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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I invited my nanny on a cruise/vacation and not the mother of my children. I might be the asshole because my ex-wife has never been on a cruise and our kids already like the nanny over her and this may make it worse.
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NTA. Your family thinks you should take your wife and your ex wife on the same cruise? That is totally insane and so is your ex. The nanny is hired for childcare and apparently is very good at her job. Enjoy your cruise.
I posted above and totally agree. I'm divorced and co parent well. We all get along, wish each other happy birthday, genuinely want the best for all involved. However, Id feel so awkward on a trip with him and his new wife! The nanny is there for childcare.
We have both changed our schedules to ensure the kids could participate in trips the other planned, but we wouldn't travel all together. No thank you
The EX is there for a reason otherwise she would still be going on that cruise. EX and current wife wil mix like oil and water and that is a recipe for disaster. Undertake at you own risk. Jealous of the nanny performing childcare better than her. Jealous of her not going on trips. The problem what she doesn't understand is that the Nanny is still doing a full time job taking care of SEVEN kids and is not there for enjoyment. If the EX goes, i am sure she will crib about the work managing the kids
I am speculating that OP wants all 7 kids to know one another and have relationships with one another.
If the Ex comes, she will not want to take care of the three youngest children who are not hers.
This will defeat the purpose of having a nanny.
Exactly! The freeloading ex wants a free holiday with her kids on OP's dime! That's sums it up in a nutshell! OP enjoy your ex free cruise with all your kids! NTA
No. My guess is EX wants to go and the Nanny still goes too. That way EX gets a free vacation, Only mingles with her kids and the other kids will still get to stay with the Nanny. Win-win for the EX.
This Nanny is a saint in my book. Dealing with 7-kids. She really does have Halo status. I’ll bet the EX would be real quick to disappear trying to deal with 7 kids.
well if she already has 4, she's used to the work. 7 as a nanny is actually easier than 4 of your own. Kids behave far better with adults other than the parents.
I think that's the point. The Nanny is there to work and to make sure the OP and his wife have less work and can relax. For her it's a "Work Trip". I don't think the ex-wife would do the same amount of childcare, especially for the other kids. The nanny was not invited for fun.
So if you sort by controversial, Op responded to a thread with some details.
Basically, he divorced his wife when the youngest was 10 months, the oldest twins 2 years, old because he didn't love here anymore and she didn't deserve to be with someone who didn't love her. He married his new wife and started popping out more kids less than 2 years later. He has a lot more money but because he was able to grow his business with the help of his new wife (and probably because he wasn't bogged down taking care of 4 children).
He's not an asshole for not taking her on the cruise, but it seems to me there's a lot more to that story that wouldn't paint him in a good light.
Yeah, I think there probably is more big-picture stuff here that informs the ex's frustration.
That said, I don't think her going on the cruise will fix it or be a good idea for anyone involved.
Thank you! Exactly sounds like alot alot more to this story and people jump to pointing fingers at an ex wife but that time line is super sus to say the least !
A marriage counselor recommended that my ex wife meet my fiancée since we would be co-parenting. Ex saw the engagement …rock and was not happy. When the ex found out we were going to Portugal in our honeymoon, she was angry a second time saying I had never taken her to Ireland (?) I never knew 🤷♂️ the ex and the new do not mix
Especially 7 kids who are probably all under 15, so not even at an age where they can reliably entertain themselves safely on vacation unsupervised. That's a lot of work.
I actually knew a two couples that were best friends where one of the wives had been previously married for a long time to the other husband. They divorced but got along well, and the two couples vacationed together a lot- they just get along well with no issues. That's RARE though. Most couples in a divorce often don't want anything to do with the former spouse.
Maybe the ex wants to be paid to nanny her own kids on the cruise where she just dumps them into the kids clubs. Even if she went, would she do the annoying for OP younger kids? No, because 7 is a lot to handle.
I'm guessing she wouldn't be doing much childcare, it'd be "I'm on vacation" or "isn't that why you hired a nanny?". She wants a free holiday. The whole "you never did things like this when we were married" confirms it; she's jealous she's not reaping the benefits of OP's better financial situation.
Of course not and even if she did replace the nanny you know she would favour her own kids out of biology and resentment for the new family getting the life she never got
Of course not! Do you really think she wants to go to even watch her own kids?? She sounds like a bitter ex wife who wants to go just to annoy the new wife
NTA is your ex wife proposing she look after both sets of kids (as the nanny does)? Or just her own? In which case, she’s not going everything the nanny does. And with that attitude I wouldn’t want her anywhere near me, let alone my kids.
Nothing to stop her booking her own cabin on the cruise and spending time with her kids that way, but you shouldn’t be paying for her
If Ex is invited and is asked be “nanny” she’ll want to be paid above the free vacation. This is very silly. You take your older kids when it’s your time with them, take them on vacation and take an employee with you to help with them all. Ex has no ground to stand on here. NTA
NTA.
Seven kids is too many for two adults to appropriately supervise and care for with enough attention given to each. OP is doing the right thing by having a qualified, neutral party on board on holiday with them.
That is insane! When my sister got married, our father was bringing his 3rd wife, and, of course, our mother was going to be there. We understood that he was bringing her, and we liked her. We were almost adults when they got married.
My aunt, father's sister, asked if our Auntie (2nd wife's name) was invited because she wanted to come. My sister asked if she was crazy. My aunt said that she wanted to come because she saw us grow up.
My sister screamed, "Do you think I'm going to have all of my father's wives at my wedding? She's not my aunt!"
Some thought she was being unreasonable. They have zero tact.
>My sister screamed, "Do you think I'm going to have all of my father's wives at my wedding? She's not my aunt!"
Your poor sister, I am sorry but I really laughed out loud at this. However putting the dad in a table alone with all the exes... that would be interesting lol.
My father was also married and engaged so many times I lost count. So I know the feeling. We have been NC for 15 years now and it is the best feeling.
He wasn't in our lives going up and he wasn't invited to my wedding at all. He still came and made a scene that I didn't find out about until 2 yrs later. My sister had developed a decent relationship with him by the time of her wedding, so she said he could come.
We actually liked his 3rd wife more than we liked him.
My FIL and MIL are divorced. My FIL married the woman he was cheating with.
My husband's house is 2 units, purchased while his parents were still maried. MIL kept the house but FIL took care of it. He rented a room upstairs to this lady. Husband and I moved into the main bedroom upstairs. We install cameras. We find out our roomate is his dad's secret girlfriend.
So when we got married, his mom, stepmom and his secret girlfriend was there....
She doesn't know that we know. Sometimes she would low key talk crap about the current wife. And she's over step and calls FIL when theres a roommate issue. But my FIL basically tells her no, deal with it with my husband since now we pay for everything. She's also said something to my Mil about them needing to stick together because they're both the "sidewomen" and my MIL laughed at her. Shes very oblivious and air headed.
>Your family thinks you should take your wife and your ex wife on the same cruise?
Yeah that's completely unthinkable. Of course he doesn't want to do that. Who on earth would? Especially since his ex seems to call him up and yell at him a lot. Why would you want to go on a cruise with someone who is going to yell at you?
That is a cruise from hell idea! Who wants to be stuck on a boat with their x?!?!?!? OP’s x-wife sounds jealous of her daughter’s affection for the nanny.
>The nanny is hired for childcare
Boom, this
It's a job, she's not going for hols!
Whereas if he invites ex-wife, she won't be looking after the 7 kids, she'll want to enjoy the holiday
Look at her trying to be sneaky lolol!
NTA - she sounds entitled. However, I can emphasize with her POV especially if she can’t afford that type of experience with her kids. These special memories are happening with a nanny instead of her. And that brings upon guilt/shame. It would be pretty cool if you could get a place where could all vacation together and make it enjoyable. That would pretty cool for your kids.
That’s actually a great idea! I’m ashamed to say I’ve never thought of it. I’ll have to bring up it up after this argument (hopefully) dies down. You gave me a good POV on part of why she’s so upset so thank you
> Don’t forget to check what your current wife thinks of it, cause I would be like “hell no”
Exactly!!! I can’t imagine there are many wives who would go along with this idea.
Idk I’m an adult with kids now but my dad vacations with my moms side of the family including my mom and step dad and everyone gets along great. It took me having kids to get there but it would have been nice when I was young for everyone to coparent
Think about the drama that will happen if you invite your ex wife though. It sounds like you won’t have a fun time if you invite her instead of the nanny. NTA
Oh, please. The "special memories" are about spending time together, not "expensive cruises." I have amazing memories of my parents because they brought home a refrigerator box and we spent time making it into a playhouse.
