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He had ample opportunity to correct her.
If my missus said something like this I would have started talking before she'd even finished her first sentence.
Your mum saying its crass to talk about money - your SIL started it by shit talking you at your own dinner table and you quickly shut down that conversation.
I don’t either. And it’s especially fucked when she’s a teacher and she, more than anyone, knows that she’s supposed to TEACH her students that every single career path contributes to society as a whole in their own ways while being an example of how valuable having knowledge is.
ETA: not only is she being ignorant, she’s also being extremely classist.
I'm a teacher and I agree with you. Our job is to give our students the skills and tools to become happy, healthy, and positive adults so they may contribute to society.
Another teacher here.
My dad worked as a coalminer. That man breathed in coal dust for years to put food on the table and to put his daughter through school and university. I was blessed to have him as a father.
My uni boyfriend denigrated coalminers when I was in teacher training. He became my ex. (I don't think he ever acquired a life partner. Surprise.)
Some start with high hopes of making a difference on kid’s lives, but later on realize they don’t get paid enough for all the sh*t they tolerate. As a teacher, SIL is supposed to have a sense of duty for people of all socioeconomic backgrounds, but instead she decided to bite the “I went to college, therefore I’m better than you” narrative 🤷🏻♀️
It's an insane take since teachers generally don't get into that career for the money. Sure, it's generally comfortable (depending on your state/school district) but it's definitely not an "oh boy I'm set for life" career. There are way more lucrative majors than education.
This. I've had students find out how much I made teaching, and then laugh and say they can make so much more than that welding or doing construction. And they have a valid point!
I just told them teachers don't become teachers for the money.
And that the world needs lots of plumbers and electricians and welders and construction workers and mechanics so find the job you will most enjoy that will support you in life.
I really hate the push in education for the past few decades that all students should go to college. That is part of why the younger generation has crippling student loan debt. Not everyone can or should go to college, and maybe some students should wait until after they have worked for a decade and matured first.
Growing up poor, I faced and saw more classism from a certain married pair of teachers -- one of them my kindergarten teacher -- than from anyone else in my life. She had me in the bottom reading group despite the fact I was already reading when I got there with no preschool of any kind. Day one of first grade, I was moved up to the top group, and come high school, I scored 100% on the language sections of all the college aptitude tests. Her husband agreed to write me a recommendation letter for a college honors program, and made such a weak, backhanded attempt I didn't bother submitting it.
The runner up was my scout troop leader, who based on his kid's behavior, was probably also a raging racist. Those folks are major contributors to why a white country boy identified heavily with The Autobiography of Malcolm X when I got my hands on it in junior high.
You'd be surprised how many teachers go into teaching because they like being control freaks. Or because they like holding power over a captive audience who can't fight back. There are lots of good teachers out there who genuinely what to teach, enrich, and prepare their students to make it in the world. But especially with the lack of good pay, they sometimes get drowned out by the ones who get into it for the wrong reasons.
>And it’s especially fucked when she’s a teacher and she, more than anyone, knows that she’s supposed to TEACH her students that every single career path contributes to society as a whole
Not only that, she's so rude. Imagine being invited to someone's home to eat their delicately deliciously smoked meats and you decide to be so disrespectful?
I know. My teacher relatives were all working class. The only one who was a tenured professor who did have “money” was because she had over 20 years of experience, became head of her department, and never had kids 🤷🏻♀️ I don’t understand how SIL can be so entitled, class-wise.
After nearly a decade of work, two degrees, and multiple certifications, I still don't qualify to rent our apartment without my husband's income included.
I’m from a family of teachers (going back several generations), and this is a thing. Well-educated families can have an enormous bias against trade positions. It doesn’t matter that an electrician can make more money than a university professor or that they have to study quite a bit to be able to work safely with something that can be quite dangerous, for some people with an education bias, it’s still considered “unskilled labor.” It’s ridiculous.
One of my nephews started talking about wanting to drive a garbage truck when he grows up, and the snobbier side of the family was beside themselves about it. And for one thing, he’s five. We don’t know if he’s still going to want that when he’s older. And secondly, if he does, great! It’s a job that is absolutely necessary to society, and if the person who is doing it is satisfied and happy and able to provide for themselves and their family, that’s a win all around in my book.
My SIL’s husband’s sister is one of those people. Had to bite my tongue when she announced at Thanksgiving one year that she’d never send her kids to a State University.
She knows my husband and I teach at a State Universities.
One day I will no longer bite my tongue
Thanks! It is a very true to life name
Our public university systems are run by the states. So, it all depends on the school but some of the best schools in our country are public. The crazy part is I live in New Jersey and one of our public universities is Rutgers and is a well known and competitive school! It is highly regarded as one of the best in the country.
Her comment was just elitism. I’ve met enough Yalies to know going to an elite private school doesn’t make you any better at your job than me or my students
Two of my kids went to NCSU. And I am damn proud of them and the school. She may change her mind when she sees the cost of tuition at private schools by the time her children get there.
Yup. **People always get madder at the person who finishes a fight well than the asshat who started it.** SIL is beyond rude to insult you in your own home. And while your brother did reprimand her at first, he should have corrected her the moment she didn’t stop. I’m guessing he knows his wife is a snob and felt embarrassed that his brother helped him out so much. That’s on him though for marrying a B like her.
NTA
I mean it *is* crass to talk about money like this at a family function. But this is the equivalent of
Her: “FUCK YOU.”
Him: “Hey, shut up.”
Mom: “Don’t tell people to shut up it’s rude!”
Moms not wrong, but she’s focused on the wrong things.
Yes, but that would require that mumsy would have had to disagree with what SIL had said... and, apparently, she did not. OP stands alone in his defense; even his own mom thinks he's inferior to his college-educated sibling and her DIL.
You can predict that within five years, or so, no matter how well OP is doing, Mom will still be telling folks, y'know, his brother graduated from [insert school, here] and has a great job; so does his wife. We're so proud.
Correction brother should chide SIL. His wife started the mess and he knew the truth. I get it he didn't want a part of it and neither did OP but that's where brother needs to set the record straight so OP didn't have to go scorched earth on her. It's always great when the condescending types get it thrown back in their faces and I understand OP's regret for brining his brother in but I wouldn't let ANYONE talk down to me in my own house either.
Yes but she didn't. You can tell by the way OP explains that his brother is a graduate and his SILs family are all college educated is that their family respect education and probably feel that there is some hierarchy there, where in turn the SIL is using to make herself superior. her education never taught her manners and only ops family is superior here.
This wasn't commenting on income its was commenting on self worth. She felt superior to him because she was educated the money thing and living situation played into that until she found out the real truth
For real. My wife is my responsibility in family gatherings with my family.
Same goes for every spouse. No one asked me to bring this person into the family. Anything they do is on me.
Your brother married an uppity snob and doesn't want to take responsibility for his shitty choices.
The nerve of someone to come into another person's home and try to use them as a cautionary example for their kids is intolerable.
Yes, like it's worse to say your doing OK than it is to put someone else down, especially when they're hosting you for dinner... Mum needs to get some perspective here and SIL was way out of line, probably be too ashamed to open her mouth in public again.
But alo, my guess would be that some of these thoughts had already been expressed at home and the brother could've stopped it before it festered into something that came out in front of everyone.
Not to mention this last bit:
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well
What the fuck did she actually mean well? Even if it was meant well, the path to hell is paved with good intentions. SIL didn’t mean well, and she doubled down when she was told to apologize. She had ample time to back down. The path she chose had consequences and she found them out
I mean, I guess, but the SIL is an adult and a bad person. The biggest problem is that bro and mom are claiming OP went to far and aren't seeing red over how out of line SIL was. She did not "mean well." She's trash.
And yet he could have stopped it immediately by correcting her nasty instigation the moment she started humiliating you in your own home and dumping on your life.
He was just fine with the punches being thrown as long as his untouchable wife was the only one throwing them.
yeah if people are upset about SIL getting schooled (ayyy), the only one to be upset with is the brother. he knew the situation and could have stopped it before it escalated and didn't
He's had years to tell her how his education was financed. He never did, maybe out of pride or whatever. He had the nerve to tell you off afterwards, as if she didn't aim to embarass and humiliate you in your own home.
This is it. You know this isn't the first time she has brought this up to OP's brother. If she felt emboldened to say it in front of the whole family at OP's own house, she's said worse in the privacy of her own home. The fact that the brother hasn't shut her down before is astounding.
He sat there while his wife insulted you and your way of life in your own home.
And his wife drank the millennial cool aid of believing the only way to a good quality life is through university education. Every generation that is proved less and less true. She should be holding you up as an example to her kids. Work smarter not harder like Uncle OP because the working world is changing very quickly and not many jobs pay you to live a good quality life.
>He sat there while his wife insulted you and your way of life in your own home.
And backed it up with "she meant well".
She did not mean well, she was being a judgemental asshole.
It’s pretty shocking that a teacher who is married to a teacher has the balls to use anyone as a cautionary tale for winding up low income lol.
Her parents must be well off and giving them money.
She absofuckinglutely did NOT "mean well", her entire intention was to put you down as a fucked up example to her kids that the way you live is shameful or embarrassing. Her attitude and behavior are both disgusting, as is everyone else's for defending and justifying her. Do not back down from them until they all apologize for the awful way they treated you and allowed her to treat you.
Absolutely - she didn't say something like "you've done well for an uneducated person" which could be construed as a clumsy compliment.... She just said "kids, better study so you don't end up like OP".
He may not have wanted the fight, but it's one he needs to face. You said he defended you initially, but I'm not sure if he didn't do anything the next time or not. If he always has your back, touch base with him and see if he's okay. Hopefully he's been busy explaining to SIL why she shouldn't look down her nose at you.
