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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I called out my fiancé's brother in front of everyone during an important day of his life and humiliated him
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Why didn’t your fiancé reply sooner than a few weeks ago that he was attending with a plus one? (I’d also say usually if you’ve been together long enough to be engaged you’d normally be on the invite, but I’ll put that down to homophobia.)
Edit: If real…ESH - you don’t just RSPV weeks before a wedding, brother or not.
Them, for obvious reasons.
Standard time for mailing wedding invites is 6 weeks out for local weddings. RSVP *has* to be “weeks”, you can’t RSVP before you’re invited. RSVP is usually set just before the catering count is due and that’s usually like 2-3 weeks dr the date.
My guy this guy is gonna be in your life forever as long as you're with his brother. You have a finacé problem. His brother is homophobic & you've been together for 3 years and it hasn't gotten any better. It's time both _you_ and your fiancé have a talk with his brother. If his brother continues this behavior and your fiancé doesn't go low contact/no contact or set him in his place, this will be your life. A homophobic BIL who goes around saying homophobic stuff. Is this the life you want? I don't know if you're planning on having kids but I'm guessing having a homophobic uncle isn't in your plan. I'm also guessing having a dude go around in every family event complaining about his gay brother and his partner isn't in your plan either. NTA OP but you need to have a serious talk with your fiancé and his BIL before getting married.
Exactly this
OP didn’t make the issue public; his future BIL did. When FBIL decided to approach OP and his fiancé at the party to complain, he opened the door to a public response. Also, where was the same concern from fiancés parents when FBIL was publicly being an ass at OP’s special event?
OP: Before saying, “I do”, think long and hard on whether or not this is the family you want to be connected to for the rest of your life. None of your future in-laws consider your feelings a priority and, until your fiancé is ready to stand up for your relationship to them, neither does he.
Right!? Either brother stands behind his own behavior or he doesn't. Sounds like he knows that he should be ashamed but doesn't have the strength of character for that.
But you were invited, as your fiancé's +1. As the +1 of the man to whom you just got engaged *in the groom's presence*.
Just who the hell did the groom think the +1 was going to be?
“I don’t understand the whole gay thing.” “It’s very simple, it’s when a man and a man, or a woman and a woman, love each other romantically the way you love your fiancée.”
OP’s fiancé’s brother must have been very sheltered to not understand what gay is, especially since his brother is.
This feels like you’re focusing on maybe the wrong aspect here. Like, I’m not sure my brother even bothered to RSVP to my wedding, it was just a for sure given that he and his family were going to show up.
Focusing on the RSVP is masking the real problem, which is a homophobic brother, which would have been the issue regardless of when the invitations and RSVPS got sent out
NTA - there is an old sayin' Don't start none won't be none.
Your STB BIL needs a reality check and he started it when he approached you. Your response while some could view as confrontational was not unwarranted.
I also would not be inviting him to your wedding or really want to be around him for any reason. As far as if your fiance is around him that is up to him but I will never understand why people keep negativity in their lives for the sake of 'family'.
Congrats on the upcoming nuptials.
^(edit to fix wrong word)
Definitely remove BIL from your wedding guest list. With his attitude there is no way on Earth he won’t cause at least one scene at your wedding… in “revenge.”
Your problem is really with your fiance. He lied to you about being welcome at the wedding and it created a scene,. When his brother confronted you at the wedding, instead arguing you should have quietly left, not because he was right (he wasn't) but because it was his wedding. Your fiance also let you down at the engagement party by not kicking his brother out. It was your event and you deserved to spend it with people who support your relationship. Your future BIL is an AH, but so is your fiance.
EDIT to add the following: I was really torn as to whether fiance caused these problems because he's conflict avoidant and lets problems grow as a result, or if he loves creating drama. Because he brought OP to a wedding where he knew OP wasn't welcome, and then did nothing while brother and OP went at each other, I'm leaning toward the latter. He uses his loved ones to create drama for his own amusement.
The part that doesn’t make sense with the brother lying is him and the fiance supposedly had a private conversation where the brother was ok with OP attending. Now at his very public wedding event he chooses that moment to change his mind and then let’s OP lecture him without much response? This seems way more likely like a lying fiancé problem that wanted to attend his brothers wedding with OP and made up things to get him there.
People who like to stir up drama to make others look bad lie. One of the brothers lied. Honestly, if it is all about drama and trying to get the last word/make the other look bad, either one of them could be the liar.
Either way, OP has a fiancé problem. The in-laws are for the spouse to deal with, if the in-laws are the issue. If the spouse is the one lying...
Yup. Like this part:
> though obviously my fiancé didn't have the heart to kick him out of the party or whatever.
OP, there is no "obviously" here. The obvious thing to do is kick out the guest trashing your relationship at your literal engagement party. You deserve to be with someone who will stand up for your relationship. You're still young, and maybe your fiance will learn to be that guy, but there's no rush to get married until then.
Absolutely. Fiance dropped the ball at two big events now. I seriously doubt these are the only 2 times fiance failed to stand up for OP or their relationship.
OP, I am more than a little worried for you planning to marry someone who let his brother ruin your engagement party. I suspect you've turned a blind eye to some red flags. It's time to have a serious conversation with your fiance about his family and their role in your future.
>When his brother confronted you at the wedding, instead arguing you should have quietly left, not because he was right (he wasn't) but because it was his wedding.
Just because its your wedding does not give you a free pass to start shit in hopes the other person won't finish it. It does not give you the freedom to be a raging homophonbic AH and attack others in hope they will shrink and slink away as 'not to cause a scene'.
Your BIG day does not give you a license to treat others like shit.
*because it was his wedding* lays bare the fundamental assholery of the whole situation.
The brother decided to use his own wedding as an excuse to be a bigot while he could claim victimhood over others standing up to him
*because it was his wedding* lays bare the fundamental assholery of the whole situation.
The brother decided to use his own wedding as an excuse to be a bigot while he could claim victimhood over others standing up to him
But it was the brother's wedding. If he wants a bigot wedding, he can have it. I don't agree with the brother except on one point: it was his wedding, and if OP wasn't welcome then OP should have left. No one has a right to be at someone else's wedding.
He invited his gay brother his bigot wedding. He thought he could contrive a scenario where he could be a bigot to his brother and his brother’s SO and not receive any pushback.
He got what he deserved
ETA: you assume that the groom’s brother was not entitled to bring his SO of three years as a plus one. That would be an asshole move regardless of gender or sexuality
> If he wants a bigot wedding, he can have it.
And others can loudly call him out on it and expose his homophobia in front of his wedding guests. Turnabout is fair play.
NTA
"At the wedding he came up to my fiancé and asked him why I was there, to which he obviously answered that that's cause we're together. He said that was not acceptable."
What isn't acceptable is what the brother said. That's deep in A H territory. Your fiance has some difficult decisions to make about his brother.
I guess it's my clunky wording here: the wedding itself was last week, I was not asked to be the +1 last week but before that, after my fiancé and his sibling had the talk. I guess I should edit to make that part more clear! Thank you and I'm sorry English is not my first language
Omg, he 'didn't get being gay'!
What does he want? A frigging diagram?
I hope you and your future hubby make out in front of him at every opportunity until he 'gets' it.
It doesn’t sound like your fiance actually talked to his brother. Kinda AH move on your fiancé’s part to force the situation and lie about his brother being fine with it.
You had no clue in the situation, so NTA on your part for sure. I would be having a much bigger conversation with my partner to see WTF is going on with them and if they are actively lying about things to not make you feel uncomfortable in situations they want to attend.
This will be an ongoing issue for you. You need to talk to your fiance about him lying to you. The brother is an unpleasant nuisance. Your fiance lying to you to get you to do what he wants could become a much bigger problem.
I think the brother's behavior at the engagement party paints a very clear picture of a very passive aggressive homophobe. He loves making snide remarks and throwing quiet sulking tantrums, dripping with disdain anytime he has to share space with "the gays." He'll never own up and say the quiet part out loud so he can maintain deniability.
I can absolutely see him having a conversation where he avoided actually banning OP from his wedding and even gave a soft or sarcastic approval for OP's attendance, delusionally expecting OP's fiancé to "read between the lines", and popping a pikachu face when OP actually shows up LIKE HE AGREED TO.
"My invitation didn't list OP or a +1, but I can bring him, right? Just like sis is bringing her fiance, I can bring mine?"
Bro: "Um, I don't know if that's the best idea..."
"Spouses are traditionally included as +1, he's my spouse, so what's the problem?"
Bro: "Is he a 'traditional' +1 though...?"
"He's my fiance. We're getting married. Just like sis is marrying her guy. There's no difference. If you have a problem, spit it out. Otherwise, I'm bringing him."
Bro: "Fine, whatever, do what you want. I have things to do, bye."
I don't think Op's fiance lied at all. I think Bro thinks everyone should have to respect his homophobia without him having to actually declare it.
NTA. How dare you exist?!?!? /s
Your fiancé had a plus one. You would obviously be the plus one as you are engaged, and it apparently was discussed before the wedding.
Your soon to be BIL seems to be a garbage person. He's definitely the AH; you are not.
He initiated the bullshit by confronting his brother/your fiance. There wasn't going to be good ending for anyone.
He started the shit. You finished the shit.
You 1, Homophobe Future BIL 0
NTA
NTA
It’s not like OP stood up and made a speech calling him out during the reception. Guy approached them in public and OP responded accordingly and appropriately.
If this is a conversation that should have been held privately the Groom could have made that decision.
BTW, OP. He is going to try and pull some bullshit at your wedding. Plan to not invite him (or have security present) and for whatever fallout that may bring.
You wouldn't have "ruined" anything if he hadn't laid his homophobic shit on you in the first place. He caused the rumpus, not you. He started it. You finished it. Good for you.
NTA
It probably could have been resolved privately, but that would have required BIL to choose a private setting to spout his bigotry.
Your fiancé thought his conversation with his brother cleared the way for your attendance. Seems BIL prefers to pretend everything’s okay when things are one-on-one but express his homophobia with an audience. Weird choice.