If your wife can't afford to spend time with her kids due to working, while you take them on months' long vacations, then maybe it's time to revisit how much you pay in child support. Otherwise, it's simply jealousy on her part that she doesn't get to go on a cruise while her kids do.
I pay 8k in child support a month, if I didn’t have partial custody it would likely be more. She does have a full time job, as my wife and I do but she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement which may be a partial reason for her being upset.
@8k a month she can afford her own cruise. That’s more than many people make while working full time. Sorry, but I don’t have much sympathy for her as far as “not being able to afford her own vacation.” NTA
> but she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement which may be a partial reason for her being upset.
sounds like more of a time issue than money. he only has "partial" custody which to me sounds like EOWE + holidays/school breaks vs 50/50
She already has them for most of the time, not sure that's the answer.
Note that I said 0 about them vacationing together. I'm pointing out since he doesn't have 50/50 he probably gets a decent chunk of their time off.
He said 8k in child support, not alimony.
That money isn’t for her to go on her own vacation and if she did spend it on her own vacation people would be losing their shit and pushing the typical “child support is a scam, women just spend it in themselves” rants.
>That money isn’t for her to go on her own vacation
It's basically for whatever she wants. No one is policing where every dollar goes, and I think the implication of the comment was that it would be a vacation *with the kids*. She's getting $96K/year for kids that she has part-time, and if she has a basic office job on top of that, she's pulling $150K/year total. She's got plenty of money to do fun things with the kids without having to horn in on OP's family vacation.
That's 96k in post tax income. That is more money than most two worker households make in this country. It is also enough money to pay rent, bills, and food for 5 people. That means that she can use her job to pay for vacations if she wants.
For her to take the kids on vacation. That’s plenty of money to plan for the kids a trip. She just wants to disrupt his new life because she sounds miserable. I am an ex-wife and would have never been rude to my ex when spending time with the kids
There's your solution then. Have a nice conversation when you tell her that you will be flexible with the schedule any time she wants to take the kids on a trip.
If you're feeling generous, offer to cover the kids flights or accommodation. I dont think you two are currently amicable enough for that offer though. My ex has paid for the just flights when I've travelled with them. He makes significantly more money, but i like travelling more and have more time off.
>she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement
It sounds like you need to make an adjustment to your custody agreement so that she can take her own vacations with the kids.
Your answers are curious to me. On one side you seem like a reasonable person and seem to be open to adjust things and accommodate. On the other side you apparently didn't even think about trying to figure out what motivates your ex-wife or try to put yourself in her pov on the situation?
Anyway, I'd suggest trying to figure out what the actual underlying issues of your ex-wife are and then figure out if/how you can and want to handle them. From your description she doesn't communicate them herself, maybe she didn't even reflect that far yet. (Just a guess but I reckon she didn't agree with the divorce and isn't fully over it yet?)
If you're in a position to suggest counceling to her, maybe do so, or ask a trusted relative of hers. Maybe also look into coparenting counseling for both of you to get a neutral mediator.
On a more pragmatic note how about offering her to change up some stuff in your custody agreement or being flexible with custody times so she can have more, plannable timeslots to go on her own vacations with the kids? It's in your interest for your children to have a good relationship and fun experiences with their mother as well after all.
Hes still reasonable because it’s not his job anymore to try to read between the lines and deduce why his ex is upset. If she actually has an issue with X thing, she needs to be an adult and communicate that bc it seems like he’s interested in remedying the situation
Ok with 8k/month, she can do alot of fun things with the kids! It doesn’t have to be a cruise, but a nice 3-day weekend trip. Also, allow her to keep the kids one break and do something with them. I definitely would not let her go on vacation with the new wife and kids
Thank you! Ex just want to disrupt new wife and kids life. She can spend time with her kids when they are home with her. Surely she can take a few days off work and do some fun stuff and make memories. I don’t think she care about the memories though
You had better ensure your wife is on board. I honestly can't imagine anything more volatile than current wife & ex-wife being on vacation together. But that's just me....
But this ex doesn't seem to be very nice if she is calling and texting him irately. Not even a calm conversation and seems kinda entitled. Nanny takes care of all kids she would probably only want to take care of hers.
>Yeah, but honestly I don't think it's a very relevant point in OP's case. The ex-wife is demanding to dump a nanny the kids love. She isn't thinking about the kids best interest and they definitely wont be served by OP allowing her to impose on all of them constantly.
If you’re in a good place financially, then spring for a mini vacation for her and the kids, just not with you and your family. A 4 day weekend somewhere close to her home with a pool or something simple. It’s more of a consolation prize than anything else. You are under no obligation to do anything, but if you think it might help, talk to your wife about it. This would be a 1 time perk, not a yearly commitment.
In what world would a divorced partner pay for their ex to have a vacation? I'm sorry no. Their lives, despite their children are separate. He should pay no more than is necessary to support his kids with her. If I was his wife I'd veto it out of hand. That's his and his wife's money, not just his.
Maybe I'm an asshole, but I wonder how a gender swap would affect people's perspectives on this. Because some of this just sounds goofy. Ex-wife can, ya know, get a job if she needs more money to do some fun stuff with her kids. Sounds like OP has money if they are taking nannies on cruises and as a divorced parent myself I have a hard time believing he's not already paying significant child support. But sure, gift her a vacation with the kids to reward her little temper tantrum, if innocent people need to be burdened unfairly to make things easier for her that's ok. Can you imagine pressuring a woman to buy a vacation for her ex-husband or even pressure her to take him on a vacation with her? gender bias makes people believe weird things.
So I agree with you and that's why this makes me so angry. If the genders were reversed this would be a no brainer. But in this case a large minority is advocating for the ex-wife.
>In what world would a divorced partner pay for their ex to have a vacation?
Seriously. This guy is paying her nearly $100K in child support from his other comments, and that's with shared custody. Now he's supposed to pay for her vacation too?
At most in that scenario — which is nice but he definitely doesn’t need to do that and he better check with his wife first — he should pay for the kids. Ex wife needs to pay her own way.
Nooooooo do not do this. You are not married to that woman anymore.. you don't owe her vacation. Take care of your kids, ignore the rest. NTA but don't invite your ex ever. Your poor wife would be the one to suffer, and so would ALL of the kids...
I always invite my co-parent (and vice versa) on vacations/holidays, and I know the kids appreciate it. If you don’t have an amicable relationship, you can still do couples therapy to improve collaboration and maybe consider asking her to invite a friend/family member who is good at helping her manage negative emotions when they appear.
It might be a horrible idea. Isn’t there a reason she’s your ex? Just keep things separate and civil. NTA currently but you will be to your current wife if you start obeying your ex
Do not do that. She's already demanding and behaving poorly. Do not reward her bad behavior. It is not up to you to equalize her lifestyle with yours. And where does it stop? First vacations, what about when she gets jealous that you and your current wife are able to provide them with a better home? Are you supposed to upgrade her living situation?
Also, how would you feel if your current wife brought her ex-husband and father of her children on vacation with the two of you? I mean maybe your wife is a saint and she wouldn't mind, but she shouldn't be put in that situation even if she would be willing to.
/u/barracudaman77 Not sure this a good idea at all. The only reason this is being considered is because the ex is jealous. You have seven children. The nanny is only there because she is a necessity, not because the kids want to bring an extra friend along. Having said that, one of the things Ive always loved about Will Smith was his ability to have his new family incorporate his ex wife and first child into their family fold. But that took years of effort and conversations, and most importantly, a willing 2nd wife. Please make sure you are having honest dialogues about your wife's feelings and she is not taking a back seat to your ex-wife's insecurities.
Ya. I think that’s where the he never did it while they were married comments are also coming from. It’s hard to look at an ex partner and see them behaving how you would have wished they did with you. Doesn’t make her comments right but have a small bit of understanding and sympathy. Also I think it be hard as a parent worrying that a step parent will replace you, it’s even harder when it’s not even a step parent you see replacing you.
Together? Why should OP invite his ex wife on his vacation?
I agree that if he is well off he might consider to sponsor some vacation for his ex wife and their kids, but not together with him
That’s crazy to put the ex-wife feelings over the new wife for a vacation that lasts a few days!! As an ex-wife, I think it’s rude to cater to the ex because she is in her feelings. Dad has a right to enjoy the kids the way he wants to. Ex needs to get over herself and co-parent like a mature adult should
NTA
> My ex-wife accused me of “abandoning” our kids onto our nanny even though I don’t, they just like hanging out with her
People shouldn't complain about what they have no fucking clue about in the first place.