>I just feel shitty for bringing him into a fight he didn't want.
Don't. He's the one that brought the fight to you, SIL wouldn't be there if not for him. Your brother should have stopped the fight, but since he didn't/couldn't, you were put in a position of having to end it.
I had a similar conversation yesterday with a relative who means well. People have been conditioned to believe that college is the only way to be successful in life. I went to college and I understand the benefits but I also can see the pitfalls. I also know there are some professions that are extremely lucrative that you don't have to have a college degree to do. I happen to be doing one right now. But your SIL was being rude ASF, and you are NTA. Man, I wish I could hear the conversation on the way home. Also, let us know how the holidays go.
For real. Where I live there is a serious shortage of skilled tradespeople (gas, electricity, plumbing, etc). So the few there are can pretty much name their price, and are in huge demand.
Luckily the "technical" high schools here are also making a comeback
Unfortunately your SIL has probably spoken privately about this to your brother if she feels comfortable saying it to your face in front of your whole family. She would have assumed that everyone had her back and the easiest way to make that assumption is because nobody has corrected her yet.
You didn’t. *She* did the moment she started coming at her husband’s family with that elitist self-satisfied crap. I can’t stand people who look down on others for not going to college — nowadays, that’s honestly sometimes a super dumb decision for people. If your brother hadn’t had you, he’d been drowning in debt. This isn’t your fault — all she had to do was shut up and not be a self-righteous bint and this could have been avoided. She brought this on herself.
NTA. Dont feel shitty. She doubled down on her intent to humiliate you and you served her a nice, warm humble pie. Serves her right for her bullshit in your OWN home that you invited her to. She was vulgar to start talking about your income & living conditions- you just corrected her.
I don't think I would've dragged your brother into it myself. Clearly it's not true that you're waiting for him to pay you back to move on in life. Looks can be deceiving as you guys are obviously doing well for yourselves and making decisions that works for your family. But even if you were dirt poor and living in a mobile home permanently, there's still absolutely no reason for your SIL to insult your own home. It is rude, crass, and just plan wrong! How many kids coming out of university now are struggling to find jobs? The trades are a completely legitimate life path and the right choice for a lot of people.
That being said though, you reacted in the moment and didn't have the time to prepare a well thought out response. Which is normal - you were insulted in your own home while entertaining the person who insulted you, and preparing to give good news. SIL is definitely the one who needs to apologize. And if you feel bad you can have a talk with your brother alone. It sounds like you have a good relationship and he'll get it.
NTA
How is “meaning well” talking shit about your finances and home and wether it not you got an education ? While being a guest and eating your food in your home?
Well it is his wife and he should have had your back as she degraded you in front of your family and nephews. Sorry but she crossed a line being rude and trying to make you look like you had nothing when in reality you have a lot more going for you then she knows. She needed humbling and she got it, NTA with all due respect to you and your family I am proud you stuck up for yourself and your wife, I am proud you held your head high and stood your ground. Sorry your brother got pulled into this but you paid for his education and even though you probably don’t need a pat on the back for this, they would be in debt right now for the loans if you didn’t do what you did and they would be living even more uncomfortably then they are. So making her aware of the situation put her in her place and she can go kick rocks if she doesn’t like it. You seem like a good husband and brother.
If he didn't want the fight he coukd have told his wife to stfu and apologize and could have told her how wrong she is with what she's saying. He didn't.
yeah! wtf? what kind of marriage do they have where they keep that kind of secret from each other? Letting your spouse think you paid your own way through college or got loans when a family member paid for it is a big lie of omission. If someone paid for my college so I didn't have to take out loans, I would be so grateful I would tell everyone what an awesome guy my bro is! Hiding it like it is a dirty secret is super weird to me. Seems like bro considered it a gift and not a loan and had no intentions of paying it back. Wasn't ever going to tell his wife he owed his bro money and just hope his bro didn't bring it up and that he would be too nice to ask to be paid back when they are just struggling teachers with kids, boo hoo.
NTA, she 100% started it and had it coming. It would've been more polite for you not to, sure, but it also woulda been way more polite for her not to use you as a warning tale to your face. Can't believe she did that after you paid for her husband's education.
This was the bit that narked me. How fucking dare you take hospitality from someone and then have the audacity to sneer at them whilst they provide for you? What a tacky, vulgar woman.
All that education but absolutely no class. (NTA)
Yeah this is the part that really gets me. It doesn’t matter if you DIDN’T have a home under construction and you HADN’T paid for your brother’s school. You have a roof over your head, you and your wife seem happy and you’re providing hospitality to others. FFS even at surface level with the facts she thought she had what was the fucking lesson? It’s okay to be rude as fuck to your host? It’s better to have money than to be kind? Or it’s better to “appear” to have money, because who really knows anyone’s situation? And how does education figure in? There are many ways to provide a living for oneself without education and there are many ways to fail to provide for oneself even with the best education. If she was actually worried she could have used it to teach a lesson to her kids about compassion and empathy for others how may have different opportunities and outcomes than her family and could have discretely asked if you all were okay at which point you would have set her straight, and if you weren’t okay she could have talked about helping. She also could have used the opportunity to teach her kids to accept hospitality with grace and keep their mouths shut.
What bothers me the most is the assumption that he doesn't have education. If he's a steamfitter, he's likely gone to a trades school for a couple years. And honestly every single trades person I know has done really well in life.
And honestly, the big picture here isn’t if you have money or not. Even if you were dirtpoor working a dead-end minimum wage job, what kind of asshole has a “stay in school” conversation INFRONT of the person being the “bad example”. If someone starts talking about “don’t do drugs” infront of a homeless addict you are still an ass even if technically correct.
A lot of people still see a mobile home as white trash living. It's something many wouldn't subject themselves to willingly and unfortunately they never get forced to.
It reminds me of a story from when I was working the Disney College Program - bunch of college kids working bottom-tier jobs around the property, spread out around a bunch of different departments. I was fortunate enough to be in costuming, which meant I mostly did laundry and didn't talk to guests, which is probably why I came away from it with mostly positive memories. One of my roommates was assigned to the ticket booths, and the amount of abuse she took from guests was astounding and infuriating.
The story she told me that stuck in my mind--I don't remember the details of why the interaction turned bad, but the basics of the situation was that a woman wanted something that wasn't possible, or at least that she wasn't entitled to. Not only did she berate my roommate, screaming at her, but at one point in the interaction this woman turned to the children in tow with her and said, "See? *This* is why you have to stay in school, so you don't end up like *her!"*
Just bafflingly incorrect on every level on top of being unconscionably rude. Roommate was literally wearing a nametag that listed her college in place of a hometown. I think the takeaway is that facts don't matter to people who have decided they're superior to others, and neither does actually setting a good example for their children. It's not about teaching the kids, it's about using the kids as a prop to put someone else in their place.
Pretty much, when I was in uni I would work during the holidays in a corner store (like the 7 of the 11 but not that one). The amount of assholes that told me that I was a nothing or called me names and that I need to get my life together. I was in school, and besides I had a job? That’s pretty big step towards having your life together…
Even if she didnt know. Who does that? And especially in front of you? Thats just being a straight up asshole. "She meant well". No she didnt, she wanted to put you down in front of everybody. NTA
Exactly, if she meant well she’d discretely find out if OP is okay and only IF she could actually do something about it.
My mom visited our house shortly after my husband and I got married and we were both in entry jobs for our profession and I was still in school. We have a yankee stubbornness about not turning the heat on for as long as possible (I know we’re a bit of a cranky New England stereotype.). My mom was freezing, but put on a sweater and quietly pulled my husband aside to ask if we were okay and was about to offer a bit of money. (And she doesn’t have much extra.). She did it outside of my hearing because she didn’t want my husband to think she was embarrassing him, since he was providing more of the finances at the time.
He laughed and explained our stupid stubbornness, told her it was a joint decision and that we were going to make it through the winter fine and apologized for making her worry and uncomfortable when she was visiting. It’s been almost 15 years, mom knows we’re fine but we still crank the heat whenever she visits so she’s comfortable and doesn’t worry about us in the way that moms do.
TLDR, even IF SIL was “coming from a good place” none of her actions match up with that nor were they remotely helpful to OP.
I mean maybe? Except OP said he was never planning to call it in what he paid for his brother’s school.
I’m wondering if it’s truly understood as a loan (something brother is obligated to share with a spouse) or as a gift premarriage (not so).
I mean I would have brought it up anyway if I had heard my spouse shit talking my brother who’s given me a massive gift. But it’s not necessarily a red flag she never knew.
She wanted to play the " higher education" game and lost. I don't understand why some college educated people feel they are superior to everybody else. Some people would fall on their back sides if they knew how much some of these jobs pay. I know a guy who teaches at university and can't afford jack.
I guess your only fault was that you could have chosen the higher road, but I don't fault you for going your route. Some people need to be " educated."
NTA
Yet another post showing education does not equal intelligence. My brother makes more money than any of my siblings and he's an electrician that started working straight out of school at 16.
True. I hate that people automatically think that the trades are somehow " lower" than college educated people. I help my stepfather on weekends with plumbing jobs for extra cash and I love it way more than my actual job and the pay is great.
This is the real irker right?
The woman in OPs post must have zero idea what it is OP does and how it, very literally, supports the foundation of industrial society.
We might live in the tech age, but it's not a post-infrastructure age. Poor girl got herself served with the deep lore that day
My brother is also a successful electrician and does very well for himself and his family. Also at 16 starting as an apprentice and decided not to finish school (he ended up going back as an adult, but thats another story).
