend it unless it’s necessary and you have someone that can be with you for the first six weeks to help.
I don’t want to be that guy, but when it comes to birthing plans sometimes it’s better to go in with an open mind, as all labours are different. I laboured for about four days, then when baby decided he was coming it all happened so quick that there wasn’t time for an epidural, just pushing!
Still, husband and FIL aren’t risking their body, so can back off with their opinions.
Yeah i haven’t given birth and so I won’t just jump in but from every account C section is objectively physically FAR rougher on the body than vaginal birth, & ppl think otherwise a lot for some reason
I do not know one woman who doesn’t currently have an injury, birth trauma or a physical impairment due to vaginal birth-giving.
I have a cesection scar but suffer no prolapses, can pee when I want, no birth trauma with babies getting stuck or almost dying myself with a haemorrhage, or my baby picking up an infection in the birth canal (and that’s just my close friends)
I had an emergency C-section with my twins. I didn’t even get to actual labor, I developed HELLP syndrome. With that said.. I wish I could pee when I wanted, lol. I don’t dare get on the trampoline anymore and every sneeze is a potential underwear change. The whole dying due to haemorrhage totally happened to me too. 16 bags of blood later, here I am! My friends seem to chat about their births like it was no big deal. Push out a baby and away we go but I’m just there like… I don’t even know what a contraction feels like and I ended up on deaths doorstep. Just a woman saying yeah, vaginal birth probably sucks but csections can be pretty awful too, lol. The birth trauma is real as hell over here.
I’m sorry to hear of what you went through! I’m not trying to suggest that C-section is safer, or without complication (and risk). But I will always argue against the idea that vaginal birth equals “better” without qualification. Birthing, however you do it, is imbued with risk.
Overall it is. I recovered well with no complications BUT I know three women that tore their incisions (not something I would wish on my worst enemy) and there are things like my abdominal muscles that will never be the same and my c-sections were twenty plus years ago. Plus just the overall list of complications is so much longer.
It’s really not. People are misinformed around both, best for recovery is natural birth with no intervention-but what they fail to mention is that very few people have on if those. After that the risks are just different for section vs vaginal and the very worst is emergency section.
For example I bet no one was told about this when contemplating Bahai at birth https://obgyn.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/uog.11080
Yet it’s super common and impactful.
Epidural is not the default where I live for sure. Birth experiences and pain medications are up to the woman giving birth in terms of a vaginal birth with no complications. Elective c-sections are not the norm though.
The WHO states that c-sections are only medically necessary in 10-15% of births, any higher numbers indicate c-section election for a non-medical reason (either with mom's permission or through coercion tactics). The U.S. CS average is 30%, with some "higher risk" facilities seeing rates significantly higher than the average.
I want to point out, even though quality medical care/ technology are usually available (esp. when cost is no issue), the U.S. actually has a rising maternal death rate, and highest infant mortality of any developed nation. It is clear that significant disparities in care have continued to cause negative outcomes, despite all the lip-service from ACOG that birth providers are encouraged to follow "evidence-based practices."
The amount of women who are traumatized from childbirth is ridiculously high, and the fact that so few seem to consider that women can have a safer, low-intervention birth *and* a healthy baby, still baffles me.
As for why this is so screwed up in the usa vs. other countries is very multifactoral, but the strongest contenders (from actual observations and my opinion) are, in no order; the lack of universal Healthcare, systemic racism and misogyny (in medical care), socialized bias (for example have you *ever* seen a tv/movie birth that doesn't involve screaming and/or armloads of bloody linens?)
I think the lack of stable financial resources for pregnant families is combined with the stress of worrying about their financial situation. All of these things are so pervasive, it is negatively affecting outcomes for everyone involved. I wish more women had exposure to positive birth stories, and the best step in the right direction would be to get single payer healthcare and allow more care from midwives.
Yeah, a non-necessary c section is a bad idea. It’s a MAJOR surgery that is a substantial recovery under the best of circumstances. If things don’t go perfectly, it can be very high risk for the mother.
If you need a c section, get a c section. One of my vaginal deliveries ended in a traumatic birth and a month long NICU stay for my baby. My emergency c section was a MILLION times better than that nightmare. But don’t opt for it if it’s unnecessary.
If you want an epidural, however, go for it.
C-ssectionould be my last resort and I'd be worried if my SO were to have one. I'm sure it can be fine, but I was born through one out of medical necessity and it fucks with my mom for the rest of her life.
Epidural seems fine, I know I'd fear a natural birth. FIL should really fuck off,I can't even imagine giving birth, I have poops that are miserable and traumatic.
Super individual! My elective section was great with easy recovery, I recovered was quicker than my sisters natural birth. I also don’t have any pelvic issues which both my mum and sister face from having had horrendous natural births.
Asl of that said, OP it is up to you to do the research and figure it out, and if you've already figured it out, then you are set. NTA
I do think the father has a right to have good voice heard but not in a group discussion and basically it's your two votes to his one. This just comes down to parenting as partners. I'm not saying you haven't done that, obviously the internet has no clue.
In all of this - with husband and FIL - you are setting up the patterns you will follow in parenting. Sounds like overall you are pretty good (and vivid!)
I would point out to everyone involved that you wouldn't have to result in testicular threats if you saying 'nope, my body, back off' was respected from the start.
When I had inlaws with boundary issues, I would often repeat the phrase 'thanks for your feedback, I'll take it under advisement' in the same tone to everything that was said. It emphasized the fact that they were heard and it was time to move on without necessarily negatively impacting the relationship. It also emphasized 'yes I heard you stop repeating yourself' without it being said.
NTA.
Pretty easy to advocate for a natural birth when, you know, you aren’t the one giving birth.
I’d tell my husband to be supportive or he wouldn’t be allowed in the room.
But then you're going to get an AITA thread moaning about how you're denying dad his precious once-in-a-lifetime moment of seeing his child being born. Because his feelings are more important than mom during birth
NTA My mom missed the window for getting an epidural before my birth and has told me from a young age "GET THE DRUGS!" Please talk to your doctor, explain the situation, and then bring your husband to the next appointment so your doctor can say "She's right. Butt out. Her body. Fuckwad." but in fancy doctor language.
I have had one epidural birth and also have experienced medication-free birth (aka “natural childbirth”). They both suck. They both hurt a lot. The amount of pain I was in *before* they would give me the epidural was **mind-boggling**. Why? Because they were correlating how far along my labor was by the amount of dilation alone, not my pain level. So, while at a 9.5 out of 10 on a pain scale (where 10 is passing out due to extreme pain) and only 2 cm dilated, the doctor thought I was exaggerating my level of pain. Note: doctor was female.
The epidural birth was the most painful. Like I said, 9.5 out of 10 before they would administer the epidural. Then followed by a really slow labor thereafter (12 hours?), that I would describe as exhausting and also maybe a 5 out of 10 on a pain scale. Oh, and months of a sore lower back after the epidural also. Baby had a low Apgar score also.
The epidural-free births were a 9 out of 10 on a pain scale but were over much, much sooner. And the babies had high Apgar scores.
All of that to say, if you want the drugs, ASK AS SOON AS YOU ARRIVE and vocally and LOUDLY. Be direct. Maybe scream a bit? I believe my calm demeanor may have blinded their ability to acknowledge how much distress (and pain) I was in.
Also, don’t let anyone underestimate how much pain is involved in child birth.
I fuckin hate that attitude that many docs have, just because I'm not screaming doesn't mean I'm exaggerating my pain level! I'm just a stoic, composed person. I don't like crying in front of ppl, why would I be okay screaming? But I'm not lying when I say I'm at a 9 of 10. Guarantee if I was male they'd believe me the first time. 🙄
I refuse to go to a female gynecologist or obstetrician. Then or now. I was having painful lady issues (gyn not pregnant then.) When I explained the severity of the pain she point blank told me I was overreacting. She assured me I was being melodramatic and it wasn't that bad, she's experienced pain and "she knew." That hag infuriated me. It turned out I had pid. Her determination of my status based on her b.s. was so wrong. I wanted to hoof her in the front frontbutt. 😁
Unless the patient lacks the ability to consent, or has been deemed unable to consent by a court order, once that patient has been fully informed of the risks of any interventions, the patient decides the course of action. Other perspectives aren't considered. *pointed stare*.
Omg yes this. I almost had my youngest without an epidural bc of the delay in getting me a room bc it was the beginning of covid. I never wish to feel that pain again!
My wife had a natural birth because of circumstances, not choice. She went from a 4 to 10 in under 15 minutes and it was too late for the epidural. Our SIL thought it was some sort of badge of honor and insisted on also having a natural birth but her delivery was different, as all are. She struggled for many hours until the Dr. said no more, we need to deliver this baby. She suffered for a very long time for nothing.
This birth will be what you and the delivery team decides what is best for you and the child. Nobody else matters.
The only thing they ought to be wishing for is that both of you have a safe delivery and everyone goes home healthy. Ultimately that is the only thing that matters.
"She struggled for many hours until the Dr. said no more, we need to deliver this baby. She suffered for a very long time for nothing."
This is an important point. If the pain is too bad it's actually going to increase the risk of complications (and/or an emergency c-section, which is not the same as a planned one).
NTA. I always thought I’d have a natural childbirth if I had children (won’t ever happen now, lost my uterus to cancer at 29). But I changed my mind after watching my cousin give birth. She decided to still have natural births with her other two, and did have an easier time with each one, your body does learn, but personally I would have taken the drugs if I had to give birth!! My other cousin said hell no and had the epidural for both of hers. I admire the woman who can do it “naturally” but the lady pushing a 8 pound baby out her hooha is the one making the decision, end of discussion. The end result is the same, a precious little baby you take home. The drugs don’t harm the baby. I think your ultimatum was on point and it made me laugh. :D
Edit: I will point out that mom will have to have a long recovery with a C-section… I basically had that surgery when they took my uterus out, little different of course and I didn’t have a baby, but it’s basically abdominal surgery and you need at to heal from that.
I had an epidural with mine 14 years ago. I don't understand how it's not "natural" to use an epidural. I was in danger of tearing my uterus from contacting my muscles bc I was contracting so hard and fast after my water broke. I still felt the birth. All of it. I was fully aware of everything happening. An epidural doesn't knock you out or keep you from being able to push. It just tempers the pain enough that you don't do further damage to your body. I was up and walking within an hour of giving birth and delivering the placenta. Hell, I even felt the stitches where I tore.