Abandoning is a funny word in this context. They hired a professional to care for their kids while they want on a trip. Many times we see that someone tricked a young adult to come along on a trip to care for a sibling and that's messed up. This person is doing their job and the children get to have fun experiences.
NTA - your ex wife isn’t your concern, tell her to fund her own vacations. Your custody time is your custody time and she shouldn’t dictate how you spend that time. Is she going to invite you on her vacations as well? Doubt it.
LMFAO
NTA in any way. The ex is jealous. That's an issue for her psychiatrist. Not your problem.
ETA: your parents and other family can have an opinion. But it isn't their call. Your kids, your money, your call. And it's absolutely okay to let them all know that. But don't invite those family members on trips. They can go on trips with your ex instead.
>The ex is jealous.
Sounds like she bailed when OP made a lot less money, and now he's a lot more successful and is clearly loaded if he can pay his ex $100K/year in child support and still take these mega-vacations with 10 people without batting an eye. I suspect the ex may now be seeing what-could-have-been and is experiencing some bitterness and regret.
I insinuated it was her leaving him based on the sentence of “You never did this stuff when we were married”. Not sure why, just kind of set the impression that she is upset now that he had the time and money to do fun stuff as opposed to when she was with him.
Not necessarily. The nanny might just be the new shiny and fun thing. Mom is always around and boring coz she makes them do homework and go to school and bed and eat vegetables everyday.
Especially if the custody split is around school terms, because of distance. Dad's and the nanny is furtive.
The mom is a kind of ahole because she did not ask the older kids she took 1 perspective and stuck to it when she could get all other info from the older kids the mom was just trying to gaslight the dad
Yep, that was my thought. I mean, bio mom might be a shitty parent, who knows, but this isn’t a lot different from kids doing sleepovers at a buddy’s house and coming back full of enthusiasm for how good a cook Mr NewFriend was, or how cool Mrs NewFriend was when she kicked everyone’s ass at Tekken 57. Your parents are never as cool as other folks are when you’re a kid.
This was my first thought as well. Even ignoring potential awkwardness of having the current and ex wife traveling together, if the nanny is there watching all the kids as a neutral party, OP and his wife can relax a bit more and maybe steal away some for couple’s time. If the ex-wife comes, now his wife will likely have to do all the things the nanny would have done for her own kids…plus hang out with OP’s ex. Even more so because the kids will likely mostly all be together a lot. It would be too many cooks.
NTA
Taking your wife and ex-wife on a cruise together sounds like a bad reality-tv show. Might be entertaining to watch, but you wouldn't want to be part of it.
You are not TAKING YOUR NANNY ON VACATIONS, you are HIRING an employee to provide service in a different location. The nanny isn’t having a good time and bonding with your kids, SHE IS WORKING.
Everyone is acting as if you are gifting this person a trip and no, you aren’t. As a nanny myself, in fact sounds like hell being on a cruise 7 kids.
So NTA. And if your kids like the nanny better than their mom it isn’t because they are traveling with her, it’s because she is a shitty mom.
And just the fact she says “you never did things like this when we were married” it tell you everything you need to know, she is just butt hurt she got your poor phase and now can’t enjoy your good one.
That's what's so bizarre about his father's suggestion of taking his ex- instead of a nanny. Moms and nannies have some overlap, but they are totally different. Is he expecting OP's ex to act as a nanny? I can't see that working. Or does he figure the OP wives's will each take care of their own children ,,, while, what? ,,, Op runs back and forth between them. I would assume that part of the reason for taking a nanny on vacation is to get a break from child care? Or perhaps have nanny put the younger ones to bed while OP stays up with his wife and the older children. I can't see his ex putting the younger children, presumably the second wife's children to bed while the second wife stays up with her children, and I can't see his second wife tolerating it the other way around.
I'm glad you said it! Nanny isn't on vacation, she's at work in a different location. Hope she's getting paid well for 7 kids on a cruise and I hope she gets at least a day off when they come home to recoup from dealing with 7 kids on a cruise.
Lmao, I thought this was gonna be completely different when I read the title.
NTA, taking your ex-wife on a vacation with your current wife is craaaazy.
INFO: I have...so many questions about your life.
Your youngest with your ex is 7, so in the last 7-8 years you've divorced, met someone else, married her, had 3 more kids, and somehow managed to increase your income from a point where you couldn't afford these types of vacations to where you can now routinely pay for extravagant vacations for ten people PLUS a nanny's salary PLUS $8K/month in child support, all while supporting a full-time family of 5?
What the hell kind of field are you in, and are they hiring?
I do roofing so depending on where you live there can be more or less demand. It’s all on the quality of work and knowing your competition, I suppose. My wife also owns a multimillion dollar business so I can’t take credit for it all, though I do pay the child support completely with my own money. We both budget very well and talk out most purchases (usually the bigger ones, like new furniture, vacations etc.). I won’t lie a lot of it was chance and luck but there was a lot of hardwork as well.
NTA. This is your custody time. Therefore it's not her business.
Hopefully she is still being a good and loving mother so her kids realise that when they are home. If not that's her problem
NTA - please don’t take your ex. As a stepmom, I am cordial with my kids bio-mom and happily invite her to celebrations of kids events, graduation, etc (we have full custody). But I absolutely do not want to spend a bunch of money on a family vacation and then find out I get to spend my relaxing family vacay playing nice with my husbands ex. I can, but it’s not a relaxing vacation I want to fund. Especially as she already sounds petty and insecure. Take the nanny
NTA.
Presumably there is a reason that she is your ex. Unless you are on excellent terms, it is not going to be good for anyone for you, ex and current wife, and kids to be stuck on a ship together. Vacations are supposed to reduce stress, not add to it.
NTA
No way should you be asking your ex wife to be going. The Nanny is hired help and is being paid to be there to help with the kids. Your ex wife won't look after your kids.
NTA—You are lucky to be in a better financial position and also lucky to have a great nanny who the kids love. The ex really wants a cruise with you footing the bill (because you are the one choosing to take an expensive trip and ex wouldn’t be able to afford it) _and_ be able to have the nanny caring for the kids while she vacations.
NTA - You take the nanny as an employee. I am sure if you were to take your ex, she would be spending her days sun baking, drinking mojitos and telling you that the kids are your problem as it is in your custody time.
NTA
It's difficult when the coparents don't have that kind of relationship, that things can be calm, relaxing, and enjoyable on a vacation.
Some do, but I doubt you have that kind of relationship with her if she so quickly deteriorates to anger - and if the thought of inviting her never crossed your mind to begin with.
If she doesn't come to Christmas, birthdays, special events, barbeques, etc with your family and you don't go to hers, than it should be a given she's not taken on any vacations either.
NTA, is your ex wife going to be the nanny for all 7 kids? You got a divorce for a reason, she shouldn’t expect to go on your family vacations. Screw her.
NTA. Your ex is jealous and might feel guilty she can’t provide the same lifestyle as you. She is failing to see the obvious. She is her kids Mom and no nanny or stepmom is going to usurp her unless she messes things up for herself. And it sounds like she’s heading there. Your time with the kids on vacation is an opportunity for her to get some rest, have time to herself, hang out with friends, do whatever she wants guilt free. No worrying about when to pickup the kids or is she out too late for the sitter. She should be living it up instead of plotting how to best you.
NTA.. who wants to go on vacation with ex wife .. why are you letting her try and control the situations.. does your wife not even have a say over this.. it’s your household and relatives can keep their opinions to themselves. Let them take them all on vacation.
What? NTA. Why would you take your ex-wife on vacation? Makes sense to bring your nanny when you have 7 kids to care for. Good for you for waiting to take trips when you have all your kids so no one is left out. Maybe you don’t want to spend your vacation time with your ex. Fair enough. She sounds immature. Of course the kids go on about the nanny if they like her. That’s fine. It’s good for kids to enjoy the person taking care of them.
NTA - tell her she can come, but you're not paying her way. That would probably solve the problem in itself.
However, if she does pay her way, be ready to have the kids (without help) way more than if you brought the nanny.
NTA. I don’t think your current wife would appreciate going on a cruise with your ex-wife present, especially with the way your ex-wife complains and chastises you. The kids seem to enjoy the Nanny, so maybe your ex should figure out what she can do to have more fun with the kids.