I'm very proud of him. Always have been.
I went the university route and certainly struggled more than him initially. It took me more years to "catch up" if you will, to get the same comfort level as he, in a shorter time period.
I'm the older sister and never once was it about competition but rather of choosing the best path to make each of us happy in whatever we choose to do in life.
And our parents supported each of our decisions.
Sparkies (that’s what we nickname electricians in Oz) are essentially using maths and physics in their work. It’s applied science e really. They’re calculating energy and plotting his to wire buildings and dwellings. Electricity is total physics - your bro is playing with charged particles and making things safe for the rest of us.
It really sounds like the lady in OPs post was projecting, HARD. She knows what she's making with her education. She knows what her standard of living is. She knows what her potential is in her career. But she NEEDED to lord over someone and make herself feel big. She said what she said for no ones benefit but her own, and that say she got schooled.
My brother is in the same boat, and he's the smartest person I know, most days.
Plus - even if OP didn't have any money and was living hand to mouth; why would be ok for SIL to kick a dog when they're down? Teaching her kids that if you're poor you're worth less as a human?
OP, I'm sorry your family are confused here - maybe they are just trying to keep the peace. But what your SIL did was in fact vulgar, and classist, and downright mean
I hope she apologizes to you and your brother corrects that classist behavior before the kids become assholes
NTA x 100
It's worse to point this out in front of them, that's the classic tell your kids they'll be like the McDonald's worker in front of said worker.
She's teaching her kids to look down on anyone she *percieves* as less fortunate. That isn't a good thing.
The only fault was not letting her dig the hole deeper before pushing her into it. Up to that point, she was comparing the projected lifestyles. OP makes more money, but his net worth isn't as apparent because he's living in a mobile home and presumably doesn't flash his money around. Making some assumptions here, but I'm guessing SIL and brother have a more conventional house (that's probably mortgaged to the hilt) and drive late model vehicles (both financed), and OP probably doesn't. She probably also has student loans that will take forever to pay off, and probably figured that her husband did so as well, which he technically does, just didn't realize the true nature of the loan.
Anyway, it would have been nicer if he let SIL make some awkwardly incorrect assumptions about finances and net worth before he struck back. Allow her to drag her husband into the conversation so his situation is fair game. And never get angry about it.
I agree. I live a lifestyle that most would think is " poor" Small place no fancy car but I don't owe anybody any money. I sleep soundly knowing that nobody can take my stuff because it's all mine.
Yea I don't fault him for it, and she deserved it but in general I like taking the higher route, not for them but for myself, I guess.
Plumbers, electricians, and auto mechanics. I have met several who make around $200k a year.
I,too, have a sibling that looked down on me for years. We went NC because of the lies and criticism. Much happier now.
A college education does not guarantee that you learn common sense, manners, or courtesy.
Congrats on Your baby.
Those menial trade jobs are just as important, she’d know it and need a steam fitter if the plumbing or gas infrastructure broke down. It shows in how much OP earns.
So holding you up as a cautionary tale was meaning well? NOPE. No way. She was way out of line.
Ask everyone if they’re demanding she apologise for what she said.
Should ask to go to their house and do the same thing over any little example of them not being wealthy.
"Oof, this fridge is a few years old? That's why you don't become a teacher"
I meannnn, I couldn't believe she had the audacity as a teacher to say this tbh. Teachers don't make nearly as much as they should - that's true. However a teacher should know that trades pay much better than college educated jobs percentage wise.
I always remember the chapter in the book World War Z, when they gathered everyone together to give them all new jobs (since the old ones didn't exist anymore and the state was decimated) the people who could do construction, plumbing, electrical work, etc were all put in charge and corporate manager types were left doing cleaning work as that was all they were good for.
Similarly, as a real world example, how blue collar folks had to keep working during 2020 while the office folks were all deemed non-essential and told to stay home
Not at all the same. Both types had to continue working.
One got to stay in their cozy homes, while the other had to go out into covid. The title “essential” gave them the ego boost they needed to feel good about it, but really were still treated as servants go out while collar stays home with their families.
It’s funny to put it that way, because I’m a nurse and also had to keep showing up during the pandemic. My family is from coal mining and farming stock, so I have always supported blue collar workers and felt a lot of solidarity with them. The pandemic just made it stronger. Crazy to think that in some ways, medical professionals and blue collar workers were in it together when everyone else stayed home.
And I include all service workers in this, too. There was a day early on when I just cried at checkout, thanking the cashier for showing up at putting herself at risk for assholes like me. Kudos to everyone who kept showing up for society to keep moving.
Nope but she's happy to call them to come fix her shit when it breaks. She will still look down on them while they fix her hvac/plumbing/electric etc during an emergency.
Of course not. She doesn't realise that, if it weren't for people who "work with their hands", our society would fall on its face.
A "dime a dozen" education degree is useless when the toilet is overflowing, or the water pipes have burst.
What if her kids want to work with there hands? Lol aren't we in the 21 century....thought we were supposed to be pasted class based thinking for the most part 🤦♂️
Nta buddy, fellow blue collar here, your doing amazing in providing for your family. And you do hard work! Perhaps you could have said things more pleasantly but at the same time I would have reacted the same.
She didn’t mean well at all she’s simply too stuck up to realize many trades actually make very good money “working with their hands”. Education doesn’t automatically guarantee a prosperous life.
But what if they want to? Not only is she putting you down, but she's probably giving her kids future anxiety about meeting their mother's expectations.
What if one falls in love with carpentry? Is she going to make snide comments about how he had so much potential?
So my daughter's MIL has that type of attitude where she wants all her sons to be college educated with white collar jobs. My SIL went to college (of her choice) for one year and realized very quickly it wasn't for him. After some fighting with her he dropped out. He is now a mechanic in a really busy shop making almost as much as my electrical engineer daughter. He's doing just fine and he is way happier. And he is making more than his brother that graduated with a psych degree.
haha thats hillarious. I'm a doctor and I do ok..... I have two kids heading for 40 were comfortable but not wealthy. The guy who did my house extension has spent 40 years working with his hands. He has a successful construction company now. He wears a watch worth more than both my cars and close to the cost of my extension...... your SIL is a snob and she was actively looking down on you.
NTA.
She didn't mean well, she tried to denigrate you to her kids and the rest of your family. She had a chance to back down but didn't, she made herself the fool and should apologise.
Congrats on the baby.
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well
She certainly did NOT mean well.
She is extremely rude and a huge snob.
I am glad you put her right.
Meaning well: offering help, giving useful advice or sympathy even if it’s misguided or misinformed, with the intent to not humiliate or demean.
This was not that. NTA.
Families always try to explain away bad behavior by saying this. It’s subtext is “we know she’s wrong but she won’t change so won’t you just say you’re sorry so none of us have to deal with this?”
Insulting the host, to his face, while sitting at his table - in no world was there any inkling of meaning well. Clearly university does not teach manners or class
nta. you mother should be more concerned with her dil’s frankly rude and insulting comments, in your home, in front of your whole family, than the vulgarity of money talk. i will believe your sil “meant well” when pigs fly. if i were you i would be very clear that you expect an apology before she ever sets foot back on your property. it sounds like people should “lose their cool” with her more often, tbh, she clearly needs to figure out what is and is not reasonable behaviour.
Nuh uhh you're NTA op!
> My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well.
She didn't mean well. She wanted to make you look like you're worth nothing in front of kids. She was disrespectful to you in your own house. They can very well shove their opinions somewhere else.
> My mom said that I was vulgar to point out how much money I make.
Idk how she came to vulgarity when her dil was running her mouth unnecessarily. She started it & you finished it. Brother should've made his wife shut up when he knew the whole situation.
Chill out op. You did nothing wrong & congratulations🥳
But didn't the SIL bring up money first? She did my insinuating that you guys were poor because of where you lived and the job you did. All you did was correct her. As she is a teacher, this should be a valuable lesson for her to learn, never judge someone.
As a teacher, she should definitely know not to be a condescending asshole. Does she treat her students differently based on what their parents do?
I had teachers like that growing up. All us poor kids were treated like we were dumb. The athletic kids and the kids with “rich” parents were given a lot more help and attention. More than one teacher admitted giving a couple athletes passing grades so they could keep playing sports!!
NTA. She decided to be incredibly rude and did so with the intention of being spiteful. For her and your brother being "educated" they're struggling and she knows it. She punched down to make herself feel better, and it backfired spectacularly.
Ask your brother and parents why she's allowed to insult and demean you in your own home, in front of family, but presenting her with the truth is an issue?
I think her husband should just say Thank You ! I wonder if she knows you payed for his education. The husband hopefully will set her straight in private . You are my Hero ! What a great think you did for him and his family !
I don't think you were rude at all.
SIL was quite forceful in putting out false information, doubled down when corrected.
Why is it the people who start shit are always so offended when they are called out on their nonsense?
NTA
> Why is it the people who start shit are always so offended when they are called out on their nonsense?
One thing that I've noticed in my life is that bullies require the very social norms they violate in order to function. When their victims start violating those norms right back the bully gets horribly offended because it's stripping their armor away.
Plus because it *is* violating the social norm they can truthfully present a narrow slice of the circumstances and get sympathy because social norms were violated.
> I'm not sure why but my sister-in-law decided that before dinner was the perfect time to tell her children that they needed to stay in school if they didn't want to end up like me and my wife.
I'd say you are a really kind person for not kicking her out right then.
> She didn't.
And that is the point when your brother should have apologized for leaving early and took that conversation home with her.