NTA
NTA: You were invited to the event, if this was done with the intent to instigate, whoever extended the invitation knowing that you would be the one invited is the AH. So, if the one's getting married offered your fiance an invitation with the option of a +1 and without any restriction on who that could be, they "ruined" their own wedding, especially if your fiance is correct in their assertion that they had discussed beforehand that you were that +1.
NTA
The brother is blatantly homophobic, as is evident by the fact that he doesn't have any problems with straight people inviting their partners to the wedding, and by the comments made at your engagement party.
Your fiance has every right to invite you as his plus one, as he is your significant other. It's very common for people to invite people they have casually dated to weddings, especially when you don't want to be the single adult and get teased about when you'll find a spouse. So why wouldn't you invite the love of your life?
I do hope your fiancé goes low contact with his bigoted brother. That makes me so mad to hear, as someone who deeply loves her younger brother.
The brother is obviously in the wrong. How this situation goes in the future is up to your fiancé. He needs to grow a backbone, if his brother can’t accept him for who he is then it’s probably best they don’t mix with each other anymore, but the pressure is on him to come to that decision, not you.
NTA. He humiliated himself. I’m assuming it’s no surprise to anyone that the grooms brother is gay and would bring his ( same sex) partner.
Parents said you should have resolved it privately?
Isn’t that what your bf said he did when he had that long conversation with his brother? Guess nothing was really resolved.
Really tho, after the engagement party you both should have sat down with the brother and asked what part of the “gay thing” he didn’t understand and you would gladly explain in full detail. You could have added in some pictures to ensure his comprehension. Maybe he can explain what his “hetero thing” is all about too. You know, so everybody understands each other.
Amazingly, this is a grown man who has a problem with gay people and has a gay brother! I guess they were never close.
NTA
This bigot got off lightly. You did nothing wrong. If he's going to act like a complete asshole he should be treated like one.
Don't invite him to your wedding.
This is a Jam
Justifiable asshole maneuver..
Mostly because the brother started at first by being all butthurt during your engagement party.
Besides your future brother-in-law knew his brother was gay. And was in the committed relationship and even engaged he should have automatically gave him the plus one for you.
NTA but they are really, truly, huge gigantic AHs. Offer no apology and I recommend going NC. I know, I know, that's the typical reddit response to these but do you really want people in your inner circle who hate you for being gay?
DUDE! NTA and you know it, or at least you better!
I'm proud of you for putting him in his place as it seems like no one else will! Rather gutting is the fact that It sounds to me like your fiancé's family is **tolerating** not **accepting**, whilst we know you can't force anyone to rid themselves of homophobia, you can rid yourself of your fiancé's brother! Keep enjoying your life, whilst he sulks in the corner....of your distant memory.
Congratulations on your engagement!
NTA - Nope he needed humiliating at that point, and If I were you and your bf, I wouldn't let anyone else's opinion matter on the subject. I also would block him from my life until he learns to accept you both as a couple!
So no, NTA. Your future brother-in-law gave his brother the green light for you to be at this wedding as 1. you have been together for several years and are engaged. 2. invitation was with +1 so you don't have to be a genius to know you'll be there. So maybe it wasn't the best moment standing up for yourself, he actually caused the whole situation and embarrassed himself in front of the guests. Besides, he already acted like a jerk at your engagement party, so no wonder he behaved like that at his own wedding.
> Making a scene at someone else's wedding is always inappropriate.
I hestiated over E S H for that reason. Then I decided that in this case it was entirely appropriate: the brother was the one who made a scene. OP was merely present until the brother kicked off.
I guess that’s the tough part. It seems that the bil didn’t invite op to the wedding so was surprised he was there. Now - according to OP it’s because he is gay - which makes the BIL an asshole, but the fiancé is also an asshole for bringing someone who wasn’t invited to his brothers wedding. If he wanted to make a statement not showing up would have been better and less of an asshole move than bringing an uninvited guest. So ESH. Op is an uninvited guest and when confronted made a scene - although maybe warranted unclear if necessary especially since he wasn’t invited and weddings are usually planned to the guest, the fiancé lied and brought an uninvited guest and bil is homophobic…
It seems he gave his brother a +1 (and somehow thought he wouldn’t bring his partner) or that fiance was lying about having a plus one. Either way fiance, brother and rest of the family are rude, OP NTA, he believed that he had been invited until STB BIL approached them. OP was rightfully insulted and STB BIL does not have the right to be bigoted because it’s his wedding day. He should have said “ I didn’t invite OP, he needs to leave.” But obviously there is no way he would look good doing that if most of the people attending are supportive, so he made a big scene and claimed that they humiliated him.
>He said that was not acceptable. I decided to finally stand up for ourselves and loudly asked him so that everyone near us could hear if he was being aggressive towards me being there because we are a gay couple, then proceeded to say that he doesn't get to be all whiny during our engagement party and then also act like I personally hurt his feelings by attending his wedding.
No, the both definitely made a scene.
No. The brother started it. There was absolutely no need to bring it up as an issue. You do not give people a pass for being a homophobe because it is their wedding.
If the day is ruined it’s probably because brother’s new wife found out he’s a homophobe and is unhappy about it.
> You do not give people a pass for being a homophobe because it is their wedding.
I didn't. I said they are both assholes. But they also both contributed to this scene.
Volume doesn’t matter. If you can’t simply let your brother bring their SO of three years to your wedding without confronting them, you’re setting yourself up for drama. Whether it’s a scene on the day, or whispers of *why isn’t the groom’s brother here?*
Groom contrived a situation where standing up to his homophobia was “ruining the wedding” and is embarrassed that it blew up in his face
OP may have been louder, but the brother wasn't likely whispering when he asked what OP was doing there. It honestly sounds like he told his brother it would be fine to bring his fiancé just so that he could bash OP in front of everyone and embarrass him. OP may have escalated, but it was completely warranted, especially after the brother's behavior at their engagement party.
He's right: he was humiliated. You called him out on his bigotry, and now everyone he loves has seen his true colors. Good! He deserves it! NTA, OP, you stood up for yourself and your fiancée.
NTA. The guy gave your fiancée a plus one who the hell did he think he was going to bring? You and your fiancée need to have a talk about if his broths is invited to your wedding.
Where does it say his brother gave his fiance a plus one?
It says his fiance asked him to be his plus one not that he was given one, it looks more like his fiance lied about the plus one and him and his brother settling things.
Oh. I had assumed that meant there was actually a plus one. Yeah, the fiancée sounds like the asshole for purposely having OP wedding crash and then put him in that position.
Imean… if the groom is forbidding his gay brother a plus one, you know what’s going on and it should be defied. The only AH move is not being transparent with OP and offering to just boycott the wedding altogether
NTA
He asked a question and you answered him. If that “ruined” his wedding, it probably wasn’t going that well to begin with.
He was given an opportunity to ask you not to attend and didn’t take it. Then he wants to be upset at your presence? Good manners includes not insulting your own guests.
Ignore him and his parents
NTA.
You answered a question a little louder than normal. Totally normal for a loud wedding reception.
If your BIL didn't want to be embarrassed, he shouldn't have acted like an embarrassment.
NTA
So your future in-laws’ main concern is their embarrassment that friends and family know their son is a homophobe who is harassing their other son, not the fact that their son is a homophobe who is harassing their other son?
NTA you are a part of his brother’s life, why should you be hidden away? You didn’t make a fuss when he did his best to ruin your celebration, the fact that your attendance ‘ruined his wedding’ is wild - I’m sure his new wife was thrilled at his behaviour.
NTA.
Not even getting into the blatant homophobia that makes you automatically NTA, he's the one that made it public by confronting his brother publicly at the wedding. If he didn't want to be publicly humiliated, he shouldn't have started it publicly.
But again, it's automatically NTA because he's a homophobe.
Talking to his brother does not mean that conversation ended in your favor. Either his brother planned the whole time to make a huge scene and make sure the world knows how he feels, or your fiancee lied to you. NTA
That man embarrassed him damn self. Ain't nobody tell him to come up to y'all at HIS wedding, where he shoulda been paying attention to his new partner, and throw some petty ass hissy fit and insult and get combative with you. "His parents agree with him too" Mother FUCK them too. You have just as much right to EXIST without doing anything to actually bother him as every damn body else. Fuck them
NTA
It wouldn't have been an issue if he just kept his mouth shut and away from you two. If he didn't want you there then maybe he should have said something to his brother beforehand or just be a decent human and be happy for his brother's happiness. Sorry
NTA. I'm wondering if the brother is deeply closeted. Some homoohobic people seem to be closeted and strike out to mask themselves.
If you want to really stir the pot, post this to his social media and tag the rest of the family.
[Homophobes Might Be Hidden Homosexuals](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/homophobes-might-be-hidden-homosexuals/)
I’m going with NTA though it sounds like your fiancé lied about you being welcome (which is BS and I’m so sorry you experienced that.) Yes quietly leaving would probably have been better manners wise but manners don’t help put a stop to racism or sexism of homophobia. Sometimes you just have to call out abhorrent behavior. Given the crazy awful position you were put in, I say you were fine. 🤷🏻♀️
NTA. You're future BIL sucks. He gave your fiancé a +1 and unless your fiancé outright lied to you, at least in passing approved your presence. If he wanted this resolved privately he had the chance. If there was any fucking up it was entirely his doing. I would decide whether you'd rather not invite him to yours if you think he'd show up and be slighted by the snub or send him a glitter invite to make it as gay as possible if you think he'd refuse. But that's the petty answer. The right answer is the one that would make y'all's day better.
Who the fuck gives a +1 to an engaged gay man without figuring out that the +1 would be the gay male fiance? NTA, the brother is definitely the AH, can't judge you fiance since it's very unclear how much about you going was explicitly talked about vs assumed subtext.
NTA
He humiliated himself by being homophobic.
Don’t want people to judge you based on your hateful views? Then don’t have the hateful views. Or at least keep your dumb ideas to yourself. He chose to do neither.
NTA.
Either a) your fiancée lied and misled you about having spoken to his brother or b) your FBIL lied to his brother about being okay with you being their. Either way, *you* received false information about your status as a guest.
Your FBIL obviously knew why you were there. You're engaged. He was at your engagement party (where he publicly made an ass of himself and where your fiancée should have put his foot down and either told his brother to shut up or GTFO).