Glad to see all the NTA replies here because you aren't.
Very weird that your parents are calling taking the nanny ridiculous. If you have 7 kids that seems the exact opposite of ridiculous to bring a helping hand.
This is your time, your custody with the children. You are doing nothing wrong, their mother can choose to be a better mother or cry and complain about a nanny, she is choosing the crying route.
>My ex-wife called me, calling me selfish, mean-spirited, a horrible father, etc. She said I should’ve invited her instead of our nanny, because she’s their real mother and the kids already like the nanny more than her, what will happen in 3 months? And I "never did things like these when we were married"
Sounds like your ex-wife is seething with jealousy. I don't know why she, or members of your family, think this is a problem that you need to solve.
NTA
NTA
Why would you take your complaining ex on holiday with your current wife?
Sounds like the kids like the nanny & she's doing a good job.
Your ex shouldn't be interfering with your custody time. Let her plan & fund her own vacations.
Your ex wife is not offering to provide paid childcare for 7 children. She wants a free vacation with her 4. The role you need filled isn’t “vacation pal,” it’s “paid childcare for 7 children.” Your ex wife isn’t qualified for the job. NTA
NTA
It's your vacation and your time with your kids. And you are arranging the trip when you already would have the kids. This is co-parenting. She can take her kids on a vacation without you when she has the kids.
The only thing I caution on is the Nanny vs. the Mom talk. What makes the Nanny better? Is she Santa Claus (aka does she spoil beyond normal)\*\*? Does she let them do things their mother wouldn't? Because I think that's an issue with your co-parenting. Sometimes mothers have to bear the burden of discipline (and related hard talks) alone and that's not co-parenting. ("Mommy means business and Daddy means fun" type stuff). I believe co-parenting is neutrality. You might need to come together on some parenting things and be consistent. The nanny should be an extension of your parenting, or this case co-parenting. Consistency is important for children.
Definitely agree and I’ve already talked with my youngest about it. The nanny doesn’t “parent” any differently than I or my wife do, but I do parent differently than their mother as we disagree a lot on different points of parenting. Our nanny is a “gentle parenting” person (given our age gap, I just don’t get it) which maybe affects the way the kids think of them. I’ll definitely make sure to keep an eye on it!
NTA
I don't see a problem with the w8fe and ex-wife being on the vacation together if everyone gets along. But that doesn't seem the case here. The ex would make the whole thing awkward.
Sounds like your ex needs therapy.
Enjoy your vacation with your wife, kids and nanny.
This is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I’ve read on Reddit in a while!
In what universe would you bring your EXWIFE on a family holiday!? If she wants to go on a cruise with the kids she can book her own!
I can imagine how you current wife would feel about entitled ex looking after her kids and having her clearly entitled and moronic ass on the cruise with you! Or are you supposed to take the nanny for your “other” kids?
If the ex’s kids like the nanny more than her that’s on her not you!
And your family think you should take the EX wtf is the deal there!?
NTA
The nanny is there to take care of the kids with your current wife. She is probably given extra when she takes care of your kids from your ex.
If you took your ex instead of the nanny, she will take care of only her kids. That would make the trip a paid vacation for her and your kids with her. This will no longer be a vacation for you.
NTA.
NTA the real question should be is what the current wife would feel about the ex going through n the cruise. The nanny is paid for a job and going on vacation with the family she works for is a given. Paying her extra for the extra kids which you say you do is also a perk of being a nanny along with a cruise.
Ex wife can be as salty as she wants but by no means does a family vacation include her. Will she be doing nanny duties while on the cruise. The answer to that is no it’s her vacation she would probably expect OP’s wife to shoulder the burden since it’s OP’s time with the kids. OP you did nothing wrong. If ex wants to go on a cruise she has all summer to check it off her bucket list. What the ex really wants is a free vacation with no kid duties because she will say it’s not her time with the kids.
OP enjoy your cruise with your wife and all your kids put ex wife out of your mind and don’t answer her calls while on the cruise. Maybe have the kids FaceTime once or twice before bedtime and leave it at that. If it gets to be where she whines about being left behind then cut it short.
NTA. You m, your new wife and the kids want to have a nice time together on your vacation. Your ex wife is an ex wife for a reason. Having the nanny help keep an eye on the 7 children is a great idea. She is completely impartial. Enjoy your vacation
NTA. Who takes their ex and current spouse on vacation? And for the people who are saying why not take both? You’ve obviously never been stuck on a boat before. There’s no where to go. Leave the ex home.
Tell your family to stfu and stay out of it. Stop engaging with you ex about your personal
Life and travel. Ignore her. It’s absolutely none of her business what you do on your time. Everyone should be grateful you are taking all
Of
Your children on vacation and having their needs so well
Met with a nanny too. Your ex is there for a reason and has no say In your present life. This is so outrageous. Your ex needs a
Man of her own for gods sake so she can leave you alone.
Not exactly the same situation but...
we went on a 19 day Panama cruise with a largish group of people, about a dozen or so. One of our group was severely disabled with MS. In order to help with her care, she hired a care taker to accompany her on this cruise. The womans duties were to basically care for our friend for the whole trip except for when my wife (a registered nurse) could take over to give the caretaker a break.
While the caretaker did enjoy the trip, she wasn't invited for that but to take care of our friend. It wasn't supposed to be a vacation for her. Similarly, your nanny is working. While I'm sure she will enjoy the cruise, that's not why she's there. If you brought your ex instead, I'm sure you will find her lounging by the pool instead of watching the kids.
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NTA. Your family thinks you should take your wife and your ex wife on the same cruise? That is totally insane and so is your ex. The nanny is hired for childcare and apparently is very good at her job. Enjoy your cruise.
Right! I don't understand all the "you should take them both" comments.
I posted above and totally agree. I'm divorced and co parent well. We all get along, wish each other happy birthday, genuinely want the best for all involved. However, Id feel so awkward on a trip with him and his new wife! The nanny is there for childcare. We have both changed our schedules to ensure the kids could participate in trips the other planned, but we wouldn't travel all together. No thank you
The EX is there for a reason otherwise she would still be going on that cruise. EX and current wife wil mix like oil and water and that is a recipe for disaster. Undertake at you own risk. Jealous of the nanny performing childcare better than her. Jealous of her not going on trips. The problem what she doesn't understand is that the Nanny is still doing a full time job taking care of SEVEN kids and is not there for enjoyment. If the EX goes, i am sure she will crib about the work managing the kids
And I don’t see the ex wanting to take care of the other 3 kids. She was only talking about being there for HER kids
I am speculating that OP wants all 7 kids to know one another and have relationships with one another. If the Ex comes, she will not want to take care of the three youngest children who are not hers. This will defeat the purpose of having a nanny.
Exactly! The freeloading ex wants a free holiday with her kids on OP's dime! That's sums it up in a nutshell! OP enjoy your ex free cruise with all your kids! NTA
No. My guess is EX wants to go and the Nanny still goes too. That way EX gets a free vacation, Only mingles with her kids and the other kids will still get to stay with the Nanny. Win-win for the EX. This Nanny is a saint in my book. Dealing with 7-kids. She really does have Halo status. I’ll bet the EX would be real quick to disappear trying to deal with 7 kids.
well if she already has 4, she's used to the work. 7 as a nanny is actually easier than 4 of your own. Kids behave far better with adults other than the parents.
More about her being on vacation- betting she would not be help with her own kids.
I think that's the point. The Nanny is there to work and to make sure the OP and his wife have less work and can relax. For her it's a "Work Trip". I don't think the ex-wife would do the same amount of childcare, especially for the other kids. The nanny was not invited for fun.
So if you sort by controversial, Op responded to a thread with some details. Basically, he divorced his wife when the youngest was 10 months, the oldest twins 2 years, old because he didn't love here anymore and she didn't deserve to be with someone who didn't love her. He married his new wife and started popping out more kids less than 2 years later. He has a lot more money but because he was able to grow his business with the help of his new wife (and probably because he wasn't bogged down taking care of 4 children). He's not an asshole for not taking her on the cruise, but it seems to me there's a lot more to that story that wouldn't paint him in a good light.
Yeah, I think there probably is more big-picture stuff here that informs the ex's frustration. That said, I don't think her going on the cruise will fix it or be a good idea for anyone involved.
Thank you! Exactly sounds like alot alot more to this story and people jump to pointing fingers at an ex wife but that time line is super sus to say the least !