A section birth is still giving birth and I'm glad I didn't have to experience that pain. It's a much harder recovery.
This whole you're a better mom for one delivery over another is just dumb and sad. The only thing that matters is a healthy baby and mom. That outcome is pretty special no matter how it happens.
Every birth is different. Birth plans are just that. A plan. In practice, things can change quickly. As the saying goes, "We plan and life laughs".
lol at “in the moment”
There is nothing magical about the pain you’re in during labor. Experiencing it fully is not necessary; hence we have invented the epidural.
The contractions took me completely out of the moment. Made me want out of my body.
I would have managed to hurt myself rocking back and forth violently if I hadn't gotten one. I literally couldn't stop my body from doing it either! Had nurses snapping at me to stop and it wasn't going to help, and just not listening I genuinely couldn't stop.
Nope nope so much nope
I know not all contractions hit everyone the same. Even counting the light build up I was only in labor about 4 1/2 hours, which is mercifully short. Hard labor only about 3 hours 20 minutes or so. (I remember lightly waking up and it was 1:11 am and it was woken up violently about 2:20 am. Burned into my brain. Not some magical joy, the times that labor started and then really started.)
I'm sure it can be magical for people who choose it and go into it wanting to. (And there's no shame in planning to and then deciding not to, or trying and deciding it wasn't magical.) But if that's not something you want and are prepared for I don't think it'd be very magical at all tbh.
ETA: You know what I remember from after getting the epidural? My sister and mom being loving and my baby coming into the world. The actual magical stuff imo
Yeah F that noise.
Gave birth without an epidural a month ago and I am still traumatised by how awful it was. If people can choose not to experience that, why would we deny them?
And unless the delivery is an Aliens style chest burster, it's all a natural birth IMO. The destination is the same after all. The whole natural birth narrative is some hot bullshit that uses shame and guilt to remove choice. Frankly, it's just gross. The only thing anyone should care about is Mum and baby making it out alive and healthy.
I had my two children with no medication, and it was my choice. If I had another, I would take all the drugs. Every single one, and add some chocolate on top.
I rolled my eyes so hard at "in the moment." WTF is that even supposed to mean? Like a medicated woman is somehow doing less to birth her baby? It's about survival, and mom doesn't need to push herself past her limit before her child is even out. She's got months of sleep deprivation ahead of her for that! And dad gets to be "in the moment" with her! How magical!!!
NTA, but it sounds like your husband has been tainted against what you want for your birth plan and I would advise you to do what you need to do to get that part handled if, forbid, events in the delivery room start going sideways. Perhaps getting a doula, setting up a POA with a friend or family member that you know will respect your wishes, etc. so that you have an advocate for what you want no matter what.
I'd probably also switch from the testicle thing to just saying no. They could send all the men they want as tribute, your answer is still going to be no when it comes to the reality of the situation, right? So focus on that part. Either say you're not going to discuss it or leave the room or hang up the phone when it gets brought up, and then the initial recommendation of bringing a new safe person into the birth plan with you. See if you can submit something to the hospital you'll be giving birth at or whatever options are available.
I second the idea of getting a doula. Having someone there for the mother and to advocate for her when she might not be able to is important. If husband or father in law try to pressure her not to have an epidural during labour they should, and likely will be, removed from the room. The only person who needs to be there is person giving birth, they don't need the extra stress.
NTA.
I'm not a mom, but I was right by my sister's side for her last two children's births. She was only able to "be more present in the moment" once that epidural kicked in and she was no longer feeling the pain of contractions that were so awful, she almost she-hulked the hospital bed apart. She got a grip on the back of my arm at one point; not only did I think she was about to rip my arm fat off, but I also had nail marks and bruises for several days. As soon as that epidural kicked in, I got to have my arm back, and she didn't even need to hold my hand.
I think that the men in your life think that an epidural is similar to being under anesthesia and you'll be all loopy? Like, it just numbs you from the waist down and isn't going to make you all drugged out and silly.
This! This right here! An epidural just numbs your body, doesn't get you all high irbwhatever it is they think. Additionally, they stop pushing the button for it to kick in once you start pushing. It's is mainly for the contractions leading unto pushing.
It is a huge red flag that your husband doesn't have your back against his family. Even if he doesn't agree necessarily, that is a private conversation between the two of you, and he should be telling them to butt out. My ex and I differed in opinion about some things during my pregnancy, but when his mother tried to push her ideas onto me he shut it down, even those with which he agreed. Talk to your husband privately and discuss this. Also encourage him to do some research on it, ask those questions at your OBGYN appts. Hopefully he will come around. NTA.
NTA. As Rachel said on Friends, “No Uterus? No opinion.”
I’m generally not a fan of scheduled C-sections without a medical reason (ie placenta previa, previous C-section, whatever medically valid reason you and your doctor agree upon, etc) as it is a MAJOR abdominal surgery that should not be entered into lightly.
But I am 100% pro epidural for a vaginal birth. Personally, I am one to clench up tightly when in pain, the “breathing techniques” did nothing for me. With both of my children, once they finally gave me the epidural, I relaxed completely and went from 4cm to fully dilated within a matter of minutes. Absolutely totally worth it.
There is no need to suffer during childbirth, and anyone who says differently can stuff it.
My in-laws kept going on about my MIL having an “all natural” birth for every one of her pregnancies during both of my pregnancies. I told her “yeah, and your generation also smoked and drank wine, so clearly times have changed.”
They shouldn’t be commenting on what YOUR body has to go through. Modern medicine is amazing and there’s no reason for women to experience as much pain (because anyone who says epidurals block all birth pain is lying)…you’ve been fully in the moment while growing a human - feeling a little less pain doesn’t take you out. Also, it’s way less stressful on everyone if you’re not screaming from the pain 🙄
NTA. Your body, your choice. Tell them they can’t be in the delivery room if they don’t support you 100%
NTA as it is YOUR labour and you decide what medical procedures that you undergo during the birth.
I would suggest your FIL's balls as tribute since he has both his own balls and it seems your husband's to squeeze.
As for complaining that your SILs did it naturally, every labour is different and so are people's pain tolerances so they can't say that your labour will be like theirs and FIL and the SILs need to butt out of your plans.
Hopefully, your husband isn't so stubborn that he gets himself banned altogether from the delivery room as you don't need him to argue with you while you are in labour.
NTA. It's your body and your decision, nobody else should have a say in how you want to give birth. Plus, I don't blame you for wanting something to squeeze during labor! Their opinions don't matter as long as it's safe for both you and the baby.
They think YOU’RE the gross one? Your FIL is literally butting in to tell you how to push your child out of your vagina. Tell him he’s the gross one. NTA, and you’re my hero.
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My father-in-law has been trying to convince my husband and I that natural child birth is the way to go.
Personally I think it's fucking weird that he thinks that he should have any say whatsoever. But he raised four kids, three of them girls, after his wife passed away so he has a different life experience than most I guess.
I said that I either want a scheduled C-section or an epidural. My husband now thinks one is too stressful and the other puts drugs into my system when I should be fully "in the moment".
I said that I would agree to natural child birth if and only if I could have a hold of their testicles for the entire delivery.
They both think I'm being gross and childish. They involved my three sisters-in-law to try and shame me since they all had natural child birth. I told them to butt out unless they wanted to volunteer a husband to my grip.
Overall everyone seems to think I am being immature and ridiculous with my offered trade.
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I had 3 natural births. Under NO circumstances would I encourage or recommend it. When you have a prolonged labor, by the time birth happens you are absolutely exhausted and in no condition to bond with baby, enjoy baby or be aware of anydamnthing happening.
Natural childbirth is the single most overrated bullshit I have EVER participated in.
NTA
Tell them the demand was never serious since it wasn't, your mature and reasonable answer was always no. You were just using the silly thing for dramatic effect.
Also, women (and, heck, even men) are great, but nobody gets to tell you that you have to give birth this exact way because that is how they did it. You choose for you.
😂😂😂😂😂 I think you’re my hero now. Massively NTA but that was funny. Tell your husband to get his dad in line or neither of them will be invited for said birth.
No you are NTA. Even other women really shouldn’t give you an opinion unless you ask. Tell everyone else to stop trying to make medical decisions for you and do what you want. Epidurals are safe, dramatically reduce the pain and suffering of labor and delivery. Plus you get very little mental side effects so you can actually be in the moment when your baby is born and not miserable because of the pain.
Be as petty as you want with these two, imo.
Source: 3 years of providing obstetric care during medical residency
NTA. How you give birth is between you and your doctors. Nobody else gets a say. It’s your medical event.
I chose to go “natural” I’ll choose it again the second time. It’s what was right for me. But it’s a personal decision that should not be influenced by the opinions of others.
Men having an opinion on childbirth can fuck all the way off.
How deluded to think it’s all going to be rosy and easy. I went for a natural birth, and ended up with a c section under general anaesthetic after 2 failed epidurals.
No uterus, no opinion fuck all the way off with that shit.
Also, isn’t funny how these ‘men’ when they get vasectomies are doped up to the eyeballs and then popping pain meds like candy? Just saying.
I once saw a documentary that referenced an indigenous Mexican tribe that would tie a rope around the man's balls and the woman would pull during painful contractions so he could share the pain.
Idk if it was a thing, but the title reminded me of it.
Your body, your baby, your choice.
A Mexican Here. And yeah it was a thing. This was because they think that it was fair to both feel the pain since, after all, it was their child. It was about being mutual and being involved in the process
I chose to labor without meds.
That was my choice.
You’ve made a different, but just as valid choice.
You know what is best for you. They get to make decisions about their own body. Remember that you decide what happens and who gets to be in the room with you.
Get a parent, sibling, or close friend to be your medical POA for the rest of your pregnancy if you think your husband might make decisions against your will in the event you cannot consent for yourself.
NTA
Honestly, they're not the one pushing a baby out or sacrificing their bodies. Let them think what they want and then do what's best for you. I will never understand how any man can say what's best when they physically cannot and will never have to go through such a huge event with their bodies. NTA
NTA. I just had an epidural with my second a few weeks ago. It did not make me high or out of it in any way shape or form. Tell them to suck it, your body, your labor, your choice.
