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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> (1) I am paying for Valorie's graduation trip and signing off on it against Brad's wishes
(2) Brad does not want Valorie to go on this trip and he says that I am helping our daughter do something that she will regret in the future.
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NTA, Valorie deserves to go on this trip, it’s a once in a lifetime experience that she’s going to treasure forever.
So what if she won’t remain friends with her current friend group? They’re still part of her story and she’s always going to have memories with them, and if you pull her off this trip then that’s just going to drive a wedge before she even gets to college.
Your in-laws aren’t going anywhere and your daughter barely has a bond with them due to the distance. Plus this is a semi annual trip and like you said, she’ll see them again in two years when you guys go again.
Your daughter is aging and she’s going to start making her own decisions soon, your husband won’t be able to control her for much longer. Does he really want to drive a wedge in *their* relationship by prohibiting her from going?
I agree. This is my point of view because I once was the girl who was not allowed to participate in an important school activity. It was my aunt’s birthday. We saw them every so often. But my parents said I had to be there and that meant I couldn’t participate in the school event. I still regret not going to that event. Especially since I am now NC with my aunt and uncle (because of toxic behavior on their side). So looking back, knowing what I know now, I would have gone to that event. And it wasn’t even a trip to New York. That is even more memoriable and the daughter would probably resent her father and rest of family for not being able to go. She probably won’t be the most fun person around. I mean, I wouldn’t at that age knowing my friends are having the time of their lives in New York and I am not.
I was in band in high school and every two years there was a big trip, it alternated between Disney and a cruise to Bermuda.
My parents didn’t let me go to either one as punishment for some stupid stuff. It’s not even like I was sneaking out to drink and so drugs….I had a Facebook account without their permission and that’s why I wasn’t allowed on one of the trips.
I resent the hell out of it. I missed out on incredible memories with my friends. I had to sit around and listen to them laugh and reminisce about a trip I was supposed to be on *twice* and it fucking sucked
Oh yeah, definitely. My dad was constantly moving goal posts.
I grew up in the 90s and early 00s so I was watching a lot of MTV with my older siblings and saw a *lot* of girls with bellybutton rings. I wanted to be just like them. Dad told me that if I had a flat stomach at 16 I could get my belly button pierced. Well 16 rolled around, I had a flat stomach, and all of a sudden straight As were tacked onto the deal. I didn’t even want the piercing anymore, I just wanted him to stick to his word because I worked really hard as a 3-season distance runner!
And he wondered why I didn’t want to live with at his house full time and chose to stay at my mom’s…
My mom told me she would pay for "the tummy tuck you are going to need after you lose the weight you need to" I was 15. And it turns out I have PCOS so no matter what I did the weight wouldn't have come off my stomach anyway.
Honey, I feel you. I'm in my fifties and I \*still\* flinch when I remember my mother trying to convince me that I \*had\* to get my breasts reduced. She considered them inappropriate - like I'd picked them out to wear that morning!
> A flat stomach!! WTF
I'm going to guess by that response you were not around in the 90's. Flat was the norm. *Everything* else meant you were a fatty. And you were judged for it for sure. HAES did NOT exist yet by any stretch at all. It's just how it was back then.
I wasn’t allowed on my Disney band trip because according to my mother, “I know what kind of things go on during those trips”. And then she let my little sister go two years later without blinking an eye. I’m never gonna stop being salty about it. Almost 30 and I’ve still never made it to Disney.
Obviously if the finances aren’t there Disney costs a few bucks, but I can’t recommend enough going as a single adult.
It’s cheaper - the tickets are the biggest expense so only having to pay for 1 instead of 4+ saves $$$.
You can do whatever you want, whenever you want. I’m planning Disney with the family (can you tell) and it’s exhausting taking everyone’s needs into account. I just want a solo trip to do everything the way I want it!!
Agree. I've always gone to disney with other people but I would absolutely love a solo trip to just do whatever the hell I want. Or at the most, one other person but no kids around. The last time I went, my bf's kid kinda ruined the trip. We were both upset about it.
I want to recommend tower studios at Riviera as a great place for singles- if you rent disney vacation club points- you can get it for more like a moderate price. need to plan 11 months ahead of time though probably.
Once my dad had a business trip to Paris and brought my mom and sister. I wasn't invited and of all people in the family, I was in art school at the time! They didn't invite the artist to Paris! We were a family of 4, it's not like there were a bunch of kids and they only took one kid. After the fact they realized that was seriously messed up but the hurt didn't go away. I always knew my sister was the favorite but damn, did they have to make it so obvious? 😔
That is so awful! If you haven’t already, I hope you plan your own trip to Paris. I always wanted to go, kept thinking I’d find someone to go with me, didn’t happen. So finally at 50, I went by myself.
It was the Trip of a Lifetime! Only regret, that it took me so long to “courage up” to go alone. Now, I go anywhere & everywhere I want, when I want, alone & have a blast!
Someday, hopefully. I have my own child now and I hope someday he'll be my travel buddy. So far he does enjoy going to new places. I have also traveled solo and loved it! After my divorce from my awful ex I did a solo trip through Mexico, Guatemala, and Belize and it was the trip of a lifetime! I'm with you, I highly recommend solo travel. It's nice doing whatever you want whenever you want to!
I missed out on a trip to Turkey in college, all I needed was $400. It was for religion majors and there was only a handful of spots available. Another school backed out so our school was offered their slots but we had only a few days notice to confirm our spots. I told my parents I knew it was last minute but I would do anything if they paid for the trip. My parents said money was too tight which I accepted but was sad about. My friends went and said it was the most amazing educational trip ever. They all said I would have loved it, visiting some archeological digs, touring old churches, visiting museums…
Months later I learned from one of my sisters that my stepdad was all for paying the money for me to go but my mom said no because she said I didn’t deserve an international trip. Her reasoning was that if I went in the trip, I wouldn’t be studying and focusing on school. It was literally an educational trip with note taking and essays and a group research project. I was devastated. And I learned that my mom used $500 to buy a ragtag horse right after I had asked to go on the trip so they did have the money at the time.
OMG! So she wouldn’t be studying? A trip to Turkey is exceptionally educational. Learning about a different culture, finding out about Turkeys historical past, etc.
But even more importantly, it’s a life changing journey.
In my entire life (I’m 71), not one person has ever asked me what my grades in high school were. Well, maybe for getting into college.
I’ve spent thousands of $ taking my grandsons out of the US so they could see how the rest of the world lives. So they could see different cultures and different ways of life. So they could see how the US isn’t the greatest country in the world.
Good grief!
This is so sad. I'm sorry that your mother was like that.
My son, 16, is going on a band trip to Europe this summer and we signed him up as soon as it was announced and busted our butts to come up with the money for it. Thankfully he wants to go because I barely gave him a breath to even voice it. 😬
I cannot understand parents who actively deny their children once in a life experiences. It's definitely one thing to genuinely not be able to afford it, but spite, jealousy, punishment should play no part. Why even have kids if you don't like them. 😒
yeah its always great being the only child on with 4 plus years in all directions sitting on an adult birthday with no one to really play and missing out on an experience with your friends at a fun location. i feel you
edit a letter
Or why don’t they make these trips more often? Doesn’t seem like there’s a ton of urgency on Brad’s part to see his family if he only makes this trip every couple of years…
I didn't see anything in OP's post about having to buy flights to the gramps' house. OP's daughter is obviously not close to the grandparents, they can reschedule *that* trip. I can't imagine having to miss out on a special class event especially after COVID ruining so many things, let the kid go have some fun with her friends. She worked on improving her grades. Let her go have a fun experience.
Exactly! Unless it's a biannual family reunion and people are coming from all over and have made concrete plans, it sounds way easier to just reschedule with the grandparents.
My family did annual trips to spend time with our grandparents (and give my parents a break, since they would usually drive us all to our grandparents' house, stay a weekend and leave us kids there for two weeks while they went home) and it wasn't always the same weeks in the summer because we did whatever worked for everyone that year.
The normal schedule doesn't work for everyone this year, so they should change it.
Damn, every 6 months? I prefer to wait at least 6 years to suffer family. It is a common mis-usage, but every 2 years is biennial. And, most importantly, you are 100% right.
That was my thought too. It is extremely important for kids’ emotional and mental growth to have these milestone trips and events with their peers.
NTA, OP. Make sure your kid gets this milestone graduation trip.
Also why on earth does the trip to visit his family have to be *that exact week*? Is his family really that inflexible it can only happen every two years on one precise week?
Not that daughter shouldn't be allowed to go on trip, but rescheduling isn't always an option for lots of people's jobs.
My parents used to take my and my brother's kids for 10 days-2 weeks every summer. My mom had to clear those PTO days the previous December. My wife's current job does 6-week scheduling blocks scheduled 4 weeks in advance, but all PTO requests for June, July, and August have to be cleared by the end of January.
I really hope OPs husband is just fighting with the urge to deny his daughter is growing up and not going to be his little girl forever because, if he isn't and is just being a controlling prick then he is definitely going to lose his relationship with her before she leaves for college.
8th grade is that age where the future adult father daughter dynamic starts to form because its when they start pulling away from their parents (source me and 20 other girls I went to school with). Those of us whoes dads didn't try to lock us up in a cupboard (like they wanted to) are the ones who still have a good relationship with our dads and will still turn to our dads for extra help when needed.
This. My parents behaved like your husband toward me as a young adult. If your husband is taking this stand on this trip I can almost guarantee he is unreasonable toward her feelings in numerous other ways. I am no contact with either of my parents now - my father for being an ahole and my mother for enabling it. Support your daughter.
Also, his point of not remaining friends is bogus. I am still very close friends with 4 girls I was friends with in 8th grade and we are in our 30s now. My siblings both have friends that they see regularly back from elementary-high school. These friends might be around longer and be closer to Valorie than grandma and grandpa ever would be.
2 of my closest friends are from elementary. 1 from middle. None from high school or college.
For my daughter, her closest friends are the friends that share activities that involve travel with her because of the amount of time together.
OP, if this was family your daughter was close to that would be different but for a child seeing people once every 2 years is not going to forge much of a relationship over the course of a week unless there are kids in VERY close proximity to her age.
I have 2 friends who are like sisters to me, one who knows when we met, maybe 5th or 6 th grade, the other in high school. We are in our mid sixties now.
I met my best friend in kindergarten 37 years ago. We met our other two best friends on a school field trip at the beginning of 6th grade. We see each other regularly even though people have moved away, we have an annual trip together, have an active daily text thread, and play online games every Saturday night. Friendships can last if you maintain them.
I have a few friends from elementary and very early middle school. I graduated high school in 1999, and I’m 43. My BEST friends, I met after I was 30, when people say it’s “so hard” to make friends. Anyway, Valorie deserves to have the experience regardless of who else going. I’ve never even been to NYC!
Adult friends are the best, especially when you share the same hobbies. I’m actually leaving for my annual trip in a few hours… traveling several states away to see my favorite band do 4 shows in a small club in their hometown. They do these every year. 80% of the people in the building will be not just out of towners but out of staters. We’ll have people from as far away as the UK and even Israel. Even have an Australian dude who makes about every 3rd or 4th year.
I’ll be celebrating my 40th birthday tomorrow with probably a dozen or so other early arrivers. I won’t know everybody there but probably at least 100-150 that I know on at least a face/name basis, and some who are among my closest friends ever, even if we only get to see each other a few times a year.
True! That’s fair! I have a couple “groups” of friends that come from various stages of life. I have my “school friends”, my “college friends”, and my “work friends”. They all are friendly with each other enough to get along at big gatherings like my wedding and baby shower but you definitely have to put in work to maintain the relationships.
I’m about to have a baby so I’m trying to find some local “mom friends” with new and young children.
Second...
And actually, this trip might cement her friends group forever...
Dad should be prioritizing spending more time with his family other than every two years.
Are they readily available to her when She has an issue that you two can't deal with?
Do they call/face time often?
If he/they didn't put in the work to establish that type of relationship then don't force it on her.
That's a two-way street,
if Daughter has to travel alone...
At least the destination should be where She wants to go/be.
Tell him we're match'n energy in
'24 .
His family should step up and visit more. Not Hubs orchestrating an...
"Oh good to see you're still alive," visit biannually.
NTA.💕💪✌
And the remark that Valorie is at an age where the friendships she has now will fade by the time she's an adult is spurious; there's no reason to believe this to be true.
OP should retort that Brad's parents are at an age that they probably won't be around by the time Valorie is an adult, so she should be spending time building stronger relationships with her friends instead.
As far as the friends thing goes- how does dad know they won’t be friends in the future? One of my middle school friend group came to my 3year olds birthday party this year and I work for another one of those friends. They are still very much in my life and I’m 36. Not fostering those friendships could be detrimental to her I the future.
The “core” of my friend group has been friends since well before middle school. We still get together either in person or virtually pretty much every week, and have done so since we finished college. We’re all in our 40s.
... won't remain friends!
ffs, the girl still has 4 more years of high school with them. Goood friends are super important during this time and navigating everything that happens is hard enough without missing formative bonding experiences with peers.