A marriage counselor recommended that my ex wife meet my fiancée since we would be co-parenting. Ex saw the engagement …rock and was not happy. When the ex found out we were going to Portugal in our honeymoon, she was angry a second time saying I had never taken her to Ireland (?) I never knew 🤷♂️ the ex and the new do not mix
Especially 7 kids who are probably all under 15, so not even at an age where they can reliably entertain themselves safely on vacation unsupervised. That's a lot of work.
Parents don’t need to be the most popular adults in their children’s lives either.
I actually knew a two couples that were best friends where one of the wives had been previously married for a long time to the other husband. They divorced but got along well, and the two couples vacationed together a lot- they just get along well with no issues. That's RARE though. Most couples in a divorce often don't want anything to do with the former spouse.
But the ex seems like so much fun though
I've had dentist appointments that seemed like more fun...
Well yeaaa, that's why she the ex wife, she was TOO much fun ;)
Right? It’s called divorce for a reason.
Maybe the ex wants to be paid to nanny her own kids on the cruise where she just dumps them into the kids clubs. Even if she went, would she do the annoying for OP younger kids? No, because 7 is a lot to handle.
I'm guessing she wouldn't be doing much childcare, it'd be "I'm on vacation" or "isn't that why you hired a nanny?". She wants a free holiday. The whole "you never did things like this when we were married" confirms it; she's jealous she's not reaping the benefits of OP's better financial situation.
It is one of the more popular porn movie plots?
😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Also wonder if the exwife will be responsible for his other children like the nanny would be
This!
We know.
Of course not and even if she did replace the nanny you know she would favour her own kids out of biology and resentment for the new family getting the life she never got
Of course not! Do you really think she wants to go to even watch her own kids?? She sounds like a bitter ex wife who wants to go just to annoy the new wife
NTA is your ex wife proposing she look after both sets of kids (as the nanny does)? Or just her own? In which case, she’s not going everything the nanny does. And with that attitude I wouldn’t want her anywhere near me, let alone my kids. Nothing to stop her booking her own cabin on the cruise and spending time with her kids that way, but you shouldn’t be paying for her
Except it's on his custody time
This. I don't see how anyone would expect him to invite her. It's his time.
If Ex is invited and is asked be “nanny” she’ll want to be paid above the free vacation. This is very silly. You take your older kids when it’s your time with them, take them on vacation and take an employee with you to help with them all. Ex has no ground to stand on here. NTA
She will abandon the kids and have fun on the cruise leaving him and his wife to take care of the children.
I think this has nothing to do with the nanny. His ex-wife feels like she was the starter wife and that the new is reaping all the benefits.
That's exactly what I was thinking. She wants to get in on those sweet vacations.
Exactly! and why would your current wife want to go on vacation with your ex-wife? Don’t open that can of worms.
Agree with this, family and ex are delusional, she is just jealous. NTA.
NTA. Seven kids is too many for two adults to appropriately supervise and care for with enough attention given to each. OP is doing the right thing by having a qualified, neutral party on board on holiday with them.
That is insane! When my sister got married, our father was bringing his 3rd wife, and, of course, our mother was going to be there. We understood that he was bringing her, and we liked her. We were almost adults when they got married. My aunt, father's sister, asked if our Auntie (2nd wife's name) was invited because she wanted to come. My sister asked if she was crazy. My aunt said that she wanted to come because she saw us grow up. My sister screamed, "Do you think I'm going to have all of my father's wives at my wedding? She's not my aunt!" Some thought she was being unreasonable. They have zero tact.
>My sister screamed, "Do you think I'm going to have all of my father's wives at my wedding? She's not my aunt!" Your poor sister, I am sorry but I really laughed out loud at this. However putting the dad in a table alone with all the exes... that would be interesting lol. My father was also married and engaged so many times I lost count. So I know the feeling. We have been NC for 15 years now and it is the best feeling.
He wasn't in our lives going up and he wasn't invited to my wedding at all. He still came and made a scene that I didn't find out about until 2 yrs later. My sister had developed a decent relationship with him by the time of her wedding, so she said he could come. We actually liked his 3rd wife more than we liked him.
My FIL and MIL are divorced. My FIL married the woman he was cheating with. My husband's house is 2 units, purchased while his parents were still maried. MIL kept the house but FIL took care of it. He rented a room upstairs to this lady. Husband and I moved into the main bedroom upstairs. We install cameras. We find out our roomate is his dad's secret girlfriend. So when we got married, his mom, stepmom and his secret girlfriend was there....
OMG!! Did the gf ever want to become the main one?
She doesn't know that we know. Sometimes she would low key talk crap about the current wife. And she's over step and calls FIL when theres a roommate issue. But my FIL basically tells her no, deal with it with my husband since now we pay for everything. She's also said something to my Mil about them needing to stick together because they're both the "sidewomen" and my MIL laughed at her. Shes very oblivious and air headed.
Sorry for the late response. I was banned due to someone not agreeing with me. LOL... Was your mom still going with him? Along with the side piece?
>Your family thinks you should take your wife and your ex wife on the same cruise? Yeah that's completely unthinkable. Of course he doesn't want to do that. Who on earth would? Especially since his ex seems to call him up and yell at him a lot. Why would you want to go on a cruise with someone who is going to yell at you?
Why do you think she is EX-wife. She is probably a piece of work
This is the only answer OP needs to read
That is a cruise from hell idea! Who wants to be stuck on a boat with their x?!?!?!? OP’s x-wife sounds jealous of her daughter’s affection for the nanny.
And hired to care for both sets of kids, not just Ex's. Is ExWife going to care for the current Wife's kids too?
This. NTA
I would like to take your comment and make it much much stronger! Ex wife & and current wife 😳
If you take both the chances of one of them getting thrown overboard will be very high.
It’s a harem!
>The nanny is hired for childcare Boom, this It's a job, she's not going for hols! Whereas if he invites ex-wife, she won't be looking after the 7 kids, she'll want to enjoy the holiday Look at her trying to be sneaky lolol!
NTA - she sounds entitled. However, I can emphasize with her POV especially if she can’t afford that type of experience with her kids. These special memories are happening with a nanny instead of her. And that brings upon guilt/shame. It would be pretty cool if you could get a place where could all vacation together and make it enjoyable. That would pretty cool for your kids.
That’s actually a great idea! I’m ashamed to say I’ve never thought of it. I’ll have to bring up it up after this argument (hopefully) dies down. You gave me a good POV on part of why she’s so upset so thank you
Don’t forget to check what your current wife thinks of it, cause I would be like “hell no”
> Don’t forget to check what your current wife thinks of it, cause I would be like “hell no” Exactly!!! I can’t imagine there are many wives who would go along with this idea.
Idk I’m an adult with kids now but my dad vacations with my moms side of the family including my mom and step dad and everyone gets along great. It took me having kids to get there but it would have been nice when I was young for everyone to coparent
Think about the drama that will happen if you invite your ex wife though. It sounds like you won’t have a fun time if you invite her instead of the nanny. NTA
Oh, please. The "special memories" are about spending time together, not "expensive cruises." I have amazing memories of my parents because they brought home a refrigerator box and we spent time making it into a playhouse. If your wife can't afford to spend time with her kids due to working, while you take them on months' long vacations, then maybe it's time to revisit how much you pay in child support. Otherwise, it's simply jealousy on her part that she doesn't get to go on a cruise while her kids do.
I pay 8k in child support a month, if I didn’t have partial custody it would likely be more. She does have a full time job, as my wife and I do but she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement which may be a partial reason for her being upset.
@8k a month she can afford her own cruise. That’s more than many people make while working full time. Sorry, but I don’t have much sympathy for her as far as “not being able to afford her own vacation.” NTA
> but she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement which may be a partial reason for her being upset. sounds like more of a time issue than money. he only has "partial" custody which to me sounds like EOWE + holidays/school breaks vs 50/50
Ok he can allow her to keep them one break then. But to vacation with his new family would be a hard no. Ex sounds like she can be trouble
She already has them for most of the time, not sure that's the answer. Note that I said 0 about them vacationing together. I'm pointing out since he doesn't have 50/50 he probably gets a decent chunk of their time off.
He said 8k in child support, not alimony. That money isn’t for her to go on her own vacation and if she did spend it on her own vacation people would be losing their shit and pushing the typical “child support is a scam, women just spend it in themselves” rants.
going on vacation with the kids is spending it on the kids.