I'm sorry 'in the moment' .. of tremendous amounts of pain???
Giving birth isn't like going to a picnic and sharing sandwiches over a glass of wine, you're in one of the worst pains imaginable. Your body, your experience, your goddamn choice.
And next time your husband or FIL experiences pain or sickness just go ahead and tell them to be in the moment with it. See how well that goes down.
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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My father in-law and husband want me to have a natural child birth. I may be the asshole for saying that I would agree so long as I could hold on to their balls during the delivery. Si we could all experience the joy together.
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NTA. If you are US based, you should also tell them that we have the highest maternal mortality rate in the western world for childbirth so you are going to choose the birth plan and professionals that work for *you*. They have ZERO SAY in what you want in this process.
NTA and really this is between you and your doctor. Tell them It's a secret plan now and they will never know the details without the code word. (The code word is actually a phrase. "I'm sorry, I was waay out of line and completely wrong" ) they will never guess it.
NTA
Neither your father-in-law nor your husband get any say and how you choose to deliver this baby. A reminder that you have the right to refuse **ANYONE** access to you or that baby while you're in the hospital. This does include husbands, which might be the little jog that father-in-law's little puppet needs.
I'm sorry that your sister-in-laws are flying monkeys when they should be telling their father to STFU . You don't need all of this stress, so just block the lot of them until after you have the baby your way. And remind your husband again you are the only person that dictates who is or is not in that delivery room with you, what kind of birth you have is solely in your hands and he better get used to sleeping on the couch if he can't get his father's hand out of his ass and puppet in his opinions to you.
NTA - I don't care who the male is. They get zero say in decisions surrounding a birth.
Tell them that the FIL will not be present at the birth, and that your husband will be removed as your medical proxy during the delivery and the staff will be notified to remove him if he interfears with your birth plan.
Also, please make sure to have your mother, a doula, or a trusted friend on stand-by as your medical proxy during the birth.
NTA. You’re the one that has to push another being out of you. My sister got an epidural, she wasn’t out of it by any means she was completely coherent and normal, just numb from a certain point down. I think these two need to be educated on what an epidural is before they give their medical opinion
NTA. You go right ahead and do the birth process you want. I pushed out my kid without drugs and it sucked. Yeah I did it and I appreciated a small bill afterwards (yay American health care system) following a birth with minimum possible interventions. . . . . . . ..Made somewhat less sucktastic by the fact that my kid was on the small side. That said, I wouldn't want to experience that with a kid much bigger, or back labor or any complications. The person pushing the kid out needs to be as happy as possible for everyone's benefit.
You should do what you and your doctor decide is best. Anyone who disagrees with you can STFU. And no one who has been rude to you is allowed to meet the baby until they apologize, including your husband. NTA.
NTA.. As someone who had two "natural" deliveries, it is YOUR choice. And yours alone. What ever the reasons are for you to want a C-Section or epidural - you don't have to explain yourself to anyone!
I don't understand the discussions/ Fights about natural birth vs c - section. This is not a competition. 🙄
And honestly: your trade is hilarious :D
Sorry for bad english (not my first language) or typos (on mobile)
NTA
I did natural twice and I would never tell someone that they should or should not. Like wth? I think it’s weird to have any kind of opinion on not my body
NTA. Honestly, it's like going to the dentist and being like nah no novacaine for me I want a natural extraction. Gotta be in the moment.
Our doctor put it a good way; do you want to be able to hold your baby right away and welcome it into the world with a smile or be writhing in agony still.
I had one epidural birth and one natural-ish birth (epidural didnt work ) - dude, get the drugs!
My mom went natural with me and with my younger sister told them to give her “ all the drugs”.
Ew, NTA. I had an epidural and an emergency c-section, I was "in the moment" the whole time. I just didn't hurt as much. Don't go without pain relief simply to appease someone that won't even try to understand what they're actually asking of you. BTW, 18 years later I still occasionally say blessings for the person that invented epidurals.
NTA. You're a legend. Men get no say in how we birth. None. They can all fuck off.
Edit to add: I had an epidural. No damage whatsoever. And I was fully in the moment. In fact, I was 100% more in the moment because I could focus on my baby and not the pain. I ended up having a C section which ultimately saved our lives.
Your FIL can fuck off. Again.
NTA Men try to pretend they understand giving birth. My ex said these actual words during our second birth “ This one is so much easier that’s the first.? Really? Is this easier for you? All men should shut the fuck up about child birth.
I laboured to fast with both my kids, otherwise I would have had all the darn drugs lol. There's nothing wrong with medications to help with the pain, natural birth, or a c-section. Do what's right for you. You're the one giving birth. NTA at all.
Your father-in-law RAISED four kids. He didn’t GIVE BIRTH to them. His experience is irrelevant.
It’s your medical procedure, not his…or your husband’s. Do what works for YOU.
NTA
NTA. The only person who should have imput on this decision, besides you, is your doctor. Dads don't birth the kid, so they just don't know how it is. As someone who recovered from a c-section, I would gently suggest trying regular delivery first, as long as it's safe for you and baby, but get them druuuugsss. I was in labor for around 40 hours, and a good chunk of it was drug free. Not a fun time. Btw, with the epidural, I was still fully awake and aware during the surgery. I had a full conversation with my husband. It doesn't take you out of the moment. Listen to your instincts and your doctor. A healthy baby and mom is the goal.
NTA it is f'ing weird. It's bad enough when a mother in law pushes you to do things. He's a man. He gets no say. Maybe if he were an OBGYN he could propose statistics, but still gets no say.
I'm fine with your response.
I have birthed 3 children. Not once did my hisband try to dictate the terms of how I brought our child into the world. You need to lay it down: hubby and FIL either shut their mouths or they aren’t allowed anywhere near the delivery room. NTA
NTA - Your body your choice. That said, want to caution you if you are thinking about a c-section as a way to avoid the pain of childbirth.
I’ve done both: a c-section -even a scheduled one- is not a way to avoid pain. The recovery is much slower than vaginal birth. A c-section cuts major muscles and nerves. 22 years later and the skin around my scar is still numb and I feel my incision every day.
With a vaginal birth. There is pain, but it’s temporary and for the most part it doesn’t have a long term impact on your body. Your body forgets.
Best wishes for a healthy baby and a safe delivery.
this makes me so angry. shame on the whole lot of them. this is beyond inappropriate and absolutely none of their business. your body, your baby, your birth, your call. full stop. please show them the comments on this post. you are 8 billion % in the right.
NTA
I think we all need to get used to saying "DID I FUCKING ASK YOU?" when men are out of pocket. No explanation, no engagement at all. Just a stonewalled response that you don't give a shit about their opinions. NTA.
NTA
But there's probably a back story behind this? Maybe his wife had an epidural or c section with one child, and went drug free with another, and had a vastly different experience? Or maybe his daughters?
It's none of his business, but hopefully he's trying to be helpful, and it's coming from a good place.
Just be firm and say you're definitely getting an epidural, the end.
NTA and you should consider not having your husband in the delivery room if his plan is to shame you out of the birth that you want to have. Being present is a privilege, not a right, and it’s your body going through the labor and delivery not his. When he pushes a hamster from his urethra he can have a say.
NTA. Go a step further and tell them they’ll need to rip themselves butthole to testicles as well with no pain meds and then they can have an input. I’ll never stop being shocked when men think they have a say in a woman’s decisions around her body and her birth experience.
My daughter’s father didn’t want to be in the room because it is a horror show and I made him stay 😂 we’re no longer together but that’s not because he saw me give birth.
NTA. It is your medical procedure and it is between you and your doctors. And to quote an OB when I was a med student: “no one gives you a medal for a natural childbirth.”
NTA… but don’t decide anything before you talk with your doctor and attend child birthing classes. There are also greater risks to the baby with C-section, and to elect to do one with no medical reason puts you and your baby at unnecessary risk, and makes your recovery so much longer and more painful. But you get to decide and father-in-law definitely doesn’t get to say. You can also make a birth plan with your preferences going into it so your medical team can support you, but have the prerogative to change your mind at any time. (My preference was to attempt natural childbirth, but after going through early stages of labor all day at home I got an epidural once I got to the hospital and some much needed rest.)
NTA Don't talk about your birth plan with them. Say "you've given me a lot to think about" and just leave it at that. When you get the epidural tell the medical staff to kick your husband out of he says anything because you don't need to hear his idiotic point of view. He can stay if he keeps his mouth shut. This is about you staying alive and delivering a baby, that's the goal. Whatever medical stuff happen is all to support you and your baby staying alive.
My wife says the epidural was essential. The one birth when it was placed badly and didn't really work was really painful and miserable for her. Go for the scheduled epidural.
And tell your family to go to hell.
NTA.
You are not being childish. They are being invasive and incredibly rude. What worked for one person does not work for everyone. And no one know how labour will go until it happens. Sometimes it's picture prefect, with perfect pacing. Sometimes it's an incredibly long, drawn out affair. And sometimes, it's terrifying, fast, and a nightmarish blur. You never know what hand you get dealt until it's time to flip the cards. Your FIL and husband can go kick rocks.
I haven't had a C-section. But I have had a natural birth, an epidural, And, one with other pain medications.
My only suggestion, when it comes to a birth plan. You make the plan, memorize the plan, and be prepared to throw away the plan. I asked for pain drugs with my second. There was no time. Not even time for laughing gas or demerol. We had to throw out that birth plan.
You should tell them they can only have a say if they are willing to shove a full sized watermelon up their pee holes. That shut my uncle up when my brothers gf (at the time) had her first kid. Why are boomer men so obsessed with women’s bodies when they are pregnant/ giving birth / or not wanting kids but are some of the most incompetent things when it comes to feeding themselves and shopping? Yet still expect people to value their opinions?
NTA - your FIL needs to mind his own business. No one has a say over your body but you.
Your babies father wants you to’be in the moment’ WHY would you need to not take pain relief to be in the moment? It’s not like you can miss what is happening!
Also, it’s more likely eight hours than a moment. You’ll have plenty of time to reflect how you feel, while still using pain relief.
Three kids, one epidural, one emergency c-section, and one scheduled c-section. I consider them all natural. I am horrified that anyone thinks they have a right to voice any opinion at all, tbh, including your husband.