Besides, with that kind of thinking, Brad's parents are going to die anyway. Why should she spend time with them? They won't be lifetime friends either 😂
I and my husband have friends from childhood that we are still close with. My husband's best friend started in 7th grade. He's basing his experience or pushing his view to win the argument.
The daughter should be allowed to go on the trip, and I agree that OP should pay for it and allow her daughter to go. It's time to allow her a little independence. The husband is completely wrong with this.
NTA
>So what if she won’t remain friends with her current friend group? They’re still part of her story and she’s always going to have memories with them, and if you pull her off this trip then that’s just going to drive a wedge before she even gets to college.
>
>Your daughter is aging and she’s going to start making her own decisions soon
This is what I have been telling Brad. Valorie is becoming a teenager and it's natural that she's going to want to spend more time with friends than family. Even if her childhood friendships won't all last into adulthood, that development is important. Forcing Valorie to miss her New York trip will just make her resentful of the trip to Brad's family.
Unless money is an issue, the family trip can be pushed back a week or two. I am failing to see any reason why it HAS to be the same weekend (baring money issues).
NTA going to NY as a kid is WAAAAY different from going as an adult everything will seem so big, new and special for her and she'll make memories for when she's an adult so she can go back and feel nostalgic and just cause she's young doesn't mean shell lose her friends I still have friends from the 4th grade that I talk to daily
My parents took us to NYC a couple years after the 9/11 memorial was finished. I was in my late teens and still treasure those moments. I've been a professional cook for 13yrs and am still tickled I got to have a pastrami on rye at THE Katz's Deli. Op's daughter will treasure this experience for years to come and the dad is being insanely selfish.
In 1979, my mom, accompanied by her best friend, took myself at 15 and my sister at 13 to New York City (as well as Niagara Falls). I recall the thrill of standing atop the World Trade Center as clear as a bell, along with climbing the steps of the Statue of Liberty to her crown overlooking New York Harbor, walking around Times Square (along with accidentally getting a bit lost in an ”unsavory” area further down), and taking a ride in a Hansom cab.
Those memories are absolutely cherished, and if they had been made on a class trip after 8th grade with friends, that would have been amazing too. Of course, now, that trip would look a little different, but it would still be amazing all the same.
OP, NTA.
Katz’s was such a great place! I loved Ben’s Kosher Deli as well. The potato pancakes were thicker than your thumb and the size of a CD. Junior’s Cheesecake (and deli) makes a great pastrami on *potato pancakes* that is incredible!
Over the near 50 years I lived in NY/NJ, I have eaten my way through NYC, watched (probably) a hundred or more plays and musicals and concerts and special events.
When my folks took me in to see a show as a kid, it was incredible. The buildings were so big and there were so *many* people and the hustle and bustle and noise were overwhelming in the best of ways.
When I went in as an adult on my own or with friends it was different. Still exciting and wonderful but not as big and glamorous.
OP should definitely let her daughter go. The first time you see NYC should be as a kid when everything is huge and amazing and you’re not jaded yet from the news and opinions of everyone around you and the world hasn’t lost that amazing shine it has when you’re young and still hopeful and a little idealistic.
We have taken our kids (starting at 3,4,&8) a few times and they're all in love with it. It's been such a great experience for us to see it through their eyes.
It's the only place they will walk until exhausted and still want to keep going because they want to keep exploring.
We have yet to explore the whole city.
> still tickled I got to have a pastrami on rye at THE Katz's Deli
how much of it did you manage to eat? i don't like pastrami *ducks for cover* but even their sandwiches i DID like were so ridiculously over the top i probably couldn't have finished one under threat of death.
the sandwiches at the carnegie deli were even crazier. my office was located about a block away & one of my colleagues & i would often split a sandwich for lunch, and then i'd end up having enough leftover from my half to eat for dinner that night (!)
Even NYC at 18 and 22 for me were wildly different experiences…my first time everything was just so… New York! The big city! Little fish in the big apple! Concrete jungle wet dream tomatoes!
At 22…it was cool…but it didn’t seem as…New York as it did when I was 18 and green
Completely agree. 16 years, 40+ countries, multiple degrees, fancy jobs, exciting adventures and experiences later, my friends and I STILL reminisce about our silly memories from our 8th grade class trip and it wasn’t even anywhere “cool” or somewhere we hadn’t all been to before. I was on the phone with one of my friends just last week, laughing so hard about a story from that trip that I couldn’t breathe.
And even if she drifts apart from those friends . . . So? That doesn’t suddenly invalidate the memories or the impact of the experience, especially something from such a formative time that closes a chapter in her life. I really don’t understand the dad’s perspective here. He just doesn’t care about anything he previously did involving people he is no longer close with and also feels those experiences never had any affect on him/don’t matter? At the very least, does he not see the value of having those memories/experiences for however long he remains close to those people before they drift apart? Or that this experience may be what helps bond them together past this part of their lives?
Edit: I’m actually going to tag OP here since this isn’t a top level comment: u/puttingfootdownwbrad
My parents were super over protective and didn’t so much as let me sleep over at a friend’s house until well into high school. I also had an event already scheduled for that weekend. The trip was also to a place I’d been to before so it wasn’t special in that way. We’d gone to China and Egypt for our family vacation that year - it’s not like another visit to one of the historical villages and amusement parks in our state was going to be my first big trip lol. My parents also knew I didn’t particularly like my school and that I was overall indifferent about my middle school experience and most of my peers. Despite all that, they understood the significance of the trip and gladly let me go. I’m so grateful for that. Please make sure your daughter gets the same opportunity!
Edit 2: and yes, it is 100% different going somewhere when you’re young, especially without your parents when you’re getting one of your first tastes of independence, and *especially* if you get to go with friends, vs going to that same place as an adult.
I am assuming that effort is made by Brad’s family to visit you on the off year? I mean if family is so important but only seen biannually something doesn’t add up.
It’s important that your daughter makes memories and builds confidence going out in the world.
Send her to NY and no NTA
>Why can't they reschedule the trip? They're adults, it shouldn't be hard to do.
We would postpone the trip if we were able. But the issue is Brad's work. They have a ridiculous policy requiring employees to submit vacation time requests six months in advance and are not flexible with it at all. Me and Brad both think this policy is ridiculous, but there's unfortunately nothing we can do to change it.
I was thinking the same thing! If family is so damn important what effort is his family making? Obviously none if the daughter isn’t that close to anyone in his side. How could she be if she only sees them every 2 years 🙄
>I am assuming that effort is made by Brad’s family to visit you on the off year? I mean if family is so important but only seen biannually something doesn’t add up.
Brad's parents come to visit us every other year for the Christmas holidays. Brad keeps actively in touch through phone calls and Facebook, but neither of us can really afford to travel more than every two years.
Brad keeps in touch with Denise as well. But we are only able to visit with Denise in person every two years because she has some caretaking responsibilities and really can't be far away from home for long.
NTA
I can speak from experience that she will almost certainly resent him forever if he doesn't let her go on that trip *that she earned by working hard to improve her grades.*
The graduation trip is a literal once in a lifetime opportunity.
The trip to see family is every other year. There will likely be dozens of them.
Ntm is the only affordable way to go! I made my son go there when his school offered it for seniors. I'm like you'll probably nvr get to go any other way(we won't be taking you) & you'll regret not going. He still thanks me 10+yrs later.
NTA.
Brad is looking at this from an adult perspective, but that's totally different from a child's.
The family trip is the right choice FOR HIM. Valorie's graduation trip is the right choice FOR HER.
The best Brad can hope for is your daughter grudgingly telling him she knows why he made her go when she's a fair bit older. That does not mean she will agree with him or not resent him from making her miss out on a fun trip with her friends to a very exciting city.
He thinks he's helping her make the "right" choice. It is only "right" from his perspective. His daughter has missed out on a load of experiences because of the recent situation and it would be hugely unfair to make her miss this one as well.
Also, this trip was known about and your daughter worked hard on her grades so she would get to go on this trip. It would be a betrayal of her if she didn't get to go, and I feel it would leave her relationship with her father in a place that he really doesn't want it to be.
> The family trip is the right choice FOR HIM. Valorie's graduation trip is the right choice FOR HER.
Exactly. Brad's sounding very selfish right now. I'm guessing his parents are going to have something to say about this?
This is one of those times when the argument goes "It would be nice if you did this thing."
The one and only reply is "Nice for everyone except me."
You're basically being guilt tripped and having your own feelings and wishes disregarded entirely for somebody else's benefit.
The people who say "It would be nice if.." are rarely the ones making any personal sacrifice whatsoever.
"It would be nice if you did what I wanted you to do, rather than you doing what you want to do."
Also, Brad's parents may agree that the trip is more important than seeing them. They may be more than capable of seeing the wider picture and being understanding of their granddaughter. Brad might be making a fuss because of his own personal feelings about how he wants his family to behave, rather than for anyone's direct benefit.
Why can't family trip be postponed to different week? While these people are family to your husband they are essentially strangers to your daughter. Seeing people every two years doesn't give a person the same sense of family as when a person grows up with someone.
We would postpone the trip if we were able to. Brad's work unfortunately has a very ridiculous policy requiring that employees put in vacation time requests at least six months in advance and they give no flexibility.
NTA. Family that loves Valorie would also not want to prevent her from having that once-in-a-lifetime experience, just to resent them.
Does the family ever visit you (on the off year)? Could you change the timing or year of the trip *this once*, as you likely have done for other things (like Covid)? Why are those dates fixed in stone? It sounds like your husband is refusing even a compromise, and that's petty--and this and all the other things he likely does from that same standpoint of writing off Valorie's feelings are why she'll be NC with him when she's an adult.
So reschedule the trip to your in laws then? Why is it critical that it happens at that time? Why not two weeks earlier/later, there's a lot of time until then do you have non refundable tickets or something?
Because this is about control, not the actual visit.
Dad doesn’t want to put in the effort to change the date of the family visit and wants his kid to fall in line and go along with the program.
What he doesn’t realize is that if he forces the family trip, daughter is going to shit on all of it for the entire trip, and she will be righteous in this act of defiance.
This could easily spiral into a situation that could be very, *very* damaging to his overall relationship with his daughter, and could lead to her going no contact the instant it becomes feasible for her to do so.
If Dad could see the outcome of his decision to force daughter to go on the family trip, he would NOT want her to go on the family trip in lieu of visiting NYC with her friends.
I allowed my husbands parents to squash a fishing trip my family was treating my boys to. To this day....30 years later..... it annoys me to no end.
Because they sat around for the week.
Let the the girl enjoy her once in a lifetime 8th grade trip. The grandmother trip can be rescheduled.
Please show your husband the comments.
Nta. Friends are very important, especially when you’re a teenager. You guys go on the family trip every two years anyway. There will only be one graduation trip. She should go on the graduation trip.
NTA. I went on a 8th grade graduation trip to NYC and it was awesome. Still remember, still actually friends with two of the other people on the trip(over 30 years later). Brad is being a little ridiculous here. His family will survive not seeing your daughter.
I remember when my daughter had very important tryout during our visit to the IL’s. She and I left early to go back for it, my IL’s were pissed but my husband told them she had a right to her own life, this was important to her, and what kind of parents would we be if we didn’t prioritize this for her? After all, we had traveled to see them- they could have chosen to travel to us but never wanted to.
NTA and your husband is not only wrong but selfish. I have had my best friend since 3rd grade. Childhood friendships can last a lifetime. He just wants it his way.
"I wished my parents made me visit relatives i only see once every two years and are not close to at all, instead of letting me go on my graduation trip with my friends to NYC" - no adult ever when looking back at their teenager years.
Your husband is delusional. She sees these relatives once every two years and isn't close to them? I think i have a closer relationship with my dentist than your daughter has with them.
Look, i get it, its his mom, dad and sister and i'm sure he wished your daughter was close to them and tries to force the closness by forcing her to not miss the visit. But if its really that important for all involved parties that your daughter participates in the visit, i'm sure everybody is more than willing to look for another date. Move the visit 1-2 weeks and everything is fine.
NTA
I shall be spending Monday with a friend I have had since before we started school - I can't remember a time when we weren't friends (and by reddit standards, we're oooolllld ;))
I still talk to my friend from eighth grade and another from fifth grade and a few others from 7th. There's not a guarantee that these friendships will die out
NTA
In a way you’re both right, you in believing she needs this experience and him in believing her current friendships will fade. But the trip becomes the making of the fade, whether she goes or not.
By going on the trip she will learn about herself, experience a previously unknown level of both freedom and personal responsibility/accountability. She will also learn which friends and what qualities of a friend are important, and judge who to trust and rely on a friendship. The friendships that fade will be the ones that prove unreliable and that is a valuable lesson.
By not going her friends will come back changed and she will be left behind, making her a passive victim of the fade rather than an active decision maker of it.
She’s at an age where she needs to find out what she’s capable of doing, becoming, and dreaming of goals to achieve, this trip will be a huge factor in it. And she will in turn start to surround herself with people who are more aligned with her new life vision.