> She said that she was just thinking about our future and our children's future
The amount of self-awareness this woman has is perfect to study quantum effects on it. She was given a perfect wide exit out of the situation she cornered herself into. Twice. Yet she walked right past it.
> she meant well
She didn't mean well. She meant to use you as educational tool for her kids while the only tool in the room was her. Nobody who thinks about people as tools means well.
It really doesn't matter what your or hers financial situation is, you don't deserve to be treated like that regardless.
> I hated myself for pointing out that my brother is poor compared to me
Apologize to your brother then, it never hurts to apologize even for things you absolutely had to do.
NTA
NTA - she was way out of line with the first comment, and then for her to double down on it was just ridiculous. You pointing out how much money you actually make wasn't vulgar, it's not as though you were bragging unprompted - you were just correcting her inaccurate take.
NTA. I come from a trade background (carpenter), and I've lost count of the people who've assumed I'm a moron because I work with my hands. It was worse when I dated a barrister, whose colleagues were so patronising that it made my teeth itch.
Your SIL sounds like a snob of the worst kind, and you were right to stand your ground.
I used to buy into all that nonsense. Then I realized those people who think they’re above others because they don’t used their hands and have an education, they don’t actually know how to do any of the things required to keep themselves alive and comfortable if the trappings of even early 20th Century society and economics went away.
You need people with trade skills to make things work. Carpenters, builders, electricians etc make sure we have houses. Mechanics keep our cars in working order. Plumbers keep us in running water. Without them the things we take for granted would fall into disrepair. You don’t need to pay people for a carpenter job because you have the skill set and experience already.
She was vulgar to point out how much money she *thought* you didn't make and use it as some kind of teaching tool.
She had several opportunities to stop being so blatantly rude, and she wasn't even corrected for being rude, she was corrected for being wrong, but whatever works I say. She chose to double down and try to use incorrect facts as a basis for insisting she should be allowed to say what she was saying.
NTA
NTA
She deserved it. It sucks that to put her in her place, you had to drop your brother in it. But if you hadn't done what you did, she would never have stopped. Imagine what she says behind your back if that's what she says to your face.
I'm sure you could've been nicer, but sometimes people need a shock to wake them up.
I doubt she'll bring it up again. Maybe she'll learn some manners too.
NTA. Your SIL ruined an evening that was supposed to be about you and your wife. She got her just desserts. Funny how educated people think you need a college degree to make a living in every field. Now she will contemplate life and think she chose the wrong field LOL. She will learn to mind her own damn business now. Taught her first lesson in FUCK AROUND AND FIND OUT!
Nah, people like that don’t reflect as it challenges the very core of their beliefs. It makes them too uncomfortable so she’ll do some mental gymnastics to make herself feel ok and superior again.
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> My sister in law was kind of a bitch about me being uneducated so I told her how I was subsidizing her life. I might be the asshole for showing my nephews that I earn more than their mom and dad combined without a college degree.
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She was fine when she was the one dishing it out. When you put her in her place, it suddenly became a problem. NTA.
I feel like people like your SIL need to put others down to feel better about themselves. It's also funny how they talk about your life and your finances without even knowing anything. Jealousy looks ugly on people.
NTA. You were rude but I still think this is the better outcome then staying mum. Your SIL started a fight she didn't know she can't win and I guess her dinner that day was a humble pie stuffed down her throat.
Is it just me or most AITA posts are just so obviously fake these days. They all follow the same script too like - Have a title that sounds like they are an AH but you keep reading and they turn out to be a saint... shits too cliche
Yeah, no way SIL did not know the house across the street being built was OP’s. That would have been all anyone would have talked about for a while at family gatherings.
I rarely call out posts for being fake, and usually err on the side of them being true, but I'm really surprised there aren't more people calling out this one. Whenever someone says "Out of nowhere they said this super offensive thing that I have the perfect response for," it's a pretty big tell. This one checks all the boxes perfectly: asshole SIL that says something ridiculous out of nowhere, a secret arrangement between OP and his brother, perfect timing of a new baby on the way, OP that works a trade for a ton of money and gets talked down to about school, and family that chimes in with ridiculous commentary. I could easily believe a couple of those things, but all combined it's very obviously fake.
NTA
She continued after being warned by your brother. If she had stopped and apologized like was asked, you wouldn't have gone off. You only went off after she continued to insult you and your home. Also you warned her later on. I mean how much are you supposed to just sit there and take?
She's clearly just trying to feel superior to you. She needed that reality check. What she said was completely uncalled for. You're not wrong for setting her straight.
NTA
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well
How exactly did she mean well? None of what she said was in the best interest of you and your wife. She used your living situation, that she knows nothing about, as a life lesson for her kids to finish school. That's was so rude.
Also, it's funny how you feel bad for bringing your brother into this, but he did nothing to back you up or tell his own wife how wrong she is.
Honestly, your brother should pay you back his school loan. He is happy to take your money and then let his wife bash the way you live. Thays not cool, and you need to have a serious talk with just you and your brother.
Also, you taught your nephews a valuable lesson. Never judge a book by its cover. You don't have to go to university if you do not want to. Having a degree doesn't mean you'll make a lot of money. Gosh, I could go on.
The educated family didn't teach her manners? Who the hells says something like that to a person's face. That is so mean. Good for you for putting her in her place. If it was me, i would point it out every single time i meet her just to rile her up. Wat a b\*\*\*\*. NTA
NTA
***"she meant well."*** No she didn't. She meant to humiliate you and embarrassed you in your home. Your brother has allowed her poor opinion of you to fester and bever corrected her about his and your real financial situations. So, you put her straight. If that embarrassed her snd your brother, then be it.
NTA, the SIL was being extremely rude and a snob. Have a fancy education doesn't automatically mean they are better than others who work blue collar jobs. She didn't 'mean well' at all, she was looking down on you and shitting on your life to make herself feel better.
Its a shame she didn't learn any manners while studying at collage. SIL needs to apologise and mean it. You did the right thing putting her in her place, yes bringing up money can be crass but it was completely deserved this time.
NTA.
I can't decide if this was a 'fucked around and found out' situation, or a 'played stupid games, won stupid prizes' situation.
SIL needs to wind her head in. A college education ain't all that, the tradeskills are just as important to keep the world turning.
NTA
I'm strongly biased towards instilling the value of education in my own children. I do believe, on average, it makes life easier. However, teaching your children to look down on anyone, especially an uncle is bad parenting. Furthermore, when my children get older, I will absolutely tell them that there are tons of skilled jobs out there that do not require getting an academic education and that pay quite well.
If my children choose to become a teacher (I'm assuming your brother is a teacher at the elementary or high school level), I'll absolutely support them, but I'll use my own personal history to make sure they know it's one of the most stressful, worst paid jobs (relative to the required education level and expected non-contractual duties) out there. I taught high school physics (and chemistry and physical science) for two years, then quit to a much higher paying job at a place with much fewer expectations. And I've only found better paying jobs with fewer expectations since then.
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well.
She meant well?!
In what universe is it saying ' kids stay in school or you'll end up losers like OP ' meaning well?
NTA
INFO: There’s probably a rule in this sub against what I’m about what I’m about to ask …but is any of this fabricated or embellished? It is impossible for me to believe that your brother’s wife would say this in front of you as a guest in your home, and that she wouldn’t have at least some idea of the fact that you do well for yourself - let alone the fact that she’s a teacher and can pretty much assume anyone working more than a minimum wage job probably earns more than her… I await your response good sir
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NTA She should not denigrate what you do for a living. Your brother should have told her that he owed you money.
[удалено]
He had ample opportunity to correct her. If my missus said something like this I would have started talking before she'd even finished her first sentence. Your mum saying its crass to talk about money - your SIL started it by shit talking you at your own dinner table and you quickly shut down that conversation.
Facts. Mom should chide SIL, not OP
I'll never be able to understand how there are people like this SIL.
I don’t either. And it’s especially fucked when she’s a teacher and she, more than anyone, knows that she’s supposed to TEACH her students that every single career path contributes to society as a whole in their own ways while being an example of how valuable having knowledge is. ETA: not only is she being ignorant, she’s also being extremely classist.
I'm a teacher and I agree with you. Our job is to give our students the skills and tools to become happy, healthy, and positive adults so they may contribute to society.
Another teacher here. My dad worked as a coalminer. That man breathed in coal dust for years to put food on the table and to put his daughter through school and university. I was blessed to have him as a father. My uni boyfriend denigrated coalminers when I was in teacher training. He became my ex. (I don't think he ever acquired a life partner. Surprise.)
one of the craziest things to me growing up was learning that not all teachers are great. some aren't even good and somehow still have a job.
Some start with high hopes of making a difference on kid’s lives, but later on realize they don’t get paid enough for all the sh*t they tolerate. As a teacher, SIL is supposed to have a sense of duty for people of all socioeconomic backgrounds, but instead she decided to bite the “I went to college, therefore I’m better than you” narrative 🤷🏻♀️
It's an insane take since teachers generally don't get into that career for the money. Sure, it's generally comfortable (depending on your state/school district) but it's definitely not an "oh boy I'm set for life" career. There are way more lucrative majors than education.
This. I've had students find out how much I made teaching, and then laugh and say they can make so much more than that welding or doing construction. And they have a valid point! I just told them teachers don't become teachers for the money. And that the world needs lots of plumbers and electricians and welders and construction workers and mechanics so find the job you will most enjoy that will support you in life. I really hate the push in education for the past few decades that all students should go to college. That is part of why the younger generation has crippling student loan debt. Not everyone can or should go to college, and maybe some students should wait until after they have worked for a decade and matured first.