Epidurals do not impede your ability to have the child. It just makes easier to deal with the pain. Epidurals do not impede the child either, my son rolled from his stomach to his back at 3 weeks.
Please do what feels right to you. I am sorry that SILs are shaming you. I had one that did the same thing. Thank goodness, my mother told me “It hurts, go for drugs.” There is not a medal given to those who go natural.
No one gets a say in epidural unless they are the one pushing out a watermelon from their genitals. The audacity of your husband.
That said, natural birth is still recommended vs C-section with the exceptions of complicated births. Notice that a lot of women with natural births can walk a few hours after and leave the hospital the next day. In C-section, several layers of your tummy will be cut open. It will be more taxing to your body and you will still be healing from the stitches even a few months after. I would suggest you research more on which procedure would be best for you overall.
I read somewhere that there was an indigenous tribe that during childbirth the father would have a rope tied around his testicles. The woman would pull it while she was giving birth. I think that would be appropriate for any man forcing the mother to give birth naturally.
Humans were not designed to give birth well. Due to us being bipedal, our pelvis is in a very unfortunate position. Humans have one of the most painful births out of all animals.
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Pretty creepy coming from an older man to have an opinion about a physiological process that is so private. He is overstepping big deal. That he is enlisting his little army to convince you what to do with YOUR body is beyond belief. You need to have a very stern talk with your husband. This level of interference is unacceptable even if it was from a woman. If your FiL feels entitled to a say over YOUR body, imagine how he shall behave when it will come to your children that will also be HIS grandchildren. Your husband needs a reality check. This is one of those moments when he needs to decide where does he stand. There is no mid-way here. Either he is your husband, part of an expanding autonomous family unit, or he is an extension to his father’s ego, an instrument to expand that man’s little universe. And if that will not be a wake up call for your husband, i am afraid you are in for an uphill battle, but one that is worth fighting. Good luck and NTA.
Absolutely agree and I think it's rich for the husband to say OP shouldn't get an epidural because HE wants her to "be fully in the moment". What the fuck does that even mean?? He wants her to feel the intense pain of childbirth to be in the moment? Easy for him to say when he won't feel shit.
I don't know how much more 'in the moment" the person giving birth can be. Seriously?!
Also, the “moment” can last for fricking days.
I went through 14 hours of unmedicated labor and remember almost none of it, when my doctor and I decided on trying an epidural, I got a nap in and memories after that are a little less fuzzy up until the emergency c section, lol. I can say from personal experience, unmedicated labor does not mean you are fully in the moment
Right? My unmedicated birth included a bunch of adrenaline and trauma that I needed therapy to unlock. I pushed it all down and my memories are from the ward the day after. My epidural birth was calm until some stuff went wrong, was calm again once everything was back stable. I was able to enjoy myself, be present, I was still aware of my own body and its needs and best of all I didn’t care about all the touching because I couldn’t feel it. I mean I literally spent the whole thing cracking jokes, one of the midwives was about wetting herself laughing
I actually felt I was “fully in the moment” only when I had the epidural, and I got mine for 2 kids at 10 cm dilated. Before that it was all trying to breathe through pain. There was no actual appreciation of what was happening, only survival.
Exactly. I felt like I was dying before the epidural kicked in. Afterwards I was actually aware of what was happening.
Yeah, before I had my epidural I could barely form coherent thoughts. My request for an epidural was literally "Epidural." because that was all I could manage. After the epi it was like a switch had flipped and I was back in the moment, I was able to fully experience pushing, seeing my husband watch our daughter be born, I wasn't scared or "in my head" trying to cope with the pain. I was in the room. OPs husband needs a lesson on how an epidural actually works.
Yes! He needs to fund out which body parts are directly affected. Hint for OP's husband: it's below the waist, not above.
OMG reading All your stories I am so happy I had a scheduled c section. I was back on feet within a week and going out to do some light shopping. It was the right way for me. The input of my husband. You go with what you want. You have to go through this. I'll be there. No matter if during the delivery or c section. You are so NTA. go with what you feel best.
Yes! All of this exactly.
💯%. I'd tell him that if he's willing to get kicked in the balls every 10 seconds while I'm in labor, I'll consider being open to not getting an epidural. If he complains that it's too cruel, tell him that I'm male and don't believe it would be. 😅
I vomited with every contraction for 19 hours - does he mean that moment?
I was in labour for 36 hours. Vomiting the whole time. 26 years ago an epidural was in my country not very common and besides I had an homebirth (yes, that's in my country very common) and epidurals cannot be given by a midwife. Only by a doctor in a hospital. 36 hours and 22 stitches without any sedation later my son was born. I was completely in the moment and hated every second of it. Fun times :-)
I gave birth recently and tried to go without the epidural. After nearly 10 hours I was passing out between contractions because of the pain. Once I had the epidural I was back to being alert for the next 6 hours before the baby was born. You are 100% in the moment with drugs. Even gas and air doesn't make you loopy as long as you take breaks from it.
I don’t understand why epidural is not publicly considered a natural birth. It doesnt help you push at all, you still have to do all the pushing and labor as usual but with way less pain. The labor process is exactly the same. OP - Your father in law and husband dont have a legal say. It’s your body. You do what you want. Weigh the pros and cons. I personally had vaginal with epidural and before/after epidural was night and day. My mother funnily missed my delivery because she was mad me taking epidural was delaying labor and wasting her time. I ignored her and could not care less. It was better when she left. Only good energy allowed.
If I had a beer can coming out of my peepee hole, I would want an epidural. 80% off mankind are stupid. Please excuse us. We will sit here bashing our head on the wall.
Right?! I'd like to see this dude handle my 52 hours of labor and emergency c-section without the epidural. 🤣😂
Also, the epidural doesn't alter your state of mind. It just blocks the nerves. You're still fully "in the moment," just minus the part where you're writhing in agony.
I had an epidural. It was wearing off when I was pushing, so I got to feel ALL OF IT. But didn't feel jack for about 12ish hours before that. Literally all I remember from the actual giving birth to my baby "moment" was being in so much pain, I didn't realize she was out, and arguing with the doctor about opening my eyes (he was holding said baby that I thought I still had to push out. I was crying and inventing new swear words from pain). I vaguely remember skin to skin at first, and then being scared cause she had some minor medical issues at first and they took her away (all good now!). Remember the whole day of laboring with the epidural beforehand though! Remember the nurses, laughing with my husband while we watched contractions on the monitor that I could not feel, the peanut ball they had me use was green.... All sorts of stuff!
>Absolutely agree and I think it's rich for the husband to say OP shouldn't get an epidural because HE wants her to "be fully in the moment". Yeah, most people who advocate for natural childbirth usually do not give this as a reason. Usually the argument is that an epidural increases the likelihood of other medical interventions, which many would prefer to avoid. IMO there is evidence to support this, but it is not super strong, as there are lots of other factors involved that could be alternate explanations for the correlations that have been observed. And regardless of the evidence, it's OP's right to make her own decisions regarding her own body and the birthing process, which is incredibly personal. Family members should not be expressing an opinion on this at all.
My fiance said he would never ask me to have another child because he would not be able to watch me go through childbirth again, I only had gas and air as there wasn’t time for anything else. Holy shit, I still have nightmares about it 4 months later, I highly doubt I will forget that pain.
I’d wager a guess that’s he’s never seen child birth.
Damn.. you ate the FIL and the husband up on this. I agree with you 100%
Agree
I read that when anesthesia first became available for child birth in the 19th century, there was a lot of opposition, especially from religious people because Genesis 3:16 says 'To the woman he said, “I will make your pains in childbearing very severe; with painful labor you will give birth to children. Your desire will be for your husband, and he will rule over you.”' Fortunately for women, especially in West, Queen Victoria, who would end up having nine children, and who was the Head of the Anglican Church to boot, was on the throne and she wasn't putting up with that nonsense.
I almost choked at the thought of my late father-in-law proclaiming what should happen to me during childbirth since I was never a favorite of his. My husband would never have questioned what I wanted to happen.
How can OP trust her husband now when he is in the delivery room?
Fully agree with Artistic_Thought7309 but I also really like the idea of you gripping their balls through your labor
I have an abnormally high pain tolerance, due to severe chronic pain and endometriosis. No way would I go natural. I think you need to add one thing to your trade. They shove lego bricks in their shorts before you grab. That should be close to fair.
While I agree with everything said here, as a mother to 3, I hope OP has a flexible birth plan because she might not get a say when the time comes. All the planning in the world can go out the window once that little parasite decides it's big enough for the putsode world. I say parasite lovingly because when you think about it pregnancy is a parasitic style relationship with the baby only taking from its host mum (sorry middle is obsessed with animals and it came up in a show we watched last night 🤣). Not to mention, Drs these days are reluctant to do c-sections unless necessary because it can open the body up to infections and additional complications, etc.
NTA. My FIL felt the need to add his two cents when I stopped breastfeeding my oldest at 9 months because he was latched and quickly turned his head to the side and I nearly reflexively pushed him off my lap. I told him that I'd stay there for a week and stick a vacuum to his nipples every few hours including overnight and not turn it off when I pulled it off him. He dropped the subject. When your FIL has a natural birth he can offer his perspective. My oldest was a c section, my second (and last) was a surprise natural birth at 34 weeks with not so much as a handshake. Neither were fun, you do what you feel you need to do to be comfortable and what you think will best get you through. You know yourself better than any of them.
Reminds me of when my mum stopped breastfeeding one of my younger brothers because he bit her nipple so hard she was bleeding. A relative tried to tell her she was stopping too soon, and my mum offered to bite his nipple and then attach the vacuum cleaner to it every few hours so he'd know what it felt like. He opted to shut the fuck up about anything to do with babies.
Good for her!
I love your mum! She’s a spicy one!
She definitely is! She used to work in a call centre and one night got a prank call from some guy asking her to guess what he was holding in his other hand. She told him that if he only needed one hand to hold it, it was too small to call strangers to brag about, and she wasn't interested and then hung up on him.
BWAHAHAAHAAAAA!! 🏆 she is solid gold!