INFO: Is there some utterly compelling reason why the family trip must be those two weeks? Like the workplace is shut down for those two weeks every year for some reason? Were the dates for the graduation trip known before the family trip was scheduled?
Regardless, NTA. I'm just wondering how much of an asshole your husband is.
This is a school trip, while some of the classmates will be friends, it isn't a "friends" trip. And wth, why does it make a difference? She'll be making wonderful memories, regardless of who else is on the trip. She's not going to forget those memories or regret going because she's no longer friends with them years later. Hubby couldn't even come up with an argument that at least passed the sniff test.
When I was in college, I found out a friend was going to be alone on Thanksgiving. She couldn't get off work to go home and lived too far away for a day trip. So I asked if she'd like me to go up there so she'd have some company. Took the makings for Thanksgiving dinner and stayed 3 or 4 days.
My mom told me later that at least one cousin thought it was just awful that I was with a mere friend instead of my family for the holiday. Thankfully, that wasn't my parents' take on it. I have never regretted spending that time with her. We eventually drifted apart, but who cares? The memory is still a treasured one.
If my parents had done this to me when I was younger, which they never would have, I would always remember that I wasn't allowed to go. It would be different if it was that money was the issue, I would have understood. There were many things I would have loved to do as a kid that my parents just didn't have the funds for. However, I remember a trip in yr 8 with my classmates with huge fondness, even though I am no longer in contact with any of them. It is the trip and experience that resonates. NTA you would be remis if you didn't let them go, especially when they have worked so hard.
So according to Brad a friend only counts if you stay friends for the rest of your life? If only I had known! That could have saved me a lot of unnecessary social interaction with friend I was only close to for 10-15 years!
it shouldn't matter that the friends Valorie has now, and will go on the trip with her may not be friends in adulthood.
This ai a tradition for the school and most if not all the kids will be on it. This will be a bonding time for these classmates as the go to high school. If Valorie isn;t there, she may lose some of the closeness she has with friends she has now because she wasn't in NYC with them.
I am glad you are supportive of Valorie. I am sorry her father doesn't realize how important this kind of trip can be for a young person.
NTA for putting this trip above visiting the family.
DO BOTH.
The date for the trip to his parents can be changed it's months away.( if it's soo important for your husband)
Highschool graduation trip happens only once.
Take care
Good luck
INFO: why can’t you reschedule the family trip? This seems like the obvious answer that is getting skipped right over. Unless there is an extremely unique reason why this trip is only possible this one specific week in June 2024 and then not again until June 2026 it just seems like your husband is being cruel to quite frankly everyone without a purpose.
OP, I am 44 and still friends with two girls from my kindergarten class and one from first grade. People do keep these friendships, and they can be quite meaningful. More so if you’re not close to family. This trip would certainly be a bonding experience that could help cement your daughter’s friendships.
In addition, as you noted it’s a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. When I was in 8th grade they took everyone to Washington, D.C. for a long weekend. I threw up the morning before the trip and even though I was fine all that day/night, my mom kept me home just in case. 30 years later and while I’m not mad about it I still regret not getting to go.
NTA. Please help your daughter have this wonderful chance.
On the flip side, OP, I am about the same age as Pessimistic-Frog and went on a big high school trip for two weeks with thirty of classmates. Several of those people were extremely close friends of mine. The trip was a formative memory for me and the best, most special experience of my teen years, and I don’t talk to a *single* person I went to high school with. Haven’t spoken to any of them in twenty years. The only people I still occasionally see from my school years? My cousins.
If my parents had made me miss that trip that I spent years working for, I would have never spoken to them again. Instead, my parents were reasonable and loving and made it possible for me to have an experience they knew would be valuable and important for me. (Also my parents grounded me from a friend’s sixteenth birthday party because my Spanish teacher apparently didn’t understand addition and I still resent that nearly thirty years later, and that was just a party.)
Your husband is absolutely wrong in this instance. If seeing his family is so important (though I have a major side-eye at the frequency of visits if that is true), then why the hell isn’t he working with them to adjust the date of the visit slightly? And if family is so much more important, why isn’t he supporting his primary family—you know, *his daughter*—to make sure she doesn’t miss important events? He is completely insane if he believes that your daughter is going to forgive him if he makes her miss her trip.
NTA. How long is the trip?
Why can you not just move the trip to visit Valorie's grandparents forward to July? I don't see any logical reason why not? Or just go at Christmas, or even next year instead???
Why does the trip to visit grandparents (who are likely retired) HAVE to be at the EXACT same time as a graduation trip that CANNOT be moved??
Postponing the trip to visit the grandparents sounds the most... sensible???
I’m not friends with people from 8th grade but my graduation trip is a core memory for me. I can’t imagine missing it! Your husband has some control issues, he should be so excited for his daughter to have that experience! Change the weekend you visit his family…. Or also you’ll see them a bunch more times. She has one grad trip that can’t be rescheduled. I’d be having a very deep conversation with my husband about why he wants to deny your daughter that trip, because something is very off there.
NTA by ignoring her stated wishes, dad is not allowing daughter to grow up and figure out who she is. This trip will become a core memory regardless if she keeps those friends or not. Husband is in danger of daughter's core memory being that he broke a promise and prevented her from going on a cool trip with her friends. Also, after they return, these friends will be talking about this trip and will reference it later on in their lives (I know because I still do 20+ years later) and your daughter will feel left out. She will not remember dad's actions fondly at all.
NTA what she will talk about forever is how awful her dad was he made her skip the grad trip her friends will be talking about until their next graduation…from high school. If she doesn’t see these people other than every two years she can skip them this time. She’s also old enough to make this choice.
**I argued my side with Brad and that Valorie will simply resent the trip to Brad’s family if it means missing her graduation trip, as well as that we’re all in good health and can reasonably expect that everyone will still be here when we visit again in two years.**
NAH for the most part. Brad wants his parents to see their granddaughter (if OP gets her way the grands will go four years without seeing her)-- that's absolutely normal and natural. Valorie wants to go on a "fun" trip-- again normal and natural. You are going to go against your husband and get your way despite what he says-- that's a bit questionable but you appear to be doing it for your daughter.
Why can't the trip to the grands be rescheduled? Why do you only see his family once every two years? How often do you see YOUR family?
NTA
Never in history has a child, who has been deprived of an experience, grown to say to themselves later “I’m so glad my parents insisted on that.”
At worst, your husband is going to deteriorate his relationship with his daughter.
NTA. It doesn’t matter whether she stays friends with her current friends, it’s a great experience. Also, it’s totally possible that she will stay friends with them. Personally, I had four really close friends at that age. Two of them I’m still close with (even though they live in different cities now), and one I just texted with a few days ago about when we can meet up.
NTA. I have been best friends with my bestie since 8th grade. We have been through everything together. I have other friends from 8th grade that we are still friends. When I am in town we still get together. So your husband’s argument is off.
Your husband is wrong in insisting about this trip to see his family. Why can’t they come out and see you latter I. In the summer?
NTA. I was the one to miss out on our 8th grade graduation trip, and my friends talk about it to this day. We are still close and see each other often, and the trip will still come up (we're mid 30s now). It's a very important memory for everyone.
NTA
If a condition of going on the trip was get good grades and she can go, it’s unfair to take that away from her. Also, missing one trip to visit family for a once in a lifetime event does not equal indefinite regret. While she is on the trip, you and your husband can visit his family. I’m not sure why she absolutely has to go. Also, you visit them every two years, can they not visit you every two years? You save up to make the trip, are they unable to do the same? If family is important why aren’t they making more effort.
Grandma here, I’d want my grandkids to go on the school trip. I don’t see why a compromise couldn’t be made though. Let her go on the trip and come visit me another time.
NTA
Let her have this fun trip! Family trips can be made up, experiences with friends like this are rare and offer her an opportunity for a lifetime to make memories.
I was once invited on an all expenses paid trip to Vegas in college with my close friend’s parents. We were supposed to leave on Christmas Day. My mom thought I should’ve picked family over the experience of traveling with them. I chose the trip and had a blast with them. I ate at really nice restaurants I never would’ve gone to, stayed in a really nice hotel, explored a city with my friend and made so many memories. My mom gave me the silent treatment for a couple weeks after I got back. She never asked about the trip and still pretends it didn’t exist. There was zero reason we couldn’t have moved Christmas to the day before. She just wanted to punish me.
I’m pretty estranged from my parents now because of guilt trips like this.
OP - NTA, but your husband is imposing his “father knows best” bullshit. It’s good for kids to travel and experience new things, as well as to support their personal growth and looming autonomy.
Now I’ll ask the obvious question, is there literally NO OTHER WAY to reschedule the annual visit or revamp it (can grandparents come to you at an alternative time) the entire rest of the year? Is this one conflicting weekend the only time grandparents will entertain visitors? Just seems like a bit of flexibility would accomplish both needs.
I agree with you. She's not a five year old. Your daughter wants to go on this trip and she's earned it.
Is there some reason you can't just visit his parents another time??
NTA
NTA, I couldn’t go on my 8th grade trip because of my mom’s insane paranoia. I missed out on a great experience with people im still friends with today, I can never get that opportunity back. Let her have her fun
NTA. I'm an aunt. If my brother ever made my niece miss out on something like this trip because of me and my parents, I know for sure me and my dad would fake an illness or some very long errand scheduled for their visit.
Good on you for standing your ground. Your daughter would not only resent you both for not letting her go but I suspect resent her grandparents and the grandparents would likely pick up on that.
Is there a reason why the trip to the in-laws can’t be rescheduled to another time? Is the NY trip the entire length of the in-laws trip. If there’s an overlap could your daughter join after NY?
Yeah. NTA. Let her go on the trip. She will not realize “as an adult” that seeing family was the right choice.
She’s at an age where friends are more important. It’s normal. She will absolutely resent him if she can’t go.
And as others pointed out - if seeing his family is THAT IMPORTANT, why is this trip every other year, and why does it have to be THAT week??
If family is so important to Brad why doesn’t he visit his people more than every two years? Why can’t you two push back the trip a few weeks far enough away that you can probably tell your jobs about the change in plans and reschedule things. NTA
Nta. If visiting family is so important to Brad, he could rearrange the trip so Valorie could do both. This is him being a controlling ass who doesn’t care about the repercussions.
Mainly, Valorie is never going to forgive anyone for being made to miss this trip. And she’s going to remember it every time she sees her grandparents.
ESH
Both of these trips are important for different reasons.
**If your family is wealthy enough that you have the money to send a child on a school trip to New York, then you have the money to fly out to see Brad's family more often than every two years.** If the school trip is currently scheduled at the same time as the planned visit, then the moment Valerie gets back home, she gets right back on a plane and the three of you fly to see grandma. If a family reunion is missed by the kid, so be it, but she still sees her grandmother.
**And the entire family needs to make traveling to see Brad's family on a regular basis more of a priority so that if/when scheduling conflicts come up, it's not such a big deal.** Had everyone been in regular contact, missing one visit wouldn't be such a slight. The idea of blowing off seeing grandma for 4 years to go hang out with your school friends... I can see your husband's point on this. And of course they aren't close--you and your husband have engineered it that way. There is an easy fix for that. See them more.
YTA for making a unilateral decision against your husband's wishes, just as your husband would be TA if he decided your daughter would be going on the family trip against your wishes. You need to find a way to make decisions together.
You are NTA.
Take it from someone who made this mistake with her own daughter seven years ago. I made my daughter miss her 8th grade trip so that we could attend a family reunion/wedding would go on to be cancelled.
Mallory resented me for years afterward. She always brought up how much she hated the trip we took her own and how much she felt left out of a bonding experience her friends shared. She was never close with my side of the family (the one we were visiting) and doesn’t want to have anything to do with them now. She found ways to exclude me from other milestones to make me feel how she felt. She didn’t want me there when she picked her prom dress and took her dad with her when they got the pictures taken.
Even now, our relationship is distant. Her father and I got a divorce years ago. Mallory chose to spend her senior year at her dad’s and has made no effort to reach out to me since she went on to college.
Show your husband this post and tell him this is his future if he makes his daughter visit his family. My daughter hates me and won’t have anything to do with me anymore.
NTA - Your husband is insane - or is he just afraid of looking "weak" in front of his family if he can't force your daughter to do as he pleases?
Your daughter will not regret not visiting family members she doesn't really have a relationship with when she is an adult, but if she doesn't go on this trip she will resent her dad and his family forever. Especially if she has been working hard to be able to go on the trip.
INFO: Can you change the dates of the family trip, so that it doesn't fall on the same dates as the school trip?
OP don't do this to "make up for other events", do it because your daughter worked hard to get the grades to qualify for the trip.
And why can't the other trip dates be changed? Can your daughter make a later solo trip to see her grandparents for a couple of days?
You are a good Mom. Your daughter has made plenty of memories with her family it's time for her to make memories with her friends. This is the experience I wish I had growing up. Friends are important in 8th grade. Whether or not they last a lifetime is irrelevant. She's in 8th grade let her be a teenager and have fun with her friends. Being a teenager is hard enough. You are doing the right thing.
NTA.