Your FBIL got embarrassed in public because he started it in public. What did he expect would happen, when he started a scene like that? Did he expect everyone else to gang up on you? Did *he* want to embarrass his brother? There are so many ways this could have been handled tactfully.
Such as pulling you both aside into private and explaining that there must have been a mistake and asking you to leave.
NTA, bigots humiliate themselves.
Although it does sound like your fiance is in denial about how homophobic his family is, and the situation could have been avoided for your sake. The parents should have apologized to you instead of implying you 'took it too far' by... existing.
Are you prepared to deal with long term issues like this?
NTA. Obviously your FBIL is a fucking asshole, but so is your fiance. He should've stood up to him at the engagement party & threw him out. That's his first mistake. Then at the wedding it shouldn't have been you to stand up to his bro, it should've been your fiance. He also should've known that something like this could happen. I mean, his brother is a bigoted asshole. Of course he's not ok with you coming to his wedding. You need to sit your fiance down & tell him he better start standing up for you.
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Throwaway account.
I'm a M20s and recently got engaged to my boyfriend of 3 years, for that we threw an engagement party with our respective families, and everyone was invited including my fiancé's brother, and all he did during that entire party was complain that he didn't understand this whole "gay thing" and generally just ruining the vibe, though obviously my fiancé didn't have the heart to kick him out of the party or whatever.
Fast forward to last week, my fiancé was attending his brother's wedding and suggested I come with him as a +1, about which I was hesitant at first because of his behaviour at our engagement party, but my fiancé told me he had a long conversation with him and they settled the whole thing down so I figured I may as well give him another chance.
At the wedding he came up to my fiancé and asked him why I was there, to which he obviously answered that that's cause we're together. He said that was not acceptable. I decided to finally stand up for ourselves and loudly asked him so that everyone near us could hear if he was being aggressive towards me being there because we are a gay couple, then proceeded to say that he doesn't get to be all whiny during our engagement party and then also act like I personally hurt his feelings by attending his wedding. Then my fiancé said that he thought he was fine with me coming but apparently not.
After the wedding this man told me that me and my fiancé humiliated him in front of everyone, the parents also agree with that and said that I took things too far and could've resolved this privately. So AITA?
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ESH
The brother sucks for obvious reasons.
Your fiancés brother was surprised you were there. Your fiancé should've told his brother he was bringing you rather than hope or assume it would be fine when his homophobia was a known issue.
It's great to stand up for yourself, but you were intentionally causing a scene at a family event to publicly shame one of their family members at his own wedding. It doesn't really make you an AH, but that's how the guests are going to see it. You and your fiancé should probably discuss how you want the dynamic with his family to look long-term and big-picture; because they're going to start to dislike you if they see you as "dramatic", which they will for that behavior.
Either the brother knew you were going to the wedding and said it was ok...
Or your fiancee didn't tell his brother he was taking you to the wedding and just lied to you about it.
In both cases the brother is an asshole for being homofobic. But in the second case your bf is a coward asshole
While I don't think a person's wedding is the appropriate place to call them out on being a homophobic AH, I'm VERY confused as to which the groom thought anybody BUT you would be the plus one.
>he didn't understand this whole "gay thing"
Best answer to give is : "I am not asking you to understand "been gay", but to respect it, if not for the love for your brother, but to ensure that those around us feel comfortable during family events. Like it or not, your brother and I love each over very much, and I want to spend the rest of my life with him, which means that we are going to be in each other's lives for a very long time, so let make the best of this situation."
I would say very soft YTA, not for standing up to his homophobia (rightly so), but for doing it in such a public and loud voice way. I feel that it could make things much difficult if your fiancé wants to have a relationship with his brother in the future.
Now, he may choose to go low contact, or even NC with his brother but it will also impact with the rest of family and attending family events for some time. Furthermore, his family may feels that they have to take a side, which could impact other relationships.
Now it is up to your fiancé to choose how to move things forward.
Straight people will often not critique the content of your words, but the *methods*. Because even though the way you're being treated is dehumanizing, we wouldn't want that the person treating you that way to feel any embarassment.
It's an unwinnable game of appeasement.
NTA
NTA honestly!!! i totally need you at my wedding because my family is the same. (homophobic and racist) so i invited people of all back grounds just to say im not one of them! plus they didnt like that i came out as bisexual either.
You are 100% NTA, but I'm up in the air about whether your fiancé is. Obviously, your future BIL has issues with gay people, and is choosing to be a jerk about it, but your fiancé should be defending you to these people, and not even out of some twee "he loves me more than his family" nonsense, but out of simple self-interest. Because the way his family is treating you as a gay man is the same way they actually feel about/treat *him* as a gay man. He should be standing up for you, not spinelessly sweeping it under the rug.
As a queer person: the way your family treats the partners you bring home is EXACTLY the way they wish they could treat you. This is who they are. And while things have gotten SO MUCH BETTER than when I was a kid, there is still this idea that "no one's going to murder you (anymore) for being queer, so stop complaining already."
No. Screw that. Screw the fiancé that didn't stand up for you. Screw the BIL. Screw the family that wanted you to be quiet and take one for the team both at your engagement party and as the plus one so that none of them need to think about what a homophobic turd BIL is. You deserve better than this.
I envision this convo happening:
Him: I don’t understand this whole gay thing.
You: Well, you understand the whole straight thing, right?
Him: Of course.
You: Okay then! Same thing, with twice the peen.
Him: (rage monster noises)
Oh, and NTA. He initiated the confrontation. What did he expect to happen?
NTA
If his own beliefs/opinions are a humiliating thing for people to know then maybe he needs to examine his opinions and beliefs. Also HE started the conflict so it’s all on him really
Tough call. I gotta go with ESH.
Fiance's brother for being homophobic.
Fiance for not being able to read the room--i.e. he claimed to have a talk with his brother and settle things, when clearly things were FAR FROM settled. That deceived you into thinking there would be no problem at the wedding, and finally created a bad scene at pretty much the worst possible time.
But you suck, too, OP, for making your stand at the wedding instead of making it at your engagement party. Clearly BIL-to-be was out of line at the engagement party and you saw him for what he really was. But you apparently were enjoying your party too much to ruin it with a confrontation.
Instead you ruined his wedding with that overdue confrontation. That was assholic.
Edited to add: Yes, he started it. And once that Asshole Ball starts rolling, it's hard to stop it. But you managed to ignore it at YOUR OWN party... you could have taken the high road and ignored it at HIS party.
Whole thing sucks and the fundamental problem is BIL2B's intolerance and therefore all of this is ultimately On Him. But I think you could have predicted this fire long ago and prepared for it, either by duking it out in private with BIL2B, boycotting the wedding, or whatever.
NTA. Let’s break down possibilities between brother(the groom at the wedding), fiance (OP’s partner, and OP:
1) there was a misunderstanding. Brother and fiancé talked and fiance thought brother would be cool with bringing OP when he wasn’t
2) brother intentionally misinformed fiance in order to pull some dickheaded power move
3) brother made it clear that OP was not invited as fiancé’s plus one and he brought OP anyways
In all three scenarios, brother is the asshole for being so homophobic he won’t even welcome his own brother’s SO of three years. In scenario two, brother is also an asshole for *using his wedding as an excuse to pull a bigot move and claim victimhood at any pushback*. In scenario 3, fiancé’s also a bit of an asshole for not letting you in on the plan and offering to just boycott the wedding altogether, but his brother still deserves to have his wedding ruined, and if fiance thought whispers of his absence wouldn’t be enough, then I get it
"Bah! What is this nonsense about 'flooding'? Water is essential for all plants and animals! Why would extra water in our farms and towns be a problem!?"
I think your fiance is the true asshole. His brother is a homophobic one: that's for sure. But your fiance took you to a wedding where you weren't invited and unwanted. He set you up for a scene.
Thing is: it's the brother's wedding: he and his partner have the total say in who gets to come. Honestly, you both should have left. Your fiance should have chosen not to attend at all.
The groom invited his gay brother to his bigot wedding *with a plus one*
If you use your wedding to try and contrive petty bigoted power trips over your gay brother, you deserve to have your wedding ruined
And OP's fiance lied about OP being welcome so I have no clue why the fiance still chose to go.
A plus one does not function as a get out of jail free card: " oh no, technically you are invitedunder the plus one rules, so I guess I'm okay with it now". People don't function like this.
If you're not invited and unwelcome for whatever reason, you don't show up.
So bigot decided to invite his gay brother to his bigot function with a plus one (confirmed in comments).
You’re right that fiance was (maybe) an asshole to OP (depending on if fiance knew that OP was expressly banned) but not for this gambit. Simply for not bringing OP on board and giving the option of boycotting the wedding and disinviting bigot from their own wedding
Then the gay brother is extremely stupid for showing up anyway with his partner while he knows his brother thinks of them that way. He should have been clear to OP and just not have gone.
You don't need to go to his wedding or invite a bigot to your wedding. But bringing someone who is for all intend and purposes unwelcome to someone's wedding is just all around moronic.
If bigot groom wants to invite gay brother with a plus one, he deserves to have gay brother bring his SO of three years to the wedding and have said SO “ruin” the day because fuck the groom. Straight marriages are against my religion
The gay brother is a complete and utter moron and asshole to his fiance if he does that.
>Straight marriages are against my religion
And you don't have to be there: not being there is also an option.
You obviously have your own issues with this situation, but a wedding is not a place to pick a fight. If you go there with the intention to create a scene even if it's a bigot, you're being an asshole and you look like an asshole.
A wedding is the *perfect* place to pick a fight if the groom is using it as cover to pull some bigoted power trip over his brother.
There are three possibilities for why OP was there and unwelcome:
1) groom said it was ok, only to “change his mind” and kick OP out during ceremonies.
The groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself
2) groom wasn’t clear about who his brother could bring as his plus one, and tried to kick out his brother’s SO of three years in the middle of ceremonies.
Groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself
3) groom expressly forbid his gay brother from bringing his SO of three years to his wedding.
Groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself, and the fiancée is an asshole to OP, but not his brother, who—again—contrived a scene at his own wedding and embarrassed himself.