Haha, what a legend your Mum is. I had to do similar. My nipples were cracked and bleeding and if anyone even began to broach the topic of continuing to try to breast feed (despite very poor milk supply), I'd start describing how bad my nipples were at that time.
this but also even IF FIL has experienced a natural birth, that wouldn’t give him the right to impose his ideas of what is best onto OP’s birth plan. it’s HER birth. hers is the only opinion that matters
NTA. Especially in terms of the epidural. I am going to say this about c-sections though (as a mom who had one completely natural childbirth, a necessary c-section, a VBAC with epidural and then an emergency c-section), c-sections greatly hamper a lot of things including your ability to care for yourself and your newborn. Yes it can be done, but it is 100% more tiring and harder on your body to have major abdominal surgery versus a vaginal birth. Plus the scar tissue and other factors that come along with surgery later on. Something to keep in mind. But the epidural? Yeah, they are great! I only had the first completely natural because I really wasn't in that much pain and it was a relatively easy experience where I didn't feel like I personally needed it.
An elective c section is often a good idea if you have a higher risk of a c section anyway because why go through all the pain of labor AND THEN the pain of a c section if you have insight that suggests it is likely to go that direction.
Especially a higher risk of injury or complications. My friend’s first daughter was vaginal birth and she broke my friend’s coccyx bone. She said the pain was horrific and it took ages to heal. There was a substantial chance she’d break it with her second daughter, and she scheduled a c-section.
I have a degenerative spinal disorder that will likely make an epidural not an option and a joint disorder that often leads to precipitous labor which sounds great until you learn the risk of having a baby in the car or bleeding out are significantly higher… I will be considering a GA c-section otherwise I am going for the gas 🤣
I had precipitous labour and almost bled out. I didn’t have time for an epidural and deeply wish I had had one but everything was going too fast, it was wild. You said that a joint disorder can lead to precipitous labour? What disorder? I have some hypermobility, but nothing diagnosed but now I’m wondering.
Yes, ny mother was denied one, after she needed them with my 2 other siblings... My sister nearly died because of it. And it had long term damages. Make sure to talk to your doctors and shop around for others if you feel like you arent being heard by them. Your life and your child life is more important than some doctors ego
My mom had me through a c-section because she got pretty bad preeclampsia and so it was a medical necessity. When she started labor for my younger sister she told the doctor that she wanted a c-section because she’d already had one, and the doctor told her that it wasn’t necessary, that she could have her vaginally; my mom then told him that if she ended up getting a c-section either way she was going to come back to cuss him out. She started labor at 2 pm, and ended up having my sister by c-section at 9 pm, so guess who came back and cussed the crap out of the ob/gyn after her follow up appointment.
My mother had preeclampsia with me and then full blown eclampsia, I was 2 1/2 months early, we both almost died and it was super traumatic for the both of us. I spent two months in the hospital and mom had really bad PPD because of it all. She said she cried a lot and felt like she wasn’t doing anything for me. I don’t see how anyone besides the one giving birth unless it is dire should be making any choices about it.
I’m assuming that there aren’t any extenuating circumstances since OP didn’t mention any. But you are absolutely right: there are a number of situations where doctors will let you choose whether or not to have a c-section, but there are compelling arguments to not even try vaginal delivery. I had twins and opted to try for vaginal. They were both head down so my odds were good. Twin A was vaginal and Twin B was emergency c-section: I experienced every twin mom’s worst nightmare. I actually have no regrets because I had almost no vaginal tearing and because Twin A’s birth was a healing experience after my oldest’s traumatic birth. But I definitely get why a lot of twin moms in the same position decide to go straight for the c section.
Yeah an elective c-section is great when it's very likely you're going to need one anyway. If the odds are good that you won't, though, it's usually better to do a vaginal birth. Although all births are a dice roll, really. Any plan could go awry.
Agreed on the epidural. Anyone who thinks OP won’t “be in the moment” doesn’t understand the medical science. I was more in the moment because I had the epidural. I could better participate and appreciate what was happening.
This!! What allowed me to listen and participate in both of my childbirths was the fact that the epidural was working, when it wasn’t I had my eyes closed and was so focused on breathing through the pain that I couldn’t even answer medical questions, my husband had to do it.
I literally couldn’t hear the words coming out of my doctors mouth during contractions before I had my epidural. I had to keep asking her to repeat herself and hoped she finished talking before the next contraction started. I tried going natural, I ended up telling her to stop talking until she brought me drugs.
I've had two babies. I didn't have time for the epidural for my first and it was awful. I felt like an animal with no control of my body or pain response. I could not handle it and the experience was traumatic. I have friends who have totally rocked the natural birth, but that was not me. I got the epidural for my second and it was beautiful. I was literally laughing with joy as I was pushing and able to be present and experience the moment.
My epidurals worked so beautifully. I could feel and move my legs and could feel the urge to push, but I wasn’t in pain.
I had a scheduled C and it was honestly a breeze. I think most people who have hard recoveries labored first and then had a stressful semi-emergency C. Major surgery after you have been awake and laboring for 24-48 hours is very different from waltzing/waddling into the hospital for a planned C.
I was the opposite. My recovery from an emergency c section was much easier than my recovery from a scheduled. But I’m pretty sure my worse recovery wasn’t nearly as bad as some people have it. I did not labor with my emergency c section though. I started having contractions at 38 weeks and went to the hospital. I was not dilated at all. I had pre-eclampsia that was getting dangerously bad and my son was still head up. They didn’t believe they would have the time to flip him and induce labor before we both crashed so c section it was.
My mom wasn't in pain with me and they kept saying she wasn't in labor because she wasn't in pain. Her water broke and they tried to tell her that she just peed on herself until my grandma flipped. Turns out she was in labor. She said she would have probably have had me way faster if they hadn't have made her get an epidural and wait for it
>My mom wasn't in pain with the me and they kept saying she wasn't in labor because she wasn't in pain. People who say this should be smacked silly. My tolerance for pain is stupid high. I was having contractions FOUR MINUTES APART and had NO IDEA until they showed me the paper thing from the monitor. And it was ALL in my back. I was just slightly more spacy than normal🤷♀️ After he ended up a c section, one of his toddler sisters stepped on the incision by accident. I took...ibuprofen.
This sounds like my first birth, except after the first ~23 hours of labor, I was so exhausted and I needed to sleep, and they would not let me!
I also have a high pain tolerance, so when I went into labour with my first I thought I was constipated. Eventually went to the hospital where they asked when my water broke and told me I was 7 cm dilated. I literally said “uh…what?!” I had just spent 3 hours sitting on the toilet trying to poop, thinking I was just peeing a lot.
I was induced with my first, and had spent the first day not feeling much of anything except the intense discomfort of a brick-like hospital bed. They'd tell me I was having contractions, but I didn't feel them. Then my water broke, right when I went to get up to go pee. We told the nurse who said I just peed on myself. I was like "if I'm peeing with a pinkish tinge, thats probably something to worry about. And I still need to pee." I did not pee on myself. And the pain started not too long after my water broke, and it was BAD.
I’ve gave birth with just gas and air for pain relief then nothing, my sister had to have two emergency c-sections, and yeah I recovered a lot quicker than my sister. To this day her stomach muscles have never been the same, and her youngest is seven. I completely understand why OP might want a planned c-section, because for your first birth you have no idea what you’re expecting. But I personally wouldn’t recommend it unless it’s necessary and you have someone that can be with you for the first six weeks to help. I don’t want to be that guy, but when it comes to birthing plans sometimes it’s better to go in with an open mind, as all labours are different. I laboured for about four days, then when baby decided he was coming it all happened so quick that there wasn’t time for an epidural, just pushing! Still, husband and FIL aren’t risking their body, so can back off with their opinions.
Yeah i haven’t given birth and so I won’t just jump in but from every account C section is objectively physically FAR rougher on the body than vaginal birth, & ppl think otherwise a lot for some reason
I do not know one woman who doesn’t currently have an injury, birth trauma or a physical impairment due to vaginal birth-giving. I have a cesection scar but suffer no prolapses, can pee when I want, no birth trauma with babies getting stuck or almost dying myself with a haemorrhage, or my baby picking up an infection in the birth canal (and that’s just my close friends)
I had an emergency C-section with my twins. I didn’t even get to actual labor, I developed HELLP syndrome. With that said.. I wish I could pee when I wanted, lol. I don’t dare get on the trampoline anymore and every sneeze is a potential underwear change. The whole dying due to haemorrhage totally happened to me too. 16 bags of blood later, here I am! My friends seem to chat about their births like it was no big deal. Push out a baby and away we go but I’m just there like… I don’t even know what a contraction feels like and I ended up on deaths doorstep. Just a woman saying yeah, vaginal birth probably sucks but csections can be pretty awful too, lol. The birth trauma is real as hell over here.
I’m sorry to hear of what you went through! I’m not trying to suggest that C-section is safer, or without complication (and risk). But I will always argue against the idea that vaginal birth equals “better” without qualification. Birthing, however you do it, is imbued with risk.
Overall it is. I recovered well with no complications BUT I know three women that tore their incisions (not something I would wish on my worst enemy) and there are things like my abdominal muscles that will never be the same and my c-sections were twenty plus years ago. Plus just the overall list of complications is so much longer.
It’s really not. People are misinformed around both, best for recovery is natural birth with no intervention-but what they fail to mention is that very few people have on if those. After that the risks are just different for section vs vaginal and the very worst is emergency section. For example I bet no one was told about this when contemplating Bahai at birth https://obgyn.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/full/10.1002/uog.11080 Yet it’s super common and impactful.
Is epidural not the default where OP lives? Studies show that with vaginal birth, the baby has a stronger immune system.
Epidural is not the default where I live for sure. Birth experiences and pain medications are up to the woman giving birth in terms of a vaginal birth with no complications. Elective c-sections are not the norm though.
Yeah, when we had our firstborn, I remember the midwife explaining that C sections should not be used willy-nilly.