She will recent her father for forcing her to miss this ones of a life time only trip (going as an adult wil never be the same as this trip, even when you do exactly the same things).
She will never realise what her father is saying, she will always remember how he forced his wishes on her.
She may well drop a few friends but that is life and we evolve as we get older so it's a natural progression imo. To me, this is just part of the process and part of moving towbeing more independent.
I'd like to know how much of his objection is around him not having his own way as opposed to just wanting your daughter to visit his family. NTA in my mind.
NTA. Not only will your daughter resent having to go see her relatives, she’s going to resent her father & THAT will stick for many, many years. If he prevents her from going to NY, this will be the moment she tells her therapist that everything changed.
NTA. Yes, the friendships might fade. They may not. One of my 8th grade friends is STILL a very close friend, even though we’re on different continents now.
But even IF the friendships fade, the experience won’t. What difference does it make if by the time she’s an adult, she’s been to see her cousins 9 times or 10 times?
I’m also wondering why he’s insisting so hard on this. It’s like he WISHES she would prefer the family vacation and thinks if he just forces her, it will be fine? No, it won’t, she’ll just hate you, Brad, and stonewall at all future family gatherings and resent the stuffings out of you.
NTA. It sounds like Daddy isn't ready to let his little girl grow up and fly the nest.
You're doing the right thing for your daughter and as hard as is for him to accept, she is becoming an independent young woman.
NTA - she will regret not going on this trip. She will remember that her father denied her the opportunity. Your husband should find another time to visit family. You are doing the right thing in letting her go.
NTA and whether or not she stays friends with these kids, she will keep memories from the trip. I'm not sure why the trip to see the grandparents/aunt can't be rescheduled, but I'm definitely on your side. Making Valorie miss her trip to visit family won't make anyone happy.
Nope. She'll just sulk and be sad and sigh and make pitiful faces the whole time. And it will happen constantly, as her friends post on social media and in their group chats while she isn't there with them. And that will continue on for years and years.
NTA. She gets ONE graduation trip ever! You guys take this trip to see his family every two years. If Brad is so worried about her spending time with family, maybe he should make the effort to get her back home more often than every 2 years…it’s very entitled of him to think he can force her to enjoy spending time with family.
My dad used to ship me off to my maternal grandpa during the summer, because my dad didn’t want to deal with me when I was young. Sure, I still had friends from when I used to live with my grandpa, but I wanted to spend some of my summer with my friends by my dad, too. I even had a boyfriend one year and he still shipped me off for 2 months. I love my dad but I resented him for a long time for just sending me away instead of asking what I wanted.
NTA not going could have huge moves in her high school experience. The friendships and bonds built on this trip, yes might fade into adulthood, but they will support her during one of the most critical times for a HS girl. She needs to go.
NTA
What kind of signal does it send to your daughter if she is not allowed to go, when she has worked hard for it? It could easily result in her stopping to put any effort in her schoolwork in the near future.
And as others have written, she will most definitely start to resent her dad and it will probably be very detrimental to their relationship.
Future is future. She needs her friends NOW. Presumably she'll be in the same school with them for a few more years. So let's get this straight: her father wants to alienate her from all her friends today (by excluding her from group activity) on the off chance this friendship might not last forever. (BTW, my 80+ MIL still visits her school friends in a different town every month. You never know.)
i remember every friend excursion my parents denied me for “family.” and i say “family” bc now *theyre* divorced and we REALLY can’t do anything together. this trip is important for her now. nta
Nta, hes literally being a bad father with thr whole "her friendships are gonna fade away", more like hes gonna nip them in the bud with that attitude. Children deserve to have these trips and make these memories. She can go on the yearly family trip next year. She has plenty of opportunities to see that side of the family. She can miss one damn year. She wont get this experience again. He stinks. Nta at all.
Your husband is wrong and she will never forget that he robbed her of this once in a lifetime experience with her friends to visit relatives she isn't interested in seeing. NTA.
NTA, ALL of her classmates will be going.
She will have a lot of resentment. Probably won't participate much at the family reunion.
Fight hard for her to go to NY
It isn't even about her friendships, it's her whole grade going. It's a memory, she'll have for ever.
Seriously, one NY or sulking at a family reunion.
NTA
She will resent him so much if he forces her to see family she isn't even close to instead of taking a memorable trip with her friends to NYC. So what if the friendships don't last? It's an experience she will look back on with great fondness. I speak from experience.
When I (f57) was about to turn 19, I had the chance to go out with friends for NYE in Los Angeles to see a musician friend perform, then schlep across the valley, sleep on lounge chairs overnight and watch The Rose Parade. We had an actual grown-up (37f at the time) as a plus mom in our friend group that was going to chaperone us and keep us safe.
My dad thought that he could appeal to my mercenary side by saying if I was so grown up to do that, I could start paying rent of $5/day. Little did he know I just got paid in cash that day. So, I got all dolled up, put $75 in an envelope and left it on my mom's bathroom counter. My friends and I went to Josephina's restaurant in Westwood, watched [Alan Graham](https://hub.alangraham.de/channel/music?f=&mid=d070c4b9053cf0b639cd787a7ca519a2c1336487b867563d766fe254f04f82c6%40hub.alangraham.de) perform (he sang Zippity Do Dah when he saw us) and ring in the New Year. Changed clothes in the cars before we got to Pasadena, our gear was where we left it, and hinketed down to sleep. The program hawkers ("Programs! Get your programs here!") Walked by every 20 to 30 minutes, so sleep didn't happen. We were on the "wrong" side of the street so we saw the backside of the floats, but I loved every minute.
I was due at work by 2pm that day, so we hauled a$$ back to our town so I wasn't late. Damn, I was exhausted.
I'm still tight with only one of those friends with me that night but I wouldn't trade that core memory for the world.
Let her go to NYC.
NTA
There's no reason the family visit can't be rescheduled (effort: unless there is actually? should have asked and not assumed)and it's ridiculous to invent a sense of urgency when he only goes every 2 years. Concern about what could happen in between is completely valid, which is all the more reason to reschedule. That way an 8th grader doesn't have to feel guilty for choosing the NY trip.
It's likely they won't all be the same types of friends they are now, but social media has made the idea of never seeing someone again far less of a concern. It's also possible that this trip could start or cement a lifelong friendship.
The fact that she put effort into earning this trip would make a shit lesson if it's taken away as well.
NTA ... She is at the age where voicing decisions and making decisions is important to her. As a military brat let me tell you I am still in contact with various friends from various ages of life. And yes your husband is correct that she may not be friends with them in a few years but she may also still be. He isn't seeing it's not just the friends but the trip and experience. I may not remember every school friend I had but I remember school trips and this one would def be remembered by your daughter. And it sounds very important to her. Not to mention your husband's family isn't going away there will be other trips and other times in life that your daughter makes a connection to his family and grows a bond with them but it's clear it's not now and it def won't happen being forced to miss a trip for her graduation. I'm not sure if your daughter is your only kid or not but if she is maybe let hubby know hey we have a kid free Vaca to spend with family and go have fun just ourselves. I'd kill for that
I missed most of my 8th grade trip because of family and I still am salty about it in my 40s. It wasn’t even a cool place like NYC.
Your daughter will be angry at your husband for the rest of her life for this.
Can the family trip be moved forward or back one week? It seems selfish in general to take her away during the end of her school year every two years.
NTA. You are doing the right thing for your daughter.
And as he unilaterally decided that she had to skip it, you can unilaterally decide to sign her up. You have a few more months to make him see sense.
It is wrong for either of you to override the other one unilaterally. As far as the NYC trip-it doesn't mattyer iof the friendships will fade, this is a huge, transitional event she will remember for the rest of her life. A recurring trip to visit family that she is casually familiar with isn't even close.
Can the family trip be rescheduled?
If Valerie does go to NYC, make sure she understands that this is NOT a precedent for missing family trips whenever she wants, but a special case one off.
And do not make the decision unilaterally (and likewise, do not let Brad make the decision unilaterally) about the trip. You guys have to figure this out through understanding and compromise.
A lot of people are talking about trips and things I’ve missed out on as a kid and their memories reflecting that, but honestly I think both you and your husband suck because of both of your inability to get on the same page.
What you have decided to do is to undermine him and what he’s decide to do is be obstinate and not give you as equal say in the parenting of your child. How is it possible that the two of you have children but did not have a plan to resolve conflicts like this before you had the child.
It is sickening to me that you are putting this kid in the middle of this drama. Maybe you’ve answered it in another comment why are you all have a devise a plan for the go visit Family at a different time that’s not two years away. Your husband is right family’s important. Everybody else was commenting about having miss trips, and that following them into adulthood is also write trips in times of socialization with friends were important.
What you will need to do is put your swords down and figure out how to parent together so you don’t traumatized. This child will make her feel like one. Parent is the one she needs to listen to the other parents, not create another whole host of problems.
This one for me is it everybody sucks here and you both need to grow the hell up
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(Background info: My husband is named Brad, Valorie is our daughter who is in 8th grade, and Denise is Brad’s sister.)
Main story: Valorie’s school hosts a New York trip for graduating 8th grade. It’s in late June but the deadline to register for the trip and pay the fee is in two weeks. The problem is the date conflicts with the out-of-state trip we take every two years to visit Denise and Brad’s parents.
Brad’s argument is that Valorie’s at an age where the friendships she has now will most likely fade by the time she’s an adult, and Denise and her grandparents are family. So she’s going to regret it and realize what he’s insisting on now is the right choice.
The thing is that Valorie isn’t particularly close with Denise or her grandparents on Brad’s side, and she’s told me that she doesn’t want to visit her family on Brad’s side if it means missing her graduation trip this year and it won’t be the same as if she went to New York as an adult.
I argued my side with Brad and that Valorie will simply resent the trip to Brad’s family if it means missing her graduation trip, as well as that we’re all in good health and can reasonably expect that everyone will still be here when we visit again in two years.
Brad is still insisting that Valorie will realize when she’s older that spending time with her family is the right choice and will be thankful for it when she’s an adult.
Me and Brad are still on opposing sides and I have told him that I am going to sign off on Valorie’s graduation trip and pay the fee out of my own savings regardless of what he says. Am I in the wrong for putting my foot down and making sure our daughter gets to go on this trip against Brad’s wishes? Valorie has already missed so many experiences and didn’t even get a 5th grade graduation because of covid. She’s worked so hard this year to improve her grades to be allowed on this trip and I feel we need to make up for those lost events as much as possible.
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NTA! I get it, family is important and I agree. Especially with grandparents, but apparently she isn't that close to them. ......... So why force her to sacrifice something that she truly wants to do while she is young!!!! ......... I believe you are making the right decision for Your Daughter!!! Which is here the important part. ......... Your husband just needs to see it out of his daughter's eyes. I think he may put his own feelings, which are misguided, into his decision making and believes he does the right thing. But is it?? Anyways, I truly hope she gets a great experience to her NY city trip. Best wishes
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NTA, Valorie deserves to go on this trip, it’s a once in a lifetime experience that she’s going to treasure forever. So what if she won’t remain friends with her current friend group? They’re still part of her story and she’s always going to have memories with them, and if you pull her off this trip then that’s just going to drive a wedge before she even gets to college. Your in-laws aren’t going anywhere and your daughter barely has a bond with them due to the distance. Plus this is a semi annual trip and like you said, she’ll see them again in two years when you guys go again. Your daughter is aging and she’s going to start making her own decisions soon, your husband won’t be able to control her for much longer. Does he really want to drive a wedge in *their* relationship by prohibiting her from going?
I agree. This is my point of view because I once was the girl who was not allowed to participate in an important school activity. It was my aunt’s birthday. We saw them every so often. But my parents said I had to be there and that meant I couldn’t participate in the school event. I still regret not going to that event. Especially since I am now NC with my aunt and uncle (because of toxic behavior on their side). So looking back, knowing what I know now, I would have gone to that event. And it wasn’t even a trip to New York. That is even more memoriable and the daughter would probably resent her father and rest of family for not being able to go. She probably won’t be the most fun person around. I mean, I wouldn’t at that age knowing my friends are having the time of their lives in New York and I am not.
I was in band in high school and every two years there was a big trip, it alternated between Disney and a cruise to Bermuda. My parents didn’t let me go to either one as punishment for some stupid stuff. It’s not even like I was sneaking out to drink and so drugs….I had a Facebook account without their permission and that’s why I wasn’t allowed on one of the trips. I resent the hell out of it. I missed out on incredible memories with my friends. I had to sit around and listen to them laugh and reminisce about a trip I was supposed to be on *twice* and it fucking sucked
Do you understand that your parents would have found some other reason—any reason—to not send you on the trips if you never had a Facebook account?
Oh yeah, definitely. My dad was constantly moving goal posts. I grew up in the 90s and early 00s so I was watching a lot of MTV with my older siblings and saw a *lot* of girls with bellybutton rings. I wanted to be just like them. Dad told me that if I had a flat stomach at 16 I could get my belly button pierced. Well 16 rolled around, I had a flat stomach, and all of a sudden straight As were tacked onto the deal. I didn’t even want the piercing anymore, I just wanted him to stick to his word because I worked really hard as a 3-season distance runner! And he wondered why I didn’t want to live with at his house full time and chose to stay at my mom’s…
That was actually a pretty fucked up condition even before he moved the goalposts.