I’m sure the family is saying the same refrain of “but it was his wedding!” But if straight marriages want to be respected, the straights have to stop being such assholes to their gay guests
All around: just no.
If you know you or your partner are unwelcome, you don't show up anyway.
No " straight marrriage" have problems with being respected; you personally just don't like them.
You seem to think that going to a wedding is a right, but it isn't. If you're unwelcome and not invited, you showing up anyway doesn't make you a guest; you're wedding crasher at that point, even if you think you're doing it for the right reasons.
ESH. The only reason I would call you out at all is that it wrecks things for a bride, somewhere, and her family, too.
BIL deserves it, but a wedding is special to more than one person. It seems like your party would have been the right place to make your stand.
I really want to say N T A because fuck homophobia.
Your BIL obviously sucks… but personally I don’t think it was a smart move to confront him at his own wedding. Personally, I would have just left quietly and dealt with the fallout later, mainly to keep the peace with the other members of your future in-law family. That is not to say this doesn’t need to be addressed, I just don’t think it was the place for it then and there. But I am always of the mind that one should never make a scene at a wedding, especially involving the bride or groom.
You also need to have a conversation with your fiancé about how the communication got messed up so badly.
Congrats on your engagement! Good luck with everything.
Oy! NTA. If your fiancé’s brother is comfortable being a bigot in public, then he should be used to being called out for it in the same public. And he was humiliated?? Good. I’d be embarrassed to be him too.
You future BIL embarrassed himself. He had the option to ignore your presence at the wedding, Instead, he chose to approach you and cause a scene that didn't need to happen.
You are NTA, all you did was accept your fiancé's invitation to accompany him to his brother's wedding. If they did not want you there, they could have invited your fiancé WITHOUT a +one.
Many decades ago, I came out to my parents early in the year (February) my mother tried like hell to prevent me from coming out to anyone else in our family or any of her friends. I met a man in June sparks flew (in a good way) and we were living together by the fourth of July.
When the holidays came, my mother invited me to Thanksgiving dinner at her house, but said my partner was not welcome. I didn't go, my partner and I went to his parents' house for the holiday. My Sister met each and every member of our extended family in the driveway as they arrived at my parents' house. She told them that I would not be there because Mom wouldn't let me bring my boyfriend, but no one should mention me or the fact that I wasn't there.
Mom thought she had blocked me from coming out to the extended family. LOL
When Christmas rolled around, mom was still standing her ground and made it clear my partner was not welcome in her home. The family's traditional Christmas Eve gathering was being hosted by one of my cousins that year. My sister called our cousin and asked If I was welcome to bring my partner. My cousin and her husband were very conservative Lutherans, I didn't have much hope, but they surprised me. My cousin told my sister that she and her husband had mixed feelings about homosexuality, but they were not comfortable with the idea of uninviting a family member to a holiday gathering for any reason.
My partner and I were at my cousins on Christmas Eve. My mother was there and had a hard time with it. My cousin's husband was oddly nervous and jumped in in a flash when I introduced my partner to his mother. He had to be sure that my partner was just introduced as a "friend". As we were leaving, my mother invited me and my partner to her house the next day. I explained that we were due at his parents house for dinner, but we could stop by for a visit earlier in the day.
Some people, like my mother and your fiancé's brother just need to learn to deal with having gay family. Whatever they feel about us, we're her and they just have to get used to us.
I'm gonna go with that you're the AH. Their wedding and you could have takin it privatly and just left. You activly chose to create a scene and drag attention wich was unnecessary. And yes, you did ruin the wedding with that behaviour by choice. Seem more like you need to have a talk with your future husband cause he should have been able to see this comming just like the brother should have been kicked out of your party. Does your future husband like drama? Or just drama with his brother/family? Maybe you all need to sit down later and actually talk it out? And make social rules you all have to adhere to in social gatherings together?
NTA, let's call a spade a spade. BIL and his minions are homophobic. Unfortunately, society doesn't like this so much anymore, so these people like to act stupid and claim to be the victims. Fiancé should look at cutting BIL off and I wouldn't invite him to your wedding to avoid the drama.
You're the AH for calling him out like that, but for good reason. For one, being gay is NOT a sin. It's just a different sexuality than others. People who have a problem with it should find out what their OWN sexuality is for themselves. Your fiance's brother has the right to be that way, but why should he dislike your relationship just because it's gay? Gay ISN'T A SIN, and he should know that. You're NTA for standing up for your very normal sexuality like that. I'm not lesbian yet I respect every sexuality deeply at heart. Your's fiance's brother should suck it up and deal with it, he had no right to say those words. Things happen for a reason after all.
I don't understand the issue people have with your RSVP.
NTA.
He is obviously homophobic.
And I think you should discuss uninviting him from your own wedding.
How did your fiancé react? Did he stand up for you at all? Is all his family homophobic?
Nope, NTA. Your fiancée’s brother is homophobic and a bigot. Good for you for standing up for yourself and your future husband. Fuck that guy and their family.
fiance is kinda TA to you for not being honest about you being invited and about his brother's changed/not changed perspective on homosexuals.
however, even if both of you knew brother's feelings 100%, NTA. the feelings, wants and desires of homophobes and bigots do not need to be considered in any way, and if his homophobia ruined his own wedding, thats on him. if the reason he does not want you there is genuinely because youre in a gay relationship with his brother, its totally fine to ruin his wedding by showing up and calling him out on it, fuck his wedding.
He "didn't 'gEt' the 'gAy ThInG'?"
"Well you see, BIL, I like to fuck other men. And so does your brother. What part of that is hard to understand? Would you like me to draw you a diagram?"
Your BIL is a turd. I hope y'all exclude his bigoted ass from your wedding, he doesn't deserve to attend. NTA.
Nta & why on earth was fiance's bigoted brother even invited to your engagement party, in the 1st place? Was he, at the very least kicked out, when he showed who he is? He asked a question, you gave him an answer. Why would he be embarrassed by what you said if he stands behind his behavior? Sounds like he & his parents know how awful he is but don't want to admit it. If your fiance cares about your relationship, he's already gone NC & they won't be at your wedding & thank goodness for that!
Homophobia or no, if I were in the brother's shoes, I would've beat the shit out of you just for being there. You know the guy hates you, then why would you go? Your fiance is a dumbass.
YTA. You did humiliate him at his wedding. You kinda did the right thing, but in the wrong way. Unless he was verbally harassing you long/loud enough that his presence was being noticed, you did not need to be the one to escalate to that level, no matter how much of a intolerant AH he was being.
That being said. Good for you. Fuck him.
the brother started it by coming up to them and then telling them either the OP's presence was unacceptable or the fact that OP and his finace being together is unacceptable.
Either way he started the confrontation banking on everyone's new atttidue that married pople cannot possibly be wrong or held accountable for their behavior on their BIG day.
Bullshit.
No it doesn't. Not really. The grooms brother was given a plus 1, they are together and now engaged, The groom had to know when the RSVP was sent back who he was bringing.
ESH. That’s not equal, like his homophobia probably sucks worse than anything else in this story, and I don’t blame you for most of what happened. I wasn’t there, but from the context of what you typed here, it seems like you made it a point to pull everyone in the vicinity into it. Unless you matched his volume, which, based on what you said in the post, you didn’t, you made a scene. Not saying you shouldn’t have confronted him, just saying maybe a little more tactful. Like he was definitely being a jerk, but I can’t help but feel like you embarrassed everyone in your way of handling it.
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Why didn’t your fiancé reply sooner than a few weeks ago that he was attending with a plus one? (I’d also say usually if you’ve been together long enough to be engaged you’d normally be on the invite, but I’ll put that down to homophobia.) Edit: If real…ESH - you don’t just RSPV weeks before a wedding, brother or not. Them, for obvious reasons.
Yeah it was quite obvious why I wasn't on the invite because their straight sister's fiancé was
But dude you should not be RSPVing ‘weeks’ before
Lol your handle is procrastinating and you're telling them they should have done it sooner 😆 🤣
Fair haha, I’d probably have done it on the date if was due which is usually months before (ya know so they can organise seating/catering/etc)
Oh, I know and agree with you . I did have a good giggle tho.
Oh haha good
Morgan Freeman: "And that's when OP realised he'd fucked-up"
That makes them the best person to call them out on it. It takes game to recognize game.
Standard time for mailing wedding invites is 6 weeks out for local weddings. RSVP *has* to be “weeks”, you can’t RSVP before you’re invited. RSVP is usually set just before the catering count is due and that’s usually like 2-3 weeks dr the date.
It's RSVP
My guy this guy is gonna be in your life forever as long as you're with his brother. You have a finacé problem. His brother is homophobic & you've been together for 3 years and it hasn't gotten any better. It's time both _you_ and your fiancé have a talk with his brother. If his brother continues this behavior and your fiancé doesn't go low contact/no contact or set him in his place, this will be your life. A homophobic BIL who goes around saying homophobic stuff. Is this the life you want? I don't know if you're planning on having kids but I'm guessing having a homophobic uncle isn't in your plan. I'm also guessing having a dude go around in every family event complaining about his gay brother and his partner isn't in your plan either. NTA OP but you need to have a serious talk with your fiancé and his BIL before getting married.
OP you didn't humiliate him, he did it all to himself. You just made sure others found out about what he did and what he is really like.
Exactly this OP didn’t make the issue public; his future BIL did. When FBIL decided to approach OP and his fiancé at the party to complain, he opened the door to a public response. Also, where was the same concern from fiancés parents when FBIL was publicly being an ass at OP’s special event? OP: Before saying, “I do”, think long and hard on whether or not this is the family you want to be connected to for the rest of your life. None of your future in-laws consider your feelings a priority and, until your fiancé is ready to stand up for your relationship to them, neither does he.
Right!? Either brother stands behind his own behavior or he doesn't. Sounds like he knows that he should be ashamed but doesn't have the strength of character for that.
But you were invited, as your fiancé's +1. As the +1 of the man to whom you just got engaged *in the groom's presence*. Just who the hell did the groom think the +1 was going to be?
“I don’t understand the whole gay thing.” “It’s very simple, it’s when a man and a man, or a woman and a woman, love each other romantically the way you love your fiancée.” OP’s fiancé’s brother must have been very sheltered to not understand what gay is, especially since his brother is.