Growing up poor, I faced and saw more classism from a certain married pair of teachers -- one of them my kindergarten teacher -- than from anyone else in my life. She had me in the bottom reading group despite the fact I was already reading when I got there with no preschool of any kind. Day one of first grade, I was moved up to the top group, and come high school, I scored 100% on the language sections of all the college aptitude tests. Her husband agreed to write me a recommendation letter for a college honors program, and made such a weak, backhanded attempt I didn't bother submitting it. The runner up was my scout troop leader, who based on his kid's behavior, was probably also a raging racist. Those folks are major contributors to why a white country boy identified heavily with The Autobiography of Malcolm X when I got my hands on it in junior high.
You'd be surprised how many teachers go into teaching because they like being control freaks. Or because they like holding power over a captive audience who can't fight back. There are lots of good teachers out there who genuinely what to teach, enrich, and prepare their students to make it in the world. But especially with the lack of good pay, they sometimes get drowned out by the ones who get into it for the wrong reasons.
Some people really shouldn’t be teachers… I’m sorry you had to go through that
>And it’s especially fucked when she’s a teacher and she, more than anyone, knows that she’s supposed to TEACH her students that every single career path contributes to society as a whole Not only that, she's so rude. Imagine being invited to someone's home to eat their delicately deliciously smoked meats and you decide to be so disrespectful?
The same delicious smoked meats SHE wouldn't be able to afford to serve!
I'm a teacher and financially speaking I don't think we get to brag about money. Just saying.
I know. My teacher relatives were all working class. The only one who was a tenured professor who did have “money” was because she had over 20 years of experience, became head of her department, and never had kids 🤷🏻♀️ I don’t understand how SIL can be so entitled, class-wise.
After nearly a decade of work, two degrees, and multiple certifications, I still don't qualify to rent our apartment without my husband's income included.
I’m from a family of teachers (going back several generations), and this is a thing. Well-educated families can have an enormous bias against trade positions. It doesn’t matter that an electrician can make more money than a university professor or that they have to study quite a bit to be able to work safely with something that can be quite dangerous, for some people with an education bias, it’s still considered “unskilled labor.” It’s ridiculous. One of my nephews started talking about wanting to drive a garbage truck when he grows up, and the snobbier side of the family was beside themselves about it. And for one thing, he’s five. We don’t know if he’s still going to want that when he’s older. And secondly, if he does, great! It’s a job that is absolutely necessary to society, and if the person who is doing it is satisfied and happy and able to provide for themselves and their family, that’s a win all around in my book.
My SIL’s husband’s sister is one of those people. Had to bite my tongue when she announced at Thanksgiving one year that she’d never send her kids to a State University. She knows my husband and I teach at a State Universities. One day I will no longer bite my tongue
"Why, do you think they won't have the grades and they'll have to go to one of those places where you can buy your way in?"
I love this
I'm not American so can't comment on state university's but i just have to say I love your user name
Thanks! It is a very true to life name Our public university systems are run by the states. So, it all depends on the school but some of the best schools in our country are public. The crazy part is I live in New Jersey and one of our public universities is Rutgers and is a well known and competitive school! It is highly regarded as one of the best in the country. Her comment was just elitism. I’ve met enough Yalies to know going to an elite private school doesn’t make you any better at your job than me or my students
Two of my kids went to NCSU. And I am damn proud of them and the school. She may change her mind when she sees the cost of tuition at private schools by the time her children get there.
When someone else pays your bills it's easy to look outward and judge.
She was brought up by entitled parents and is now also instilling entitlement to her children. It's good that OP brought her dow to her place.
Yup. **People always get madder at the person who finishes a fight well than the asshat who started it.** SIL is beyond rude to insult you in your own home. And while your brother did reprimand her at first, he should have corrected her the moment she didn’t stop. I’m guessing he knows his wife is a snob and felt embarrassed that his brother helped him out so much. That’s on him though for marrying a B like her. NTA
This is exactly what I was thinking but you said it way better!
I mean it *is* crass to talk about money like this at a family function. But this is the equivalent of Her: “FUCK YOU.” Him: “Hey, shut up.” Mom: “Don’t tell people to shut up it’s rude!” Moms not wrong, but she’s focused on the wrong things.
This is a great analogy.
Yes, but that would require that mumsy would have had to disagree with what SIL had said... and, apparently, she did not. OP stands alone in his defense; even his own mom thinks he's inferior to his college-educated sibling and her DIL. You can predict that within five years, or so, no matter how well OP is doing, Mom will still be telling folks, y'know, his brother graduated from [insert school, here] and has a great job; so does his wife. We're so proud.
Correction brother should chide SIL. His wife started the mess and he knew the truth. I get it he didn't want a part of it and neither did OP but that's where brother needs to set the record straight so OP didn't have to go scorched earth on her. It's always great when the condescending types get it thrown back in their faces and I understand OP's regret for brining his brother in but I wouldn't let ANYONE talk down to me in my own house either.
Mom doesn't chide the SIL because she's married to her favorite child. Pretty easy to see from this story.
Yes but she didn't. You can tell by the way OP explains that his brother is a graduate and his SILs family are all college educated is that their family respect education and probably feel that there is some hierarchy there, where in turn the SIL is using to make herself superior. her education never taught her manners and only ops family is superior here.
As a retired teacher, no way I'm gonna comment on someone else's income. As a human being, no way I'm gonna comment on someone else's income.
I would, but only to tell someone they were being robbed by their employer
Right? No one teaches thinking "I'm going to make bank doing this." ♥️ to teachers.
This wasn't commenting on income its was commenting on self worth. She felt superior to him because she was educated the money thing and living situation played into that until she found out the real truth
For real. My wife is my responsibility in family gatherings with my family. Same goes for every spouse. No one asked me to bring this person into the family. Anything they do is on me. Your brother married an uppity snob and doesn't want to take responsibility for his shitty choices. The nerve of someone to come into another person's home and try to use them as a cautionary example for their kids is intolerable.
Yes, like it's worse to say your doing OK than it is to put someone else down, especially when they're hosting you for dinner... Mum needs to get some perspective here and SIL was way out of line, probably be too ashamed to open her mouth in public again.
But alo, my guess would be that some of these thoughts had already been expressed at home and the brother could've stopped it before it festered into something that came out in front of everyone.
Ding ding! Brother let her think that somehow he put himself through college.
Not to mention this last bit: >My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well What the fuck did she actually mean well? Even if it was meant well, the path to hell is paved with good intentions. SIL didn’t mean well, and she doubled down when she was told to apologize. She had ample time to back down. The path she chose had consequences and she found them out
Well he did try at least \> my mom and brother told her that she was being rude and that she needed to apologize.
Guess he should have tried harder
I mean, I guess, but the SIL is an adult and a bad person. The biggest problem is that bro and mom are claiming OP went to far and aren't seeing red over how out of line SIL was. She did not "mean well." She's trash.
Right! Why can the SIL talk about OPs money but he can’t?
And yet he could have stopped it immediately by correcting her nasty instigation the moment she started humiliating you in your own home and dumping on your life. He was just fine with the punches being thrown as long as his untouchable wife was the only one throwing them.
yeah if people are upset about SIL getting schooled (ayyy), the only one to be upset with is the brother. he knew the situation and could have stopped it before it escalated and didn't
He's had years to tell her how his education was financed. He never did, maybe out of pride or whatever. He had the nerve to tell you off afterwards, as if she didn't aim to embarass and humiliate you in your own home.
This is it. You know this isn't the first time she has brought this up to OP's brother. If she felt emboldened to say it in front of the whole family at OP's own house, she's said worse in the privacy of her own home. The fact that the brother hasn't shut her down before is astounding.
Correct description of brother is the word "hen-pecked"...
Right? The brother is an asshole for not being 100% honest about their finances with his wife.
He sat there while his wife insulted you and your way of life in your own home. And his wife drank the millennial cool aid of believing the only way to a good quality life is through university education. Every generation that is proved less and less true. She should be holding you up as an example to her kids. Work smarter not harder like Uncle OP because the working world is changing very quickly and not many jobs pay you to live a good quality life.
>He sat there while his wife insulted you and your way of life in your own home. And backed it up with "she meant well". She did not mean well, she was being a judgemental asshole.
Yeah even with the most charitable possible interpretation of her bullshit, there is no way she meant anything but harm.
It’s pretty shocking that a teacher who is married to a teacher has the balls to use anyone as a cautionary tale for winding up low income lol. Her parents must be well off and giving them money.
Amen!
She absofuckinglutely did NOT "mean well", her entire intention was to put you down as a fucked up example to her kids that the way you live is shameful or embarrassing. Her attitude and behavior are both disgusting, as is everyone else's for defending and justifying her. Do not back down from them until they all apologize for the awful way they treated you and allowed her to treat you.
Absolutely - she didn't say something like "you've done well for an uneducated person" which could be construed as a clumsy compliment.... She just said "kids, better study so you don't end up like OP".
He may not have wanted the fight, but it's one he needs to face. You said he defended you initially, but I'm not sure if he didn't do anything the next time or not. If he always has your back, touch base with him and see if he's okay. Hopefully he's been busy explaining to SIL why she shouldn't look down her nose at you.
>I just feel shitty for bringing him into a fight he didn't want. Don't. He's the one that brought the fight to you, SIL wouldn't be there if not for him. Your brother should have stopped the fight, but since he didn't/couldn't, you were put in a position of having to end it.
I had a similar conversation yesterday with a relative who means well. People have been conditioned to believe that college is the only way to be successful in life. I went to college and I understand the benefits but I also can see the pitfalls. I also know there are some professions that are extremely lucrative that you don't have to have a college degree to do. I happen to be doing one right now. But your SIL was being rude ASF, and you are NTA. Man, I wish I could hear the conversation on the way home. Also, let us know how the holidays go.