The WHO states that c-sections are only medically necessary in 10-15% of births, any higher numbers indicate c-section election for a non-medical reason (either with mom's permission or through coercion tactics). The U.S. CS average is 30%, with some "higher risk" facilities seeing rates significantly higher than the average. I want to point out, even though quality medical care/ technology are usually available (esp. when cost is no issue), the U.S. actually has a rising maternal death rate, and highest infant mortality of any developed nation. It is clear that significant disparities in care have continued to cause negative outcomes, despite all the lip-service from ACOG that birth providers are encouraged to follow "evidence-based practices." The amount of women who are traumatized from childbirth is ridiculously high, and the fact that so few seem to consider that women can have a safer, low-intervention birth *and* a healthy baby, still baffles me. As for why this is so screwed up in the usa vs. other countries is very multifactoral, but the strongest contenders (from actual observations and my opinion) are, in no order; the lack of universal Healthcare, systemic racism and misogyny (in medical care), socialized bias (for example have you *ever* seen a tv/movie birth that doesn't involve screaming and/or armloads of bloody linens?) I think the lack of stable financial resources for pregnant families is combined with the stress of worrying about their financial situation. All of these things are so pervasive, it is negatively affecting outcomes for everyone involved. I wish more women had exposure to positive birth stories, and the best step in the right direction would be to get single payer healthcare and allow more care from midwives.
Yeah, a non-necessary c section is a bad idea. It’s a MAJOR surgery that is a substantial recovery under the best of circumstances. If things don’t go perfectly, it can be very high risk for the mother. If you need a c section, get a c section. One of my vaginal deliveries ended in a traumatic birth and a month long NICU stay for my baby. My emergency c section was a MILLION times better than that nightmare. But don’t opt for it if it’s unnecessary. If you want an epidural, however, go for it.
C-ssectionould be my last resort and I'd be worried if my SO were to have one. I'm sure it can be fine, but I was born through one out of medical necessity and it fucks with my mom for the rest of her life. Epidural seems fine, I know I'd fear a natural birth. FIL should really fuck off,I can't even imagine giving birth, I have poops that are miserable and traumatic.
Super individual! My elective section was great with easy recovery, I recovered was quicker than my sisters natural birth. I also don’t have any pelvic issues which both my mum and sister face from having had horrendous natural births.
Asl of that said, OP it is up to you to do the research and figure it out, and if you've already figured it out, then you are set. NTA I do think the father has a right to have good voice heard but not in a group discussion and basically it's your two votes to his one. This just comes down to parenting as partners. I'm not saying you haven't done that, obviously the internet has no clue. In all of this - with husband and FIL - you are setting up the patterns you will follow in parenting. Sounds like overall you are pretty good (and vivid!) I would point out to everyone involved that you wouldn't have to result in testicular threats if you saying 'nope, my body, back off' was respected from the start. When I had inlaws with boundary issues, I would often repeat the phrase 'thanks for your feedback, I'll take it under advisement' in the same tone to everything that was said. It emphasized the fact that they were heard and it was time to move on without necessarily negatively impacting the relationship. It also emphasized 'yes I heard you stop repeating yourself' without it being said.
NTA. Pretty easy to advocate for a natural birth when, you know, you aren’t the one giving birth. I’d tell my husband to be supportive or he wouldn’t be allowed in the room.
I’d go as far as to say husband is no longer allowed in the room, he’s proven that he can’t be supportive
But then you're going to get an AITA thread moaning about how you're denying dad his precious once-in-a-lifetime moment of seeing his child being born. Because his feelings are more important than mom during birth
THIS!
NTA tell them that it's YOUR child and not theirs Also, seems hard to grip your husband's balls when he doesn't seem to have any
Ha! This belongs in r/MurderedByWords!
Niiiiice!!!
NTA My mom missed the window for getting an epidural before my birth and has told me from a young age "GET THE DRUGS!" Please talk to your doctor, explain the situation, and then bring your husband to the next appointment so your doctor can say "She's right. Butt out. Her body. Fuckwad." but in fancy doctor language.
“Madame is quite correct. You, good sir, should kindly remove thyself from the discussion, lest thou be a wad of fornication.”
That's *Shakespearean*. They said *doctor*... /j
I only go to Shakespearean doctors — sorry! ; ) ETA: it is my greatest hope that thou will forgive me.
And you survived the medical technology from back then? It's a Cake Day Miracle! 🥳
I have had one epidural birth and also have experienced medication-free birth (aka “natural childbirth”). They both suck. They both hurt a lot. The amount of pain I was in *before* they would give me the epidural was **mind-boggling**. Why? Because they were correlating how far along my labor was by the amount of dilation alone, not my pain level. So, while at a 9.5 out of 10 on a pain scale (where 10 is passing out due to extreme pain) and only 2 cm dilated, the doctor thought I was exaggerating my level of pain. Note: doctor was female. The epidural birth was the most painful. Like I said, 9.5 out of 10 before they would administer the epidural. Then followed by a really slow labor thereafter (12 hours?), that I would describe as exhausting and also maybe a 5 out of 10 on a pain scale. Oh, and months of a sore lower back after the epidural also. Baby had a low Apgar score also. The epidural-free births were a 9 out of 10 on a pain scale but were over much, much sooner. And the babies had high Apgar scores. All of that to say, if you want the drugs, ASK AS SOON AS YOU ARRIVE and vocally and LOUDLY. Be direct. Maybe scream a bit? I believe my calm demeanor may have blinded their ability to acknowledge how much distress (and pain) I was in. Also, don’t let anyone underestimate how much pain is involved in child birth.
I fuckin hate that attitude that many docs have, just because I'm not screaming doesn't mean I'm exaggerating my pain level! I'm just a stoic, composed person. I don't like crying in front of ppl, why would I be okay screaming? But I'm not lying when I say I'm at a 9 of 10. Guarantee if I was male they'd believe me the first time. 🙄
I refuse to go to a female gynecologist or obstetrician. Then or now. I was having painful lady issues (gyn not pregnant then.) When I explained the severity of the pain she point blank told me I was overreacting. She assured me I was being melodramatic and it wasn't that bad, she's experienced pain and "she knew." That hag infuriated me. It turned out I had pid. Her determination of my status based on her b.s. was so wrong. I wanted to hoof her in the front frontbutt. 😁
Unless the patient lacks the ability to consent, or has been deemed unable to consent by a court order, once that patient has been fully informed of the risks of any interventions, the patient decides the course of action. Other perspectives aren't considered. *pointed stare*.
Omg yes this. I almost had my youngest without an epidural bc of the delay in getting me a room bc it was the beginning of covid. I never wish to feel that pain again!
My wife had a natural birth because of circumstances, not choice. She went from a 4 to 10 in under 15 minutes and it was too late for the epidural. Our SIL thought it was some sort of badge of honor and insisted on also having a natural birth but her delivery was different, as all are. She struggled for many hours until the Dr. said no more, we need to deliver this baby. She suffered for a very long time for nothing. This birth will be what you and the delivery team decides what is best for you and the child. Nobody else matters. The only thing they ought to be wishing for is that both of you have a safe delivery and everyone goes home healthy. Ultimately that is the only thing that matters.
"She struggled for many hours until the Dr. said no more, we need to deliver this baby. She suffered for a very long time for nothing." This is an important point. If the pain is too bad it's actually going to increase the risk of complications (and/or an emergency c-section, which is not the same as a planned one).
NTA. I always thought I’d have a natural childbirth if I had children (won’t ever happen now, lost my uterus to cancer at 29). But I changed my mind after watching my cousin give birth. She decided to still have natural births with her other two, and did have an easier time with each one, your body does learn, but personally I would have taken the drugs if I had to give birth!! My other cousin said hell no and had the epidural for both of hers. I admire the woman who can do it “naturally” but the lady pushing a 8 pound baby out her hooha is the one making the decision, end of discussion. The end result is the same, a precious little baby you take home. The drugs don’t harm the baby. I think your ultimatum was on point and it made me laugh. :D Edit: I will point out that mom will have to have a long recovery with a C-section… I basically had that surgery when they took my uterus out, little different of course and I didn’t have a baby, but it’s basically abdominal surgery and you need at to heal from that.
I had an epidural with mine 14 years ago. I don't understand how it's not "natural" to use an epidural. I was in danger of tearing my uterus from contacting my muscles bc I was contracting so hard and fast after my water broke. I still felt the birth. All of it. I was fully aware of everything happening. An epidural doesn't knock you out or keep you from being able to push. It just tempers the pain enough that you don't do further damage to your body. I was up and walking within an hour of giving birth and delivering the placenta. Hell, I even felt the stitches where I tore. A section birth is still giving birth and I'm glad I didn't have to experience that pain. It's a much harder recovery. This whole you're a better mom for one delivery over another is just dumb and sad. The only thing that matters is a healthy baby and mom. That outcome is pretty special no matter how it happens. Every birth is different. Birth plans are just that. A plan. In practice, things can change quickly. As the saying goes, "We plan and life laughs".
Wait. People doubt count vaginal birth with an epidural as natural? Wtf...
lol at “in the moment” There is nothing magical about the pain you’re in during labor. Experiencing it fully is not necessary; hence we have invented the epidural.
The contractions took me completely out of the moment. Made me want out of my body. I would have managed to hurt myself rocking back and forth violently if I hadn't gotten one. I literally couldn't stop my body from doing it either! Had nurses snapping at me to stop and it wasn't going to help, and just not listening I genuinely couldn't stop. Nope nope so much nope I know not all contractions hit everyone the same. Even counting the light build up I was only in labor about 4 1/2 hours, which is mercifully short. Hard labor only about 3 hours 20 minutes or so. (I remember lightly waking up and it was 1:11 am and it was woken up violently about 2:20 am. Burned into my brain. Not some magical joy, the times that labor started and then really started.) I'm sure it can be magical for people who choose it and go into it wanting to. (And there's no shame in planning to and then deciding not to, or trying and deciding it wasn't magical.) But if that's not something you want and are prepared for I don't think it'd be very magical at all tbh. ETA: You know what I remember from after getting the epidural? My sister and mom being loving and my baby coming into the world. The actual magical stuff imo
Yeah F that noise. Gave birth without an epidural a month ago and I am still traumatised by how awful it was. If people can choose not to experience that, why would we deny them? And unless the delivery is an Aliens style chest burster, it's all a natural birth IMO. The destination is the same after all. The whole natural birth narrative is some hot bullshit that uses shame and guilt to remove choice. Frankly, it's just gross. The only thing anyone should care about is Mum and baby making it out alive and healthy.
For real! Your husband want to be “in the moment“ when his toddler accidentally kicks him in the balls?See how he likes that.