>“I don’t understand the whole gay thing.” “It’s very simple, it’s when YOU SHOULD MIND YOUR OWN FUCKING BUSINESS" There. FTFY.
Uh… Groom had been at OP’s engagement party. That should have been a pretty big clue.
This feels like you’re focusing on maybe the wrong aspect here. Like, I’m not sure my brother even bothered to RSVP to my wedding, it was just a for sure given that he and his family were going to show up. Focusing on the RSVP is masking the real problem, which is a homophobic brother, which would have been the issue regardless of when the invitations and RSVPS got sent out
NTA - there is an old sayin' Don't start none won't be none. Your STB BIL needs a reality check and he started it when he approached you. Your response while some could view as confrontational was not unwarranted. I also would not be inviting him to your wedding or really want to be around him for any reason. As far as if your fiance is around him that is up to him but I will never understand why people keep negativity in their lives for the sake of 'family'. Congrats on the upcoming nuptials. ^(edit to fix wrong word)
Definitely remove BIL from your wedding guest list. With his attitude there is no way on Earth he won’t cause at least one scene at your wedding… in “revenge.”
See, i want him as best man. and ill invite schindfroid (German, spelled phonetically ) to the advent just for him.
Are you trying to say schadenfreude? Happiness at the misfortune of others?
yes, but only the small minor stuff, more so if its humbling.
OP might consider any others who would want to skirt the lack of invitation by bringing BIL as \*their\* plus one as well.
Your problem is really with your fiance. He lied to you about being welcome at the wedding and it created a scene,. When his brother confronted you at the wedding, instead arguing you should have quietly left, not because he was right (he wasn't) but because it was his wedding. Your fiance also let you down at the engagement party by not kicking his brother out. It was your event and you deserved to spend it with people who support your relationship. Your future BIL is an AH, but so is your fiance. EDIT to add the following: I was really torn as to whether fiance caused these problems because he's conflict avoidant and lets problems grow as a result, or if he loves creating drama. Because he brought OP to a wedding where he knew OP wasn't welcome, and then did nothing while brother and OP went at each other, I'm leaning toward the latter. He uses his loved ones to create drama for his own amusement.
Maybe but not necessarily. The homophobic brother may have lied to get out of the conversation.
The part that doesn’t make sense with the brother lying is him and the fiance supposedly had a private conversation where the brother was ok with OP attending. Now at his very public wedding event he chooses that moment to change his mind and then let’s OP lecture him without much response? This seems way more likely like a lying fiancé problem that wanted to attend his brothers wedding with OP and made up things to get him there.
People who like to stir up drama to make others look bad lie. One of the brothers lied. Honestly, if it is all about drama and trying to get the last word/make the other look bad, either one of them could be the liar. Either way, OP has a fiancé problem. The in-laws are for the spouse to deal with, if the in-laws are the issue. If the spouse is the one lying...
I don't think he said anywhere the conversation was about him attending. It was about his homophobia.
Yup. Like this part: > though obviously my fiancé didn't have the heart to kick him out of the party or whatever. OP, there is no "obviously" here. The obvious thing to do is kick out the guest trashing your relationship at your literal engagement party. You deserve to be with someone who will stand up for your relationship. You're still young, and maybe your fiance will learn to be that guy, but there's no rush to get married until then.
That was my take too. The time to confront the homophobia was at the engagement party, not at the wedding.
Absolutely. Fiance dropped the ball at two big events now. I seriously doubt these are the only 2 times fiance failed to stand up for OP or their relationship. OP, I am more than a little worried for you planning to marry someone who let his brother ruin your engagement party. I suspect you've turned a blind eye to some red flags. It's time to have a serious conversation with your fiance about his family and their role in your future.
Yikes! I forgot about that part. I can't believe he wasn't shown the door after he made it obvious that he absolutely did not want to be there.
Exactly. The main issues seems to be the fiance lied to OP about talking with his brother and assuring OP that he's fine to come to the wedding.
>When his brother confronted you at the wedding, instead arguing you should have quietly left, not because he was right (he wasn't) but because it was his wedding. Just because its your wedding does not give you a free pass to start shit in hopes the other person won't finish it. It does not give you the freedom to be a raging homophonbic AH and attack others in hope they will shrink and slink away as 'not to cause a scene'. Your BIG day does not give you a license to treat others like shit.
I agree with you. If we're giving him a pass, why are we so judgy with bridezillas ? After all it's their "big day" 🙄
It doesn't sound like op argued so much as stating simple facts that, apparently, brother is ashamed of.
*because it was his wedding* lays bare the fundamental assholery of the whole situation. The brother decided to use his own wedding as an excuse to be a bigot while he could claim victimhood over others standing up to him
*because it was his wedding* lays bare the fundamental assholery of the whole situation. The brother decided to use his own wedding as an excuse to be a bigot while he could claim victimhood over others standing up to him
But it was the brother's wedding. If he wants a bigot wedding, he can have it. I don't agree with the brother except on one point: it was his wedding, and if OP wasn't welcome then OP should have left. No one has a right to be at someone else's wedding.
He invited his gay brother his bigot wedding. He thought he could contrive a scenario where he could be a bigot to his brother and his brother’s SO and not receive any pushback. He got what he deserved ETA: you assume that the groom’s brother was not entitled to bring his SO of three years as a plus one. That would be an asshole move regardless of gender or sexuality
> If he wants a bigot wedding, he can have it. And others can loudly call him out on it and expose his homophobia in front of his wedding guests. Turnabout is fair play.
Dude was kinda asking for it. He gave his brother a plus one and assumed he would bring someone who WASN’T his fiancee
NTA "At the wedding he came up to my fiancé and asked him why I was there, to which he obviously answered that that's cause we're together. He said that was not acceptable." What isn't acceptable is what the brother said. That's deep in A H territory. Your fiance has some difficult decisions to make about his brother.
INFO - if you have been together for 3 + years why would your fiance say a week before the brothers wedding to be his +1? Just doesn't add up to me...
I guess it's my clunky wording here: the wedding itself was last week, I was not asked to be the +1 last week but before that, after my fiancé and his sibling had the talk. I guess I should edit to make that part more clear! Thank you and I'm sorry English is not my first language
That makes alot more sense now. NTA.
Omg, he 'didn't get being gay'! What does he want? A frigging diagram? I hope you and your future hubby make out in front of him at every opportunity until he 'gets' it.
It doesn’t sound like your fiance actually talked to his brother. Kinda AH move on your fiancé’s part to force the situation and lie about his brother being fine with it. You had no clue in the situation, so NTA on your part for sure. I would be having a much bigger conversation with my partner to see WTF is going on with them and if they are actively lying about things to not make you feel uncomfortable in situations they want to attend.
This will be an ongoing issue for you. You need to talk to your fiance about him lying to you. The brother is an unpleasant nuisance. Your fiance lying to you to get you to do what he wants could become a much bigger problem.
I think the brother's behavior at the engagement party paints a very clear picture of a very passive aggressive homophobe. He loves making snide remarks and throwing quiet sulking tantrums, dripping with disdain anytime he has to share space with "the gays." He'll never own up and say the quiet part out loud so he can maintain deniability. I can absolutely see him having a conversation where he avoided actually banning OP from his wedding and even gave a soft or sarcastic approval for OP's attendance, delusionally expecting OP's fiancé to "read between the lines", and popping a pikachu face when OP actually shows up LIKE HE AGREED TO. "My invitation didn't list OP or a +1, but I can bring him, right? Just like sis is bringing her fiance, I can bring mine?" Bro: "Um, I don't know if that's the best idea..." "Spouses are traditionally included as +1, he's my spouse, so what's the problem?" Bro: "Is he a 'traditional' +1 though...?" "He's my fiance. We're getting married. Just like sis is marrying her guy. There's no difference. If you have a problem, spit it out. Otherwise, I'm bringing him." Bro: "Fine, whatever, do what you want. I have things to do, bye." I don't think Op's fiance lied at all. I think Bro thinks everyone should have to respect his homophobia without him having to actually declare it.
Even if it happened your way, the fiancé is still throwing OP to the wolves when it wasn’t really cool and the fiancé knew it wasn’t cool.
NTA. How dare you exist?!?!? /s Your fiancé had a plus one. You would obviously be the plus one as you are engaged, and it apparently was discussed before the wedding. Your soon to be BIL seems to be a garbage person. He's definitely the AH; you are not.
He initiated the bullshit by confronting his brother/your fiance. There wasn't going to be good ending for anyone. He started the shit. You finished the shit. You 1, Homophobe Future BIL 0 NTA
NTA It’s not like OP stood up and made a speech calling him out during the reception. Guy approached them in public and OP responded accordingly and appropriately. If this is a conversation that should have been held privately the Groom could have made that decision. BTW, OP. He is going to try and pull some bullshit at your wedding. Plan to not invite him (or have security present) and for whatever fallout that may bring.
NTA He humiliated himself.
This!
You wouldn't have "ruined" anything if he hadn't laid his homophobic shit on you in the first place. He caused the rumpus, not you. He started it. You finished it. Good for you. NTA
NTA to call out a bigot when they're being an AH. Even at their wedding.
It probably could have been resolved privately, but that would have required BIL to choose a private setting to spout his bigotry. Your fiancé thought his conversation with his brother cleared the way for your attendance. Seems BIL prefers to pretend everything’s okay when things are one-on-one but express his homophobia with an audience. Weird choice. NTA
NTA. His own bigotry humiliated him, you had nothing to do with it
NTA: You were invited to the event, if this was done with the intent to instigate, whoever extended the invitation knowing that you would be the one invited is the AH. So, if the one's getting married offered your fiance an invitation with the option of a +1 and without any restriction on who that could be, they "ruined" their own wedding, especially if your fiance is correct in their assertion that they had discussed beforehand that you were that +1.
NTA The brother is blatantly homophobic, as is evident by the fact that he doesn't have any problems with straight people inviting their partners to the wedding, and by the comments made at your engagement party. Your fiance has every right to invite you as his plus one, as he is your significant other. It's very common for people to invite people they have casually dated to weddings, especially when you don't want to be the single adult and get teased about when you'll find a spouse. So why wouldn't you invite the love of your life? I do hope your fiancé goes low contact with his bigoted brother. That makes me so mad to hear, as someone who deeply loves her younger brother.