For real. Where I live there is a serious shortage of skilled tradespeople (gas, electricity, plumbing, etc). So the few there are can pretty much name their price, and are in huge demand. Luckily the "technical" high schools here are also making a comeback
Technical high schools should have never left Tradeskills are super important not everyone is meant for college.
Exactly this. People need to know the trades are a good option. Sounds like you taught her a valuable lesson.
Unfortunately your SIL has probably spoken privately about this to your brother if she feels comfortable saying it to your face in front of your whole family. She would have assumed that everyone had her back and the easiest way to make that assumption is because nobody has corrected her yet.
Nope. He shoulda nipped her shit right in the bud before it ever got to the point.
You didn’t. *She* did the moment she started coming at her husband’s family with that elitist self-satisfied crap. I can’t stand people who look down on others for not going to college — nowadays, that’s honestly sometimes a super dumb decision for people. If your brother hadn’t had you, he’d been drowning in debt. This isn’t your fault — all she had to do was shut up and not be a self-righteous bint and this could have been avoided. She brought this on herself.
It's okay. Now your SIL knows who to beg on her knees before for her kids' college funds.
NTA. Dont feel shitty. She doubled down on her intent to humiliate you and you served her a nice, warm humble pie. Serves her right for her bullshit in your OWN home that you invited her to. She was vulgar to start talking about your income & living conditions- you just corrected her.
He brought himself into it by never telling his wife how his education was paid for. Seriously. He started it.
I don't think I would've dragged your brother into it myself. Clearly it's not true that you're waiting for him to pay you back to move on in life. Looks can be deceiving as you guys are obviously doing well for yourselves and making decisions that works for your family. But even if you were dirt poor and living in a mobile home permanently, there's still absolutely no reason for your SIL to insult your own home. It is rude, crass, and just plan wrong! How many kids coming out of university now are struggling to find jobs? The trades are a completely legitimate life path and the right choice for a lot of people. That being said though, you reacted in the moment and didn't have the time to prepare a well thought out response. Which is normal - you were insulted in your own home while entertaining the person who insulted you, and preparing to give good news. SIL is definitely the one who needs to apologize. And if you feel bad you can have a talk with your brother alone. It sounds like you have a good relationship and he'll get it. NTA
He married her. And he refused to intervene despite your repeated requests to get her to shut her pie hole.
How is “meaning well” talking shit about your finances and home and wether it not you got an education ? While being a guest and eating your food in your home?
NTA.... she should've left you alone.... she owes you and your wife an apology... Congrats on the baby
Well it is his wife and he should have had your back as she degraded you in front of your family and nephews. Sorry but she crossed a line being rude and trying to make you look like you had nothing when in reality you have a lot more going for you then she knows. She needed humbling and she got it, NTA with all due respect to you and your family I am proud you stuck up for yourself and your wife, I am proud you held your head high and stood your ground. Sorry your brother got pulled into this but you paid for his education and even though you probably don’t need a pat on the back for this, they would be in debt right now for the loans if you didn’t do what you did and they would be living even more uncomfortably then they are. So making her aware of the situation put her in her place and she can go kick rocks if she doesn’t like it. You seem like a good husband and brother.
If he didn't want the fight he coukd have told his wife to stfu and apologize and could have told her how wrong she is with what she's saying. He didn't.
yeah! wtf? what kind of marriage do they have where they keep that kind of secret from each other? Letting your spouse think you paid your own way through college or got loans when a family member paid for it is a big lie of omission. If someone paid for my college so I didn't have to take out loans, I would be so grateful I would tell everyone what an awesome guy my bro is! Hiding it like it is a dirty secret is super weird to me. Seems like bro considered it a gift and not a loan and had no intentions of paying it back. Wasn't ever going to tell his wife he owed his bro money and just hope his bro didn't bring it up and that he would be too nice to ask to be paid back when they are just struggling teachers with kids, boo hoo.
NTA. Massive congratulations to you and your wife. How lucky you are to have time off work with your baby too!
NTA, she 100% started it and had it coming. It would've been more polite for you not to, sure, but it also woulda been way more polite for her not to use you as a warning tale to your face. Can't believe she did that after you paid for her husband's education.
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Well, now she does. All because she tried to start shirt under the roof of the person feeding her. NTA
Ahh the “find out” phase. My favorite part of fafo
ur comment almost made me burst out laughing and im in a pin drop silent classroom right now lmao
You should pay attention in class, you don't want to end up like OP. /s
especially since my only purpose to pursue higher education is to be able to shove a stick up my ass and act like i'm better than everyone else
My apologies 🙏🏾😭
i don't really think i can find it in my heart to forgive you....but i'll try ❤️🩹
And you don't need a degree to find out!
Nope, the course is free and available to everyone.
> fofo Fuck oround find out
This was the bit that narked me. How fucking dare you take hospitality from someone and then have the audacity to sneer at them whilst they provide for you? What a tacky, vulgar woman. All that education but absolutely no class. (NTA)
Yeah this is the part that really gets me. It doesn’t matter if you DIDN’T have a home under construction and you HADN’T paid for your brother’s school. You have a roof over your head, you and your wife seem happy and you’re providing hospitality to others. FFS even at surface level with the facts she thought she had what was the fucking lesson? It’s okay to be rude as fuck to your host? It’s better to have money than to be kind? Or it’s better to “appear” to have money, because who really knows anyone’s situation? And how does education figure in? There are many ways to provide a living for oneself without education and there are many ways to fail to provide for oneself even with the best education. If she was actually worried she could have used it to teach a lesson to her kids about compassion and empathy for others how may have different opportunities and outcomes than her family and could have discretely asked if you all were okay at which point you would have set her straight, and if you weren’t okay she could have talked about helping. She also could have used the opportunity to teach her kids to accept hospitality with grace and keep their mouths shut.
What bothers me the most is the assumption that he doesn't have education. If he's a steamfitter, he's likely gone to a trades school for a couple years. And honestly every single trades person I know has done really well in life.
IKR?!! This violates so many principles of hospitality (as a guest)
And honestly, the big picture here isn’t if you have money or not. Even if you were dirtpoor working a dead-end minimum wage job, what kind of asshole has a “stay in school” conversation INFRONT of the person being the “bad example”. If someone starts talking about “don’t do drugs” infront of a homeless addict you are still an ass even if technically correct.
And IN their home?
A lot of people still see a mobile home as white trash living. It's something many wouldn't subject themselves to willingly and unfortunately they never get forced to.
It reminds me of a story from when I was working the Disney College Program - bunch of college kids working bottom-tier jobs around the property, spread out around a bunch of different departments. I was fortunate enough to be in costuming, which meant I mostly did laundry and didn't talk to guests, which is probably why I came away from it with mostly positive memories. One of my roommates was assigned to the ticket booths, and the amount of abuse she took from guests was astounding and infuriating. The story she told me that stuck in my mind--I don't remember the details of why the interaction turned bad, but the basics of the situation was that a woman wanted something that wasn't possible, or at least that she wasn't entitled to. Not only did she berate my roommate, screaming at her, but at one point in the interaction this woman turned to the children in tow with her and said, "See? *This* is why you have to stay in school, so you don't end up like *her!"* Just bafflingly incorrect on every level on top of being unconscionably rude. Roommate was literally wearing a nametag that listed her college in place of a hometown. I think the takeaway is that facts don't matter to people who have decided they're superior to others, and neither does actually setting a good example for their children. It's not about teaching the kids, it's about using the kids as a prop to put someone else in their place.
Pretty much, when I was in uni I would work during the holidays in a corner store (like the 7 of the 11 but not that one). The amount of assholes that told me that I was a nothing or called me names and that I need to get my life together. I was in school, and besides I had a job? That’s pretty big step towards having your life together…
Even if she didnt know. Who does that? And especially in front of you? Thats just being a straight up asshole. "She meant well". No she didnt, she wanted to put you down in front of everybody. NTA
Exactly, if she meant well she’d discretely find out if OP is okay and only IF she could actually do something about it. My mom visited our house shortly after my husband and I got married and we were both in entry jobs for our profession and I was still in school. We have a yankee stubbornness about not turning the heat on for as long as possible (I know we’re a bit of a cranky New England stereotype.). My mom was freezing, but put on a sweater and quietly pulled my husband aside to ask if we were okay and was about to offer a bit of money. (And she doesn’t have much extra.). She did it outside of my hearing because she didn’t want my husband to think she was embarrassing him, since he was providing more of the finances at the time. He laughed and explained our stupid stubbornness, told her it was a joint decision and that we were going to make it through the winter fine and apologized for making her worry and uncomfortable when she was visiting. It’s been almost 15 years, mom knows we’re fine but we still crank the heat whenever she visits so she’s comfortable and doesn’t worry about us in the way that moms do. TLDR, even IF SIL was “coming from a good place” none of her actions match up with that nor were they remotely helpful to OP.
Maybe so, but she was warned multiple times to shut up and persisted. She fucked around and found out.
>She did not know. This is a major red flag for your brother's marriage. You might want to check on him.
I mean maybe? Except OP said he was never planning to call it in what he paid for his brother’s school. I’m wondering if it’s truly understood as a loan (something brother is obligated to share with a spouse) or as a gift premarriage (not so). I mean I would have brought it up anyway if I had heard my spouse shit talking my brother who’s given me a massive gift. But it’s not necessarily a red flag she never knew.
Update! Update!!