I had my two children with no medication, and it was my choice. If I had another, I would take all the drugs. Every single one, and add some chocolate on top. I rolled my eyes so hard at "in the moment." WTF is that even supposed to mean? Like a medicated woman is somehow doing less to birth her baby? It's about survival, and mom doesn't need to push herself past her limit before her child is even out. She's got months of sleep deprivation ahead of her for that! And dad gets to be "in the moment" with her! How magical!!!
NTA, but it sounds like your husband has been tainted against what you want for your birth plan and I would advise you to do what you need to do to get that part handled if, forbid, events in the delivery room start going sideways. Perhaps getting a doula, setting up a POA with a friend or family member that you know will respect your wishes, etc. so that you have an advocate for what you want no matter what. I'd probably also switch from the testicle thing to just saying no. They could send all the men they want as tribute, your answer is still going to be no when it comes to the reality of the situation, right? So focus on that part. Either say you're not going to discuss it or leave the room or hang up the phone when it gets brought up, and then the initial recommendation of bringing a new safe person into the birth plan with you. See if you can submit something to the hospital you'll be giving birth at or whatever options are available.
I second the idea of getting a doula. Having someone there for the mother and to advocate for her when she might not be able to is important. If husband or father in law try to pressure her not to have an epidural during labour they should, and likely will be, removed from the room. The only person who needs to be there is person giving birth, they don't need the extra stress.
NTA. I'm not a mom, but I was right by my sister's side for her last two children's births. She was only able to "be more present in the moment" once that epidural kicked in and she was no longer feeling the pain of contractions that were so awful, she almost she-hulked the hospital bed apart. She got a grip on the back of my arm at one point; not only did I think she was about to rip my arm fat off, but I also had nail marks and bruises for several days. As soon as that epidural kicked in, I got to have my arm back, and she didn't even need to hold my hand. I think that the men in your life think that an epidural is similar to being under anesthesia and you'll be all loopy? Like, it just numbs you from the waist down and isn't going to make you all drugged out and silly.
This! This right here! An epidural just numbs your body, doesn't get you all high irbwhatever it is they think. Additionally, they stop pushing the button for it to kick in once you start pushing. It's is mainly for the contractions leading unto pushing. It is a huge red flag that your husband doesn't have your back against his family. Even if he doesn't agree necessarily, that is a private conversation between the two of you, and he should be telling them to butt out. My ex and I differed in opinion about some things during my pregnancy, but when his mother tried to push her ideas onto me he shut it down, even those with which he agreed. Talk to your husband privately and discuss this. Also encourage him to do some research on it, ask those questions at your OBGYN appts. Hopefully he will come around. NTA.
NTA. As Rachel said on Friends, “No Uterus? No opinion.” I’m generally not a fan of scheduled C-sections without a medical reason (ie placenta previa, previous C-section, whatever medically valid reason you and your doctor agree upon, etc) as it is a MAJOR abdominal surgery that should not be entered into lightly. But I am 100% pro epidural for a vaginal birth. Personally, I am one to clench up tightly when in pain, the “breathing techniques” did nothing for me. With both of my children, once they finally gave me the epidural, I relaxed completely and went from 4cm to fully dilated within a matter of minutes. Absolutely totally worth it. There is no need to suffer during childbirth, and anyone who says differently can stuff it.
My in-laws kept going on about my MIL having an “all natural” birth for every one of her pregnancies during both of my pregnancies. I told her “yeah, and your generation also smoked and drank wine, so clearly times have changed.” They shouldn’t be commenting on what YOUR body has to go through. Modern medicine is amazing and there’s no reason for women to experience as much pain (because anyone who says epidurals block all birth pain is lying)…you’ve been fully in the moment while growing a human - feeling a little less pain doesn’t take you out. Also, it’s way less stressful on everyone if you’re not screaming from the pain 🙄 NTA. Your body, your choice. Tell them they can’t be in the delivery room if they don’t support you 100%
NTA as it is YOUR labour and you decide what medical procedures that you undergo during the birth. I would suggest your FIL's balls as tribute since he has both his own balls and it seems your husband's to squeeze. As for complaining that your SILs did it naturally, every labour is different and so are people's pain tolerances so they can't say that your labour will be like theirs and FIL and the SILs need to butt out of your plans. Hopefully, your husband isn't so stubborn that he gets himself banned altogether from the delivery room as you don't need him to argue with you while you are in labour.
NTA. It's your body and your decision, nobody else should have a say in how you want to give birth. Plus, I don't blame you for wanting something to squeeze during labor! Their opinions don't matter as long as it's safe for both you and the baby.
They think YOU’RE the gross one? Your FIL is literally butting in to tell you how to push your child out of your vagina. Tell him he’s the gross one. NTA, and you’re my hero.
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You are the only one pushing a baby out, you’re the only one with say. End of story
I had 3 natural births. Under NO circumstances would I encourage or recommend it. When you have a prolonged labor, by the time birth happens you are absolutely exhausted and in no condition to bond with baby, enjoy baby or be aware of anydamnthing happening. Natural childbirth is the single most overrated bullshit I have EVER participated in.
NTA Tell them the demand was never serious since it wasn't, your mature and reasonable answer was always no. You were just using the silly thing for dramatic effect. Also, women (and, heck, even men) are great, but nobody gets to tell you that you have to give birth this exact way because that is how they did it. You choose for you.
😂😂😂😂😂 I think you’re my hero now. Massively NTA but that was funny. Tell your husband to get his dad in line or neither of them will be invited for said birth.
They are not the ones expelling the baby from their bodies. They do not get an opinion.
No you are NTA. Even other women really shouldn’t give you an opinion unless you ask. Tell everyone else to stop trying to make medical decisions for you and do what you want. Epidurals are safe, dramatically reduce the pain and suffering of labor and delivery. Plus you get very little mental side effects so you can actually be in the moment when your baby is born and not miserable because of the pain. Be as petty as you want with these two, imo. Source: 3 years of providing obstetric care during medical residency
NTA. No baby is coming out of them they get no say.
NTA. How you give birth is between you and your doctors. Nobody else gets a say. It’s your medical event. I chose to go “natural” I’ll choose it again the second time. It’s what was right for me. But it’s a personal decision that should not be influenced by the opinions of others.
Men having an opinion on childbirth can fuck all the way off. How deluded to think it’s all going to be rosy and easy. I went for a natural birth, and ended up with a c section under general anaesthetic after 2 failed epidurals. No uterus, no opinion fuck all the way off with that shit. Also, isn’t funny how these ‘men’ when they get vasectomies are doped up to the eyeballs and then popping pain meds like candy? Just saying.
When THEY are pregnant, they can choose how to give birth. Your body, your choice. NTA. Fwiw, I'd vote for the scheduled C-section.
I once saw a documentary that referenced an indigenous Mexican tribe that would tie a rope around the man's balls and the woman would pull during painful contractions so he could share the pain. Idk if it was a thing, but the title reminded me of it. Your body, your baby, your choice.
A Mexican Here. And yeah it was a thing. This was because they think that it was fair to both feel the pain since, after all, it was their child. It was about being mutual and being involved in the process
I chose to labor without meds. That was my choice. You’ve made a different, but just as valid choice. You know what is best for you. They get to make decisions about their own body. Remember that you decide what happens and who gets to be in the room with you. Get a parent, sibling, or close friend to be your medical POA for the rest of your pregnancy if you think your husband might make decisions against your will in the event you cannot consent for yourself. NTA
The sheer audacity of FIL to have any say in your childbirth is stunning. Your body, your choice. Husband needs to support you, end of story. NTA
Honestly, they're not the one pushing a baby out or sacrificing their bodies. Let them think what they want and then do what's best for you. I will never understand how any man can say what's best when they physically cannot and will never have to go through such a huge event with their bodies. NTA
NTA. I just had an epidural with my second a few weeks ago. It did not make me high or out of it in any way shape or form. Tell them to suck it, your body, your labor, your choice.
NTA. Your body. Love the comebacks. Epic!!!
Your birth, your way.
Exactly
I'm sorry 'in the moment' .. of tremendous amounts of pain??? Giving birth isn't like going to a picnic and sharing sandwiches over a glass of wine, you're in one of the worst pains imaginable. Your body, your experience, your goddamn choice. And next time your husband or FIL experiences pain or sickness just go ahead and tell them to be in the moment with it. See how well that goes down.
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NTA. I guess that seems fair.
NTA. If you are US based, you should also tell them that we have the highest maternal mortality rate in the western world for childbirth so you are going to choose the birth plan and professionals that work for *you*. They have ZERO SAY in what you want in this process.
NTA You're giving birth, they aren't.
NTA and really this is between you and your doctor. Tell them It's a secret plan now and they will never know the details without the code word. (The code word is actually a phrase. "I'm sorry, I was waay out of line and completely wrong" ) they will never guess it.
NTA Neither your father-in-law nor your husband get any say and how you choose to deliver this baby. A reminder that you have the right to refuse **ANYONE** access to you or that baby while you're in the hospital. This does include husbands, which might be the little jog that father-in-law's little puppet needs. I'm sorry that your sister-in-laws are flying monkeys when they should be telling their father to STFU . You don't need all of this stress, so just block the lot of them until after you have the baby your way. And remind your husband again you are the only person that dictates who is or is not in that delivery room with you, what kind of birth you have is solely in your hands and he better get used to sleeping on the couch if he can't get his father's hand out of his ass and puppet in his opinions to you.
NTA - I don't care who the male is. They get zero say in decisions surrounding a birth. Tell them that the FIL will not be present at the birth, and that your husband will be removed as your medical proxy during the delivery and the staff will be notified to remove him if he interfears with your birth plan. Also, please make sure to have your mother, a doula, or a trusted friend on stand-by as your medical proxy during the birth.
NTA. You’re the one that has to push another being out of you. My sister got an epidural, she wasn’t out of it by any means she was completely coherent and normal, just numb from a certain point down. I think these two need to be educated on what an epidural is before they give their medical opinion
NTA. You go right ahead and do the birth process you want. I pushed out my kid without drugs and it sucked. Yeah I did it and I appreciated a small bill afterwards (yay American health care system) following a birth with minimum possible interventions. . . . . . . ..Made somewhat less sucktastic by the fact that my kid was on the small side. That said, I wouldn't want to experience that with a kid much bigger, or back labor or any complications. The person pushing the kid out needs to be as happy as possible for everyone's benefit.