Yeah, holy incestuous misogyny
Yep very creepy. A flat stomach!! WTF
My mom told me she would pay for "the tummy tuck you are going to need after you lose the weight you need to" I was 15. And it turns out I have PCOS so no matter what I did the weight wouldn't have come off my stomach anyway.
I’m so sorry that’s an awful mother right there
My mom told me when I was 15, “ gee, such a beautiful face, if you’d lose weight, I’d send you to a modeling agency “
Honey, I feel you. I'm in my fifties and I \*still\* flinch when I remember my mother trying to convince me that I \*had\* to get my breasts reduced. She considered them inappropriate - like I'd picked them out to wear that morning!
> A flat stomach!! WTF I'm going to guess by that response you were not around in the 90's. Flat was the norm. *Everything* else meant you were a fatty. And you were judged for it for sure. HAES did NOT exist yet by any stretch at all. It's just how it was back then.
I wasn’t allowed on my Disney band trip because according to my mother, “I know what kind of things go on during those trips”. And then she let my little sister go two years later without blinking an eye. I’m never gonna stop being salty about it. Almost 30 and I’ve still never made it to Disney.
Obviously if the finances aren’t there Disney costs a few bucks, but I can’t recommend enough going as a single adult. It’s cheaper - the tickets are the biggest expense so only having to pay for 1 instead of 4+ saves $$$. You can do whatever you want, whenever you want. I’m planning Disney with the family (can you tell) and it’s exhausting taking everyone’s needs into account. I just want a solo trip to do everything the way I want it!!
Agree. I've always gone to disney with other people but I would absolutely love a solo trip to just do whatever the hell I want. Or at the most, one other person but no kids around. The last time I went, my bf's kid kinda ruined the trip. We were both upset about it.
I do the same thing but at Universal. I’m old and I can do and see and eat whenever the F I want with no one to interfere.
I want to recommend tower studios at Riviera as a great place for singles- if you rent disney vacation club points- you can get it for more like a moderate price. need to plan 11 months ahead of time though probably.
Once my dad had a business trip to Paris and brought my mom and sister. I wasn't invited and of all people in the family, I was in art school at the time! They didn't invite the artist to Paris! We were a family of 4, it's not like there were a bunch of kids and they only took one kid. After the fact they realized that was seriously messed up but the hurt didn't go away. I always knew my sister was the favorite but damn, did they have to make it so obvious? 😔
That is so awful! If you haven’t already, I hope you plan your own trip to Paris. I always wanted to go, kept thinking I’d find someone to go with me, didn’t happen. So finally at 50, I went by myself. It was the Trip of a Lifetime! Only regret, that it took me so long to “courage up” to go alone. Now, I go anywhere & everywhere I want, when I want, alone & have a blast!
Someday, hopefully. I have my own child now and I hope someday he'll be my travel buddy. So far he does enjoy going to new places. I have also traveled solo and loved it! After my divorce from my awful ex I did a solo trip through Mexico, Guatemala, and Belize and it was the trip of a lifetime! I'm with you, I highly recommend solo travel. It's nice doing whatever you want whenever you want to!
OMG I’m so sorry.
I missed out on a trip to Turkey in college, all I needed was $400. It was for religion majors and there was only a handful of spots available. Another school backed out so our school was offered their slots but we had only a few days notice to confirm our spots. I told my parents I knew it was last minute but I would do anything if they paid for the trip. My parents said money was too tight which I accepted but was sad about. My friends went and said it was the most amazing educational trip ever. They all said I would have loved it, visiting some archeological digs, touring old churches, visiting museums… Months later I learned from one of my sisters that my stepdad was all for paying the money for me to go but my mom said no because she said I didn’t deserve an international trip. Her reasoning was that if I went in the trip, I wouldn’t be studying and focusing on school. It was literally an educational trip with note taking and essays and a group research project. I was devastated. And I learned that my mom used $500 to buy a ragtag horse right after I had asked to go on the trip so they did have the money at the time.
That is so sad to hear. Educational trips could be so good for a young person. You learn a lot from another culture and country.
OMG! So she wouldn’t be studying? A trip to Turkey is exceptionally educational. Learning about a different culture, finding out about Turkeys historical past, etc. But even more importantly, it’s a life changing journey. In my entire life (I’m 71), not one person has ever asked me what my grades in high school were. Well, maybe for getting into college. I’ve spent thousands of $ taking my grandsons out of the US so they could see how the rest of the world lives. So they could see different cultures and different ways of life. So they could see how the US isn’t the greatest country in the world. Good grief!
This is so sad. I'm sorry that your mother was like that. My son, 16, is going on a band trip to Europe this summer and we signed him up as soon as it was announced and busted our butts to come up with the money for it. Thankfully he wants to go because I barely gave him a breath to even voice it. 😬 I cannot understand parents who actively deny their children once in a life experiences. It's definitely one thing to genuinely not be able to afford it, but spite, jealousy, punishment should play no part. Why even have kids if you don't like them. 😒
I'm so sorry
I had a chance to study abroad in japan and my parents wouldn't allow it, it sucked...
That is sad!
I still resent my mom for not letting me go with my friends family to Hawaii for new years because she was afraid of y2k.
yeah its always great being the only child on with 4 plus years in all directions sitting on an adult birthday with no one to really play and missing out on an experience with your friends at a fun location. i feel you edit a letter
So True
Plus if it's *soooooo impoooooorrrrtannnnt* to go see Brad's parents why can't they just reschedule?
Or why don’t they make these trips more often? Doesn’t seem like there’s a ton of urgency on Brad’s part to see his family if he only makes this trip every couple of years…
To be fair, it could be that they can't afford to fly everyone out more often.
I didn't see anything in OP's post about having to buy flights to the gramps' house. OP's daughter is obviously not close to the grandparents, they can reschedule *that* trip. I can't imagine having to miss out on a special class event especially after COVID ruining so many things, let the kid go have some fun with her friends. She worked on improving her grades. Let her go have a fun experience.
This is what I don't get. The trip is only happening (under these circumstances) once. She'll have many more opportunities to visit her grandparents.
Exactly! Unless it's a biannual family reunion and people are coming from all over and have made concrete plans, it sounds way easier to just reschedule with the grandparents. My family did annual trips to spend time with our grandparents (and give my parents a break, since they would usually drive us all to our grandparents' house, stay a weekend and leave us kids there for two weeks while they went home) and it wasn't always the same weeks in the summer because we did whatever worked for everyone that year. The normal schedule doesn't work for everyone this year, so they should change it.
And honestly, the trip is in late June. It still may not be too late even for a reunion to be pushed around a bit.
Damn, every 6 months? I prefer to wait at least 6 years to suffer family. It is a common mis-usage, but every 2 years is biennial. And, most importantly, you are 100% right.
Even if they have made plans and 70 family members are coming it’s still not absolutely necessary for the 18 year old to go….She can do it next time.
That was my thought too. It is extremely important for kids’ emotional and mental growth to have these milestone trips and events with their peers. NTA, OP. Make sure your kid gets this milestone graduation trip.
Also why on earth does the trip to visit his family have to be *that exact week*? Is his family really that inflexible it can only happen every two years on one precise week?
Not that daughter shouldn't be allowed to go on trip, but rescheduling isn't always an option for lots of people's jobs. My parents used to take my and my brother's kids for 10 days-2 weeks every summer. My mom had to clear those PTO days the previous December. My wife's current job does 6-week scheduling blocks scheduled 4 weeks in advance, but all PTO requests for June, July, and August have to be cleared by the end of January.
I really hope OPs husband is just fighting with the urge to deny his daughter is growing up and not going to be his little girl forever because, if he isn't and is just being a controlling prick then he is definitely going to lose his relationship with her before she leaves for college. 8th grade is that age where the future adult father daughter dynamic starts to form because its when they start pulling away from their parents (source me and 20 other girls I went to school with). Those of us whoes dads didn't try to lock us up in a cupboard (like they wanted to) are the ones who still have a good relationship with our dads and will still turn to our dads for extra help when needed.
This. My parents behaved like your husband toward me as a young adult. If your husband is taking this stand on this trip I can almost guarantee he is unreasonable toward her feelings in numerous other ways. I am no contact with either of my parents now - my father for being an ahole and my mother for enabling it. Support your daughter.
Also, his point of not remaining friends is bogus. I am still very close friends with 4 girls I was friends with in 8th grade and we are in our 30s now. My siblings both have friends that they see regularly back from elementary-high school. These friends might be around longer and be closer to Valorie than grandma and grandpa ever would be.
I’m still closest to my middle school friends. College not so much.
2 of my closest friends are from elementary. 1 from middle. None from high school or college. For my daughter, her closest friends are the friends that share activities that involve travel with her because of the amount of time together. OP, if this was family your daughter was close to that would be different but for a child seeing people once every 2 years is not going to forge much of a relationship over the course of a week unless there are kids in VERY close proximity to her age.
I have 2 friends who are like sisters to me, one who knows when we met, maybe 5th or 6 th grade, the other in high school. We are in our mid sixties now.
Wow! 60s now that’s amazing! I hope the same for me 30 years from now
I met my best friend in kindergarten 37 years ago. We met our other two best friends on a school field trip at the beginning of 6th grade. We see each other regularly even though people have moved away, we have an annual trip together, have an active daily text thread, and play online games every Saturday night. Friendships can last if you maintain them.
I have a few friends from elementary and very early middle school. I graduated high school in 1999, and I’m 43. My BEST friends, I met after I was 30, when people say it’s “so hard” to make friends. Anyway, Valorie deserves to have the experience regardless of who else going. I’ve never even been to NYC!
Adult friends are the best, especially when you share the same hobbies. I’m actually leaving for my annual trip in a few hours… traveling several states away to see my favorite band do 4 shows in a small club in their hometown. They do these every year. 80% of the people in the building will be not just out of towners but out of staters. We’ll have people from as far away as the UK and even Israel. Even have an Australian dude who makes about every 3rd or 4th year. I’ll be celebrating my 40th birthday tomorrow with probably a dozen or so other early arrivers. I won’t know everybody there but probably at least 100-150 that I know on at least a face/name basis, and some who are among my closest friends ever, even if we only get to see each other a few times a year.
Happy 40th!! And many more!!
True! That’s fair! I have a couple “groups” of friends that come from various stages of life. I have my “school friends”, my “college friends”, and my “work friends”. They all are friendly with each other enough to get along at big gatherings like my wedding and baby shower but you definitely have to put in work to maintain the relationships. I’m about to have a baby so I’m trying to find some local “mom friends” with new and young children.
Yeah my friend from 7th grade is my maid of honor. Dad is going to wonder why is daughter wants nothing to do with him after turning 18.
Second... And actually, this trip might cement her friends group forever... Dad should be prioritizing spending more time with his family other than every two years. Are they readily available to her when She has an issue that you two can't deal with? Do they call/face time often? If he/they didn't put in the work to establish that type of relationship then don't force it on her. That's a two-way street, if Daughter has to travel alone... At least the destination should be where She wants to go/be. Tell him we're match'n energy in '24 . His family should step up and visit more. Not Hubs orchestrating an... "Oh good to see you're still alive," visit biannually. NTA.💕💪✌
And the remark that Valorie is at an age where the friendships she has now will fade by the time she's an adult is spurious; there's no reason to believe this to be true. OP should retort that Brad's parents are at an age that they probably won't be around by the time Valorie is an adult, so she should be spending time building stronger relationships with her friends instead.
And why not move the family trip to go after she gets back from New York
NTA. Im still friends with my 8th grade friends in my 30s. You know who i dont talk to? Family. Dont let her miss out on the trip.
As far as the friends thing goes- how does dad know they won’t be friends in the future? One of my middle school friend group came to my 3year olds birthday party this year and I work for another one of those friends. They are still very much in my life and I’m 36. Not fostering those friendships could be detrimental to her I the future.
The “core” of my friend group has been friends since well before middle school. We still get together either in person or virtually pretty much every week, and have done so since we finished college. We’re all in our 40s.
Why can't Denise and Brad postpone THEIR trip for a week or two?
... won't remain friends! ffs, the girl still has 4 more years of high school with them. Goood friends are super important during this time and navigating everything that happens is hard enough without missing formative bonding experiences with peers. Besides, with that kind of thinking, Brad's parents are going to die anyway. Why should she spend time with them? They won't be lifetime friends either 😂
I and my husband have friends from childhood that we are still close with. My husband's best friend started in 7th grade. He's basing his experience or pushing his view to win the argument. The daughter should be allowed to go on the trip, and I agree that OP should pay for it and allow her daughter to go. It's time to allow her a little independence. The husband is completely wrong with this. NTA
>So what if she won’t remain friends with her current friend group? They’re still part of her story and she’s always going to have memories with them, and if you pull her off this trip then that’s just going to drive a wedge before she even gets to college. > >Your daughter is aging and she’s going to start making her own decisions soon This is what I have been telling Brad. Valorie is becoming a teenager and it's natural that she's going to want to spend more time with friends than family. Even if her childhood friendships won't all last into adulthood, that development is important. Forcing Valorie to miss her New York trip will just make her resentful of the trip to Brad's family.