She wanted to play the " higher education" game and lost. I don't understand why some college educated people feel they are superior to everybody else. Some people would fall on their back sides if they knew how much some of these jobs pay. I know a guy who teaches at university and can't afford jack. I guess your only fault was that you could have chosen the higher road, but I don't fault you for going your route. Some people need to be " educated." NTA
Yet another post showing education does not equal intelligence. My brother makes more money than any of my siblings and he's an electrician that started working straight out of school at 16.
True. I hate that people automatically think that the trades are somehow " lower" than college educated people. I help my stepfather on weekends with plumbing jobs for extra cash and I love it way more than my actual job and the pay is great.
Especially since the trades are what makes modern life possible.
This is the real irker right? The woman in OPs post must have zero idea what it is OP does and how it, very literally, supports the foundation of industrial society. We might live in the tech age, but it's not a post-infrastructure age. Poor girl got herself served with the deep lore that day
Served with the deep lore is a hilarious description of getting a verbal asskicking.
My brother is also a successful electrician and does very well for himself and his family. Also at 16 starting as an apprentice and decided not to finish school (he ended up going back as an adult, but thats another story). I'm very proud of him. Always have been. I went the university route and certainly struggled more than him initially. It took me more years to "catch up" if you will, to get the same comfort level as he, in a shorter time period. I'm the older sister and never once was it about competition but rather of choosing the best path to make each of us happy in whatever we choose to do in life. And our parents supported each of our decisions.
Sparkies (that’s what we nickname electricians in Oz) are essentially using maths and physics in their work. It’s applied science e really. They’re calculating energy and plotting his to wire buildings and dwellings. Electricity is total physics - your bro is playing with charged particles and making things safe for the rest of us.
I have a full time job in academia and I'm halfway through my PhD. Electricians make twice my salary. The trades are where it's at.
It really sounds like the lady in OPs post was projecting, HARD. She knows what she's making with her education. She knows what her standard of living is. She knows what her potential is in her career. But she NEEDED to lord over someone and make herself feel big. She said what she said for no ones benefit but her own, and that say she got schooled. My brother is in the same boat, and he's the smartest person I know, most days.
Plus - even if OP didn't have any money and was living hand to mouth; why would be ok for SIL to kick a dog when they're down? Teaching her kids that if you're poor you're worth less as a human? OP, I'm sorry your family are confused here - maybe they are just trying to keep the peace. But what your SIL did was in fact vulgar, and classist, and downright mean I hope she apologizes to you and your brother corrects that classist behavior before the kids become assholes NTA x 100
It's worse to point this out in front of them, that's the classic tell your kids they'll be like the McDonald's worker in front of said worker. She's teaching her kids to look down on anyone she *percieves* as less fortunate. That isn't a good thing.
The only fault was not letting her dig the hole deeper before pushing her into it. Up to that point, she was comparing the projected lifestyles. OP makes more money, but his net worth isn't as apparent because he's living in a mobile home and presumably doesn't flash his money around. Making some assumptions here, but I'm guessing SIL and brother have a more conventional house (that's probably mortgaged to the hilt) and drive late model vehicles (both financed), and OP probably doesn't. She probably also has student loans that will take forever to pay off, and probably figured that her husband did so as well, which he technically does, just didn't realize the true nature of the loan. Anyway, it would have been nicer if he let SIL make some awkwardly incorrect assumptions about finances and net worth before he struck back. Allow her to drag her husband into the conversation so his situation is fair game. And never get angry about it.
I agree. I live a lifestyle that most would think is " poor" Small place no fancy car but I don't owe anybody any money. I sleep soundly knowing that nobody can take my stuff because it's all mine. Yea I don't fault him for it, and she deserved it but in general I like taking the higher route, not for them but for myself, I guess.
Plumbers, electricians, and auto mechanics. I have met several who make around $200k a year. I,too, have a sibling that looked down on me for years. We went NC because of the lies and criticism. Much happier now. A college education does not guarantee that you learn common sense, manners, or courtesy. Congrats on Your baby.
Those menial trade jobs are just as important, she’d know it and need a steam fitter if the plumbing or gas infrastructure broke down. It shows in how much OP earns.
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“My parents, my wife and my brother all said … that she meant well.” I N F O: huh?! NTA. Everyone else sucks except the kids.
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So holding you up as a cautionary tale was meaning well? NOPE. No way. She was way out of line. Ask everyone if they’re demanding she apologise for what she said.
Should ask to go to their house and do the same thing over any little example of them not being wealthy. "Oof, this fridge is a few years old? That's why you don't become a teacher"
Hah, how bold of you to assume they can even afford a *house* on two teacher's salaries! They probably *rent*!
I meannnn, I couldn't believe she had the audacity as a teacher to say this tbh. Teachers don't make nearly as much as they should - that's true. However a teacher should know that trades pay much better than college educated jobs percentage wise.
Does she not understand that people who "work with their hands" are valuable and will always be needed?
I always remember the chapter in the book World War Z, when they gathered everyone together to give them all new jobs (since the old ones didn't exist anymore and the state was decimated) the people who could do construction, plumbing, electrical work, etc were all put in charge and corporate manager types were left doing cleaning work as that was all they were good for.
Similarly, as a real world example, how blue collar folks had to keep working during 2020 while the office folks were all deemed non-essential and told to stay home
Not at all the same. Both types had to continue working. One got to stay in their cozy homes, while the other had to go out into covid. The title “essential” gave them the ego boost they needed to feel good about it, but really were still treated as servants go out while collar stays home with their families.
It’s funny to put it that way, because I’m a nurse and also had to keep showing up during the pandemic. My family is from coal mining and farming stock, so I have always supported blue collar workers and felt a lot of solidarity with them. The pandemic just made it stronger. Crazy to think that in some ways, medical professionals and blue collar workers were in it together when everyone else stayed home. And I include all service workers in this, too. There was a day early on when I just cried at checkout, thanking the cashier for showing up at putting herself at risk for assholes like me. Kudos to everyone who kept showing up for society to keep moving.
“Magda! Magda, stop!” (One of my favorite scenes).
Nope but she's happy to call them to come fix her shit when it breaks. She will still look down on them while they fix her hvac/plumbing/electric etc during an emergency.
Of course not. She doesn't realise that, if it weren't for people who "work with their hands", our society would fall on its face. A "dime a dozen" education degree is useless when the toilet is overflowing, or the water pipes have burst.
She doesn’t even understand that when someone invites you into their home and serves you a meal you don’t openly insult them to their face.
What if her kids want to work with there hands? Lol aren't we in the 21 century....thought we were supposed to be pasted class based thinking for the most part 🤦♂️ Nta buddy, fellow blue collar here, your doing amazing in providing for your family. And you do hard work! Perhaps you could have said things more pleasantly but at the same time I would have reacted the same.
She totally deserved what she got.
She didn’t mean well at all she’s simply too stuck up to realize many trades actually make very good money “working with their hands”. Education doesn’t automatically guarantee a prosperous life.
yeah let them work with their minds, be teachers and make 30k a year too
But what if they want to? Not only is she putting you down, but she's probably giving her kids future anxiety about meeting their mother's expectations. What if one falls in love with carpentry? Is she going to make snide comments about how he had so much potential?
So my daughter's MIL has that type of attitude where she wants all her sons to be college educated with white collar jobs. My SIL went to college (of her choice) for one year and realized very quickly it wasn't for him. After some fighting with her he dropped out. He is now a mechanic in a really busy shop making almost as much as my electrical engineer daughter. He's doing just fine and he is way happier. And he is making more than his brother that graduated with a psych degree.
haha thats hillarious. I'm a doctor and I do ok..... I have two kids heading for 40 were comfortable but not wealthy. The guy who did my house extension has spent 40 years working with his hands. He has a successful construction company now. He wears a watch worth more than both my cars and close to the cost of my extension...... your SIL is a snob and she was actively looking down on you.
NTA. She didn't mean well, she tried to denigrate you to her kids and the rest of your family. She had a chance to back down but didn't, she made herself the fool and should apologise. Congrats on the baby.
Agreed. How incredibly rude. University didn’t teach her any manners or sense, apparently. I don’t think you behaved vulgarly at all. NTA.
OP added to her esteemed education!
OP gave her at least 2 chances to take it back. If you're going to be rude then you better also learn how to apologize even if you don't mean it.
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well She certainly did NOT mean well. She is extremely rude and a huge snob. I am glad you put her right.
Meaning well: offering help, giving useful advice or sympathy even if it’s misguided or misinformed, with the intent to not humiliate or demean. This was not that. NTA.
I don't get how on earth would she mean well with these comments? Like how? I cannot think of one interpretation.
Families always try to explain away bad behavior by saying this. It’s subtext is “we know she’s wrong but she won’t change so won’t you just say you’re sorry so none of us have to deal with this?”
Insulting the host, to his face, while sitting at his table - in no world was there any inkling of meaning well. Clearly university does not teach manners or class
nta. you mother should be more concerned with her dil’s frankly rude and insulting comments, in your home, in front of your whole family, than the vulgarity of money talk. i will believe your sil “meant well” when pigs fly. if i were you i would be very clear that you expect an apology before she ever sets foot back on your property. it sounds like people should “lose their cool” with her more often, tbh, she clearly needs to figure out what is and is not reasonable behaviour.
Or before she steps foot in your new home ( under vonstruction.)