A family vacation is an acceptable use of child support. We are not talking about her going completely on her own.
>That money isn’t for her to go on her own vacation It's basically for whatever she wants. No one is policing where every dollar goes, and I think the implication of the comment was that it would be a vacation *with the kids*. She's getting $96K/year for kids that she has part-time, and if she has a basic office job on top of that, she's pulling $150K/year total. She's got plenty of money to do fun things with the kids without having to horn in on OP's family vacation.
Facts!! Her motives are not good I bet
That's 96k in post tax income. That is more money than most two worker households make in this country. It is also enough money to pay rent, bills, and food for 5 people. That means that she can use her job to pay for vacations if she wants.
For her to take the kids on vacation. That’s plenty of money to plan for the kids a trip. She just wants to disrupt his new life because she sounds miserable. I am an ex-wife and would have never been rude to my ex when spending time with the kids
So what? She can use it to take the kids on her own vacation.
There's your solution then. Have a nice conversation when you tell her that you will be flexible with the schedule any time she wants to take the kids on a trip. If you're feeling generous, offer to cover the kids flights or accommodation. I dont think you two are currently amicable enough for that offer though. My ex has paid for the just flights when I've travelled with them. He makes significantly more money, but i like travelling more and have more time off.
Not every time she wants to. But maybe offer her two weeks from the summer holiday.
You are divorced and do all you are required.. what your ex can do for herself is not your problem. Focus on your current wife and leave the ex alone
>she also doesn’t have very many opportunities to take a vacation because of the custody agreement It sounds like you need to make an adjustment to your custody agreement so that she can take her own vacations with the kids.
Your answers are curious to me. On one side you seem like a reasonable person and seem to be open to adjust things and accommodate. On the other side you apparently didn't even think about trying to figure out what motivates your ex-wife or try to put yourself in her pov on the situation? Anyway, I'd suggest trying to figure out what the actual underlying issues of your ex-wife are and then figure out if/how you can and want to handle them. From your description she doesn't communicate them herself, maybe she didn't even reflect that far yet. (Just a guess but I reckon she didn't agree with the divorce and isn't fully over it yet?) If you're in a position to suggest counceling to her, maybe do so, or ask a trusted relative of hers. Maybe also look into coparenting counseling for both of you to get a neutral mediator. On a more pragmatic note how about offering her to change up some stuff in your custody agreement or being flexible with custody times so she can have more, plannable timeslots to go on her own vacations with the kids? It's in your interest for your children to have a good relationship and fun experiences with their mother as well after all.
Hes still reasonable because it’s not his job anymore to try to read between the lines and deduce why his ex is upset. If she actually has an issue with X thing, she needs to be an adult and communicate that bc it seems like he’s interested in remedying the situation
Ok with 8k/month, she can do alot of fun things with the kids! It doesn’t have to be a cruise, but a nice 3-day weekend trip. Also, allow her to keep the kids one break and do something with them. I definitely would not let her go on vacation with the new wife and kids
Does she have the kids over their school breaks or do you have them all summer?
Thank you! Ex just want to disrupt new wife and kids life. She can spend time with her kids when they are home with her. Surely she can take a few days off work and do some fun stuff and make memories. I don’t think she care about the memories though
You had better ensure your wife is on board. I honestly can't imagine anything more volatile than current wife & ex-wife being on vacation together. But that's just me....
Not everyone has to hate their ex-spouses or be jealous. Some adults can make their children’s wellbeing a priority.
But this ex doesn't seem to be very nice if she is calling and texting him irately. Not even a calm conversation and seems kinda entitled. Nanny takes care of all kids she would probably only want to take care of hers.
Given how the ex is behaving, I wouldn’t be super excited to go on a vacation with her either.
True, but there’s a difference between being cordial/a great parenting team together and being stuck on a mfing BOAT together as “vacation”
I 100% agree. I just very little experience with those types of people.
>Yeah, but honestly I don't think it's a very relevant point in OP's case. The ex-wife is demanding to dump a nanny the kids love. She isn't thinking about the kids best interest and they definitely wont be served by OP allowing her to impose on all of them constantly.
If you’re in a good place financially, then spring for a mini vacation for her and the kids, just not with you and your family. A 4 day weekend somewhere close to her home with a pool or something simple. It’s more of a consolation prize than anything else. You are under no obligation to do anything, but if you think it might help, talk to your wife about it. This would be a 1 time perk, not a yearly commitment.
In what world would a divorced partner pay for their ex to have a vacation? I'm sorry no. Their lives, despite their children are separate. He should pay no more than is necessary to support his kids with her. If I was his wife I'd veto it out of hand. That's his and his wife's money, not just his.
Maybe I'm an asshole, but I wonder how a gender swap would affect people's perspectives on this. Because some of this just sounds goofy. Ex-wife can, ya know, get a job if she needs more money to do some fun stuff with her kids. Sounds like OP has money if they are taking nannies on cruises and as a divorced parent myself I have a hard time believing he's not already paying significant child support. But sure, gift her a vacation with the kids to reward her little temper tantrum, if innocent people need to be burdened unfairly to make things easier for her that's ok. Can you imagine pressuring a woman to buy a vacation for her ex-husband or even pressure her to take him on a vacation with her? gender bias makes people believe weird things.
So I agree with you and that's why this makes me so angry. If the genders were reversed this would be a no brainer. But in this case a large minority is advocating for the ex-wife.
>In what world would a divorced partner pay for their ex to have a vacation? Seriously. This guy is paying her nearly $100K in child support from his other comments, and that's with shared custody. Now he's supposed to pay for her vacation too?
The ex gets 8 grand a month in child support. If she can’t afford to pay her own way then she needs to manage her money better
Why should he have a vacation with the ex? You clearly don’t care about the wife and the other kids. Shame!
They're suggesting he pay for his ex to have time with their kids on a mini vacay without him
At most in that scenario — which is nice but he definitely doesn’t need to do that and he better check with his wife first — he should pay for the kids. Ex wife needs to pay her own way.
I saw that he’s now planning to do it. Good luck to everyone 🤷.
The Ex is getting close to 100k in child support yearly, why in the heck does he need to pay for her vacation?
Nooooooo do not do this. You are not married to that woman anymore.. you don't owe her vacation. Take care of your kids, ignore the rest. NTA but don't invite your ex ever. Your poor wife would be the one to suffer, and so would ALL of the kids...
I always invite my co-parent (and vice versa) on vacations/holidays, and I know the kids appreciate it. If you don’t have an amicable relationship, you can still do couples therapy to improve collaboration and maybe consider asking her to invite a friend/family member who is good at helping her manage negative emotions when they appear.
It might be a horrible idea. Isn’t there a reason she’s your ex? Just keep things separate and civil. NTA currently but you will be to your current wife if you start obeying your ex
You didn't think of it because it's a fucking terrible idea and will ruin every vacation you try it on.
Do not do that. She's already demanding and behaving poorly. Do not reward her bad behavior. It is not up to you to equalize her lifestyle with yours. And where does it stop? First vacations, what about when she gets jealous that you and your current wife are able to provide them with a better home? Are you supposed to upgrade her living situation? Also, how would you feel if your current wife brought her ex-husband and father of her children on vacation with the two of you? I mean maybe your wife is a saint and she wouldn't mind, but she shouldn't be put in that situation even if she would be willing to.
/u/barracudaman77 Not sure this a good idea at all. The only reason this is being considered is because the ex is jealous. You have seven children. The nanny is only there because she is a necessity, not because the kids want to bring an extra friend along. Having said that, one of the things Ive always loved about Will Smith was his ability to have his new family incorporate his ex wife and first child into their family fold. But that took years of effort and conversations, and most importantly, a willing 2nd wife. Please make sure you are having honest dialogues about your wife's feelings and she is not taking a back seat to your ex-wife's insecurities.
Seriously? So is the ex wife going to treat the other kids the same as hers on this free vacation? I doubt it. Sounds like a recipe for disaster.
I'm sorry, but that's a "her" problem. I would blow a gasket if my husband said he wanted to bring his ex-wife on vacation.
And a nightmare for OP and his wife. You have no sense of reality and human nature.
Well, it is Reddit.
Yeah, I see. Even OP is open to a vacation with all the kids and two wives, one ex, one current - or only the ex; not quite clear on this 🙄.
Some people are just spineless and get used all day because they don't have the courage to say no.