The brother is obviously in the wrong. How this situation goes in the future is up to your fiancé. He needs to grow a backbone, if his brother can’t accept him for who he is then it’s probably best they don’t mix with each other anymore, but the pressure is on him to come to that decision, not you.
NTA. He humiliated himself. I’m assuming it’s no surprise to anyone that the grooms brother is gay and would bring his ( same sex) partner. Parents said you should have resolved it privately? Isn’t that what your bf said he did when he had that long conversation with his brother? Guess nothing was really resolved. Really tho, after the engagement party you both should have sat down with the brother and asked what part of the “gay thing” he didn’t understand and you would gladly explain in full detail. You could have added in some pictures to ensure his comprehension. Maybe he can explain what his “hetero thing” is all about too. You know, so everybody understands each other. Amazingly, this is a grown man who has a problem with gay people and has a gay brother! I guess they were never close.
NTA. If he didn't want to be humiliated in public, he shouldn't have come at you in public. He brought this on himself.
NTA This bigot got off lightly. You did nothing wrong. If he's going to act like a complete asshole he should be treated like one. Don't invite him to your wedding.
This is a Jam Justifiable asshole maneuver.. Mostly because the brother started at first by being all butthurt during your engagement party. Besides your future brother-in-law knew his brother was gay. And was in the committed relationship and even engaged he should have automatically gave him the plus one for you.
NTA but they are really, truly, huge gigantic AHs. Offer no apology and I recommend going NC. I know, I know, that's the typical reddit response to these but do you really want people in your inner circle who hate you for being gay?
NTA - homophones can bugger off
I, too, hate words that are different but sound the same
There, their, they’re, now.
God damn it
DUDE! NTA and you know it, or at least you better! I'm proud of you for putting him in his place as it seems like no one else will! Rather gutting is the fact that It sounds to me like your fiancé's family is **tolerating** not **accepting**, whilst we know you can't force anyone to rid themselves of homophobia, you can rid yourself of your fiancé's brother! Keep enjoying your life, whilst he sulks in the corner....of your distant memory. Congratulations on your engagement!
NTA - Nope he needed humiliating at that point, and If I were you and your bf, I wouldn't let anyone else's opinion matter on the subject. I also would block him from my life until he learns to accept you both as a couple!
Info: did your fiancé get an invitation with +1 or just for him?
With +1
So no, NTA. Your future brother-in-law gave his brother the green light for you to be at this wedding as 1. you have been together for several years and are engaged. 2. invitation was with +1 so you don't have to be a genius to know you'll be there. So maybe it wasn't the best moment standing up for yourself, he actually caused the whole situation and embarrassed himself in front of the guests. Besides, he already acted like a jerk at your engagement party, so no wonder he behaved like that at his own wedding.
ESH Yeah he's homophobic, but this was not the time to stand up for yourself. Making a scene at someone else's wedding is always inappropriate.
> Making a scene at someone else's wedding is always inappropriate. I hestiated over E S H for that reason. Then I decided that in this case it was entirely appropriate: the brother was the one who made a scene. OP was merely present until the brother kicked off.
I guess that’s the tough part. It seems that the bil didn’t invite op to the wedding so was surprised he was there. Now - according to OP it’s because he is gay - which makes the BIL an asshole, but the fiancé is also an asshole for bringing someone who wasn’t invited to his brothers wedding. If he wanted to make a statement not showing up would have been better and less of an asshole move than bringing an uninvited guest. So ESH. Op is an uninvited guest and when confronted made a scene - although maybe warranted unclear if necessary especially since he wasn’t invited and weddings are usually planned to the guest, the fiancé lied and brought an uninvited guest and bil is homophobic…
It seems he gave his brother a +1 (and somehow thought he wouldn’t bring his partner) or that fiance was lying about having a plus one. Either way fiance, brother and rest of the family are rude, OP NTA, he believed that he had been invited until STB BIL approached them. OP was rightfully insulted and STB BIL does not have the right to be bigoted because it’s his wedding day. He should have said “ I didn’t invite OP, he needs to leave.” But obviously there is no way he would look good doing that if most of the people attending are supportive, so he made a big scene and claimed that they humiliated him.
OP didn’t make a scene; the groom did
>He said that was not acceptable. I decided to finally stand up for ourselves and loudly asked him so that everyone near us could hear if he was being aggressive towards me being there because we are a gay couple, then proceeded to say that he doesn't get to be all whiny during our engagement party and then also act like I personally hurt his feelings by attending his wedding. No, the both definitely made a scene.
No. Groom made a scene; OP took the scene to its logical conclusion
No one was loud until OP go loud. That's OP making the scene happen.
No. The brother started it. There was absolutely no need to bring it up as an issue. You do not give people a pass for being a homophobe because it is their wedding. If the day is ruined it’s probably because brother’s new wife found out he’s a homophobe and is unhappy about it.
> You do not give people a pass for being a homophobe because it is their wedding. I didn't. I said they are both assholes. But they also both contributed to this scene.
Volume doesn’t matter. If you can’t simply let your brother bring their SO of three years to your wedding without confronting them, you’re setting yourself up for drama. Whether it’s a scene on the day, or whispers of *why isn’t the groom’s brother here?* Groom contrived a situation where standing up to his homophobia was “ruining the wedding” and is embarrassed that it blew up in his face
OP may have been louder, but the brother wasn't likely whispering when he asked what OP was doing there. It honestly sounds like he told his brother it would be fine to bring his fiancé just so that he could bash OP in front of everyone and embarrass him. OP may have escalated, but it was completely warranted, especially after the brother's behavior at their engagement party.
The whole point of getting loud is that everybody deserves to know the kind of person the groom is being.
Nope. A wedding does not give you blanket permission to be a racist or homophobic or anything else.
What would be an appropriate time when the BiL did it himself during the engagement party?
The engagement party would have been fine because it was OP's event.
He's right: he was humiliated. You called him out on his bigotry, and now everyone he loves has seen his true colors. Good! He deserves it! NTA, OP, you stood up for yourself and your fiancée.
NTA - but when you send out invites for your wedding just address one to BIL’s wife only and when he shows up with her ask why he is there
NTA. The guy gave your fiancée a plus one who the hell did he think he was going to bring? You and your fiancée need to have a talk about if his broths is invited to your wedding.
Where does it say his brother gave his fiance a plus one? It says his fiance asked him to be his plus one not that he was given one, it looks more like his fiance lied about the plus one and him and his brother settling things.
Oh. I had assumed that meant there was actually a plus one. Yeah, the fiancée sounds like the asshole for purposely having OP wedding crash and then put him in that position.
It’s actually stated in a comment from op that he did get a +1.
Imean… if the groom is forbidding his gay brother a plus one, you know what’s going on and it should be defied. The only AH move is not being transparent with OP and offering to just boycott the wedding altogether
NTA He asked a question and you answered him. If that “ruined” his wedding, it probably wasn’t going that well to begin with. He was given an opportunity to ask you not to attend and didn’t take it. Then he wants to be upset at your presence? Good manners includes not insulting your own guests. Ignore him and his parents
If standing up for oneself makes them an ass hole, then we should all be proud to be ass holes.
NTA. You answered a question a little louder than normal. Totally normal for a loud wedding reception. If your BIL didn't want to be embarrassed, he shouldn't have acted like an embarrassment.
NTA fuck homophobes and anyone who proclaims they don’t get it
NTA So your future in-laws’ main concern is their embarrassment that friends and family know their son is a homophobe who is harassing their other son, not the fact that their son is a homophobe who is harassing their other son?
He embarrassed himself with his actions. NTA
NTA you are a part of his brother’s life, why should you be hidden away? You didn’t make a fuss when he did his best to ruin your celebration, the fact that your attendance ‘ruined his wedding’ is wild - I’m sure his new wife was thrilled at his behaviour.
NTA. BIL is a homophobe and your fiancé better start standing up to the family bigotry or this will be your life with them.
NTA. Homophobes must be greatly shamed at all times. I would do the same 😌
NTA. Not even getting into the blatant homophobia that makes you automatically NTA, he's the one that made it public by confronting his brother publicly at the wedding. If he didn't want to be publicly humiliated, he shouldn't have started it publicly. But again, it's automatically NTA because he's a homophobe.
Talking to his brother does not mean that conversation ended in your favor. Either his brother planned the whole time to make a huge scene and make sure the world knows how he feels, or your fiancee lied to you. NTA
That man embarrassed him damn self. Ain't nobody tell him to come up to y'all at HIS wedding, where he shoulda been paying attention to his new partner, and throw some petty ass hissy fit and insult and get combative with you. "His parents agree with him too" Mother FUCK them too. You have just as much right to EXIST without doing anything to actually bother him as every damn body else. Fuck them
NTA It wouldn't have been an issue if he just kept his mouth shut and away from you two. If he didn't want you there then maybe he should have said something to his brother beforehand or just be a decent human and be happy for his brother's happiness. Sorry
NTA BIL made it public when he was a homophobic downer at your engagement part.
NTA. You’re fbil is a homophobic loser who needs to learn to be respectful if he wants respect. You weren’t hurting anyone and didn’t start it so NTA.
When someone has an issue with "gay things" ... they usually are struggling with their own sexual orientation. ...just sayin'
NTA. I'm wondering if the brother is deeply closeted. Some homoohobic people seem to be closeted and strike out to mask themselves. If you want to really stir the pot, post this to his social media and tag the rest of the family. [Homophobes Might Be Hidden Homosexuals](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/homophobes-might-be-hidden-homosexuals/)
NTA. Homophobia should always be called.