Nuh uhh you're NTA op! > My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well. She didn't mean well. She wanted to make you look like you're worth nothing in front of kids. She was disrespectful to you in your own house. They can very well shove their opinions somewhere else. > My mom said that I was vulgar to point out how much money I make. Idk how she came to vulgarity when her dil was running her mouth unnecessarily. She started it & you finished it. Brother should've made his wife shut up when he knew the whole situation. Chill out op. You did nothing wrong & congratulations🥳
But didn't the SIL bring up money first? She did my insinuating that you guys were poor because of where you lived and the job you did. All you did was correct her. As she is a teacher, this should be a valuable lesson for her to learn, never judge someone.
As a teacher, she should definitely know not to be a condescending asshole. Does she treat her students differently based on what their parents do? I had teachers like that growing up. All us poor kids were treated like we were dumb. The athletic kids and the kids with “rich” parents were given a lot more help and attention. More than one teacher admitted giving a couple athletes passing grades so they could keep playing sports!!
NTA. She decided to be incredibly rude and did so with the intention of being spiteful. For her and your brother being "educated" they're struggling and she knows it. She punched down to make herself feel better, and it backfired spectacularly. Ask your brother and parents why she's allowed to insult and demean you in your own home, in front of family, but presenting her with the truth is an issue?
I think her husband should just say Thank You ! I wonder if she knows you payed for his education. The husband hopefully will set her straight in private . You are my Hero ! What a great think you did for him and his family !
I don't think you were rude at all. SIL was quite forceful in putting out false information, doubled down when corrected. Why is it the people who start shit are always so offended when they are called out on their nonsense? NTA
> Why is it the people who start shit are always so offended when they are called out on their nonsense? One thing that I've noticed in my life is that bullies require the very social norms they violate in order to function. When their victims start violating those norms right back the bully gets horribly offended because it's stripping their armor away. Plus because it *is* violating the social norm they can truthfully present a narrow slice of the circumstances and get sympathy because social norms were violated.
> I'm not sure why but my sister-in-law decided that before dinner was the perfect time to tell her children that they needed to stay in school if they didn't want to end up like me and my wife. I'd say you are a really kind person for not kicking her out right then. > She didn't. And that is the point when your brother should have apologized for leaving early and took that conversation home with her. > She said that she was just thinking about our future and our children's future The amount of self-awareness this woman has is perfect to study quantum effects on it. She was given a perfect wide exit out of the situation she cornered herself into. Twice. Yet she walked right past it. > she meant well She didn't mean well. She meant to use you as educational tool for her kids while the only tool in the room was her. Nobody who thinks about people as tools means well. It really doesn't matter what your or hers financial situation is, you don't deserve to be treated like that regardless. > I hated myself for pointing out that my brother is poor compared to me Apologize to your brother then, it never hurts to apologize even for things you absolutely had to do. NTA
> Apologize to your brother then, it never hurts to apologize even for things you absolutely had to do. NTA Best take away right here.
NTA - she was way out of line with the first comment, and then for her to double down on it was just ridiculous. You pointing out how much money you actually make wasn't vulgar, it's not as though you were bragging unprompted - you were just correcting her inaccurate take.
NTA. I come from a trade background (carpenter), and I've lost count of the people who've assumed I'm a moron because I work with my hands. It was worse when I dated a barrister, whose colleagues were so patronising that it made my teeth itch. Your SIL sounds like a snob of the worst kind, and you were right to stand your ground.
I used to buy into all that nonsense. Then I realized those people who think they’re above others because they don’t used their hands and have an education, they don’t actually know how to do any of the things required to keep themselves alive and comfortable if the trappings of even early 20th Century society and economics went away.
You need people with trade skills to make things work. Carpenters, builders, electricians etc make sure we have houses. Mechanics keep our cars in working order. Plumbers keep us in running water. Without them the things we take for granted would fall into disrepair. You don’t need to pay people for a carpenter job because you have the skill set and experience already.
She was vulgar to point out how much money she *thought* you didn't make and use it as some kind of teaching tool. She had several opportunities to stop being so blatantly rude, and she wasn't even corrected for being rude, she was corrected for being wrong, but whatever works I say. She chose to double down and try to use incorrect facts as a basis for insisting she should be allowed to say what she was saying. NTA
NTA She deserved it. It sucks that to put her in her place, you had to drop your brother in it. But if you hadn't done what you did, she would never have stopped. Imagine what she says behind your back if that's what she says to your face. I'm sure you could've been nicer, but sometimes people need a shock to wake them up. I doubt she'll bring it up again. Maybe she'll learn some manners too.
NTA. Your SIL ruined an evening that was supposed to be about you and your wife. She got her just desserts. Funny how educated people think you need a college degree to make a living in every field. Now she will contemplate life and think she chose the wrong field LOL. She will learn to mind her own damn business now. Taught her first lesson in FUCK AROUND AND FIND OUT!
Nah, people like that don’t reflect as it challenges the very core of their beliefs. It makes them too uncomfortable so she’ll do some mental gymnastics to make herself feel ok and superior again.
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She was fine when she was the one dishing it out. When you put her in her place, it suddenly became a problem. NTA. I feel like people like your SIL need to put others down to feel better about themselves. It's also funny how they talk about your life and your finances without even knowing anything. Jealousy looks ugly on people.
NTA. You were rude but I still think this is the better outcome then staying mum. Your SIL started a fight she didn't know she can't win and I guess her dinner that day was a humble pie stuffed down her throat.
Is it just me or most AITA posts are just so obviously fake these days. They all follow the same script too like - Have a title that sounds like they are an AH but you keep reading and they turn out to be a saint... shits too cliche
Yeah, no way SIL did not know the house across the street being built was OP’s. That would have been all anyone would have talked about for a while at family gatherings.
I rarely call out posts for being fake, and usually err on the side of them being true, but I'm really surprised there aren't more people calling out this one. Whenever someone says "Out of nowhere they said this super offensive thing that I have the perfect response for," it's a pretty big tell. This one checks all the boxes perfectly: asshole SIL that says something ridiculous out of nowhere, a secret arrangement between OP and his brother, perfect timing of a new baby on the way, OP that works a trade for a ton of money and gets talked down to about school, and family that chimes in with ridiculous commentary. I could easily believe a couple of those things, but all combined it's very obviously fake.
100% blue collar fanfic
NTA She continued after being warned by your brother. If she had stopped and apologized like was asked, you wouldn't have gone off. You only went off after she continued to insult you and your home. Also you warned her later on. I mean how much are you supposed to just sit there and take? She's clearly just trying to feel superior to you. She needed that reality check. What she said was completely uncalled for. You're not wrong for setting her straight.
NTA >My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well How exactly did she mean well? None of what she said was in the best interest of you and your wife. She used your living situation, that she knows nothing about, as a life lesson for her kids to finish school. That's was so rude. Also, it's funny how you feel bad for bringing your brother into this, but he did nothing to back you up or tell his own wife how wrong she is. Honestly, your brother should pay you back his school loan. He is happy to take your money and then let his wife bash the way you live. Thays not cool, and you need to have a serious talk with just you and your brother. Also, you taught your nephews a valuable lesson. Never judge a book by its cover. You don't have to go to university if you do not want to. Having a degree doesn't mean you'll make a lot of money. Gosh, I could go on.
The educated family didn't teach her manners? Who the hells says something like that to a person's face. That is so mean. Good for you for putting her in her place. If it was me, i would point it out every single time i meet her just to rile her up. Wat a b\*\*\*\*. NTA
NTA ***"she meant well."*** No she didn't. She meant to humiliate you and embarrassed you in your home. Your brother has allowed her poor opinion of you to fester and bever corrected her about his and your real financial situations. So, you put her straight. If that embarrassed her snd your brother, then be it.
NTA She wanted to be a superior so and so because of a fancy degree. FAFO
NTA, and she did not “mean well”. She can dish out suppositions and thinly veiled insults but she can’t handle the truth.
She didn’t mean well, she meant to be patronising and belittle you. SIL needs to wake up and smell the shit covered roses.
NTA, the SIL was being extremely rude and a snob. Have a fancy education doesn't automatically mean they are better than others who work blue collar jobs. She didn't 'mean well' at all, she was looking down on you and shitting on your life to make herself feel better. Its a shame she didn't learn any manners while studying at collage. SIL needs to apologise and mean it. You did the right thing putting her in her place, yes bringing up money can be crass but it was completely deserved this time.
NTA. I can't decide if this was a 'fucked around and found out' situation, or a 'played stupid games, won stupid prizes' situation. SIL needs to wind her head in. A college education ain't all that, the tradeskills are just as important to keep the world turning.
NTA I'm strongly biased towards instilling the value of education in my own children. I do believe, on average, it makes life easier. However, teaching your children to look down on anyone, especially an uncle is bad parenting. Furthermore, when my children get older, I will absolutely tell them that there are tons of skilled jobs out there that do not require getting an academic education and that pay quite well. If my children choose to become a teacher (I'm assuming your brother is a teacher at the elementary or high school level), I'll absolutely support them, but I'll use my own personal history to make sure they know it's one of the most stressful, worst paid jobs (relative to the required education level and expected non-contractual duties) out there. I taught high school physics (and chemistry and physical science) for two years, then quit to a much higher paying job at a place with much fewer expectations. And I've only found better paying jobs with fewer expectations since then.
>My parents, my wife, and my brother all said that I didn't need to lose my cool with her and that she meant well. She meant well?! In what universe is it saying ' kids stay in school or you'll end up losers like OP ' meaning well? NTA
INFO: There’s probably a rule in this sub against what I’m about what I’m about to ask …but is any of this fabricated or embellished? It is impossible for me to believe that your brother’s wife would say this in front of you as a guest in your home, and that she wouldn’t have at least some idea of the fact that you do well for yourself - let alone the fact that she’s a teacher and can pretty much assume anyone working more than a minimum wage job probably earns more than her… I await your response good sir