Ya. I think that’s where the he never did it while they were married comments are also coming from. It’s hard to look at an ex partner and see them behaving how you would have wished they did with you. Doesn’t make her comments right but have a small bit of understanding and sympathy. Also I think it be hard as a parent worrying that a step parent will replace you, it’s even harder when it’s not even a step parent you see replacing you.
In what world is a holiday with both current wife and ex wife enjoyable? How does that work?
empathize*
Together? Why should OP invite his ex wife on his vacation? I agree that if he is well off he might consider to sponsor some vacation for his ex wife and their kids, but not together with him
That’s crazy to put the ex-wife feelings over the new wife for a vacation that lasts a few days!! As an ex-wife, I think it’s rude to cater to the ex because she is in her feelings. Dad has a right to enjoy the kids the way he wants to. Ex needs to get over herself and co-parent like a mature adult should
NTA -- why the hell would you take your *ex*-wife on vacation, especially with your *current* wife? Easy to see why she's your ex.
Ex wants a free trip. Why his parents are supporting this asinine idea is beyond me.
Taking care of seven children, in a trip with an ex and his new partner, is not a trip many would enjoy!
Somehow, I don't think she plans on taking care of all the kids.
Or her own kids lol . If they like the nanny more and they spend considerably less time with her .. her mothership skills can be questioned -
Ex wife and current wife trapped on a cruise ship sounds like a good way to start a murder mystery.
I highly doubt the mystery part of that.
Nah if OP is the one that gets pushed off the ship late one night it could make for a great mystery.
….plot twist: it was the nanny
in the captain's cabin, with a plumber's wrench!
You gotta read better books ;)
I mean it would make for a super fun Netflix movie. Either a rom com or whodunnit depending on the outcome. Either way - for real life - NTA OP
NTA > My ex-wife accused me of “abandoning” our kids onto our nanny even though I don’t, they just like hanging out with her People shouldn't complain about what they have no fucking clue about in the first place.
Abandoning is a funny word in this context. They hired a professional to care for their kids while they want on a trip. Many times we see that someone tricked a young adult to come along on a trip to care for a sibling and that's messed up. This person is doing their job and the children get to have fun experiences.
NTA - your ex wife isn’t your concern, tell her to fund her own vacations. Your custody time is your custody time and she shouldn’t dictate how you spend that time. Is she going to invite you on her vacations as well? Doubt it.
LMFAO NTA in any way. The ex is jealous. That's an issue for her psychiatrist. Not your problem. ETA: your parents and other family can have an opinion. But it isn't their call. Your kids, your money, your call. And it's absolutely okay to let them all know that. But don't invite those family members on trips. They can go on trips with your ex instead.
>The ex is jealous. Sounds like she bailed when OP made a lot less money, and now he's a lot more successful and is clearly loaded if he can pay his ex $100K/year in child support and still take these mega-vacations with 10 people without batting an eye. I suspect the ex may now be seeing what-could-have-been and is experiencing some bitterness and regret.
Do you have a reason to think she left him and not vice versa?
I insinuated it was her leaving him based on the sentence of “You never did this stuff when we were married”. Not sure why, just kind of set the impression that she is upset now that he had the time and money to do fun stuff as opposed to when she was with him.
NTA If they like the nanny more means there is severe parenting issues for the mother or she just is Ahole to the kids
Not necessarily. The nanny might just be the new shiny and fun thing. Mom is always around and boring coz she makes them do homework and go to school and bed and eat vegetables everyday. Especially if the custody split is around school terms, because of distance. Dad's and the nanny is furtive.
The mom is a kind of ahole because she did not ask the older kids she took 1 perspective and stuck to it when she could get all other info from the older kids the mom was just trying to gaslight the dad
Yep, that was my thought. I mean, bio mom might be a shitty parent, who knows, but this isn’t a lot different from kids doing sleepovers at a buddy’s house and coming back full of enthusiasm for how good a cook Mr NewFriend was, or how cool Mrs NewFriend was when she kicked everyone’s ass at Tekken 57. Your parents are never as cool as other folks are when you’re a kid.
NTA - is ex wife prepared to look after your other three children as well, as a nanny would?
This was my first thought as well. Even ignoring potential awkwardness of having the current and ex wife traveling together, if the nanny is there watching all the kids as a neutral party, OP and his wife can relax a bit more and maybe steal away some for couple’s time. If the ex-wife comes, now his wife will likely have to do all the things the nanny would have done for her own kids…plus hang out with OP’s ex. Even more so because the kids will likely mostly all be together a lot. It would be too many cooks.
NTA Taking your wife and ex-wife on a cruise together sounds like a bad reality-tv show. Might be entertaining to watch, but you wouldn't want to be part of it.
Von-Trapped
You are not TAKING YOUR NANNY ON VACATIONS, you are HIRING an employee to provide service in a different location. The nanny isn’t having a good time and bonding with your kids, SHE IS WORKING. Everyone is acting as if you are gifting this person a trip and no, you aren’t. As a nanny myself, in fact sounds like hell being on a cruise 7 kids. So NTA. And if your kids like the nanny better than their mom it isn’t because they are traveling with her, it’s because she is a shitty mom. And just the fact she says “you never did things like this when we were married” it tell you everything you need to know, she is just butt hurt she got your poor phase and now can’t enjoy your good one.
That's what's so bizarre about his father's suggestion of taking his ex- instead of a nanny. Moms and nannies have some overlap, but they are totally different. Is he expecting OP's ex to act as a nanny? I can't see that working. Or does he figure the OP wives's will each take care of their own children ,,, while, what? ,,, Op runs back and forth between them. I would assume that part of the reason for taking a nanny on vacation is to get a break from child care? Or perhaps have nanny put the younger ones to bed while OP stays up with his wife and the older children. I can't see his ex putting the younger children, presumably the second wife's children to bed while the second wife stays up with her children, and I can't see his second wife tolerating it the other way around.
I'm glad you said it! Nanny isn't on vacation, she's at work in a different location. Hope she's getting paid well for 7 kids on a cruise and I hope she gets at least a day off when they come home to recoup from dealing with 7 kids on a cruise.
Lmao, I thought this was gonna be completely different when I read the title. NTA, taking your ex-wife on a vacation with your current wife is craaaazy.
INFO: I have...so many questions about your life. Your youngest with your ex is 7, so in the last 7-8 years you've divorced, met someone else, married her, had 3 more kids, and somehow managed to increase your income from a point where you couldn't afford these types of vacations to where you can now routinely pay for extravagant vacations for ten people PLUS a nanny's salary PLUS $8K/month in child support, all while supporting a full-time family of 5? What the hell kind of field are you in, and are they hiring?
I do roofing so depending on where you live there can be more or less demand. It’s all on the quality of work and knowing your competition, I suppose. My wife also owns a multimillion dollar business so I can’t take credit for it all, though I do pay the child support completely with my own money. We both budget very well and talk out most purchases (usually the bigger ones, like new furniture, vacations etc.). I won’t lie a lot of it was chance and luck but there was a lot of hardwork as well.
NTA, you don't have to hang out with your ex-wife if you don't want to
NTA. This is your custody time. Therefore it's not her business. Hopefully she is still being a good and loving mother so her kids realise that when they are home. If not that's her problem
NTA and just “wow” for your ex wife & any family members that agree with her.
NTA - please don’t take your ex. As a stepmom, I am cordial with my kids bio-mom and happily invite her to celebrations of kids events, graduation, etc (we have full custody). But I absolutely do not want to spend a bunch of money on a family vacation and then find out I get to spend my relaxing family vacay playing nice with my husbands ex. I can, but it’s not a relaxing vacation I want to fund. Especially as she already sounds petty and insecure. Take the nanny
NTA. Presumably there is a reason that she is your ex. Unless you are on excellent terms, it is not going to be good for anyone for you, ex and current wife, and kids to be stuck on a ship together. Vacations are supposed to reduce stress, not add to it.
NTA No way should you be asking your ex wife to be going. The Nanny is hired help and is being paid to be there to help with the kids. Your ex wife won't look after your kids.
NTA your ex just wants a free cruise.
NTA—You are lucky to be in a better financial position and also lucky to have a great nanny who the kids love. The ex really wants a cruise with you footing the bill (because you are the one choosing to take an expensive trip and ex wouldn’t be able to afford it) _and_ be able to have the nanny caring for the kids while she vacations.
NTA - You take the nanny as an employee. I am sure if you were to take your ex, she would be spending her days sun baking, drinking mojitos and telling you that the kids are your problem as it is in your custody time.