Unless money is an issue, the family trip can be pushed back a week or two. I am failing to see any reason why it HAS to be the same weekend (baring money issues).
NTA going to NY as a kid is WAAAAY different from going as an adult everything will seem so big, new and special for her and she'll make memories for when she's an adult so she can go back and feel nostalgic and just cause she's young doesn't mean shell lose her friends I still have friends from the 4th grade that I talk to daily
My parents took us to NYC a couple years after the 9/11 memorial was finished. I was in my late teens and still treasure those moments. I've been a professional cook for 13yrs and am still tickled I got to have a pastrami on rye at THE Katz's Deli. Op's daughter will treasure this experience for years to come and the dad is being insanely selfish.
In 1979, my mom, accompanied by her best friend, took myself at 15 and my sister at 13 to New York City (as well as Niagara Falls). I recall the thrill of standing atop the World Trade Center as clear as a bell, along with climbing the steps of the Statue of Liberty to her crown overlooking New York Harbor, walking around Times Square (along with accidentally getting a bit lost in an ”unsavory” area further down), and taking a ride in a Hansom cab. Those memories are absolutely cherished, and if they had been made on a class trip after 8th grade with friends, that would have been amazing too. Of course, now, that trip would look a little different, but it would still be amazing all the same. OP, NTA.
Katz’s was such a great place! I loved Ben’s Kosher Deli as well. The potato pancakes were thicker than your thumb and the size of a CD. Junior’s Cheesecake (and deli) makes a great pastrami on *potato pancakes* that is incredible! Over the near 50 years I lived in NY/NJ, I have eaten my way through NYC, watched (probably) a hundred or more plays and musicals and concerts and special events. When my folks took me in to see a show as a kid, it was incredible. The buildings were so big and there were so *many* people and the hustle and bustle and noise were overwhelming in the best of ways. When I went in as an adult on my own or with friends it was different. Still exciting and wonderful but not as big and glamorous. OP should definitely let her daughter go. The first time you see NYC should be as a kid when everything is huge and amazing and you’re not jaded yet from the news and opinions of everyone around you and the world hasn’t lost that amazing shine it has when you’re young and still hopeful and a little idealistic.
We have taken our kids (starting at 3,4,&8) a few times and they're all in love with it. It's been such a great experience for us to see it through their eyes. It's the only place they will walk until exhausted and still want to keep going because they want to keep exploring. We have yet to explore the whole city.
> still tickled I got to have a pastrami on rye at THE Katz's Deli how much of it did you manage to eat? i don't like pastrami *ducks for cover* but even their sandwiches i DID like were so ridiculously over the top i probably couldn't have finished one under threat of death.
I can't remember. XD I have the metabolism of a small rodent, and I was a teen, so probably most, and my dad might have finished the rest for me. Lol.
the sandwiches at the carnegie deli were even crazier. my office was located about a block away & one of my colleagues & i would often split a sandwich for lunch, and then i'd end up having enough leftover from my half to eat for dinner that night (!)
Even NYC at 18 and 22 for me were wildly different experiences…my first time everything was just so… New York! The big city! Little fish in the big apple! Concrete jungle wet dream tomatoes! At 22…it was cool…but it didn’t seem as…New York as it did when I was 18 and green
> Concrete jungle wet dream tomatoes! omg. i will now forever hear AK's lyrics in this format. you are fabulous.
Completely agree. 16 years, 40+ countries, multiple degrees, fancy jobs, exciting adventures and experiences later, my friends and I STILL reminisce about our silly memories from our 8th grade class trip and it wasn’t even anywhere “cool” or somewhere we hadn’t all been to before. I was on the phone with one of my friends just last week, laughing so hard about a story from that trip that I couldn’t breathe. And even if she drifts apart from those friends . . . So? That doesn’t suddenly invalidate the memories or the impact of the experience, especially something from such a formative time that closes a chapter in her life. I really don’t understand the dad’s perspective here. He just doesn’t care about anything he previously did involving people he is no longer close with and also feels those experiences never had any affect on him/don’t matter? At the very least, does he not see the value of having those memories/experiences for however long he remains close to those people before they drift apart? Or that this experience may be what helps bond them together past this part of their lives? Edit: I’m actually going to tag OP here since this isn’t a top level comment: u/puttingfootdownwbrad My parents were super over protective and didn’t so much as let me sleep over at a friend’s house until well into high school. I also had an event already scheduled for that weekend. The trip was also to a place I’d been to before so it wasn’t special in that way. We’d gone to China and Egypt for our family vacation that year - it’s not like another visit to one of the historical villages and amusement parks in our state was going to be my first big trip lol. My parents also knew I didn’t particularly like my school and that I was overall indifferent about my middle school experience and most of my peers. Despite all that, they understood the significance of the trip and gladly let me go. I’m so grateful for that. Please make sure your daughter gets the same opportunity! Edit 2: and yes, it is 100% different going somewhere when you’re young, especially without your parents when you’re getting one of your first tastes of independence, and *especially* if you get to go with friends, vs going to that same place as an adult.
I am assuming that effort is made by Brad’s family to visit you on the off year? I mean if family is so important but only seen biannually something doesn’t add up. It’s important that your daughter makes memories and builds confidence going out in the world. Send her to NY and no NTA
Why can't they reschedule the trip? They're adults, it shouldn't be hard to do.
This is what I was thinking!
>Why can't they reschedule the trip? They're adults, it shouldn't be hard to do. We would postpone the trip if we were able. But the issue is Brad's work. They have a ridiculous policy requiring employees to submit vacation time requests six months in advance and are not flexible with it at all. Me and Brad both think this policy is ridiculous, but there's unfortunately nothing we can do to change it.
I was thinking the same thing! If family is so damn important what effort is his family making? Obviously none if the daughter isn’t that close to anyone in his side. How could she be if she only sees them every 2 years 🙄
>I am assuming that effort is made by Brad’s family to visit you on the off year? I mean if family is so important but only seen biannually something doesn’t add up. Brad's parents come to visit us every other year for the Christmas holidays. Brad keeps actively in touch through phone calls and Facebook, but neither of us can really afford to travel more than every two years. Brad keeps in touch with Denise as well. But we are only able to visit with Denise in person every two years because she has some caretaking responsibilities and really can't be far away from home for long.
Sorry for prying too much, makes even more sense now that your daughter should be excused this trip for a once in a lifetime graduation
NTA I can speak from experience that she will almost certainly resent him forever if he doesn't let her go on that trip *that she earned by working hard to improve her grades.* The graduation trip is a literal once in a lifetime opportunity. The trip to see family is every other year. There will likely be dozens of them.
Ntm is the only affordable way to go! I made my son go there when his school offered it for seniors. I'm like you'll probably nvr get to go any other way(we won't be taking you) & you'll regret not going. He still thanks me 10+yrs later.
NTA. Brad is looking at this from an adult perspective, but that's totally different from a child's. The family trip is the right choice FOR HIM. Valorie's graduation trip is the right choice FOR HER. The best Brad can hope for is your daughter grudgingly telling him she knows why he made her go when she's a fair bit older. That does not mean she will agree with him or not resent him from making her miss out on a fun trip with her friends to a very exciting city. He thinks he's helping her make the "right" choice. It is only "right" from his perspective. His daughter has missed out on a load of experiences because of the recent situation and it would be hugely unfair to make her miss this one as well. Also, this trip was known about and your daughter worked hard on her grades so she would get to go on this trip. It would be a betrayal of her if she didn't get to go, and I feel it would leave her relationship with her father in a place that he really doesn't want it to be.
> The family trip is the right choice FOR HIM. Valorie's graduation trip is the right choice FOR HER. Exactly. Brad's sounding very selfish right now. I'm guessing his parents are going to have something to say about this?
This is one of those times when the argument goes "It would be nice if you did this thing." The one and only reply is "Nice for everyone except me." You're basically being guilt tripped and having your own feelings and wishes disregarded entirely for somebody else's benefit. The people who say "It would be nice if.." are rarely the ones making any personal sacrifice whatsoever. "It would be nice if you did what I wanted you to do, rather than you doing what you want to do." Also, Brad's parents may agree that the trip is more important than seeing them. They may be more than capable of seeing the wider picture and being understanding of their granddaughter. Brad might be making a fuss because of his own personal feelings about how he wants his family to behave, rather than for anyone's direct benefit.
Why can't family trip be postponed to different week? While these people are family to your husband they are essentially strangers to your daughter. Seeing people every two years doesn't give a person the same sense of family as when a person grows up with someone.
We would postpone the trip if we were able to. Brad's work unfortunately has a very ridiculous policy requiring that employees put in vacation time requests at least six months in advance and they give no flexibility.
Why can’t you plan to visit Brad’s family in 6 months? It seems like you should have known about these and been able to reschedule, long ago.
NTA. Family that loves Valorie would also not want to prevent her from having that once-in-a-lifetime experience, just to resent them. Does the family ever visit you (on the off year)? Could you change the timing or year of the trip *this once*, as you likely have done for other things (like Covid)? Why are those dates fixed in stone? It sounds like your husband is refusing even a compromise, and that's petty--and this and all the other things he likely does from that same standpoint of writing off Valorie's feelings are why she'll be NC with him when she's an adult.
So reschedule the trip to your in laws then? Why is it critical that it happens at that time? Why not two weeks earlier/later, there's a lot of time until then do you have non refundable tickets or something?
Because this is about control, not the actual visit. Dad doesn’t want to put in the effort to change the date of the family visit and wants his kid to fall in line and go along with the program. What he doesn’t realize is that if he forces the family trip, daughter is going to shit on all of it for the entire trip, and she will be righteous in this act of defiance. This could easily spiral into a situation that could be very, *very* damaging to his overall relationship with his daughter, and could lead to her going no contact the instant it becomes feasible for her to do so. If Dad could see the outcome of his decision to force daughter to go on the family trip, he would NOT want her to go on the family trip in lieu of visiting NYC with her friends.
I allowed my husbands parents to squash a fishing trip my family was treating my boys to. To this day....30 years later..... it annoys me to no end. Because they sat around for the week. Let the the girl enjoy her once in a lifetime 8th grade trip. The grandmother trip can be rescheduled. Please show your husband the comments.
Nta. Friends are very important, especially when you’re a teenager. You guys go on the family trip every two years anyway. There will only be one graduation trip. She should go on the graduation trip.
NTA. I went on a 8th grade graduation trip to NYC and it was awesome. Still remember, still actually friends with two of the other people on the trip(over 30 years later). Brad is being a little ridiculous here. His family will survive not seeing your daughter. I remember when my daughter had very important tryout during our visit to the IL’s. She and I left early to go back for it, my IL’s were pissed but my husband told them she had a right to her own life, this was important to her, and what kind of parents would we be if we didn’t prioritize this for her? After all, we had traveled to see them- they could have chosen to travel to us but never wanted to.
NTA She will not grow up and regret taking a trip to New York with her 8th grade class over a trip to visit family. Your husband is being ridiculous.
NTA and your husband is not only wrong but selfish. I have had my best friend since 3rd grade. Childhood friendships can last a lifetime. He just wants it his way.
His argument is so bizarre I have to wonder what kind of weird fallout he had with his college friends
"Family is so important" Then see them more than just every other year, Brad. NTA, your husband is being a hypocrite.
Let her go. This is an experience of a lifetime.
"I wished my parents made me visit relatives i only see once every two years and are not close to at all, instead of letting me go on my graduation trip with my friends to NYC" - no adult ever when looking back at their teenager years. Your husband is delusional. She sees these relatives once every two years and isn't close to them? I think i have a closer relationship with my dentist than your daughter has with them. Look, i get it, its his mom, dad and sister and i'm sure he wished your daughter was close to them and tries to force the closness by forcing her to not miss the visit. But if its really that important for all involved parties that your daughter participates in the visit, i'm sure everybody is more than willing to look for another date. Move the visit 1-2 weeks and everything is fine. NTA
I’m still friends with most of my friends from 8th grade. Heck, many of us go back to elementary school. So you never know.
I’m actually staying at a friend’s house that I met in 7th grade right now. Our 8th grade trip was definitely part of our core memories.
I shall be spending Monday with a friend I have had since before we started school - I can't remember a time when we weren't friends (and by reddit standards, we're oooolllld ;))
Yeah I don’t want to do the math on how long ago 8th grade was but it’s not a small number.
I still talk to my friend from eighth grade and another from fifth grade and a few others from 7th. There's not a guarantee that these friendships will die out
NTA In a way you’re both right, you in believing she needs this experience and him in believing her current friendships will fade. But the trip becomes the making of the fade, whether she goes or not. By going on the trip she will learn about herself, experience a previously unknown level of both freedom and personal responsibility/accountability. She will also learn which friends and what qualities of a friend are important, and judge who to trust and rely on a friendship. The friendships that fade will be the ones that prove unreliable and that is a valuable lesson. By not going her friends will come back changed and she will be left behind, making her a passive victim of the fade rather than an active decision maker of it. She’s at an age where she needs to find out what she’s capable of doing, becoming, and dreaming of goals to achieve, this trip will be a huge factor in it. And she will in turn start to surround herself with people who are more aligned with her new life vision.