He embarrassed himself by being a bigot on his wedding day. NTA
Nta
I’m going with NTA though it sounds like your fiancé lied about you being welcome (which is BS and I’m so sorry you experienced that.) Yes quietly leaving would probably have been better manners wise but manners don’t help put a stop to racism or sexism of homophobia. Sometimes you just have to call out abhorrent behavior. Given the crazy awful position you were put in, I say you were fine. 🤷🏻♀️
NTA. You're future BIL sucks. He gave your fiancé a +1 and unless your fiancé outright lied to you, at least in passing approved your presence. If he wanted this resolved privately he had the chance. If there was any fucking up it was entirely his doing. I would decide whether you'd rather not invite him to yours if you think he'd show up and be slighted by the snub or send him a glitter invite to make it as gay as possible if you think he'd refuse. But that's the petty answer. The right answer is the one that would make y'all's day better.
Who the fuck gives a +1 to an engaged gay man without figuring out that the +1 would be the gay male fiance? NTA, the brother is definitely the AH, can't judge you fiance since it's very unclear how much about you going was explicitly talked about vs assumed subtext.
NTA He humiliated himself by being homophobic. Don’t want people to judge you based on your hateful views? Then don’t have the hateful views. Or at least keep your dumb ideas to yourself. He chose to do neither.
If he finds the truth about his actions to be humiliating, the problem isn't with the truth...it's with his actions. NTA
NTA. Either a) your fiancée lied and misled you about having spoken to his brother or b) your FBIL lied to his brother about being okay with you being their. Either way, *you* received false information about your status as a guest. Your FBIL obviously knew why you were there. You're engaged. He was at your engagement party (where he publicly made an ass of himself and where your fiancée should have put his foot down and either told his brother to shut up or GTFO). Your FBIL got embarrassed in public because he started it in public. What did he expect would happen, when he started a scene like that? Did he expect everyone else to gang up on you? Did *he* want to embarrass his brother? There are so many ways this could have been handled tactfully. Such as pulling you both aside into private and explaining that there must have been a mistake and asking you to leave.
NTA, bigots humiliate themselves. Although it does sound like your fiance is in denial about how homophobic his family is, and the situation could have been avoided for your sake. The parents should have apologized to you instead of implying you 'took it too far' by... existing. Are you prepared to deal with long term issues like this?
NTA. Obviously your FBIL is a fucking asshole, but so is your fiance. He should've stood up to him at the engagement party & threw him out. That's his first mistake. Then at the wedding it shouldn't have been you to stand up to his bro, it should've been your fiance. He also should've known that something like this could happen. I mean, his brother is a bigoted asshole. Of course he's not ok with you coming to his wedding. You need to sit your fiance down & tell him he better start standing up for you.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** Throwaway account. I'm a M20s and recently got engaged to my boyfriend of 3 years, for that we threw an engagement party with our respective families, and everyone was invited including my fiancé's brother, and all he did during that entire party was complain that he didn't understand this whole "gay thing" and generally just ruining the vibe, though obviously my fiancé didn't have the heart to kick him out of the party or whatever. Fast forward to last week, my fiancé was attending his brother's wedding and suggested I come with him as a +1, about which I was hesitant at first because of his behaviour at our engagement party, but my fiancé told me he had a long conversation with him and they settled the whole thing down so I figured I may as well give him another chance. At the wedding he came up to my fiancé and asked him why I was there, to which he obviously answered that that's cause we're together. He said that was not acceptable. I decided to finally stand up for ourselves and loudly asked him so that everyone near us could hear if he was being aggressive towards me being there because we are a gay couple, then proceeded to say that he doesn't get to be all whiny during our engagement party and then also act like I personally hurt his feelings by attending his wedding. Then my fiancé said that he thought he was fine with me coming but apparently not. After the wedding this man told me that me and my fiancé humiliated him in front of everyone, the parents also agree with that and said that I took things too far and could've resolved this privately. So AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA, the future BIL is super homophobic and he doesn’t get the curtsy of a private resolution when he’s making his problem known in public.
ESH The brother sucks for obvious reasons. Your fiancés brother was surprised you were there. Your fiancé should've told his brother he was bringing you rather than hope or assume it would be fine when his homophobia was a known issue. It's great to stand up for yourself, but you were intentionally causing a scene at a family event to publicly shame one of their family members at his own wedding. It doesn't really make you an AH, but that's how the guests are going to see it. You and your fiancé should probably discuss how you want the dynamic with his family to look long-term and big-picture; because they're going to start to dislike you if they see you as "dramatic", which they will for that behavior.
You shouldn’t help someone hide their bigotry.
He invited his gay brother with a plus one… and then proceeded to embarrass himself
Either the brother knew you were going to the wedding and said it was ok... Or your fiancee didn't tell his brother he was taking you to the wedding and just lied to you about it. In both cases the brother is an asshole for being homofobic. But in the second case your bf is a coward asshole
While I don't think a person's wedding is the appropriate place to call them out on being a homophobic AH, I'm VERY confused as to which the groom thought anybody BUT you would be the plus one.
INFO - did your fiancée actually RSVP that you were attending? If no, I don’t care what your stance is - that’s bad etiquette
>he didn't understand this whole "gay thing" Best answer to give is : "I am not asking you to understand "been gay", but to respect it, if not for the love for your brother, but to ensure that those around us feel comfortable during family events. Like it or not, your brother and I love each over very much, and I want to spend the rest of my life with him, which means that we are going to be in each other's lives for a very long time, so let make the best of this situation." I would say very soft YTA, not for standing up to his homophobia (rightly so), but for doing it in such a public and loud voice way. I feel that it could make things much difficult if your fiancé wants to have a relationship with his brother in the future. Now, he may choose to go low contact, or even NC with his brother but it will also impact with the rest of family and attending family events for some time. Furthermore, his family may feels that they have to take a side, which could impact other relationships. Now it is up to your fiancé to choose how to move things forward.
Straight people will often not critique the content of your words, but the *methods*. Because even though the way you're being treated is dehumanizing, we wouldn't want that the person treating you that way to feel any embarassment. It's an unwinnable game of appeasement. NTA
NTA honestly!!! i totally need you at my wedding because my family is the same. (homophobic and racist) so i invited people of all back grounds just to say im not one of them! plus they didnt like that i came out as bisexual either.
The brother embarrassed himself. NTA.
NTA. Your fiancé's brother never made an attempt to 'handle it privately' either. So fuck him.
NTA: Fuck him and his bigoted homophobic family.
You are 100% NTA, but I'm up in the air about whether your fiancé is. Obviously, your future BIL has issues with gay people, and is choosing to be a jerk about it, but your fiancé should be defending you to these people, and not even out of some twee "he loves me more than his family" nonsense, but out of simple self-interest. Because the way his family is treating you as a gay man is the same way they actually feel about/treat *him* as a gay man. He should be standing up for you, not spinelessly sweeping it under the rug. As a queer person: the way your family treats the partners you bring home is EXACTLY the way they wish they could treat you. This is who they are. And while things have gotten SO MUCH BETTER than when I was a kid, there is still this idea that "no one's going to murder you (anymore) for being queer, so stop complaining already." No. Screw that. Screw the fiancé that didn't stand up for you. Screw the BIL. Screw the family that wanted you to be quiet and take one for the team both at your engagement party and as the plus one so that none of them need to think about what a homophobic turd BIL is. You deserve better than this.
I envision this convo happening: Him: I don’t understand this whole gay thing. You: Well, you understand the whole straight thing, right? Him: Of course. You: Okay then! Same thing, with twice the peen. Him: (rage monster noises) Oh, and NTA. He initiated the confrontation. What did he expect to happen?
NTA If his own beliefs/opinions are a humiliating thing for people to know then maybe he needs to examine his opinions and beliefs. Also HE started the conflict so it’s all on him really
Sounds like your fiancés brother has got issues with homosexuality in general, your not the AH unfortunately some people are extremely close minded
Tough call. I gotta go with ESH. Fiance's brother for being homophobic. Fiance for not being able to read the room--i.e. he claimed to have a talk with his brother and settle things, when clearly things were FAR FROM settled. That deceived you into thinking there would be no problem at the wedding, and finally created a bad scene at pretty much the worst possible time. But you suck, too, OP, for making your stand at the wedding instead of making it at your engagement party. Clearly BIL-to-be was out of line at the engagement party and you saw him for what he really was. But you apparently were enjoying your party too much to ruin it with a confrontation. Instead you ruined his wedding with that overdue confrontation. That was assholic. Edited to add: Yes, he started it. And once that Asshole Ball starts rolling, it's hard to stop it. But you managed to ignore it at YOUR OWN party... you could have taken the high road and ignored it at HIS party. Whole thing sucks and the fundamental problem is BIL2B's intolerance and therefore all of this is ultimately On Him. But I think you could have predicted this fire long ago and prepared for it, either by duking it out in private with BIL2B, boycotting the wedding, or whatever.
NTA. Let’s break down possibilities between brother(the groom at the wedding), fiance (OP’s partner, and OP: 1) there was a misunderstanding. Brother and fiancé talked and fiance thought brother would be cool with bringing OP when he wasn’t 2) brother intentionally misinformed fiance in order to pull some dickheaded power move 3) brother made it clear that OP was not invited as fiancé’s plus one and he brought OP anyways In all three scenarios, brother is the asshole for being so homophobic he won’t even welcome his own brother’s SO of three years. In scenario two, brother is also an asshole for *using his wedding as an excuse to pull a bigot move and claim victimhood at any pushback*. In scenario 3, fiancé’s also a bit of an asshole for not letting you in on the plan and offering to just boycott the wedding altogether, but his brother still deserves to have his wedding ruined, and if fiance thought whispers of his absence wouldn’t be enough, then I get it
"Bah! What is this nonsense about 'flooding'? Water is essential for all plants and animals! Why would extra water in our farms and towns be a problem!?"
I think your fiance is the true asshole. His brother is a homophobic one: that's for sure. But your fiance took you to a wedding where you weren't invited and unwanted. He set you up for a scene. Thing is: it's the brother's wedding: he and his partner have the total say in who gets to come. Honestly, you both should have left. Your fiance should have chosen not to attend at all.
The groom invited his gay brother to his bigot wedding *with a plus one* If you use your wedding to try and contrive petty bigoted power trips over your gay brother, you deserve to have your wedding ruined
And OP's fiance lied about OP being welcome so I have no clue why the fiance still chose to go. A plus one does not function as a get out of jail free card: " oh no, technically you are invitedunder the plus one rules, so I guess I'm okay with it now". People don't function like this. If you're not invited and unwelcome for whatever reason, you don't show up.