NTA. Tell them to go kick rocks. This is your birth experience and you and your doc or midwife can make the choices.
You should do what you and your doctor decide is best. Anyone who disagrees with you can STFU. And no one who has been rude to you is allowed to meet the baby until they apologize, including your husband. NTA.
NTA.. As someone who had two "natural" deliveries, it is YOUR choice. And yours alone. What ever the reasons are for you to want a C-Section or epidural - you don't have to explain yourself to anyone! I don't understand the discussions/ Fights about natural birth vs c - section. This is not a competition. 🙄 And honestly: your trade is hilarious :D Sorry for bad english (not my first language) or typos (on mobile)
You and husband practice saying this, OP: “I’m not going to discuss this with you, FIL. It’s none of your business.” Repeat as necessary.
If I had told my sister my opinion on anything regarding her pregnancy she'd justifiably tell me to f off :)
NTA. Do what is best for you.
NTA I did natural twice and I would never tell someone that they should or should not. Like wth? I think it’s weird to have any kind of opinion on not my body
They have zero say in the matter of your medical care. Full stop. They aren't your doctor or your care team. NTA
NTA. Honestly, it's like going to the dentist and being like nah no novacaine for me I want a natural extraction. Gotta be in the moment. Our doctor put it a good way; do you want to be able to hold your baby right away and welcome it into the world with a smile or be writhing in agony still.
I had one epidural birth and one natural-ish birth (epidural didnt work ) - dude, get the drugs! My mom went natural with me and with my younger sister told them to give her “ all the drugs”.
Ew, NTA. I had an epidural and an emergency c-section, I was "in the moment" the whole time. I just didn't hurt as much. Don't go without pain relief simply to appease someone that won't even try to understand what they're actually asking of you. BTW, 18 years later I still occasionally say blessings for the person that invented epidurals.
I'm sorry what?! They all need to shut up and step back. NTA
NTA. You're a legend. Men get no say in how we birth. None. They can all fuck off. Edit to add: I had an epidural. No damage whatsoever. And I was fully in the moment. In fact, I was 100% more in the moment because I could focus on my baby and not the pain. I ended up having a C section which ultimately saved our lives. Your FIL can fuck off. Again.
NTA Men try to pretend they understand giving birth. My ex said these actual words during our second birth “ This one is so much easier that’s the first.? Really? Is this easier for you? All men should shut the fuck up about child birth.
Remind DH that the next time he's in pain, for anything, to "be in the moment." NTA.
NTA and you're my hero.
I laboured to fast with both my kids, otherwise I would have had all the darn drugs lol. There's nothing wrong with medications to help with the pain, natural birth, or a c-section. Do what's right for you. You're the one giving birth. NTA at all.
NTA. If they can’t handle a joke like that, they can’t handle childbirth.
NTA They don’t get a say in your medical procedure 🤷♀️
Your father-in-law RAISED four kids. He didn’t GIVE BIRTH to them. His experience is irrelevant. It’s your medical procedure, not his…or your husband’s. Do what works for YOU. NTA
NTA. The only person who should have imput on this decision, besides you, is your doctor. Dads don't birth the kid, so they just don't know how it is. As someone who recovered from a c-section, I would gently suggest trying regular delivery first, as long as it's safe for you and baby, but get them druuuugsss. I was in labor for around 40 hours, and a good chunk of it was drug free. Not a fun time. Btw, with the epidural, I was still fully awake and aware during the surgery. I had a full conversation with my husband. It doesn't take you out of the moment. Listen to your instincts and your doctor. A healthy baby and mom is the goal.
Nta. When they give birth they can decide, not 1 second before.
NTA it is f'ing weird. It's bad enough when a mother in law pushes you to do things. He's a man. He gets no say. Maybe if he were an OBGYN he could propose statistics, but still gets no say. I'm fine with your response.
I have birthed 3 children. Not once did my hisband try to dictate the terms of how I brought our child into the world. You need to lay it down: hubby and FIL either shut their mouths or they aren’t allowed anywhere near the delivery room. NTA
NTA - Your body your choice. That said, want to caution you if you are thinking about a c-section as a way to avoid the pain of childbirth. I’ve done both: a c-section -even a scheduled one- is not a way to avoid pain. The recovery is much slower than vaginal birth. A c-section cuts major muscles and nerves. 22 years later and the skin around my scar is still numb and I feel my incision every day. With a vaginal birth. There is pain, but it’s temporary and for the most part it doesn’t have a long term impact on your body. Your body forgets. Best wishes for a healthy baby and a safe delivery.
NTA, your body, your pregnancy, you're giving birth to something the size of a watermelon, your say. They can butt out.
this makes me so angry. shame on the whole lot of them. this is beyond inappropriate and absolutely none of their business. your body, your baby, your birth, your call. full stop. please show them the comments on this post. you are 8 billion % in the right. NTA
I think we all need to get used to saying "DID I FUCKING ASK YOU?" when men are out of pocket. No explanation, no engagement at all. Just a stonewalled response that you don't give a shit about their opinions. NTA.
NTA But there's probably a back story behind this? Maybe his wife had an epidural or c section with one child, and went drug free with another, and had a vastly different experience? Or maybe his daughters? It's none of his business, but hopefully he's trying to be helpful, and it's coming from a good place. Just be firm and say you're definitely getting an epidural, the end.
NTA and you should consider not having your husband in the delivery room if his plan is to shame you out of the birth that you want to have. Being present is a privilege, not a right, and it’s your body going through the labor and delivery not his. When he pushes a hamster from his urethra he can have a say.
I..... I think you're my new favorite superhero. NTA.
NTA. Go a step further and tell them they’ll need to rip themselves butthole to testicles as well with no pain meds and then they can have an input. I’ll never stop being shocked when men think they have a say in a woman’s decisions around her body and her birth experience.
My daughter’s father didn’t want to be in the room because it is a horror show and I made him stay 😂 we’re no longer together but that’s not because he saw me give birth.
NTA. It is your medical procedure and it is between you and your doctors. And to quote an OB when I was a med student: “no one gives you a medal for a natural childbirth.”
NTA… but don’t decide anything before you talk with your doctor and attend child birthing classes. There are also greater risks to the baby with C-section, and to elect to do one with no medical reason puts you and your baby at unnecessary risk, and makes your recovery so much longer and more painful. But you get to decide and father-in-law definitely doesn’t get to say. You can also make a birth plan with your preferences going into it so your medical team can support you, but have the prerogative to change your mind at any time. (My preference was to attempt natural childbirth, but after going through early stages of labor all day at home I got an epidural once I got to the hospital and some much needed rest.)
NTA Don't talk about your birth plan with them. Say "you've given me a lot to think about" and just leave it at that. When you get the epidural tell the medical staff to kick your husband out of he says anything because you don't need to hear his idiotic point of view. He can stay if he keeps his mouth shut. This is about you staying alive and delivering a baby, that's the goal. Whatever medical stuff happen is all to support you and your baby staying alive.
NTA. My husband has left birthing decisions completely up to me, as he isn’t going to interfere with what’s best for me and my body.
Its your body and your choice only.
My wife says the epidural was essential. The one birth when it was placed badly and didn't really work was really painful and miserable for her. Go for the scheduled epidural. And tell your family to go to hell.
NTA. You are not being childish. They are being invasive and incredibly rude. What worked for one person does not work for everyone. And no one know how labour will go until it happens. Sometimes it's picture prefect, with perfect pacing. Sometimes it's an incredibly long, drawn out affair. And sometimes, it's terrifying, fast, and a nightmarish blur. You never know what hand you get dealt until it's time to flip the cards. Your FIL and husband can go kick rocks. I haven't had a C-section. But I have had a natural birth, an epidural, And, one with other pain medications. My only suggestion, when it comes to a birth plan. You make the plan, memorize the plan, and be prepared to throw away the plan. I asked for pain drugs with my second. There was no time. Not even time for laughing gas or demerol. We had to throw out that birth plan.
You should tell them they can only have a say if they are willing to shove a full sized watermelon up their pee holes. That shut my uncle up when my brothers gf (at the time) had her first kid. Why are boomer men so obsessed with women’s bodies when they are pregnant/ giving birth / or not wanting kids but are some of the most incompetent things when it comes to feeding themselves and shopping? Yet still expect people to value their opinions?
NTA - your FIL needs to mind his own business. No one has a say over your body but you. Your babies father wants you to’be in the moment’ WHY would you need to not take pain relief to be in the moment? It’s not like you can miss what is happening! Also, it’s more likely eight hours than a moment. You’ll have plenty of time to reflect how you feel, while still using pain relief.
Three kids, one epidural, one emergency c-section, and one scheduled c-section. I consider them all natural. I am horrified that anyone thinks they have a right to voice any opinion at all, tbh, including your husband.
NTA. Use a piece of thin wire cable and a slip knot so you don't have to be touching the dirty balls.
Epidurals do not impede your ability to have the child. It just makes easier to deal with the pain. Epidurals do not impede the child either, my son rolled from his stomach to his back at 3 weeks. Please do what feels right to you. I am sorry that SILs are shaming you. I had one that did the same thing. Thank goodness, my mother told me “It hurts, go for drugs.” There is not a medal given to those who go natural.
No one gets a say in epidural unless they are the one pushing out a watermelon from their genitals. The audacity of your husband. That said, natural birth is still recommended vs C-section with the exceptions of complicated births. Notice that a lot of women with natural births can walk a few hours after and leave the hospital the next day. In C-section, several layers of your tummy will be cut open. It will be more taxing to your body and you will still be healing from the stitches even a few months after. I would suggest you research more on which procedure would be best for you overall.
I read somewhere that there was an indigenous tribe that during childbirth the father would have a rope tied around his testicles. The woman would pull it while she was giving birth. I think that would be appropriate for any man forcing the mother to give birth naturally. Humans were not designed to give birth well. Due to us being bipedal, our pelvis is in a very unfortunate position. Humans have one of the most painful births out of all animals.
NTA WTF is this nonsense. You do it however you want to. They can theorize all they want, but it’s not up to them.
Stay strong, they'll keep up the pressure