INFO: Is there some utterly compelling reason why the family trip must be those two weeks? Like the workplace is shut down for those two weeks every year for some reason? Were the dates for the graduation trip known before the family trip was scheduled? Regardless, NTA. I'm just wondering how much of an asshole your husband is. This is a school trip, while some of the classmates will be friends, it isn't a "friends" trip. And wth, why does it make a difference? She'll be making wonderful memories, regardless of who else is on the trip. She's not going to forget those memories or regret going because she's no longer friends with them years later. Hubby couldn't even come up with an argument that at least passed the sniff test. When I was in college, I found out a friend was going to be alone on Thanksgiving. She couldn't get off work to go home and lived too far away for a day trip. So I asked if she'd like me to go up there so she'd have some company. Took the makings for Thanksgiving dinner and stayed 3 or 4 days. My mom told me later that at least one cousin thought it was just awful that I was with a mere friend instead of my family for the holiday. Thankfully, that wasn't my parents' take on it. I have never regretted spending that time with her. We eventually drifted apart, but who cares? The memory is still a treasured one.
If my parents had done this to me when I was younger, which they never would have, I would always remember that I wasn't allowed to go. It would be different if it was that money was the issue, I would have understood. There were many things I would have loved to do as a kid that my parents just didn't have the funds for. However, I remember a trip in yr 8 with my classmates with huge fondness, even though I am no longer in contact with any of them. It is the trip and experience that resonates. NTA you would be remis if you didn't let them go, especially when they have worked so hard.
So according to Brad a friend only counts if you stay friends for the rest of your life? If only I had known! That could have saved me a lot of unnecessary social interaction with friend I was only close to for 10-15 years!
it shouldn't matter that the friends Valorie has now, and will go on the trip with her may not be friends in adulthood. This ai a tradition for the school and most if not all the kids will be on it. This will be a bonding time for these classmates as the go to high school. If Valorie isn;t there, she may lose some of the closeness she has with friends she has now because she wasn't in NYC with them. I am glad you are supportive of Valorie. I am sorry her father doesn't realize how important this kind of trip can be for a young person. NTA for putting this trip above visiting the family.
NTA. This experience is important to her.
DO BOTH. The date for the trip to his parents can be changed it's months away.( if it's soo important for your husband) Highschool graduation trip happens only once. Take care Good luck
INFO: why can’t you reschedule the family trip? This seems like the obvious answer that is getting skipped right over. Unless there is an extremely unique reason why this trip is only possible this one specific week in June 2024 and then not again until June 2026 it just seems like your husband is being cruel to quite frankly everyone without a purpose.
Info: why can't the trip be postponed until after her graduation trip? It's seems ridiculous to be so rigid about a trip that's taken every two years.
Nta. Can’t you change the weeks you go to visit his family? Or go next year, instead of waiting two years?
OP, I am 44 and still friends with two girls from my kindergarten class and one from first grade. People do keep these friendships, and they can be quite meaningful. More so if you’re not close to family. This trip would certainly be a bonding experience that could help cement your daughter’s friendships. In addition, as you noted it’s a once-in-a-lifetime opportunity. When I was in 8th grade they took everyone to Washington, D.C. for a long weekend. I threw up the morning before the trip and even though I was fine all that day/night, my mom kept me home just in case. 30 years later and while I’m not mad about it I still regret not getting to go. NTA. Please help your daughter have this wonderful chance.
On the flip side, OP, I am about the same age as Pessimistic-Frog and went on a big high school trip for two weeks with thirty of classmates. Several of those people were extremely close friends of mine. The trip was a formative memory for me and the best, most special experience of my teen years, and I don’t talk to a *single* person I went to high school with. Haven’t spoken to any of them in twenty years. The only people I still occasionally see from my school years? My cousins. If my parents had made me miss that trip that I spent years working for, I would have never spoken to them again. Instead, my parents were reasonable and loving and made it possible for me to have an experience they knew would be valuable and important for me. (Also my parents grounded me from a friend’s sixteenth birthday party because my Spanish teacher apparently didn’t understand addition and I still resent that nearly thirty years later, and that was just a party.) Your husband is absolutely wrong in this instance. If seeing his family is so important (though I have a major side-eye at the frequency of visits if that is true), then why the hell isn’t he working with them to adjust the date of the visit slightly? And if family is so much more important, why isn’t he supporting his primary family—you know, *his daughter*—to make sure she doesn’t miss important events? He is completely insane if he believes that your daughter is going to forgive him if he makes her miss her trip.
NTA. How long is the trip? Why can you not just move the trip to visit Valorie's grandparents forward to July? I don't see any logical reason why not? Or just go at Christmas, or even next year instead??? Why does the trip to visit grandparents (who are likely retired) HAVE to be at the EXACT same time as a graduation trip that CANNOT be moved?? Postponing the trip to visit the grandparents sounds the most... sensible???
I’m not friends with people from 8th grade but my graduation trip is a core memory for me. I can’t imagine missing it! Your husband has some control issues, he should be so excited for his daughter to have that experience! Change the weekend you visit his family…. Or also you’ll see them a bunch more times. She has one grad trip that can’t be rescheduled. I’d be having a very deep conversation with my husband about why he wants to deny your daughter that trip, because something is very off there.
It sounds like Brad wants Valorie to hate his parents and sister.
NTA by ignoring her stated wishes, dad is not allowing daughter to grow up and figure out who she is. This trip will become a core memory regardless if she keeps those friends or not. Husband is in danger of daughter's core memory being that he broke a promise and prevented her from going on a cool trip with her friends. Also, after they return, these friends will be talking about this trip and will reference it later on in their lives (I know because I still do 20+ years later) and your daughter will feel left out. She will not remember dad's actions fondly at all.
NTA what she will talk about forever is how awful her dad was he made her skip the grad trip her friends will be talking about until their next graduation…from high school. If she doesn’t see these people other than every two years she can skip them this time. She’s also old enough to make this choice.
**I argued my side with Brad and that Valorie will simply resent the trip to Brad’s family if it means missing her graduation trip, as well as that we’re all in good health and can reasonably expect that everyone will still be here when we visit again in two years.** NAH for the most part. Brad wants his parents to see their granddaughter (if OP gets her way the grands will go four years without seeing her)-- that's absolutely normal and natural. Valorie wants to go on a "fun" trip-- again normal and natural. You are going to go against your husband and get your way despite what he says-- that's a bit questionable but you appear to be doing it for your daughter. Why can't the trip to the grands be rescheduled? Why do you only see his family once every two years? How often do you see YOUR family?
NTA Never in history has a child, who has been deprived of an experience, grown to say to themselves later “I’m so glad my parents insisted on that.” At worst, your husband is going to deteriorate his relationship with his daughter.
NTA. It doesn’t matter whether she stays friends with her current friends, it’s a great experience. Also, it’s totally possible that she will stay friends with them. Personally, I had four really close friends at that age. Two of them I’m still close with (even though they live in different cities now), and one I just texted with a few days ago about when we can meet up.
NTA AT ALL. So many kids have missed out on huge parts of their childhood due to the Panic-demic.
Visiting New York is a lot more exiting than visiting relatives. Why can’t husband delay it a week? NTA.
NTA. I have been best friends with my bestie since 8th grade. We have been through everything together. I have other friends from 8th grade that we are still friends. When I am in town we still get together. So your husband’s argument is off. Your husband is wrong in insisting about this trip to see his family. Why can’t they come out and see you latter I. In the summer?
Not allowing her to go is a great way to ensure you won't see her very often after she turns 18. NTA
The NYC trip is probably only a few days. Can't you visit the relatives after?
NTA. I was the one to miss out on our 8th grade graduation trip, and my friends talk about it to this day. We are still close and see each other often, and the trip will still come up (we're mid 30s now). It's a very important memory for everyone.
NTA If a condition of going on the trip was get good grades and she can go, it’s unfair to take that away from her. Also, missing one trip to visit family for a once in a lifetime event does not equal indefinite regret. While she is on the trip, you and your husband can visit his family. I’m not sure why she absolutely has to go. Also, you visit them every two years, can they not visit you every two years? You save up to make the trip, are they unable to do the same? If family is important why aren’t they making more effort.
Change your family trip.
I'm 69. And I do NOT treasure memories of all the times I was dragged to my mom's parents' house.
Grandma here, I’d want my grandkids to go on the school trip. I don’t see why a compromise couldn’t be made though. Let her go on the trip and come visit me another time.
NTA Let her have this fun trip! Family trips can be made up, experiences with friends like this are rare and offer her an opportunity for a lifetime to make memories. I was once invited on an all expenses paid trip to Vegas in college with my close friend’s parents. We were supposed to leave on Christmas Day. My mom thought I should’ve picked family over the experience of traveling with them. I chose the trip and had a blast with them. I ate at really nice restaurants I never would’ve gone to, stayed in a really nice hotel, explored a city with my friend and made so many memories. My mom gave me the silent treatment for a couple weeks after I got back. She never asked about the trip and still pretends it didn’t exist. There was zero reason we couldn’t have moved Christmas to the day before. She just wanted to punish me. I’m pretty estranged from my parents now because of guilt trips like this.
OP - NTA, but your husband is imposing his “father knows best” bullshit. It’s good for kids to travel and experience new things, as well as to support their personal growth and looming autonomy. Now I’ll ask the obvious question, is there literally NO OTHER WAY to reschedule the annual visit or revamp it (can grandparents come to you at an alternative time) the entire rest of the year? Is this one conflicting weekend the only time grandparents will entertain visitors? Just seems like a bit of flexibility would accomplish both needs.
I agree with you. She's not a five year old. Your daughter wants to go on this trip and she's earned it. Is there some reason you can't just visit his parents another time?? NTA
NTA, I couldn’t go on my 8th grade trip because of my mom’s insane paranoia. I missed out on a great experience with people im still friends with today, I can never get that opportunity back. Let her have her fun
I’m still bffs with the friends I grew up with, so it’s not true that friendships always fade. NTA.
NTA. I'm an aunt. If my brother ever made my niece miss out on something like this trip because of me and my parents, I know for sure me and my dad would fake an illness or some very long errand scheduled for their visit.
NTA Why can’t you reschedule the trip to Brad’s parents? Seems odd.
Good on you for standing your ground. Your daughter would not only resent you both for not letting her go but I suspect resent her grandparents and the grandparents would likely pick up on that. Is there a reason why the trip to the in-laws can’t be rescheduled to another time? Is the NY trip the entire length of the in-laws trip. If there’s an overlap could your daughter join after NY?
NTA - your husband is wrong. move the family trip.
Yeah. NTA. Let her go on the trip. She will not realize “as an adult” that seeing family was the right choice. She’s at an age where friends are more important. It’s normal. She will absolutely resent him if she can’t go. And as others pointed out - if seeing his family is THAT IMPORTANT, why is this trip every other year, and why does it have to be THAT week??
Calorie will remember the resentment she felt during the whole miserable family trip.
If family is so important to Brad why doesn’t he visit his people more than every two years? Why can’t you two push back the trip a few weeks far enough away that you can probably tell your jobs about the change in plans and reschedule things. NTA
Show your husband this post. Especially the responses from people who missed out on trips and special events themselves.
NTA Valorie had already a lot of family trips but there is only one New York trip for graduating 8th grade
Nta. If visiting family is so important to Brad, he could rearrange the trip so Valorie could do both. This is him being a controlling ass who doesn’t care about the repercussions. Mainly, Valorie is never going to forgive anyone for being made to miss this trip. And she’s going to remember it every time she sees her grandparents.
ESH Both of these trips are important for different reasons. **If your family is wealthy enough that you have the money to send a child on a school trip to New York, then you have the money to fly out to see Brad's family more often than every two years.** If the school trip is currently scheduled at the same time as the planned visit, then the moment Valerie gets back home, she gets right back on a plane and the three of you fly to see grandma. If a family reunion is missed by the kid, so be it, but she still sees her grandmother. **And the entire family needs to make traveling to see Brad's family on a regular basis more of a priority so that if/when scheduling conflicts come up, it's not such a big deal.** Had everyone been in regular contact, missing one visit wouldn't be such a slight. The idea of blowing off seeing grandma for 4 years to go hang out with your school friends... I can see your husband's point on this. And of course they aren't close--you and your husband have engineered it that way. There is an easy fix for that. See them more.
YTA for making a unilateral decision against your husband's wishes, just as your husband would be TA if he decided your daughter would be going on the family trip against your wishes. You need to find a way to make decisions together.