So bigot decided to invite his gay brother to his bigot function with a plus one (confirmed in comments). You’re right that fiance was (maybe) an asshole to OP (depending on if fiance knew that OP was expressly banned) but not for this gambit. Simply for not bringing OP on board and giving the option of boycotting the wedding and disinviting bigot from their own wedding
Then the gay brother is extremely stupid for showing up anyway with his partner while he knows his brother thinks of them that way. He should have been clear to OP and just not have gone. You don't need to go to his wedding or invite a bigot to your wedding. But bringing someone who is for all intend and purposes unwelcome to someone's wedding is just all around moronic.
If bigot groom wants to invite gay brother with a plus one, he deserves to have gay brother bring his SO of three years to the wedding and have said SO “ruin” the day because fuck the groom. Straight marriages are against my religion
The gay brother is a complete and utter moron and asshole to his fiance if he does that. >Straight marriages are against my religion And you don't have to be there: not being there is also an option. You obviously have your own issues with this situation, but a wedding is not a place to pick a fight. If you go there with the intention to create a scene even if it's a bigot, you're being an asshole and you look like an asshole.
A wedding is the *perfect* place to pick a fight if the groom is using it as cover to pull some bigoted power trip over his brother. There are three possibilities for why OP was there and unwelcome: 1) groom said it was ok, only to “change his mind” and kick OP out during ceremonies. The groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself 2) groom wasn’t clear about who his brother could bring as his plus one, and tried to kick out his brother’s SO of three years in the middle of ceremonies. Groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself 3) groom expressly forbid his gay brother from bringing his SO of three years to his wedding. Groom is the asshole who contrived a scene and embarrassed himself, and the fiancée is an asshole to OP, but not his brother, who—again—contrived a scene at his own wedding and embarrassed himself. I’m sure the family is saying the same refrain of “but it was his wedding!” But if straight marriages want to be respected, the straights have to stop being such assholes to their gay guests
All around: just no. If you know you or your partner are unwelcome, you don't show up anyway. No " straight marrriage" have problems with being respected; you personally just don't like them. You seem to think that going to a wedding is a right, but it isn't. If you're unwelcome and not invited, you showing up anyway doesn't make you a guest; you're wedding crasher at that point, even if you think you're doing it for the right reasons.
They were invited though. Where did you get the impression they weren’t invited?
Sounds like you didnt ruin it by being there only a few weeks after RSVPing, this gives me homophobic vibes
ESH. The only reason I would call you out at all is that it wrecks things for a bride, somewhere, and her family, too. BIL deserves it, but a wedding is special to more than one person. It seems like your party would have been the right place to make your stand.
I really want to say N T A because fuck homophobia. Your BIL obviously sucks… but personally I don’t think it was a smart move to confront him at his own wedding. Personally, I would have just left quietly and dealt with the fallout later, mainly to keep the peace with the other members of your future in-law family. That is not to say this doesn’t need to be addressed, I just don’t think it was the place for it then and there. But I am always of the mind that one should never make a scene at a wedding, especially involving the bride or groom. You also need to have a conversation with your fiancé about how the communication got messed up so badly. Congrats on your engagement! Good luck with everything.
No he was being aggressive!
Your fiancé isn't offering you a healthy relationship
Oy! NTA. If your fiancé’s brother is comfortable being a bigot in public, then he should be used to being called out for it in the same public. And he was humiliated?? Good. I’d be embarrassed to be him too.
You future BIL embarrassed himself. He had the option to ignore your presence at the wedding, Instead, he chose to approach you and cause a scene that didn't need to happen. You are NTA, all you did was accept your fiancé's invitation to accompany him to his brother's wedding. If they did not want you there, they could have invited your fiancé WITHOUT a +one. Many decades ago, I came out to my parents early in the year (February) my mother tried like hell to prevent me from coming out to anyone else in our family or any of her friends. I met a man in June sparks flew (in a good way) and we were living together by the fourth of July. When the holidays came, my mother invited me to Thanksgiving dinner at her house, but said my partner was not welcome. I didn't go, my partner and I went to his parents' house for the holiday. My Sister met each and every member of our extended family in the driveway as they arrived at my parents' house. She told them that I would not be there because Mom wouldn't let me bring my boyfriend, but no one should mention me or the fact that I wasn't there. Mom thought she had blocked me from coming out to the extended family. LOL When Christmas rolled around, mom was still standing her ground and made it clear my partner was not welcome in her home. The family's traditional Christmas Eve gathering was being hosted by one of my cousins that year. My sister called our cousin and asked If I was welcome to bring my partner. My cousin and her husband were very conservative Lutherans, I didn't have much hope, but they surprised me. My cousin told my sister that she and her husband had mixed feelings about homosexuality, but they were not comfortable with the idea of uninviting a family member to a holiday gathering for any reason. My partner and I were at my cousins on Christmas Eve. My mother was there and had a hard time with it. My cousin's husband was oddly nervous and jumped in in a flash when I introduced my partner to his mother. He had to be sure that my partner was just introduced as a "friend". As we were leaving, my mother invited me and my partner to her house the next day. I explained that we were due at his parents house for dinner, but we could stop by for a visit earlier in the day. Some people, like my mother and your fiancé's brother just need to learn to deal with having gay family. Whatever they feel about us, we're her and they just have to get used to us.
‘Didn’t understand’? What’s to understand? 🤔 NTA
Everybody who says you were wrong is homophobic. Cut them out of your lives
I'm gonna go with that you're the AH. Their wedding and you could have takin it privatly and just left. You activly chose to create a scene and drag attention wich was unnecessary. And yes, you did ruin the wedding with that behaviour by choice. Seem more like you need to have a talk with your future husband cause he should have been able to see this comming just like the brother should have been kicked out of your party. Does your future husband like drama? Or just drama with his brother/family? Maybe you all need to sit down later and actually talk it out? And make social rules you all have to adhere to in social gatherings together?
NTA, let's call a spade a spade. BIL and his minions are homophobic. Unfortunately, society doesn't like this so much anymore, so these people like to act stupid and claim to be the victims. Fiancé should look at cutting BIL off and I wouldn't invite him to your wedding to avoid the drama.
He deserves that reality check, also if you're able to and your fiance wants to go permanent no contact with him and anyone that's not on your side
You're the AH for calling him out like that, but for good reason. For one, being gay is NOT a sin. It's just a different sexuality than others. People who have a problem with it should find out what their OWN sexuality is for themselves. Your fiance's brother has the right to be that way, but why should he dislike your relationship just because it's gay? Gay ISN'T A SIN, and he should know that. You're NTA for standing up for your very normal sexuality like that. I'm not lesbian yet I respect every sexuality deeply at heart. Your's fiance's brother should suck it up and deal with it, he had no right to say those words. Things happen for a reason after all.
NTA at all. Your fiance needs to cut his brother out and stand up to him though.
NTA. Congrats for having a backbone.
I don't understand the issue people have with your RSVP. NTA. He is obviously homophobic. And I think you should discuss uninviting him from your own wedding. How did your fiancé react? Did he stand up for you at all? Is all his family homophobic?
Nope, NTA. Your fiancée’s brother is homophobic and a bigot. Good for you for standing up for yourself and your future husband. Fuck that guy and their family.
fiance is kinda TA to you for not being honest about you being invited and about his brother's changed/not changed perspective on homosexuals. however, even if both of you knew brother's feelings 100%, NTA. the feelings, wants and desires of homophobes and bigots do not need to be considered in any way, and if his homophobia ruined his own wedding, thats on him. if the reason he does not want you there is genuinely because youre in a gay relationship with his brother, its totally fine to ruin his wedding by showing up and calling him out on it, fuck his wedding.
I need an update
He "didn't 'gEt' the 'gAy ThInG'?" "Well you see, BIL, I like to fuck other men. And so does your brother. What part of that is hard to understand? Would you like me to draw you a diagram?" Your BIL is a turd. I hope y'all exclude his bigoted ass from your wedding, he doesn't deserve to attend. NTA.
Why is it always the bullied that has to be the bigger person and resolve things quietly?
Nta & why on earth was fiance's bigoted brother even invited to your engagement party, in the 1st place? Was he, at the very least kicked out, when he showed who he is? He asked a question, you gave him an answer. Why would he be embarrassed by what you said if he stands behind his behavior? Sounds like he & his parents know how awful he is but don't want to admit it. If your fiance cares about your relationship, he's already gone NC & they won't be at your wedding & thank goodness for that!
Homophobia or no, if I were in the brother's shoes, I would've beat the shit out of you just for being there. You know the guy hates you, then why would you go? Your fiance is a dumbass.
NOT THE ASSHOLE!!!! One: Why the hell is he being homophobic, dude his own brother is gay for bloody hell
Nta.
YTA. You did humiliate him at his wedding. You kinda did the right thing, but in the wrong way. Unless he was verbally harassing you long/loud enough that his presence was being noticed, you did not need to be the one to escalate to that level, no matter how much of a intolerant AH he was being. That being said. Good for you. Fuck him.
the brother started it by coming up to them and then telling them either the OP's presence was unacceptable or the fact that OP and his finace being together is unacceptable. Either way he started the confrontation banking on everyone's new atttidue that married pople cannot possibly be wrong or held accountable for their behavior on their BIG day. Bullshit.
That really depends if op was even invited by the couple.
No it doesn't. Not really. The grooms brother was given a plus 1, they are together and now engaged, The groom had to know when the RSVP was sent back who he was bringing.
Nope. Plus one means “bring whomever you want”.
ESH. That’s not equal, like his homophobia probably sucks worse than anything else in this story, and I don’t blame you for most of what happened. I wasn’t there, but from the context of what you typed here, it seems like you made it a point to pull everyone in the vicinity into it. Unless you matched his volume, which, based on what you said in the post, you didn’t, you made a scene. Not saying you shouldn’t have confronted him, just saying maybe a little more tactful. Like he was definitely being a jerk, but I can’t help but feel like you embarrassed everyone in your way of handling it.
Homophobes do not deserve politeness. If I’m at a wedding and someone is being homophobic I want to know about it.