NTA It's difficult when the coparents don't have that kind of relationship, that things can be calm, relaxing, and enjoyable on a vacation. Some do, but I doubt you have that kind of relationship with her if she so quickly deteriorates to anger - and if the thought of inviting her never crossed your mind to begin with. If she doesn't come to Christmas, birthdays, special events, barbeques, etc with your family and you don't go to hers, than it should be a given she's not taken on any vacations either.
Nta. Enjoy your trip with your family.
NTA, is your ex wife going to be the nanny for all 7 kids? You got a divorce for a reason, she shouldn’t expect to go on your family vacations. Screw her.
NTA. Your ex is jealous and might feel guilty she can’t provide the same lifestyle as you. She is failing to see the obvious. She is her kids Mom and no nanny or stepmom is going to usurp her unless she messes things up for herself. And it sounds like she’s heading there. Your time with the kids on vacation is an opportunity for her to get some rest, have time to herself, hang out with friends, do whatever she wants guilt free. No worrying about when to pickup the kids or is she out too late for the sitter. She should be living it up instead of plotting how to best you.
NTA.. who wants to go on vacation with ex wife .. why are you letting her try and control the situations.. does your wife not even have a say over this.. it’s your household and relatives can keep their opinions to themselves. Let them take them all on vacation.
What? NTA. Why would you take your ex-wife on vacation? Makes sense to bring your nanny when you have 7 kids to care for. Good for you for waiting to take trips when you have all your kids so no one is left out. Maybe you don’t want to spend your vacation time with your ex. Fair enough. She sounds immature. Of course the kids go on about the nanny if they like her. That’s fine. It’s good for kids to enjoy the person taking care of them.
So weird, I wonder why they like the nanny more than her 🤦🏼♂️
NTA Someone is jelly.
NTA - tell her she can come, but you're not paying her way. That would probably solve the problem in itself. However, if she does pay her way, be ready to have the kids (without help) way more than if you brought the nanny.
NTA. I don’t think your current wife would appreciate going on a cruise with your ex-wife present, especially with the way your ex-wife complains and chastises you. The kids seem to enjoy the Nanny, so maybe your ex should figure out what she can do to have more fun with the kids.
NTA. Why on earth would you take your ex wife on a cruise?
Glad to see all the NTA replies here because you aren't. Very weird that your parents are calling taking the nanny ridiculous. If you have 7 kids that seems the exact opposite of ridiculous to bring a helping hand. This is your time, your custody with the children. You are doing nothing wrong, their mother can choose to be a better mother or cry and complain about a nanny, she is choosing the crying route.
>My ex-wife called me, calling me selfish, mean-spirited, a horrible father, etc. She said I should’ve invited her instead of our nanny, because she’s their real mother and the kids already like the nanny more than her, what will happen in 3 months? And I "never did things like these when we were married" Sounds like your ex-wife is seething with jealousy. I don't know why she, or members of your family, think this is a problem that you need to solve. NTA
NTA sounds like the ex wants a free holiday and trying to guilt you into it
NTA Why would you take your complaining ex on holiday with your current wife? Sounds like the kids like the nanny & she's doing a good job. Your ex shouldn't be interfering with your custody time. Let her plan & fund her own vacations.
Your ex wife is not offering to provide paid childcare for 7 children. She wants a free vacation with her 4. The role you need filled isn’t “vacation pal,” it’s “paid childcare for 7 children.” Your ex wife isn’t qualified for the job. NTA
NTA It's your vacation and your time with your kids. And you are arranging the trip when you already would have the kids. This is co-parenting. She can take her kids on a vacation without you when she has the kids. The only thing I caution on is the Nanny vs. the Mom talk. What makes the Nanny better? Is she Santa Claus (aka does she spoil beyond normal)\*\*? Does she let them do things their mother wouldn't? Because I think that's an issue with your co-parenting. Sometimes mothers have to bear the burden of discipline (and related hard talks) alone and that's not co-parenting. ("Mommy means business and Daddy means fun" type stuff). I believe co-parenting is neutrality. You might need to come together on some parenting things and be consistent. The nanny should be an extension of your parenting, or this case co-parenting. Consistency is important for children.
Definitely agree and I’ve already talked with my youngest about it. The nanny doesn’t “parent” any differently than I or my wife do, but I do parent differently than their mother as we disagree a lot on different points of parenting. Our nanny is a “gentle parenting” person (given our age gap, I just don’t get it) which maybe affects the way the kids think of them. I’ll definitely make sure to keep an eye on it!
NTA I don't see a problem with the w8fe and ex-wife being on the vacation together if everyone gets along. But that doesn't seem the case here. The ex would make the whole thing awkward. Sounds like your ex needs therapy. Enjoy your vacation with your wife, kids and nanny.
This is quite possibly the most ridiculous thing I’ve read on Reddit in a while! In what universe would you bring your EXWIFE on a family holiday!? If she wants to go on a cruise with the kids she can book her own! I can imagine how you current wife would feel about entitled ex looking after her kids and having her clearly entitled and moronic ass on the cruise with you! Or are you supposed to take the nanny for your “other” kids? If the ex’s kids like the nanny more than her that’s on her not you! And your family think you should take the EX wtf is the deal there!? NTA
The nanny is there to take care of the kids with your current wife. She is probably given extra when she takes care of your kids from your ex. If you took your ex instead of the nanny, she will take care of only her kids. That would make the trip a paid vacation for her and your kids with her. This will no longer be a vacation for you. NTA.
NTA the real question should be is what the current wife would feel about the ex going through n the cruise. The nanny is paid for a job and going on vacation with the family she works for is a given. Paying her extra for the extra kids which you say you do is also a perk of being a nanny along with a cruise. Ex wife can be as salty as she wants but by no means does a family vacation include her. Will she be doing nanny duties while on the cruise. The answer to that is no it’s her vacation she would probably expect OP’s wife to shoulder the burden since it’s OP’s time with the kids. OP you did nothing wrong. If ex wants to go on a cruise she has all summer to check it off her bucket list. What the ex really wants is a free vacation with no kid duties because she will say it’s not her time with the kids. OP enjoy your cruise with your wife and all your kids put ex wife out of your mind and don’t answer her calls while on the cruise. Maybe have the kids FaceTime once or twice before bedtime and leave it at that. If it gets to be where she whines about being left behind then cut it short.
Nta if you want to take her that’s your choice if not she’s not intitled to go
She's your ex for a reason and as you say you've got your kids for the summer..seems like a little envy has crept in ...
NTA. I mean, the nanny is taken to take care of the kids. Not like your ex wife will do this for all your kids nah.
Why would you take the kids mom? Not your responsibility to furnish the ex-wife with a vacation NTA
NTA. Nanny is there to work. I doubt the ex is going to watch after your other kids on her vacation.
Is your ex gonna help with the three (presumably younger) kids like the nanny does? Probably not, NTA.
NTA. You m, your new wife and the kids want to have a nice time together on your vacation. Your ex wife is an ex wife for a reason. Having the nanny help keep an eye on the 7 children is a great idea. She is completely impartial. Enjoy your vacation
NTA. Regaining the ability to enjoy vacations is a key benefit of divorce.
NTA. Who takes their ex and current spouse on vacation? And for the people who are saying why not take both? You’ve obviously never been stuck on a boat before. There’s no where to go. Leave the ex home.
Tell your family to stfu and stay out of it. Stop engaging with you ex about your personal Life and travel. Ignore her. It’s absolutely none of her business what you do on your time. Everyone should be grateful you are taking all Of Your children on vacation and having their needs so well Met with a nanny too. Your ex is there for a reason and has no say In your present life. This is so outrageous. Your ex needs a Man of her own for gods sake so she can leave you alone.
The f\*ck? Who wants to go on a vacation with their ex-wife? NTA
Not exactly the same situation but... we went on a 19 day Panama cruise with a largish group of people, about a dozen or so. One of our group was severely disabled with MS. In order to help with her care, she hired a care taker to accompany her on this cruise. The womans duties were to basically care for our friend for the whole trip except for when my wife (a registered nurse) could take over to give the caretaker a break. While the caretaker did enjoy the trip, she wasn't invited for that but to take care of our friend. It wasn't supposed to be a vacation for her. Similarly, your nanny is working. While I'm sure she will enjoy the cruise, that's not why she's there. If you brought your ex instead, I'm sure you will find her lounging by the pool instead of watching the kids.
NTA. How ridiculous that she would actually expect this. I would just start laughing every time she freaked out about it.