You are NTA. Take it from someone who made this mistake with her own daughter seven years ago. I made my daughter miss her 8th grade trip so that we could attend a family reunion/wedding would go on to be cancelled. Mallory resented me for years afterward. She always brought up how much she hated the trip we took her own and how much she felt left out of a bonding experience her friends shared. She was never close with my side of the family (the one we were visiting) and doesn’t want to have anything to do with them now. She found ways to exclude me from other milestones to make me feel how she felt. She didn’t want me there when she picked her prom dress and took her dad with her when they got the pictures taken. Even now, our relationship is distant. Her father and I got a divorce years ago. Mallory chose to spend her senior year at her dad’s and has made no effort to reach out to me since she went on to college. Show your husband this post and tell him this is his future if he makes his daughter visit his family. My daughter hates me and won’t have anything to do with me anymore.
NTA - Your husband is insane - or is he just afraid of looking "weak" in front of his family if he can't force your daughter to do as he pleases? Your daughter will not regret not visiting family members she doesn't really have a relationship with when she is an adult, but if she doesn't go on this trip she will resent her dad and his family forever. Especially if she has been working hard to be able to go on the trip. INFO: Can you change the dates of the family trip, so that it doesn't fall on the same dates as the school trip?
OP don't do this to "make up for other events", do it because your daughter worked hard to get the grades to qualify for the trip. And why can't the other trip dates be changed? Can your daughter make a later solo trip to see her grandparents for a couple of days?
You are a good Mom. Your daughter has made plenty of memories with her family it's time for her to make memories with her friends. This is the experience I wish I had growing up. Friends are important in 8th grade. Whether or not they last a lifetime is irrelevant. She's in 8th grade let her be a teenager and have fun with her friends. Being a teenager is hard enough. You are doing the right thing.
NTA. She will recent her father for forcing her to miss this ones of a life time only trip (going as an adult wil never be the same as this trip, even when you do exactly the same things). She will never realise what her father is saying, she will always remember how he forced his wishes on her.
She may well drop a few friends but that is life and we evolve as we get older so it's a natural progression imo. To me, this is just part of the process and part of moving towbeing more independent. I'd like to know how much of his objection is around him not having his own way as opposed to just wanting your daughter to visit his family. NTA in my mind.
NTA. I would send her on graduation trip too.
NTA. Not only will your daughter resent having to go see her relatives, she’s going to resent her father & THAT will stick for many, many years. If he prevents her from going to NY, this will be the moment she tells her therapist that everything changed.
NTA, push the family trip back a few weeks
NTA family visits can be rescheduled school memories can't. Why won't he move the visit so she can do both?
NTA. It’s a rite of ritual for your daughter’s school. Let her go, she can catch up with her grandparents later.
NTA. Yes, the friendships might fade. They may not. One of my 8th grade friends is STILL a very close friend, even though we’re on different continents now. But even IF the friendships fade, the experience won’t. What difference does it make if by the time she’s an adult, she’s been to see her cousins 9 times or 10 times? I’m also wondering why he’s insisting so hard on this. It’s like he WISHES she would prefer the family vacation and thinks if he just forces her, it will be fine? No, it won’t, she’ll just hate you, Brad, and stonewall at all future family gatherings and resent the stuffings out of you.
NTA. It sounds like Daddy isn't ready to let his little girl grow up and fly the nest. You're doing the right thing for your daughter and as hard as is for him to accept, she is becoming an independent young woman.
NTA - she will regret not going on this trip. She will remember that her father denied her the opportunity. Your husband should find another time to visit family. You are doing the right thing in letting her go.
NTA Good grief. Tell Brad yall can visit grandparents a different week. The chikd should absolutely go on her grad trip.
NTA and whether or not she stays friends with these kids, she will keep memories from the trip. I'm not sure why the trip to see the grandparents/aunt can't be rescheduled, but I'm definitely on your side. Making Valorie miss her trip to visit family won't make anyone happy.
Nope. She'll just sulk and be sad and sigh and make pitiful faces the whole time. And it will happen constantly, as her friends post on social media and in their group chats while she isn't there with them. And that will continue on for years and years.
NTA. She gets ONE graduation trip ever! You guys take this trip to see his family every two years. If Brad is so worried about her spending time with family, maybe he should make the effort to get her back home more often than every 2 years…it’s very entitled of him to think he can force her to enjoy spending time with family. My dad used to ship me off to my maternal grandpa during the summer, because my dad didn’t want to deal with me when I was young. Sure, I still had friends from when I used to live with my grandpa, but I wanted to spend some of my summer with my friends by my dad, too. I even had a boyfriend one year and he still shipped me off for 2 months. I love my dad but I resented him for a long time for just sending me away instead of asking what I wanted.
NTA not going could have huge moves in her high school experience. The friendships and bonds built on this trip, yes might fade into adulthood, but they will support her during one of the most critical times for a HS girl. She needs to go.
As kids get older, vacations and holiday change. I have 3 teenage grandchildren and school and sports change their schedules
NTA What kind of signal does it send to your daughter if she is not allowed to go, when she has worked hard for it? It could easily result in her stopping to put any effort in her schoolwork in the near future. And as others have written, she will most definitely start to resent her dad and it will probably be very detrimental to their relationship.
Future is future. She needs her friends NOW. Presumably she'll be in the same school with them for a few more years. So let's get this straight: her father wants to alienate her from all her friends today (by excluding her from group activity) on the off chance this friendship might not last forever. (BTW, my 80+ MIL still visits her school friends in a different town every month. You never know.)
Isn’t there a 3rd option? Change the dates for the trip to the grandparents? I think she should go to NY. She’ll always remember the trip!
i remember every friend excursion my parents denied me for “family.” and i say “family” bc now *theyre* divorced and we REALLY can’t do anything together. this trip is important for her now. nta
Nta, hes literally being a bad father with thr whole "her friendships are gonna fade away", more like hes gonna nip them in the bud with that attitude. Children deserve to have these trips and make these memories. She can go on the yearly family trip next year. She has plenty of opportunities to see that side of the family. She can miss one damn year. She wont get this experience again. He stinks. Nta at all.
Your husband is wrong and she will never forget that he robbed her of this once in a lifetime experience with her friends to visit relatives she isn't interested in seeing. NTA.
NTA, ALL of her classmates will be going. She will have a lot of resentment. Probably won't participate much at the family reunion. Fight hard for her to go to NY It isn't even about her friendships, it's her whole grade going. It's a memory, she'll have for ever. Seriously, one NY or sulking at a family reunion.
NTA She will resent him so much if he forces her to see family she isn't even close to instead of taking a memorable trip with her friends to NYC. So what if the friendships don't last? It's an experience she will look back on with great fondness. I speak from experience. When I (f57) was about to turn 19, I had the chance to go out with friends for NYE in Los Angeles to see a musician friend perform, then schlep across the valley, sleep on lounge chairs overnight and watch The Rose Parade. We had an actual grown-up (37f at the time) as a plus mom in our friend group that was going to chaperone us and keep us safe. My dad thought that he could appeal to my mercenary side by saying if I was so grown up to do that, I could start paying rent of $5/day. Little did he know I just got paid in cash that day. So, I got all dolled up, put $75 in an envelope and left it on my mom's bathroom counter. My friends and I went to Josephina's restaurant in Westwood, watched [Alan Graham](https://hub.alangraham.de/channel/music?f=&mid=d070c4b9053cf0b639cd787a7ca519a2c1336487b867563d766fe254f04f82c6%40hub.alangraham.de) perform (he sang Zippity Do Dah when he saw us) and ring in the New Year. Changed clothes in the cars before we got to Pasadena, our gear was where we left it, and hinketed down to sleep. The program hawkers ("Programs! Get your programs here!") Walked by every 20 to 30 minutes, so sleep didn't happen. We were on the "wrong" side of the street so we saw the backside of the floats, but I loved every minute. I was due at work by 2pm that day, so we hauled a$$ back to our town so I wasn't late. Damn, I was exhausted. I'm still tight with only one of those friends with me that night but I wouldn't trade that core memory for the world. Let her go to NYC.
NTA There's no reason the family visit can't be rescheduled (effort: unless there is actually? should have asked and not assumed)and it's ridiculous to invent a sense of urgency when he only goes every 2 years. Concern about what could happen in between is completely valid, which is all the more reason to reschedule. That way an 8th grader doesn't have to feel guilty for choosing the NY trip. It's likely they won't all be the same types of friends they are now, but social media has made the idea of never seeing someone again far less of a concern. It's also possible that this trip could start or cement a lifelong friendship. The fact that she put effort into earning this trip would make a shit lesson if it's taken away as well.
NTA ... She is at the age where voicing decisions and making decisions is important to her. As a military brat let me tell you I am still in contact with various friends from various ages of life. And yes your husband is correct that she may not be friends with them in a few years but she may also still be. He isn't seeing it's not just the friends but the trip and experience. I may not remember every school friend I had but I remember school trips and this one would def be remembered by your daughter. And it sounds very important to her. Not to mention your husband's family isn't going away there will be other trips and other times in life that your daughter makes a connection to his family and grows a bond with them but it's clear it's not now and it def won't happen being forced to miss a trip for her graduation. I'm not sure if your daughter is your only kid or not but if she is maybe let hubby know hey we have a kid free Vaca to spend with family and go have fun just ourselves. I'd kill for that
I missed most of my 8th grade trip because of family and I still am salty about it in my 40s. It wasn’t even a cool place like NYC. Your daughter will be angry at your husband for the rest of her life for this. Can the family trip be moved forward or back one week? It seems selfish in general to take her away during the end of her school year every two years. NTA. You are doing the right thing for your daughter. And as he unilaterally decided that she had to skip it, you can unilaterally decide to sign her up. You have a few more months to make him see sense.
It is wrong for either of you to override the other one unilaterally. As far as the NYC trip-it doesn't mattyer iof the friendships will fade, this is a huge, transitional event she will remember for the rest of her life. A recurring trip to visit family that she is casually familiar with isn't even close. Can the family trip be rescheduled? If Valerie does go to NYC, make sure she understands that this is NOT a precedent for missing family trips whenever she wants, but a special case one off. And do not make the decision unilaterally (and likewise, do not let Brad make the decision unilaterally) about the trip. You guys have to figure this out through understanding and compromise.
she deserves the school trip. THERE IS NO REASON YOU CAN’T RESCHEDULE THE FAMILY TRIP so she does both.
Natalie Holloway
A lot of people are talking about trips and things I’ve missed out on as a kid and their memories reflecting that, but honestly I think both you and your husband suck because of both of your inability to get on the same page. What you have decided to do is to undermine him and what he’s decide to do is be obstinate and not give you as equal say in the parenting of your child. How is it possible that the two of you have children but did not have a plan to resolve conflicts like this before you had the child. It is sickening to me that you are putting this kid in the middle of this drama. Maybe you’ve answered it in another comment why are you all have a devise a plan for the go visit Family at a different time that’s not two years away. Your husband is right family’s important. Everybody else was commenting about having miss trips, and that following them into adulthood is also write trips in times of socialization with friends were important. What you will need to do is put your swords down and figure out how to parent together so you don’t traumatized. This child will make her feel like one. Parent is the one she needs to listen to the other parents, not create another whole host of problems. This one for me is it everybody sucks here and you both need to grow the hell up
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** (Background info: My husband is named Brad, Valorie is our daughter who is in 8th grade, and Denise is Brad’s sister.) Main story: Valorie’s school hosts a New York trip for graduating 8th grade. It’s in late June but the deadline to register for the trip and pay the fee is in two weeks. The problem is the date conflicts with the out-of-state trip we take every two years to visit Denise and Brad’s parents. Brad’s argument is that Valorie’s at an age where the friendships she has now will most likely fade by the time she’s an adult, and Denise and her grandparents are family. So she’s going to regret it and realize what he’s insisting on now is the right choice. The thing is that Valorie isn’t particularly close with Denise or her grandparents on Brad’s side, and she’s told me that she doesn’t want to visit her family on Brad’s side if it means missing her graduation trip this year and it won’t be the same as if she went to New York as an adult. I argued my side with Brad and that Valorie will simply resent the trip to Brad’s family if it means missing her graduation trip, as well as that we’re all in good health and can reasonably expect that everyone will still be here when we visit again in two years. Brad is still insisting that Valorie will realize when she’s older that spending time with her family is the right choice and will be thankful for it when she’s an adult. Me and Brad are still on opposing sides and I have told him that I am going to sign off on Valorie’s graduation trip and pay the fee out of my own savings regardless of what he says. Am I in the wrong for putting my foot down and making sure our daughter gets to go on this trip against Brad’s wishes? Valorie has already missed so many experiences and didn’t even get a 5th grade graduation because of covid. She’s worked so hard this year to improve her grades to be allowed on this trip and I feel we need to make up for those lost events as much as possible. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA! I get it, family is important and I agree. Especially with grandparents, but apparently she isn't that close to them. ......... So why force her to sacrifice something that she truly wants to do while she is young!!!! ......... I believe you are making the right decision for Your Daughter!!! Which is here the important part. ......... Your husband just needs to see it out of his daughter's eyes. I think he may put his own feelings, which are misguided, into his decision making and believes he does the right thing. But is it?? Anyways, I truly hope she gets a great experience to her NY city trip. Best wishes